AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2008 > October > 02 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USLooking at this Braves winter and beyond
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Settling into the offseason, which began earlier for the Bravos that it once did. Again. But really, it’s been enough years (three) of them not making the postseason that it no longer feels strange seeing them as one of the 22 teams on the outside looking in, rather than the eight inside, where everybody wants to be.
Anyway, the Braves are now scattered to the corners of North and South America and the Caribbean, done with baseball for a while (until Fall League or Winter League assignments, for some).
And while I’d prefer covering a team immersed in the playoffs at this point, after a few years of no postseason, at least it’s allowed me to catch up on a bunch of great returning TV series and a couple of new ones, including Sons of Anarchy. Love that show, though they shouldn’t have all the dudes in SOA riding with those windshields on their bikes. The Mayans’ bikes looked much badder in the last episode, no windshields, just a lot of ape-hanger bars on those Harleys.
Oh, and The Shield remains one of my favorite shows. Outstanding. Tense and gritty as ever. But can anyone seriously keep up with the feud between the Mexicans and Salvadorans that began at the end of last season and has been the focus of this season?
Damn, I find myself pausing the DVR sometimes just to try to think it through. I feel almost senile watching it, at times. Oh, well, we all just want to see what happens to Vick and Shane anyway, right?
Now, where were we?
I said on the radio yesterday that the Braves are still regarded as one of the elite major league franchises by most people who’ve been in or around the game for a while. They really are, though I know that might seem hard to believe for some frustrated fans.
But I added this, and I really believe it: They’d better get this thing turned around in the next year or two or the Braves’ brand, as the suits call it, will lose a lot of its cache quickly. That process already began, what with them not being on TBS nightly like they were back in the day, and now missing the playoffs once, twice, three times straight.
The memory of the Big Three pitchers and the run of divisional dominance and decade-and-a-half of regular-season excellence … all of that will start to slip from the national sports conscience. It already has, to a degree. No question.
But it’s still only three years. This isn’t like the Miami Dolphins or New York Knicks going from perennial contenders to laughingstocks. It’s a long way from that. But if they don’t put the brakes on this and get it turned around….
Well, enough doomsday scenarios. GM Frank Wren and the rest of the front office believes the Braves can be contenders next year by filling a few big needs, if they fill them properly. There are plenty, perhaps a majority, of pundits and fans who think otherwise, that the Braves have a two- or three-year rebuilding project before they get back to the postseason.
Me, I feel like Wren could be right — but only if the Braves do it right, if they get two legit proven starting pitchers, whether that’s sign reliable Derek Lowe to be an ace and trade for a potential stellar No. 2 starter like a Matt Cain (15-30 the past two seasons with the Giants, but pitched well enough to legitimately have been 30-15 in that span with good run support on a good team).
Or trade for a big-time No. 1 starter, a guy that perhaps we don’t even know right now will be on the trade block. Yes, I’m talking about a Roy Oswalt type of guy. You never know. The Braves traded for Tim Hudson in the prime of his career, didn’t they? And they have more than enough payroll room to take on Oswalt’s salary, and enough prospects and/or a young, cheap player to trade to a Houston team that might be looking toward the future.
Then there are the Marlins. With 17 players eligible for arbitration, keep an eye on Fredi Gonzalez’s team. I know they’d prefer to trade outside the division, but the Marlins might find irresistible a Braves offer for one of their talented young pitchers, or perhaps left fielder Josh Willingham (if the Braves didn’t spend any more than his salary in LF, they could have more to spend on pitching, starting or otherwise).
Again, I’m just tossing stuff out there, because chances are at least one of the moves the Braves make will be one that’s from out of left field.
Speaking of left field, they’ve got to get a guy with at least 25-30 homer potential next season, to hit fourth behind Chipper on a daily basis (or at least as daily a basis as Chipper’s in there, probably a 120-135 days. Makes it even more important to have that big bat when Chipper’s not in there, which they didn’t have this year once they traded Teixeira. And Teixeira didn’t hit much during April and May to begin with.)
OK, but we’ve got a lot of time to talk about this stuff. Moves generally don’t start happening until after the postseason, save for some players re-upping with current teams or some scattered trade rumors.
Hot Stove is going to be stoked this winter, folks. No doubt about that. Braves are going to be in the middle of a lot of rumors, some of them legit.
Future does look promising: Talking to Wren on Monday, he reiterated what he’s said before about the depth and quality in the minor league system and how the Braves need to fill some needs now through free agency or trades until they start to get another steady flow of impact-type players from their system.
He acknowledged they haven’t produced any of their own impact-type players from the organization since the crop of “Baby Braves” came up in 2005 (and, we might add, most of those guys, with the exception of Brian McCann, haven’t enjoyed the sort of career ascendance the Braves hoped they would.)
Most of the Braves’ top minor-league talent is still a year or more away, though a couple of them — CF Jordan Schafer, pitcher Tommy Hanson perhaps? — could be here sooner.
But Wren’s not just blowing smoke up the blog when he says the Braves have a lot of talent in their system at the Double-A level and lower.
Perusing the new issue of Baseball America that just arrived at offseason Braves/MIB Blog Headquarters (aka my house in Atlanta), a few familiar names jumped out from the magazine’s list of Top-20 prospects in each minor league.
A few of these guys could be in the Braves’ lineup, Schafer as soon as next season, OF Jason Heyward, 1B Freddie Freeman by 2011, OF Gorkys Hernandez maybe 2011 (it’s not difficult to imagine a Braves of Schafer, Heyward and Hernandez.
Anyway, here are Braves who made the BA lists:
TRIPLE-A: Charlie Morton was the No. 9 prospect in the International League, where he didn’t up a home run in 12 starts before he was promoted to the majors. Folks, don’t let the impression you got of Morton with Atlanta spoil it for you; the kid is extremely talented, but that shoulder-blade thing sapped him of his velocity up here and he wasn’t the same pitcher I saw last fall in Arizona or that minor league opponents saw this early summer. We saw him throw about 91-93 in the majors most of the time, about 4-5 mph off his best.
He’ll be back next year on top of his game, I have a feeling. Needs to strengthen the shoulder and do the type of specific workouts he hasn’t done in the past, to withstand the rigors of pitching many innings at a high level.
OF Brandon Jones was the No. 17 prospect in the International League. Not sure what to make of his future, since he’s not talked about by the Braves the way he was in the past and had a underwhelming year in the minors. Wren said Monday that the nagging shoulder injury that brought Jones home early from the Mexican Winter League probably robbed him of some power all season.
We’ll see. Maybe he was saying that for the benefit of other teams that might be interested in trading for him, or maybe it’s just the truth. We’ll see.
By the way, check out the names from BA’s top 10 International League prospects list five years ago: 1. Jose Reyes, 2. Justin Morneau, 3. Victor Martinez, 4. Chase Utley, 5. Freddy Sanchez, 6. Adam LaRoche, 7. Brandon Claussen, 8. Cliff Lee, 9. Jeremy Guthrie, 10. Coco Crisp.
DOUBLE-A: Tommy Hanson came in at No. 9 on the Southern League list, despite only being promoted to the league from high-A Myrtle Beach in June and struggling initially to make the adjustment. But man, did he ever make it.
Beginning with his 14-strikeout no-hitter June 25 vs. Birmingham, Hanson went on a 5-1, 1.41 ERA tear in which he recorded 79 strikeouts in 57 innings. This after starting out the season at Myrtle by going 3-1 with an 0.90 ERA in seven starts, with 49 strikeouts (11 walks) in 40 innings.
For the season, Hanson led full-season minor league pitchers with a 2.41 ERA and 163 strikeouts. Dude throws a 91-94 mph fastball with excellent life, the scouts say, and he honed a devastating slider that he first broke out for game action in that no-hitter.
CF Jordan Schafer slipped to No. 13 prospect in the Southern League after entering the season as the Braves’ No. 1-rated prospect and heir apparent to Mark Kotsay in CF. That’s what a 50-game early season suspension for suspected HGH use will do for you.
It set him back, but Schafer still finished the season hitting .269 with a .378 OBP and .471 slugging, and a strong last two months upped his totals 18 doubles, 10 homers and 12 stolen bases in 297 at-bats. I talked to Mississipi manager Phil Wellman about Schafer when Wellman was up with Atlanta in September, and he said the kid really impressed him in the last two months of the season, after trying too hard initially to make up for the lost 50 games.
Here’s what Frank Wren said Monday about him: “The last two months of the season put him back in a top prospect position. Put it this way: He’s better than most of the competitors in the league he played in… He’s in the group of those who will be challenging for a job [with Atlanta in spring training]. Whether he’s in the final mix, I don’t know yet. But he’s put himself back in that position.”
Me, personally? If I had to guess, I’d say Schafer is going to be in center field on opening day. There, I said it.
By the way, BA’s top 10 list of Southern League prospects in 2003 included: Miguel Cabrera, J.J. Hardy and Dan Haren, among others.
High CLASS-A: 20-year-old CF Gorkys Hernandez was one of the youngest players in the Carolina League, and one of the best. He was rated the No. 3 prospect in a league in which 22-year-old former Georgia Tech catcher Matt Wieters was No. 1 (Wieters is also BA’s Minor League Player of the Year for all levels, and the cover boy on the issue before this one of the so-called Bible of the Sport).
The little synopsis of Hernandez said he was the best defensive OF in the league and that his overall skills rated second only to Wieters’. The description of Hernandez ended: “A five-tool athlete with above-average speed that translates equally well the outfield and basepaths, Hernandez projects as a big-league leadoff hitter with 40-steal potential.”
Don’t know about five tools (he’s not a power hitter), but four tools should certainly be enough to establish him as a Braves cornerstone-type player in a few years, if they don’t trade him before then.
Myrtle Beach SS Brandon Hicks was rated the No. 13 prospect in the Southern League.
Low CLASS-A: Big Jason Heyward came in at No. 2 on the lists of South Atlantic League prospects, with Rome roommate Freddie Freeman at No. 10. Heyward hit .323 (third in the league) with a .388 OBP (fourth in the league), and the Henry County High graduate had 27 doubles, six triples, 11 homers, 15 steals and 52 RBI. The 19-year-old was the top-rated position-player prospect in the league, with Giants pitcher Madison Bumgarner rated as the No. 1 overall prospect in the league.
“Scouts love Heyward’s 6-foot-5, 220-pound frame,” BA wrote. “With his sweet lefthanded swing that projects to produce significant power numbers, he attracts comparisons to a young Dave Parker.” (Personally, I think he looks very similar to a youth Derrek Lee. I was covering the Marlins when they got D-Lee from San Diego, and his long limbs, narrow waist and V-shaped back back then are what Heyward looked like when I saw him last spring. D-Lee filled out to about 240 pounds.)
(By the way, did you guys happen to know that Heyward’s parents both went to Dartmouth? Well, you do now.)
Freeman had a the breakthrough year for the Braves, shooting up their prospects chart with his .316/.378/.521 with 33 doubles, seven triples, 18 homers and 95 RBI. Like Heyward, he doesn’t strike out much. Great plate discipline. And Freeman is regarded as a very good defensive first baseman, in addition to the impressive hitting.
Also on the top 20 South Atlantic League list from the Rome team were a couple of the Braves’ top pitching prospects, 13. Jeff Rohrbaugh and 14. Jeff Locke, and outfielder Cody Johnson at No. 20.
Oh, and if you want to see an interesting prospect list, look at the 2003 BA top 10 from the South Atlantic League: 1. B.J. Upton, 2. Scott Kazmir, 3. Cole Hamels, 4. Jeff Francoeur, 5. Jeremy Hermida, 6. Hanley Ramirez (are you kidding me? No. 6?), 7. Fausto Carmona, 8. Merkin Valdez, 9. Scott Olson, 10. Mike Hinckley.
OK, I’m gonna leave it at that, not get into the Rookie League lists and all. It’s getting late.
Diversions: Rewarded myself with an end-of-season CD buying binge this week. In one day picked up a haul that included: The mighty Otis Redding’s reissued Live In London & Paris; Okkervil River’s The Stand Ins (I like it, but not quite as much as their last two); Teddy Thompson’s A Piece of What You Need (Richard Thompson’s son has become quite a performer in his own right); Gentleman Jesse’s self-titled debut CD (folks, I can’t recommend this brilliant recording from an Atlanta band high enough for any of you who like, say, early Joe Jackson or Nick Lowe, or just great low-fi rock with pop hooks and a punk ‘tude); Cold War Kids’ Loyalty to Loyalty (I like it a lot, but not as much as their great debut CD, which everyone should have); Creedence Clearwater Revival’s Green River (remastered just-released 40th anniversary edition of a classic); Carrie Rodriguez’ She Ain’t Me (if you’ve never heard of her, you should remember the name - it’s terrific); Tom Morello: The Nightwatchman’s The Fabled City (even better than his solo debut, this one’s political/protest rock revved up a bit and produced by Atlanta’s own producer-to-the-stars Brendan O’Brien; Freedy Johnson’s The Trouble Tree (1990 debut by the Kansas troubadour); Uncle Tupelo’s Still Feel Gone (remastered version of their seminal second album); The Rosebuds’ Night of the Furies (love the Rosebuds from N.C., one of the most underrated rock bands anywhere), and Elvis Costello’s Imperial Bedroom (the two-disc, expanded version of one of his must-have masterworks, which I’ve now bought in five or six different forms, from LP and cassette to CD, to expanded single-disc CD, to this even-more-expanded opus. I’m a sucker, but it’s terrific.)
OK, a tune to wrap it up. This song has always done it for me, but sometimes more than others. As I get older, more than ever. If you don’t know or have a “Martha,” I bet you will. Met mine in Fort Lauderdale. She lived in Sausalito, Calif., last time I spoke with her. My ex-wife was absolutely convinced I stayed in contact with this girl in the years when I never did. Dammit.
”MARTHA” by Tom Waits
Operator, number, please:
it’s been so many years
Will she remember my old voice
while I fight the tears?
Hello, hello there, is this Martha?
this is old Tom Frost,
And I am calling long distance,
don’t worry ‘bout the cost.
‘Cause it’s been forty years or more,
now Martha please recall,
Meet me out for coffee,
where we’ll talk about it all.
And those were the days of roses,
poetry and prose and Martha
all I had was you and all you had was me.
There was no tomorrows,
we’d packed away our sorrows
And we saved them for a rainy day.
And I feel so much older now,
and you’re much older too,
How’s your husband?
and how’s the kids?
you know that I got married too?
Lucky that you found someone
to make you feel secure,
‘Cause we were all so young and foolish,
now we are mature.
And those were the days of roses,
poetry and prose and Martha
all I had was you and all you had was me.
There was no tomorrows,
we’d packed away our sorrows
And we saved them for a rainy day.
And I was always so impulsive,
I guess that I still am,
And all that really mattered then
was that I was a man.
I guess that our being together
was never meant to be.
And Martha, Martha,
I love you can’t you see?
And those were the days of roses,
poetry and prose and Martha
all I had was you and all you had was me.
There was no tomorrows,
we’d packed away our sorrows
And we saved them for a rainy day.
And I remember quiet evenings
trembling close to you…
Services »
Comments
By hk
October 2, 2008 6:52 PM | Link to this
… Final year-end ‘MVP’ (Runs + HR’s + RBI’s) …
http://www.mindspring.com/~hk3/mvp08a.htm
… been keeping this MVP since 1997, this year the lowest ever by 30% … here are the last 12 years vs this year …
http://www.mindspring.com/~hk3/newton.htm
By richbrave
October 2, 2008 6:59 PM | Link to this
My man,thanx!!!!
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the new Blog, Chief!
AAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!
That dang Reaper hit a freakin’ GRAND SLAM!!
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!
Fillies up 5-1. Crud!
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 7:09 PM | Link to this
Anyway, the Braves are now scattered to the corners of North and South America and the Caribbean, done with baseball.
Really?
BTW—Not to be picky, but the Rays beat the Sox 6-4.
By Steve from OH
October 2, 2008 7:13 PM | Link to this
Me, personally? If I had to guess, I’d say Schafer is going to be in center field on opening day. There, I said it.
I hope so.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 7:19 PM | Link to this
There have been two stolen bases off CC, and both guys stole third.
Why is it that most pitchers just ignore the guy when he’s on second? Hellooo! They cann still steal third! Pay attention!
At least neither guy scored. (Well, actually they both have scored, but not after the steals.)
By David O'Brien
October 2, 2008 7:20 PM | Link to this
Anyway, the Braves are now scattered to the corners of North and South America and the Caribbean, done with baseball.
Really?McFann
Yeah, really. Did you not get the memo?
By David O'Brien
October 2, 2008 7:30 PM | Link to this
I feel bad for CC, man. All that work on short rest (his last three reg-season starts, all on short rest) might have finally caught up with him.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
Yeah, really. Did you not get the memo?
Haha! No, I guess I didn’t, LOL!
That was a stupid thing for me to say…I musta left something out…
Geepers-creapers! They’re running wild on CC and Kendall! Good grief! It’s like a Braves game!
I feel bad for him, too…since it’s the Fillies, and everything.
By Steve from OH
October 2, 2008 7:48 PM | Link to this
Man, Shane Victorino is probably my least favorite player in the majors bar none. I hope we sign Penny on a one-day contract so he can drill him with a 100 MPH fastball.
By Frank
October 2, 2008 7:56 PM | Link to this
I’m pulling for either a W.Sox/Cubs WS or a R.Sox/Cubs WS….but the Cubs didn’t help themselves last night getting beat 7-2.
I know there have been talk about The Z Train not starting for the Cubs last night because of that outing against Houston when he threw the no-no…..but I sure as heck would’ve started him over Dempster.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 7:58 PM | Link to this
Steve Man, Shane Victorino is probably my least favorite player in the majors bar none.
Mine, too.
Haha! Good plan. You thin that, if the Braves were playing them in the playoffs, they’d plunk the Reaper?
Nah. Then he’d be on base…and we know what that means…
Although, Brian caught him stealing twice this year. That’s a lot, considering…
By Efrim
October 2, 2008 8:08 PM | Link to this
Might be CC’s last start before he hits free agency. I really think he is going to be a Dodger. I think they’ll give him a similar contract to Zito.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this
You thin that Me
Whoops. Meant “think”. Sorry.
By Efrim
October 2, 2008 8:19 PM | Link to this
DOB
Also on the top 20 South Atlantic League list from the Rome team were a couple of the Braves’ top pitching prospects, 13. Jeff Rohrbaugh
I think it’s Cole instead of Jeff. It would sure be nice if he turns into another Cole that’s in the NL East…..
By Run Heap Run
October 2, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this
chances are at least one of the moves the Braves make will be one that’s from out of left field.
Heh. We can only hope.
I’m all for the Rays, Brew Crew or Angels. I love Lou Pinella but how any self respecting baseball fan can be for the Cubs is beyond me. lol just messing around, Frank. But I am actually looking forward to hearing who or what the Cubs fans will blame if they don’t win it this year.
By bruce
October 2, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this
who was it last winter who started the count down clock til spring training and kept us posted every few days… that was such an encouragement… the number seems pretty big right now…. but these guys do have a tough schedule… Feb thru sept and maybe offseason too.
By cabravesfan
October 2, 2008 8:39 PM | Link to this
wow…eric gagne- not a good look dude
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this
Bruce—
Yeah! We oughta start a countdown! Anybody know what day pitchers and catchers report??
By cabravesfan
October 2, 2008 8:43 PM | Link to this
how any self respecting baseball fan can be for the Cubs is beyond me run heap run
Because that means they would have beaten the dodgers and this makes me very happy:)
The bandwagon around here attracts fans like magnets- and there may be nothing worse then an overflowing bandwagon (not saying I want the cubs to win- heaven forbid!- but if it means i don’t have to listen to the dodger fans anymore it is worth it)
By LT-A blogger
October 2, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this
Since I haven’t blogged when the Braves fell out of contention, I’ve demoted myself to a single A blogger.
Anyways, what’ll it take to get a Peavy or an Oswalt. How bout Jojo, Morton, and Franceour to SD for Peavy (or Oswalt). Next, trade Chipper straight up to Boston for Bay. Then sign Furcal to a 2 yr deal and move Escobar to 3rd. They’d probably still have enough cash to go after Lowe and resign Hamp
Pitching: Peavy (or Oswalt) Jurjens Lowe (or insert best free agent here) Campillo Hampton
Lineup: Furcal Escobar Bay McCann Kotchman Johnson Schafer (or Anderson) B. Jones
By Couch Tater
October 2, 2008 8:56 PM | Link to this
To my good friends at TBS who dropped the Braves in exchange for the post-season:
I’m hoping for a Brewers/Rays World Series.
By Yunel Lillibridge
October 2, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
Can’t trade Gorkys. He’s the proto-typical leadoff hitter that the Braves so desperately need. While DOB’s idea of Schafer in center in ‘08, presumably flanked by Francoeur in RF and a power bat in LF is most likely, how about the alternative? If Schafer truly has a plus arm, then stick him in RF, let Blanco keep CF warm for Gorkys, and sign/trade for a LF power bat. This of course leaves Frenchy the odd man out-Trade him for pitching. Schafer projects as what, 15-20 HR for now? That’s more than we saw from Francine in ‘08, and his plate discipline and fielding would be a dramatic upgrade over Jeff’s.
Another scenario… Since all available power hitting LF’s are deficient in some area (Ie. fielding, too manky K’s, etc.), might the Braves sign a Willingham type on the cheap for LF, trade Kotchman for pitching, and then get into the Tex sweepstakes? Tex is a more complete player (aside from his infamous poor first two months of the season) than any LF’s available. While Tex would be more expensive than a Burrell, the Braves could offset that expense by acquiring a pitcher via trade that is signed for a reasonable amount over the next 3-4 years, rather than paying top dollar for a free agent.
By NickC
October 2, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
You’ve ruined the suspense for me!
On baseballamerica.com the International league is tomorrow!
By bruce
October 2, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this
McFann—- PCR yea… that is the day… I checked on my calendar, was sure I had it written in… (dear diary) but no… so I checked the DOB MIB archives and this was the blog title on Feb1 Pitching Camp convenes, spring training near then on DOB titled it… Feb 11 No more weekends off: P’s & C’s reporting so maybe we should count down to PCC pitching camp convenes then PCR pitchers and catchers report, oh the drama
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan (not saying I want the cubs to win- heaven forbid!- but if it means i don’t have to listen to the dodger fans anymore it is worth it)
So just say, you’re not rooting for the Cubs, you’re rooting against the Dodgers.
I’ve done similar before—like, Cubs-Fillies, Cubs-Mets, Fillies-Mets, you know. Never rooting for the former, just rooting against the latter.
; )
But, I have to say, if it comes down to Cubs-Fillies, I might just hafta pull slightly for the Cubs…I despise the Fillies that much.
By Run Heap Run
October 2, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this
*Because that means they would have beaten the dodgers and this makes me very happy:)
The bandwagon around here attracts fans like magnets- and there may be nothing worse then an overflowing bandwagon (not saying I want the cubs to win- heaven forbid!- but if it means i don’t have to listen to the dodger fans anymore it is worth it)*
Oh I lived in LA for a short time and still have a lot of close friends from there, believe me, I KNOW how they are. One of my best friends is the most obnoxious LA sports fan ever .. I don’t want the dodgers to win either…which means, Go Brew Crew! lol
By ncscoots
October 2, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this
DOB, you can really see Gorkys and Schafer in the same OF? I would think one of the two would have to show a good bit more power for that to happen, no? Schafer, at least, has shown some pop, but neither strike me as a corner OF offensively. Yet, anyway.
What the heck, neither one is shaving every day, probably, so no telling what they’ll be like when they grow up some.
By cabravesfan
October 2, 2008 9:14 PM | Link to this
I’m going to stick to the other league for now and just say GO ANGELS
By Josh
October 2, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this
LT-A blogger not trying to be overly critical because I’m no expert armchair GM, but Jo-Jo, Morton, & Francoeur might round-out a deal for Peavy/Oswalt if one of the “untouchables” is included. (Hanson, Heyward, Schafer, Freeman, Teheran). If the Braves want to acquire Peavy/Oswalt without trading one of those 5 players it will take a glut of 4 & 3 star prospects (of which the Braves have several). If the team wants to roll the dice on Prado, or fill 2B via free agency, KJ would be a player many teams value. I’d prefer to keep Kelly but thats just my opinion.
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 9:19 PM | Link to this
I am still pulling for the Phillies since they are the team from the EAST. It’s not like the Marlins or Braves got it done.
National League, NL East, Braves. Going up the ladder if the Braves are not there at least a team from our division would be nice. And the World Series from National League, Dodgers, Cubs, Brewers whoever can get it done.
Just whereever I am, I want the winning team.
Had some extremely good food this evening at Gumbeaux in Douglasville. Seafood Rotini, a mixture of shrimp, crab and sausage in a pasta bake. Served with cheese grits and jalapeno hushpuppies. This meal has removed my huge Sunday spread probably won’t eat solid food for a week, ie salad and soup only.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this
Bruce—
Countdown begins! Thanks for the links! So let’s see…17 weeks till February 1st…that’s 119 days!! Dang…first workout was Feb. 14 in ‘08…So maybe it’ll be the 16 this year? if so, that’s 134 days!! You’re right…the drama!!
I guess once Thanksgiving and Christmastime roll around, we’ll be plenty occupied…
; )
BossLady I am still pulling for the Phillies since they are the team from the EAST.
Guess you’re happy, then.
Nothing could ever make me pull for the Fillies! Even if the unthinkable happened and McCann signed with them as a FA, I’d just pull for him and not the Fillies and just keep bein’ a Braves fan. Because, when all in baseball is said and done, the Braves are the only team I will ever pull for.
By ncscoots
October 2, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this
On a non-baseball note, I’m stoked about tomorrow and the wide release of Appaloosa. How did we leave Viggo off the recent list of this generation’s excellent actors, anyway? And Ed Harris as a steely-eyed gunslinger isn’t much of a reach, either. I haven’t seen the early take on the flick, but the casting certainly lifts one’s hopes.
By cabravesfan
October 2, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this
McFann
I actually read somewhere that the camps will open a week early for the players on the rosters of the World baseball Classic and that pitchers and catchers will be able to report at the same time…I believe Feb. 7th? (it is possible that i totally made that up but i seem to recall it on ESPN…)
and yes- I am more against the dodges then for the cubs…
By Food Critic
October 2, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this
Had some extremely good food this evening at Gumbeaux in Douglasville.
A most excellent place - highly recommended to all you west - siders..
By bruce
October 2, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this
McFann thanks for doing the math… you are probably “in the ball park” I say that because my guess is they translate back from opening day which is different this coming year I think… now I recal something else… I remember when it was a three digit number of days it seemed so far off… and it does now… ok how about count down to winter meetings after that the number to PCR seems much easier to bear…
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan—
Hmm…That could be true…and sounds familiar. Why do they hafta do the WBC at that time, anyway? If they hafta do it, do it…uh…I don’t know…but it messes with Spring Training.
Wonder if any Braves will be in the WBC this year…Hope not. Whoever they picked would prob’ly hurt himself and hafta miss a month. I’m a downer, ain’t I?
It’ll be int’resting to see how tonight’s game goes. What up, Cubbies??
Oop…Soriano’s on base…
I might be packin’ it up for the night, but I’m not sure yet…rest of the family’s watchin’ the debate.
By cabravesfan
October 2, 2008 9:58 PM | Link to this
McFann
Injured players can also report with the pitchers and catchers- which means half our roster will get some early spring work in:)
I kinda had the same thought about our guys in the WBC…last thing the braves need is someone blowing out a knee in a meaningless game
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this
Bruce—
You’re welcome!
Haha…Yeah, a three-digit number seems like forever…Opening Day is April 6, 2009, which is waaay too late, IMHO. Course, I guess there’ve been years when it was much later…
I was thinking last night (or was it the night before last?) that it seems like such a short time ago that the P’s & C’s were reporting for ‘08. Back then it was like, “Wow! We’ve got over six months of baseball ahead of us!” Now it’s gone again. And it seems like I could go back over the whole season—like it took no time at all. That’s when I think, “It really was a long time, wasn’t it? Then why does it seem like it lasted for just a minute?”
But, we still have next year…The countdown continues. When do the Winter Meetings start? Except those things make me nervous…I’m always worried they’re gonna let somebody get away…
cabravesfan—
Haha…yeah, we’re gonna have a full camp right away, huh?
last thing the braves need is someone blowing out a knee in a meaningless game
I agree. That’s why I’m not real “into* the WBC. Just seems…well, meaningless.
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 10:10 PM | Link to this
McFann, I was taught baseball at the knee of my dad and my uncles.
See, it works like this, if you love the game then you go with the best players, the best plays and the best team. You can’t just love the Braves, which I really do and my dad loved them dearly.
When there are so many good teams, players and pitchers on ANY team they deserve respect and praise.
Unless if their character and game ethics are dirty otherwise they all are equal. Some of the greatest players in the game DID NOT come from the Atlanta Braves. Most of them came from the Yankees, Cardinals, Dodgers and Giants believe it or not.
Love the game itself, have a favorite and always love your Braves, but watch and see the greatness of the overall game. It will be enjoyable.
By jed
October 2, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this
dob
thanks for the detailed blog—extensive and insightful as always. this blog was the best thing about the braves’ season this year. i also agree that we’re in better position than most people think. i was surprised by bradley’s view that we were several years off. still dont get that. i see us a few acquisitions away from a contender. pitching and LF. shouldnt be that difficult.
i just hope something happens so that i can watch the games on TV next year. MLBTV was a pale substitute and eventually became unbearable. used to have baseball ticket on dish network, then it switched to direct tv. surely MLB can figure a way that we can pay to watch the games. what am i supposed to do? switch my cable system out every time MLB sells the broadcasts to a different system?
By Wayne
October 2, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this
Great article Dave. Thanks!
Many are wondering about Schafer’s power potential. I suspect that guys like Schafer and Hernandez will evolve as they mature.
I like Lou Pinella and Joe Torre. Do NOT like Al Soriano or Manny Ramirez. Hard to pick one. I guess I will let the chips fall where they may, but whoever wins will be my pick over the Phillies!
Rays over the ChiSox, Bosox over the Angels, and Rays over the Bosox.
Beyond that, I don’t really care too much!
That Eva Longoria sure is a good hitter, as well as good looking!
(sorry, weak attempt at blog humor!)
By cabravesfan
October 2, 2008 10:15 PM | Link to this
meanwhile the cubbies are imploding again…dammit!
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this
Food Critic, YEAH!!!!!!Westside
It’s where the land is plentiful, no public transit, lakes with fish, golf courses, two lane roads, wild life, farms, fruit/vegetable gardens and real Georgia living.
I wouldn’t cross I-20 to come into that big monster for nothing.
By garla
October 2, 2008 10:21 PM | Link to this
The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of Derek Lowe in our rotation. I think the thing we have to hope for at this point is that he doesn’t pitch so well in the postseason that he raises his price tag out of where we want to go. That’s a concern. DOB, do you think it’s possible to pick up one of these top of the rotation starters via a trade without parting with one or some of those next wave prospects? I know Wren has said he won’t trade from that group but is it possible to get an Oswalt or Peavy without doing that?
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 10:24 PM | Link to this
BossLady—
I know where you’re coming from. Yes, the Fillies have a lot of good players, but I don’t like the Fillies.
I do, however, respect your opinion on the matter. I love the game very much (or at least, I thought I did…). I’ll give the Fillies their due respect if I have to…like, if they win the WS or something…and I wouldn’t put it past them.
I do enjoy watching the playoffs and getting the chance to watch some other teams that I’ve despised all year. Most of the time I just watch, and whoever wins wins, and that’s fine by me.
Some of the greatest players in the game DID NOT come from the Atlanta Braves.
Hmm…Maybe I missed that memo as well. ; ) But you left off the Reds (Johnny Bench!)
I think I’m gonna turn myself in for the night. Not that I wanna leave this good conversation, but it’s getting late…
BTW—Clint Hurdle’s BFF hit a BASES LOADED DOUBLE; the Dodgers are up 5-0 (sorry, cabravesfan). John Grove just K’d.
Wayne (sorry, weak attempt at blog humor!)
You better watch it, or the blog will go down again!
; )
Night, all!
By Wayne
October 2, 2008 10:25 PM | Link to this
Lew Just saw your post on the other blog. I do remember talk about the Braves being interested in that one Japanese hurler, the one who was some sort of a “free-agent”, I think he kept his amateur status.
Where can we go to get info on those Japanese players who might be available? Don’t those who play within their league have to stay for 10 years?
By Andy
October 2, 2008 10:26 PM | Link to this
Braves offseason to do list in no particular order:
Rotation Oswalt/Greinke/Cain Lowe Jurrjens Campillo Hampton/Morton/Reyes/Glavine
Lineup CF Schafer SS Escobar 3B Chipper C McCann LF Byrnes 1B Kotchman RF Frenchy 2B Johnson
Pen Smoltz Moylan Soriano Gonzalez Ohman Carlyle
Bench Norton Prado Millar Anderson Blanco Sammons
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this
During my favorite time the best player was Mike Piazza. I cried when Shea Stadium played “It’s so hard to say goodbye to yesterday” in honor of him.
I was furious when Joe Torre had to leave the Yankees.
Doc Gooden tried to come back and did not fare well with the Yankees.
I never, never liked the METS or Yankees but Piazza, Torre and Doc are greatness.
By Wayne
October 2, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this
garla I found myself hoping that both Lowe and Dempster would not be outstanding for the same reasons!
By Wayne
October 2, 2008 10:35 PM | Link to this
Andy I hope I am wrong, but I suspect either KJ or Francoeur will be dealt for that top pitcher we are all hoping for.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 2, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this
BossLady I cried when Shea Stadium played “It’s so hard to say goodbye to yesterday” in honor of him.
Chills. Didn’t see that, but still…
But I’ll still never forget the look on Mike’s face when Andruw Jones made a diving catch on a ball that Mike hit in May, 2006…Piazza was saying that it bounced, but the umps said no.
OK, now I gotta go. Night, all!
By JC from UT
October 2, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this
I think the big question this winter will be which centerfielder do we keep and which do we trade, Gorkys or Shafer? Gorkys seems to be the prototypical leadoff/ceneterfielder and Shafer more in the Grady Sizemore mold. Do we trade one of them in a package to get the big front end starter or is there a chance both roam the outfield in Atlanta. Could Shafer turn into a legit 3 hole hitter to replace Chipper, since he shows some power potential? Alot of big questions for FW this off season. If I were FW I keep both of them and try to package Francouer. As a fan I want to win each and every year but I would be willing to sacrafice a season or two and enjoy an outfield of Heyward, Shafer and Gorkys with Freddie Freeman at 1st base.
Does anyone know anything about Brandon Hicks? Is there any chance he could suprise and take over the 2nd or short positions if FW decides to trede either Esco or KJ in order to get pitching? How about Esco to the Reds for Aaron Harang?
By Steve from OH
October 2, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this
I hate to be a buzzkill, but we’d be better served with Gregor Blanco or Brandon Jones in left field than Eric Byrnes. Besides being a serious injury risk, he is also a terrible career OBP guy (.325) and has really been an OK SLG guy, for a corner outfielder(career: .446).
His OBPs for the last 4 seasons? .294, .313, .353, .272. That is not good.
I really doubt that FW is going to trade for Eric Byrnes (4th outfielder for the D-Backs, btw) and the $22MM owed to him over the next two years. Not gonna happen.
By Steve from OH
October 2, 2008 10:56 PM | Link to this
JC from UT, Hicks OPSed .815 in 342 AB for class A+ Myrtle Beach this season. Most scouting reports I’ve read project him as a utility guy with good defensive skills and a nice arm. It looks as though his hitting may be coming along a little bit nicer than expected, though.
It might be wise not to trade Hicks because the Braves lack SS depth in the minors (especially if they trade Lillibridge, who I think is all but gone). Wouldn’t be sad at all if he went, but something to think about.
By Steve from OH
October 2, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this
And JC, based on DOB’s reports, I’m almost certain Escobar isn’t going anywhere. And I would be very surprised if KJ goes anywhere, either.
By nolie
October 2, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this
It’s where the land is plentiful, no public transit, lakes with fish, golf courses, two lane roads, wild life, farms, fruit/vegetable gardens and real Georgia living.
I wouldn’t cross I-20 to come into that big monster for nothing. BossLady
Lived there for a few years in the 70s. Sounds like it’s still way nicer that the Big City. Don’t believe Gumbeaux was around back then.
By doc
October 2, 2008 11:17 PM | Link to this
well as i watch the dodgers lambast the cubs i think back to the comment once attributed to the ted saying the worst mistake he made was firing bobby the first time. i have to wonder if that was his second mistake with the first being to fire joe torre when he was here. got to feel good about the torre story continuing in l.a. i can only hope bobby can work some magic soon to get the bravos back into the premier 8 again.
dob, i can only hope that out of town operator heard what you had to say about brand recognition and the begin to think at the big picture of enhancing the product so when they decide to sell it in three years it has improved its value rather than shrink it due to inattention. if they do it will be a lot more fun to be a fan. funny to think that a few extra 5 or 10 million spent might have brought in a more durable arm or two in the past two years and it doesnt do my heart good to see tex in the playoffs while the bravos sit or maybe better said spread out over the world if i got the memo right.
By Wayne
October 2, 2008 11:24 PM | Link to this
Steve When I am on the road (like tonight) and NOT watching a vp debate, oft times I become the Braves GM. I fixate on what it would take to get a certain player from another club.
I ask myself, what would it take to get Peavy/Cain/Oswalt/Shields type pitchers from their respective teams. We have to be able to offer something the other team covets, and something that we can live without.
This is why I chuckle (I suppose many of us do) when we hear of the trade proposals of Prado, Lillibridge, Blanco, Reyes and throw in Thorman for Matt Cain. Or other similar deals. Let’s unload all the players who will not be of any significance to us, for a top player of the other team.
This is why I believe that it might take someone like Francoeur, KJ or one of our really decent minor league players (short of the top 4-5 that DOB references), maybe a Gorkys H or Rohrbough.
Not that I really want to trade one of those guys, but to be honest, if it gets us a Jake Peavy or Matt Cain type, I trade Frenchy AND KJ along with Gorkys AND Rohrbough. Those pitchers are that valuable.
Whaddya think, my friend?
By bruce
October 2, 2008 11:30 PM | Link to this
*Then why does it seem like it lasted for just a minute? * McFann
I followed what you were saying and as soon as I read this question I had a thought about an answer that I think you will like, I know it is true for me.
As a genuine fan of a team, when we lose, we think, I am really looking forward to tomorrow so we can play another game and put this loss behind us.
When we win, we can’t wait til game time the next day to keep the streak going.
So we end up compressing the time between games. Its the nature of watching as many of the 162 games as we cann, which seems like alot at the beginning of the season and at the end when you think about it. But then time flies because each major event that might take a week to endure (like Brian after Victorino played dirty), later becomes just a point in time in the big picture of 163 games and April through September when we are rooting for 3 more doubles, or two more stolen bases, throwing out Victorino, another triple. Just joy in being a fann. People who aren’t can’t understand. That’s ok. Not sure I explained what I was thinking very well, but I tried.
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
Nah, Nolie.
These are places that have moved here in the previous five years. Gumbeaux is Cajun with every seafood uninmaginable. Fabiano’s is another good place out here. Sam & Roscoes an Italian restaurantis another. Since my husband is Italian we eat there often. See Olive Garden is not hard core Italian.
McFann, Oh well.
We are ususally talking about bar-be-que and music. My music taste is 97.1 The River with all the old classics. I heard Dream Weaver. Never changed the dial since then. Those are the songs I heard in Atlanta in the 60s and 70s. I am an old school Classics and Rocker. I really miss Garo McKee (94Q and 98.5)
By Francoeur-Royals '08
October 2, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
Man if the Braves could get Peavy for a package centered around Jeff Francoeur…that would be the steal of the century!
By Steve from OH
October 2, 2008 11:38 PM | Link to this
Wayne:
Frenchy, KJ, Gorkys and Rohrbough for Cain/Peavy? I wouldn’t do it, because, for me, it opens too many holes on the big club.
Again, unless I’m misinterpreting DOB’s report from the other day, I don’t expect Yunel or Kelly to be traded. Jeff? I could see it happening, but only for a Peavy or Cain type of pitcher. But I don’t really expect him to go anywhere.
I agree with you that we will have to offer something of value to the other team, which is why I’m not really optimistic about acquiring Peavy or Cain (although Sabean does seem to be an idiot, so maybe Frank could pawn Francoeur off on him). I think Oswalt would be feasible, but I’m not sure the Astros are willing to deal him. Anyway, going back to what you said about coveting, I think that because it is really hard to A. know which players the other team covets and B. know how the other team feels about our prospects, especially the ones that we don’t throw around the blog daily, that it is extremely difficult to play armchair GM. Fun, perhaps, but tough. The front office know so much more about every prospect in the organization than any of us that it would make your head spin, lol.
I guess my point is that just becuase we don’t offer KJ or Escobar or whoever in a deal, that doesn’t mean we’re not giving the other team something of value. It looks less likely, sure, but then again, the other team might really value a package of handpicked prospects more than a deal centered around a well-known player or two. But, like I said, it’s really tough to say.
Players that I think are as good as gone this offseason: Lillibridge, B. Jones, JoJO Reyes and Todd Redmond. To me, we’re building a package around those guys. Maybe Jorge Campillo is on the block as well? A sell-high opportunity for sure.
By Mitch
October 2, 2008 11:39 PM | Link to this
Hey DOB, I’m a student at UGA and I’m interested in sports journalism. I was just wondering about your education background to give me a point of reference. Do you have a bachelors or masters? Go anywhere besides KU?
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 11:42 PM | Link to this
Oh Yeah, Nolie. Was Hudson bar-be-que here back then? It’s still around but I don’t eat pork and beef. We tend to eat seafood and Italian when we go out.
By Wayne
October 2, 2008 11:45 PM | Link to this
bruce … and then the winter drags on endlessly. We watch some playoff and world series games, but not with the same passion we would if our team were in it. We wait for the first set of meetings, knowing little will come of it, and then anticipate the winter meetings. But the October through January time really goes so slowly!
I can remember when I was when I learned of certain trades through previous winters. Being a fan is not an easy thing.
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 11:46 PM | Link to this
Hey Mitch, why don’t you ask DOB some personal questions?
I knew you were a student the way you went after Katy.
Just—blog man.
By BossLady
October 2, 2008 11:50 PM | Link to this
The Phillies won and the Dodgers won!!
Whew, the way they are playing I think the National League will pull this off.
By David O'Brien
October 2, 2008 11:51 PM | Link to this
Can’t believe Dodgers are going to take a 2-0 lead out of Chicago. But I shouldn’t have picked the Cubs after also saying IF Zambrano’s at full strength. Because he clearly isn’t.
By GeorgetownKid
October 3, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this
Mr. O’Brien,
I was pleased to read your assessment of Charlie Morton. Howver, I remain concerned over some of his quotes that I have read in your articles, especially the ones in which he refers to the fact that “people keep telling me I have the talent to be here…”
The guy seems a little off to me. He’s got a great arm and certainly has the talent to be a successful big leaguer. But he seems to lack the moxy that elite pitchers have.
Do you not think that he is a bit too timid and insecure to be a big-time pro ball player?
By fastasballs
October 3, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this
Great blog DOB, good stuff for us to chew on a few days.
I really think Wren can pull off a trade for very good young pitcher. Maybe Peavy, Oswalt or Cain, but then again maybe someone like JJ.
A young pitcher like Cain may be a better situation for the Braves if they DO make a play for Lowe/Dempster. This would still allow them the money to sign a big bat for LF.
The farm system is deep with talent, especially speedy outfielders that are highly rated so maybe one of them is traded.
This winter is going to be fun & action filled.
By N Nine
October 3, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this
Cubs only one loss away? DOB that world series mathup you predicted has taken a big hit.
i have not seen sweet Lou. he must be p**.
By flbravesgirl
October 3, 2008 12:10 AM | Link to this
I love your analysis in your 11:30, Bruce. Good stuff.
By Kentavo
October 3, 2008 12:19 AM | Link to this
I’m kinda skeptical what the Bravos can get on the free agent marking, starting pitching-wise. I think Lowe will be in serious demand and out the Braves’ price range.
By Jake
October 3, 2008 12:20 AM | Link to this
I can’t believe how dominate the Dodgers have been the first two games. The Cubs are just messing up left and right. Those fans at Wrigley look stunned. I didn’t think they would be so bad at home. They’ve had better luck at so called Wrigley North and Wrigley South. Postseason baseball. It’s unpredictable.
By Rick
October 3, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this
This Cubs loss is on DeRosa for blowing a cinch double play that would have gotten Zambrano out of the 2nd inning with no runs scored . It reminds me of when he was with the Braves and he was given the 3rd base job when Chipper moved to left field and he lost the job . He is a better hitter now but his fielding is still bad .
By N Nine
October 3, 2008 12:39 AM | Link to this
Kentavo
A valid point, I was thinking of that also and found this on mlbtr
Olney feels Brian Cashman is more likely to pursue Derek Lowe than Mark Teixeira
We hear CC is sought after also and that their payroll is dropping. Lowe might not be best option for the yanks.
On different note: Peavy
GM Kevin Towers admitted payroll may be lower than $58MM in 2009
Seems like some teams are not spending as much! Great to be the BRAVES!!
2009-2010 here we come!
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 12:42 AM | Link to this
for all the the novice baseball fans out there.
it is really hard to coast into october.
the cubs and the angels have not played meaningful baseball for some time.
the five game series makes it hard for teams playing against teams that have played make or break baseball in september.
the braves suffered from this syndrome.
it is hard to restart those engines. teams tend to play tight and it usually shows up on defense.
the five game series is not fair. it is not fair to teams that have dominated their league all season.
basketball and hockey both have seven game series in the opening round of their playoffs, so why not baseball.
it cheapens teams success over 162 games.
please make every series seven games.
we play 162 games to determine our best teams, why not play a seven game series in the first round.
say what you want to say about manny being manny, but the manram is a difference maker.
that trade has both worked for boston and the dodgers.
the addition of blake, manny, and getting furcal back make the dodgers a different looking offensive club.
this series does not get back to chicago.
once again you play 162 games. you win the most games in your league, and the playoffs for a lesser word are a crapshoot.
we need a seven game series in the first round.
By N Nine
October 3, 2008 12:45 AM | Link to this
Postseason baseball. It’s unpredictable Jake
No kidding! Maybe we should make all rounds a 7-game series. Having two Aces can really control a short series.
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 12:57 AM | Link to this
just watched the post game interview with chad billingsley.
he has less facial hair then half of the players in the little league world series.
getting old kind of stinks.
the dodgers really look good. a real solid bullpen, and manny in the middle of that order has changed everything.
By ObiWanKobe
October 3, 2008 1:01 AM | Link to this
Thanks DOB & Carroll, w/ TBS dumping them, you have allowed me to maintain & actually get a more in-depth perspective of my favorite team (sans the Lakers). I’m sure I speak for all fans in other parts of the country; your work is much appreciated. Thanks again.
By nolie
October 3, 2008 1:04 AM | Link to this
BossLady
Sorry. I know I’ve eaten there a couple of times and the food was great, but I can’t remenber if it was while I lived ther (approx 72-75) or after I moved farther west around Bremen and Carrollton, or when I’ve gone back there every so often. I do know they have been there a long time. Hudson’s Hickory House isn’t it?
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 1:14 AM | Link to this
lew,
saw braveheart’s kind words the other day, i think i might take him and you up on that larry munson thing.
is orca getting fitted for his new snowshoes?
By BA
October 3, 2008 1:25 AM | Link to this
DOB, what about ugabrave’s theory, you know, “coasting into the postseason” and the difficulty thereof? Is there anything to that?
A real standout blog today, what a tune! You can’t go wrong with Waits. You can, however, go wrong thinking about those damn Marthas. Still Feel Gone, great record, that’s for sure (that’s Coxian dialect).
And for the record, I’m all for raiding the Marlins. And by all means, bring in Oswalt.
Oh yeah, and when I saw DOB write “missing the playoffs once, twice…” I got my hopes up for a little Buckwheat (amember me?).
By Wayne
October 3, 2008 2:07 AM | Link to this
Watching the Fox Sports 100 most Mind Blowing Moments. Awesome! Loved the Kevin Mitchell barehanded catch in the corner of left field.
Some good stuff.
Steve Agree with all you state. Like I said, I try to be the armchair GM, and think from both sides of the coin. We really can’t know whta other teams covet, but we can sure speculate!
Nite all…
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 2:24 AM | Link to this
uga-brave, he looked like a young fan they’d brought out of the crowd to be interviewed, wearing that hoody and all, with no ballcap and, as you said, no facial hair….
ObiWan, my pleasure. Thanks for your input.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 2:28 AM | Link to this
mitch, Bachelors degree in journalism. But you don’t need one (a journalism degree, that is). Any degree from a good four-year school will do, from my experience and based on the colleagues I’ve worked with (one of my buddies, a great writer at the Sun-Sentinel, majored in Russian studies at Tufts). Long as you can write and report. It helps a little to have taken some reporting classes in college, to get a feel for it. Better yet, experience working at a paper while in school. Just a lot easier to get a foot in the door that way. In that regard, journalism schools usually offer a way to get connections in the business.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 2:35 AM | Link to this
ncscoots, absolutely right about Viggo M., he’s put himself in that elite group of current actors. You see Eastern Promises? Great stuff. And Appaloosa looks like it’s gonna be strong, perhaps a lot like Unforgiven.
By GermanBravesFan
October 3, 2008 3:08 AM | Link to this
Good morning from Switzerland!
I guess this will get there too late for anybody to read, but I may just post it again later.
I think if the Braves could trade for Matt Cain who will probably not make too much money yet, then there should be plenty left to make a huge splash with a free agent. The name that comes to mind:
MANNY RAMIREZ
Okay… Two things that might make this impossible:
The length of the contract he is seeking (and, of course the salary)
His attitude…
Can a Manny Ramirez be controlled in a Bobby Cox type clubhouse?
I totally disagree with what he did in Boston just to get out of there. There is absolutely no excuse for that… However, if the Braves want to make a big splash and creat excitement, he might be the guy to get! I suppose he will be asking for $20 million per year, but if the Braves succeeded in getting Matt Cain (of course, a big IF), then there should be plenty of money to get Ramirez and another top-level pitcher.
Anyways… just my thoughts.
Any thoughts from anybody else??
By Braveheart
October 3, 2008 3:55 AM | Link to this
Teams can make pitch for Peavy, but to Towers it’s just fact-finding
By Tom Krasovic
Tuesday, September 30, 2008
http://www3.signonsandiego.com/stories/2008/sep/30/padres-peavy-towers-contract/?padres
Coming off a 99-defeat season, Padres General Manager Kevin Towers said Tuesday he considers no player “untouchable” and will find out the trade value of every player. Towers, speaking last Wednesday from Los Angeles, also said Padres ace Jake Peavy will not be exempted from his offseason fact-finding mission and that he would be shirking his duties if he did not find out Peavy’s value on the trade market.
“Are we going to shop Jake Peavy? No,” Towers said. “It’s a time of year to gather information. If it’s something that makes sense, you’ve got to talk as an organization.”
Unless Towers gets dazzled, it appears Peavy, 27, will be with the club to open the 2009 season. But Peavy’s salary will jump from $11 million to $15 million in 2010, and the pitcher himself said he has pondered whether he could become too expensive for the Padres in, say, 2011, when his salary will be $16 million.
“If they think they need to get rid of me to make the team better, they might trade me,” Peavy said. “But I hope it doesn’t come to that.” One potential catch: As part of the $52-million extension Peavy received last season from CEO Sandy Alderson and Towers, he also obtained full no-trade powers through the 2010 season. Peavy’s consent, therefore, would be needed for a trade to any of the other 29 clubs.
What’s more, Peavy told The San Diego Union-Tribune on Saturday that if it ever comes to it, he would only accept a trade to a National League team..
If so, that would remove two of baseball’s biggest spenders that Towers long has cultivated for trade purposes – the Yankees and Red Sox. In July, the Houston Astros inquired about the availability of Peavy; Towers said July 11 that his response to the Astros, whom he did not identify at the time, was that he would not consider moving Peavy, either during the season or the offseason.
That he now is open to at least discussing Peavy with other clubs, Towers said, reflects a change of season, not a change of heart. “The way I approach the offseason, it’s different,” he said.
Peavy bought a home in San Diego this year and said his wife has fallen in love with the area. But the Alabama native also is aware that the Padres have a history of trading players as the heftier portions of a backloaded contract come due. Peavy said he appreciates the commitment the organization made to him, and is hopeful that a broader commitment can bring San Diego its first World Series title, with his help on the field.
“I want to win here,” said Peavy, who was 10-11 with a 2.85 ERA this year. “If I didn’t, I wouldn’t have signed the extension. The extension was about me loving being a part of this organization, wanting to be here in San Diego and believing this franchise was headed in the right direction. That was what I was led to believe – that we were going to do what we could do around here to win, on a consistent basis. That’s what I want to happen, without a doubt. That’s first and foremost. “That being said, if that’s shown not to be what’s going to happen and what our goal is around here – I’m not saying what people say, but what actions show – then I’m open to doing what they think is best. I want to win. Bottom line.”
By ncscoots
October 3, 2008 6:45 AM | Link to this
DOB, saw Eastern Promises, loved it, bought it, LOL.
I guess Unforgiven really is the standard, anymore, no? I fear any other Western is going to suffer by that comparison, though, no matter its own merits. I loved 3:10 To Yuma, but it wasn’t Unforgiven. I don’t expect Appaloosa to be, either, but that won’t stop me from enjoying it if it’s good.
I can’t help it, I love those doggone oat-eater morality plays. Give me a righteous man backing his beliefs with a Colt (and a big tub of Orville’s), and I’m there, LOL.
By Lee in S GA
October 3, 2008 7:58 AM | Link to this
Speaking of Appaloosa, Ed Harris has to be one of the most underated actors ever. The man is superb in any motion picture I’ve ever seen him in. I certainly will be checking the new western out.
Well what curse will the Cubs come up with this season. Anyone see this Dodger team actually going to the W.S.? Perhaps another team like the one that beat the A’s in 1990. I think they could do it.
By Eware
October 3, 2008 8:04 AM | Link to this
Great blog, DOB. Minor leaguers getting the call up the majors or even just the next level has become the most fun thing for me in baseball. I had the most fun this season watching Charlie Morton’s first start. It was a blast. Reminded me a lot of Chuck James first start with Todd Pratt behind the plate. I’m not comparing the pitchers, just the amount of fun I had watching.
I’m rooting for Brandon Jones. There’s something about this dude I really like. Maybe it was the 100 plus RBI season in 2007….
I still think its great that our mashers in the minor leagues are named Freddie and Jason. Scary!
By getnathan
October 3, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this
FA WISH LIST IN CAPS: Braves lineup:
CF - Schaefer, Blanco SS - Escobar 3B - Chipper LF - MATT HOLLIDAY C - McCann 1B - Kotchman RF - Francoeur 2B - Johnson
JOE NATHAN via trade. I truly believe he would instantly makes us contenders
DEREK LOWE, MATT CAIN or ZACK GREINKE
By tapate
October 3, 2008 8:37 AM | Link to this
Man, that list doesnt even mention Tyler Flowers, Medlen, or Rohrbaugh. We are LOADED at the lower levels!
By Run Heap Run
October 3, 2008 8:49 AM | Link to this
Hello Switzerland
If you were serious, The Braves can’t and won’t pay for Manny…and he’s wanting to be a Yankee I hear. If the Dodgers don’t get him, and they’ll probably pay him almost anything to keep him, then expect to see him in pinstripes.
If you were not serious, well hello anyway.
DOB I can’t believe it either (Dodgers up 2-0) … before they got Manny the Dodgers, IMO, were no better a team than the Braves and the Cubs clearly owned us all season. Huh. Is there anyone left to blame in Chicago?
By GermanBravesFan
October 3, 2008 8:59 AM | Link to this
Run Heap Run…
I was serious about being in Switzerland. And I was somewhat serious about Manny… Hey, we can all dream, can’t we? I just read an interesting piece on ESPN about the Manny situation in Boston. It’s rather long, but here it is:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=manny
I wish the Braves would make a real splash at some point. Who knows if Francoeur will come around? Will Kelly continue hitting the way he did the last six weeks of the season? Will Derek Lowe really create a buzz in Atlanta? I am not so sure about that. IF the Braves truly have $40-45 million available, why not spend $20 million on a superstar? Get a good young pitcher who is not that expensive yet through a trade and sign a veteran starter for $12-15 million.
I know, I know… it’s easy to sit in front of a computer and come up with all those (unrealistic) scenarios. But I really believe in order to create excitement about Braves baseball again, there needs to be a real splash!!!
By ssiscribe
October 3, 2008 9:19 AM | Link to this
Ummmmmmm … Hudson’s BBQ. Might have to ride out and see my folks this weekend and get me a pork sandwich, a cheeseburger (best burger I’ve ever had, and my wife always wants one when we go see my parents) and a big cup o’ stew. And of course, a huge sweet tea in a styrofoam cup.
When the wind would blow from the northwest, the smell of that delicious BBQ would float over our high school campus. Nothing like walking to my old truck in the parking lot after school and smelling that ‘que in the wind. Awesome!
D’Ville has grown so much since I left nearly a dozen years ago. The playground where I threw my first fastball, my first touchdown pass, hit my first jump shot, is long gone, replaced with a mega mall. Ugh. But though I’ve lived from the mountains to the isles and now back in the ‘burbs, DC always will be home.
Now back to the offseason, already in progress.
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By Mitchell
October 3, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this
love love love those dodgers dodgers dodgers.
where have the cubs gone, where’s the faith, the fire, the passion in wrigleyville? don’t care actually.
loved the debate last night. you know, i feel a little ill-informed at times about what’s really goin’ on in America. i sometimes wonder who to turn to. You know what I think I’m gonna do? I’m gonna go find me a socker geem tomorrow and find out how da American peeple are doin’ and what dey call tell me about how those folks are doin’.
By A.D.
October 3, 2008 9:36 AM | Link to this
Dave
Reading what you have said all the way up top it seems as if the braves really do not have any idea of which way to go. On one hand the braves are thinking of spending their money on some high priced free agents and then we talk about bringing the young kids up from the farm. Frank Wren has to make a decision one way or another. If you want to win now go out and sign a CC Sabathia at whatever the cost is along with another tier 2 pitcher like a derek lowe(who is by no means an ace)bringing smoltzy back as the closer and trying to sign Hampton back on a 1 or 2 year low base with incentive deal and fill the holes we have in LF and CF (sorry but blanco and anderson aren’t enough for us to win now & giving Frenchy another chance to rebound off a miserable season and try to win. If the don’t put a product like that on the field then save the money and bring the kids up and give them time to develope like we gave the young guys from late 80s to early 90s to develope. Smoltz, Glavine, Justice, Gant, Bluaser, Lemke ect didn’t just pop up and become players, they needed 2 or 3 years before they really started producing.
Do you agree with me or not? A.D.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 9:42 AM | Link to this
DOB-I second your opinion of Eastern Promises. Watched it on cable one night when there was nothing else on . Didn’t think it would appeal to me, but Viggo did an excellent job-as usual. I’m looking forward to the DeCaprio/Mortensen movie they just released. I’ve tried to not like Leo for years, but the kid keeps putting out great peformances like in The Departed and Blood Diamond. Also would like to see the new western with Ed Harris (another great actor), Appaloosa.
UGABrave-I will look for a suitable reference picture of Larry Munson (help from the Denizens is ALWAYS appreciated) I need you to get in touch with me LewHartman@comcast.net so I can get your address and such things.
Let me preface this next with a caveat-THIS IS NOT a political commentary, but an observation about Political coverage.
Of course, I watched the VP Debate last night-interesting to say the least. I made my choice a while back (NO, I won’t tell who), so the debates are meaningless to me in that way, but the commentary is always illuminating-AGAIN, to say the least-the ABSOLUTE LEAST.
This morning, I heard one pundit (On a Network that indulges in Breath by Breath coverage-and has done so for two years now, since the mid term elections). This pundit proclaimed “She proved she can speak in full sentences. I think she hit a Home Run.”
Have I perhaps pulled a 21st Century Rip Van Winkle and woke up in the future, a la Idiocracy? For God’s sake, is this a Mad TV Lowered Expectations moment? Are we now so easily appeased? Speaking in Full Sentences is Home Run worthy? Damn, we’re doomed if it is. Gee Whiz, Gosh Golly-Maybe we need to elect someone who knows vocabulary, too. Or maybe we just need better analysts and pundits. MUst be some of those “Journalists” with no degree that DOB mentions. At least our Braves’ Beat writers are educated-the rest of the political pundits? Not so much, apparently.
By GermanBravesFan
October 3, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
A.D.
I agree with you… I think that sums up my earlier post about Manny Ramirez.
Go out and get a superstar (Manny, CC Sabathia, or else) even if it costs $20 million per year and use the remainder of the $25 million for the rest OR trade Chipper, get more prospects that way, and let all the high-level prospects play!
Somehow, I am hoping the Braves will do something that will get us all excited again about this team! It would also send a message to the remainder of the league that the Braves are serious contenders again.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this
uga-brave i agree. a 7 game series would be better.
By Robert
October 3, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this
By my count it’s around 135 days until Bobby Cox reports to spring training, effectively eliminating the Braves from the ‘09 World Series race
By Robert
October 3, 2008 10:06 AM | Link to this
135 or so days before Bobby Cox reports to Disney for spring training thereby eliminating the Braves from the 2009 World Series
By Patrick
October 3, 2008 10:12 AM | Link to this
What about CC? We have payroll. Could we make a run at him?
By CMC
October 3, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
DOB,
Thanks for the great Braves coverage this year. Enjoy your blog as well as listening to your radio spots. Hopefully, we will have some good things to discuss this winter about this Braves team that needs a few additions. Got a question for you. Do you ever accept speaking requests for local civic club meetings? Strange question, I know. But I am a member of a club in Cartersville and wondered if you would be interested. Hey, it’s a great time of the year to get on your Harley and ride up for the day. You can visit our Booth Western Art Museum while here. That itself is worth the trip.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this
ssiscribe great to see you back! can we look forward to your daily posts every morning this offseason?
By LT-A blogger
October 3, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this
Josh- thanks for the response last night. I tend to agree with your assesment that it would take more than Reyes, Morton, Franceour to land a true ace like Peavy/Oswalt. I think I was more ruminating on what it will take to land one of those types. Hey, if the dude from 2 guys a girl and a pizza place can land Scarlett Johanson, anything seems possible this week.
Hudson’s injury really hurt next year big time. I think they gotta land a Peavy or Oswalt type to contend. Of course, I don’t watch Cains or the Greinkes of the world pitch so maybe I’m wrong.
Anyways…Awesome to be a Phillies, Dodgers fan and sucks to be a Cubs, Brewers fan. I hate the 5 game series. Anyone out there know why MLB is not willing to shorten the season by one series and make the DS 7 games?
By Thrillhouse44
October 3, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this
2 years later, and still nothing new from Robert.
Did everyone see Phish is getting back together?
By TommyP
October 3, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this
Wow…this blog is chock full of tidbits. I aim to come back just to re-read it.
Lew: I sat there laughing at the very thing you just mentioned you’re appalled by…..unreal. (smart not to engage in the political speak….that and religion are no-no’s.)
I am starting to think a lot of people on here are going to be disappointed with the pitcher(s) that Wren acquires. Too many putting all of their hopes on the mega-ace basket.
With Oswalt, I have to say no to that one. Roy is great…I’ve loved watching him. But there sure is a ton of mileage on that arm. We’re not talking just 200 inning seasons…he’s had several around the 250 mark. Couple that with his stature and that arm has to be close to falling off. (slight exag. but you get my point)
As far as Peavy, love him. Again, you worry a bit with the wear and tear over the years but it’s not as bad as Oswalt. What I am not crazy about at all is the salary after this year and years following. Is it $22 mil one year or am I thinking about Oswalt? Too much for one guy, especially an arm with that mileage.
I’ve had that Japanese pitcher on the radar for about a month. Need to find his name again. Rarely do the Braves dip into that market but they’ve been involved from the beginning.
Funny that the LF acquisition is getting far less play on here than the pitching.
By Nate
October 3, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this
As long as we’re talking about next year, I want to put in my two cents.
Somebody mentioned trying to get Swisher from Chicago. He had a bad year with a new team and wants out. His career numbers are pretty solid and there’s no reason to think he won’t rebound. He shold come pretty cheap, and he would be a huge upgrade over Blanco, and he provided some depth at first base. the Braves could use some depth at first base. Kotchman isn’t going to start every game, and Prado and Norton have no business playing first.
Swisher playing center instead of Anderson or Blanco, allows the Braves to shoot a little lower in filling the left field hole. Its easier to find another guy who can hit 25HR than a guy who can hit 40HR.
With regard to pitching, the Jo-Jo experiment needs to be over. There have been no sighs of life with this guy. I think is a no-brainer to resign Hampton. they could win 15 games next year easily is he stays healthy. An incentive based contract is perfect.
I think the staff needs a legitimate ace, who is going to stick around for awhile. I think trading for Roy Halladay would be perfect. He’s frustrated with Toronto, and they aren’t going to compete anytime soon in that division. I have no idea what it would take to get a deal with Toronto done, but the price would be steep.
After Halladay, signing a guy like Lowe makes sense.
That’s my two cents.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 10:34 AM | Link to this
lew i agree with you on the pundits out there. i cant stand them.
i studied media and communication in college. i have an undergrad degree in mass com. one thing i took away from studying media is never believe anything you hear. anything. im not sure if that what i was supposed to get out of it, but i did!
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this
Bruce—
That’s a very good point. Very well said, too.
But then time flies because each major event that might take a week to endure (like Brian after Victorino played dirty), later becomes just a point in time…
So true. At the time, that week seemed to take FOREVER! But when it was over it was like, “Dang, here we are again.”
we are rooting for 3 more doubles, or two more stolen bases, throwing out Victorino, another triple.
I bet if he wouldn’t have gotten run over, he’da broken Pudge’s record for doubles. But he’s now tied for the NL record, and even though I didn’t see that record-tying double, it was incredibly fun. I saw the word “double” come up on the Gameday screen for his third 2B of the night, and I was the happiest fann in the state. The fact that it came against the Fillies made it even sweeter.
And then he threw out the Reaper that same night! That was one of the best games of the year!!
I wonder if Mac will ever hit another triple…If not, then April 24, 2008 will forever be known as The Day Brian McCann Hit a Triple. LOL.
I was hoping for just one more homer. When he came up to bat in the ninth inning with two outs and two on, representing the go-ahead run, I was clinging to a hope that he’d hit one out. But instead, he popped out, and ended the season. That hurt.
And so we look to next year, and once again we will feel, as you said, “The joy of being a fann.”
By Mitchell
October 3, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this
Here’s a thought that came to me a couple days ago:
Do you think Jeff Francoeur made the right decision by chosing baseball over football?
I’m wondering if he might not have been a better football player than a baseball player.
Yo, I gotta say… that’s pretty deep. I’m pushin’ buttons here people.
He’ll be better next year I hope.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this
Nate-Several things Dude. First, the Braves will not go out and get a left fielder AND a center fielder. And why, exactly, should they? Are you not aware of the expected ascendence of Schafer and Heyward? Why would you go out and make big trades for mulitiple years (likely what it would take) to fill a position you expect to fill from your own system in a year or so? Makes no sense, especially since-
We need pitching and pitching will be infinitely harder to acquire than an outfielder.
JoJo Reyes-You say the experiment should be over. Not too sure it was an experiment as much as it was desperation due to losing 3/5 of their starting rotation. Otherwise, JoJo (or HoHo as some prefer), would have spent the last year in Richmond, learning how to continuously pound the strike zone and gaining confidence in his ability to do so. Since it is doubtful his trade value is anywhere approaching it’s zenith, who would you trade him to and for what? Leave him at Gwinnett next April and let him try to turn it all around.
Halladay is NOT leaving Toronto. I don’t know where you got the info he was ready to leave. I spent time in Toronto this summer and heard nothing of it. I also heard an interview with A.J.Burnett last week on XM and he was talking about how he and Roy were in the process of re-upping with the Jays because they were happy with the Jays and the Jays were happy with them. Without Burnett and Halladay, a pretty damn good one-two punch, what do you feel the Jays chances are in that division? Do you believe them to be suicidal by letting them walk, thereby killing ANY chance they have to compete?
By Lew
October 3, 2008 11:03 AM | Link to this
Mitchell-Not that sure you’re as deep as you might think. However, while watching a Braves/Nats game this season, with Don Sutton on the Nats’ feed, he made an interesting comment.
He was talking about Frenchy’s football career in HS-he played (I believe) free safety. Sutton made a point that he played baseball the same way as a free safety plays football-with abandon, reacting as plays happened. He equated this style of play with Jeff’s approach at the plate. Not too sure he was wrong in his analysis. Frenchy is definitely a reactive, as opposed to an analytical type player
By DAP
October 3, 2008 11:12 AM | Link to this
swisher wouldnt be a bad pickup. youve gotta think that at 27 years old, he isnt gonna hit .219 for the rest of his career. he would be good for 20 homers, hopefully a .250 average and on this team, maybe 80 RBIs. not bad. he should be considered if he is on the block.
By ssiscribe
October 3, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this
DAP: Yeah, I need to jump back in here. I certainly enjoy the discussion, and I’ve been reading all season. The combination of a job promotion (very good thing), and launching my own blog and its subsequent growth this season (very good thing) has really added to my daily list of “duties.” As in, duty calls far more often, but again, that’s a very good thing.
But yes, I’m going to make time to jump in here a little more during the offseason. Been something I’ve been meaning to do.
Thanks for remembering I once was here on a much more frequent basis! Hope all is well.
And now … duty calls!
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By DAP
October 3, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this
lew the Braves will not go out and get a left fielder AND a center fielder. And why, exactly, should they? Are you not aware of the expected ascendence of Schafer and Heyward? Why would you go out and make big trades for mulitiple years (likely what it would take) to fill a position you expect to fill from your own system in a year or so?
depending on what they can get, i definetly think they should get a CF and a LF. again, depending on what they get. if it comes time to let shafer of heyward or gorkys to take over somewhere, trade the guys who are in the way. the circle of life. having player “a couple of years away” should not keep us from getting good players for this team. we will cross the prospects bridge when we get there.
By JD
October 3, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this
Nate, the Braves could never get Halladay. They would have to give up every top prospect they have and then some. You could probably add in someone like Escobar too. Never going to happen. This is not even mentioning the fact that Halladay won’t leave Toronto anytime soon, I am not sure where you heard that.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this
re: frenchy playing football vs. baseball
i was listening to mike and mike and they had a guy on there that had been a football player. he was talking about how baseball (and golf) is so different than football, that it makes it hard for football players to understand baseball. in football, the harder you hit, the more pumped up you are, the more effort and intensity to give , the better you play.
in baseball, these things can hurt a player. baseball, espcially hitting and pitching, is about fine motor skills as opposed to gross motor skills.
this former football player said that it was hard to reconsile in his mind that it didnt help him to swing as hard as he could.
jeff is an MLB player, so im not saying that at this point, he doesnt understand how to play, but who knows? maybe he cant shake the football mindset.
By Mitchell
October 3, 2008 11:39 AM | Link to this
Good context Lew,
didn’t hear that analysis by Sutton, for obvious reasons I suppose. don’t live in D.C. live in atlanta.
with less emphasis on the individual performance like a batter facing off with a pitcher, i think football is the game that best suits jeff’s instincts.
he could probably be a really good quarterback, i don’t even know if he would play quarterback or if he would be big enough for the nfl but i think in general he might have been a better football player than baseball player.
is there an echo in here?
and thanks for putting me in my place Lew. you’ve helped me to realize that I’m not quite as deep as I thought I was. see that’s called humor Lew. I mean, I was laughing, and usually anytime I laugh at something I say I know with certainty that what I said was very humorous.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this
DAP-Dude. They are NOT getting a left fielder and a center fielder-especially since we already have Anderson, Blanco, Diaz and Schaeffer. It just will NOT happen. What part of we need pitching is unclear to some of the Denizens here? Pitching will be infinitely more difficult to acquire and much more expensive. Yes, we have a lot to spend, but it won’t be enough if it’s all spent on the outfield.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this
Lew, Sutton is a very intelligent dude.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this
DAP-Dude, just checked last year’s salaries for several of the most commonly mentioned possible outfield acquisitions. Blake (who you want) 08 salary, $6.1 mil. Pat Burrell- 08 salary $14.2 million. Adam Dunn-08 salary $13 mil. Nick Swishewr 08 salary- $3.6 mil and arbitration eligible. I repeat. We need the money to acquire pitching. I see no way on the face of this earth that the Braves pick up a left AND center fielder who will cost us in the vicinity of $15-$30 million. Just ain’t gonna happen. Just ain’t.
By Mitch
October 3, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this
thanks for the info DOB. maybe i’ll see you around the ajc offices someday.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
this is what i would do to help this team. its pretty simple.
sign one of these pitchers: derek lowe, ben sheets, ryan dempster, randy wolf, oliver perez.
then, trade for one of these pitchers: aaron harang, justin duchscherer, bronson arroyo, erik bedard scott olsen.
my idea for the outfield hinges on what the brewers do with cameron. if the brewers decline camerons option the braves should sign him to play CF and casey blake to play LF. this adds about 40 homers and good defense to our outfield. the point of this is that instead of trying to add one 40 homer guy, we can add two guys to do that, and be deeper.
if we do those 4 things, all thats left is to resign hampton, norton, and ohman. this will make us a much better team. (obviously we would have to get at leasy one of the very good pitchers i mentioned, and not two middle of the road one)
if we cant get cameron, i think we need to try to get a big outfeilder. not dunn, burrell, or manny. this makes it tough, because we will have to trade for someone. if we can get ordonez, perfect. if we get willingham, maybe compliment him with shwisher, and were good.
anyways, my dream senerio would be derek lowe, aaron harang, mike cameron, casey blake, mike hampton, will ohman, greg norton.
can we do all that with $45mil and some prospects? probably not….. but almost.
By ncscoots
October 3, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this
Oswalt has thrown about 1500 ML innings in the last seven years, and Peavy has thrown about 1200 in the last six years. Those are hardly “arm falling off” numbers. Of all the reasons that those two might be unattractive to the Braves, “wear and tear” would rank somewhere south of Key West.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
Mitchell-Dude, If you think THAT was me putting you in your place, you obviously Have NOT been around long. That was a kinder, gentler response. I realized you were saying it tongue in cheek.
DOB-Yeah, I’ve always liked Sutton and his analysis. Seems to know what he’s talking about and I never have had much occasion to discount his take on things.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
A.D.: You asked, so I’ll answer. No, I don’t agree with your CC-or-nothing scenario that you described at 9:36 a.m. And as for Wren’s plans, he said they’ll use their assets — case, prospects for trade, etc. — in whatever way is necessary to fill their needs.
What do you want him to do, commit to spending all the money on free agents and ignore potential trades? Or vice-versa? Makes no sense to say you’re going to fill this need this way and that one that way, when we haven’t even gotten to the free-agent filing period, or to the GM meetings where those guys talk about potential trades and get a better idea of whether they might realistically be able to fill a need through a trade.
By ellaguru
October 3, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this
Dave, this blog is just, as they might say in the Alaska Legislature, chock-a-block with information you wouldn’t get from a lotta guys. But if I can make one comment on a tiny, tiny thing therein:
What kind of parents would give their little shaver a name like “Merkin?”
By Lew
October 3, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this
Mitchell-I don’t live in D.C. either. I’m in central Vermont. The reason I heard it is that I have the MLB Extra Innings Package on cable. I see all the Braves’ games, but many times, the broadcast is done by the other team’s TV crew, hence when we play the Nats, I often get to listen to Sutton. It’s also nice hearing Vin Scully do the Dodgers’ broadcasts, too. Dude is one of a kind. Quite possibly the most informed Announcer I’ve ever heard. By way of contrast, the Brewer’s Dudes, are terrible.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 12:07 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, thanks for posting that Krasovic story on Peavy at 3:55 a.m.
I’m telling you, it’s not far-fetched to think the Braves will make an offer. They’ve done deals with the Padres, and the Padres love getting solid prospects and young players. They’re exactly the kind of team the Braves could get an ace from, a team with payroll restrictions and an aggressive GM always thinking years down the line (Towers) and staying competitive in a market with payroll limits.
By Nate
October 3, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this
I’ll admit that getting Halladay is a stretch and it would take a lot to pry him away from Toronto. But everybody wants to play for a contender, and Toronto isn’t going to contend anytime soon. Halladay may say all the right things to the media, and he does a great job of being a poster boy for the franchise. But he did express some concern this summer over a lack of progress by the front office. MLBTraderumors had some interesting things to say during the summer.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2008/07/jays-quietly-di.html
I’m just saying the Wren should definitely make a call to Toronto to inquire.
The Braves have to acquire two outfields if they wish to contend next year. Blanco or Anderson are not good enough to be starting on team that has playoff aspirations. Acquiring two outfielders who can hit 20-25 HR is in many ways easier that acquiring one guy who can hit 40 HR. With a big question mark next to Frenchy the Braves have to get two outfields if they want to compete next year.
Schafer and Heyward are prospects. They’ve gotten a lot of hype but so did Salty, Brandon Jones and JoJo Reyes. Frenchy was on the cover of Sports Illustrated and look where he’s at now. I don’t understand why so many of you are ready to crown Schafer the new king of Atlanta when he’s really only played well for a few weeks at a time in double-A ball. And that’s ignoring the HGH suspension. Are you guys really ready to pin the future of the franchise on this guy?
By DAP
October 3, 2008 12:12 PM | Link to this
lew They are NOT getting a left fielder and a center fielder-especially since we already have Anderson, Blanco, Diaz and Schaeffer.
We need the money to acquire pitching. I see no way on the face of this earth that the Braves pick up a left AND center fielder who will cost us in the vicinity of $15-$30 million.
you are probably right. like i said, if we get both a CF and a LF, i would depend on WHO we get. if we get a LF who hits 40HR, we dont need a CF who can hit 20. as far as blanco, diaz, anderson, shafer…blanco and anderson showed me this year that they arent good enough. they are ok, they do somethings well, but blanco needs more power, and anderson needs a little more power and needs to walk more. they arent ready. shafer? maybe hes ready, maybe hes not. it wouldnt hurt him to get a year at AAA. and i love diaz, but he cant play center, and he isnt going to be enough to help us win in 2009.
i dont want dunn or burrell. but if we get them, theorietically, we could deal with shafer maybe not having a great rookie year in center. if we get somone with 20homer power instead of 40 homers power, we might need some help in center.
if we could get cameron and blake for about $15mil, i think we oughta do that. i think both would be very valuable to this team. with the $30mil thats left, maybe we could get lowe and trade for duchscherer. that should leave us enough money to resign hampton, ohman and maybe norton.
By Bruce's Pearl
October 3, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this
Lew- Hope you have recovered from last weekend.Keep your chin up,you still have us (TN) to play and that should be a Dawg win.At the trade deadline,we thought we had a deal with Pittsburgh for Bay,indicating to me we match with them as far as players we have that they like.That said what would you think of Ian Snell? Would you give Branden Jones,Lillibridge,and JoJo for Snell and a prospect?
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this
Mitch, I went back and re-wrote my answer to you about degrees in journalism. I answered in a hurry very late last night/this morning, so I went back and did it again, if you want to scroll back up.
By Jeff R
October 3, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this
DOB, thanks for the thorough update on prosects.
Derek Lowe… I don’t know why Wren would want to sign Lowe’s 36-year-old arm to a long term contract. And why Lowe would want to come to Atlanta, when he will likely have the option of going to a sure contender, is beyond me. Word on the street is that the Mets are going to make a big play for his services. For a lot of reasons, he’s a better fit behind Santana in NYC than in Atlanta.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this
I saw DOB actually may have found some interest in my belief the Braves should go after Josh Willingham, if he can be had, of course. I think the Braves should go 1 step further, if they can. Since the Marlins are going to have so many arb-eligible players, maybe FW and the Braves should attempt to snag Scott Olsen along with Willingham. I like the idea of prepping the Braves for a younger rotation, starting with JJ and Olsen. I know DOB says FW isnt going after3 starters but if he can be had for prospects, then I believe FW may entertain the idea of 25/26 yr old lefty with upper echelon stuff, that he can control for a few years, he can be the #3 or 4 guy. Like I’ve been saying, go after Oswalt. Then you sign a FA pitcher. Re-sign Hampton. Go hard after Brandon Phillips as well, and I mean hard. That means a KJ package(I like Kelly but we need more RH umph and again we need a lineup that can still produce minus Chipper/and or McCann, adding 2 hitters to the lineup does this). I also think Josh Anderson will be the starting CF next year to start the season but Scahfer will be with the big club by June, though. I think the same instance with Charlie Morton as well. He will start in Gwinnett, get him some innings and re-store any of his confidence and then bring him up as well. Just my thoughts. Can’t wait to see how the Braves do this offseason
By Lew
October 3, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this
Peavey and Lowe would work just fine, plus one of the Japanese Dudes.
By Mitchell
October 3, 2008 12:25 PM | Link to this
I guess it never occurred to me how few African Americans there are in the North Side of Chicago.
You look at the crowd at Wrigley Field, not a lot of diversity.
Not that that means anything, I’m not sayin’ anything. I just I hadn’t quite noticed before.
Okay, I am saying something.
Go Dodgers.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
riche i would be ok with getting olsen and willingham from florida. it would be a risk, with olsen control issues, and willinghams injury issues, but it could work out well.
but i draw the line at brandon phillips. he is a very good play and i like him alot, but i dont think he is better than kelly johnson. that would be a mistake, i think. id take phillips if he was packaged with arroyo or harang, for a package including kelly, but unless we get one of those pitchers, no.
By Vol
October 3, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
What’s better, Peavy at $15MM a year and you have to trade talent, or CC at closer to $20MM for a longer period, but only draft picks go.
I think that Peavy is probably the better pitcher even though CC gets all the hype. I’d be so excited to land him along with a #2 like Lowe via FA.
Maybe I should settle down and expect to land some of those guys on the ajc.com poll. Ramirez? Martinez? Who came up with that list?
By Jeff R
October 3, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this
Solid points, Richie. Go younger in the rotation. Position the team for the wave of farm talent coming along in 2010 and 2011.
By TommyP
October 3, 2008 12:41 PM | Link to this
Just checked the contracts of Oswalt and Peavy.
Peavy is the one with the $22 million one year but it’s a team option. The next few years go something like 15, 16, $17 million and then the option. Much better than I thought.
Oswalt has about the same type of contract.
ncscoots: I would bet that “wear and tear” on Oswalt is a DEFINITE concern for any team that goes after Roy. Not definite but he’s had a few injuries over the past few years. However, not sure if those were arm injuries.
At any rate, Roy isn’t the Roy he used to be.
Peavy, as DOB stated, would be a coup, especially considering that $22 mil is simply a club option.
By Mitchell
October 3, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this
Lew, I’m already starting to have a hard time with these cold mornings in the atl.
I don’t know about you, I’d be falling into a deep depression if I was facing the onset of a New England winter. I assume you’re used to it. I guess Vermont is nice. I’m ready for spring already.
I would love to be able to hear Vin Scully do the Dodgers Cubs series. That guy has the best voice in the history of voices.
Don Sutton has always been great. I wish he was still with the Braves. You gotta like having Joe and Chip and Smoltz doing the playoffs.
It would be nice if maybe next year they could do it with their team on the field.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 1:00 PM | Link to this
i dont think oswalt is going to be available. the ‘stros have no reason to dump payrole, they are competitive every year, the have oswalt under control for a long time, thet dont have an ace to take his place…i dont see any reason why he would be going anywhere. if anything, the ‘stros are gonna try to land lowe or sabathia to compliment oswalt and maybe make them a division favorite.
By TennesseePaul
October 3, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this
There is a lot of speculation that Lowe will go to Detroit. At least out here in LA. He has said he’d like to play near home.
But I also hear talk of Detroit cutting payroll so I don’t see them in the market to sign free agents.
I’m excited to see what Wren will do. I’m hoping for at least one Star. Someone to ooooooo and aaahhh over. Be that a pitcher or hitter. Two stars, even better. But I will be underwhelmed if he only deals for Rookies again. Jurrjens was great, but I want more pizzazz. Something to take the edge off.
By Steve from OH
October 3, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this
Scribe, I didn’t know you had your own blog…could you please direct me to it? I’d like to give it a read, if you wouldn’t mind.
By clay17
October 3, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this
DOB, A year or two ago the Braves signed a 16 yr old South American pitcher that they were calling the next Santana. Was that Julio Teheran? What is the word on his prospects, or is it still to early to tell?
By mbatl
October 3, 2008 1:10 PM | Link to this
*Are you guys really ready to pin the future of the franchise on this guy? * - Nate
Nate, I don’t know that the Braves are going quite that far. They are hanging the future of centerfield, not the entire franchise, on Schafer.
I would guess that whenever he makes it (hopefully opening day), he’ll struggle against lefties for a while, and Bobby will be tempted to platoon him.
But, the guy’s speed and defense alone will make him a competent CF, and his bat will almost surely come around. Keep in mind, he hit .316/.356/.421 in 38 spring training at bats… a very small sample, but at least enough to suggest he won’t be completely overwhelmed by big league pitching.
Don’t know if it will ever happen, but I would pay real money to see an outfield of Schafer, G Hernandez and Heyward. Great speed, great defense, great youth… it would be the best defensive OF in baseball for the next half decade (starting in about 2010 or ‘11, of course).
I’ve read that most scouts expect Gorkys to develop power as he matures… he has the right swing mechanics and the potential, just not the strength/weight yet.
By braves1966
October 3, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this
Well,
I see that noise is already being made about the Yanks and Mets getting into a bidding war for the services of one C.C. Sabathia. I must say, if the Mets get C.C., one of Fuentes/Krod, and most likely Manny Ramirez (I think he will be a Met). Then, the Mets are going to be hard to beat for years. If the Braves want to hang, they better bring in some players of some serious calibre. Shopping in the bargin bin, and rushing up rooks, aren’t going to allow them to be sucessful, when you figure the money the Mets have to throw at every desirable FA.
By Steve from OH
October 3, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this
mbatl, I agree with your 1:10. In any case, he really can’t do any worse than Blanco or Anderson IMO. Sounds like he’s got at least equal (or better) D and a much better arm. Projects to hit for a lot more power, anyway, even if not at first.
By Thrillhouse44
October 3, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this
I get what you’re saying, braves1966, but I think Frank Wren just has to do what he can to make this team better. Constantly worrying about the other guys and trying to keep up with the Joneses isn’t the way to go. The Mets have put plenty of teams out there that should have won the division on paper. I don’t think ATL can hang with the Mets’ or Yanks’ money this year, but I don’t think we’ll be shopping in the bargain bin either. Discounted CDs are one thing, discounted FAs are another.
Go Braves!
By Ed Glennon
October 3, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this
Let’s hope Wren does better than the Tex trade which gave us Kotchman. Using Kotchman’s stats from the Angels and Braves he still came in as the worst first baseman in the National League. (Washington did not have a first baseman all year so I don’t count them.) The two draft choices we would have gotten are looking pretty good right now.
By TommyP
October 3, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
Are there any Braves fans that would rather see them get two solid pitchers and invest in a stud LF?????
Haven’t heard from that camp yet, if it even exists.
Just would be interesting to hear….
By DAP
October 3, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
mbatl I would pay real money to see an outfield of Schafer, G Hernandez and Heyward.
im sure the braves box office doesnt appreciate you paying them in monoploly money these last few years. how are we gonna sign free agents with that?
By Hammy the Brave
October 3, 2008 1:40 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Thanks for your updates on FW’s thoughts on his plans for rebuilding the Braves this winter. I don’t want to be too pesimisstic, but I do think it could realistically take 2-3 yrs to become a strong play-off contender again.
Have you heard, or could you ask FW if he plans to get a headstart on the offseason by resigning his own players soon-ie, Ohman, Norton and possibly Hampton?
By ssiscribe
October 3, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this
Steve: sure. Follow this link
—30—
By DAP
October 3, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this
ed Using Kotchman’s stats from the Angels and Braves he still came in as the worst first baseman in the National League.
im surprised at this. can you post the data?
By mike o.
October 3, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this
Roy Oswalt isn’t going anywhere; the only uniform he will ever put on will be that of the Houston Astros.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this
Some creep in our neighborhood seems to think the rest of us want to hear his trashy music. It’s been going ALL DAY, I kid you not.
Wow. I cann honestly say, I didn’t expect John Grove to be batting a mere .143 (1-7) thus far in the playoffs. I know it’s only been two games, but dang.
I also didn’t expect the Cubs to fall on their faces like this, either. Why couldn’t it have been the Fillies…?
No, really. It’s sad, I have to say. To lose the first two at home? Sheesh.
No NL games today, which stinks. Oh well…GO RAYS!!
Oops…maybe I better not choose sides. If I do, the Rays might end up like the Brewers…
By mike o.
October 3, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
And Tommy P, Roy won 17 games this year. I guess it wasn’t Roy being Roy this year.
By nolie
October 3, 2008 1:58 PM | Link to this
uga-brave i agree. a 7 game series would be better.DAP
me too. I’m all for it.
By ncscoots
October 3, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
I would guess that whenever [Schafer] makes it (hopefully opening day), he’ll struggle against lefties for a while, and Bobby will be tempted to platoon him.
mbatl, luckily, there won’t be anybody other than Infante to platoon him WITH. :-) Maybe that can put the kibosh on that little platoon temptation.
I doubt that the fourth OF on the 2009 club will be there because he can play CF. Last year, Kotsay’s potential for absence had to be covered, and Infante started on the DL, so SOMEBODY who could play CF had to make the club. Not so (at least, as it now appears) for 2009.
Unless Schafer shows he’s really, REALLY ready in ST, he could probably use a month or two at AAA. Just to transition a little. But, other than that? Plug him in, let him hit 8 for 80 or 100 AB, and then turn him loose at the top. Righties AND lefties.
By Kentavo
October 3, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this
Other than payroll restrictions, why would Padres trade Peavy? Is he in the last year of his contract?
I’d love to see Braves snap him up.
Isn’t he from nearby? Alabama maybe?
By nolie
October 3, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
I see that even with his poor year, B Jones snuck into the top 20 in AAA for Baseball America
I think that in part speaks to the change in how many big league teams use AAA any more. At one time years ago back in my day, AAA was the definitive last stop on the way up and was usually populated mostly with an organization’s best and brightest. Now days that is less true and often is populated with older guys with big league experience that a team is stockpiling for emergency availability. Many more guys jump directly from AA to the bigs or spend less that a full season at AAA. I don’t think it is as full of top-ranked prospects as it used to be.
Jay Bruce, of, Louisville (Reds)
Andrew McCutchen, of, Indianapolis (Pirates)
Wade Davis, rhp, Durham (Rays)
Reid Brignac, ss, Durham (Rays)
Jed Lowrie, ss, Pawtucket (Red Sox)
David Huff, lhp, Buffalo (Indians)
Neil Walker, 3b, Indianapolis (Pirates)
Denard Span, of, Rochester (Twins)
Charlie Morton, rhp, Richmond (Braves)
Homer Bailey, rhp, Louisville (Reds)
David Purcey, lhp, Syracuse (Blue Jays)
Kevin Mulvey, rhp, Rochester (Twins)
Matt Joyce, of, Toledo (Twins)
Brandon Moss, of/1b, Pawtucket (Red Sox)
J.A. Happ, lhp, Lehigh Valley (Phillies)
Jeff Niemann, rhp, Durham (Rays)
Brandon Jones, of, Richmond (Braves)
Collin Balester, rhp, Columbus (Nationals)
Brett Gardner, of, Scranton/Wilkes-Barre (Yankees)
Chris Getz, ss/2b, Charlotte (White Sox)
By Josh
October 3, 2008 2:08 PM | Link to this
LT-A blogger Absolutely. I’m sure Frank will kick the tires on Peavy or Oswalt, and with either pitcher holding a no-trade clause and each player reportedly more than open to playing for the Braves the team might just hold an advantage over the other clubs.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 2:11 PM | Link to this
Clay17, that was him. Way too early to tell, but scouting reports on him this year were excellent, despite his mediocre numbers. Just a kid getting used to pitching in pro ball, and he had a period of shoulder soreness (MRI was clean). Throws hard and has what they call a loose, live arm, like a young Pedro Martinez type, slender, with a whip arm.
By Brady
October 3, 2008 2:13 PM | Link to this
Might be my most favorite blog ever, and although I don’t write very often, I read every blog. As always, nice job DOB.
By Brent S.
October 3, 2008 2:13 PM | Link to this
You are dead-on about the Okkervil River and Cold War Kids new albums. Good, but less good than previous albums. I found myself listening to Stage Names instead of the new Stand In’s recently.
The new Kings of Leon is good. I keep coming back to My Morning Jacket’s album of the year Evil Urges over and over.
By Michael Procton
October 3, 2008 2:17 PM | Link to this
Just a heads up, Sabean just called Matt Cain “untouchable” on Wednesday. “You don’t trade a Cy Young Award winner, whether he’s actually got the award or not. There were times this year that Matt Cain pitched like a Cy Young winner.”
By Richie
October 3, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this
DAP He is offensively and defensively statistically better than KJ(Phillips has a .990 fielding pct the past two years vs Kelly’s .978 in 07 & .980 this year, Phillips is a 2nd baseman with a SS range). I like KJ, a lot, I think he is going to be really good. However, the Braves need to get more productive RH’d bats in the offense, because Francoeur can’t carry the offense alone as the teams only RH’d bat.
By cabravesfan
October 3, 2008 2:19 PM | Link to this
For the sake of my sanity- Please let the cubbies pull this one out! It is only 11:00 and I have had to endure the full effects of the dodger bandwagon and the greatness that is Dodger Manny (as opposed to Boston Manny, who everyone in my office hated) ARRGGHHHH!
By Joe
October 3, 2008 2:23 PM | Link to this
how about a trade for Oswalt and Carlos Lee. solve two problems at once!!!
By nolie
October 3, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this
Did everyone see Phish is getting back together?Thrill
they still live in the hearts of Ben & Jerry. yum yum
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this
* cabravesfan* and the greatness that is Dodger Manny (as opposed to Boston Manny, who everyone in my office hated)
Ugh. Of course. That’s the way it always is.
By Bobby's Cox
October 3, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this
Looks like the series is gonna be Rays vs Dodgers.
Torre’s got his team playing good playoff baseball. His hitters are disciplined and taking tons of pitches….a common goal he stressed to the team all year long (as per the articles I’ve posted on here).
Torre knows how to get it done. Preaching to your players pays off (hint, hint Bobby Cox & your coaching staff). Playing in the west obviously helped.
Sucks, cuz I absolutely hate the dodgers.
By JOE
October 3, 2008 2:39 PM | Link to this
Is it just me or do the Cubs look just like the Braves in their play-off run. Very similar to the Braves post season melt-downs the past three play-off seasons..
By DAP
October 3, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this
richie He(brandon phillips) is offensively and defensively statistically better than KJ
oops, thats wrong. brandon phillips is very good defensivly. very fun to watch. offensivly, hes not as good as kelly. kelly’s OPS this year was .795, which matches his career average. brandon phillips OPS for 2008 is .754, and his career OPS is .733. kelly is better at the plate.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this
Joe I’d love it but we would have to offer starting players AND top prospects for that, don’t think FW and the Braves would do that. Plus, Lee has a full No Trade clause for the next 2 seasons and a limited one in 2011
By DAP
October 3, 2008 2:45 PM | Link to this
richie p.s. if you seperate kelly’s career slugging and OBP, they are each higher than phillips’ career slugging and OBP.
By Wayne
October 3, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this
What are the thoughts that the Braves might be willing to deal Gonzo? We have some real question marks next year in the pen, but if Moylan, Soriano and Smoltz comes back, we could have a real solid pen.
To be able to offer a closer plus some hot prospects, might bring a decent starter. The Rays could use a closer. Would they be interested enough, or is Balfour their future closer?
Would Gonzo and prospects be enough to bring Jered Weaver from the Angels?
By DAP
October 3, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
richie Francoeur can’t carry the offense alone as the teams only RH’d bat.
yunel escobar and chipper jones bat right handed too.
not to mention johnson, kotchman, maccann hit the same weather they are facing a lefty or righty.
oh yeah, prado and infante on the bench are both righties. and if we resign norton, he bats righty too.
we dont need to get rid of kelly for a lesser player just so we can have a right hander.
By Hoosier Aaron
October 3, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
Just curious - I see Zach Greinke’s name tossed about all the time as a potential trade target.
However, I never see the name of Shaun Marcum. I saw him a few times this year and really like him.
He didn’t pitch as many innings as Greinke this year - but for you stat-lovers his ERA and WHIP were lower.
Is there something about the guy I don’t know?
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 3:13 PM | Link to this
Brent S., got O. River’s “Stage Names” playing right now. Vastly superior to their new one, which is good, not great.
By Robb
October 3, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this
Houston is NOT TRADING OSWALT. Every season, New York outlets and everywhere imaginable thinks we’re trading him. Well guess what? Oswalt is not not not not not not not not going anywhere. And why should he? He’s a below market contract number 1 starter? Any team would build around him and not trade him off. So can we please stop with the Oswalt rumors? Also, he has a no-trade clause and would ask to be traded if he were approached with a deal. So no. Please let you be the last out of Houston-market writer to suggest this.
By Bobby's Cox
October 3, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this
uga-brave
great post.
I still can’t believe MLB hasn’t implemented a best-of-seven format in the first round.
By Wayne
October 3, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
Hoosier I think he had Tommy John surgery recently. If that is wrong, it was something else, but he is out for a year.
Dude seemed to be a real stud though.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this
DAP @ 2:50—
I agree.
By Scott from Fairburn
October 3, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
As I think about all the emboldened Cubbies fans who enjoyed themselves the past few years at Turner Field …
GO DODGERS!
Getting swept couldn’t happen to a more insufferable group of fans.
By PatioDaddio
October 3, 2008 4:01 PM | Link to this
An already imposing pitching staff became more frightening tonight when the Atlanta Braves announced that they’d given 1992 NL Cy Young Award winner Greg Maddux the largest guaranteed contract ever for a pitcher by signing the free agent to a five-year, $28 million deal.
Maddux already had 6 full seasons under his belt and was 27 when he pitched his first season with the Braves. Kinda sweet that the Braves gave Maddux the largest guaranteed contract ever for a pitcher. Could it happen again?
Ok if the Braves did stun the baseball world and CC did win the Cy Young, the above paragraph would change to this…..
A not so imposing pitching staff became closer to becoming more frightening tonight when the Atlanta Braves announced that they’d given 2008 NL Cy Young Award winner CC Sabathia the largest guaranteed contract ever for a pitcher by signing the free agent to a ????? year, $???? million deal.
By Josh
October 3, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this
So, Robb, let me see if I’ve got this straight…Houston’s not trading Oswalt?
By Adam Smith
October 3, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
David, I realize you are not an economist, although I’m sure you would have done well at the Wharton School of Business. Let me propose a couple of scenarios to you and tell me what you think. Unemployment goes to 7 %, no lessening of the credit crunch, no relief in the housing market, stock market continues its preceipitous decline. At that point do you think you would have a slight retrenchment in the rhetoric of the uber agents or would it be business as usual as Scott whines about “cc not being able to provide for family at anything less than 130 million over 5 years”. Personally I don’t think I would like to expose my client to the “Maria Antoinette” resentment that might be rising in many communities. Of course since they are sports fans you just might have a father of three, about to lose his job, lacking any health care and 3 weeks from foreclosure and you would probably have him fighting to make sure that Ben Sheets gets whatever he needs to come to Atlanta.
Sports Fans, you gotta love them.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
pattiodaddio that would be pretty crazy if that happend. you know what, though? without ted turner’s check book, i dont think its gonna happen.
By AZBravoFan
October 3, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this
DOB: Assuming Smoltz is healthy, and I realize that’s a big IF, where do you see him fitting in to the Braves staff next year? Obviously if he feels healthy enough to start that would be great. But I’m assuming it’s more likely that he’ll be a reliever at this point. Do you automatically make him closer? Can you take that away from Gonzalez as good as he’s looked and knowing that he’ll be even stronger next year? Is Smoltz at a place in his career where he’d be willing to set-up? Personally, I’d love to see a situation where Moylan and Soriano work the 7th, Smoltz the 8th, and Gonzo the ninth. I know the starters would.
By justdoit
October 3, 2008 4:25 PM | Link to this
trade for snell - makes 3m in 09 trade for J Willingham - makes nothing? thats two needs filled at a low cost and leaves plenty of money for them to sign a cc dempster lowe or burnette - and a power bat like dunn or Pat B? that team would look like a contender to me… thoughts?
By Lew
October 3, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
Nolie-Yeah, Ole Ben and Jerry are thinking of a new flavor in honor of The Phish’s guitarist Trey Anastazio-Oxycontin Oreo Cookies.
By Kentavo
October 3, 2008 4:48 PM | Link to this
How ‘bout Peavy and Giles for…
Frenchy (replaces Giles in RF), JoJo (he’s a socal guy), and Tyler Flowers.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 5:04 PM | Link to this
BravesFan79-OK, Your And Racist.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this
DAP All of those players you named don’t play regularly, only Chipper and he doesn’t bat Right Handed regularly either. And if Kelly hits lefties why are we always platooning him? This is an upgrade not getting rid of. Brandon Phillips, is not a lesser player by any stretch of the imagination. Go look up his stats at Baseball Reference.com, in 2007 he hit 288. 30HR 94RBI 32SB, and he was in a lineup with Griffey, Josh Hamilton & Dunn. Imagine what he would’ve done with Tex, Mac and Chipper in 07. We would’ve been in the playoffs. THis year he .274 21HR 78RBI 23SBs but missed the last 6 weeks with a broken hand. His stats are superior to KJ’s and they have been in the NL the same amount of time. And shame on you McFann, you always look up stuff before rushing to judgement on players. This would an opportunity to get one good player for another. We have to improve the team for the long haul.
As I have stated before the 22 game hit streak improved KJ’s standing with the team, too many people wanted Kelly out of here and now after this streak he is untouchable? No. I can’t believe that. We have to upgrade the lineup. This is a small cog. The Braves go after Phillips and we are adding 51 HR and 172RBI’s(over the last 2 seasons) and stellar defense to team that needs it. Then we can go out and sign a sinker baller like Lowe because he would have a strong defense up the middle behind him as well. How many potential DP’s did Kelly mess up on?, enough to know that people here felt we should start Prado or Infante over him.
By ncscoots
October 3, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this
Even if one thinks Milledge and Dukes are thugs, that doesn’t disqualify them from making a living. I’ve hired folks who seemed to lack maturity and character, simply because they had great talent to do the job for which I hired them. Some managed to overcome those social defects, some didn’t. For those that didn’t, as long their performance outweighed their flaws, I ignored those flaws. Business is business, and my business is not how well (or poorly) someone leads their personal life.
You (or the Nats management, for that matter) don’t have to invite Milledge or Dukes to dinner at your home. And, frankly, I wouldn’t, given the opportunity. That has no bearing on anything related to baseball, however, unless you count “public relations” as a sixth tool. On that skill, both players are still in the Gulf Coast League.
By Hoosier Aaron
October 3, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this
Lew No question - Scully is still awesome.
I agree that the Brewer’s announcer are horrible…maybe the worst.
I like watching some Orioles games just to listen to Jim Palmer - I think he is the best former player doing games right now. Blyleven is very good as well.
Rex Hudler with the Halos is bad.
Can’t stand to listen to the White Sox or the Mets.
By Jeff R
October 3, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this
Richie, I think the priority is to improve the Braves starting rotation. I believer that no matter how much the team upgrades the offense, without solid pitching, you are far less likely to make it to post season. I appreciate that the Braves need to boost their offense. No question about that. But I’d rather see Wren focus on putting healthy, talent arms i the rotation first.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this
DAP, what were Kelly’s and Brandon’s Avg HR and RBI totals the last 2 years, enough said? Brandon Phillips is not Chico Lind or Rafael Belliard here. This guy brings them in, he’s batted 2nd-5th in his career with the Reds. His totals the past 2 years have been really, good. 30 HR from a 2nd baseman is astounding. He had a .288 average in 07. If he didn’t miss the last month he probably wouldve hit about the same this year. It took the hit streak to restore Kelly in everyone’s eyes.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 5:29 PM | Link to this
Richie-Dude, don’t make the mistake of thinking just because many here on the blog wanted Kelly Johnson gone, that it means the Braves brass ever felt the same way. Apples and oranges. A lot of people here wanted to sign Rocco Baldelli and Coco Crisp, too-doesn’t mean it ever made sense or that the Braves concurred.
By Fred
October 3, 2008 5:36 PM | Link to this
AJC staff, Is there any way we can get bravesfan79’s racist post removed from the blog? That type of post is inexcusable.
By FJR
October 3, 2008 5:42 PM | Link to this
Here is my take on next year/what we do. A lot of this is more to do with what I am relatively certain the Braves will do, not what they should do:
Absolute certainties: 1) Brian McCann at catcher 2) Chipper at 3B 3) Jair in the rotation 4) Yunel at SS
Near certainties: 5) Kotchman at 1B 6) K-Jo at 2B 7)Gonzo closing 8) Frenchy in right (they’re not giving up on him this early and his trade value is essentially 0 right now)
I’d say every other spot is a huge ? for us. Ranking the needs:
1) #1/2 SP 2) #2/3 SP 3) LF power 4) CF OBP/speed/some pop 5) #4 SP (optional, probably won’t happen) 6) Random bullpen needs
The one guy I would target the most is Dunn. He does two things that we really need, hit homeruns and walk. You don’t really have to worry about clogging up the bases when B-Mac is hitting behind you.
We need pitching more, but so does every other MLB club. There are way too many variables here to have any clue of who we might target to fill our many pitching needs. My guess would be we sign or trade for a #2 guy as our ace, a #3 guy as our 2/3 and try to have Jurrjens be a 2/3 SP again. I don’t see us signing CC, sorry guys. I have a feeling that the Yankees are going to sign both CC and Tex, they have something insane like 90 million coming off the payroll, are going into a new ballpark and missed the playoffs. If they don’t one of them will go to the Angels or Dodgers. I could also see Tex going to the Mets.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 5:44 PM | Link to this
Richie And shame on you McFann, you always look up stuff before rushing to judgement on players.
Excuse me, but…why are you putting shame on me? What’s wrong with looking stuff up?
I guess I just don’t get it…
By Ed Glennon
October 3, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this
DAP - I looked at ave, hr, rbi for all the first baseman in the National League. There are the really great ones like Albert, Delgado, Berkman, Lee, Howard and so on. But take a guy like Jacobs with a low average high SO’s but he has 32 HR and 99 RBI’s. Same for our old friend LaRoche - 25 HR’s 85 RBI’s or Looney .289 96 RBI’s all of these guys produce runs one way or another. Connor Jackson .300 hitter 75 RBI’s Maybe the Giants have a worse first baseman but that still means 13 teams have a more dangerous hitter playing first than the Braves with Kotchman.
By THB
October 3, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this
If Peavy becomes available, I think the Braves will be deep in talks with the Padres. Not saying they’ll get him, but they’ll go hard for him. I know he has said of any team he’d like to go to the Braves were one of like 3 teams. I think if we offered quantity over quality we’d have a chance. We do have excellent depth up to AA, but we’re gonna have to include some very good players. Think along the lines of Flowers, Rohrbough, Locke, Gorkys, B.Jones, and Lillibridge if we don’t include Schafer, Hanson, Freeman, Medlen, or Heyward.
I think we can get Peavy and sign a solid #3 pitcher. I’m thinking Lowe will get too expensive…I wonder how much Oliver Perez will command. Could we snag him for a 4 year 52 million? That would be all that bad considering he’ll be 27 next year and at the rate good young pitchers go, we’d have a nice top of the rotation that can compete with any other team in Peavy, Perez, Jurrjens. If Hampton came back for a 1 year deal, that’d help too.
I think Wren’s assumption that we need 1 big bat isn’t on the right track. We had that last year, I think we need 2 pretty big bats, like a Swisher and a Magglio. Neither hit 40+ homers, but both will hit in the mid 20’s with good OBP. But that’s not really realistic if we make a trade for Peavy AND look for two more trades.
I’m not really sure what I’d do. If Schafer can step in and hit .270/.350/.450 with 15 HR and 20 SB, I think we’d be just fine as long as we got Magglio to play LF. So I think a lot rests on him and Franceour next year.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
Jeff R, * Lew*,
I know this. I have said this in my original post @ 12:18. I did say focus on the pitching 1st then the offense. I have read enough people talking about getting a big OF bat to solve the offenses woes. Even FW has said he’d like to get a big OF bat. I am saying 1 hitter doesnt fix everything. It wont. The moves I have discussed give the Braves the opportunity to be more than competitive, and to still focus on pitching where it is the priority. The salaries of these 2 hitters(Willingham too) allow the Braves, the flexibility they like to have as well.
By Hoosier Aaron
October 3, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this
Whoaa, now…stop the bus.
Let’s not start making Raffy Belliard examples, here.
Although I knew Raffy’s home run was gone the minute it left his bat -I’m not trying to say he’s Babe Ruth - I’m just saying Raffy is off limits.
Chico - fine…Raffy - hands off!
By FJR
October 3, 2008 6:01 PM | Link to this
An intriguing name for the Braves, that probably won’t happen in a million years. Manny. There are a dearth of power hitting RH LFs in this free agent class and in Manny you have one of the 5 best RH hitters of all time. He’ll probably cost more than the Braves could afford and he doesn’t fit the.. ahem… image that a lot of braves bloggers prefer. But I’d say he’d turn our lineup immediately into a playoff level lineup. Perhaps the best in the NL.
Again, I realize it probably won’t happen, but I’d have to say, I’d be pretty happy if it did.
I wouldn’t make too much out of his final days in boston, there is just too much that could have gone on there. Maybe I’m just naive and want to keep the image of the lovable lunatic who once had 15 million in uncashed paychecks sitting in the top of his locker and lived in a one bedroom apt that cost 1500 per month in rent. Or maybe the Red Sox brass wanted him out and Boras wanted him out and manny listened to what they were both saying.
By Fred
October 3, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this
Hoosier Aaron, I was at Shea when Raffy homered. I agree, it was quite the blast.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 6:14 PM | Link to this
Richie-The point is this-we need at least two starting pitchers (and a return of a healthy Hampton-if there IS such a thing). Then you’re saying we need two new outfielders. Fine. Then you’re saying let’s trade Kelly Johnson. Then we will need a second baseman as well. Believe me, Prado will NOT be the starting 2B.
Answer this- If you’re Frank Wren, what do you do? Just replace the whole damn team and start from scratch? Time to get real here. If we can get the two starting pitchers and sign Hampton and Ohman, and then pick up a power bat, it will just have to do (and honestly, that should work just fine).
I would be willing to bet that the Braves are going to do (or try, anyway) exactly what they say they will-get two starters and an outfielder with power- and that doesn’t include replacing the right side of the infield. Period.
By Steve from OH
October 3, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
Scribe, thanks. Very good read. Goin’ on my favorites right now…
By THB
October 3, 2008 6:20 PM | Link to this
Richie-I’d love to have Brandon Phillips. But he’s not really that much of an upgrade over Kelly. Kelly has a better OBP by a lot, which is the most important stat for offense. Phillips is a very nice player, but for what he would cost in terms of prospects it’s not worth it when Kelly is still pretty good.
Ed Glennon-Avg, HR, and RBI are nice but not that important. Did you realize that Jacobs had an OBP under .300 this year? That’s terrible, about as bad as Franceour. OBP and slugging percentage are good measures for offensive value, although I still do look at AVG, HR, and RBI. Just remember that you need people to get on base to score runs, so we want a player who can get on base and hit for power.
By Brian
October 3, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this
If FW decides to make a trade for a top pitcher/power hitter, and the top prospects are off limits, I don’t see how we get both. Maybe one, but not Oswalt/Ordonez. Whatever, this talk is gettin’ old,fast!! GO RAYS, GO ALL THE WAY!!
By Efrim
October 3, 2008 6:41 PM | Link to this
BravesFan79
You still coming on here and spitting out racist comments? Get off this blog man. No need for that s**.
By Brian
October 3, 2008 6:59 PM | Link to this
BravesFan79- Man, there’s bad in every race! The Tech school I go to is 50% white/50% black and there is as many smart a* whites as blacks! It’s all in how you are raised.
Lets all just be excited the Cubs might get swept!
By TennesseePaul
October 3, 2008 7:24 PM | Link to this
Lew’s right. The pitchers are the most important right now. The team can always use offense but without the pitching it’s hopeless. Braves won it all in 1995 with the second to weakest bats in the majors. Of course they had the best pitching ever to go along with it… Any way, I don’t think Wren will be able to pull off too much considering who he will NOT trade. But I would think he could at least trade for one impact player and sign another big player and then populate the rest of the spots with solid, but not outstanding, guys. Or he could trade for a bunch of AAA phenoms no one has heard of.
At any rate I’d like to keep Prado on the Bench. We could use a solid bench for a change. Tired of running out there in April with the likes of Woodward, Pratt, Corky, Gotay and so forth.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this
Go Tampa Bay!! Whoo-hoo!!
Been meaning to post some numbers on here, perhaps I’ll do that tomorrow…They’re my Projected Stats for McCann (the ones I calculated during the Break) vs. his actual season stats. Some of them ended up pretty close, I might add.
By David O'Brien
October 3, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this
AZBravoFan, I’m thinking Smoltz is going to bullpen if he makes it back, though the rotation hasn’t been ruled out. He has said he just wants to get back to pitch in whatever role he can be effective in, including setup if that’s what is best for him and the team.
I don’t think he automatically goes to the closer role. Not at all. He’s going to have to be used carefully if he makes it back. Of that, I’m fairly certain.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 8:07 PM | Link to this
Uh-oh…is it broken again?
By Efrim
October 3, 2008 8:12 PM | Link to this
Lew and Tennesee Paul
I agree with both of you. Pitching has to be the priiority heading into next season. A power bat in left field is also important, but let’s remember that we will get better power numbers from Francoeur, Kotchman, Escobar and whoever is in centerfield(I guess if its Schafer). So while it is important that we get a power bat in left, it isn’t as crucial as acquiring twp starters.
By Lew
October 3, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this
TenPaul-An option not too many are even including in their projections on who is available and for whom-Japan. There are players there who have forgone a Japanese pro career so they can negotiate without MLB having to pay Dice Kay $$$$$ just to talk. Think about it. You get them without having to do anything but pay them-no players in trade and no U.S. free agency. Not all other teams have the presence in Japan we’ve been told the Braves are developing. Could this be the reason they are focused to the East? At the very least, it IS an option.
By Efrim
October 3, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this
Although this was a post from last year, there are a couple of Japanese pitchers that may be available for this coming offseason:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/11/ranking-japan-1.html
By Richie
October 3, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this
Lew Did you see my post @12:18? If you didnt I will repost it. Here it is:
*I saw DOB actually may have found some interest in my belief the Braves should go after Josh Willingham, if he can be had, of course. I think the Braves should go 1 step further, if they can. Since the Marlins are going to have so many arb-eligible players, maybe FW and the Braves should attempt to snag Scott Olsen along with Willingham. I like the idea of prepping the Braves for a younger rotation, starting with JJ and Olsen. I know DOB says FW isnt going after3 starters but if he can be had for prospects, then I believe FW may entertain the idea of 25/26 yr old lefty with upper echelon stuff, that he can control for a few years, he can be the #3 or 4 guy, in this rotation. Like I’ve been saying, go after Oswalt. Then you sign a FA pitcher. Re-sign Hampton. Go hard after Brandon Phillips as well, and I mean hard. That means a KJ package(I like Kelly but we need more RH umph, and he has a big stick, and again we need a lineup that can still produce minus Chipper/and or McCann, adding 2 hitters to the lineup does this). I also think Josh Anderson will be the starting CF next year to start the season but Scahfer will be with the big club by June, though. I think the same instance with Charlie Morton as well. He will start in Gwinnett, get him some innings and re-store any of his confidence and then bring him up as well. Just my thoughts. Can’t wait to see how the Braves do this offseason. *
I said the Braves 1st focus is on pitching as you can see. I don’t see the Braves as major players in the FA market. That hasnt been the Braves MO. I also said to re-sign Hampton. I also pointed out the Braves should improve the team by not only going after Willingham but Olsen as well, to pair him with JJ, so we can slowly fill out our younger rotation.
I said we need 2 bats in our lineup because 1 big bat doesnt save the woes of the Braves lineup. There were times when Chip and Mac were out for an extended period of time. And we saw how the lineup looked with them out. If you add 1 big bat to this lineup, it will look how it did when Tex was here - they will just pitch around him and the Braves will be in the same predicament, waiting for Chipper and BMac to come back to jump start the offense. The idea is to put together a lineup that will be great with them in the lineup and still function if/and when they are out of the lineup.
I also targeted them because they both hit well against our fellow NL East opponents, which is very important. Plus, I also suggested these moves because it seriously aid the Braves return to continual prominence. Plus, we have to start putting the lineup together for life without Chipper Jones. The Braves have to. If this lineup hinges on his health, then we will be where we have been the past 3 years. The guys the Braves bring in will not all pitch shutouts, nor need the pressure of having to pitch lights out every start, because it won’t happen and those guys will falter.
By Bravenate
October 3, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this
Looking at the way Tampa Bay is playing the game the only thing that we can do is to thanks them, that’s the way baseball should be played, strategy is the name of the game, and whe you can put players in your line up, not only to hit homers but to manufacture run by running the bases, hitting to the oposite side, that’s the way pitchers get burned down.
I don’t understand where in the book of baseball was wrote that left fielder should be a big power hitter, or third basemen, or first basement, or rigth fielder, if you have a player in each position that can hit the ball consistenly the homer will come sooner or latter, but in the mean time the team can produce lot of runs all over the field.
I’m a Brave’s fan since the beggining of 1990s and looking the game that Rays are playing I only can say thanks Rays for your game.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this
Alright, TB!! 6-2!!
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 9:10 PM | Link to this
Hey, Z’s gonna play…first base tonight?
Huh…He played a couple games at first for the RSox this year. Int’resting.
By cabravesfan
October 3, 2008 9:19 PM | Link to this
wow- city of chicago down a collective 0-4…who woulda predicted that?
By Will Jenkins
October 3, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
Josh willingham is a shell of his former self. His back problems will make any club signing him a huge risk. And remember he is already 29 years old and I doubt the old back will be getting better with age.
Scottie is Scottie. An erratic left hander who will not show up for the big game and who has the disconcerting habit of pitching just well well enough to lose whether it is 7-6 or 3-2.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 9:27 PM | Link to this
It has been stated the Braves have 48mill to spend. FW want to acquire players while not moving any of the potential future Braves. The moves I suggested will leave the Braves with money for in season acquisitions if necessary. Olsen and Willingham are arb-eligible. I can’t see them getting more than 12mill combined, and that is a stretch. Acquiring Oswalt and his salary is another 14mill. 5 mill for Hampton. Then you go after Dempster, Penny, Lowe(only Lowe would cost us that 15mil, if you do Dempster or Penny). Re-sign Ohman for 3-4 mil per. And then you go after Phillips and his as an icing on the cake.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this
It has been stated the Braves have 48mill to spend. FW want to acquire players while not moving any of the potential future Braves. The moves I suggested will leave the Braves with money for in season acquisitions if necessary. Olsen and Willingham are arb-eligible. I can’t see them getting more than 12mill combined, and that is a stretch. Acquiring Oswalt and his salary is another 14mill. 5 mill for Hampton. Then you go after Dempster, Penny, Lowe(only Lowe would cost us that 15mil, if you do Dempster or Penny). Re-sign Ohman for 3-4 mil per. And then you go after Phillips and his salary as an icing on the cake.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this
It has been stated the Braves have 48mill to spend. FW want to acquire players while not moving any of the potential future Braves. The moves I suggested will leave the Braves with money for in season acquisitions if necessary. Olsen and Willingham are arb-eligible. I can’t see them getting more than 12mill combined, and that is a stretch. Acquiring Oswalt and his salary is another 14mill. 5 mill for Hampton. Then you go after Dempster, Penny, Lowe(only Lowe would cost us that 15mil, if you do Dempster or Penny). Re-sign Ohman for 3-4 mil per. And then you go after Phillips and his salary as an icing on the cake.
By Adam Smith
October 3, 2008 9:38 PM | Link to this
Hey Ritchie, great effort. If the Senate and House had spent that amount of time tracking the insidious path of credit deriviatives, we would have been spared much pain. I would think a little extrapolation on the pernicious evil of tieing earmarks into a bill that was probably needed to salvage the banking system might be informative.
Let’s just say the credit market completely drys up, with a commensurate inmact on commercial paper impacting the ability to engage in day to day transactions, would that cause Scott Boras to cut back on asking over 120 million for a fat slob that will propbably break down faster than a Mike Hampton Bobblehead Doll left in a sinkhole?? OR will it be business as usual for the Pied Piper of Mayhem amidst a land where anguish and angst is becoming the rule??
By McFann O –[zz]
October 3, 2008 9:41 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan—
Whew! Not me! That’s why betting on baseball is not a good idea (not that I’ve done it, but I sure never would!).
Night, all!
By Richie
October 3, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this
Lew
I was saying that the Braves can go 2 batters for the offense. Not 2 outfielders. After we focus on the pitching because FW has saying the Braves need more RH’d pop in the lineup. Those 2 guys are Rh’d, 1 is a LFer and the other is a 2nd baseman.
By Efrim
October 3, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this
Wow. 4-0 Red Sox. That has to be game right? Dice-K 9-0 on the road? Anyway. If the Angels lose this series, maybe they will start to value OBP…….
eh. Probably not.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 10:01 PM | Link to this
Adam I sure do know. Here is a funny tidbit. I put a credit card offer from WAMU on corkboard, with them offering up to $30,000 limit w/ an *0% APR. I said that is how we got in this mess to begin with
By HeywardTheFuture
October 3, 2008 10:04 PM | Link to this
I like DOB’s suggestion of Willingham + A Ordonez/Burrell/Ibanez would make our Outfield formidable. Plus 2 Starting Pitchers realistically Byrd and Lowe. Then we are right back as contenders.
By f.n. hale
October 3, 2008 10:29 PM | Link to this
maybe it’s just me, but if i’m the gm, i don’t spend $100 mil or so next year to be the 7th or 8th best team in baseball, and pretty much assuring they won’t be any better for a couple more years. i think johnson and kotchman are going to be impact players for a number of years. i like escobar and frenchy, but they are a little less likely to be really good. i love chipper and mccann, but i would be speaking to chipper right now about where he might want to go in a trade when the time is right (before the season starts) and i would be mandating that mccann get his butt in shape. as i said, i love both players but i don’t see chipper having more than one or at the most two good years left (if he stays healthy), and mccann will wear down fast with another year or two with as many innings as this year carrying all that excess baggage. if we are two or three years away, why not trade guys who won’t be at the top of their games then for a few really good prospects, some of who will work and some who won’t? business people don’t want to try to sell the fans on a rebuild, but i think fans really want a team on the upswing, and not one that will barely squeak into the playoffs (like we did the last few times) with no hope to go all the way. i know i do.
By DAP
October 3, 2008 10:31 PM | Link to this
richie i just saw your post from earlier. let me respond.
*All of those players you named don’t play regularly, only Chipper and he doesn’t bat Right Handed regularly either. And if Kelly hits lefties why are we always platooning him? *
yunel escobar doesnt play regularly? chipper only bats righty when hes facing a lefty, dude. which is when you want righties! also, kelly doesnt platoon. he gets days off because infante and prado are good enough to play fairly regularly. hey man, we dont need right handed hitters just for the sake of having them. weve got some to pinch hit against lefties or maybe make a spot start against a tuff lefty. im not saying that we shouldnt add a right handed hitter or that it doesnt matter, butwe dont need to trade kelly for a lesser player just because hes right handed. now, is brandon jones a lesser player? ill explain that he is.
This is an upgrade not getting rid of. Brandon Phillips, is not a lesser player by any stretch of the imagination. Go look up his stats at Baseball Reference.com, in 2007 he hit 288. 30HR 94RBI 32SB, His stats are superior to KJ’s and they have been in the NL the same amount of time.
i have looked up his stats, and ive looked at ALL the stats that matter, not just homers and RBIs.(quick side note…when looking at RBIs, for 2007 and 2008, did you consider batting order? kelly spent alot of time leading of and in the 2 hole the last two years, while phillips bat cleanup most of the year in 2007 and has always been a middle fo the order kind of guy)
kelly johnson gets on base at a much higher rate. his OBP is far superior. his slugging % is also higher than phillips’, though not by much. do you know what this means? it mens kelly johnson makes outs less often (which is good, in case you dont know) and even though he doesnt hit as many homers, he collects more bases per at-bat on average than phillips. (that means, even though he hits fewer homers, hes got better power. alot of doubles and some triples help his cause)
richie, you can even look year by year. in 2007, phillips had his best year. but guess what? kelly still had a higher slug% (better power) and a MUCH higher OBP than phillips. this was kelly’s first full year in the majors, and his first year at a new position, and he out hit phillips.
sorry, richie. the stats are indisputable that kelly is a better offensive player. on defense, phillips is definitely better though. oh, and he steals bases(but gets caught alot). he is very fun to watch.
if you want to get dan uggla for 2nd, however….thats a different story.
By Steve from OH
October 3, 2008 10:46 PM | Link to this
DAP, Kelly has also had (DOB’s of the world avert their eyes here) higher EqA’s (by a pretty good margin) both seasons.
Kelly was .286 and .277, Phillips was .272 and .256.
So why do we get rid of a good, cheap secondbaseman?
he makes outs less often (which is good in case you dont know)
haha. Priceless.
Good to see the Rays get another win today. I’m rooting for them all the way, baby.
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 10:50 PM | Link to this
ADAM SMITH,
pretty sure not too many on here has read “wealth of nations.”
that being said, competition in every aspect is what this country is built on.
i dont like scott boras either, but he gets his clients top dollar.
you or any other product are only worth what the market will bear.
i have no problem with anyone trying to get top dollar in their profession.
not saying i agree with it but, they should have the freedom to shop their talent to the highest willing bidder.
is that not what free markets are based on?
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 10:57 PM | Link to this
dap,
i somewhat disagree with you on your take on brandon phillips.
the dinger numbers and the stolen bases numbers put him past k.j.
until k.j. evens it out, and he might, he is a decent middle infielder, nothing more.
By Efrim
October 3, 2008 10:58 PM | Link to this
Steve from OH
Think the Angels will start to value OBP if they get swept by the Red Sox?
By Steve from OH
October 3, 2008 11:07 PM | Link to this
Efrim:
Probably not. Arte Moreno will keep doing silly things like signing Gary Mathews Jr and Torii Hunter to huge contracts (not that Torii is bad, persay, but his contract was a bit much, IMO).
It’s a shame, though, becuase their pitching is so good that if they had even a shred of offense they would be a dynasty in the making. First thing they should do is sign Tex.
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 11:08 PM | Link to this
efrim,
i am with you. it sure did not work for the most overated general manager in baseball, billy bean.
i think shaun just had a seizure.
By Steve from OH
October 3, 2008 11:16 PM | Link to this
uga-brave:
I dunno about Beane. They’re in the middle of a rebuilding process right now, so I think it’s hard to evaluate how well they’re doing, at least for me, anyway. Let’s wait and evaluate them when the prospects from the Haren and Blanton deals come up.
But it’s sure working for the Red Sox (1st in MLB in OBP), isn’t it? Or the Cubs (2nd)?
By Richie
October 3, 2008 11:26 PM | Link to this
DAP
I have looked at that as well. And as you said, Kelly’s role has been a run ignitor vs Phillips, whose role is an RBI guy. Kelly’s OBP is going to be higher because he was supposed to be getting on base for Chipper and the rest of the offense. Phillips is supposed to put the ball in play and drive in the guys on base. Isnt that what we need? I am looking for bats to get runs in other than Chipper and BMac, because face it they need help. And his bat helps, DAP. You still seem to be ignoring that fact. You can throw all the stats in the world about OBP & OPS but OBP and OPS dont drive in runs and win ball games, those 21 HR’s he hit this year would have made him made 3rd in HR’s, and his 78RBI’s made him tied for 2nd on the team, with Tex, who isn’t even here anymore. And missed the last 20 games of the season due to injury, and still hit 21 HRs, 9 more than Kelly, who played in 10 more games.
Uggla….? Whoa!! He would make it a necessity for Prado and Infante. Phillips make them a luxury.
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 11:28 PM | Link to this
jason bay and the manram both hitting dingers in their first two playoff games with different teams in the postseason, pretty rare that both teams are in the postseason and both are happy.
actually i know that jason bay played for the bucs, but it looks like the bucs are the ones that got short changed.
boston is happy and la la land is happy.
both players brought something that both franchises needed.
manny brought excitement.
bay brought professionalism.
By Moby Grape
October 3, 2008 11:33 PM | Link to this
i somewhat disagree with you on your take on brandon phillips.
the dinger numbers and the stolen bases numbers put him past k.j.
until k.j. evens it out, and he might, he is a decent middle infielder, nothing more. UGA
Nah. OPS is a more reliable indicator of productivity as is EqA. Johnson is a better hitter,Phillips has got a career OBP of .308. That absolutely sucks. Makes WAY too many outs. Cripes even Jeffy has a higher one and everybody in Atlanta moans about how many outs he makes. Makes no sense to swap Johnson for Phillips offensively, and that Cincy park has a plus 20-30% home run level over average. So he is likely to hit fewer homers in another park like the Ted. I can’t tell you how unhappy I’d be with that OBP of his.Name of the game on offense is to make outs as slowly as possible along with some timely hitting and his clutch stats are most all in the .250-260s. Nothing special there either.
By Richie
October 3, 2008 11:35 PM | Link to this
uga brave
Thank you for seeing my point. You add his pop to the lineup along with Willingham(whose 15 HR were about 70% of our entire OF combined) and everyone numbers will go up. Our lineup would be potent. Phillips numbers could even go up in our lineup because he’d have more protection than in Cincy. And let’s face we need RBI guys
By Wayne
October 3, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
What, no blockbuster trades today?
By Efrim
October 3, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
UGA Brave
Well, I think the Angels have seriously lacked the ability to form a lineup that could complement their pitching. It’s unfortunate. Have they had an extra base hit this series? Haven’t had too many walks either. The usual for the LAA.
By Wayne
October 3, 2008 11:40 PM | Link to this
Talk about being hard on your bullpen, Dice-K has thrown 108 pitches through 5 innings. Through the year, he was a 5 inning starter.
By uga-brave
October 3, 2008 11:40 PM | Link to this
steve,
i have always respected your posts, heck besides WW and DOB you have always had a very objective take.
the braves left more runners on base then anyone in the national league this year.
dont get me wrong, i am a huge fan of .obp, it makes pitchers work and it puts pressure on the defense.
that being said the braves did not complement their very high .obp with power or speed.
steve you are a stat kind of guy. you seem to like billy beane, tell me the value he would put on jeff francoueur?
By DAP
October 3, 2008 11:48 PM | Link to this
uga-brave stolen bases are great, but phillips succuss rate is about 66%. he got caught 10 time in 33 attempts. that means even when he gets on base (at a .312 clip, by the way, which is horrible) he still makes outs on the base paths. i dont see how anybody can put phillips above KJ offensivly. is phillips good? yeah. like i said. i like him. but he isnt better than KJ.
richie Kelly’s OBP is going to be higher because he was supposed to be getting on base for Chipper and the rest of the offense. Phillips is supposed to put the ball in play and drive in the guys on base. Isnt that what we need?
what? so phillips can just turn on the OBP if he wants to? dont you think a .350 OBP like kellys would be good no matter where you bat in the order? if phillips could do that, he would. but he cant, because he isnt as good as kelly at getting on base.
You can throw all the stats in the world about OBP & OPS but OBP and OPS dont drive in runs and win ball games
actually, yeah they do. you must be new. as shaun points out often, teams witht he highest OBP and slug% tend to be the highest in runs scored. do you know what slug% is? of course it drives in runs. OBP is avoiding outs, which mean guys on base, which means more opportunity to score more runs. these are good things, and important things. and kelly is better at them.
Uggla….? Whoa!! He would make it a necessity for Prado and Infante. Phillips make them a luxury.
im assuming you say this because of his defense, which i understand. but uggla is light years better than phillips offensively.
By Wayne
October 3, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this
Richie You got some sort of a man-crush on Phillips. Moby is right, we don’t need a second baseman. Let’s not complicate things. We need an outfielder with some pop, and 2 starters.
uga Whass going on? I think it is too early to grade that 3 way trade from the Buc’s perspective. They picked up 3-4 decent prospects. Gotta give it a year or two to grade it. It has worked out well for the Dodgers and the Sox though.
who you like for Braves acquisitiions?
By Chuckie
October 3, 2008 11:58 PM | Link to this
I thought the name of the game on offense is to score more than the team you play against or better yet hit the ball in play where the defense isn’t. All that OBP & OPS doesnt do anything on the field. It’s what the guy with the bat in his hand does when the ball gets to the plate that decides what happens on offense and how the game is decided.
By mbatl
October 4, 2008 12:05 AM | Link to this
Phillips was a disaster in ‘08 outside of Great American Ballpark. On the road, he hit .247/.298/.401, for a .699 OPS. 13 of his 21 HR came at GAB (with almost identical AB’s).
For perspective, for his career, KJ is hitting .378/.491/.600, with 2 HR and 9 RBI in 12 games at GAB (1.091 OPS).
Richie, you put a lot of value in HR, which I don’t agree with, but even accepting that: Put Phillips in Atlanta and he probably hits 18-20 HR; I’d bet we’ll get close to that out of KJ, with a much higher OBP. And Phillips makes at least $22 mil over the next three years (more with escalators), while KJ will probably make less than a quarter of that.
Phillips is a dynamic player and a good defender, but an even swap of KJ for Phillips makes no sense. Agree with whoever said that if KJ was part of a package to get Phillips AND a quality starter, that might be okay. But straight-up? No way.
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 12:11 AM | Link to this
DAP
Not with 171k’s. Not at all, dude….
Wayne
I am trying to get some more thunder in the lineup. Young, not so expensive RH thunder.
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 12:11 AM | Link to this
wayne,
what is going on? i hope all is well.
to answer your question. a trade for peavy would be nice. i think verlander might be available.
as for the F.A’S, derrick lowe is going to go for more then the braves are willing to offer. same for aj burnett.
not to be negative but i think we might here a lot of ” we did not think it was prudent” or “it was not in the best interest of our long term plans.”
we as fans are not stupid. most of us would not have a problem if mgmt. told us we were going young.
what most fans hate is telling us one thing and doing another.
By Wayne
October 4, 2008 12:11 AM | Link to this
I am sorry, but I am not satisfied with our back ups for Chipper and Mac. How would it be to have two guys like Huff and Willingham (or substitute another righty outfielder). that way you can rest each one, and have a backup for Chipper with some pop availabble.
Would the Brewers take Gonzo and Brandon Jones for Corey Hart?
By Deep Throat
October 4, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this
Sigh, more Kelly Johnson debates. That is probably going to be half the offseason talk.
Johnson and Yunel Escobar are both good, solid middle infielders. And all people here do is whine and complain about them. Gosh, what would it be like here if they (Johnson and Escobar) hit more like the league average at their position….or hit like Francoeur? Woah.
By Lew
October 4, 2008 12:32 AM | Link to this
Richie-Dude, You’re spending so much time trying to convince me of-what? That we can put studs at all positions? That we can trade for every player you want and change half the team doing it?
It just beats hell out of me that when Wren sits there and tells everyone (Heard it from DOB, Bradley, Bowman, Terence Moore, and Wren himself in Chop Talk) that the Braves are going to (well, hope to) acquire two veteran starting pitchers and a power hitting outfielder and people just decide that it can’t possibly be so. He tells them Yunel and Kelly Johnson, as well as several stud prospects ( Studs at least in the minds of the Braves) are untouchable and people decide it can’t possibly be so, either. They all of a sudden believe that the Braves will trade everyone they say is untouchable and they will change the right side of the infield to trade for Brandon Phillips (who we don’t need), or Matt Cain (who the Giants swear is off limits and not a veteran), or trade Francoeur, Anderson, BLanco and Diaz so they can bring in Manny Ramirez, or Adam Dunn or God knows who else. Of course those who aren’t free agents will be acquired by trading JoJo Reyes and the Ghost Of Francoeur’s Bat. Hell. Maybe we can just get Coco Crisp or Carl Crawford or half the Rays’ pitching staff.
Dude, it’s the same thing every winter. This blog turns into a letter to Santa Claus and everyone forgets to pay attention to what the people who will make the deals tell them. But what the hell. I’d like Ichiro in center. Maybe we CAN trade JoJo for him. They took Horacio for Soriano, didn’t they?
By Wayne
October 4, 2008 12:35 AM | Link to this
Excellent point on KJ and Yunel DT.
There are so many ways to go for the Braves. Last year, mny of us thought for sure the Braves would send Renteria to the Tigers. What we didn’t know is that JJ would be the man we would get. We all thought it would be Bonderman or Roberston.
We are probably going to be big time surprised this winter. SOOO many ways that they can go.
Somehow, I hope we can get a backup catcher that hits better than 100.
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 12:37 AM | Link to this
i will absolutely puke if the braves spend any money on pat burrell.
the braves had their transition guy in tex.
they traded for him. why not give him the 18-20 million he wanted.
so as we venture into the F.A. market tell me one outfielder’s #’S that would of been better then TEX’S.
so lets get this straight. tex could of been our off season addition.
we will not sign anyone else that will approach his numbers.
that ENTIRE SCENARIO makes me wonder if the braves credibility is waning.
they do have MILLIONS TO SPEND. right?
By Jake
October 4, 2008 12:40 AM | Link to this
Wayne
I agree that we need a better backup for Mac. He really hasn’t had anyone good since he’s been the starter. I think our backups for Chipper are good enough. Infante and Prado don’t hit for much power but they hit for average.
I don’t like that trade of Gonzo and Jones for Hart. First off our bullpen still has a lot of ifs in it. If Smoltz comes back, and we don’t know how Soriano and Moylan will be coming back from surgery. Gonzo will be healthy by Spring Training and really the only one we don’t have questions about. Besides Corey Hart has a lot of holes in his swing. He can’t lay off the sliders. Similar to that of Frenchy and we can’t afford another monumental struggle from an outfielder.
By StuckInThePast
October 4, 2008 12:54 AM | Link to this
I thought the name of the game on offense is to score more than the team you play against or better yet hit the ball in play where the defense isn’t.Chuckie
shows what you know old-timer. . Next to nuthin’.Don’t make outs, you gotta eventually score runs. simple dude. Get outta the 60s and be a knowledgeable fan
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 12:54 AM | Link to this
lew,
my friend from yudys, sons of italy, and steverinos.
please dont get your blood pressure up.
how else will all us good braves fans get updates from your first two week visit to dark star.
believe it or not, or believe, you said it in spring training when you said josh could run.
anybody else think he reminds you of a BIGGER faster STEVE FINLEY?
blanco, who could work the count as well as anybody, does not have andersons’s raw speed.
By Wayne
October 4, 2008 1:00 AM | Link to this
uga I would be ok w Tex.
Lew How bout Chone Figgins for second, move Kelly to left, put Prado on first, and trade Kotchman for Ryan Freel! :0
jake Good points. Got a long drive, and the brain is on overdrive.
I still don’t like Prado and Infante for Backing up Chipper. We need someone with some authority in the 3 hole. KJ could hit there if he was more consistent.
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 1:05 AM | Link to this
Lew I’ve brought up realistic possibilities of players the Braves could acquire to make us competitive again. Maybe you like complaining about how bad the Braves are. I sure enough don’t like the Braves getting beat by the likes of the Mets and Phillies and especially the Ex-Braves(Nats), teams I think we are better than.
This 3 year no playoff crap has robbed me of my dream of going to a Braves playoff game in Atl. I’ve had the luxury/punishment of having to root for my Braves at the now defunct Shea. I am from NYC but that’s a different story.
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this
By StuckInThePast
Old Timer…? LOL, I’m only 32. But the game is simple. It’s only complicated by the stat geeks and those are usually the guys who’ve only baseball on their PCs, and video game systems
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this
why not keep a PROVEN 4 hole hitter.
who are the braves gonna get in left field that is better then him.
so when the frank wren tries to sell us josh willingham or raul ibanez, just ask what was wrong wit TEX FOR 5 years?
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 1:22 AM | Link to this
chuckie,
where from the lower side.
i have been back in forth twice in the last two weeks.
always loved the lower side.
By RMR
October 4, 2008 1:25 AM | Link to this
By StuckInThePast
October 4, 2008 12:54 AM
shows what you know old-timer. . Next to nuthin’.Don’t make outs, you gotta eventually score runs. simple dude. Get outta the 60s and be a knowledgeable fan
Your Name shouldve been IDonthaveaclue
And how do you not make outs? By hitting the ball in play where the defense isnt. It’s that simple. This is what is wrong with the youth today. I am only 32 and know that much. Learn from the 60’s, so you can become a knowledgeable fan
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 1:28 AM | Link to this
every series is 2-0.
we as starved baseball fans would at least like to see a game 5.
By Richie
October 4, 2008 1:29 AM | Link to this
It is safe to say Kendrick cost the Angels this game. That 7th inning AB was just disgusting…Angels are going home guys!!! 100 wins and will be home by next week
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 1:34 AM | Link to this
I live in the Bronx about 10 minutes, by train, away from Yankee Stadium. I weant to a Richmond Braves game back in 83 and have been a fan of the Braves ever since.
Good to meet a fellow NYCer!!!!
By mbatl
October 4, 2008 1:35 AM | Link to this
every series is 2-0…. we as starved baseball fans would at least like to see a game 5.
Maybe four 3-game sweeps would be just the (financial) incentive for MLB to get it’s head out of it’s butt and make the divisions series 7 games.
By THB
October 4, 2008 1:52 AM | Link to this
RMR-Actually, it’s not really difficult at all to understand that drawing a walk is just as good as a single. It is good in every way-works the pitcher, gets you on base, advances runners. Honestly, would you want a team full of Franceour’s or a team full of Kevin Youkilis’s? Franceour has had a season with 29 HR and two seasons with 100+ RBI, but who’d better?
By uga-brave
October 4, 2008 1:57 AM | Link to this
once again, it is not fair to the cubs or the angels.
they won more more games in either league.
they at least deserve a 7 game series.
the fact our atlanta braves advanced to five world series is a credit.
in a short series, it is somewhat about a hot team.
but then again the braves kept running into a hot kevin brown when he was a padre, or a marlin. the big unit and schill when they were d’ backs.
the fact the braves took care of business in the early series at least give us hand over teams like the mets, cubs and everyone that ridiculled us.
it is hard to get there.
By gotigers72
October 4, 2008 2:19 AM | Link to this
Been fun watching ex-Braves play in the playoffs. Glad to see Tex come up big when the spotlight of the playoffs are glaring. I always thought he would, be a big game player, but you never know until someone is given that chance. After all, look at A Rod’s postseason stats. Not pretty. Sorry Tex’s team is down 0-2. I was hoping to get to watch him for some more games, even the World Series. I picked Cubs vs. Angels in the Series in a friendly wager with a friend. Just for a meal, but guess I’d better be searching in the wallet for some scratch. I really can’t believe the Angels. Didn’t they just drill the Red Sox in the regular season? Won 100 games too. They still have somewhat of a chance, but not much of one since the next two are at Fenway. One against Beckett. He has a history of putting teams away in the playoffs.
Furcal and Aybar are also having good postseasons. Aybar had a pretty good regular season. Who did we get from Tampa Bay for him? Nobody? We just released him? Big mistake. I know his off field problems contributed to his release, but he may just turn out to be a playa.
Wasn’t that a beautiful bunt by Furcal? Before I became disabled and was able to go to 6-8 Braves games a year in person, he was my favorite to watch at the game. You cannot tell it by watching television, but watching him in person, he is just a blur running the bases. A FREAKIN’ BLUR! Saw him hit a triple once at the Ted, and he was at third before I blinked my eyes twice. WHEE DOGGIES [Kudos to Jed Clampett] that man can run.
By Judge Ito
October 4, 2008 2:44 AM | Link to this
OJ Simpson going up the river, found guilty on all charges in the Vegas hold-ups, justice finally served
By Robert
October 4, 2008 2:46 AM | Link to this
To whoever said “2 years later, and still nothing new from Robert.”
How about - 17 years later and still nothing new from a team managed by Bobby Cox
By jed
October 4, 2008 3:36 AM | Link to this
every year around this time, i post a long diatribe against the first round of the playoffs being a best-of-5 series. this year will be no different, except that i have a hard time caring enough at this point to make this a long post.
the dodgers are up 2-0 on the cubs, and for all intents & purposes that series is over. same with the angels & red sox. so after 2 playoff games, the teams with the best records in their league, over the course of a 162-game marathon season, are essentially done for.
in a 7-game series, they’d only be a little behind the 8 ball with plenty of time to come back, but with the 5-game series, they’re one game from elimination. is this not ridiculous?
for a game that sells itself on tradition, the 5-game series is a joke. this situation is imminently fixable, but if (bud selig’s) MLB doesnt care about the integrity of its playoffs, then why should we?
By Robert
October 4, 2008 4:20 AM | Link to this
“the dodgers are up 2-0 on the cubs, and for all intents & purposes that series is over. same with the angels & red sox. so after 2 playoff games, the teams with the best records in their league, over the course of a 162-game marathon season, are essentially done for. “
First of all, discrepency in strengths of schedule can make for misleading differences in won-loss records
Second of all - The best teams may win the regular saeason, but the best MANAGED teams win the World Series
By Bill
October 4, 2008 6:36 AM | Link to this
I suggested that the Braves trade for Nick Swisher but was taken to the cleaners by Random. He want’s out of Chicago and had a down year but still managed to hit 24hr’s. He’s a switch hitter and can play the OF and 1st. base. That would be cheapest way to go and spend all resources on pitching. Pitching is going to get you in the playoff’s and hopefully to the WS.
By ncscoots
October 4, 2008 7:10 AM | Link to this
the game is simple. It’s only complicated by the stat geeks and those are usually the guys who’ve only [seen] baseball on their PCs, and video game systems
Spoken like a true stats Luddite. There are plenty of folks in this forum that not only have good eyes but also a brain to go with it. Folks with a rich baseball experience, who can use stats to further analyze the hypotheses developed from that experience (our bud nolie is a great example of it). To impugn such folks as basement-dwelling “stat geeks” shows a colossal and woeful ignorance.
While some of those posters may not be the sabermetric Svengali that is Shaun, they aren’t exactly knuckle-draggers, either. Stick around here long enough, and you’ll find that those very folks are the ones with cred, and worth reading.
And, luckily, ignorance is a curable condition.
By Steve from OH
October 4, 2008 8:30 AM | Link to this
uga-brave (thanks for the compliment btw), I don’t think that offense is necessarily our problem: we’re 6th in the NL in runs scored/game, but we’re 12th in RA/G. Sure, maybe we do need some more power, but we’ll get that in LF and maybe CF if Schafer starts. No need to upgrade power at 2B. No need to “re-invent the wheel,” as they say. Plus, we’ve gotten quite unlucky all year. I mean, look at all the one-run losses (some due to patchwork bullpen) and, at the end of the season, look at all the new and innovative ways we found to lose…nothing went right for us this year. And hitting is only part of the equation. And I hope you didn’t find my last post to be too snarky; wasn’t meant to be.
Frank Wren is taking the team in the right direction, IMO. We need pitching (see above) and we’re going to go after it. We need a power upgrade in a corner OF spot, and Frank is going after it.
Beane? I don’t absolutely love him, but I think he’s got the right idea. Just another smart GM to me. And I seriously doubt that he sees any kind of value in Francoeur at all, unless he still thinks he has room to improve.
Got to have people on base to get RBI, by the way.
Scoots, good post at 7:10
By TommyP
October 4, 2008 8:34 AM | Link to this
Great conversation on here concerning filling some needs.
Mike O.: Wins aren’t the only barometer of a good/great pitcher. C’mon… Bronson Arroyo just won 15 with a 4.77 ERA so just staring at wins is a bit short-sighted.
I say that “Roy isn’t Roy” anymore for a few reasons.
First, his ERA is starting to increase every year. This is probably attributed to the fact that his average fastball velocity has dropped slowly the past few years. With that drop, Oswalt is throwing more breaking balls (not the best thing for the arm).
Next, factor in that though he has great mechanics, scouts have been worrisome of his small frame breaking down over the years.
I’m not sure of all of his injuries but he’s had hip problems, back problems and either last year or the year before he had pain in his left side. (never heard more about that)
Again, Oswalt is still dealing. He’s just not dealing like he used to.
Let’s look at Pedro Martinez who is similar in dominance and physical stature.
In ‘97 and ‘98, he pitched 241 and 233 innings. It drops to 213 and 217 over the next two years and then 116, 199 and 186. He bounced back for two more 200+ innings years but then never again.
I don’t want to pay big time money PLUS a package of prospects for the potential injuries he’s bound to have.
ALSO, can’t remember which poster suggested we go after Scott Olsen but there’s a lot of baggage between the ears with that guy. Not exactly a “Braves type of player.”
If you want to net a young Florida pitcher entering his arbitration years, Nolasco is great but might be tough to nab. Josh Johnson is another with HUGE upside and is cheap and young.
Junichi Tazawa is one of the Japanese pitchers the Braves have been looking at that will probably come over next year. He’s one that doesn’t have to be posted so you only need to worry about signing him.
Reportedly, he throws 97 but that means he’s probably consistently in the low 90s peaking at 97.
Just 22 years old.
By keef1234
October 4, 2008 8:37 AM | Link to this
Considering the last 3 years (are we giving back another 11 to even this “we won the division 14 in a row thing?)did we REALLY need to spend $10 million dollars on the stadium TV screen??? Exactly who signed off on that??? Liberty Media better stick to their promise (which they won’t) that there is NO payroll limit…. Because if they continue to lie, their investment ESPECIALLY WITH TBS NOT SHOWING THE BRAVES NATIONALLY ANY MORE (HUGE MISTAKE)will end up a financial mess and they may end up selling us for less than they paid…Which in the end might be a fantastic deal for Mr Blank… World Series winners can be sold for a lot more than a cellar dweller. Are you listening Liberty Media? Do you EVEN understand baseball? Do you even understand economics? Do you care?
By TommyP
October 4, 2008 8:51 AM | Link to this
Great conversation on here concerning filling some needs.
Mike O.: Wins aren’t the only barometer of a good/great pitcher. C’mon… Bronson Arroyo just won 15 with a 4.77 ERA so just staring at wins is a bit short-sighted.
I say that “Roy isn’t Roy” anymore for a few reasons.
First, his ERA is starting to increase every year. This is probably attributed to the fact that his average fastball velocity has dropped slowly the past few years. With that drop, Oswalt is throwing more breaking balls (not the best thing for the arm).
Next, factor in that though he has great mechanics, scouts have been worrisome of his small frame breaking down over the years.
I’m not sure of all of his injuries but he’s had hip problems, back problems and either last year or the year before he had pain in his left side. (never heard more about that)
Again, Oswalt is still dealing. He’s just not dealing like he used to.
Let’s look at Pedro Martinez who is similar in dominance and physical stature.
In ‘97 and ‘98, he pitched 241 and 233 innings. It drops to 213 and 217 over the next two years and then 116, 199 and 186. He bounced back for two more 200+ innings years but then never again.
I don’t want to pay big time money PLUS a package of prospects for the potential injuries he’s bound to have.
ALSO, can’t remember which poster suggested we go after Scott Olsen but there’s a lot of baggage between the ears with that guy. Not exactly a “Braves type of player.”
If you want to net a young Florida pitcher entering his arbitration years, Nolasco is great but might be tough to nab. Josh Johnson is another with HUGE upside and is cheap and young.
Junichi Tazawa is one of the Japanese pitchers the Braves have been looking at that will probably come over next year. He’s one that doesn’t have to be posted so you only need to worry about signing him.
Reportedly, he throws 97 but that means he’s probably consistently in the low 90s peaking at 97.
Just 22 years old.
By richbrave
October 4, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this
keef1234:
No.
By bighank
October 4, 2008 8:59 AM | Link to this
I’m a first time poster -but have really enjoyed the blog over the past two years.
My approach or orientation is a little bit different - I am looking to see where a francise can make the best investment.
This is a seriously thin free agent group when you look at factors such as age, susceptibility to injury, quality of results. There isn’t much out there that is without some serious risk or major downside. I’m trying to find the blue-chip investments that would allow the Braves to restore the franchise.
Initially, I would focus on the two relatively unflawed free agents in the mix. I would take my money and pay what it would take to land CC and TEX -even if it took most of what I had.
Here’s why - you would be an instant contender again. Not just for the short term, but for the next 5-6 years.
If he could secure both of them, Wren then has the luxury of being able to trade prospects or players like CK and JF to shore up other elements of the team.
OF course, I may not be giving full consideration to other weaknesses - but at least I’ve addressed the big two - an arm and a bat. Plus, I have the wherewithal to deal for more.
Oh, and by the way - if we did sign them, they would both be here while still at their prime when the new wave started to arrive from the farm.
This is a starkly simple approach that gets us back on the right track immediately. There is nothing convoluted about it - FW can do this all he needs is the guts.
By semiballcoach
October 4, 2008 9:09 AM | Link to this
the only thing about campillo in rotation—the playoffs are the time for power pitchers….think about how maddux struggled in the playoffs, and campillo ain’t no maddux
By Lew
October 4, 2008 10:05 AM | Link to this
UGABrave-You’re right, Fellow Dawg, I DO like Anderson and his speed. If only he could learn to slash the ball to the gaps on a regular basis, I would absolutely be in favor of his being our starting CF. However………Not too sure if he will ever become and offensive force. Sorry, but no Spring Training this year. This whole financial mess has me afraid to spend the money, so maybe in 09 when some monthly bills no longer exist.
Chuckie-Maybe I want to complain on how bad the Braves are? Dude, I’m mystified about that comment. First of all I never complained about how bad they were, I was complaining about absurd trade proposals. You must be a relative newcomer here if you think I complain excessively about the Braves. I’m ordinarily known as the biggest Braves’ Homer on the blog and have been for going on my fourth year. I’m known for giving people hell who rake on the Braves here in DOB Land. Obviously you have me confused with my good friend N8 (or Nathan as he used to be known).
By Stuck Is A Dummy
October 4, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this
And how do you not make outs? By hitting the ball in play where the defense isnt. It’s that simple.Stuck
one of the single most stupid things I have ever read. If you actually believe that they can “hit them where they ain’t” on purpose, you are a fool. If they could do that at will, nobody would ever make an out. You need a lot of help learning about how the game actually works dummy. Better study for another 32 years and hope you learn more than in that first 32, dingbat.
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this
THB
You can’t go from 1st to 3rd on a walk but you can on a single.
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this
**By ncscoots
October 4, 2008 7:10 AM | Link to this
the game is simple. It’s only complicated by the stat geeks and those are usually the guys who’ve only [played, is what I meant to say] baseball on their PCs, and video game systems
Spoken like a true stats Luddite. There are plenty of folks in this forum that not only have good eyes but also a brain to go with it. Folks with a rich baseball experience, who can use stats to further analyze the hypotheses developed from that experience (our bud nolie is a great example of it). To impugn such folks as basement-dwelling “stat geeks” shows a colossal and woeful ignorance.
While some of those posters may not be the sabermetric Svengali that is Shaun, they aren’t exactly knuckle-draggers, either. Stick around here long enough, and you’ll find that those very folks are the ones with cred, and worth reading.
And, luckily, ignorance is a curable condition**
It is not ignorant to say that you have to explain baseball in its simplest form. Explain the game of baseball as if you are talking to your kid who is curious as to why we like the game so much. I’ve played baseball for a long time, and all I needed to know on the field, was I had to put the ball in play where defense wasn’t to win the game on offense or get on base somehow and let someone else drive me in. All the extra stuff OPS, OBP & Slugg % is just statistical jargon and gives people stuff to argue over.
By justice may be served
October 4, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
Am I the only one who thinks it’s funny that the Angels are on the brink of elimination…..
Couldn’t happen to nicer mercenary
Go Tex!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By Lew
October 4, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this
BigHank-Dude, welcome to the MIB/BBQ blog.
Your post is one of the more logical ones on trade scenarios that we’ve seen. However, there’s two points that I believe will negate any possibility of the two players mentioned coming to Atlanta.
What this will mean is that Sabbathia will almost certainly command well in excess of $20 mil per year-I would be willing to bet more than $25 mil per would be closer to reality and maybe even as much as $30 mil per (believe me, someone making that figure-likely a pitcher-is coming soon to a theater near you). He is THE elite pitcher in all of baseball, IMO. The Braves will NOT sign him. They won’t be able to afford the price tag.
You’re absolutely right about what their presence would mean to a winning Braves team. You’re absolutely correct when you say their presence would open other trade scenarios. I just don’t believe we will see their presence in Atlanta-at least NOT in the Home Clubhouse.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 4, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this
Ah…Just got back from the Blessing of the Pets. Huh, we were the only ones without a dog!
F.N. Hale and i would be mandating that mccann get his butt in shape.
Here, read this, Duuuude.
Is that to your satisfaction?
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this
**By Stuck Is A Dummy
October 4, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this
And how do you not make outs? By hitting the ball in play where the defense isnt. It’s that simple.Stuck
one of the single most stupid things I have ever read. If you actually believe that they can “hit them where they ain’t” on purpose, you are a fool. If they could do that at will, nobody would ever make an out. You need a lot of help learning about how the game actually works dummy. Better study for another 32 years and hope you learn more than in that first 32, dingbat.**
Well, it is obvious you don’t read that much then. And you never played baseball. You watched all summer but never played, so you’ve got a chip on your shoulder, and so you come on this blog to release all of your pent-up childhood frustration from not being able to play baseball when you were a kid. Ok,I understand. DO you need a hug? We are a support group here too. However, Youth is wasted on the young. Pitiful. It is common sense to know you are going to make outs(because outs can make runs too), and you aren’t going to get a hit every AB. But how do you drive guys in without that formula? Come on dude. I am more than certain coaches are explaining that theory to their kids as we speak.
By Chuckie
October 4, 2008 11:26 AM | Link to this
**By Lew
October 4, 2008 10:05 AM* *I was complaining about absurd trade proposals. You must be a relative newcomer here if you think I complain excessively about the Braves
I am not complaining about them either. I believe we may have both read our blogs out of context. Even Mark Bowman(MLB.COM) has said Kelly and Prado have made themselves attractive trade pieces, whether or not it comes to fruition - who knows. My 1st priority for the Braves has and always is pitching. Good pitching beats good hitting any day of the week. I think we can both agree on that.
Any of the pitchers I spoke about(Oswalt and Olsen) are really attainable. I gathered this from the comments Wren made about having the money and prospects to acquire players. I am not asking for a super or fantasy team, a more complete one - and I think everyone here wants that, including me.
By Lew
October 4, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this
Chuckie-You’ll get no argument from me about Oswalt. The guy is one of the elite pitchers in all of baseball and would be a great addition to the top of our rotation. Hope we could get him without giving up all of our Farm System. Let’s see how The House Wren works the magic this winter. If he can pull off trades similar to the Jurrjens, Infante/Ohman deals of this past off season, life will be good in Atlanta next year. I AM hopeful, as we have not had this much $$$$$$ at our disposal for a decade or more. Hope they spend wisely, though I’d bet they will.
You’re also correct about the possibility of some of the young Marlins pitchers (and Willingham) being available-again hopefully wihout giving up the farm. Seeing as Joe Girardi (someone I will ALWAYS complain about) has already forced the Marlins’ rotation through their various arm surgeries, they should make great pickups. Hopefully by the Braves.
I would not discount a deal in Japan, either. Does ANYONE here have an inkling of who might be available from the Pacific Rim? It’s hard to find info, but it has been reported that the Braves have a large presence in Japan.
BTW-Dude, I was fussing about Richie’s proposal that we HAD to have Brandon Phillips-NOT about anything you proposed. I think we did read one another out of context. It happens. No harm, NO foul, as far as I’m concerned.
The reason I doubt KJ will be traded is that he didn’t just come out of a slump at season’s end, but made an adjustment in his plate approach that led to the great streak. I would be willing to bet (and Wren too, I believe) that Kelly will become an excellent offensive 2B (and likely a better defensive one as well) in 09. He can hit, hit for power and RUN!!!
By Steve from OH
October 4, 2008 12:07 PM | Link to this
Chuckie, can you come up with any criticism of stats other then “well, gee, you’ve never played before, nerd.” If you’ve got a legitimate criticism, I’m all ears. Always have been. But please, don’t say silly things like “you’ve obviously never played before,” which (at least in my case) are as far from the truth as can be.
Look, dude, I agree that you don’t explain the game like that to a kid. I mean, you do want to teach your kid to “play the game the right way,” you know, how to properly run the bases, know the situation, determine pitch selection, etc. I don’t talk in statistical terms in a casual baseball talk to coaches, players, etc. when I’m playing. That’s kinda silly. But in the MAJOR LEAGUES, everyone knows how to do those things, and do them very well. So, it logically follows that you need to come up with OBJECTIVE measures to evaluate performance if you’re a GM. Those are the terms we’re speaking in.
I also think it’s absurd that people say “statistics are stupid, you little nerd boy” (or something like that) and then they promptly cite statistics like RBI and batting average. That just boggles my mind.
Oh, and re: singles vs. walks. It is true that singles offer more potential to advance runners under certain circumstances. Sometimes, a walk and a single are wash. I’ve seen figures that say singles are 10-15% more valuable than walks, which is fine and dandy. But NOT walking and MAKING AN OUT is infinitely more damaging to your team than walking instead of singling. You can’t disagree with that, can you? I mean, the entire point of batting is to not make an out, which, in turn, leads to scoring runs. I don’t see what is so hard to understand about that. Good God….
By The AntiChuck
October 4, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
so you come on this blog to release all of your pent-up childhood frustration from not being able to play baseball when you were a kidNYChuckieCheese
LOL. you couldn’t be more wrong, dude I played from LL thru A ball before getting hurt, and i know damn well that nobody can regularly determine where their ball is going into play. You are the fool who talks a bunch of idealistic crap like you never played at any competitive level above LL or a crappy HS league. If the hitters can do what you claim dodo, why does anyone ever make an out? Get real dude. You been listening to too much play by play crap on tv dude
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
Lew, BigHank: If you guys had heard about three of the dozens and dozens of conversations I’ve heard with various Braves people since the Tex trade, you’d no there was zero chance the Braves would make Tex a free-agent offer this winter, so whether or not he’d listen is entirely moot….
Lew, you know how many people have been predicting there’d be a $30 mill-a-year-player in the near future since A-Rod took the salary bar way past $20 mill nearly a decade ago? Well, how many people have even matched A-Rod’s annual salary since he signed that deal? No one. And it’s been so long, he’s actually signed ANOTHER long-term deal since then.
We’re nowhere near $30 mill a year for any one salary, and as I said, no one else has even approached the average annual salary (25.2 mill) of A-Rod’s FIRST huge deal with Texas, which he signed eight years ago.
By Lawrence
October 4, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this
re why not a 7 games first round series,the answere is money. If the season would be shortened by a week the lost revenuse would be large,15 games x 6 days = 90 games lost. If the average attendance was only 20,000 that’s 1.8 million tickets @ say an average ticket of $20 = 36 million lost to say nothing of parking,and refreshements. The owners do not want to lose that kind of revenue. However if the season were to start a week earlier it could work.Just means some common sense in scheduling, no cold weather cities other then those with domes.
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this
Damn, just noticed that his comment I made at 2 a.m. didn’t make it to the board. I hit post and left the computer. It never showed up.
HERE it is, a little late: hey traded for him. why not give him the 18-20 million he wanted.uga-brave
To begin with, your five-year (length you gave in the other comment) and $18-20 mill per, for a total of between $90 annd $100 mill, wasn’t even CLOSE to being what Teixeira was/is looking for.
Try seven years, $150 mill, and you’ll be a lot closer.
uga-brave, I don’t believe you’re not thinking along same lines as Braves brass on this. Not even close, actually. They are NOT looking to give a five-year, $100 mill (or five-year, $75 mill, for that matter) contract to a LF. They’re going to try to get a power bat who’s signed or will sign for two or three years, until the Braves’ young sluggers are ready, including Heyward at one corner OF and Freeman at 1B.
They’re not looking to give a 5- or 7-year free-agent contract to a power hitter. The biggest money is earmarked for pitching….
On an entirely different note, saw a killer live band tonight, The Walkmen, at the Earl. Place was sold out, and when they launched into “The Rat” the place just about exploded with energy. Lead singer is a helluva performer. How he doesn’t shred his vocal chords in a week is beyond me.
By Bulldog Drummond
October 4, 2008 12:44 PM | Link to this
The Braves finish 20 games out of first.
They finish 12 and a half games out of third
They haven’t made the play-offs in three years.
Yet in DOB’s fanciful world they are an “elite franchise.”
By McFann O –[zz]
October 4, 2008 1:10 PM | Link to this
Bulldog Drummond Yet in DOB’s fanciful world they are an “elite franchise.”
They won 14 straight Division Titles. If that doesn’t make you an elite franchise, I don’t know what does.
By Richie
October 4, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this
Steve
I had no idea I was talking to you. We have agreed on things in the past. I played from HS to Double A ball myself. I also got hurt as well. You know as well as me that as a player you don’t focus on OPS & OBP on the field, just finding a way to get on base or getting the ball in play so it can make something happen. Besides, I watch baseball games with the sound off. I dont need those commentators to over explain what I see on TV. I know a bad game plan at the plate when I see, like Howie Kendrick last night in the 7th with the bases loaded, I didnt need anyone to explain that to me.
By texmex
October 4, 2008 1:43 PM | Link to this
forget about tex - i think kotchman was a great pickup and i think he is going to become a very good player - he was ranked the number 6th prospect in all of baseball in 2005 after hitting like 370 between AA and AAA in 2004 with 313 ABs and is 25 years old and should get those power numbers up..
By Steve from OH
October 4, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this
Richie, my last post was addressed to Chuckie, if that’s what you were talking about. Sorry for the confusion.
But I do agree with the rest of your post. I know that when I was at bat, I wasn’t thinking about padding my OBP or SLG—I was thinking aboutt doing what was best for the team, which, ironically, usually involved getting on base or getting an XBH, or at least moving a runner over or making the pitcher work. All good stuff, and I agree wits you.
Agreed on “knowing a bad game plan when I see one” (paraphrasing) too. That’s what scouting is for. You went to a more advanced level of ball than I did, so I won’t try to explain that one to you, lol.
Hey, I’ll admit, I wouldn’t have bought into the whole stats thing while playing HS ball. But, lo and behold, I do a little reading here and there and voila! it makes perfect sense, from both a playing standpoint and a player eval standpoint. Ask most “statheads” that have both played the game and are rational people and they will tell you that statistical evaluation and scouting go hand in hand (like scoots said in his 7:10).
By richbrave
October 4, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this
texmex:
Maybe take lessons form COACH HOSS.
By AntiChuckie(or Richie as the case may be)
October 4, 2008 2:10 PM | Link to this
But I do agree with the rest of your post. I know that when I was at bat, I wasn’t thinking about padding my OBP or SLGSteve
nobody said anything about thinking about stats while at bat, the idea is to not make an out, preferably with a hit. but if not in any way possible. Seems to me that anybody who claims to have played ball at a pro level would understand that. Stats simply show how successfully you did you job, and to some extent how likely you are to get it done in the future.
By Efrim
October 4, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
Lew
Here is a list of Japanese free agent pitchers, Kuroda is obviously signed, but there are a couple of others:
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/11/ranking-japan-1.html
By Steve from OH
October 4, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this
nobody said anything about thinking about stats while at bat, the idea is to not make an out, preferably with a hit. but if not in any way possible
Right. That’s pretty much the premise behind every single post I make on here. Are my posts really that ambiguous?
By THB
October 4, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this
Chuckie-So what? So the player trying to advance to third can get thrown out, then what? A walk is very good, plain and simple. A hit helps the team out more but a walk is never bad. That’s why I don’t want to get rid of Tyler Flowers. He gets on base more than any player in our system, hits for very good power and has the ability to catch and play first. He is honestly one of our most valuable prospects.
By Lew
October 4, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this
DOB-I agree about Tex not coming back and that’s what I told Hank.
As to the $30 mil plateau-well, let’s just wait and see about THAT one. It may not happen this winter, but I would be willing to bet it’s coming sooner than later. I also would certainly not discount the possibility of CC receiving $25mil-especially if the Yankees get into the negotiations.. As to ARod not receiving that amount-were he five years younger, you never know.
I might be wrong-it’s happened at least one other time (I think), but I get this funny feeling when some Large Spending Teams pull in over 4 million in attendance. That’s lots of Big Bucks and we know that certain teams can’t keep the money in their pockets for long.
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this
Bulldog Drummond, judging from your perspective (immediate only, no context extending beyond a few years), I’m guessing you’re, oh, something younger than middle-aged?
I say this because of perspective. I see the one you displayed often in a lot of neophyte sports fans. And that is not meant as a slap at you, whatsoever. (For all I know, you might be 50 and just have an entirely different perspective on what makes a franchise or program “elite.”)
Anyway, do you really judge “elite franchises” based on this year’s results only, or even the past few years?
If so, then by that criteria, Penn State, Miami and certainly Notre Dame are not even close to being elite football programs (they haven’t won anything important in a lot longer than the past three years).
The Dallas Cowboys aren’t an elite NFL franchise, by that criteria (they haven’t been to the Super Bowl since 1995 and won more than 10 games once since then).
The Los Angeles Dodgers certainly aren’t an elite major league franchise, since they haven’t even won a single freakin’ playoff series in two decades, since winnning the World Series in 1988.
We could go on and on, but my point: Drummond, your view is quite short-sighted, the what-have-you-done-for-me lately, history-means-nothing perspective.
I’ll go back to my “fanciful” world of sports now, where, yes, 14 division titles since 1991 still carries a at least a little cache in determining what is an elite franchise.
I didn’t say they were the present-day Red Sox. Or the Yankees (who apparently no longer are required to win World Series titles to maintain elite status, despite spending more than every other team, every year).
I just said they’re still regarded as an elite franchise, but that they’re slipping and need to get this turned around in the next couple years, to get back to annual postseason appearances.
So, Drummond, are the Dodgers an elite franchise? Tell me which ones are, if the Braves and Dodgers don’t belong in the group.
I’d say the Red Sox, Yankees, Cardinals, Braves, Dodgers are all elite franchises. You could make a case for a couple others, too.
Or, in your world, is it only teams that have won a couple World Series in recent years? If that’s the case, are the Marlins an “elite” franchise, despite terrible attendance and the necessity of blowing up their roster every few years to maintain a tiny payroll?
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this
Lew, A-Rod got a $252-million, 10-year deal in 2001, seven seasons ago. Revenues have exploded across the sport since then, absolutely dwarfing what they were at the time he signed that deal.
Yet no one’s even come close to that contract, and most huge, long-term pitching contracts have not worked out well for teams handing them out.
I, too, think CC could get a deal worth more than $20 mill per year, perhaps for 4-5 years (instead of a seven-year deal at a lower salary).
But it’s a long leap from $20 mill to $30 mill. Maybe it’ll happen, eventually it probably will. But I don’t see it happening for quite some time, and I really don’t see any developments to support the idea it’s going to happen in the forseeable future.
Santana’s salary this year worked out to just under $17 mill, including prorated portion of bonus. That was a deal signed less than 12 months ago, and he’s the highest paid pitcher in the game. You’re suggesting a team would give CC more than $10 mill more per year, less than 12 months later? Sorry, can’t see it.
By Lew
October 4, 2008 4:12 PM | Link to this
DOB-Only time will tell, I suppose. Like I said, I’ve been wrong before. One thing for certain-I’ll never see that kind of money-probably not even the ML minimum. I’ll keep watching though and paying a small percentage of someone’s salary.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 4, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
DOB @ 2:57—
I totally agree with you.
By Ronald Millsaps
October 4, 2008 4:37 PM | Link to this
I read last night that the Braves are considering shopping Kelly Johnson. Don’t do it! Don’t shop him or anyone else, for that matter. This team honestly does not need a trade, so please don’t meddle with a successful core to a team that was hit hard by injuries left and right. Okay, so Atlanta should have approximately $40 million to spend this offseason. What should be done? Re-sign Mike Hampton and Will Ohman. Reacquire Juan Cruz, and acquire Adam Dunn. Potential 2009 lineup: Josh Anderson Casey Kotchman Chipper Jones Adam Dunn Brian McCann Jeff Francoeur (should be a resurgent year) Yunel Escobar Kelly Johnson (do NOT trade this man) Bill Parcells once said that it’s impossible to fix a problem if you don’t identify what the problem exactly is. He’s right. As important as pitching is in the area of winning in baseball, the Braves actually put too much emphasis on it and not enough in terms of overall execution, intangibles, and nowadays, defense (it wasn’t that good this year. Ironically, Mark Kotsay provided one of the few bright spots in this regard, and it’s ironic because of who he replaced and his subsequent scrutiny). Look at last Friday night’s game, which symbolized this entire season: The Braves were down, 4-3, in the ninth and had runners on first and second with no one out. Did they try a double-steal? No. Did a double-play ensue—yet again? Yes. This team simply has not executed the intangibles the way the Phillies and Mets have, as those two teams venture more and therefore gain more, and the Braves’ disappointments on the basepads, obviously, are not the result of injuries to the pitching staff. Trades are not needed. If you want to sign pitchers, fine, but please don’t trade anyone. I like this offensive unit overall, especially with Josh Anderson providing a real leadoff role for this team. No need to take backward steps with trades. Charlie Morton and Jo-Jo Reyes also need to work hard this offseason, especially Reyes, who has a lot of potential but needs to attack the strike zone more aggressively. His not doing so is holding him back. More later… (In the meantime, I’d like to see the moderators do their jobs on here.)
By Nelson
October 4, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this
The first step to solve a problem is to recognize what the problem is. I’m watching the Braves everyday since 1991 and in my opinion (may be I’m wrong), the Braves problems besides pitching are: 1- Our good friend Kelly is a fine baseball player, but unfortunately he is not and never be a good second baseman. He has to be moved to the outfield where he belongs. 2-Said that the Braves could shop either for a good right field or left-field now that they say they have the money, they insist to keep the right field position for Francoeur, I personally don’t believe he is going to be the player they are dreaming about, he is the worst free-swinger I have ever seen in my life. If Pendelton has been unable to fix him in 3 years how comes he will turn around his failure in a few months? Please wake up I won’t swallow that ugly pill, Please!!!. 3-If they don’t want to place Prado or Infante in second (I don’t know why?), then thy need to find a second-baseman. 4- No more Corkys as back-up catchers. 5- Another manager, give Bobby a good job in the organization, he deserves that, but face the reality under Bobby the Braves will never win again, he was a very good manager in the Regular season, I’m saying was because lately he is in love with players and projects that are not working at all. I don’t have to mention that He is the worst in postseason, to be a good one he has to turn around his philosophy all around and play the games like the last one, post season are very short series and you have to win today’s game at any cost, tomorrow we will see, he doesn’t follow that simple rule.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 4, 2008 7:15 PM | Link to this
Boo-yah! The Brewers are winning 2-zip!
By Efrim
October 4, 2008 7:56 PM | Link to this
Blog broken? Or just no one here…
By McFann O –[zz]
October 4, 2008 8:33 PM | Link to this
Efrim—
I think there’s just no one here tonight.
Not that there’s really anything to discuss…other than the glorious fact that the Fillies are losing 3-0.
I gotta split…
By richbrave
October 4, 2008 8:38 PM | Link to this
EFRIM:
Just got back from my grandson’s football game. Wha’s ‘zup?
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 8:39 PM | Link to this
Efrim, I guess no one’ s here.
I just got back from the Le Mans race at Road Atlanta with our man from Ella Guru, Don. He’s a certified gearhead. Dude was out there today from the start of the morning practice and was going to stay all the way until the end of the race, either 1,000 miles or 10 hours.
I went out for a few hours after watching KU escape with a win. Then I bailed on Don when they had what looked like it was going to be a long caution, since they had to rebuild a tire-wall barrier. I was on the bike and didn’t want to get stuck in traffic leaving later.
Pretty cool seeing four classes of cars run four races within the same race. The Peugeot and Audi diesel prototype cars in the top class run almost silently, a very high-tech whoosh going past you if you’re watching along the rail. Then a Corvette or a Ferrari goes thundering by at ear-splitting level, completely different sound.
By Efrim
October 4, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
Yea, Saturday night, figured I would lay low and watch the games tonight. While I did pick the four teams that are up 2-0 to win their series, I didn’t think that they would sweep. If you are an Angel or Cub fan, I feel for you. Braves fans went through it far too often, losing in the first round after having such a good regular season. I really hope some of these teams down 0-2 don’t go down without a fight. It really shouldn’t be this easy.
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 8:59 PM | Link to this
‘Bama got a scare, now Auburn’s getting taken to the wire by Vandy….
By Efrim
October 4, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this
And I must say, John Smoltz is a natural up in the booth. Dude sounds like has been doing this for years.
By ncscoots
October 4, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this
DOB, took in Appaloosa last night. Excellent, though not in the realm of “great”. As good or better than 3:10 To Yuma but not in the class of Unforgiven. High re-watchability, though, worth a buy on the DVD when it comes out.
How does Viggo go from con-man artist to Russian gangster to 1880s gunman, and be totally believeable in all of them from the first minute on the screen, LOL? He’s become reason enough for me to see the movie; not too many I can say that about.
By Steve from OH
October 4, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this
Efrim, I agree on Smoltz. Guy is pretty decent in the booth.
This week’s sign of the apocalypse: Jamie Moyer, at 46, is better than Jamie Moyer ages 24-29. Wierd, huh?
By TheAntiMe
October 4, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
I’m with you, DOB, as far as the Braves needing to get this thing back on track to be able to retain their credibility as one of the best.
A lot of folks say, “All we have to do in the offseason is to sign CC Sabathia and Ben Sheets and we’re on our way.”
For one thing, even if you have the bucks to sign those guys, they actually have to want to come and play for the Bravos. In my heart I feel like every player in the world should want to play for the Braves.
Then my annoying head gets into the act and spoils everything by reminding me that these studs aren’t going to want to come here and play for a team that barely missed finishing last in their own division. That’s why it’s imperative that Frank Wren get this thing turned around ASAP.
As far as Matt Cain goes, DOB, I think it would be dynamite to have him as a Brave. My main concern is that the Giants GM has resisted attempts to this point to make him available for trade. I have a feeling that a trade for Cain would mean either trading our best offensive player (Brian McCann) or seriously depleting our farm system of offensive prospects or both.
I believe the Braves will take a shot at signing Derek Lowe but with the market being sort of bare in starting pitching free agents this winter it may be a tough job to get Lowe to sign with the Braves.
I do have confidence in Wren, however, so I am keeping my fingers crossed. I could be wrong (and often am) but I think we have a much better chance at signing Derek Lowe than we do of acquiring Matt Cain from SF.
In any case, I do believe that when spring training 2009 comes that we will be pleasantly surprised with what our GM is able to come through with for the Braves over the winter.
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this
ncscoots, if it’s as good as 3:10 to Yuma, that’s plenty good for me. I really liked 3:10 to Yuma….
By David O'Brien
October 4, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
Victorino’s bush-league play cost his team a run there. What a dumba$#. Didn’t even try to slide, just tried to take out Counsell standing up. Good for Sveum to bring it to the ump’s attention (and Smoltz, for calling Victorino’s move “unprofessional” even before the run was erased).
By Efrim
October 4, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this
Good job by the Brew Crew. Things could get very interesting if they can push this back to Philly. Hamels-Sabathia Game 5 would be worth the price of admission, that is for sure.
By Deep Throat
October 4, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this
The thing is though, the San Diego Union-Tribune says Peavy has told the Padres he would refuse to waive his no-trade clause for a trade to an AL team. If true, the Red Sox and Yankees would be out of it.
Of course, I think it is all moot. The Padres are not trading Peavy. It is nice to dream but Jake Peavy a Brave in 2009 is not happening.
By ObiWanKobe
October 4, 2008 10:29 PM | Link to this
USC appears to have righted the ship…
By Braveheart
October 4, 2008 10:33 PM | Link to this
Yeah, Bama didn’t look very good today but a win is a win is a win…… and Auburn lost, so today was a good day.
Scoots, ever seen Viggo play a Latino gangster in Carlito’s Way? Damn good job in that movie. Because of that movie, I never call him Viggo. I always call him Lalin. Let him effin’ kill me! Eff you! Kill me, you mofo! Look what I got! I mean, look at me! You got everything! I mean, come on! Look what I gotta friggin’ go around with: Freakin’ diapers! I got friggin’ diapers! I crap in my pants every day! I can’t walk, I can’t hump. Go ahead and kill me, you sucker! They made me do it, or they send me back. I’m no good in the joint. I’m in an effin’ wheelchair.
By Kentavo
October 4, 2008 10:55 PM | Link to this
I can’t wait ‘til someone clocks Victorino.
It will come.
By Braveheart
October 4, 2008 11:12 PM | Link to this
Kimbo goes down!
By Otis!
October 4, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
If he didn’t die young, Otis Redding would have been considered one of the greatest singers on the last century. He was absolutely brilliant.
By nolie
October 5, 2008 12:00 AM | Link to this
ever seen Viggo play a Latino gangster in Carlito’s Way? BH
yup yup, great movie and great acting job. I though Sean Penn was awesome in it too. Almost unrecognizable.
By nolie
October 5, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this
**Worst To First
Mississippi overcomes slow start to win SL crown**
By Bill Ballew, Baseball America October 3, 2008
ATLANTA—One of the more remarkable turnarounds this season occurred in the Southern League. The Mississippi Braves overcame a Double-A worst 2-15 start in April to win the Southern Division’s second half before taking the league title.
While improved starting pitching with the promotions of righthanders Tommy Hanson and Deunte Heath and the shift of righthander Kris Medlen from the bullpen to the rotation were keys to the reversal of fortunes, the primary constant was the performance of 23-year-old righthander Todd Redmond. He helped keep the M-Braves’ heads above water with a 4-0 performance in May and a 5-1 mark in his last nine outings.
Redmond then set the tone in the postseason by tossing eight shutout innings in Game One of the SL divisional series. He finished the year 13-5, 3.52 with 133 strikeouts and 33 walks in 166 innings.
“We started off so bad, but we never gave up,” said Redmond, who was named the SL pitcher of the year. “Our starting pitching started to improve, then our hitters started to warm up. Everything started to click and we decided as a team that we were going to do everything we could to make the playoffs.”
Redmond endured a difficult 2007 campaign with the Pirates at high Class A Lynchburg, going 7-12, 4.54. Pittsburgh had concerns about his lack of aggressiveness with his fastball and traded the 2004 draft-and-follow pick to the Braves during spring training for righthander Tyler Yates.
M-Braves pitching coach Derek Botelho moved the 6-foot-3, 210-pound Redmond to the left side of the rubber, which improved his mechanics. As a result, he began getting ahead in the count, enabling him to throw all of his pitches at any time. Mixing his 90 mph fastball with a good curveball and a solid changeup, Redmond pounded the zone and wound up tying for the SL strikeout lead.
“Things were a little shaky my last year with the Pirates, but I couldn’t be more pleased with the way things are going right now,” Redmond said.
Wigwam Wisps
• Hanson and first baseman Freddie Freeman were named the Braves’ minor league pitcher and player of the year, respectively. Hanson fanned 163 batters in 138 innings between high Class A Myrtle Beach and Mississippi, while Freeman paced the farm system with 95 RBIs while hitting .316/.378/.521 with 18 home runs at low Class A Rome.
• Righthander Matthew Small was suspended 50 games after testing positive for an amphetamine. A nondrafted free agent signed in 2007, Small was 1-2, 2.55 in 13 relief outings at Rookie-level Danville.
By uga-brave
October 5, 2008 12:30 AM | Link to this
DOB.
HOW about vandy?
the cubs are done.as a braves fan, like wayne said casey blake would work.
we dont need josh willingmam.
we already have jeff francoeur.
i think the hope for him to get better is a total wish.
francoeur, still thinks he is in the world baseball classic.
a .239 .ops is great jeff.
if you would of hit a lick with the bases loaded the season might of been different.
By uga-brave
October 5, 2008 12:38 AM | Link to this
BRAVHEART’
THAT
By ccrider
October 5, 2008 12:56 AM | Link to this
Deep Throat; I couldn’t disagree with you more. I think one of the most logical spots for Peavy to land is in Atlanta. Kevin Towers knows with the payroll limits he faces that it will be years before he can rebuilt to compete with the Money of the Dodgers and the talented youth of Arizona. The beginning of that rebuild is trading Peavy for young talent. Also, if you didn’t know, Peavy grew up a Braves fan and has total approval this year as to who he can be traded to. He has stated he would only approve a trade to a national league team. There are very few teams in the National league with the money, prospects and reputation for competing that Peavy would approve a trade to. The Braves would be one of a very few near the top of that list and Peavy has final approval! The Braves have plenty of high end pitching and position prospects or a few players on the major league roster to trade without including the prospects Frank Wren said he wouldn’t discuss. I think Peavy would be the first trade target for the Braves and I think it is a very realistic possibility.
By uga-brave
October 5, 2008 1:00 AM | Link to this
fwell i guess i should end that rant WW.
for anyone that posts here.
braveheart, steve from ohio, shaun, lew, and scoots. are the best posters on this blog.
DAP has his momwents.
dap, i like you, you argue your points.
either way flange asked me once about the stock market.
i called bear, called lehman.
for all that i did not see wachovia they own AG EDWARRDS.
evryones money is safe. the fdic jacked it up to 250.
By uga-brave
October 5, 2008 1:10 AM | Link to this
well at least dero showed up.
guess what it is harder then everyone thinks. the five gsme series is bullcrsp.
the cubs and the angels deserve better.
By N Nine
October 5, 2008 1:13 AM | Link to this
Smoltz, for calling Victorino’s move “unprofessional”
I call that Getting victorinoed
Crazy! All four teams facing 0-2 hole.
I bet one will prevail
Shocking. How are Cubs done?(last inning)
DOB i was with you on Cubs-Angels TIX
It’s a sexy pick featuring- two best teams
It would be nice if you can offer us your “revised” world series prediction.
By Jake
October 5, 2008 1:14 AM | Link to this
Cubs are done already. Swept out. Thank God I’m not a betting man.
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 1:20 AM | Link to this
DAMMIT dodgers sweep the cubbies…useless f*ing cubs! Now i am stuck with at least one more series of the dodgers…and find myself facing the posibility of pulling for the phillies…UGH
By StingerSplash
October 5, 2008 1:25 AM | Link to this
Make that … 101 years.
By keylargo
October 5, 2008 1:27 AM | Link to this
For those people who are so critical of the Braves for winning only one WS in their fourteen year run, the Cubs and Dodgers are exhibit one.
You could start with a seven game series.
By N Nine
October 5, 2008 1:27 AM | Link to this
With the Cubs getting destroyed in this fashion, their plans might get altered. Isn’t Rich Harden a free agent? Maybe we can get the injury prone dude! Have Harden/Hampton in one rotation spot. Ok i agree this is a far fetched idea.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 1:29 AM | Link to this
anybody catch Manny’s foot-in-mouth, oh-no-he-didn’t-say-that moment during the postgame interview with Verducci? He’s asked how the Dodgers got it turned around after that losing skid they were on in August, etc, and Manny says something trivial, then looks over at someone off-camera and says (I’m paraphrasing here, but this was the gist of it): “You have to thank Scott for getting me here.”
Wow. Scott Boras had to have winced and/or cringed when he uttered those words (and it takes a lot to make Scott Boras cringe).
Folks in Boston are going to have a field day with that comment. After the Red Sox accused Boras of orchestrating the whole Manny thing but couldn’t prove it, Manny makes that comment. Manny being Manny. Gotta love it.
By N Nine
October 5, 2008 1:38 AM | Link to this
DOB maybe boras will sell TEX to boston cheap to make up for that manny being manny comment!
By uga-brave
October 5, 2008 1:44 AM | Link to this
flange,
it will be worse before it gets better.
that beiing said the volatity index is approaching 50. BUY THAT.
BUY the spx 500.
please buy the usd. the numbers on the supper long semi conductor index is easy money.
guys i am not that smart, but the usd’s are easy money.
the semi conductor index is at a huge bottom.
i am long and strong. this is how wealth is built.
guys, this is easy money. bet on the etf that it is the SMH’S
I MAY be a somewhat intoxicated, but i am pretty sure this etf will work.
BUY THE USD’S
By Richard Simmon's Sweatin' to the Oldies
October 5, 2008 2:08 AM | Link to this
“Tom Glavine has talked to McCann about the importance of getting in better shape, and bench coach *Chino Cadahia *delivered the same message during a conversation he had with the young catcher on Saturday”
Yeah, I want a guy named Chino with a BIF (Butt in Front) telling me how to get in shape
By Brian
October 5, 2008 2:40 AM | Link to this
ugabrave- The Cubs deserved better? WHAT? F*** the Cubs and their rude, stupid a* fans!! They got exactly what they deserve and I hope it’ll be another 100 years before they win s**!! F*** Shane “midget” Victorino too, cause if I’m Counsel, I’d knock that ugly little turds teeth down his throat!!
By Brian
October 5, 2008 2:47 AM | Link to this
DOB- That Manny comment shows the dudes got some screws loose and how Boras is has got pure evil ruuning through his veins! EEEEWWWW, and that’s Lowe’s agent? I didn’t know that until a couple of days ago. He’s gonna be about 15-16 mill. this winter. No less than that
By uga-brave
October 5, 2008 3:18 AM | Link to this
brian,
i agree, the cubs fans are gone,
they are bye bye.
cubs fans are right there with the SOX fans.
By Ronald Millsaps
October 5, 2008 3:19 AM | Link to this
Manny Ramirez should get $20 million rock-bottom. People give this man a hard time, and though he is a disorganized individual in many ways, he gets the job done, and he can hit in clutch situations, too.
By N Nine
October 5, 2008 3:37 AM | Link to this
The answer to our glaring need is sitting there shining at us. Padres need to lower payroll. PEAVY! I’m convinced we need to pull this deal off. Change: Peavy-Braves’09
By Lew
October 5, 2008 4:17 AM | Link to this
UGABrave-We’ve had our retirement portfolio with TIAA-CREF for the last 23 years or so. Got out of most of the Mutual Funds a few years back, even though they had no investments in sub-prime. Been mostly in Real Estate (they have an incredible RE portfolio). Can’t wait to see how those Inflation Linked Bonds are doing.
By Dem Bums
October 5, 2008 4:48 AM | Link to this
As a Dodgers fan, Dave, I know I sure love Manny being Manny.
By gotigers72
October 5, 2008 4:56 AM | Link to this
DOB - Do you ever freakin’ sleep? Always at a concert, car race, at a movie, at a ballgame or watching one on the tube, riding your motorcycle with the wind in your hair and bugs in your teeth. Go to all of the great cities in America. What a life you lead my friend. That’s the way to do it. Live life to it’s fullest. You can sleep when you die, right?
Yes, I’m envious. I used to be like that in my 20’s, somewhat. Not the way you go at it though. Saw some great concerts, lots of movies, traveled a good bit, even got to see Henry Aaron hit a few big flies. [He was great fielder too, so graceful] Then I got married, had kids, then grandkids. All of that slowed me down some, but not until I became disabled [5 years ago] did I really slow down. Now to even go to a movie, I have to pop a pain pill or suffer the consequences. At least I’m not pushing up daisies yet. I have 7 year old twin grandsons and that alone makes it worth staying above ground. I have been able to see them grow up. This year they played T-ball. What a hoot! Very funny. Even though Grandpa walks funny and slow and has gray hair, that doesn’t matter at all to them. They still love him. Have to look a little more, but there is still “JOY” to be found.
So please continue to go balls to the wall and blog about it. That way guys like me can live vicariously through you. You still get to have all of the fun, but get to share it also. Pedal to the metal DOB!
I’m going to see Appaloosa on Monday with my brother. Was already looking forward to it ‘cause I love Westerns. But coming on here tonight and reading all of the posts about it has me [pun intended], chomping at the bit.
As far as Victorino, I said he was a dirty player and he continues to prove that fact. He better look out or he will be “Pitched inside” a whole lot, if you know what I mean. At least it cost his team tonight. It didn’t cost him OR his team when he lowered his shoulder and ran over McCann. Cost McCann and his team though. Lots of people said that was just ‘playing hard’, but I thought it was dirty. Maybe because my position in high school was catcher.
By Coach (Skip will be missed)
October 5, 2008 5:50 AM | Link to this
I keep hearing names like C.C. Sabathia, Derek Lowe, Jake Peavy and Ryan Dempster cussed and discussed here in the blog.
It makes me wonder if people are really paying attention or just lip service.
Quick, name the only 20 game winner who is eligible for free agency without referencing the internet.
That’s right, he went 20-9 with an ERA of 3.37. With twenty-one quality starts, 200 innings of work and didn’t miss one start and he is going to the Hall of Fame.
Better go look before your brain melts.
O yea, about Jake Peavy. I got news for the baseball universe, his elbow is about to explode. The guy misses 26 games at the age of 27 with a tender elbow and just 1,260 innings under his belt. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure it out. Poor mechanics + violent delivery = T.J surgery real soon.
By TommyP
October 5, 2008 7:24 AM | Link to this
Coach: Mussina. Are you endorsing we go sign him?????? Just wondering….
While I love Peavy, I’d go after Chris Young from staff.
He’s affordable for several years, very effective, and wouldn’t cost a King’s ransom to acquire like Peavy would/should.
I know everyone wants that “ace” but we already paid “ace-price” with the Tex deal.
By TommyP
October 5, 2008 7:32 AM | Link to this
Word is that the D’backs might deal Conor Jackson due to their glut in the OF.
They have Chris Young, Upton, Dunn and Byrnes (who will be tough to deal with that salary).
This won’t be popular with the masses but I’d LOVE to get Jackson from them. He’s on the verge of busting out big time and shouldn’t cost a ton.
Add a Yusmeiro Petit to the deal and sign one FA pitcher and you still should have money left over.
By Crap-Wheelie
October 5, 2008 7:48 AM | Link to this
I’m so happy the Cubs lost. I really have nothing against the team. BUT I can’t stand their obnoxious fans. And to be swept when they were supposed to make the Series, that’s sweet!
Maybe some teams are finally realizing what Braves fans have known for a decade: In the age of the Wild Card, the playoffs are a crap shoot. You can have the best team in the world and still not make it to the Series, much less win the Series because of that damned five-game opener.
By JC from UT
October 5, 2008 7:57 AM | Link to this
TOMMYP: What are you offering to AZ to get Connor Jackson?
By NickC
October 5, 2008 8:05 AM | Link to this
The Dbacks would just move CoJack back to 1st.
If he wasn’t on the table for a Tex deal, I don’t see how he’d be on it for prospects.
By TommyP
October 5, 2008 8:12 AM | Link to this
JC from UT: Depends on what they are looking for. :)
They don’t appear to be looking for starting pitching as the Unit will probably re-up with them and Scherzer will join the rotation.
Every position appears to be set for them aside from 2B. Not sure if they’re going to offer a deal to Hudson.
I think the Braves might have to go the 3 team trade route, honestly. We have some prospects to deal but not sure we have major league pieces we’re looking to peddle away.
By TommyP
October 5, 2008 8:15 AM | Link to this
NickC: Tracy is at first.
Article in the Arizona paper said they’re tired of waiting on him and have no place for him.
By richbrave
October 5, 2008 8:30 AM | Link to this
uga-brave:
Gotta’ say FRANCOUER took us out of a lot of games. Not that others didn’t contribute, but it appeared that opposing teams would actually put men on to get to FRENCHY.
By JC from UT
October 5, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this
I think we are going to see some kind of combination of Francouer plus prospects or KJ plus prospects going to KC for a package with either Grienke or Brian Bannister involved. We may even be getting Jose Guillen back, who is going to be the stop gap until Heyward gets here.
DOB: What are the chances we see either Hanson or Kris Medlin in the rotation some time in 2009. Do you think either can crack the rotation out of spring training? Also is there any chance in that Shafer actually becomes the left fielder and Gorkys is the CF of the future?I’ m not saying in 2009 but maybe Shafer in 2009 and Gorkys up i 2010? Or do you think one of them will be used as bait?
By Efrim
October 5, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this
Wow. Cubs got swept. How about Alfonso Soriano’s career playoff line:
.213/.264/.299 line in 174 career playoff at-bats
136 million dollars……
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
the semi conductor index is at a huge bottom.
i am long and strong. this is how wealth is built.
guys, this is easy money. bet on the etf that it is the SMH’S
I MAY be a somewhat intoxicated, but i am pretty sure this etf will work.uga-brave
Is this how the Oracle of Omaha got started?
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this
JC: Yes, sure there’s a chance we could see Hanson and/or Medlen in the rotation in 2009 (though if we see both, that will probably not be a good thing, as it would likely result from multiple injuries to Braves starters).
Don’t know how it would work, but I can see Schafer and Gorkys in the same outfield, too, long as the Braves have power at the other spot. By the way, HGH talk aside, Schafer could end up hitting 20 homers a year, possibly more. He’s got enough power to do that, and he’s still young and developing physically.
Could one end up trade bait? Anything can happen, man. You’re talking about years down the road. So much could depend on whether Francoeur bounces back in 2009. Just too many variables at play.
By Lew
October 5, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this
DOB-Have you heard anything about the new Pretenders’ CD due out in a couple weeks? They were running numerous commercials on VH1 Classic yesterday and the few clips they played sounded kickin’ in the extreme. I’m looking forward to hearing it all.
By Lew
October 5, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
Another musical item-The new Joan Baez (yes, I can hear the moans now), which I have not heard, was produced by Steve Earle. I wonder how he influenced the CD.
By ppaddy123
October 5, 2008 11:51 AM | Link to this
Guys and Gals…. as a casual “Man in Black” blog reader and sometimes poster, but die hard Braves fan…..I wonder how a player like Pete Rose would fare with all the stat heads, if Pete was a prospect. Pete Rose was a singles hitting machine but never an RBI guy. When he first came up, the Reds weren’t even sure where they would play him. What he brought to the Reds can’t be measured.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
So, I hear the Reaper made a bone-headed move last night that cost the Fillies a run. HAHA!!
From the Filies website…Shane Victorino never slid. Instead, he ducked his head and rammed directly into Brewers second baseman Craig Counsell, knocking him backward as he received Bill Hall’s throw…
Never slid? “Ducked his head and rammed directly into” him? Hmm-hmm…Where have I seen that before?
Oh yeah! It was in Filly…same guy, too. Huh…must just be his “thang”.
Feels strange that there’s no game today…first Sunday without my Braves. I feel like I should be sittin’ here in my jersey, lookin’ at the starting lineup. Dangit…
This week went by slow, BTW.
By Steve from OH
October 5, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this
ppaddy123, as a statistics enthusiast and general baseball lover, I can say that I would have loved Pete Rose had things like EqA been around during his time. That’s not to say that I didn’t love ol’ Charlie Hustle already, though.
Case in point: Rose career OBP: .375 (good), and was even higher during his prime. Had six seasons w/ and OBP above .400. That’s awesome. He did have a career SLG over .400, which isn’t too terrible, esp. for a middle infielder.
Career EqA?: .293, which is also quite good. Throw in 4000+ career hits, and you’ve got one of the game’s all-time greats.
He wasn’t too shabby in the minors, either.
It’s too bad that he gambled on baseball.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 12:15 PM | Link to this
Whoo-hoo! Just watched the replay of that DP! Yee-haw! The look on the Reaper’s face!
Oh man, what cann I say? GO BREWERS!!
I’d watch your game, but we’re gonna be headin’ out momentarily—that is, any minute now.
BEAT THEM FILLIES!!
By Steve from OH
October 5, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this
Oh, and Corky Miller, Vladimir Nunez, and Ruben Gotay were outrighted off the 40-man the other day. Since they all have enough minors service time, they’re all free agents, I believe.
By mbatl
October 5, 2008 12:26 PM | Link to this
ppaddy123, Rose spent the vast majority of his career hitting 1st or 2nd… I don’t think RBI was his priority, or the team’s. He scored a ton of runs, had a great OBP (brought down a little in his later years)… didn’t strike out much. And in his prime had respectable power.
Also, had the versatility to play at least 579 games at five different positions (1B, 2B, 3B, LF, RF). Pretty amazing. He was not a good base-stealer, and would probably be just about the perfect “2-hole” hitter today.
I don’t like the guy personally, but I think his skills would be highly valued, even in today’s stat-minded baseball world.
By Braveheart
October 5, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this
ppaddy123, Joe Posnanski wrote a good article about Jeter vs. Rose:
http://joeposnanski.com/JoeBlog/2008/09/15/rose-vs-jeter/
By Braveheart
October 5, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this
Joan Baez is still alive? How many records must not be sold before they call her done?
By Steve from OH
October 5, 2008 12:53 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, that was an excellent article you linked above.
Even if you say they were approximately equal offensively, Rose’s defense and versatility definitely put him over the top, for me at least.
By nolie
October 5, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this
Even if you say they were approximately equal offensively, Rose’s defense and versatility definitely put him over the top, for me at least.*Steve Ohio8
yeah i guess you are right, but I hate to admit it. The guy was such a total azzwhole and bully his entire life on and off the field. Used to run into him a good bit in the souther Ohio area in 70s and he was always a total jerk to everybody. The only people he was remotely ok with were total suck-ups and he usually bullied them. What a colossal ego.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this
Lew, the Pretenders CD is coming out Tuesday, and I’ve heard some very promising things about it. Love that band, and it’d be great to see them come back with a strong record (last couple were so-so).
Lucinda Williams’ new one is out Oct. 14. And by the way, saw a good review of that Baez CD. I’ve heard nothing from it, but she covered some great tunes on this one, and as you note, Earle produced it.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 1:10 PM | Link to this
Never slid? “Ducked his head and rammed directly into” him? Hmm-hmm…Where have I seen that before?
Oh yeah! It was in Filly…same guy, too. Huh…must just be his “thang”.McFann
One play was at the plate, the other at second base. Very big difference. You slide to break up a double play. You can slide hard to take the guy out, but you don’t run in standing up and take him out.
Barreling through a catcher is part of the game, if he’s blocking the plate. Some don’t want to accept that when it’s their player being barreled over, but it’s part of the game.
By Steve from OH
October 5, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
nolie: yeah, but what can you do? Some people are just like that (sadly). He’s sure getting his comeuppance now, eh?
By Braveheart
October 5, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this
Jeter is not a good defensive SS but I think he would have been a great defensive centerfielder. He just doesn’t have the catlike agility needed to a be a great defender at SS. I disagree with Posnanski saying Jeter wasn’t really fast. Jeter had really good sprinting speed that would have benefited him in center. There’s a huge difference between speed and agility. I think Jeter had the speed of a good wide receiver that a great defensive outfielder needs but didn’t have have the agility skills of a cornerback that a great defensive middle infielder needs.
If you think about Jeter’s two most famous plays, they came when he was in full sprint mode. And he is also well known for being good about going after flyballs in the outfield. So I’m not sure I could agree that Rose was a better defender because Jeter’s speed and arm likely would have made Jeter a much better defensive outfielder than Rose. And can you imagine how limited Rose’s range would have been at short since he had neither the agility or speed or arm of Jeter?
But I never saw Rose play until the last five years when he was a washed up fat arse who wouldn’t let go, so I really can’t say much about who would have been a better defender or hitter.
By TexasBrave
October 5, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this
DOB I am trying to wrap my brain around a question I have been pondering for a while. I know the Braves and their fans (myself included) want to get back to our winning ways and into the playoffs again. But do we really have enough key people in place to make a serious push. You have been writing that two starters and a power hitting LF would get us back, but I have to wonder whether more may be needed in order to make another strong run next year. To me there are to many “If’s” out there to be sure that three key players are all we need.
Who play’s center? I know you say Schafer, but to me he needs a little more time in the minors or are we to let him get his seasoning with the big club and hope he comes around sooner or later to help the offense?
Will Frenchy, Escobar, Johnson and Kotchman find any sort of consistancy? Will Chipper give us at least 130 games next year or are we going to have to suffer with Prado and Infante, and when I say suffer obviously they are good hitters but they are not Chipper at the plate nor in the field.
Not to mention the problems in the pen especially if we don’t resign Ohman.
With so many question marks what would be the harm in adding to the Braves as the farm system produces players. Wren indicated we have good players on the way. Why not let the Glavine’s, Smoltz’s and Chipper’s in our farm system develope bring them up, then get ready for another long run. Yes this method will take time. But it seems to me a better way of doing things than trying to reload each year and then banging our heads when things go south.
By BossLady
October 5, 2008 2:10 PM | Link to this
Phillies, (NL East) ahead
Falcons MFL (South) ahead
Oh what a day for my area teams.
What, Manny was not free to negotiate and talk trade with the Dodgers? I don’t see what Scott and Manny did wrong.
In America, if you want to leave your employment with any corporation you go out and look for future employment. If he had been in a contract that could not have happened without BSox involved too. This is a huge country with tons of money and opportunity.
Go Phillies, Go Falcons!!!!!!
By TexasBrave
October 5, 2008 2:11 PM | Link to this
DOB I am trying to wrap my brain around a question I have been pondering for a while. I know the Braves and their fans (myself included) want to get back to our winning ways and into the playoffs again. But do we really have enough key people in place to make a serious push. You have been writing that two starters and a power hitting LF would get us back, but I have to wonder whether more may be needed in order to make another strong run next year. To me there are to many “If’s” out there to be sure that three key players are all we need.
Who play’s center? I know you say Schafer, but to me he needs a little more time in the minors or are we to let him get his seasoning with the big club and hope he comes around sooner or later to help the offense?
Will Frenchy, Escobar, Johnson and Kotchman find any sort of consistancy? Will Chipper give us at least 130 games next year or are we going to have to suffer with Prado and Infante, and when I say suffer obviously they are good hitters but they are not Chipper at the plate nor in the field.
Not to mention the problems in the pen especially if we don’t resign Ohman.
With so many question marks what would be the harm in adding to the Braves as the farm system produces players. Wren indicated we have good players on the way. Why not let the Glavine’s, Smoltz’s and Chipper’s in our farm system develope bring them up, then get ready for another long run. Yes this method will take time. But it seems to me a better way of doing things than trying to reload each year and then banging our heads when things go south.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave, I don’t know that there is anything wrong with your way of doing it. But it’s not the way the Braves are approaching it. So we can debate which way is best, but really, is there a point? By that I mean, do you think they’re going to be persuaded to abandon their plan, to decide you (and some others) are right and that they should plan for the future and write off next season as a rebuilding year?
Because really, TexasBrave, you don’t think there’s any chance they’re going to do that, do you, after spending countless hours in organization meetings, re-signing Cox for another year, and in Wren’s second year as GM, you don’t think they’re just going to go, “Scrap those plans to compete next year, let’s aim for the future,” do you?
I’ve got to spend the majority of my work trying to chronicle what they’re actually doing, the moves they’re making this season, not what some believe they should do. That’s the beat reporter’s job, to report on what the team’s doing. Sure, we can blog all we want about what they should do, but understand, this course has been determined. They’re moving forward with their plans for next season, not taking suggestions or polls to determine a proper course.
By Daybed Wagmoe
October 5, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this
Don’t know if this has already been posted, but a friend passed this along. Looks like Frank Wren is making sure that he explores all possible options:
Craigslist Posting: Wanted - Starting Pitcher for the Atlanta Braves
By ncscoots
October 5, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
Why not let the [kids] in our farm system develope bring them up, then get ready for another long run. Yes this method will take time.
Will Frenchy, Escobar, Johnson and Kotchman find any sort of consistancy?
TB, do you not find a little humor in having those two notions in the same post, LOL? Of the four you mention, only Francoeur has as many as 1500 ML ABs. If developing kids in the minors “will take time”, why would the expectation be any different for the players you mention? They are basically learning on the job; shouldn’t they also be given the benefit of time?
Or, turning the premise around, is the expectation that current minor leaguers such as Heyward, Freeman, heck, ALL of the “new wave”, will NOT struggle at some point early in a ML career? I fear that would qualify as “unlikely”.
Most inexperienced players struggle at some point. Nature of the beast, but, talent will out. Usually does, anyway. What torques me ofttimes is the impatience of fans (not you, but plenty of others here) in expecting a talented kid to play like a five-year vet from the get-go. And when that doesn’t happen (news flash), some are ready to kick the player to the curb, regardless of talent level.
And then raise the cry of “let’s go young!”, oblivious that the Braves have been doing exactly that for the last three years.
By ppaddy123
October 5, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
OK OK OK……. I gave you stat guys enough rope……the point I was making about Pete Rose was: WHAT HE BROUGHT TO THE GAME CAN’T BE MEASURED BY STATS ALONE …….whether you liked the guy or not…..he made every team he was on BETTER
This is what the Braves as a team need…………a guy that makes them better. Gives them attitude….whatever. Say what you want about Manny Ramirez, the Dodgers are a better TEAM because of him. He brought a swagger and confidence to a team in dire need of it. Does his act get old? Absolutely….but right NOW….it’s what they needed.
The Braves have always been considered a professional organization. When someone rocks the boat (like a John Rocker) they get rid of them. It keeps them consistent, regular if you will. Now might be the time some irregularity. We might need a year of rocking the boat to get back to where we belong.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this
This paragraph from Posnanski’s very good article on Dayton Moore and the Royals would not seem to portend any possibility of a Francoeur trade to K.C. (a guy like Kelly would seem much more in this mode):
“We have to understand the importance of on-base percentage,” Moore says, and he repeats those words — “on-base percentage” — about 29 times during the interview, which is good to hear. The last five years, the Royals have finished 12th, 13th, 11th, 13th and 13th in on-base percentage, and frankly it’s really, really hard to score a lot of runs when you can’t get on base (especially when you do not have much power — and the Royals don’t. Plus they play in a big ballpark).
By nolie
October 5, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, that was an excellent article you linked above.Steve
yeah it was. Thanks BH. I am a big Poz fan but I missed that one.
By mbatl
October 5, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
This is what the Braves as a team need…………a guy that makes them better. Gives them attitude….whatever. Say what you want about Manny Ramirez, the Dodgers are a better TEAM because of him. He brought a swagger and confidence to a team in dire need of it. Does his act get old? Absolutely….but right NOW….it’s what they needed.
paddy, the Dodgers are better with Manny because he’s hit .396/.489/.743 with 17 HR in 53 games with them. Give me Stuart Smalley posting those numbers, and he’ll improve my team.
His benefit to teams he plays on are IN SPITE of his bad attitude, not because of it.
By TexasBrave
October 5, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
DOB I here you, hopefully the third time is the charm. I am also fully aware that this is also not the year to start it with several of those players still a year or two away.
I take it from your response that you have been asked this same question a million times and it is a sore spot with you. I have only been reading your lead ins and not the blog responses lately. No I have lost all hope a long time ago that any in the Braves organization that does read this blog and takes anything (ideas, suggestions) from it. Why in the world would they care what there fans think. I am sure they know exactly what’s best for is organization.
Lastly, I thought the whole reason for this blog is so the fans can have a place to air out their thoughts about a team they love dearly. If my comments were so offensive to you and not worthy of your time then why answer it in the first place? You have done it before with unworthy questions of mine and others. You do a great job of getting us information and keeping us in the loop and although I have not visited many other blogs I can’t imagine anyone doing any better than you.
I don’t mind you letting fans (me) know when we are being stupid, but the lamb basting was not necessary.
Thanks
By Steve from OH
October 5, 2008 3:13 PM | Link to this
“OK OK OK……. I gave you stat guys enough rope……the point I was making about Pete Rose was: WHAT HE BROUGHT TO THE GAME CAN’T BE MEASURED BY STATS ALONE”
Right. Like “defense” or “ability to play multiple positions.”
Qualities like “attitude” and “grit” and “toughness” are usually exaggerated in “gaminess” in players that hit well and play good defense. Those same qualities are usually villified as “arrogance” or “selfishness” in players that aren’t as good. Nature of the beast. First and foremost, I want players that are “good” at playing baseball on my team. Any of those other “intangible” qualities are bonus, but they don’t make a player good. What makes a player good is his ability to hit and catch baseballs. Pete Rose had these qualities. If he didn’t, he wouldn’t have been talked about half as much as he is now. The fact that he did possess these other intangible qualities is a nice bonus, and that’s what makes the game of baseball great.
I agree with the rest of your post (general premise). I want players that are good. If they’re jerks, so what? Winning puts butts in the seats, not “nicest team.” But I am NOT for acquiring players for their intangibles if they can’t hit or catch baseballs. That’s stupid.
By TexasBrave
October 5, 2008 3:13 PM | Link to this
DOB I here you, hopefully the third time is the charm. I am also fully aware that this is also not the year to start it with several of those players still a year or two away.
I take it from your response that you have been asked this same question a million times and it is a sore spot with you. I have only been reading your lead ins and not the blog responses lately. No I have lost all hope a long time ago that any in the Braves organization that does read this blog and takes anything (ideas, suggestions) from it. Why in the world would they care what there fans think. I am sure they know exactly what’s best for is organization.
Lastly, I thought the whole reason for this blog is so the fans can have a place to air out their thoughts about a team they love dearly. If my comments were so offensive to you and not worthy of your time then why answer it in the first place? You have done it before with unworthy questions of mine and others. You do a great job of getting us information and keeping us in the loop and although I have not visited many other blogs I can’t imagine anyone doing any better than you.
I don’t mind you letting fans (me) know when we are being stupid, but the lamb basting was not necessary.
Thanks
By TexasBrave
October 5, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
ncscoots you make my point more than you know. Those guys are still developing and need time, thus are three guys enough to get us in the playoffs next year. I hope so but a lot will have to come together for that to happen. I take DOB’s point that the Braves have already set the organizations focal point for next year and nothing we can say will change any of it.
Just wondering out loud and hoping for the future.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this
I take it from your response that you have been asked this same question a million times and it is a sore spot with youTexasBrave
No, not really. Just answering you honestly. While I understand and have no problem whatsoever with folks here debating the proper course for the franchise — seriously, I understand the appeal and interest of doing that — personally I’ve just got too much to do in coming weeks and months just following the actual course they’re going to take, or at least that they’ve laid out publicly as the course they plan to talke, to also entertain all the various hypotheticals that I don’t think are going to happen.
By kirknga
October 5, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
The Cubs performance seemed slightly familiar in some ways.Looked so great during the regular season, then came the playoffs and they couldn’t answer the challenge.
Let’s really really hope that we can pry away an effective and healthy starter from some team. Unless a guy is headed for free agency as was the case with Hudson, I believe it is going to be harder to get a good starter who has already resigned with a team.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
DOB—
I know…I know.
It just slipped out…Sorry about that.
I wish the Brewers would just score five runs here and give them Fillies what for.
By Brian
October 5, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this
I HATE THE PHILLIES!! Pat Burrell can keep his streaky a* in Philly cause I wouldn’t want him over Dunn anymore!! I just want to go to a game where we play the Phils, bring my sling shot and pop Burrell,that midget, and grease head Utley right in the a*!!!!
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
Dangit…I jinxed the Brewers…and Jason Kendall. Sorry guys.
DagNABIT!!
By Bring Me the Head of Francisco Cabrera
October 5, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
Poor Braves fans are in the position of having to root for the Dodgers now. Joe Torre’s boys are all that stand between Victorino and the World Series.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
Brian—
Whoa, dude. Chill.
If the WS is Rays-Fillies, I’m pulling for the Rays. If it’s Boston-Fillies……um…I’ll root for Kotsay, and whichever team wins…whatever.
But who knows…Maybe the Dodgers will beat the Fillies in the NLCS…Then the Yankees are really gonna be SORRY!
I feel for the fans of these teams that are getting the early exit…I know how they feel.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 4:16 PM | Link to this
Bring Me the Head of Francisco Cabrera Joe Torre’s boys are all that stand between Victorino and the World Series.
Yeah…
Dude, if I have to see the Reaper’s mug in the WS, I might lose what’s left of my mind.
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
Phillies-Dodgers? I think I’ve just become a fan of the american league…
By Bring Me the Head of Francisco Cabrera
October 5, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
How ironic would it be, after all those great seasons on all those great Braves teams, if Andruw Jones — now the worst hitter in the majors — were to finally get a World Series ring riding the pine for the Los Angeles Dodgers?
Unfortunately, Andruw’s replacement in center, Matt Kemp, doesn’t exactly look like a natural in the field. I think his lack of range (compared to Andruw, anyway) might cost the Dodgers an important game somewhere down the line.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this
Who’d have thought, who could have possibly thought, when the season began that Manny Ramirez would lead the Dodgers to the NLCS and Andruw Jones wouldn’t be on the playoff roster?
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 4:45 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan—
Not a bad idea. I mean, it’s only temporary.
By NickC
October 5, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this
TommyP, given a choice in the outfield between Conor Jackson and Eric Byrnes, they’ll choose Jackson.
Given a choice between Tracy and Jackson at first, they’ll choose Jackson.
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 5:12 PM | Link to this
McFann
It just seems the lesser of two evils…the thought of having to pull for either one of those teams makes me a little nauseous
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this
Although…wouldn’t it be nice to have Joe Torre manage the NL in the All-Star Game next year???
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 5:25 PM | Link to this
McFann
No:)
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 5:38 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan—
Makes me kinda nauseous, too. Though for me, it’s more ‘cause of the Fillies.
No:)
Haha! They wouldn’t have to win the WS…
Nah, I’m not really pulling for LA, either (just very against the Fillies). I’m with Tampa Bay! They’ve never had a winning season until this year, and I think it would be sweet if they could win it all!!
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 5:43 PM | Link to this
McFann
I’m with Tampa Bay!
Sounds good to me:) Go Rays!
By MGL
October 5, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this
Some contrasts I found interesting between Braves and Brewers:
MSA Population (rank) Atlanta 5,298,504 (9), Milwaukee 1,544,398 (38)
2008 Home Attendance Atlanta 2,532,834 (14) Milwaukee 3,068,458 (9)
2008 Payroll of record Atlanta $102,424,018 (10) Milwaukee $81,004,167 (15)
So, less than a third the population, 20% higher attendance, 80% of the payroll.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan—
Uh-oh…now the Rays are losing…
Maybe we should start “rooting” for the teams we want to lose…
; )
By Lew
October 5, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
TexasBRave-Lamb Basting is what they do to a Lamb’s leg before making Gyros. I think you meant lambasting-which, BTW was not what DOB’s response to you indicated to me at all.
Dude, If you don’t read the responses, how do you know what’s being or been discussed and might have been covered? Your approach to team buliding, while a bona fide way to go (mainly if you’re totally rebuilding, which the Braves are NOT) has been debated here ad nauseum for three years (that I’m aware of). It also has NOT been how the Braves have approached the matter and all indications by the Braves’ Brass (also debated here ad nauseum) is that they will not start now. That’s what DOB told you and nothing else.
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 6:19 PM | Link to this
McFann
Maybe we should start “rooting” for the teams we want to lose
you might be on to something there…all the teams i want to win have failed miserably…
Maybe you should wake up Rally McTurtle:)
By Lew
October 5, 2008 6:22 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave-As to the acquisition of two starters and a power hitting outfielder-If we also re-sign Ohman and maybe find a good backup for Chipper (like Casey Blake who DAP advocates), I think most of our problems will have been solved. The loss of our starting staff was as much to blame for the meltdown of the pen as much as anything. Those acquisitions pretty well cover the rest.
KJ had a decent season and his streak in September was the result of a modified approach at the plate-NOT just coming out of a slump. Frenchy, though having a lousy year, still was third in RBI for the Braves at 71. Not, of course what we were used to from him, but he also came on late when he lost the bulk he put on over the winter. Yunel was just fine if you discount the injuries, which were entirely circumstantial, not the result of bad training or being out of shape-likely to not be a factor again..
Dude, those three pieces are what we need. Not a lot more rookies falling over themselves.
By McFann O –[zz]
October 5, 2008 6:33 PM | Link to this
cabravesfan all the teams i want to win have failed miserably
Mine, too. They always have. I mean, I became an incurable Braves fan in ‘06…
You’re right—McTurtle!! Maybe he cann work his “magic” on a team besides the Braves!
U, Rally McTurtle!! WAKE UP, I say!!
By McFann Ô
October 5, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
Whoo-hoo!! He’s up!! A little groggy, but still up.
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 6:43 PM | Link to this
It’s a start:)
By Navigator
October 5, 2008 6:52 PM | Link to this
I’m a simple person. Spend all of the extra money for top pitching. I believe the Braves can score enough runs with this team (plus minors promotions) to win, if they have quality pitching to hold the score down. I really like how the team played at the end of the season, affecting the races with wins against both the Mets and Phillies.
By cabravesfan
October 5, 2008 6:53 PM | Link to this
McFann
So you became a Braves fan in ‘06, huh? Wonder what (or should I say who) was responsible for that:) (actually he’s my guy too- absolutly love the guy!) But wow do i feel old!
By Marc
October 5, 2008 7:04 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Do you drop by Turner Field during the offseason when news isn’t happening? When are the Braves’ organizational meetings?
By Braveheart
October 5, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this
McFann, no offense but has Rally McTurle ever brought anything but bad luck? Surgeries for all of our hurlers, loss after loss after loss, a trade of our slugging first baseman, stolen bases off your crush, concussions for your crush, less homers in the second half for your crush. It’s time to bury Rally McTurtle and the Roo Nuts.
By JINX?
October 5, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this
2006 McFann becomes Braves fan. 2006 Braves lose first division title in 15 years and continue for both years following. can we deduce anything from the above facts?
By KC
October 5, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this
Did I really see Horacio Ramirez’s name in that web poll???? That’s a joke, right DOB?
By scottbravesfan
October 5, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this
Braves have to try and sign Derek Lowe and get another big time starter. They need some help on offense as well but I have no idea who they could get to help out in the outfield. They will be too cheap to sign Manny and probably rightfully so. And I don’t know if I want them trying to trade for Holliday from Colorado. Since he will be a free agent after the season and is a Boris client.
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 7:28 PM | Link to this
Braveheart—
Now you’ve gone and hurt his feelings! And no, not time to bury McTurtle. He stays.
cabravesfan—
Haha…Well, that helped…I started to watch the Braves with real regularity around July of ‘05…But I became the nutty, gotta-know-everything-about-this-game fann in ‘06.
But yeah, it helped that the guy I picked as my new favorite had an incredible year.
absolutly love the guy!
DITTO!
JINX?—
Thanks!
By MGL
October 5, 2008 7:28 PM | Link to this
Navigator, I’m inclined to agree with you with the exception of a LF power bat for the cleanup spot. Must be able to hit LHP.
I like our infield of CJ, YE, KJ, and CK. Prado and Infante are quality backups who can play more than the average bench player.
We need a better backup catcher, enough of the sub .100 Pratt/Miller types. Not sure Sammons can rise to the cause.
With a Power bat in LF, Schafer in CF, and a refreshed Frenchy in RF, we can have Anderson, maybe Blanco, maybe Norton as the rest of the bench.
Put the bulk of the $$$ on pitching. And don’t trade any of the above players so that we have to backfill the bench with the likes of Gotay and Woodward.
By Francoeur-Royals '08
October 5, 2008 7:32 PM | Link to this
YES: Adam Dunn, Pat Burrell, Matt Holliday and Magglio Ordóñez.
NO: Raul Ibanez and Bobby Abreu
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
Braveheart—
Uh, one more thing…
The day McTurtle arrived, my crush crushed two homers…He hit a Grand Slam off Lidge during McTurtle’s reign…He tied the NL record for most doubles in a season by a catcher…The Braves won a wild one against Florida 16-14…
Let me also remind you that the event that some people claim killed the Braves season—the series against the Fillies July 1-3, happened before McTurtle came. Smoltz had his surgery before McTurtle came…so did Moylen…Soriano went down before McTurtle’s time with us…Glavine went on the DL about a month before McTurtle joined the Blog…People were running wild on McCann long before even I came on the Blog…
So you see, it’s not McTurtle’s fault. Timmy’s surgery, McCann getting Victorinoed, and the trading of Tex—yes, those all happened while McTurtle was here, but that’s about it.
Oh, and the fewer homers…but I don’t know what the ding-dang heck caused that.
By Josh
October 5, 2008 7:52 PM | Link to this
Francoeur-Royals ‘08 agreed on all players above. I wouldn’t mind having Ibanez or Abreu in LF on a short-term deal if the team had a very good to elite level hitter in RF. As it stands now I think the Braves should go after Ordonez if he’s made available, and Holliday will probably be the Plan B. If the team decides to fill the hole via Free Agency I’d love to see Dunn come here but I think Burrell’s more likely.
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this
How come when a Braves player pops one up like that it gets caught?
By ncscoots
October 5, 2008 8:50 PM | Link to this
Those guys are still developing and need time, thus are three guys enough to get us in the playoffs next year.
TB, here’s the thing. Those guys have already been through a time of adversity. In business, we call that a sunk cost. One hopes that the players learned from it, and will know how to cope when they, inevitably, again go through it. A new set of young players would have to go through the same learning curve, just further delaying the Braves’ return to prominence.
I don’t know enough about Kotchman to make a call on him, but Francoeur, Escobar, and Johnson have too much talent for me to believe that 2008’s past is prologue for them. A simple, normal step forward in their development, plus one more big bat to solidify the lineup, and things will look up.
The team still has most of the important roster parts that produced an 800-run offense in 2007. It’s not out of the realm to think they can do so again, with only slight changes.
By BossLady
October 5, 2008 8:52 PM | Link to this
YEAH!! It looks like the Dodgers and the Phillies will hook up. I take the Phillies in FOUR. Since, I am a National League East person I have to stick with them. I HATE Victorino and know he is dirty, realllly dirty. I cannot take away from Utley, Ryan, Burrel and great pitching. Manuel has coached to the MAX.
As i watched the SOX and saw them win I hope that Big Thome, Griffey, Jr., Jermaine Dye and even D Wise bring it home.
I watch the games and as DOB’s article says that all these ex-Braves are in the hunt.
AT least the METS and Yankees are not in any of this an we can rejoice in that.
THE BRAVES ARE GONE HOME TO PLAY WITH THEIR WIVES AND CHILDREN, LEAVE IT ALONE
It would be fitting that Thome, Griffey, Dye and Guillen would get somewhere since they are AL and I don’t have a personal feel for them at all. They ARE not in my area of the of playoffs.
Why in the he!! did they put Chip in the AL announcer of BSox & Angels. I don’t see him announcing anything.
I would like to see Griffey, Jr and Thome win something even if it is just the Pennant.
I don’t know the RAYS and until they put us numbers to show they are the Pennant leader, I will not.
Goodbye, Cubs, Goodby Brewers, but let’s go Dodgers and Phillies, please beat the winners of the SOX, Angels, BSox and Tampa
I would like to see the Phillies and the Rays in the World Series.
I haves still prepared the Sunday feast and am beat and confused as to why I had to cook all this food and not eat it.
Okay, let’s go I hate the BSox!!!!!!!!!!
By Braveheart
October 5, 2008 8:56 PM | Link to this
Whatever, McFann, the Roo Nads, Rally McTurtle, the blue unis, the chopping cow all need to be buried before next season.
Let me also remind you that the event that some people claim killed the Braves season—the series against the Fillies July 1-3, happened before McTurtle came.
I think you’ve got the wrong series. The one at the end of July was the killer series where McCann hit the homer in the first game and then the Braves blew leads in the next two which was followed by Hudson going out for the season and Wren trading Tex away.
Of course, many believe the killer series against the phillies was in early June when KJ fumbled the game away with two outs in the ninth. And, yes, KJ lovers, I said that just to tick you off because I know that any mention of that gets the anonymous antagonist we’ve got on here to put on his pink KJ jersey and cry and defend his man’s honor ………….. but, let’s be honest, that series was the last time they were over .500.
Hard to believe that they were ever over .500 this season. They had 29 wins and were on a pace to win 87 games after 54 games ….. geez, KJ really did a number on this team when he fumbled away that game …… :-)
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this
Braveheart—
I did have the wrong series. I meant the June series. Mea culpa.
I don’t think that was the killer…I am with you in that the killer was July 26-27, the two worst games of the season. And yes, McTurtle was here for that.
But really, we can’t act like Cubs fans here. Maybe the players themselves had more to do with their lack of success (though there are exceptions, we had some good players). Or maybe it was the injuries that did them in…not McTurtle or the unis or whatever.
Rally McTurtle is staying. I’m sorry, but he is. The blue unis—whatever, but the other two things…yeah, I’d ditch that. The Cow’s a tad bit tacky, I’m gonna be honest.
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
BTW—Braveheart The one at the end of July was the killer series where McCann hit the homer in the first game…
McCann hit two homers that night. A solo-shot in the fourth, a Grand Salami in the ninth.
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this
BossLady I HATE Victorino and know he is dirty, realllly dirty.
Can’t argue there…
Fillies in four…? Wouldn’t surprise me none.
By Couch Tater
October 5, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this
Braveheart More good news from Destrehan, LA. (4-star)
By BossLady
October 5, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this
DOB, I know you are the Beat Writer and all for the BRAVES. I love you in a sense that you make us whole. I AM NOT A “FRESH” woman coming at you.
I would like to thank you for your complete and thorough coverage of the Braves in 2008.
You are the “Bomb Man”, I cannot say that I had a day when I did not know what was coming and expected. You covered this beat and made sure we knew everyting that was going on and on.
I love you man, and I love Carroll for making sure that we had all the information.
It could not have been easy. It has to be hard for you two to leave your home, be on the road and always kept us informed. I am beside myself with admiration and proudness that we have a “GOOD MAN”!!!
Thank you, DOB and Carroll for 2008.
I have been on this blog for two years and have appreciated what you do day after day. Sometimes it seems that you needed protection and we all stepped up for you. I know, I know you did not need protection but, we did it anyway.
Listen take care and enjoy. The Music, Bar-Be-Que, and Brave were good.
I love you, really love you and I hope that the off-season does you well.
Just know that all of us love you and look forward to and linger on your words.
As I said, this is not a proposition or anything, We just appreciate you for so many things.
THANK YOU DAVID O’BRIEN, THANKS SO MUCH
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 9:40 PM | Link to this
Marc, organizational meetings are this week at Dark Star (in Florida).
By cutty
October 5, 2008 9:40 PM | Link to this
with regard to your last post….me.
By McFann O
October 5, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this
Dang…Boston tied it again!
Well, I gotta be goin’. Night, all!
By Deep Throat
October 5, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this
geez, KJ really did a number on this team when he fumbled away that game
You’re right…had Kelly Johnson caught that ball the Braves would have finished 73-89!
By Savannah Guy
October 5, 2008 10:32 PM | Link to this
Comments that just caught me at the right time and couldn’t resist commentary just for fun:
Is this how the Oracle of Omaha got started?
If Warren worked late nights like ugabrave, instead of net worth of billions he’d now be working in a cattle slaughterhouse in Omaha. Not exactly a buffet.
…heard the new Pretenders’ CD due out in a couple weeks? …the few clips they played sounded kickin’ in the extreme. I’m looking forward to hearing it all. / … Another musical item-The new Joan Baez (yes, I can hear the moans now).
Lew, listening to girl-rock now? What next, a sweet Judy blue eyes Collins comeback? Say it ain’t so… a heavy metal mellowing and musical glass ceiling shattering event? Hey, Dylan left Baez because, in a fit of rage (or disgust or jealousy) she threw away his favorite old denim jacket that took years to break in. She claimed it was because he threw up all over it while passed out in a drunken stupor during the time he was hanging around with Johnny Cash, but still, it was an unforgivable act and a fashion faux pas… so how could her music be worth listening to today?
Who’d have thought, who could have possibly thought, when the season began that Manny Ramirez would lead the Dodgers to the NLCS and Andruw Jones wouldn’t be on the playoff roster?
Manny leading the Dodgers to NLCS, not thought… not in wildest dreams. Now, Andruw not being on the playoff roster… not even a stretch of the imagination.
Oh, and the fewer homers…but I don’t know what the ding-dang heck caused that.
Now look what you cretins have done. You’ve finally pulled the innocent young McFann down into the blog gutter talk along with your ding-dang selves.
By Roman Gal
October 5, 2008 10:56 PM | Link to this
McFann, no offense but has Rally McTurle ever brought anything but bad luck? Surgeries for all of our hurlers, loss after loss after loss, a trade of our slugging first baseman, stolen bases off your crush, concussions for your crush, less homers in the second half for your crush. It’s time to bury Rally McTurtle and the Roo Nuts*
McFann Sorry, but I’m gonna have to go with Braveheart on this one. The combination of the Rally McTurtle and the Pagan Bovine killed the season for the Braves.
By richbrave
October 5, 2008 11:40 PM | Link to this
Has anyone gone after any of the three outrighted to the minors.?
By Billy
October 5, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this
By DOB Marc, organizational meetings are this weekend at Dark Star (in Florida).
DOB, Are the organizational meetings concluding tomorrow?
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 11:57 PM | Link to this
Man, what a terrific inning that was, K-Rod facing the heart of the Sox order, then getting out of a bases-loaded jam. Great stuff.
By David O'Brien
October 5, 2008 11:59 PM | Link to this
Marc: No, they haven’t started yet. It’s this week in Florida. Sorry, I said weekend earlier. This week, not weekend.
By Billy
October 6, 2008 12:00 AM | Link to this
Has anyone gone after any of the three outrighted to the minors.?
richbrave, I believe those three can become free agents and free agents can still negotiate with their own team for 10 days after the end of the World Series. At that time I believe they can then negotiate with all teams.
By Tomas
October 6, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this
Papelbon is untouchable in the playoff. He justs brings it.Great game. The Angel vs Red sox series has definitely been the most interesting one, and exciting.
By Rally McTurtle and the Turner Field Rally Cow
October 6, 2008 12:09 AM | Link to this
McFann Sorry, but I’m gonna have to go with Braveheart on this one. The combination of the Rally McTurtle and the Pagan Bovine killed the season for the Braves.
Hey, we resent this. We bring good luck! It’s not our fault that fate conspired against the Braves. We can only do so much good.
And ‘U Kno Who’ called me, the rally cow; “tacky”! After all I did for him in his 2008 NL batting title run too!
By Tomas
October 6, 2008 12:12 AM | Link to this
Torri Hunter has had a lot of key errors in the playoff the last couple of years. He dropped a ball Friday that was hit right at him(in front), he didn’t take charge in a pop fly, and cost the Angels 3 runs, and when he was with the Twins, he dived for a ball which he absolutely had no chance of getting, and the Yankees had an inside the park homerun.
By Tomas
October 6, 2008 12:22 AM | Link to this
That ump totally robbed Jacoby on that at bat. He was definitely mad about the reaction in Jacoby’s called strike two, which was perfectly located at the knees, and in the inside corner.
By JC from UT
October 6, 2008 6:27 AM | Link to this
DOB: With the orginzational meetings happening this week do you think any rumors of who FW is targeting will be leaked out? Do you think the front office would have any interest in signing KRod and trading Gonzo? And what do you think about bringing in Miguel Olivo to be the backup catcher?
By David O'Brien
October 6, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this
JC, sign K-Rod and trade Gonzo? No, don’t see those things happening.
OK, folks, I was gonna do a blog this morning, but realized this training class I’ve got to attend starts at 10 a.m. and not 10:30. Last 6-1/2 hours, until 4:30 p.m.. Yes, all day. Fun, fun.
So I’ll write a new blog soon as I get back from it.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this
SavannahGuy-What, No Love for our Sisters In Rock, Dude? I’ve only got one Pretenders (a Greatest Hits), but what I heard of the new CD rocks pretty well. As for Joan-None of her CD’s, I was just interested in what influence Steve Earle might have had on the new CD. Seemed like a strange combo to me.
However, I’ve always been a fan of Heart (their more raucous tunes-ever hear them cover Zeppelin?), Pat Benadryl and Candace Night of Blackmore’s Night. Even get into Renaissance (Annie Haslam) upon occasion. Check out Girlschool if you’re squeamish about our more mellow sisters. Those Ladies can rock with the best of them. Just go ask Lemmy and his Motorhead Mates.
By GermanBravesFan
October 6, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this
Okay, so let’s dream a bit… How about this line-up:
Starting Pitchers: 1. Oswalt or Lowe 2. Matt Cain 3. Jurrjens 4. Hampton 5. Glavine (Morton/Campillo)
Bullpen: Gonzalez Soriano (hopefully healthy) Smoltz Moylan Ohman Boyer Carlyle
Bench: Norton Anderson/Schafer Prado Infante Catcher not named Corkie Miller
As I said, just dreaming. As much as I dislike Manny Ramirez’s behavior, but he’d create some excitement again in Atlanta!
By NickC
October 6, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
How come when a Braves player pops one up like that it gets caught?
Jason Bay missed one in the first week for us, which would have been the final out.
By McFann O
October 6, 2008 9:55 AM | Link to this
Wow. People have turned on Rally McTurtle!
Just remember: Chipper won his first Batting Title under McTurtle’s watch. Keep that in mind.
I, for one, am not superstitious. It just wasn’t the Braves turn this year…or last year…or the year before. They’ll get back in the race, and it won’t be because of turtles or cows or uniform colors or anything like that. It’ll be because the players step up and do what they need to do; it will be because they don’t have the injuries they had this year. It’ll be because guys are hitting the ball out of the ballpark. And no, McTurtle didn’t cause those things to not happen this year.
Rally McTurtle wasn’t supposed to bring “good luck” or “bad luck”, he was supposed to just be fun.
By McFann O :,(
October 6, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this
NickC—
Oh yeah. How could I forget that…considering McCann hit it and all.
By DAP
October 6, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this
germanbravesfan
while i would love to have someone who could hit like manny, i honestly think he would do more harm than good. this is a guy who will intentionally play poorly if he isnt happy about something. i dont want someone that would have to be babysat.
also, i dont know how the lineup will be constructed…but what if we started batting kotchman 2nd, and freed up escobar to be an RBI guy? escobar is a great #2 hitter, but it seems like kotchman is even more in that mold. what do you think?
By MGL
October 6, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this
Dap - If you look at Casey’s spray chart, he grounds out a lot to the right side of the infield. In fact, it looks like that is his most frequent out. That is a bad formula for a number 2 hitter.
By Renegator
October 6, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this
DOB
Did you see the news about the Havana Sandwich Shop?
By BravesFanInRockies
October 6, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this
Happy postseason, denizens —
We may be about to witness a genuine test of the value of statistical analysis.
Jerry Manuel says he thinks it’s a bunch of garbage — or something like that — and wants the Mutts to move away from all that OPS nonsense.
*On his first full day as the Mets’ long-term manager, Manuel forcefully attacked the SABR-type mathematical analysis some have fixated on in recent years.
“You get so many statistical people together, they put so many stats on paper, and they say, well, if you do this and you score this many runs, you do that many times, you’ll be in the playoffs,” he said.
“That’s not really how it works, and that’s what we have to get away from. And that’s going to have to be a different mind-set of the team in going forward. We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people. We have to win because we have baseball players that know and can understand the game.”*
As a Braves fan, I say bring it on! Maybe we can convince him to take Jeff Francouer and Josh Anderson off our hands for, say, David Wright? Carlos Beltran? Hey, a guy can dream.
By MGL
October 6, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this
BravesFanInRockies - I guess Shaun won’t get a job with the Mets.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this
McFann-Rally McTurtle led to Chipper’s first batting title? Don’t think so. It was the deer painting I gave him.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 12:07 PM | Link to this
MGL-He grounds out a lot to the right side? Dude, he wore a groove three degrees to the left of first base. It will take Ed Mangan a month to fill in the trench.
By DAP
October 6, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this
hey guys, a few trading ideas on MLB trade rumors…
delmon young maybe available. he is only 22…is he the kind of guy the braves need in LF? i dont know much about him…i dont know if he really has the kind of power we are looking for.
brian robert may be on the trading block if he cant reach an extension with baltimore. anybody interested in robert for 2B? he is a great player…if we had him, we could move kelly to LF like weve mentioned, or trade him. but would that be a good move?
also, the white sox are looking for a pitcher, an athletic CF, and a 2B, so that they can move ramierz to SS. the rumor is that jermain dye would be on the block for a pitcher…but maybe if we can offer them a CF and a 2B they would give us dye?
what do you guys think?
By DAP
October 6, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this
MGL i just realized my post in response yours earlier never posted. weird. let me wuickly re post the jist of it.
about kotchman grounding out to the right.
i think kotchman does several things that i like to see #2 hitters do. he handles the bat well. he puts it in play, doesnt strike out very much. also, grounding out is not a good thing for a hitter at any position :-) but, if your number #2 hitter is always hitting behind the runners (aka the right side) thats a good thing. with a guy on base somewhere, that ground out to the right will often be a productive out.
the thing i dont like about kotchman in the #2 hole is that his OBP isnt great. so, if we dont have a great leadoff hitter, chipper could be batting with the bases empty alot, which isnt good. i just think kotchman could be a good option, so that we can use escobar to protect the bottom of the order and drive guys in.
just an idea. escobar is a great #2 hitter as well.
By Steve from OH
October 6, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
BFIR:
Well, those comments (and Omar Minaya’s extension) don’t bode well for the Mets. I suppose this means that they’re planning on throwing oodles of cash at K-Rod. Well, that’s good for us, anyway. Keeps them from spending $$ on the supporting cast that they really need.
Did anyone else get a kick out of him bashing “new-age” stats and then promptly saying: “We have to put a value on getting a bases on balls?” Ha, that’s what most of the stats that he was bashing are!
By Wayne
October 6, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
DAP If he stays agreesive as he did in September, I personally like KJ in the 2 hole. Escobar, for my money is a good 6-7 type hitter. Kotchman I think will be good either way. I think the last couple of months will be a distant memory next year.
As for Dye, I would love to see him in a Braves uni. Also, Nick Swisher is another Sox outfielder that might be available, but he does not hit for as high of an average as Dye.
I could see a possible deal for one of these guys. Might have to send them a ML almost ready pitcher, maybe Redmond, Prado and Blanco would get it done?
I would love to see us hang onto Reyes for ONE more go. Dude looked very good the early part of this past season. I think he is another head case, that might be worthy of one more chance. Morton is in the same boat, in my book.
Peavy would be nice, but that arm sure scares the heck out of me. I think he is primed for a TJ surgery in the next couple of years.
Personally, I like Matt Cain. I think just hanging around John Smoltz for a year might be all that kid needs to take his game to the top level. I think we might want to overpay for this guy.
By mbatl
October 6, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this
DAP, I would love to have Delmon Young. He’s likely to become an offensive force, and has a great arm. Problem is, it would probably take Escobar (plus a pitching prospect or 2) to get him.
And Roberts would be interesting too. He’s the prototypical leadoff hitter we haven’t had and would be a defensive upgrade. And I’m okay with moving KJ to the OF. But (there’s always a “but”, right?) Roberts would be a 1-year deal, as he’s a FA after ‘09.
Both are interesting players - just have to weigh the costs and downside.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this
DAP-I sure as hell wouldn’t give up two young players for Dye. Maybe if he were available as a free agent, but…..
The Dude (with the exception of this past year) has missed between 17 and 97 games a year since 2002. That is hardly a track record (given the state of Braves injuries) that is likely to inspire confidence. His power would quite possibly be reduced in Atlanta and his career OBP is marginal at .338 (it wasn’t all that great even given his good offensive season in 08).
Sorry Dude, why you would consider giving up a couple of good prospects or (as I think you really meant) Kelly Johnson and a center fielder (Blanco? Anderson?) is mystifying to me and is, I believe, insanity personified. I’d much rather go with the options we already have. Now if he could be had for a package of minor league possibilities (certainly not our youg studs like Schafer and Hanson), well maybe then.
By MGL
October 6, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this
DAP - I agree with a lot of what you like about Kotchman, but at Turner field, he grounded out 56% of the times he put the ball in play (44 of 79). Most of these were to the right side. While I agree with your hitting behind the runner comment to some degree, if you look at his chart, as Lew pointed out he frequently hits right at the 1st baseman. Unless a runner has a good lead, and is fast, that is probably a DP, along with the grounders to the left side.
By DAP
October 6, 2008 1:20 PM | Link to this
lew why you would consider giving up a couple of good prospects or (as I think you really meant) Kelly Johnson and a center fielder (Blanco? Anderson?) is mystifying to me and is, I believe, insanity personified.
haha…relax, man. just blog fodder. i didnt say i would do or am considering anyting. (as if it matters even if i am!)
just as blog fodder, to throw it out there (i dont want to be accused of insanity) if we got brian roberts from baltimore for…lillibridge and redmond, or something small…then got dye for LF with kelly johnson and josh anderson…would that make this lineup alot better?
im thinking it would for 2009, but not for the longterm.
By DAP
October 6, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this
MGL keep in mind about kotchman that he slumped horribly when he got to atlanta. it does seem like he got a season’s worth of bouncers to 1st base in his first month and a half or so here, but hes a better hitter than that.
if we could really conclude that he would ground out weakly to the 1st baseman 56% of the time he put the ball in play, he probably wouldnt really belong on a major league roster. i dont think thats our conclusion on kotchman.
By Adam
October 6, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
I think Greinke is the guy to go after. He doesn’t get any pub because he plays in KC. He has 4 above average pitches and likes to hit. He has a fastball that can touch 98 and good control. I would take him over Cain. I don’t see the Braves willing to give as much as Peavy is gonna take to get. I would love to see Byrnes in the OF. When he’s healthy he can be a real spark.
I’m not high on Reyes at all. He doesn’t trust his stuff at all. I think next year is going to be a very telling year on Morton. If he can get past his confidence issues, he could be a legit big league pitcher.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
DAP-Not to mention Dye earned almost $10 mil this season. That puts WAY too much $$$$ at risk that won’t be spent on pitching.
As MGL says about Kotchman-his hitting proclivities are NOT what you want from a #2 hitter. I’d bat him 5th or 6th. Whatever power he has would be more suited to a lower spot in the order, as well. Leave Yunel there and bat Kotchman and KJ lower.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this
DAP-My main problems with Dye (and Dude, I’m aware you’re not totally serious) is that he makes too much and has missed in 02-31 games, in 03-97 gms, in 04-25 gms, in 05-17 gms, and in 06-26 games. Nuff said?
By Braveheart
October 6, 2008 1:58 PM | Link to this
I think Greinke is the guy to go after. He doesn’t get any pub because he plays in KC. He has 4 above average pitches and likes to hit. He has a fastball that can touch 98 and good control.
After reading the below article, I don’t know if Greinke will be available.
Royals GM Dayton Moore says things are going to change around here. Of course, everyone has been scrambling to figure out what he means by that. Does this mean the Royals make some major deals this offseason? Will they sign another high-priced free agent or two? Will they dump some players who have underperformed?
Maybe. Maybe not. But none of those gets to the main point.
Moore’s main point is this: Things are going to change around here. He’s had enough.
“That’s it,” he says. “We’re at a point now where you will never, ever hear me say again that we have young players who are improving. You will never, ever hear me say again that we are rebuilding. That stuff is over. I’m sick of all that. “We’re not a young team anymore. We’re not an improving team anymore. There are no more excuses. It’s not like we made a lot of excuses before, but I’m sick of all that. It’s time now.”
Now we get to the heart of things: Dayton Moore is tired of conceding. He’s tired of telling people that winning will take time. He came to Kansas City to make the Royals a proud organization again. He came to Kansas City to make the Royals the team, to make everyone, in and out of town, look at the Royals and say, “Man, those guys know what they’re doing.”
That hasn’t happened yet. Nothing close. Until a big finish, the Royals seemed destined for another last-place and another dreadful year. The big finish moved them out of the basement (first time in five years) and offered a bit of hope — but this is the point. Moore doesn’t want that kind of hope anymore. Moore doesn’t want moral victories. It drove him mad last year when former Texas Tech coach Bob Knight came to town for Big 12 media days and popped a couple of jokes about the Royals.
“I used to like Bob Knight,” Moore said through gritted teeth — and he was joking, but he wasn’t joking at all. He takes all the slights personally. He keeps a loose list in his mind of all the commentators who have bagged on the Royals the last three years. It isn’t that he plans on telling them “I told you so” at some point. Not at all. It’s that he fully expects that someday he won’t have to say, “I told you so.” They will know.
Moore has been general manager of the Royals now for two full seasons plus the second half of 2006. He has seen the Royals’ big-league club make steady improvement, from the second half of another 100-loss season (their fourth in five years), to a 93-loss season, to this year when the Royals went 75-87. He is confident that the Royals have made huge strides in the lower realms of the minor leagues and, especially, in Latin America. He’s reasonably proud of the incremental improvement. He knew this would not be an overnight project.
Still, Moore crossed a line this season. In Kansas City — because the payroll’s lower than most and the team has not been especially good in years — it’s easy to get stuck on the “Hey, we’re getting better” treadmill. They pick up a few new players, pray for a couple of young guys to emerge, and say, “Hey we’re getting better.”
Well, Moore is tired of running in place. He shocked more than a few people around baseball when he let go scouting director Deric Ladnier in September. Ladnier is well-liked, and by most accounts the Royals had a good amateur draft in 2008, highlighted by the drafting and signing of two players — first baseman Eric Hosmer and pitcher Tim Melville — who are considered big-time talents.
Moore still fired Ladnier. He did not talk much about the firing — he praised Ladnier and said he simply wanted to give his highly regarded right-hand man J.J. Picollo more control of the draft. But make no mistake; this gets to the heart of what Moore is thinking. He wants to break away. He wants to win now. He wants everyone to understand that the bar has been raised. He expects people to see the Royals the way he sees the Royals — as the best operation in baseball.
“I didn’t come here as a springboard,” he says. “I didn’t come here to stay three or four years and then move on to something else. I came here because I believe the Kansas City Royals are a great organization. “It’s time for everyone — that includes the general manager, the manager and coaches, the players, everyone — to perform. We’re not making excuses for anyone now. We’re not going to say, ‘Oh, he’s just a young player, he will get better.’ We have to move forward. I know everyone is trying hard. But it’s not enough to try hard. We have to be successful. It’s time.”
So now you ask: What does this mean in baseball terms? What kind of changes will the Royals make this off-season?
That’s a trickier question. The Royals have made a couple of coaching moves. They fired hitting coach Mike Barnett and third-base coach Luis Silverio. Barnett was easy to fire in many ways. The Royals were 12th in the league in runs scored and dead last in walks. Moore is quick to point out this wasn’t Barnett’s fault exactly — he’s a good coach and he preached plate discipline and worked tirelessly with players on their hitting — but he also didn’t fix things. This is where Moore’s hard-edged philosophy is now: You are part of the solution or you are part of the problem.
“We have to understand the importance of on-base percentage,” Moore says, and he repeats those words — “on-base percentage” — about 29 times during the interview, which is good to hear. The last five years, the Royals have finished 12th, 13th, 11th, 13th and 13th in on-base percentage, and frankly it’s really, really hard to score a lot of runs when you can’t get on base (especially when you do not have much power — and the Royals don’t. Plus they play in a big ballpark).
Clearly, though, they are not going to dramatically improve their on-base percentage by hiring a different coach. Moore says that, in some ways, things will get better naturally. Third baseman Alex Gordon, after hitting bottom in late July, had a three-hit game against Oakland and two days later walked five times against the A’s. He had a better-than-.400 on-base percentage the rest of the year, and it looked like he had a much better ability to draw walks. Billy Butler seemed to find his swing about the same time and hit .309 the rest of the year. Moore thinks rookie Mike Aviles might not hit .325 every year like he did this season, but he will draw more walks as he gets to know pitchers.
And Moore says the Royals are not going to give up on Mark Teahen despite a difficult season. Teahen hit well the last month or so. “We still like Mark a lot,” Moore says. “I see how hard he prepares for every game. And he played better at the end of the year. We still have a lot of faith in Mark as a player.”
But, again, Moore refuses to wait around for young players to get better. He says the Royals will have to add offense, even if it means moving and shoving some current players into different positions.
We can’t be picky,” he says. “We need to go out and get the best offensive players we can get. We have to do it. And when we get those players, we need to play them in their natural positions. And we can do that because we have guys on our team that are versatile and can play a lot of positions.”
The Royals can move center fielder David DeJesus to a corner outfield, outfielder Mark Teahen to first or third, third baseman Alex Gordon to first, shortstop Aviles to second. And Moore insists the Royals will do whatever they can to get more offense, and that includes sending any player who is not performing to the minor leagues.
“These guys have had time in the major leagues,” he says. “They have earned an opportunity, but that’s all. They have to make the most of their opportunity or we have to go with someone else. The learning period is over.”
OK, so Moore wants offense — and a lot of it. That leads to the next question: Where are the Royals going to find more offense? Moore concedes that the Royals don’t have as much payroll flexibility as they have the last couple of years when they signed pitcher Gil Meche ($11 million per year) and outfielder José Guillen ($12 million per).
“We’re open to anything,” Moore says. “And if we can do something impactful in free agency, we’ll certainly do that. But looking at it right now, I think we’d probably be looking more at trying to do those things through trades.”
OK. Trades. The most positive step the Royals took in 2008 was that several pitchers established themselves. Zack Greinke won 13 games, finished fifth in the league in strikeouts and 10th in ERA. Gil Meche won 14, tied Greinke in strikeouts and was one of the league’s more dominant pitchers the last four months of the season. Closer Joakim Soria had an amazing year, start to finish, as his 42 saves and 1.60 ERA suggest.
So would the Royals be willing to trade any of those guys? Moore says he will keep his options open. But, honestly, a bold move involving one of those pitchers does not fit his personality. Moore believes a team wins with pitching, defense and an offense that maximizes its opportunities.
“You see what the Angels are doing, Minnesota, Tampa,” he says. “That’s our blueprint.” Well, the Royals finally seem to have built a strong pitching nucleus, and I suspect he won’t break that up in some kind of bold blockbuster move. “Yeah,” he says. “I’m more of a piece-by-piece kind of guy.”
So what kind of trade are we talking about here? Moore admits he does not know yet. The Royals have some bullpen arms they could deal, they could certainly trade one or more of their young hitters, they could deal Guillen if someone out there has any interest — trades are hard to predict, and they’re hard to anticipate. Moore plans to spend an offseason making a lot of calls, banging on a lot of doors, and hoping to create some imaginative trade possibilities.
“I just can’t predict what kind of opportunities we’re going to have,” he says. “All I can tell you is that there’s a lot more urgency going forward. We’re going to create as many options as we can. We’re going to do everything we can to make changes. There’s a lot of room for us to get better. And right now, that’s all that matters. We have to get better.”
By DAP
October 6, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this
lew his hitting proclivities are NOT what you want from a #2 hitter.
what do YOU want from a #2 hitter? what do you look for?
By McFann O :,(
October 6, 2008 2:28 PM | Link to this
Lew It was the deer painting I gave him.
Hmm…You’re prob’ly right.
By richbrave
October 6, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
DAP:
The new JEFF TREADWAY or EDGAR RENTARIA please, or maybe the old FA RENTS.
By Roman Gal
October 6, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
Come on now, McFann. Cheer up!
‘Tis all in jest.
By Adam
October 6, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,
Reading that article makes me feel that it is even more likely that Greinke is available. Moore wants more offense but doesn’t have payroll to add more so that leaves his other option of trades. Moore also had a hand in drafting players such as Francoeur and KJ. I would not hesitate in moving either of those players and a prospect for Greinke. Moore knows he has to give up something to get something. The most attractive piece that Royals have that other teams will want is Greinke and Soria.
By Original Jon
October 6, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
Hey Braveheart I am pretty sure it is illegal to do what you just did. You know, post an article without citing the source or author.
By McFann Ô
October 6, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this
Roman Gal—
Thanks. Boy, it took some work to get this guy outta his shell again!
By Bay Area Steve
October 6, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this
Who’s giving the lawyer legal advice?
Free Braveheart.
One harmless turtle comment, and they want to lock you up.
By Braveheart
October 6, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
Hey Braveheart I am pretty sure it is illegal to do what you just did. You know, post an article without citing the source or author.
Sorry goober but DOB cited that very article and the author of it yesterday and I cited the guy and linked him myself yesterday on here and we all had a big ole discussion kissing the writer’s arse yesterday on here.
But you’re technically right, I shouldn’t have forgotten to link him and should have just given a link and not given the whole thing in any regard. Just figured everyone knew whose article it was since there was an earlier discussion on this very blog about that very article.
But there you go goober:
http://www.kansascity.com/180/story/827259.html
Maybe next time, you’ll follow along Original Jon
By DAP
October 6, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this
richbrave i guess your talking about #2 hitters. im looking for qualities, not players.
By DAP
October 6, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
dont worry, braveheart. you may be wanted, but since this is a blog, nobody knows what you look like, where you are or who you are. i think your safe.
By McFann Ô
October 6, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this
Hey, I bought the new issue of ChopTalk today.
Glad I did, though we could do without the full page photo on page 28, couldn’t we? Cringe…
By Braveheart
October 6, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this
One harmless turtle comment, and they want to lock you up.
The turtle doesn’t believe it was harmless. The turtle has filed suit against me, alleging the harmful infliction of emotional distress from words uttered with malice or, in the very least, a reckless disregard for any harm that could be caused by the utterance thereof.
By McFann Ô
October 6, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this
By the way…We all know what important event in Braves History took place on this day, October 6, three years ago, right? (Yeah, I know, I’m driving you people crazy.)
By David O'Brien
October 6, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
OK, I’m home and ready to crank out a blog.
But first, I regret to inform you all that Skip Caray did NOT make the ballot for the Frick award. Which is frickin’ sad, if you ask me. Dude absolutely deserves the award, and didn’t even make the fans’ top three.
Here’s the first part of release I got e-mailed to me:
(COOPERSTOWN, NY) — The 10 finalists for the 2009 Ford C. Frick Award, presented annually for excellence in baseball broadcasting by the National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum, were announced today. The final ballot includes three fan selections produced during a record-total 145,138 votes recorded throughout September exclusively at baseballhall.org.
For the second consecutive year, Joe Nuxhall paced all broadcasters in the fan-voting, totaling 19,547 votes. Jacques Doucet (10,282) and Tom Cheek (8,992) also earned spots on the final ballot, joining seven broadcasters selected by a Hall of Fame research committee: Billy Berroa, Ken Coleman, Dizzy Dean, Lanny Frattare, Tony Kubek, Graham McNamee and Dave Van Horne.
By Original Jon
October 6, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
Ohhh, real big of you to name call. Isn’t it? Sorry, I shouldnt have tried to help. I am also sorry that I do not spend every waking moment on this blog reading every single post that is written, I have better things to do, like live. I get on here to find out basically what Dave has to say and I saw this big long giant post with no source cited and figured, hey, maybe this guy doesnt know. But hey, name call all you want if it makes you feel bigger or better.
By DAP
October 6, 2008 4:01 PM | Link to this
original jon thats it. im calling the cops.
By Thrillhouse44
October 6, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this
Skip didn’t get in??? That’s weak! There’s no excuse for that.
By David O'Brien
October 6, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this
Something less funny than Dane Cook: Frank TV promos.
By Thrillhouse44
October 6, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this
Geez, what’s happening in the world today? OJ is found guilty. Lawerence Phillips is sentenced to 10 years in the pen. And now Braveheart is wanted???
By S E C
October 6, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
Retirement Plan Investment Tip If you had purchased $1000.00 of AIG stock one year ago, it would now be worth $56.91. With Washington Mutual, you would have $120.36 left of the original $1000. With ‘Fannie Mae’(FNM), you would have $11.34 left. If you had purchased $1000.00 of Lehman Bros one year ago it would now be almost worthless; less than $0.86. If you had purchased RH Donelley, you would have $45.69 left. But, if you had purchased $1000.00 worth of beer one year ago, drank all the beer, then turned in the cans for the aluminum recycling refund you would have $214.00. Based on the above, the best current investment advice is to drink hea vily and recycle.
By Bay Area Steve
October 6, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this
Son of a b***.
My broker told me to drink heavily, but I chose whiskey. My recyclables are in worse shape than AIG.
By Braveheart
October 6, 2008 4:50 PM | Link to this
Orginal Jon, my bad, I shouldn’t have called you a name. It’s a very bad habit of mine.
My broker told me to drink heavily, but I chose whiskey. My recyclables are in worse shape than AIG.
Doggone it. I thought Bay Area Steve was one of dem joe six packs. shoulda known he was one of dem whiskey willies……..
By Efrim
October 6, 2008 5:16 PM | Link to this
As much as I would love to see Zack Greinke here, I have a feeling that the asking price would be too high. But I tell ya, if they aren’t going to sign him long term, then why not deal him? If he is apart of your future, then why not show everyone by signing him long term? I guess maybe they haven’t come to that yet….but the clock is ticking.
By McFann Ô
October 6, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this
Great catch an inning ago by Gabe Gross to rob Pierzynski of a homer! Wow. That was nice.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this
DAP-The proclivities of which I speak are not grounding into 3-6-3 double plays-something which with Kotchman’s proclivities to ground the ball to the first baseman, would happen with much more frequency than the Braves need. He is just much better suited (especially with his power potential) for lower in the lineup than #2. Just how often with Escobar and Johnson, did you see Casey batting second? It will be no different next year. Take it to the bank (that is of course, if yours is still solvent-I’m one for two).
By Wayne
October 6, 2008 6:20 PM | Link to this
Lew If Schafer impresses in the spring, and is put into the leadoff spot, as some have predicted, who then of our two middle infielders would you put in the two hole?
My vote would be for KJ, especially if he keeps his agressiveness that he displayed in September.
By Steve from OH
October 6, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
Baseball America’s transaction list:
Atlanta Braves Granted free agency: OF Jason Perry Recalled: RHP Jairo Cuevas, RHP Anthony Lerew, RHP Phil Stockman, LHP Francisley Bueno, LHP Chuck James Removed from 40-man roster: RHP Vladimir Nunez, C Corky Miller, 2B Ruben Gotay
The 28-year-old Perry, a.k.a. the Tigers’ bounty for Jack Hannahan whom they dumped this spring training, received a four-game audition with Atlanta but batted just .118. He did hit a triple, though. The switch-hitting Gotay, who still is just 25, struggled in a pinch-hitting role, bating .235/.322/.343 for the Braves.
By David O'Brien
October 6, 2008 6:37 PM | Link to this
NEW BLOG IS UP
By DAP
October 6, 2008 6:42 PM | Link to this
lew -The proclivities of which I speak are not grounding into 3-6-3 double plays
c’mon man, thats weak. if you really think thats all kotchman ever does, why is he on a major league baseball team.
im not trying to argue that kotchman probably will bat 2nd next year. i dont really think he will.
but thats a side note to the question i proposed to you. try not to avoid it this time. (hint: the question has nothing to do with kotchman, so no need to reference him in your answer) what qualities do you look for in a #2 hitter?
by the way, my banks are fine. thanx for asking.
By Total-E-Sports
October 6, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this
For All the Latest on the MLB Playoffs make sure you check out
Total-E-Sports.blogspot.com
By Lew
October 6, 2008 8:27 PM | Link to this
DAP-Weak? Dude, I agree that Kotchman has potential and we might not have seen it because of the circumstances of his arrival in Atlanta and his Mom’s illness, but I’m not sure what team you were watching if you didn’t notice him grounding to first frequently. For crying our loud-the Dude wore a tunnel to first and I was thinking it wouldn’t be long until they started calling him Mr. 3 Unassisted and NOT because of his defensive prowess.
Dude, I usually respect what you have to say, but I’m completely stymied why you can’t see that either Kelly Johnson OR Yunel Escobar is by far superior a choice for a #2 hitter than Kotsay. I don’t know how to check it out, but I would be willing to bet he grounded to first unassisted at least 20 times after coming to Atlanta. With a runner on first and Kotchman’s total lack of speed down the line, he would lead the league in GIDP if he hits second.
By Lew
October 6, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this
DAP-As for your question, I would like a number two hitter to be able to be patient, take a pitch so the leadoff man (should he reach) has a chance to steal second (. I would also look for someone with good bat control who could hit behind the runner or be able to hit and run. Thirdly, I would like to see a #2 hitter with enough speed to avoid GIDP. None of this describes Kotchman.
Wayne-I would bat Kelly later in the order because it is apparent after his streak in September, that being agressive, rather than painfully patient works better for him. Leave Yunel at #2 and bat Kelly further down.
Another possibility depending on what power bat we get (or not) is to bat Kelly third and let Chipper cleanup.
By John
October 7, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this
I just read T. Moore’s blog about Fran Wren’s “vision.” What is it about TOTAL FAILURE that Frank Wren does not understand?
By NO MORE BOBBY
October 8, 2008 4:22 PM | Link to this
SMOLTZ FOR MANAGER 2010!!!!!!!
By Savannah Guy
October 10, 2008 8:29 AM | Link to this
Hot stove and playoffs… another great October.
Now, trade talks: I’ll trade a Viggio Mortensen and Leo DeCaprio and throw in an Ed Harris for a Daniel Day Lewis. Then I’d throw in any top five prospects for a Russell Crowe. Round out the starting rotation with Christian Bale and be assured of a post season.
Nicholson and Anthony Hopkins are in the twilight of their careers and De Niro is past his prime but I’m keeping them all on the roster… elbow problems or not, they can still carry a game on their shoulders.
I’m thinking Tom Hanks as manager.
By veyutlrf iowcnyspe
November 13, 2008 7:34 AM | Link to this
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By veyutlrf iowcnyspe
November 13, 2008 7:34 AM | Link to this
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