AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2008 > December > 10 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USCC to NY, now AJ to ATL?
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Las Vegas — Now that the first huge domino named CC has fallen, the Braves hope the one named A.J. will fall soon. Provided it falls toward Atlanta.
CC Sabathia and the Yankees have reportedly agreed to the framework of an seven-year, $160 million contract — framework as enormous as the 6-7, 300-pound Sabathia himself — other free agents should start getting serious about their own future destinations.
So how does the Sabathia deal with the Yankees, reached sometime during Yankee GM Brian Cashman’s visit Tuesday night to Sabathia’s Northern California home, affect the Braves’ chances of beating out the Yanks and other suitors for the services of Burnett?
Well, there’s two ways of looking at it. I tend to think it improves the likelihood, unless another team comes in and raises the ante even further than the Yankees did when Cashman made Burnett what was believed to be a four-year, $64 million offer on Tuesday, which is $4 mill more than the Braves’ offer made to Burnett last week.
That initial Braves offer might be worth more just based on the cost of living in New York compared to Atlanta. That said, I’ve got to believe the Braves will consider raising it, if necessary, and perhaps turning a fifth-year option from that offer to a fifth-year guarantee and perhaps increasing the per-season average for a total of $80 mill. It was reported elsewhere this morning that the Braves have already done that, though I haven’t gotten it confirmed from any reliable source on either side.
The Braves indicated all along they would be willing to improve their already rather large offer in order to assure they land Burnett, one of the few remaining pitchers that comes close to fitting the “ace” label.
The others are Derek Lowe, a Scott Boras client that most believe is eventually headed to Boston or the Yankees, Ben Sheets, who has never won more than the 13 games he won this season for Milwaukee, and has not totaled as many as 160 strikeouts or 200 innings since 2004. Braves haven’t shown much, if any, real interest in him.
Oh, and don’t forget Jake Peavy, the rumor-a-minute machine who was the target of the Braves’ attentions for more than six weeks this offseason before the frustrated Braves pulled out of stalled trade negotiations with the Padres for the 2007 NL Cy Young Award winner.
If he doesn’t go to the Cubs in a multi-team deal that may or may not be close, depending which report you read or who you ask, then perhaps — hey, we said perhaps - the Braves could revisit that if Burnett falls through.
And sure, the Yankees could raise their offer to A.J., too. But ask yourself this: Even the Yankees, with their apparent ability to print money in a vault beneath Yankee Stadium, might be uncomfortable going five guaranteed years with Burnett on top of seven guaranteed with Sabathia.
Insurers don’t go beyond three years on these contracts, though teams can renew after any year. In other words, the Braves could sign Burnett to a five-year deal, then renew their three-year policy after the first year if he stays healthy, so they’d be covered through the fourth season. And so on.
But just what if, what if, the Sabathia got hurt halfway through that contract, a major injury. Same for Burnett. Oh, that’d be a lot of money committed for a long time to pitchers potentially not as good as they were when those deals were handed out.
Burnett’s agent, Darek Braunecker, who met for the first time face-to-face with Braves GM Frank Wren on Tuesday (their previous conversations were over the phone) has said his client probably wouldn’t sign before the Winter Meetings in Vegas adjourn Thursday.
I don’t know that the Sabathia signing with affect that at all, since Burnett’s agent has indicated that another team might raise its interest level in A.J. after the resolution of other unnamed developments it was monitoring.
Perhaps that meant that a team with interst in Sabathia might raise its interest level in Burnett if Sabathia signed with the Yankees. I’m not sure. Maybe we’ll know more later today if Braunecker elaborates.
In the meantime, let’s consider for a moment the enormity of the Sabathia contract, the most lucrative deal in major league history for a pitcher. Did the man pick the right time to churn out brilliant, clutch performances on short rest, or what? With free agency waiting, he pitched like a man possessed for Milwaukee down the stretch this season, after being traded from Cleveland.
Now he gets the deal of his lifetime, or the lifetime of pitcher who’s lived until now.
Just consider, Sabathia will make more during this deal than Greg Maddux, who retired Monday, made during his entire, spectacular 23-year career. Maddux made about $154 million and won 355 games, recording 109 complete games and 3,371 strikeouts in 5,008-1/3 innings and 740 starts.
Sabathia, 28, has 117 career wins and 1,659 innings.
After going 17-10 with 251 strikeouts in 253 innings this season, he would have to average 16.5 wins and 223 innings for the next 15 seasons to match Maddux.
OK, a tune: Got to keep this blog short because we have a BBWAA meeting at 9 a.m. Vegas time. We’ll be back shortly. Enjoy the music. (I live Glen Campbell’s cover of this song best.)
”GALVESTON” by Jimmy Webb
Galveston, oh Galveston
I still hear your sea winds blowing
I still see her dark eyes glowing
She was twenty-one
When I left Galveston
Galveston, oh Galveston
I still hear your sea waves crashing
While I watch the cannon flashing
And I clean my gun
And I dream of Galveston
I still see her standing by the water
Standing there, looking out to sea
And is she waiting there for me?
On the beach where we used to run
Galveston, oh Galveston
I am so afraid of dying
Before I dry the tears she’s crying
Before I see your sea birds flying
In the sun, at Galveston
.JPG)
Services »
Comments
By K_chub
December 10, 2008 11:46 AM | Link to this
Could it be…1st?
By Jim H.
December 10, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this
C’mon AJ. Sign with us already! I don’t want Wren to have to trade Escobar in order to get an ace pitcher!
By Ernest
December 10, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this
It would be a GREAT winter if we could get both Burnett and Peavy. Hope we can at least get the former done so we can concentrate on getting a corner outfielder. I still would like to see us target a free agent, like Abreu. If Jermaine Dye can be had for a reasonable trade, I’d like that also.
DOB, any word on corner outfielders on the Braves radar at this time?
By Memphis
December 10, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this
Get the AJ DEAL DONE!!!!!!!!!
By Mark
December 10, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this
Couldn’t agree with you more DOB. Especially with the reports that the Yanks are in serious discussions (whatever that means) with Lowe. It just makes more sense for them to balance out the signing of an ace to a long-term deal, with a safer signing like lowe to a 4-year deal.
By glorydays
December 10, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this
DOB,
The Cubs offer doesn’t appear to me to be any better or even as good as the Braves offer of a stud SS and promising CF. How likely is it that the main reason the Peavy deal fell through is because he doesn’t want to come to the Braves if Escobar is included, as alluded to earlier?
By JR
December 10, 2008 11:53 AM | Link to this
See if Blank was our owner then we could have signed CC to pitch and play left tackle for the Falcons. Sorry couldn’t resist that.
By StingerSplash
December 10, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this
Fourth?
OK, DOB, dispel those nasty Smoltz to Boston rumors that are floating around. Go back to a BBWAA meeting and smack Verducci in the head for circulating those. And I noticed one other thing … ESPN baseball man Rob Neyer is also a Jayhawk … appears to have gone there around the same time as you … I smell a KU conspiracy to take over baseball journalism.
By Junior
December 10, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this
DOB, Thanks for all you do and put up with.
By JIMMY L
December 10, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
GOOD DAY DAVE , LETS HOPE EVERYTHING WORKS OUT WITH AJ HAVE A GOOD
By Saff
December 10, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
Sign Burnett so we can get to the next level and get that power bat we must have. GO BRAVES!!!
By MJ
December 10, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
That contract for Sabathia and the Yankees are ridiculous! This is why the Yankees and for the most part the Red Sox are bad for baseball. The Yankees are the only ones on the planet w/ the money and resources to make that kind of offer and consequently they drive the market. This sport needs a salary cap and a shot of reality! At some point baseball and the powers that be will realize that just having the New York and Boston sell out all season long is not the way to make money and that 2/3 of all stadiums are half empty most of the year b/c most of the teams in baseball suck. If you have a little more competition than maybe more people would show up to games and its why baseball really lags behind most sports in that regard and why the NFL is head and shoulders better.
By OHIOBRAVESFAN
December 10, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
First!!??
Let’s get something done today. My eyes are tired!
By Blind Hog
December 10, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
Even a blind hog will find an acorn on occasion. Even before I read the DOB observations this morning, I felt that if the Yanks did get CC, it bettered the chances AJ ended up in ATL. Seems the other teams besides the Yanks who may have been pushing in the CC sweepstakes were the Angels, Giants, maybe the Dodgers and Brewers. The West Coast teams would not seem to fit AJ’s preference to land somewhere within driving distance to his Baltimore home. The Brewers aren’t exactly around the block from home either.
If CC had bolted to the West Coast, I think the Yanks would have pulled out all the stops for AJ. Since they landed CC and want Manny as well….. I think the odds of AJ in Atlanta are greatly improved.
By Lew
December 10, 2008 12:02 PM | Link to this
BravesFanInRockies-I somewhat understand your reticence with Frenchy, but I know he’s capable of hitting 29 HR and knocking in 100 runs in the majors-because he has already done it, despite the holes in his swing.
He identified the problems from last year and has taken steps to rectify them-Not too sure you can actually ask for more from ANY player.
By bill
December 10, 2008 12:02 PM | Link to this
I’d be happy with AJ or Peavy at this point, but truth be told I’d really much rather have Jake, if he wants to be here.
Maybe at some point we’ll find out if the jerk in that deal is Towers or Peavy or if there isn’t one at all.
DOB, Not related, but I want to ask what’s the deal with Phil Stockman? He seems like a solid bullpen guy that has performed well every time he’s been given a chance. Why has he not caught on with the big league club yet?
By Lt. Col. Kilgore
December 10, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this
I love the smell of new bloggage in the morning.
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this
Ken Rosenthal reports- “Talks between the Braves and free-agent right-hander A.J. Burnett “progressed through the night,” but the Yankees remain a factor in the Burnett discussions, major-league sources say.” nothing about a contract tho.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this
MLB.com’s Marty Noble:
http://hotstove.mlblogs.com/archives/2008/12/sevenyearsforsabathiaand_t.html
And forward, in this case, means pursuing two other free-agent pitchers — Derek Lowe and A.J. Burnett — though the club wants to sign one, not both.
The source said the Yankees believe they can top the Braves’ offer to Burnett if it is five years for $15 million per and that the Yankees’ interest in Mark Teixeira has waned.
Let’s hope they ink Lowe soon. If I am the Yankees, that is they guy I go after. Probably the more safe play now that they have Sabathia signed.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the new Blog, Chief!
From the last Blog:
Lee in S GA McFann - got to agree with you about not wanting Zambrano in Atlanta. It would be hard to picture McCann being his catcher also.
That is rather hard to picture, ain’t it?
By Ron Roberts
December 10, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this
Can you just imagine how pressured Frank Wren and A.J. Burnett and his agent must feel now that a few bloggers have insisted in BOLD CAPS that they all get this deal done, now!
Folks, do you read what Dave O’Brien writes or just skip past it and blog your desires blindly? He just said the deal probably still wouldn’t get done during the winter meetings; that may change, and as he stated, other teams may step to the dish to take a whack at signing him, as well, complicating the matter.
Screaming “get it done” makes no sense. The Braes can’t make him sign a contract before he’s surveyed all the offers and potential offers, first. Chill. It’s not even 2009 yet.
By Blind Hog
December 10, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this
I don’t claim to be an expert and lord knows I’m not privy to what goes on between agents, players and GM’s. From reading media reports from all directions,angles and areas of the country, (not just ATL) I see NO indication that Peavy will end up in ATL. From all accounts, he really doesn’t want to be in ATL. He wants to be a CUB. Towers wants him to be a CUB. Hendry wants him to be a CUB. The CUBs are jumping through hoops to trade DeRo to the Twins or Phils or whoever and letting the Padres decide what pitching they want in return from any team that the CUBS deal with.
Even if something falls through where the CUBS can’t make the deal, it doesn’t seem Peavy is willing to waive his clause to come to ATL, no matter what his earlier preference may have seemed to be.
I have no farm to bet, but if I were betting the farm, I would have to bet Peavy is a no show in ATL.
By Lew
December 10, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this
Stinger-Just rumors. Smoltz will not be pitching for anyone other than the Atlanta Braves. Not this year, anyway. How in the world can anyone sign him not even knowing if he can come back-much less pitch as effectively as previously? Makes zero sense-just like most rumors.
By Chris
December 10, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this
Am I the only person that is worried about Burnett seeing the Yankees land CC and thinking, “Man if i went there we’d be a nasty combo at the top of that rotation - I bet we’d win.” Then he signs with the Yankees and we are left with Javier Vasquez as our ace in the NL East.
By Ron Roberts
December 10, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this
Oh, and thanks for the new blog and update, DOB.
Honestly, if the news about Smoltz is legit, I don’t think we’re in such dire need for an “ace” as we all thought a month ago, anyhow.
I’ll take a (healthy) rotation of Jurrjens, Smoltz, Vasquez, Campillo and Parr/Hanson with a stout bullpen if it goes with a LF power bat and our infield intact.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 12:15 PM | Link to this
*Bill DOB, Not related, but I want to ask what’s the deal with Phil Stockman?
Bill, Stockman had issues last year with hamstring problems, I think back problems and then he lost his Visa or something to get back into the country. I think, I cannot remember really if that was the case, but I do know he fought the injury bug last year.
By cmac1919
December 10, 2008 12:17 PM | Link to this
Please Frank Wren, stop messing around and just give Burnett a 5 year deal and be done with it. A 4 year deal obviously isn’t going to cut it.
Good grief, so far this off-season has frustrated me more than the regualar season ever did!
By Vol
December 10, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this
I read that there are now up to four teams involved in the Peavy deal. One fact in there was that Marquis replaces Marshall on the Cubs side. What??? I’m sure that the Cubs have to give up some valuable pieces ultimately. However, this is starting to look like a saving face situation for Towers that is going to land him in a lesser position than if he just went back to the Braves. I guess he isn’t going to, but is this the guy that needs to be in charge of big money?
Was it actually Wren who said that the Braves would go higher if necessary on AJ? Now that the Yanks spent their big money, was that a smart comment in retrospect? I know they want AJ and won’t let a few million get in the way, but why say that? I guess it is the risk of missing out.
By ROBIN
December 10, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this
Burnett is not worth the agrivation either. I put him in the same package as Peavy. They want a guarantee to win but dont want to be part of the package to send the effort.
Lets just bring in our top rookies from the minors and build from within with Vazquez being our ace and Jurrjens #2 and Hanson #3. Wait for Chucky to start throwing and look at him. In meantime we have Morton and Parr and Camp. Then look at Schaffer for center and go ahead and bring up Heyward for left. Yes lets just let the kids come and gain experience then explode into the NLE next season as they condition. I think that would be fun. To heck with winning this year, Bring up our own kids and lets see what they can do as they mature into the major leagues.
By BravesFanInRockies
December 10, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this
Lew,
We’ll see about Frenchy. I hope he rebounds, but I’m not counting on it.
And I think you’re absolutely right about Smoltz. The only way he wouldn’t sign with Atlanta (if he can pitch, of course) is if some other club made an indefensible offer — multiple guaranteed years, for $10MM or more each — and then the Braves could be forgiven for not matching it.
By Vol
December 10, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this
Can I go back to a blog from two years ago? Can we get Carlos Lee from the Astros? I wrote about that way back (along with many others) and DOB got annoyed - probably going to happen again. I would assume that Houston isn’t looking to unload him since they have a decent team. Someone can correct me on the facts, but doesn’t he provide about 80% of Tex’s numbers? Worse defense and not worth a high quality package of prospects, but he drives in a lot of runs.
By Wayne in Utah
December 10, 2008 12:26 PM | Link to this
Obviously, the CC signing helps us in our pursuit of Burnett, but I am a tad bit disappointed in “the rich get richer” way the Yankees seem to come through more often than not.
Now, I guess I can hope that Manny will only get a 2 year offer. That would ease my pain somewhat, but again, I am not optimistic.
L8R
By Kris in NC
December 10, 2008 12:27 PM | Link to this
Nice to see Wren progressing talks with Burnett and his agent through the night. He means business about getting AJ in Atlanta.
I agree with AJ’s 12:00 post where he says the Yankees and the Red Sox are bad for baseball where they offer these types of contracts and drive the market up and make it difficult for other teams to compete for these type of players.
You got small market teams out there who can’t afford players like CC or Tex who want these 3 figure multi yr deals all due to teams like the Yankees and Red Sox.
Off my soap box now, once we get AJ in the fold, Wren gets around to getting our power hitting LF. I personally wouldn’t touch Ankiel for one reason…Scott Boras. Satan reinvented if you ask me. Ankiel will be a FA after the 09 season so we all know how Boras operates, do we really want to mess with Ankiel and Boras? For the Cards to even think of asking Wren to trade Gonzo to them for Ankiel, they had to been drinking. Wren will probably get Gonzo locked up during the season.
One thing I am happy to see this off season is the Braves are being very active, whether it was going after Peavy, signing a veteran backup catcher or actively pursuing AJ before the WM. Wren knew what the team’s needs were and has been actively pursuing every avenue to get them filled.
By J.L.
December 10, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
The free agent outfield options for the Braves are terrible. they are old {me too} slow and field like K.J. on a bad day. Dye has really slowed down bad. The options for centerfield are acceptable IMO,maybe junior and Diaz in left.Rightfield is a problem, i would not give up on frenchy,but i really do not expect him to be the answer. If we don’t spend the money for a pitcher, maybe we can trade for Odonez {I’m not looking up the spelling so VORP it} his salary is high but if we do not give to much in players, the guy can RAKE.
By raymond
December 10, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
Don’t get too excited, Burnett is not coming to Atlanta because they still lack some pieces to contend. After he picks someone else, the Padres will want a kings ransom for Peavy and the Braves will end up with a John Garland or Oliver Perez. Third Place at best.
By Chris
December 10, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
Braves offering way too much money for A.J. He’s not as good as that much money suggests. He simply isn’t.
By N8
December 10, 2008 12:29 PM | Link to this
blind hog
So you’re saying that I should contact the merchandise section on the Braves official site and ask for a refund on my customized Peavy Braves jersey that showed up yesterday?
Damn!
By Josh P.
December 10, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this
Blind Hog - Be careful out there on that limb! :D
By Freddy
December 10, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this
DOB - Do you think there is any chance that the if AJ signs that the Braves pursue Peavy again? I guess they would have to move Vasquez/Salary if they did, but that would certainly be a better 1-2 punch?
By Vol
December 10, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this
If we need another innings-eater would we ever do a PTBNL for Marquis and have the Cubs eat half the salary? He would run about $5MM if that was the case and he has averaged close to 200 innings a year. Not in lieu of an ace, but to add someone else who can go more than 5 innings.
I know he’s not that good, but is someone going to get him at a relative bargain just because that’s what’s holding up the Peavy deal for the Cubs? Ironic if it’s the Braves who step in to get the thing done. I’d put the likelihood ay 0.1%, but what the hey?
By NY Yankees
December 10, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this
CC to Yanks AJ to the Yanks Manny to the Yanks = 2009 Champs!
By JPHUNT
December 10, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this
35th ???
Never seen so many people waste a post trying to be 1st. DOB whats the story on Norton? I would love to see him back next year, his PH stats were great. I figure he is not much of a priority but just wondering when they will get those dealings underway.
By Fred
December 10, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this
The winter meetings are a joke…a bunch of guys sitting around waiting to see what Boston and the NY teams do. This sport is in serious need of a salary cap.
By Fun Facts R Us
December 10, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
Jon Sciambi looks like Robert Marion La Follette, Sr.
By Turlock Brave
December 10, 2008 12:38 PM | Link to this
Would the Yankees deal with CC push Boston to want to do business with Burnett, or am I just typing with my rear end?
By DAP
December 10, 2008 12:44 PM | Link to this
carlos lee is owed alot of money. thats really the only problem with him. he really isnt bad defensively…runs pretty well for the big guy that he is, but his cost, salary plus trade pieces, is just way to much.
By tlj
December 10, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this
I just read on sports illustrated site that the Peavy deal will be as follows if it goes through:
Cubs get Peavy Phillies get DeRosa
Pads get Marquis from cubs & 2 pitching prospects from Phillies
How is that a better deal that what the Braves offered. If this is the actual trade Towers will really look foolish
By MattyRoss
December 10, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this
Turlock, if you’re typing with your rear end, that’s remarkably accurate spelling and punctuation. Certainly makes it easier to blog at work. Well done. I think Boston’s going for Tex and not a ton else, but I could be wrong.
By Lew
December 10, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this
Freddy-If the Braves were to go after Peavy, exactly why would they need to move Vasquez or salary to do it? Dude, that makes no sense whatsoever. You are aware that even with Vasquez’s salary of $11.5 million, that it hardly puts a dent in the (supposed) projection of $40-50 mil being available or the Braves’ stated desire to obtain two pitchers for the rotation over and above Smoltz or Glavine (should they return)?
By Dim Bulb Braves Fan
December 10, 2008 12:47 PM | Link to this
Am I a moron or an imbecile? Just cannot figure it out?
By BravesFanInRockies
December 10, 2008 12:48 PM | Link to this
Wayne,
What’s the over/under on the number of starts CC misses over the course of his seven-year deal?
I’m glad the Yanks will tie up so much money for so long on one pitcher, especially since they also have A-Rod, Posada, Jeter and Rivera locked up for at least two more seasons.
There’s no guarantee this bunch will win anything, but they sure will cost a lot.
I’m not wild about potentially locking up AJ for five years, but am much more comfortable with the terms that have been rumored for him than the commitment the Yankees made to CC — understanding the much different finances of both the Braves and the Yanks.
By Jonathon
December 10, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
This Smoltz/Red Sox rumor is NOT FUNNY. In any event, just because the Sox are checking out his medical records, and just because some beat writer (no offense, DOB) thinks Smoltz is a good fit in Boston, doesn’t mean any of it is true. I think Wren knows that letting Smoltz go elsewhwere would be a PR nightmare; he will not let the offseason end without re-signing John Smoltz. I will now resume my worrying about losing John Smoltz. Ugh.
By MWC
December 10, 2008 12:53 PM | Link to this
To BravesFanIn Rockies… Multiple years???
By DAP
December 10, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this
J.L. Odonez {I’m not looking up the spelling so VORP it}
just sound it out, JL! you know theres got to be an R in there somewhere…:-)
By Lew
December 10, 2008 12:55 PM | Link to this
Freddy-Were the Braves to acquire Burnett and Peavy, along with Vasquez and the possible (probable?) return of Smoltz, it would give us a rotation of Peavy, Burnett, Vasquez, Morton/Hanson/Campillo/Parr/Glavine and Smoltz.
With a rotation like that, I’d go with Diaz/Brandon Jones in left, Shafer in center and find a cheap, good fielding Shortstop (if Yunel is traded for Peavy) and we would still have a killer winning team-Home Run power or no.
By Lew
December 10, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this
Excuse me-I forgot to add Jurrjens-even better rotation.
By JR
December 10, 2008 12:58 PM | Link to this
Some of you forget that AJ has narrowed his choices according to where his wife and family are located. So if it’s not the Yankees or Braves then it would be Toronto, Boston, and probably Baltimore that have a shot. Of all of those Toronto and Baltimore will probably not do 5 years and I’m not sure if Red Sox are interested right now with their focus in Tex. I would like to have Oliver Perez along with AJ. Is that possible since we are not going after an OF via free agency?
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 12:58 PM | Link to this
Just saw this on ESPN:
Thanks to Francisco Rodriguez, Mets fans won’t have to cover their eyes in the ninth inning anymore
Yes. Yes they will. I know every free agent ball player is “flawless” this time of year, but K-Rod is not pretty in the ninth. Not by any stretch of the imagination. I’ve watched this guy since the Angles dropped Troy and promoted him. He can make any lead look precarious. I’m actually kind of excited he’s a Met. I fully expect him to collapse and it will be fun to watch it happen in the NL East for a team that isn’t based in Atlanta.
By T-Bone
December 10, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Any thought of Wren turning around and offering Vazquez to SD as part of a Peavy trade? That would give them a better pitcher than Morton or Jo-Jo. And I’d rather have Peavy than Vazquez.
Also much ego gets involved in these trades? In other words, will Towers feel like he is losing face if he comes back and deals with the Braves and takes a deal that he at first spurned?
By Lew
December 10, 2008 1:00 PM | Link to this
No other team in the NL (and most in the AL, too) could field a rotation approaching Peavy, Burnett, Jurrjens, Vasquez and Smoltz/Hanson. Screw Home Run power. That’s as good a rotation as could ever be hoped for. Improbable, but killer, nonetheless.
By Goat Horns
December 10, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this
I am glad to see some bloggers coming around to the idea of developing our young players rather than retooling with question marks and castoffs.
We are not the Yankees, Mets, or Angels. We do not have unlimited funds. We cannot afford to overpay in cash or players for anyone.
I disagree with breaking the bank for A.J. You don’t give that kind of money to a questionable player. Only 3-200 inning seasons in 8 years and only won more than 12 games once!
12 game winners are not aces!
Let the Yankees have him and he can sit on their D.L. collecting a paycheck for 2 years or so out of the next 4.
He is not worthy of collecting 15-20% of the Braves payroll over the next 5 years!
By car3boogie
December 10, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this
Come on DOB get out of that meeting and announce this Deal for AJ
By JR
December 10, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this
All of you that are rehashing the Peavy thing are probably way off. If Peavy wanted to be in Atlanta then it would have already happened. Nothing that the Cubs could offer could touch what the Braves already were rumored to offer. Yunel was the prize in that equation, but I really don’t believe Peavy truly wants to play for the Braves with our current offensive situation. Let’s face it we do not give much run support and haven’t for a while
By Joe M.
December 10, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this
Peter Gammons:
John Smoltz wants to come back for another season. He is throwing and thinks he will be ready early next season. The Red Sox have been given his medicals and videos. The feeling is that Boston might be a good fit.
Please no.
By Tommy
December 10, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this
The Yankees haven’t been able to spend their way to a WS win since 2000. Don’t expect that to change anytime soon.
By freddy
December 10, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this
Lew - The too much salary does make sense if the Braves are going to pay for a power hitting outfielder also.
By JR
December 10, 2008 1:06 PM | Link to this
Thanks to Francisco Rodriguez, Mets fans won’t have to cover their eyes in the ninth inning anymore
Yeah right If you have to face that murderers row in Philly you would close your eyes too in the ninth inning regardless of who is on the hill
By J.L.
December 10, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this
DAP; I told you I was old,sound what is that.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
December 10, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this
If the Braves sign Burnett, which I hope they do, I don’t see how they get that power hitting OF. Signing Burnett would not leave enough money to sign a Dunn or Abreu. And, I just don’t see anybody who would be available through trade. No way is one year of Ankiel worth trading Johnson or Escobar.
By DAP
December 10, 2008 1:10 PM | Link to this
tlj if that is the trade that happens, i will be extremely ticked off. i just hope towers will get heck for it, which i doubt he will. subtract escobar and the braves deal is probably still better!
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 1:17 PM | Link to this
Lew
No other team in the NL (and most in the AL, too) could field a rotation approaching Peavy, Burnett, Jurrjens, Vasquez and Smoltz/Hanson. Screw Home Run power. That’s as good a rotation as could ever be hoped for. Improbable, but killer, nonetheless.
That probably isn’t going to happen, and I’m not sure I want it to. Braves need some offense or you’ll be forced to win a lot of 3-2, 2-1 games. Which means you are constantly asking your relievers to pitch in high leverage situations. I’d rather have a more balanced attack. Adding Burnett to Vasquez, Jurrjens and two of Campillo/Reyes/Morton/Hanson sounds like a very solid rotation. And an addition of a power hitting outfielder will have this team right there with the Mets and Phillies in 2009.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this
No doubt the Red Sox would be a good fit. But the Braves are a better fit for Smotz. Come on, folks, do you really think the Braves would risk the public backlash by low-balling John Freakin’ Smoltz? Can’t see it. And I don’t blame his agents one bit for getting the info out there, the video, etc, to make it clear early that they’re not just going to sign the dotted line on any offer the Braves stick in front of their faces. They’re just doing right by their client, making sure he gets treated fairly by the Braves. Just in case they need a little leverage, can’t just go in saying, “OK, Frank, what have you got for us?”
By Don't Trade Franceour, Sheesh
December 10, 2008 1:22 PM | Link to this
Smoltz in Boston…?
If he were to pitch for anyone in the AL East…it may be more than I am prepared to handle…That cannot be a possibility.
By Ron Roberts
December 10, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this
Robert (C.I.B.) why would the Braves not be able to afford a power-hitting OF if they signed Burnett?
We had about $40-45 million to add to payroll (per-season) and we picked up Vasquez’ salary, and would add about $15-16 per-season for Burnett, which would leave more than $7-12 million to add an OF. Yeah, it takes out of the Dunn/Burrell sweepstakes, but who among us believes spending more than $5 on either of those flawed individuals makes sense for us, anyhow?
By Chris
December 10, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this
Some of us are beating dead horses.
By Jonathon
December 10, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this
Gammons is a bit of a Red Sox “ho,” so I don’t put much stock in his report. He links everyone to the Red Sox. Every free agent is a good fit for Boston. That’s just how he rolls. Like I said, major PR nightmare for the Braves. And beyond that, Smoltz is valuable b/c of his versatility to start or pitch in relief, whether it’s as a set-up for Gonzo or as an occasional closer, depending on the matchups. I don’t think Bobby and Frank are going to let Smoltz get away, especially if his rehab goes according to plan.
So, to sum up, Gammons=complete Boston shill
I see the point many people are making about the price rising too high for AJ, but wouldn’t it be nice to have pitchers that can strike people out on occasion? There’s only so much Chuck James/Jo Jo/Buddy Carlyle/Lance Cormier/Mark Redman nibbling I can take. We need a couple hammers in the rotation, folks.
By Rick Long
December 10, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this
What is all of this sentiment that the Braves should “do what it takes” to land Burnett? I still maintain that his agent is merely using what appears to be almost desperation on Wren’s part to land this guy to up the price before he eventually signs elsewhere. My own view is that losing out on the Burnett “sweepstakes” would be good news for the Braves. He has been a consistent underachiever who has had a significant injury history and the Braves are willing to GUARANTEE 5 years to land him. This is insane! The Yankees can make that kind of mistake, but getting him and having him underperform and/or get hurt again would be a killer for Atlanta.
I still say that if Atlanta doesn’t have to give up Hanson, Heyward and one of their 3 other top propsects, they should at least re-visit the potential of acquiring Peavy. Peavy is a true ace and is only 27 years old. You rebuild great starting rotations around someone like him, not A.J. Burnett.
By Wrank Fren
December 10, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this
I sure hope the Braves get Burnett.
By brian
December 10, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this
the Braves obviously do not need to overpay for a 40 something year old pitcher coming off major shoulder surgery, but if the Braves do not do right by John Smoltz the entire front office should be fired on the spot.
Does anyone seriously think the Braves will not do right by Smoltz?
The Braves will not low ball Smoltz and Smoltz will not try to unneccesarily milk every penny he can from the Braves. They will come to an agreement that both sides will be happy about.
John Smoltz came into the majors a Brave and he will retire a Brave and only a Brave. Go Smoltz!
By Vic
December 10, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
Milton Bradley the Best for the Money. You are getting him to play ball, not lead church service and we need some excitement. The Guy can hit.
By DannyFish
December 10, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
It sounds like the Braves are in a great position now to close the deal with AJ. I am pleased with the positive reports of Smoltz bullpenn session. And I don’t think there is any chance he plays for anyone but the Braves.
My hopes for our rotation next season would be: Burnett-Jurrjens-Smoltz-Vasquez-Campillo with Hanson ready to be brought up if someone gets hurt.
Also I have confidence that Frenchy will at least somewhat bounce back from last years struggles. I just don’t believe that a player with his amount of talent just forgets how to play. So assuming FW adds a decent power hitting LF I think our outfield looks very solid.
I’m feeling more and more confident in our team as this offseason progresses.
By JR
December 10, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
I don’t blame Smoltz if he were to sign with Boston. He has been faithful to Atlanta for a long time and we haven’t done much to make him believe we want to contend in awhile. Our farm system has been through some lean times lately. Look at the guys that are playing for us now that are home grown. I’m not talking about the older guys i.e. Chipper. The only one that stands out right now is BMac and potentially Yunel. I agree with getting Vazquez, but we gave up the only big power hitter that was remotely close to being ready for the Bigs. This is the main reason I do not like the idea of trading prospects especially the bigs ones which I am glad that Wren is looking like he will hold on to. Also, as much as I dislike Yunel’s attitude if we trade him who is gonna play short. In the Words of our former Pres. “Can’t do it, wouldn’t be prudent”
By Logan
December 10, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
N8
My Sidd Finch jersey for your Jake Peavy jersey. Deal or No Deal?
By Bayou Brave
December 10, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
Rosenthal is reporting that the Braves offered A.J. $80 over 5 years last night.
By DAP
December 10, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
goat horns We do not have unlimited funds. We cannot afford to overpay in cash or players for anyone.
normally this is correct, but i think this offseason is a little different. the braves have at least $40mil to spend. maybe closer to $50mil, but lets just say $40mil for now. the braves WILL spend this money. i guess some folks think they should stick it in their pocket for a rainy day, but it doesnt work that way. toward the 2009 budget, they have committed about $13mil, by my count. (vazquez and the BUC) which means the braves have at LEAST $27mil to spend.
so what should they do with the money? it wont help the brave to use it on jon garland and juan rivera. they have some available funds, and need to get a big player, that can help them in 2009, but also beyond that, when hudson comes back and several young players are ready.
so im of the opinion that the braves need to get a big player in the FA market, weather its in the bullpen, (juan cruz) a potential ace (burnett), innings eaters (wolf, lowe, pettite, byrd) or position players (bradley, dunn, abreu)
By GT
December 10, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
some of the potential “Awesome Rotations” mentioned on this blog are funny. I see a lot of things like this: Peavy, Burnett, Jurrjens, Smoltz/Vasquez/Morton/JoJo/Campillo/Glavine/Chuck/Hanson/Parr/etc/etc/etc.
Two comments to bring us all back to reality: 1 - how will this look without Peavy at the top? 2 - having an abundance of less-an-average pitchers to slot into the #4 and 5 positions doesn’t make a strong rotation.
By brian
December 10, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this
wonder if Griffey JR would sign a 1 year $5 million contract to play LF for the Braves. The Braves would give him days off against many lefties (cannot say platoon with Griffey) letting Diaz get ABs. Not much on the market for LF
Maybe the Braves should play Anderson in LF with Schafer in CF going to a run manufacturing offense versus sitting back and waiting for the 3 run home run. Power would have to come from Chipper, McCann, and yes Francoeur with Escobar and KJ hitting their strides.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this
JR Yeah right If you have to face that murderers row in Philly you would close your eyes too in the ninth inning regardless of who is on the hill
That’s for darn sure.
By Tim
December 10, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this
Once Wren gets that front of the rotation starter (preferably Burnett), it’s been said he’ll then have eyes set on a corner outfielder with some power. So with that in mind, WHY hasn’t Milton Bradley’s name come up? People forget how good of a hitter this guy is, not to mention the fact that he was just as good while in the NL with SD and LA. Of course there are the injury concerns, but every free agent it seems has their question marks that make you weary of signing him.
By Roach
December 10, 2008 1:35 PM | Link to this
JR
Flowers ready for the big leagues not close is what you meant to say right?
By JIMMY L
December 10, 2008 1:36 PM | Link to this
PLEASE GO JOHN AND TAKE TOM WITH YOU. YES I SAID THAT………………………..
By N8
December 10, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this
Lew
“No other team in the NL (and most in the AL, too) could field a rotation approaching Peavy, Burnett, Jurrjens, Vasquez and Smoltz/Hanson.”
How about Peavy, Zambrano, Dempster, Lilly and Harden/Hill? Hell, throw Marquis in there if you want to. His ERA was better than Vazqez’s was (though he had 40 less IP).
Not sure dude, but even as a Braves fan, I think I’d roll the dice with THAT rotation over the Braves.
If Smoltz is 100 percent “no doubt about it” healthy, I’d take the Braves staff.
But come on, dude.
By Joe M.
December 10, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this
My personal concern, and maybe it isn’t reason for concern, is not the Braves low-balling John Smoltz; but rather them p***-footing around, attempting to wait till mid-January to know what to do, and Smoltz feels insulted by that because other teams are making offers to him but not the Braves.
By Tami
December 10, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this
BRAVES’ FANS ALERT: This headline is out one si.com about Smoltzie!!! Say it ain’t so!!!
Posted: Wednesday December 10, 2008 11:35AM; Updated: Wednesday December 10, 2008 12:25PM Tom Verducci > INSIDE BASEBALL
Could Smoltz land with Red Sox? Story Highlights John Smoltz may not be ready to return from shoulder surgery until May The possible downsides to the Mets’s signing of Francisco Rodriguez The Reds are making a bad bet on newly-acquired Ramon Hernandez
John Smoltz has pitched for the Atlanta Braves since 1988, winning 210 games and saving 154. Ed Wolfstein/Icon SMI Tom Verducci’s Mailbag Tom Verducci will answer select questions from SI.com users in his Baseball Mailbag.
Name:
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Smoltz has pitched his entire 20-year big league career with the Braves, who remain the favorites to wind up with the right-hander. But the Red Sox have been told that Boston “is one of the very few places” he would pitch if he decides Atlanta cannot give him one more realistic shot at the postseason. Smoltz, one of the game’s great competitors, would thrive in the 81-game playoff atmosphere of Fenway Park. In a best-case scenario, Smoltz would be back in May, but the Red Sox would be willing to wait even if he needed more rehab time and became a second-half addition.
By muxi87
December 10, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this
Rosenthal reports the Braves have offered AJ an $80 MILLION deal!!!
By JR
December 10, 2008 1:39 PM | Link to this
Vic, I agree 100 percent. Look at how many championship teams have a few wild childs on their team. I like Bradley. He’s a player, but he would need leadership in the club house and I’m not sure we have that. Chipper is on of the greatest players to ever wear a Braves uni, but let’s face it he’s not much on leadership. That being said I still would take a chance on someone like Bradley. BTW We had Gary Sheffield too in Atlanta and he’s no angel himself.
By don
December 10, 2008 1:39 PM | Link to this
Wow. Let’s do whatever it takes to get Burnett. He can be the Braves’s next Hampton.
Dumb management, as usual.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 1:40 PM | Link to this
T-Bone that is the dumbest thing heard on here, no offense. Padres are trying to DUMP salary, hence their relentless efforts to drop Jake. Taking on Vazquez’s 23 million over the next 2 years is a shade under what Jake is making…And to sav DOB’s fingers for 7 seconds, even though he’d skip over your comment, they didn’t get Javy to “flip” him, at all. If ATL lands Burnett, Smoltz comes back healthy, with Jurjjens and Vazquez at #4 eating 200 IP and 200+ K’s thats a dominant #4…
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this
He has been faithful to Atlanta for a long time and we haven’t done much to make him believe we want to contend in awhile
What? Smoltz was with this team from start to finish of the 14 straight division titles. He’s seen this team deal out a big hit to the farm system in an attempt to contend (for example, Teixeira). He saw this team attempt to build a contender every year since the off season of 1990/1991. He’s watching Frank Wren run around attempting to build one right now, even if it isn’t necessarily in the best interests of long term growth (but Frank is attempting to build around those interests with a goal of winning now).
That statement of yours makes zero sense.
Smotlz’s agents are doing the right thing, they are determining fair market value for John. When it becomes evident and crystal clear that Smoltz can pitch (the desire is not in question), Frank will meet with John’s agents and both sides will agree on a deal that is both fair to both sides and true to the market value.
By BravesFanInRockies
December 10, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this
Rosenthal sez the Mets are interested in Juan Pierre.
YESS!! The Mutts finish fourth!!
By Tim
December 10, 2008 1:44 PM | Link to this
You know baseball has a problem when Sabathia is gonna make more with this contract than Greg Maddux made his entire career. SMH.
By Neon Deion
December 10, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this
Where McCarver at?
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this
Ken Rosenthal - Source: Braves make $80M offer to Burnett (posted about 2 minutes ago.
By Novice Ned
December 10, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this
Unless the Braves threaten to walk away (and to whom would they walk?), we would AJ take the Braves offer immediately when he could sit back and see who else decides to ante up some dough? If he believes that there is one more team with cash than there are available aces, then it would be wise for him (and the other aces) to hold back as long as possible.
By car3boogie
December 10, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this
DOB your post on Smoltz was dead on….Except for the fact that Smoltz is a good fit for any team not just Boston
By Don't Trade Franceour, Sheesh
December 10, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this
Note: Milton Bradely lead the AL in Slugging Percentage last year.
By staggerlee
December 10, 2008 1:48 PM | Link to this
Braves up ante for AJ.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8922020/Wednesday-MLB-winter-meetings-blog
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this
I know it hopefully won’t happen, but having videos out med records etc. out make it a slight possibility atleast…But let me tell you and I hope you all agree, if Smoltz left ATL for say another 3-5 million from another team, like Boston or NY, I don’t care what he did 20+ years, I would boo him until he went deaf. Relentless INTENSE boo’s.
By Ricardo
December 10, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this
According to Fox, we made an $80 mil offer last night to AJ. That’s gotta be the limit on this guy for us, right?
By 18 Wheels of Love
December 10, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this
Gammons is a HOF reporter…I put a lot of stock in what he reports, even if he is a Red Sox homer. I have no problem with that.
By Raddad
December 10, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this
The braves have increased there offer to AJ 5 years 80million. I guess we must overpay to get pitching in the ATL.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
80 Million??!!
We’ll if this is true and AJ hasn’t agreed to the deal on the spot, then AJ’s interest in Atlanta isn’t as strong as preceived. There has to be more to this than a guaranteed 5 year 16 million a year deal. I’m not even sure how the Braves would afford that over the long term. He’d be 37 making 16 million… Maybe they just pay $25 million in a signing bonus, and actually pay that bonus over the next two years. The first two years of AJ would be steep but there after would be manageable.
By DAP
December 10, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
the proplem with bradley is that he has alot of injures, mostly his legs. uh oh.
you never know, playing the field might help his legs, instead of hurt them, and he is another year removed from his ACL injury, which could have contributed to his leg problems this year. he ended up playing about as much as chipper did.
bradley has also never really had consistency from year to year, so even if we get him, there is no way to predict what he will do, even if he stays healthy.
i dont know the answer to left field. there arent really tons of great choices. maybe this is a year for the braves to stock up on pitching. starting and relief. as ron burgendy would say “I am in a PICKLE!!!”
By Lee in S GA
December 10, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this
Tim So with that in mind, WHY hasn’t Milton Bradley’s name come up?
It comes up on the Braves blog from time to time. Injuries, no DH in the N.L. and attitude problem seems to be the reasons to sum it up in a nutshell. I don’t know about his defensive skills but according to everything I read and hear every FA outfielder this year must be the worse crop of defensive players ever assembled at one time.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this
Frank Wren means business….
5 years for 80 million.
By MizzouBravesFan
December 10, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this
We’ve offered A.J. a 5 yr., 80 mil. contract according to Rosenthal.
If that’s true, I think he’ll sign today.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this
Tim: Who should be the economic barrameter for player salaries? Gil Meche is making more than many, many, hall of fame pitchers made in their careers… combined.
By Don't Trade Franceour, Sheesh
December 10, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this
As for comparing A.J. Burnett to Mike Hampton…
uhhh…Burnett has already had Tommy John surgery, soo…yeah. Annnnddd remember how well Smoltz pitched in his mid-30s after Tommy John surgery…?
So, let A.J. at least come tear some pectorals or strain some big toes before we call him Michelle Hampton II.
By N8
December 10, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this
Rosenthal states that a source says Braves made a “new” offer to Burnett:
“A source told Gerry Fraley that the Braves made an offer to A.J. Burnett late Tuesday of $80 million over five years.”
Prediction (mine): Burnett to Yankees for 5 years 92.5 million (18.5 per year).
If the Yankees want him…. the Yankees will get him. My guess is that they’d rather have Lowe, but Lowe is going back to Boston. Why wouldn’t he? Boston will match whatever Yankees offer Lowe, IMO.
2nd Prediction: Braves sign Oliver Perez.
Yikes.
Of course…. I could be wrong. LOL!
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 1:58 PM | Link to this
A source told Gerry Fraley that the Braves made an offer to A.J. Burnett late Tuesday of $80 million over five years.
Talks between the Braves and the free-agent right-hander “progressed through the night,” with the Yankees still a factor in the discussions, major-league sources told Ken Rosenthal.
WOW?
By Marty
December 10, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this
N8 - While your point about the Cubs having the best potential rotation going into next season is well made, I certainly hope you’re not suggesting that Marquis is anything but significantly inferior to Vazquez. I mean, really — look at the peripherals. You won’t find anyone else with any knowledge of the players who agrees with that.
Other than that, then yes — the Cubs are going to have a better rotation on paper than the Braves to start next season, pretty much regardless of what happens between now and opening day. Then again, we know what “on paper” gets you…
By N8
December 10, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this
Tim
“You know baseball has a problem when Sabathia is gonna make more with this contract than Greg Maddux made his entire career. SMH.”
Good point. But why are you surprised? It’s a “trend” that has been escalating for years.
Andruw Jones is making more on his current 2 year deal with the Dodgers (after having a HORRIBLE 2006 season), than Dale Murphy made his entire career.
Times change, dollars change, and more importantly, players change teams to chase said dollars.
It is NEVER going to happen, but MLB needs a salary cap more than any other sport. It’s ridiculous.
By chris
December 10, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this
Efrim
I was going to blog the same exact sentiment you just said. But we do need to upgrade the offense because we won’t win until we put an offense on the field that can be productive without Chipper and BMac in the lineup and dangerous with them in it.
By Keeper
December 10, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Towers looks like a complete idiot - hilarious that he’s now managed to tick off his Cubs “buddy” with his blabbering mouth.
Given that it’s now basically Cubs or broke, if that 4-5 team deck of cards falls apart, do you think Towers would be better off calling Wren and praying the bridge isn’t burned, or waiting until the July trading deadline?
Also, I gather Maddux isn’t the sentimental type, but if (big IF) the Braves manage to make a strong playoff run, do you think there’s the slightest chance he could get bored at home and decide to do a Clemens, signing with the Braves at midseason to reunite with his golf buddies and Cox?
Not that Wren would bring him back as a front-line starter (learned that lesson the hard way last year), but just for bullpen and the fun of rejoining the Old Gang (assuming Smoltz and Glav are back) and go out on a high note.
Crazy, highly unlikely idea, I’m sure - just curious what you thought of it after that press conference, with him talking about how much he’ll miss the golf and camaraderie between starts as much as anything else.
By N8
December 10, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this
T-Paul
“He’d be 37 making 16 million”
I suspect in 2013 that will look like a STEAL, provided he can still tie his own shoes. LOL!
And just think, we thought Mike Hampton’s contract was hampering us last year! LOL!
By D Wright
December 10, 2008 2:03 PM | Link to this
KC website says we get outfielder José Guillen too!
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
N8
If the Yankees want him…. the Yankees will get him. My guess is that they’d rather have Lowe, but Lowe is going back to Boston. Why wouldn’t he? Boston will match whatever Yankees offer Lowe, IMO.
I can’t see the Red Sox signing Lowe and Tex, and I am pretty sure they’ll get Tex. I’ve heard they don’t want to go to four years for Lowe. The Yanks were rumored to have offered 4 years and 68-72 million. Lowe wouldn’t turn that down. This contract offer from the Braves should be enough to land Burnett. If not, then there is really nothing else Frank Wren could of done.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 2:08 PM | Link to this
2 Things
Whoever says Milton Bradley is an option…LOOK AT THIS CAREER STATS!!! The most games he has played in the last 4 years was 126 LAST YEAR!! He played 140 games 4 years ago, his largest total EVER in his career. Did anybody mention he is a HEAD CASE??? PLEASE stop mentioning him. And when he does play he puts up solid not good or great numbers. AND he wants multiple years at $10 million+…So, seriously, c’mon!!!
And this whole Smoltz to Boston thing coming out of Gammons mouth is just his little inner-fantasy because he is a Red Sox fan. Ain’t happenin…
By northbeach Scott
December 10, 2008 2:08 PM | Link to this
if Smoltz left ATL for say another 3-5 million from another team, like Boston or NY, I don’t care what he did 20+ years, I would boo him until he went deaf. *Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
You’re kidding, right? So if you left Job A after a long career for Job B at a higher salary, would you expect to be booed? That is really provincial thinking and ignorant. I suppose you are in the same group that booed Glavine and Maddux after they left via free agency?
While it is unlikely that Smoltz will leave the Braves as DOB and others have articulated, it is possible. Perhaps Smoltz has a strong desire to play for a winner again for another championship and a chance to further add to his post-season legacy.
If you want to boo someone, boo Frenchy and Andruw for their worthless performance the last few years, not one our former Stars that has changed teams.
By T-Bone
December 10, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this
James till 6th. Sorry. Point well made. I didn’t know Vazquez’ salary.
At the same time, does anyone else besides me believe that Smoltz will serve us better next year as a closer than a starter? With his recurring arm problems, I think that he would be open to that. How about a Gonzo/Soriano/Smoltz for a 7-8-9th, with Moylan thrown in the bullpen as well? Then, at least as it stands now, you’ve got a rotation of Vazquez/Jurrjens as 1 & 2, with a combination of Glavine, Jo-Jo, Campillo, Morton, taking the 3-4-5 spots, with Hanson coming up sometime, possibly. Looking at that, we really need FW to make sure we get either Peavy or AJ (or both?)!
By Tim McCarver
December 10, 2008 2:10 PM | Link to this
You’re a real man Deion. A real man.
By jeff
December 10, 2008 2:11 PM | Link to this
jose gillen to the braves everybody!
By Nate
December 10, 2008 2:16 PM | Link to this
If you look at both career ERA and winning percentage the difference between Vazquez and Burnett is smaller than the difference between Burnett and Peavy.
Burnett is not a Number 1 pitcher. He’s not even teh best pitcher on his current team. And that team didn’t make the playoffs either.
Burnett has only pitched over 200 inning three times in his career, and with his injury history he’s likely to be out of baseball before that five year contract expires.
The fact that the Braves are willing to offer Burrnett five years indicate just how desperate Wren has become.
The Braves are a few years away from contending. There is no good reason to take such a huge gamble when you’re as far away from contending as the Braves are. Acquiring AJ won’t put the Braves over the top, it will insure that they stay nearer the bottom for the next few years.
By Calvin
December 10, 2008 2:17 PM | Link to this
How do you turn down 5 guaranteed years as a pitcher?
By GB
December 10, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this
Stick Heyward in left, Hanson in the rotation, and let’s play ball!
By rammerjammer
December 10, 2008 2:19 PM | Link to this
T-Bonedoes anyone else besides me believe that Smoltz will serve us better next year as a closer than a starter?
Smoltz has said that, at this stage in his pitching life, starting would be less stressful than relieving because it would be a regular routine. The erratic nature of relieving won’t work for him any longer.
By Fred Secunda
December 10, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this
DOB must have headed over to the Spearmint Rhino, haven’t heard from him in a while.
By propp
December 10, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this
Where are you reading the KC stuff? All I see is Dayton Moore shooting it down
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this
where are the confirmed- (or rumored- what the hey) reports of us signing Guillen? I’ll put no stock in it from random posters until I get some proof
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this
jeff - jose gillen to the braves everybody!
What’s your source?
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
NorthBeachScott
I didn’t boo Glavine not one bit, because he is a standup class-act guy that I have had the pleasure to meet and share a few words with on a few occasions…But I would be infuriated with Smoltz if he wants to play for a “contender” and leaves for a couple million. My reasoning is he is one of the major reasons ATL was not a “contender” last year. I will say I would only boo if ATL DID get AJ and he left because having: AJ, Smoltz, Jurjjens, Vazquez, Hanson/Glavine spells “contender” to me…What about you dude?? And the only reason that rotation would not contend would because Smoltz didn’t hold up…I could see if Smoltz was a lifetime Royal or Oriole here, but when AJ signs along with Smoltz, Javy, JJJ and Hanson/Glav (Who could learn alot from John)…That is about as strong as you can get 1-5….
Again Scott this is stupid to even argue because if they make a respectable offer, he’ll take it because that is the type of guy he is. Also, DOB will co-sign this, John puts alot of stock and heart into retiring a Brave, again if they give him a respectable contract and don’t insult him…
By alex
December 10, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
One way to look at it is the CC signing makes the Yankees that much more attractive, as any player wants to go to the best team possible. And adding CC certainly makes the Yanks a much better team.
I’d be pleasantly surprised if Burnett ends up in Atlanta.
By Deion Sanders
December 10, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
Where McCarver at?
By Blue Magic
December 10, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
So if AJ signs does this mean that Huddy will be done in ATL after 2010 (assuming his option gets picked up)?
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 2:28 PM | Link to this
LEW — You’re right, that rotation (Peavy, AJ, Jair, Javy Lopez, Smoltz/Hanson) would stack up against any in baseball. If Frank could pull it off without losing Escobar, the Braves would be my pick to win the NL pennant. For Peavy, maybe Frank could offer up Reyes, Morton, Lil Bridge, B. Jones, and one or two level 2 prospects. Anything (almost) to keep Escobar. I know, I’m dreaming… but what else can you do in the hot stove season. By the way, I’m still in mourning over Flowers. I was planning my spring training ticket buys in Jupiter around seeing Hanson, Flowers, Chipper, etc.
By N8
December 10, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this
Efrim
Good point about Tex and Boston. But you and I both know that Boston and NY make “reactionary” moves to one another. And both of them can afford to do so.
But you’re point is still a good one.
As for Wren not being able to do anything else, you are correct. All teams can do is offer money, if the rest of the team scares the players as to not sign long term, then it is what it is.
Then we’ll be forced to overpay (in prospects) for trades to be made (Peavy), or just wait until our youngsters carry us to the post season (like the Rays last year and us in 1991), and THEN the free agents will come, like they used to.
By LTBravesFan
December 10, 2008 2:30 PM | Link to this
He’s not the best pitcher on his team because he was the same team as Halladay.. Just because he is not better than Halladay doesnt mean he’s not Ace quality. So that’s not really an argument.
By MGL
December 10, 2008 2:30 PM | Link to this
Another way of looking at it is whether AJ wants to go to the Yankees as #2 or 3, or to the Braves as #1.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this
And NBScott
Boo somebody else that was not a star like Andruw?? The guy who put up phenomenal years for ATL for 10+ years and 10 straight Gold Gloves and smashed 2 Homers at Yankee stadium in the 96 WS?? I’m sure your’e one of the guys who booed him too. And I’m also sure your’e one of the guys who booed 24 year old Jeff who has not yet lived up to his Lord Jesus Christ title he was labeled at age 22…He had an off year if you are booing him after not giving him a chance to bounce back after he had 3 solid years and a GG as a 21, 22 and 23 year old, that is ignorant.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 2:35 PM | Link to this
got a rotation of Vazquez/Jurrjens as 1 & 2, with a combination of Glavine, Jo-Jo, Campillo, Morton, taking the 3-4-5 spots
That pen would be mighty, but they’d have nothing to save with a Jurrjens Vazquez 1-2 punch.
By R1U
December 10, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this
Nobody, nobody is worth that kind of $$$$ anywhere, anytime. Let’s see how the owners respond to the next players assoc. negotiation. Sick, Wrong, sick!!!
By nolie
December 10, 2008 2:37 PM | Link to this
I think, I cannot remember really if that was the case, but I do know he fought the injury bug last year. OJ
I think that he has had a lot of injury problems over the years, hasn’t he?
By N8
December 10, 2008 2:39 PM | Link to this
Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
“I didn’t boo Glavine not one bit, because he is a standup class-act guy that I have had the pleasure to meet and share a few words with on a few occasions…But I would be infuriated with Smoltz if he wants to play for a “contender” and leaves for a couple million.”
Steve-O, that is quite possibly the dumbest thing you have ever said on this blog. Come on man. The Braves made a VERY competitive offer to Glaving and he took “a couple of million” more to play with the Mets.
Add to that, the Braves were still VERY competitive when Glavine left, so his going to the Mets tilted the balance of power (on paper), by spurning the Braves and joining the Mets. If I remember correctly, the other team he was in talks with was the Phillies. So he definitely wanted to stick it to the Braves.
As of right now, the Braves are NOT that competitive, so if they low-ball Smoltz, I would hold NOTHING against him for bailing out. In fact, one could call him GREEDY if he chooses to take Atlanta’s money, if he feels that they are NOT in contention, or wouldn’t be with his services.
To question Smoltz’ integrity, takes yours away, IMO. Sorry dude, that’s how I see it. (I’m not really attacking your integrity - just attacking that statement).
That all being said, Smoltz isn’t going anywhere. If he’s pitching in 2009, he’ll have a tomahawk across his chest.
By StingerSplash
December 10, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
Jonathon,
Don’t know if I’d go so far as to call Hall of Famer Peter Gammons a Red Sox “ho.” True, he has spent the bulk of his career covering the Old Towne Team. But, especially with the previous management groups, few have been more critical of the Red Sox’s excesses and those things that they chose to neglect (Fenway Park, for instance, until the Henry-Werner-Lucchino group took over). If you want a good read, try his book “Beyond the Sixth Game,” which delves into the start of free agency and how the Sox screwed it up for everybody. Besides, few people have his contacts or reputation in journalism, be it sports or any other avenue, because of his approach to the profession or to the people involved.
By DAP
December 10, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
t-bone as stacked as our bullpen is already, i honestly think smoltz would help us more in the rotation.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this
For Peavy, maybe Frank could offer up Reyes, Morton, Lil Bridge, B. Jones, and one or two level 2 prospects. Anything (almost) to keep Escobar. I know, I’m dreaming…
Yes. You are. Lillibridge has already been delt to the ChiSox for Javy Lopez
By jhughes
December 10, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this
nate Is smoltz a number 1 how about hudson? if smoltz comes back for a year or 2 then really burnett is just a little icing on the cake. in 2010 hudson will be back and that pitching staff will be stacked i dunno how you cant see that
By Billy Walsh
December 10, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
5 years 80 million is a huge gamble. Someone was quoted on the WFAN that anyone who signs Burnett will be lucky if he gives them 2 injury free years. Yikes. Dave, would a package of Frenchy, Escobar, and Gorky get it done for Greinke? I know its a lot, but a young and cheap potential might be worth it. If escobar and frency are dealt, the braves could sign furcal and abreu.
By nolie
December 10, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
Am I a moron or an imbecile? Just cannot figure it out? Dim
how ‘bout and idiot?
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
N8
As for Wren not being able to do anything else, you are correct. All teams can do is offer money, if the rest of the team scares the players as to not sign long term, then it is what it is.
Then we’ll be forced to overpay (in prospects) for trades to be made (Peavy), or just wait until our youngsters carry us to the post season (like the Rays last year and us in 1991), and THEN the free agents will come, like they used to.
Basically. Because I have a feeling that it’s Burnett or we’ll end up making a trade for someone. I’d go after Sheets if the Yanks beat us out for Burnett. But I’m sure Wren would rather go make a trade, than to sign the injury plagued Sheets.
By N8
December 10, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this
AdirondackDave
“You’re right, that rotation (Peavy, AJ, Jair, Javy Lopez, Smoltz/Hanson) would stack up against any in baseball.”
Sorry dude, but any rotation with Javy Lopez in it, is in serious trouble. LOL!
By Dadgum
December 10, 2008 2:45 PM | Link to this
Folks, Wren with the upped ante also has issued a take it or leave it proposition. You simply don’t guarantee a 5th year and sweeten the pot by 5m without something in return. IMO….AJ has until 5:00PST tomorrow to accept the offer. If he doesn’t the Braves were going to not be able to sign him anyway. Move on to option #3 whatever that is.
Absolutely no sense in dragging this thing on past the meetings with that offer on the table so AJ can play it off other teams. In other words Wren is saying “here is the contract you wanted and we want you in Atlanta….by 5:00 tomorrow”. Under no circumstances would I revisit that offer to Burnett if he doesn’t accept. Indeed that may already be too much but I swear any more and it is insane. Folks that is more than Peavy makes!
Nobody on this blog is going to blame Wren for losing out on Burnett after that offer. Nobody. Ya’ll think about it. Would you really give Burnett more than a day to accept that overly generous offer? I wouldn’t. In fact I might even yank a million off the deal for every day past tomorrow that it takes him to sign. My two cents.
Rock on…….hey hey I wanna be a rock star.
By stynes
December 10, 2008 2:46 PM | Link to this
If the foxsports scoop is correct that the Braves have offered AJ $80m for 5 years then you’ve gotta think the Braves are now the front runner, don’t you? Sounds like the Braves are upping the ante for the sake of getting the deal done now that CC is out of the way. I’m sure they also want to finalize their budget in terms of filling their #1 priority so they devote their attention to filling other needs.
By LivininAL
December 10, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
OK..admitted I am a poor old country boy..so would someone tell me why a player needs 2-3 agents representing him?
By Rosenthal
December 10, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this
The Braves are pushing hard to land Burnett, the second-most desirable starter on the market after lefty CC Sabathia, who has a preliminary agreement in place with the Yankees. How hard? The team on Tuesday night made an offer of $80 million over five years, a major-league source told Gerry Fraley.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this
Just walking around the lobby and casino area, tapping into the buzz in the aftermath of the Sabathia deal. Opinions vary on what it meant for the Braves’ chances of signing Burnett, but most people at least agreed that it certainly didn’t hurt Atlanta’s and might, as I suggested, have helped them.
But for everyone who agreed with me that even the Yankees might have a problem guaranteeing five years for A.J. after guaranteeing seven enormous-salary years for CC, there was someone who raised his eyebrows or threw up his hands and said, in effect, the Yankees can do whatever the hell they want when it comes right down to it.
And I can tell you that some with the Braves fear that the Yanks will blow them away with a five-year, $100 mill offer for A.J. at any time.
I don’t think so, but we’ll see. I did hear from one reliable person that the Braves had guaranteed the fifth year since last night, but a couple of others close to this situation said they didn’t know.
I’m pretty sure that fifth year has been guaranteed, or it’s been made clear to Burnett’s agent, at least, that it will be guaranteed if that’ll get a deal done.
But I still think Burnett probably will wait a little longer to decide, to see if others will make competitive offers.
If I had to guess, I’d say better than 50-50 chance Braves get him.
By Ryan
December 10, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
DOB is it possible that Peavy said he’d veto the trade to the braves if Yunel was involved?
I just don’t undertand how the Pads would be interested in this multi-team deal with what people are speculating they’ll get back. Sean Marshall from the cubs and a couple of decent prospects from the O’s and Phils repectively. All told 3-4 players in the total deal going to the Pads, and this package would be nothing close to the talent they’d have gotten from the Braves. What is the logic behind this deal for the Padres?
By U Kno Who
December 10, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
I think everyone knows Dave O’Brien is on the slots in Vegas and chasing stories every three or four hours.
By KneeJerk
December 10, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this
Adirondack Dave- are you from Jupiter?
By nolie
December 10, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this
No other team in the NL (and most in the AL, too) could field a rotation approaching Peavy, Burnett, Jurrjens, Vasquez and Smoltz/Hanson. Screw Home Run power. That’s as good a rotation as could ever be hoped for. Improbable, but killer, nonetheless. Lew
that’s true and it’s nice to dream, but no way on earth are they gonna get Burnett and Peavy along with JV. I truly believe that Peavy does not want to come to Atl, and all the complexities involved in his trade is for that reason, but even if that isn’t it, the Braves are not gonna get all three.H3ll they don’t even wanna spring for Ohman.
By gayle
December 10, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this
I just love it when off-season conversation here transforms average pitchers into instant Cy Young winners.
Last year the predictions were for Hampton to win 15 and Smoltz about the same.
How did that work out?
Now we have Peavy and Vasquez and Burnett. You’ve got a legitimate ace in Peavy, an innings eater in Vasquez and a question mark in Burnett.
The level of activity speaks to the state of affairs with the Braves, but these names will not fix this team. The issues are far more fundamental. This is rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.
Look at the Falcons. See how they have completely transformed that franchise in less than a year. Arthur Blank had the courage and commitment to make the changes necessary.
Until the Braves make a similar commitment, the outcome will not change from what it has been the last three - and more - years. Thirteen years without a title and counting.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this
Should have also added, there are some at MLB who, privately, aren’t happy at all with the enormity of the deal that the Yankees just gave Sabathia. Near as we can tell, the next-highest offer was $110 million.
I just talked to Bobby Cox in the lobby, and he was saying how owners better be careful with these long-term, huge deals in this economy, which he fears is going to stay bad for several more years. Hey, Bobby’s no economist, but tough to argue against the idea that there should be some concern by most owners about these huge deals with what’s happening in the real world.
By BravesFanInRockies
December 10, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this
DOB,
If the Braves don’t sign AJ, after you got our hopes up that the Peavy deal would go through, I promise to never accept your betting advice again. :-)
By Ryan
December 10, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who? The man, the myth, the 3rd basemen?
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
N8
The only point I was making there was that I NEVER booed Glavine. That dude said I was probably one of those ignorant people to boo Glavine. I did not boo Glavine and stated my reason for it. I fully agree he spurned and stuck it to the Braves and left for more money. But the bottom point I was trying to make is: A) Tommy won us a WS in 95 with that epic game 6 and B) He is a stand up class act guy who I have had good experiences with when I have ran into him around the stadium…
You just did’nt understand the point I was trying to make…
Also..If AJ is signed, and with that 5/80 offer, I’d be surprised if he didn’t..Your gonna sit there and type to me that AJ/Smoltz/JJJ/Vazquez/Glav-Hanson for a Starting Rotation…After the power bat is added to the ATL lineup and the extremely solid bullpen with Bobby manning the troops is not as competitive a team you will find in the NL???
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
Oh my. This is somewhat of an aside, but I found Brent Lillibridge on facebook. I wasn’t sure so much if it was him, but-lo and behold- he writes me back. I told him I enjoyed his play and that he was the hidden gem of the Gonzo trade, and I wished him the best of luck. here is what he wrote me:
“I appreciate the support, and will miss Atlanta very much, i met a lot of great people there and greater fans. It was a joy to sign autographs to all the fans who came to the game early or waited outside the gate after. See you somewhere, somehow.”
kindof aloof sounding but, a response nontheless.
figured I would share it on this anticipatory news day
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who Not funny at all.
By Hillbilly
December 10, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this
U Know Who?
Y’all kill any giant bucks this season? Can I look forward to another Buck Commander Video in ‘09?
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this
JR—
You brought up leadership…
Someone—was that yesterday?—mentioned the interview that Chipper did on 790 The Zone when discussing Escobar. In part 2 of that interview, after talking about Escobar, Chipper had some things to say about leadership. Very good chunk of interview. You cann find it on 790thezone.com (maybe it’s still there, I don’t know). It would be under Podcasts, but for the life of me, I can’t get it to download an iPod friendly version.
Anyway, it’s good stuff…very good stuff.
Hey! Chipper, is that really you at 2:50??
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
Can we please stop dreaming about a rotation of Peavy AND Burnett? We’ll be doing good just to get one of them.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this
Is Chipper kickin’ it??
By Gil In Mechanicsville
December 10, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this
The Yankees are playing with monopoly money. Maybe they are thinking that if the economy goes into the tank, they can declare Chapter 11 and void all previous contracts.
By Thrillhouse44
December 10, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this
Was that U Kno Who, you know who??? Sounds like the double dimer is calling DOB.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
Hey I wouldn’t be surprised Chip was pushin for AJ…He’s probably checkin in to say what’s goin down out there as DOB said he would check in…But we need DOB to give him the 3 random odd-ball question test first….
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
They just introduced Jeter as captain of the U.S. WBC team, having a WBC press conference with manager Davey Johnson and LaSorda, etc.
They haven’t released rosters yet, but Braves expected to or considering playing include Jurrjens (Netherlands), Acosta (Panama), Campillo (Mexico), Gonzalez (U.S. or Mexico), Vazquez (Puerto Rico), and Chipper and McCann.
Cox said sure, he’d rather have his guys in camp all spring, but that he fully understood that some would want to play for their countries in the WBC and that the Braves would never ask them not to.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
Went back in and changed some wording in original blog, because I’m hearing the Braves raised the per-season average to make the total worth $78-80 mill.
By winterville
December 10, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who
If that’s really you, how is the arm feeling? Do you think you should be full strength for the season?
By nolie
December 10, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
So far I haven’t seen anybody mention the out clause in CC’s contract after 3 years. Pretty nifty IMO. Gives him pretty much the best of all worlds. If he hates NY he can leave soon.
By Wes
December 10, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
DOB another popular rumour out now (and I understand its an internet rumour) is the Braves have made an informal offer to Bobby Abreu. Anything to that?
By Voice of Reason
December 10, 2008 3:13 PM | Link to this
gayle:
Very well thought out and very well written. I disagree, but nicely expressed.
By N8
December 10, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this
Efrim
“But I’m sure Wren would rather go make a trade, than to sign the injury plagued Sheets.”
I agree that Wren probably goes to the trade route, rather than agressively going after Sheets. But that being said, Sheets has made only 5 less starts in the past 5 seasons, than Burnett has.
So, they’re basically the same guy. Other than the recent history of Burnett staying healthy for the full season.
DOB
I second the thought of some Braves people (my earlier “prediction” stated just that), that if the Yankees STILL want Burnett bad enough, they will BLOW the Braves offer out of the water, and not look back.
But as Efrim pointed out earlier, I’m guessing the Yankees would rather have Lowe, and if the Sox go get Tex, it is less likely that they will go after Lowe as well.
THAT being said, there is NOTHING that would stop the Yankees from adding Sabathia, Burnett AND Lowe, is there? After all, it’s just the Boss’s money. Mere pocket change for a team that also owns the network their games are televised on.
Too bad we don’t have an owner that owns his own TV station, huh? What’s that?
Oh. Never mind.
By safebet
December 10, 2008 3:15 PM | Link to this
only thing I dont understand ? is where Burnetts agent said right team right offer he will sign now. does that mean that each team has a different set price for him that he will go for.
By DAP
December 10, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this
uh, DOB, you left out who chipper and mccann will be playing for in the WBC.
By Redchip
December 10, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who - Are you out there playing the slots with him? Did you get a chance to get to the Maddux press conferences? And finally what’s your favorite Maddux story?
Looking forward to bringing my 3 year old to his first game this year. Stay healthy so he can watch you play!
Go Braves ‘09!!!
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this
If another clubs tops THIS offer, I say let them have him and go after Sheets.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
I am just a lil’ curious dude, what are you doing looking up Brent Lillibridge on FaceBook?? I still never understood why he was a good prospect…His D is there but realistically can’t hit his weight. When he was up at bat it looked like he was facing Nolan Ryan circa ‘83.
N8 P.S. - The ONLY ATL player I have ever booed was Dan (Funkin’)Kolb. Not only was he so ridiculously terrible, but the guy was a complete arsehole. Him and his Pontiac 17 year old girl car. Everytime he blew a game, which seemed to be every night, he just had the dumb look on his face like, “I suck, I know, Oh well…”
By Dadgum
December 10, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
Chipper, if that’s really you, gotta be impressed with Wren’s attempts to land Burnett. A pitcher of the ilk you wanted the Braves to go after. If I am Burnett I would have inked that offer 5 minutes ago. You?
Rock on……Go Braves
By Heath
December 10, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
5yr/$80M…that’s a nice chunk of change… can’t imagine FW would increase his offer from that that figure if Burnett did not seem inclined to take it. Peavy’s a good pitcher, but if I were FW, I would hate to have to call Towers up again after the debacle earlier this off-season.
Saw a post earlier about signing Griffey to a 1-yr deal to “platoon” in left with Diaz. That could be interesting (at the right price) if FW is unable to get a better solution…
U Kno Who… da man!
By Thrillhouse44
December 10, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this
DOB, have they asked you to be the beat writer for the WBC?
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this
If it’s U Kno Who, he’ll be able to tell me this:
What advice did you give a few of us writers in Houston after a series-ending loss a couple of years ago, as the Braves continued one of their worst losing jags in quite some time and prepared for a flight to Florida. We came to your locker and you said something that was absolutely hilarious.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
uh, DAP, I guess I figured most people would know which team Chipper and McCann would play for. You unsure of that?
By Anders
December 10, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
Can’t blame Burnett for waiting a while longer. CC stood around whistling for three weeks and without anyone else even remotely close to the Yankees offer he got $21 mil more from them.
Based on that, Burnett would be crazy to sign with the Braves before Lowe signs with anyone. If Lowe signs with The Red Sox then Burnett might get to $100 mil with the Yanks. That’s worth the risk for Burnett imo. I can’t believe he’s looking at 75 - 80 mil already!! I told you guys the Yanks would spend like drunken sailors but I have to admit the CC money blew me away. They’re crazy - he ain’t worth it. Not for 7 years anyway. The prices for all three of these guys is stupid.
By Rahul
December 10, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this
DOB, I didn’t realize you were the president of the BBWAA. That is awesome, they couldn’t have picked a better writer. I want to congratulate you on all your hard work and on adding 4 great writers today, in Carroll, Karhl, Neyer, and Law.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this
DOB
Any meat to the reports from WFAN’s Sweeny Murti saying the Braves are in serious talks about Dye coming back to ATL??
Wes
Where did you see the Abreu rumor? He is a Left Handed batter though..I don’t see that…They need a big RHB…I think Dye has another 2-4 quality years of solid production left..
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
N8 — Get with it. “javy Lopez” Vazquez’s new name. At lest that’s what Frank Wren mistakenly called him at the press conference the other day.
However, I suggested Lil Bridge be included in a revised deal for Peavy. That might be tough since he was traded in the Vazquez deal. My bad.
By Bayou Brave
December 10, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who, are you excited about the Javy Vasquez signing? You’ve gotta like your chances to win the East if A.J. and Smoltzie head the rotation, right?
By MiamiBrave
December 10, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this
haha, been waiting for U Kno Who to appear on here since DOB mentioned he would stop by again…awesome
By Patrick
December 10, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this
U Know Who:
Did you take any momento’s from Shea Stadium before they demolished it???
By car3boogie
December 10, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this
DOB let it ride on 10
By stynes
December 10, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this
I wonder how many times people post as “U Kno Who” when it’s really not anyone that anybody should know just to get folks all riled up. All the more reason for the AJC to finally get some “real” forum software. DOB and the occassional fill in do such a great job with content and there are so many loyal readers and posters it just seems like a shame that you can’t do so many of the “normal” things you can do with all of the other forums out there. I digress.
Thanks for visiting again, Chipper! Call AJ and tell him to sign today!
By BosnianBaller
December 10, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this
5 years and $80 mil for Burnett no thanks.I rather sign many for a 2 year deal and try to make the 2009 team similar to the 2002 or 03 team that can hit.Thats way too much money for a guy that gets injured A lot.Yeah manny would cost near $20,but so is burnett only manny is here 2 years and he might learn francouer a thing or two.
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 3:29 PM | Link to this
Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O) I am just a lil’ curious dude, what are you doing looking up Brent Lillibridge on FaceBook?? I still never understood why he was a good prospect…His D is there but realistically can’t hit his weight. When he was up at bat it looked like he was facing Nolan Ryan circa ‘83.
Look he has a page on facebook called fans of brent lillibridge, and as a fan, I am slightly interested in what he has to say.
However, I guess I can ask you a question of the same ilk…why is your screen name Chuck James? I mean he was a great window installer, but I never understood his pitching….
By skull
December 10, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this
Economy problems? Certainly not as far as the Stankees are concerned.
CC—7 yrs $161M—supposedly done deal.
Rumors are they offered Lowe 4yrs $68-72M ($17-18 per) & he’s considered to be the 3rd best FA P with AJ being 2nd. How high will they now counter FW’s 5 yrs $80M?
More Stanks rumors: Hank now wants to go after Manny.
They are also rumored to have offered Sheets 2 yrs $26M.
Doesn’t it ever end? Are they completely out of control. At what point do they so negatively impact BB enough that something has to be done, some changes have to be made?
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
Braves expected to or considering playing include Jurrjens (Netherlands), Acosta (Panama), Campillo (Mexico), Gonzalez (U.S. or Mexico), Vazquez (Puerto Rico), and Chipper and McCann.
Egad!!
I’m with Bobby!!
By Ryan
December 10, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
i’m totally poking lillibridge on facebook, then i’ll invite him to join the group “mediocre at best”
By Voice of Reason
December 10, 2008 3:34 PM | Link to this
By Thundersticks December 10, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this If another clubs tops THIS offer, I say let them have him and go after Sheets.
true dat…
By Shockley
December 10, 2008 3:35 PM | Link to this
Yankees have gaping holes in their rotation. At a minimum having to replace Moose and Pettite, you think they will stop at CC w/o getting AJ and settling with Lowe — you are nuts. Bidding war may slightly favor the Yanks. Slightly. Dude, 5/80 is a jumping off point. Crazy as it is.
By brent a.
December 10, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this
If the Yankees want to pay Burnett $100 million over 5 years, then so be it.
And, if they can do that, then MLB free agency is a farce.
As great as it is for the Yankees to have all that money, and be in New York, and generate revenue in all the ways they know how …
I still ask, could the Yankees, if independent of MLB, still pay the kind of salaries they do to the likes of A-Rod, Jeter, Sabathia, (Clemens), etc.?
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this
BFBFBBCBM
I’m not rippin on ya dude…I just found it curious..You said “I think it might be him” You did’nt elaborate Lillibridge had his own fan site..That’s funny…Who are his “friends/fans” his mom, grandfather, step-brother and you?? just kiddin man…
I made this screename early in the ‘07 season when Chuck continued to do very solid through 5 innings then the wheels came off in the 6th like clock-work. Been comin’ on here for awhile ‘cause DOB doesn’t miss a beat and I like the input of some good people on here..
By DAP
December 10, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this
no, DOB, just pickin’
By Ron_Paul
December 10, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this
BBFCFM
If you really are from Mars…does that mean there is intelligent life forms from other planets?
And..
Did you get tickets for Hampton?
By Casey
December 10, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this
Even now, we are still being hurt buy John Schuerholz’s ridiculous trades all these years. The Braves are legendary around MLB for throwing in 2, 3, 4, extra top notch minor league prospects just to get a deal done. So, now teams always keep asking for more and more and more and more to see how much they can get from the Braves. Apparently, Frank Wren came to his senses (THANK GOD) before we made another of these insane giveaways (for Peavy). If nothing else happens, the Braves can at least now deal on a level playing field with the rest of the league. Christmas is over, I hope.
By Blair
December 10, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this
Isn’t Chipper going to play for Team Florida and Mac for Team Georgia? ;-)
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this
Rahul, thanks. Just glad the motion passed. Good step forward.
By brent a.
December 10, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this
I also think it’s great work by CC and his agent to get the extra year, and $$.
Just two days ago, Steve Phillips was on ESPN, smarmily commenting on how he could CC playing on the West Coast, because he thinks he be happier there, but, that he wouldn’t want CC managing his finances.
Meanwhile, CC is actually playing the Yankees, Dodgers, and the media, and pulling off the largest contract ever for a pitcher!
I have trouble believing that the extra year and $$ made all the difference for CC. He has known for 2 years what kind of offers would await him from New York this off-season.
And, bad economy in all, he still pulled off a record deal.
By Wes
December 10, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this
Heard the Abreu thing on 610 WIP in Philadelphia, but they stressed it was a rumour (whoever is on before Howard Eskin there).
By N8
December 10, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this
AdirondackDave
Yeah, I know that Wren called him “Lopez”. Just didn’t catch that you did it purposely.
Sorry. I thought I added the “LOL” at the end to let you know I was giving you crap and not busting you ballz.
Either way, I was just giving you crap.
By mr baseball
December 10, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this
Instead of throwing maybe too much money and too many years at Burnett, here’s an alternative.
Braves sign Adam Dunn to hit cleanup, but not to play LF. Package Kotchman, JoJo & maybe Gorkys to Seattle for Bedard, whose arm injury from last season was apparently not that serious.
That gives the Braves a power bat in the middle of the lineup, a starter comparable to Burnett and maybe enough $ left to upgrade LF without creating a major vacancy (Escobar in Peavy deal, no cleanup hitter if Burnett signed).
Would still prefer spending an additional $10 mil on Tex, but that obviously ain’t gonna happen.
By Anders
December 10, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
Should have also added, there are some at MLB who, privately, aren’t happy at all with the enormity of the deal that the Yankees just gave Sabathia. Near as we can tell, the next-highest offer was $110 million.
This deal is so over the top that when I was talking with a die hard Yankee apologist up here in NY today even he said “No wonder the rest of baseball hates us. I’m starting to hate us.”
By Shockley
December 10, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
Leave poor Chip alone, let him drive-by jab our intrepid albiet flawed DOB (some of us cannot resist the slots and their sweet call) in peace. Cripes.
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
Ryan: Lillibridge told me he doesn’t like you. So that wouldn’t work.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
Just walking around the lobby and casino area, tapping into the buzz
Getting the tips on the hot tables and slots…
And now I see UKW has scooped that line.
Damn it. Gotta learn to read and type faster.
DOB: 78-80 million?? 5th year guaranteed? Is it reasonable to think some other team will top this? I know the Yankees could if they so choose, but seriously? What would be AJ’s hold up if that rumor is indeed true?
U Know Who: How is the hunting? Do you go with a riffle or bow and arrow? Bolt action? Savage Model 110 or Winchester 70?
My nephew went out hunting on Thanksgiving. Tradition to hunt or, if all else fells, just fire the guns. He nailed a squirrel on his first try. Not bad for a six year old.
By Dudeman
December 10, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this
Burnett will never make it through the five years. He is an arm injury waiting to happen. Also, the Brave sneed more that one decent pitcher to contend. PLEASE - DO NOT SIGN HIM…build with young talent and sign long term. It may take another year or two but the results will be longer lasting. Free agency is only to bring in the final piece of the puzzle. Name more than a few pictchers signed long term who actually produced other than Maddux and Mussina. I guarantee this signing is the one that brings the Braves to their knees!!!
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this
Chuck:
I know it man. I know what your name means as well. I’ve been here since this blogs inception, though I rarely post. All in good fun. My friend made the site. I just joined it because it is absurd.
Ron_Paul:
Yes, there is life on Mars. you’re the first to ever catch my name. No Hampton tix, but I seen em a million times already, so I’m not bummed
By Hoosier Aaron
December 10, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this
DOB
Should have also added, there are some at MLB who, privately, aren’t happy at all with the enormity of the deal that the Yankees just gave Sabathia. Near as we can tell, the next-highest offer was $110 million.
Honestly - I think the Yankess have to WAY overpay to get some of these guys. They don’t call it the Bronx Zoo for nothing.
If the Cardinals offer me $100M to play in that city and that stadium for those fans and the Yankees offer me $160M - chirp, chirp - I’m playing for the Redbirds! I’m a lifetime Braves fan - but it only takes one game in St. Louis to fall in love with that place.
Seriously - do you think players feel that way too - or does the union pressure them to take the highest offer - regardless of their personal preference?
By Wayne in Utah
December 10, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this
Only way the Braves allow Smoltz to get away is if they some totally changed their philosophy about 2009, and decided to retrench for 2010. Not gonna happen.
I never boo’d Tom Glavine, mainly because I never go to see him pitch.
Glavine shouldn’t be mentioned in the same sentence with JS (couldn’t bring my self to typing his name that close to Glavine’s. Traitor Tom is a good nickname. I wish him well in his retirement.
Milton Bradley would be a good addition, if you could feel better about his durability. I don’t think Bobby has a problem with some problem children type players. Sheffield did OK here.
AJ, what the heck are you waiting on? Oh yeah, that “last” offer from the Yankees.
By Anders
December 10, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this
Mr. President
Is it true the Governor of Georgia is taking offers for your old position in the BBWAA?
By THE BEAR
December 10, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this
I have been a fan of this blog for about two years although I seldom post. I especially appreciate David O’Brien’s efforts in keeping a very interesting blog going at all times. That is not an easy task.
I also get a kick out of watching the people here who fall into what any corporate personnel manager would characterize as a collection of the norm, i.e. those with their glasses always half full, those with their glasses always half empty and those who think before they write.
Those posters who fall in the middle are reasonable, logical thinkers who are willing to accept reality for what it’s worth. They are the most interesting although the others do tend to keep it lively. I even get a kick out of those who can’t get through the day without insulting another poster. If that poster lived next door to me however, I doubt I’d want to associate with him.
Carry on and let’s all hope Frank Wren can bring home the bacon that will enable the Braves to field a competitive team next year. For some reason I believe he will pull it off although the final package, whatever it is, will not please many of you. At least there is no doubt at all about that statement.
Are you one of the negatives or positives? Think it over and maybe you can join the group in the middle who can see both sides.
Some of the things some of you say about people such as Bobby Cox, Frank Wren, John Scheurholz and players with the Braves are almost unbelievable. How would you like to see such things said about you in print by people who have never met you? Think about it before you write such drivel.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
I am sure if it was U Kno Who, he would have answered DOB’s question by now. I doubt its him.
By Ryan
December 10, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
haha you must be the biggest lillibrige fan of all time. take a joke buddy, settle down
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
Could be wrong, but this could/should be the last winter of outrageous free agent contracts. Have to think that the perfect economic storm, which is just beginning, will trickle up even to the lords of baseball. On the positive side, it may have the effect of pushing teams to development their own players through the farm. The way it was for the better part of 100 years. It also will help build fan support in the way these mercenary free agent rentals cannot. Still can’t get over losing Flowers.
By skull
December 10, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
Royals claimed RHP Jairo Cuevas off waivers from the Atlanta Braves.
Now this is a waiver war. The Royals claimed Cuevas on waivers from the Braves on Oct. 24, lost him back to the Braves on Nov. 27 and now have reacquired him. They’ll probably keep him on the 40-man roster this time. Rotoworld
DOB
Please explain what this waiver war thing is about. Are there some bad feelings now between Dayton & Frank.
Thanks
By Wanting to relive the glory days
December 10, 2008 3:54 PM | Link to this
This off season can be compared to being forced to sit through the Mamma Mia movie….painful at best. I am hopeful that a starter who can lead our pitching staff is found. If Wren can’t get AJ or Peavy, I hope there is a plan c and d or else it will be a long season. Remember, if you can’t out pitch them, you have to out hit them.
By richbrave
December 10, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
I never was good at math but, WOW. 23 million per year more or less and for seven. That approaches what I thought it would. And we’re countering with FOUR at 75-80 for A.J.? That’s like 19-20 mill per. Is that right, or is it for five. Getting closer to my guesstimate all the time. Ridiculous isn’t it.?
By TBraveFan
December 10, 2008 3:57 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah you can kiss my grits…
Love ya Tommy - praying for a speedy recovery and can’t wait to see you in Spring Training!
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 3:58 PM | Link to this
N8 — No problem, we’re good.
By Ron_Paul
December 10, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this
BBFCFM
About 30 times since 1994 for me…feel like I saw some great ones though! Me neither on Hampton…
By Josh P.
December 10, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this
U Know Who - This is completely shameless, and mostly meant in good fun anyway, but times are tough so it’s worth a shot! If you ever need someone to manage your ranch, my Dad has over 20 years experience in gameland management. I couldn’t tell you specifics but I know the harvest % for white tails had increased by close to 1000% the last time I saw the records, and that was before the limits really started to increase. The farm he manages now is in a state of ownership flux (you know how that is) so he’d be more than happy to send you a resume. ;)
By Thrillhouse44
December 10, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
Ron_Paul/BBCFM, I missed out on tickets too. I have a hotel room, so I’m debating if I’m still going to go or not.
By RC
December 10, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
Braves trivia question: What special event occured for only the 2nd time at Turner Field on May 18th, 2004?
Answer in 5 minutes.
By KLB
December 10, 2008 4:01 PM | Link to this
DOB - Any insight on the BBWAA voting in Neyer and Law this year after they were left out last year? It was a big deal a year ago, but I don’t think I ever read any of your thoughts on the matter.
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this
DOB,
It appears that Staten Island historians have now successfully traced the genealogy of the Wu-Tang Clan all the way back to 1993.
Impressive work.
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
Look, Ryan, this is what Brent told me. He must be the one upset. I would take it up with him. I’m sure he would join your group if you asked him nicely.
By DannyFish
December 10, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
All the ribbing and complaining…it’s starting to feel like the hot stove IN HERE. The funny thing is if AJ takes the Braves offer it will only take a few hours for people to start getting antsy again for another trade. Free agency makes people crazy.
Wren has contingency upon contingency for how the offseason will play out. If AJ went somewhere else I have confidence that he will simply move on to his next possible move.
By Lew
December 10, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
Nathan-Yeah, but they ARE the Cubs.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
WayneInUTah….
If I don’t recall Tommy sealed THE ONLY WS Championship in ATL history….Smoltz that series?? Look it up…
Glavine made a mistake in going to NY…But saying you can’t mention his name with Smoltz?? C’mon man…
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
Ron_Paul: 50-60+ since 98. However, I would trade half or more of those to hit some 94-98 though.
By Andy K.
December 10, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this
Josh P.
Your proposal for Chipper is unlikely, as Chipper’s own dad currently manages Double Dime Ranch.
By Casey
December 10, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah, this is a Braves FAN blog. If they have a baseball team up in Utah, you should find their blog. Glavine is one of the greatest players to ever put on a Braves uniform. He is a future Hall of Famer. You are not worthy of watching him play.
By skull
December 10, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this
Ron_Paul Did you get tickets for Hampton?
What’s Mike selling tickets too?
By N8
December 10, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this
Steve-O
First of all, I was more reacting to you saying you DIDN’T boo Glavine, but WOULD boo Smoltz. Hypocritical, IMO.
As for:
“Your gonna sit there and type to me that AJ/Smoltz/JJJ/Vazquez/Glav-Hanson for a Starting Rotation…After the power bat is added to the ATL lineup and the extremely solid bullpen with Bobby manning the troops is not as competitive a team you will find in the NL???”
I never said that. Somebody (Lew?) had pointed out how incredible the Braves rotation would be with Peavy at the front end, and simply stated that as good as that would be, the Cubs with Dempster and Zambrano might be that much better with Peavy at the front.
As for the power bat being added? I’ll believe it when I see it. So far (unless Burnett comes to Atlanta), Wren hasn’t gotten anybody to bite at the Braves hook with all the money on the end of it.
So that tells me that if he doesn’t get a big-time pitcher here, the bats aren’t coming either via free agency. Which means trade time, at which point we would have to give up Escobar, KJ or one of the young studs that are up and coming to get a bat, which is counter productive.
To give up a young bat for a young pitcher (Escobar for Peavy), is a valid “risk” that has potential reward and shows that the team is attacking an area of weakness from an area of strength (or alleged strength).
To trade a bat for a bat (KJ for Ludwick) is silly at best.
I’m getting tired of talking in hypotheticals when dissecting the Braves roster/rotation.
It might all change by April, hell it might change by the time I hit the “Post” button. But the bottom line is that so far we have added Javier Vazquez and addressed our backup catching position.
Meanwhile the Mets added K-Rod, and the Yankees might outbid us for our 2nd “option” to add to the rotation, I say 2nd because Wren obviously had a huge boner for Peavy, and failed to get him.
How is he supposed to “sell” the fans on the upcoming season, when we’re down to our 3rd option for fixing the rotation?
My answer to that? Some of us have NEVER been sold on next season being a contending one, and we’re OK with it, as long as Escobar, KJ and Hanson (along with Schafer, Gorkys, Heyward and Freeman) are still in our system when the season begins.
Go Braves in 2010.
By Kevin C
December 10, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this
Well what about signing Perez now to give us a lefty?
As for offense, the Pirates are asking a lot for Nate McLouth and Paul Maholm—would anyone package Jordan and pitching, not Hanson to Pirates for Nate?
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 4:12 PM | Link to this
Thrillhouse:
That seems to be a common problem. I have some friends in the same boat. And then I have one friend who won that blasted lottery w/ 2 tix everyday for 3 days, and he is hotelless. I’ll just wait for the tour to start and pick up some then. The madness that is Hampton (well doesn’t that work on multiple levels) is something I can pass on
By Ron_Paul
December 10, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this
BBFCFM and thrillhouse
You know some people on this blog are thinking…
why are these three people still talking about Mike Hampton…and why is he putting on a concert?
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
Well there should be no bellyaching if the Braves don’t sign Burnett. An $80 million offer is very serious attempt to sign the guy. I think there’s no way the Braves match $100 million and we shouldn’t expect it.
It might be on to Plan C.
By Wayne in Utah
December 10, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
TBravefan Sorry to hit a nerve on TG, but I wish no ill will toward the man, but it pained me to have him back last year.
I have a real hard time understanding how a player can leave “his” team, for a marginal difference (especially considering the added expense of living in NYC for half the year). It was all a “union take the highest offer” deal for Tommy back then. He was more loyal to the union than he was to his fans.
I hope his arm heals well, and he enjoys his retirement. I hope to never see him with a tomahawk across his chest again.
I know you probably feel differently, and that is OK.
Let’s just not name him in the same sentence with a real team player, like John Smoltz.
Dannyfish Amen on FW having a plan A, B, C, D, etc.
By sam
December 10, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
let boston have lowe back..he’s a bum. i’ll take my chances with burnett.or peavy for that matter…
By Anders
December 10, 2008 4:16 PM | Link to this
RC
Braves trivia question: What special event occured for only the 2nd time at Turner Field on May 18th, 2004?
A sell out?
By Kevin C
December 10, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
Any one willing to offer Perez a 3 year deal around 12??
Also DOB what are the chances that the Braves look at Adam Dunn—we need some Offense
By Ron_Paul
December 10, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
Just after I posted that Skull asks the question!!!
Too funny!
By RC
December 10, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this
Sorry, I was way longer than 5 minutes. The answer is that is one of the two times at Turner Field that Mike Hampton has every pitched 9 innings.
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this
All the ribbing and complaining…it’s starting to feel like the hot stove IN HERE. The funny thing is if AJ takes the Braves offer it will only take a few hours for people to start getting antsy again for another trade. Free agency makes people crazy. DannyFish
I’d be willing to bet that Wren has a trade in place for LF but can’t pull the trigger on it until he lands his ace. My guess would be for Jose Guillen in a salary dump.
By Erik
December 10, 2008 4:25 PM | Link to this
DOB you have said a couple of times that Smoltz’s agents are just putting info out there to make sure the braves don’t low ball him. My question is what kind of offer are Smoltz and his agents looking for. 1 or 2 years at 7 million? Similar to the deal Glavine got last year?
Would 7-8 million a year for 1 or 2 years get it done for Smoltz?
Thanks DOB
By ClayB25
December 10, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this
Boras is asking for 5 years 70 million for Oliver Perez…. What a Joke.
By Murphy
December 10, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this
Augh!! Oliver Perez…NO! My neighbors could not take me screaming at his inconsistency every other game! Please say we pass!
By BravesFanInRockies
December 10, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this
*KevinC,8
Too late! Boras wants 5/$70 for Ollie!
By skull
December 10, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
Ron_Paul December 10, 2008 4:18 PM Just after I posted that Skull asks the question!!!
Excuse me sir! I asked 4:08, you posted 4:14.
BTW how’s the compaign going? What’s the word on 2012?
By ncgary
December 10, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
id like to see them go after sheets even if they get burnett,. being that its Christmas and all
By N8
December 10, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
Thundersticks
Why wouldn’t Wren pull the trigger on the trade NOW, that way the free agents would see that the team is improving, and be more likely to sign?
I don’t doubt that Wren has a trade in place, but he probably just feels the need to focus on Burnett at this point, to not miss out.
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 4:29 PM | Link to this
One thing is very satisfying though about the Yanks gorging on free agents… they usually lose anyway. Nothing more enjoyable than hearing about George or one of the George juniors ranting during or after another no-ring season.
I’ll say this, though. Selig should get the “Weakest/worst Commissioner in History” award. Remember that quaint phrase “in the interest of baseball.” And yes, I know he has greatly lined the pockets of owners/himself with the tv deals, while the taxpayers pony up enormous amounts of money for stadiums, etc. ($1.5B to Steinbrenners alone for the new Yankee Standium.) The same taxpayers who now need $200 to take the family to the old (new) ballpark for the day.
Bart Giamatti would role over in his grave… By the way, anybody know how much Selig makes these days for playing ball with these guys?
By gayle
December 10, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this
Dudeman is right. Sign Burnett for five years and the guy has a history of injuries? Has everyone forgotten about Hampton already? A hitter is one thing for a long term deal, but to sign a pitcher long term is rolling the dice.
If you forgot about Hampton, just ask the SF Giants about Barry Zito or the Mariners about Carlos Silva.
Selective memory. Just bite the bullet and rebuild. All these band aids just postpone the inevitable.
And thank you, Voice of Reason. There can always be honest disagreements while staying away from name calling.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this
Does anybody know when they announce the rosters for that WBC?
Thanks!
By TBraveFan
December 10, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this
Wayne yes you hit a big nerve. Tommy did what was best for himself at the time, it’s a more complicated story than most know. But let me ask you how you feel about Doggie? Any ill feelings there? After all he held the Braves hostage basically by accepting arbitration when he’d said he wouldn’t…and then fans were surprised when he wasn’t offered another contract here. It’s business - plain and simple - sad, but true. But in the long run - wouldn’t YOU too take the best job offer you were given? btw- I love them all - and wouldn’t trade my time watching any of the Big 3 play for anything. I like all the players - past, present and future. Long as they play their best for me, as a Braves fan, I’m ok with everything else.
By skull
December 10, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this
RC Sorry, I was way longer than 5 minutes. The answer is that is one of the two times at Turner Field that Mike Hampton has every pitched 9 innings.
You forgot to mention that was the perfect game pitched by RJ that MH pitched in that day!
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 4:37 PM | Link to this
Oh, for those wondering, Mike Hampton is playing a concert next year. All the kids are dying to see it. He’s hot like Hannah Montana- Musically that is. Anyway, heres the link to the flyer of his upcoming concert
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this
h, for those wondering, Mike Hampton is playing a concert next year. All the kids are dying to see it. He’s hot like Hannah Montana- Musically that is. Anyway, heres the link to the flyer of his upcoming concert.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/33265731@N06/?saved=1
By Nat
December 10, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this
From Ken Rosenthal:
4:28 p.m. — Braves prepared to lose Smoltz
The Braves are prepared to lose right-hander John Smoltz as a free agent if another team offers him a significant guarantee on a one-year deal, according to a source with knowledge of the team’s thinking.
Smoltz, 41, has undergone five arm surgeries — four on his elbow, one on his shoulder last June. The Braves believe that his medical history warrants a contract with a low base salary and the chance to earn more through performance-based incentives.
Smoltz’s agents are circulating his medical records and recent video of him throwing off a mound to teams gathered at the winter meetings.
By CouldItBe
December 10, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this
From Rosenthal Braves prepared to lose Smoltz The Braves are prepared to lose right-hander John Smoltz as a free agent if another team offers him a significant guarantee on a one-year deal, according to a source with knowledge of the team’s thinking.
Smoltz, 41, has undergone five arm surgeries — four on his elbow, one on his shoulder last June. The Braves believe that his medical history warrants a contract with a low base salary and the chance to earn more through performance-based incentives.
Smoltz’s agents are circulating his medical records and recent video of him throwing off a mound to teams gathered at the winter meetings
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this
I believe Glavine, Maddux, and Smoltz will all wear a Braves cap once all are inducted into the HOF.
Glavine won 2 Cy Young awards with us and left in an epic clash of giant egos. He was voted union rep and did his job. It wasn’t pleasant, but he did what he was elected to do.But he wanted to return and he did for less money.
Glavine and his very real 1-0 WS clinching performance certainly belong in the same sentence and Smoltz and his playoff win record.
By nolie
December 10, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this
I even found a Smoltz To Mets write-up out there in ether space. That would be a low blow huh?
By BravesFanInRockies
December 10, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
AdirondackDave,
Agree with your 4:29 entirely.
The Yanks better plan on getting lots of money from the YES network, because I wouldn’t be surprised to see lots of empty seats in the new ballpark by mid-summer. Unless the club discounts tickets like crazy (as the Rockies do out here) just to put butts in the seats.
If the checks haven’t cleared to pay for all those luxury boxes and premium seats, at least some of them may sit vacant. What CEO in its right mind would pay tens of thousands of bucks in this economy for baseball tickets?
Forgive me for saying it, but Lou Vales may have been onto something.
By Mark
December 10, 2008 4:41 PM | Link to this
On talkingchop.com that have this:
The Kansas City Royals re-claimed Jairo Cuevas off outright waivers from the Atlanta Braves.
This opens up a spot on the 40 man roster…..could something be happening soon?
By U Know who
December 10, 2008 4:41 PM | Link to this
Whasup everybody. Thanks for all of the questions. I will try and answer as many of them that I can. As for A.J., dude hurry up and sign,and let’s get started thinking about the postseason.
DOB,dude, you know I can’t tell the whole story on here. lol
By Anders
December 10, 2008 4:42 PM | Link to this
Boras is asking for 5 years 70 million for Oliver Perez…. What a Joke.
If that’s true, consider it a gift to the Braves. I could see the Yanks taking this deal over the Burnett one. CC, Wang, Perez, Joba and Hughes. That could be scary if Joba and Hughes really pan out. Yanks won’t quibble over $10 mil to have a guy who has been healthy and BTW is Lefty which always helps in Yankee land ( The new park has the same short porch).
By skull
December 10, 2008 4:42 PM | Link to this
Thundersticks I’d be willing to bet that Wren has a trade in place for LF but can’t pull the trigger on it until he lands his ace. My guess would be for Jose Guillen in a salary dump.
Jose is considered a major head case, a clubhouse cancer, as bad as Barry was in the clubhouse.
Why would we want him? Look at his record, he’s been with more teams than Hefner’s been with bunnies!
By nolie
December 10, 2008 4:42 PM | Link to this
I have trouble believing that the extra year and $$ made all the difference for CC. He has known for 2 years what kind of offers would await him from New York this off-season. BrantA
from what I understand the contract has an opt-out clause for him after 3 years. and supposedly that was the deal-maker. Haven’t seen the official terms yet to know if that is really true.
By Ryan H
December 10, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this
It is amazing how little info we are hearing about atl coming from the meetings. Don’t we need a LF? GEEEZZ
By Dan
December 10, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this
If the Braves present a fair offer, hopefully Smoltz would honor their loyalty and accept the offer, even if it means taking slightly less money than he would get (guaranteed) from another team.
I have a sneaky suspicion that Smoltz would not shy away from a heavily laden performance based contract. Check that….He would gladly accept such a challenge.
By Glen W
December 10, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this
Ryan H - are you kidding? little info? the AJ stuff is really progressing… and SP is the priority, I think DOB had stated that the Braves are unlikely to make a move for a hitter until the pitching needs are filled… they will need to see what that have to work with after settling the rotation.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this
People Yeah, its NOT U Know Who, he didnt answer DOB’s question because he doesnt know the answer. Please stop acting like its Chipper, because its not.
By Ron_Paul
December 10, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this
BBFCFM
that was a great flickr photo!! Many laughs!!
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this
Nothing more enjoyable than hearing about George or one of the George juniors ranting during or after another no-ring season AdirondackDave
So true, so true!
But I don’t blame the Yankees, I blame all of the owners who allowed the system to become what it has. They are up against the most formidable union in the country and lose every time.
I admire the Yankees in a way. They play in the system baseball has and they want to win.There are other owners who are richer than Steinbrenner, but they are willing to put the $$$ on the line.They want a player the go after him, it’s a beautiful thing for Yankee fans I would imagine.
If Ted had bought Time Warner instead of the other way around, I would imagine none of us would be grousing much as the Braves would certainly have a larger payroll and would have gone after Sabathia.
The Braves and other teams could’ve have signed Sabathia but decided not to.The Braves do not have the revenue stream of the Yankees but they do generate revenue beyond just ticket sales.They had philosophical, as much as financial reasons for not pursuing Sabathia.
The Yankees are as aggressive an sports organization as there is and most fans, down deep, would like to see the same from their teams as well.
By Steve from OH
December 10, 2008 4:59 PM | Link to this
I hope the open 40-man roster spot goes to Burnett. I can’t see the Braves taking anyone in the rule V draft. I would’ve maybe said Donald Veal, but with O’Flahrety and Logan in the fold and an offer out to Ohman, I don’t see why they would…
By GB
December 10, 2008 4:59 PM | Link to this
U Know who- Don’t let ‘em trade KJ
By Ryan H
December 10, 2008 5:01 PM | Link to this
Glen W — Other than the AJ stuff, there is nothing. FW should be making his plans, his plan B, etc. Not just sitting there waiting on AJ’s answer. Not saying he is doing that, but it is just amazing that we hear nothing else related to the braves coming out of vegas.
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 5:03 PM | Link to this
You guys know Smoltz wants to remain a brave so chill out on all that. Wait till the bravos offer before assuming the worst. Looks like Peavy might still yet end up in pinstripes. At least it will get him out of the NL if the braves can’t be his destination. AJ’s contract is very steep, so Mr. O’Brien who would be available next year via FA in case we missed out on AJ? Anyone ace material there if we wanted to save money and build for 2010? Most likely we can’t legitimately contend in 09 so why not save money and build a powerhouse for 2010 and beyond? Pitching wins unless you are the Padres of 05 and 06. You have to have a few bats mixed in, all the more reason to save up the farm and money.
By BBFCFM
December 10, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this
Ron_Paul
No problem! here to please
By brent a.
December 10, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this
nolie,
thanks. opt out after 3 years, interesting.
I had heard the Brewers were including something similar in their proposal, but did not know that the Yankees would even consider such a deal.
Kind of strange to think about them both A) extending the length of the contract, and B) adding an early-out clause.
Best of both worlds for CC.
By Mark
December 10, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this
The Braves will guarantee A.J. Burnett a fifth year, and the Yankees are now going to revise their offer.
There’s a good chance that the bidding will exceed the total value of Carlos Zambrano’s extension ($91.5M over five years) with the Cubs.
MLB
By Jonathon
December 10, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this
Yankees are now revising their offer after Braves guarantee 5th year and offer $80 million. Folks, it’s over. The Yankees are going over $90. The writing is on the wall. They are going to pay whatever they have to pay to get Sabathia AND Burnett. It’s been decided. There’s really nothing we can do at this point. The Yankees simply play under a different set of rules from the rest of baseball. I’m going to puke.
By couldItBe
December 10, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this
From Keith Law The Braves will guarantee A.J. Burnett a fifth year, and the Yankees are now going to revise their offer.
There’s a good chance that the bidding will exceed the total value of Carlos Zambrano’s extension ($91.5M over five years) with the Cubs.
By Braveheart
December 10, 2008 5:13 PM | Link to this
I even found a Smoltz To Mets write-up out there in ether space. That would be a low blow huh?
Nah, we’d just kick the sh!t out of Smoltz like we did to Glavine in his first two years as a Met. Maybe we should let Smoltz go to the Mets. He could go over there and be a double agent of sorts like Glavine was. He could even tank the last game of the season like Glavine did and sabotage their whole season. Then he could tell them he if he was a Brave, he’d be devastated. But since he’s just a Met, he’s merely disappointed. Smoltz sucking in a big game for the Mets would hurt them way more than Glavine sucking in a big game did ‘cause that’s Smoltz’s thing: big games.
By Matt
December 10, 2008 5:15 PM | Link to this
U Know Who, you’re a figgin loser!!!
By U Know who
December 10, 2008 4:41 PM | Link to this
Whasup everybody. Thanks for all of the questions. I will try and answer as many of them that I can. As for A.J., dude hurry up and sign,and let’s get started thinking about the postseason.
DOB,dude, you know I can’t tell the whole story on here. lol
**Like Chipper would say any of that BS on a blog …
By Jonathon
December 10, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this
From Rosenthal:
4:28 p.m. — Braves prepared to lose Smoltz The Braves are prepared to lose right-hander John Smoltz as a free agent if another team offers him a significant guarantee on a one-year deal, according to a source with knowledge of the team’s thinking.
Smoltz, 41, has undergone five arm surgeries — four on his elbow, one on his shoulder last June. The Braves believe that his medical history warrants a contract with a low base salary and the chance to earn more through performance-based incentives.
Smoltz’s agents are circulating his medical records and recent video of him throwing off a mound to teams gathered at the winter meetings.
By Ace
December 10, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this
Frequent reader, infrequent poster here.
Could you guys figure out a way to put U Know Who’s heading in bold? No offense to anyone else… but I often don’t have the time to read every comment.
By MJ
December 10, 2008 5:21 PM | Link to this
Well this is not good, the Braves are now in a bidding war w/ the Yankees and last I checked Cashman has deeper pockets than Wren.
Speaking of which, what a great job Cashman has…give a guy as many blank checks as he wants, which is not his money mind you, he basicly signs whatever high profile free agent he wants and he gets sell and live in the greatest city in the world which is NYC. Where do I sign up!?
By eric in albany
December 10, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this
i keep hearing on mad dog unleashed on sirius that the yankees are deep in talks with lowe. i keep getting very excited about A.J. getting linked to the braves. but being a braves fan i can not count on this signing actually happining…
every time i hear about other teams and what they are doing. none are as close related to AJ as the braves are…
i start getting excited
i hear all the talk about the yankees and C.C. and now going after lowe. putting AJ 3rd on the list.
i hear the braves up-ing the offer to AJ to 5 yrs.
and i cant help but think its but a done deal.
so i get excited again.
then i remember… its the braves… and i remember this is exactly what i thought about jake peavy.
Please please please let this deal happen!
By 18 Wheels of Love
December 10, 2008 5:25 PM | Link to this
Hey Chip,
Same with you…don’t you go anywhere else before you hang ‘em up. Seriously.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this
ACE its NOT U Know Who!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By Nocturnal Owl
December 10, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this
CHIPPER is that you? Smoltzie will not go anywhere. Rosenthal is jumping the gun on this story…
By Lew
December 10, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this
Chipper-I’ve got a question for you that you can definitely answer-where did you have me send the deer painting?
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 5:28 PM | Link to this
Folks, it’s over. The Yankees are going over $90. The writing is on the wall. Jonathon
How do you know? Are you privy to the negotiations? If not, then why don;t you just let the parties involved tell us really what’s going on.
Thanks
By Murphy
December 10, 2008 5:28 PM | Link to this
I gotta a little more faith that THIS U Kno Who is the real Chipper. Congrats on your outstanding season last year!
By ShawnB
December 10, 2008 5:29 PM | Link to this
Baseball economics are such a joke. Yankees paying, reportedly, over $50 million more than the next best offer to Sabathia, and now are about to throw close to $100 million to Burnette. And they still plan to sign another FA pitcher after him. Wake up baseball, this is the reason why the NFL has passed you in popularity in this country. Nobody likes witnessing such a blatantly stacked deck.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who: Smoltzie is a little irked with this report saying he’s considering the Mets
HA! I’ve heard talks about how vigilant Lasorda was as a manager. That he would discipline his players to “hate the Giants” as the Dodgers have always hated the Giants. Any such talk from Bobby like that about those filthy, filthy Mets?
This too is probably something not apt for public posting.
By Joe M.
December 10, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this
Hope that 5 years, 91 million for Burnett like C. Zambrano got from the Cubs is some BS leaked by his agent.
By Eware
December 10, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who, how did you and Smoltz feel about that Houston tribute to Craig Biggio a year or two ago? That’s gotta be something that every big leaguer in your position looks forward to.
We want and need you guys to stick around.
Smoltz to the Mets…come on, that one’s just absurd.
By nolie
December 10, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this
thanks. opt out after 3 years, interesting Brent A
Like i said we haven’t seen the contract final form obviously, so not positive about that , but I have seen several references to it. Maybe Dave has heard something out there.
On another subject, if the Yanks really have upped the offer over our last one, it is likely time to bail on AJ. Looks like the rumors that they are gonna try to sign three SPs might have some fact to them. Bah !
By flylikeeagle05
December 10, 2008 5:33 PM | Link to this
I hate the Yankees.. they are certainly an evil empire. I hope they miss the playoffs again.
By Braveheart
December 10, 2008 5:37 PM | Link to this
Speaking of which, what a great job Cashman has…give a guy as many blank checks as he wants, which is not his money mind you, he basicly signs whatever high profile free agent he wants and he gets sell and live in the greatest city in the world which is NYC
Don’t forget that Cashman also gets too much credit for what Gene Michael,.Bob Watson, Buck Showalter. Joe Torre and Steinbrenner built, bought and maintained and that the only reason he got that job and has never been fired even though he never wins anything with all that money is because his daddy is good friends with Steinbrenner.
By Joe M.
December 10, 2008 5:39 PM | Link to this
I hate asking a question like this, but what could it hurt?
Chipper: do you prefer Kelly Johnson or Martin Prado as the starting everyday Atlanta Braves second baseman next season?
By Corey
December 10, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this
ESPN’s Keith Law reporting that Yankees are revising their offer for Burnett. He expects it to surpass Carlos Zambrano’s contract (5 years - 91.5 million).
I’m afraid Jake Peavy was our one shot at a true ace. Wren should have got that done. For those who don’t know, take a look at the 2009 salaries of: Peavy (11 million) & Vazquez (11.5 million). Peavy’s goes up substantially after that, and if the 5th year option was picked up he would average something like 17 per, but Oliver Perez is asking for 5 years @ 14 per folks!
By Lew
December 10, 2008 5:42 PM | Link to this
Chipper-Better yet and more definitive-what is the first letter of your street address where I sent the deer?
By GB
December 10, 2008 5:43 PM | Link to this
Talked to about 5 or 6 of my customers this week who have either lost their jobs or who have been cut back on their hours. 160 milllion? 80 million? Makes me kinda sick.
By ChampBurrows
December 10, 2008 5:44 PM | Link to this
DOB thanks for stopping by the Bill Shanks Show good to hear you on the radio, hey if that really is you Chipper, thanks for being a class act and fierce ball player your entire career that will no doubt land you where you belong in the Hall Of Fame!
By Epinephrine
December 10, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this
No offense DOB but it is already on the interwebs that Chipper wears four pairs of sliding shorts. Might want to ask a different question.
By Epinephrine
December 10, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this
Also the fact the MLBTR picked this story up shows how much credibility we should be putting in there stories.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this
Four pairs of sliding shorts… isn’t it?
By chris
December 10, 2008 5:48 PM | Link to this
hey dave, I know that question even. lol four pairs of socks to support the bottom of his feet.
By Nocturnal Owl
December 10, 2008 5:48 PM | Link to this
Chipper how does that shoulder feel? Any insights on next season. Hows hunting with Adam LaRoche this offseason???
By Andy K.
December 10, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
DOB is it possible to get Chipper’s posting label in solid blue, like yours, to prevent impostors? That way, we don’t have to ask him questions every time he pops in, to figure out if it’s him or not
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
And now that my post is submitted and posted, I realize the creepiness of the knowledge of such, correct or not. But I remember DOB writing something about it within the last year.
By caz1158
December 10, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
Sorry Braves Fans (me included), I hope we don’t sign AJ! He’s injury prone,last year was a contract year so throw that out. And he’ll be 37 in his last year of the 5 year deal reported. Me,I’m willing to let our farm system do it’s job.5 years/80 mil for an injury prone pitcher is not a good business decision. If so why not Ben Sheets? Lets not blow the bank on a question mark.
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
DOB, couldn’t you just call and ask if it is him?
By brent a.
December 10, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
I have to believe that the Braves are only “prepared to lose Smoltz” if they are able to accomplish some or most of their other off-season priorities.
How in the world could the Braves a) strike out on Peavy, B) strike out on Burnett, C) strike out on any other top tier pitcher
and still allow smoltz to leave because one team decides to guarantee him a decent salary for 1 year?
It doesn’t make sense.
Plus, we don’t even know if Smoltz can pitch this season. He could get 8 - 12 weeks down the road, and his arm could fall off. So, what is the likelihood that some team comes in and offers him a guaranteed $7-8 million per year, before the Braves have had a chance to get their ducks in a row?
To add insult to injury if Smoltz left - Hampton left us to be closer to his children, and Smoltz would be leaving us despite the fact that his children are here in Atlanta.
It all makes perfect sense.
In short, if we lose Smoltz, then I have to believe that some other very good things will have happened.
It will really be depressing if we have a rotation of
JJ/Glavine/Vazquez/Morton/Hanson
Yikes!
(Won’t happen).
By Randy S
December 10, 2008 5:50 PM | Link to this
Don’t think that question will prove it. It has already been reported that Chip wears 4 pairs of sliding shorts.
By It aint u kno who
December 10, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this
It’s pretty common knowledge that he wears 4 pairs of sliding shorts.
By Steve from OH
December 10, 2008 5:52 PM | Link to this
What’s FW supposed to do? Grab AJ’s hand and force him to sign on the dotted line? C’mon folks, if FW is offering 5/80, that’s one heck of an offer, especially from a pretty conservative Atlanta organization.
By Andy K.
December 10, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who, thanks for giving A.J. that recruiting call. Bowman just told us at the end of one of his articles.
By proeye
December 10, 2008 5:54 PM | Link to this
hello
By ppaddy123
December 10, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this
IDIOTS WHAT A BUNCH OF IDIOTS! Now the guys that run mlbtraderumors.com have it rumored that Chipper (U KNO WHO) has been on here talking about Smoltz. We can all see DOB isn’t convinced it’s Chipper, but now it’s out there. I think sometimes the best news is no news. We all come here to participate. Please…..let’s use some common sense.
By chris
December 10, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this
underwear? lol oh ok didn’t know about that (thank goodness) lol
By ncscoots
December 10, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this
I’m guessing some of our most virulent Yankee-haters probably didn’t mind too much when the Braves were throwing Ted’s money around. Some forget that the Braves, at times, had one of the top few payrolls in baseball.
I mean, what do you want the Yankees to do? Squirrel the profits away under the mattress? Try to be less profitable? Decide that “$40MM is good enough for the Royals, it’s good enough for us”? Please.
They are a highly successful franchise, and they pour money back into the product. Unlike some teams that take revenue-sharing and luxury-tax dollars and put them to the bottom line (and the owner’s pocket), instead of players and development.
I don’t particularly like the way NYY can corner the market with dollars, but, listen, they operate under the same rules as the other 29 teams. And I can’t knock a company for reaping the benefits of being successful. Hey, that’s America.
By proeye
December 10, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this
We need Smoltzie!
By Austin from So IL
December 10, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this
Hey guys, I just want to wish the Braves the best of luck next season. While I am a Cards fan, I would much rather see you guys end up with Burnett than the Yankess.
Good luck and please win the NL East!
By Epinephrine
December 10, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this
Tenn Paul if you just do a google search for “Chipper Jones” and “four pairs of” it comes right up, so it’s out there.
By WhiteMike
December 10, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this
Hey Chipper, I know your a Florida guy, so give me your take on the Florida and OU matchup. Can the Gators really stop Sam Bradford and that offense?
By brian
December 10, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this
the Braves are not going to lose Smoltz. Smoltz wants a 1 year guaranteed contract and probably would like it now. His agent is just getting the Braves attention while making sure John gets what he deserves. They also need to cover their bases in the unlikely event the Braves said no thanks.
Smoltz will retire a Brave in an emotional, moving ceremony with a fitting tribute to this Hall of Fame pitcher.
Smoltz and Chipper each have the opportunity for their Biggio moment and they are not going to throw it away this late in their career unless the Braves do something stupid. Frank Wren is not stupid
By Devin
December 10, 2008 5:57 PM | Link to this
Chipper,
Who’s the one pitcher, past or present, you hate(d) facing?
By nolie
December 10, 2008 5:57 PM | Link to this
Speaking of which, what a great job Cashman has MJ
and what an appropriate last name Cash-man
By chopper2chipper
December 10, 2008 5:57 PM | Link to this
How anyone can still doubt Smoltz is beyond me.
By caz1158
December 10, 2008 5:59 PM | Link to this
On Smoltz-Like all Braves Fans I’d hate to see him go. But I understand it would be a business decision. He loves Atlanta. It’s hard to see sports figures in there waning years,you hope they stick arround forever. But just like Maddux showed us,that day may be sooner than later! Glavine too. Boy what a run!
By bernie
December 10, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this
Ain’t nobody worth 161 million for seven years. Sure the Yanks have more money than sense but with the contract they gave CC he’ll just become another superstar on a Yankee team that I hope they will finish no better than third place in the division. Remember Yankees money will not buy you a championship but players with heart will win a championship. Remember the Rays in 2008 Yanks. Go Red Sox or anybody but the Yanks.
By Andre
December 10, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this
They should have got Peavy when they had the chance. AJ will be just as good
By Austin from So IL
December 10, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this
Forgot to mention, U Kno Who, that was one hell of a season. Congratulations!
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this
The “U Kno Who” stuff is hilarious. We’ve even got MLB Trade Rumors paying attention to us:
John Smoltz Rumors
By Tim Dierkes [December 10 at 4:38pm CST]
4:38pm: Chipper Jones popped onto Dave O’Brien’s blog under the handle U Kno Who (unless it’s an imposter), mentioning that Smoltz is irked by the link to the Mets and isn’t going anywhere.
(You’re right, Epinephrine. At least the folks at MLB Trade Rumors provide links to different sites. It’s not just their own made-up stuff.)
By The obvious
December 10, 2008 6:03 PM | Link to this
Why can’t DOB call Chipper and ask if it is him?
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 6:03 PM | Link to this
I was correct. And not the only one who knew…
DOB, but the whiskey down, back away from the craps table and come up with a more vetting question. You’re dealing with Braves fans here. Not your average, run of the mill, Vegas night trippers…. and I used to be one of those back in the day. Vegas baby! Vegas!. That’s a long drive from the LBC. But once you hit Zyzzx you know it isn’t far. You start to see the bright beacon of the Luxor
By PTBNL
December 10, 2008 6:03 PM | Link to this
Those of you who say “Wren should have gotten the job done for Peavy”, have you ever tried to have a conversation with a wall? Or better yet, have ever tried to catch wind in your hand? Once you grasp something in your hand, it is wind no more! It seems that this is what the negotiations with the Padres was like. It was not just a matter of how much they asked for, though that was getting to the point of ridiculous, too, but it was also a matter of shifting sand. The Padres asked for something, Wren gave them what they asked. But then they changed their mind and wanted something different. This kept happening… over and over. How do you deal (negotiate) with that? It is nothing but a circus…. IF indeed it was like what Wren has described. So… the best thing to do is get out of the circus. If there was or is any chance of the Braves actually getting Peavy, this whole thing would have been handled differently OR the Padres would revisit the trade possibilities with the Braves. It takes more than one team to “negotiate”. It is unreasonable to put this on Wren as though he was unwilling to negotiate for the trade…. as though he was not willing to give the Padres something that is more than reasonable in return for Peavy. No one (other than a select few) knows what was actually offered. So how can we judge the negotiations with such a state of ignorance?
By safebet
December 10, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this
I LIKE THE THIUGHT OF SMOLTZ VASQUEZ JJ REYES MORTON. WITH BENNET HANSON PARR READY IF NEEDED… THEY ALL HAD SOME SOLID GAMES AGAINST GOOD TEAMS.
By proeye
December 10, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this
DOB… The system needs revamping. I can post under any name.
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who, if it is really you, thanks for being a true Atlanta Brave and are you gonna finish your career here in Atlanta?
By Bob Dole
December 10, 2008 6:05 PM | Link to this
What do you mean or you will be joining him soon?
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 6:05 PM | Link to this
I have solid evidence that A.J. Burnett has just signed with the St. Louis Cardinals for six years, $90.
(The $90 was a typo that Burnett and his agent overlooked.)
Congrats on the new contract, A.J.
By Shamus
December 10, 2008 6:06 PM | Link to this
U kno Wo, you are a doosh baggolo!
The Braves stank a big black dank.
Yankees 27 in 2009!
By Don!
December 10, 2008 6:06 PM | Link to this
I’ll say this — and I’ve been a Braves fan since both the team and I arrived in Atlanta …
If Smoltz signs with the Red Sox or anyone other than the Braves, I’ll put every Braves jersey I own, and every other MLB item I’ve collected in a box for Goodwill — and never watch another MLB game again.
My kids have already grown away from baseball because of the late start times and watching their favorite players leave the Braves — mostly Glavine, and to some extent AJ. Watching my 10-year-old boy literally cry because his favorite player now plays for the Mets was tough — and Tommy’s even coming back to the Braves wasn’t enough for him to recapture his love of pro baseball.
In my case, I feel the same about Smoltz. If he goes, I go.
Later,
Don!
By geauxbraves2000
December 10, 2008 6:06 PM | Link to this
If the Yankees really want Burnett, there is no way the Braves are going to outbid them. They are going to ruin this game. I know a cap would probably never get by the players union, but come on, this is ludicrous.
Geaux Braves!!
By Chris
December 10, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this
yea smoltzie will be back, if not, it wouldnt make much sense. lol wish you could guarentee burnett in a braves uni hoss. but we’ll see how that goes
By Chris
December 10, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this
yea smoltzie will be back, if not, it wouldnt make much sense. lol wish you could guarentee burnett in a braves uni hoss. but we’ll see how that goes
By Braindawg
December 10, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this
Smoltz is the man. As a Braves lifetime fan, I will support Smoltz no matter where he goes. Ive been a Braves fan since the mid 70’s, Ive sat through the 100 loss seasons, and watched Smoltz lead us into championships, and make us a force in baseball. All i want to say is Thanks John!!!!!
By U Kno Who
December 10, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this
fd
By N8
December 10, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this
I’m officially going on record right now, stating that if Wren lets Smoltz walk, I’M DONE following this team.
It’s that simple. The man (and the fans) deserve to have him finish his career with the Braves. Period.
If it means trading Soriano in a salary dump to make up the cash, DO IT.
Ridiculous is the only word to describe that situation if it’s even true.
If Wren is simply posturing to gain leverage against Smoltz, he’s making a huge mistake with the fan base.
Everybody talks about loyalty when referring to Hampton, and how he should have stayed with the Braves for little to nothing to make up for the wasted money paid to him after his first year with the Braves.
There isn’t a dollar amount that could be given to Smoltz to re-pay him for the joy that he has brought this fan base.
Now, if Smoltz was DEMANDING top dollar (say 18-20 million for a guaranteed one year deal), that is a different story. Wren’s got a team to put together.
But if LM can’t give Smoltz (and the fans) the reward of remaining a Brave til the end, AND allowing Wren his normal budget, then they might as well NOT BOTHER with Glavine and Chipper should be dumped as well. Tell Bobby to stay home, and certainly trade Francoeur.
Because allowing Smoltz to walk, not only is a slap in the face, he might be our last shot at a legitimate ACE for this rotation if he’s healthy that actually WANTS TO PITCH FOR THE BRAVES!!! Nobody else seems to want to.
Damn, the past 7 weeks or so have been more painful than the last 2 months of the season were.
DOB
Do you still think it’s too early to be worrying about the Braves filling needs with legitmate players ready to help them compete?
By U Kno Who
December 10, 2008 6:08 PM | Link to this
Javier Vasquez is totally an ace.
By Steve from OH
December 10, 2008 6:08 PM | Link to this
Yes, it seems as though a simple “hey bro, you bloggin’?” text message might be appropriate right now.
By MVH
December 10, 2008 6:09 PM | Link to this
We gotta get this sorted out, which one is Chipper? And Chipper, not saying you would, but I’d probably get p** at this other dude and stop talking if I was you. But please, don’t do that, we really enjoy your comments - makes for a good finals study break.
By Tomas
December 10, 2008 6:10 PM | Link to this
If he is able to pitch the braves will offer smoltz a one year contract. And he obviously would prefer to finish his career in the only team he has ever played for. I really doubt any team would offer Smoltz a contract right now. They’re just waiting to see how his rehab goes, just like the braves.
By Apollo
December 10, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this
“He will be back in a Braves uniform or I will be joining him soon.”
Chipper….don’t say stuff like that! Hey, you’re like my hero, but anyway, could you comment on A.J. and what signing him would mean for the Braves, both long term and short term, especially considering the awesome talent the Braves have coming up on the farm?
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this
Looks like it’s time to get Chipper his own sign in credentials.
By BA
December 10, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this
Damn, Hoss on the ol’ DOB blog. Like anybody REALLY thought the Bearded Icon would go to the Mutts….
By stamper
December 10, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this
this is getting ridiculous.
do we trust the U Kno Who who has a bad memory or… do we trust the U Kno Who who can’t spell ‘guarantee’?
i say… we let them settle this in a game of paper/rocks/scissors: the winner gets to be the real U Kno Who. The other has to go away indefinitely.
may the best man win.
By SteveInRaleigh
December 10, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this
I wonder what happens if we don’t get any pitchers and lose Smoltz? Start rebuilding? Trade veterans Marlins style?
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this
The Braves are not going to end up with any of the top pitchers or a legit power hitting OF. there’s always 2010.
By proeye
December 10, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this
Appreciate you coming on here Chipper… Hope that’s you.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this
N8
Amen to all you said…Nix the whole booing thing, I co-sign everything you just said man. That was the whole point I was trying to make…If Smoltz goes to another team I will be violently disgusted and end my baseball loving days rapidly…
By Tomas
December 10, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who goes hunting
By Carroll Rogers | Thursday, September 18, 2008, 11:10 AM
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Everybody on this blog knows the talents and versatility of a certain “U Kno Who.” That he can pop up in unexpected places and engage us in ways we didn’t expect.*
Well, it’s not just blogging, folks. Our friendly neighborhood third baseman has a new hunting video out, and I just happened to get my hands on it.
By N8
December 10, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
scoots
“I’m guessing some of our most virulent Yankee-haters probably didn’t mind too much when the Braves were throwing Ted’s money around. Some forget that the Braves, at times, had one of the top few payrolls in baseball.”
I agree with you. Until there is a salary cap, the Yankees are free to do what they want with their money. If the other owners are so tired of it…..DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!
But when comparing what the Yankees are doing to what the Braves did in the past with Ted’s money, watch yourself, the scenarios aren’t even close.
First of all the free agents that started the run (Bream and Pendelton) were cast-offs that there previous teams (and nobody else) wanted.
2nd, the ONLY guy that was ever really gone after hard core, was Greg Maddux. In fact, he took less money (than the Yankees offered), to team up with Smoltz, Glavine and Avery.
McGriff was a trade and subsequently re-signed (at below market value), with the Braves.
EVERYBODY ELSE pre-1998 when the went after the Big Cat, that was given top dollars, were their own guys they drafted, developed or traded for when they were minor leaguers (Smoltz).
BIG DIFFERENCE in paying your own players, rewarding them for a job well done, than cornering the market with monopoly money during free agency. BIG DIFFERENCE.
In fact, until a few years ago, the Yankees were pretty good at paying their own guys too, with the occasional veteran guy at the end of his career being bought to fill a bench roll, bullpen spot of back of the rotation/depth guy.
Not until their string of WS ended in the 90’s, did they start going crazy in free agency or taking on every HUGE contract that the other teams wanted to dump. Ironically, they haven’t won a DAMN thing since they started doing that.
Which is WHY the other owners just laugh and let them keep over-spending for losers.
By Aaron
December 10, 2008 6:17 PM | Link to this
Lol gotta agree, this all keeps me from studying like i should
By Ritchie from Scotland
December 10, 2008 6:17 PM | Link to this
I’m quite shocked somebody, possibly even a fan of the Braves, would bother coming onto a blog and pretending to be Chipper. Maybe one was and fair play to the guy for taking time out to comment on a blog, whether it was now or in the past. The immaturity of the imposter(s) shocks me a little.
By brent a.
December 10, 2008 6:17 PM | Link to this
I don’t hate the New York Yankees for spending money.
I hate that the major league baseball system allows this to happen.
Not everyone can do what the Yankees are doing, plain and simple, the money just isn’t there.
The Yankees can do it, and to a certain extent, should do it; but, it doesn’t mean that I have to like it, and it doesn’t mean that I am going to criticize my own team for not doing it, or not being able to do it.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 6:17 PM | Link to this
It wasn’t Chipper. I just talked to him on the phone.
Very uncool, posting as U Kno Who. Bad form on the old blog.
By stamper
December 10, 2008 6:17 PM | Link to this
i hope the idiot pretending to be chipper is enjoying himself. it takes comic brilliance to come into a baseball forum and impersonate someone else. oh how do you come up with this cleverness?
you’re a tool.
By Tomas
December 10, 2008 6:18 PM | Link to this
i happen to have just talked to FW and he tells me that AJ will sign our deal tomorrow morning when the meetings enter the final day.
If this happens then I’ll believe you’re Chipper.
By Deep Throat
December 10, 2008 6:19 PM | Link to this
i happen to have just talked to FW and he tells me that AJ will sign our deal tomorrow morning when the meetings enter the final day
Javier Vasquez is totally an ace.
Oh man, you had people here and at MLBTradeRumors believing you and you blew it and now that trade rumors site has removed your Smoltz post. You pushed the envelope and blew your credibility.
(Unless the original was really Chipper and a recent person came by and is faking. Someone get the real Chipper a David O’Brien, password-protected name.)
By LTBravesFan
December 10, 2008 6:19 PM | Link to this
Chipper, have you seen Tommy Hanson pitch yet?
how nasty is he on a scale of 1 to 10?
By safebet
December 10, 2008 6:20 PM | Link to this
U KNOW WHO: YOU might be just talking but i do think Javy will have his best year to date as a pro.
By PopeVanIII
December 10, 2008 6:20 PM | Link to this
It’s really a shame that the U Kno Who name has been compromised by a bunch of losers. The MLBTR link couldn’t have helped. Couldn’t AJC peeps do something to prevent that? Chipper’s contributions are a resource to be protected!
By Mike Honcho
December 10, 2008 6:20 PM | Link to this
Hey Chipper, any truth to the rumor out there that Chuck Norris facts were orignally about you?
Because, and I’m going to be frank here, I’ve heard that Chipper Jones can kill two stones with one bird.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 6:21 PM | Link to this
Anybody with common sense and any slight knowledge (1% of knowledge on Chipper) knows A) Chipper does not act like an immature 13 year old and B) Would have kindly answered DOB’s question along with other random facts that only Chipper would know to prove his validity and then say..Good enough Dave?? Like the last time he was on here…SO PLEASE stop asking questions and buying into this until the real Chipper comes on and spits random facts that prove so and once DOB says “YES ALL ITS HOSS” then avoid the 11 year old impersenator who thinks this is even remotely funny…Its annoyingly pathetic and I feel sorry for the people who got excited and genuinely believed it.
By U Kno Who
December 10, 2008 6:22 PM | Link to this
Signing AJ would be a great addition to the Braves and I’m sure he would go along way to putting us over the top.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 6:23 PM | Link to this
By the way, Chipper said he’s been working out a lot, lifting weights in the gym he had installed at his house and, for the first time in his career, running on a treadmill. Has been running a mile a day for the past week.
Said he’s getting more muscular without putting on any weight, still about 220 but bigger. Shoulder feels good, no problems. Hasn’t started throwing or hitting, but said he can simulate throws with no discomfort.
Also, he doesn’t sound too confident about Braves getting A.J., though hopeful. He talked to A.J. a week or two ago.
By eric in albany
December 10, 2008 6:23 PM | Link to this
Im starting te get real angry about this C.C. Signing. the yankees want over 300mill in tax free bonds from the city to help in the construction of the new Stadium. at the same time they sign C.C. now they offer lowe over 68 mill over 4 years. and the most greed laced part of this whole thing is that on top of those 2 top free agent pitchers, they are driving the price of the only guy the braves have a chance of getting to save the future of the team. The yankees already have a good pitching staff as it is. they will soon have 6/7 starters when other teams are lucky if they can find 4 who really should be in the big leagues
what happened to the bad economy?
By DannyFish
December 10, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this
U Know Who
How many games do you expect to play this year? 130? 150?
Also, how is Frenchy dealing with his name coming up in trade rumors? It must be tough going from hometown golden boy to trade bait.
Either way, assuming this is the real UKW good luck this season! And if it isn’t…good luck in whatever you do.
By chopper2chipper
December 10, 2008 6:27 PM | Link to this
Just because the Yankees are in it isn’t the end of the world. Don’t forget that guys like Chipper & Smoltz have taken less money to play for us (one reason I am so proud to be a fan of this team).
I live in Boston and would probably cry if Smoltz went to the Red Sox, but I know that there’s no way that the Braves would be foolish enough to let him leave.
By Andy K.
December 10, 2008 6:27 PM | Link to this
Whoever is impersonating Chipper Jones, you’re a horrible person. I put fourth a motion that we track down this dude’s IP Address, and exile him from Braves Nation and the DOB blogs forever.
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 6:28 PM | Link to this
Thanks, DOB, for checking with Chipper. Geez, what kind of loser does phony stuff like that? Pathetic.
By proeye
December 10, 2008 6:28 PM | Link to this
DOB, please have your webmaster fix the forum so we don’t get any more of these “U Kno Who“‘s showing up. Thanks.
By Apollo
December 10, 2008 6:28 PM | Link to this
That was horrible……whoever that “U Kno Who” was almost made my day…until he ruined it.
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 6:29 PM | Link to this
Thanks DOB, that is why you rule. And to the imposter, you suck and we never believed you.
Chop Chop, you have any proof for your cards comment? I think you are full of it and just trying to get something going. Here is my call of your bluff: [Boo Yah] (http://stlouis.cardinals.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081208&contentid=3706103&vkey=newsstl&fext=.jsp&c_id=stl)
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 6:29 PM | Link to this
Thanks DOB, that is why you rule. And to the imposter, you suck and we never believed you.
Chop Chop, you have any proof for your cards comment? I think you are full of it and just trying to get something going. Here is my call of your bluff: [Boo Yah] (http://stlouis.cardinals.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20081208&contentid=3706103&vkey=newsstl&fext=.jsp&c_id=stl)
By DannyFish
December 10, 2008 6:29 PM | Link to this
Damnit I tried to hold out!!!
I recant my post to U Kno Who!!!
Guess I got a little over excited.
By The Real Joebrave
December 10, 2008 6:30 PM | Link to this
Hey U Kno Who imposter, Chipper wears four pair of socks to help with the bunions DUMB@SS!!!
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 6:30 PM | Link to this
DOB - is there anything new on the offer or no offer from the Braves to AJ?
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 6:31 PM | Link to this
LTBravesFan: He’s for real, no doubt. Saw him pitch a game in the Fall League. He could hold his own right now in a major league rotation, even though he’s not pitched above Double-A.
By ncscoots
December 10, 2008 6:31 PM | Link to this
Wouldn’t we call impersonating a ballplayer on the blog a bannable offense? Smite that IP.
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this
that’s great.chipper not confident after talking to aj that aj is coming here. 2010? how about 2011? this team is going to finish in 4th again.
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 6:34 PM | Link to this
eric in albany,
If A.J. Burnett is the “only guy the braves have a chance of getting to save the future of the team,” then I submit that the future has already been lost.
By tennessejed
December 10, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
Frank Wren is going to have to start looking at plan “C”. There is no way in hell the Braves are going to outbid the Yankees, who reportedly have offered both Lowe AND Burnett deals, and are willing to pay whatever it takes to make sure they outbid every team that is interested. Supposedly, Burnett really wants to pitch for the Yankees anyway, so this is just a huge ploy stringing the Braves along to drive up the price. Maybe we should just forget about signing an ace now, stick with what we got, and hope that Hanson, Heyward and company are ready to play and contribute by 2010. Some of these salaries being paid (to injury prone pitchers) are outrageous and not worth it.
By fastasballs
December 10, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
I’m disappointed to see Smoltz ever be rumored to going to other teams. At the rate the Braves are going he may be the ACE in the rotation in 2009, well that is if they sign him.
For what he has done for this organization he should be offered a fair contract at the very least. He’s left more money on the table several times & pitched through more pain than most of have ever had to deal with.
While I’m thinking of it Chipper should get an extension as well. He’s up at the end of 2009 I believe. The Braves can’t sign anyone else, so may as well lock of the two fan favorites who have given the team the most the past 15 plus seasons & still have plenty left in the tank.
By DOB to Chitown
December 10, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
DOB talked to the imposter. We all know Chipper doesn’t workout in offseason. He saves that for the 40 games he sits out each yr.
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 6:37 PM | Link to this
Totally butchered that link….try again?
By Salty Dawg
December 10, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this
Someone get the real Chipper a David O’Brien, password-protected name.
Ditto. I don’t know how many major leaguers out there are cool enough to periodically post on a fan blog, but probably not many. The least AJC could do is set the guy up a locked user name. He’s not going to want to do it again if he has to jump through hoops to prove it’s him.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this
test
By Klesko12
December 10, 2008 6:40 PM | Link to this
I agree on a password for Chipper, but that sucks he talked to AJ 2 weeks ago and doesn’t feel too good about our chances, not good at all……
By Reddy
December 10, 2008 6:40 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Can’t you give the real Chipper a linked name like yours so this can’t happen again?
By brian
December 10, 2008 6:41 PM | Link to this
can you ban the chipper imposter from posting here again?
By KC
December 10, 2008 6:41 PM | Link to this
DOB: Did Chipper give any indication as to why he’s not confident that the Braves will land AJ?
Is it just because he thinks someone else will give him a ridiculous contract, or because AJ is leaning in a different direction for other reasons?
And does his lack of confidence (given that he’s friends with the guy) affect your opinion of the Braves odds? Do you still believe the Braves have better than a 50/50 chance?
By nolie
December 10, 2008 6:42 PM | Link to this
EVERYBODY ELSE pre-1998 when the went after the Big Cat, that was given top dollars, were their own guys they drafted, developed or traded for when they were minor leaguers (Smoltz) N8
what about Jordan? but yeah, you’re mostly right. they have never been a big free agent team. Not the same as the Yanks really
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 6:43 PM | Link to this
It wouldn’t hurt anything to start thinking Plan C or D now. If true, no AJ, and perhaps no Peavy, are not the end of the world or season.
Smoltz is an ace, he just will not be available for the entire season.
The Braves could do well with another solid starter and a run-producing bat and staying in the race until Smoltz returns.
If the Braves avoid another June Swoon, then they could be in the thing all season and make moves at the trade deadline.
No need to get too down, the offseason has a ways to go still.
By KC
December 10, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this
I’m afraid I don’t understand why it would be so hard to get Chipper his own special log-in (like the AJC writers have) to make his identity unmistakable when he blogs here.
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this
GSU-Lee,
The only proof I have that A.J. Burnett has signed with the St. Louis Cardinals for ninety dollars over six years is this:
I made it up.
Think about it:
Ninety bucks, man. It’s comedy.
By tennessejed
December 10, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this
Incognito,
I’m afraid I don’t see the Braves competing ANYTIME soon. They just don’t have the payroll that the Mets do, or the talent the Phillies do. If we are going to be able to contend within the next 5 years, it will be ala the Rays with high draft picks turning into gold for the future.
By john Fisher
December 10, 2008 6:45 PM | Link to this
HEY DOB,,
Why didnt Chipper sound “confident” about AJ?? i mean i consider us, the Braves, the frontrunner. And thanks for the answer about the past tense thing yesterday. it was confusing but i wasnt trying to insult you.
Thanks as always
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 6:45 PM | Link to this
at least we will compete with nats for last place
By eric in albany
December 10, 2008 6:46 PM | Link to this
Chop Chop~
He Gives us a better chance of making the play offs then the staff we have right now. smoltz and glavine wont get us in the post season. see also 2008. our staff could use a jump start is all im saying nad aj would be a jump start.
By Bob Dole
December 10, 2008 6:48 PM | Link to this
Hello i am former Senator Bob Dole, just wanting to say GO BRAVES!! you don’t need a pill like me to go big, you do it with money to get AJ.
By Steve McP
December 10, 2008 6:49 PM | Link to this
DOB - wasn’t getting more muscly what cost Frenchy so much last year? Is this Chipper news therefore that good.
By the way the comedian you saw in the gym yesterday was probably Russell Brand, a fellow Brit who is working more over here at the moment after getting in trouble for one of his broadcasts on the BBC earlier this year.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 6:50 PM | Link to this
Fascinating… Chipper’s aspects of AJ are not entirely strong. Perhaps there is some base truth to the Smoltz-will-consider-a-condtender talk. If Vazquez is all this team is capable of pulling in to satisfy Wrens’ “Top of the rotation” acquisition, this team will have a very strong chance of sinking below the Nats next year.
1 mile a day? That’s it? Does he want to make it in this business or what?
By h_charles
December 10, 2008 6:51 PM | Link to this
Burnett would be nice, but I think we can forget about Peavy. While we all follow our local guru DOB, his equivalent in SD indicated last week that the Cubs were basically it, and that part of the reason was that despite the “Atlanta’ perspective otherwise, the “San Diego” perspective says Peavy has some reservations about waiving the no-trade clause to Atlanta. Helps to read what other local papers are saying for perspective.
By MGL
December 10, 2008 6:51 PM | Link to this
Does everone realize that indirectly $20M of taxpeyer bailout money is going to the Mets. I’m sure a lot more is going to the Mets and Yankees in the form of Luxury Suites, etc.
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 6:52 PM | Link to this
Eric in Albany — Yes, it really is an outrage, the Yanks spending what amounts to tax dollars, mine and yours, for excessive free agent salaries. By the way, that $300m in new tax-free bonds is in ADDITION to over $1 billion of tax money already committed for the new stadium, as I understand it. Given the recession/depression we have entered, there is a very realistic possiblility of default. More and more looking like a house of cards. The whole thing makes me sick.
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this
KC,
It could be that those are only for employees.
A smarter idea would be to discuss having Braves (and other Atlanta pro teams) players show up for chat sessions. The AJC could promote the hell out of the sessions. Most of us here would eat that stuff up.
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this
Chop Chop, I assumed it meant 90-million….and Everybody, ESPN is reporting that the Yankees have made AJ Burnett a 5-year deal offer…no dollar amount reported…but if FW really wants to get this going, he needs to definitely offer 5 years and probably like 80-mill because if the yanks are in with 5 years it will at least be that much
By Hiawatha Terrell Wade
December 10, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this
I agree, poor form using that handle to post here.
Why on Earth would you want to mess with such a good thing. We are in the unique position of having a a direct pipeline to one of our favorite players, and you are going to jeopardize that because you need attention and/or think you are funny?
Shaq on Twitter. Chipper on O’Brien’s blog…don’t make these athletes regret interacting with their fans.
By Heath
December 10, 2008 6:55 PM | Link to this
Andy K. I agree with you…. DOB, track down the IP address of that idiot that posted as U Kno Who and ban them… truly bad form.
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 6:55 PM | Link to this
this is prime example why baseball now sucks.yankees get what they want.when is a salary cap gonna be put in?
By will
December 10, 2008 6:57 PM | Link to this
yanks offer aj 5years cc and aj this is bad for baseball why cant baseball have a cap like football
By BravesFanChris24
December 10, 2008 6:57 PM | Link to this
Buster Olney on Sports Center just said Yankees have apparently offered AJ a 5 Year Deal.
Doesn’t sound good at all.
By eric in albany
December 10, 2008 6:57 PM | Link to this
mad dog just reported yanks offered 5- yrs 80 million to AJ.
there is no chance the braves make the playoffs
By John Fisher
December 10, 2008 6:58 PM | Link to this
ESPN is now reporting that the friggin Yankees have now offered AJ a guaranteed 5 year nearing 91.5 million dollar deal.
Bottom line, Damn
By Chris
December 10, 2008 7:02 PM | Link to this
Hey DOB, is it me or does it seem like this year during the meetings, there has been alot more false rumors in and around baseball? I mean, ive seen a good number of false rumors, but nothing like this year. Is it because of the lack of movement during the meetings this year? Oh and its been kind of a bad day in the “rumor” department for the braves, first offering burnett 5 years, only for it to be untrue according to bowman’s source, and smoltz having mutual interests with the tigers….ouch
By PutMeInCoach
December 10, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this
Is it still possible to go back to Peavy if AJ’s price range goes too high?
I don’t want to pay the guy $90 million for 5 years…can’t see the value.
By SteveInRaleigh
December 10, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this
A healthy Smoltz is more of an ace than AJ Burnett. I’d say the likelihood of injury is roughly the same between the two guys. Maybe Wren should focus on not losing Smoltzie and let AJ wear pinstripes. They were talking on ESPNradio about how if the economy dives again, and the Yankees have all this money locked up in Sabbathia and Burnett, it could return their franchise to late 80’s, early 90’s status. Here’s to hoping…
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this
like people have been saying.forget aj. no chance he comes here. braves are doomed in 2009.
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 7:04 PM | Link to this
6:00pm: Buster Olney says the Yankees have talked with the Padres recently about Peavy, but it didn’t go anywhere.
This from MLBTR and I believe I called that one earlier today. The Yanks are trying to end up with a rotation full of potential cy youngs. one year out of the playoffs made them crazy for winning.
By Nocturnal Owl
December 10, 2008 7:04 PM | Link to this
Its very easy to picture a cold winter for the Braves.
Peavy decided against being a Brave.
A.J. might go elsewhere.
Smoltz loses interest in Braves
Talented shortstop waiting to leave Atlanta. Flowers gone.
Biggest acquisition is a 16-game loser.
Not trying to look negative but can reality be setting in…
By nolie
December 10, 2008 7:04 PM | Link to this
at least we will compete with nats for last place Incog
hey, maybe not. They just offered Tex 7 years and 150 mil according to some sources. LOL
By Chris
December 10, 2008 7:05 PM | Link to this
And as i typed that last section, yanks offer burnett 5 years at about 90 million. wow, it doesnt get much worse then this as a braves fan =(
By Bobby from SC
December 10, 2008 7:05 PM | Link to this
RotoWorld says Yankees offered AJ a 5 year deal. They are bad for baseball
By Wake Up Call
December 10, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this
Somebody wake me up in March when we have a good idea of what our 2009 roster will look like.
By Joe M.
December 10, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this
Source: Yankees offering Burnett five-year, $91.5M deal
The New York Yankees, making a hard late charge to beat out the Atlanta Braves for A.J. Burnett, offered the free agent right-hander a guaranteed five-year contract Wednesday, a baseball source told ESPN.com.
Crud. I hope he turns into another Carl Pavano for them.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this
yankees get what they want.when is a salary cap gonna be put in?InCognito
It might be a bigger issue if a different team didn’t win the World Series pratically every year, with the exception of the Sox in the past decade.
Or if the Yankees’ $1 billion-plus spent on payrolls in the past five years had even gotten them a pennant, much less a World Series (they’ve not been there since Beckett and the Marlins beat them in ‘03).
By John Smith
December 10, 2008 7:07 PM | Link to this
I believe that the 5 years 91.5 million figure is just a guestimation on ESPN’s part
By eric in albany
December 10, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this
I HATE LIVING IN NEW YORK!
True Fans Know What Its Like To Lose! And We Get Mad When We Do! Yankee Fans Couldnt Care Less If They Lose. Unlike a yankee fan who just reminds themselvs about their 26 rings witch most of them only remember about 4
I was going to go to the new yankee stadium this year and also to see the braves in citi field and coors fiels in july to see the bravos in july.
instead, im going to stay home and wait for my yankee tickets in the mail since they are using so much of my money to distroy baseball and make yet another underacheaving allstar team.
might not even go to citi field.
i guess im just going to be spending my money in orlando for spring training and in july in colorado to invest my money in teams who could use it the right way
AdirondackDave thanks for helping me pay for the yankees!
Ps what town are you in? im in rensselaer!
By MGL
December 10, 2008 7:09 PM | Link to this
In Forbes most recent MLB valuations, last April for 2007, The NYY were dead last in operating income at -$47M. The most profitable…Nats at $44M, then Marlins at $36M.
http://www.forbes.com/lists/2008/33/bizbaseball08The-Business-Of-Baseball_Income.html
By Nocturnal Owl
December 10, 2008 7:10 PM | Link to this
Stop with the hyperbole people. I still think the Braves are the front-runners for Burnett. Who cares if the Yankees lose out on Sabithia? The Braves still have over 30 million, there is NOTHING stopping them from outbiding the Yankees Joe M.
Once Steinbrenner turns the knob and opens the luxurious vault people run away…….
By Epinephrine
December 10, 2008 7:11 PM | Link to this
People need to calm down.
First of all, the ESPN article doesn’t say the Yanks offered him 5 years at 91.5. It just says they offered him 5 years, and that the numbers are unknown but he WANTS 91.5.
Second, ESPN and MLBTR were reporting last night that CC Sabathia was going to the Giants.
MLBTR reported today that Chipper Jones told a braves blog Smoltz was upset about being linked to the Mets.
All this stuff is just noise. We don’t even know that the BRAVES have offered a fifth year. We know the Yankees want to land another pitcher. It makes sense that they would want to keep an offer on the table before AJ signed. Then again, they may decide to blow the doors down. But we won’t know the truth from anonymous sources posted on blogs. We will know when we know.
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 7:12 PM | Link to this
i am so mad right now.this really stinks.how can people not see baseball needs cap?if not,it should have contraction.royals and pirates may never compete again.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 7:12 PM | Link to this
Nocturnal Owl, it’s bad enough without you having to exaggerate. Absolutely no proof, or really even reason to believe, that there’s any validity to these two points:
Smoltz loses interest in Braves
Talented shortstop waiting to leave Atlanta
What has Smoltz done or said to lead you believe he’s “lost interest” in the Braves. He’s divorced with four kids are in Atlanta. The school he helped build is in Atlanta. And it’s the only organization he’s ever played for, and he said several times since the end of the season that he fully expects to be able to work out a contract to stay.
But you take a Boston paper saying that he’d be a “good fit” for the Sox to mean Smoltz has lost interest in Atlanta? Absurd.
Let me ask, which team would a future Hall of Famer with impeccable reputation NOT be a good fit for, provided he’s healthy? That’s a silly statement, that he’d be a good fit for this or that club.
He’d be a better first with the one club he’s every pitched for, where fans love him like almost no other player, than he would be anywhere else.
And how is Yunel “waiting to leave Atlanta?” Because the Braves offered him in a deal for Peavy that fell through and hasn’t been discussed by the teams in four weeks?
By Salary Cap
December 10, 2008 7:14 PM | Link to this
I would love to see a salary cap! It’s vulgar when the Yankees actually could end up with CC, AJ, Lowe and Manny if they really wanted to. They could actually buy the entire FA class of 2009 if they were determined to do so.
But there isn’t going to be a salary cap. Know why? All the playoff and WS teams of the last few years that have been successful with payrolls near the bottom of the pack.
Even though the Yanks, Boston, Mets and a few other teams make a mockery of the FA process by buying the field, there always seems to be a Tampa Bay Rays or some other low payroll team that takes the salary cap argument away when they play in a World Series.
By Chris
December 10, 2008 7:14 PM | Link to this
that’s 41.1 million dollars anually for two pitchers on one team folks. you put arod’s and jeter’s contract with those two and your paying about 90 million dollars for 4 players. that’s just about matches the braves payroll! on top of that, yankees are still set after going for lowe AND even considered offering sheets a contract(not sure about now with the new burnett contract offer) oh and the yanks were recently discussing about trading for peavy though i dont know how much truth is with that
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this
Its BS how the Yankees are able to do whatever they fricking want. I wish there was a salary cap on baseball. This is just too much. Cashman knew we needed Burnett to be our Ace, but instead, Burnett will now be their #2 or #3 pitcher if the rumors are true about the Yanks offering a guaranteed 5 year contract worth 91.5 million. What a bunch of BS.
By InCognito
December 10, 2008 7:18 PM | Link to this
dave,but still bad for baseball.no questioning that high payrolls like yanks allow them to get what they want and compete. teams with high payrolls normally at least have shot each year.except mariners this year. other teams just can’t compete for fa in this economic model.
By Tony Austin
December 10, 2008 7:19 PM | Link to this
I can read the print already at the conclusion of the meetings, with the Braves coming out with the same they went in with: Frank Wren, “Well, we had some good dialog with a lot of people and were able to gauge what is out there and what our possibilities could be. A lot of good conversation. Most of the possibilities will probably occur until early next year or possibly closer to spring training. It was a good meeting and I left feeling positive.”
In other words - we didn’t do anything, we have no chance at Burnett and we don’t really need a power hitting fielder right now, we can wait until later. (The same later when all the options have already signed on with their new team).
There is no way this 2009 team, as it is constructed right now, is even a .500 team much less a playoff team.
By My Entire Team Sucks
December 10, 2008 7:20 PM | Link to this
i really thought Towers would have contacted Wren by now but i do believe it is time for Wren to get back in touch with towers as quick as he can - Burnett is not worth that kind of money with his health issues - Get Peavy and do what ever it takes without giving up heyward or hanson and do it quick -
By nique
December 10, 2008 7:20 PM | Link to this
any chance wrenn gets canned if he can’t get peavy or burnett? so far i’m not too impressed (except for the edgar-jurjens deal).
By A.S.
December 10, 2008 7:20 PM | Link to this
AJ is probably headed to NYY with CC. I doubt the Braves will be able to top an offer higher than the 5/80mm rumored. The most I would go would be 17. I dont even think AJ is worth all that.
By Make it Quick
December 10, 2008 7:23 PM | Link to this
Guys, time to accept Burnett is gone. It went from the Braves seemingly being close with a five year, 80 million deal to Bowman shooting that big Braves’ offer down and the Yankees giving him said five year deal at a high annual salary.
Best we can hope for now is Burnett to sign tonight or tomorrow and not drag out his signing with the Yankees. Euthanize our hopes of getting Burnett rather than make us suffer, you know?
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 7:23 PM | Link to this
Eric in Albany — Couldn’t agree with you more. We are over in Utica. I wish we still had our minor league team here to get my baseball fix. A few years ago Cal Ripkin bought the Utica Blue Jays (NY-Penn League) for 3M and moved them to his neighborhood in Maryland, I guess. Ripkin is the least popular Hall of Famer in this town, I can tell ya.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 7:28 PM | Link to this
If Burnett signs with the Yankees, then that makes the Vazquez trade look meaningless.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 7:28 PM | Link to this
Bummer. I get on the MTA to come home thinking the Braves may have a chance to get Burnett, and then I turn on the tv to see Crasnick saying the Yanks offered Burnett a fifth year. Maybe AJ would actually leave a few bucks on the table to play in the ATL.
By Chris
December 10, 2008 7:32 PM | Link to this
Your probably right tony austin. not much has happend with the braves this whole week during the meetings which is kinda scary (though not many teams have done anything during the meetings)but it doesnt look too good for the braves whatsoever so far and this coming from someone who tries to stay positive and patient.
By propp
December 10, 2008 7:33 PM | Link to this
I think the Burnett non-signing would be a blessing in disguise. When he is on he is good, not big 3 good. He has ace stuff, but has not performed well enough long enough to get 17 mil per season. I wouldn’t be completely dissappointed not getting him and going through next season banking that extra money. If the Braves are in it in July, maybe they can swing a deadline trade. Like I tell my wife, just because money is there, doesn’t mean it has to be spent.
By matt
December 10, 2008 7:36 PM | Link to this
Hey DOB really enjoy your blogs on the Braves. Have been reading them for two years. I have been a Braves since 90. I saw this on Yahoo Sports and am very concerned. Please comment if you have anything to add….
The Atlanta Braves are prepared to lose right-hander John Smoltz as a free agent if another team offers him a significant guarantee on a one-year deal, according to a source with knowledge of the team’s thinking.
Smoltz, 41, has undergone five arm surgeries — four on his elbow, one on his shoulder last June. The Braves believe that his medical history warrants a contract with a low base salary and the chance to earn more through performance-based incentives.
Smoltz’s agents are circulating his medical records and recent video of him throwing off a mound to teams gathered at the winter meetings.
Source: Foxsports.com
By MGL
December 10, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
Propp, you’re lucky your wife doesn’t spend money that isn’t there.
By Chuck James is solid until the 6th!! (Formerly Steve-O)
December 10, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
If the Yankees sign AJ. I say “F-It” Sign Manny to a 4/90 contract and get Garland or somebody. If we aint gettin an “ace” mine as well outslug other teams and throw out a bunch of 200 IP guys with 4.00 ERA’s and pray Smoltz is healthy in September and October. Again everybody the freakin’ Phillies won the World Series with Cole Hamels, Brett Myers, Jamie “Im 46 and throw 79” Moyer, Kyle Kendrick, Joe Blanton and Adam Eaton…
By david
December 10, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
if burnett dont work out sign sheets and get a left fielder thats worth a damn
By nique
December 10, 2008 7:42 PM | Link to this
the braves will be horrible next year without a legit number 1-ish pitcher. fans will lose interest really quckly without a competitive team. go get peavy and forget about burnett.
By Saltywoody
December 10, 2008 7:43 PM | Link to this
I might be in the minority here, but I’ll happy as heck if Burnett signs with the Yanks.
Best case scenario is AJ stays healthy for a few seasons in a row for the first time in…well, ever. And he anchors a team that doesn’t have terribly realistic playoff hopes with their offense the way it stands.
Worst case scenario (and much more likely) is that AJ gets hurt and spends a good portion of those five years on and off the DL (the last thing the Braves need from their “ace”) and his 90 million dollar deal cripples the team from doing much else.
The bad thing here is that the Braves have a lot of money to spend and can’t get free agents to come to Atlanta. That’s not good. I could be totally off-base here, but the thought of playing for Bobby Cox and a winning organization seems like it used to hold a lot of allure for people…and that allure seems to have disappeared somewhat, making it tough for the always economical Braves to sign top tier free agents because they refuse to get them simply by overspending.
It’s not that I want the Braves to throw in the towel on the upcoming year, especially if we could potentially get Smoltz and Glavine back and have a very formidable team. But, I’d also say that they’ve GOT to look to 09-10 when Hudson will be back, Schafer/Hanson/et al should be up and ready to produce, JJJ will be more seasoned, etc.
Again, I’m not saying throw in the towel. I’m saying don’t do something that will cripple the team for years to come just because you’ve got some spending money. Signing Burnett to a five year deal at 90million+ with his track record seems kinda foolish to me.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
matt Dude, that information was posted and discussed on this blog for over half an hour now. If you love reading this blog so much, then you would know that.
By MGL
December 10, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
“Hey DOB really enjoy your blogs on the Braves. Have been reading them for two years. I have been a Braves since 90. I saw this on Yahoo Sports and am very concerned. Please comment if you have anything to add….” matt.
Hey matt, you must not have read this one as your question was answered above by DOB.
By Steve McP
December 10, 2008 7:46 PM | Link to this
Oh well - back to Towers and Jake, and probably having to give up more because they know we don’t have anywhere else to go - maybe Towers has got it right after all
By ShawnB
December 10, 2008 7:47 PM | Link to this
I’m loving the NFL more and more as this free agent season goes along. MLB hot stove is a joke, it’s Yankee hot stove and then whoever they don’t want everyone else can fight over.
By bravesfan09
December 10, 2008 7:49 PM | Link to this
Lets just hope the Braves dont lose 100 games this year. We could be competing with the Nationals for last place.
By The Bottom Line
December 10, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this
The Braves need to abandon this Burnett thing. They need to start rebuilding and quit talking about trading Escobar. The only attitude problem he has is just wanting to win. You can’t really blame him for having one. How would you like it if you were on a team full of morons and an in-bred for a manager making bone-headed after bone-headed moves? Imagine what he sees when a struggling outfielder is sent down and after a few days is brought back up because he didn’t want to be down there. Imagine playing for absentee owners who don’t really give a rats a* what you do? Sounds to me like his bad attitude might be just a little bit justified.
By glorydays
December 10, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this
Have we confirmed that Peavy let it be known that he does not want to be a Brave, because when we miss out on AJ folks will be screaming about Peavy.
By Max
December 10, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this
The Yankees offered Burnett 5 years worth 91 million dollars. Burnett will not sign with the Braves. Once again, it will be a tough year to be a Braves fan. I am so sick of this Franchise. They do not do what they need to do to win. I mean they would not trade Tyler Flowers for Jake Peavy but they will trade him for Javier Vasquez. WTF???????????????????? I really would not be surprised if Smoltz signs with the Red Sox. Frank Wren is a horrible GM. I am also tired of hearing about all these up and coming players. They have not done anything to prove they are good. I will believe it when i see it.
By A.S.
December 10, 2008 7:52 PM | Link to this
Efrim the Vazquez trade was just one way the Braves want to address their need for SP this off-season. They will likely target Lowe if Burnett goes to NYY. There are other SP’s available via trade.
By mr baseball
December 10, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this
Rational, intelligent discussions on this blog (and just about every other one of the AJC’s sports blogs) are evidently a near impossibility. The pack mentality and Henny Penny reactions of most of those on here drag down just about every topic on the blog.
Failing to trade for Peavy or to sign Burnett will not constitute the end of the world for the Braves. There are other directions the GM can take, but not many on here seem to recognize that fact. And most of the other names tossed out as possible trade targets are typical fantasy wishes of those with no clue whether those players are actually available or what they would cost the Braves in return.
I’m waiting for someone/anyone on here to offer up a reasonable alternative for what moves Wren could make that do not regurgitate idle rumors that are floated by bored media types with nothing better to do than make stuff up. I tossed out an idea that actually might make sense and solve 2 problems, but I guess that since it was grounded in fiscal reality and involved a player who might actually be available, it ain’t worth much to those who are all a twitter over the possibility that the Braves’ 3B may or may not have joined the discussion.
By The Bottom Line
December 10, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this
As long as Liberty Media, Frank Wren, and Bobby Cox are in control, the Braves are going to be perennial losers!
By eddie
December 10, 2008 7:56 PM | Link to this
DOB: Didn’t the Braves misplay their hand on Burnett? If they were willing to give 5 years at 17M/year, why didn’t they offer it and hopefully close the deal? Oh how the Braves have fallen!
But we got Vasquez and Ross! Wow!
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 7:58 PM | Link to this
SI.com’s Jon Heyman says the Yankees have offered a five year deal worth 80 million. Braves haven’t offered a five year deal. It’s still four years for 60 million with a vesting option.
http://www.fannation.com/siblogs/hotstove/posts/31141-yankees-offer-burnett-five-year-deal
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 7:58 PM | Link to this
ok, it seems that now the Burnett offer from the Yankees is more along the lines of 5 years and 80 million, which is 16 million a year. If the Braves match that, would Burnett be willing to play in Atlanta knowing that New York’s cost of living is much more expensive?
By amorrow
December 10, 2008 7:58 PM | Link to this
bravesfan09_
the nationals? dont you mean the marlins? - if you been paying attention the nationals actualy are making a couple of moves and are making a goood run at tex.
By Jay Blaisdell
December 10, 2008 8:00 PM | Link to this
If you’re AJ Burnett — a pitcher whose medical chart is twice as gaudy as his pitching record — you take the longer guaranteed contract. Which means he winds up in NY, just like all the big fish eventually do. This free agent thing has become a joke. So is MLB. What kind of game, or league, has this amount of disparity and uneveness built into its rules ? Only baseball, where Boros & Fehr & The Selig rule the game. — Jay Bee.
By AdirondackDave
December 10, 2008 8:01 PM | Link to this
Sheets, yup he’d be worth a try assuming AJ is gone. Actuallty, he’s as good as any of them if he can hold up physically. He’s likely cheaper and would sign a more flexible contract, I imagine. Maybe 2+option or 3+ option.
By BabyGoatEater
December 10, 2008 8:01 PM | Link to this
Yankee’s offer now at 5/80. Not nearly as bad as the 5/90 news. I think Wren would go 5/80 to 5/85. If AJ doesn’t consider BC and the cost of living an advantage then we have no shot anyways. If he does, 5/85 would get it done. Not sure if it would be a good move on the Braves part (insurance, injury history, not really a true “ace”), but it could still happen.
source: John Heyman
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
Max Dude, get a grip. Its not the end of the world, thats for sure. Flowers was never part of a deal for Peavy, so you can just scratch that.
By My Entire Team Sucks
December 10, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
reports saying it might be 5/80 which would mean the braves are still in it if that is what they offered.
By Offseason from Hell
December 10, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
Jake Peavy to Cubs
A,J. Burnett to Yankees
John Smoltz to someone other than the Atlanta Braves
By John Fisher
December 10, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
What in the hell are the Braves going to do if we manage to screw ourselves out of Burnett as we did with Peavy. Good lord i hate loving the Braves
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 8:06 PM | Link to this
A.S.
Efrim the Vazquez trade was just one way the Braves want to address their need for SP this off-season. They will likely target Lowe if Burnett goes to NYY. There are other SP’s available via trade.
I’m trying to be optimistic here, but Derek Lowe isn’t coming to Atlanta my friend. We certainly outbidding the Red Sox or Yankees for him. I’m not sure what other starting pitchers are available through trade, and as I have said before, I don’t want to trade prospects. I’m tired of that. That has always been the Braves thing. With 40 million plus to spend, free agency was the route to go. But, as has been the case for the last three seasons, the Braves got unlucky and had all of this money to spend during the same offseason as the Yanks.
As far as Vasquez goes, I understand why they made that move. You might be talking about another post from another blogger.
By A.S.
December 10, 2008 8:10 PM | Link to this
MLB.com’s Jason Beck says at least seven teams have shown some level of interest in Smoltz.
By MAX
December 10, 2008 8:13 PM | Link to this
Original JOHN The Padres ask about Flowers being in the Deal and the Braves said no. The fact is the braves are itting back and letting the Yankess take everything. If the braves wanted to win they would have offered 5 years in the first place. They would have given what the Padres wanted. and NOT have traded for Vasquez
By rotty
December 10, 2008 8:14 PM | Link to this
Do you actually think any of the years and dollars being thrown around are anything more than guesses?
So you believe Wren is telling Bowman the exact details of a financial contract. You think AJ’s agent is faxing the offer letter to Rosenthal, Krasnick or any one else?
You really believe that?
The Braves may or may not get AJ but understand everyone is pulling years and dollars out of their backsides.
By Blog Hopes
December 10, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this
I’m waiting for someone/anyone on here to offer up a reasonable alternative for what moves Wren could make
Yes. And every one on this blog was anxiously awaiting the ever so smart mr baseball to present this idea. Alas, all that was offered was a condescending lashing to all those who enjoy engaging in conversation on this blog.
By RC in ATL
December 10, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this
The Bottom Line, Well, tell us how you feel! I hate to say it - and I know the Kool-aid sipping comapny guys are going to unload on you about this - but you said a mouthful…and a lot of truth. Not sure about Escobar’s attitude problems and their root causes, or the team being full of morons, but Bobby Cox makes decisions that just leave me scratching my head so very often. And it didn’t just start. I have yet to figure out why Liebrandt was brought in to pitch to Puckett, and then after blowing it, brought in to blow the next year’s WS by pitching to Winfield. I could go on all night…some of his decisions are not only indefensible, but jut stupid. And no one ever has the guts to hold him accountable for it. He has found his nitch managing in a place like Atlanta. And I agree with you on how the Francoeur situation was handled as well.
By steve_97060
December 10, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this
the sky is falling, the sky is falling…
By Blog Hopes
December 10, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this
MAX DOB refuted your entire premise last week. Flowers was not the hang up in the deal. It was the Bryant like position which Towers was trying to implement on Wren that made the deal fall apart.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 8:24 PM | Link to this
So the Yanks are upping the ante even more than the rumor mill upped for the Braves. Gotta wonder how true this is. Bowman refuted the $80 million/5 year offer from the Braves this afternoon. How long until some one refutes the Yankees offer?
AJ not coming to the Braves might be a good thing. It will almost certainly require a trade for Wren to fulfill his goal, but said trade has the potential to return something better than AJ.
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 8:24 PM | Link to this
Why does everyone keep saying the “cost of living” like that is a big issue? You really think that if you made $16 mil a year you would really care that much about that? You could take the “Yankee” approach and do whatever you wanted. Mr. O’Brien, do you see any darkhorse out there on the starting pitcher front that we have yet to mention or think of? Anyone that fits the #1 or #2 bill?
By tim
December 10, 2008 8:25 PM | Link to this
Dave, I haven’t read the whole blog so thi squestion might have been answered already but I’ll ask and hop somepn eresponds. The Braves aren’t seriously considering not offering Smoltz are they? What do you think? What does Wren say. Surely we’re gonna resign him.
By Cory
December 10, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this
DOB, what is the deal my friend? Now I am reading that the Yankees have offered Burnett a 5 year 80 million deal and that Burnett’s agent is seeking a deal like Zambrano’s and that is a 5 year 91 million deal.
The Braves are in desperate need of a ACE Pitcher.. Why are they screwing around with this? Just offer the guy the 5 year deal he seeks and be done with it.. I have a bad feeling that Atlanta is going to lose out on all the good pitchers.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this
DOB: Didn’t the Braves misplay their hand on Burnett? If they were willing to give 5 years at 17M/year, why didn’t they offer it and hopefully close the deal? Eddie
Who said they were ever willing to over an $85 mill five-year contract? I know I never said that.
By kris
December 10, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this
The questions with Burnett are 1-Taxes and 2-Is an extra 10 million from the yanks over 5 years worth the media scrutiny and pressure he would get on a daily basis?
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this
BabyGoatEater: If AJ does consider cost of living, then it would not be needed to out bid in actual dollars. 35 million in Atlanta is 80 million in NY. Or another way of 80 million in NY is 184 million in ATL.
By jtb
December 10, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this
nique,
Why should Wren get fired if he can’t get Peavy or AJ? I would rather the Braves not have AJ than for them to offer him 5 years 91 million for him. He’s not THAT good. And I would also rather have Tommy Hanson, Yunel, Boyer, and Gorkys, or whatever it was that Towers wanted than Peavy. Sometimes the best deals are the ones you don’t make. I don’t want the Braves to be like the Mets of a few years ago who paid so much for Mo Vaugn, Glavine, Roberto Alomar, etc. and had all of those players under perform like they did.
I’d rather the Braves end up being no good this year and trading Vasquez and Gonzo or whatever at the trade deadline and getting a fresh load of prospects back in return than throw away money now for another 3rd place finish.
By JP
December 10, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this
Max, you should be renamed Mad Max. Obviously, you don’t have a budget and you don’t have any idea how to negotiate.
By proeye
December 10, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this
DOB…
How important do you think it is for the Braves and their future to land Burnett?
By flylikeeagle05
December 10, 2008 8:35 PM | Link to this
I hope the Steinbrenner’s family keep signing on all of those rich players then have to file bankruptcy and they can’t get any of those bailout money!
By Yars
December 10, 2008 8:42 PM | Link to this
If all else fails, perhaps Wren can talk to the O’s & see what it would take to land Ryan Freel. I think JoJo/Prado for Freel would be a fair trade. O’s would have to trade Brian Roberts first, unless they see Prado as a super utility guy.
By Lew
December 10, 2008 8:42 PM | Link to this
Some of y’all really need to get a grip.
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 8:45 PM | Link to this
Max Flowers was not the issue in the Peavy, never was. And if the Braves came right out and offered a 5 year deal in the first place, do you think that would have sealed the deal?? No, it wouldnt have, it would have been a starting ground as to which they would have worked from, what would have been next in the negotiations? 6 Years?? I dont think so bud.
By Apollo
December 10, 2008 8:48 PM | Link to this
DOB, If this Yankee offer is exactly the same as the Braves offer….what does it mean? Does it mean that NY is toying around just to gauge Burnett’s interest first, before swooping in and overwhelming him? Or do the Braves really have a shot at being competitive in the event of a bidding war, and do you think they’ll be willing to go any higher?
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the kind words my friend TennPaul. 34 million, 80 million, 184 million. Isn’t it all the same…multimillionaire? Point that you missed was unless he is Brewster or MC Hammer then he will not be able to go through all that money in ATL or NYC.
Let’s just see if AJ decides to come to God’s country (the south) or if he goes to NYC. Then we can move on with the other holes we have.
By nique
December 10, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this
jtb,
wren said that his primary goals this offseason were to get two sp’s and an outfielder. he’s had the opportunity to get a 27 year old ace who’d be paid a very cheap salary, and seemed on the verge of getting that done for what i think was a bargain. honestly, if he had to throw in one more decent prospect i think peavy would be worth it. the guy is a cheap 27 year old ace.
as for burnett, i think that burnett at 4/$60 would have been worth it. that doesn’t appear to be what’s on the table now (he’s being offered way too much), and i’d prefer them not to sign him at 80mill.
however, if wren doesn’t sign a top of the rotation pitcher (who i’d prefer to be peavy), what was the point of trading a stud prospect for vasquez? you just wasted a stud for a guy who’s going to eat innings on a very bad team.
it’s all of the moves or lack thereof taken together that make this offseason a failure so far. if you’re not going to get someone to pitch at the top of the rotation then don’t trade flowers and play for the future as you suggest, but don’t half-a** it so that you don’t have sufficient talent to compete now or in the future.
see my point?
By Still Alive
December 10, 2008 8:56 PM | Link to this
Until he signs, it ain’tover. I agree with most others on here 5/80 would be it for me…let the Yankees bankrupt themselves. Let’s get Sheets if AJ is a no-go. Let’s make the Frenchy/greinke thing look much better than your sister as a date to the prom. KJ and RP for Ankiel or let’s get Abreu or Dunn. I like Greinke, especially at a lot less. Everybody breathe, Smoltz will stay- he’s just a class act…anyone remember a few years back when Yankess courted him and he told them to stick it and signed for less/same in the ATL…If no Greinke, let’s work something out for Bedard.. I’m all for consistency over flashiness…don’t take me wrong, AJ would be great in an NL uniform in the ATL, but not at bankrupting us…THis could be doable: Greinke, Sheets, JJ, Vaz and Smoltz/Hanson, et al… no slouch and money to also help spend elsewhere..FW will do the right thing
By Ron Roberts
December 10, 2008 8:56 PM | Link to this
Calm down, folks; we don’t get Burnett, fine.
Freak out ifwe don’t re-sign Smoltz. Then the sky is falling.
I’m fine w/a rotation of Jurrjens, Smoltz, Vasquez, Campillo oand Hanson/Parr so long as we get a power-hitting LF/CF and Jeff Francoeur rebounds to form.
With the pending return of Soriano and the rejuvinated Gonzo as closer, and the return of Pete Moylan to the ‘pen, we just need starting options and re-signing Smoltz and giving Glavine his due while awaiting the return of Tim Hudson is fine by me.
It may or may not be enough to snag a playoff spot, but it doesn’t come with an over-priced arm sitting in our “ace” slot only because we felt pressured to sign a guy in the offseason to fill that role. And it won’t come with the price-paid of losing key prospects.
Face it; Burnett’s not worth Zambrano money, and he and his agent know this. They also know some teams are desperate enough to pay it this off-season, though, so they’re going for it. Can’t blame them; I would blame the team that paid him, though.
Sure, this might be 1990-esque, but I like what I hear (and read) about Hanson, and Parr wowed us last September, and Campillo and Jurrjens looked damn-capable to me. In all those playoff runs, we never had more than four truly capable starters and a 5th guy who was just a 5th guy. Give it a go, in 2009; if we fill our offensive holes in the outfield and can have a healthy rotation with what we have and the same for the bullpen, we’re as or more balanced han most NL teams, the Phillies included.
Chill out.
By Billy (TBFnB)
December 10, 2008 9:04 PM | Link to this
some of you who complain about losing flowers dont seem to understand that he was not going to play in atlanta
By Original Jon
December 10, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this
Hmmm, I thought we would be the ones wheeling and dealing at these meetings, but it looks like the Mets are the ones doing the most so far this offseason. First they sign K-Rod, and now they are on the verge of trading for Putz. That is a good late inning tandem.
By BravesFanChris24
December 10, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this
According to Ken Rosenthal….
Mets trying to acquire JJ Putz from Mariners.
By Kevin
December 10, 2008 9:10 PM | Link to this
I hate the f*** yankees
By car3boogie
December 10, 2008 9:11 PM | Link to this
DOB is this off season beginning to take a big ole Dump.
By JR
December 10, 2008 9:12 PM | Link to this
5 for 91 mill for AJ is way too much. As much as I would love to have him business is business. I have said all along that my two favorites are Sheets and Oliver Perez. Yeah I know Sheets is a huge risk but we have to take one if we lose out on AJ, plus I love having lefties too. Not sure Oliver is worth dealing with Boras though. Get Sheets before Nolan Ryan does. 3 years 40 million
By Wayne in Utah
December 10, 2008 9:14 PM | Link to this
I just logged in and only went a couple of posts up to find nique. Are you kidding me???
Peavy never wanted to come to Atlanta. Have you been reading the news here? Kevin Towers, Peavy and his agent were just working and using the Braves to try to get more for Peavy from the Cubs, which is where he wanted to go anyway.
So, to say another player would have made the difference is being naive.
Also, our “stud” prospect, wasn’t truly on the “stud prospect” radar screen a year ago.
One of Atlanta’s needs is a couple of strong starters, and Vazquez is definitely an upgrade over everybody that is left presently, except for Jurrjens.
I suspect you are one of the folks that frequent the blog that are living in the “what have you done for me today” world. The off season is long. Have some patience. Frank Wren and his team had Peavy as their plan A, and Burnett as plan B. If you truly think Burnet is not worth the money being offered, you might be right, but in todays market, if you want a #1 starter without giving up multiple prospects, that is the price.
Now, if Burnett is not signed, I would promise you that Wren has plan’s C, D, and E in waiting. (Could be guys like Greinke, Jackson, Arroyo, Harang, Maholm, RJohnson, who knows…..)
So, please don’t sit there and talk about the failure of the off season yet. It is still in the early innings.
By fastasballs
December 10, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this
Wren it not a failure if he doesn’t land Peavy or Burnett. Towers blew the Peavy deal, plain & simple. He is now stuck dealing with the Cubs who may never be able to complete the deal.
If the Yankees want to over pay for AJ let them go & do it. The same people calling Wren a failure for not signing Burnett will be the same ones later calling him a failure if AJ pulls a Hampton & lives on the DL.
Now if Wren lets Smoltz sign with another team it will be a cold day in hell before I support the man anymore.
The Braves need to stick with their youth. They need to draft even more pitching to go with the core they have now. The only guy that was traded for Tex that I wish we had back is Feliz. He would be coming right along not too far behind Hanson had he still been a Brave.
Winning in 2009 is probably not going to happen. I accepted it last year once I took a look at the big picture of what the Braves have to work with. Way too many big holes needed to be filled this offseason & they all still remain basically.
What the Braves do have is a fantastic farm system that will produce a lot more for years to come than any quick fix will.
I supported trying to trade for Peavy because he’s that special & under control for 4-5 years. I can live with the Vazquez trade, but hope Wren doesn’t go full bore with trading the kids & without signing AJ or trading for Peavy I would suspect he accepts 2009 as a rebuilding year or at least I hope he does.
By SteveInRaleigh
December 10, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this
If the Mets get Putz as a set-up guy, that will most definately impact my fantasy keeper league…
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this
I’m fine w/a rotation of Jurrjens, Smoltz, Vasquez, Campillo oand Hanson/Parr so long as we get a power-hitting LF/CF and Jeff Francoeur rebounds to form.
I’m not okay with that. Smoltz is no given considering the shoulder surgery.
By Sarah
December 10, 2008 9:18 PM | Link to this
I’m really glad to see all the optimism from Braves fans……
By JP
December 10, 2008 9:20 PM | Link to this
Nique, everybody is blaming Wren for not getting Peavy. Negotiating with Towers was like negotiating with a divorce lawyer. Right when you think you have everything worked out, they up the ante. That compares to negotiating with a 4 year old. You can’t blame Wren for backing out he was being held hostage.
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 9:20 PM | Link to this
I think that most people are upset over flowers because of the leverage or “chip” he could have brought to the braves in trade value. I dont know about anyone else but I feel that we could have used him for a different player of more ace material. BMac is there for a while.
I agree with an earlier writer that said we should go for sheets (for 3 years) and Greinke without losing Hanson, sign that RH bat or settle for a LH one like Dunn and feel pretty good about it.
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this
I’m torn at this point. I thought for sure that 5/80 would get it done and now that may not have been offered by the Braves. But then again, I don’t know that I would go 5/85.
I think I would do one of two things: go hard after Sheets or Greinke. IMO Sheets if every bit as good as AJ when healthy and their track records are very similar. But because of the timing of his injury, Sheets won’t require as large a committment. I’m thinking 3/40 should do it. Because he would only cost money and that’s what we have, I’d go that route.
As for our power-hitting LF, my prediction will be Guillen if we get AJ. He wouldn’t cost that much as KC wants to unload his salary. He’s not Manny, but he’ll do. I think would also be included if we made a trade for Greinke. But if we were to sign Sheets, we could afford to take on some additional salary and could probably afford Magglio. This is why I think Wren is holding off on filling this need because he needs flexibility right now to get his ace.
Good luck Frank!!!
By chris
December 10, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
and to top off this yet again another bad day for braves, mets might acquire yet again another closer in JJ Putz
By jman
December 10, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
If Burnett signs with the Yanks…
May your arm fall off…
May CC Sabathia rip a ligament…
I have a whole new level of hatred for the Yankees… Thank you… you are nothing but a bunch of money grubbing baseball w*******… Hopefully all the money you spend will go down the drain and if there is a supreme being you will never make the playoffs again…
By brian
December 10, 2008 9:27 PM | Link to this
i’m sitting here laughing my a* off at the the hysterical posts by some on this blog. get over yourselves. if they Yankees out bid the Braves on Burnett so be it. i suspect many on this blog never lived through the miserable 80s that were the Atlanta Braves. Be happy this team is at least a story on the rumor mill. trust me they were not in the 80s if a rumor mill even existed back then. i would rather suffer through 2 more seasons of mediocrity and third to last place finishes than offer to over pay for a guy who i suspect will never make it through a 5 year contract and not spend a significant amount of time on the DL. Let’s infuse these young guys in with reasonable valued vets(Javy V., Smoltz/Glavine(if able), etc.) This team has been on youth movement for the last 3 years and will continue down that path. Had the Peavy thing worked out along with Javy V. signing then I would have thought this team would compete for the division. It ain’t happening folks and that’s not necessarily a bad thing. This team always dealt from strength in the 90s because they had the f**ing pitching. They don’t have it now but seemed to have it soon with the likes of Hanson and potentially with Reyes and others in the farm system. The future looks potentially bright for the Braves but this year of free agents ain’t going to get us there.
By Couch Tater
December 10, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this
Peavy wants to go to the Cubs for the Employee Stock Ownership Plan.
By BravesFanChris24
December 10, 2008 9:29 PM | Link to this
Poor Jairo Cuevas. KC claims him, Braves claims him back and now KC claims him back.
By Boo-Yah
December 10, 2008 9:29 PM | Link to this
Offseason from Hell:
LOL An addendum to your two would be:
Brian McCann loses his will to play baseball. Thank God, we won’t see this (or the other two) happen any time soon!
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this
Great point wayne from utah. Wayne, what do you or anyone else think about going after sheets, penny, or looper? I know all we need some LHP to take down the Phils but we might want to take a chance there. Of those three, Sheets is the only one offered arb that costs the pick. Arroyo and Harang would be good as well. Maholm is a lefty if I remember correctly but Pirates ask way too much for their low-level talent.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 9:32 PM | Link to this
I supported trying to trade for Peavy because he’s that special & under control for 4-5 years. I can live with the Vazquez trade, but hope Wren doesn’t go full bore with trading the kids & without signing AJ or trading for Peavy I would suspect he accepts 2009 as a rebuilding year or at least I hope he does.
My biggest fear throughout all of this was the moves Frank Wren might make if we miss out on Burnett and Peavy. He isn’t going to trade Heyward or Hanson, but that doesn’t mean that this system can still withstand a trade where they part with two of Freeman, Schafer, Hernandez, Rohrbough and Locke. That’s why Burnett was/is key. Signing him means you can still keep those players in house. Not signing him means you’ll have to part with them to get a front-line type starting pitcher if you want to compete next year.
By JR
December 10, 2008 9:34 PM | Link to this
Let’s look at the reason why we struggled so bad last season
First. The back end of our rotation struggled mightily. Right now we are no better than we were last season. I like Vazquez as our 3 or 4, but he’s not close to matching Hudson. We still need two pitchers
Second. Let’s face it our two best hitter are only gonna play 135 games at best. Chipper will miss some and BMac is a catcher. I do like the move bringing in Ross, but we HAVE to have a go to bat that will be reliable. In reality we need two
So the way I see it. To improve from where we were last season we have to get two more starters to get better and two more bats. Not sure who those 4 people are but that’s why Wren get’s paid the bucks.
We may have to rent a couple of guys for a year but that’s the nature of the business until our young bucks get ready.
By MT Braves Fan
December 10, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this
If the Yanks’ offer is for $80 million, I’d guess we’re probably still in the mix at the very least. There was the report earlier about Wren offering 5 for 75-80 also, in this very blog, so to say it’s foregone is a bit premature I’d say. Even if we don’t end up with Burnett, I think the team will be fine for next year. If they have money laying around that would have gone to A.J., pay it to a couple different guys (Sheets, Perez, etc.) and turn the attention to doing whatever it takes to get a big run-producing bat. The sky isn’t falling, granted A.J. would be a nice piece of the puzzle, but with Smoltz, JJ, Vazquez, and some combination of Sheets/Perez/Garland/Morton/Hanson/ Campillo the rotation would be plenty good to compete in this division.
By Marty
December 10, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this
Please, those of you who have anointed this season a failure for Wren, explain to us what he should have done. Should he have kidnapped Peavy? Perhaps Wren should have offered Sabathia $400 million and partial ownership in the team. How will overpaying for a fragile Burnett, if he spurns the Braves’ generous offer and takes a ridiculous one from the Yankees, make the offseason a success?
Have some sense. Wren is doing the best he can with the available options.
By N8
December 10, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this
nolie
“what about Jordan? but yeah, you’re mostly right. they have never been a big free agent team. Not the same as the Yanks really.”
Well, since I said PRE-1998, he wouldn’t apply, would he? Since he was signed in 99. LOL!
And if memory serves correctly, he too took less money (Mets wanted him), to come to Atlanta.
Wayne
While I agree with you, about Wren having plans C, D and E on the backburner in case Burnett blows us off. I disagree that this off-season hasn’t been a failure so far, if you judge “success” by Wren doing what he set out to do.
He set out to get two top of the rotation guys. So far we’ve gotten NONE. Sure Vazquez “technically” is right now our #1 (I’d still rate JJJ ahead of him, though). But so what? Jeff Francoeur was technically our most “powerful” OF last year, with his whopping 11 HR.
It’s all relative.
As for Greinke? Sure. Love to have him. NOT at what Moore will ask for. No thanks. Rather have Peavy, who’s signed for 4 years (maybe 5), instead of 2. Like I said. No thanks.
As for Jackson, Arroyo, Harrang, Maholm. NO. NO. NO. NO.
Why bother?
I’d rather see Wren RIDICULOUSLY overpay on 1 year contracts to Sheets, Randy Johnson (who is said to only be asking for a 1-year deal), or Pettitte.
If Burnett spurns us, I go with play F.
As in “F” it for 2009, and start looking towards 2010.
We can’t get a starter to sign on, and the Mets are about to acquire a 2nd closer to go with the best closer in baseball that they just signed.
If they get Putz you can add 10 wins to their 2008 total RIGHT NOW.
Wren has a LOT of work to do, and so far he’s 1 for 3. Well, technically he’s still in his 3rd AB and keeps fouling off balls and staying alive. But the Yankees are abou to strike him out.
Hopefully he’ll “adjust” for his 4th AB and hit a HR.
By jman
December 10, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this
It’s not that I’d be upset that the braves DIDNT get Burnett… I’d be upset if the money grubbing Yankees DID get him. I’d rather him go to the Phillies! The Yankees, Red Sox, and Dodgers are ripping the game I love to shreds. Baseball is becoming a sad sad story of the rich getting richer. Sad day if the Yankees end up with everyone they want just because they apparently print their own money…
By Marty
December 10, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this
*AR Brave * - If I may offer an opinion on your question: To quote one of ESPN.com’s contributors, “Sheets’ natural habitat is the DL.” As for Penny and Looper, they’re both awful. I’d rather pay Campillo nothing and use him as a starter than pay either of those guys anything.
By N8
December 10, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this
Efrim
“Not signing him [Burnett] means you’ll have to part with them to get a front-line type starting pitcher if you want to compete next year.”
Totally agree with you. Which is why I was ALWAYS for signing Burnett, rather than trading for Peavy, even though they are clearly not in the same class as each other.
But the above statement you made is EXACTLY why you don’t even attempt to compete next year, if Burnett is missed out on.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this
BravesfanChris24: That move by Dayton Moore and the Royals didn’t seem to go over too well in some Braves circles, from what I hear….
Nique: Lamest post of the week. Congrats.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 9:43 PM | Link to this
That’s an excellent addition by the Mets if they can get it done. Putz/Rodriguez back end of the bullpen would be really solid. Probably one of the best tandems in the NL.
By Seth
December 10, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Hit up the Poker Room at Planet Hollywood before you leave. That’s where all the fishies hang out. Made a killing in the 4-8 No Limit Table last January. Goodluck and happy gambling amigo. Buy Bobby a freakin cold one for me.
By repo man
December 10, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this
I hope Wren don’t try to top the Yankees 85 Million. Let him go, he’s not worth it. Sometimes the best deal is the one you don’t make.
Go to contingency plan and gett’r done.We can still get a couple good pitcher and do just as well.
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
I’m surprised that the Mariners would even think about trading Putz.
Seems to me if they would trade their star closer then they might entertain offers for Felix Hernandez as trading their closer isn’t going to help any of their starters.
I still would take a crack at Justin Duchscherer and there’s talk in Houston that Oswalt if they can’t unload other salaries.
There’s much offseason remaining and the Braves still have a pool of money and resources to trade. There will be moves made, as long as those moves are solid they help the Braves.
By AR Brave
December 10, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
Point taken Marty Looper is awful and Penny has fallen hard. Let’s hope the Bravos sign AJ.
Love the blog, but c’mon people. This is the Braves we are talking about and don’t think JS doesn’t have a watchful eye there with Wren. JS put us in line for 14 straight so give the men upstairs some time. It is only the first few days of the meetings.
Wren is due a HR via the ole 2-1 knuckletrade.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 9:58 PM | Link to this
Boo-Yah—
Yes indeed—that’s not happening any time soon at all. Thank goodness!
Night, all!
By brent a.
December 10, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this
Thankfully, Bobby Cox isn’t going anywhere.
:-)
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 10, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this
Nique fans will lose interest really quckly without a competitive team.
Not me! Let’s just be happy we have a baseball team. They’ll win again.
Night, all for real!
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this
Just so you know, one of Boras’ guys also claims the Braves have expressed at least some interest in Lowe.
By Time To Punt?
December 10, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this
What if?
The Braves don’t land AJ or any other top of the rotation starter? I don’t want to hear Peavy as an option, that ain’t gonna happen. Everyone keeps talking Towers this, Towers that. It seems like Peavy is the guy who doesn’t want to be in Atlanta and of course he has the final say. Actually, I’m not crazy about giving AJ five years. Four scares me to death with his track record! My feelings won’t be hurt if the Braves lose out on the AJ sweepstakes.
I just hope the Braves don’t get desperate and sign another mid rotation guy like Vazquez for 10-12 mil per year. that would be insane! Thats too much money for innings eaters. If they lose out on all of the preferred top of the rotation guys, I hope they change gears and pick up a bat or two, give Hansen a chance to make the opening day rotation, and regroup for next years FA market. If the Yanks load up on all the FA pitchers in the market with all those long term contracts, they can’t get upside down again in next years market.
If Glavine heals up, sign him to an incentive laden contract. Since they haven’t signed a top of the rotation FA, the Braves will have the cash to sign Smoltz to a one year contract that he deems respectable.
If the stars line up, Smoltz might remain healthy and give you a good year. JJJ might be better than last year. Campillo could be respectable. Glavine and Vazquez could give you a chance to win a game or two. Hansen may prove he’s ready for the big leagues. Spend some of the money you were planning to spend on pitching this year for a bat or two. Who knows? Decent, not great, pitching and improved offense might put you in the playoff hunt.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 10:04 PM | Link to this
N8
But the above statement you made is EXACTLY why you don’t even attempt to compete next year, if Burnett is missed out on.
The thing is, Wren’s already said that they expect to compete. It would look pretty bad if they ended up backing away from that statement if they missed out on AJ. I’m not sure if they would trade a few top prospects for a pitcher, my guess is “no” for certain guys, “yes” for others. And by “top prospects”, I mean a guy like Freddie Freeman or Jordan Schafer or Gorkys Hernandez. Those guys are top prospects. Just not on the level of Heyward or Hanson, who are elite, damn near can’t miss prospects.
By Marty
December 10, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this
N8 - You can’t be serious in thinking that Putz would somehow increase the Mets’ win total by 10. Even if you assume that 2008 was a fluke for Putz (whereas his career stats imply that 2006-07 may have been the fluke), it’s ludicrous that adding a setup guy would increase a team’s win total by 10.
By kirkinga
December 10, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this
We can’t get a starter to sign on, and the Mets are about to acquire a 2nd closer to go with the best closer in baseball that they just signed. N8
With all due respect,Mariano Rivera is still the best closer in baseball.
And let’s not forget that if our pen is healthy, Gonzo, Soriano, Moylan, Boyer and Acosta are as strong and deep a group as there is in baseball.
If they are healthy and aren’t asked to pitch as many innings as last year, the Braves pen is a strength and certainly much better than we’ve had in seasons pasts.
By Marty
December 10, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this
Night, McFann.
By BravesFanChris24
December 10, 2008 10:08 PM | Link to this
DOB
If that’s the case, could some bridges be burnt?
By ric flair
December 10, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
DOB what about Ben Sheets? Why not? He is injury prone just like AJ Burnett. And he would be cheaper!!!
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
**Wren is about 24 hours away from failure if he doesn’t step up to the plate and hit a homer.
I don’t understand how he can be so casual about doing nothing. Peavey should have been singed weeks ago.**
By MiamiBrave
December 10, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this
Man, just not a good day of info coming out of the winter meetings today…
I have not been productive at all, between the ol’ blog and other rumor sites, I can’t get any work done…
Here’s (optimistically) hoping that something good comes out of the final day of meetings…
anyone else like to hear that the Bravos have contacted Towers on Peavy or vice versa? I know I b*hed about how I didn’t want Peavy anymore lol but this Burnett to the Yankees thing doesn’t help the situation…we need an ace (what’s that, it’s been mentioned? my bad…)
I know that if we can pick up an ace, we could seriously have a sick rotation IF Smoltzie can go out there and start about 25 games
Burnett/Peavy, Smoltz, JJ, JV, Hanson/Glavine
that would be a nice rotation coming out of spring training…ah the dreams a Braves fan has…
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this
While I don’t agree with N8 that Putz will add 10 wins, he is going to help the Mets bullpen, and if you don’t think so, you didn’t watch the Mets pen in the second half of last year.
By Sweatin' to the Oldies by Richard Simmons
December 10, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this
Apparently, the Yankees are overpaying CC Sabathia by the pound. He will suck anyway since the Brewers used him every other day like a little league ace on the way to Williamsport last season. Idiots bidding against themselves.
By Anders
December 10, 2008 10:18 PM | Link to this
Efrim
Did you hear Minaya with Fransesca on the FAN at 6:00? He said all he’s focused on is pitching. He intimated that he was looking at the possibility of a trade and another signing. Not one or the other but both. He also said he thought he could get a number 2 or 3 starter, not just a number 4 or 5. He also said he wasn’t done in the bullpen. (No suprise there). He told Mike there is a lot of interest in Heilman by other teams. I’m guessing that may be the Seattle hook.
Also on the Mets hot stove report on FSNY tonight the Newsday writer said that Minaya was talking to the beat writers in his suite this evening when his phone rang. He excused himself, picked up his laptop and took three of his lieutenants (the writers words not mine) into the next room. The writer said the feeling was something hot was going on.
The Mets are absolutely serious about addressing their pitching.
We have two first place teams in the NFL in NY and they can’t get baseball off the back page of the newspapers in December. There is huge money at stake for the Mets and Yanks to stay competitive. That’s why they’re willing to spend what they do.
By ChrisfromSacramento
December 10, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this
The hell with it. Build from within. Sign Smoltz, save the money for next year. Build the farm system. Keep our young guys. Let them learn how to win. Mother F* the Yankees, Mets, Sox. May them all go to hell.
GOD I HATE THE METS!!
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 10:23 PM | Link to this
*By Marty
December 10, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this
Please, those of you who have anointed this season a failure for Wren, explain to us what he should have done. Should he have kidnapped Peavy? Perhaps Wren should have offered Sabathia $400 million and partial ownership in the team. How will overpaying for a fragile Burnett, if he spurns the Braves’ generous offer and takes a ridiculous one from the Yankees, make the offseason a success?
Have some sense. Wren is doing the best he can with the available options.*
Well said Marty, well said.
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this
DOB - I know we have had some updates about the Braves situation, but it just seems less than other clubs; is that just because they have always been so tight lipped about what is going on?
Like we hear the Yankees are being so aggressive, but if we are in that big of a need of an ace, why are we not hearing more?
I know thats stingy but i believe thats a right we have as fans.
Love your blogs by the way.
By brian
December 10, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this
no way the Braves get into a bidding war with the Red Sox for Lowe. How about Boras getting the Yankees to sign Lowe so they will leave Burnett alone?
I would sign Lowe to a 3 year contract if he will let Jurrjens sign with the Braves before hitting free agency.
And yes, that is how much I want to sign Lowe. Zip
By brian
December 10, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this
no way the Braves get into a bidding war with the Red Sox for Lowe. How about Boras getting the Yankees to sign Lowe so they will leave Burnett alone?
I would sign Lowe to a 3 year contract if he will let Jurrjens sign with the Braves before hitting free agency.
And yes, that is how much I want to sign Lowe. Zip
By jj
December 10, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this
Don’t feel bad— Be Happy—you can always go to the park and pull for our star LF Frenchy.
By Salty Dawg
December 10, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this
DOB
Any chance the Braves will sign me this winter? I’ve never pitched before, but I would be remarkably cheaper than the FA’s currently available. And let’s be honest, the market is pretty thin these days. They need me on the roster and I would be willing to play for free beer and a parking pass. Can you make a call for me?
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 10:34 PM | Link to this
Thundersticks, kidnap Peavey? That deal should have been made. There were many times after their negotiations stopped that a phone call from Wren could have jumped started that deal. Is it a pride thing? I don’t know, but I do know there were several times when Towers would have taken Wrens offer after the Braves “pulled out”. We need an ace, period. Wren acts sooo casual about doing nothing and that frustrates me.
By Salty Dawg
December 10, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this
Please, those of you who have anointed this season a failure for Wren, explain to us what he should have done. Should he have kidnapped Peavy?
That’s actually not a bad idea. Anybody got a black van with tinted windows available for hire?
Perhaps Wren should have offered Sabathia $400 million and partial ownership in the team.
My people tell me that Wren hasn’t ruled that out just yet. First he wants to see if the deal could be done for $300M and replacing the giant cow with a 40ft CC statue that spits fire after every strikeout. I’m told CC is fond of the idea.
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this
DOB
Have you been able to confirm exactly what the Braves’ current offer is to AJ? I’ve seen mixed reports of 4/60 here and 5/80 there.
By the way, it was great to hear you on the radio with Shanks this afternoon.
Thanks!!!
By LTBravesFan
December 10, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this
Just because we are not hearing about stuff doesnt mean there is not mean there isnt anything going on..
By Voice of Reason
December 10, 2008 10:45 PM | Link to this
DMBJAMS:There were many times after their negotiations stopped that a phone call from Wren could have jumped started that deal. Is it a pride thing? I don’t know, but I do know there were several times when Towers would have taken Wrens offer after the Braves “pulled out”.
Wow… you were there? You were that intimately involved? Towers has you in his “fave five” or something?
By C-ville Ranger
December 10, 2008 10:46 PM | Link to this
I’m the former and hopefully future A-ville Ranger.Now on to baseball.The one player the team should absolutely get signed is Smoltz.If he gets healthy he will be a #1 and could be the bridge till the young farm stud is ready.
Let me add my two cents on Maddux.He was the best baseball player I’ve had the privaledge to watch.I don’t expect to ever see his equal again.
By fastasballs
December 10, 2008 10:46 PM | Link to this
Efrim
I agree with you on AJ, but the Braves don’t need to overpay, or maybe they will HAVE to overpay in order to sign him. Regardless I don’t see a lot of hope for next season with or without AJ.
The Mets are getting stronger by the day & Phillies will just as good as last season.
If AJ can’t be signed I hope they just sign someone like Perez or a short term deal with Sheets. Roll the dice, but don’t gut the farm in the process.
I’m just getting a bad feeling that if AJ isn’t signed Wren starts trading instead of accepting the fate of 2009 as a rebuilding year.
How much pressure is Liberty putting on Wren to compete in 2009 instead of building for 2010 & beyond? I’m guessing we’ll know by spring training, maybe sooner.
By mb
December 10, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this
DOB, I think the Braves should let Burnett go to the Yankees if it’s going to cost 5 yrs guaranteed for $91M. He’s not worth it! He has a career ERA near 4.0, he has been on the disable list too much and he has only started 30 games in a season twice in his career. His two best years came right before he signed a new contract. Let him go!!!
As much as I dislike Scott Boras, I would pursue Derrick Lowe. He has started over 30 games the past 7 years with a better ERA than Burnett. In addition we could offer him a 3 year contract, let’s all say it together “Insurance.” Not that the Braves payroll is my problem, it’s something they are going to consider. Lowe is going to give you 14 or 15 wins and if our bullpen holds up and we actually score some runs, maybe 17 or 18 wins. Plus he has playoff experience and winning a world series.
If we sign Lowe I would still try to get another pitcher, preferrably a left hand starter, Wolf or Perez will do. The savings from not signing Burnett will pay about half the salary of another pitcher.
Starting rotating, 1. Lowe,2. Jurrjens, 3. Vazquez, 4. Wolf, 5.(Smoltz/Reyes/Morton/Hanson)?
With this line up we would have additional trade bait with Reyes and Morton.
This is just some of my thoughts after sitting back and thinking about the crazy contract offers on Burnett.
Thanks MB
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this
*By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 10:34 PM | Link to this
Thundersticks, kidnap Peavey? That deal should have been made. There were many times after their negotiations stopped that a phone call from Wren could have jumped started that deal. Is it a pride thing? I don’t know, but I do know there were several times when Towers would have taken Wrens offer after the Braves “pulled out”. We need an ace, period. Wren acts sooo casual about doing nothing and that frustrates me.*
So your suggestion is just call up Towers and give him whatever he wants? The reason the Braves “pulled out” is because Towers kept changing his mind about what he wanted. Wren worked on this for over a month, trying to reach an agreement, and its his fault? Give me a break.
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this
John Smoltz will be the Braves ace in 2009, if Wren can swing that deal.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 10:50 PM | Link to this
Anders
I hear ya on the Mets. Didn’t hear Minaya on the FAN though. Looks like you guys may be getting Putz, Jeremy Reed and Sean Green for Joe Smith, Aaron Heilman, Mike Carp and Endy Chavez. Not too bad man.
By Efrim
December 10, 2008 10:51 PM | Link to this
Perhaps the Braves could sign Sheets and then trade for another starter without having to give up too much from the top prospects pool? Just thinking out loud here. Losing out on Burnett would, well, suck.
By Bhank
December 10, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this
It looks as if the Yankees really want this guy and will pull out all of the AJ stops. Do the Braves really need a power outfielder? Seriously, let’s look at this a different way. What if they began to look at speed and table setters like they worked to create in the early 90’s. Face it, our offense didn’t make anyone nervous and always waiting on 3-run homers from a team that doesn’t hit many won’t put fans in the stands. Now making other pitchers nervous and creating an energy and buzz around the field will. There are a bunch of second tier pitchers out there I know Leo could have whipped into shape and maybe Roger could too.
By Time To Punt?
December 10, 2008 10:56 PM | Link to this
The theme song of this blog should be,
“The Girls All Get Prettier At Closing Time!”
Actually, if the FA pitching market was a group of ladies, we’d be rating them about a “6.” You have to rate the candidates by track record, durability, miles on their arm, and what it would take to sign them. CC has thrown 192-241-253 innings the last three years. Thats a lot of miles on a fat boy. Seven years, 161 mil? Good luck with getting 7 productive years out of a guy who throws a lot of innings and weighs 300 lbs. Lowe wants a contract that takes him ‘til age 40 and pays him lots of money. AJ? five years and 80-90 mil? Since AJ became a regular starter in 2001, he’s thrown 200 innings 3 times. The other 5 out of 8 years he’s thrown 173—165—120—23—135. Folks, that says that this guy is only going to be totally healthy 3 out of 8 seasons. That’s less than 50%. So we want to give him 5 years and 80-90 mil? Ben Sheets? Geez, haven’t we had enough experience watching pitchers sit more than they stand?
The only real mistake made in the off season by the Braves was Wren stating that the Braves were going after two front of the rotation starters. I bet he wished he had tempered that statement with something just indicating that the Braves were going to try and strengthen their rotation.
I just hope Wren doesn’t feel pressured to make a move because of his offseason statements.
Frank….don’t drink too many beers and think those ugly women who are still around at closing time don’t look too bad after all!
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 10:56 PM | Link to this
*By Salty Dawg
December 10, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this
Please, those of you who have anointed this season a failure for Wren, explain to us what he should have done. Should he have kidnapped Peavy?
That’s actually not a bad idea. Anybody got a black van with tinted windows available for hire?
Perhaps Wren should have offered Sabathia $400 million and partial ownership in the team.
My people tell me that Wren hasn’t ruled that out just yet. First he wants to see if the deal could be done for $300M and replacing the giant cow with a 40ft CC statue that spits fire after every strikeout. I’m told CC is fond of the idea.*
That is just too funny!!!!
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this
I believe the deal could’ve been done with less than the braves initially offered.
There have been weeks since the negotiations stalled that we could have picked up JP.
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 11:01 PM | Link to this
*By Bhank
December 10, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this
It looks as if the Yankees really want this guy and will pull out all of the AJ stops. Do the Braves really need a power outfielder? Seriously, let’s look at this a different way. What if they began to look at speed and table setters like they worked to create in the early 90’s. Face it, our offense didn’t make anyone nervous and always waiting on 3-run homers from a team that doesn’t hit many won’t put fans in the stands. Now making other pitchers nervous and creating an energy and buzz around the field will. There are a bunch of second tier pitchers out there I know Leo could have whipped into shape and maybe Roger could too.*
I agree. Besides Furcal, what speedsters are out there?
By Pickens
December 10, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this
I hate to say it but it looks like 2009 will be a rebuilding year. Even if AJ came here i thought we still needed another pitcher in the rotation and a power hitting outfielder. But the real question is if the organization and the fans have what it takes to accept 09’ as a rebuilding year…??
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 11:08 PM | Link to this
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this
I believe the deal could’ve been done with less than the braves initially offered.
There have been weeks since the negotiations stalled that we could have picked up JP.
Just exactly how do you figure that?
By Voice of Reason
December 10, 2008 11:09 PM | Link to this
By DMBJAMS December 10, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this I believe the deal could’ve been done with less than the braves initially offered.
Wha?
Seriously, I don’t rag on folks here, ‘cause I think folks are entitled to opine any way they want, but your posts tonight have just been WAY out there, dude. WAY out there…
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 11:13 PM | Link to this
Gah ppl.. do you think they’re stopping the off season after tonight or something. some of you ppl are acting like there is no tomorrow or heck, even a next week etc. Season is lost? Come on…
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 11:15 PM | Link to this
**This just in at MLBTR:
9:57pm: Tony Massarotti indicates the Red Sox are out and Burnett will choose between the Yankees and Braves. Jerry Crasnick says that if the Yankees sign Burnett, a third free agent rotation addition would likely be a short-term guy like Ben Sheets as opposed to Derek Lowe.**
Looks like it is down to the Yankees and Braves. On the bright side, if we lose out on AJ, we may have a shot at Lowe - although he is represented by Bor a$$.
By brian
December 10, 2008 11:17 PM | Link to this
I agree that the Braves priority should be and by all accounts is pitching and not a power bat. Getting one more top flight pitcher is very important for the Braves. Overpaying a little for AJ is acceptible because one we are definitely in need and two he will not cost us our farm system. If AJ goes elsewhere and the Sheets market stays flat the Braves may try a shorter contract which will pay Sheets well while giving him a chance to really establish himself for the next contract. Otherwise Wren will have to get creative.
The Braves can win with pitching and defense. As far as offense, it would be a refreshing change to see a team that gets on base and manufactures runs. Good fundamentals (I wonder if anyone learned how to bunt this offseason) and speed could replace power. Anderson in LF, Schafer in CF, and the rest of the positions unchanged. For that to work though we would have to have the pitching.
By Anders
December 10, 2008 11:18 PM | Link to this
Efrim
I didn’t hear that whole deal. Where did you see that? I was busy watching my Rangers tonight. I hate to give up Chavez. Especially with Tatis and Murphy as a platoon in left. Chavez is a great late inning replacement. But… it is all about the bullpen this off season.
As for those on here that are saying if the Yanks get Burnett then Wren should go after Lowe. There’s no way the Red Sox will miss out on Lowe if the Yanks sign CC and Burnett.
I’m really baffled at why Wren walked from the Peavy talks? Sounds like Towers was being an a$$ but so what? I still say you leave the thought in Burnetts head that the Braves could trade for Peavy. Anyway, you think the Braves will consider Perez if all else fails? I’m thinking 4 years at $55 mil with a 5th option might get him. I wouldn’t rule the Mets out on OP.
By Grab Some Bats
December 10, 2008 11:19 PM | Link to this
Grab some bats this year. There are more options available in that department and it’s more affordable than pitching to boot. Put together your offense this season. Target next off season to evaluate what you have and pick up the pitching you need then. Hanson should be ready. Hudson should be back. JJJ another year wiser and more experienced. Vazquez will still be a #4-#5.
I can live with 2009 being a strengthening process, building for 2010.
By Thundersticks
December 10, 2008 11:20 PM | Link to this
**This just in from Ken Rosenthal:
UPDATED 10:50 p.m. — Yanks boost offer to Burnett The Yankees have increased their offer to A.J. Burnett to include a fifth year, according to a major-league source. That development was first reported by ESPN.com. The offer is for $91 million, according to a major-league executive.
The team is apparently not content to stop at CC Sabathia and is in active discussions with Burnett, Derek Lowe, and Andy Pettitte.
A source told Gerry Fraley earlier Wednesday that Burnett, who is seeking a five-year deal, has an $80 million offer from the Braves. He presumably would want more from the Yankees.
The Yankees are “progressing” in their discussions with Lowe, according to a major-league source. Another source, however, says reports that the team is close with Lowe are overblown.
Lowe is expected to receive a deal for between three and five years with an average of around $17 million per year.
The Yankees could possibly sign two out of those three, though it is unclear what exact direction they will go.**
If this is accurate, I say see ya!!
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 11:21 PM | Link to this
I think Wren should have and could have signed Peavey, what’s “way out there” about that?
I’ve read a couple of articles where Towers quotes sounded almost desperate. I think Wren could have exploited that a bit. I think Towers may have taken the deal Wren offered to begin with had negotiations resumed. Did that clear my opinion up?
By tlj
December 10, 2008 11:21 PM | Link to this
MLTR is reporting John Hayman at Sports Illustrated advised the yankee offer for AJ is 5 years at $ 80 Mil. Braves offer is the 4 year $ 60 with an option for a 5 th year. Hayman wasn’t sure if the braves would match NY offer.
If that is true, Wren needs to contact AJ agent and ask if AJ wants to pitch in Atl. If so match or increase the offer a little and get him signed. If he is not interested in Atl, then Wren will have to look someplace else.
MLTR also listed sources indicating the Peavy to the Cubs is in trouble. The hang up appears to Marquis salary and the fact the Cubs do not want to trade DeRosa. Towers stated he might have to pick up some of Marquis salary.
I don’t know if Peavy wants to pitch in Atl or not but why list Atl on his original list. It looks like Wren maybe should re visit the Peavy trade. Talk with Towers and see if Peavy will approve a trade with Atl and if so put the original package on the table. Good chance Towers will take it this time.
It appears the second tier and third tier pitching will soon start signing. We may have to go with what we have. I wish we could get AJ or Peavy and the power OF. It would be nice christmas present.
Good night all.
By BravesFanChris24
December 10, 2008 11:23 PM | Link to this
The 3 way between Mets/Mariners/Indians is official. It was posted on MLB.com first now it’s on MLBTR.
By GSU-Lee
December 10, 2008 11:27 PM | Link to this
DOB, if the Yankees did in fact offer Burnett 5 yrs/80 Mill, do you think the Braves will meet or surpass that offer? And if not and he signs there, who is more likely to end up in Atlanta- Lowe or Peavy?
By Bubdylan
December 10, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this
Please, no higher on A.J. Let’s just pick up a servicable veteran and have a low-expectation year. Who knows, maybe the team will just play better.
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 11:31 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Good job holding your water and not giving us this quote earlier today:
(Chipper) Jones added, “He (A.J. Burnett) did say if he plays in the National League, it’ll only be with us. But he said he enjoys pitching in the American League because he doesn’t have to hit and doesn’t have to run the bases, and he can concentrate on pitching.”
I wonder what the denizens think about that last sentence.
By Voice of Reason
December 10, 2008 11:31 PM | Link to this
By DMBJAMS December 10, 2008 11:21 PM | Link to this I think Wren should have and could have signed Peavey, what’s “way out there” about that?
Oh, I don’t know… How about Peavy’s not a free agent and therefore cannot be signed?
By BravesFanChris24
December 10, 2008 11:32 PM | Link to this
Just read that the deal will be final pending physicals for three of the players involved which are Green, Carp and Reed.
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 11:33 PM | Link to this
Looks like I’m not the only one. Thanks, tlj.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 11:36 PM | Link to this
Peavy never wanted to come to Atlanta. Have you been reading the news here? Kevin Towers, Peavy and his agent were just working and using the Braves to try to get more for Peavy from the Cubs, which is where he wanted to go anyway
What? What??
Peavy listed Atlanta as one of the only five teams he’d waive his no-trade to go to.
Towers said from the beginning that the Cubs didn’t have enough talent to get a deal done.
Towers had said very, very early that the Braves had the best offer available.
Towers is ringing phones like mad trying to find enough players to make a trade work.
How in the hell is it possible to conclude Towers was merely trying to squeeze more out of the Cubs this entire time… since the beginning of October?
Efrim: You seem really disappointed in the potential non-acquisition of Burnett. More so than the failure of the Peavy deal. Is this merely because of Yunel?
If Wren doesn’t get his two “top of the rotation starters and a power bat in the outfield” this off-season will be a failure. It will be a failure based on the terms Wren set up himself. And so far, he is looking at turning in 2 of 3 at best, and that would requiring getting a legit bat and bonafide ace. Vazquez is not a top of the rotation starter, but his acquisition has cramped the possibility of Wren actually acquiring two top of the rotation starters. But the truth is, Ankiel isn’t a legit bat. Neigher is Hardy, Ludwick, or pretty much any other name thrown out there.
I’m not “down” on the team because of this. I thought this shopping list was too large to fill in one off-season any way. But Wren defined success prior to the off-season and now that is what he has to be measured against.
By Anders
December 10, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
*thundersticks8
I’ve been telling you guys for months that the Yanks were going to spend like never before. It’s the perfect storm for them. They missed the playoffs for the first time in 15 years. Their plans to go with the kid pitching staff bombed. They watched the guy they let go to the Mets have a Cy Young type season 7 miles away. They have huge payroll coming off the books. They’re moving into a brand new stadium. The young Steinbrenners finally have the keys to the kingdom.
How can anyone be suprised at how they’re going about their business? They say it’s about the championships and there is some truth to that, but at all costs it’s about being the most talked about , envied, hated and popular franchise worldwide in sports that gives them their true value.
They can’t risk becoming irrelavent even for a season.
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
Even after the Yankees up the offer, Wren says that they “are still in it” for Burnett services. This is on the AJC’s sports homepage.
http://www.ajc.com/braves/content/sports/braves/stories/2008/12/10/bravesyankeesburnett.html
By The Goche
December 10, 2008 11:39 PM | Link to this
I think the best idea for LF might be Ty Wigginton.
He’s primarily a 3b, but he played a fair amount of LF too. He hit 25 HR last year, he kills lefties and he is solid against righties.
The Astros are looking to deal him, and he’s not too expensive.
He’s no superstar, but he’s better than the other options, in that he actually does kind of fit.
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 11:39 PM | Link to this
Voice Of Reason, you know what the hell I meant. The deal should have been done.
By Grab Some Bats
December 10, 2008 11:40 PM | Link to this
Grab some bats this year. There are more options available in that department and it’s more affordable than pitching to boot. Put together your offense this season. Target next off season to evaluate what you have and pick up the pitching you need then. Hanson should be ready. Hudson should be back. JJJ another year wiser and more experienced. Vazquez will still be a #4-#5.
I can live with 2009 being a strengthening process, building for 2010.
By Jay
December 10, 2008 11:41 PM | Link to this
Mets get get Putz, Jeremy Reed and Sean Green for Heilman, Joe Smith, Mike Carp and Endy Chavez.
By The Goche
December 10, 2008 11:42 PM | Link to this
He may be only a little better than Diaz, but he’s got lots more power.
Plus he’s got some utility qualities. When we play lefties he could even play 2b or spell Chipper at 3rd if necessary with Diaz playing left.
By Ron Roberts
December 10, 2008 11:42 PM | Link to this
Efrim ya pulled one statement from my much-longer post and distorted the thought process altogether, friend.
I’d rather go w/the rotation I cited in 2009 then overpay for Burnett after a p!$$ing match w/the Yankees and I’d rather go w/the rotation I cited in 2009 than plucking our farm system bare (again) for somebody elses questionable #2 guy in some blockbust(er) deal.
Does that mean we’re playoff threats in ‘09? Maybe not; but we keep Hanson, we keep our OF up-and-comers intact, we keep our productive middle infield, and to me, that’s a damn fine start towards another long run of playoff baseball at the ‘Ted.
And frankly, I’ll take my chances on the gritty Smoltz over “Breakdown” Ben Sheets, or Derek (we’re starting to reach even) Lowe(r) or A.J. Burnett. We’re talking about spending at least #10+ million a year for any one of those guys, who are/were damaged goods with spotty histories of health and success.
A bidding war for Derek Lowe? The Dodgers #2 from the past few years? A bidding war for A.J. Burnett when he wasn’t Toronto’s ace??? Really? I’ll pass and let our youth be served and our history be honored in 2009.
By elliwg6
December 10, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this
DMBJAMS
Wren should have and could have signed Peavey, what’s “way out there” about that?
Maybe people would take you more seriously if you didn’t consistently misspell the name of the player of which you seem so enamored.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 11:47 PM | Link to this
And maybe if you didn’t say he could have “signed” the guy who’s name you misspell.
By TennesseePaul
December 10, 2008 11:48 PM | Link to this
Wren says that they “are still in it”
We’ll see. Even if Wren ends the off-season with acquiring Carl Pavano and Willie Bloomquist he’d spin it as a success. I’ve never heard a Braves official take a different position. Not even when they signed Mark Redman.
By fastasballs
December 10, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this
Sooner or later I guess we’ll find out what actually went down with Wren & Towers regarding Peavy.
If anyone has appeared to be a flake it is Towers, who has contradicted himself countless times to the media.
If the Braves were on Peavy’s trade to list then he would have accepted a trade here. I’m also not buying that the Braves would balk at giving him a no trade claus. That was more of a JS thing than a team policy.
I truely think Towers kept trying to up the ante with Wren. Obviously Wren got sick of it & left the table. After that there has been zero negotiations to my knowledge.
If the Cubs thing falls apart, which it is looking that way, does Wren & Towers end their Mexican standoff?
If Peavy has changed his mind about coming to Atlanta then so be it, but I have not seen him, Towers or his agent say he wouldn’t accept a trade here. It’s been speculated he wouldn’t, but to my knowledge it’s not been anyone credible.
If the Cubs trade drys up Towers is either stuck with Peavy & his contract or he will come back to Wren. I don’t see any other options.
By Grab Some Bats
December 10, 2008 11:53 PM | Link to this
It’s a gamble but IF…. Smoltz is healthy and capable, sign him and forget AJ or any of the other mediocre pitching superstars out there. I would rather have Smoltz for one year than AJ for five.
If Smoltz is healthy, no reason to think he won’t be effective. You would have him, JJJ, Vazquez, Campillo, and maybe Glavine/Hanson.
What does signing Smoltz for one year over AJ for five years buy you? It buys you entering the FA pitching market next year instead of this year when you won’t be bidding against the Yankees who will be all in on two or three long term pitching contracts already. Perhaps next years pitching crop will be better. How does Beckett, Lacky, Brandon Webb and names like that strike you? (of course some of those guys have option years)
By DMBJAMS
December 10, 2008 11:55 PM | Link to this
Burned. I’m an idiot. Sorry for trying to discuss with you fine people.
By GTgirl
December 10, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this
UPDATED 11:25 — Yanks can have one, not both The Yankees will not sign both A.J. Burnett and Derek Lowe, according to a major-league source. They can sign one of the aformentioned pitchers, and Andy Pettitte or another free-agent pitcher. They’ve also spoken to Ben Sheets.
This is according to Ken Rosenthal’s post.
By David O'Brien
December 10, 2008 11:57 PM | Link to this
GTGirl, do you really not understand why teams such as the Yankees and Mets have so much of their business played out in public, and why they’re in so many more rumors, as opposed to the Braves?
Real simple: Both of those clubs, and a few others, are in huge markets and have long operated with a strategy of using the media as part of their negotiations and also to compete with each other for space on the back page, to always let people know they’re trying to do everything possible to get better, etc. And the rumors, many of them unfounded, are a natural byproduct of the sheer number of reporters covering those teams, in addition to the above-mentioned philosophy that involves leaks to the media, tidbits thrown their way, etc.
Braves have always done their business with a belief that it’s better to keep most everything private and not confirm or deny rumors, etc.
Sorry if you feel that as a fan you’re entitled to more, but you can get water from a rock. If there are no leaks in an organization, as there really haven’t been today on this offer thing, then you have to rely on getting them from the other side, from agents, from other teams involved in the same player, etc. Makes it a lot tougher than having someone in an organization just feed rumors and updates to reporters, as so often happens with some teams.
By Chop Chop
December 10, 2008 11:58 PM | Link to this
MLB Trade Rumors posted a link to this gem of a story from the San Jose Mercury News:
Brian Sabean goes crazy on the media.
By Voice of Reason
December 11, 2008 12:00 AM | Link to this
DMBJAMS:
I’ll give you this much, the deal should have been done for the right price. Numerous reports have stated that the 2 teams agreed on the final players to be sent, and Towers reneged at the last minute and asked for one more piece. I’ll refer you to the following article:
The Braves devoted six weeks and two days toward attempting to complete that trade and, in the final hours before pulling out of the talks, thought they were about to close the deal.
The Padres, though, continued to change the names they were requesting, according to sources. And just when San Diego was expected to request that the pitcher waive his no-trade clause in a deal that would have sent pitcher Charlie Morton, shortstop Yunel Escobar, reliever Blaine Boyer and minor-league outfielder Gorkys Hernandez to the Padres, the San Diego front-office shifted yet again.
Frustrated, the Braves finally pulled out of the talks and turned their attention elsewhere. –Scott Miller, CBSSportsLine.com
Frank Wren could have chosen to play that kinda game all winter, but wisely chose to move on. Can you honestly say that it is Wren’s pride preventing a deal from transpiring?
I’d do the deal today for Yunel, Morton, Boyer and Hernandez, so we do have common ground. Where we disagree is your belief that Wren somehow screwed the deal…
By brent a.
December 11, 2008 12:03 AM | Link to this
Wren said, “We think we’re still in it. We have no reason to believe we’re not.”
The power of the actual quote is more telling than the snippet from the headline.
By Chipper 4 MVP
December 11, 2008 12:08 AM | Link to this
FRANK WREN, go over to Towers door, drop down on your knees and beg like a little baby for him to take his deal.
DOB, go tell Frank that you will even add a new blog just to Towers telling everyone how smart he was for taking this deal, that might be the deal breaker =]!!
By GTgirl
December 11, 2008 12:08 AM | Link to this
Thanks DOB, yeah i undertand the bigger market thing and how the Yankees do business; i was actually just asking to make sure there are more to these meeting on the Braves point than what we are hearing. Thanks again
By Life Is Not Fair
December 11, 2008 12:08 AM | Link to this
DOB, How do the Yankees go begging to Bloomberg to float another 240,000,000 bond issue for the stadium and then turn around and do these deals? Would that be like you and I going to our parents and asking them for a 100,000 to close on a million dollar house, they give us the loan and then we go buy 250,000 in furniture. I don’t blame Wren or the Braves ownership for any of this. Sometimes the rules/circumstances are just so skewed that you can’t compete. Is it fair that Kentucky and Vandy must compete with Florida in football or Miss St must compete with Alabama? Just realize there is a really good chance AJ blows his arm out and CC’s early onset obesity could lead to all types of injuries. This might become very entertaining.
By Voice of Reason
December 11, 2008 12:15 AM | Link to this
CC’s early onset obesity
LOL!
By Brett Michaels
December 11, 2008 12:15 AM | Link to this
The only CC I need is CC Deville of Poison
By Interested Observer
December 11, 2008 12:16 AM | Link to this
Everyone should know that it wouldn’t be like the Braves to complete a major transaction while DOB is on scence ready to go. They only do the big deals on DOB’s day off, during a KU basketball game, or when DOB has plans to go to a concert. So give it a few more days!
By JasonInFL (formerly ME)
December 11, 2008 12:20 AM | Link to this
Has FW talked to AJ’s agent today? I am still baffled by the fact that Wren and Towers haven’t at least touched based at the meetings…ridiculous really.
By DMBJAMS
December 11, 2008 12:20 AM | Link to this
Voice Of Reason
I don’t think it’s Wrens fault that the negotiations stopped. Hell, I was singing his praise for not selling the farm. I just think talks could have and should have resumed. Hell, all the articles I’ve read on the subject make it seem like Wren & Towers aren’t even on speaking terms. The line “Mexican standoff” is exactly what this seems like, and that takes two.
By N8
December 11, 2008 12:22 AM | Link to this
Marty
I didn’t say that adding Putz adds 10 wins to the Mets total. I said that adding a 2nd closer to go with the closer (K-Rod) they added yesterday, would add 10 wins to their total.
As for explaining what Wren could have done differently? How about NOT publicly claim he was gonna add two “top of the rotation” starters? How about go about your business in a quiet, snake, stealth like manner that JS did, often making a trade out of nowhere that nobody saw coming? Instead, he raised the bar for himself, and the expectations of the homers that actually thought he’d put some all-stars back on our roster.
Instead, he’s acquired Javier Vazquez. A move so stunning, he forgot the dudes name and called him Javy Lopez at the press conference.
If you’ve paid any attention to my angle all off-season, it’s been that of riding out 2009 and moving forward with youth, and letting them gain experience. Even if it means taking their lumps.
He’s got anywhere from 40-50 million to spend and NOBODY wants to take any of it. THAT ALONE should let you know what the rest of MLB and the current free agents and their agents thinks is going down in Atlanta.
Wren needs to accept it, put his arms around it, and go forward and build his OWN empire like JS took all the credit for, when Bobby was the GM before him. JS left some nice pieces of the puzzle for him to build upon. All he has to do is wait for them to come up and contribute, and get rid of the right guys and he’ll look like a genius.
kirkinga
Mariano Rivera WAS the best closer in post-season history (might still be), but all due respect to your “all due respect” Trevor Hoffman is the saves leader, and look what he’s become the past couple of years.
Mo might very well have a few good years left in him, but denying that K-Rod is the most electric closer in baseball is just silly.
Also, while you are correct, if Soriano and Gonzo are both healthy, our bullpen will still be VERY GOOD….. until about August when they’re tired from being over-used. LOL!
But the comment wasn’t about how good the Mets bullpen was/is compared to ours. It was about how the Mets still finished 18 games ahead of us, with the 4th worst bullpen in baseball. NOW they’ve addressed that. You can’t deny that the Mets are a better team than they were yesterday by adding K-Rod, can you?
Anders
For once (OK, it’s happened more than once), I actually agree with you. The Yankees could risk being the 2nd most relevant team in NY, and are throwing their weight around. Similar to a guy that comes into an open poker game where the initial buy in was 50 dollars and buys 500 dollars worth of chips. Then starts going ALL IN on every hand to scare the crap out of everybody at the table.
By kris
December 11, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this
If we don’t get Burnett or Peavy, I don’t know how this offseason is not looked at as a complete and utter failure. jmo
By Joe
December 11, 2008 12:30 AM | Link to this
I’ am a Braves fan but if The Yankees offer AJ Burnett more money I would take that deal and plus The Yankees have a better shot at going to the playoffs than the Braves.
If I was GM Frank Wren I would give AJ Burnett a time frame in making his choice cause if the braves keep waiting for him to choose they could be losing out on other players waiting for AJ.
GM Frank Wren should call back The GM of The Chicago White Sox and work out a deal and try to get Jermaine Dye then after that they should call work out a deal with free agent picture John Garland.
By Nick
December 11, 2008 12:36 AM | Link to this
IMO not overpaying for a player is not a failure. It means that Wren is smart and doesn’t want to put all of his eggs in one basket. If we end up with Sheets or Oliver Perez on three year deals and maybe pick up a bat in a trade. This will leave us $$$ to offer Smoltz and Glavine decent deals to get us through 2009. Then when 2010 comes around we can make good offers to Webb, Lackey and others . That plus resigning Hudson and Chipper to finish out their careers here need to be taken into account as well.
Just field us a decent team that botth let’s the kids develop and provides longterm stability and/or get us through this year so we can foucs on 2010. The sky is not falling!!!!!!!!!
By Voice of Reason
December 11, 2008 12:45 AM | Link to this
DMBJAMS:
Towers tried to play Wren for and idiot and got VORPED. Now he gives varying versions of excuses to whichever media outlet will give him a forum in an attempt to save face. His trade market is quickly evaporating leaving him holding a contract he cannot afford.
The real truth is, if he could hold off until the July trade deadline, he’d probably get his max return.
By DMBJAMS
December 11, 2008 12:47 AM | Link to this
Great post, Nick.
By STU
December 11, 2008 12:49 AM | Link to this
THE YANKEES OFFER AJ 91 MILLION AND SAVE FRANK WREN’S JOB!!!
TRUST ME FOLKS. I AM THE BIGGEST BRAVE FAN IN TORONTO AND BURNETT IS NOT A MAN FOR US. INSIDE SOURCES FROM THE TEAM TELL ME LAST YEAR HE PITCHED THROUGH PAIN TO GET A GOOD DEAL ON THE OPEN MARKET. HE HAS BEEN ON THE DL 10 TIMES ALREADY - HIS ERA AND WHIP WERE AWFUL LAST SEASON, HE FALLS APART IN BIG GAMES AND HAS A TENDENCY TO GO TO SLEEP WITH BIG LEADS. NOT AN ACE AND NOT A BRAVE. NEVER.
By Jeff
December 11, 2008 12:50 AM | Link to this
First of all, Smoltz is pitching next year. The question is where? Glavine is pitching next year for the Braves. Wren needs to sign Smoltz — Now. If Wren gets Smoltz and Tommy back he can forget about pitching, if the Braves starting pitchers are Glavine, JJ, Smolz, Campillo and someone else. Our bullpen should be good. We need bats. We do not need Jake Peavy or Burnett. Lets sign our pitchers and get some hitters. Its not that hard to do.
By Bubdylan
December 11, 2008 12:57 AM | Link to this
I WANT TO BELIEVE YOU STU BUT CAN YOU GUESS WHY IT IS DIFFICULT?!!!!!!!
By Bubdylan
December 11, 2008 1:03 AM | Link to this
Jeff, …. nevermind.
By DMBJAMS
December 11, 2008 1:14 AM | Link to this
I will never underestimate John Smolz.
By Wayne in Utah
December 11, 2008 1:15 AM | Link to this
N8 Checked in real quick and saw your response to my comment to another impatient blogger.
As a former teacher, I guess you can assign a grade “to date” for a course (the off-season would be FW’s course).
But to be honest, the only grade that really counts at all is the final grade. So, to say he has been a failure so far is like saying to a student, “Hey, you screwed up a bit on that first quiz, and you have yet to take the next quiz or the final yet, so far you are a failure.”
The student could ace both other grades, and get a good score for the course.
What I am getting at is don’t be too quick to judge. To be honest, if FW doesn’t get that top of the rotation guy, it might not really be his fault. You can offer more than a player is worth, and if another teams comes along and offfers more than he is worth, plus 10%, is it your fault??? Not in my grade book.
I am with you that I would rather see us take a couple of fliers on 1 year contracts. Don’t know if the Braves are so inclined though.
Personally, I think Sheets might be a decent risk, depending on the yearly rate and # of years.
As for Vazquez, I think many took FW literally about two TOP of the rotation starters. I fully expected to get somebody like Peavy/Burnett/Sheets and then add another piece like Vazquez/Wolf/RJohnson. So, in my book he is scoring well so far.
Later, my friend. I really haven’t had much chance to give you much grief lately. Life is darned complicated lately. Hope that things are better for you these days!
By Wayne in Utah
December 11, 2008 1:19 AM | Link to this
Jeff Didn’t we try that last year?
Nick Dead on!
Bubdylan Close ‘er out strong tonight!
BTW, John Smoltz is going nowhere folks. Give it a rest!
By N8
December 11, 2008 1:27 AM | Link to this
Nick
That was a nice post. You seem to get it.
“Just field us a decent team that botth let’s the kids develop and provides longterm stability and/or get us through this year so we can foucs on 2010. The sky is not falling!!!!!!!!!”
I concur with that statement. That is EXACTLY what I would do. But Wren and the entire Braves organization stated at the beginning of the off-season that they wanted to add two “top of the rotation” starters, a power bat for LF and fortify the bullpen/bench areas.
Unless there is a trade out there, that we’re unaware of, Wren is gonna fall short of his statement. IE: Failure.
THAT being said, I’m OK with moving on with what we’ve got, maybe adding a guy like Randy Johnson for one year. It would do two things.
Give us a good arm (if healthy) for one year, which COULD result in over-achieving and a playoff push.
But in a worst case scenario, it offers a stop gap until Hanson is ready to be in the rotation for a full season, and until Hudson comes back. 2010 looks good either way.
Now, having said that, why on earth would Randy Johnson want to finish his career in Atlanta? It appears that NOBODY wants to come to Atlanta. LOL! Javy Lopez…er…Vazquez seemed elated. Of course his manager essentially called him a wuss. So ANY PLACE where Ozzie Guillen isn’t would have been fine with him.
Anything that went bad last year, did. This season is filled with many “if’s”:
IF Smoltz pitches well (in Atlanta), that is good.
IF Glavine pitches and is healthy, that is good (for the purpose of eating innings).
IF Chipper is healthy, that is good.
IF Francoeur rebounds, that is good.
IF Hanson isn’t out of his league, that is good.
IF Escobar can get over the fact that Brayan Pena isn’t coming back, that is good.
IF Vazquez is rejuvinated upon his return to the NL, that is good.
IF Gonzo, Soriano, and Moylan remain healthy, that is good.
IF we get anything from Hudson late in the year, that is good.
IF Wren makes NO MORE moves (and I suspect many minor moves are coming), and things go as well in 2009 as they did BAD in 2008, we could win 95 games.
However, if all of the above mentioned “ifs” don’t go so well, we might lose 100 games.
By ccrider
December 11, 2008 1:27 AM | Link to this
I have watched the on-going moves so far and am of the opinion that if the Burnett signing fails the Braves should rethink their plans for this year. Yes, if Smoltz and Glavine are healthy enough to pitch, sign them! We have Jurjjens, Vazquez, Hanson, Morton(Who I believe will surprise us all when he is healthy) Campillo and maybe Medlin(who also could surprise). The pitchers in free agency left like Garland, Oliver Perez, Sheets, Wolf Etc. are either not good enough to invest in long term(Garland, Perez, Wolf) or in Sheets case to much of a risk to sign for more than a year. I would like to see the Braves use the $40 Mil+ sign a leftfield bat and use the rest to sign the players they feel are in their long term plans. If, Escobar, Kelly, Jurjjens and Gonzalez are players they want to keep, use the money to extend and pay bonus money to reduce their impact on future budgets. I firmly believe that if Smoltz and Glavine are healthy to go with Jurjjens, Vazquez and Hanson or Morton our pitching will be good enough to give us a chance to get in the playoffs. I hope they will be smart about this. It would be shear folly to tie up long term money on anyone that is not an ace or near ace! Reduce future payroll so that when we do get the young players ready we will be in position to sign what we need and win it all.
By kirkinga
December 11, 2008 1:30 AM | Link to this
N8, Rivera blew 1 save last season…one! K-Rod blew 7 and Hoffman blew 4.
Rivera’s WHIP was .67, K-Rod’s 1.29, Hoffman 1.04
All are very good, but Rivera pitches on the biggest stage in baseball and has the record for saves when in the playoffs when it counts the most.
When all is said and done Rivera will hold the record. But if I needed to save a game, I’m giving the ball to Rivera. That goes doubly so if it’s a playoff game.You’d rather give the ball to K-Rod or Hoffman, ok then.
I made no comment about the Mets pen, you were discussing the Mets with someone else.
I did however, comment about our pen because it is a strength, if fully healthy which it should be by May(Soriano).I think people overlook this strength of the Braves and thus underestimate the importance of having starters that can eat innings in the rotation.
I’m not going to deny the Mets are improved, but if we’re being honest, then we have to say the same about the Braves with the return to health of Smoltz, Glavine, Soriano, and Moylan as well as the addition of JV.
You can win alot of games when your pen only has to pitch 2 or so innings every night rather than 4 or 5 as was the case last season.
There will be other moves made, but right now the Braves are an improved team over the one that finished last season.
By safebet
December 11, 2008 1:30 AM | Link to this
ok mets have a bullpen now. but what about the first 6 innings.
By nolie
December 11, 2008 1:35 AM | Link to this
What does signing Smoltz for one year over AJ for five years buy you? It buys you entering the FA pitching market next year instead of this year when you won’t be bidding against the Yankees who will be all in on two or three long term pitching contracts already. Grab
unfortynately it looks like the slate of quality starters who will be FAs next year is very short. I’m sure there will be other teams to compete against with so few available. I doubt it will be any better,
By kirkinga
December 11, 2008 1:37 AM | Link to this
I will never underestimate John Smoltz. DMBJAMS
Exactly! People who say we have no ace are doing just that.
The Braves have at least two aces already, one is out for 09, and the other will only be available for half a season, but will be strong for August and September.
Oh, and JJ might, might, be an ace as well.
By Nick
December 11, 2008 1:38 AM | Link to this
I wonder if Moore would bite on an offer of Schaefer/Gorkys Jo Jo, Medlen and someone like Gregor Blanco/or similar , for Guillen and Greinke ? If we could get Greinke to sign a 2 year extension for say $12 mill a year he’d be here until I think 2012? Guillen’s 3 year deal expires at the end of the 2010 season which would time well with the arrival of Heyward for LF. Guillen’s not a big impact bat, but he at least would hit a good many dingers out there in LF. Good stopgap until the kids are ready . Plus , he’d be a throw in to dump salary anyway. Grienke is the real prize . If Dayton Moore still wants Frenchy we could sub him for Schaefer/Gorkys and take off the additional player.
My gut tells me he’s gonna bounce back to around an .800+ OPS this season tho, nothing spectacular, but at least above league average. I’d rather give him one more year to prove himself and/or boost his trade value for 2010.
Wouldn’t be the worst deal in the world and we’d still have the $$$ left over for Smoltz and Glavine and for the deadline.
By nolie
December 11, 2008 1:38 AM | Link to this
Looks like Edwin Jackson, who some here are high on, just got traded to Detroiy for Joyce. Another option down.
By Saltywoody
December 11, 2008 1:45 AM | Link to this
Bubdylan, I think DOB needs to sign you to a long-term blogging deal.
Seriously, dude, you haven’t had a post in a month that I haven’t either fallen out of my chair laughing at or nodded in agreement with.
By uga-brave
December 11, 2008 1:48 AM | Link to this
quit whining about the yankees ability to spend money. they operate under the same guidelines as every other franchise in the major leagues.
the only difference is that they are not owned by a souless corporation.
not long ago the braves were one of the so called sharks in the pond, pretty sure there was not of a lot b!thching going on then.
i applaud teams that make the commitment to winning. at least when you go to the ball park and drink a $8 beer you at least get he feeling that your team has put forth an effort to deliver as many wins as possible.
there is a soft cap in place, teams under the cap receive luxury tax payments.
the system may not be fair for every franchise, so deal with it.
but please quit whining about it.
if i were an owner in a mid-market city when the next collective bargaining agreement came up i would vote to fold at least one franchise.
By kris
December 11, 2008 1:50 AM | Link to this
Looks like Burnett is about to sign with the Yanks. I hope Wren has some whiskey he will need it.
By nolie
December 11, 2008 1:52 AM | Link to this
I wonder if Moore would bite on an offer of Schaefer/Gorkys Jo Jo, Medlen and someone like Gregor Blanco/or similar , for Guillen and Greinke ? If we could get Greinke to sign a 2 year extension for say $12 mill a year he’d be here until I think 2012? Guillen’s 3 year deal expires at the end of the 2010 season which would time well with the arrival of Heyward for LF. Nick
in case you missed it Nick, DOB has said that the Braves are indicating no interest in Guillen so that isn’t likely to happen I’d guess..
By N8
December 11, 2008 2:02 AM | Link to this
Wayne
Agree with you.
It’s actually ironic, that if things go as they’re going (the big guns NOT coming our way), that I’ll ultimately get my wish.
That being that we go into next season with some serious “stop-gap” guys, and with a little luck, will compete just fine, but along the way the kids (mainly Hanson, Morton and Jo-Jo), get some valuble experience along the way to 2010, when I’ll think we’ll be in good shape REGARDLESS of who we get for the rotation, because Hudson will be returning. To use the Bobby Cox line “which will be like adding a big-name free agent”. LOL!
I just like to rock the boat with the crue that think Wren was gonna really ramp up this roster this off-season with all the money to spend. When anybody out there could predict that with the Yankees, Mets and Red Sox looking to add the high ticket guys, NOBODY was gonna come to the Braves.
You put all of your eggs in one basket when shooting for the free agents in this market. Times have changed for the Braves. The only thing left for them to do, is make trades (failed with Peavy) and - or- wait for the kids to come around, and then fill the gaps with mid-range free agents (IE: Bream and Pendleton.
The ONLY reason I feel bad about losing out on the big-guns, is for Chipper and for Smoltz if he returns. Which is why I have a gut feeling that if Wren doesn’t add some serious weapons to the roster, Smoltz just might move on to a real contender.
So my initial gut reaction is to ride it out until 2010, but my desire to see Smoltz get another shot at winning, makes me desire Wren getting anybody that can help make that happen.
Ironically, if Smoltz is healthy, he’s our ACE to go along with the innings eating power of Vazquez.
Just don’t know if Wren can count on Smoltz, and he has stated that much as well. Adding Burnett and Vazquez makes us better, but not as good as the Mets or Phillies. However if Smoltz is healthy and he too is added to the rotation, then we’re on to something.
By DMBJAMS
December 11, 2008 2:02 AM | Link to this
Wren needs to sign Smoltz now. I will say I have no doubt that he will. I f’en love John Smoltz!
By Mitchell
December 11, 2008 2:03 AM | Link to this
By NY Yankees December 10, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this CC to Yanks AJ to the Yanks Manny to the Yanks = 2009 Champs!
Hahahaha… laughing out loud… rolling on the floor laughing. Oh God, that’s hilarious.
You are funny NY Yankees guy.
Oh, you’re serious.
The Yankees, Mets and Cubs can buy any player they want, they won’t win a thing.
By N8
December 11, 2008 2:09 AM | Link to this
kirkinga
Thanks for the stats on Rivera, K-Rod and Hoffman.
I guess I’ve taken Rivera for granted, at how great he actually is. I didn’t pay much attention to the Yankees, due to them being out of it last year. But you’re right.
With 1 game on the line, I’d give the ball to him too.
That being said, the Mets added the best AVAILABLE closer, AND a setup guy that also was a closer last year. The bullpen was their biggest weakness last year. It won’t be this year (on paper).
You are also correct about us being better if things go our way (see my 1:27 post). We could easily win 90-95 games if things go our way this year.
But based on recent history (past three seasons), I’m not sold. I won’t be until they sell me, by winning more than they lose.
I really would be content on just improving BACK to an above .500 team. That’s the first step, IMO.
By Nocturnal Owl
December 11, 2008 2:13 AM | Link to this
peavy saga nears end
Padres GM Kevin Towers said he expects to know Thursday whether a Jake Peavy-to-the-Cubs deal is possible or not. It won’t be done by the time they leave the winter meetings, but he should know whether it will get done. “We had more dialog today than any other day,” Towers said. “We’ll know tomorrow [Thursday]. Before we check out of this hotel … we’ll know if we have a deal. This has been the entire focus of baseball ops.” The Phillies are still believed to be the third team in the trade, but Towers thinks a fourth club will be named. No one has shut the door on the possibility of Felix Pie going to the Orioles, with Baltimore sending Garrett Olson to San Diego in the deal Rotoworld
By Nick
December 11, 2008 2:24 AM | Link to this
i didn’t see that we weren’t interested in Guillen, must’ve missed it . ( but there is a hell of a lot to keep up with)
To continue an earlier statement tho, I think if we miss out on AJ we throw a bone to Sheets and see if he bites.Mybe take a chance on a 2 year deal for Dunn or something.( i admit my manlove for the big donkey!! he’s such a fear inducing force when he hits!!) If not , we just fill the gaps with cheap guys , like maybe take a flyer on Mulder and/or Prior. Re-sign Smoltz and Glavine and throw this out there for next year.
JJ Vazquez Smoltz(when he’s ready) Glavine Mulder/Prior/Morton/Hanson
That could be a disaster , or it could be awesome. Odds are it’s slightly above average. We stick Schaefer in center, keep Escobar and KJ , maybe throw an offer to Dunn and if not try to grab a fill in player with a 2 year contract ( like Dye) and throw this lineup out there
Schaefer Escobar Chip Dunn/Dye McCann Frenchy KJ Kotchman
that would be 7 players with 15 HR potential in a row and maybe 5 or 6 with 20+ HR potential ( if they meet potential) Nonethe less , it would be a better team than last year and all of the young -uns would get another year under their belts and we would have bread left for next season.
By kirkinga
December 11, 2008 2:25 AM | Link to this
N8, agreed we need more moves before I’m completely sold as well. Without something done with the offense, it’s not going to matter if we get Peav, AJ, or anyone else for that matter.
Then again we all know that multiple aces don’t automatically translate to playoff success.
Also agree about the Mets. I’m still scratching my head as to why the Mariners made that trade.
It would appear they aren’t thinking about contending next season so I hope the Braves go after Hernandez.
By N8
December 11, 2008 2:28 AM | Link to this
Jerry Crasnick is reporting:
“If the Yankees are successful in landing A.J. Burnett in the next day or two, he’ll join CC Sabathia in the New York rotation at a total cost of nearly $250 million……If Sheets joins Burnett and Sabathia in the Bronx, Lowe will be looking at Boston, Philadelphia, the Mets and Atlanta as his most likely destinations.”
That wouldn’t bother me at all, if Wren was dead set on adding a free agent pitcher. When all this nonsense started, Lowe was the guy that I would have rather had all along. The guy is a work horse.
Especially if Smoltz returns. Way less risk than Burnett, IMO.
Of course, again pops the question…. Why would he choose the Braves over the Mets and Red Sox? The answer is that he more than likely would not.
By kirkinga
December 11, 2008 2:32 AM | Link to this
The Peavy saga just continues to grow more weird. Now there’s a 4th team involved? Geez.
I’m betting the real snag is no one wants Marquis’ salary.I thought the Cubs couldn’t spend more money until after their sale. Even if they get rid of Marquis’ $9.5 million and take on Peavy’s $15 million they still need to find a lefthanded bat they said they needed.
By fastasballs
December 11, 2008 2:37 AM | Link to this
If AJ signs with the Yankees lets all hope Wren signs a Perez/Sheets/Johnson & Smoltz to round out the rotation. Maybe a minor trade for an outfielder, sign some bench players & take the team to spring training.
If the team is contending by the break then maybe go for it then, but not now, not by trading away prospects just for the sake of making a half assed attempt at the division.
If the Braves are out of it by the break & guys like Chipper/Smoltz wants to go to a contender we would get something in return. I’m not advocating that at ALL, but it’s their calls if they want to go out a winner. Smoltz more than Chipper because Hoss has 3-5 years left most likely. Maybe Smoltz & his bionic arm has more in the tank than we think.
Also other moves could be made as well to really gear up for 2010 & beyond.
Again the Smoltz stuff is nothing but speculation, but I have little doubt he will pitch & it had damn well better be in a Braves uniform if he wants.
At this point a rotation of JJ, Vazquez, Sheets/Johnson/Perez, Hanson & Smoltz doesn’t look too bad to me. Throw in a Glavine or a Jo Jo/Morton as well. It might now be what Wren dreamed of, but it could be a lot worse had he not pulled off the trade for JJ.
Who knows maybe Hanson can dominate on this level like Avery did when he arrived with a bang. Morton could take shape as well since he was pitching somewhat injured last season.
By uga-brave
December 11, 2008 2:44 AM | Link to this
for what it is worth espn is reporting that burnett could be signed by the yankees as early as thursday afternoon.
if the braves dont spend the balance of the money i hope they plow it into scouting and player development.
i think that is half of the problem that got us to this point.
when payroll was frozen around $80 million, we tried to sell the fan base around local players, not that there is anything wrong with that, but that netted us a lot of great stories but yielded us very average and somewhat overated talent.
guys like mackay mcbride, kyle davies, jeff francoeur, chuck james, blaine boyer.
the only one that has overcome that was b.macc.
fact is atlanta is not viewed as the same destination as it used to be.
as for smoltz, the bearded icon is a stretch to being able to really contribute this year.
major surgey at 41 in may does not really translate into productivity in the spring.
i will say this though, wren has at least been in the conversations. the braves are trying, sometimes though you aint the best looking person in the bar.
By NO MORE BOBBY
December 11, 2008 3:02 AM | Link to this
I think its funny how the Yankees show they are serious to win again with their signings and pursuit of other big name players. Who are we after? A guy from the Royals who was 13-10? Cmon guys! We all know the signing of CC to NY just made the Yanks look that much better to Burnett. Why? BECAUSE THEY ARE SERIOUS ABOUT WINNING!! We just want to get by and play well enough to make $$ at Turner Field. I passed on season tickets this year because I knew we were not going to land anyone that would make a difference (and Im over our manager).
Its going to be another long summer in Atlanta. Let Smoltz go pitch for Boston this season and come back to Atlanta as manager in 2010. Then baseball will return to the ATL!!
By nolie
December 11, 2008 3:11 AM | Link to this
i didn’t see that we weren’t interested in Guillen, must’ve missed it . ( but there is a hell of a lot to keep up with) Nick
yeah there is a lot. and to add to it for you, DOB says that your guy Dunn is also of no interest to the Braves trust. Sorry.
By GermanBravesFan
December 11, 2008 3:19 AM | Link to this
Good Morning from Switzerland! Looks like nothing really happened over night (except for the Yankees throwing an insane amount of money at Sabathia)… I believe it’s time to step back, take a deep breath and let this thing play out. There are too many unfounded rumors floating around and I am just tired trying to keep up (and missing some stuff at work in the process). However, one last thought: why on earth would Towers go through all this crap trying to get two, three, or however many teams involved to trade Peavy to the Cubs when he could have had a great package from the Braves and be done with it? Did he feel so insulted after being told that Hanson is off limits? or die Jake Peavy simply not want to be traded to the Braves? It sure as hell cannot be the “not trade clause” - I am sure the Braves would have worked with Peavy on that one!! Oh well… time to get some work done!
By Bravo Nam
December 11, 2008 3:23 AM | Link to this
DOB
Another great song choice. I like Glen Campbell’s interpretation better, but Jimmy Webb also does a good job.
By slharvey
December 11, 2008 3:56 AM | Link to this
Make Bobby Cox GM again. Wren is a screw up. He messed up the Peavy deal by hardballing. He could have already gotten A.J. Burnet and should have already pulled of the deal for Peavy or Loewe. I would just go with Glavine,Smoltz,Juuries,(probably misspelled) Hanson,who is sensatioal and Morton. If they can re-negotiate and get Peavy,that would be great. Plus bring up Redmond for a try and they have the guy from the White Sox. If they were going to give up Flowers, they should have included Jermine Dye in the deal. They were really crazy to have gotten rid of him years ago. Remember, he hit a home run in his very first at bat. Another one that got away was Gary Mathews Jr. And why not go for Ramerez for three years and put him between Chippper Jones and McCann. What a lineup that would be. They can start to rebuild by bringing up Heywood for the outfield and Freeman for first base. As for Kotchman, use him for trade bait. Now since they got rid of Tyler Flowers,which was stupid,their top catching prospect, what are they going to do there unless they use Sammons? It’s kid of funny that after they trade Flowers they cut him down by sayig that he was a very good offesive player but his defensive skills were lacking. That’s why they didn’t include Dye in the deal because they opened their big stupid mouth. Sure his his defensive skills were lacking. He had been in the minor leagues for two years.He just needs a little of experience and he will be alright. McCann is so valuable a catcher and an excellent hitter that he should catch three or four days and platoon at first base. The Braves, since they finallly have money to spend, why don’t so something worthwhile? Send Johnson to the White Sox and ever how many touchable prspects for Dye. They should have icluded him in thier deal with the White Sox. If they do somethig constructive they should boot Wren and brig back Moore from Kansas City. Schurholtz did a great job with no money and when he did have we did great. If they have to get rid of Escobar to get Peavy bring back Frucal, who should have never gotten away. Don’t give up Schafer. He needs to be playing center field and start developing and then get Davy Lopes or Ricky Henderson so they can teach our guys how to steal bases. I think I have said enough.
Slharvey
By GermanBravesFan
December 11, 2008 4:07 AM | Link to this
Darn… I didn’t have my coffee this morning when I wrote the previous post. Too many typos…
By elliwg6
December 11, 2008 5:49 AM | Link to this
Slharvey
I am completely and utterly stunned that there are people like you still out there. It’s nothing short of astonishing. You said so many terribly false things that my only conclusions is that you are obscenely intoxicated. I don’t really know why I’m choosing to dignify that post with a response.
Anyway first of all, look at the roster of the Atlanta Braves and figure out how to spell the names of the players. It’s incredibly insulting. Also, just learn to spell in general.
Let’s see, messed up Peavy by hardballing… nothing much i can say to that claim other than who are you or I to say he wanted to play in atlanta anyway. Wren didn’t cave and give up players he said he wouldn’t and that’s good.
could have already gotten A.J. Burnet how exactly do you think he could have done that, he offered a substantial contract, other than that, what more do you want? It’s in AJ’s court now.
As for your reliance on Glavine and Smoltz. They are both coming off major surgeries and may or may not be ready to pitch in the spring or ever pitch again. Wren has repeatdly said he isn’t relying on them because he can’t. And likewise you can’t simply pencil them into the rotation.
the guy from the white sox is name Javier Vazquez, and while he’s not jake peavy, he’s certainly a welcome addition to a depleted Braves rotation. He is definitely going to start, no one is giving him a shot to earn it or anything. Its all about where he fits in. Secondly regardless of your view on Flowers, a prospect as young as he is is not going to net two high quality players from another team. What if it we announced that the Braves gave up Hudson and Frenchy for a catching prospect. Pretty laughable that you would think that they would just throw in Dye. Especially bc his value is still based on his first major league at bat for some reason….?
Heyward and Freeman are not ready to play in the majors, that’s why they aren’t playing yet. There are no plans to see them in 2009 and we are just hoping they develop of 2010. Obviously Wren feels they are long term solutions, but they aren’t ready or they would be the answer. That has to be Blatantly obvious to everyone.
Also the Braves won’t be using Sammons as they have signed David Ross to be the backup catcher. Pay attention.
Also the White Sox scouted the AFL so they knew all about Flowers and his upsides and his downsides. How do you think this works? They GM’s all describe the players they are trading and everyone takes each other’s word for it. The evaluation of Flowers defense was honest and known to all major league scouts and had absolutely no impact on the trade whatsoever. Especially since ultimately the Sox don’t mind if he can’t catch since they have the DH. No one let out a big secret and told about how he was a bad catcher. Can you be serious.
Futhermore McCann wants to catch. He is a catcher. His value is created because of his position. He isn’t a first baseman no crazy fan perpetuated ideas of crazy platoons are ever going to happen, nor would they work.
And lastly, JS is a great GM, maybe the best ever. He got a lot for a little again and again. But to say he did what he did with no money is crazy. May I remind you of a guy named Ted Turner?
In conclusion, before you post you should do a few things.
Learn the names of the players
Learn the details of previous trades and the benefits of the players received
Learn how the game and the business of baseball work
and please for the love of all that is good
read the blog before posting
By JasonInFL (formerly ME)
December 11, 2008 6:06 AM | Link to this
Oh well, the Bravos gave it their best shot in regards to signing AJ. Again, FW, please put aside your pride, ego, or whatever else it is and please at least touch base with Towers…especially now that the Cubs are “digging in their heels” regarding what they will give up.
By William
December 11, 2008 6:28 AM | Link to this
The Mets are kicking our butts making deals!!!! Now they have J.J. Putz and KROD. What do we have????? A number 4 or 5 Starter…………….. Better get ready for another long year!!!
By JohnGTFan
December 11, 2008 6:31 AM | Link to this
First, there was nothing Wren could have done to sign AJ. He was going to wait, regardless of what offer was out there, until the winter meetings. Anyway, I’m wondering where all that money ATL has is going to go now? With all due respect to DOB (who I think along with Sekou is the best), Peavy nor Burnett will be coming to ATL. I seriously doubt Sheets is coming and Randy Johnson will stay as close to home(Arizona) as possible. YUCK! Might as well just ante up for Manny Ramirez and just try to outscore everyone!!!! lol ahhhh the life of being an Atlanta fan (Braves, Falcons, Hawks, GT, Thrashers)….never ends….but neither does the hope and love.
By Bill
December 11, 2008 7:05 AM | Link to this
I am sick of pro sports and these cry baby players, but it’s not their fault. It’s some of the owners that’s ruining the game. I hope I live to see the day that some of the pro sports teams will be brought down. It’s got to the point that the average fan can’t afford to go to a game. There’s nothing like high school or college sports. Frank Wrenn has worked his butt off, trying to improve the Braves. I hope they don’t overpay for some of these players. I had rather sign someone for a couple of years and build within. If Smoltz wants to walk, let him go. Out of respect for Chipper, I would ask him if he wants to move on. I had rather suffer with the young players than give a high salary to a injury prone player. Baseball needs a new system but it will never happen.
By Lew
December 11, 2008 7:13 AM | Link to this
elliwg-Dude, be careful. Speaking such logic in the midst of this shark feeding frenzy just won’t be tolerated by the sharks. Your 5:49 post was damn near Wurlitzer Worthy. Keep talking such sense and you’ll end up the next winner, IMO-IF the lunatics in our hall don’t bludgeon the sensibility right out of you.
By tlj
December 11, 2008 7:28 AM | Link to this
I just heard on XM radio that in addition to CC the yankees have offered AJ $ 91 Mil over 5 years and Lowe $ 60 mil for 4 years. There is no way for other teams to compete with that kind of money. They just bought the entire upper tier of the FA pitchers market.
That is their right to make those offers but it’s going to make the industry look bad. I don’t think the average fan is going to feel sorry for the owners at the next collective bargaining session.
It looks like the braves will not get their ace. I guess the best we can hope for is maybe making Sheets an offer oh wait a minute I think the Yankees were thinking about making him an offer of $ mil for 2 years.
Maybe we can revisit the Peavy situation. As of last night the deal with the cubs had hit a snag. There has been all kinds of rumors what the Pad would get from a third or fourth team. It was speculated they would get Olson from the Orioles, Marshal, Hart and Vitters from the cubs. Another speculation was 2 pitching prospects and a catcher from Phil, Hart and Marquis from the cubs.
Problem is the cubs do not want to trade deRosa to the Phils and having hard time trading Marquis.
What about the braves contacting Towers and making the original offer (Escobar, Hernandez, Morton/Reyes and including Locke). The Pads can keep Escobar to play SS or they can flip him to another team for pitching help (Orioles Olson or possible KC). In 2 to 3 years when they are ready to compete they will have Escobar still under their control or a pitcher contributing if he is traded, Morton/Reyes has several experience and should be reaching their potential hernandez and Locke will ready to join the team and make contribution. All of the players will still be under the Pads control and cheap.
Any thoughts?
By JR
December 11, 2008 7:33 AM | Link to this
DOB. The point you mentioned earlier about the larger markets spilling their intentions to the media as negotiations is a very valid point. We do not really know what the Braves have offered or who they have talked to besides AJ. As a fan I would like to know what the Braves are doing, but I would rather them handle their business in private than spill their guts to a bunch of reporters.
All along I have said we need two more pitchers and two more outfielders. That’s just the facts. We lack terribly in those areas. Smoltz could be one of the two pitchers, but his success is a bigger question than AJ or Sheets. Honestly , I could probably live with a platoon of Hermida and Diaz in left until we find that big bopper. That’s assuming we can get a guy like Hermida and possibly someone like Ankiel in CF for one year. Let’s face it Blanco, Anderson, and others aren’t ready. Don’t get me wrong I LOVE watching Anderson play he reminds me of Victorino in Philly, and I wouldn’t be too terribly disappointed if he is the guy in CF until Heyward can get here.
By Marty
December 11, 2008 7:47 AM | Link to this
N8 - Thanks for that goofy bunch of baseless assertions and likely misinterpretations of things which may or may not be facts.
The only thing you say in your post which has actually been substantiated that Wren proclaimed a few months back, on a couple of occasions, that his goal this offseason would be to get two top-of-the-rotation starters and a big bat. Sorry, but I’m not going to get mad at the guy for trying to give Braves fans some hope and show us (and everyone else) that the Braves are still serious about winning.
I’m really not seeing how the fact that one starting pitcher, whom the Braves did not even bid on by all accounts, signed with someone else leads you to believe that free agents just don’t want to come here anymore.
More importantly, if the Braves won’t offer Lowe the 5 years/$85MM he’s supposedly looking for or Burnett 5 years/$91MM, that’s not a bad thing. Just because Wren said that he wanted to get a couple of starters doesn’t mean that he should get caught up in the idiocy and commit 5 years or pay anywhere near $17MM for a 37-year-old non-ace like Lowe.
We get that you are angry that the Braves aren’t perennial Braves anymore — lots of us are — and that you hate the Vazquez trade because of your misconceptions and misinterpretations of Vazquez’s past and likely future performance, but you need to calm down. I used to see rational posts from you. I don’t know what happened.
By Braves Fan in PA
December 11, 2008 7:54 AM | Link to this
So what if the Cubs bail (their rotation is very strong already) and then Towers is “stuck” with Peavy. Maybe we could get him on the cheap and not trade away the farm system. I certainly would hope Frank doesn’t feel compelled to offer the same as he did before. Especially if we get Burnett. I could live with not getting a bat and having a potential rotation of Smoltz, Peavy, Burnett, JJ, Vazquez. and Hansen/JoJo/Morton in the wings in case of injury. Who needs offense with a rotation like that :).
By Couch Tater
December 11, 2008 8:01 AM | Link to this
1. Our GM needs to get off his azz. 2. Players and their agents don’t want to come here anymore. 3. Our owners are cheap.
lol. I could have continued with most teams.
By Blind Hog
December 11, 2008 8:06 AM | Link to this
Just some clarification to the bloggers who are fixated on a certain pitcher the Padres currently control.
Some of you may need a bit of hand holding here so follow closely.
The Braves offer Towers and the Pads the best deal for Peavy. Nothing else seems close. Towers even seems to indicate for a time that the Braves have the best package although trying to push the price up a bit.
Towers seems to change direction and starts pushing the Cubs to make a deal. Towers keeps jumping through hoops to make a deal with the Cubs for players they don’t have. It takes a third team, maybe even a fourth team! All the while there is a real sense that at the end of the day the Cubs still won’t have a better offer on the table than the Braves had initially. Towers would probably love to give his ulcer a rest and make a deal to the highest bidder who can bring the Padres the best prospects. Instead, he keeps trying to get blood out of a turnip (the Cubs) He keeps burning that midnight oil and now he’s crapping blood because this is killing him!
It could have been so easy. It could have amounted to returning the Braves call and getting the deal done!
Why would Towers do this? Why would Towers probably end up with a lesser deal than the Braves would have given him? Does he love drama? Does he not have enough turmoil? Is his pride so stiff that he’ll damage the Padres organization by accepting a lesser deal from the Cubs than he had from the Braves?
Geez folks, wake up finally! It’s been reported by numerous sources, (not named the Atlanta media)that Peavy has stated the wants to go to the Cubs first, Houston second and is not crazy about ending up in Atlanta no matter who was on the trade list he gave Towers!
Peavy has a no trade clause. He can veto any trade. He wants the Cubs. He doesn’t want to come to Atlanta.
That’s why Towers is trying to turn a sows ear into a silk purse with the Cubs.
Enough about Peavy. He doesn’t love us, he doesn’t want us. Move on!
By Eric
December 11, 2008 8:20 AM | Link to this
I have to agree with a lot of the sentiment on this blog regarding the Braves and their lack of a significant signing this off-season. The Braves just don’t appear to be that darling organization anymore where free agents are rushing to come play, particularly pitchers.
Trading away Escobar, a tremendous young talent, and keeping Johnson, when we have Prado, makes no sense to me. No question, we need pitching and offense, but based on what I’m reading from DOB and other blogs, I don’t see the Braves acquiring any major talent/free agents. We’re the Oakland Raiders of the South; just acquiring cast offs and “use to be’s” with the hope that they can rekindle that fire under Bobby Cox. It’s sad, I guess we’re not quite a small market team, but those large markets are really running rings around the Braves and the rest of MLB.
By Eric
December 11, 2008 8:21 AM | Link to this
I have to agree with a lot of the sentiment on this blog regarding the Braves and their lack of a significant signing this off-season. The Braves just don’t appear to be that darling organization anymore where free agents are rushing to come play, particularly pitchers.
Trading away Escobar, a tremendous young talent, and keeping Johnson, when we have Prado, makes no sense to me. No question, we need pitching and offense, but based on what I’m reading from DOB and other blogs, I don’t see the Braves acquiring any major talent/free agents. We’re the Oakland Raiders of the South; just acquiring cast offs and “use to be’s” with the hope that they can rekindle that fire under Bobby Cox. It’s sad, I guess we’re not quite a small market team, but those large markets are really running rings around the Braves and the rest of MLB.
By Anders
December 11, 2008 8:22 AM | Link to this
Lew
Have you heard the new Vegas slogan?
“What happens in Vegas is really good for NY baseball.”
Kind of catchy - no?
By jmart1951
December 11, 2008 8:22 AM | Link to this
Trade fever makes us feel defeated when someone the Braves have an interest in decides to take another offer. Sometimes the best trades are the ones that fall through. Sure the Braves have lots of money to spend this year. But spending it wisely is more important than just spending it. Look at the Yankees. They have spent and spent and spent but ever since they bought ARod they have not won a World Series. Winning a World Series is about putting the right combination of players together. I believe that we have the right combination of players on the way (2009 and 2010). We should do nothing to jeopardize that situation. AJ Burnett could easily become injuried in the first half of next year and the Yankees could have a Hampton situation on their hands. Pulling complimentary players together is an art and can be done smartly and not at extreme costs. I am for adding carefully selected players that will compliment the players that we have coming up from our farm system. For instance, Oliver Perez is young and could be signed for what might be considered too much based on his past couple of years but a bargain based upon his potential. The key is do Cox and our pitching coach see things in Perez that they can add or correct to help him get to the next level. If they don’t then don’t sign him. If they do then sign a young left hander that would compliment the others that are on the way. Taking calculated risk on players with upside I believe is a superior plan to taking hopeful risk on players that have already proven a propensity for injury. If I were Wren my scouts and Bobby Cox would be evaluating players for their potential (with the caveat that our coaches see ways to improve their current performance) and I would be signing and trading for them. It never hurts to have money on hand for the big name star when it becomes an bargain opportunity rather than an auction.
By LTBravesFan
December 11, 2008 8:32 AM | Link to this
Ken Rosenthal says the Braves have offered Burnett another 4 yr deal with a vesting opition for the 5th yr and could be worth around 80 mil if the opition is vested…
By Herschel Talker
December 11, 2008 8:33 AM | Link to this
HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HEY DOB - I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By JR
December 11, 2008 8:37 AM | Link to this
Peavy doesn’t seem to want to play in Atlanta, or he would have made that deal happen. Probably the only reason he listed Atlanta was to appease his family in Alabama and then he could make some excuse to them why it didn’t work out with the Braves i.e. no trade clause, which we all know is a load of bull.
JJ and Vazquez are gonna be solid. I am not against throwing the young bucks in the fire. We did it to Glavine years ago and it worked out fine. We also did it to David Justice. BTW we did it to Andruw Jones too. They turned out ok too. Some of you might say Hanson and Heyward are not ready. I could see where Heyward may need another year, but Hanson should be ready. I would put both of them smack dab in the middle of the fire during spring training and give them every opportunity to succeed. They are not gonna perform any worse than what he have seen last year. Arizona and Tampa threw the Uptons in the fire and they are ballin right now. Wouldn’t you love to have them.
By stamper
December 11, 2008 8:39 AM | Link to this
i still say the braves need to go in to 2009 in a rebuilding mode. i doubt we’re going to sign anyone remotely important… with the exception of John Smoltz. why be delusional and think that getting one more arm will somehow make us a contender?
The yankees will probably get AJ and Ben Sheets. The Red Sox are going to pick Lowe. The best remaining players will be Johnson (too old), Garland (even worse than Vazquez) and Perez (no way)… we’ll be better off not signing any of them.
our biggest transaction thus far was for a guy who’s career record is 127-129… Having a record in the negatives after 250 decisions isn’t an ideal path for success. - at the cost of a potential 20-30HR a year guy. we need to have serious look in the mirror.
We need to start thinking about getting this team ready for Hernandez, Schafer, Heyward, Freeman, Hanson, etc… cause at this point, for 2009, we just don’t have the pieces.
meanwhile, the mets have locked down their bullpen. the phillies are still world series champions. the marlins aren’t any worse. and the nats appear better.
By bill
December 11, 2008 8:40 AM | Link to this
Watching ESPN Sportscenter before work it seemed that the Yankees are the only team with an offer to AJ. They never even mentioned any other team during the 2-3 minutes or so they spent on the topic.
By Thundersticks
December 11, 2008 8:46 AM | Link to this
CC to the Yankees…
AJ to the Yankees…
I say F-You to the Yankees!!!
By Kris in NC
December 11, 2008 8:49 AM | Link to this
tlj on your 7:28 am post, you stated you heard on xm radio that the Yankees offered AJ a 5 yr $91M contract, well Ken Rosenthal of FoxSports.com who reported that information yesterday, wrote another article in which he stated that was wrong information based on a rival executive.
He also reported that the Braves offer of 5 yrs $80M was also wrong, it was 4yr deal with a 5th yr with an attainable vested option as earlier reported. It seems both of these previously reported stories were never verified with people close to action.
As for Lowe contract information, I have not seen that reported anywhere. Of course DOB will be on later so he can either verify that what Rosenthal said earlier this morning is true or not but Rosenthal wrote his statements about 3:28 am our time.
As for the Peavy situation, Wren gave him the best offer, Towers got greedy. If Peavy wants Chi-Town, let him have it. We will keep our guys. Why put us on your list of teams you will accept a trade to if you don’t want to come here? Because we won’t win immediately for your taste, sorry. We didn’t want you anyways. I wanted Peavy alot but if he came to the Braves with the attitude of “I will pitch but I don’t really want to be here”, I don’t want him here at all. I agree with alot of folks who blog here, time to move on. Wren is trying hard to get us the pieces to make this team competitive, whether by trade or FA. If you, who don’t think Wren is doing enough, then lets see you do his job, I don’t think you can do it any better then him. Sure, you can talk the talk but can you walk the walk, probably not. Let Wren do what he can to make us better until our future gets up to bigs, until then watch our team play and be proud of them.
Go Braves!!!
By Yars
December 11, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this
couchtater……..regarding your 8:01 AM post, I agree with the #2 statement. Most players aren’t dumb. I’m sure they keep up with MLB news. Let’s see, we have no LF, CF is still a question mark, we have no clue how many games Chipper will play, we can only pray that Frenchy will not have a repeat of ‘08, as of right now we can only confirm our starting rotation is Vazquez & Jurrjens. Teams like the Mets & Phillies, hell even the Fish will yet again have strong teams in ‘09.
By CB Chambers10
December 11, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this
Going into this off season I was so excited that we had 40 million to spend. And now I just relize, that the Braves are CHEAP and have no care in the world about sporting a GOOD baseball team. We get to the winter meeting and we have gotten Vasquez, and Ross. We could get Burnett today and id still be dissapointed!! The Braves need to call up Liberty Media and ask them if we can spend about 50 million, and sign Burnett, trade anyone with reason to the Padres not named Heyward or Hanson, and get Jake Peavy!! I mean we probably could have got Peavy just by adding Locke. And I really beleive Furcal is waiting back and hoping the Braves call him up. and sign Fookie. Sport that rotation of Peavy, Burnett, Jurrjens, Vasquez, Hanson. And a lineup of Furcal, Johnson, Jones, OF, McCann, Kotchman, Francoeur, Schafer, Peavy!!!! AND WIN THE FLIPPIN WORLD SERIES!!!!!
Liberty Media DID NOT set a payroll, they have NOTHING to do with the Braves anyway, ask for an extra 10 Million and get it done!! The Mets have made killer upgrades to thier bullpen, and we got VASQUEZ and ROSS. Oh what a terrible boring season this will be!!
Im one of the biggest Braves fans in the world, but they play it safe to dang much and its frustrating!! Whew ok im done. Go Braves haha!
By LTBravesFan
December 11, 2008 8:54 AM | Link to this
Yeah, that’s the New York Bias thing coming out in them… It’s always been that way and always will. (Same goes for NY Mets and Boston) They are in these big market where it’s nothing but a media frenzy and ppl go nuts over one thing and tend to leave out other details. Why do you think there are so many Sunday games With One if not two of those three teams on EPSN.
By Thrillhouse44
December 11, 2008 8:59 AM | Link to this
I can only imagine how long it will last, Herschel Talker.
By LTBravesFan
December 11, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this
Actually the belief is the Braves have 45 to 50 million to spend according to reports from earlier this offseason.
By Efrim
December 11, 2008 9:18 AM | Link to this
Yankees have certainly had a great offseason if they can sign Burnett and Sabathia and trade a fourth outfielder like Melky Cabrera for Mike Cameron. If that all happens, they have added 50 million in annual salary to their payroll. But because they had 80 million come off the books, they have managed to get better without yet equaling last years payroll.
By Prime Time
December 11, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this
There has to be something else going on with this whole Peavy to the Cubs deal. From the rumors I’ve seen of what the Cubs are offering is no comparision to the Braves offer. So if the Braves offer is better why wouldn’t Towers call back up the Braves? Isn’t the purpose to get the best players in return? If it’s a quantity issue, throw some lower level players at him.
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 9:23 AM | Link to this
Ellwg6: I’m standing to applaud your 5:49 a.m. post. Thank you.
By NCBravesFan
December 11, 2008 9:26 AM | Link to this
Everyone should relax a little. If AJ goes to the Yankees, it’s not the end of the world. There are other options and other situations FW can explore.
So far, the Braves are holding true to their goal of trying to improve the team in the short term, while not sacrificing the players they envision as part of their long-term success. That’s a reasonable, prudent and smart approach.
The Braves biggest problem in the offseason comes down to this: they are trying to improve an area of their team (SP) where there is a shortage of front line talent at this particular point in time, and some heavy hitter teams that have money to spend (and the same need for pitching).
That’s the market, and it’s beyond Frank Wren’s control.
My guess is he’ll get something done in the next few weeks (if not days). But even if nothing substantive happens, the long term future of the franchise is looking bright, and I for one don’t mind one more year of transition to get us there if that’s what it takes.
By dap01
December 11, 2008 9:26 AM | Link to this
I would rather make no moves than make bad moves.
If Wren makes good attempts for moves but fails then that is ok.
What’s is not ok is to overspend on anyone and mortage our future.
We should only make moves that will help in the long run.
If we spend too much we may stay average a long time.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 11, 2008 9:30 AM | Link to this
Thanks, Marty! : )
Perhaps Wren should have offered Sabathia $400 million and partial ownership in the team.
LOL!
elliwg6 Futhermore McCann wants to catch. He is a catcher. His value is created because of his position. He isn’t a first baseman no crazy fan perpetuated ideas of crazy platoons are ever going to happen, nor would they work.
AMEN!!!
By Anders
December 11, 2008 9:31 AM | Link to this
Efrim
Cameron would be a mistake for the Yanks. Having him and Nady in the same lineup is a risk. Both productive but streaky. The Yanks need to get back to their formula of quality at bats. That’s what won for them in the 90’s. 4 WS titles and not one league MVP. That’s amazing. Of course they had top notch pitching back then too which they are addressing again- daily apparently.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 11, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this
THE METS TRADED HEILMAN??? To the AMERICAN LEAGUE??
How could they do such a thing?? He was one of their best pitchers…my favorite…I—I—
The only way they could have justified that move would be if they’d have sent him to the Fillies!
:,( I’m gonna miss him…
DOB—
It was a very good post, indeed.
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this
Eric, Blind Hog, and others: There is certainly validity to what you say about free agents not want to come to Atlanta like they used to. Especially pitchers. Much of that has to do with the fact that 1., they’ve missed the postseason for three years running, and 2., they are competing against a few teams, one in particular, that are spending far more money than the Braves.
By Efrim
December 11, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this
Anders
It’s an offensive upgrade. Melky Cabrera isn’t good at hitting a baseball. Swisher can now play a decent first base for them. The Yanks have had a tremendous offseason if they can lock down Burnett. Cameron, Swisher, Sabathia, Burnett….possibly one of Sheets, Lowe or Pettitte. And like I said, they have yet to equal last years payroll.
By BA
December 11, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this
One of the more subtle misconceptions around here is getting on my nerves, goes something like this:
“Burnett’s not an ace- he wasn’t even Toronto’s ace…”
If Tom Glavine were a free agent circa 1993, would you say he wasn’t an ace because he pitched with Smoltz and Maddux?!
The guy was on a staff with Roy freakin’ Halladay! On most other staffs, he’s an ace. You don’t like nipple rings, or his injury history, fine. But it’s (at best) misleading to say he isn’t an ace.
And yeah, it’s time for a cap. No for parity, but because there should be more than two teams able to sign stars in the offseason. The Braves (or Royals, or Brewers, etc.) should have just as many opportunities to cripple themselves with big contracts as the Bronx ones.
MLB has been rigged for NY for two hundred years. Enough is enough.
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 9:48 AM | Link to this
Prime Time: If Peavy has told Towers, either directly or through his agent (and Towers’ friend) Barry Axelrod, that he’s unlikely to waive his no-trade clause to the Braves, then it would certainly help explain Towers’ reluctance to call the Braves and try to restart the talks or call them and say, ‘Is that Escobar deal still on the table? We”ll take it.’”
I did speak with someone while here in Vegas who said that Peavy, indeed, had real reluctance to come to the Braves, primarily because of his concerns about them being behind Mets and Phillies.
They also, by the way, said that the story about Peavy singing “Go Cubs Go!” in a bar the other night was probably true, because, as this person said, “The guy is not the sharpest tool in the shed.”
By Salty
December 11, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
Posts like Herschel Talker only support the belief the human gene pool is in serious need of shock treatment! Fortunately, those like Ellwg6 suggest otherwise…or at least that the treatment can wait a bit longer! LOL! Kudos, Ellwg6!
By Thrillhouse44
December 11, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this
FYI, Smoltz will be on the Dan Patrick show this morning and he’s going to ask him about the Sox. I doubt anything newsworthy will come out of it, but I thought some of the denizens would be interested.
By BA
December 11, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this
Thank goodness Hershel Talker is back- time for some compelling and intelligent discourse.
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this
By the way, you should’ve seen the group of NY, Boston and a couple of national reporters hanging around the hallway that leads to elevator to the GMs’ suites last night at about midnight. They were waiting to make sure Mark Teixeira, or at least Boras, didn’t come walking out of there with a smile on his face and a done deal.
By Lew
December 11, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this
Anders-It sure seems that way, doesn’t it? The money being tossed around by the Yankees (and the Mets too), is definitely obscene (and in Hiomage to Lou Vales) especially in this economy..
The amount it’s costing for pitching this year makes it seem like the $11.5 mil we’re paying Javier Vasquez is bargain basement. People are screaming that $16 mil for Lowe is absurd, but that’s about what second tier starters are making these days.
BTW Dude, The Rodriguez signing was a good move for the Mets. It definitely strengthens the back of your pen and will make you a tougher team. However, I wouldn’t be doing my job as a Braves’ Homer if I didn’t mention how perfect it is that a pitcher named Putz would be pitching for a Mets’ team.
By Thrillhouse44
December 11, 2008 10:07 AM | Link to this
Peavy, indeed, had real reluctance to come to the Braves, primarily because of his concerns about them being behind Mets and Phillies. DOB
Dude’s been pitching for the stinkin’ Padres for his whole career and he thinks he’s too good for the Braves? That really peeves me! I mean, that’s like Hanson saying they’d never play a show with the Jonas Brothers.
By Anders
December 11, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this
DOB
Glad to see you are starting to come around to my previously posted theory that “The lure of Bobby Cox and the Braves organization ain’t what it used to be.”
That’s why Wren might have to put up with the kind of crap Towers was pulling and stay in there for the good of the organization. The Braves can’t just leave on principle anymore expecting the next guy on their wish list to step up and sign on.
When your not in the drivers seat anymore you have to overpay in some way. Money, prospects or pride.Even then there’s no guarantees. Why do you think the Mets made some of the deals they made in the 90’s? Not only were they not desired by players, but the players had a higher paying more succesful option right in the same city. The Braves are finding out it’s not easy attracting talent, especially at a bargain, when winning doesn’t appear to be automatic anymore.
The next step in this evolution. Keeping the guys you have when it becomes apparent the team is a year or two away. Do Smoltz and Chipper really want to go through that? Forget what the fans want - what do those guys want? No small question if this whole off season goes south for the Braves, which is not out of the realm of possibility.
By Patrick
December 11, 2008 10:12 AM | Link to this
I think the most telling stat is that Ben Sheets has actually made MORE starts over the past few years combined than Burnett has…
By semiballcoach
December 11, 2008 10:12 AM | Link to this
maybe AJ doesn’t want to be the “lead dog” of a pitching staff…in florida he was mixed in with beckett and penny..in toronto he’s with halladay…in new york he’ll be with c.c. and lowe whomever, et al…with the braves he’d be expected to be the stopper..
By LTBravesFan
December 11, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
8:53am: Ken Davidoff and Kat O’Brien wrote that the Yankees “appeared to be closing in on a deal” for Burnett late last night. They put the offer at about $80MM.
mlbtraderumors.com
By Thundersticks
December 11, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
Look at these numbers:
2008:
SP IP ERA WHIP SO K/9 K/BB A 198.1 3.09 1.15 158 7.17 3.36 B 221.1 4.07 1.34 231 9.39 2.69
Career:
SP IP ERA WHIP SO K/9 K/BB A 1428.0 3.72 1.20 1206 7.60 3.85 B 1376.1 3.81 1.28 1278 8.36 2.25
Both pitchers are essentially the same age and are right-handed.
Which pitcher would you rather have?
By Mark
December 11, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this
DOB, the main question is are you gonna be able to watch The Office tonight? Should be a good one with it being a christmas episode.
By BA
December 11, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this
I wonder if the Mutts conduct a training session for new pitchers:
The art of finger-pointing
I am confident that the Mutts will be fully prepared for another grueling five-month NY season. Having the option to take September off has to be a big draw in the free agent market!
By Elmer
December 11, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this
Braves need to secure a power hitting outfielder first. They will have to pay too much for an old “ace” in this market.
By 18 Wheels of Love
December 11, 2008 10:18 AM | Link to this
Zip City (aka Atlanta)
With all due respect and apologies to The Drive-By Truckers
Your agent was mad as hell
He was mad at you know who
As he tried to exclaim at the front of
the bar and save your deal from that
ditch that it slid into
Don’t know what his angle is
Or why he keeps pimpin’ you this way
Don’t know why you put up with his sh!t
When they don’t pay out in Zip City so
far today
Your agent is a worker and he’s down with
the Anti-Christ
And he makes good money as long as Scott
Boras pays everyone nice and right
Your wife’s got a good a life as any ex-
wife you’ve seen
But she’s puttin’ that sweet stuff on
every GM in town but Beane
Your brother was the first-born that got
drafted in the pros
And it’s a damn sad thing he’s reminded
daily of his his failure by his bros
Baby it’s a twenty-one hour drive from
Zip City to the Northern lights
Keeps your mind clean
Gets you through the night
Baby it’s just a destination, a town for
him to go
Keeps you from having to spend all his
seventeen million bills all alone
Keep your phone on, girl, it ain’t worth
the flight
By the time you call him he’ll be gone
And he’ll be right here next fall if
Bobby is right
You say you’re tired of them taking him
for granted
Callin’ up at the last minute to see what
Scott’s workin’ through
Well it’s only fifteen, girl, and Scott
ain’t got no secretary
And “collusion” is a mighty big word for
a city girl like you
You know that’s just his agent talking
Cause he knows that blood red venom of
the baseball’s Anti-Christ
Ain’t gonna ever see no contract between
them and you
Zip City it’s a good thing that they
built a team around you
Fly up to Chicago then fly back down to
the South
He’s got 95 miles on a two-seam fastball
He gets 17 mil a year
That ain’t got no strings at all
By Calvin
December 11, 2008 10:20 AM | Link to this
the guy is not the sharpest tool in the shed. Mr. O’Brien
That made me laugh. Hard.
By Joe M.
December 11, 2008 10:21 AM | Link to this
Not trading Escobar for Peavy is fine. Not signing Burnett I can deal with. But the mere mention of Smoltz maybe possibly playing for a team other than the Braves is what gets me.
By Nate
December 11, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this
The fact that Burnett has been on the same team as Roy Halladay means Burnett has not been a number 1 starter the past few years. Unless you seriously believe that AJ is better than Halladay there’s no way to argue with that statement.
You can make the argument that AJ would have been a #1 on another team. I guess you could make that argument for a bunch of #2 starters. If you seriously look at AJ’s innings pitched, wins, and ERA over the past three years there’s no way to conclude he’s a true ACE pitchers. There’s really only a handful of true ACE pitchers in baseball and AJ is not one of them.
By Anders
December 11, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this
Lew
Jeter + A-Rod + Sabathia = $75 mil in 2009. Class of their own them Yanks.
BTW- Jeters deal is coming up in a year or two. Talk about a negotiation to end all negotiations. How would you like to be the face of the franchise for the franchise of all time? Seems we’ll actually answer that age old question of “What do you think a guy like Dimaggio, Williams, Mantle, Mays etc.. would get in todays market?” Jeter may not be the player those guys were but no one has had as much value to an organization as him.
By Ryan H.
December 11, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this
When are we going to do something?!?!?!
By Efrim
December 11, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this
Patrick
I think the most telling stat is that Ben Sheets has actually made MORE starts over the past few years combined than Burnett has…
Burnett has thrown 730 innings the last four seasons. Ben Sheets has thrown 601 innings the last four seasons. Burnett has made 112 starts to Sheets 94 starts in that time frame.
I suppose we can take into account 2001-2004, but why? Burnett has obviously been more durable from 2005-2008. I’ll take the more recent sample.
By Salty
December 11, 2008 10:28 AM | Link to this
However, I wouldn’t be doing my job as a Braves’ Homer if I didn’t mention how perfect it is that a pitcher named Putz would be pitching for a Mets’ team.
Classic, Lew! LOL!!!
By GermanBravesFan
December 11, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this
Thrillhouse - that’s exactly why Peavy does not want to join the Braves… He is tired of losing and he does not think the Braves will be able to compete for the NL East or the Wild Card, respectively. Right now, he has a point…
By Dadgum
December 11, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this
Fellow denizens of this slow(but great!) blog….
IMO the Braves are not getting Burnett. With a guaranteed 5 years at 18m per from the Yankess why on earth would he accept 5/16 from Atlanta (which is generous and hopefully final). Remember he left almost 11 mil on the table in Toronto so he could test the free agent market. Given this will most likely be AJ’s last contract of huge value, he is going to go with the money and to a team with a solid chance of getting to the post-season and world series. Obviously that would be a gamble with the Braves.
Oh, and forget that cost of living junk as a difference maker. Investments and exposure to a huge media market trump that.
Also there has been posts about the Braves putting a renewed interest in Peavy. Contact Towers immediately…blah blah. That too is 100% not happening. Reason….after weeks now what looked good then doesn’t look good now from the standpoint of players and prospects lost. Towers blew it plain and simple and he has egg on his face big time. Sometimes the best trades are the ones not made and I have to believe that Wren is sighing a bit of relief over not losing Escobar and prospects now that he has pushed away from the table. Even if Towers comes begging I would pull Escobar out of the earlier offer. On top of that, as many have mentioned, Peavy must approve a trade. Does he really want to be here? Does he want to be here without Escobar at SS? I like the analogy of a past post(can’t remember who)that opined you don’t want to go to bed with a 10 and wake up with a 2. Duh huh! That sums up the Padres deal pretty much on the nose.
The Braves will end up with a very competitive team of that I am certain. We will look back in March at this Hot Stove as good blog material and feel good about the season ahead. We will all be looking anxiously toward Tommy Hanson’s first start in the Bigs as he is simply too good right now not to be in the starting rotation. Especially a Braves rotation given injuries and uncertainty.
Rock on…….
By dmack
December 11, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this
I thought Peavy was reluctant about coming to the Braves only if they traded Escobar?
He needs to understand that the addition of him to the Braves team gives us the ace that can lock horns with Santana and Hamels.
Assuming the Braves add a LF bat, their offense is not that far behind the other two teams.
Why did he put the Braves on his list of five teams then? Does not make sense.
By Carolina Gent
December 11, 2008 10:34 AM | Link to this
To those out here in blog-land who are saying that FW is a failure because he’s not yet reached his stated objectives for the offseason… First of all, what he stated was what just about any one of us who watched the Braves last year KNEW was true; that to be a real contender in the NL East we needed 2 starting pitchers and a power-hitting corner outfielder. Secondly, if he’d maybe had some informal, off-the record conversations with Towers and had heard that Peavy might include the Braves on his list of teams that he’d play for this year, it’s possible that Wren was thinking optimistically that he might be able to get that deal done when he said that. Third, did anyone, outside of Yankee-dom, think that they’d be spending over 200 million on just two starters? Perhaps Wren is guilty of underestimating the opposition. Perhaps not. He had what he had available to spend which would normally be very attractive, except when you’re going head-to-head with the Yankees and Red Sox. I give Wren an “A” for effort. Players want to play for winners. It’s the same reason that I’d bet Tex shuns the Nats and O’s and ends up in Boston. The Braves are probably a couple of years away from regaining some of their lost glory. That’s why I advocate doing a bit less this year, especially if it means that we hold on the more of our young core.
By LarryC
December 11, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this
DOB - What do you think of the Rays’ pitcher Edwin Jackson who was traded to the Tigers yesterday? Seems like he would have been a good fit for the Braves - 25 years old, 14-11 with a 4.42 ERA, 183 1/3 innings last year. Also, with the free agent pitcher market supposedly drying up, are there more guys out there like Jackson who the Braves might target?
By Thundersticks
December 11, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this
Sorry, folks. The numbers were lined up when I posted them.
Basically, over their careers, Sheets and AJ have comparable numbers. Both are power pitchers, but Sheets has a little better control (better K/BB ratio) while AJ relies more on the strikeout (better K/9 ratio). Both have had their problems with injuries, but Sheets’ inability to finish last season is a concern and why he is not getting the same attention as AJ.
I say we forget AJ as the Yankees are going to out-bid us anyway and focus our efforts on getting Sheets. I would think a 3/40 with a team option for a fourth year should go the job.
Then resign Smoltz and/or Glavine if they can pitch. And go after Dye using Morton and a prospect.
By raymond
December 11, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this
I see where Smoltz is naming teams he would be interested in. Is the timing of this to the possible Burnett signing just a coincidence or is Smoltz telling the Braves don’t spend all your money on free agents because you still have to sign me.
By YoungBuck
December 11, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this
It must be good to be the Yankees.. You know, they get to use Monopoly money… It’s just seems like a big game to them (the business side of things)
By CB Chambers10
December 11, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this
On MLB.com theres a story up saying Peavy will probably be dealt today, or atleast before the meetings are over =[.. is there any chance Frank Wren is going to surprise us with a big trade for Peavy, or do we all need to just relize that everyone got our hopes up of getting that true ace, and now, were going to get nothing? DOB, go to Franks hotel room right now, or where ever he is, and tell him to go bang on Towers door and tell him to get the hell up outta the bed and make this deal done before everyones nerves are shot.
By Billy Pilgrim
December 11, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this
I’m just putting this out there. If you like it you can take it, if you don’t then send it right on back.
Two days ago there was a rumor of a Greinke to the Braves trade. It was promptly shot down by both GMs. The rumor stated that the Braves wanted a resolution to the Burnett situation first. So as much as I’d like it to happen they wouldn’t bring in both these players. So it goes.
Anyway, it started to remind me of another KC-ATL trade rumor that was shot down, temporarily at least.
At the 2007 deadline the Dotel-Davies trade got leaked before it was finalized. Both sides said there was no truth to it…until it became official hours later.
Perhaps this Greinke leak was based in truth, but neither side wanted to have it played out through the media, especially if the Braves land Burnett and the whole thing becomes moot?
It’s not the perfect situation, for various reasons. Greinke is affordable…for 2 more years then he hits Free Agency. Escobar is almost a lock to have to be included. It creates a hole in RF (although some would say based on Frenchy’s ‘08 that’s a good thing), and a hole at SS (but Furcal and Greinke combined will cost slightly more in ‘09 what Burnett would cost in ‘09).
I’m probably totally off and both GMs were being truthful when they said there was no truth to the rumor, but we’ll see.
By Jonathon
December 11, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this
Latest from Rosenthal:
Talks between the Braves and free-agent right-hander A.J. Burnett “progressed through the night,” but the Yankees remain a factor in the Burnett discussions, major-league sources say.
The Braves, according to two sources, have not offered Burnett five guaranteed years, contrary to what FOXSports.com reported Wednesday, citing a different source.
The team’s offer is for four years with an easily attainable vesting option for a fifth year, the sources said. The total value, if the option were vested, would be approximately $80 million over five years.
For a brief time on Wednesday, FOXSports.com also reported that the Yankees had improved their Burnett offer to five years, $91 million, citing rival executives.
A source with knowledge of the negotiations, however, immediately responded that the amount was inaccurate; the Yankees’ offer is believed to be between $80 million and $85 million.
Would the Braves guarantee the fifth year to secure Burnett? Probably. Would the Yankees raise their offer to $91 million to approximate Carlos Zambrano’s deal with the Cubs? Perhaps.
But neither has occurred yet.
By KC
December 11, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this
DOB: Do you still feel the Braves have better than a 50/50 chance of signing AJ?
I’m starting to get the sense that perhaps the Braves chances are fading a bit. I hope I’m wrong.
By Jonathon
December 11, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this
According to Yahoo! Sports, Towers has put a self-imposed deadline of today on the Cubs to do a deal for Peavy. If Chicago doesn’t figure out a way to shed Marquis’ salary, I think Towers is finally going to pick up the phone and see what his old buddy Frank Wren is offering.
The deadline could just be bull-crap, but desperation has got to hit that dude at some point.
By Anders
December 11, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this
BA
*Having the option to take September off has to be a big draw in the free agent market!”
In a rare twist something you wrote actually made me laugh.
By Thundersticks
December 11, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this
A #1 starter and ace are not synonymous. Just because a pitcher is not the #1 starter on his team does not mean he is not an ace (see Maddux, Glavine & Smoltz in the 90’s). So the argument that AJ is not an ace because he wasn’t the #1 on his previous does not hold water, so please stop trying to argue that point.
However, I’m not so sure AJ IS an ace. I think he has the stuff to BE an ace and may or may not turn into one. IMO he is on the bubble.
By Stovetop
December 11, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this
What is Wren doing? We need to rebuild, with the young talent we have (or at least had) we can be competitive in 2-3 years. We need to trade off some of our veterans for some young players that are 2-3 years out from being productive. I love Chipper but if this team wants a hope of being competitive again it is time for him to go. Plus he deserves to go out on a championship team. Hudson as soon as he is healthy should be out of here for some prospects.
By McFann O –[zzz]
December 11, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this
Lew a pitcher named Putz would be pitching for a Mets’ team.
Putz…Fooey! I bet he’s not half as good as Heilman.
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this
On MLB.com theres a story up saying Peavy will probably be dealt today, or atleast before the meetings are over =[..CB Chambers10
Meetings are over today, most GMs leaving immediatly after the Rule 5 draft, which will be over before noon.
Since Frank reiterated yesterday that there have been NO discussions with Padres in four weeks, then I would seriously doubt the scenario you outlined could take place.
By Joe M.
December 11, 2008 10:51 AM | Link to this
Buster Olney, ESPN
The Yankees are feeling good about their position in the A.J. Burnett bidding. It is not likely that they will make an offer that is comparable to the $91.5 million deal once signed by Carlos Zambrano, as has been speculated, but they are confident that they will have the largest offer on the table — five years and $80 million — when the bidding is over.
Whether Burnett takes less with the Braves or some other team is another question entirely. Fox Sports is reporting that the Braves’ offer to Burnett is for four years, and not five.
Are the Braves giving him five years or not? If they’re not, than just tell Bowman or someone in the media and stop teasing us that the offer gives the Braves a realistic shot at signing Burnett.
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
IMO the Braves are not getting Burnett. With a guaranteed 5 years at 18m per from the Yankess why on earth would he accept 5/16 from Atlanta (which is generous and hopefully final). Remember he left almost 11 mil on the table in Toronto so he could test the free agent market.Dadgum
Actually, Burnett opted out of two $12 mill option years, $24 mill total, to become a free agent.
By David-ATL14
December 11, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
Wanted to add my praise to that of both Lew and the esteemed blogmaster of the for the 5.49AM post by Ellwg6.
Spot on analysis and commentary.
Sad to see the Braves being treated like the KC Royals now by perspective players and agents.
By MGL
December 11, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
“He needs to understand that the addition of him to the Braves team gives us the ace that can lock horns with Santana and Hamels.”
It sounds to me like Peavy is a sissy wuss who is afraid to go toe to toe with Santana and Hamels.
By rammerjammer
December 11, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this
If AJ goes elsewhere, it isn’t the end of the world. We have some extremely promising young pitchers and there’s every reason to think they’ll develop.
For example, Charlie Morton. Of his 15 starts last season, six were quality starts and another was two outs short. His ERA was awful, but five starts totaling 12 2/3 IP and 25 ER can do that.
In August, he had four quality starts, 26 IP in those, with seven ER…a 2.42 ERA. He is very capable.
Personally, I’m excited to see what these young guys - Jurrjens, Morton and Hanson in particular - will do. Look no further than Tampa Bay to see the possibilities of where young, talented pitching can take you.
By GermanBravesFan
December 11, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this
If the Yankees offered 5 years @ $90 million, I’d say let Burnett wear pinstripes!
Sign Smoltz to a one-year contract. Try to sign either Randy Johnson (IF he’s interested) or Ben Sheets to a one-year contract and let Hanson pitch in 2009. Oh, and sign Maddux as pitching coach/mentor for Hanson, Jurrjens, Morton and Reyes in 2010!
By Thundersticks
December 11, 2008 10:57 AM | Link to this
*By Billy Pilgrim
December 11, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this
I’m just putting this out there. If you like it you can take it, if you don’t then send it right on back.
Two days ago there was a rumor of a Greinke to the Braves trade. It was promptly shot down by both GMs. The rumor stated that the Braves wanted a resolution to the Burnett situation first. So as much as I’d like it to happen they wouldn’t bring in both these players. So it goes.
Anyway, it started to remind me of another KC-ATL trade rumor that was shot down, temporarily at least.
At the 2007 deadline the Dotel-Davies trade got leaked before it was finalized. Both sides said there was no truth to it…until it became official hours later.
Perhaps this Greinke leak was based in truth, but neither side wanted to have it played out through the media, especially if the Braves land Burnett and the whole thing becomes moot?
It’s not the perfect situation, for various reasons. Greinke is affordable…for 2 more years then he hits Free Agency. Escobar is almost a lock to have to be included. It creates a hole in RF (although some would say based on Frenchy’s ‘08 that’s a good thing), and a hole at SS (but Furcal and Greinke combined will cost slightly more in ‘09 what Burnett would cost in ‘09).
I’m probably totally off and both GMs were being truthful when they said there was no truth to the rumor, but we’ll see.*
I agree that something is brewing there, but I’m not sure it is for Greinke - unless they miss out on AJ. If you go back and look at the quotes from both GMs, they indicated they had not discussed Franceour. Neither mentioned Greinke or Guillen or any other players, only Frenchy. I don’t think this was a coincidence.
By JasonInFL (Formerly ME)
December 11, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this
For the record, I find no fault in the fact that FW may get outbid for a FA pitcher…I do think the FA system is a little messes up, but that’s another story. I do find it odd that Towers and FW haven’t at least checked in with each other. As I have been saying, the only logical explanation is that Peavy said he wouldn’t come to the Braves. If FW doesn’t know that, it makes no sense for the two to not at least check in, especially considering the criticality factor of the Braves obtaining an ace.
By GermanBravesFan
December 11, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this
ooops… I meant an $80 million offer to Burnett in my previous post.
By Lew
December 11, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
If the Yankees are intent on buying Burnett, Lowe and Sheets, why don’t we try to sign Petite?
By chris
December 11, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this
Am I reading it wrong but the Braves and Yankees have the same deal, money wise, on the table - except that the Yankees gave a guaranteed 5th year. To me it makes sense for Burnett to come here. His ERA should be almost a run lower from having the pitch to the 8 & 9 hitters(which is always the pitcher- nowadays, many pitchers can’t & don’t hit well). That would allow him to go longer in games alone. Thus, making his option with the Braves a walk in the park to attain, as long as he doesn’t sustain any major injuries. Versus pitching in the AL, where the lineups are stacked 1 thru 9, with a DH included. He would have a 4.00 + ERA, every year over the life of his deal with the Yankees. This is just an observation IMO
By Scottcho
December 11, 2008 11:12 AM | Link to this
DOB, Back in time for Hayes Carll tonight?
By DAP
December 11, 2008 11:12 AM | Link to this
MGL It sounds to me like Peavy is a sissy wuss who is afraid to go toe to toe with Santana and Hamels.
i had the same thought. if peavy doesnt want to come to the ATL becausehe doesnt think we can compete with the phils or mets, its because he doesnt think HE can compete with the phils or mets, which doesnt sound like him, from what ive heard.
if thats how he feels about it, what do you say to that. “well, jake, were TRYING to be competitive, thats why were talking to you.”
will wren give sheets a chance? ive heard he is talking to the rangers.
By Original Jon
December 11, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this
chris that all sounds logical, but Burnett himself has told Chipper that he prefers playing in the American League because he doesnt like to hit and run the bases, if he doesnt have to do those things, it allows him to concentrate more on pitching.
By Dadgum
December 11, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this
DOB…yes 12 mil. My last post was per year not total of the option years left.
By Jonathon
December 11, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this
If the Yankees are guaranteeing 5 years, then the Braves are probably going to have to guarantee 5 years, regardless of whether the money is the same or not. The vesting option might be “easily attainable,” but it’s not guaranteed. Nothing in life is certain.
By "Peavy" Rules
December 11, 2008 11:21 AM | Link to this
Still think Wren is trying to win now for Cox’s FINAL ( I say this with confidence) season. Many Braves fans realize that unless a miracle occurs as it did in 1991 this team is mediocre at best. Two outfield positions in question, will French-Fry bounce back, can Johnson improve defensively and be consistent at the plate, will Escobar even be around, will Smoltz sign, will certain pitchers step forward finally, will Kotchman be the answer at 1st …so, so many questions. Players sense this also. Deep down inside Smoltz has to be wondering on what to do also. He realizes his chances are growing slimmer and slimmer of ever winning another World Series.
Players like Randy Wolf and Oliver Perez are more on the Braves level of play if last season is any indication. Top Free Agents are going to go where there is more money and that usually means greater chance the team is destined for the playoffs. Can anyone really blame them?
Gimme a “P”, gimme an “E”, gimme an “A”, gimme a “V”, gimme a “Y” what does that spell …. “PEAVY”
By LTBravesFan
December 11, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this
Well Yankees offer is said be around 85 for 5 yr and is said to be 80 for 5 (that’s including the opition.)
By Mike Honcho
December 11, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this
Why am I studying for law finals? Why didn’t someone give me the memo to become a major league baseball player?
This isn’t meant as a criticism, they can do what they want. But Chipper is running for the first time in his career? And a mile a day at that? Burnett would like to stay in the American league because he doesn’t want to hit or run the bases?
Can we discuss this? Again not a criticism, but if I was Chipper on the cusp of the Hall of Fame (or any professional athlete for that matter) I’d be training harder than a Rocky montage.
For the love of Ron Gant, doesn’t anybody train anymore? I’m seriously, I want to see Chipper with some sweet 80s beats training Drago style (sans shots) running around that indoor track in slow-mo, then running through some hunting obstacle course, then off to yoga class for the hammys and feet, and then finally in some high tech batting machine showing his batting speed rising to unheard of levels with some Russian guy saying “He is a machine!”
But then again, I didn’t just win a batting title, or win 18 games and deciding between 60-80 mill….Instead I’ve got Con Law II to comfort me. DOB, find a song lyric for that :(
By Jonathon
December 11, 2008 11:26 AM | Link to this
Does Peavy think the Padres are going to be “competitive” any time soon against the likes of Arizona, the Dodgers, and maybe even San Francisco? San Diego is about to go into the crapper for the immediate future. I’m pretty sure Atlanta has a much better chance of making the playoffs than the Padres. There is no reason to sit and waste prime years with the San Diego franchise.
By Nate
December 11, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
I mentioned Scott Baker here about a week ago. I’m wishing the Braves would talk to the Twins. Baker is gonna be a true ace in the near future. The Twins would be very reluctant to trade him, but they’re desperate to add punch to their infield. They were hoping to sign Casey Blake but he’s off the board. To them a guy like Escobar who could play 3B and SS would be very attractive. Plus they have guy in Brenden Harris who could be a suitable stopgap for us at SS.
What would it take to make this trade work for both sides?
By chris
December 11, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
Original Jon
I thought he said he likes pitching in the AL too, not prefers. Those are 2 different words when placed in that context. I also hope he realizes he doesn’t actually have to hit, a sacrifice is just as sufficient to the offense as a hit. He can still concentrate on pitching if he concentrates on mastering the bunt., a problem that plagued us all season.
By chris
December 11, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this
Do you think the Braves should re-visit attempting to acquire McClouth and Maholm? I would think the Braves should do it even they do get Burnett. That would solve 3 holes for us. A CF, leadoff hitter & a SP(Who is a lefty-which would be a ++).They say the price would be steep but now that they have acquired Vasquez they wouldn’t request Escobar from us.
By Anders
December 11, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this
Lew
Pettitte’s done. Look at his last 10 games last year when it was on the line for the Yanks. He was 2-6 with a 5.43 ERA. Plus there’s rumors his elbow was barking.
I think he was using more often than he copped to just to get through other seasons. First year he’s busted for steroids and he fades miserably in the second half? Suspicous at least.
By Joe M.
December 11, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this
Rosenthal
Sources: Yanks out front to land Burnett
LAS VEGAS - CC and A.J.?
The chances for the Yankees look good.
The Yankees, after reaching a preliminary agreement with free-agent left-hander CC Sabathia, have emerged as the clear front-runner for free-agent right-hander A.J. Burnett, according to major-league sources.
Burnett’s representatives were expected to contact interested clubs Thursday, giving them one last chance to beat the Yankees offer of five years and approximately $85 million.
The Braves have offered four years and an easily attainable vesting option for a fifth year that would put the total value of their package to about $80 million, according to sources. To land Burnett, they would need to guarantee the fifth year and increase their financial offer.
By JimBo
December 11, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this
DOB - What’s the deal with the Braves offer? I seem to remember Wren and/or Cox saying if it took 5th year then they would do it, if that’s what had to be done? Still only a vesting opition after the Yankees have given him the 5th year.
Seems a little backwards to me. The Braves said from the beginning they would go the 5th year route if thats what it took. Now Peter Gammons saying they’re not going to go that route. And the Yankees did give him the 5th year (real quick) and they were said to be reluctant to give the 5th year.
By Jersey Gil
December 11, 2008 11:40 AM | Link to this
Zmotlzy Guarantee Pitching next year in the Dan Patrick Show, He sid he is open to anybody( any team to offer him a contract), He said he be ready tp ST.
By Marty
December 11, 2008 11:40 AM | Link to this
Mike Honcho - Enjoy law school while you can; the practice of law isn’t a whole lot better for most people…it just pays better.
By Don't Trade Franceour, Sheesh
December 11, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this
Mike Honcho
Training for boxing, and then football (sort of) are very different than baseball.
Baseball is a loooooonnnnngggg season and it is hard to keep the body from breaking down. In boxing you train 1-2 years for one 45 minute fight where all energy can be exerted.
If a baseball player (especially over 30) trained like a boxer, they wouldn’t make it a half year.
Granted and 80s montage with Chipper would be awesome, it just isn’t efficient or practical.
By Salty
December 11, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this
will wren give sheets a chance? ive heard he is talking to the rangers.
With all due respect, the Rangers and free agency is checkered at best (at least since ‘88…Ryan, Julio, etc.). They’re one of those franchises where simply doing their opposite would pay dividends! Then again, maybe 20 years futility will change things. LOL!
By David O'Brien
December 11, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this
NEW BLOG
By YoungBuck
December 11, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this
Kelly Johnson made very few errors in the second half of the season last year… I think he went like 20 something games without making an error. (not sure on that last part) but i do know that his defensive stats improved signicantly in the second half of last season.
By My Entire Team Sucks
December 11, 2008 11:46 AM | Link to this
Yanks trade for Mike Cameron now….
By rammerjammer
December 11, 2008 11:46 AM | Link to this
If it’s reasonable to assume 2009 is it for Smoltz, do you think he wants to go out with meaningless games in September? I don’t.
The scenario I forsee is he pitches for the Braves but - if they’re out of contention - he’s dealt in late August to a contender.
Yes, he’s a Brave through and through. But you know the guy LIVES for the big game. He’s the best big game pitcher of our lifetime. IMO, he’ll wear any uniform for the chance to pitch in October just once more. And I’d be rooting for him the whole way.
The man is a warrior and deserves to finish his career on the battlefield…not the golf course.
By DAP
December 11, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this
lew If the Yankees are intent on buying Burnett, Lowe and Sheets, why don’t we try to sign Petite?
i think pettite would be a pretty good signing no matter what.
there is something about him though that makes him seem fragile in my mind. its like wherever he goes, he has to have his blankie. he was with the yanks, along with clemens and torre, then followed clemens to houston, and then back to the yankees….and then weve heard rumors of him going to LA to get back with torre. i would love to try and sign him, but it seems like he might be a guy that tends to stick around people he’s comfortable with.
either way, id offer a two maybe three year deal for the guy. veteran lefty, tons of experience. if he doesnt need to be babied (no idea, just wondering) he would a great veteran addition.
By Drummerdad
December 11, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this
I dare say that Maddux came to the Braves for less money than the Yanks because there was something attractive about the Braves. They had some “pop” and were on the upswing. They’re clearly not back to that point yet and it seems that some of these guys are avoiding them because of it. I guess they’re being used as a bargaining chip.
By MDBraveFan
December 11, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
To FW - “keep your head while everyone else is losing theirs.” Don’t let desparation make you do something dumb. AJ is a good pitcher but not worth giving him a mint. And pls don’t even THINK of giving in to greedy Towers by giving up Hanson. Stick to your guns. Bad enough that you put Escobar out there don’t compound it by giving away our best pitching prospect. Peavy is good no doubt but not worth most of our good, young talent. We need to keep some of these guys and start mixing them in with vets. My two cents. And thanks DOB for updates; you are keeping the winter from being very boring.
By Wes
December 11, 2008 12:02 PM | Link to this
DOB, I was wondering if there were any talks at the meetings about contracting the league down to the Cubs, Yankees, Mets, Red Sox and Phillies. Throw in one of the Los Angeles teams as well.
You can give me Tampa all you want but they will be non-competitive in 2 years when all those young players sign with one of the above teams ala the 2003 Marlins.
I think I’m done with baseball. Going forward I’ll stick to the NFL and NBA, where the level playing field caused by the salary cap allows even small market teams to compete on a regular basis.
By Nick
December 12, 2008 5:01 PM | Link to this
Jerry Crasnick reports AJ signs with Yankes for 5 years $82.5 mill , money was supposed to be even between the two teams , he chose NYC…
By Ronald Millsaps
December 13, 2008 1:19 AM | Link to this
Why not pursue Andy Pettitte?
By Psg81
December 13, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this
The fact is burnett was not worth what atlanta offered him hes not a true acs a good 2 guy but no ace Dude hasnt won more than 13 games till this year i mean what did u want them to do blow there load on a guy that would be lucky to have 3 more good years think about it man time to start building from within i think they have the right idea and let peavy rot in san diego hes never going to win a world series there anyways he will probably blow his elbow out next year i mean if the dude dont want to come to Atlanta why should we want him anyways
By scoff
December 13, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this
How about this trade… Frank Wren for John Schueholz
By Original Jon
December 13, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
how about this trade…..scoff for a bag of peanuts….
By Ozzie
December 13, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this
Wren is still operating at a C+ level grade as a GM. He has the JJ/Rent trade which was a difference maker for the team. Every other move was ok not game changing.
The Vaz deal was clearly a reaction to losing Hampton and for a player who was no longer welcome in Chicago. It would not have taken much for any team to get him.
Wren is piling up the near misses and “we almost made it” deals. Tex, Peavy, AJ even Hampton bolting is not great.
Now much of that has to do with money but it also has to do with the direction the team is heading and what players think of mgt & their plan to win and soon.
Wren’s “next wave of talent” mantra is not (so far) attracting top talent. The Braves lack of PR around how aggressive they will be to win soon and how much money they will spend is also a problem.
They don’t have to print their payroll number in the paper but when your team looks like a sinking ship with rats leaving you need to step up the PR and talk about WS rings - nothing less is acceptable etc. Players like Peavy and others want to hear that from GMs, Managers, Ownership.
The straight laced Braves way of playing everything close to the vest doesn’t work when your team has played and or faired as poorly as the Braves have over the past 3-5 years.
JS, McGuirk and Malone need to crawl out from their oak lined offices and say “the Braves are tired of losing and will be very aggressive in building a WS caliber team and soon” “We are about winning the WS series and nothing less is acceptable by anyone is this organization.”
That statement made repeatedly couple with some more aggressiveness in dealing with many players & agents will help repair their reputation.
They also need to make offers to multiple players with deadlines. They cannot afford to focus on one guy and they be left holding the bag when he bails. That is a going out of business strategy especially in a light market for impact guys.
Wren’s comment yesterday “we were swimming up stream the whole time with AJ” (due to his wife’s flying issue) is a perfect example of how not to do things.
If you knew the geo issue was likely a deal breaker then why didn’t you have other offers out there? Why weren’t you on a plane to TX to meet with Andy Pettite or setting up meetings with Sheets etc.
Now Wren can say they had a lot of good conversations in Vegas but players want to see comittment and Wren like JS seems against showing up at anyone’s door demonstrating how much they want that person and discussing their plan for winning.
When you don’t have the most money or the biggest market you must add the personal touch. Heck even the NY teams have no issue with going to someone’s house even on top of offering them ungodly amounts of money.
The Braves do neither. The work things through agents and often never meet the player unless he signs a contract. This needs to change.
By JasonInFL (formerly ME)
December 13, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this
I need a new blog…can’t go all weekend without a new blog…not that I expect DOB to do one, but more that I need to converse with some fellow Braves fans. I still think FW is going to do something. His comment about filling the rotation “with depth” scares me…tells me there is no front line pitcher available to him at this point and that he is not willing to revisit the Peavy talks.
By jetsgrn5
December 13, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
it is pretty crappy that they are so close to contending yet so far away - i hope Wren can atleats get a power hitting oufielder - and sign oliver perez so the mets dont get him back - he has the stuff to be a very good pitcher / just needs to stay in control and not throw wild
By Doc Holliday
December 13, 2008 2:37 PM | Link to this
Im really starting to think we will end last in the standings next year and that we will be competing for the worst record in the league if something is not done in the next 2 weeks.
Lowe is not the answer to our problems.
Lets go for Oliver Perez.
If we land Peavy, its OK, if not……..I couldnt care less…….he showed he didnt care about the Braves, so why care about him???
Manny is LA bound.
I like what has been said around……….get Furcal and send KJ to LF. But then we will still be missing a power RH bat.
Let Glavine go for gods sake. He cant help us anymore.
What are the Braves doing as an effort to land Snell?
By Doc Holliday
December 13, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this
“There are still a number of guys that we like who can fill out our rotation,” Wren said. “There are still options out there.”
And there are a number of GMs that can do a better job and organizations that are getting things done out there……….I would add.
By Psg81
December 13, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this
ya but oliver perez is looking for a 5 year 70 mill deal thats 14 mill a year and i dont think the braves should provide that kinda money to a 3 or 4 starter they would be better off signing Paul Byrd for like 7 mill he said he would like to play closer to his atlanta home so im sure he would be happy to return he would provide some more depth in our rotation he was 11wins 12 loss this year with a 4.52 era in 180 IP i think he would benifite from returning to the NL maybe he would take a 1 year deal
By kc08
December 15, 2008 11:28 PM | Link to this
OMG it is true….looks like the braves might sign Furcal. However i dont think that means that they are back in for Peavy. kelly johnson could be traded as well. And what would you rather have, an ace or 3 decent pitchers that have quality starts. I thought that a staff of Hudson Smoltz hudson Jurrjens would have gotten the job done….but it didnt…why? we didnt have depth,,,our aces got hurt and we were left with nothing. Think about it
By Edwin Gilmore
December 18, 2008 8:39 AM | Link to this
Hello,
Another player slips through Frank Wrens fingers. Maybe the former GM should have taught Wren how to sell, and sign players in the off season. What has this GM done for the Braves in the last two seasons. People want to blame the agents who are just doing their job for their clients. It is a dirty buisness and the Braves do not have the personnel to play this game. It is up to the GM to sell the player on wanting to play for their team. Wren has not done a very good job at that. Plus he is losing battles with other general managers. Counter offer for heavens sake. Land an Ace pitcher or an elite outfielder. I would hate to see Bobby Cox go through another losing season like the last two. The organization owes him a contender.