Braves

By B-RITT

February 5, 2009 9:06 PM | Link to this

first?

By Derick Richard

February 5, 2009 9:17 PM | Link to this

As for the platoon with Matt Diaz, what seemed to be his big problem last season prior to his injury when he hit the wall. He was having a difficult year already, perhaps simply something baseball players go through. Was it the pressure of being the everyday guy rather than a platoon player? He seemed to have no health issues as I recall. Year before last, he hit for a high average and I was really surprised at his comparative lack of production. Is the feeling that he will bounce back? Does he consider it better for him to be a platoon players. I’m sure you’ve had this conversation somewhere along the way. I read frequently, but not all the comments.

By efuzz

February 5, 2009 9:19 PM | Link to this

I hope you are reading The Dude right. We ned the lefty in our pen. Don’t know if you caught Glavine on 680 today but he really sounded positive to be ptiching in March.

By dan

February 5, 2009 9:20 PM | Link to this

Ken Rosenthal seems to think that the Braves might not make Tommy an offer. We could use a left handed pitcher in the rotation.

I really hope that the Braves do not think that they can get back to the World Series without another proven bat. Seems like a waste of money to dump everything into the pitching staff without improving the lineup.

While I would like to have Ohman back, I think it is more important to acquire a LF and sign Tommy Glavine. We already have two, possibly three left handed relief pitchers. Granted Ohman is good, but if money is indeed running out, it could be better spent elsewhere.

By efuzz

February 5, 2009 9:20 PM | Link to this

or maybe we need the lefty in our pen

By Chris

February 5, 2009 9:20 PM | Link to this

What exactly does Bud do for $17.5 mil? Good work if you can get it , I guess…

By mitchie-san

February 5, 2009 9:21 PM | Link to this

Top ten again??? wow.

By steve_97060

February 5, 2009 9:24 PM | Link to this

so what is the deal with all the people who seem to get some sort of satisfaction for being the first person to post on various blogs, even though all they post is “first”.. big deal… is there some blogmeister somewhere who keeps score and hands out little prizes to these attention seekers?

By 18 Wheel s of Love

February 5, 2009 9:25 PM | Link to this

Do player incentives count towards the ‘budget’?

By OldBravesBag

February 5, 2009 9:26 PM | Link to this

Hey DOB…

I think Ohman gave you another clue…. I am not at LIBERTY to discuss???!!!! LOL

By mitchie-san

February 5, 2009 9:29 PM | Link to this

steve_97060, you just wasted our time with your post as well, stop being a little attention seeker.

By The Vet

February 5, 2009 9:30 PM | Link to this

I think we should add a cheaper outfield option to the compitition in the outfield, the way it looks now its not good, there are a few vetern outfielders availble that dont come as expensive as Abreu or Dunn. Alou, Anderson, Gonzalaz just to name a few. Good leadership and knowldge of the game all proven hitters and profesionals, if we dont get a bat look for our pitches to lose alot of game but have a good ERA

By Efrim

February 5, 2009 9:30 PM | Link to this

Just posted this on the last blog:

Baseball Prospectus has an interesting article up about certain teams in the NL and some solutions for their needs. Here’s what they said about the Braves:

“Free-Agent Fix #1, Atlanta Braves: Atlanta’s outfielders combined to hit just .260/.324/.367 with the majors’ lowest OPS of any outfield crew last year, a serious handicap for an offense. It could be more of the same given that PECOTA doesn’t hold out much hope for anyone in the left- and center-field slop-fest (Matt Diaz, Josh Anderson, Gregor Blanco, Brandon Jones) to better a .260 Equivalent Average. Having made impressive gains in the rotation this offseason, the Braves owe themselves a shot at upgrading their offense, and the most affordable quick fix may be provided by Dunn, whose park-neutral projection (.255/.387/.528) would be better than any Brave this side of Chipper Jones in the OBP and SLG departments.—Jay Jaffe”

The key point I take out of that is this:

“Having made impressive gains in the rotation this offseason, the Braves owe themselves a shot at upgrading their offense…”

Agreed. I’m glad Wren has patience right now, because obviously, Dunn and Abreu are still asking for too much on the free agent market and Brian Cashman is asking for too much in trade for Swisher or Nady. That said, I don’t think the Braves can wait until June or July, I think they need to get a banger before opening day.

By idmo245

February 5, 2009 9:32 PM | Link to this

Sign Glavine if he is healthy enough to pitch. Let Brandon Jones, Diaz, Anderson, Blanco and Jordan Schafer fight it out for left and center field. They can always make a deal during spring training or a trade during the season if that plan isn’t working out. You might want to say a prayer for Jeff Francoeur.

By Alan

February 5, 2009 9:36 PM | Link to this

I’m pleased with what the Braves have done to upgrade their pitching staff, particularly the rotation. As it is now — even without Tim Hudson — it is as good as anyone else’s in the NL East. The bullpen looks good, too, although I agree with DOB that retaining Will Ohman would be “huge” — to borrow a Chipper-ism. However, the proposed lineup as currently constituted is hardly fearsome. A big bopper, such as Adam Dunn or Jermaine Dye, really would transform the lineup and make the Braves instant contenders. Without such a guy — not Nady or Swisher or even Abreu, let alone anyone already on the 40-man roster — I honestly don’t believe the Braves are in the same league (figuratively, of course) as the Phillies and the Mets.

By fastasballs

February 5, 2009 9:37 PM | Link to this

From what I have read it seems Glavine is looking for something a little more than a minor league deal. More like 3 mil of guaranteed money if what I read is accurate. I see no point in signing him if that cash will be needed for a left fielder or other needs later in the season.

With four spots locked down in the rotation & a slew of guys competing for the fifth spot why offer a contract to Glavine? Even if it’s less than the rumored 3 mil you have to think one of the kids will be a pleasant surprise. By giving Glavine a major league contract it seals the fate of all the kids no matter how well they pitch in the spring.

By ccrider

February 5, 2009 9:39 PM | Link to this

Ken Rosenthal is reporting that the Braves might be leaning toward spending the money they have left on an outfielder rather than Glavine. I think Wren needs to look at the advantages of a veteran lefty in the rotation to mix with the righthanders, as well as, the benefits of the crew of Hanson, Morton, Reyes, Medlin, Redmond having time at Gwinnett to sort things out. The Braves certainly could also target a minor leaguer with a stronger lefty bat, that hits righties with more power than B. Jones, Anderson or Blanco, to platoon with Diaz.

By The Vet

February 5, 2009 9:47 PM | Link to this

I say go with a cheaper vetern outfielder that add experience to the young outfield, still leaving enough for Ohman and Glavine, I do agree fastballs tho we have alot of options for the 5th starter , if the money for glav would remove the chance to get a better bat for outfield its a tuffy…

By wondering

February 5, 2009 9:51 PM | Link to this

Is this the year?

The year David O’Brein finally gets his goat’s milk fudge in Florida?

By CovBravesfan

February 5, 2009 9:54 PM | Link to this

DOB,

Have you heard anything about the Braves considering signing Garrett Anderson to split time with Diaz in left field? He hasn’t signed with the Angels and is still a free agent and maybe be a good option. While stats can sometimes be deceiving, he appears to be a pretty decent hitter and has very good fielding stats. Plus, maybe we could get him relatively cheap and still be able to get Ohman and Glavine as well.

Thoughts?

By mb

February 5, 2009 9:55 PM | Link to this

The next 2 paragraphs below are from one of the rumor mills.

*Mets call on Ohman Will Ohman | Braves | Interested: Mets? Braves? Phillies? Mets general manager Omar Minaya made his first contact of the winter with Page Odle, the agent for lefty reliever Will Ohman, reports ESPN.com’s Jerry Crasnick. The Mets weren’t interested when it appeared that Ohman was seeking a deal similar to Jeremy Affeldt’s two-year, $8 million contract with San Francisco. But they’ve decided to jump in now that spring training is approaching and the price has dropped.

Contrary to reports, the Phillies haven’t ceased talks with Ohman’s representatives. But GM Ruben Amaro is near his budget limit unless he finds a way to unload Adam Eaton or Geoff Jenkins. So if the Phillies are going to sign Ohman, Dennys Reyes or Joe Beimel, it probably won’t be for much more than a one-year deal in the $1 million range.*

This paragraph is just my opinion I keep sharing here on the blog.

I think the Braves should sign Ohman and a Left Fielder hitter. I would pass on signing Glavine, good guy and all, but why take the chance.

thanks

mark.

By j

February 5, 2009 9:56 PM | Link to this

I am still intrigued about Abreu in our OF, but what about the Brian Roberts talk? Is this deal dead?

By Tomas

February 5, 2009 10:02 PM | Link to this

Tom Glavine the 42 year old coming of a season cut short to season endig shoulder surgery in which he had an ERA over five. The Braves have Jorge Campillo, Tommy Hanson, Charlie Morton, Jo-jo Reyes, and James Parr already competing for the fifth spot. I mean out of respect for the guy, who is making an effort to comeback, and considering his huge hall of fame career with the Braves they should make an offer. No way a guarantee’d 3 million(who in the world would give Glavine that kind of money). Maybe 1.5 million max. But the question is, who would you prefer to have on the team, Bobby Abreu(an outfielder with power which they desperately need) or a 42 year old pitcher(who they don’t really need considering they already 5 pitchers competing for the last spot in the rotation). It’s a question of common sense.

DOB, help me understandone thing, If Abreu is eventually going to get a 5-8 million dollar contract, why on earth would the Braves even consider trading for Nick Swisher or Xavier Nady. Abreu wasn’t even offered arbitration, so the Braves wouldn’t even lose a draft pick, and the guy hit 296 with 20 HR 100RBI’s, 371OBP, and 10 outfield assist in right field. Much, much better than Swisher 219/24/69 and a 332OBP. Not to mention Abreu stole 22 bases, more than any braves player last year. Something just doesn’t add up, especially because on top of the 5-7 million Swisher and Nady being paid to them, they’d have to give the Yankees players in return. It’s just stupid, am I the only one who thinks this isn’t logical?????

By The Vet

February 5, 2009 10:03 PM | Link to this

I totally agree with you Covbravesfan, he is a very proffesional hitter still, i believe he can hit 15-20 homers and we know he’ll hit 290. or better, other options include Moises Alou and Luis Gonzalaz

By Ray

February 5, 2009 10:12 PM | Link to this

On the subject of Brave farm pitchers, whatever happened to the Oriole pitcher that the Braves got for the “loss” of “rocker” Leo Mazone. I believe his name is Moises Hernandez (or another Hispanic name). I haven’t seen his name anywhere. There aren’t that many “Moises” in circulation even is I am hazy about his last name.

By TennesseePaul

February 5, 2009 10:19 PM | Link to this

Abreu makes the most sense for this team if he is available on a reasonable one year deal. I’d love to see that guy in the line up with Chipper and McCann. It’d make for a much more promissing season.

By Hahahahahaha

February 5, 2009 10:31 PM | Link to this

The Padres DFA’d Matt Bush; the 2004 #1 overall draft pick!

Another brilliant move by GM dumba#@. Ranks right up there with failing to get Escobar and prospects over inevitably and eventually taking a lesser, cruddy Cubs’ package.

By JC from UT

February 5, 2009 10:31 PM | Link to this

DOB: If Glavine is signed will he be placed on the DL to save the roster spot until after ST? And if Ohman is signed would this surplus of bullpen arms especially left handers enable the Braves to offer a package for eithe Nady or Swisher? With all these posible moves something is going to have to give to fit the 40 man roster. And that is not even bringing up either Schafer or Hanson. In your opinion, who would be moved from the 40 man? Does Phil Stockman have any alue in a package? I’m sure Boyer does but I would think the FO is not ready to give up on him as of yet.

By #1 Smoltz Fan

February 5, 2009 10:36 PM | Link to this

I do know how most of the Obrien blog veterans here feel about Andruw Jones but I am a huge fan, and find it amazing that I cannot find one shred of news, rumor or speculation about where he and Bora$$ might be headed. I don’t know if I am looking in the right places but I tried Google, MLB trade rumors, Atlanta braves web site and nothing.

I am still holding on to the hope that by some miracle (or what most would say a bonehead move) that Andruw comes home to the Ted, but to hear absolutely nothing seems strange to me, I mean when he was locked down with LA Bora$$ was very quick to get him released but now it’s silence.

With his sudden 24 month rapid decline in his performance, I think everyone would agree that it is uncommon and a little odd, or not the norm, yes? If so then why is it that nobody thinks there is even a shred of hope that it is something other than the man just can’t play ball anymore ? Has it ever happenned before where a player just basicly forgets how to play? He was a lock for the HOF 3 years ago in most peoples opinion and now Barry Bonds will probably get an offer before Andruw will!

For me it seems obvious that something happenned the last year or so, be it the stress of the contract ending, (didn’t he sign with the Braves one time wihout his agent present just him his dad and JS?), playing in a new stadium, his knee injury, or just some type of depression obviously I don’t know but it seems more logical that some level of comfort and trust, along the inspiration and motivation the comfort of being back in a Braves UNI and I believe we could see at least half the defense/offense we have seen from him in the past. Is there anyone here that would not be happy to pay $1M for a Gold Glove and 29 HR? I really don’t think that is too far fetched.

Wren please do us fans a favor and give ANDY a shot, I think he will impress us all and get a standing O more than once at the Ted this year.

Come home Jones and hit us 30 or 40 mammoths like I know you can!!!!!

By Steve McP

February 5, 2009 10:36 PM | Link to this

Moises Hernandez’s only real claim to fame is that he was the brother of Felix - missed all of 2008 due to injury and even before that nothing much was happening in the minors for him, but who knows with prospects? Maybe he will come back with a killer fast ball and make an excellent closer in 2012!

By Ric

February 5, 2009 10:37 PM | Link to this

# 1- Sign Glavine. This is starting to make me ill. If you sign him for $ 3 million and he wins 5 games that will be a better buy than the Lowe salary per win. Tommy Glavine would put 100 % effort in with a broken arm. Yes, he went to the Mets but is an Atlantan all the way.

What about Mark Redmond? AA pitcher of the year. Not a bad pick-up for Tyler Yates. Does he have a chance to make the Big Team?

By Blane McFarnersternski

February 5, 2009 10:59 PM | Link to this

36th?

By Tim McCarver

February 5, 2009 11:06 PM | Link to this

You’re a real man Deion.

By Canadianbrave

February 5, 2009 11:16 PM | Link to this

DOB

Do you think the Braves are thinking that they might get a bit more power out of KJ, Kotchman and Escobar as they mature and rely on the outfield for speed and defense. Escobar does hit the ball hard and some of those might just start climbing the fence? After all hrs are hrs and it doesn’t really matter where they come from.

By Canadianbrave

February 5, 2009 11:30 PM | Link to this

I remember listening to the Braves on I think it was 750 Am when I was a kid. Maybe it was WSB. Anyway I remember the excitement That Aaron used to generate. What a solid player he was!! I’ll tell you right now that most of those 2200and something RBI’s were the game winning kind. The thing I remember most about his homeruns were how many came on 3-0 or 0-2 counts. You would think the at bat was over and crack it was out of there. The speed of his hands was incredible. I remember one game against the Expos where they slowmowed the at bat. It looked for sure like this inside pitch was right by him and then it was over the fence. Smart base runner, good outfielder, just an all round class act. He is the reason I became a baseball fan, and the reason I have stayed a Braves fan all these years. Wouldn’t it be a dream to have him on the team now!

By Chuck James was solid until the 6th!!!

February 5, 2009 11:33 PM | Link to this

Sign Keith Lockhart for 3 Yrs/27 Million. He is stellar.

By Canadianbrave

February 5, 2009 11:39 PM | Link to this

I’m pretty sure the radio announcer’s name was Ernie something. I do remeber that the station also got drowned out by some big detroit station, so we could only listen to the games for like 3 minutes out of every 15.

By AR Brave

February 5, 2009 11:51 PM | Link to this

Glavine would be good for the ole rotation of RHPs, but not as good as that LF bat. Sign dunn if possible or abreu. Forget nady and swisher and the prospects they cost. Seriously why would we do that? It makes zero sense.

Why have a one year rental in Nady, who will leave with boras after the season, only to try to fill the role again next year because Heyward is at least two years away.

Swisher is an average player that costs prospects and carries a salary that doesn’t suit him in this new economy. Man, I hope the Braves don’t waste money and prospects on him.

Dunn and abreu are our best bets because they won’t even cost a first round pick! It would be great to have a leadoff guy like Roberts but that isn’t happening. Can schafer fill the role of leadoff? Maybe josh Anderson?

I would be supremely happy with a lineup like 1 schafer 2 yunel 3 youknowwho 4 dunn/Abreu 5 mccann 6 kotchman 7 Kelly 8 frenchy 9 pitcher. That would be a fun lineup to watch.

If we can’t get abreu or dunn then sign glav and ohman and wait till later in the season. Here’s to hoping we don’t give up prospects an pay the salary for a player like swisher or nady.

By saff

February 5, 2009 11:53 PM | Link to this

BOLD ric mark redmond is a scrub hes awful the guy your thinking of is todd redmond

By AceCometh

February 5, 2009 11:58 PM | Link to this

After Smoltz abandoned the fans for a better chance of winning, the Braves Seriously need to offer Glavine a contract. And soon. We don’t need another PR hit like the one that roused the ire of die hard fans when the Bearded Icon walked away.

By uga-brave

February 6, 2009 12:08 AM | Link to this

denizens,

scoots, wayne, among others please do not throw up.

i believe francoeur is a about to have a pretty decent season.

i read the link to si/cnn.com.

he finally has realized his mecahnics, to say it lightly stunk.

if he really is doing what he says, shorter strides, keeping his weight back, and pushing his hands back before he committs, watch out.

the dude is definetly gifted, if he really learns how to drive the ball gap to gap, he could be the difference maker.

call me stupid, but i saw that hole in his swing a long time ago.

he is saying all the right things, and i think he has finally got it.

he always thought that he was, how do you say, the best player on the field.

no more, he understands the importance of his season.

look for a darn good season from him.

wow, yes i said it. got a hunch he will be pretty darn good this year.

i am now on the record of saying that francoeur might have a pretty great season.

so if, when he does, you heard it here first.

been his biggest critic, but will be his biggest fan.

By N8

February 6, 2009 12:11 AM | Link to this

Andruw Jones…..

You’re and idiot.

By AR Brave

February 6, 2009 12:20 AM | Link to this

I hope frenchy does bounce back strong. I will root for him regardless.

By uga-brave

February 6, 2009 12:36 AM | Link to this

N8,

why the hate on #25.

he was boarderline great in his time in the atl.

he pretty much carried us in the last year we made the playoffs.

i say sign glav, sign andruw and see what he has left, the juice might be worth the squeeze.

as for bobby abreu, leave it alone.

none of the free agents left really makes sense.

you will know right away whether #25 in spring training is done.

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 12:55 AM | Link to this

I have to admire one thing about the approach that Frank Wren has taken so far during this off season. The man has been unwavering in his single minded focus of improving the pitching.

That said, I think that Frank Wren is still waiting to see if and when Will Ohman and Tom Glavine will join the Braves. Until the question of yea or nay is answered concerning the two on them, it appears that our Braves are in a holding pattern?

If there is any clue as to whether or not our venerable GM is going to add another bat or stand pat, it’s the Braves 40 man roster.

Among the position players there are 3 catchers, 7 infielders and 6 outfielders. None of whom are candidates to be dropped off the 40 man roster. Leaving 24 pitchers from which one or two might be given the axe, but only if Ohman or Glavine are added. I can think of three who might be candidates: Phil Stockman, Anthony Lerew and James Parr.

Of course, there is always the trade scenario, which would open up the necessary roster space needed to add another bat.

And another thing. There are still more than seventy free agents on the market with nine days left until spring training opens. Buyers market….. ya think????

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 1:11 AM | Link to this

Wayne “The Train” was in fine form tonight. Still playing when we left (dude plays a couple of 90-minute sets each night). At times he sounds like Hank reincarnate. He really does. And a helluva band, including a stand-up “doghouse” bass player and pedal-steel….

uga-brave, if one didn’t know better, one might think you just like to go to one extreme or the other with Francoeur, and toward the other end than whatever the popular opinion seems to be. I mean you ripped him mercilessly for the past year or more, now when others rip him in similar fashion, after his terrible season, you predict a big season out of him based on something you read about him recognizing his mechanics were wrong.

Hey, OK, maybe he will have a big season. Just seems you were too quick to jump on him a year ago — before he’d actually had a bad season, and coming off a second straight 100-RBI season and a Gold Glove — and are now awful quick to predict a big rebound season from him. But I know the Braves hope you’re right….

And uga-brave, speaking of Athens (though I know this one is way after your time there) whatever happened to the alt-rock band The Glands, whose self-titled CD in 2000 was outstanding. I don’t think they’ve put out anything since then, and just assume they broke up at some point. Too bad. They were extremely promising….

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 1:13 AM | Link to this

Coach, it is truly remarkable that more than 70 free agents are still unsigned with spring training opening in barely over a week. And plenty of significant names in that bunch, too….

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 1:31 AM | Link to this

Coach If it’s a buyers market today, think what it will be by mid week next week!

uga I hope you are dead on about Frenchy my friend. A guy with that much natural ability, and “awe schucks” good looks, would be a shame to throw all that away.

Similar sentiments about Andruw. Dude, quit listening to your agent, and listen to your heart. Come back to the Braves, offer to come in on a minimum minor league salary. Heck offer to play for free this year (knowing that’s not really possible, but heck offer it anyway!). If you still have something in the tank, that will endear the team (FO and teammates) and fans to you. Otherwise, everybody will just say, AJ, go screw yourself. If you want to come back, you gotta do it with your hat in your hand.

I think Ohman is 50/50, due to the facts Dave lays out about the 3 other situational lefties on the team. Can’t really blame the Braves for needing to get him at a bargain, since we have 3 guys in waiting. All we need is for one of them to come through. Heck, last year, nobody really thought Ohman was a given until he put it all together. Who’s to say that Logan or Ridgway or O’Flaherty won’t be similar this year?

As for Glavine, I would love to have him in a Smoltz kinda situation. Only bring him in when we are 200% sure he is ready, even if that is in May or June. By that time we will know a lot more about the capability of all our current possibilities. We really aren’t 100% sure that KK will come in and make the rotation this year. Or even Hanson or Morton or Reyes, for that matter.

Can never have too many arms!

I still look for a deal for a guy like Nady, maybe moving Prado and a bullpen arm for him.

Like I said, the bargains on outfielders will get even better in another 4-5-6 days.

Nite all….

By SC James

February 6, 2009 1:32 AM | Link to this

DOB, Let me know what you think of this local band. http://www.afteraugust.net Also, with everyone denying having interest in Manny, will anyone actually sign him?

By tscott625

February 6, 2009 1:36 AM | Link to this

trade kj and some other guys for a big time lf/clean-up hitter and sign orlando hudson to play 2b and leadoff!!!!

By N8

February 6, 2009 1:47 AM | Link to this

uga

No hate for Andruw. I just think it’s assinine for him to refuse a minor league contract from the Yankees, when regardless of whether he plays at all (including the independant leagues), he’s still getting paid the remaining 21 million on his Dodgers contract.

If Dunn, Abreu and the likes (you know… guys that can still hit), are not getting offered decent money, why would Andruw turn that down?

Because he’s and idiot.

As for him pretty much “carrying us the last year we made the playoffs”?

So what? Dan Kolb, Chris Reitsma and HoRam all contributed to that squad too. Do you want them back as well?

Didn’t think so. No hate for Andruw. I stated a few weeks back when he got released, that if he was willing to take a minor league contract with an invite to ST and win a job there… PERFECT! So long as Bobby batted him no higher than 6th or 7th.

Not a chance in hell, that he’s shown enough to make a 40 man roster move for him WITHOUT seeing him at ST first.

If he’s demanding a major league contract, let him get it from somebody else.

“as for bobby abreu, leave it alone….none of the free agents left really makes sense.”

I totally agree. Which is what I’ve been saying for two weeks now (and DOB hinted - many times, including today - that Wren might think the same thing), that we should go to dark star, let it ride for a week or two, and re-assess.

But, if we were to make a run at any of the FA, my choice would be Abreu. I think if a move is to be made (mid-way through ST), that it will be in the form of a trade. Especially if Glavine is deemed healthy, and signed. We already (seemingly - just like last year), appear to have depth in our starting pitching, which means that somebody is gonna give up a decent OF for a young pitcher. Perhaps Jo-Jo Reyes for Young from Minnesota.

Not sure what it would take, or if he’s anybody I would want. But it’s gonna be THAT type of deal that happens, if anything at all.

I’m afraid I have to agree with Terrence Moore… We NEVER should have traded Jermaine Dye.

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 1:58 AM | Link to this

In our division, one of the best off season moves that no one is talking about is the Met’s acquisition of Tim Redding.

The former Washington National nailed down 33 starts last season, of which 20 were efforts where he gave up three earned runs or less. His 4.95 ERA is deceiving. The Nats were 20-13 when he started.

Considering the fact that Redding is the Met’s fifth starter along with the airtight bullpen headed by F.Rod and J.J. Putz, those Metrosexual’s are scary.

By uga-brave

February 6, 2009 2:15 AM | Link to this

DOB,

it is called discerning. i always called him a lunger.

if he quits that, who knows?

if he continues to jump at the ball, i will be wrong.

dave, i ripped him when he was as you say good.

at least i have enough of a open mind to say he has realized what does not work for him.

never seen a good hitter that dropped his hands and had no balance.

look at hoss’s swing, he might get fooled but the hands and weight are always back.

thus the ability to drive the ball to the off field.

if francoeur learns that he will be more then servicable.

just gotta a better then average hunch he might realize what went wrong.

what is wrong with that?

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 2:23 AM | Link to this

N8, I partially agree with you on the trade of Jermaine Dye. In retrospect, it looks like a major brain fart on the part of John Schuerholz.

But, you have to look at what Keith Lockhart and Michael Tucker contributed. Tucker was a decent outfielder for two seasons ( 97-98) and Keith Lockhart was a solid utility man for six years with the Braves. Tucker was also part of the Cincinnati trade that brought Bret Boone and Mike Remlinger to Atlanta.

Jermaine Dye was sacrificed to keep the division streak alive. Was he worth it? It’s all relative and opinion with no definitive answer.

By uga-brave

February 6, 2009 2:31 AM | Link to this

n8,

i think abreu is played out. you never know when a player hits the wall. plus we dont need another marginable left handed hitter.

spend the money on glav, if he is healthy his leadership will pay for itself.

not to be opining for the past, but he is the last piece of our run.

we needed a rh hitter. unless we get nady stand pat.

that being said, nady for a prospect would not hurt either.

nady is the right guy. dont care that it is a one year rental.

By N8

February 6, 2009 2:40 AM | Link to this

Coach

I was going to add either a (LOL!) or perhaps a (sarcasm), and just about added the little smiley face thing… :-)

It was purely sarcastic. While Dye would have been useful at times for us since the 97 trade, Braves fans would have been fed up with him not being healthy long ago. Add to that, you’re right Tucker and Lockhart definitely helped the Braves out.

If anybody actually recalls, when Lofton was healthy (really only the first month or so of 97), that was BY FAR the best “top of the order” this team has seen since the “run” began in 91.

The Braves went 19-6 in Aprile (averaging 5.6 runs per game), with Lofton [.395 BA, .434 OBP, 26 Runs, 11 SB] and Tucker [.418 BA, 20 RBI in the 2-hole], leading the way.

Of course the pitchers allowing only 73 runs (2.8 per game), didn’t hurt the record either.

I just get a kick out of people ragging on JS for trading Dye. Adding Lofton and Tucker (with Lockhart being an important bench player), was the CORRECT move at the time. Once Lofton got hurt, he wasn’t the same.

I truly believe that Lofton at 100 percent, makes a difference in that 97 series against the Marlins. Though (and DOB could attest, since he was covering them then), that the 97 Marlins were built specifically to match up head to head with the Bravos.

I disagree that Dye was “sacrificed” to keep the division streak alive. We had enough pitching (more than enough, actually) to keep the streek alive. Dye was traded with winning in October in mind.

Wainright was “sacrificed” in the JD Drew trade to keep the streak alive.

Just my opinion.

By CharlieAlphaBravo

February 6, 2009 2:48 AM | Link to this

I don’t think Abreu is marginable. He’s at least above averaged.

By N8

February 6, 2009 2:50 AM | Link to this

uga

“i think abreu is played out. you never know when a player hits the wall. plus we dont need another marginable left handed hitter.”

Agreed. I’ll repeat, IF we’re gonna go after a free agent, he’s the one to gamble on. Don’t think we should, though.

“we needed a rh hitter. unless we get nady stand pat.”

Again. Agree with you.

“nady is the right guy. dont care that it is a one year rental.”

Partially agree with you. For the RIGHT prospect, he’s the RIGHT guy. Just don’t wanna see us give up a Wainwright kind of guy for him on a one year rental.

If it’s Jo-Jo, or Charlie Morton (and who knows? That might look bad in hindsight 2 or 3 years down the road), go for it.

But I agree, Nady would be perfect for this lineup. That being said, his numbers AFTER being traded to NY, weren’t that great, either. But his defense is far superior to Dunn or Abreu, and of course, he’s RH.

That’s where Swisher comes in. Of course, he’d “cost” more prospects, due to being locked down for a few (3?) years. But I like that he’s a switch-hiter, can play multiple positions. But he’s just as “unknown” as relying on one of our prospects to win a job.

I still say that a platoon of B. Jones/Diaz (if Matt is healthy), is the best option to start the year, or at least going into spring training.

But I’m with you on Glavine. I think at this point, after watching what happened with Smoltz (and his past history of abandoning - allegedly - the Braves), he’s gonna be willing to settle for an incentive driven contract going into the year.

Tom Glavine of 2007 in the 5th slot of the rotation , would surely be acceptable to me. Only thing is that we don’t know what he has to offer in terms of health. But for christmas sakes, if Jamie Moyer at 45 can contribute, surely a first balot HOF pitcher of Tom’s pedigree can be affective, not?

By Chop Chop

February 6, 2009 2:57 AM | Link to this

Good one, CAB.

I saw “marginable” and started thinking about Parkay.

By scottbravesfan

February 6, 2009 3:03 AM | Link to this

It’s insane if the Braves don’t try and sign Abreau. The guy right there waiting for us to pick him up. They should also try and sign Glavine cheap so what he has left that way we can give Tommy Hanson another year in the minors.

By uga-brave

February 6, 2009 3:11 AM | Link to this

yeah but he is marginable, you guys got me.

chop chop, and cab. my bad. but he aint butter.

By BravesFan79

February 6, 2009 3:21 AM | Link to this

So Ohman has agreed to go to the Mets. That SUCKS!! I thought before the season ended, that it was important we lock up Smoltz and Ohman BEFORE other teams started throwing $$ at them! Look where its gotten us…… im so tired of the Braves thinking two 1.5 million relievers/backups can equal the production of one 3 million/year reliever/ backup player!

It got us NOWHERE with Chris Woodcrap, Corky Miller, etc….. now should we expect the same when a lefty reliever is put in the game in a crucial situation??
GREAT JOB WREN! YOU SUCK!

By brAves Sucios

February 6, 2009 3:25 AM | Link to this

DOB All the dudes in the Glands are still around town and mostly playing in other projects and/or working in local record shops. Rumors of a new record pop up every once in a while, but I have it on good sources that a show should happen sometime soon. Their first record is really good, too… can’t really beat songs like “The Livin’ Was Easy,” though.

Speaking from a similar time period, were you ever into RockATeens? Tenement Halls is Chris Lopez’ new project and they’re KILLER, though they too almost never play out and a second record is in serious need of being recorded and/or released.

By BravesFan79

February 6, 2009 3:27 AM | Link to this

Hanson another year in the minors? Are you people wanting to make the playoffs this year or not!? What else does this guy have to prove in the minors! JoJo could use more work in the minors, Hanson is a lock as a solid #4 starter at worst.

Waiting longer to bring Hanson up will be just like us starting out 2007 with Chris Woodcrap over Escobar… a BIG MISTAKE!

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 3:39 AM | Link to this

Um, Bravesfan79, that is not accurate.

this is

By ccrider

February 6, 2009 4:13 AM | Link to this

Bravesfan79, Where did you see Ohman signed with the Mets?

By TheAntiMe

February 6, 2009 4:39 AM | Link to this

Hey DOB, lol - I’ll bet you were the guy that the nice lady teacher on Romper Room was speaking to everytime she said, “Mr. Music, please?”

Spring Training and “MLB ‘09: The Show” are just one more month away. Good times!

By TheAntiMe

February 6, 2009 4:49 AM | Link to this

According to ESPN.com, the Mets are talking with Will Ohman’s agent but there has been nothing close to an agreement signed by any team with Ohman. It appears that the Phillies are also still interested in signing Ohman, as well.

By jed

February 6, 2009 4:52 AM | Link to this

i absolutely believe we’re going to go get a LF before ST. no way you spend all this money on pitching and then leave LF, for the most part, in the hands of brandon jones . especially not with a question mark in RF and a AAAA player in CF. you better assure as much stability in the outfield as possible. wren’s shown me he’s pretty smart so far, so i dont see him letting this slide. might indeed effect glavine and ohman however…

btw, what is going on with all the unsigned free agents? i’ve never seen an off-season like this. could be the economy, yes, but it seems like more than that. for example, nobody’s offered abreu a contract and that’s just downright peculiar, even taking into account the economy. meanwhile prices for FA’s continue to fall.

is there such a term as “soft collusion”?

By Random

February 6, 2009 5:33 AM | Link to this

spotts: “Did anyone actually read nolie’s, Aristotle’s, or Random’s enormous posts?”

Me! I did!

Two outta three, at least.

(Four outta five, if you count that I read mine three times.)

8-)

By Elmer

February 6, 2009 5:56 AM | Link to this

Schafer is the one to watch!

By ncscoots

February 6, 2009 6:09 AM | Link to this

Well, folks do forget that Brandon Jones showed excellent minor league power prior to last year. He suffered an injury in winter league last year which lingered during all of 2008, and I imagine you can attribute some of his off-year to that. If the Braves are thinking that way and look for him to return to his norms, I can see the logic in giving him a look before opting for a trade or FA. The other uncertainties in the OF make that more of a risky proposition, IMO, but I can see the reasoning behind it.

Even if that works out, though, that doesn’t solve the cleanup problem. I really think Chipper’s going to have to hit 4 this year. Even with uga’s seal of approval on Francoeur, LOL.

By John Fisher

February 6, 2009 6:58 AM | Link to this

Hey DOB,

Thanks for the update but…..

From what it sounds like you think the Braves are going to offer Ohman and Glavine an offer soon.

We defanitely wouldnt have enough money to sign both of them and sign/trade and left fielder.

So does this mean that Wren has decided our outfield is fine as it is??

Just asking

By Train Wreck Bystander

February 6, 2009 7:56 AM | Link to this

I find it very interesting that the NYY offered AJ a minor league deal. If the Yankees won’t overspend on someone, no one will.

Take the hint, Druw, or you’ll likely be taking the year off.

By BravesFan79

February 6, 2009 8:22 AM | Link to this

I cant validate the Ohman story, but i saw it somewhere. Hopefully i was wrong, or the one publishing the article last night was wrong! According to espn, nothing is official yet, so ill leave it up to DOB to be the expert on this…..

By BDubs

February 6, 2009 8:27 AM | Link to this

DOB:

I’ve got a quick question for you. Why won’t the Braves make a run to get Griffey in a one-year deal as a stop-gap to give our young boys one more year in the minors? His price has got to be dropping by the week, especially if Spring Training gets here without him on a contract. He adds a little pop to our OF. And, if we feel okay going to camp with Anderson, Blanco or Schafer, then we shouldn’t worry too much about an injury to Jr. b/c one of these guys could step up if Jr. goes down.

Just wonderin’… Thanks DOB. You got the best blog runnin’ (and I don’t just mean on the AJC)…

By Salt

February 6, 2009 8:37 AM | Link to this

I’ve been following the Braves like a soap opera every year since 1968 and, statistically speaking, 94.52% of the time, the state of the club at the beginning of Spring Training is NOT an indicator of how the season unfolds. As Skip used to say, “That’s why they play the games. That’s what makes it fun.”

78.36% of the time, Bobby Cox is a damn good manager.

Wayne Hancock has a song about my wife, “L-I-T-T-L-E-L-I-S-A, Oh, Little Lisa, you done stole my heart.”

Mobile Slim

By Travis

February 6, 2009 8:54 AM | Link to this

As the Braves stand now, the big hitters in the lineup are Chipper and Mac. With Mac getting every fifth day off behind the plate and Chiipper destined for some DL time the Braves will have nothing in the lineup to carry the team if they are both out. That potentially leaves the 3rd and 5th spot in the lineup with no sluggers to fill them. Unless my math is off (entirely possible) that is at least 32 games missed by Mac alone. We need a bopper in the lineup. Still think Dunn is the guy.

By albert

February 6, 2009 8:56 AM | Link to this

A couple of thoughts:

1) Wren may be waiting on arbitration outcomes for Kelly Johnson and Jeff Francoeur to see how much money is left for left field, Glavine and/or Ohman.

2) The Cardinals’ Ankiel and Ludwick are also in the middle of the arbitration process. They will probably trade one or the other to make room for Rasmus. Maybe Wren (and other GM’s) are waiting for the outcome of their arbitration hearings before committing to a trade.

3) The Braves may be waiting to see how a healthy Brandon Jones looks in Spring Training before making a move for a left fielder. Remember that Jones was a very good run producer with some power through most of his minor league career

By Goodoleboy58

February 6, 2009 8:58 AM | Link to this

I think we may be waiting for Spring Training so that other teams can see what Brandon Jones and company can do in action to up their value

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 8:59 AM | Link to this

I have only seen Ridgway pitch in blowout games. On the other hand, I haven’t seen Logan or O’Flaherty pitch either. I’ve only seen their line in boxscores. I’m starting to think Braves are not going to sign Ohman.

By Rolf

February 6, 2009 9:03 AM | Link to this

DOB - One Week to go until Spring Training?

I need to come up with $100M real quick. I’m going to start my own MLB team with the amazing number of free agents still out there….

My outfield will be Dunn, Griffey and Abreau. (Don’t ask me who is playing CF, because I don’t have time to hammer out those unimportant details…lol.) Nomar at first, Hudson at 2nd, Cabrera at 3rd, and Crede at 3rd. Lets put Johnny Estrada behind the plate. We then go sign Glavine, Wolf, Pedro, Benson and who else but Chuck James in the five slot. We’d get Ohman among the relievers we sign.

We then head to Vegas, sign a stadium deal, call the team the “Vegas Gamblers” We join the AL West. Ohman would introduce the players of each team every home game with his Harry Caray impression.

I think we finish 2nd or 3rd in the division despite our defensive woes. (I find it hard to believe that this team would not beat the Mariners…. ) We’d finish 2nd if Chuck can give us 5 or more quality starts during the year.

By Chief Nock A Homa

February 6, 2009 9:18 AM | Link to this

176th??!

By Anders

February 6, 2009 9:25 AM | Link to this

Lew

Not sure if you’ll be on here this morning and my day looks like it might be pretty busy but I wanted to make sure I acknowledged the article in Newsday today about the money the “Mets” lost in the Madoff scandal. Not just Wilpon’s money but the Met’s organization. I’ve been on here saying per reports it was only Wilpon who lost some of his non-Met money and you’ve felt there was more to it than that. If Newsday’s report is correct (which I have no reason to believe it wasn’t) than so were you. As one who ask’s others to “man up” on here I needed to do the same with you. I didn’t see the figures for the 13 accounts the Mets reportedly had with Madoff so I don’t know how deep the loss is.

That said, while I do now believe this may have influenced their willingness to go the extra mile to get Manny (you’ve said that repeatedly as well)they still have a payroll in the $140 mil range so I wouldn’t paint them as exactly destitute.

Put this one in the win column for you. I’ll get back on when I can today.

By jon-b

February 6, 2009 9:26 AM | Link to this

Just read in the Rocky Mountain News that Tracy Ringolsby says that the White Sox may have the inside track on Abreu because of the friendship and shared nationality with manager Guillen. The link for that is below:

http://www.rockymountainnews.com/news/2009/feb/05/ringolsby-repeat-performance-for-rays-doubtful/

Looking forward to P&C on Valentine’s Day!

By Raymond K

February 6, 2009 9:41 AM | Link to this

I read that the Mets are intersted in Ohman or Biemel as they are thin on the left side in the bullpen. Minaya spoke to Ohman’s agent this past Wed. He may be going to another NL East foe. If the Mets outbid the Braves, I think Ohman is gone. (If the Braves play around with Glavine, he won’t be with them either.)

By Train Wreck Bystander

February 6, 2009 9:41 AM | Link to this

Here’s a schedule of pitcher/catcher dates for all of MLB, including the minors.

And to go off-topic to music, Paul Simon’s Graceland album is a $5 MP3 download today at Amazon. FWIW.

By Tami

February 6, 2009 9:49 AM | Link to this

(1) Selig is waaay OVERpaid. I’d love to see another commish, but I’ve always felt that way about the guy.

(2) We really need Ohman, I’m thinking. He’s a proven pitcher, whereas the other lesser-known pitchers DOB mentioned are not. I hate to say this, but I think the Braves need him more than Glav.

(3) Regarding Glav: I don’t think it would be right, though, to let him go. In my humble estimation, I’m thinking this season is likely Glav’s last anyway. So, he could end up being the “feel-good” story of the 2009 season by coming back from his first-ever DL stint to help bring the Braves back to postseason competition. What a way to go out!!

Well…OK. It WOULD be a great feel-good story IF the Braves actually make it to the postseason. But, it’s nice to think about while we’re still in our big preseason hopefulness. LOL.

By Original Jon

February 6, 2009 9:49 AM | Link to this

Hey DOB

Whats with all the talk about only having so much money left that we could only do one thing or another? So is the Braves front office saying that if we were able to get Abreu for 5 million and Ohman for 3 million, that they wouldnt shell out 2 or 3 more million to sign Glavine? Or Vice Versa, that if we signed Ohman and Glav that they wouldnt shell out a few more dollars for an outfielder that can hit? I find it hard to believe that they would spend so much money in hopes of being contenders to let a few million stand in the way of acquiring the help we need.

I cant see them saying, “man, too bad we couldnt have spent just 3 million more to get that hitter we needed” Oh wait, we CAN!!!!!!

By Tami

February 6, 2009 9:55 AM | Link to this

P.S…..wished I seen the comment that Albert @ 8:56 am left. I agree with you Albert. I didn’t realize all those guys were STILL waiting for a contract. It would be nice to get one of those bats. It would make sense why Ohman or Glavine haven’t been signed yet.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 9:56 AM | Link to this

From what it sounds like you think the Braves are going to offer Ohman and Glavine an offer soon.

We defanitely wouldnt have enough money to sign both of them and sign/trade and left fielder.

So does this mean that Wren has decided our outfield is fine as it is??Josh Fisher

John, they already made offer for Ohman — in November. Don’t know if they have or are planning to raise it, might not be willing to get in a bidding war.

Just a gut feeling they’re probably going to make an offer to Glavine soon. But not a really strong (gut feeling), to be honest with you.

I explained above, in the blog itself, what I thought as far as how they might be looking at the outfield situation.

By Kentavo

February 6, 2009 9:56 AM | Link to this

I’m on the Garret Anderson bandwagon - sign him!!!

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 9:58 AM | Link to this

braves sucios: thanks for the update on the Glands. Does one of the band members work at Criminal, by chance? (I know at least one of the guys in Anna Kramer & The Lost Cause works there)

By Howie from Poughkeepsie

February 6, 2009 9:58 AM | Link to this

Offering Glavine an incentive ladened contract that starts at say $2m-$3m makes alot of sense - if he appears healthy. Tom provides a presence in the locker room, on the bench and on the plane when traveling that cannot be matched by other alternatives for a #5 starter. Good teams always have that type of leadership and outside of Chipper the Braves don’t have it. Glavine’s value goes way way beyond the stats he provides. Get Tom in Spring training and see how it goes with his pitching - but please don’t discount his other value. That was the REAL mistake by not signing Smoltz - let’s ‘fix’ that by signing Glavine.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 9:59 AM | Link to this

ROLF

You can sign Ben Sheets!? And don’t forget Manny!!!

Who would your closer be? Who would be in your bullpen?

Let’s see. Ohman would be the…CLOSER? Nahhh Emil Brown can come off the bench. Luis Rivas can ccome off the bench.

I would make Chuck James my long man.

Glavine, Wolf, Pedro, Kris Benson,

By wide right

February 6, 2009 10:00 AM | Link to this

If the Braves were to sign Glavine, making him the 5th starter, would Jo-Jo be an option as a left-handed specialist in the bullpen? Would he be good enough so that we wouldnt need Ohman? At least, good enough so it would make more sense to trade for Nady?

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 10:00 AM | Link to this

So is the Braves front office saying that if we were able to get Abreu for 5 million and Ohman for 3 million, that they wouldnt shell out 2 or 3 more million to sign Glavine? Original Jon

You might have noticed, the Braves front office isn’t saying anything about their finances. Just a leak here and a rumor there about how they might be pursuing this guy or not pursuing anyone one week, then considering trades the next.

Quite frankly, at this point I’ll be glad when spring training starts.

By Lew

February 6, 2009 10:01 AM | Link to this

Anders-Thanks Dude. I appreciate that. A salary level of $140 million might not leave enough left for someone like Manny. I also read today that the Mets are signing Elmer Dessens to a minor league contract. Now I’m certain they have no money left. Believe me-you’ll just LOVE Elmer. Really y’all will. He’s very effective.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 10:03 AM | Link to this

I read that the Mets are intersted in Ohman or Biemel as they are thin on the left side in the bullpen

Doesn’t instill a lot of confidence in Pedro Feliciano

The Mutts seem desperate

By Train Wreck Bystander

February 6, 2009 10:06 AM | Link to this

That spring training link ended up garbled somehow (probably my bad, it’s late for us night owls).

Here ‘tis again: http://www.springtrainingonline.com/features/reporting-dates.htm

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 10:08 AM | Link to this

Glavine could be this year’s Charlie Leibrandt!!! ha ha ha.

By Tami

February 6, 2009 10:11 AM | Link to this

I thought I heard yesterday that Sheets has to have surgery on his pitching arm. Anyone catch that? I’m about to go surf the ‘Net to catch the latest on that developing story.

If that’s still true, we can be glad that the Braves didn’t sell the farm to get the kid, only to lose him (maybe for the season, if not a good portion of it) before anyone even reports to spring training.

By Butch Haynes

February 6, 2009 10:12 AM | Link to this

I’d like to thank the headline writer for the AJC Sports section for making me think Hank Aaron was dead this morning. There’s a front page story on Aaron’s birthday celebration, which I did not initially read. But as I flipped through the sports section, I saw the headline for the continuation of that story on page four, which states that the baseball legend was “eulogized” at the gathering. I understand that technically “eulogize” means to praise someone. But come on, that is a loaded word and is commonly - heck, almost exclusively - associated with funerals. The first thing you think of when they hear “eulogy” or “eulogize” is dead guy. Anyway, I went back and read enough of the story to confirm that, despite the headline, Aaron is not dead. Thank you AJC headline writer!

By Rolf

February 6, 2009 10:15 AM | Link to this

Getnathan

At Belagio Field, home to the Vegas Gamblers, Jason Isringhausen will be our closer and Rudy Seanez will be the set-up guy. (or are those guys signed yet?)

Also, I just reviewed the preliminary drawings for Belagio Field and have modified the center field wall to 375 feet - thereby solving the issue of a lack of a true center fielder. Most of the games will have a total of over 15 runs per game. The extended duration of the games due to all of the runs will mean that we will have astounding concession revenue. The gamblers will lead the league in runs, HR’s, and (highest) ERA.

By dmack

February 6, 2009 10:17 AM | Link to this

Dave

Do you consider the off season a success if the Braves do not start the season with somebody not named Diaz, Blanco, or Jones in left field.

I like the revamped rotation, but you have to score runs as well. Our OF was the least productive in all of baseball last year. It needs help too.

Seems like a waste of money to dump everything into the rotation, and ignore the LF situation. I hope that the Braves have been smart about financies and reserved some money for Glavine and a left fielder.

By AGTfan

February 6, 2009 10:18 AM | Link to this

uga-brave I’m writing this after awakening from my fainting spell from your post. I think most of us hope you’re right. Hopefully we see the real Frenchy this year and last year was an aberation. It’s good to see that you’re pulling for him. Will it last past the first DP with bases loaded on a first pitch? I think you’re right about the hole in his swing and it does sound like he’s addressing it. And maybe he’s learned the difference between football conditioning and baseball conditioning. The extra weight and upper body muscle mass was a huge mistake last year. It also sounds like he’s getting some help from Chipper. I wonder if Chipper becomes a hitting coach after he hangs up the spikes?

By The GM

February 6, 2009 10:21 AM | Link to this

There is no reason to sign another over the hill pitcher like Glavine thereby blocking a young pitcher like Hanson from making the starting rotation. You can’t get excited about the rotation as it stands. When are the Braves going to develop their younger players like Tampa and Florida and quit trying to win another one for Bobby before he hangs it up. This isn’t exciting folks when you don’t have the bats to support the pitching and the pitchers are average at best. Lets get the young kids up here and in 2-3 years the Braves should again be able to consistently challenge at least for divsion championships. A new manager with a little more fire would help too.

By Mark

February 6, 2009 10:22 AM | Link to this

DOB,

Did you watch The Office last night? This season is def. coming to form. Andy is quietly becoming one of my favorite characters.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 10:28 AM | Link to this

ROLF

What division would the Gamblers be in? The NL WEST. In that division, they’d have a shot at winning it. With the dimensions in that ballpark, it would be today what Coors Field used to be. A place where hitters break out of slumps.

By Lew

February 6, 2009 10:38 AM | Link to this

Tami-Sheets has a torn flexor tendon in his elbow. Not surprising to some of us here who realized all along there was way too much potential for serious surgery in his near future

By DAP

February 6, 2009 10:39 AM | Link to this

“The Mutts seem desperate”

i wouldnt say desperate, but they are definitely not going top shelf for their players this offseason. contrary to what coach thinks, signing tim redding was not smart (for a team with money) because at that point there were still many starters available who would have been much better than redding.

they are building their team very frugally, which is fine, but it just tell me that they dont have money to throw around like they allegedly were supposed to. and, as anders has pointed out this morning, our hunch might be correct on that one.

count me among those who thinks its a mistake for the braves not to get someone for left field. i think they need to build the team to be as good as possible form the beginning, not wait. now, if there are reasons they cant get a guy, like money, resources for trade, ect, than i understand. but, if the braves front office thinks its a good idea to try with what they got, i think thats a mistake.

By Bayou Brave

February 6, 2009 10:48 AM | Link to this

Rolf No Manny on your team? Also, Jim Edmunds could play CF since your left and right fielders are defensive liabilities.

I assume you meant Cabrera at SS.

I think Ivan Rodriguez would be a valuable pickup to split time with Estrada.

Gotta sign Paul Byrd over Chuck.

In addition to Ohman, I’m sure you’d sign Eric Gagne, Jason Isringhausen and Luis Ayala.

By ryan c

February 6, 2009 10:54 AM | Link to this

the problem with not having a power left fielder can probably go unnoticed on days when we face a right hander and everyone is healthy. but the days where chipper is hurt, mccann is resting, francoeur is sucking, and kj isn’t streaking (not in the naked sense), we will blow and blow hard. those would be the days where an adam dunn bomb with 1 man on would be the difference maker. a power outfielder is needed on an offense that’s so inconsistent.

By JOE

February 6, 2009 10:55 AM | Link to this

I’m in New orleans- Love the blog and all the info from Dave. Can’t wait for Spring training.Will be down there in March for three games.

My Question(stupid probably)- why is Stadium in Disney called DARK STAR?

Thanks. keep up the good work. Going to see The reader tomorrow- based on your recomendation.

By Steve from OH

February 6, 2009 11:00 AM | Link to this

CanadianBrave: It was Ernie Harwell. One of the greatest ever.

By BravesFan79

February 6, 2009 11:00 AM | Link to this

wide right: you seriously think Jo Jo could replace all the clutch innings Ohman threw last year?? Did you even WATCH the Braves last year? lol…….. Lets hope this lefty we got in the trade does better work in the NL than AL, because i got a feeling Ohman isnt coming back.
Hope im wrong!

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:02 AM | Link to this

I noticed that Furcal was logging a few games at 2nd base during winter ball. Too bad he wouldn’t do that for Atlanta. I know this isn’t a cooking sight! But since you guys seem to have such good taste in music and baseball teams and I’m desperate, does anyone know where I might get a good recipe for lasagna.(no peppers please)

By Prime Time

February 6, 2009 11:04 AM | Link to this

Bottom line is that the Braves need another bat (LF) to be even considered a true contender. the rotation looks good but we had enough one run losses last year.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 11:08 AM | Link to this

Joe, look forward to seeing you at Dark Star. Oh, and it’s a mystery, the origin of that name.

By Original Jon

February 6, 2009 11:10 AM | Link to this

Hey DOB I agree with you on wishing spring training would start, wish it was here today!!!!

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 11:10 AM | Link to this

Lew, regarding Sheets: Can you imagine if some team (such as the Braves, if they made decisions based on outside recommendations) had signed Sheets to, say, a two-year contract in November?

And then he had what’s likely season-ending surgery before he’d even reported to his first spring training with the new team?

By Chris Pine Is not Kirk!

February 6, 2009 11:11 AM | Link to this

Im sorry but our team just doesnt look like we will be the power team we use to be. We dont have one guy minus chipper whom could hit 30 hr’s this year. Even if JF comes back to full form we just dont have enough bad speed.

Also I am not impressed with our starting pitching rotation, seems like we are all just trying to stay positive about this year, when in reality we are probably looking at a 3rd or 4th place finish again.

Oh DOB you going to see Friday The 13th remake next Friday? Oh trivia time too….Who knows whom Shelly is in the F13th series!

By Chris Pine Is not Kirk!

February 6, 2009 11:11 AM | Link to this

Im sorry but our team just doesnt look like we will be the power team we use to be. We dont have one guy minus chipper whom could hit 30 hr’s this year. Even if JF comes back to full form we just dont have enough bad speed.

Also I am not impressed with our starting pitching rotation, seems like we are all just trying to stay positive about this year, when in reality we are probably looking at a 3rd or 4th place finish again.

Oh DOB you going to see Friday The 13th remake next Friday? Oh trivia time too….Who knows whom Shelly is in the F13th series!

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:13 AM | Link to this

GM I agree with your comment about needing a little more fire! I understand that Schafer plays that way! Although I have never seen him personally. I know Diaz plays with some fire, if only he was more multi-talented. If someone could light a fire under Escobar, I think he would be a hell of a player, but he just seems so unemotional and mechanical. I just hope the Braves don’t field a lineup where McCann leads the teams in Hrs. and stolen bases.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 11:16 AM | Link to this

DAP

Braves are waiting on 2 fronts:
Waiting to see if Logan, O’Flaherty, Or Ridgway can take over that lefty setup role out of the bullpen. If one of them can, they don’t spend the money on Ohman. If they cannot, they might pony up to sign him.

Also, I think they are going to wait even longer on the LF situation. They may go in to the season with what they’ve got (Diaz, Brandon Jones, Jordan Schafer, et al).

If they can only afford to address one of the two situations immediately, I would rather them get a LF who can hit for power.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 11:21 AM | Link to this

I’m sure it’s been noted here before, but just in case it hasn’t: I was just looking over payrolls and stuff from last year, and did you realize that the teams with the three highest payrolls in baseball all failed to get to the playoffs in 2008?

The Yankees ($209 mill), Tigers ($138 mill) and Mets ($138 mill) spent nearly half a billion on player salaries (more than half a billion with luxury taxes included) and played no postseason games.

By Rolf

February 6, 2009 11:21 AM | Link to this

Bayou All great roster suggestions for our initial year at “The Gio.” (pronounced “Joe.”) I didn’t include Manny, because I’d rather Many be Manny somewhere else. Besides, I’m afraid he’d be constantly distracted by the scantily clad - tassel laden roaming concession girls hawking overpriced beers to our fan base during our marathon games.

I like Chuck on the roster, because frankly I like the guy. It’s not his fault that on some days one of his two pitches was not working.

I’m thinking about involving the Cirque folks somehow during the 7th inning stretch, but I haven’t figured out that one yet.

Also, I want to stay in the AL West. I still can’t figure out why the NL Central has 6 teams and the AL West only has 4. Why would the Gamblers want to go into a division with 5 already? I realize that our chance of winning the division is slim (‘cause of the Halos), but I’m sticking to it.

By Braveheart

February 6, 2009 11:24 AM | Link to this

Ooohh la la ah oui oui

I say Muhammad Ali, ya say Cassius Clay

I say butter, you say Parkay

By Daybed Wagmoe

February 6, 2009 11:30 AM | Link to this

I know that one of the guys (the keyboardist/vocalist) from The Glands works in School Kids Records on Clayton Street in Athens. At least, he did the whole time I lived in Athens, which was up until July.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 11:32 AM | Link to this

getnathan

I doubt Ohman will wait until late February or March to sign. The Braves might prefer to give the other lefties in camp a couple of weeks and decide whether they can pitch well enough to make Ohman more a luxury than a necessity. But I’m thinking that the Mets would jump in with an offer if he hasn’t signed by the end of next week. And if the Braves don’t match that offer, Ohman would take it.

As for LF, yeah, I agree they can be more patient.

My preferences (as if anyone in the FO cares): If you have enough money to sign Glavine, Ohman or a LF, spend it on the offense.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 11:32 AM | Link to this

chris pine is…

i think the braves pitching will pleasantly surprise you. the bullpen will be very good to. even with the injuries in the bullpen last year, they were very good, until later in the season when they were worn down. the starters we have for 2009 will not only give us quality innings, but they will help keep the guys in the bullpen fresh and effective. having the top 4 pitchers all likely to throw 780 innings is going to be real nice, and will lead to consistent play and fewer late-game meltdowns. (which resulted in many of the one runs losses that we faced)

with the lineup, i agree kind of. i dont think its as bad as you make it sound, but the braves need a guy to bat in the middle of the order. im talking someone to hit either in the 3, 4, or 5 spot in the order, and add some stability. i think nady would be perfect, one year rental or not. swisher or abreu would also be nice. the braves do need to add someone, definitely.

By Lew

February 6, 2009 11:33 AM | Link to this

DOB-I guess that’s why bloggers aren’t routinely considered for front office positions. Kind of like those thinking over the past few years that trading Horacio, Langerhans, Orr or some other players of their ilk would net us a superstar. Delusion tends to run rampant at times-or as The Lizard King once said-“The Lunatic reigns supreme in the heat of the night.”.

My track record this winter has been pretty good, though. I called for shorting Sheets and signing Vasquez and Lowe. Now I’ll go a bit further out on a limb since my prognostication has been spot on-Frenchy will be back and back strong. Kelly will retain consistency and we will contend all year whether or not we get that power hitting outfielder. I’d still sign Ohman, though and might consider changing my mind about signing Glavine if healthy-as long as it was for the back end of the rotation

By Lew

February 6, 2009 11:35 AM | Link to this

Chris Pine-No bad speed? How about Mac?

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:36 AM | Link to this

DOB the three highest payrolls …lost That’s because Show Boats don’t win championships! You can have a couple on your team because of their talent! But when you field an entire team, they compete with each other and not with the rest of the league!

By DAP

February 6, 2009 11:38 AM | Link to this

getnathan if the braves are waiting to see what the other lefties do, they will wait to long. ohman will be signed by the time they can find out. i hope they arent doing that.

i find it more likely that they are waiting to see what kelly and frenchy get in arbitration, so that they can examine the budget. they are getting close to the max so they need to be careful when adding a this point.

i think the pitching will be fine as it is. id like to add ohman, but i dont think its as important as a LFer. i think not getting a LFer is a mistake. we could get by without ohman and definitely without glavine.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 11:40 AM | Link to this

Chris Pine: That falls under the category of movies being remade way too soon, if they ever need to be remade at all.

What’s the point? Like with The Omen, which someone remade a couple of years ago, turning a classic thriller into just another entirely forgettable movie not worth the time.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:46 AM | Link to this

Steve From Ohio

Ernie Harwell was the guy blocking us out on the Detroit ststion I think. The Braves announcer was Ernie something else

By mbatl

February 6, 2009 11:52 AM | Link to this

Ernie Johnson, Sr. … come on guys! He’s in the Braves HOF!

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:54 AM | Link to this

Lew

Tom Waits said, In the Land of the Blind the One-eyed Man is King

Maybe the other Gms are getting smarter and the don’t want to be fleeced any more.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 11:57 AM | Link to this

Canadianbrave,

You’re thinking of the legendary Ernie Johnson (Sr.), who was on Braves radio and TV from the 1960s until he retired (was it just before the streak started in ‘91?). His son’s the studio host of Turner’s NBA coverage.

He called a few games a year on TBS even after he officially retired. If I’m not mistaken, he coined the phrase, “Time to open another can of pitchers,” which Skip used as well.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:01 PM | Link to this

mbati

Thanks! I can hear his voice now!

By keylargo

February 6, 2009 12:01 PM | Link to this

The Yankees ($209 mill), Tigers ($138 mill) and Mets ($138 mill) spent nearly half a billion on player salaries (more than half a billion with luxury taxes included) and played no postseason games. DOB

I can’t resist not adding to that post that the Yankees, Tigers and Mets combined played to the exact winning % of the Florida Marlins whose payroll was less than $22,000,000.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 12:02 PM | Link to this

BTW, if the Braves are going to bottom-feed for a LF, I’d prefer they not sign Luis Gonzalez. His OPS has fallen off a cliff the last two years and he didn’t hit RHP well to be a realistic platoon guy. And I don’t think you can count on him to play in the field more than 40-50 games.

If we didn’t have Norton, you might consider him as a PH, but I like Norton a lot better (plus he’s a switch-hitter).

Rather pay a little more for Edmonds or Griffey as a part-time LF on the cheap. Or see what we’ve got in March and shop around if needed.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 12:07 PM | Link to this

DAVID O’BRIEN High payrolls don’t equal championships. That’s why Yankees will have a hard time getting to the playoffs every year.

DAP Yes, I am with you on the fact if the Braves are playing a waiting game with Ohman, they will have waited too long. They might as well just settle on Logan, O’Flaherty, or Ridgway right now and not even think about signing him.

They would be wise to get a left fielder who can hit for power. Someone they can stick in the middle of the lineup.

By Jared

February 6, 2009 12:08 PM | Link to this

I’m actually ok with having Josh Anderson or Blanco starting in CF. It’s not like light-hitting speedsters haven’t worked before for us(see Otis Nixon). They both play good defense and can cause havic on the basepaths, which is sorely needed. When a team goes “younger”, you automatically get faster. Bobby has always said that he coaches to his teams strength. Also not concerned with a potential platoon in LF. The pitching was the major issue last year, not offense. I believe that they were still a top 10 team offensively, without any help from the outfield. Pitching and defense! Stay away from Dunn and Abreu!

By richbrave

February 6, 2009 12:15 PM | Link to this

I saw a headline coming in to the blog today saying OHMAN was considering an offer from the METS. For goodness sakes, sign this guy, and let the METS go after RIDGWAY, O’FLAHERTY and LOGAN. Dave your choice of cryptic as a descriptive adjective in relation to WIL’s e-mail sounds ominous to me. I’m not privy to the assessments of OHMAN vs. the trio of pretenders to the position, but the man’s proven, and he’s certainly earned the BRAVES respect. If he hasn’t earned their respect with his clubhouse humor and on field demeanor, I would consider that a serious flaw within the franchise. He’s a known quality quantity, solid when the chips are down. Its his last shot at a decent payday. Lets play ball with the man. Besides, I don’t want to see him coming on in the eight against us. He’s tough to deal with.

By Mets Stink

February 6, 2009 12:15 PM | Link to this

Mark, I thought last night’s episode of The Office was really good too. I wish they were all an hour, though. The hour long episodes are always much funnier. I think it’s because they have extra time to really develop each story line.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 12:16 PM | Link to this

happy birthday bob marley!

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:21 PM | Link to this

Lew

In the Land of the Blind the one-eyed man is king

Sorry I attributed that quote to Tom Waits, but I guess it belonged to a 5th century philosopher Desiderius Arasmus

My mistake!

By KC

February 6, 2009 12:21 PM | Link to this

DOB: “Joe, look forward to seeing you at Dark Star. Oh, and it’s a mystery, the origin of that name.”

DOB, it was discovered by the Germans in 1732, and was originally named “Darent Steer”, which of course means “a whale’s vagina”.

By brAves Sucios

February 6, 2009 12:22 PM | Link to this

DOB I was thinking of School Kids Records in Athens… the place you can buy a copy of the disc from the guy who wrote and sang on the disc. All the members I can think of still live in Athens, but there very well could be someone I’m missing that works at Criminal.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:29 PM | Link to this

Jared

I agree with your philosophy, but all the contributors to this blog have convinced me that we do need a little more slugging from somewhere! When I look at some of the stats some of these guys have posted, we do need some more hitting especially timely hitting. Maybe we can get it from within! I hope so! Go Braves

By richbrave

February 6, 2009 12:40 PM | Link to this

LEW:

You must have long arms. Pat yourself on the back why doncha’!!!!

By Lew

February 6, 2009 12:42 PM | Link to this

Canadian Brave-Even after 16 procedures on my right eye, I can still see quite well, Thank You. No need for a coronation-I don’t look all that good in Ermine Robes.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 12:43 PM | Link to this

I can’t wait until Spring Training. I’m tired of the talk. I want to actually see these players play. WIll be difficult from where I live. I will only see Braves 19 times when they play the Mets; another 3 times when they play the Stankees; and another 3 times when they play the Red Sox (until I move down there). And maybe 2 other times when they are on national TV. So only 27-30 times my favorite team will be on TV. I’ll probably only see them a handful of times out of that. Woe is me!!!

By Anders

February 6, 2009 12:45 PM | Link to this

“The Yankees ($209 mill), Tigers ($138 mill) and Mets ($138 mill) spent nearly half a billion on player salaries (more than half a billion with luxury taxes included) and played no postseason games.” - DOB

Anything on that list about revenues and net income? I’m thinking that’s how the owners keep score.While spending the most certainly gaurantees nothing on the field it generally helps create enough interest for ticket sales, advertising, concessions etc…

Speaking of concessions, the Yankees and the Cowboys have come together to form their own company that will provide the concessions at the new Yankee stadium and Cowboys stadium. When Randy Levine of the Ynaks was discussing it he said they felt there was a caling by fans for a better grade of concessions at the games as well as better service. I couldn’t agree more. An overcooked burger sitting under a heat lamp with grease soaked fries and a beer for $25 sure sucks. Knowing the Yanks they will take this over the top. I expect they will have world class concessions and make the experience a more pleasant one. Hate them as I do I have to give them credit that they never go halfway on anything. Plus they hope to brand this company and offer the services nationally. - Great, more revenue for the Yanks!

By Bob Marley

February 6, 2009 12:47 PM | Link to this

Thank you, I am taking a dirt nap, so I cannot make the party.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:48 PM | Link to this

DOB

About half way through the morning my posts started to be censored. I don’t recall saying anything rude or offensive, at least I don’t remember saying anything like that. I hope I haven’t offended anyone and I apologize if I have. It was certainly not my intention. If this is a general problem, please disregard this comment!

Thanks

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:49 PM | Link to this

DOB

About half way through the morning my posts started to be censored. I don’t recall saying anything rude or offensive, at least I don’t remember saying anything like that. I hope I haven’t offended anyone and I apologize if I have. It was certainly not my intention. If this is a general problem, please disregard this comment!

Thanks

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:49 PM | Link to this

DOB

About half way through the morning my posts started to be censored. I don’t recall saying anything rude or offensive, at least I don’t remember saying anything like that. I hope I haven’t offended anyone and I apologize if I have. It was certainly not my intention. If this is a general problem, please disregard this comment!

Thanks

By Jim

February 6, 2009 12:50 PM | Link to this

DOB,

When do KJ’s and Francouer’s contracts go to arbitration, and is there a good chance that the Braves will settle with KJ at least before then? Also, is there any more information coming from the pitching camp? Has Morton showed up, and, if so, is he fully recovered from his injury issues from last year? I think too many people on this blog might be selling him short.

By brian

February 6, 2009 12:51 PM | Link to this

if the ESPN rumor mill has any truth to it, and Glavine is looking for $2-3 million guaranteed then the Braves should sign him. As a 5th starter, with his experience, and at that price we should get him. Glavine is worth that much simply to have him in the dugout working with the younger players and being the leader of the team.

The rumor mill said that the Braves might consider Andruw Jones instead. I am sorry but if it came down to Tommy or Andruw I will take Glavine every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

By the way, there was also the report of OF Jones signing with the Reds. Of course it was Jacques not Andruw and Jacques did agree to a minor league contract.

By Lew

February 6, 2009 12:54 PM | Link to this

RichBrave-Dude, when you’re right, you’re right. I sure caught all sorts of grief predicting Vasquez and Lowe. Why shouldn’t I mention I was right? I sure as hell hear it when I’m wrong.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 12:55 PM | Link to this

Lew

Nothing wrong with your insight, I was referring to JS

By Stinky

February 6, 2009 12:57 PM | Link to this

Multiple posts of the same comment will get you banned Canadianbrave, just like me.

By Salty Dawg

February 6, 2009 12:57 PM | Link to this

DOB (or anyone else for that matter)

This may have already been asked and answered - if so I apologize for being redundant.

It’s been noted that we don’t really know what the Braves limits are payroll-wise, but we’ve all speculated. How do they factor in an incentive laden deal such as might be offered to Glavine? For instance, if they offer him $1M guaranteed with incentives up to $6M, do they count the entire $6M towards payroll and stop shopping for an OF (assuming $6M is what they have left), or do they count it as $2M and consider themselves to have $4M left to spend on said OF?

By Brian

February 6, 2009 1:00 PM | Link to this

Read where Cox is lobbying for A. Jones…big surprise there. Well, if they plan on going into SP without getting a LF, than why not just sign the guy to a Major league contract for $400,000? That’s probably what Cox is thinking to, maybe. Also reading where Atl. is the frontrunners for Swisher, but the Yanks won’t pay for some of his contract. Good, that guy stinks at the plate, but he is versital, so I can see the attraction.

By keylargo

February 6, 2009 1:02 PM | Link to this

Jared

I looked over Bobby Abreu’s stats pretty thoroughy a couple of weeks ago and I will have to say I am convinced he is the best outfielder available. And I would start him over Blanco or Anderson.

Abreu’s stats just have not declined significantly since 2005. One thing that shocked me is that he had 22 stolen bases last year. Blanco and Anderson had 23 combined. Somehow I have a feeling we could use the 20 dingers and 100 rbi’s that Abreu had last year.

By Johnny B

February 6, 2009 1:07 PM | Link to this

I also would like to see the Braves make an offer to Garret Anderson. Dude may not be a pure power hitter but his overall consistency and solid defense would really be a bonus in LF.

.296 lifetime hitter, 19 hrs, 35 doubles, and 90 rbi on average. .796 lifetime slugging percentage and rated 5th best defensive outfielder in baseball…and his splits are great against righties and lefties.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 1:08 PM | Link to this

Stinky

This happened before the multiple posts. and I only posted that one once

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 1:11 PM | Link to this

Brian

Where did you read this about AJ?

By DAP

February 6, 2009 1:12 PM | Link to this

“While spending the most certainly gaurantees nothing on the field it generally helps create enough interest for ticket sales, advertising, concessions etc…” anders

its kind of a circular thing for the yankees at this point, but dont you think a good product comes first? you can have a good product without spending over $200mil per year (and thats just on the players). a good product=increased revenue which= increased spending…right? i dont think spending over $200mil on the 25 man roster is what got the yankees started.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 1:15 PM | Link to this

stark says the braves are top suitors for nick swisher. i hope it gets done soon.

By Anders

February 6, 2009 1:17 PM | Link to this

Canadianbrave

It’s an exchange rate thing. Only 78% of your posts will come through.

By Anders

February 6, 2009 1:18 PM | Link to this

LEW

Take it from me. Nobody like a braggart. Especially on this blog. :)

By LKS

February 6, 2009 1:20 PM | Link to this

Canadianbrave

I am assuming you didn’t get to watch too many games this past season. Escobar is unemotional and mechanical? Really?!?!? All this past season Escobar got ripped a new one on the blog for showing TOO much emotion. IMO he has the most fire and heart on the team today. Did you see the Cubs game just for 1 example? He got hit for the 6th or 7th time in a span of two weeks and he was about to kick the pitchers a$$. Most people on this blog think he needs to tone down his emotions (I’m not one of them…I Love it) But just sayin…

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 1:22 PM | Link to this

In some ways it is easy to understand why the Yankees and mets spend the way they do! Besides the obvious size of their market and the revenue they generate, think of the enormous pressure they must be under to field a WS caliber team every year. As Atlanta fans I think we are content with a contending team,( at least I am). If we win the Ws once in a while I’m happy. Think of running a team in NY where you are supposed to win every year and have the most talented team every year. Now think of the mets who have to compete with the Yankees and their history! the pressure must be enormous!

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 1:23 PM | Link to this

DAP What are the Yankees asking for in return?

Any I just looked at Jeff Bennett’s stats in September. Very impressive. I think he is going to be the set up guy for Gonzalez, not Soriano. What do you all think?

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 1:27 PM | Link to this

Anders

That’s even worse! Even at that rate I might still be annoying. Oh well! Holidays are over next week and I will have to curtail my blog activities anyway.

By Knowitall

February 6, 2009 1:27 PM | Link to this

Is that really you Stinky? I thought you were gone forever.

By McFann O –[zzz] (Braves Fann For Life)

February 6, 2009 1:28 PM | Link to this

Lew “No bad speed? How about Mac?”

Haha!

By Anders

February 6, 2009 1:29 PM | Link to this

Dap

Agreed but I was only answering for last year’s numbers.The Yanks didn’t start with 4 million fans per year, the Yes network and the full extent of their branding either. That’s come in the last 5 -7 years. They keep bringing in the stars to maintain all of that. That drives up their salary but creates new revenues at the same time.

The Mets are trying to follow a similar model but on a lower tier, that’s all.

Oh yeah, and without the 26 WS titles too!

By DAP

February 6, 2009 1:31 PM | Link to this

getnathan probably young pitching. but the article also says that talks hit a snag when the braves tried to get the yankees to take some of swisher’s salary.

By dmack

February 6, 2009 1:31 PM | Link to this

If what Jason Stark says is true, and Bobby Cox is lobbying hard for Andruw, does anyone want to take action that Wren does not cave and sign Andruw. This being Bobby’s last contract year.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 1:33 PM | Link to this

LKS I guess I stand corrected! Maybe I will need to take a second look this year! Up here in Ontario I don’t get to see every game. But with MLB Tv Maybe this year!

By keylargo

February 6, 2009 1:37 PM | Link to this

Manny being Manny.

Gets dumped by the Dodgers after turning down $45,000,000 for two years.

People dredge up the recount of Manny knocking down the 64 year old Red Sox traveling secretary who did not produce enough tickets for Manny.

Wouldn’t it be justice if all Boras could get was $18,000,000 for two years with the Giants and we read in the paper that Manny slapped Boras around a little bit?

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 1:39 PM | Link to this

NY Yankees fans are the most obnoxious. Cubs fans are next.

Mets will always be second fiddle to the Yankees.

Mets are somewhat likable because Braves always seem to win the season series against and beat the Mets at key times (whether Braves are in the race or not).

The Yankee fans make you want to hate them. And then their management who thinks they can buy a championship. Haven’t done it yet.

I bet you Cashman would fail if he had a limited budget like Frank Wren, Billy Beane, et al, has.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 1:40 PM | Link to this

anders trudat

By Billy Walsh

February 6, 2009 1:44 PM | Link to this

Why would the braves be the top suitor for Swisher? He is too expensive. For the kind of money that Swisher is going to make over the next few years and the prospects he is going to cost….wouldn’t you rather have Abreu or Dunn? Look at Swisher’s numbers last year. They look awfully similiar to Andruw Jones last year in atlanta.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 1:44 PM | Link to this

“Mets are somewhat likable”

not by me. i hate them the most. its a fun rivalry.

By LKS

February 6, 2009 1:49 PM | Link to this

Canadianbrave

Its cool. I just spend a lot of my time defending his emotion in the game and then to read someone say he doesn’t have any I had to respond. He is my #1 player. I Love watching his emotion. I hope you do get to see more games this year to see it. Hopefully he is not upset about his name being in trade talks. Lord knows I was about to lose my mind during that time!

By 35YrBravesFan

February 6, 2009 1:52 PM | Link to this

OOOwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww Spring Training here we come!!! Sign Glav, let the youngsters fight for the outfield if you don’t want Abreu and let’s ROCK!!!

GO BRAVOS!!!!!!

By ORbravesFAN

February 6, 2009 1:52 PM | Link to this

DOB

Not sure, but maybe this has been explained already, but the insurance on Hudson should allow the Braves to sign someone for LF?

Abreu or Dunn I will take either over what we got.

By Joe

February 6, 2009 1:53 PM | Link to this

I am sorry, but if I had it my way, we would have a platoon in LF and CF. Platoon Diaz and Josh Anderson on righty lefty situations in LF. Than platoon Gregor Blanco and Jordan Schafer in CF in lefty righty situations. OR, we could trade Diaz and put Francoer in LF in a platoon till he get’s comfortable hitting again and sign Jermaine Dye for RF. Than use the aforementioned CF platoon. Dye would be a great stop-gap for Jason Heyward. (if money allowed). Also, when rosters expand late in the season, I would like to see a 1B platoon with Kotchman and Freddie Freeman. Give the kid a chance to smell the pro’s and get a taste.

By ORbravesFAN

February 6, 2009 2:05 PM | Link to this

Just read Jason Starks column on espn.com and he said that Bobby Cox is pushing harder for Andruw than anyone else in the organization. This is scary to me because if Andruw is signed to a Major League contract, then he is going to be our CF because Bobby is in love with him.

I am a huge Bobby fan, but he has to realize that Andrum has lost it and does not want to take advise to get better. We are better without him! Get a young guy in there who can play good defense and steal some bases when he get on!

By richbrave

February 6, 2009 2:10 PM | Link to this

LEW:

Yeah, I’m down with the hell when you’re wrong, silence when you’re right routine. You go bro’. I also think the pending season will vindicate my take on OHMAN.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 2:17 PM | Link to this

Swisher can hit for power. Has not shown throughout his career that he can hit for average. And the Yankees won’t pay part of his salary. But they can shell out over $400 million for players salaries. I hate the Yankees

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 2:21 PM | Link to this

Andruw has clearly lost a step. He was losing it in his last year with the Braves. It would be a mistake for the Braves to re-sign him.

By AHAM

February 6, 2009 2:22 PM | Link to this

Hey DOB, speaking of remakes:

Apparently Wes Craven’s Last House on the Left from ‘72 is being remade for release in 2009. Craven’s a producer/co-writer for this one, but from the trailer it looks like there are several major changes. The original, if you haven’t seen it, is an indie film that was Craven’s first film/horror endeavor. Low-budget horror at its finest in my opinion, well worth seeing. I thought after seeing the original that a remake could do really well, but I’m not so sure now after seeing the trailer. Effects and being able to shoot at night don’t seem to grasp the rawness that makes the original so terrifying.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 2:23 PM | Link to this

I would like to see Diaz and Blanco in a platoon with Josh Anderson in CF (and batting leadoff) and unless Jordan Schafer tears it up in ST, send him to Gwinnett for more seasoning. on Opening night, Diaz will be in the lineup because Cole Hamels will be pitching.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 2:23 PM | Link to this

billy walsh

good point about andruws 2007 numbers, but maybe the braves like swisher because he plays good defense, (unlike abreu or dunn) is a switch hitter (unlike abreu or dunn) is younger than dunn and much younger than abreu, is under control for three more years, with manageable yearly salaries.( only $5.3 mil in 09,$6.1ish mil in ‘10, and doesnt get questionable till 2011, at $9mil, and thats only high because of how the market is right now. by 2011, that could be below market again.)

just saying maybe those are some of the reasons the braves are interested.

im not of the opinion that swisher is THE guy, but i would be glad to get him.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 2:27 PM | Link to this

joe both blanco and shafer hit left handed. so which one sits against lefties?

getnathan swisher does not hit for average. in his career, he has gotten base at a good rate, but the highest hes ever hit is in the .260s. if we get swisher, i think he is our #5 hitter.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 2:28 PM | Link to this

get nathan my bad, thats what you said.

By THE BEAR

February 6, 2009 2:42 PM | Link to this

I saw a headline coming in to the blog today saying OHMAN was considering an offer from the METS. For goodness sakes, sign this guy, and let the METS go after RIDGWAY, O’FLAHERTY and LOGAN

Breaking news: Braves have made an offer to Ohman. Ohman has decided to shop himself for more money and so far has not decided what he wants to do.

Question: Since the Braves own Ridgeway, Logan and O’Flaherty just how do you suggest “the Mets go after” any of them?

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 2:46 PM | Link to this

LKS

I like Escobar too. He is an immense talent. I hold to the never trade a good hitter for a good pitcher philosophy. What an arm!! Probably better than Furcal.

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 2:49 PM | Link to this

HEY DAP , do you really think the Mets were the TEAM that could be characterized as desperate back in December?

After all, Tim Redding was 10-11 with 33 starts and an ERA of 4.95 last season pitching for the Washington Nationals. The Mets will pay him 2.25 million this year and he didn’t cost any prospects.

Javier Vasquez was 12-16 with 33 starts and an ERA of 4.67 last season pitching for the Chicago White Sox. The Braves will pay him 11.5 million this year. Vasquez and lefty Boone Logan cost the Braves four prospects.

Um, I think we can all see who is getting the better bang for their buck.

By 6-4-3

February 6, 2009 2:59 PM | Link to this

From Stark’s article on ESPN:

The only four pitchers to win in double figures in every season of the ’00s is the eclectic quartet of Tim Hudson, Javier Vazquez, Mike Mussina and Livan Hernandez.

Nice.

By Original Jon

February 6, 2009 3:07 PM | Link to this

Coach, seems you are being a bit selective when mentioning stats between Redding and Vazquez. Seems you forget that Vazquez has averaged over 200 innings pitched the past 8 years except for 1, while Redding has never pitched over 200 innings in his career, not once. Vazquez averages 193 strikeouts per year, where as Redding does not. I think Vazquez’ numbers will be much better with Bobby and Roger as his manager and pitching coach. I mean, I could see why the guy had poor numbers when his own manager didnt have faith in him.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 3:09 PM | Link to this

Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

And you say all that to say? Redding won’t make 20 starts for the Mets. I can’t wait until the Braves face him in a game and get 10+ hits and 7 runs against him.

I can see Putz blowing a couple of games against Atlanta in the 8th inning this season.

Mets luck won’t change against the Braves. You better hope Mets don’t face Braves in Sept., because Braves will beat Mets.

By cabravesfan

February 6, 2009 3:11 PM | Link to this

6-4-3

I would like to add Derek Lowe to that list- in every year that he has been a starter in the ‘00’s (since 2002) he has also won double digit games (he had 42 saves in ‘00 and 24 in ‘01)

By Jeff321

February 6, 2009 3:14 PM | Link to this

Andruw Jones is looking for a team that will give him playing time. One of Stark’s sources says Braves manager Bobby Cox is “lobbying harder for Jones than the rest of the baseball operation.”

(Via MLB trade rumors)

Call me shocked! Bobby doesn’t care if AJ is washed up or not. He just wants to have “Andy” on the team. What a donkey.

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 3:14 PM | Link to this

Did someone just compare Tim Hudson to Javier Vasquez?

Dear God in heaven.

OK, here goes.

Vasquez is 113-106 since 2000. Eight games over .500 for the last nine seasons. League average would be an understatement.

Hudson is 135-75 since 2000 and I will continue to characterize his career as HALL of FAME CALIBER.

Jason Stark can stick in his ear.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 3:15 PM | Link to this

DAP

Schafer may sit. My initial response would have been Blanco, but Bobby Cox will probably ease Schafer in.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 3:18 PM | Link to this

Rumor has it that Tim Redding is Coach’s sisters’ kid.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 3:20 PM | Link to this

Andruw Jones is looking for a team that will give him playing time. One of Stark’s sources says Braves manager Bobby Cox is “lobbying harder for Jones than the rest of the baseball operation.”Jeff321

That falls under the category of, “you already knew this but….”

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 6, 2009 3:21 PM | Link to this

Original Jon, Vasquez 11.5 million and 12 wins. Redding 2.25 million and 10 wins.

Yes Sir, I’m being extremely selective.

Getnathan, did Micheal Phelps inspire you today? Put the bong down. Those metrosexuals are the team to beat, period.

By BigPapaT18

February 6, 2009 3:22 PM | Link to this

I think the Braves would be fine without Ohman. Don’t get me wrong, he’s good, but he’s a situational pitcher and the Braves have more pressing holes to fill and a limited amount of cash to do so. I believe that Jo-Jo could be effective in filling the role vacated by Ohman.

Contrary to popular opinion, I think the Braves should also sign Glavine. Given last year’s injury plagued starting rotation, we could use some depth. Plus, Glavine has been a model of consistency throughout his career and he’s not done yet.

Not to belabor the point, but we desperately need a run producing bat in the outfield. If the Braves seriously think that they can win with virtually he same lineup as last year, they are delusional.

By dogsbrekky

February 6, 2009 3:24 PM | Link to this

Hammerin Hank Happy Birthday mate !

The reason I started following the Braves and playing baseball all those years ago

“Shake and Bake”

I am starting to think we should let the kids and JF have competition at spring training and then let the BEST TALENT play in the show this year..

I like how Josh Anderson handled himself in the majors late 2008 so hope we give him a shot to platoon with Diaz or start at CF and as lead off !

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 3:24 PM | Link to this

Canadianbrave

It’s an exchange rate thing. Only 78% of your posts will come throughAnders

That was clever.

(Of course, these days it’d be the other way around, with only 78 percent of American posts being good in Canada, but your line was still funny.)

By 6-4-3

February 6, 2009 3:26 PM | Link to this

Coach - Stark wasn’t comparing them, it was just a fact he was stating.

cabravesfan - And if you do add Lowe into that mix, I think we’ve got something goin’ here. Maybe Wren and Bobby Cox know what they’re doing after all. Can’t wait until Hudson comes back. Not bad at all.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 3:26 PM | Link to this

Canadianbrave: I have no idea why any of your posts didn’t show up. I wasn’t online between late morning and now. Taking care of a bunch of stuff around the house and financial matters before next week.

By BRAVES1973

February 6, 2009 3:26 PM | Link to this

I AM CURIOUS WHY THE BRAVES HAVEN’T GONE AFTER KEN GRIFFEY JR. AND WONDERING WHAT IS THE STATUS OF THE BRAVES AND ANDRUW…I HOPE THEY HOPE GET HIM….

By Tomahawk Matt

February 6, 2009 3:29 PM | Link to this

LAST!

By Mitchie-san

February 6, 2009 3:30 PM | Link to this

Does anyone think that the Braves are thinking about not signing either Glavine or Ohman and in turn signing Abreu and Swisher?

They have 5 guys to fight it out for the 5th rotation and a few lefties in the pen.

The outfield is what needs the most help now. They could trade either Anderson or Gorkys for Swisher and have an outfield of Abreu, Swisher and Francoeur.

Personally, I think that is the way I would go if I was FW. Anyone else?

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 3:35 PM | Link to this

The Braves like Swisher because he’s under contract for three years (reasonable salary) and is a better-than-serviceable defensive outfielder. If they’re gonna give up any talent in a trade, they want to get a guy who’s gonna be under their control a few years, so they can either keep him or trade him eventually.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 3:36 PM | Link to this

coach what are you even talking about? i didnt say the mets were desperate. what i did say is that signing redding was wierd for a team that has alot of money to spend.

there were (and are) many pitchers available even as 5th starter types who are better than redding. braden looper, randy wolf and paul byrd are all STILL available. wouldnt they have been better options for a 5th starter? to me, this shows the mets were being careful spending this offseason.

besides, the discussion had nothing to do with the braves, it was about the mets, and the fact that there has been evidence that they dont have all the money in the wolrd to spend on players this offseason, like they usually do, and like we were told they would have since they were moving ino and new park with a tv deal and salaries off the books.

i was just saying that the mets arent desperate, they are just having to be more frugal than usual.

also, coach, dont get so defensive about the huddy/vazquez comparison. stark just mentioned the pitchers who won double digits every year since 2000, and like it or not, vazquez and huddy are both on the list. its a fact.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 3:38 PM | Link to this

coach

The Mutrosexuals are the team that blows division leads in September that are 7 games or less.

By Steve from OH

February 6, 2009 3:38 PM | Link to this

Say it with me everybody: wins and losses are not informative wins and losses are not informative wins and losses are not informative.

Feel free to set it to the tune whatever genre of music you prefer.

By Jeff321

February 6, 2009 3:41 PM | Link to this

That falls under the category of, “you already knew this but….”

But, I wanted to rub a little salt in the eyes of Bobby Cox groupies.

I like to think of myself as the #1 Cox hater on this blog. And will take any and every opportunity to shed light on his mind which he most likely acquired from a donkey.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 3:43 PM | Link to this

coach i believe vazquez is worth way more than redding and im surprised at how much you are standing up for a guy who has made a full season of start just twice in 6 years. vazquez has only NOT made a full season of starts once in 10 years. i dont see how you can objectively believe that redding is near the pitcher vazquez is.

By DAP

February 6, 2009 3:46 PM | Link to this

tim redding really puts the mets over the top, apparently.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 3:46 PM | Link to this

MITCHIE

Braves supposedly do not have enough money to get Swisher and Abreu.

I would give the Yankees Gorkys Hernandez for Nick Swisher straight up only. They cannot have Jeff Locke.

By Anders

February 6, 2009 3:52 PM | Link to this

Original John

Regarding your 3:07 post. I don’t think the Mets were looking for a 200 inning guy when they signed Redding. As a matter of fact I’m sure of it. He’ll be their 5th starter at best and will probably be moved in and out of the rotation periodically. I’m not saying he’s better than Vasquez or will pitch as many innings but I’m not sure Vasquez is worth $9 mil more.

Guess we’ll see.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 4:00 PM | Link to this

DAP

Mutts fans can’t see straight. The second class sports citizens that they are. Second fiddle to the Yankees

By Mitchie-san

February 6, 2009 4:01 PM | Link to this

getnathan You are probably right. FW might still be able to work some magic to make room in the payroll for both. Combined they are gonna make like 12mil or so. (honestly, we dont know how much or little Abreu will accept for only one year, could be low) So maybe even 10 mil combined. I think I read that there is about that much left, correct?

By Bobby's Cox

February 6, 2009 4:01 PM | Link to this

The GM

Great post at 10:21. I totally agree. The Braves have a lot of young kids just about ready to go at the big league level and don’t need Glavine to block a spot for them. I like Glavine and AJ, but I think the team has moved in a different direction now. It would be more exciting seeing Schafer/Blanco/Anderson and Hanson/Medlin/Morton/Campillo in those 2 spots (CF & 5th rotation)

Have the Braves considered going with a 6 man rotation? Kawakami is used to it, Jair pitched an aweful lot of innings last year, they could let Hanson go longer in games, etc… There would be benefits signing Glavine and going with 6 guys, but i’d still rather have a 5 man rotation and then plug in one of the youngsters and/or Campillo if someone gets hurt.

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 4:02 PM | Link to this

For what it’s worth, Redding DID have some success against the Phillies last season.

By Bobby's Cox

February 6, 2009 4:05 PM | Link to this

IMO, Abreau is the best FA available, and Nady would be the best trade piece, again, of all options available. I’d be upset if we traded for Swisher. Now, if the braves could pry Nelson Cruz away from Texas, that would be the absolute best option….

By Thrillhouse44

February 6, 2009 4:05 PM | Link to this

Wow, Robert, I mean Jeff321, that’s an original and noble stance. You seem awful proud of that. Hey, whatever gets you through the day.

By Bobby's Cox

February 6, 2009 4:07 PM | Link to this

I wouldn’t be surprised if Brandon Jones stepped up and had a big year, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t either. I think the Braves feel the same being satisfied enough going into ST with what they have for the OF.

By dogsbrekky

February 6, 2009 4:22 PM | Link to this

I wouldn’t be surprised if Bobby Cox haters had very tiny weenies… but then again Bobby Cox haters usually have no idea he has won the 4th most games in history… coaching good, great and terrible teams….. EOFS

All those players want to play for him and not leave because he sucks…. yeah right on dufus

By Butch Haynes

February 6, 2009 4:25 PM | Link to this

I guess I’ll see all of you tonight at the Rick Springfield concert at Wild Bill’s in Duluth. That dude can rock.

By Jeff321

February 6, 2009 4:32 PM | Link to this

Thrillhouse44 - I have no idea who this Robert is your talking about.

No shame in my game.. I mean, what’s the sense in cheer leading for Cox anyway? Just because he’s the manager? Isn’t the object still to win?

By getnathan

February 6, 2009 4:35 PM | Link to this

MITCHIE

Having both Swisher and Abreu definitely would make the lineup a lot more threatening, but I don’t think it’s realistic.

By ncscoots

February 6, 2009 4:35 PM | Link to this

Bobby’s, Brandon Jones did start to recover his stroke in August, a little. Maybe he got a little healthier by then, I dunno. Five dingers in 18 games, and cut his K rate way down. Maybe Gil in Mechanicsville or richbrave saw him late and could give us some thoughts on the guy.

No winter ball for him this year, after getting that tweak last year. At least, I don’t think he played, too lazy to look it up. :-)

By Lew

February 6, 2009 4:47 PM | Link to this

There’s no guarantee that Heyward will be ready to plug into left field next Spring. Having someone like Swisher, who is under control for a few years makes him a much more valuable addition than a one year fix. I sure would hate to be going through this again in a year.

By Thrillhouse44

February 6, 2009 4:50 PM | Link to this

No shame, not a problem, Jeff. Robert was a character who spent each and every post attacking Cox by referring to him as Donkey. His schtick got old pretty quick. I agree, we’re all (minus Anders) Braves fans here, and that’s what’s important.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 4:50 PM | Link to this

Uh, Coach

Redding — Career ERA 4.92, 0.57 runs above league average; pitched more than 110 innings twice

Vazquez — Career ERA 4.32, 0.20 runs below league average, pitched more than 190 innings 10 straight seasons

Discuss.

By Johnny B

February 6, 2009 4:52 PM | Link to this

In his column on ESPN Onley thinks the price for Garret Anderson or Griffey Jr. could fall as low as 500,000 to 1 million on a one year deal.

If either were willing to play for that, I would much prefer the Braves sign one of them as to try and resurrect AJs career.

Also, there’s a rumor that the Braves asked the Yanks to pick up a portion of Swishers 22.5 million contract, to which they refused.

If Swisher rebounds from last year, he could be a nice addition at an affordable price (contract wise) but not at the price of multiple prospects, especially pitching prospects…Getting one of the veterans available short term seems more palatable IMO.

I would love to have Ohman return but given the choice between signing him or Glavine, I prefer they resign Tommy. Proven starting pitching is a far greater commodity than a situational middle guy.

Say what you will about Tommy, if dude is healthy he can easily add 10 to 12 wins to the back end of the rotation at a very affordable price. I also think he feels he has something to prove and will be motivated to end his career on a winning note.

As for some folks suggestion that he might “hold” Hanson back…Give me a break! I’m as hopeful as any that young Hanson blossoms into the stud / ace many are predicting. One half year at high AA and an outstanding fall league showing is still a stretch to facing major league hitters every 5th day and being successful at it.

Make no mistake, if young Hanson is lights out this spring no one will be “holding” him back…Even at that, a little seasoning at AAA will not wouldn’t hurt, IMO.

Just my assorted thoughts and ramblings for the blog!

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 4:58 PM | Link to this

At $1 million each, I’d sign both GA and Griffey and platoon Frenchy.

By Bobby's Cox

February 6, 2009 4:59 PM | Link to this

FW might still be able to work some magic to make room in the payroll for both

Signing Abreau or trading for Nady likely means the end of the Matt Diaz era in Atlanta. The most likely scenario to free up cash for either is to trade Diaz and his $1.225 million contract. They’d have Norton, Prado, Blanco, B Jones, etc.. to backup LF and wouldn’t want Diaz’s salary.

Kotsay just had surgery on his back (surprised?), and the Red Sox have always been interested….

Just saying, that’s one way to free up money if need be, though not a lot.

By Steve Keller

February 6, 2009 5:01 PM | Link to this

Braves should consider Orlando Hudson at 2B and platoon Johnson / Diaz in LF. It will improve the ‘D’ and we’ll get 25 HRs in LF. Abreu may be a cancer (Phillies & Yankees didn’t win with him and let him go), Dunn & Swisher have too many Ks’ with not enough ‘D’ and Nady is a one year loaner.

By Jeff321

February 6, 2009 5:07 PM | Link to this

Thrillhouse44 — No problem.

I don’t spend every post attacking Cox.. Only when he deserves it.

But, Cox isn’t really my main priority here. I enjoy talking about the games and players.

However, I see MLB Premium has a new chat feature this year..

By Bobby's Cox

February 6, 2009 5:13 PM | Link to this

If Swisher rebounds from last year, he could be a nice addition at an affordable

Then we’d have an “if” in LF, and an”*if” in RF, not to mention a huge salary we couldn’t unload if he does have another “off-year”. Too many “if’s”, which kinda reminds me of 2008.

No on swisher. Please….

Steve Keller Not a bad idea about O-Hudson. I’ve seen it mentioned here a few times, and wouldn’t mind that idea. Hudson’s been rounding into quite a nice hitter the last 2 years. Then again, he’s coming off that wrist surgery, so maybe there’s a risk factor there too.

By Tomas

February 6, 2009 5:16 PM | Link to this

I think the Braves should make a trade for an outfielder but not Nick Swisher or Xavier Nady because of the simple fact there are better options for the same price in the free agent market.

But what other options, well maybe David DeJesus form the Royals. The Royals payroll is said to be higher than expected, and this guy is making 3.6 million in a crowded outfield. They just got Coco Crisp who is basicly the same kind of player De Jesus is only a little bit better defensively(and more expensive). DeJesus can play CF or LF, has a great OBP, bats 300, and had a 452SLG %. This guy would give the Braves a good defensive outfielder with an average or below average arm, and a leadoff hitter who has a high OBP, and bats 300(by the way he did have more homeruns(12) than the three Brave outfielders). Beats out trading for Nick Swisher.

But what will the Royals ask in return? Well if you ask me, I think they need a SS or 2B(Alviles would play one of those positions), a catcher, and a power hitting outfielder(not named Jose Guillen), another starter in case of injury (not named Horacio Ramirez), and bulpen. Well the Braves don’t have room in their 40-man roster(the royals have 3 spots remaining), if the Braves traded James Parr, Anthony Lerew, Boone Logan, and Brandon Jones for David Dejesus I’d think it would be a good move, because this will permit the Braves to get a good outfielder and open up roster spots for Will Ohman, Tom Glavine, and who knows maybe Andruw Jones.

Imagine that, Andruw, Dejesus, Franceour, Anderson, Blanco, Schafer, and Diaz all competing for the three spots in the outfield. Obviously Dejesus and Frenchy would get two of those spots, and if Andruw manages to go back in time to his former self it would be a tremendous outfield, and if not Diaz could platoon in LF with Anderson or Schafer.

By mitchie-san

February 6, 2009 5:22 PM | Link to this

I don think that it is that far fetched at all to sign both. Diaz is definatly expendable as Bobby’s Cox just said. Certainly Diaz and/or Prado would get Swisher. Yes, they (Yankees) dont need another outfielder, but we could make him go away and use Prado and a prospect in the move.

Abreu most likely will sign a low one year and try again next year on the market.

I would like Glavine for one more year, but I think its for centimental value more than anything else. Ohman is the man, but spending 3 mil or so for a reliever after one good year is a little crazy. I am a fan of Ohman and would like him to be on the diamond, but he alone is isnt going to get us to the playoffs.

We need to score more runs, period. I think adding a leadoff guy and a clean-up hitter is WAYYY more imoprtant than a fifth starter and a third lefty in the bullpen…

Am I wrong??

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 5:26 PM | Link to this

Bobby’s Cox

O-Dog’s a switch-hitter. But he doesn’t bring anything to the Braves’ offense they don’t already have.

If they’re going to spend up to $10 million a year on a free agent, get a legitimate power threat (Dunn) or an on-base machine (Abreu). O-Dog isn’t that great at either.

By Steve Keller

February 6, 2009 5:27 PM | Link to this

I’m bettting the Braves like Swisher since he has fire in his belly and a MLB heritage. He could play CF which may be a plus if Josh doesn’t work out. He could also play 1B if Kotchman turns into a Thorman instead of a Grace. Personally, I think Swisher is a risk but so is Hudson, to some extent, with his wrist.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 5:28 PM | Link to this

Hey, Tomas,

You mentioned DeJesus! Next someone will bring up Carl Crawford ;-)

By The Vet

February 6, 2009 5:30 PM | Link to this

I say “IF” not gonna get a for sure outfielder give AJ a 400k deal it could be a high reward deal considering how cheap he is. if he does terrible just st8 up release him. but that not my choice on what we should do, depeding on what we would have to trade away for Swisher, i like him, i know the reason the guy hasnt hit for high average this guy has been in every spot in a batting order, trying to do different things, he hit leadoff for the Sox and was in the 4-5-6 spots on the A’s, he’s 28 under contract for 3 yrs switch hitter and can play all outfield spots and 1st base. he’ll hit 25 dingers, and bat 250-275. he is owed around 5 mil this year. , Garret Anderson prolly could come around same price as swisher would be with out trading prospects, he decent defender and will hit 290. and 15-20 dingers. i think abreu or dunn will take all of our remaining money. and with so many option for a 5th starter i say (as much as i hate to) not sign Glavine , we need outfield help , more.

By nolie

February 6, 2009 5:30 PM | Link to this

Per Stark

Swish-hitting: In the meantime, the Braves seem to have emerged as the club most interested in Yankees outfielder Nick Swisher. But there are indications the teams got hung up when the Braves asked the Yankees to eat some of the $22.05 million Swisher has coming over the next three years — and got turned down flat.

By Rick Astley

February 6, 2009 5:35 PM | Link to this

Blanco? Really? In 2008:

Gregor Blanco: .676 OPS

Jeff Francoeur: .653 OPS

Those are both terrible. If the Braves must inexplicably insist on starting Francoeur, they should not start Blanco too. Maybe if/when Blanco can slug at least a mere .350.

By Rick Astley

February 6, 2009 5:41 PM | Link to this

“O-Dog’s a switch-hitter. But he doesn’t bring anything to the Braves’ offense they don’t already have. If they’re going to spend up to $10 million a year on a free agent, get a legitimate power threat (Dunn) or an on-base machine (Abreu). O-Dog isn’t that great at either.”

Amen. His non-desert-inflated numbers (stats outside of Chase in Arizona) are bad too.

The Braves already have a good second baseman in Kelly Johnson (MLB’s site today called him one of the more underrated infielders in the game today) and two adequate backups in Infante and Prado. Signing Orlando Hudson is just a gross waste of resources.

Please get a real, power-hitting left fielder.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 5:43 PM | Link to this

BFIR I guess we are way beyond Crawford, Figgins, DeJesus and Freel!!!

Those were the good old days.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 5:47 PM | Link to this

Rick Astley Blanco is and always will be a stop gap starter, or back up. I suspect he will be out of baseball in 2-3 years. As for Francoeur, he will start because of 2005, 2006 and 2007. If he doesn’t revert back to that form, he will be out of baseball in 3-5 years, and for sure out of the starting lineup in 1-2 years.

Just my 2 cents worth….

By Johnny B

February 6, 2009 5:47 PM | Link to this

* Bobbys Cox*

I was NOT advocating a trade for Swisher and that’s exactly why I said “IF”. You are correct, there’s to many “ifs”.

I don’t want to trade prospects when there are options much more palatable as I mentioned, GA or JR makes much more sense economically and on the low risk / high reward scale.

By Rick Astley

February 6, 2009 5:55 PM | Link to this

Wayne, Francoeur was terrible in 2006. He was one of the worst everyday outfielders that year with that .293 OBP. In 2007 he was pretty average and only looked “good” that year when it was compared to his 2006 and, now, 2008.

By larry pennington

February 6, 2009 5:56 PM | Link to this

give andrew a try it would be better for the brave to do it. what if someone else does and he turn out to be the old andrew. if he hit a little with some power it will be better than what we had last year.

By Johnny B

February 6, 2009 6:00 PM | Link to this

I like Glavine not for sentimental reasons but for what he can add to the back of the rotation.

Ohman may have been the “man” last year as a situational lefty but his last 2 years prior to that were poor. He’s had 2 above average years out of his 8 years in the league.

When the Braves picked him up last year he was no more a proven commodity than the guys we have vying for the job this year.

Would love to have him back, but not for 3 million being rumored. Rather spend it on Glavine and / or a GA or JR in LF.

By Random

February 6, 2009 6:01 PM | Link to this

flange1: “To me it’s a character issue more so than a performance issue… . what do you think of Manny knocking down the team’s traveling secretary [Jack McCormick] for not getting him enough tickets on 1 day’s notice?”

I think this:

An argument ensued and Ramirez pushed McCormick, sending him to the ground.

Later, the two met behind closed doors and Ramirez apologized to McCormick, who accepted the gesture. No further disciplinary action is expected against Ramirez.

“Sometimes things happen,” said Terry Francona, “and when they do, we choose to handle them internally. I’m satisfied with how we handled this.”

Asked on Sunday to comment on the altercation, Ramirez responded: “That’s over. We’re fine now.”

Added McCormick: “It was an unfortunate misunderstanding and it’s over with as far as I’m concerned.”

I also think that the incident happened on Saturday, 28 Jun, was over with on the same day and was reported by the Providence Journal Monday, 30 Jun and by the Boston Globe on Tuesday, 1 Jul:

McCormick, the team’s longtime traveling secretary, added that he harbors no resentment or ill will toward Ramírez.

“I just want it to die,” he said. “It’s over. He apologized. That’s it. I want us to get back to our winning ways.

“There’s no animosity on my part. I hope there’s not on his. I think he feels the same way. I’m satisfied with how the club handled this. Everything’s fine.” . Several players, including David Ortiz, referred to the team as a “family” while discussing the incident. Ortiz slung an arm around Ramírez’s shoulders while the left fielder was addressing the media. “We are a family,” he said. “We deal with things here.”

And I think it was then nearly a month later that Dan Shaughnessy decided to exercise his outrage at the incident for his own purposes.

By JETHRO

February 6, 2009 6:07 PM | Link to this

Swisher hit .219 last year and has never had a 100 RBI season. What is the great appeal there?

By I'm Stunned

February 6, 2009 6:11 PM | Link to this

In our division, one of the best off season moves that no one is talking about is the Met’s acquisition of Tim Redding.

The former Washington National nailed down 33 starts last season, of which 20 were efforts where he gave up three earned runs or less. His 4.95 ERA is deceiving. The Nats were 20-13 when he started. Coach

my God man where do you come up with this crap all the time. Tim Redding a good pickup? He has a career ERA of 4.92 so what is deceiving about his 4.95? So what if they won 20 of his starts? It sure in h3ll wasn’t because he pitched well.W/L tell you next to nothing about a pitcher’s season.

Just about everybody in baseball ridiculed that signing, man. I think you say this kinda stupid crap just to get a rise cause absolutely nobody in their right mind could consider Tim Redding as a substantial signing. You never cease to amaze me, and i don’t mean that in a good way. You come out with a decent post or two and then out of the blue is something so against common sense baseball as to be staggering.

By flange1

February 6, 2009 6:21 PM | Link to this

Random,

Nice post at 6:01. I glad the two of them are straight with each other.

But their are only 3 people that are allowed to push a 64 year old man down, his 84 year old mother, his 64 year old wife or his 64 year old girl friend.

There is no reason AT ALL for a man in his 30’s to push a 64 year old man down.

Total and complete lack of class. or character if you prefer.

Manny and Jack might be OK about the incident, but adults (IE 30 year old outfielders) don’t push SENIOR CITIZENS down EVER.

No matter how the incident can be “spun” the result in my mind is always LACK OF CHARACTER.

By Braves Fan n NC

February 6, 2009 6:23 PM | Link to this

DOB,

Why don’t the braves have any interest in Luke Scott? He has good power averaging 21 hr’s a year the last two years. He plays left field, and is under team control for a few years.

By alan in utah

February 6, 2009 6:33 PM | Link to this

Bring back Andruw, Galvine and Ohman. Give LF a chance to sort it’s self out with what we have. Remember in ‘07 Andruw hit 26 HR’s and drove in 94 runs. I think it’s worth the money Wren would have to spend to give him a major league contract. Who would the Braves have to take off the 40 man roster…Lerew? And please stop giving away prospects, I’ll be watching the Rangers this year just to see how bad the Tex trade really was. A Braves fan since ‘57. Go Braves!!!!!!!

By The Vet

February 6, 2009 6:36 PM | Link to this

I think Tim Redding is a good pickup just not for the team that signed him (METS) he is a decent vetern that can be a solid,decent #5 or a long man. i think Luke Scott is in the O’s plans is why he isnt surfaced on anything. but hell yeah i’d like to have him play for us

By Hello?

February 6, 2009 6:42 PM | Link to this

Get Swisher - Stop being cheap. Insisting NY pick up part of a 7 mil yearly salary is embarrassing. Sure NY will do it if you hand over Gorkys/Schafer/Freeman/Heyward/Hanson. But you don’t want to do that. Geez, Matt Diaz is your left fielder today. Wake up.

By Bubdylan

February 6, 2009 6:44 PM | Link to this

flange1, I see it your way.

Manny apologists throw around a lot of “oh, so you never lost your temper and made a mistake?” and “he made an error in judgment” bunk.

But that’s bull. Error in judgment is when somebody who is a normally responsible and nice person does an irresponsible or cruel thing. What Manny did was a perfectly natural overflow of his everyday ways of thinking, fueled by countless selfish decisions that have left him morally sloppy. And that sh*t is habitual. And it’s hard to change habits, even when you WANT to, much less when there’s a household phrase excusing you for just “being who you are,” as if most every bad deed done in the history of man wasn’t done by somebody just “being who they were.” Sorry, Mrs. Steinbergh, just Adolf bein’ Adolf…” (Yes, I did… sue me.)

He knocked an old man down over some baseball tickets. And it makes perfect sense that it was Manny Ramirez who did this.

And he quit on his team. And this also fits perfectly with the rest of his actions. The dude is a jerk. On purpose. Habitually. Consistently. Disruptively. (I’ll quit before I break into a that Munchkin song…)

And baseball’s full of blah blah and why single out yeah yeah and Babe Ruth was a yadda yadda. Well, I still don’t want Manny. Call it an error in judgment. I’d rather finish in last place.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 6:47 PM | Link to this

Braves Fan n NC

Reports are that Scott could be odd man out in Balmer with the signing of Wigginton. It couldn’t cost as much to get him as it would to get Nady, and if you rule out Nady’s insane 2008 with Pittsburgh, Scott looks about as good.

Interesting idea.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 6:48 PM | Link to this

… just Adolf bein’ AdolfBubdylan

Oh man, what a line!

By Braveheart

February 6, 2009 6:48 PM | Link to this

In some ways it is easy to understand why the Yankees and mets spend the way they do! Canadian Brave

What i found interesting was that the Mets had 13 investment accounts with Madoff. We whine about the money these teams give the players, but rarely wonder enough how much the franchises are making off the fans that are not directly reinvested into what we see on the field.

To have all of these investment accounts, you have to believe that the Mets could be spending far more money than they already do if they weren’t investing some of their earned profits in the investment markets instead of the free agency market.

And you have to believe that Madoff wasn’t the only guy they had investment accounts with…. or at least, if you’re a Mets fan, you’d hope that the franchise wasn’t so foolish that they didn’t diversify their investments with more than one dude. So how many investment accounts do they have? And how much of the profits are being pocketed?

It’s smart business to not just reinvest all of the money into the roster. It’s good business to set aside money in investments so that their money grows and that the team has diversified revenue streams for the future. However, we too often hear these teams cry poverty or that they don’t have the money to get the guy we want them to get when they actually do have who knows how much money sitting out there somewhere being unused in who knows how many investment accounts.

The question then for me is how much money do the Braves have being unused in how many investment accounts? Can we believe them then when they claim we can’t afford this dude or that dude?

Madoff stole the money the Mets owners were stealing and/or just hiding from the fans and the players. It hasn’t yet been alleged yet the Madoff or someone like him stole the money AOL/TW or LM may be stealing or just hiding from the players and fans.

By N8

February 6, 2009 6:52 PM | Link to this

“One of Stark’s sources says Braves manager Bobby Cox is “lobbying harder for Jones than the rest of the baseball operation.”

Hmmm. Are you people ready for the following sound coming over the PA at Turner Field this year….

“Batting 4th… #25…. Centerfielder…..ANDRUW JONES!!”

Don’t laugh. Tell me you didn’t think the same thing, the SECOND you read that alleged scenario of Bobby “lobbying” for him.

I think I just threw up a little bit in my mouth.

By Plato

February 6, 2009 6:54 PM | Link to this

Seems to me our Bravos are foot-draggin on several fronts. That just me?

By Braveheart

February 6, 2009 6:56 PM | Link to this

A 60 yo man should take a beating before a HOF manager’s wife takes a beating from her husband. Get off the hypocritcal high horse and just leave the argument at the Braves can’t or won’t afford Manny.

By Tim Redding Blows

February 6, 2009 6:56 PM | Link to this

Tim Redding Hits the Jackpot, Odalis Perez Gets Jack: Why the Discrepancy?

Odaliz Perez had a pretty good season for the Nationals in 2009 and was in many ways the equal of fellow teammate Tim Redding.

No, he never reached the heights predicted by the baseball world when he was a top prospect for the Atlanta Braves, and no, he’s never come close to repeating his success with the Dodgers when he won 27 games with a 3.51 ERA in 2002 and 2003.

But Perez, who had signed a $850,000 contract in 2007, had hoped to parlay his 7-12, 4.34 season into a two-year deal worth-hopefully-$5 million or so.

His agent had made it clear that sure, Perez would consider coming back to Washington, but in the end he believed that his client would have many more profitable offers to choose from.

Those offers never materialized, however, and on Friday the Washington Nationals announced that Perez had been signed to a minor league deal with an invitation to the team’s major league camp.

This is quite a comedown for a pitcher that earned nearly $8 million dollars with the Kansas City Royals in 2007.

It isn’t unusual that pitchers like Perez-adequate but not above average-have found a limited market in this bad baseball economy.

What is strange is that while Perez had to settle for a minor league contract with a 102 loss team, Redding, his former teammate, was able to garner a one-year, $2.25 million dollar contract with the New York Mets, and was one of the first free agent signings of the offseason.

Put a different way, the Mets paid $225,000 per Redding win while the Nationals paid $47,500 for every Perez victory.

At 31, Perez is just one year older than Redding and has more than twice the number of major league wins as Redding.

Perez’ career ERA, at 4.34, is a more than a half-run lower than Redding’s 4.92.

And Perez is a lefty, always a hot-commodity for any major league pitching staff. Redding is a right-hander.

Though a 7-12 record isn’t particularly impressive, Perez really did pitch pretty well overall. Half of Perez’s 30 starts lasted into the sixth or seventh nning, the same as Redding.

By Plato

February 6, 2009 6:59 PM | Link to this

Madoff would be safer in prison than in public. lol

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 7:03 PM | Link to this

Plato

I think the Braves are like a lot of other teams who could use a corner OF. They’re waiting for the Dodgers to sign Manny or tell Manny to take a hike and then sign Dunn. Dunn’s contract will set the ceiling for the remaining FA and possibly set a value for corner OF who might be traded.

If Dunn signs for $10 million a year, then Abreu, etc., should expect $X. If he signs for $6 million a year, it’ll be less.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 7:08 PM | Link to this

Braveheart

That’s what aggravated me so much when everyone was upset with Glavine for leaving the Braves. He wasn’t being greedy or disloyal to the poor braves management, he was simply upholding his right to bargain for his fair share of the profit

By Bubdylan

February 6, 2009 7:12 PM | Link to this

A 60 yo man should take a beating before a HOF manager’s wife takes a beating from her husband. Get off the hypocritcal high horse and just leave the argument at the Braves can’t or won’t afford Manny. Braveheart

You have a decent point, but Bobby Cox isn’t a fountain of destructive and selfish deeds.

My high horse isn’t really all that hypocritical. I don’t do those things. I’m not sure I’m not being judgmental, or arrogant, or unbalanced. But unless I’m tackling old dudes in my sleep, or something along those lines, not hypocritical exactly.

As for just leaving the argument to the economics of the Manny thing, I picked up the argument where I found it going on, and gave my two cents. You’ll notice I don’t rant much and maybe give me the benefit of the doubt.

By Aristotle

February 6, 2009 7:16 PM | Link to this

Andruw Jones’ lack of professional ethics has become so flagrant that it merits everyones’ complete attention. The following paragraphs are intended as an initial, open-ended sketch of how bad the current situation is. From a purely technical point of view, if it were up to Andruw, schoolchildren would be taught reading, ‘riting, and greed. Do we not, as rational men and women, owe it to both our heritage and our posterity to exercise all of our basic rights to the maximum? I think we do.

We don’t need to demonize Andruw; he is already a demon, and furthermore, many people are incredulous when I tell them that he intends to threaten the existence of human life, perhaps all life on the planet. “How could Andruw be so rapacious?”, they ask me. “It doesn’t seem possible.” Well, it is unquestionably possible, and now I’ll explain exactly how Andruw plans to do it. But first, you need to realize that permitting loquacious so-called experts to cater to the basest instincts of infernal pantywaists is tantamount to suicide. That should serve as the final, ultimate, irrefutable proof that Andruw’s long-term goals cannot stand on their own merit. That’s why they’re dependent on elaborate artifices and explanatory stories to convince us that it’s okay to treat people like sanctimonious cutthroats. Now that you’ve read this, let me challenge you, the reader, not just to help me fight on the battleground of ideas for our inalienable individual rights, but also to educate others about what I’ve written.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 7:24 PM | Link to this

Bubdylan and flange

Amen on the Manny perpective.

Random Friend, you should change your moniker to Random Manny Apologist.

I am just not understanding your love fest with Manny??

(you guys been spoonin’??)

:o

By Danga

February 6, 2009 7:27 PM | Link to this

Aristotle referring to someone else as loquacious. There is a bit of irony.

By Bubdylan

February 6, 2009 7:27 PM | Link to this

Aristotle, ever heard of “never use a ten dollar word where a ten cent word will do?” I mean, sometimes there’s no other word but a fancy one that has the exact connotation you’re shooting for, but not THAT damn often.

By flange1

February 6, 2009 7:30 PM | Link to this

Braveheart,

There is no arguing that Bobby Cox’s violence toward his wife is not acceptable. At all. Even with the excuse that he may have been drinking.

But 2 wrongs don’t make a right.

From my generation’s perspective, hitting a senior citizen is not acceptable. At All.

My point is still the same as yesterday, I don’t want Manny at the league minimum. I believe he has no character and he quit on his team.

Sorry if you don’t agree!

By nolie

February 6, 2009 7:32 PM | Link to this

A salary level of $140 million might not leave enough left for someone like Manny. I also read today that the Mets are signing Elmer Dessens to a minor league contract. Now I’m certain they have no money left. Believe me-you’ll just LOVE Elmer. Really y’all will. He’s very effective. Lew

I was reading today-maybe Stark_ that the biggest increase in payroll this year will be the Phils, costing them an extra 30 Mil just to resign last years team.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 7:33 PM | Link to this

Why don’t the braves have any interest in Luke Scott?Braves Fan n NC

Who said they didn’t? I haven’t heard his name mentioned, so I haven’t written his name. But it’s not like the Braves give us a list of guys they’re interested in.

By Old Donk

February 6, 2009 7:34 PM | Link to this

Aristotle could you change my diaper? And if so, do you bat right handed as we need a LF. Heard you were “lights out” in the Greek boys league.

By Steve from OH

February 6, 2009 7:35 PM | Link to this

Braveheart, while beating one’s wife is a despicable act (which I will never condone), I’ve stated before that the main reason I don’t want Manny’s issues is that he brings them into the clubhouse, disrupting the rest of the team. While I know players hear of outside transgressions, it doesn’t directly affect them on the same level as some of Manny’s shenanigans do. That’s the distinction I’m making, because like you said, I ain’t perfect and I’m not going to criticize too harshly the actions of others.

However, it should be duly noted that I neither beat women or senior citizens, so I feel as though I can speak upon this topic without being a hypocrite :). Oh, and you are right—reason numero uno is that the Braves can’t afford Manny.

By David O'Brien

February 6, 2009 7:37 PM | Link to this

There’s no guarantee that Heyward will be ready to plug into left field next Spring. Having someone like Swisher, who is under control for a few years makes him a much more valuable addition than a one year fixLew

Good point, Lew. And I’d add that there’s a better chance than Heyward will NOT be ready to plug into the outfield next spring, given that he’s only had a couple of weeks above the low-A level, and none above high-A. And the fact that he’s a mere 19 and still a bit raw in some parts of his hitting, though developing rapidly.

By Steve from OH

February 6, 2009 7:38 PM | Link to this

flange, hitting a senior citizen isn’t acceptable for ANY generation!

And if drinking makes you an angry drunk, then you shouldn’t drink. That’s no excuse.

By nolie

February 6, 2009 7:39 PM | Link to this

CanadianBrave: It was Ernie Harwell. One of the greatest ever. Steve

I thought he was listening to Braves games not Tigers games. I must have misread that. In case I didn’t it would have been Ernie Johnson

By Areopagus

February 6, 2009 7:47 PM | Link to this

For the record, I’m changing my name here from Aristotle to Areopagus. This is a permanent change.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 7:48 PM | Link to this

I believe the uncertainty over the events of the coming season are resulting in a major cathexis among the posters on our blog site. Lets all take a collective deep breath. There: I am sure that many of the hostilities generated by the unknowns of the next couple of weeks have now been cleansed. Perhaps this catharsis will result in a more productive and informative blog, with a body of valuable insights and information submitted for each and everyone of us to share and enjoy. After we, as bloggers on a common site are much like a team, each member contributing there own insight and perspective for the good of the whole.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 7:54 PM | Link to this

D** where is that retract button?

By nolie

February 6, 2009 7:54 PM | Link to this

Tom Waits said, In the Land of the Blind the One-eyed Man is King Canadian

yeah well he stole that fron Erasmus I think from 500 years ago . guess he musta figgered nobody was still around to remember. ;-)

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 7:55 PM | Link to this

As the Manny saga goes longer and longer, the smile on my face grows wider and wider!

Couldn’t happen to a nicer guy…

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 7:59 PM | Link to this

Nolie

I think I already pointed that out somewhere way up there !

My apologies Again

By Plato

February 6, 2009 8:01 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the info BF-Rockies.

By Bubdylan

February 6, 2009 8:02 PM | Link to this

D** where is that retract button? Canadianbrave

lol, if you find it, pass it over here.

Cathexis??

By nolie

February 6, 2009 8:05 PM | Link to this

Any I just looked at Jeff Bennett’s stats in September. Very impressive. I think he is going to be the set up guy for Gonzalez, not Soriano. What do you all think? get

I think he is gonna be the groundball out guy since he had one of the highest totals in the bigs last year. If Sori is healthy he will be the 8th inning guy with some saves here and there.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 8:07 PM | Link to this

What happened with Austin Kearns. Was he a victim of the “drug testing” era? At one point several years ago, he was an up and coming power source. Never much for average, but he could crush it.

Same for Richie Sexson. If I were an AL team, I would sign him to DH against lefties. He crushes lefties.

By Areopagus

February 6, 2009 8:15 PM | Link to this

While you’re likely sick of hearing about it Old Donk, it is crucial that you read this post. As this post will make clear, after hearing about Cox’s egocentric attempts to create a system of baseball snobbism characterized by secret files, closed meetings, gag orders, and statutory immunity, I was saddened. I was saddened that Bobby Cox has lowered himself to this level. It is no news that he will stop at nothing to lead us down a path of pain and suffering. This may sound outrageous but if it were fiction I would not be writing this. As it stands, stubborn loonies often take worms or similar small animals and impale them on a pin to enjoy watching them twist and writhe as they slowly die. Similarly, Cox enjoys watching respectable people twist and writhe whenever he threatens to cause an increase in Francoeur plate appearances, teetotalism, failure, and vice. As I conclude this post, let me remind you that my goal in writing it was not only to beat Cox at his own game. I sought also to use this as a means to stick to the facts and offer only those arguments that can be supported by those facts.

By Reality

February 6, 2009 8:23 PM | Link to this

Braves offer 1-2 million contract to Tom Glavine.

By McFann O –[zzz] (Braves Fann For Life)

February 6, 2009 8:26 PM | Link to this

Bubdylan @ 6:44—

With you all the way.

By ccrider

February 6, 2009 8:36 PM | Link to this

I would guess if the Bowman story is correct and the offer is 1 to 2 million with no incentives, we have seen the last of Tom Glavine. I think the Braves have made the decision to spend on a bat and I expect Ohman and Glavine will not return. I hope for all us fans they made the right choice. Time will tell!

By Jim

February 6, 2009 8:38 PM | Link to this

DOB - @ 7:37PM -

Agree completely re Heyward. He might make it to team late in ‘10, but more likley ‘11, or even ‘12, full time. So getting Swisher - although his BA and last year scare me - might make sense. Giving Abreu a two-year deal might be even better, in Abreu and his agent would realize that next year might not even be as good as this year for FA corner OFs.

B. Jones hit .267 against all pitching and LHP and RHP last year. Against RHP, he was .267/.702; 1/17 and 1/1SB in 101 ABs. Anderson was .341/.915 and 8/9SB in 91 ABs against RHP. Blanco was .248/.693; 0/6; 3/5 in 105 ABs against LHP, and .252/.671; 1/32; 10/13 in 325 ABs against RHP. Based on this, and w/o a trade, you have to hope Schafer is ready to play CF; Francoeur rebounds and the Anderson/Diaz platoon will work in LF. Indeed, right now, and w/o a trade, LF looks like our best OF hitting position. Beased on this, I think the question is when, not whether, we pick up a Nady or Abreu. Then, Anderson or Schafer can give us a stronger bat in CF. Schafer hit 15 HRs in 565 ABs in A and AA last season. He was a bit stronger against RHP (.313/.736) than LHP (.220/.670) in Mexican winter league. If Schafer isn’t ready in April, we should also remember that Diaz hit RHP very well in ‘06 and ‘07. Starting OF, w/o trade, will likley be Diaz, Anderson & Francoeur. So line-up would have 5 left-hand hitters and 4 RH hitters (CJ switch hits). Against right hand pitching, bat Anderson first and Diaz 8th, in front of JF. Against LHP, Anderson hits 8th. RHP: Anderson, Esco, CJ, MAC, KJ, CK, JF, MD. Against LHP: Esco, KJ, CJ, Mac, CK, JF, MD, Anderson. Critical element - JF has to return to at least 2007 form.

By Butch Haynes

February 6, 2009 8:50 PM | Link to this

Hey Guys, where is everybody? I’m here at the Rick Springfield concert and I thought all of you would be here by now. I’ll just wait for you guys up by the stage - I’ll be the one with the Jesse’s Girl t-shirt on.

By Braveheart

February 6, 2009 8:54 PM | Link to this

Steve. bubdylan. I’m not saying you’re hypocrites b/c you beat women or senior citizens or anything like that. The hypocrisy I’m pointing towards, not directly you two guys, is that too many on here are getting all sanctimonious about Manny beating an old man while at the same time ignoring the domestic violence b/w Bobby and his wife. Anyone screaming and yelling that Manny shouldn’t be here because of his act of violence should’ve also been saying the same about Bobby and his violent act.

As a New York Giants fan, I can understand the sentiment about the clubhouse culture being contaminated by certain creatures dwelling within it. Tiki Barber was one of the best RBs in team history. Shockey was one of the best TEs in team history. The Giants won nothing with them and won it all without them, seemingly because their egomaniacal behaviors were no longer getting in the way of Eli doing his job as the QB. So I can see the argument against Manny in that regard.

I can also look at Burress, who is one of the best WRs in team history and who was the difference maker that got them to and won it all for them last season. But his bad boy egomaniacal ways sabotaged the Jints this season and were really the main reason they didn’t win it all again this season. With Burress, they were the best. Without him, they were just another team.

Manny is like Burress. With Manny, the Braves could really win it all this season. Of course, he could also turn around and sabotage the next season like Burress did with his selfishness. Without Manny in either season though, they don’t truly have a shot at winning it all because they don’t have the difference maker.

Latrell Sprewell beat his coach. My Knicks took advantage of that situation the next season and he carried them to the NBA Finals. Spree of course, being who he was, became a cancerous nightmare in later seasons for the Knicks. As a fan, however, I wouldn’t trade away where Spree took us in 99 just like I wouldn’t trade away where Burress took us last season even after what he did this season. I love Spree and Burress for what they did in those two seasons for my teams even if I’m angry at them for what they did to my teams in later seasons.

I feel the same way about Manny. If we wanted to win it all, we’d roll the dice on an iffy dude like the Giants and Knicks did with Burress and Spree and just take the really bad with the really good that comes with the likes of him.

I’d rather the argument be about (1) whether or not the Braves have the guts to risk winning it all and (2) whether or not they have the money to get him. They claim they ain’t got the funds, so we should just argue about how true that is and not argue about all of this other holier than thou b.s.

By Billy Walsh

February 6, 2009 9:01 PM | Link to this

You are going to trade for a guy who hit 219 last year? Why on earth would you want him for three years? Andruw Jones put up better numbers in his final year in Atanta then Swisher did last year. Wouldnt you rather have Abreu for 2 years? Swisher is too inconsistent to gamble on a three year contract. I would take 20 hr 100 rbi 100 runs scored and a 300 batting average over Swisher anyday.

By Steve McP

February 6, 2009 9:08 PM | Link to this

Just read the article on the Braves site about the Glavine offer. DOes not sound as though it is a serious offer, probably made just because Wren said he would if Glavine could pitch. Low ball basic with no incentives, surprising that latter part, I had expected that any offer would have been along the lines of the offer to Smoltz, with the opportunity to get paid on the basis of performance - clearly Wren does not want Glavine, probably feeling the money that is left would be better spent on a bat.

By Bubdylan

February 6, 2009 9:21 PM | Link to this

Braveheart, I can’t use that formula - can’t come down on this person when I don’t come down similarly on every other person with a similar offense - to filter every gut feeling I have against somebody. That’s relativism. You’re right in that it’s a dynamic you have to keep in front of you, but it doesn’t work well as a maxim. It’s that sort of thinking that ends up letting a child molester off with a 6 month sentence because a worse one got only 8 months last year.

Every indictment of a bad person isn’t given with a holier than thou attitude. Maybe mine was, I don’t know. It’s hard for most of us to see how we’re coming off. But a responsible citizen can’t be so guarded against hypocrisy and judgment that he tip-toes around every possible accusation of it. You seem to be making the argument that we should drop the Ethics Class and keep the discussion to how he’d effect wins and losses, i.e. distractions, money, etc. But, hell, Braveheart, that’s just not the kind of baseball fan I am. Sure it’s tricky waters to bring in the moral factor with a sport that’s plenty famous for its dark side. And maybe I don’t navigate those waters perfectly, or even very well.

But here I stand. To me, Cox’s deal isn’t as bad as Manny’s. I’m over Cox, who seems mostly to behave well. I don’t want Manny, who seems mostly to behave badly. That’s the best I can do.

By AR Brave

February 6, 2009 9:23 PM | Link to this

Great move on Wren’s part. Offering glavine a contract at 1-2 mil which gives us a cheap 5th LHP or gets him out of the way since we have so many others waiting to fill the 5th spot. It’s a win win situation either way. Glavine has left us before, so we will see what he does this time and I will be happy with either outcome. Now we can focus on ohman and the bat.

By Random

February 6, 2009 9:29 PM | Link to this

flange1, Bubdylan, Wayne in Utah —

I do not condone or excuse Ramirez’ behavior in that incident.

However, unlike (apparently) y’all, I do not assume intent on his part. There’s a big difference in “pushing someone” and them falling, “pushing someone down” and (a la Shaughnessy) “flattening someone”. The latter two contain elements of intent, which is absent in the original reports.

I also do not know what words were exchanged, who initiated the contact, what their previous relationship was, what previous disagreements they may or may not have had, why Ramirez wanted the tickets, why he had not asked earlier, etc, etc, etc.

I just don’t know, and have no reason to make assumptions to fit the incident into any preconception I have of Ramirez, unlike many others that definitely do have axes to grind.

Sometimes people believe what they want to believe only because they want to, regardless of the lack of evidence (or even in the face of contradictory evidence). (Another example of how religion makes us dumber.)

For example, “Manny quit on his team” — I have seen no clear evidence to support that charge, and have seen plenty of evidence that argues against it.

Unless I’ve missed something, Bubdylan for one believes it because he wants to believe it — no other reason is evident to me.

PS: Wayne in Utah: Or perhaps “Crusading EveryManny Apologist”.

8-)

PPS: Bubdylan, whence ($10?) the insights that allow you to ($7.50?) declaim Ramirez thus ($5?): “his everyday ways of thinking, fueled by countless selfish decisions that have left him morally sloppy”? Do you know him personally? Ever met him? Been to one of his games? Just wondering.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 9:29 PM | Link to this

I guess we are going to see if TG really wants to finish his career in Atlanta, if the story is true.

By cvbraves

February 6, 2009 9:32 PM | Link to this

Glad the Braves made Glavine an offer and after last year, I’d say a generous offer.

But then, I’d say the same about the offer to Smoltz. Perhaps, a little too generous.

Considering age, arm injury (in Smoltz’ case, 8 injuries or was it 9?), economics, young arms waiting in line for a shot at the #5 spot, knowing that the Braves need a power-hitting outfielder and are running low on funds…Generous, Indeed!

Love both those guys and always will…wish them well and hope they both win 20 games and share the Cy Young. But, life, business, and the real world are what they are.

By Woah

February 6, 2009 9:34 PM | Link to this

I was at the Vortex Bar & Grill and got this burger, I forgot its name, but it was a half a pound of beef, cheese, two fried eggs, five or six pieces of bacon all between two grilled cheese sandwiches. Ate it all; it was awesome.

By Random

February 6, 2009 9:40 PM | Link to this

DOB: “OK, Random. You win. Everyone who disagrees with you is wrong.”

YESSS!!!

That’s all I was sayin.

*(Woo-hoo!)

By Mike

February 6, 2009 9:43 PM | Link to this

I get the feeling that the money we had left did not include money we set aside that we offered Ohman. Maybe I am wrong, but we made an offer to Glavine (will get to that later), and we are still trying to get an OF bat, probably by trade, yet we havent pulled the offer to Ohman.

To explain, lets say we had 8 mill left and we offered Ohman 2-3 mill (just a guess) and Glavine 1-2 mill, that leaves about 3-4 mill left. I just would think that they would want to leave at least 5-6 mill to get the bat (I still would rather us give it a shot with our 5-6 mill left and offer Abreu a 1-2 yr deal and see if he takes it, as apposed to paying that much + prospects for Nady/Swisher). Maybe I am incorrect, buts its just my guess.

As far as Glavine goes…I would think if he really preferred Atlanta, he would take the 1-2 mill. I wouldn’t guess he has a need for lots of money (maybe I am wrong). And I would hope he wouldn’t consider the offer a slap in the face, because he’s gotta know that we only have so much left and that we need the OF bat. I would think he would want us to get the OF bat to help us win. So if it were me, I would take it…But then again, I’m broke and would kill to be paid 1-2 mill to play major league ball with the Braves.

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 9:47 PM | Link to this

Just thought some might be interested in reading this from Mark Bradley a couple of years back:

He (Bobby)refuses to discuss the 1995 incident that ended with him being arrested and charged with simple battery. Pam Cox had called 911 during an argument, claiming that her husband had pulled her hair. The two underwent counseling. The charge was subsequently dropped. “We have one argument in 25 years of marriage and it gets in the paper,” Pam Cox says. “I’m not proud of it, but we’ve worked hard to put our marriage back together. I tell the children, ‘It’s not a mistake if you make it a learning experience.’ “

Now, I have not been a resident of the Bobby Cox household at any point in my life, so I can’t really speak of the incident, but paraphrasing Pam Cox’ they have worked things out.

To hear some of you on the blog, you would think he is the earlier version of Pacman Jones.

Let’s try to keep things in perspective. Manny apologized for shoving the guy over the tickets. when has he ever apologized for laying down on his team in Boston?

Let’s keep our manager, and skip on the quitter.

By Jim Robinson

February 6, 2009 9:58 PM | Link to this

“Woo-hoo!”

KNOCK IT OFF!!!

By Cherokee

February 6, 2009 9:58 PM | Link to this

Than platoon Gregor Blanco and Jordan Schafer in CF in lefty righty situations Joe

why would you platoon two lefties in center?

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 9:59 PM | Link to this

Woah

Whoa Nellie!!!

Random Man, is that all you needed to hear to make you happy??? Geez, we could have accommodated you a LONG time ago!

:-)

All my evidence for Manny quitting on his team is hearsay, but I think if it were not true, many of his teammates on the Bosox would have stood up and defended him, don’t you think.

Yes, and Barry Bonds never knowingly did steroids or other PED’s.

What about them Jazz last night on national TV, kickin the Maverick’s butts? But, I guess most of you folks were well tucked in by the time it got fun in the 3rd quarter. What would my boys look like without the following missed games (out of 49 played) Boozer 37 games and counting, D-Will 14 games, Okur 8 games, Millsap 5 games, AK 11 games and counting, Harpring-the linebacker 14 games, and another dozen or more by the lesser contributing players. A total of over 100 games missed so far this season.

Sounds like the 2008 Braves!

By Bubdylan

February 6, 2009 10:03 PM | Link to this

Random, the believing-what-you-want-to-believe goes both ways, ya know. I do try to guard against it. I didn’t want to dislike Manny. Liked him fine for a while. As intuitive as you are, you must have figured out that I usually err to the opposite extreme, when it comes to giving people the benefit of the doubt.

I have only the same evidence as most everyone else. The news reports plus what I see of Manny on television. Enough to convict him in court? No. Enough to want him to stay off my favorite baseball team? Sure. Add to this the opinion of DOB, who doesn’t seem to make a lot of hasty character judgments, and who isn’t prone to ride any moral high horse, either, and I feel alright about my stance.

The last part of your post lost me, and I’m calling it a day. I really don’t have the stamina for a long blog battle. Not trying to cop out. Perhaps later.

By I'm Stunned

February 6, 2009 10:08 PM | Link to this

Rumor has it that Tim Redding is Coach’s sisters’ kid Wayne

I heard he was coach’s boyfriend. Whata putz.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 10:18 PM | Link to this

Dear Tom:

I heard about the offer they made you. I would say it spells out exactly how the front office feels about your value to the team. I guess the time has come to explore some other avenues. I hope you have enough respect for yourself as a professional, not to mention future HOF, to politely decline. I understand that there are some other organizations out there who my value an accomplished pitcher with your knowledge and history. Perhaps the Marlins, a short drive down the road, with a young developeing staff might appreciate your stabilizing influence. Even the Nationals, would be in Atlanta enough for you to keep contact, and who knows even throw a few gems against your old friends. I’m sure you’ll land on your feet somewhere. I wish it could be with the successful franchise you helped to build, working with that new management team, whose jobs you probably helped create. I know I’ll cringe every time I see that legendary Left handed change up fool another batter. I hope you still feel you’ll always be a Brave. Just remember; they can’t afford you and if they could I’m certain they would lay out the red carpet for you, as they have for so many others with half your stature! Keep in touch and I’ll be watching you in October after the Brave’s season is done.

Yours truly,

Most of the Braves Fans

By nolie

February 6, 2009 10:24 PM | Link to this

I think I just threw up a little bit in my mouth N8

you need to quit doing that all the time N8. It’s not healthy and people will think you’re bulimic

By Wayne in Utah

February 6, 2009 10:27 PM | Link to this

If TG leaving means we expedite the progress of Hanson, Morton, Reyes, etc. then I am all for it.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 10:30 PM | Link to this

Wayne (9:59)

Yup. All I know about Manny is what I read, but as you say when none of his former teammates contradict what’s reported in the press, then it has some credibility.

Besides, aside from the A’s, the Red Sox may be the most faithful advocates of statistical analysis in the majors, even having Bill James on the payroll since 2003. If any team would be willing to put statistical performance above intangibles like chemistry, the Sox would be your guys.

And still they gave him to the Dodgers and paid his salary.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 6, 2009 10:32 PM | Link to this

Canadianbrave,

Not so fast about watching Glavine in October. He might sign with the Nats.

By Random

February 6, 2009 10:34 PM | Link to this

Bubdylan — no “blog battle”; I’m fine with your response.

NBD.

(Anyway, we could already tell you were delirious, by the following: “DOB … doesn’t seem to make a lot of hasty character judgments, and … isn’t prone to ride any moral high horse, either.” Holy siht, man, where have you been?!?!?)

By Steve from OH

February 6, 2009 10:57 PM | Link to this

nolie, I thought he was talking about the Tigers games. I misread it, not you.

By Tomas

February 6, 2009 11:01 PM | Link to this

I agree with Frank Wren 100%. 1-2 million for a 42 year old pitcher who just had a season cut short due to injury, and finished with an ERA over five. And they don’t even need him, they already have 5 players competing for that 5th spot in the rotation. Out of respect they should have made an offer, and they did. Glavine is free to look elsewhere by a guarantee you he won’t get the guarantee’d 3 million + incentives to make it 6 million. The Nats just signed Odalis Perez, and they have a lot of pitchers already. In the current market, I doubt he would find a better offer than Atlanta’s, that’s the sad truth.

By nolie

February 6, 2009 11:07 PM | Link to this

I think I already pointed that out somewhere way up there ! Canadian

yes you did. however I comment when I read something so there is little chance that I will know that you changed it sometime in the future. It’s true that I’m omniscient but unfortunately not prescient. ;-)

By Moby Grape

February 6, 2009 11:11 PM | Link to this

While you’re likely sick of hearing about it Old Donk, Areopagus

you’re right I’m tired of it. Shame you didn’t change your name to something simple…like Gone Baby Gone. I hope you aren’t under the impression that those posts are funny or witty.

By nolie

February 6, 2009 11:27 PM | Link to this

Canadian

no need to apologize dude I was just kidding around, hence the universally-hated-on-this-board smiley face. Just kidding in my second reply just above too.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:30 PM | Link to this

Why do I get this feeling the Braves want Bobby Cox to retire as soon as possible!!

By nolie

February 6, 2009 11:31 PM | Link to this

Coach pitching wins are like RBI, totally necessary for a team but because of the many variable involved they aren’t very good stats by which to judge a single player’s performance FWIW.

By Efrim

February 6, 2009 11:33 PM | Link to this

Saw someone mention Luke Scott earlier. He would make a lot of sense as a platoon mate for Diaz. Scott can hit righties pretty well, but has trouble against LHP.

As far as Swisher goes, I hope the Braves can come to an agreement with the Yanks. I like Swisher. Not a star….or doesn’t appear to be at least. But a solid piece that is under control through 2011. Obviously, you’d like to think that he can rebound and be worth the 9 million that he is owed in 2011. But he is owed around 12 million the next two seasons and would be a solid addition. Although if the price includes Jeff Locke or Cole Rohrbough, I’ll pass. Gorkys Hernandez? Probably be okay with that. Gotta trade the guy at some point, if you think Jordan Schafer is the center fielder of the future. Both players value lies within their ability to play CF well. I know the Yanks already have Austin Jackson as their CF of the future, but maybe they will just look to strengthen the farm with this move. Not focus on a particular need in the system. We’ll see.

By mb

February 6, 2009 11:33 PM | Link to this

I think Wren made a basic offer to Glavine to save face with the fans and move on to the next issue. Wren obviously doesn’t want to spend a lot of money on Glavine and if Glavine wants to pitch in Atlanta, looks like he will do it with a home town discount.

Wren must figure Glavine is not going to start a significant amount of games and probably won’t be anymore effect than he was last year. So, why offer Glavine a bunch of incentives he can’t earn. It will be nice to get this issue off the table and on to more important concerns, The Braves offense.

Another everyday player for Left Field would be nice. Take your pick, Abreu, Swisher, Nady, Ludwick, Ankiel, Dunn or what about Manny. I don’t think we can afford Manny, cross him off. Can the Braves afford Abreu, maybe. Nady and Ankiel are both in the last years of their contracts, Boras is the agent, so they become free agents next year, plus we have to trade players to get them, pass. Dunn is poor defensively, Braves aren’t showing any interest for Dunn. Ludwick might be a good fit, depending on who we have to trade? Not sure St Louis still wants K.J. Swisher I believe is the best fit. We will have to trade some players to get him. If you look at the trade between NYY and CHW, the Yankees gave up Wilson Betemit, who was a good utility player for the Yankees, and two pitching prospects, Jeffrey Marquez and Jhonny Nunez. CHW gave up Swisher and pitching prospect Kaneoka Texeria. Jeffrey Marquez is 25 years old and still pitching in the minors with so-so numbers, not exactly a strong prospect. The other 2 pitching prospects don’t show any information, so not much to go on, probably some scout told them how great they will be some day. The point of this exercise was to see what would it take to trade for Swisher? The Yankees have enough outfielders without him. We might trade a utility player, like Prado, Johnson or Infanta and a lower tier prospect, meaning not one of our top 5? Just my guess, judging from the previous Swisher deal. I do like the fact Swisher can play first base and all outfield positions and he is under contract for 3 years.

Hope the Braves make a wise decision.

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:37 PM | Link to this

Nolie

Its okay no offence taken!!

By Canadianbrave

February 6, 2009 11:49 PM | Link to this

I can hear parents all over the world now. Don’t worry kids you can pick a favorite player. Just remember, he’s only on the team until he starts to cost them some money. Then he’ll be going to New York, Los Angeles or Chicago. I doubt that American baseball in its present form will last through another generation. Son its a business…no a game…no a sport…well what is it Dad? Imagine how the Pirate fans feel!!!

By SCRusty

February 7, 2009 12:05 AM | Link to this

For all you 1960’s rock & rollers—I heard on the radio today that Dewey Martin, drummer of the Buffalo Springfield, passed away. What a great but short lived band they were—Neil Young,Stephen Stills, Ritchie Furay, Bruce Palmer, Dewey Martin and late arrival Jim Messina (who replaced Palmer when he was deported back to Canada for pulling a Michael Phelps). That was the reunion I had always hoped would occur. But alas, that will peobably never happen. Palmer died about a year ago. And now, back to baseball!

By Hammy the Brave

February 7, 2009 12:10 AM | Link to this

DOB,

Does FW not have any interest in Ludwick of STL., or is he not available? Couldn’t they get him for possibly Jorge Campillo, Matt Diaz, etc. Then both teams would be taking a chance on what they’d receive in the trade.

Also, couldn’t FW look into trading K. Johnson, Brandon Jones, etc. to the Giants for Jonathon Sanchez(I think he’s a hard throwing lefty who’s about to blossom) and maybe Randy Winn(depending on salary) or Emmanual Burris(2B-SS prospect with speed)?

    Give me your thoughts,

Hammy the Brave

By richbrave

February 7, 2009 12:31 AM | Link to this

Well DAVE, “THE READER” is the pick of the litter in my book. Wow, I thought REVOLUTIONARY ROAD was a grabber. This movie wasn’t just another flick. This one makes space on my shealf.

By richbrave

February 7, 2009 12:39 AM | Link to this

BEAR:

So that’s a no to signing OHMAN I guess. In case you haven’t noticed, WIL’s not jumping all over the current stale offer on the table. Let him shop, but beat the best offer. I want him happy when he hits the mound for us in the eighth.

By uga-brave

February 7, 2009 12:41 AM | Link to this

bubdylan,

your 9:21 post confirms it. dude you got a certain talent.

very well written. dont care if you agree or disagree. well written.

By spotts

February 7, 2009 12:47 AM | Link to this

I just found another teacher in the school I work at taught Brian McCann in middle school. She has an autographed 8th grade basketball picture of him in her room. He was #32 and a little skinny.

By uga-brave

February 7, 2009 12:57 AM | Link to this

well the current so called economic downturn finally hit home.

saw three guys i worked with for close to ten years get laid off today.

nothing worse then closed door meetings on friday at 4:oo p.m.

10 years, and thank you for your time. bad day.

By uga-brave

February 7, 2009 1:10 AM | Link to this

let me expound on my last post. barney frank and
charles schumer need to be on the hook.

this was on their watch. then again barney was probably bouncing a, well the rest would of been deleted.

i worked with these guys 10 plus years, no heads up, barely a severance.

no joy in mudville tonight.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 1:23 AM | Link to this

Richbrave: I wasn’t exaggerating about The Reader, was I? Remarkably powerful movie. Kate Winslet solidified herself as an actress for the ages with that performance. That scene in the prison when he comes to visit her finally, and then walks away without showing her any affection … her body language in that scene was just something you can’t describe. The life left her there, for all intents. You could see her go limp a moment. …

On the other end of the entertainment spectrum, we watched Lisa Lampanelli’s HBO standup comedy special tonight. She is the most politically incorrect performer alive. Her act makes Louis CK or, going back a couple decades, Dice Clay, look positively quaint by comparison. And she’s hilarious.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 1:26 AM | Link to this

Woah, regarding the Vortex burger you ate (9:34 p.m. comment). Now you need to step up and tackle the famous Ghetto Burger at Ann’s Snack Shack on Memorial Drive. If your arteries aren’t completely blocked from the Vortex burger, they will be after you’ve had the Ghetto Burger.

By Wayne in Utah

February 7, 2009 1:28 AM | Link to this

uga I am feeling for you man. It is no fun going through that experience. In 1990, after 10.5 years with my company, I was sent packing with a 3 month severance. Before it was all over (you might remember there was a recession going on then), I had to live off my 401K for the next year, and then sell my house so I could go back to grad school to have something to show for that time frame. Finally got back to decent work in mid 1992. Lost it all.

Funny fact (it wasn’t funny at the time). I paid more in taxes in 1990 and 1991 than I made in salary due to cashing in the 401K one year, and selling the house the next!

Hope your friends have better luck….

By uga-brave

February 7, 2009 2:31 AM | Link to this

wayne,

it was a tough day. there are so many drinks you can buy them.

these were guys that i worked with, they have childern.

really bad day.

these are guys that were educated at michican, cornell,and princeton.

it was lifo, last in first out. really bad day.

really good friends i lost today.

but then again that senate led by barney, and charles, those rock stars that lead the banking division have done a great job.

baaaa i am bawneey fwank, i have a lisp. and i think i am a super genious.

barney frank.

By nolie

February 7, 2009 3:31 AM | Link to this

UGA

my condolences to your friends. I hope it doesn’t get too bad for them B4 they can bounce back. Hard Times in the Land of Plenty, bro.

By TheAntiMe

February 7, 2009 4:28 AM | Link to this

And just what do you want to bet that Red Sox Nation is not exactly shedding any tears over Manny Ramirez not being able to get a Wall Street CEO type of multi-year contract, so far this offseason?

After he apparently followed the advice of Scott Boras and lamed-out on the Red Sox (“It’s my left knee, no, I mean it’s my right knee, wait, it’s both knees”), I would not give him more than 1 year at $25 million or 2 years at $20 million per year.

If he pulled any crap in either of the 2 years then he would be traded at the non-waiver trade deadline in July. Commissioner Bud would possibly even extend the deadline by whatever, to get the deal done, like he did in 2008 when Manny was traded to the Dodgers.

By proeye

February 7, 2009 6:09 AM | Link to this

Follow up on an earlier post…

Hey, let’s have a little more pride in America people (for those who are Americans that is)…

The Canadian dollar is currently worth 0.82 of the American dollar (in other words, the American dollar is worth about 1.23 times the Canadian dollar). Look it up on Yahoo! Finance. (2/6/2008)

By Random

February 7, 2009 6:09 AM | Link to this

spotts: “Did anyone actually read nolie’s, Aristotle’s, or Random’s enormous posts?””

I just now went back and read “Aristotle“‘s first “comment”.

Let me say right here and now, for once and for all, that I deeply resent my inclusion in any comparison that includes his masturbatory and self-congratulatory, pretentious and self-indulgent forays into inane and arcane malapropisms.

So to speak.

By TheAntiMe

February 7, 2009 6:46 AM | Link to this

lol - I dedicate this next song (a really great tune, by the way) to you, proeye…

“In America” by The Charlie Daniels Band

Well the eagle’s been flying slow and the flag’s been flying low And a lot of people are saying that America’s fixing to fall But speaking just for me and some people from Tennessee We got a thing or two to tell you all This lady may have stumbled but she ain’t never fell And if the Russians don’t believe that they can all go straight to hell We’re gonna put her feet back on the path of righteousness And then God bless America again

And you never did think that it ever would happen again In America, did you? You never did think that we’d ever get together again Well we damn sure fooled you We’re walking real proud and we’re talking real loud again in America You never did think that it ever would happen again

From the sound up in Long Island out to San Francisco Bay And ev’ry thing that’s in between them is our home And we may have done a little bit of fighting amongst ourselves But you outside people best leave us alone Cause we’ll all stick together and you can take that to the bank That’s the cowboys and the hippies and the rebels and the yanks You just go and lay your head on a Pittsburgh Steeler fan And I think you’re gonna finally understand

And you never did think that it ever would happen again In America, did you? You never did think that we’d ever get together again Well we damn sure fooled you We’re walking real proud and we’re talking real loud again in America You never did think that it ever would happen again

By Random

February 7, 2009 6:52 AM | Link to this

Poor Frank Wren.

I’m sure that if he’d had his druthers, he’d rather have kept Smoltz than Glavine, assuming (1) it had come down to an either/or between those two and (b) they each were judged to have adequately recovered from their respective surgeries.

(I mean consider — a year ago, before any question of injury-surgery was forced upon us, who would you have kept if you HAD to choose between the two?)

But Wren was wrong-footed by the Red Sox (with or without Smoltz’ complicity), did not adjust (imo) appropriately, and has now painted himself into an even stickier corner with Glavine.

I figure TG’s as good as gone — just guessin.

I don’t know yet whether I think it’d be good or not for Wren to pass on Glavine — on the one hand, I feel confident that Smoltz will outperform Glavine in 2009, and Wren would really look like And Idiot for letting the “wrong” one go.

On the other hand, I really don’t see how keeping Glavine would “block” anyone. All the up and coming pitchers that denizens have been touting to occupy the 5th SP position have minor league options — the Braves would not be losing a one of them by going with Glavine out of ST and seeing how it goes from there.

And I do think that Glavine can still contribute positively to the Braves (albeit not as much as would Smoltz have.)

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 7:07 AM | Link to this

Ode to the old guys

Has anybody here seen my good friend Johnny. Can you tell me where he’s gone? He threw alot of pitches too bad the good can’t stay young. I just look around and he’s gone!

Has anybody here seen my good friend Greg? Can you tell me why he went? Best pitcher of our generation, but didn’t fit in the budget! I just look around and he’s gone!

Has anybody here seen my good friend Tommy! Can you tell me where he’s gone! We’ll throw him a tidbit and maybe he’ll stay home! I just look around and he’s gone!

Didn’t you love the teams that they threw for! Didn’t they put the fans back in the stands..ohohoh Wren you fool! Some day your gonna be wanting any pitcher here come and pitch for Bobby. I’ll just look around and he’s gone!

By ncscoots

February 7, 2009 7:20 AM | Link to this

Seems to me that the Braves are unlikely to make any moves at all until the arbitration hearings are held. Ludwick and Ankiel (two blog favorites) haven’t come to terms yet, and there may be other players in which the Braves have interest who are in the same position. Plus, the Braves still have two of their own to settle.

Frankly, I’m starting to lean more to the Diaz/Jones platoon in LF, even as iffy as the whole OF situation seems in that scenario. Unless the Braves get a real difference-maker out there (and I don’t consider guys such as Nady or Swisher in that category), most of the guys floated don’t seem to me to be that much of an upgrade over the current options. Diaz/Jones doesn’t solve the cleanup problem, but I don’t see Nady/Swisher/Ludwick/Ankiel doing that either.

Who knows? There doesn’t seem to be a good solution out there (that bloggers have spotted, anyway). Either Wren has something cooking under the radar, or the Braves believe Diaz can return to form and a healthy Jones can crank 15 HR. That’s my take, anyway.

By William

February 7, 2009 7:23 AM | Link to this

I think it would be a mistake to sign Glavine. Frankly, I’m surprised that it’s such a hot topic. The guy is 42 yrs old and coming of major arm surgery. Trust me, your body does not become kinder to you as you get older. Agreed, he can teach the young guys and be a veteran leader, but 3 mill is a lot to pay for “veteran leadership!!” Glavine has made it clear he wants to stay in Atlanta. Sign him as a coach and quit living in the past. Glavine is a hall of famer, but his pitching days are over!

By fengibby

February 7, 2009 7:47 AM | Link to this

I think one of the reason I prefer Swisher to some of the other trade canidates availble which have been linked to the braves is his ability to play 1st. No one knows if Kotchman is going to be successful this year and having a guy like Swisher able to fill in at 1st could save the braves. Also, if one of the young guys in our OF mix steps up the braves could then still get them playing time by sliding Swisher to 1st once or twice a week.

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 7:58 AM | Link to this

proeye

Have a peanut!

By dap01

February 7, 2009 8:03 AM | Link to this

Don’t trade for average. Average will get you no where.

By Roach

February 7, 2009 8:10 AM | Link to this

Yea dont trade for a below average player in swisher when you can sign an above average player in abreu.

By Doug

February 7, 2009 8:26 AM | Link to this

Barney Frank and Charles Schumer need to be on the hook for the economic downturn? Where have you been the past eight years? If you want to blame someone, point your finger—you know which one—to Crawford, Texas. Dubya is enjoying the good life, counting his oil money. No economic downturn there.

By Billy

February 7, 2009 8:28 AM | Link to this

On the Glavine subject I truly believe his injury occurred just before his last three starts in 2007 for the Mets. Mets fans were astonished and perplexed at his sudden nose-dive. In 2007 he had a really good year for the Mets, until those last three games which the results were inconsistent with the rest of his starts.

I have read many times where pitchers say they felt no pain in their pitching arm prior to when told they would need surgery. I am going to surmise he had a torn flexor tendon that partially healed during the off season and he redamaged it to the point he required surgey after a few starts upon pitching to the Braves 6 months after leaving the Mets. Is 5 months enough time for a partial torn flexor to heal itself with only rest?

He had unexplained loss of whatever velocity he had. He should regain that and return to the velocity he once had when he was very effective. I am quite sure he has not suffered from pitching amnesia, so if he is fixed I see no reason he can’t be as effective as Jamie Moyer, who has never been the pitcher Glavine is, but relies on the same style of pitching.

Both Glavine and Moyer rely on off speed stuff and location. Remember, Glavine did toss 200 innings in 2007, his last full season. Could he repeat that now that he is repaired? Maybe, but he will need the starts in order to get there.

KK was a part of a six-man rotation and he may be better suited for the 5th spot in the rotation with his maiden, introductory season getting acquainted with American hitters and adjusting to baseball and the States as a whole..

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 8:43 AM | Link to this

If Glavine is as greedy as most of the bloggers on this site seem to think he is, then he would be a fool to sign with the Braves when a mediocre pitcher like Wolf gets 5Mil plus incentives with the Dodgers

By Jim

February 7, 2009 9:22 AM | Link to this

Doesn’t anyone read the players’ stats?

B. Jones v. RHP is way below what Josh Anderson has done against RHP. More power, BA + OPS and it is not even close. B. Jones does not hit RHP as well as Diaz in his career.

To those who prefer Swisher because Kotchman might not be as good, please look at AL stats for both the last couple of years and tell me why you think that way. Kotchman had a bad August getting use to NL pitching and worrying about his mother. But his September was excellent, like KJs. If Kotchman goes bad, there will be a whole lot of things with this team that go bad before that.

Nady is the extra OF they need; question is how much talent they want to give up. Prado might be able to play every day for Yankees, even though he won’t for B’s, so I suspect negotiation should be focusing on how much Yankees need Prado and not how much B’s need Nady. If I were FW, I might give Yankees a pitcher between 15-20 on our depth chart, maybe even two pitchers. Yankees need pitching prospects. If they want Prado, with a longer contract than Nady, they would have to give something back in addition to Nady.

By McFann O –[zzz] (Braves Fann For Life)

February 7, 2009 9:29 AM | Link to this

spotts @ 12:47—

That’s neat!

(Sorry, BMac…know how you feel about that word. ; ) )

By jay blaisdell

February 7, 2009 9:44 AM | Link to this

It’s time the GM hitched his pants up like a big boy and signed a stick. They’re out there: Dunn, Abreu, ( NOT Manny). Or via trade ( Nady, NOT Swisher ). Without another bat, this is going to be a pretty anemic lineup, especially on days (weeks?) when The Chippah is on the DL with a nurse applying cold compresses to his head. And no more Glavine talk. Yesterday’s gone.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 9:48 AM | Link to this

fengibby, nice point (7:47 a.m.) about Swisher being able to play first. Not necessarily if Kotchman “fails” (he is what he is, has been in the majors long enough to give us a good gauge of what to expect) but just to spell Kotchman occasionally or in case of injury that might keep him out a week or two (remember what happened last year when Norton had to play there? Not good. And they’d rather not have Prado play the position every day for any stretch.)

By Dadgum

February 7, 2009 9:49 AM | Link to this

Wren gave Glavine a very reasonable offer. Frankly it is more than I would have given. Not sure I would have offered up a major league contract to somebody that has no chance of making the team. Nevertheless, Glavine would be a fool not to take it if indeed it is as reported. He will not get more guaranteed money elsewhere and would have a hard time meeting any incentives. This way he can retire in Dark Star with the Braves as opposed to Sarasota with the Reds or whomever.

I will agree with all posters that say the Braves are pretty much set in LF. Options are so numerous. Plenty of young talent to play there. Blanco, Anderson, Diaz. Don’t forget Kelly can play there but I think the Braves are resigned to him playing 2nd base and leaving Prado as their utility guy.

If the Braves are going to take a flyer on Glavine it makes zero sense not to take a flyer on Andruw for the same amount. I know. I know. Just saying why not. Maybe he does a 180. Maybe.

Sign Andruw, give Ohman an extra million (we need teh lefty in the pen), and forget about the high price veterans out there like Dunn and Abreu. The Braves have their answers in LF and they are already on the team. Bring on the young guys. Their time is now.

Rock on…..

By Lew

February 7, 2009 9:55 AM | Link to this

Fengibby-If the Braves trade for Swisher, it won’t be to take over for Kotchman, other than to fill on on a day or two when Casey needs a day off. For one thing, Kotchman is an excellent defensive first baseman. Swisher? Not so much.

By J.D.

February 7, 2009 10:42 AM | Link to this

ARod tested positive for 2 steroids in 2003 ….http://www.si.com

By richbrave

February 7, 2009 10:47 AM | Link to this

DAVE:

OMG, a truly masterful performance by WINSLET. If she doesn’t win BEST SUPPORTING ACTRESS there is no justice in this world, and she was marvelous in REVOLUTIONARY ROAD, but this performance was just towering. I hardly recognized her. She was absolutely transformed in this role. I see a sympathetic rendering of all holocaust victims is not yet possible from the controlling power’s hue and cry in HOLLYWOOD and the AMERICAN film industry.

I just didn’t find the film offensive in any way. I leaned over to my wife during the presentation of the can to the daughter by FIENNES and whispered, “there should be another title to this movie, ‘CASUALTIES OF WAR’.” Of course, that’s too hackneyed and conveys too much of the plot to be acceptable. I see foreign film critics have been far more accepting of this unique examination of holocaust victims and GERMAN guilt.

By South Dakota Braves fan

February 7, 2009 10:48 AM | Link to this

Why is everyone down on Kotchman? He is young and going to continue to improve. Can’t wait to see what Wren does for left field. I think the offer for Glavine was fair. We have plenty of pitchers ready to go if he doesn’t accept. Can’t wait to get baseball going. At least it will feel warmer watching baseball on TV when it is 15 degrees outside in South Dakota! Just wish I could see more games. Go Bravos!

By Chuck James was solid until the 6th!!!

February 7, 2009 10:50 AM | Link to this

DOB I don’t know your angle here, maybe that he will be “solid”. However, I think Kotchman has alot of room for improvement, being he is only 25. I think he can easily post .300 20/90+ and be phenomenal with the glove this year……But maybe that is what he is??

What do you make of the Glavine offer?? Heyman says both sides will talk through the weekend..Any chance he’d take that?? I’m hoping Ohman and Glavine sign by Monday so they can zero in on LF.

By Random

February 7, 2009 10:51 AM | Link to this

Thoughtful take on Glavine, Billy. Thanks.

Jim — Please lose the “B’s”.

It seems flip and disrespectful.

It’s what Faith Lehane called Buffy Summers.

By mbatl

February 7, 2009 10:51 AM | Link to this

A Rod Tested Positive

By Roach

February 7, 2009 10:52 AM | Link to this

J.D. where is it at on si???

By Efrim

February 7, 2009 10:56 AM | Link to this

ARod tested positive for steroids in 2003. Why is this released just now?

By Steve from OH

February 7, 2009 10:58 AM | Link to this

roach, right on the main page.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 10:59 AM | Link to this

A-Rod steroid story — HUGE. Sports Illustrated gets the major scoop, and it’ll tarnish his career. To what degree remains to be seen…

Richbrave: Kate Winslet’s an Oscar nominee for BEST ACTRESS for The Reader, not best supporting actress (though she should’ve been nominated for supporting actress, too, for Revolutionary Road, and won both statues).

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 11:01 AM | Link to this

Dadgum: Glavine has “no chance” to make the team? Flatly wrong. If he’s in camp and healthy, he’s got a good chance of making the team.

By NC Braves fan

February 7, 2009 11:07 AM | Link to this

Is it possible we only have enough in our piggy bank to get 2 of the 3 we want….Glavine, Ohman, and a left field power hitting stud?

I thought Braves offered Glavine a $1 million contract….which seems so low he may just say the hell with baseball and just stay home with his family.

I’d be a lot more excited about the opening of camp if we had a new big bat outfielder…otherwise we’re gonna lose a lot of 4-2 and 6-3 games.

By blazerpunter

February 7, 2009 11:23 AM | Link to this

No offense to you DOB, but some of the people at the AJC are truely idiots!!

The lead headline on the AJC frontpage is of course the ARod steroid story. Where the idiocy comes in is that they have a huge picture of Derek Jeter as the picture for the headline.

Unbelievable.

Excited for baseball to right around the corner!! GO BRAVES……

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 11:25 AM | Link to this

My wife told me about slumdog maybe falling out of favour with the academy because of the inappropriate use of child actors. Can anyone tell me about this?

By blazerpunter

February 7, 2009 11:26 AM | Link to this

At least they were smart enough to catch it, they just changed the picture to an actual ARod picture!! I agree that his legacy as being the Super baseball player will be tarnished.

GO BRAVES…………..

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 11:28 AM | Link to this

If Glavine is truly healthy, he might be the best on the team!

By mb

February 7, 2009 11:42 AM | Link to this

I think Baseball has opened it’s own can of worms. I don’t blame them for wanting to keep performance enhancing drugs out of the sport. Also, if Bonds committed purgery then he needs to suffer the consequences.

But, if you read this report on “A-Rod” who is being targeted as the media high profile player out of the group of 104 players that tested positive. Almost 10% of all the players tested positive. I believe this to be the bigger story.

Think about it. 10% of all tested were doing some performance enhancing drug, to make them better at the game of baseball. Think about all the players who didn’t get the chance to play in the Big leagues, because they chose to play the sport clean. Think about the Baseball Hall of Fame votes going forward. Already, several record setting players are not being considered for the Baseball Hall of Fame, because they are associated with the steroid era.

If A-Rod did test positive and he breaks Bonds record of most home runs, does he get an asterisk too? Does the Hall need to create a steroid or asterisk room for these players? If 10% were really using and their name is not tied to any major story line and they are consider for the Hall, will this be wrong? Hard to say, seems a lot of players were doing steroids.

I think this story will make me sick. I really don’t like Bonds at all, almost a hate for the guy he is such a jerk, and I wanted a “Clean Player” to break his record.

I wonder if Ryan Howard or Fielder can do it. Here’s the math on these two players, Howard is 30 has 177 HR’s so far, he needs to average 58.5 over the next 10years to get to Bonds record. Fielder is 28, has 114 Hrs and needs to average 54 HRs over the next 12 years. I figured the averages up to age 40 for both players. I would guess if they get close they will play past 40 to beat the record.

Beat!

By THE BEAR

February 7, 2009 11:43 AM | Link to this

Canadianbrave, did you realize Atlanta is almost half way between Miami and Chicago? It is not a short drive from Atlanta to Miami. It is about 700 miles.

Now on to other subjects:

Manny is a scumbag. Had the story about his disgusting act against his team in Boston been false no one in their right minds could think Boston would have handed his contract over to the Dodgers and paid his full salary just to get him out of town. The man is a cancer. I don’t see any other teams clamoring for his “servives.” I wouldn’t have him on my team at any price. There are some things more important in life than winning it all. Granted winning is surely desirable but at what price? No Pacman, no Burress and no Manny. Anyone who signs any of them is stating clearly that character means nothing to them.

As for Bobby Cox and his wife, they got into a family squabble. He apparently pulled her hair. No one knows what provoked it. They settled it and that should be the end of it. Character is not involved in that situation, in my opinion.

As for Andruw, character is not his problem, ignorance is his problem. He is too stupid to accept coaching. It is that simple. And it will spell his demise.

Furcal’s problem hinges on character. He did it in Atlanta with his run ins with the law and he lied his way into getting a return contract with L.A. He made the deal with Wren and then double crossed him. He should be written off Wren’s books forever for that one.

Smoltz has an ego problem. He didn’t care about Atlanta’s problems. He wanted his money regardless of the three or four times he had been on the DL for long periods at full pay including last year at $14 million. And when Wren didn’t jump when Smoltz told him to jump Smoltz dumped Atlanta. He burned a lot of good will with that move but egotists don’t care about good will.

By Because It Matters

February 7, 2009 11:45 AM | Link to this

I thought politics weren’t allowed on this blog?Why is it TheAntiMe can post that jingoistic piece of propaganda and no one calls him out on it? Yet when someone, I forget who, and it’s been several times, dares to call out the blantant hard right bias of this blog people can’t wait to tell s/he to shut the heck up? If moderates and liberals can’t say things on here without being called out, then the same should go for people who post crap from the overtly racist Charlie Daniels. This is a baseball blog right?

By Salamander

February 7, 2009 11:47 AM | Link to this

Its not surprising to me that A-Rod tested positive. I think that 25-50 years from now it will become clear that at least 33% of players were on some sort of PED during the peak years of the steroid era.

Also, 25-50 years from now, I think it will be obvious that many teams (if not all) knew that some of their players were juicing, but home-runs sell tickets and so it was best to ignore the problem.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 11:56 AM | Link to this

Canadianbrave

I understand you’re bummed about Glavine and Smoltz and Maddux no longer being Braves, but if you exclude Smoltz, this seems a little obsessive, don’t you think?

I mean, Maddux has changed teams, what, about 12 times since he left the Cubs for greener pastures in 1993.

And Glavine not only left the Braves for free agency, he signed with the hated rival Mets.

Loyalty works both ways, pal.

By Roach

February 7, 2009 11:56 AM | Link to this

This is a HUGE story about Arod because I thought he was clean but furthermore he was on his way to being arguably the greatest player of all time.

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 12:04 PM | Link to this

Afraud…… Aroid…….

Awanker…..

“Get into the groove boy”…

By Salamander

February 7, 2009 12:04 PM | Link to this

*By Because It Matters *

Perhaps because its just a song so who cares. Skip the lyrics if they bother you. Not everyone who reads/posts on this blog has a “blatant hard right bias,” so I would be careful throwing blanket statements like that around.

By dap01

February 7, 2009 12:05 PM | Link to this

Because it Matters: God bless America is not hard right.

Get a life!

Go Braves

By N8

February 7, 2009 12:09 PM | Link to this

DOB

The scary thing is that SI is saying that there is 104 other players on that list. Who else is on it, is yet to be seen.

Yup. Bud Selig and his 17.5 million dollar salary. What a worthless POS that man is. To top it off, the Players Union is a frickin’ joke as well.

I’m of the belief that our goverment has better things to do than to go on a witch-hunt for preasent, past and future PED users. But man alive, would it be nice to see ALL of those who used, run through the ringer a bit.

Every day that passes, Jose Canseco looks more honest and truthful, while Selig and the superstars who wave their fingers at congress and reporters, look like jackazzes.

For crying out loud, can we get some TRUE MLB HEROES into the HOF, like Dale Murphy, Andre Dawson and Dave Parker??

IMO, ANYBODY who’s career started since 88 (or so), should be put on hold for HOF induction, until this mess is cleared up.

Selig needs to resign NOW and give his 17.5 million dollar salary to a charity. Perhaps an anti-doping project. Add to that, Donald Fehr should do the same. They are both a disgrace to MLB, and quite possibly, the human race.

I have SERIOUS doubts about whether ANYBODY in the past 20 years, is actually clean, and that is sad. Yes that includes Chipper, Javy, Klesko, Andruw, Galarraga, Giles, Sheffield, Rocker, Gant, Justice, perhaps even Smoltz. After all, dude has recovered from a LOT of surgeries that most would retire from.

Fair? Nope. But I’m sorry. I don’t trust any of them.

If I’m a guy that’s in the HOF and I was clean. I’m going out of my way to make sure nobody with a shred of doubt surrounding them, gets into the “select company” that I worked my azz off to get into. Guys like Joe Morgan, Johnny Bench, Hank Aaron, Cal Ripken (if he was clean in the 90’s), Tony Gwynn, etc… need to be vocal and LOUD about this.

Enough is enough.

Torre was right, I will now refer to him as A-Fraud.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 12:09 PM | Link to this

Salamander

There’s no way of knowing how many players were juicing back in the day because there’s plenty of reasons for players to not ‘fess up.

That said, yeah, I’m guessing a lot of guys were ingesting stuff they shouldn’t have.

Fully agree with DOB and others who say the ARod story’s a big deal. Sure, he got a lot bigger from his days in Seattle ‘til now. But his “performance” never spiked over that time — unlike Barroid, who had never hit 50 HR in a season and then jumped to what, 70 in his mid-30s?.

ARod just kept getting better and better. Maybe he figured out how to juice without drawing suspicion to his play.

The person who has to have mixed feelings about this is Henry Aaron. If the story about ARod is true, in the eyes of many (including me), Hammerin’ Hank will always be the home run king.

By spotts

February 7, 2009 12:12 PM | Link to this

I’ll take a picture of little Mac on Monday and put it on Flickr

It should also be noted that McCann’s basketball team won the 1998 Gwinnett County championships

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 12:16 PM | Link to this

* HOF during Steroid Era*

Dave OB - Maybe for the Hall they should just open ban anyone testing positive to anything and then adjust all other players numbers from say 1994-2007 donw by say 20-25% (power numbers) to normalize them and then compare them to other Hall members…. would that make sense… then we may get a more even process…

Of note - is the improvement in the quality of numbers of some players since the start of 2007 (Manny, Chipper, Mussina etc) and the dramatic collapse of so many so called stars (Pudge, Gagne, Hafner, Clemens, ANDRUW etc etc etc). Seems the naturals (not steroid abusers) stand out now as do many I have suspected for some time.

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 12:18 PM | Link to this

N8 - on your list I DEFINITELY TRUST HOSS

After he did his knee as a rookie he has been consistently bugged by soft tissue injuries and other strains that STEROIDS would have helped prevent… very doubtful if he ever took as much as an aspirin….

By mbatl

February 7, 2009 12:19 PM | Link to this

“I’m of the belief that our goverment has better things to do than to go on a witch-hunt for preasent, past and future PED users.”

N8, I don’t think the govt is on a witch hunt for users. They’re trying to prosecute illegal traffickers and money-launderers like BALCO and related parties.

Bonds is not in trouble for using; he’s in trouble for lying to the feds about it as part of federal investigations into other parties. Same with Clemens.

The “list of 104” is old news… that’s been around for years. It’s just the “leak” of Arod’s name that is news now.

(otherwise, I agree with your rant completely!)

The entire era is tainted, not just ARod.

By N8

February 7, 2009 12:20 PM | Link to this

“I mean, Maddux has changed teams, what, about 12 times since he left the Cubs for greener pastures in 1993.” BravesFanInRockies

Really?

Maddux was drafted and developed by the Cubs, and pitched with them from 86-92.

At which point before the 93 season, he signed with the Braves. Whom he pitched for until 2003.

After being “burned” by Maddux accepting arbitration before the 2003 season, the Braves REFUSED to offer him arbitration again (if I remember correctly), essentially telling him to “go away”.

It was THEN that he chose to go BACK to the Cubs.

He pitched for the Cubs from 2004 to the trade deadling of 2006, when the Cubs TRADED HIM to the Dodgers.

After that season, he signed with the Padres. Pitching all of 2007 for them. The Padres then TRADED Maddux BACK to the Dodgers at the deadline in 2008.

The only times Maddux has CHOSEN to go anywhere else besides 93, was when the teams he was pitching for decided that they didn’t want him.

So, to correct you. He has changed teams 4 times since 1993. Twice his own choice, twice by trade.

Guess what. If the Braves had had any interest in keeping him, I’m guessing he’d still would have had a tomahawk the past 5 seasons.

God knows we could have used him the past 3 years.

Insurance asside, do you all realize that since he left the Braves, Maddux made 44 million dollars, while Mike Hampton (not all paid by the Braves), made 74 million dollars. Add to that, the 8 million the Braves paid for Glavine last year.

Hindsight is always 20/20, but looking back at our need for innings and healthy pitchers, Maddux should have NEVER been allowed to leave.

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 12:21 PM | Link to this

The Bear

Im glad you straightened us all out about today’s topics. I feel re-adjusted. For a minute there some of us must have drifted off into thinking we had our own opinions about the comings and goings of the players past and present. I don’t know what we were thinking. My views feel so much more ordered now!

By rotty

February 7, 2009 12:22 PM | Link to this

DOB - Dunn can also spell Kotch at 1B and with more power than Swisher.

I don’t see trying to squeeze in Swisher when you you will have to trade prospects & take on a 3yr/22+mm contract one (I might add) he couldn’t get in today’s market.

A 1-2yr flier on Dunn or a 1yr on Abreu makes more sense. A few extra million is not going to bankrupt this franchise but a near zero power OF will sure help resurrect the 1 run loss streak.

Swisher is scrappy but he is not a big time HR guy and while he is a utility oriented player we have buckets of those already.

We need a starting power bat in LF that can hit clean up. Every thing else is gravy not a requirement.

By THE BEAR

February 7, 2009 12:23 PM | Link to this

Mark Kriegel of FOX writes a thorough expose of Manny and it goes back a few years.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9186012/On-the-Mark:-Clubs-are-scared-of-Manny

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 12:30 PM | Link to this

THE BEAR

Saw that post earlier today. Thanks for sharing.

By THE BEAR

February 7, 2009 12:31 PM | Link to this

Mark Kriegel of FOX writes a thorough expose of Manny and it goes back a few years.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9186012/On-the-Mark:-Clubs-are-scared-of-Manny

By N8

February 7, 2009 12:31 PM | Link to this

dogsbrekky

I agree with you (logically), and as a fan I definitely WANT to beleave that. My point is that the bottom line (no matter what logic and excuses you use), is that NONE of us know, and in the case of MOST players, we NEVER will know, unless they come out many years down the road and admit it.

The bottom line, is that I don’t trust anybody, and won’t. I’ve got my ideas of who I think used and who didn’t. Many are obvious (Brady Anderson, Luis Gonzalez, Brian Giles, Strawberry - late in his career - Sheffield, Bonds, Albert Belle). Many are not. I would have NEVER lumped Andy Pettitte in that group.

So you tell me. How do YOU know?

mbatl

I should have phrased that differently. I don’t think that the government HAS BEEN on a witch hunt so far. What I was saying, was that in a preface to stating I wish SOMEBODY would go ALL OUT after these guys, that I think the government has better things to do.

Since I don’t have the resources to pay the investigators to do so, I have to hope the governement (not that we actually have the resources), does it for me. If only I was the commissioner of baseball, THEN I’d have some money to spend on…. never mind.

By Doc Holiday

February 7, 2009 12:34 PM | Link to this

If Glavine is truly healthy, he might be the best on the team!

You mean the richmond braves?

By mbatl

February 7, 2009 12:40 PM | Link to this

If Glavine is truly healthy, he might be the best on the team!

Golfer?

By THE BEAR

February 7, 2009 12:40 PM | Link to this

Canadian Brave, I am delighted to be of service. I had noticed that you needed some help and I was certain I was the man to deliver. Next time perhaps you’ll look at a map before you make such a “drastic” error.

As for my opinions on various subjects I fail to see how they differ so much from what I see on this blog on an hourly basis. Surely you have posted opinions. OTOH, maybe all your ramblings are strictly fact. Sure, that’s the answer, they are all facts, no opinions allowed in your world.

By N8

February 7, 2009 12:41 PM | Link to this

BravesFanInRockies

Maybe A-Fraud’s performance never “spiked” because he was always on them?

As for Bonds, half of what makes him “unique” is that he was on his way to the HOF before he started doubling his hat sizes every spring.

The thing to me about he HGH and what not, is that it’s not what it does to their ability to play the game. It’s what it does to their AVAILABILITY to play the game.

Imagine had Dale Murphy been able to play another 4 or 5 years (with healthy knees). Imagine what Andre Dawson would have been able to do, without having to go through 3 or 4 hours in the training room BEFORE each game just to play that day.

Arod, while never having a spike in numbers, has also never missed significant time due to injury. Is he a freak of nature, or is there a medical and scientific reason for that?

Why do you think so many relief pitchers are the ones getting busted? It’s so they can recover quicker. NOT to get the extra MPH on a fast ball.

These guys all got to the show because they are talented. It’s the ones who can play every day on a consistently great basis, that are recognized as the great ones. Those who do that over 20 years, go to the HOF.

Look in the NFL. I’m a Chiefs fan. Brodie Croyle might be the next Joe Montana. Maybe not. But dude can’t stay on the field long enough to finish a game.

It doesn’t matter how good you are, if you’re not available. Ask Mike Hampton.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 12:43 PM | Link to this

N8

I wasn’t trying to assign blame to the Braves or Maddux for what happened. We live in the era of free agency. Players change teams and teams make decisions on how they think they should best spend their budgets. From what I recall, Schuerholz and Boras didn’t get along when Maddux again reached free agency — maybe these negotiations started the bad feelings — and the Braves refused to offer Maddux the long-term deal that he and Boras demanded.

I understand why fans get upset when players leave or teams let them.

In my view, I think better of the players who take hometown discounts to stay with their original clubs, as Chipper has, and Andruw and Smoltz did for most of their careers. Once you acquire a guy who didn’t come up through your system, if he decides to leave, I may curse under my breath for a day or two, but I get over it. The game really is a business, after all. A very entertaining business, but a business.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 12:50 PM | Link to this

Also N8 I’ll confess my ignorance of Maddux’s contracts, but don’t most of Boras’s high-profile clients have NTCs? I mean it’s not at all unreasonable to assume that Maddux had to give his permission to be traded both from the Cubs and from the Padres.

Again, if Maddux wasn’t open to moving, he would have stayed put.

Can’t blame him from wanting to help teams win pennants, after all. Dude’s a legendary competitor who should be the first unanimous HOFer.

But as i said earlier, loyalty goes both ways.

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 12:51 PM | Link to this

N8 Little BRADY ANDERSON

God I remember that year he jacked a bazillion homies after what a career high of 14 and our own JAVY LOPEZ went up 20-25 lbs of muscle in one off season and jacked 41………..

I know from Aussie Footy who the most likely cheats are (in terms of injury profiles etc) but we never will know unless we were the one holding the syringe/s doing the injecting..

FWIW - My brother in law is a retired professional Aussie Footy Player and he was a huge dude but never grew his head, his foot size (Barry Bonds feet have grown for instance) and other guys he played against would suddenly put on 20lbs in a short time and seem to grow an extra leg and be able to withstand injuries etc etc… NONE OF THEM ever tested tv2 for roids or other PEDs

By Frank

February 7, 2009 12:51 PM | Link to this

For what it’s worth, IMO…

Hank Aaron is stil HR champ. Always was and always will be…

Sorry DOB…….but for all the Glavine-haters…..step the hell off, ALRIGHT? I’m so sick of the resistence to Tommy on this blog.

If Moyer can pitch effectively way past his 40th birthday…SO CAN TOMMY.

By N Nine (eta57)

February 7, 2009 12:55 PM | Link to this

Torre knew a little something something about A-Fraud. That chase to beat Barry Bonds now means less to me! Sad day for MLB.

After absorbing this latest news, Its no shocker. …and we came 2nd to get his services in 2003.(probably a good thing)

Sign Glavine and find a bat. Ohman would be a bonus. We need a left handed starter. Glavine made what 8 MM last year for his terrible results? He owes us a hometown discount. Some hate that “owes” approach, but this is different!! Take the 1-2MM and move on.

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 12:56 PM | Link to this

The Bear

I was smiling as I wrote that. Must have come out wrong! No i can assure you my ramblings are exactly what they seem, Ramblings

By Salamander

February 7, 2009 12:58 PM | Link to this

Yes,BravesFanInRockies I completely agree with you that players have every reason to keep quiet about using PEDs, which is why I attached the “25-50 years from now” clause to my statement. For the same reason why players used substances like steroids and HGH ($$$), I think some former players who fall on hard times will fess up and start naming names - think book deals, documentaries, TV specials, etc.

Even if none of that happens, I think enough circumstantial evidence will have come to light that the period of roughly 1985-2005 will be forever remembered as the Steroid Era, which of course is a conclusion that many people have already come to.

The REAL question is how many players are currently taking substances that are non-detectable. Given the amount of money that players can earn, its in their best interests to do whatever it takes to succeed at the major league level. Of course, this is just pure paranoid speculation on my part. I truly hope no player is currently using PEDs, but such a hope is probably very naive.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 12:58 PM | Link to this

N8

RE: AFraud—

Maybe he was juicing all the time. One way people tend to assume players were juicing is that they bulk up and slow down (as a buddy of mine used to say, Bond went from a 40-40 guy to a 70-0 guy in a couple of years). Other than the season ARod stole 46 bases (when he was 22), he’s never swiped more than 28 and most years he’s been in the high teens, low 20s.

So again, he hasn’t shown the dramatic changes in performance that made guys like Brady Anderson and Bonds and Palmeiro (and I’d include Luis Gonzalez, too) stand out.

The really big deal of all this, as I said earlier, is that MLB’s opportunity to ask people to forget about Bonds and McGwire and Palmeiro is gone. Over. Kaput.

ARod’s tainted, too, and any career records he surpasses will be accompanied by an asterisk in the view of many fans from now on.

By N8

February 7, 2009 1:00 PM | Link to this

BravesFanInRockies

Sorry. Wasn’t trying to butt in and rag on you. It could have been a short post about Maddux being traded as often as he’s chosen (signed) to go elsewhere.

You’re probably right about him having to accept a trade. But why wouldn’t he at the end of his career wanna go to the playoffs?

The rest of the rant, was just me babbling about how he shouldn’t have been turned loose by JS so quickly. But Time Warner (and empty seats at the Ted) had more to do with that, than lack of respect for Maddux on JS’s part, I’m guessing.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 1:01 PM | Link to this

Speaking of Glavine … just got off the phone with him. He and the family were driving to Charlotte for a hockey tourney (his kid’s team).

Gonna write a story now. He really wants to pitch for Atlanta, still hasn’t given much thought to pitching elsewhere. But….

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 7, 2009 1:10 PM | Link to this

A-Fraud, no surprise.

What will shock the blog is when one very prominent Brave is revealed as a juicer. It’s all going to come out in the wash and it’s only a matter of time.

By N8

February 7, 2009 1:14 PM | Link to this

I just have to reiterate my anger and blame to Bud Selig and Donal Fehr over this nonsense.

It has been nothing but a cover-up, since all this crap started. With nothing but their own azzes and reputations being considered.

One could argue, that in the short term Selig was doing what was best for the game by keeping it a secret, and not making the superstars walk the plank, so to speak. But in the long-term the results will be damning.

What’s more sad, is that MLB set attendance records last year. Which is “good” because that means people still love the game. But that’s bad, because the average fan isn’t outraged enough to walk away.

Then again, I still tune in. But my passion for the stats, and “little things” that make baseball great, like the rich history of records that stood for years, is gonna go away sooner than later.

Sad day, indeed.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 1:14 PM | Link to this

N8

No prob. At all. My guess is, The Streak is going to look even more impressive years from now once we reflect on how much Schuerholz had to scramble to meet those ever-declining TW budgets.

By Steve from OH

February 7, 2009 1:26 PM | Link to this

Coach—let me guess: Chipper? Explain (without me saying whether I think you are right or wrong). I’m interested to hear your argument.

By Billy Pilgrim

February 7, 2009 1:31 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the cryptic Glav update @ 1:01 DOB!

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 1:34 PM | Link to this

AROID

The SI article is especially damning as it appears AROD was using the most sophisticated type of roids (outside the clear) in 2003 and had been warned..

One would NOT learn about non-prescription roids and use them unless they had intimate knowledge/advice on the subject

104 others tested positive and the names are in the hands of the FEDS…

I think we may be hearing a LOT more of these names once the FEDS win the court case against the players union….

By THE BEAR

February 7, 2009 1:35 PM | Link to this

CanadianBrave, your comment accepted; it’s a closed subject.

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 1:37 PM | Link to this

DOB Could we use JO JO Reyes in lieu of The Dude out of the pen this year and just sign Glavine ?

By N Nine (eta57)

February 7, 2009 1:42 PM | Link to this

“What will shock the blog is when one very prominent Brave is revealed as a juicer. It’s all going to come out in the wash and it’s only a matter of time.” Coach

George Mitchell missed out on Identifying A Fraud, so the point of a Brave is always a possibility. But Who is big enough that matters?

Chipper and Andruw come in mind. I seriously doubt Chipper ever touched anything. Chipper always had the talent and has been steady. Andruw would not shock me! His downfall brings doubts. David Justice is fighting this issue. Even our future talent was suspended. Its part of life. I just hope no Braves legend is on the black list.

By N Nine (eta57)

February 7, 2009 1:45 PM | Link to this

dosbrekky Why JOJO? we will automatically put Campillo in the Pen and we do have some leftys but Ohman would seal the deal…

You know, I really think Soriano will pitch more this year.

By Braveheart

February 7, 2009 1:45 PM | Link to this

N8, are you really still that angry about it? You knew or should have know what was going on over a decade ago. Did you really have no clue what was going between 94 and Mitchell? You kind of sound like The Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer from the SNL skits

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I’m just a caveman. I fell on some ice and later got thawed out by some of your scientists. Your world frightens and confuses me! Sometimes the honking horns of your traffic make me want to get out of my BMW.. and run off into the hills, or wherever.. Sometimes when I get a message on my fax machine, I wonder: “Did little demons get inside and type it?” I don’t know! My primitive mind can’t grasp these concepts. But there is one thing I do know………

By mbatl

February 7, 2009 1:48 PM | Link to this

If Chipper has ever used (which I very much doubt), he sure had some cajones for this 2007 interview

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 7, 2009 1:49 PM | Link to this

The irony of all this is, when Jose Canseco linked A-Rod to steroids, nobody listened. Typhoid Mary (Canseco) should know, he started it all back in the late eighties.

Jose Canseco has more credibility than anybody right now because he blew the damn whistle when the rest of MLB was trying to sweep steroids under the rug. And that is a sad statement concerning the condition of the game I love.

Besides, the guilty should know better than the innocent by virtue of having violated the conscience of morality.

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 7, 2009 1:52 PM | Link to this

Chipper Jones is clean as far as I’m concerned. Fingering anybody else is pointless until the evidence comes to light.

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 1:55 PM | Link to this

N Nine

I was just thinking if we have run out of loot, why not put JOJO and Campillo in the pen, sign Glavine as number 4 or 5 starter if his arm is good and kiss the Dude bye bye….. then if we need a bat we may get one…………

By Tomas

February 7, 2009 2:03 PM | Link to this

A-roid, A-fraud, wow this is huge news. Turns out chipper was right after all. This is just devastating news for baseball, but at least now I can laugh at all those Yankee fans.

By KC

February 7, 2009 2:12 PM | Link to this

If A-Rod was roid’ing… can we officially call Ken Griffey Jr. the greatest player of this generation?

I think so.

If Griffey didn’t have so much injury troubl, and Bonds hadn’t stolen the HR record… we might have seen a great player legitimately cross the 755 mark.

By DAP

February 7, 2009 2:20 PM | Link to this

this is a little off topic, but ive been thinking, we need to hope that vazquez has a really good season this year, and bounces back. not only because it will help us win, but because he is definitly trade bait after the season.

the braves will probably excersise hudson’s option, unless he doesnt pitch at all this year, which means we will have lowe, vazquez, hudson, jurjens, and kawakami under control for 2010. weve also got hanson, morton, jojo, campillo, just to name a few, who will all be about ready to be in the rotation full time.

also, soriano and gonazlez will be free agents. chipper will be a free agent (i hope we extend him first)

the braves are going to need a closer, a setup guy and a third baseman, maybe some oufielders, and will have a whole bunch of extra starting pitchers.

i think vazquez will have a good rebound year, and then will get traded in a package for bullpen help, and/or maybe an outfielder. it will be salary releif and will open spots for young guys.

i think its either this, or hudson’s option does not get excersied, which probbaly means he didnt make it back in 2009. so, lets hope vazquez lights it up this year and raises his value, so we can get some good pieces in return.

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 2:30 PM | Link to this

I think we need to examine the structure of society, before we make villians out of past users of steroids or related substances.

It is a well known fact that as a society we are prone to succumb to the opinions of the so-called authority figures in our lives.

How many people blindly accept the word of their doctors or lawyers or accountants, or government for that matter as fact, without every questioning or acquiring a second opinion.

I am in no way trying to exonerate the athletes, by excusing them from responsibility for their actions, but it is possible that the existing athletic medical sub-culture of the time, created an environment where the players trusted the medical personnel, as authority figures, in counselling them in the administration of these substances.

Baseball at the time was suffering financially, and the powers that be no doubt turned a blind eye to the underlying events that contributed to the public’s renewed interest in mammoth homerun races, and power displays, that reestablished their confidence and enjoyment of America’s game.

The players in turn had to compete with this increased power production in an effort to be seen as competitive, in an environment that was constantly more demanding.

Salaries were escalating and the game was becoming dominated by power displays. In order to compete, and reap the benefits, players who were just competent, had to indulge to survive, and so the wheel had been driven.

On the surface, everyone was benefitting, from the use of these substances, and the game was thriving. As questions began to surface, These drugs became more sophisticated, became available in oral forms, and were administered by individuals that the players trusted, under the authority of trusted medical personnel.

In the 80’s, homerun crowns were won by players with 36 home runs. By the end of the nineties, if a player hit 30 homeruns, he was just middle of the road power-wise. The public appetite for homeruns was ravenous, and if players didn’t recover from surgeries immediately, the fans were crying for new and more powerful replacements. By this time, which brings us up to near the time of the A-rod news, it is probably scary to think what percentage of players were juiced in some way.

Fear of being left out of the financial windfall, trust of authority, and pressure from fans for increased productivity probably all drove the steroid market.

Don’t get me wrong, I am a firm believer in innocence is no plea, but I think fans, owners, the media and the players all share a role in the evolution of the use of these substances.

Or maybe not, just another ramble!

By Saltywoody

February 7, 2009 2:32 PM | Link to this

But…

?????????

By Butch Haynes

February 7, 2009 2:34 PM | Link to this

As expected, the Rick Springfield concert last night was awesome! That dude can shred! He rocked out with Jesse’s Girl, and then played some other stuff, and then mellowed out with an acoustic version of Jesse’s Girl, and then played some other stuff, and then closed the set with the extended play version of Jesse’s Girl! Kicked butt!

By N Nine (eta57)

February 7, 2009 2:35 PM | Link to this

DONK!

That was Steinbrenner head hitting the floor. I bet they want an out clause also, and redo that signing!

10-year, $275 million contract that will pay him into his forties!

not just that he got a “special” bonus clause that includes SIX MM per milestone HR. Yes all 5 milestones. OUCH. The fans will hate him and the whole marketing idea will fail. Afraud indeed.

Wonder if Yankees will find a way out of this. Stay tuned…

Fill in the blank. 2008-Roger Clemens. 2009- AROD - 2010- who is next?

KC I agree Griffey is now in line for the best in the 90’s generation. Yes he would have crushed those HR#’s

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 2:35 PM | Link to this

DAP - Vazquez has the most strikeouts in baseball over I think the last 5 years and is coming from a hitters park with a rat-a* manager to a pitchers park to a manager who will build him up !

They have Buck Shoalwater on now (Rangers manager in 2003), he says they were never told about ANY positive tests…………

By N8

February 7, 2009 2:36 PM | Link to this

Braveheart

YEAH!! I’m still angry about it. Believe it or not, my buddies and I were talking about who we thought was roiding long ago.

I truly wanted to believe that Arod was clean. He has denied allogations from Canseco. Now he’s not only guilty, he’s a liar.

The Feds (along with Selig and Fehr), know who’s on that list. That bothers me.

The fact that this week it came out that Selig is making 17.5 million dollars, only heightens my anger.

Ask yourself. What on earth has Selig done for the game, that when future generations of baseball fans look back, they will say “Thank god, that Selig was commissioner”????

Every commissioner is remembered for something. Giamatti will ALWAYS be connected to Pete Rose. Period.

IMO, Selig will be remembered for two things. Not only allowing, but facilitating the roid-era, and of course, who’s EVER gonna get the dumb-founded (empasizing the word DUMB), look on his face at the famous “tie game” all-star game?

If you can name something GOOD he’s done for the game. Please do.

I’m not angry about the roids, and the players that were ALLOWED to do so, without punishment, or reprimand. I’m angry at the person(s) in charge of allowing it to do so.

If your neighbors dog repeatedly does it’s “business” on your lawn, who’s to blame? The dog or the dog’s owner? Me? I place blame right to the top.

“Jose Canseco has more credibility than anybody right now because he blew the damn whistle when the rest of MLB was trying to sweep steroids under the rug. And that is a sad statement concerning the condition of the game I love.” Coach

Agree 100 PERCENT! Sad that in the end, Canseco (for whatever revenge/motive/financial gain he had up his sleeve for righting the book), is only one with some dignity in all of this.

By Yars

February 7, 2009 2:38 PM | Link to this

theBear……I agree with you 100% regarding your 11:43 post about Manny. I still see the Dodgers resigning him.

By J.D.

February 7, 2009 2:39 PM | Link to this

Does this eliminate A-Rod from the Hall of Fame? The biggest names with this always get the worst of it, and it isn’t like A-Rod wasn’t a hated man in NY before. Wait until they start playing in new Yankee Stadium. It is going to be UGLY.

By dogsbrekky

February 7, 2009 2:40 PM | Link to this

Butch BUT, did he do the disco remix version of Jessie’s Girl ?

BTW - When he was a 60s rocker ol’ Ricky did an awesome hard rock version of Eleanor Rigby.. (FWIW)

By N8

February 7, 2009 2:42 PM | Link to this

Braveheart

Forgot to mention that I actually LOVE the Caveman Attourney skits. So thanks for bringing it up. Made me smile.

I guess the problem with secrets (which is exactly what the hold decade - be it, a poorly kept one - for Selig). By NOT coming out with the names and letting each player (along with himself), deal with what Bonds, Clemens, Palmeiro and McGwire have dealt with, is that EVERY TIME a new superstar’s name comes up, it just reminds everbody of it all over again.

VERY sad that Bonds, McGwire and Clemens might never see the HOF, when every single one of them more than likely would have gotten their anyhow.

Makes me appreciate guys like Murphy, Brett, Ozzie Smith a little more.

By Cheesy Music Lover

February 7, 2009 2:45 PM | Link to this

Damn, I hate that I missed the Rick Springfield concert. Unfortunately, I was too busy over at the mall watching Debbie Gibson and Tiffany,

By Yars

February 7, 2009 2:49 PM | Link to this

For those with the MLB Network, try to catch that hour long Bob Costas interview with Joe Torre. What a fascinating interview, especially when A-rod is discussed. now playing: happiest girl by depeche mode.

By JasonInFL (Formerly ME)

February 7, 2009 2:51 PM | Link to this

N8, while I too think Selig has done as more to hurt the game than to help, many people will point to the Wild Card as a huge plus. There are folks that love interleague (I hate it). Teams and players both make more money now which is one of the goals of the guy in charge…

By Anders

February 7, 2009 2:51 PM | Link to this

Today the MLB Network becomes a man thanks to A-Rod. They’re covering this whole story live like CNN covers election day. Costas, Verducci, Reynolds, former players who played with A-Rod , one of the writers who broke the story for SI - all within hours of the story breaking. As I said when this network opened for business a month ago, if you’re a baseball fan there won’t be any reason to turn ESPN on again when baseball news breaks or during the season when you want to catch scores and watch highlights.

Costas gives them such a major player presence. They’ve really nailed this thing.

BTW- didn’t read all the posts above but I did see a couple that brought Chipper’s name up. There are two guys that I’d be willing to bet my life never used steroids - Jeter and Chipper. I will say that I always suspected Piazza would be on a list someday - maybe this is the list.

By McFann O –[zzz] (Braves Fann For Life)

February 7, 2009 3:01 PM | Link to this

Spotts—

OK! Sounds good! Just post a link to it once you get it up, please.

Danke!

By Tomas

February 7, 2009 3:02 PM | Link to this

Andruw is close TO SIGNING A MINOR LEAGUE DEAL with Texas. Why didn’t the Braves offered him at least a minor league deal?

By Bobby's Cox

February 7, 2009 3:03 PM | Link to this

N8

I’m not angry about the roids, and the players that were ALLOWED to do so, without punishment, or reprimand. I’m angry at the person(s) in charge of allowing it to do so

Amen to that….that should be the story, not the individual players. I could give a rat’s about a-rod, conseco, mcgwire, bonds, clemens, etc…All I care about are the records that were tarnished, and the facts that the ones in charge of the game let it happen to spike the ratings after the strike.

Selig’s HAS done good things for the game. Getting more teams into the playoffs, interleague, etc… but the steroid issue was entirely his fault by letting it happen, and he let it slip to increase ratings. By the way, the unbalanced schedule sucks…

The only other thing I care about is the other sports taking a back seat to baseball when a marginally higher percentage of players in other sports (i.e. football) use the stuff more than baseball players.

By Yars

February 7, 2009 3:04 PM | Link to this

As a baseball obsessed child, Canseco was my favorite player, along with Eric Davis, Strawberry, Sandberg, Mattingly, Vince Coleman, Maddux, Glavine, Murphy, Mark Grace, ect… When Canseco’s first book came out in ‘05, I bought it & everything he admitted to did not surprise me one bit. His first book was slammed by players & the media from the very beginning, how it all was a lie, meaning all the players he exposed as users, such as A-rod, McGwire, Clemens, Bret Boone, Jason Giambi, were given a free ride by the media. Just no way any of them were ever on PED’s. Those of us that are hard core baseball fans, that live & breathe baseball pretty much everyday, (probably 95% of us on this here Braves/MIB blog) have always had, I’m sure, our suspicions of certain players. I’ve never cared much for A-rod. Hell, I hope even more dirt is dug up on the guy. By all this being exposed, I can’t help but appreciate players like Maddux, Glavine, Chipper, Griffey, Jeter even more. now playing: monkey gone to heaven by the pixies.

By Braveheart

February 7, 2009 3:06 PM | Link to this

Oh, N8, I just wanted to work in an Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer reference. But I agree with you. Like you, the little bit of anger that I still have is directed at the powers that be that created an environment where most of these guys could be seen as foolish, ignorant, negligent or uncompetitive if they weren’t using. I always think of what Chad Curtis said after Senator Mitchell outed so many of them - paraphrasing him - “I was a starter on a bad team, a fourth outfielder on a contender, but maybe if I was on that stuff or if no one else was on that stuff, maybe I was so much more.”

By Randy S

February 7, 2009 3:08 PM | Link to this

Andruw close to a minor league deal with the Rangers, hmmmmm.

STORY

By Chuck James was solid until the 6th!!!

February 7, 2009 3:12 PM | Link to this

Anders How much does the MLB Network cost? I assume MLB Extra Innings is seperate?

For all the strong basketball played by the Knicks this past week, they really got nothin’ to show, huh? I’m startin to love Al Harrington too, he is really good!

For all who don’t want Glavine You can never have enough reliable starting pitching. What you’re going to rely on Campillo/Morton/Reyes for the #5 spot? What if Kawakami is a bust like Kei Igawa?? What if, God forbid, Lowe/Jurrjens or Vazquez go down?? What if Campillo gets found out?? Too many question marks there..See the Braves 2008 Pitching staff! Glavine, if healthy, which it appears he finally is after he got his arm and shoulder cleaned up, will be a phenomenal asset to the Braves rotation and squad as a whole…

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 3:14 PM | Link to this

I guess Scott Boras sent Andruw out to Texas for more than just hitting tips from Rudy Jaramillo a few weeks ago. Probably sent him there to convince Rangers officials that he could still hit.

By mbatl

February 7, 2009 3:18 PM | Link to this

N8, seems to me you want to blame everybody (Selig, MLB, the government) except those who actually cheated - the players who illegally obtained banned substances, and used them against the rules of MLB (even though there stupidly was no punishment for using them, they were banned).

By Steve from OH

February 7, 2009 3:18 PM | Link to this

Another solid article from Will Carroll over at Baseball Prospectus regarding the cutting edge of steroid technology.

By N8

February 7, 2009 3:19 PM | Link to this

Jason in FL & Bobby’s Cox

I guess, for me, I’m not a huge fan of Interleague (actually like the idea, but don’t like the current “set up”), and prefer more games against division opponents, so the LONG 162 Game regular season determines who’s in, come October.

IE: Never have been a big fan of the Wild Card. As Ricky Bobby’s dad allegedly said, if you’re not winning you’re losing. Which is what the wild Card is… the best of the losers.

Of course, that being said, I understand WHY the wildcard is in place. Because every 50 years or so, there is a situation like the one that happened in 93, when the Giants won 103 games and MISSED the playoffs. Kinda like the Chargers winning the weak AFC West, while the Patriots sat at home at 11-5 (or 10-6, already forgot).

But, as long as interleague AND the wild card BOTH exsist, it’s an unfair scenario. Until they create a balanced schedule, where everybody in the NL play the same teams, and the everybody in the AL play the same team, it won’t be “fair”.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 3:20 PM | Link to this

Well, if Frank Wren has shown anything this winter, it’s that connections to the Braves’ glory years aren’t going to guide his decisions. That should be clear now, after the modest offer to Smoltz, the even-more-modest offer to Glavine and declining to guarantee anything to Andruw.

By The Vet

February 7, 2009 3:20 PM | Link to this

hey DOB anything new on Chipper and a contract extension? spring is getting closer and coming fast, i would hate to see AL teams lineing up offers for him to be a DH this fall

By the jerk

February 7, 2009 3:29 PM | Link to this

I like Glavine I really do. I want him back.

But, I don’t want Hanson sitting in AAA if he’s ready to pitch now. If Tampa has David Price in their rotation, there’s no reason the Braves should not have Hanson in theirs if he shows he’s ready in ST.

The best case scenario would be to sign Glavine if someone got hurt during the season or if Hanson proved not to be ready, but I’m not sure Glavine’s set on waiting.

By Anders

February 7, 2009 3:29 PM | Link to this

Chuck James

I have verizon/Fios and it didn’t cost me anything when the network started in January. It was considered part of the sports pack I already had.

MLB innings is seperate.

Man, it looks like Gene Orza and Donald Fehr really screwed this whole testing thing up by not having the test results destroyed as the agreement called for. 104 players could be outed when all they agreeed to was anonymuos testing that was to be destroyed after the data was collected.Is it possible for these players to sue their own union about this? This could get very, very ugly.

DOB - Am I wrong here? Your thoughts on all this?

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 3:34 PM | Link to this

N8

I think MLB would love to expand to 32 teams, eight divisions. Then the wild card wouldn’t be necessary. The economy may set that cause back a decade if not longer.

Man, what a relief if Andruw signs with the Rangers. Braves fans won’t have to worry that he would be the everyday CF for this year’s Braves team even if he hit .150. Again.

BTW, Dook/Miami headed to overtime!

By N8

February 7, 2009 3:38 PM | Link to this

DOB

Was thinking the same thing about Wren and nostalgia. Looks like Glavine (ex-NL Players rep Glavine), is gonna have to think long and hard about how much HE wants to pitch for Atlanta.

mbatl

I’m not totally ridding the players of any blame. I’ve often tried to determine if I was put in the same position (where deciding to do steroids might mean the difference in MILLIONS of dollars), what I would do. I can’t answer that.

They are definitely to blame. At some point they have to be held accountable.

You said: “…even though there stupidly was no punishment for using them, they were banned.”

Exactly. No REASON (other than morally), to NOT do them. That and health reasons later in life.

But there is PLENTY of penalty for DUI’s, yet people continue.

By #1 Smoltz Fan

February 7, 2009 3:39 PM | Link to this

Biggest story of 2009 will be the come back of Andruw Jones in my opinion. I dont understand the thought process of Frank Wren, he flat out does not understand that a come back of Andruw Jones is EXACTLY what would fill the seats at the Ted.

I dont see the spark in our lineup right now??? We have several good pitchers, but I think everyone agrees none are great. And the same goes forour lineup in my opinion, we have good players batting 1-7 (I suspect) but are any of them great? Possibly McCann….maybe Escobar? Andruw Jones needed to be back home and an reasonably competitive offer to Andruw would have brought him home for an explosive comeback season.

Congrats RANGERS you will have headlines across the nation at some point this year, and the loralty of a great player for taking a little risk on what will bounce back to be a Huge bat.

Nice job Wren, show NO dedication to the players and you wonder why nobody will take your money. I hope Bobby retires soon as you are a disgrace to the dedication he gives his players.

By Bobby's Cox

February 7, 2009 3:41 PM | Link to this

I agree on that too N8

I’m a little over interleague, but more with its current “set up”. If they could have every team play the same winning percentage of teams based on the previous year’s record, and who hasn’t played who that most recent, that would be more “fair”. The current set up of east playing east every other year, and east playing central/west every 4th year, that’s “unfair”.

I like the wild card too. It gets more teams involved in the playoff picture. It also enables some teams in the stronger divisions to make the playoffs, i.e the AL east this year with 3 very good teams.

In terms of the playoffs, the first round should be best of 7 games to prevent the .500 teams a chance of moving deeper in the playoffs.

Now, i can’t stand the unbalanced schedule. They definitely need to change that.

By mbatl

February 7, 2009 3:42 PM | Link to this

“Man, it looks like Gene Orza and Donald Fehr really screwed this whole testing thing up by not having the test results destroyed as the agreement called for.”

Anders, you didn’t ask me, but I agree 100%. Those tests should never have had names attached in the first place. Also, I have a feeling the Feds are gonna be p**sed that this whole thing (arod) got leaked. Wouldn’t be surprised to see them subpoena SI for the source names… which would lead to a whole new legal action.

From Richard Nixon to Martha Stewart, Barry Bonds to Roger Clemens … the beat goes on. People under-estimate how serious the feds are in their investigations.

By Anders

February 7, 2009 3:44 PM | Link to this

Bravesfaninrockies

I think it’s more likely that the MLB will add wild card teams in the next few years. Look at the AL. With the Yanks and Red Sox in the same division it almost assured that one will win the division and the other the WC taking away the WC as a possibility for the central and west. Last year was an exception imo.

By Bobby's Cox

February 7, 2009 3:45 PM | Link to this

Glad Andruw’s not coming back.

Do you seriously think AJ would have the same success here that he would have in Texas? Texas is filled with big-time hitters, and that leads me to think they have a good hitting program. It’s no mistake Boras wanted him to go there. Texas also has a DH.

I hope AJ does turn it around and can still play OF. That might make Nelson Cruz available for a ST trade….wink.

By The Vet

February 7, 2009 3:49 PM | Link to this

Hey #1 Smoltz fan are any of our hitters great? Um are u sure your a braves fan?? Chipper Jones is one of the best hitters in the game…. add the last 2 years up of any hitter Chipper is in top 3 in AVG,OBP only behind the likes of Big Papi and Pujols

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 3:49 PM | Link to this

**#1 Smoltz Fan##

Andruw may — I say may — hit for a higher average in 2009 than he did in 2007. But I’d be shocked if his power numbers are better this year than they were then (26 HR, 27 2B). I wager he’ll strike out 150 times if he gets more than 500 plate appearances.

Of course he might not get 500 plate appearances because he’ll be benched.

By Anders

February 7, 2009 3:54 PM | Link to this

It also appears Gene Orza was tipping players off when they would be tested. Holy crap! The players union has a huge problem. I have an idea on how to start to fix this that you guys won’t like but I truly believe will help. Glavine should retire and take over running the union. He has credibility in this area on all sides. He comes with a squeaky clean image. He says that the old guard is gone and we need to move forward to clean this up -now.

Maybe I’m reading this whole thing wrong but it appears this whole steroid thing is going to explode again with the union management itself being implicated in wrong doing and incompetence.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 3:56 PM | Link to this

Bobby’s Cox

I like the Cruz idea, but first he has to stink and Andruw has to shine. Those are big ifs.

Texas has a “good hitting program” because Arlington is a great hitters park. Something about the sightlines and the dimensions and (most likely) the heat wearing out pitchers as the season goes along.

By McFann O –[zzz] (Braves Fann For Life)

February 7, 2009 3:56 PM | Link to this

#1 Smoltz Fan “but are any of them great? Possibly McCann…”

Possibly…

And don’t forget CJ. I hear he’s pretty good.

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 4:00 PM | Link to this

Anders

That Glavine idea is truly inspired. One thing you’ve always been able to say about him: He’s all about the integrity of the sport.

By Steve McP

February 7, 2009 4:01 PM | Link to this

Maybe Andruw will regress so far that the diehard fans might get the chance to see him at the Hickory Crawdads.

By Steve from OH

February 7, 2009 4:08 PM | Link to this

This is awesome. A cheater AND a liar to boot.

By N8

February 7, 2009 4:09 PM | Link to this

mbatl

I should have added that the players have a competitive streak in them like none of us will ever know. Millions of dollars are/were at stake. Not only for them, but their agents, the advertisers (whom the players endorse), along with the owners (and it’s RICH commissioner).

The ONLY thing that can truly punish these guys is banishment, ignoring them and treating them like they never exsisted.

As much as McGwire seemed to love the spot-light of “saving baseball” along with Sosa in 98. Do you think the fact that the HOF voters, along with ALL of the fans in MLB, have basically said “we don’t care about you”, would make him change his mind about cheating?

Not only are these guys competitive, but (like any entertainer), they’re ego maniacs. So how do you hurt somebody that wants attention? Ignore them.

By jtb

February 7, 2009 4:14 PM | Link to this

Your 3:39 post doesn’t really make any sense to me for many reasons. First of all, how would a comeback of Andruw Jones fill seats at Turner Field? The Braves attendance has been hovering in between 30 to 33 thousand per game for the past 5 plus years including last season when Andruw was not a Brave.

Secondly, what leads you to believe that he will have a huge season this year? I haven’t heard anything from anyone other than McCann and Scott Boras that leads me to believe that anything has changed. Chipper sure didn’t have anything positive to say about how he was hitting in the cages a few weeks ago.

Third, why is Wren supposed to show dedication to Andruw Jones when it was Andruw who left the Braves for the Dodgers for more money. Where was that loyalty that you give Andruw so much credit for possessing?

Finally, so let me get this straight, you think the Braves line up lacks a truly great hitter, and Andruw Jones could have been that guy? Have you simply forgotten the reigning NL batting champion Chipper Jones? You think Andruw Jones, the guy who had 33 hits in 209 at bats last year will provide a spark greater than Chipper, McCann and Yunel?

By Anders

February 7, 2009 4:15 PM | Link to this

Bravesfninrockies

Most on here have always taken my dissapointment in Glavine as a Met as a hatred of him. I’ve stated numerous times that it wasn’t the case and that as a professional and as a person I have the utmost respect for him.

I think he is just the kind of guy we need to lead the union now. He represents the clean guys who played in the tainted era in question. It’s time those guys had a voice in this. That’s the only way this gets dealt with and put behind us. ( I don’t say cleaned up becuse I don’t think it cn truly ever be totally cleaned up)

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 4:30 PM | Link to this

One last note on Andruw. He turned down a minor-league invitation from the Yanks but is apparently about to accept one from the Rangers.

I’m guessing the boos he heard the last two years affected him.

But seriously, where’s he going to have a better opportunity to win? Seriously? What does that tell you?

By cvbraves

February 7, 2009 4:38 PM | Link to this

DOB What do you think or can you give an honest opinion, given the circumstances?

Without naming names or teams, would a $1-2 million offer be fair in today’s market for a starting pitcher who is approaching 43 years of age, had a 2-6 won lost record, a 5.54 ERA in 13 starts last year, then went on the DL and had arm surgery?

By Blane McFarnersternski

February 7, 2009 4:58 PM | Link to this

I hope Glavine goes to another team. He thinks the Braves owe him.

No more old broken down pitchers , please.

By Salamander

February 7, 2009 5:09 PM | Link to this

BravesFanInRockies I think Andruw signing with the Rangers indicates a few things:

(1) better chance to make the ML club (than with the Yankees). (2) better chance to pad numbers in that ballpark. (3) Andruw was convinced by the Ranger’s hitting coach that he can help him with his swing during ST. (4) easier to “rehab” his career away from the media circus of NY.

What I’m left wondering is why he would take a minor league deal from the Rangers, but not the Braves.

By Braveheart

February 7, 2009 5:16 PM | Link to this

For whatever reason, I came across the below excerpt on the internet today from Bill James about Dick Allen in his politics of glory book. I thought it was somewhat applicable to the debate we’re having on here about Manny.

Bob Carroll, in making Dick Allen’s Hall of Fame case wrote that “Rugged individualism is more admired at a distance than up close and personal.” Rugged individualism? How about alcoholism, irresponsibility, and vindictiveness? How about paranoia and pettiness? They’re all easier to admire from a distance.

“Had Dick Allen played fifty years ago,” Carroll continued, “he might be lauded today as a shining example of American independence. Instead, his moodiness, self-absorption, and free-and-easy approach to baseball make him anathema to many.”

Well, pardon me, but was there an era in baseball history where moodiness, self-absorption and a casual approach to the game were considered desirable qualities in a ballplayer? Was there a time in baseball history when a player could not show up at the ballpark once in a while without anybody making an issue out of it?

By Coach (Skip and Pete will be missed)

February 7, 2009 5:18 PM | Link to this

An open letter to Tom Glavine.

Your Hall of Fame resume is complete with 305 wins. Twenty-two seasons and 128 million is in the bank. Two Cy Young awards and one World Championship ring along with ten All-Star appearances and four Silver Slugger awards must have your trophy cabinet looking grand.

That said. You say that YOU want to pitch for the Braves. We keep hearing YOU say that the old left arm is nearly ready and money is hardly an obstacle. My advice, swallow the pride and pitch. We want you, the Braves want you and only YOU can make the right decision.

Tommy Turncoat is a thing of the past, let’s keep it that way, OK.

By TexasBrave

February 7, 2009 5:26 PM | Link to this

I don’t understand the move by Andrew if it really happens. Andrew would have a better shot at making the team here with two available spots than with the Rangers that are content with the outfielders they have (Murphy, Hamilton and Cruz) plus Byrd is their DH and can play the outfield in a pinch. They also have two other outfielders on their roster.

very courious move.

By lexbrave

February 7, 2009 5:26 PM | Link to this

i think the only thing left for the braves to do now to complete the veteran insult trifecta is to offer chipper a 5 million dollar a year extension.

By Dadgum

February 7, 2009 5:28 PM | Link to this

DOB…..Glavine if healthy would be a long-shot to command the #5 slot IMO. Give me youth and talent over experience every day. Again as I have said Glavine deserves a shot but 1.5 - 2 mil is indeed generous given all the Braves have to go on. They don’t have a crystal ball and understandably are gunshy.

A-Rod? Steroids? Now there is a real shocker! If it is true that will really hurt his rep no question. McGwire, Clemens, Bonds, and A-Rod would not make the HOF most likely. If I had a vote I would not vote for Bonds. When Shoeless Joe and Rose are in then maybe. Regardless of how Bonds played early in his career the HoF is for complete careers.

Rock on…….

By raymond

February 7, 2009 5:31 PM | Link to this

I also believe Glavine is history and I think the only reason the Braves made an offer at all is so they can say they did when the fans get mad. They know he is not going to sign for a million per, but at least they can say they made him “what they feel is a competitive offer”. Spend the money on a left fielder and if we have enough left, use it to get Ohman.

By richbrave

February 7, 2009 5:35 PM | Link to this

DAVE:

Yours of 10:29 a.m. I had her on my post as BEST ACTRESS nominee until I went on-line and read some of the supposed controversy over the role. It said she was up for BEST SUPPORTING ACTRESS. I thought to myself who he!! did she support? She MADE this movie. So on sagacious advice(yours) I revert to my original - KATE WINSLET, BEST ACTRESS 2009 for “THE READER.”

By waterstim

February 7, 2009 5:36 PM | Link to this

I can’t stand A-rod, nor the Yankees. But it is wrong to promise someone that the records are to be sealed, and it leaks out. Pathetic. It mirrors out society. Greed and lies. Journalists are no different than anyone else. You can’t just stand behind, “I just doing my job”. This is ethically wrong…..but I don’t guess that matters anymore.

By TennesseePaul

February 7, 2009 5:38 PM | Link to this

McGwire, Clemens, Bonds, and A-Rod would not make the HOF most likely

Yeah right. I’d like to think the voters were working on some sort of principle concerning the HF, but from everything I’ve read, the logic is Bonds should be voted in for his days in Pittsburgh alone and A-Rod will slide by as well. Clemens may be ruined if only for his capitol hill testimony… the same seat occupied by Sosa, McGwire and Gonzalez.

It’s a sham. The greatest players of the day are all suspected cheats. But, I really enjoyed watching the homeruns fly. I’ll never forget watching Barroid launch homeruns in SF while I sat behind home plate. He’d kill that ball. Same with Mac. Just loved watching him crush the ball. I don’t think they should be enshrined, but I’m glad to know what it looks like up close when chemistry and baseball are mixed.

By more BS from Tommy G.

February 7, 2009 5:58 PM | Link to this

This quote from the article about TG:

“I’m not going back to pitch simply because I want to make more money, I’m going back to because I think I have some unfinished business,” Glavine said.

That was followed by more TG double talk about wanting more money and the economy and if it’s worth it… blah, blah freakin blah!

Tom, your comment says it all. P** or get off the pot. 1 mil, 2 mil, 10 mil… when you’ve made well over 100 million in your career and you make the comment you made above. You either sign the contract or not.

Do not play the media and the Braves fans once again. If you still don’t understand why some Braves fans don’t forgive you for leaving the Braves the first time… you might want to re-read what i wrote. You’ve pi$$ed this former Glavine fan off again.

By Oromus

February 7, 2009 6:00 PM | Link to this

Braves should sign Ohman, Griffey, Andruw and Glavine

Andruw - Well, at this point, All Andruw seems to want is play time. Offer him 500K and slot him for CF. If he stinks it up the first few weeks, we have plenty of people to replace him. But, if he can even manage to be Andruw of 06, we will have struck gold.

Griffey - Offer him 3 Mil to Platoon in left with Diaz. His numbers vs righties last year were very good and we’d get 20+ homers between the two of them. I haven’t seen any offers to him so far, so, he may jump at this with ST being so close.

Glavine - Offer him another 1.5 in incentives making it worth 3 Mil if he pitches 160 innings. With his experience, he would be one of the best #5s ever.

Ohman - Offer him 5 Mil over 2 years. He’s good against lefties and righties.. which is good since Bobby really doesn’t like Loogys.

That’s 7.5 to 9 Mil (depending on Glavines incentives). I’ve seen that we have 7 to 9 still left to spend, so, if we do have 9, we should be able to get this done. The only real gamble here is Andruw. But, it would be worth 500K to see if the injuries last year and the year before really were the cause of his decline.

By William

February 7, 2009 6:05 PM | Link to this

My question is if Glavine does not want to come back for the money, why is he “mulling” the offer? I think the Braves offered to much to a guy coming of arm surgery and about to turn 43.

By Steve McP

February 7, 2009 6:13 PM | Link to this

I see that a Nationals pitcher just won an arbitration case. When are the hearings for Johnson and Frenchy scheduled?

That might have some bearing on where Wren puts his $$, this could make a $2 mill dent in the figures if they both won their cases and affect the budget for meeting our remaining needs.

By Moby Grape

February 7, 2009 6:14 PM | Link to this

Texas is filled with big-time hitters, and that leads me to think they have a good hitting program. BobbysC

of course it’s got great hitters, it’s one of the 2 or 3 the best hitter’s parks in America

By kirkinga

February 7, 2009 6:18 PM | Link to this

Why are people saying Andruw has signed with the Rangers? I haven’t seen it reported anywhere, including in the Dallas paper.

It’s not on the ESPN, SI, Fox, or CBS sites. Is there another sourvce confirming a signing?

By Couch Tater

February 7, 2009 6:18 PM | Link to this

From DOB’s 2/15/08 blog. In 2007 Tom Glavine pitched 200 1/3 innings and went 8-1 with a 3.20 era before the final three starts.

Why not offer a contract with incentives to repeat that?

By Wide Right

February 7, 2009 6:21 PM | Link to this

Glavine says:

I understand those guys are waiting in the wings, and somewhere down the line they’re going to be productive in the rotation. But I think if all things are equal, I’m the better option.”

True, Tom. The problem is you want about 3X-4X as much as those guys are going to cost..which will prevent the Braves from addressing other needs. All things aren’t equal…and we may need a powerhitting LF more than a more accomplished 5th starter.

Thanks for the interview, DOB.

By nolie

February 7, 2009 6:23 PM | Link to this

But seriously, where’s he going to have a better opportunity to win? Seriously? What does that tell you? BFIR

should be no surprise that if Atlanta didn’t take him back that Boras would try to set him up in one of the best hitter’s parks to give him better odds of looking productive, plus Texas does have a well-respected hitting coach.. Be glad he wasn’t sent to Colorado.

By Lew

February 7, 2009 6:27 PM | Link to this

Braveheart-Maybe so, but Dick Allen could crush a baseball harder than any player I’ve seen during those 50 years that were being discussed. he also had one of the all time best baseball lines-“If my horse can’t eat it, then I don’t want to lay on it.” So what if he wasn’t nice? Neither were Ty Cobb or Steve Carlton. Didn’t make them any less great as players.

By waterstim

February 7, 2009 6:27 PM | Link to this

This is not an editorial……it’s a fact. Isn’t it obvious that the Braves don’t want to sign Glavine. I can’t say that I blame them (that is an edtiorial comment).

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 6:29 PM | Link to this

DOB…..Glavine if healthy would be a long-shot to command the #5 slot IMO. Dadgum

Dadgum, in my opinion you’re wrong.

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 6:30 PM | Link to this

Steve McP, if ‘m not mistaken, Frenchy’s hearing isn’t until the last day of scheduled hearings, the 20th. Not sure about Kelly.

By dgd

February 7, 2009 6:33 PM | Link to this

I’m absolutely floored that the Braves didn’t offer Glavine any incentives in the contract. Seems completely ridiculous to me: offer TG $1.5 guaranteed with the chance to double that if he stays healty and triple it if he has a really good year. Offer him another $1.5 for 25 starts and an additional $1.5 for 12 wins. Sorry, but I think this is an ugly, arrogant side of Fran Wren. I can see not guiding all decisions by the Braves’ glory years, but if Glavine’s arm really feels better than it has in years, 12 wins might be the minimum he’d win, and the Braves would only be out $4.5M. The offer that Wren made was an insult. I can see not offering any more guaranteed, but the lack of incentives was really obnoxious. On a musical note, saw an oldie but goodie band last week: The Outlaws. Man, those guys can really rock. Have two lead guitarists who are both awesome and Henry Paul still sounds great (and looks like Dennis Quaid). They should do a new, live album of their old hits. A new generation has been introduced to them because “Green Grass and High Tides” is on Guitar Hero…

By David O'Brien

February 7, 2009 6:33 PM | Link to this

Richbrave, confusion probably stemmed from fact she was nominated for best supporting actress (for some unknown reason) for the same role by SAG, Golden Globes and someone else. Obviously Oscars got this one right — it’s not a supporting role, in any sense.

She’ll win. Has to. Best actress, period, in my opinion. Taking the baton from the great Ms. Streep and running with it.

By Canadianbrave

February 7, 2009 6:39 PM | Link to this

When JS came in to make his mark he let the young guns play and brought in his own supporting cast. Frank Wren is probably doing this same! The only problem is ,I don’t think this cast of young guns is quite as talented.

Anyway the season is close and I can smell baseball in the air!

By Poorbrave

February 7, 2009 6:42 PM | Link to this

Thanks Mr. Wren for looking forward to the future instead of returning to the past with A. Jones. I hope Glavine moves on, wishing him well.Now get that hitter for LF. Go Braves!

By N8

February 7, 2009 6:47 PM | Link to this

“Glavine - Offer him another 1.5 in incentives making it worth 3 Mil if he pitches 160 innings. With his experience, he would be one of the best #5s ever…….Ohman - Offer him 5 Mil over 2 years. He’s good against lefties and righties.. which is good since Bobby really doesn’t like Loogys.” Oromus

Let me get this correct. You’re gonna “only” give Glavine 3 million for his reaching 160 innings. But Ohman is to be given 2.5 million (58.2 innings last year), to be the 7th inning guy/situational lefty??

By BravesFanInRockies

February 7, 2009 6:49 PM |