AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2008 > October > 22 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USJake could make for J-heavy rotation
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
A few things while pondering how a rotation with Jake, Jair and Jorge would be in J-overload if Jo-Jo were also to join (realizing, of course, his name actually has nothing to do with why Jo-Jo Reyes could be left out of said rotation).
Oh, by the way, folks: Nice job crashing the previous blog with comment clog, for the second time in a week. You guys do realize it’s the offseason, right? (We kid. Participation and passion are always welcome.)
We’ll keep this entry brief (we always say that, seldom follow through) and let you folks have at it. Because if you’re going to make predictions on the World Series we’ve got to have them in quickly, since making a prediction after one team falls behind, say, 5-0 in the first two innings of Game 1 will not carry much weight.
I’m going with Cole Hamels to win the battle of stellar young lefties tonight against Scott Kazmir, and Hamels’ Phillies taking the World Series in seven games. Yes, goin’ the distance.
I’ll be up in Philly for Games 3, 4 and, provided its necessary, Game 5. We’ll have a good chunk of the AJC sportswriting staff in Philly this weekend, with a few across the street from Citizens Bank Park at the Falcons-Eagles game.
But for the first two games, I’ll be watching on TV, just like you all. Then watching Sons of Anarchy on DVR tonight after Game 1.
We’ll stay on top of any developments in the Peavy saga and report them as soon as we get anything, obviously. I say this because sometimes I get e-mails from people asking me what’s happening, what do I know, etc, as if I’m keeping the best stuff to myself, out of the paper and off the blog.
Speaking of pitching, or lack thereof, I forgot to mention this the other day when I found this while pillaging through team-by-team pitching totals: Do you realize the Braves were the only NL team without at least two starters who pitched 150 innings this season?
Jair Jurrjens had 188-1/3, and Hudson was next at 142. Jorge Campillo pitched 158-2/3 innings, but only 137 came as a starter.
That’s amazing. And for a team that for so long led the league with three and sometimes four starters who pitched 200 innings, many of them topping 220 back in the day, which really wasn’t long ago.
One other unrelated note: Because I’m going to the GM meetings in two weeks, I had to do the absentee voting thing today. Folks, I stood in line for two hours. Two hours! That’s what happens when Dekalb County has just one place to do absentee voting before next week.
I love that so many people are doing their civic duty and all, but two hours was absolutely excruciating for someone with no patience (that’d be me).
By the way, I’ll break with blog rules and share with you how I voted: Yes, on both measures involving the Homestead Exemption.
This just in: McCann is good. Got an e-mail today from someone connected with the 2009 Bill James Handbook, which just ranked Brian McCann in its Top 25 players under age 30.
The Braves’ 24-year-old catcher is 22nd, one spot behind Stephen Drew, and just ahead of Miguel Cabrera. Not bad company, I’d say.
James ranked the Braves ninth for overall young talent on the major league roster, up from 16th a year ago. They were ranked just ahead of the Boston Red Sox.
The top 10 teams: 1. Minnesota, 2. Arizona, 3. Tampa Bay, 4. Florida, 5. Kansas City, 6. Milwaukee, 7. Cleveland, 8. Colorado, 9. Atlanta, 10. Boston.
Here’s a couple things from the press release: “…. The Braves ranked 16th in our survey last year, but shot up the list due to a solid year by McCann and the emergence of Jurrjens, Yunel Escobar, and others (Gregor Blanco, Jorge Campillo, Martin Prado, Jo-Jo Reyes, Josh Anderson.) Francoeur and Kelly Johnson are still young players. They just need for some of these guys to pump up the volume.”
And from an explanation of the rankings: “To achieve his inventory, James first eliminates from the list all players who were 30 years old or older in 2008. He employs two widely used statistics — “Runs Created” for position players and “Runs Allowed” for pitchers-as the basis for comparison. He makes several adjustments, including for injuries suffered during the year and the differences in predictability between pitchers and position players, and then takes into account the number of years the player should be at his peak performance.
(Blogmaster note: If you notice, everybody on this list is 26 or younger, so it appears that age was also taken into account, with the younger players given credit for their youth, more or less. If Josh Hamilton were on the list, he’d be the oldest, at 27.)
James’ Top 10 young players (and their ages): 1. Prince Fielder (24), 2. Hanley Ramirez (24), 3. Tim Lincecum (24), 4. David Wright (25), 5. Ryan Braun (24), 6. Dustin Pedroia (24), 7. Matt Kemp (23), 8. Francisco Rodriguez (26), 9. Jose Reyes (25), and 10. Nick Markakis (24).
The next 15: 11. Joakim Sorian (24), 12. Ryan Zimmerman (23), 13. Cole Hamels (24), 14. Troy Tulowitzki (23), 15. Felix Hernandez (22), 16. Jon Lester (24), 17. Evan Longoria (22), 18. John Danks (23), 19. Adrian Gonzalez (26), 20. James Loney (24), 21. Drew (25), 22. McCann, 23. Cabrera (25), 24. Grady Sizemore (25), 25. Joey Votto (24).
The 3B is excited about moves: I’ve talked to several Braves players who’ve closely followed the reports of potential offseason moves the team could make, including Chipper Jones. It’s the offseason, and you might have heard the old dude keeps an eye on the blog and other sources of info.
I quoted him in a story about Peavy earlier this week (you can find it on our Braves page at AJC.com), but here’s another quote from Chipper that didn’t make it in the story.
I asked him about the rumors of what the Braves might do, and Frank Wren stating they’re going after two proven starting pitchers and a power-hitting outfielder:
“It’s nice that there’s at least smoke, and we’re gonna make some hay,” Jones said, seamlessly blending two figures of speech into one. “Whether it’s free agent market or via trade, nice that we’re gonna be active.
“That’s good. It’s an exciting time,” he said, then again revealed his fondness for Braves/MIB denizens. “It keeps our fans reading the papers, reading the blogs to see what might be on the horizon. The Braves have said they want to make a splash.
“We need pitching, no doubt about that. There’s some good ones out there, some marquee names that are out there. Don’t know if we’ll be able to afford the really big names, but there’s enough out there that getting a couple of them can make us a contender next year.”
He went on to talk about Peavy and about A.J. Burnett, and that stuff’s in the story I wrote. Here it is again, in case you missed it:
“I don’t think the organization can survive too many more Teixeira trades,” Jones said. “Don’t get me wrong, it’s great to get a guy like Tex and have him produce the way he did. But what you give up for such a short-term fix can set your minor league organization back quite a bit. And it did. We don’t have a lot of prospects at the higher levels. We have a ton at the lower levels.
“You want to be very careful you don’t stunt the growth of your minor league system by trading away all the good ones for a short-term fix. Now this Peavy thing, it’s not a short-term fix. Getting a guy in his prime for four or five years, at or velow market value…
“There’s no doubt [the Braves need an ace]. If he was in the last year of his contract coming up, this would be the same scenario [as Teixeira]. But this is a lot different. You’re looking at a guy who’d be your opening-day starter for the next year four years.
“He’s one of those guys you don’t particularly like facing. And he’s a good guy, he’d fit right in with the guys [on the Braves]. He’s a golfer, a hunter, from the country, just like us. I think Atlanta would be a perfect fit for him.”
He went on to say this about Peavy and Burnett:
“There’s some names out there that are very appealing to me,” Jones said. “I like a guy like A.J. Burnett. I’ve always dreaded facing that guy, with the Marlins and whatnot. A.J. is a bulldog. Peavy’s a bulldog.
“Those guys, they take the mound, they want to stick it to you, and they’re competitors, not afraid to show emotions, stuff like that. I think that’s great. They’re not showing anybody up, they just want to win.
“I think that, at times, is something we’ve been missing, that guy who’s going to walk out on the mound, and when he walks on the mound he’s looking to throw a complete-game shutout. That kind of competitive spirit would be good for this clubhouse and this team.
“And they’re both strikeout pitchers. We all know that’s what wins in the postseason. You get two power arms like that, you’ve got a formula for not just being built for 162 games, but for a short series.”
Speaking of Chipper…. He’s hosting his annual Chiper Jones Invitational Golf Tournament Nov. 3 at Bear’s Best Atlanta Golf Course, with proceeds to benefit the Cystic Fibrosis Foundation.
You can help raise funds by participating in the raffle at www.netRaffle.org. A grand prize winner will be invited to play with three of his or her friends in the tournament and receive four tickets to the banquet/acution on Nov. 2.
Raffle tickets are $2 each and there’s a minimum five-ticket purchase. The raffle closes on Monday (Oct. 28) at 9 a.m.
No kidding: They just showed the national anthem being performed … by the Backstreet Boys. Really, Tampa Bay? The Backstreet Boys?
Oh, well. Enjoy the game, folks.
“TUESDAY’S GONE” by Allen Collins & Ronnie Van Zant
Train, roll on, on down the line.
Won’t you, please, take me far away.
Now I feel the wind blow outside my door.
Means I’m, I’m leaving my woman at home.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
Oh, my baby’s gone with the wind.
And I just don’t know, oh, where I’m going.
I just want to be left alone.
Well, when this train ends I’ll try again
Oh, but I’m leaving my woman at home.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
My baby’s gone with the wind.
Train, roll on, Tuesday’s gone.
Train, roll on many miles from my home.
See I’m, I’m riding my blues away, yeh.
Tuesday, you see, she had to be free.
Lord, but somehow I’ve got to carry on.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
Tuesday’s gone with the wind.
My baby’s gone with the wind.
Train, roll on ‘cause my baby’s gone…
I’m riding my blues away, baby
turn around my blues
ride on, train, ride on, train
ridin’ my blues, babe
come back to me, babe
come back to me
oo-oo-oo-oo-oo-ooh train….
Comments
By keylargo
October 22, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this
Tried to warn you DOB
By David O'Brien
October 22, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this
OK, everyone take note this new blog was posted at 8:32 p.m., well before Utley’s homer. I don’t want anyone thinking I made my prediction after he put the Phils up 2-0.
By cabravesfan
October 22, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this
The heart says Rays in 7 but the brain is screaming phils in 6
By MGL
October 22, 2008 8:57 PM | Link to this
Dob, thanks for squeezing in the new blog. It helps pass the time during th commercials.
By BravesFanChris24
October 22, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
LOL @ The National Anthem pick.
The more the Peavy trade talks happen, the more I get anxious and want it to happen. I think getting Peavy would definitely be step 1 of a busy off season for Wren. I just hope it gets done sooner than later.
By Aristotle
October 22, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this
I was told that this scenario would not be entertained on any other Braves’ blog. The front office type that I discussed it with couldn’t, or wouldn’t explain why. I was just trying to understand the great disparity between the goals of the Braves at the Braves’ webpage and all the policies of the AJC that are diametrically opposed to the goals.
This very expressive, dedicated member became decreasingly communicative with every attempt of mine, to simply understand the enigmatic aspects of that sports website. All communication of this nature ceased when I suggested that the team change its name to Alice’s Republic; because it is an adventure in Wonderland, with all its colorful cast of characters there.
As I was checking out of the rabbit hole, I heard a faint voice from Hotel California, a cowering soul, mumbling what sounded like “Braves.” I didn’t catch the name of the captive free spirit; but the Red Queen did. And, you know, “Off with his head;” just like Lewis Carroll said. So, they are playing strictly by that surrealistic script in their “Theater of the Absurd.”
This hypothetical is for the sole sake of discussion at the AJC Braves/MIB blog. It wishes no harm to anyone. It must have been imagined by others, though I haven’t seen anything like it. But something similar must have occurred to many others.
This is not a wish, hope, or dream, or anything like that. It’s just to probe the thoughts of thinkers. And in the current state of Braves’ affairs, it seems that anything is thinkable, but the right thing. There seems to be a national aversion to the right thing, coupled with a natural inclination to the wrong things.
This hypothetical concerns that two MLB teams, between a pair of horses, one of which is two-faced. It may be better to call them thoroughly bad, than thoroughly bred. We don’t want to give thoroughbreds or any horse a bad name; even though horses and those two racers are full of the same. Makes you want to go north of the Mason-Dixon line, just to get away from the stench of those two beasts. If not, you must be part of the Mets, and in a quandary about where to flee for your life and liberty, with your property in tow and hopes of happiness all aglow.
Anyway, both horses, one white & one brown, move into the starting gate. There is a good crowd in attendance. The white horse is in considerably worse shape than the black horse; and is subject to expiring at any moment. Well, it does in the starting gate. Here one minute and gone the next. It’s possible, isn’t it? Life happens and so does death. And for sole sake of discussion, assume that old white horse had heart failure from too much primary race stress. (This is just for sake of discussion; with nothing but the very best of wishes to all animals. It’s just a harmless analogy used only for purposes of illustration. No member of the animal kingdom is in danger here.) Everyone wants to see a race every year; but there must be a protracted funeral procession first. And this extended time gives the owners of the brown horse opportunity to think, while the white horse fans attend to funeral duties.
Both owners have lengthy discussions during and after the funeral; and reach a tentative agreement that must be presented to the white horse fans prior to proceeding as agreed. The brown horse will run under the colors of the white horse against an old black mare running under the former colors of the brown horse. Put another way, the brown horse only changed running colors, nothing else.
In times past, this would have been outrageous; but times are a changin.’ And change is all anyone has, or wants, provided it’s only change of pace maintained in the wrong direction.
The young, galloping brown horse recently beat the old, loping black mare. So, the white horse fans with the new black horse have a proven winner! And all they ever cared about was winning. It didn’t matter how they did it; because they had a very big tent to please. The brown horse fans get to see their old black mare lope again, under their own colors; and regardless of which horse wins, they win. So, it’s a win-win situation for the brown horse fans. Will the white horse fans take the magnanimous offer and cheer for their new black horse on race day?
Do you think the Mets, Phillies, Nationals, Giants, Marlins, Yankees, Blue Jays, Cubs, Orioles, Pirates, Red Sox, etc. would cheer the Braves to victory? The correct, unqualified, unequivocal, answer is obvious, isn’t it? Its saliency slaps you in the face with a liberal dose of bone-chilling reality, in a way you’ll never forget.
They are all in it to win it, no matter what. Like I heard once, they can change their Collective Mind in midstream. But…there’s that notorious word again, “BUT!” Seems the Braves invented it: “We want Jake Peavy; but….” Substitute whatever front office spin you want for the next few words and you get the same phrase, ad infinitum, ad nauseam. So, there may be a slight problem with the otherwise obvious outcome of this scenario. It could be the deal breaker - the proverbial last straw on the ungracefully aged Pachyderm’s back.
Have you already guessed it and beat the agonizingly slow hunt-&-peck typing to the all too obvious punch line? If you are a big baseball fan, you knew the answer from the start. In fact, you recognized the scenario at first mention of the word. But, MLB novices need a reminding clue of the prominent, defining characteristic mentioned in the opening description of the race horses. The Braves faithful would notice it at first glance, while looking the “gift horse in the mouth.” The Braves have only one face; and the faithful always demanded more! What would you do?
What are they going to do? “What would the brilliant Schuerholz do?” Grow him a conservative face, just for the race!
That’s the hypothetical presented with no harm intended to any party animal, or anyone’s prospects hyper-sensitivities; and well wishes to all, but contra-revolutionaries.
With all due respect to those riding “a horse of a different color.”
By Brian
October 22, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this
How many here think Victorino will do something dirty in this series?
By cabravesfan
October 22, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this
I made my pick before I knew the score- i swear…
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the new Blog, Chief!
Thanks especially for that part about McCann. 8 ) Gotta say, it’s easy to see why he’s only 22nd. All those guys in front are really good. Some of them I didn’t realize were that young…but I’m pretty bad at ages.
Yikes…yeah, we didn’t watch the whole Anthem…That was pretty bad…whoa…
One thing about the Backstreet Boys’ other songs: Like, they all have the same beat…
I knew the Blog was gonna blow up while we were gone. Sorry if anybody posted anything to me.
But hey, at the AT&T store, my brother and I got to use an iPhone for about 16 minutes! It was one of the displays.
GO RAYS!! BEAT THEM FILLIES!!
Good lord, Lorn…The Reaper hit a single…
By David O'Brien
October 22, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this
Anyone who had any really insightful, brilliant and/or hilarious comments toward the end of the last blog might want to post them again, if you remember them. Because I didn’t see them, and me and others can’t call up the old blog now that it’s crashed.
By Efrim
October 22, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this
Rays in 7
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this
Oh, by the way, folks: Nice job bringing down the previous blog with comment overload, for the second time in a week. You guys do know it’s the offseason, right?
I bet it was Random. Once he came back, the Blogs started to blow up.
; )
By Brian
October 22, 2008 9:11 PM | Link to this
BravesFanChris- I’m with ya! Hopefully when the WS is over they’ll snag Peavy, or sooner. I mean, the first thing I did when I walked in the door today was check out the blog for updates on Peavy! Kinda like a little kid around the Christmas tree.
By mitchie-san
October 22, 2008 9:12 PM | Link to this
Thanks DOB That last one was killing my computer…..
By jrjags
October 22, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this
Phillies in six. Don’t know why. Th starting pitching is way in the Ray’s favor, especially if the Phils do send out Moyer. Just got a feeling about the Phils, playing real well lately.
By 22oz
October 22, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this
Can’t believe Victorino slid into homeplate and didn’t try to bowl over Navarro. Can you McFann?
By chick
October 22, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this
another great blog. What about the possibility of Jermaine Dye coming to Atlanta to solve our power problem
By Steve from OH
October 22, 2008 9:18 PM | Link to this
Fantastic song choice DOB.
Well, this is neither insightful nor hilarious (Rays in 6, btw), but Sandy Alderson made a few comments yesterday, some of which were about Peavy. Here’s the main one:
*The Peavy trade is not on the front burner. There were a couple clubs that tried to get a head start by starting before the playoffs ended. Those discussions have taken place but there has been no immediate progress. Alderson doesn’t think anything will happen in next two weeks. *
Maybe FW is balking at including top prospects after all? Maybe he is a sly dog? Maybe this is all pure speculation? I don’t know!
By mitchie-san
October 22, 2008 9:18 PM | Link to this
I made it to the Sharks game last night. Good game until they lost it in the ninth…Anyway, Kala Ka’aihue played the whole game and struck out once and had a few walks. I forgot my camera (even after charging the battery….) so no new videos this time around. Everytime I watch Kala play, one person comes to mind….Andres Gallaraga.
By BravesFanChris24
October 22, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
To be honest, along with me, a few people at my work who are Braves fans have been discussing this each day. As soon as I get up in the morning, I check it out before work and after I get home. It has me excited for this off season for Braves.
Also, I want it to happen sooner than later so we can get on with the other pitcher and consistent power OF bat :)
By Mr. J
October 22, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this
So Chipper says he’s excited about the prospect of a big trade, yet the Braves can’t stand anymore Texeira fiascos. So which side of the fence is he on?
Myself, the more I read here on the blog and consider the arguments, the more I think the trade is not going to happen. And unless Towers gives in like Beane did and decides that he really, really needs the salary dump, I don’t think we should do the deal.
Go after Burnett or Lowe. See what else might turn up. Give Hanson a chance to show his stuff.
By keylargo
October 22, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this
Let’s say the offer to San Diego is Escobar, Schafer, and two more prospects not named Heyward or Hansen for Peavy and Greene.
If the Padres turn it down or say I’ll get back to you this is what I would do if I was Frank Wren. I would call the Florida Marlins and offer the same package for Hanley Ramirez. Don’t tell me the Marlins won’t trade him because they will trade anyone to trim payroll and get prospects. This would save the Marlins $5mm in salary (2009) and give them a starter at SS and 3 almost MLB ready players they can control for the next 4 - 5 years.
Yes, I have proposed this before, but this is a win/win trade for both teams. Hanley Ramirez would be a lead off man, that hit 34 HR’s, stole 31 bases, and hit .301. He is signed for 6 years @ $70mm.
It wouldn’t hurt anything and would put the pressure on the Padres to make the deal or would give us a true super star for at least 6 years.
By Braveheart
October 22, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this
http://www.fairfield-echo.com/o/content/shared-blogs/ajc/braves/entries/index.html
By MGL
October 22, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this
One of the idiot Fox announcers commented that Carl Crawford was the longest tenured Ray. He was there back when they were called the Devil Rays. That was all the way back to last year!
Aristotle, could you please net out your comment to a single sentence so some of us less read bloggers can understand it?
By Mike
October 22, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this
So I have read on MLBtraderumors.com that several MLB execs say that its likely the Braves will get Peavy and that the deal looks to be along the line of Hanson, Schafer, and either KJ or Escobar. Buster Olney feels that it will be Johnson. Soooo, considering that, lets look at what we lose to what we gain. I admit, at first I dont like seeing Hanson’s name there, but then I thought about it. In Schafer you lose a potential CF allstar…but…you have Gorkys Hernandez, whom some project to be more talented, just a year behind him, and Blanco or Anderson will fill in nicely till hes ready, so no major lose there. Next is KJ, a good, not great, sometimes inconsistent 2B that you could replace with Prado, a good, not great, 2B who has shown so far to be a good, not great hitter. So, no major lose or downgrade there. Which brings us to Hanson. A possible future ace pitcher. But you cant forget that we would be getting a current allstar pitcher, and for at least 4 years (maybe longer) thats cheap. I know, the health concern is an issue. But you will be hard pressed to find a good pitcher that hasnt or doesnt have health concerns. And overall Peavy hasnt missed much time, and according to info on MLBtraderumors.com, he has a clean bill of health. You always run the risk of health with a pitcher, anything could go wrong at any moment. In baseball, a GM has to take risks, they just try to make the least risky move as possible. We all know that we wouldnt commit the time or the money to land CC. We have the money, but good teams that dont have $150-$200 mill payrolls dont win and build solid teams for year after year by commiting such a large amount to one player. And lets face it after CC, whos the next best pitcher available…Peavy. So the Braves get an ace pitcher for 4 years cheap, they have more money to spend to get a Lowe/Garland/Wolf type, and a power LF, and we dont set the organization back for years with the lose of prospects. Like all trade deals for big players, there is always the unease of wondering what you lost to get it. Me…I’d take it!
By cabravesfan
October 22, 2008 9:32 PM | Link to this
MGL
The Fox guys also made a comment in pre game about how Crawford could recall the “lean years” when the Rays were bad…umm- that was also LAST YEAR (and the 9 preceeding it)
By J.L.
October 22, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this
A little math again. Peavy 15.5 mil ,Greene if we have to take him in the deal 6.5 mil, thats 22mil . Take the 22 mil and go after c.c. or some other free agent pitcher,and don’t give up our prospects.
By James Munson
October 22, 2008 9:34 PM | Link to this
DOB, I was wondering about the draft this upcoming June. If we sign a type “A” free agent, do we lose our pick? I thought that if it were a top 10 pick we kept it.
By Deep Throat
October 22, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this
Myself, the more I read here on the blog and consider the arguments, the more I think the trade is not going to happen.
Huh? This sounds like you think blogger opinions can sway Frank Wren one way or another.
The Peavy trade needs to happen. As long as KJ or Escobar are not involved, it is only a step forward. Not just for 2009, but for years beyond that.
As for Tommy Hanson, I think the Braves’ scouts can tell Wren just how good he may be years down the line. But right now, the way people here act as if Hanson is “can’t miss” and a sure thing, the more I am reminded of Dan Meyer and Kyle Davies and Jose Capellan and Andy Marte, et all.
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this
22oz—
Ah, man! I didn’t see that play! But yeah, I can’t believe he didn’t try something like that.
Aw, he slid this time, though? That was nice of him (she says in a sarcastic voice, still wondering why he didn’t slide on July 27…’Oh yeah,’ she remembers. ‘He was trying to jar the ball loose…’)
Brian How many here think Victorino will do something dirty in this series?
Oo! Oo! Pick me! Pick me!
BRB…bases loaded…
By J.L.
October 22, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this
Just a thought, A C.C. & Mcann Battery.
By Brian
October 22, 2008 9:44 PM | Link to this
Mike- Finally, someone with some sense! Couldn’t agree with you more. I take that back, there have been some people that have points and arguments.
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 9:44 PM | Link to this
Hey, you dummy! Why don’t you try running to first base? BJ! And I thought you were supposed to be good…Good lord, Loren…
cabravesfan I made my pick before I knew the score- i swear…
Uh-huh. We “believe” you… ; )
Go Rays!! BEAT THEM FILLIES!!
…Pretty please?
Holy…another single for guess who. Look out, Navarro!
By John
October 22, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this
National Anthem wasn’t so bad at all. Who’s the tall guy with the big voice? Trust me, I’ve heard a lot worse.
By N Nine
October 22, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this
The more the Peavy trade talks happen, the more I get anxious and want it to happen
That is our problem, we have other tasks to complete and we want it done. The Padres should not recieve best offer yet. As i said before, rushing this major move will hurt us the most. There is not as much competition from others yet…
By BravesFanChris24
October 22, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this
Someone please steal. I want a TACO~!
By richbrave
October 22, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this
PEAVY:
$$$$ and anybody on the forty-man except ESCO, CHIP, JJ, HUDSON, GONZALEZ and McCANN. Any farm-hands AFTER our top ten. Otherwise, let’s fish in a different lake.
By Run Heap Run!
October 22, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this
My money is on the Phillies. Sorry Rays, you had a good run…but the Phillies are just too good.
waves to U Kno Who
By cabravesfan
October 22, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this
McFann
I swear on my stalker-esque obsession with a certian catcher
I am pulling strongly for the Rays if it helps…the phils served their purpose and now I can go back the disliking them again:)
By jrjags
October 22, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this
James Munson,
All picks in the first half of the draft are protected. If we sign a type A, I believe we would give up our #2.
By scottbravesfan
October 22, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this
I got Tampa Bay in 6. I do think the Phillies will win game 1 though even before the game starter.
Also Dave, how many posts did we have on the last blog?
By richbrave
October 22, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this
MGL:
Yours of 9:24 p.m. U-u-u-urah, good buddy.
By N Nine
October 22, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
Someone please steal. I want a TACO~!
I’m parked next to taco bell’s drive thru will someone alert me on the pronto..yo quiero taco bell..or how bout them valcano ones…mmm tasty
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
Hiya, Run Heap Run!!
I’m afraid you might be correct about the Fillies winning this thing…oh! The horror!!
No offense. ; )*
And I cann already hear Joe and Boog and Chip…mostly Chip:
“And here he is! The World Series M. V. P! The Flyin’ Hawaiian, Shane Victorino!”
I repeat: THE HORRR!!
N Nine—
I had posted a response to you on the last Blog right before we left the house—I think it was around 5 o’clock—don’t know if you got it.
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan—
I know you were serious, I was just givin’ you the business.
the phils served their purpose and now I can go back the disliking them again:)
LOL! Always a good idea!
my stalker-esque obsession with a certian catcher
Hmm…I think I might have that same “problem”…What do you wanna bet it’s with the same certain catcher?
By mitchie-san
October 22, 2008 10:08 PM | Link to this
The HORRR? GO wash your mouth out with soap!
By kirknga
October 22, 2008 10:10 PM | Link to this
J.L. , I agree with you. Peavy and Green could cost as much as Sabathia and Escobar at first, but Green is likely to see a salary increase after this season.
By cabravesfan
October 22, 2008 10:11 PM | Link to this
McFann
I hope its the same catcher…I’d hate to think you are obsessed with Corky Miller! (although Clint is kinda hot…)
By cabravesfan
October 22, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this
McFann
and by the way, who ever said it was a “problem”?
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this
mitchie-san The HORRR? GO wash your mouth out with soap!
Yeah, I meant “horrer“…
Gotta shutdown, unfortunately.
Oh! Happy days! The Reaper got out!
Night, all!
By Mr. J
October 22, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this
Deep Throat,
That’s not what I was trying to say. The arguments on the blog are not going to sway FW or anyone else with the Braves. But these arguments (at least the better ones) are probably close to the ones involved in the Braves front office internal debate.
Hopefully, they ran through all these scenarios long before we did.
The point I was trying to make was more about what I think will happen, more than what should happen. Sorry I wasn’t clear.
By tlj
October 22, 2008 10:19 PM | Link to this
I know Peavy will not agree to a AL team but if was agreeable Would Tampa Bay trade David Price, BJ Upton and Reid Brignac for Jake Peavy?
You have a minor league pitcher (David Price) with huge upside and a probable top of the rotation pitcher - same as Hanson
A young everyday MLB player (BJ Upton)who just completed his first ML season. He had a good season but not great (just considering regular season) and is projected to be allstar down the road - same as Escobar
A young Minor league player almost ML ready (Reid Brignac)but had a little bit of a down season - same as Schafer.
The answer is NO, Tampa is not making the trade beacuse all of theses players all have high upside and it is not in their interest to make this trade.
Why does anyone expect the braves to make a similar trade. All 3 of the braves players have a huge upside and all project to be good ML players.
I can see using one of them as the center piece but not all 3 in the same deal.
By McFann Ô
October 22, 2008 10:21 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan I hope its the same catcher…I’d hate to think you are obsessed with Corky Miller!
LOL! Yeah, it’s the same guy for both of us! No, not a “problem” at all!
(although Clint is kinda hot…)
Eh…nya…
By clay
October 22, 2008 10:24 PM | Link to this
TACO!!!!!!
By BravesFanChris24
October 22, 2008 10:24 PM | Link to this
Bartlett :)
Bartlett won everyone a free taco :)
By Steve from OH
October 22, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this
tlj, that’s a close analogy, but not quite apples-to-oranges. David Price is way, way more valuable than Tommy Hanson, and Upton is probably more valuable than Escobar. I’d take Schafer over Brignac (personal preference), but still, Tampa’s three are of higher quality than our three.
But it’s an excellent observation, man. Lots to think about, and I think that that’s a really good analogy to what we’re giving up—even if those guys are better, it’s still their “top 3” compared to our “top 3.” They wouldn’t give up their 3, so why should we? Even if ours aren’t quite as good, they’re still our top 3 prospects/young players. Those are the guys you build around.
I agree that we should make ONE of them the centerpiece and let the Pads pick what second-tier prospects they want. If they don’t like it, tell ‘em to shove it and have fun losing 90 games again next season. They know as well as we do that they aren’t likely to improve much without importing players into their system.
By Taylor S
October 22, 2008 10:34 PM | Link to this
DOB- Please tell me there is no chance Wren sends Hannson, Schafer, and Escobar for Peavy and Green??????????
By Josh P.
October 22, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this
I think one important aspect of the Peavy discussion that gets lost in the shuffle is the ascension of the man, the myth, the legend: Barry Axelrod. That’s a pretty brutal surname.
By brian
October 22, 2008 10:43 PM | Link to this
I still think the Braves should keep Hanson. He is what the Braves have been waiting for in a young pitcher. I would not include him for Peavy.
I would include Escobar if it came down to it. The attitude is a concern and if the rumors posted by DOB are true it will be hard to build around someone whose attitude worsens when things are down. If escobar lets us keep Hanson I would do it. Morton, Escobar, and Schafer for Peavy and Greene. Or else KJ, Schafer, and a pitcher not Hanson or Teheran. Short of that I would move on to another target.
By Braveheart
October 22, 2008 10:43 PM | Link to this
Here’s some advice for Braves’ GM Frank Wren - don’t make the same mistake John Schuerholz did five years ago when Adam Wainwright was traded.
5 years later, only 400 innings and only 30 runs allowed above average. Sorry, Shanks, Wainwright is hardly killing us thus far……. If Hanson only has 400 innings and 30 runs allowed better than average 5 years from now, this trade will not be a mistake…….
By Yars
October 22, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this
I get the feeling KJ is good as gone, whether it be to the Padres, or another team. Cards & D’backs also looking for a 2B, I could be wrong, but I don’t think Prado is going to be handed the 2B job. What likely made KJ’s career in Atlanta a short one was his awful defense. Perhaps Lillibridge will stick around & get thrown in the 2B mix?
By A-ville Ranger
October 22, 2008 11:03 PM | Link to this
I called Philly in 6 just after the last out of the ALCS.I like the phils vets and particularly Utley.Does anybody else see Utley as the Phillies’ Paul O’Neill ? he just has that grit about him.
By Steve from OH
October 22, 2008 11:07 PM | Link to this
Braveheart:
Agreed. Now the big question: do you do the KJ/Hanson/Schafer + prospects deal?
By MattyO
October 22, 2008 11:09 PM | Link to this
I would love to get Peavy , but not for Hanson, Schafer, and either Johnson or Escobar. That’s ridiculous and I think Wren knows it is. One of those guys should be the start. I wouldn’t even give them two of those guys. If they can’t work it out, so be it. Jake would be a perfect fit but not at such a high cost. I hope they can get something done without giving up too much. Go Bravos!
By David O'Brien
October 22, 2008 11:13 PM | Link to this
Josh, until I read your 10:41 post I’d never really thought of that. Thanks, man. Thanks a damn lot.
By David O'Brien
October 22, 2008 11:16 PM | Link to this
Taylor: I can’t tell you there’s no chance.
By Brian
October 22, 2008 11:38 PM | Link to this
Josh- I just hope that McFann is in bed after that comment! Her precious virgin ears don’t need that!
By jrjags
October 22, 2008 11:43 PM | Link to this
That should settle the MVP debate. How can you be an MVP if an opponent intentionally walks the hitter in front of you in the 9th inning of the World Series?
Can you ever see that happening to get to Pujols? Utley? No. It doesn’t matter if it sets up a double play. You wouldn’t ever want to put more runners on for those guys. Howard is not in the same class.
By uga-brave
October 22, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this
the phils are 86-0 when leading after eight innings. that must make charlie manuel the best manager in baseball?
all kidding aside that statistic is amazing considering the bandbox they play 81 games in.
jason werth is turning into the player that many thought francoeur would be.
By Wayne (taco lover)
October 22, 2008 11:46 PM | Link to this
Great news tonight!!! We all get a free taco on November 28th between the hours of 2 and 6 pm local time
Put it in your calendars folks!!!
Comeon Rays, time to stop Lidge’s streak.
By Wayne (taco lover)
October 22, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this
It worked folks, Frank Wren has been reading the blog the past few days, and he says he sees the logic in my thought process on the Peavy trade.
He says he is going to offer a centerfielder, a shortstop, and a second baseman, in addition, he is sending a major league ready starter, and a couple of prospects:
Gregor Blanco Brent Lillibridge Martin Prado Jorge Campillo Diory Hernandez Dan Smith and Phil Stockman
Sounds like the Braves will get Peavy without giving up Tommy Boy, although the price is still extremely high for the Braves.
I convinced Frank that he MUST give up talent to get talent!
(your welcome!)
By mbatl
October 22, 2008 11:57 PM | Link to this
Wayne, I hear that next year, Porsche is planning to do a similar promotion.
btw, I don’t think walking Utley was a slap at Howard… not with one out. It was the only choice. Puts the double play in force, and would you rather face Utley and Howard, or Howard and Bruntlett? A no brainer, IMO.
Howard is in a funk, though. No doubt about it.
By Wayne
October 22, 2008 11:59 PM | Link to this
We might have to succumb and throw in Buddy Carlyle. I know this will be hard for some to take.
That’s what we used to call a “drop ball” that Lidge is throwing!
By Couch Tater
October 23, 2008 12:05 AM | Link to this
I wonder if the Phillies were concerned that Lidge had an arm motion that could lead to surgery?
By Chuck
October 23, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this
How is Josh Hamilton not on that list of top 25 players under 30?! Sorry if somebody already brought that up, I haven’t read the whole blog. Could it be because of his past or something like that. What do you think DOB?
By Braveheart
October 23, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this
You people want to win now, or do you want to keep throwing kids into the deep end of the pool and hope they swim? Personally, I’m sick of losing.
RammerJammer, I love it. Spoken like the true Crimson Tide fan you are. Win. Win it all. Win it all now. Sick of losing after one really bad season. Definitely a man that lives to chant “we just beat the hell out of you. rammer, jammer, yellow hammer, give ‘em hell, alabama!” Roll Tide, man, Roll Friggin’ Tide!
The shadow of the Big Three will always loom large over this franchise like the shadow of the Bear has loomed so large on our program ever since he retired and died. No way we will ever find three like Smoltz, Maddux, and Glavine just like we’ll never find another Bear.
It would likely be a smallminded mistake to limit our search to our own prospects for the same reason we have at times hurt ourselves at Bama by acting like every coach has to have played for or coached with the Bear. Gotta be careful going outside the family though because we sometimes find ourselves dealing with clowns. From what Chipper is saying though, Peavy may be that cutthroat fella like Nick Saban that you sell your soul for in order to win and change the attitude. As it turned out, Tex was more of the weasel Dennis Franchione flavor.
By Jake C.
October 23, 2008 12:09 AM | Link to this
Why aren’t the Rays playing footage of Albert Pujols while Lidge trots out to the mound and warms up? I still think we are good for one classic Lidge blow up in this series, though he did look great tonight.
By Joe
October 23, 2008 12:12 AM | Link to this
The Braves need to cut ties with Jo-Jo Reyes.
By Taylor S
October 23, 2008 12:16 AM | Link to this
Well folks, its going to be a very sad day if we trade Escobar, Hanson, and Schafer. To me this is far worse than the Tex trade. Even tho Peavy will be with us for 5 yaers, we will be trading 3 guys who could all have a major impact on this years team. With Tex most of the players were so far away it didn’t really hurt.
By A-ville Ranger
October 23, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this
That’s the first I’ve seen about Escobar’s attitude.I saw the comments regarding ”bad clubhoude”etc but no word on the source.
It’s a shame the guy could be a huge asset on field.The way the team seemed to quit middle of the season was about more than a lack of talent so if he’s a downer,move him out.
By jrjags
October 23, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this
mbatl,
I hear what you’re saying about the double play and facing Howard and Bruntlett. I understand that strategy.
However, Howard is a guy a lot of people have been talking about as a possible MVP. I think instances like this prove he doesn’t deserve it. There are some hitters (Manny, Pujols, Utley, etc.) that are so good that you would never intentionally walk the man in front of them, even to set up a double play. Partly because you know there’s almost no chance of them hitting into one in that situation.
Howard is different. He’s good, don’t get me wrong. He leads MLB in home runs and RBIs over the last three years. But yet, teams aren’t scared enough of him to prevent them from walking someone to get to him instead of Utley. That’s more than being in a funk (coincidentally one that started just as the playoffs did).
He’s a really good power hitter. I just don’t think he belongs in the MVP discussion.
By mbatl
October 23, 2008 12:30 AM | Link to this
jrjags, I get what you’re saying. I thought it was sound strategy (1 run game with Lidge coming on to pitch), even if Pujols or Manny was coming up. But, believe me, I’m not trying to rekindle the Howard/MVP talk!
By Bobby's Cox
October 23, 2008 12:30 AM | Link to this
I didn’t get my World Series pick in before Game 1, but I still think the Rays take it. Their overall starting pitching is better.
The Phils may win 2 games, which very well may be both of Hamel’s starts, and it will allow Tampa to celebrate at home.
Rays in 6.
By David O'Brien
October 23, 2008 12:42 AM | Link to this
jrjags, you have to understand that what happens in the postseason, good or bad, simply has no relevance to the voting for MVP or Cy Young or Rookie of the Year or Manager of the Year. None. It can’t, since the votes must be submitted before the first postseason game.
So Ryan Howard is a streaky hitter, no question. He was awful early in the regular season, then arguably the best or second-best (to Pujols) hitter in the league for most of the last three months of the season.
Now he’s in a terrible funk, which happens to streaky hitters (ask Kelly Johnson). During the season, this would be a two- or three-week slump, not uncommon for him (or for most other hitters, actually. Even great ones).
But if you took into account what players did in the postseason, well, Upton would be AL MVP with seven homers in the postseason, which is almost as many as he hit all season.
And Hamels would be a Cy Young frontrunner, since he’s 4-0 with a miniscule ERA in the postseason after a very good, but not overwhelming, regular season.
And Lou Piniella and even Joe Torre wouldn’t be in the Manager of the Year running, because you’d have to give it to Charlie Manuel.
And on and on.
But the postseason DOES NOT MATTER for purposes of BBWAA award voting. The votes must be cast before the first postseason game is even played. So your point about walking Utley to get to Howard now, which they’d have never done in the second half of the season, is completely irrelevent. Sorry, but it just is.
By jrjags
October 23, 2008 12:47 AM | Link to this
mbatl,
MVP talk aside, I see what you’re saying about the strategy. I would use it a majority of the time (except when Pujols, Manny, Utley, etc. were up). Howard doesn’t qualify for me - unless he were facing the Braves; he kills us. I think we can both agree that even with a game one win, Howard has to step it up for the Phils to win. Their other starting pitchers aren’t good enough to hold TB to 3 runs every night.
By Bobby's Cox
October 23, 2008 12:50 AM | Link to this
i actually had a really good post at the end of last blog that is worth repeating.
So the Braves offer San Diego Hanson, Schaffer, and Escobar for Peavy and Green. They then give Peavy an MRI and have it examined by Dr. Andrews. The Braves pay Andrews 2.3 million to switch Peavy’s MRI with Hampton’s 2005 results. The Braves call the trade dead. In a month, Wren goes back to San Diego and says, “We’d still like to get Peavy for 2010. At that time, we’ll have a healthy Hudson and Peavy. We’ll also have Jurrjens with another year under his belt, as well as Hanson. We’ll take Peavy’s, and Green’s salary off your hands for Chuck James, Jo Jo Reyes, Redmond, and Lilibridge.” San Diego accepts. By “an act of God,” Peavy’s elbow heals. When San Diego sues, the Braves give Dr. Andrews and a 3rd party physician another million each, again wired into a Swiss bank account, to manipulate the MRI images. This will work so well, the Braves will pull the same trick with Tampa for David Price and James Shields, and carry a 7 man rotation in 2009.
Viola.
By jrjags
October 23, 2008 12:59 AM | Link to this
DOB
I know that the postseason has no bearing on the voting. I know all of those votes are turned in before it starts. I was just pointing out that I thought it proved Howard was not in the same league as other hitters who are also candidates. I wasn’t saying that his game tonight had any bearing on his case for MVP because I know it doesn’t. I just thought it was especially telling of his weaknesses and was comparing him in that situation to the other hitters. Just my opinion.
By Catfish
October 23, 2008 1:04 AM | Link to this
Frank Wren is starting to look more like JS. JS raped the franchise with the disastrous trade for Tex, and now Wren wants to be a copycat by trading away top prospects that will probably be in the majors next year.
Well folks, I’ve got news for you. A trade for Peavy will not put the Braves in the playoffs, but it will set the franchise back further if top propsects are used.
A better choice would be to wait and see what the free agent market will serve up.
By David O'Brien
October 23, 2008 1:21 AM | Link to this
jrjags, understood.
I’m sure you can see where that point might have been confusing because you said, “He’s a really good power hitter. I just don’t think he belongs in the MVP discussion.”
By Bobby's Cox
October 23, 2008 1:23 AM | Link to this
One comment about Hanson. Anyone who has the ability to strike out the rate of hitters he does at the minor league level, usually turns out to be pretty good at the major league level.
One thing i did post at the end of the last blog, was in reference to Shaun and Steve from OH. That was, if the Braves do trade Hanson, maybe Wren has a Japanese pitcher in mind like Yu Darvish. That would be impressive.
Since the Stros and Braves are the only 2 teams, Wren should play to the strength of Houston’s weak prospects, and to Peavy’s no-trade clause. I’m sure Wren is only offering a little more than what Houston can provide. Hopefully Hanson, Heyward, Schafer, Escobar, Gorkys, Medlin, Marek, Freeman aren’t in those proposals.
I’d be only willing to part with Medlin/Marek (not both), Freeman, Redmond, Johnson, Francouer, Chuck HR James, JoJo, Morton, Campillo, Blanco, Prado, Lilibridge. It’s not a lot, but I don’t think I’d be pretty excited to land Peavy if it costs us any of the “untouchables” Wren told us before the offseason.
By A. Downing
October 23, 2008 1:29 AM | Link to this
Steve from OH Upbeat blog. What’s the low-down on Upton? I know Upton’s HR totals are up and down. But, I’m sure the Phillies were about to upchuck thinking about Upton hitting it downtown. Down the stretch, do you see Upton’s stock up or down?
I know you are no psychic, otherwise you’d be in an Upton Sinclair novel (lol) but, if your up to the assessment of Upton; I appreciate it. If not, I’m down with that.
By Frank Viola
October 23, 2008 1:40 AM | Link to this
Voilà!
Il est moi, Frank Viola!
By jrjags
October 23, 2008 1:43 AM | Link to this
DOB
Sorry about the confusion. I reread my post, and it was somewhat ambiguous. I didn’t clarify that I was just stating my opinion about the comparisons of the hitters and not in regard to the actual vote.
However, I am pulling for Howard to turn it around so that the NL can get a victory and shut up the national media about the AL. Great game tonight, glad the Phils pulled it out. Although the thought of having to continually face Cole Hamels over the next few years is not fun. Guy’s a stud.
A. Downing
Upton’s power was down this year because of a shoulder injury. He couldn’t take a full swing because it put too much stress on his shoulder. It’s had enough time to heal, and we’re seeing the results in the postseason.
Most scouts project him as a 30/30 guy with 40/40 potential. Average should be around .300. He’s a true 5 tool player - has great range (evidenced by his ability to play so shallow and still get to everything kind of like Andruw in his prime) and has an absolute cannon.
I’ve seen a lot of scouts predict him to be a perennial MVP candidate along with Longoria. Funny thing is that most scouts say his brother Justin will be better in a few years.
By Wayne
October 23, 2008 1:46 AM | Link to this
Bobbys Cox This Yu Darvish dude looks like a potential stud. Only problem with him is all that off the field stuff. You know, that underage smoking and getting your girl friend pregnant won’t cut it in the Braves dugout.
Next thing we’ll hear is that some of our players are hanging out at Hooters… uh wait a minute.
Let’s sign him!
By BA
October 23, 2008 2:30 AM | Link to this
Fourteen years for Axl Rose to put out a single- and all he can come up with is a cheesy Papa Roach-style anthem.
Could’ve been the american Rolling Stones. Wound up being 30 seconds to mars. The Slash/Duff/Weiland band was infinetly better.
Rays in seven.
By BosnianBaller
October 23, 2008 2:42 AM