Braves

By DonCoburleone

July 31, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this

Looks like the kid we traded Tony Pena Jr. for, Erik Cordier is having himself a fine season so far at Single A (granted hes 22 and in single A, but he was once a highly rated prospect. Plus, who would have thought we could get anything for Tony Pena to begin with?)

By Herschel Talker

July 31, 2008 2:56 PM | Link to this

First! The Braves should be buyers! Manny Ramirez should be shunned by every team! The Bulldogs are going to go 12-0. DOB is a blind homer!

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this

So far an uneventful trade deadline, hopefully it gets heated up quick.

Any word on if any trades for Braves?

By Tomahawk Kris

July 31, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this

1st?

By Mecha O Brien

July 31, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this

“There’s just something about these Falcons.”

Oops wrong blog! :)

Well as the first comment I have to say that I think next years contention will depend on the off season and what we do with all this money, I still think at worst we have a shot next year at the wild card.

By Matt_T

July 31, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this

A song for Manny?
How about “Highly Suspicious” by MMJ, because that’s how most us react to rumors of him being traded every year

By Matt_T

July 31, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this

A song for Manny?
How about “Highly Suspicious” by MMJ, because that’s how most us react to rumors of him being traded every year

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this

This is the face that launched a thousand ships

Thanks for the updates DOB.

By Yusef Isis

July 31, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this

Dave,

I think this song would fit Manny Ramirez pretty well

Meja - All About the Money

By The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy

July 31, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this

Scoots and Lew from the last blog,

More like the last of the 300-game winners, if you ask me. I’m sure the percentages have tipped to more bloggers unaware of even the existence of Wurlitzers than otherwise. Chances of an award-winner from the current neighborhood bunch is pretty slim, I’m guessing.

That analogy fits, too. I was thinking along the lines of the Jedi. Braveheart is one of the elite.

I can’t say much about it, because I never won a Wurlitzer, but I do know of it’s origins and have seen many of the award-winning posts……back when I was merely a young Hillbilly from the Natural State ;-)

By bravesfaninmetsland

July 31, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this

DOB: This whole Braves year has been depressing to me, so I wanna ask you about something completely different…

When the executive producer of My Boys on TBS (you know, baseball writer who has all this free time to play poker and drink beer) was asked about the lead characters free time, she said they researched and shadowed some baseball writers who do indeed have down time, and rarely travel with the team and write from home.

I look forward to your blogs daily and respect your journalisim to a fault. Are you the hardest working writer in papers or did this producer just hook up with some slack asses? Please tell me it’s the latter

By Matt

July 31, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this

First? Who are the players for Ohman, DOB?

By Braves fan born in 1987

July 31, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this

I could make the obligatory “Take a load off, Manny” post, but I’ll refrain. How bout Neil Young’s “F**kin’ Up?” Sounds about right.

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this

The longer Fuentes stays in Colorado, the better deal the Braves should get for Ohman.

Less than an hour…..

Clean out some of the garbage, Mr. Wren!

By Tomahawk Kris

July 31, 2008 3:05 PM | Link to this

DOB

Song for Manny - how about Dennis Leary’s I’m an A*****? Although that is probably not AJC material

By Heath

July 31, 2008 3:05 PM | Link to this

….deadline has almost come and gone…and kotsay and ohman are still here… they really gonna be here the rest of the season? Shouldn’t we be concerned about trying to put as many people for next year’s team on the field to learn to play with each other?

By eware

July 31, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this

Might not be appropriate for a dude, but howabout Rhett Miller’s “Ain’t That Strange”. Even if it doesn’t work, it’s a pretty cool song.

Boring deadline day so far.

By The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy

July 31, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this

You’re So Vain maybe?

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this

Looks like we may keep Ohman. I’d be happy with that. Hopefully, we get something today.

By Yusef Isis

July 31, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this

For the Manny Ramirez song, a Perfect Fit:.

Meja - All about the Money

By justin

July 31, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this

Want a song for Manny? How about that old 90’s chick rock song “I’m A B***.” Remember that one?

Think Ohman and Kotsay are gonna stay? Theres only an hour left till the deadline and it looks like this year all the big deals are already done.

By Blue Magic

July 31, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this

Cordier is going to be a fighter for our 5 spot next year, IMO. He’s got better stuff and makeup than Morton. Charlie has the advantage of being on the 40 player roster and his experience next year.

Let’s go Chuck tomorrow!!!

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this

The owner is accountable to the media and the fans.Braveheart

I gotta ask: What world you living in?

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this

Hopefully some good trades happen. Preferably some by Braves.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:13 PM | Link to this

Not so fast on Ohman. Braves might just decide to keep him….

By 3trees

July 31, 2008 3:13 PM | Link to this

I might suggest “My Party” off the recently mentioned Mark Knopfler’s (OK, its officially a Dire Straits record) “On Every Street”. He’s playing a totally smug “jagoff” party host in that one and pretty much nails the “me, me, me” thing. Not a great song, but made me think of Manny. I’m sure Randy Newman has a tune that would cover Manny doing Manny.

It gets very interesting for the Braves over the next few years. We’ll get to really see what sort of shape the organization is in and the folks who are guiding/leading it. That, of course, includes the players. Right now, it looks like it might take a while.

Go Braves!

By NCBravesFan

July 31, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

DOB I think the last part of I Want to be Evil by Eartha Kitt kinda sums Manny up nicely …

Like something that seeks it’s level I wanna go to the devil

I wanna be evil, I wanna spit tacks I wanna be evil, and cheat at jacks I wanna be wicked, I wanna tell lies I wanna be mean, and throw mud pies

I want to wake up in the morning with that dark brown taste I want to see some dissipation in my face I wanna be evil, I wanna be mad But more than that I wanna be bad

I wanna be evil, and trump an ace, Just to see my partner’s face I wanna be nasty, I wanna be cruel I wanna be daring, I wanna shoot pool

And in the theatre I want to change my seat Just so I can step on Everybody’s feet

I wanna be evil, I wanna hurt flies I wanna sing songs like the guy who cries I wanna be horrid, I wanna drink booze and whatever I’ve got I’m eager to lose

I wanna be evil, little evil me Just as mean and evil as I can be

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

A few things I wouldn’t mind seeing the next two months….

Fundamental baseball.

A rookie CF. (not Gregor)

Corky hit a broken bat dribbler to the mound….and we find he’s corkin’ his bat.

A shot of Cox by cameras when he’s not pickin’ his nose.

Brandon Jones.

More Prado, even if he platoons with Kelly.

Something promising from Frenchy.

By Thrillhouse44

July 31, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

Re: Manny song, I suggest Crazy by Gnarls Barkley.

By Bobby's Cox

July 31, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

Feliz has been sensational this season in A-ball and Double-A, going 8-3 with a 2.46 ERA and 127 strikeouts and only 35 walks in 102-1/3 innings. That’s one that could haunt the Braves — for a long time.

Key to knowing if a minor league pitching prospect will dominate in the Bigs:

More K’s than innings pitched (i.e K/9 ratio of 9+, but over 11 is really dominant). I’d say that one bites us too. Feliz’s K/9 is 11.17. Ouch.

By The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy

July 31, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

How about Shine by the original Hoss?

My friends never understood my rough & rowdy ways

They think I’m the only fool my daddy ever raised & I don’t shine

Shine shine shine, see me shine

With a little luck & a greenback dollar, You’re gonna see me shine

I like livin’ easy, I like bein’ free

Livin’ free & easy brings out the best in me

Makes me shine

Shine shine shine, makes me shine

With a little luck & a greenback dollar You’re gonna see me shine

By Braves fan born in 1987

July 31, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

Rays get Bay from Pirates for Brignac -Rotoworld

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

Jason Bay to Tampa for Brignac and Neimann?

By Braveheart

July 31, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

Elvis Andrus has numbers at 19 in AA similar to what Edgar Renteria put up at 19 in AA in 2005.

Elvis, 19 yo, AA, 2008: .294/.353/.363, .716 OPS, 11 doubles, 2 triples, 3 homers, 43 stolen bases in 390 plate appearances

Edgar, 19 yo, AA, 1995: .289/.331/.388, 15 doubles, 7 triples, 7 homers, .719 OPS, 30 stolen bases in 540 plate appearances

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this

Integrity. Interesting term. In baseball, it has a multitude of definitions. Does Manny have any integrity? How about Scott Boras? (does anybody really believe that Manny got all worked up all by himself, without some prodding by his agent, who stands to only get paid if Manny’s option is NOT exercised.

OK, back to my point. Whe facing contenders for the next two months, we need to put out the best possible team we can. Does that mean we couldn’t bring up Brandon Jones and plug him into LF, or to bring up Lillibridge to play third, or plug in Sammons while McCann is still ailing (certainly couldn’t be any worse than Corky!).

I would not advocate running out 5-6 rookies while playing the Cubs, or Brewers, etc. I don’t think that putting a couple of rookies in the lineup would damage the Braves integrity. Besides, we are a frickin Mash unit as is!

When playing non-contending clubs, I would sure love to see 3-4 youngsters in there for the next 2 months. Also, let’s plug in a rookie pitcher or two when it is not a critical game (or if we don’t have anybody else who can chuck it up there.)

Now that I have said that, I am not sure that I needed to…..

56 more minutes. Ohman’s price keeps getting higher, especially with his sense of humor, which should bring in a mid-level prospect all by itself!

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this

Apparently, Bay to Rays.

Its on MLB Trade Rumors.

By Taylor S

July 31, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this

Mark Bowman says the Braves may hold on to Ohman. Aparently we asked the Red Sox for a pitching prospect and they passed ?

By Raleigh Brent

July 31, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this

From Baseball Prospectus:

Kevin Goldstein (11:41:36 AM PT): Recent text messages indicate that Paul Byrd and Mark Kotsay are likely not going to go anywhere until next month’s deadline with the waiver wire.

In additon, the Braves cointinue to go through offers for Ohman, and while he’s probably going to go somewhere, the offers are not in the range they expected.

By Lew

July 31, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this

Rhinestone Cowboy-Maybe some day I’ll start the Wurlitzers up again, but after a couple more retinal surgeries, I ended up doing my last portrait with an eye patch on one eye-had the whole Johnny Depp thing going on, right? I can still do the work, but it sure does take longer because I really have to pay attention that a line is actually something I drew as opposed to blood floating around my eye.

By skip

July 31, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this

DOB For the love of Sox fans everywhere, get some type of quote from Julian on the Manny situation!

By Shaun

July 31, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this

How about Foghat’s “Slow Ride” for Manny Ramirez taking 5-6 seconds to get to firstbase on grounders?

By jtb

July 31, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this

N8

No real arguments from me about your last post. I agree that JS deserves some credit for successfully adding parts to the team, but it was Bobby who laid the foundation for the turnaround. Outside of Chipper and Smoltz, I can’t think of any great players taking less money to play for Bobby. Maybe a role player here or there, but even the lifelong Braves (Lopez, Glavine, Furcal, Andruw, etc.) took more money to go elsewhere. The one comforting part about that though is that they all seem to miss the Braves once they leave. Not that it really matters, but it says something about the franchise.

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this

What’s the point in keeping Ohman? Because Cox seems to love putting that “jobber” Boyer in there. So, once Ohman comes in, its already over with.

By Heath

July 31, 2008 3:22 PM | Link to this

…Dave…I hope they only keep Ohman because they are able to by pass free agency and sign him to an extension that makes sense to the Braves… If that can be done…then I would say it is a good move… if not… baaaaad move.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:22 PM | Link to this

bravesfaninmetsland: the latter. there is very little about that show that is even remotely realistic.

I watched parts of two episodes last year. Saw enough. When one male sportswriter gave her a ball autographed by a current player as a gift, in the pressbox, I was incredulous. You’ve got to be freakin’ kidding me. First of all, that’s about the last gift any sportswriter I know would want. Secondly, if a scene like that ever unfolded in a pressbox, they’d both be banished. Or at least humiliated by anyone who saw the grotesque event occur.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 3:22 PM | Link to this

Bobby’s Cox The Freel thing is a joke. Try to keep up…

By Sox Fan

July 31, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this

Song suggestion for Manny and the Sawks:

We Just Disagree by Dave Mason…

there ain’t no good guy, there and no bad guy, there’s only you and me and we just disagree.

;-)

By Sox Fan

July 31, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this

Song suggestion for Manny and the Sawks:

We Just Disagree by Dave Mason…

there ain’t no good guy, there ain’t no bad guy, there’s only you and me and we just disagree.

;-)

By twosheds

July 31, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this

How about “Little B*******” by the A* Ponys?

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this

Highly Suspicious by MMJ — that’s a candidate, for sure. Good choice.

Let’s keep trying, though.

By westy12

July 31, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this

Random,

Here’s why your roster percentage method doesn’t work as a gauge for how the Braves fill holes. Take the recent history of the SS position, for example. Furcal left via free agency, and there was no can’t-miss prospect to take over. Hence, a hole.

The Braves traded a prospect for Renteria, filling the hole at SS. Before Renteria’s contract expired, another top prospect, Escobar, showed that he was ready to take over. The Braves were able to save money, and acquire two prospects by trading Renteria.

Escobar didn’t fill a hole. There was never a hole to fill. Renteria would still be with the Braves if Escobar wasn’t ready to take over.

If you don’t understand this, there’s no point in further debate.

So, I say jb’s casual statement that the Braves frequently trade prospects to fill holes was perfectly reasonable. It certainly didn’t deserve your typical condescending remarks and personal attacks.

There are plenty of examples to be cited, just as I pointed out to you with Renteria, but most of us don’t have time to research well-known facts to satisfy your silly “where are your footnotes” game. Pointing out that a blog poster didn’t provide a bibliography doesn’t make you the winner of any debate. Nice try though.

Or maybe not. Maybe DoucheBag.com didn’t think your last post was worthy of sponsorship? I don’t know why, I thought it was right up there with your typical smarmy responses.

By Renegator

July 31, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this

DOB

You mentioned that Ohman has enjoyed pitching here in Atlanta. Any chance he signs an extension and doesn’t hit free agency this off-season?

As I mentioned yesterday - he is perfect for a Bobby Cox bullpen. He seems to thrive in the environment of being over-used.

Wow Chuck James is starting tomorrow night? How low can this season go? Who would’ve thought that the Hawks would out perform the Braves this year?

By DAP

July 31, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this

scots, lew, The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy

where have all the former wulitzer winners gone anways? it seems like we lost alot of bloggers this year, and a few bloggers just went off the deep end. the blog has changed alot…still great, but not as many great bloggers.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this

Bobby’s Cox The Freel thing is a joke. Try to keep up…

By Michael Procton

July 31, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this

Hmm…let’s not get ahead of ourselves on Cordier. A 1.52 WHIP ain’t gonna translate to an ERA in the 2s in AA, much less the majors.

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this

The A*******hole Song by Jimmy Buffett

1987 I’m hearing the same (Bay to the Rays) on Tampa radio. But their source is Rotoworld as well.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this

Rhinestone Cowboy: Yes, but Waylon’s “Shine” would seem to suggest Manny’s just misunderstood, that he’s a free spirited good guy, etc. I don’t want to imply that at all.

NCBravesFan: I Want to be Evil … now THAT is an original and very appropriate entry. Strong candidate.

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 3:29 PM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah: I commented on the “integrity” comment(s) on the other blog right before we got the new one.

Look at Monday’s lineup:

G Blanco LF 4 1 4 1 1 0 0 .271

Y Escobar SS 5 0 0 0 0 1 5 .280

M Kotsay CF 5 0 1 0 0 0 4 .289

G Norton 1B 4 0 2 1 1 0 0 .224

O Infante 3B 5 0 0 0 0 0 6 .283

K Johnson 2B 3 1 1 0 1 1 3 .264

J Francoeur RF 3 1 1 1 1 0 0 .232

C Miller C

If THAT’S integrity, I want none of it.

If we are interested in finding out if Brandon Jones is an everyday LF, play him. Every day. Vs. contenders.

The poster(s) claiming a lack of integrity for playing a few rookies is basically saying that September baseball lacks integrity.

Please.

By Mac

July 31, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this

Edgar was actually 18 that season. He lied about his age; like Betemit, he was too young to sign.

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this

Jason Bay to Tampa for Brignac and Neimann?

I know, right?

By Walt Jocketty

July 31, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this

Please take Adam Dunn off our hands!

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this

Bay to the Ray

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this

OK, back to my point. Whe facing contenders for the next two months, we need to put out the best possible team we can. Does that mean we couldn’t bring up Brandon Jones and plug him into LF, or to bring up Lillibridge to play third, or plug in Sammons while McCann is still ailing (certainly couldn’t be any worse than Corky!).Wayne In Utah

Certainly nothing at all wrong with those suggestions. It’s the bring up Diory H. (what, and play in place of Escobar) and a bunch of non-40-man-roster types that were named earlier that was ridiculous.

LEW: You saw Don’s message about the Wurlitzer, right? He really digs the Alejandro Escovedo drawing, going to frame it and hang it in his new shop if he gets the lease on the place to go through. If not, we might have no more Ella Guru. That would be a bad thing.

Ella Guru is good.

By Jimmie "Bo" Horne

July 31, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this

Song should be “Dance Across the Floor” because Manny knows how to move. And that was Jimmie “BO’s” best piece of work.

By BossLady

July 31, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this

No Song?

By Patrick

July 31, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this

Love to see Tampa going for it. Nice pickup in Bay!

By Raleigh Brent

July 31, 2008 3:34 PM | Link to this

Unless the best prospect we could get in return for Ohman is a pyromaniac or severe headcase or would actually detract from the organization, I don’t see why we wouldn’t trade him. There is absolutely no point in keeping him right now.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 3:34 PM | Link to this

Manny’s song: Lisa Loeb in the 80’s did “Shove Me in the Shallow Water”

By Greg

July 31, 2008 3:35 PM | Link to this

DOB,

Wasnt Hanson’s no-no at Mississippi? I believe he had been struggling then was quoted as saying something just “clicked” which makes the mediocre AA numbers that much less disheartening.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this

Sox Fan: Seriously, that Dave Mason song is one of my all-time favorites. Love that song, one of those I remember so clearly listening to on the radio as a kid.

But it says “there ain’t no good guy, there ain’t no bad guy, there’s only you and me and we just disagree.”

And while Theo may not be the good guy, we know Manny is the bad guy. So that doesn’t work.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this

Or was it “Choke Me in the Shallow Water”??

By BossLady

July 31, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

Clowns to the Left Jokers to the Right, and Stuck in the Middle with Manny.

By d-rock in Scotland

July 31, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

Manny Song:

“He’s Such a D!ck”,

-Golden Smog

By 18 Wheels of Love

July 31, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

How about Goodbye by the DBT’s?

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

If the Braves aren’t getting good offers for Ohman, then I hope they do keep him. I’d try to re-sign him before the season’s up. Even if they do end up trading him, I hope they tell him beforehand they’ll want to talk to him in the offseason.

By 22oz

July 31, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

Ugh, i tried to listen to Rob Dibble & Kevin Kennedy on XM to get any breaking trades, but i can’t do it anymore. I never listen to their show because i can’t stand either one of them, but i thought maybe a trade deadline show might be tolerable. Wrong. DIbble is awful, and Kennedy hasn’t even come on yet. Back to surfin the net for news…

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this

How in the hell did the Rays get Bay for 2 prospects when we offered 4?

By duh

July 31, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this

Didn’t Wren say he wasn’t through dealing? Uh where are they?

By DonCoburleone

July 31, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this

Mark Bowman is saying that the Braves don’t have a better deal on the table for Ohman than the supplemtal draft pick they would get if they kept him… How is that possible? A pick somehwere between 30 and 45 is better than a proven minor league prospect?

By matt_T

July 31, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this

Not too original but how about “Satisfaction” by the Rolling Stones.

Or maybe for Manny, Britney Spears cover…

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this

Run Heap, that’s be perfect. But can’t post those lyrics.

By 22oz

July 31, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this

Jerry Reed-“She got the Goldmine, i got the shaft”

By Shaun

July 31, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this

Manny’s song: “Slow Ride” for his 5-6 second jogs to first on ground outs.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this

TommyP The lineup you posted was about as good as it gets that night. No Chipper, Heap or Tex available.

By Michael

July 31, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

DOB: I read somewhere the Braves might not trade Ohman because they think he will be a Type B free agent. How does Elias decide who is a Type A (top 30%), Type B (20%), or Type C (rest), and is it easy to predict?

By jcmo71

July 31, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

Org. John, probably the quality of the prospects.

By Braves fan born in 1987

July 31, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

If it was from Manny’s point of view, Idiot Wind by our Greatest Living Prophet would certainly work. Or The Black Keys’ The Flame (“I know we can’t regain the flame”)

By Lew

July 31, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

Wayne-On the other blog, you asked what I would do with the rotation (and the club) if we did not sign one or more of the ancient ones-something I still contend we should avoid at all costs.

First thing I would do and I would do it today, is to sign Jorge Campillo to at least a two year deal. If anyone doesn’t realize that by now he is the real deal, then they will never be convinced. If he doesn’t start, he can always eat innings in the pen and he should not be overly expensive. Lock him up NOW.

In the offseason, I would do everything humanly (or inhumanly if that’s what it takes) to sign Sabbathia. This would fall in the category of essential now that Hudson is gone for most, if not all next year (maybe never to pitch for Atlanta again). That would give us a starting three of CC, JJ and Campillo.

Then I would trade for a proven mid to bottom rotation pitcher for the number four slot and let Chuckie (Hope he’s been learning that third pitch), JoJO and Morton battle it out for the number five starter role. Add Lerew to the mix and possibly Hanson and there’s your starting depth if you need it. You still should have $15-20 million left to do more dealing.

Next, I would move Kelly Johnson back to left field and find the best second baseman I could find via trade or free agency, or leave KJ where he is and sign a power hitting outfielder for left field. Blanco is shoing more promise as a leadoff guy than I ever thought possible and even Frenchy is showing sign of coming back-at least somewhat at this point

With whatever cash is left (and it should be relatively considerable, especially since McGuirk is still claiming there will be a boost in payroll, I would boost the bench by dumping Corky and finding a decent back up catcher and replace Norton and Gotay. Keep Infante. He is proving to be a good glove man and good hitter with Chipper out.

Those are the moves I would make (and signing Will Ohman for a couple years if we don’t trade him).

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

Brent Lillibridge and Brandon Jones alone are better than the prospects the Rays gave up to get Bay, and we were going to throw in 2 more players. What are they smoking to give up Bay for just 2 meager prospects?

By ernesto

July 31, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

“The Asshle Song (Were You Born An Asshle)” by Buffet is a fine one.

By BA

July 31, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

I don’t think calling up Diory Hernandez would be ridiculous. Extremely unlikely, but not ridiculous. The kid has hit around .300 all year down (or up) there. Couldn’t be worse than Gotay- he still has that Mutts stench on him.

By Hotspur

July 31, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah —

Are you thinking of “What I Am” by Edie Brickell and New Bohemians?

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

DOB: What’s ridiculous is your closed-minded thinking.

Diory being a SS doesn’t mean he can’t play some 2B. Are you friggin’ kidding me?

“Bunch of non-40-man roster types”……When a player is dealt (Ohman, Kotsay, maybe another player) from the 40, someone else is added.

And the players I mentioned were the only ones that POSSIBLY have a future in Atlanta.

Ridiculous?

Using the term “jagoff” in your blog and expecting to be taken seriously would be ridiculous.

By Bobby's Cox

July 31, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

Wayne Thanks. After posting i reread the thread. Thank god.

Doc

Nice last post on last blog. Here’s a lineup or 2 I’d like to see before chipper’s back:

Blanco(LF), Prado, Escobar, McCann, infante, Kotchman, anderson (CF), frenchy.

or

Blanco (CF), escobar, Kotchman, McCann, infante, KJ (LF), Prado, Frenchy

When Chip’s back:

Blanco, escobar, Chipper, McCann, Infante, Kotchman, Prado, Frenchy.

or

Blanco, prado, Chipper, McCann, Escobar, Kotchman, frenchy, KJ.

By Robert S

July 31, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this

Doesn’t look like Ohman’s going anywhere. The Braves were rightfully looking for a pitching prospect from Boston (not a Masterson or Buchholz-caliber, mind you), but Boston passed.

That might be a good thing. As bad as this team is right now, they need all the humor they can get.

Fifteen minutes left. Something could happen, though.

By GeneGarbage

July 31, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this

DOB- have you seen the Zack Galifianakis dvd- Live at the Purple Onion? F’n hilarious- right up your ally

By TexasBrave

July 31, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this

Wayne great suggestion. I think it was “shove” not “choke” but the latter would be more appropriate.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this

Raleigh Brent: Sure there is a reason. Braves are going to lose draft picks when they sign a free agent or two this winter, so if they can get a pick by keeping a guy now, unless there’s a good trade offer for that guy, then why not wait to get the pick?

Braves like to use the draft, and you can’t if you have no picks in the early rounds. If no team makes you an offer of a solid prospect now for Ohman, why not keep him. And then might come to their senses and realize he’s worth re-signing. They need to fortify the bullpen, in part because you can’t count on Soriano, frankly.

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this

Oh, and I have a song for Manny Ramirez

‘You’re So Vain” by Carly Simon

By Shaun

July 31, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this

Original Jon, do we know which prospects? Maybe the Rays two prospects are better than the Braves’ four.

By westy12

July 31, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

Nice call, d-rock!

A Smog reference…Well done.

By murph2thehall

July 31, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

So is there any reason why Ring, Taverez, Hampton, Gotay and Norton anymore? Since none of them will be a part of out team next season we need to get rid of them and bring up some youngsters to get some experience and see what they can do.

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

15 minutes….

Hey DOB what’s up with Esco? Is he still in some pain? Sux that he hurt his shoulder just as he was getting hot, he’s been cold as ice since coming back.

By N8

July 31, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

Interested Observer

“If the Braves aren’t getting good offers for Ohman, then I hope they do keep him.”

If they’re not gonna trade him, then they damn well BETTER keep him at all costs.

If he walks at the end of the year, going to the highest bidder and all the “I love playing for Bobby” was just smoke and mirrors, then Wren should be fired immediately.

Zero reason to keep him for the next two months, if your not positive you can and will re-sign him. It’s that simple.

By mitchie-san

July 31, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

lisa loeb didnt sing that song.

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah: It SHOULDN’T be as good as it gets is my point.

Corky Miller? Definitely in the running for worst major leaguer I’ve EVER seen.

When you don’t spend money on your bench, “that’s as good as it gets.”

Again, I’d much rather see rookies in place of that dead weight on the roster.

By Kentavo

July 31, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this

Songs for Manny:

What about “Big Shot” by Billy Joel?

or “The Big Money” by Rush?

or “Put the Money Down” by The Who?

“Bushleaguer” by Pearl Jam?

By Robert S

July 31, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this

Original Jon, MLB’s Jonathan Mayo says “hold your horses” on that Bay-to Tampa deal. There’s a hangup over Brignac being dealt. So it could fall apart…….eleven minutes, and we’ll know for sure…

By The Goche

July 31, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this

I know the time is almost past, but does anyone else think it would be wise to trade Soriano to someone, like the Yankees maybe.

I think he’s good and all, and I’m not saying we don’t need a closer because we can’t compete next year, or anything like that, but I don’t think that we’re going to win the division because we are paying a closer $6 million. Plus I’d bet he’s gone after that, better now then trying to squeeze something out of him next deadline.

We have enough other holes that that money could certainly be better utilized. I say we go into next year with a bullpen centered around Ohman (if he’s 3 mill or less) and Gonzo. Hopefully Moylan back before too long. (And if Smoltz somehow gets back for part of the year would that be in the pen or the rotation).

We could just as easily move Sori in the offseason though. So, the ship hasn’t totally sailed.

By the way, Jason Stark on the “worldwide leader’s” deadline blog says the Braves have informed other teams that unless they pony up quick we’ll keep him.

By geauxbraves2000

July 31, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this

How about “Too Sexy”. (He probably thinks he is.)

Geaux Braves!!

By BravesFanInRockies

July 31, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

Unless something happens in the next 70 minutes I’m going to have to remember how that whole get-through-waivers trade thing works.

Crap.

By Bo

July 31, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

espn just said, braves trying to get deal for ohman but may not get it done. Bay to rays not a done deal yet.Both noy agreeing. 10 mins to go.

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

Bay to Rays ISN’T final yet.

By Lew

July 31, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this

DOB-Yes, I did see his post and he’s certainly welcome. He sure has helped me (and many other Denizens, I’m sure) to find some hard to get music. Glad he likes it.

By J.D. Phillips

July 31, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this

There must not be an injury prone pitcher available via trade.

By N8

July 31, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah

“Manny’s song: Lisa Loeb in the 80’s did “Shove Me in the Shallow Water””

Not that I’m a fan of either, but it was actually Edie Berkel (sp?) and the New Bohemians. Not Lisa Loeb. Lisa Loeb was a “90’s” girl.

Edie Berkel was married to Paul Simon.

By Lee

July 31, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this

Jayson Stark says Braves keeping Ohman.

By Bobby's Cox

July 31, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this

Greg

The no-hitter was at Mississippi.You’re right.

By Phil

July 31, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this

Goofball Wren is working on a blockbuster trade with Green Bay for Brett Favre…..

By BKH

July 31, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this

Manny’s song: Freebird - “If I leave here tomorrow, would you still remember me?”

By Shaun

July 31, 2008 3:54 PM | Link to this

DonCoburleone, I’m guessing the Braves are thinking there is a decent chance they can re-sign Ohman or are trying to get teams to up the offers they’ve already received or both.

By NCBravesFan

July 31, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this

DOB Thanks. In this 1962 version, Eartha even looks a little like Manny …

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQ5VaBgXzuM

By Renegator

July 31, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this

What a boring trade deadline day.

Boo

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this

DonCoburleone what is a proven minor league prospect?

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this

DonC, you know something we don’t? Because I haven’t heard of a solid minor league prospect being offered for Ohman.

By ncscoots

July 31, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this

BTW Dude, Just read the new Chop Talk. The Glavines have a dog named Scoots.

Ahhh, man, that ain’t right. That just…ain’t…right.

Dog probably has good speed, but a poor SB percentage, I’m guessing.

No relation, me and the dog, BTW, despite the churlish thoughts of many in this forum.

Or at least humiliated by anyone who saw the grotesque [autographed-ball] event occur.

Yes, savaged by the ink-stained wretches, I like it. DOB snaps one off at the knees on the black. Boo-yah.

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 3:57 PM | Link to this

Well, this year’s trade deadline day has sucked.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 3:57 PM | Link to this

d-Rock, great choice, by a great band. Golden Smog is entirely underrated.

But can’t post those lyrics, either.

By OrlandoFan

July 31, 2008 3:58 PM | Link to this

My choice for Manny’s song: “Rosie” by Jackson Brown. If you know the song, you know why.

By Bobby's Cox

July 31, 2008 3:58 PM | Link to this

If that Bay to the Rays deal is legit, MLB.com is slow as hell.

You’d think MLB’s webpage would be the 1st to report. The blog mentioned it 20 min ago, and with 3 min to the deadline, nothing on MLB.com excpet the Fish getting Rhodes, and Griffey to White Sox.

By ObiWanKobe

July 31, 2008 3:58 PM | Link to this

How about ” I think I’m Paranoid” by Garbage (which Manny is btw). Here is a snippet of the lyrics:

-I think I’m paranoid And complicated I think I’m paranoid Manipulate it

-I fall down just to give you a thrill Prop me up with another pill If I should fail, if I should fold I nailed my faith to the sticking pole

-Steal me, deal me, anyway you heal me Maim me, tame me, you can never change me Love me, like me, come ahead and fight me Please me, tease me, go ahead and leave me

By NASCAR fanatic.

July 31, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this

@DOB,

How does Corky Miller still have a job? Is the braves farm system that depleted? Last night he was bunting with the pitcher coming up. Let’s play Clint Sammons everyday. Do we have another players as a servicable backup to Mcann? Please say yes. Watching Corky Miller is dangerous to my health.

By tr

July 31, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this

For Manny:

Joe Vatale’s “Rollercoaster Weekend”

By OrlandoFan

July 31, 2008 4:01 PM | Link to this

DOB: Have to tell you that after years of missing out on it, my wife and I have been watching The Wire. Got the entire series (well, we’re up to the third year) from Netflix. Have been amazed by that show. Incredible writing and acting. And the score is great, too, often just plain great theater. Thanks for your endorsement on that.

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this

Looks like no trades will occur until August’s waiver deadline.

By Braves WIll WIn

July 31, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this

People the reason we are not getting Bay for our offer is that the pirates don’t want to get shafted again. Hint: Laroche trade. The Braves rapped the Pirates in that deal.

By will36206

July 31, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this

DOB, if Mike Hampton has a couple of good outings do you think he might be claimed in a waiver deal. I’ve got to believe he will be put on waivers. Makes no sense for Braves management not to take a shot.

By Tomas

July 31, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this

The deadline is over.

By N8

July 31, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

I must apologize for my “fire Frank Wren” if he doesn’t trade Ohman.

Didn’t realize that we’d get a decent pick for him if he leaves. Add that to the fact that DOB is correct. Similar to signing Glavine last year, Wren might be more busy than normal in free agency, which means most of our picks will go bye bye.

By Mac

July 31, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

“Brain Damage” by Pink Floyd.

By sooner

July 31, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this

‘If You’ve Got The Money I’ve Got The Time’ - Willie Nelson

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this

I stand corrected on my singer, but the song still fits: “the elevator doesn’t go to the top floor with poor Manny!”

As far as Manny goes, I would love to see the Sox not take his option, and then he gets a 1-2 year offer for 15-20 million total!! Poetic justice for the jerk.

I would think with some of his comments, the Sox would have a case to get some of their $$ back.

Welcome back to the Braves, Mr. Will Ohman. Glad to have you on board.

By 18 Wheels of Love

July 31, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this

I got it….

A Blessing and a Curse lyrics!

When it all comes down There’ll be nothing left to catch you but ground It’s calling your name and filling your head With delusions of glory

Is that how you’re gonna write your story? Down in your time as a high-flying flame out? Sucking on what’s left of your trust fund? Sucking on the end of a shot gun?

By Woodrow

July 31, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this

DOB:

What about “Crazy as a Loon” by John Prine???

By Stuart

July 31, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this

DOB,

Your 3:47 post about Ohman is as right as any that you have ever posted. Not that you need us to agree with you, but I could not have said what you said about Ohman, Soriano and the draft any better.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this

When you’re not willing to give $3 million to a top-quality lefty reliever, you end up with the Royce Rings of the world!

By ObiWanKobe

July 31, 2008 4:09 PM | Link to this

Martha Wainwright “Bloody Mother effing As*$#!”

(Can’t post the lyrics either)

By Bobby's Cox

July 31, 2008 4:09 PM | Link to this

since this has been a boring trade day, i thought you might me interesting in hearing some breaking news….

They found water on Mars.

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this

Looks like the only deal was Teixeira… a Boras client. Fitting.

Now some time to watch these partially made over Braves. See if we can find some highlights and positives come out of these guys as they play out the season.

By The Goche

July 31, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this

Braves are going to lose draft picks when they sign a free agent or two this winterDOB

Obviously it still stinks to lose 2nd and 3rd rounders, but aren’t we safe (assuming we don’t get super hot or something) for the first round.

Top 15 picks are protected, correct? Currently, we are 24th in the league in record and falling and 5 games and 9 teams back from falling out of those top 15 picks.

In other “seeing the bright side” news, is anyone else excited to see what we could get if we pick 7th (as we would be now) or near there. Our last top 15 pick in the last 20 years (approximately) was Jason Heyward.

By Shamus Thacker

July 31, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this

I nominate David Allen Coe’s “The Azzhole Song.”

By Obi Wan Kenobi

July 31, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this

Met’s you will choke.

Ryan Howard, Chase Utley, and Jimmy Rollins need surgery and miss next season.

May the force be with the Braves. Hampton, Chipper you will not get injured.

By Thrillhouse44

July 31, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this

Lew, take care of those eyes, man. The world needs more of your good art for sure.

DOB, any chance Don takes his store online? I’m sure many denizens would order from him if he did.

By Rhett

July 31, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

DOB - Not perfect, but the first thing I thought of….

What have I become My sweetest friend Everyone I know goes away In the end And you could have it all My empire of dirt I will let you down I will make you hurt

If I could start again A million miles away I would keep myself I would find a way

By jtb

July 31, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

TommyP

I feel like one of the Braves problems with the Braves the past couple of years has been the assumption that players can just switch postions without it having much of an effect on theere performance defensively and offensively. ie. KJ at 2nd, Gotay at 3rd, Nortan and Infante in left, Salty at first last year. If you look at the teams in the World Series every year, they tend to have players playing at their natural positions.

By Big Easy

July 31, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

I second Mac. Hard to beat the Floyd’s Brain Damage

The lunatic is on the grass. The lunatic is on the grass Remembering games, daisy chains and laughs Got to keep the loonies on the path

~E~

By BravesinTN

July 31, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this

“Don’t Go Away Mad (Just Go Away)” by Motley Crue

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

My memory fails me. Wasn’t Edie Brickell a hot ticket?

I like “Free Bird” and “Brain Damage” both for Manny songs.

Or maybe the theme song to “Pee-Wee’s Playhouse”

By Ace

July 31, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

For a Manny song, we could turn to our local lads:

Collective Soul, “Smashing Young Man”

www.lyricsfreak.com/c/collective+soul/smashing+young+man_20032680.html

By Graham

July 31, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

If teams are involved in talks up to the trade deadline, but have not secured a deal specifically, can MLB extend the deadline for those teams to see if a deal gets done?

By Tomas

July 31, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

If the manny trade had happened, the pirates would have gotten 5 young players including Hermida. They would have been the winners in that trade.

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

Just ‘cause 4:00 passed doesn’t mean we won’t hear of some trades. Many have been mentioned in the 5:00 hour due to waiting for approval from the Commish.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this

Did we make it??

Cecil34 (Last blog)—

Yeah, I guess so. (Well, there’s one good thing about the trade ; ) ) Sorry.

3BMac should be ready to play “soon” (but not soon enough!) Read on braves.com that he could be cleared to begin light baseball activities today!

Has this week gone by slow or what? Dude! I keep thinkin’ it’s Friday, but no, it’s only Thursday! Sheesh…

BKH—

Hey now! Manny doesn’t deserve a song like that!

By Tyler

July 31, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this

DOB Any word on if the game will be played tonight or not? Thanks!

By Tyler

July 31, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this

DOB Any word on if the game will be played tonight or not? Thanks!

By Tomas

July 31, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this

Manny = Bob Marley but with an uglier hair.

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

Millionaire Blues Mark Knopfler

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

Jtb: The only player of substance you mentioned was Kelly. And when did he have better numbers as a LF????????????

Norton, Gotay, Infante and Salty: Journeymen and a prospect.

Salty’s hitting woes weren’t the result of switching positions. He hasn’t hit that well as a catcher or DH in the majors, either.

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

Glad they hung onto Ohman. As good as he has been this season I hope Wren signs him. He seems to really want to stay, unlike the lip service Tex issued the other evening.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this

Lew—

Yes, do take care! Your drawings are so good! (Love the McCann one you sent me in January!)

Dang! My stupid ; ) in my last post got cut off!

Is Ohman still here??

By TheCutMan

July 31, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this

Whew! It’s about as clear as it can get that the Braves need to go fast-forward on this new re-building, re-tooling, or re-(put your own label here) and NOT give up any more quality young prospects.

Check on that, now that the deadline has passed. I’m extremely glad they didn’t palm off Will Ohman either as he’s really the best guy they have in the ‘pen right now and so what if it costs a middling $3M or so to re-sign the guy? Duh.

Actually, this is a great time to be a Braves fan because it’s the old ‘out with the old and in with the new’ time, isn’t it? Time for the young lions to come up and display their wares.

Time for a re-assessment of the current on-field leadership? Most definitely! I’m most happy the Braves didn’t mortgage more of their future for a rental or leased player.

I’ll close by stating that the Braves and Frank Wren did marvelously well in prying Kotchman and Marek away from the Angels for a guy that will break their bank to re-sign.

MEMO TO: Halos. Be sure to enjoy those 25-50 at bats from Teix in the post season and then ask yourselves if he was all that much better than the guy you dealt?

By IgCognito

July 31, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this

how about Floyd’s Comfortably Numb? That’s my nomination…

By Chief Nocahoma

July 31, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this

The curse will continue until my teepee is restored!

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 4:29 PM | Link to this

Manny dealt according to rotoworld.

By Logan

July 31, 2008 4:29 PM | Link to this

Manny to the Dodgers according to si’s Heyman. We’ll See!

By Randy

July 31, 2008 4:29 PM | Link to this

Did you just write Jagoff in the AJC? CAN you write Jagoff in the AJC?

Can I write Jagoff?

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this

MLB.com is saying that the Dodgers MAY have struck a last minute deal for Bay. Nothing official though.

By Ace

July 31, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this

“Smahsing Young Man”

Beggars description Of what Ive been missing Exploit your position Dont think I didnt listen Hey I hope youre feeling A little better now

Success is so tragic Pain is your gadget Your tongues just lashing Just b*** by habit Hey I hope youre feeling A little purer now Hey I hope youre feeling Securer now

Help me I plea I dont understand Your ways and means You smashing young man Help me to see The good you have planned Youre wearing thin You smashing young man

You preach synthetic-like Peace is an oversight Its nothing to ignite Your self-lit spotlight Hey I hope youre feeling A little special now Hey I want to tell you I think youre special now

I dont recall asking for guidance I dont recall wanting to I dont recall bowing before you But Im so impressed With the kindness in your attitude

By IgCognito

July 31, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this

Manny to the Dodgers according to Heyman…

Manny to the Dodgers

By DAP

July 31, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this

Tomas Manny = Bob Marley but with an uglier hair.

take it back. not the thing about manny’s hiar, about manny=marley. so not true.

By matt_T

July 31, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this

SI is saying Manny to Dodger: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/baseball/mlb/07/31/manny.sweepstakes/index.html?eref=T1

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this

Manny Maybe Headed To The Dodgers

From MLBTR:

3:26pm: Many people are emailing saying Jon Heyman is reporting Manny to the Dodgers.

WOW

By NCBravesFan

July 31, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this

FoxSports reporting the Dodgers may have gotten Manny.

By lewie

July 31, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

DOB song for manny: leaving trunk…pick any version but i’ve always enjoyed the taj, black keys and derek trucks band takes on the tune…cheers

helluva braves blog as always…my first year finding out about it and i check it every day…keep it up

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

Manny To Dodgers & Bay To Red Sox

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/baseball/mlb/07/31/manny.sweepstakes/index.html?eref=T1

WOW

By Einstein

July 31, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

I am amazed at the amount of total idiots that post on here.

Like this guy:

“TommyP

I feel like one of the Braves problems with the Braves the past couple of years has been the assumption that players can just switch postions without it having much of an effect on theere performance defensively and offensively. ie. KJ at 2nd, Gotay at 3rd, Nortan and Infante in left, Salty at first last year. If you look at the teams in the World Series every year, they tend to have players playing at their natural positions.”

Ummm…Kevin Youkilis plays 1B or 3B..and they manage to win titles???

I mean do you know what a utility player is?..well Prado, Infante, Gotay were signed/traded for to play “utility roles”..they didn’t sign Greg Norton for his defensive prowess…they signed him because he has some pop off the bench and is a versatile (not great, but versatile) player in the field.

Kelly Johnson playing 2nd base is not the reason the Braves are in fourth place.

Will people please try to start posting facts that support their arguments?

I once had an Econ teacher in college who preached that anyone who tries to argue their point of view without supporting data should be ignored. I understand what he meant now. I wish there was an ignore feature on this blog.

DOB: thanks for the updates…keep’em coming!!!

By Chris

July 31, 2008 4:35 PM | Link to this

Looks like Manny is going to the Dodgers but nobody knows for who yet.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this

So, the Bay to the Dodgers trade was part of the Manny to the Dodgers trade. Bay ends up going to the Red Sox. It all makes sense now.

By tr

July 31, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this

I like BravesinTN’s song suggestion:

“Don’t Go Away Mad (Just Go Away)” by Motley Crue

By Anders Dad

July 31, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this

Hey Anders, Where is your mom? I am still waiting my newspaper & my cigars!!!

By tr

July 31, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this

Manny Ramirez has been traded to the Dodgers in a three-team blockbuster, pending the approval of the commissioner’s office, according to a source with knowledge of the deal.

Pirates outfielder Jason Bay is headed to the Red Sox. The Pirates will receive Andy LaRoche and right-hander Bryan Morris from the Dodgers and outfielder Damien Moss and releiver Craig Hansen from the Red Sox.

The Red Sox will pay all of the approximately $7 million remaining on Ramirez’s contract.

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 4:42 PM | Link to this

Pirates hit the jackpot….

They will get….

The Pirates will receive Andy LaRoche and right-hander Bryan Morris from the Dodgers and outfielder Brandon Moss and releiver Craig Hansen from the Red Sox.

By Randy

July 31, 2008 4:43 PM | Link to this

DOB,

Any chance of Fox letting the Ohman lineup be put on YouTube?

Does Ohman have the copyright on that? Maybe he can come out with some kind of DVD for Christmas?

Also, why not bring Ohman in the 8th inning last night to start off instead of Blaine “Major Appliance” Boyer.

By Braveheart

July 31, 2008 4:43 PM | Link to this

Gotta go with a Cypress Hill song for Manny:

Insane in the Brain

Stoned is the Way of the Walk

Dr. Greenthumb

I Wanna Get High

Hits From The Bong

Here’s the Cypress Hill song for Theo Epstein:

How I Could Just Kill A Man

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 4:43 PM | Link to this

This is from Ken Rosenthal:

Manny Ramirez has been traded to the Dodgers in a three-team blockbuster, pending the approval of the commissioner’s office, according to a source with knowledge of the deal.

Pirates outfielder Jason Bay is headed to the Red Sox. The Pirates will receive Andy LaRoche and right-hander Bryan Morris from the Dodgers and outfielder Brandon Moss and releiver Craig Hansen from the Red Sox. The Red Sox will pay all of the approximately $7 million remaining on Ramirez’s contract.

By Ron_Paul aka The Dude

July 31, 2008 4:43 PM | Link to this

Sometimes there comes a man…I won’t say a hero…cause what’s a hero?

Just checked in…to see what condition my condition was in…

Possible song for Manny?

By Smoky Joe Wood

July 31, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this

Manny song: How about the best rock song ever (according to Rolling Stone, and I concur) and a great b***-out song: Like a Rolling Stone? “Now you don’t talk so loud/Now you don’t seem so proud/How does it feel?”

Or maybe one of the best crazy dude songs—Tom Waits’ “What’s He Building in There?”

By bsj

July 31, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this

Uncommon Connection - Hiatt. “It takes every drop of energy just to run my brain…”

I like the idea of keeping Ohman. Along with Moylan, Boyer, Gonzo and Soriano, that’s decent out of the pen next year. Hopefully, Liberty will cough up the cash for him and an outfielder with some pop.

Oh, and there is the little matter of a staff ace… though JJ is on the cusp, methinks. He’s got the stuff and the makeup.

By sicofmusikblogs

July 31, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this

DAP your 3:26 question The good ones have probably gone on to sports blogs that blog sports and not “music”

By Big Easy

July 31, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

More Floyd suggestions:

Money (this one is obvious) Nobody Home What Do You Want From Me? Poles Apart

Just to name a few….

~E~

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

Wow Manny to the Sox! Bet that would have brought in Conner Jackson…

By lewie

July 31, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

wow

didn’t see that one coming…esp with LA not being forced to part with Kemp

By Chop Chop

July 31, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

Einstein,

I have a Theory of Appalachian Relativity that explains why some bloggers don’t know a whole lot.

By Frank

July 31, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

DOB

Not your type of music, but appropriate title. “My Stupid Mouth” - John Mayer

My stupid mouth has got me in trouble, I said too much again…

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

Will’s a happy dude, hoping he’ll “get to stay here longer than two more months.”

He wouldn’t comment until I had a Braves PR man tell him it was official, that he wasn’t traded. That was about 4:40.

Haven’t talked to Wren or Cox yet; they’re in Cox’s aux office by the dugout talking privately right now.

By DAP

July 31, 2008 4:48 PM | Link to this

if this trade goes through, its a good one for everybody. the pirates will get 4 good young players, the red sox get rid of manny, and give up two other platers for bay, and the dodger only give two players for manny…a good player who will give them much needed offense. they may storm back and win that division because of this move.

By jtb

July 31, 2008 4:48 PM | Link to this

TommyP

I do believe that last year as a catcher for the Braves Salty was hitting around .300 and as a first baseman his numbers were comparable to the 08 Andruw Jones. Norton and Infante have costs the Braves with their sub-par fielding in left and as we all know KJ has certainly not done well defensively at 2nd. Bloopers and seeing eye singles can kill a team (not to mention errors) and some of those hits could be taken away by players playing at their correct positions. So I don’t see the logic in bringing up a minor leaguer to play an unnatural position.

By MGL

July 31, 2008 4:49 PM | Link to this

Manny’s new song “Will you still love me tomorrow?”

By Smoky Joe Wood

July 31, 2008 4:50 PM | Link to this

Excitable Boy, Warren Zevon?

By Random

July 31, 2008 4:50 PM | Link to this

westy12: “Maybe DoucheBag.com didn’t think your last post was worthy of sponsorship?”

Not so much that at all — actually, I was busted.

AJC.com VISITOR AGREEMENT

Specific Prohibited Uses. Without limiting the foregoing, we may immediately terminate your use of any Communications Service if you engage in any of the following prohibited activities:

• Uploading, posting, emailing, transmitting or otherwise making available any unsolicited or unauthorized advertising, promotional materials, or any other form of solicitation, without our express written approval

8-)

“Escobar didn’t fill a hole. There was never a hole to fill. Renteria would still be with the Braves if Escobar wasn’t ready to take over.”

So, when Schafer replaces Kotsay in CF next year or the year after, he won’t be filling a hole because we could have kept Kotsay? And Tex didn’t fill a hole at 1B because we already had Thorman?

You’re right — there’s no point in further debate. The parameters of your argument are too subjective and too likely subject to shifting as the discussion progresses.

Just as you’ve progressively downgraded jb’s original claim of “always” to “typically” to “traditionally” to (now) “frequently”.

And you’re right in another respect — to really settle a question like this, we would need to go further back than just this season’s roster in order to legitimately determine a trend (if any). And right you are again — who has time for that?

“So, I say jb’s casual statement that the Braves frequently trade prospects to fill holes was perfectly reasonable.”

So, let’s call it quits, and finish back where we started — here is jb’s “casual” (bold-face font from the original) statement about what the Braves “frequently*” do:

The Braves will do what they always do, trade prospects to fill holes.

Ta-ta.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this

Randy

I saw Ohman’s bit on youtube, but I just looked and it’s not there anymore. So I think you have your answer.

By bravos2249

July 31, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this

Ahhh…..Rochy’s brother now plays with him….sorry but you know they both are happy about that.

By cooper

July 31, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this

You know your team stinks when no one wants your players at the deadline.

No one was willing to stretch for Ohman and we you received an ok 1B and a see you never AA reliever for Tex.

Sugar coat it all you want, say the deals weren’t there but the Braves cannot even sell with the best of them.

Wow.

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this

Randy@4:29

Only if you’re Myron Cope,supposebly.

By Big Easy

July 31, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this

Well, if the Manny deal is for real, looks like the Dodgers finally got the outfield pop they were looking for…But it looks like Pittsburgh got the better end of that deal. I guess the BoSox really were ready to do anything to get Manny out of there…

~E~

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this

Lewie, I like that a lot. Great candidate.

By TheAntiMe

July 31, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this

Poor little rich Redsox - I guess they’re still stuck with Fanny. I guess GM Theo Einstien had no luck depending on the Marlins and Pirates to work it out.

The Sox probably are better off on the field by keeping Manny. Theo can mostly avoid dealing with his stupid crap for the rest of the season. I guess Terry Francona and crew are the ones who really have to put up with Manny’s stupid antics.

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this

The three way trade doesnt make any sense to me. The Pirates come away looking like Geniuses for getting LaRoche, Moss, Hansen and Morris.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

Oh…and I wonder how much the DBacks want Teixeira now!

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

Hey I got it…Tex’s old AB song…The Watchtower..Hendrix

*There must be some kind of way out of here Said the joker to the thief Theres too much confusion I cant get no relief Businessman they drink my wine Plow men dig my earth None will level on the line Nobody of it is worth Hey hey

No reason to get excited The thief he kindly spoke There are many here among us Who feel that life is but a joke but uh But you and I weve been through that And this is not our fate So let us not talk falsely now The hours getting late Hey

Hey

All along the watchtower Princes kept the view While all the women came and went Bare-foot servants to, but huh Outside in the cold distance A wild cat did growl Two riders were approachin And the wind began to howl Hey Oh All along the watchtower Hear you sing around the watch Gotta beware gotta beware I will Yeah Ooh baby All along the watchtower*

By Renegator

July 31, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

Wow, Manny joins an already over-crowded, over-paid outfield for the Dodgers. Andruw is going to struggle to get playing time.

By Matt

July 31, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this

Manny to the Dodgers! Everyone loves to buy except the Braves!

Well, except for the fact we keep Julio Franco playing..speaking of which, have we signed him yet?

By TDub

July 31, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this

Uh, how many outfielders do the Dodgers have now?

By Lawman

July 31, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this

RE: Manny song

“Shattered” by Rolling Stones

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this

I could see the Dodgers resigning him. They wouldn’t lose any draft picks if they did and he’d get his mega deal he’s seeking. Dodgers would have to dump one of their outfielders going forward though. Andruw, Pierre, Kemp, Either, and Manny… Crowded House.

By tr

July 31, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this

The NYMEX Crude Future fell $2.64 (-2.08%) at 4:07 p.m. EDT upon hearing the news of the Manny to LA trade. Traders were rioting in the ailes, screaming, “WTF!”

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this

I just noticed that the spelling is atrocious in those lyrics I just posted…I just copied and pasted from the first google hit I found.

By BravesFanInRockies

July 31, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this

Holy Cornelia. The billion-dollar outfield.

By NCBravesFan

July 31, 2008 4:58 PM | Link to this

I just became a big of Theo Epstein fan & fan of that ownership! Way to take out the garbage and focus on the stretch drive!

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 4:59 PM | Link to this

Nice bluff for the bumper sticker.

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 5:01 PM | Link to this

The 3 Way Deal Is OFFICIAL!!!!!

Manny to DODGERS

Jason Bay to RED SOX

Pirates get RH Pitchers Bryan Morris (LA) & Craig Hansen (BOS) and OF Brandon Moss (BOS) and INF Andy LaRoche 9LA)

Its cool for Andy, he can play on the same team with his brother Adam.

By bravos2249

July 31, 2008 5:02 PM | Link to this

*do believe that last year as a catcher for the Braves Salty was hitting around .300 *

and he’s hitting .245 as a catcher this year…hmm

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 5:02 PM | Link to this

Poor Rays. The media and fans there were drooling all over Bay and patting the team management on the back like nobody’s business from what I was hearing on Tampa radio about an hour ago.

By 74Dawg

July 31, 2008 5:03 PM | Link to this

How about Evil Ways by Santana? Or Lido by Boz Scaggs- “He’s for the money…” Re: the Braves,do they really think they are a player or two away or do they see this as a fairly significant rebuild job? it’s true they were legit w/ the team Wren had put together going into the year, but what is left is ,basically,an allstar disabled list and a very mediocre 25 man roster. They don’t need guys they can ‘plug in’, they need more young guys they can build around. But is this the way they see it?

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 5:03 PM | Link to this

Hard to fault either of the three teams making that trade.

Pirates received two great prospects and two other good ones.

Red Sox unloaded a problem player and received a cheaper, productive LF in return.

Dodgers get a two month rental of Ramirez for free and the rights to try and resign him in the offseason. Only had to give up two prospects for him. And the prospects they gave up are less than what the Angels gave up for Tex, imo.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 5:04 PM | Link to this

Holy Crap Batman? How many disfunctional outfielders can one team handle?

Manny, Andruw and Pierre to go along with the up and coming Ethier and Kemp (not to mention Repko).

Maybe Andruw can go in and play SS for the Dodgers! (Wasn’t that a big thing for him a few years back???)

Good luck Joe!

By cooper

July 31, 2008 5:04 PM | Link to this

Good point Observer.

Wren gets the trophy for nervous trigger finger move of the week.

He could have parlayed the Manny rumors into getting Connor Jackson or at least a ML starter in AAA/AA from LAA.

Had he waited another day or two he could have received more than a 1B swap.

Wren is looking totally outclassed this year and this week.

McGuirk next time hold open auditions for the GM spot. Healthy competition for a critical role is actually good thing.

JS is totally nepotistic so why bother directing any comments to him.

By TheAntiMe

July 31, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this

Oh yeah, song for Manny.

How about Mandy by Barry Manilow

Of course this would be sung totally from Manny’s point of view by changing the name Mandy to Manny.

By ernesto

July 31, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this

The Dodgers are going to have to sit some expensive butts with Manny coming to town.

Or maybe Juan Pierre, fastest first baseman in the MLB?

Good trade though for all concerned IMO, just wish the Bravos had been able to land Bay.

By Tomas

July 31, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

The Dodgers now have so much outfield. Manny, Eithier, Pierre, Andruw and Kemp. I’m guessing they are going to exercise manny’s option so it would not be a two month rental. I wonder if the Braves can get Kemp, and maybe Pierre. Pierre porbobally wont be a good idea but if they did, they’ll have a proven leadoff hitter who can steal a lot of bases, and bunt for base hits as well as Blanco. And Kemp, would be the centerfielder, which would give the braves a young power bat in the outfield. Question is what will the dodgers want in exchange for Kemp.

By Ron_Paul aka The Dude

July 31, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

The Manny trade makes no sense to me either…they have 5 outfielders now…what?

I love living in Pittsburgh right now!

By j-school dropout

July 31, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

If the story in the LA Times is right, Pittsburgh did very well in this trade.

Dodgers get Manny Ramirez from Red Sox The Dodgers acquired Manny Ramirez from the Boston Red Sox today in a three-team deal that sent the Pittsburgh Pirates’ Jason Bay to Boston. By Dylan Hernandez, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer The Dodgers acquired Manny Ramirez from the Boston Red Sox today in a three-team deal that sent the Pittsburgh Pirates’ Jason Bay to Boston, according to a source aware of the deal but not authorized to talk about it. It is not yet clear which Dodgers players were involved, though ESPN.com reported that third baseman Andy LaRoche and right-handed pitcher Bryan Morris will go to the Pirates, and outfielder Brandon Moss and right-handed pitcher Craig Hansen will leave the Red Sox orgianization for Pittsburgh. Ramirez had a no-trade clause with the Red Sox but cleared that today.

That’s four solid players for Bay. This is real bad news for A.J. He won’t see any at bats, just defensive work. Bet he gets released next year.

By lewie

July 31, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

i’d make a serious run at Kemp in the offseason via trade

and wonder what we’d have gotten had LA pulled this Manny deal off before the Tex deal…might have been able to pull in cojack

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

The Dodgers could have 2 outfielders (Jones and Pierre) on the bench that are making a combined 30 million this year! The Dodgers bench is more expensive than the entire Florida Marlins team!

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this

Randy—

Here’s a link to Ohman’s Harry Caray!

Man! I never get tired of watching that!

If the Braves did keep Ohman (which I’m guessing they did), then he should get a new T-Shirt:

Take one of those “I Survived the Tower of Terror” shirts, put white tape over “Tower of Terror”, and write “Trade Deadline”.

By VaBravesfan

July 31, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this

What about “The Joker” by the Steve Miller Band. I am sure Manny is a midnight toker.

By DAP

July 31, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this

the braves need to keep an eye on the dodgers and be there when they offer to trade ethier or kemp.

By BostonBravesGirl

July 31, 2008 5:12 PM | Link to this

Here’s my song for Manny - “I Feel Pretty” from West Side Story, and the lyrics are even printable (go here: http://www.westsidestory.com/site/level2/lyrics/pretty.html). Need a good sense of irony though.

As a Sox fan (hey I live in Boston, I have to make nice), I can tell you that most of Red Sox nation has a big case of happy feet!

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 5:13 PM | Link to this

Good grief! The Dodgers got Manny? Eesh…Don’t anybody “Think Blue” anytime soon! Yikes…

The Fillies are in first place? Crud…I hadn’t noticed…I found out they won last night when Braves Live! insisted upon shoving Utley’s and Victorino’s home run down my throat. (Not that I had my eyes open at the time…)

By lewie

July 31, 2008 5:15 PM | Link to this

the brothers unibrow in the laroche boys might net some marketability for the ole bucks

By rupert

July 31, 2008 5:16 PM | Link to this

living in florida i have followed the rays since their inception and they are kind of my second team, that being said i think they really screwed this one up, bay would of been great and with their farm system they could have parted with who the pirates wanted…unless the pirates just pulled out of it, losing bay would be bad enough but having him go to the rival sox is gonna hurt, the morale can’t be great, there a talented team and will bounce back, but bay would have been a great fit, on a side note, not sure how bay will handle the pressure of a pennant race in boston, he’s never struct me as the kind that would relish that

By ernesto

July 31, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this

McFann - could you repost that link, it’s not working on Safari.

By TheAntiMe

July 31, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this

Wow - pretty wild. I guess you can never underestimate the Red Sox GM. Theo really is an Einstien.

By Brian

July 31, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this

I’ve got a song for DOB.

It’s set to the tune of “One The Road Again” by Willie Nelson

I got scooped again, The Braves beat writer got scooped by ESPN, Teixiera trade, Hudson’s elbow and not a word all day about Ohman possibilities until an hour before the deadline.

By j-school dropout

July 31, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this

Guys, stop slamming Wren. Manny is not a two-month rental and he plays outfield. Wren wouldn’t have received this deal for Tex. Nobody needed a first baseman and he is a free agent.

If I understand Manny’s contract correctly, there are team option for $20 million through 2010. I believe those options now belong to the Dodgers.

By cooper

July 31, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this

Instead of wasting ink on Manny songs how about some criticism of Wren’s itchy trigger finger move and then his air pocket today?

I am not a Manny fan but to to think he won’t rake in LAD better than anyone we have is to be in denial.

Wren screwed the pooch by moving Tex two days early.

If he had an ultimatum offer for Yourkliss or Conner Jackson you can explain it but Kotchman, please?

Wren is being out maneuvered and outclassed by other GMs and we are high-fiving each other about being out of the fray and laughing about the Manny deal. Just sad.

Wren did very little to set the Braves up for the future and everyone is giving him a mulligan on Tex when it was clear last night and today he could have parlayed the Manny/Bay movement it a much bigger bounty than Kotch and a no name no impact AA reliever.

How can you buy what Wren is shoveling?

By bravos2249

July 31, 2008 5:20 PM | Link to this

*do believe that last year as a catcher for the Braves Salty was hitting around .300 *

and he’s hitting .245 as a catcher this year…hmm

By JC FROM UT

July 31, 2008 5:20 PM | Link to this

DOB: Since Ohman was not traded, is there any chance that he signed an extention? I would doubt that Ohman would make it thriugh the waivers required to trade him know.

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 5:20 PM | Link to this

Cooper Wren had no idea that Manny was going to be traded at all this week, much less to the Dodgers. So saying that he should have waited just to see if Manny was indeed going to be traded to the Dodgers to make Arizona give us Conor Jackson is like saying, I am not going to fill up my tank right now at 3.68, I’m gonna wait and hope that Gas prices continue to go down. What an assanine post.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 5:21 PM | Link to this

Does Scott Boras have a guest house for Manny, too or will he be roomies with Tex!

By Reid in EAV

July 31, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this

I got it. “Can’t Tell Me Nothing” by Kanye West.

Lyric excerpts:

“I feel the pressure / under more scrutiny / and what do I do? / act more stupidly”

“la la la la / wait ‘til I get my money, right / la la la la / then you can’t tell me nothing, right / excuse me, was you saying something? / Uh uh, you can’t tell me nothing”

By Charlie S.

July 31, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this

Hey Dave, Why didn’t the braves do anything to help there pathetic offense or bullpen? Also if they like draft picks, why have they only signed 21 of there 50 picks?

By Chop Chop

July 31, 2008 5:25 PM | Link to this

I agree, Couch Tater. Very nice bluff, indeed.

DOB: Dude, I heard you’re going to be traded today, but I don’t have any definite information. Since you’re going to be leaving, I was wondering if I could have that awesome bumper sticker? It would be a nice memento to remember you by. After all, you’ve been a cool go-to guy in the clubhouse this year.

Ohman: Yeah, dude. You can have it, but only if you promise me that you’ll put it on your car.

DOB: We have a deal, dude.

Ohman hands DOB the bumper sticker. DOB immediately leaves the clubhouse, puts the bumper sticker on his car and, after a short period of time, returns. Within five minutes, an attendant starts yelling about a car being on fire. DOB and Ohman quickly run outside.

Three Nihilists are standing near the car.

DOB (turning to Ohman): Well, they finally did it. They killed my f*** car.

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this

cooper again dude, you need to grasp the reality of the game. How the heck was Wren supposed to know that Manny was going to the Dodgers, if anywhere at all? he got what he thought, and still is, a great package. And what makes you think that because the Dodgers got Manny that that would have forced Arizona’s hand and they would have been forced to give us Conor Jackson? Seriously! If anything, it tells us nothing other than whats done is done.

By ncgary

July 31, 2008 5:28 PM | Link to this

dodgers wont release AJ, probably assign him to A ball and hope he quits

By cabravesfan

July 31, 2008 5:28 PM | Link to this

j school dropout- According to reports Manny actually dropped those options in order to be traded- guess he REALLY wanted out of Boston

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this

Just to clarify, my original comment was meant more as a comment about the Dbacks then about Wren. Not only were the Dbacks unwilling to part with Jackson (can’t say I blame them for that), but they were also unwilling to trade either of their top pitching prospects (Sherzer or Parker). I wonder if Wren would have preffered to take Chad Tracy if one of the two pitchers came along. Without one of the pitchers, I think the Kotchman/Merak package probably was the better of the two.

By TheAntiMe

July 31, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this

Hey Theo don’t play around (nor does their owner). Everyone thought he was crazy when he traded Nomar a few years ago at the deadline when he was being a pain in the arse to the Red Sox but that trade helped give them some additional defense that really did help them win the Series that year.

This trade as well shows that they ain’t gonna put up with your crap no matter how hard you hit that danged white ball.

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this

Charlie S. I can answer that one, the reason the Braves didn’t do anything to help their offense or bullpen is because this season is a wash, no need in going overboard when the rest of this season doesn’t mean anything. Wait it out till the offseason then make the trades or signings for next year. This year, gone, next year, not so much.

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this

Perhaps Lillibridge for Kemp…

Thomas: Pierre porbobally wont be a good idea but if they did, they’ll have a proven leadoff hitter who can steal a lot of bases, and bunt for base hits as well as Blanco

No way would Pierre be a good idea. The Dodgers picked up AJ because of how weak Pierre is. They picked up Manny because of how weak Pierre is and how poor AJ is doing. I’ve spent the last couple years watching the futility that is Juan Pierre attempting to do anything on a baseball diamond. He struggles to get the ball from shallow left field to the cut off man. He’s horrid out there. And then to think the guy can’t even get on base. He’s a 9 million a year pinch runner.
Frank Wren would lose all credibility if he picked up Pierre. Especial, as you mentioned, already having Blanco and Anderson on the team. Makes no sense to get a less skilled higher paid version.

By jtb

July 31, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this

Einstein

Thanks for the kind words…

First of all, the only times Youk plays 3rd is either when Lowell needs a day off or when they’re in a NL park. He also didn’t play 3rd once during the playoffs last year.

Secondly, no I don’t know what a utility player is, please explain. I didn’t mention Prado, so he’s irrelevant to my claim. One of the reasons Gotay was released by the Mets was because of his inability to play any position other than 2nd, so I wouldn’t say he was signed to be a utility man. I would call him a pinch hitter/back up second baseman. Before coming to the Braves, Norton had only played 76 games in the outfield in 901 games. That’s 8.4% of his games played. I would certainly not consider him an outfielder. I’ll give you Infante.

Finally, when exactly did I say that Kelly Johnson playing 2nd is the reason we’re in 4th place. You’re putting words in my mouth to try to bolster your own argument. I do however feel that the Braves would be in a better position this year if they had a natural 2nd basemen. He has 10 errors this year, most on the team It is also tied for worst in the NL and tied for 2nd worst in baseball for 2nd basemen.

Tell me where exactly to go to find the stat for ‘Fly balls that would’ve been caught by Blanco, but not by Norton or Infante’ or ‘Ground balls that Prado would’ve gotten to’ or ‘Double plays the Prado and Escobar would’ve turned’ or ‘the amount of times a fielder was late on a play because he couldn’t get the ball out of his glove’

This is baseball, not Econ.. Even though baseball does have far too many stats, there aren’t stats for everything. There are some things that you can only pick up on by watching the games.

By Tomahawk Kris

July 31, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this

Ok here is where I am a little confused - the Braves traded away Tex with 2 days to go until the trade deadline. Now all of sudden the Dodgers have Manny Ramirez and they have just one-upped the Diamondbacks. Why didn’t the Braves wait to deal Tex until today - I mean I have to imagine they could have gotten more from Arizona now that the Dodgers have Manny.

Call me crazy, but I think the Braves missed an opportunity to use some leverage and get a better deal for Tex. Also who did the Dodgers give to Pbgh for Manny? I bet they gave away some damn good prospects - is Manny move valuable than Tex? Maybe slightly more valuable because of his post-season experience, but then he has the whole Manny being Manny thing that you have to deal with. I think they are relatively equal so it looks like the Braves got the shaft because all we got was Kotchman (whoopty friekin do) and for the 2 month rental of Ramirez the Pirates get 4 solid pospects from LA.

I think the Braves were a little to anxious and jumped the gun by trading Tex so early.

By cabravesfan

July 31, 2008 5:36 PM | Link to this

Boston is also picking up the rest of Many’s salary this year…nice deal for the Dodgers

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 5:37 PM | Link to this

Bobby’s Cox

I agree with your lineups…………

Braves are very thick in talent and player good enough to make the playoffs any day.

We had bad breaks, agree that teams get bad break, of course this year has been ridiculous.

We all love the Braves, that the only reason to keep watching in 2008, thats no secret.

25 man roster in opening day so far should look like this (although I hope some help will be here before that):

CF Blanco: Good speed, learning fast how to get on base and using speed to do so……..very good bunts for base hits.

1B Kotchman: he must hit second. Only because he puts the ball in play, specially to the right side of the IF…..With Blanco on 1B you could play lots of hit and run, and even if Cox doesnt, he will put Blanco in scoring position most often than not.

3B Chipper: a no-brainer.

C McCann: his our best option for cleanup right now, good enough power, good batting avg.

SS Yunel Good enough to protect Brian, plus he hits RH. He might do better than this year, sky is the limit for him.

2B KJ: he enjoys hitting 6th……….should do better than this year. Great power for the 6th spot.

RF JF: he should not hit higher than 7th until he hits at least .275 for more than a month.

LF Matt: he is the only one that has shown capable of playing in the majors, problem is he also showed he is not an everyday player.

SP: Jurrjens, Campillo, Hampton, Sabathia???, James/Marek, Morton???

Bench: Infante (whats the contract situation with him, Braves must do everything they can to hold up to him), Prado, Anderson, XXX catcher,

Bullpen: Soriano, Bennett, Smoltz, Acosta, Gonzalez, Carlyle and Ohman.

If James can keep his ERA around 4.00 (+/- 0.25), he could be a great addition to the rotation in the 5th spot.

We will get some answers for next year tonight after we watch Hampton pitch.

Im `pretty sure somebody will be struggling out of the pen or will be injuried or day to day or something by the time Moylan is ready, so it wont be a problem to reinsert him in the pen. We would still have Boyer, Stockman, Ridgway and Julio to play with if needed

If you are reading carefully I had only spent money on Hampton and Sabathia and Ohman……..There are still lots of $$$ to get our LF.

We would still have BJ, Schafer, Flowers and Heyward in the minors if somebody is injured or struggling…….

Go Braves.

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 5:39 PM | Link to this

Just opened the new Chop Talk to see Bobby’s timely article titled “We still think we can get back in this race”….oops.

Got some serious thunder going over here, is it raining at Turner Field again? I’m still holding out hope for something to happen to that damn cow.

By Michael

July 31, 2008 5:39 PM | Link to this

Original Jon I completely agree with you

cooper Frank Wren totally outclassed this year? Two words: Jair Jurrjens. Yes, totally outclassed.

By Nihilists

July 31, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this

Ve don’t care about the trade deadline. VE CARE ABOUT NOTING, O’BRIEN!

By jake

July 31, 2008 5:41 PM | Link to this

I heard that Andruw wont be starting for the Dodgers anymore now that they have Manny. What a waste of money he has been for the Dodgers.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 5:43 PM | Link to this

Expect AJ to get a little better know that he has one of the best hitters in baseball teaching him to be patient and to protect the plate for 10 pitches in order to get “his ball”.

By ncgary

July 31, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this

dodgers wont release AJ, probably assign him to A ball and hope he quits

By GLEP

July 31, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this

Well folks, You just saw the front office in action. Or lack thereof.While Wren was asleep in Atlanta deals were made.Is there any wonder why this team is in the shape it’s in? The team plays like their GM deals. Yanks get Nady, Tigers get Farnsworth; Dodgers get Manny;Sox get Bay;Grif jr to ChicagoBrewers have CC;Mets have Santana; Cubs get Harden;etc… But take refuge Braves fans, We still have Corky Miller!!

By harey carey is still a brave

July 31, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this

here is a link i found on ohman’s harey carey bit…. Nitram Odarp!!!!!!! [http://www.thefightins.com/meechone/will-ohman-does-an-impression-of-will-farrell-doing-harry-carey/]

By Steve from OH

July 31, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this

Very impressive return by the Pirates. Gotta love that if you’re a Pirates fan. I think the deadline today shows that FW still has confidence in guys like Frenchy, KJ, etc. and isn’t throwing in the towel on them yet. I’m really pleased to see KJ wasn’t moved. I’d look for Kotsay to be moved in August if Schafer shows some improvement between now and then in Mississippi. 2009 should be very, very interesting.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 5:47 PM | Link to this

Ernesto—

Here it is again. Sorry it’s not working. Don’t know why it’s not (well, yes I do…I posted it—why should it work?)

Anyway, hope that one works for you.

Time for some home-cooked BBQ’d beef!

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this

I think Braves did good letting Bay go. I mean, the guy has a career ratio of 1K avery 4 ABs. That is way to high. he has more than 650 K and has not played the games to say he has 5 full seasons in the majors.

By Tomahawk Kris

July 31, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this

Original Jon,

What makes you think the Diamondbacks would have traded Conor Jackson or one of their top pitching prospects? The thing is you don’t know and nobody does because the Braves hastily dealed Tex away 2 days before the trade deadline. You never know what is going to happen and you never know how a team will react when their rival gets an impact player to one-up them.

I am not saying Wren should have been clairvoyant and seen this happening, but what is the problem with waiting until today before you deal Tex. It reminds me of the Seinfeld where Kramer gets burned by the coffee and sues the company - then when they are going to give him a settlement he takes the first offer before they even tell him the rest.

The Braves traded Tex Prematurely and if you think getting Kotchman and a mediorce Relief Pitcher prospect is great (especially now that it is known that Hudson is basically done for next year) then you are smoking crack.

By Lew

July 31, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this

McFann and Thrillhouse-Thanks for the well wishes. It’s pretty much under control.

If nothing else, I proved that I can pull the eye patch thing off as a fashion statement. Considering I’m twenty five years older than Johnny Depp, have one third his hair and do not have his movie star looks or money, we’ll have to go with me looking like an old biker who’s been around the block a few times-But I did pull it off real well..

By brian

July 31, 2008 5:54 PM | Link to this

please note that it was not me picking on you DOB for “being scooped.” Thanks for all your input here and there is a reason this is the #1 baseball blog - you DOB.

By duh

July 31, 2008 5:54 PM | Link to this

Doc I have to argue with you. Outside of C and SS. There aren’t many teams willing to trade their starters for the Braves, if any. This team is not as good as the hometown fans like to think. There are holes everywhere. JJ is the ONLY starting pitcher. And Chipper is not on the list because a soon to be 37 yr. old non-playing 3B doesn’t exactly fit the bill either.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 5:54 PM | Link to this

BTW, Marek threw 1 scoreless inning yesterday for AA Mississippi. Looks like the braves are gonna use him as reliever………

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this

Doc

Why would AJ correct his approach now that he has Manny to emulate? I think Chipper would’ve set a good example for AJ, too, about plate discipline, etc. Didn’t take to learnin’ then, and I doubt anything’ll change now.

I bet the Dodgers will waive Andruw in August and see if there are any takers. Hmmm…

By spotts

July 31, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this

DOB - any chance the Braves will call up Tommy Hanson? He’s tearing up AA. What about Schafer?

By Tomahawk Kris

July 31, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this

Doc Holliday,

So if all those years of playing with Chipper didn’t teach Andruw to be more patient at the plate what makes you think 2 months with Manny Ramirez is going to do anything?

By NO MORE BOBBY

July 31, 2008 5:57 PM | Link to this

I have to say it was a bit depressing at the game yesterday when I saw on the Clubhouse Store a sign that said All Teixeira jerseys 50% off.

I walked around the park with my SMOLTZ FOR MANAGER 2010 banner and it got a great response. Actually people were asking why not 2009. I guess unaware Bobby had already signed for next season. Nice to know Im not alone on wanting a manager change.

By NASCAR Fanatic

July 31, 2008 5:58 PM | Link to this

@ Tomahawk Frank,

Check the facts before mouthing of here. The dodgers did not give up four prospects. They gave up two. If the braves waited till the last minute the Angels might have said no, and we would have been left with an egg. How exactly is Andy Laroche so much better than Kotchman? Casey is proven at the ML level.

Some of you need to quit whining!!!!!!

By spotts

July 31, 2008 5:59 PM | Link to this

Poor Andruw…he was already benched. With Manny in the outfield he pretty much has no chance of playing. Guess that gives him more time to eat.

By BravesFanChris23

July 31, 2008 5:59 PM | Link to this

GLEP

Why would Frank have or need to make a deal like the other teams did when we’re out of it this season? There’s no leverage in getting a big player like that in our favor. So, why not wait for the off season when the odds are better.

You’re just reaching for ways to bash Wren, because that’s how its coming off.

By **Steve in Utah**

July 31, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this

How about Three Day Grace’s “I Hated Everything About You”?

As for Braves prospects, what’s the latest on Jordan Schafer?

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this

AJ has 2 HR and 13 RBI in 65 games……poor guy, how sad for a guy that once was a winner.

I suppose playing for a players manager almost all his career didnt help him down the road.

By tr

July 31, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this

cooper

Great GM observation!!!

Let’s see, Theo got Jason Bay, and all it cost him was Manny, two good prospects, and $7,000,000.

If Wren had been that sharp we’d have Bay, two less good prospects and only be out $3,500,00.

NOT

By Charlie S.

July 31, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this

BOLDOriginal Jon—I agree the season is over, but isn’t it time then to try some other things then. I mean how much longer do we have to watch double plays with the bases loaded or 2-1 games become 9-1 because Blaine Boyer, Royce Ring, Julian Tavarez and Buddy Caryle can’t get anybody out in the 8th and 9th inning. Release them NOW and try 4 new guys from AA or AAA, they could proberly do better. Then try Jordan Schafer in center and Gorky Hernandez in right and BENCH Kotsay and Francoeur

By j-school dropout

July 31, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this

Again, I think you guys are being too hard on Wren. The Ramirez deal wasn’t even announced until after the deadline. In that scenario, how do you imagine that the Diamondbacks would have had time to react and trade Jackson for Tex? I didn’t even hear the Dodgers mentioned as a solid candidate for this trade until late this afternoon. Are you supposing that Wren and the DBacks would have some amazing insight into what the Dodgers were doing that would have allowed them to pull off a last-second deal? Besides, Kotchman may be as good as Jackson. Give him a chance.

By TheAntiMe

July 31, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this

I agree, Original Jon. If this were the past, when the Braves were making a pennant run, they would have kept Tex for their own 2 month usage and then use his 12.5 million that they were off the hook for in the off-season to simply replace him with another free agent.

By letting the Angels rent him for the 2 months as the Braves did the Braves get the rights to a darn fine 1st baseman in Kotchman for a very much lower price and still can, as before, use the money that they are off the hook for on Tex and replace him with another free agent in the off-season.

Arguably, in this case, it’s like we’re getting a 1st baseman of say 65% value for (I’m guessing) 25% of the price (or maybe less) for the next couple of years.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 6:05 PM | Link to this

Lot of talk about the Manny trade. And let’s just say there were some in Florida relieved NOT to get him….

Kotchman cleaning up tonight, after Blanco, Escobar and Kotsay. Sammons is catching, hitting eighth.

Yes, Chuck’s starting tomorrow, as most of you know by now.

By Big Easy

July 31, 2008 6:09 PM | Link to this

Oh, that Ohman clip is awesome. Nitram Odarp!

~E~

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 6:10 PM | Link to this

Tomahawk Kris

It could, Im not saying it will happen.

duh

JJJ is not the only pitcher……….Campillo has looked dominant and Hampton could be back.

The team is not as talented as many fans think, but it is not as bad as its record shows……

Are the Tigers as mediocre as their record shows?

Are the Dbacks?

Are the Cards as good as their record shows?

Are the marlins as good as their record shows?

Things are not always how records tell you they are…….. If there was not pitching how come were leading the league in pitching not so long ago? And in top 3 in BA? and OBP???

You need talent in order to do that………..but you need more talent to translate that into wins……….and that is what braves lack of……….and you already know my opinion………it includes Cox.

By westy12

July 31, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this

Random,

Not sure what’s difficult for you to understand about there not being a hole at SS when your All-Star caliber SS (Renteria) is under contract beyond the current season. If the team decides to upgrade, that’s a luxury, not filling a hole.

Thorman was widely considered a liability last year. That’s a hole. The Braves traded prospects to fill that hole.

Man, that was a lame comparison and a losing argument, even by your standards. Surely an A-hole like you can understand the simple concept of a hole. I’m not buying this latest act for a minute.

And by the way, I didn’t “downgrade” jb’s original claim. I interpreted the intent of that claim, which any reasonable person would do. Obviously jb didn’t mean that every single “hole” the Braves have filled throughout the history of the franchise has come via trading prospects.

And you know that too, Random. You know that statement wasn’t meant to be taken literally. But you saw your opportunity, didn’t you? So you intentionally misnterpreted jb’s casual statement in an absurd literal way so you’d have a straw-man battle to fight, puffing up your fragile little ego in the process, demonstrating how right you are, and how factually incorrect that sub-human blog poster is, with his reckless statements, unsupported by any Works Cited page whatsoever. Unbelievable.

Rules or no rules, you’ll always be Random by Douchebags-R-Us in my book.

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this

Wren did a great job. He did not get “asking price” for the top left-handed reliever on the market and kept him. Would you rather he have traded him for a B level prospect? A win for us, if you ask me, particularly since Ohman likes the team and wants to stay. Woohoo.

As for the “if only we’d waited and gotten more for Tex” crew… What???? If we had waited for the Manny deal to go down, then we would have gotten nothing, nothing for Tex. The deal with the Sox/Pirates/Dodgers went down right at the deadline. We’d not have had time to pull the trigger on any trades. And the market for Tex was so thin anyway that waiting did not behoove us. Wren pulled the trigger when he had a couple of players he wanted.

By Lew

July 31, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this

RedEyed-Dude, the Dodgers are not going to release Andruw and then eat $18.5 mil next year-much less the six or so he’s still owed on this season.

By CONNECTICUT BRAVES FAN

July 31, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this

Yankees needed a catcher but i guess the trade of Corky Miller for Mariano Rivera fell through. I guess they felt that Pudge Rodriguez was a better choice. Moron Cox last night letting Corky bat with the bases loaded and the Braves in the ballgame when he had Kotsay to pinch hit was another stroke of genius. Then to bring in Moyer & Taveras to totally blow the game will get him more votes for NL manager of the year. But the good news is that if this keeps up for the rest of the season, management will have to fire the goober picking idiot.

By too tough44

July 31, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this

Ole, Manny, just hard to like a fella like that! Whats his beef? Good Grief! Good for Boston!

By nitram odarp

July 31, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this

glad he is staying now we can have something to smile about

By LT-AA blogger

July 31, 2008 6:18 PM | Link to this

I seriously doubt that LA getting Manny would’ve forced the D-Backs to trade for Tex. From all indications, he was off limits meaning they believe he is equally as valuable as Tex (which from watching Tex for a year and comparing stats- he is not too far off Tex). I still think the Braves got the better of the Angels- I don’t think Tex comes anywhere close to making them a lock for a World Series appearance - let alone a WS title. Say you have Scott Thorman or Julio Franco playing first base for you and you go out and get Tex- now that’s a huge upgrade.

Anyways, glad to hear Ohman would really like to stay in ATL. His Harry Cary impression alone is worth a 2-3 year deal. It seriously rivaled that of Will Ferrel. On top of that, he can pitch.

I’m not sure if the Braves can land Sabathia this winter. With the FA pitchers that’ll be out there- he’s gonna be one rich dude. I’m not too sure about Sheets- doesn’t he get hurt every single year? One thing the Braves do not need is an injury prone pitcher.

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 6:19 PM | Link to this

Lew

You’re right. Forgot AJ had a two-year deal. Tx.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 6:21 PM | Link to this

Spotts, Schafer is struggling. Can’t see them calling him up unless he gets it going between now and September.

Hanson isn’t on the 40-man and has only a dozen starts above A-ball. Maybe in September, but I kind of doubt it.

By Chop Chop

July 31, 2008 6:22 PM | Link to this

Lew,

While I failed to win a Wurlitzer (something for which I’ll never forgive you, dammit) at least you gave me the opportunity to send a message (along with others) to Skip when he received his Wurlitzer.

That was cool.

If I’d ever been deemed Wurlitzer-worthy, I think I would have requested a typical centerfield TV shot of Maddux throwing his patented cut fastball tailing back to the outside corner against a right-handed hitter (for the purposes of the picture, the hitter would have been Mike Piazza). Whenever I think of the ’90s Braves, that image is the first thing to come to my mind.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 6:28 PM | Link to this

Reid in EAV, another outstanding candidate, the Kanye tune. Gonna have to decide on one soon….

Chop Chop, Nihilists: Those posts were great. Good to know we have Lebowski fans out there.

And the John Prine suggestion, another great song choice. Damn, I didn’t realize how many there were….

The Braves beat writer got scooped by ESPNBrian

Really? Interesting. ‘Cause I sure thought I was the first to file a story last night at game time about Hudson being advised to have Tommy John surgery by two doctors. Hmmm.

But whatever. No thanks on the compliments later, Brian. Keep your kudos to yourself.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 6:30 PM | Link to this

Lew—

Glad to read it’s pretty much under control.

have one third [Johnny Depp’s] hair and do not have his movie star looks

That’s not a bad thing…

By ku5h

July 31, 2008 6:30 PM | Link to this

Of course Wren ain’t gonna do a damn thing. Typical behavior of a Braves GM. I guess Schuerholz taught him to pick his nose very well.

By TommyP

July 31, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this

By Einstein July 31, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this I am amazed at the amount of total idiots that post on here.

Like this guy:

“TommyP

I feel like one of the Braves problems with the Braves the past couple of years has been the assumption that players can just switch postions without it having much of an effect on theere performance defensively and offensively. ie. KJ at 2nd, Gotay at 3rd, Nortan and Infante in left, Salty at first last year. If you look at the teams in the World Series every year, they tend to have players playing at their natural positions.”

Ummm…Kevin Youkilis plays 1B or 3B..and they manage to win titles???

I mean do you know what a utility player is?..well Prado, Infante, Gotay were signed/traded for to play “utility roles”..they didn’t sign Greg Norton for his defensive prowess…they signed him because he has some pop off the bench and is a versatile (not great, but versatile) player in the field.

Kelly Johnson playing 2nd base is not the reason the *Braves are in fourth place.

Will people please try to start posting facts that support their arguments?

I once had an Econ teacher in college who preached that anyone who tries to argue their point of view without supporting data should be ignored. I understand what he meant now. I wish there was an ignore feature on this blog.*

Wow…that was absolutely priceless, Einstein.

You win some sort of award. Perched from your holier than thou branch, you took one person’s quote and credited it to me, all the while calling me an idiot and how I should be ignored.

LOL Wow…there’s absolutely nothing I can add that could make you look any worse.

hitting ignore button for Einstein

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 6:34 PM | Link to this

Huddy’s going to throw once in the next few days (not today), before the homestand ends, then decide. But this surgery seems absolutely inevitable, and he said as much.

He has not one, but two tears in the UCL. One he said was a partial tear, the other apparently “complete,” judging from the MRI pictures.

“They’ve pretty much all been the same diagnoses,” he said of what he’s been told by multiple docs.

“From an MRI standpoint, it doesn’t look good. I was shocked to see what it looked like myself. But it is what it is. I don’t feel bad. My arm don’t feel totally horrible right now.

“But when you go out there and really crank on it, throw full effort, that’s when it starts getting you.”

“Obviously you hate to jump to Tommy John right off the bat. You want to weigh your options and see.”

But, he quickly added, “I think it’s to the point where it’s kind of foolish to try to rehab for five months and try to let it heal that way. I think the damage is beyond trying to heal itself.

“But you just try to treat the symptoms now; I’m gonna throw and see how it feels, and then make a decision.”

And does he really expect anything other than the same pain when he tests it by throwing again?

“Hey, man, miracles happen,” he said.

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 6:35 PM | Link to this

*Tomahawk Kris * While I agree that Wren maybe should have waited another day, I dont agree with the assessment that he got ‘Fleeced’ because he made the trade when he did. So lets say that Wren did wait and by waiting, he makes the GM of the Angels mad, so that GM pulls the offer off the table, but Wren thinks, so what, i dont care, I am going to wait and get a better offer, BAM, Manny gets traded to the Dodgers, OH NO, the D-Backs are scared, but not scared enough to give up Conor Jackson for a 2 month rental, because they know he can produce runs just as much as Tex or Manny can in the final two months, Oh, and also, he is young and controllable for a long time. So after all the waiting, Frank gets Nada, Zero, Zilch. WHY? All because he didnt want the fans to think he got ‘fleeced’. So who is smoking crack now?

By Bo

July 31, 2008 6:35 PM | Link to this

I for one believe Frank Wren did a good job trading Tex for Kotchman and Marek. I believe both will help the Braves for next few years. Marek remember the name. Now lets see if Wren can finish the job!

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this

Charlie S. You asked I mean how much longer do we have to watch double plays with the bases loaded or 2-1 games become 9-1 because Blaine Boyer, Royce Ring, Julian Tavarez and Buddy Caryle can’t get anybody out in the 8th and 9th inning.

I can answer that one as well.

You asked how much longer, Sept. 28th buddy.

By JEB

July 31, 2008 6:39 PM | Link to this

Bad deal for tonights game!! Serious rain, lightening & thunder headed toward the stadium. Game will be delayed (a long one if it is delayed), started and then delayed (bad for Hampton & bullpen), or cancelled for tonight.

By ernesto

July 31, 2008 6:40 PM | Link to this

Thanks McFann, that was absolutely classic! Sorry I missed that part of the game…

By Mike in Savannah

July 31, 2008 6:47 PM | Link to this

Braveheart, maybe you meant 1995 as Renteria’s rookie year was 1996-7.

By Supes

July 31, 2008 6:47 PM | Link to this

DOB

Any word on Mac or Chipper? How are they coming along, will they be able to get back into a the lineup in a week or so?

As far as Chuck James against the Brewers on Friday…over/under how many HR will he give up to the pi**ed off HR bashing team that is the Brew Crew? I’m saying 3 HR for Chuck in 5 innings on Friday before Bobby pulls him out and the game is out of hand.

Unless Chuck learned how to throw a fastball with movement while he was in AAA that is.

Meanwhile, I’m glad to see Sammons in there tonight. I know he went 0fer the other night, but all of his swings just look better than anything Corky Miller has done. At least with Sammons there is the hope for a hit, with Corky is…oh well his stellar sub .100 average speaks for itself.

By Drummerdad

July 31, 2008 6:49 PM | Link to this

Carly Simon’s “You’re so Vain” could apply to Manny, but somehow I see A-Rod wearing that one. The Simon song might be too 70’s pop -rock for DOB besides. You could try Steely Dan’s “Daddy Don’t Drive No ElDorado No More”. With Manny’s mindset he might be eatin’ his dinner from a paper sack.

By monty

July 31, 2008 6:53 PM | Link to this

THe Dodgers rolled the dice on Andruw’s season last year hoping that it was an abberation, well obviously it wasn’t. Frank Wren feels like this year is an abberation for FRenchy. I hope he’s right. I just hope Chipper doesn’t place the Andruw moniker on anyone else next spring! “lose an Andruw, gain an Andruw”

By Drummerdad

July 31, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this

Okay, I was wrong about the Steely Dan song because the title is actually “Daddy Don’t Live In That New York City No More”.

By Daren

July 31, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this

Hey man this aint ‘Nam. There’s rules.

And DOB: What do you think the chances are that the Braves actually throw out serious money this off season?

By Warren Haynes For President

July 31, 2008 6:55 PM | Link to this

How about Shades of Black by The Rancantuers?

Go ahead, go ahead, go ahead And smash it on the floor Take whatever’s left And take it with you out the door…

See if I cry, See if I she’d a single sorry tear I can’t say that it’s been that great No, in fact it’s been a wasted-free year

Everybody sees And everyone agrees That you and I are wrong And it’s been that way too long

Take it as it comes And be thankful when it’s done There’s so many ways to act And there’s many shades of black There’s so many shades of black There’s so many shades of black

Let it out (let it all out) let it all out Say what’s on your mind You can kick and scream And shout and say things That are so unkind.

Yeah, See if I care And see if I stand firm or if I fall Cause in the back of my mind, And on the tip of my tongue Is the answer to it all…

And everybody sees And everyone agrees That you and I are wrong And it’s been that way too long

Take it as it comes And be thankful when it’s done There’s so many ways to act And there’s many shades of black, There’s so many shades of black, Yeah, there’s many shades of black

Yeah… Everybody sees And everyone agrees That you and I are wrong And it’s been that way too long

So take it as it comes And be thankful when it’s done There’s so many ways to act And you cannot take it back No you cannot take it back There’s so many shades of black, There’s so many shades of black, Yeah, there’s many shades of black There’s so many shades of black There’s so many shades of black Yeah, there’s many shades of black There’s so many shades of black Yeah, there’s many shades of black There’s so many shades of black

Oh yeah

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 6:57 PM | Link to this

JEB

I dont see no clouds on the radar and the chance of precipitation is dropingfrom 50 to 40 in the next hour and then to 30% the next hour.

By BravesFanInRockies

July 31, 2008 6:58 PM | Link to this

10Paul,

I’m with you. Make a run at either Kemp or Ethier now, before whatever is it Coletti is smoking wears off!

By nelson

July 31, 2008 6:59 PM | Link to this

GM WREN U SUCKS !!

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 7:02 PM | Link to this

You’re welcome, Ernesto. Yeah, that is totally classic! You cann just watch it over and over and over…And it never gets old!

Nitram Odarp!

(Another great line: “I’m not buying it!”)

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this

Huddy should go under the knife today. Every day he delays it is on more day he will be out sidelined next year.

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this

Boras is getting all of his players to southern California. Dr. Andrews is getting his to Hot lanta.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 7:07 PM | Link to this

What about picking AJ back and the Dodgers paying 85% of his sallary

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 7:07 PM | Link to this

nelson classic immaturity.

By Dawg88

July 31, 2008 7:09 PM | Link to this

Song for Manny:

“Stuck On Me!”

By Original Jon

July 31, 2008 7:11 PM | Link to this

You know, we certainly won’t win the division, but that doesn’t mean we cannot kill others playoff hopes.

We could play a big role in spoiler the next 2 months.

We have 21 games remaining against teams that are ahead of us in the division. Lets wreck havoc on them and make it hard for any of them to win the division. That should be the goal now, oh, and to get above .500, thats important as well.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 7:12 PM | Link to this

Just talked to Frank, who said he and Bobby discussed today how they’re going to take a look at some young players. Wouldn’t say who or how many, but also said they’re going to try to win games and help decide the National League East. In other words, aren’t going to run a tryout camp the rest of the way. But are going to look at some young players if they believe they can help them win.

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 7:15 PM | Link to this

Looks like Andruw is going to be spending a lot of his time sitting on the bench. I didn’t think he would turn it around in LA, but his #’s this year damn near Miller-like. The Corkster has what, half as many dingers as Andruw? Now that’s saying something.

By BravesFanInRockies

July 31, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this

Doc,

Compared to Andruw, Frenchy looks like Ted Williams. No thanks.

By SR

July 31, 2008 7:20 PM | Link to this

I am pleased at least that they held on to a solid bullpen arm in Ohman. If they don’t lose him in a waiver deal down the stretch, we should see if McGuirk’s veracity holds up and they make an honest effort to re-sign him.

By BravesFanInRockies

July 31, 2008 7:21 PM | Link to this

So am I correct in assuming the Dodgers now have 5 OF and no SS?

Maybe they’ll move Andruw to short.

By Shaun

July 31, 2008 7:22 PM | Link to this

To anyone who thinks the Braves missed an opportunity to somehow use a Manny Ramirez trade as leverage to get the Red Sox to bite on Teixeira:

Besides the obvious that the Manny trade went down to the wire…

The Red Sox already have a very productive, cheap, relatively young firstbaseman under contract for more than two months. They have a productive thirdbaseman. They have one of the best DHs. They give up Manny for a guy that’s only been about 5 runs worse this season. They don’t need Teixeira. Even if they had made the Manny trade early enough, they wouldn’t have given up what the Angels gave up.

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 7:23 PM | Link to this

Chip Caray says Hampton is the “whipping boy” on some blogs.

Looks to me like Hampton’s getting lit up. Shouldn’t he be a little sharper with all the practice?

By Murphy

July 31, 2008 7:31 PM | Link to this

Love how Simpson said he was “glad” to see Sammons behind the dish. Snicker, Snicker

By Ned

July 31, 2008 7:32 PM | Link to this

i just dont understand…WHY O WHY…some people in this blog…are STill counting on Smoltz for Next Year Bullpen…WHY? the 41-YEAR OLD Smoltz got MAJOR Shoulder Surgery…what, some guys want him in the Closer slot, Right…Please…look, i know Smoltz is a HOF,but his time HAS COME…..Stop trying to get Old Timers back…and i hope the braves try to INJECT some NEW BLOOD into this team for 2009…i hope Wren hears me, and he isnt counting on Smoltz..

By Shamus Thacker

July 31, 2008 7:32 PM | Link to this

Where’s WIPER??

He’s be mighty scarce since Pelfry and the Muts lost to the Darlins last night.

Has their meltdown already begun? Wish he’d show up so we could ask an expert idiot.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 7:33 PM | Link to this

Jeff321—

I think Chip reads this blog…

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 7:35 PM | Link to this

Just heard on the radio broadcast..

Braves OF’s 2 HR’s this month… ouch

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 7:36 PM | Link to this

I pondered whether the D-Backs would have upped the ante to get Teixeira had they known Manny was going to LA. I don’t think they would have much. Maybe, but I think it’s a slim chance.
The Dodgers gave up very little to get a free Manny Ramirez. The D-Backs initial offer for Teixeira was more than what the Dodgers gave up. So I’m not sold on the idea that Wren would have squeezed more out. I know I posted earlier with phrasing the question, but the more I think about it the less I think it would have helped.
Obviously Loney and Jackson were not available. Kotchman was. Kotchman is far better than Tracy. As for the pitcher… we’ll have to wait and see.

Now the Ramirez deal is interesting in that McCourt has collected Boston players since purchasing the team. So I could see him making a push to resign Manny. That would leave some spare outfielders on their roster. This offseason could be more lucrative with player acquizition than I previously thought possible. It’s going to be interesting.

I’m excited to hear the team is still aiming to be competitive on the field the rest of this season while mixing in some of the young guys. I’ll be paying attention to these guys. Should be fun.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 7:38 PM | Link to this

By the way, Wren acknowledged the Braves had tried to get Bay.

They also tried to move Ohman, but were’t going to take any “fringe” prospect who wouldn’t be as good as the sandwich pick (between Nos. 30 and 45) they’d get if he leaves as a free agent.

He said they haven’t ruled out re-signing Ohman, either (but that didn’t sound too likely from his response, to tell you the truth).

They like their infield and bullpen for next season, for the most part, but want to add an outfielder and definitely have to address the starting rotation, especially in light of the Hudson injury.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this

McCANN could be ready to pinch-hit in the weekend series if he gets cleared tonight by doctor. He’s coming along well. I’d expect him to be ready to catch by the start of the road trip.

By Give It a Rest

July 31, 2008 7:42 PM | Link to this

Shaun, are you on the Braves’ payroll or something? If not, you certainly expend a lot of energy and time on here that could be put to more productive use than being an apologist for the franchise’s every move.

I mean, it’s you’re life, but all pretense at objectivity is completely by the boards with you. You come off as a disingenuous spinmaster for a franchise in obvious decline.

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 7:44 PM | Link to this

McFann O

I think Chip posts on this blog.

By sooner

July 31, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this

DOB - so do you have to give Ohman his bumper sticker back? It really tied his locker together.

By Shamus Thacker

July 31, 2008 7:46 PM | Link to this

Hammy’s looking like a Cure 81 tonight.

By sooner

July 31, 2008 7:50 PM | Link to this

Huddy should listen to Dr. Andrews and have the surgery so he can get a head start on rehabbing. Dr. Andrews is very good. And thorough.

By bravos2249

July 31, 2008 7:50 PM | Link to this

DOB

so basically we got

James vs. Suppan Morton vs. CC and Campillo vs Sheets

WE GONNA BE SWEEPED!

By Shamus Thacker

July 31, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this

Great news about Mac. Wish we had more interest in signing Ohman.

I take back everything I’ve said about our “whipping boy,” he does more good injured. Wince Hammy, wince!!

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 7:54 PM | Link to this

Nice hit by Hampton!

By Train Wreck Bystander

July 31, 2008 7:56 PM | Link to this

If I lived in Cardinals territory (which I don’t), I could be watching the game on dish Network.

I see “The Big Lebowski” is on Fuse, though. Take that, Peachtree.

By Shamus Thacker

July 31, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this

Hammy can flat-out hit! He’s better than half our bench.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 8:00 PM | Link to this

Infante needs to be a fixture on this team for a while.. He’s very valuable

By bravos2249

July 31, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this

They like their infield and bullpen for next season, for the most part, but want to add an outfielder and definitely have to address the starting rotation, especially in light of the Hudson injury.

So basically they want Mr. 8.02 era instead of Mr. 2.80 era as a leftie specialist, just bescause Ring is cheap?

The Braves need to stop that c.rap….the Phillies payed to keep their leftie and many teams have too.

Your not going to get far with someone who can’t get people out.

By OldTimer

July 31, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this

Looks like the Braves and the AJC are in the same boat… and it be a sinkin. Time to bail fellas. Spend your money and time elsewhere. They’ll be back, but not with this bunch.

By ijonathan

July 31, 2008 8:04 PM | Link to this

Has anybody else noticed that in the past while, Escobar has started to develop an Andruw-like penchant for taking huge swings and falling back on his right leg? He use to be more balanced in the box and take pitches to right (with authority) much more often.

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 8:05 PM | Link to this

Francoeur may have “righted his ship” so to speak… In his past 7 games, including this one so far, he has hit the following:

G PA AB H XBH SO BB  AVG  OBP  SLG  OPS
7 29 24 8   1  4  4 .333 .414 .375 .789

By Shamus Thacker

July 31, 2008 8:05 PM | Link to this

If Hammy were a regular he’d eventually bat over .300 and have 45 doubles. Too old to switch now though, he’d be perpetually injured anyway.

By ijonathan

July 31, 2008 8:08 PM | Link to this

Was Kotchman grabbing his hammy after hitting 1B?

By Brett Butler Fan

July 31, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this

And Kotsay just jogged to first… Am I the only one who despises that? Isn’t it disrespecting the game?

By McFann Ô

July 31, 2008 8:12 PM | Link to this

Jeff321—

You’re prob’ly correct…Chip, you here?

DOB McCANN could be ready to pinch-hit in the weekend series if he gets cleared tonight by doctor. He’s coming along well. I’d expect him to be ready to catch by the start of the road trip.

WHOO-HOO!! Thanks for the great news, Chief!

He’ll prob’ly pinch hit Sunday when I can’t watch…

By KC

July 31, 2008 8:13 PM | Link to this

FRANK WREN IS A PRETTY SMART DUDE

Or so it would appear.

Lost in an unprecedented (at least from where I’m sitting it is) rash of injuries… is the fact that Wren’s winter moves turned out nicely.

We all know about the Renteria/Jurrjens trade, which is probably the best trade this team has made since the McGriff deal. But Infante and Ohman have made Wren look pretty damned smart as well.

I have to admit, I was not impressed when I heard Omar Infante was going to be the 5th infielder and Chipper’s primary backup. “OMAR WHO???!! Isn’t Wes Helms available???!!!”

I was wrong. That guy has been a bonafide bad*ss for us this year. And Ohman has been our most valuable reliever.

No one could have expected Glavine to break down. This was a guy who had never been on the DL, and here you had Moyer (who is several years older and of a similar mold) still chugging along. And he had no fewer than 3 backup options for Kotsay in CF heading into the season (Blanco, Anderson, Schafer). So it’s just asinine to try and hang the injuries on Wren, as though it’s his fault for not predicting everything that’s happened.

All in all, despite really, REALLY sh!tty luck… Wren deserves an “A” grade for his first year of work as Braves’ GM.

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 8:14 PM | Link to this

What is Omar Infante’s contract status after this season? Is he a free agent? He is a very valuable asset to the Braves because of his versatiliy, solid defense, and usually gives a quality at-bat.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 8:16 PM | Link to this

bravos2249: yeah, those matchups ain’t looking too swell, eh? Campillo can hang with anyone when he’s on, though. But it’s frightening to think how many strikeouts Sheets might get against this current lineup, considering what he does against typical Braves lineups.

You gotta wonder if the Brew Crew will come in fired up or depressed after getting kicked all over their own yard by their NL Central foes from Chicago this week….

Time to bail fellas. Spend your money and time elsewhere. They’ll be back, but not with this bunch.OldTimer

I’m not quite sure what this means, but I’m gonna suggest to take your own advice.

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 8:16 PM | Link to this

The Braves must get rid of Boyer, Acosta, Ring, and try and trade Soriano.

Now, if any of them show up next year.. You can bet Cox will have ‘em in there blowing games all the time. Which means Cox is a joke and Wren too for allowing it.

As if it matters, I would much rather see someone “new” get “lit up” than the same losers!

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this

Got to feel sorry for the Yankees fans.

Pudge Rod. strikes out in his 1st AB as a yankee and they booooo him………WTF??????? The guy has not sleep since he got traded……what a joke.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 8:19 PM | Link to this

Drummerdad, I love Carly Simon’s “You’re So Vain.” Man, 70s pop was what I was weened on.

I was just talking with a 40-something woman in the pressbox this afternoon about that subject, after the reference to Dave Mason’s “We Just Disagree.”

Loved that song, and all those from that era that I heard on top-40 radio are forever ingrained in my brain. The Jackson 5, Hughes Corporation, Dr. Hook, etc, etc.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 8:20 PM | Link to this

TEX is 1 for 1 with a walk and a runs scored.

That lineup is packed……..hard to beat those guys……they have traded andy petite like if he was chuck james.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this

Jeff321: Your 7:44 post … well, it just might be correct. Perhaps. You never know.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this

Dang! The stupid Fillies are winning again!

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this

Infante- quickly becoming one of my favorites… Keep him in the lineup Bobby

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 8:25 PM | Link to this

I just don’t understand why the Braves wouldn’t make a push to sign Ohman. I know they need an outfielder & starter, but also will have a ton of money freed up.

It’s not like they have a “cheap” alternative to Ohman. Well I take that back, they have Ring. He’s cheap, but he’s also not very good.

I was thinking the pen next year would be fairly solid with Ohman, Soriano, Gonzo, Moylan, Stockman, Bennett & ???? I would add Smoltz & hopefully he comes back, but that’s a rough sugery for a 40 something pitcher.

I just don’t see how they wouldn’t sign him to a 2 year deal. It’s way too early to tell what’s going to have to be spent on other needs so why discount signing him? I know Wren didn’t outright say that, but he seems a lot more candid than JS & everything he hinted or implied to DOB has turned out to be the case so I have no reason to doubt him this time.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 8:25 PM | Link to this

To clarify on Braves’ intentions with Ohman. I don’t know if Wren was just stating it the way he did, that they’d have two months with Ohman pitching and a draft pick as compensation, if that was an indication they had no intention of signing him. I asked and he said, no, we haven’t ruled out anything.

But I should say, Cox said he hopes the Braves can re-sign him. He really likes having Ohman in the bullpen and wants to keep him.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this

Only the Dodgers, Giants and Nats have less HR than the Braves and even the Padres have more HR.

Marlins have 33· more HR than we do. Amazing.

By Tacitus

July 31, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this

Garbage: Only Happy when it Rains…….

By Steve from OH

July 31, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this

Jeff 321:

Then who do you suggest we get to fill the remaining 4 spots in the pen? Ring may be gone next year anyway. Get rid of Boyer, Acosta, and Soriano? Why, exactly? Boyer is a pretty decent reliever who has been overworked and overexposed. Ditto for Manny Acosta. Soriano, when healthy, is a very good reliever. We’re (hopefully) getting Moylan back next season and we’ll have a full season of a healthy Gonzo and Soriano. If we keep Ohman, we can use Manny and Boyer in 6th inning/situational spots and we won’t have to keep trotting them out in the 8th with the game on the line. Luckily for the rest of us FW is a smart guy and will keep them, giving us a pretty nice looking pen next year.

Next year’s pen: Soriano, Gonzo, Moylan, Bennett, Acosta, Boyer, Ohman.

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this

It is nice having Hampton’s bat in the 9th spot…

GO BRAVES!!

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this

Its nice to see Hampton hauling A out of the box after making contact! I mean, not too many Braves do that.

By will

July 31, 2008 8:36 PM | Link to this

THE ATLANTA BRAVES SUX,IWOULD NOT SEE THIS TEAM PLAY IF THEY SENT ME A free ticket,until a owner from georgia buys the braves like arthur blank,this team can go to hell, iam tired of liars,and pimp squimps,iwork my a ss off all day long,and this franchise cant get a player, or players to try AND WIN THE NEXT 50 GAMES AND WIN THE DIVISION,THEY CAN TAKE COX,AND THE OVER PAID CHIPPER,AND THE REST OF THE LOSERS AND GO WHERE THE SUN DOESNT SHINE 9FEET BELOW IM TIRED OF LOSERS.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 8:37 PM | Link to this

TennesseePaul

Are you trying to jinx JF???

Jefff321

I also think Soriano should be gone, but Id think you cant parts ways with Boyer, Soriano and Acosta at the same time.

Id stay with Acosta, guy has good stuff, he is just a kid….he has been lights out and then struggle…….Id give him more time, but he has to be at the middle of pen not as a center piece…..let him mature.

Boyer I think would do better if he was not so overused……he might end up as Moylan………elbow surgery.

Soriano, if he has any injury the rest of the season, Id say bye bye, but if he stays healthy, maybe we get lucky with him. Mike is looking very good, and its only his second outing. Maybe we have ourselves our #3 pitcher for next year if not #2 ahead of Campillo.

By Tilly

July 31, 2008 8:39 PM | Link to this

I know that this was the non-waiver trade deadline. But, isn’t there another deadline where trades can still happen via the waiver wire? I remember a couple of years ago that the Braves put Andruw on it and basically the Braves front office said that almost everyone goes on the waiver wire. When does the waiver wire start and isn’t there a possibility that the Braves could make trades at a later date? It might be interesting to see who the Dodgers put on the waiver wire given their back log on center fielders.

By h_charles

July 31, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this

For this team to REALLY compete next year, I’d love to see this:

Package Reyes and whatever it takes to get Brian Roberts out of Baltimore. Good D, can run, and hit for some pop. Can bat leadoff, and let Blanco move to #8 so we have our own version of a Victorino — not at the top if you want to compete for a title.

Big bat in LF, RH hitter. I really wouldn’t mind Dunn. Very underrated hitter. Devastating power, the likes of which we DESPERATELY need.

Move Blanco to CF. He needs to get better breaks on the ball, but can learn.

Sign Sabathia (OK — that may be a bit much for this group, but that would be ideal). Sheets is scary as well, but injury prone. That is the LAST thing we need.

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this

Speaking with the fam an interesting point was brought up.
The team throwing up the white flag might actually be a good thing for Francoeur. This will be like a minor league rehab stint against major league pitching. No pressure to do too much, just figure out what to do and make it a habit…

By Supes

July 31, 2008 8:43 PM | Link to this

They showed some really telling stats for the month of July for Jeff, Kelly and Yunel combined, how much they’ve struggled and for a combined 3HR for the month!

This is why Bobby Cox play for the 3 run HR isn’t going to work with this bunch in 2008.

DOB glad that Frank Wren said they are going to take a look at some of the young players in the minors.

KC, I have to say Omar Infante has exceed any expectations (if there were any to begin with), and that trade with Cubs was a win for the Braves. Ohman has been our most consisant and productive arm out of pen.

Meanwhile…Ascanio is…yeah who cares!

Who knew that Omar could play such good defense on the infield? Solid DP and a good stretch by Casey to get the out at 1B.

Anyone taking me up on the over/under HR total that Chuck James will give up to a mad as hell Brewers team on Friday Night? I’m at 3 for the record, before he leaves the game:)

DOB…When are the Braves planning to get Chipper out there, when his days on the 15 day DL are up, or are they going to evaluate him and maybe give him some more time? Thanks for the update on BMac! Need BMac’s bat in the lineup!

By will

July 31, 2008 8:44 PM | Link to this

THE BRAVES CAN TAKE THIS WHOLE TEAM AND DIG A GRAVE ,BECAUSE THEY PLAY DEAD , THEY SUX , THIS TEAM IS WORSE THAN THE TEAM IN THE 70,S.IF THEY THINK IM GONNA TAKE MY HARD EARNED MONEY AND PAY FOR THAT TEAM THEY ARE DUMMER THAN ROCKS.

By Gary

July 31, 2008 8:48 PM | Link to this

Cooper and Tomahawk Kris, guys you need to get a clue on how baseball works. Wren did not know that Manny was going to be traded and the D-Backs had already told him that Connor Jackson was not available, nor was Sherzer or Parker. Wren got a great deal from the Angels for Kotchman and kept Ohman for one of two reasons either to A) resign him or B) get the draft picks when he leaves. Obviously those options were better than what the Red Sox or any other team offered. If he took a crappy B or C prospect, you two would have been on here tearing him a new one like everyone else. Sometimes the market is just not there.

The rest of you who are wondering if the Braves are going to spend money for FAs. Go to 680thefans website and see if you can locate the interview that Buck and Kincaid had with Wren this afternoon. Wren basically said the Braves will rebuild the starting rotation next year and that could include both FA signings and trades. He also said the Braves will look for a power hitting LF. Also if you don’t like Buck and Kincaid, then zip over to 790s page and lookup the interview Brandon Adams had with Mark Bowman during the pre-game show tonight. He basically said the same thing.

On another note. Chop Chop, great Lebowski reference there buddy. Love it!

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 8:50 PM | Link to this

Infante- quickly becoming one of my favorites… Keep him in the lineup Bobby

I agree, Infante plays multiple positions and knows how to hit. In other words, he can be our “Mark Derosa” since we let him get away, eh?

I just don’t understand why the Braves wouldn’t make a push to sign Ohman.

IMO, with Gonzalez as the closer.. They’ll need someone that can get outs in the 7th & 8th. And from my vantage point, those two (Ohman & Gonzalez) are the only ones I trust in the bullpen this year.

By ncscoots

July 31, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this

Tilly, thanks for asking about waivers; that might have been my all-time favorite thread here last year. But the one about root canals overtook it, LOL.

Waivers don’t “start”, players can be put on waivers at any time (and are, all the time). Two kinds of waivers, revocable and irrevocable. Players claimed on revocable can be pulled back (once), and a trade worked out between the parties. Players on irrevocable cannot be pulled back.

By Mike

July 31, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this

This team is going to need a power hitter in the worst way this offseason.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this

Is Kotchman gonna hit the ball out of the IF this year?

he is like 0 for 8 with 10 grounders………..

By StingerSplash/Casey Kasem

July 31, 2008 8:52 PM | Link to this

This long distance dedication is a two-parter. Some years ago, a precocious, some say arrogant, young man named The Duke fell in love with an alluring power hitter with an odd temperament. The Duke showered Manny with riches, but soon, The Duke was gone, torn away from Manny’s grasp. But a new romance entered the scene, the brash, even younger Theo, a hometown hero, born and bred to make the world right. And was well for so long, even through the fights and the Green Monster walls Manny threw up between himself and those who loved him. So after another spat and a throwdown with the traveling secretary, Manny felt alone and isolated. Eventually, the handsome young Theo had to set his beloved and free spirit slugger free. So this is to Manny, now thousands of miles away from the Fenway faithful who loved him. Casey, could you play “Goodbye to You” by Scandal? Thanks,

Red Sox Nation. (Actually, I prefer “For Whom the Bell Tolls” by Metallica.)

By 18 Wheels of Love

July 31, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this

Dear Looper,

Today’s the game. I hope we win. But it will be hard without Kelly.

Your Pal,

Tanner Boyle

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this

DOB—

So who gets ditched when they bring up Chucky?

Thanks!

And thanks for the updates on McCann, too! I can’t till he cann play again! I am so beyond ready! Did I thank you for the updates?

Come Monday, it’ll be alright…

By will

July 31, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this

THE COLORADO OWNERS THAT TIME WARNER SOLD THE BRAVES TO DOES NOT GIVE A CRAP WHETHER THE BRAVES WIN OR LOSE ITS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY THE SORRY A SS ES WILL NEVER GET A DIME OF MY MONEY AFTER TODAY IM THROUGH,WITH THE CSORRY AS S FALCONS, HAWKS, THRASHERS, GT, AND UGA THEY WILL NEVER WIN THE NC THIS YEAR THE SCHEDULE IS STACKED AGAINST AS A SPORTS FAN IM TIRED OF LOSERS,IN ATLANTA, THE BRAVES ARE THE WORST,THEY HAVE MORE EXCUSES, THAN OBAMA,MCCAIN,HILLERY, AND BUSH COMBINED GET RID OF ALL TEAMS IN GEORGIA SO THE AVERAGE SPORTS FAN CAN GO BACK TO A NORMAL LIFE MY GOD THIS CRAP IS RIDICULOUS,SORRY IS NOT A WORD,ICANT WRITE WHAT I WANT TO.IAM ABOUT TO EXPLODE.,THIS SORRY A SS TEAM CALLED THE BRAVES.,HOW CAN THESE PRICKS GET PAID.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this

Only the Dodgers, Giants and Nats have less HR than the Braves and even the Padres have more HR.

Marlins have 33· more HR than we do. Amazing.

The Marlins lead the Majors in HR with 151.. we have 100

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this

What??? no muts fans around the blog tonight? Is it because phillies and fish are winning?

By Saltywoody

July 31, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this

KC

Well said about Wren. Totally agree. Crap luck and underperforming regulars are not something you can predict.

By John in Wichita

July 31, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this

Regarding Manny… shouldn’t the Red Sox be saying “Don’t shed a tear for me, my life won’t end without you”?? (Paul Carrack)

http://www.lyricsmode.com/lyrics/p/paulcarrack/dontshedatear.html

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 9:04 PM | Link to this

Sammons just matched Corky’s home-run total!

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this

Nice Clint!

GO BRAVES

By Gary

July 31, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this

Will, if you don’t care about any of those teams, then leave. Those of us who do care will not be sad to see you go. Enough of the ranting already. You hate Liberty Media, we get it already. Sheesh!

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this

Please dont leave me Clint Sammons!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By McFann Ô

July 31, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this

Waytago, Sam!

6-4 Braves!!

By Renegator

July 31, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this

Is there any reason why the Braves shouldn’t DFA Corky Miller and let Sammons split time behind the plate with McCann.

Give McCann some extra days off since they are out of it anyway.

By will

July 31, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

TAKE THIS TEAM AND SHOVE IT,IM NOT WATCHING THEM NO MORE,THEY DONE,LEFT ALL THERE PLAYING ,LEFT AT THE DOOR,BOBBY SAID ITS OKAY NOT TO PLAY NO MORE ,CAUSE WE GET PAID ,BY THE DUMMIES,I BE BE ON THE DL,SEE YOU AT THE DOOR.

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

Well at least Sammons is a threat of getting a hit when he comes to the plate. He showed some good power there Sometimes I wonder why Corky waste the energy to carry a bat to the plate.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

ATLsports10: Infante is arb-eligible one more time, not a free agent until after next season. Solid player, I agree.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

Look out McCann, another sheriff is in town!

By david

July 31, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this

possible rotation for next year sheets jurrjens glavine hampton (if he sighns for a little of nothing same for glavine)campillo i think glav still has something if not sign livan hernandez hes a work horse

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this

Then who do you suggest we get to fill the remaining 4 spots in the pen?

I agree that Boyer & Acosta have been overworked. And maybe they’d pitch better if this wasn’t the case. However, while Cox was overworking Boyer & Acosta guess who wasn’t being brought in when we needed to shut the door? Ohman. So, that means Cox is incapable of managing effectively. Well, unless you’d like to try and convince me Boyer or Acosta are better than Ohman.

Ah, and then we have Phil Stockman. I know he didn’t get a lot of chances to prove himself. But, did he even give up one run? See the problem here? When someone repeatedly fails, WTF are ya doing sending them out there? Its almost a guaranteed loss for the Braves when these guys show up.

With that said, we can bring up people from AAA to fill in the spots or sign free agents. I mean, surely you see the importance of keeping a lead? Because if you let Boyer&Acosta blow it out before Gonzalez gets in there.. the game is already over..

By CC1973

July 31, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this

Hey will, You’re posting on this blog, and obviously following the club… so who exactly is dumber than rocks.

Dude- just don’t ever play poker. You’d lose everything you’ve got. OK, have fun not paying attention to the Braves.

By rupert

July 31, 2008 9:10 PM | Link to this

couple of big rips from sammons tonight, hopefully he’ll get the rest of the ab’s till mac gets back, and maybe he’ll get the backup job for the last two months, i know they wanted to get him some ab’s and he’s gotten them, so keep him up for aug. and let corky go, the team gains NOTHING by him playing, not now, not for the future, his defense is sub-par (costing the braves atleast one game) and his offensive numbers are… does he have offensive numbers?

By Bruce's Pearl

July 31, 2008 9:10 PM | Link to this

By David O’Brien

July 31, 2008 9:04 PM | Link to this

Sammons just matched Corky’s home-run total! DOB: did you mean career or this season?

By N8

July 31, 2008 9:11 PM | Link to this

will

Twice within a half hour, you’ve used the phrase… “The Braves sux”

When you did it once, I considered it a “typo”, but once you made the same grammatical error twice, I’ve come to the conclusion that your and idiot.

Ooops. Let me type in “will talk”…..YOUR AND IDIOT!!!!!

Let’s recap your (ahem) intelligence.

Quote #1: “THE ATLANTA BRAVES SUX,IWOULD NOT SEE THIS TEAM PLAY IF THEY SENT ME A free ticket,”

There’s the first time you used “sux” (which no matter how you spell it, it is NOT grammatically correct). Second, if you wouldn’t see them, maybe you should have your eyes checked. Third. I’m not sure why you stopped using ALL CAPS in the middle of a sentence. Are you drunk?

Quote #2: (this one is my favorite) “AND WIN THE NEXT 50 GAMES AND WIN THE DIVISION,THEY CAN TAKE COX,AND THE OVER PAID CHIPPER,AND THE REST OF THE LOSERS AND GO WHERE THE SUN DOESNT SHINE 9FEET BELOW IM TIRED OF LOSERS.”

Now come on. You don’t actually believe that there are ANY players that would help the Braves win the next 50 games, do you? Chipper is NOT over-paid.

What country do you live in where people are buried 9 feet below? Or were you saying you want them to go 9 FEET BELOW where you’re tired of losers? Either way, I’ve read kindergarten chicken scratch that makes more sense.

Quote #3: “THE BRAVES CAN TAKE THIS WHOLE TEAM AND DIG A GRAVE ,BECAUSE THEY PLAY DEAD , THEY SUX , THIS TEAM IS WORSE THAN THE TEAM IN THE 70,S.IF THEY THINK IM GONNA TAKE MY HARD EARNED MONEY AND PAY FOR THAT TEAM THEY ARE DUMMER THAN ROCKS.”

With the way they play, what makes you think they’re capable of digging the 6 FOOT hole (here in America, we dig 6 foot holes to bury people in), much less the 9 FOOT one you requested. Second, this team is NOT worse than the 70’s teams. But the last line I agree with. You should not spend your “hard earned money” on Braves tickets. Anybody that spells DUMBER with two “M’s”, should spend their hard earned money on the latest edition of Hooked on Phonics.

Thank you. I appreciate your ignorance and lack of intelligence. It makes some of my over the top rants NOT seem so ridiculous.

Well done.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 9:11 PM | Link to this

Wow, Hampton lowered his ERA by 3.5 runs per game tonight!

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:12 PM | Link to this

We are going to have to go on a winning streak if we are going to win 100 games this year ;)

By Supes

July 31, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this

The not so subtle hint from Joe Simpson about Clint Sammons after he hit that 2 run HR…”Hopefully he’ll continue to get a whole lot more at bats” :smirk:

Yes, if Corky sees another AB anytime soon…it’ll be hard to argue with Coach about Bobby Cox!:)

Have a game Clint Sammons, first major league HR and RBI’s both in the same game. He was sitting between BMac and Waste of Oxygen in the dugout, Corky just saw his playing time disappear, we all know how Bobby loves the 2 run and 3 run HR!

I’m encouraged by what I saw from Hampton tonight. If he continues to improve, and pitch, eventually to 7 innings consistantly, he maybe worth signing to a very small incentive based contract for 2009. Braves could use him in the rotation in the 4th or 5th spot.

By jtb

July 31, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this

will

While your post has many well thought out, intelligent thoughts, I have to ask, what’s with all the commas?

By SoWeGa Fanatic

July 31, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this

Manny song = The Temptations’ “Ball of Confusion”

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this

Wayne—

No no no…I don’t think so.

Sorry, buddy.

GO BRAVES!!! You need a win, boys!

I pray the bullpen holds this…

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this

Sammons just matched Corky’s home-run total!

In only what 2 or 3 games? Congrats to Clint on his first dinger. Too bad the Braves couldn’t have used him as the back up this season.

Sammons & Hampton have 5 RBI’s in the game, unreal……

By 22oz

July 31, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this

Hopefully Sammons plays into the Braves plan of evaluating their team for the rest of the year. It would also keep them true to their word of staying competitive, where playing Corky would not.

And i agree will, the Braves sux. lets show em’ we’re not dum.

By Brett Butler Fan

July 31, 2008 9:18 PM | Link to this

Did you hear Bobby yell “EASY” to Jeff Bennett while he was busting it to first trying to beat out that ground ball? Do you agree with that attitude? Is that the prevailing culture, the pressure to win is so great and the players make so much money that the manager is afraid they will stub their toe hustling?

I remember an incident where Tom Glavine, in his first tour with the Braves, jogged from 3rd to home, assuming the throw was going to first. The infielder instead threw home where Tommy was out easily. After the game a reporter questioned him about his lack of hustle. He answered that it was “understood that pitchers did not have to extend themselves by running hard”. I don’t accept this ‘culture’. Do you?

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this

I think we are all in agreement that Clint should be the backup catcher… But dont we still have to make a roster move for Chuckie tomorrow? I dread that decision

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this

N8

Not to be rude but if you are jumping on someone for making a grammatical error it is not advantageous to make an error yourself by substituting “your” when you mean “you’re” or “you are.”

By THIS JUST IN

July 31, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this

Hey Shaun,

Like I said bro, Feliz will come back to haunt the Braves. Yes, he hasn’t turned 21 yet. But neither has Clayton Kershaw. Do you think the Dodgers have any plans of trading him????

Not all young low A pitchers who post good bb/k ratios become stars in the majors….

but you can’t think that all of them are expendable.

And yes, that is basically what you said in your statements yesterday to me.

Feliz is a stud and the Braves shouldn’t of traded him.

And on a side note, the Braves did a good job to keep Ohman and get a draft pick because if they sign any Type A’s they will have to give up a 2nd rounder. They won’t give up their first because this team doesn’t have a shot in hell to finish in the top half of the league.

By N8

July 31, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this

will

It appears as though I hit “post” too soon. You out did yourself with your 8:55.

“ICANT WRITE WHAT I WANT TO”

Truer words have never been typed on this blog. I’m surprised you can find your damn computer, much less connect to the internet and login to the blog.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this

We have a winner in the Manny song contest. Look above.

By jtb

July 31, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this

The thing that concerns me about the Braves potentially signing Ohman is that since Bobby has, and probably will, overworked Ohman so much this season he could easily be the next Peter Moylan.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this

Corky’s homerun was in the second row of Wrigley Field with the wind gusting out to left. I’d say Sammons is ahead!

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this

N8

Funny retort. YU BETTER BE CARFUL OR, will WILL BARY YU NINE FEET UNDER.

Sammons homer made me smile… and then grit my teeth knowing the couple a games he coulda been hitting with guys on base but sat the pine for Miller.

By SoWeGa Fanatic

July 31, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this

Hey, these no-names are jelling. They are playing “the game”.

By Robin

July 31, 2008 9:26 PM | Link to this

Infante RAKES I tell ya! He RAKES!!!!!

By StingerSplash/Casey Kasem

July 31, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this

Don’t know about the future of print, but the ajc.com folks sure know how to get web hits. The front page has a story about a guy decapitating his seat mate on a bus just above the story about the city of Lavonia buying a strip joint (and closing it, alas). Guaranteed to drive traffic right there, ya’ll.

By jtb

July 31, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this

Brett Butler Fan

I think Booby’s main reason for yelling easy is because earlier in the year Manny Acosta tore his hamstring trying to beat out a double play. It seems foolish for a reliever to injure themselves hustling to 1st on a routine ground ball.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:29 PM | Link to this

Matt Harrison’s line tonight:

4.2 Innings 5 hits 6 runs (4 earned) 5 BB 2 K’s

defense didnt help him out at all though

By N8

July 31, 2008 9:29 PM | Link to this

ATLSports10

“Not to be rude but if you are jumping on someone for making a grammatical error it is not advantageous to make an error yourself by substituting “your” when you mean “you’re” or “you are.””

I normally don’t call out people for grammar errors (I make plenty).

But and idiot needs to be called and idiot, and wil is and idiot. Or should I say that all of will’s posts sux?

By SoWeGa Fanatic

July 31, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this

Omar Infiniti - and beyond!

By StingerSplash/Casey Kasem

July 31, 2008 9:31 PM | Link to this

On Teixeira’s new team, the first six batters in the order tonight are all hitting between .281 and .286. And the guy in the seven-hole is hitting .332. Maybe that’s why they’re 27 games above .500.

By Steve from OH

July 31, 2008 9:32 PM | Link to this

Jeff 321:

I never said that Boyer/Acosta was better than Ohman. Don’t think so, either, for what it’s worth. Never said anything about Cox, so I don’t know where that came from. All I’m saying is that with a healthy Ohman, Soriano, Gonzo and Moylan we do not need Boyer and Acosta to pitch in the the 8th with the game on the line. They become 6th/7th inning guys, and even then they won’t pitch that often (or as much as they have this year, in any case). And I like them in that role. They will do the job well. Stockman? He’s good, no reason not to try him. Let him win a job in ST. But there is absolutely no way we sign a FA reliever if we re-sign Ohman. I think DOB said we’ve already got 10 million committed in Gonzo and Soriano, and if we add what Ohman would get, we wouldn’t have any cash to spend on the pen if we want to upgrade the rotation.

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

Brett Butler Fan

I appreciate that you want your professional ballplayers to go “all out” during all moments of the game. But Bennett running to first on that play isn’t at all similar to, say, Manny Ramirez putzing to first on a sure out ground ball. This is a pitcher who just returned from a rehab assignment. He shouldn’t be busting it to first on a routine ground ball where he is most certainly going to be out. I mean the guy is pitching for a staff that has been ravaged by injuries. If he pulls up with a hammie pull ‘cause he’s gunning it to first on that play, I’d wring his neck.

By h_charles

July 31, 2008 9:34 PM | Link to this

Gosh I hope that HR is enough to relegate Corky to bullpen catcher

By Supes

July 31, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this

Omar Infante continues to make a case for more playing time. Dude’s been hitting line drives all over the park lately. What a steal of a utility man. I hope the Braves keep him at least for next season as well. I like his versatility and he’s got an easy going swing, seems to hit a lot of balls right on the sweet spot of the bat.

He’s Chipper Jone’s insurance right now, and a good one.

By Mike A

July 31, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this

Are the Braves assuming Ohman nets a supplemental pick? He’s probably type B right now - it’s close - but if he has a couple of bad outings he could drop below the threshold. There’s some risk involved.

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this

I think Will is the Droolers long lost brother.

By NCBravesFan

July 31, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this

In light of Ohman not being moved today, I keep waiting for Anders to pop in and tell us that if Wren would have tried to trade him Tuesday instead of today, we would have gotten Beckett or Haren in return.

By N8

July 31, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this

DOB

If going with Warren Zevon, why not go with Werewolves of London?

I know it doesn’t have anything to do with Manny Ramirez, but it reminds me of the move The Color of Money, which doesn’t sux.

By Random

July 31, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this

Here’s another currently working link to Will Ohman’s Harry Caray line-up presentation.

(Sorry, McFann — you somehow linked to this very page.)

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this

I see Frenchy’s still striking out with his golf swing. Funny, Infante used a golf swing earlier and got a hit. But, then again, Infante never looks awful like Frenchy at the plate.

By Jerald Holcombe

July 31, 2008 9:38 PM | Link to this

So far, Sammons is 5 for 10 in his short career. That’s as many hits as Miller has had all year.

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this

N8

True, Will’s grammar mistakes are a bit more apparent and even mindboggling. Nobody (especially me) is always grammatically correct. The substituting “your” for “you’re” is just a mistake one of my language arts teachers used to hound on so much that I began to notice the mistake being made more often.

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 9:41 PM | Link to this

Dante Heath has a perfect game through 6 innings for Mississippi tonight.

By N8

July 31, 2008 9:41 PM | Link to this

DOB

I saw somebody ask this question to you the other day (yesterday maybe? Or maybe earlier today? Not sure), but didn’t see your answer.

Who’s “in charge” of deciding that Corky Miller is on the 25 man roster? Bobby or Wren?

I’m not talking “in general” who has the over-riding decision on all guys on the 25-man roster. I’m specifically asking who is responsible for Corky Miller being on this roster all year?

Not that it matters. Just curious.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:43 PM | Link to this

Clint doing his thing!!! He’s got more hits in this game then Corky does in the season!!!

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 9:44 PM | Link to this

Sammons for MVP! (ahem) I mean…Sammons for backup catcher!

By Cut Corky

July 31, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this

Still in SHOCK that Tampa Bay didn’t make a huge attempt to get Tex from us. Now seeing what Manny went for, I feel like we made a so-so trade. I like Kotchman and he will do ok but I just thought that we could get more. Oh well, wait till next year.

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

Sammons has three hits tonight, 1 homer, 3 RBIs. Corky has five hits, 1 homer and 3 RBI in 26 games. Please DFA Corky, Mr. Wren.

By NCBravesFan

July 31, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

DOB Eartha says thanks for the consideration, and there’s no shame in losing to the late, great Z.

By ADC

July 31, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

DOB: Obviously corky’s been getting killed on here for a long time now. What is the organizational opinion of him? Do pitchers like throwing to him? What is it tht keeps him on the team?

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this

McFann Thought that would get your attention! :-)

Jeff321 Clearly, you do not like Bobby Cox. Not a problem, he drives me nuts sometimes too in his use of the bullpen, and some of his lineups….

But, you need to understand that Soriano has NO trade value. He has wimped out all year, after scoring that 9 Mil contract for two years. I think we are stuck with him.

Next Phil Stockman had a hamstring injury, and while he was on the roster, he wasn’t really available, as I understand it. When he was sent down, he was immediately DL’d.

As for Boyer and Acosta, they are either worn down from overuse, or extremely inconsistent. Probably a little of both. Could Bobby manage this bullpen better, certainly, but he goes with the guys he feels like he can trust, often to their detriment.

If Gonzo, Soriano and Moylan were all healthy from the get go, then Boyer, Acosta, Ohman, etc would not have been used as frequently.

You speak of bringing up AAA guys, well what do you think Boyer and Acosta were up until just recently.

Bobby is not going away until he is good and darned ready. Live with it. Nothing any of us says or thinks matters to the Braves. Personally, I really like Bobby, but just disagree with his use of the team at times, BUT, he has been successful doing it his way (regardless of what some on here would have you think!). It is hard to argue with his success, and with the respect he has around the league. If you don’t buy that, then you are sorely mistaken, or you never listen to national sports programs. (or DOB’s posts on the subject)

So, I think it was Steve in OH who was telling you that if we stay put with our pen as is, next year it should be a good one. Let’s just hope the Braves use some of that $$ saved next year on Ohman.

Let’s get worked up on who/how we can fix our left field problem, our backup catcher and corner infielder problem, Frenchy’s troubles, and our impending shortage of starting pitching for 2009.

It should be a fun winter!

By Carroll Rogers

July 31, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this

hey, just for fun to throw a changeup…..we here at Braves/MIB central have sent DOB packing to get a little R & R and i’ve taken over the controls…ha HA!

thought i’d throw out this little nugget. Since July 3, Infante has hit safely in 9 of 10 games, going 16 for 42 (.381) with two home runs.

oh and the homer for Sammons matched his own total in Richmond in 81 games.

By Jerald Holcombe

July 31, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this

Y’know, the season is really what you make of it. Even though the Braves aren’t gonna win the division or come close to the playoffs, you can still enjoy the games and see some good young players, like Sammons, really make their mark for the future. DOB Can you elaborate on Sammons. Is he supposed to be this good, or are we just seeing someone taking advantage of little info on a team’s scouting report.

By southbeachdietfreak

July 31, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this

Alas, Braves about to win and no TV! Someone call the Secretary of Defense and demand he get Peachtree on all Aircraft carriers!

By SoWeGa Fanatic

July 31, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this

Wouldn’t it be great fun if these no-names ran off a string of 10-15 straight wins. Yes, I know, but wouldn’t it be tremendously fun? Probably about like the Marlins’ season has been.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this

come on Gonzo lets close this out

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

Supes@9:35

Ditto

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

(Saying as I rock) It’s a shame Leo Mazzone hasn’t had the chance to be a pitching coach for Mike Gonzalez. (stops rocking…getting dizzy)

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

(Saying as I rock) It’s a shame Leo Mazzone hasn’t had the chance to be a pitching coach for Mike Gonzalez. (stops rocking…getting dizzy)

By Jeff321

July 31, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

DOB - When is the last time we got 15 hits without McCann or Chipper in the lineup? My guess is never.

By McFann O

July 31, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this

Random (Who are you brought to us by this time?—

Why the apology?

By TennesseePaul

July 31, 2008 9:56 PM | Link to this

Nice. The Braves can win without Teixeira. I knew it could be done!

Just got a notice that I’m on the list for a Pinback show tonight, so I’m outa here.

Good pick for the Manny song DOB.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 9:58 PM | Link to this

I think the AJC should make a poll:

Corky

or

Clint

Thatd probably be the most lopsided poll ever

By Don

July 31, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this

Is it just me, or does the Braves brass sound defeatist or almost surrendered to the impossibility of resigning any Braves player who is in their free agent year?

By SoWeGa Fanatic

July 31, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this

If the official score has a heart, he will screw up and award Hampton the win tonight … just because …

By J.L.

July 31, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this

If the manager putts corky back in, even Dob should complain.

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 10:02 PM | Link to this

ATLSports10

this is a post I used on the earlier blog. Consider this a gift. …. your welcome!

:-)

One more lesson in MIB/BBQ/Music Blogging: If someone is being totally obnoxious or totally anal, someone might nominate them for the “your and idiot” of the day.

Grammatical errors in that statement are required. Someone a long time ago (we don’t really remember who) stated “your and idiot” to another blogger, and it kinda stuck. It should never be stated any way other than “Your and idiot”.

Grammatically correct, it should be “you’re an idiot”.

No charge on the blogging lesson today!

(remember, pass it forward!)

By McFann Ô

July 31, 2008 10:02 PM | Link to this

Holy cow! (Is that phrase aloud?) What just happened?

They won! They won! They finally WON!!

Sorry to say, though, this weekend we must root for the Cardinals…

Wayne—

I couldn’t miss it. : > (Hey, I’m glad for Sammons, believe me! But I’m ready to have McCann back.)

Welcome, Ms. Rogers!

Night, all!

By Shaun

July 31, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this

Shaun, are you on the Braves’ payroll or something?

Boy, do I wish! As I’m sure most of us do.

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this

Sorry about the double post at 9:54.

By Jerald Holcombe

July 31, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this

Speaking of Leo Mazzone, does anyone think maybe Leo was on to something the way he ran a pitching staff? During his time here he didn’t have very many injuries at all. On the other hand, McDowell can’t seem to get through one week without losing a pitcher for long periods of time. Kinda makes you go hhhhmmmmmm.

By Brett Butler fan

July 31, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this

I understand and appreciate the arguments posted that pitchers shouldn’t have to run the bases hard because they might get injured. Is that the general consensus? If so, why doesn’t the National League adopt the DH? What about a position player? Should he have the right to choose whether to run hard? I don’t know how many times over the years I’ve seen Chipper jog to first on a ground ball to the right side. Brian McCann is not fast, but you’ll always see him at least trying to hustle out a ground ball. Even Escobar, Frenchy, and Kotsay have jogged to first this year if they assume they will be out. What do you think? BTW, remember when Andrew loafed after that short fly ball one year? Bobby took him out of the game during the inning! What has changed?

By Don

July 31, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this

Carroll, please answer the question posed to DOB, who is responsible for Corky being on this team? Wren , Cox, or both?

By N8

July 31, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this

Mike A

“Are the Braves assuming Ohman nets a supplemental pick? He’s probably type B right now - it’s close - but if he has a couple of bad outings he could drop below the threshold. There’s some risk involved.”

I thought the same thing a little earlier today when DOB was talking about it. With how hard Bobby rides him, it’s not that far out of line to worry about him wearing down and having a couple of bad outings.

That would really suck if he dropped just below where he needs to be for us to get a pick and the bolted for the highest bidder.

But that’s worst case scenario, I guess, huh?

By Wayne in Utah

July 31, 2008 10:07 PM | Link to this

Carroll Do you think BC will give Sammons another start after tonight?? Sure hope so.

By JEB

July 31, 2008 10:09 PM | Link to this

Sammons has as many hits (in 2 games) as Corky has ALL Season. I don’t think you have to be that smart to figure this one out! With Corky in this game - we don’t win this one. Let’s see how this goes.

By Jimmy Walker

July 31, 2008 10:10 PM | Link to this

Braves win and Joe Simpson provides the laugh of the day

Appearing on 680 the fan, Homer Joe said that the Braves should keep Bobby Cox because he provides a good ROLE MODEL for the players.

Let’s see, Joe what part of his charming overall character are you referring to?

The chronic second knuckle up the nostril syndrome?

The red-faced swearing and gesturing after every call that doesn’t go the Braves way? Wonderful example to the kids watching.

The annoying, pointless cheerleading from the top dugout step?

The misleading, nonsensical answers and general grumpiness with the press?

Of course, some of his off the field behavior in the past has been less than knightly as well but to you, Joe, he is a ROLE MODEL

Obviously your journalism teacher at the Oklahoma School for Bootlickers wasn’t your role model.

By Goodoleboy58

July 31, 2008 10:10 PM | Link to this

We scored in 5 different innings tonight… Got to love that

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 10:10 PM | Link to this

Heath is still perfect after 7 innings in Mississippi.

By Tomas

July 31, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this

Sammons has already tied corky’s amount of hits and homers. Please cut Corky.

By Don

July 31, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this

45 hits in 4-game series with Cards without Chip and Mc. Unfortunately, clutch hits were a problem in 3 of 4 games.

By BravesFan79

July 31, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this

Well all you people who defended keeping Corky around should be highly dissapointed that Sammons did as much in 1 game as Corky has done all season!!

I mean since when did ever having backups that were worth a Crap ever matter!??

HOW IN THE WORLD DID WE WIN THIS GAME WITHOUT CORKYS DEFENSIVE ABILITIES!!!!

yalls heads must be spinning….like the crazy chic on poultergeist……..

By FaninFaytown

July 31, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this

Nate With regards to your 9:11 post, thank you I couldnt’ have said it better. That was good for a couple laughs.

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this

Well tonight we learned that back up catchers can be expected to carry a batting average higher than their IQ.

How many of you think Corky would have been replaced had the Braves actually stayed in the race? I don’t.

That Infante guy isn’t half bad, huh? He’s here next year for sure they have a back up for Chipper. Just hope both can stay healthy next season. Infante can play just about anywhere it appears & not hurt you with the glove.

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this

So wait…the Dodgers are only renting Manny? hahahahahaa

By jtb

July 31, 2008 10:23 PM | Link to this

Brett Butler Fan

There just isn’t much logic in Bennett hustling to first on a routine play with no outs and no one on base. Earlier in the game with runners on first in third and 1 out, Hampton hustled down the line to prevent a double play to allow the go ahead run to score. That play makes more sense. Chipper is a selective hustler. If it’s a crucial part of the game, or if the Braves are down by a run or 2 late, he’ll book it down the line regardless of where it’s hit. He pulled him hamstring hustling down the line when the Braves already had a big lead. Was it really worth it? Think about where the Braves would be right now had he just jogged. And about the the Andruw thing, playing your position is different than hustling to 1st. Had Bennett made no attempt to field a bunt, Bobby would probably be ticked off.

By LT-AA blogger

July 31, 2008 10:23 PM | Link to this

Please, please, please, let me…..get what I want…..this time….. (The Smiths).

Let this be the end of the Corky era. Let this be the end of the Corky era. Let this be teh end of the Corky era.

There, I said it three times- that’s the magic number right?

By fastasballs

July 31, 2008 10:23 PM | Link to this

Heath gave up a walk & single in the 8th. Not too bad, still in the game & has allowed 1 hit & 1BB after 8 innings.

Rohrbough is pitching for Rome tonight, 9k’s & 2H through 5 scoreless innings.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this

45 hits in 4-game series with Cards without Chip and Mc. Unfortunately, clutch hits were a problem in 3 of 4 games. Don

And in the other 58 loses we have my friend.

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this

Hey hey DOB and/or Carroll - what are the chances they keep Sammons as the 2nd catcher and send down Corkscrew?

By ATLSports10

July 31, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah

Thanks for the lesson! I was not aware of this tradition and background since I am new to the blog, but I will remember it and pass it on. I’ll catch on to the idiosyncrasies of the blog in a few days.

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 10:33 PM | Link to this

BravesFan79

By “all you people who defended keeping Corky,” do you mean us, the bloggers or the Atl. Braves coaches/brass? Haven’t read too many pro “keep Corky” comments round these parts.

The fact that Corky can hit Major League pitching does lessen the sting of Pena being traded - at least to me. I acknowledge some of us may not get over the Pena trade for a while yet.

By David O'Brien

July 31, 2008 10:34 PM | Link to this

Who’s in charge of deciding that Corky Miller is on the 25 man roster? Bobby or Wren?N8

Ordinarily, it’d be Bobby and Frank, with occasional input from coaches. In this case, however, the decision was made by Bowman.

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 10:36 PM | Link to this

I mistyped in that last post. Meant the fact that “Sammons can hit” not, “Corky.”

By Pete H.

July 31, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this

I realize I’m late to the Manny song sweepstakes, but how about Get Out of My Life Woman, written by Allen Toussaint and recorded by many. I think the Paul Butterfield version is the one that was a semi-hit in my neck of the woods back in the 60s. And I know Albert King had a blues hit with it. And Lee Dorsey, who Toussaint wrote it for.

Manny will be with the Yankees next year. Who else would even think about having him at $30 million a year?

By NO MORE BOBBY

July 31, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this

1. Ok - now that Clint Sammons is here and can actually play MLB, can we lose the Corky Miller joke now?

By RedEyedAndBlue

July 31, 2008 10:40 PM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah

Vis-a-vis the “Your and idiot” discussion - weren’t there a set of rules drawn up for rookie bloggers a couple years back? Whatever happened to ‘em?

By Run Heap Run

July 31, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this

yalls heads must be spinning….like the crazy chic on poultergeist……..

The Excorcist.

Poultergeist? Is that a movie about scary chickens? : )

By AdirondackDave

July 31, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this

Hilarious, DOB

By Scott S.

July 31, 2008 10:45 PM | Link to this

OK, let the rebuilding start. Waive Corky, resign Ohman 3 years, Sammons is the back-up catcher. Sign Jurrgens now and take the risk. I know everyone will disagree with this next one but sign Francouer now as well. Hanson should come up in September for his audition. Eric Campbell should come up too to see what he has to offer. Schaffer too if he finishes strong. Who knows Chucky might come up and light a fire under his butt and reclaim a starting spot for the rest of the year. Just some thoughts from me to you!!!

By Random

July 31, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this

McFann O: “Random (Who are you brought to us by this time?— … Why the apology?”

Didn’t you hear? I have hanged capitalism in effigy — I’ve lost my corporate sponsorship.

The apology — you had apparently attempted to link to an Ohman clip back here, but it didn’t work. I didn’t notice that you had fixed it here.

Like I said, sorry.

Cut Corky: “Still in SHOCK that Tampa Bay didn’t make a huge attempt to get Tex from us. Now seeing what Manny went for, I feel like we made a so-so trade.”

You shouldn’t feel too bad — MannyB is head and shoulders above Tex as a hitter:

Tex (career AVG/OBP/SLG): .285/.373/.535

MannyB (career): .312/.409/.590

By N8

July 31, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this

DOB

“Ordinarily, it’d be Bobby and Frank, with occasional input from coaches. In this case, however, the decision was made by Bowman.”

That son of a beeeeeeeeeeeeeep!

So Sammons has as many hits and HR in one game as Corky has had all year, huh?

Good thing that Corky’s defense has won us a few games then, right?

Unreal. But hey. We won a game without Tex, and Kotchman hasn’t done much yet. Uh……that’s a good sign, right?

By Random

July 31, 2008 10:55 PM | Link to this

DOB: “In this case, however, the decision was made by Bowman.”

Good, great stuff!! Laugh out loud funny.

(And the Zevon was a more than apt option.)

By Singing Sweet Home Alabama All Summer Long

July 31, 2008 10:55 PM | Link to this

DOB has a man-crush on Will Ohman

By Brett Butler fan

July 31, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this

jtb at 10:23 makes some very good points. He wrote that “Chipper is a selective hustler” which I agree is very true. My question then would be, are professional coaches and managers now irrelevant? If pro players already have a profound knowledge of when they should actually give a complete effort,do they need any more coaching? Also, when a young player like Escobar doesn’t run hard to first, is that okay, too? Or is he simply being influenced by the veteran players who are setting the prevailing example?

I noticed in tonight’s game that Escobar slid into home when he scored all the way from first. He didn’t have to. He had run hard all the way and knew there would be no throw home. I think he slid because it was fun and reminded him of when he was a kid sliding for fun. He seems to be one of those guys that thrive on competition. Perhaps when he sees his “elders” decide to “save themselves’, he rebels by following suit. It’s as if he is daring someone to show some fire and yell at him to run.

Has the big money invested in these players cheapened the game? Should we accept that “that’s just the way it is”?

BTW,I’m a long time Braves fan. I once saw Ralph Garr get booed for not hustling to first. The throw was in the dirt and he would have been safe, had he run all the way. Now it’s as if nobody cares. “Just don’t get hurt!”

So you don’t think I’m Mr. Negative, I love the Braves. I just don’t like the direction the game is heading. My argument is more a general criticism of the game, using familiar players as examples.

Good win tonight! Go Braves!

By chrisklob

July 31, 2008 11:08 PM | Link to this

I believe that this is Braveheart’s original post.

By Rookie Rules of Engagement

July 5, 2007 6:14 PM | Link to this

Rookie Rules of Engagement

1. Do not address any veteran blogger….. You can speak to a vet blogger when a vet speaks to you first
2. When vets are fighting with each other….. Stay the F out of it….. otherwise, you will get caught in the nuclear fallout…… it’s kind of like not picking sides when a husband or wife fight with each other….. when the drama is over, they will get back together and both will hate you for no other reason than they do no want to resolve the difficulties between them and it is easier to unite with each other by creating a common enemy…….. For reference, see the Chipper/Smoltz backstabbing…… they might even call you a bulldog because you reported their bullsh!t and dared to call them out on their b.s.!
3. STFU about the Devil Rays. This includes Baldelli, Crawford, Kazmir, Dukes, Upton, every single bloody one of them…..
4. Mike Hampton can not just be released…… they still have to pay the darn money to him.
5. Enough already about Wilson Betemit……. you will be told he is a fringe player whether that is true or not……
6. McCann was not given that contract so that he can be traded……
7. If you ask stupid questions, you are going to be called stupid…..
8. If you are gonna disagree with Shaun, you better be ready to engage in a day long battle and be prepared to be pounded with stat after stat…..
9. Quite simply, Robert thinks Bobby Cox is a Donk….. you will hear this taped recording play over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over AGAIN!
   1. N8 is really called NHATE not innate……… He is a good fan but he will really wear you out with his negativity…….
   2. Grinch, Carolina Lady, Bob Journalist, and Journalist Jimmy Smith are institutions….. don’t mess with them no matter how much they lead with their chin….. the whole blog will hate you if you go after them
   3. Don’t cross Lew.
   4. If you really want attention….. say something really shocking….. make a name for yourself…… just nothing lewd, crude, profane…… an actual opinion usually does the trick
   5. Don’t go after DOB….. that’s just tacky……. and stupid….. and well it’s just wrong….. it is his freaking blog….. if you don’t like what he says or does, then leave, it is his friggin blog, folks…… why continue to be around something you detest…… This used to be the Don’t Be An Idiot Rule….. it has now been changed to Don’t Act Like Coach Rule.
   6. If DOB knocks you down with a pitch, don’t complain, it is a badge of honor
   7. Don’t ask DOB stupid questions……. state your opinion……. if he agrees, finds it remarkable or disagrees, he will let you know - ONLY if it is something worth commenting on. If he says nothing, then take the freaking hint……
   8. If you are a persistent little bugger who needs to keep asking questions directly to DOB, don’t ask more than once….. that is very annoying to all of the other bloggers….. At 12:03 p.m. - Hey, DOB, is blah blah player getting called up? At 12:17 p.m., Hey, Dave is blah blah player getting called up? At 12:41 p.m., Hey O’Brien, is blah blah player getting called up? You didn’t answer me the first time……. At 1:07 p.m., oh, woe is me, fine just ignore me then DOB, I guess I have to say something outrageous instead of asking stupid questions to get attention from DOB….. then the blogger posts, refreshes and reloads the blog and sees this at 12:52 p.m. from DOB: Yes, persistent inane question asker, I read your question. Sorry I was busy doing my job reporting on the Braves, blogging 24/7 on here, having a personal life, enjoying some movies, music, television and friends, but now I am back to serve your every need. But it is not likely that so and so prospect will be called up just yet for this, this, and that reason. But they really do like him as a prospect, just not yet ready for prime time……. At 1:17 p.m., Sorry DOB, you just took so long answering my question. But thanks for answering. Love your blog man…… At 1:31 p.m., DOB will say no problem, man, no worries although he must wanna strangle the fella.
   9. Andruw can not, will not be traded….. 10/5 guy and he and Boras fully intend to take advantage of that…..
   10. DOB can not wish away the $80 mil payroll……..
   11. NO RELIGION! NO POLITICS! NO RACE BAITING! That is what the rest of the AJC is for!
   12. BBQ, movies, music, baseball, beautiful women, is all EL HOMBRE asks.
   13. Be patient. Hit the post button once. Double posts are annoying. Better for your post to disappear than to make blogmates endure your drivel twice.
   14. If you are a closed minded person and you don’t like it when El Hombre talks music, well then tough, you came to the wrong blog. Go start your own blog. Or figure out on your own that the little mouse in your hand allows you to scroll past what you don’t want to read.

There’s so much more. This list of rules is subject to further editing, modification, revision. You guys can fill in the rest and make sure to post this everyday……. take turns….. put it up within 20 minutes of a new blog going up everyday… Save us a lot of grief….. Hopefully….. won’t hold my breath expecting it though….

By Carroll Rogers

July 31, 2008 11:09 PM | Link to this

i defer to DOB on corky decision. that was priceless.

yes i think clint will see more PT.

i think it might be julian tavarez in the roster move.

and here’s what bobby had to say about soriano after the game, for your perusal:

“Soriano threw the ball good tonight, let it go finally. He popped it pretty good. It’s not back. He’s going to have to throw more of it, to get back to 96, 97, but it sure looked good tonight.”

and nice to have hampton back in the post-game notebook….exhibit A, when i asked him about busting it down first to beat out the double play grounder and drive in a run

“I think I was running harder than I was going fast,” Hampton said. “I used to be fast and I got a wrap on my hamstring, I’ve got a wrap on my groin, I got a wrap on my ankle and calf and on my knee. I’m just super-glued together. I’m just hoping something don’t fly off coming around second base. You just tape it up and go.”

By Tomas

July 31, 2008 11:09 PM | Link to this

I just don’t understand why Corky is still in the team. He has given Wren and cox a lot of reasons to cut him. He is hitting 096 for god sake. When chipper gets back from the DL, I hope they cut Corky. He is just not big league material. I prefer to have buddy Carlyle hit than Corky. Corky might be a great person to have in the clubhouse, but he doesn’t hit a a beachball. CUT HIM.

By ArkyTech

July 31, 2008 11:10 PM | Link to this

Forget not hitting his weight - it just occurred to me that Corky’s no hitting his body temperature!

By AdirondackDave

July 31, 2008 11:12 PM | Link to this

Random - I’d take Tex over Manny every day of the week and twice on Sunday. He’s at least as dangerous with the stick and he’s, well, light years better with the glove. And do you really want to discuss them off the field? Didn’t think so.

It won’t happen, but I’d love to see the Braves shell out the cash for Tex this winter and use Kotchman in a trade, he has value if he doesn’t implode over the next two months. As I say, it probably won’t happen but it does begin to address our serious rebuilding needs. Anybody out there agree… or disagree?

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this

I heard that

I heard that Bowman was being traded for Kovacevic.

By AdirondackDave

July 31, 2008 11:30 PM | Link to this

Couch Tater — The Bucs demanded and got a gross of #2 pencils in the deal.

By jtb

July 31, 2008 11:30 PM | Link to this

Brett Butler Fan

I really enjoyed your last post. I think the big money has cheapened the game in many ways, especially with pitcher. ie. pitch counts.

Coaches are definitely still relevant. For the Chipper and Smoltz’s of the world, not so much. You probably saw this tonight as well, but when Pujols was tagging up and Blanco caught the fly ball in no position to make a strong throw, Chino Cadahia pulled him to the side and told him what he did wrong. For young players, good coaches are essential. I’m often impressed by how classy almost all of the players brought up by the Braves organization are, even after they leave.

I love how Escobar plays the game, but it is very frustrating not to hustle down the line on many ground balls. It’s also frustrating how slow he is in general, but that’s for another day. I’ve never thought that he could be daring people to correct his play. I could certainly see that being the case. I think he also gets frustrated with how little passion is in the Braves. He seems to wear his heart on his sleeve, and that’s not really the Braves way.

At this point though, can you really blame a Brave for having a “just don’t get hurt!” mentality? I for one consider the Cardinals series a success because no one got hurt. And we even won a game!

By TB

July 31, 2008 11:38 PM | Link to this

Okay, I scanned the blog and I can’t figure out which song won the Manny’s Song sweepstakes. My entry was gonna be Guadalcanal Diary’s “Get Over It”:

Turn your cheek, get over it Lest you speak, get over it Thoughts you keep, get over it It’s only life so don’t get mad It’s not like time is all you had You got your jaw set in place It’s making lines across your face

I hate to say you’re not the sun The world around is much more fun I know it hurts to bear the shame Of people who don’t know your name

I know that this is nothing new You find someone to drag you through Decieve yourself about your best Come to find you’ve failed the test

By Couch Tater

July 31, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this

I’m sure they stood their ground by not sharpening them.

By Interested Observer

July 31, 2008 11:47 PM | Link to this

I just saw that Tex got a stolen base tonight. I wonder how the heck that happened!

By brian

July 31, 2008 11:51 PM | Link to this

as far as younger players getting their chance which may not happen until September, I would like to see

Josh Anderson and Brandon Jones get some playing time in the OF. Lillebridge getting a look at 2B playing everyday. Sammons being the backup catcher to McCann. Chuck James staying in the rotation after Friday - if his arm is back to full strength time to see what he can do. Hernandez getting a start or two at SS or 2B.

I am not really for getting Hanson to the majors before next year. I would let him finish out the minor league season and then shut him down for the year and then see what he can do in spring training. No reason to start the clock on options/major league service time. He is still young and no need to rush him. Charlie Morton should stay in the rotation to let him get adjusted now - the more experience now the more he will help next year. I would have the rotation as Jair (though watching the total innings closely - if he is shooting past his career high I would not hesitate to shut him down a couple of weeks early), Campillo, Morton, James, and JoJo/Hampton.

Brandon Jones and Chuck James need to play well to get themselves back in the Braves plans or to make themselves good trade bait.

Any chance the Braves sign Hampton (or that he would sign) a contract for the minimum salary with incentives based on starts/IP? I am ducking out of the way of lightning as I type this (cannot believe I am asking this question) but if hudson is out next year and Smoltz goes to the Bullpen…..

Any chance the Braves try to move Soriano after the waiver deadline (to Detroit for example) or in the offseason? Notice how people are talking a lot how he has his pop back.

By brian

July 31, 2008 11:51 PM | Link to this

as far as younger players getting their chance which may not happen until September, I would like to see

Josh Anderson and Brandon Jones get some playing time in the OF. Lillebridge getting a look at 2B playing everyday. Sammons being the backup catcher to McCann. Chuck James staying in the rotation after Friday - if his arm is back to full strength time to see what he can do. Hernandez getting a start or two at SS or 2B.

I am not really for getting Hanson to the majors before next year. I would let him finish out the minor league season and then shut him down for the year and then see what he can do in spring training. No reason to start the clock on options/major league service time. He is still young and no need to rush him. Charlie Morton should stay in the rotation to let him get adjusted now - the more experience now the more he will help next year. I would have the rotation as Jair (though watching the total innings closely - if he is shooting past his career high I would not hesitate to shut him down a couple of weeks early), Campillo, Morton, James, and JoJo/Hampton.

Brandon Jones and Chuck James need to play well to get themselves back in the Braves plans or to make themselves good trade bait.

Any chance the Braves sign Hampton (or that he would sign) a contract for the minimum salary with incentives based on starts/IP? I am ducking out of the way of lightning as I type this (cannot believe I am asking this question) but if hudson is out next year and Smoltz goes to the Bullpen…..

Any chance the Braves try to move Soriano after the waiver deadline (to Detroit for example) or in the offseason? Notice how people are talking a lot how he has his pop back.

By Brett Butler fan

July 31, 2008 11:51 PM | Link to this

jtb wrote: At this point though, can you really blame a Brave for having a “just don’t get hurt!” mentality? I for one consider the Cardinals series a success because no one got hurt. And we even won a game!

Well said! I enjoyed the discussion.

BTW, what about the “Infant” (Infante)? Wouldn’t it be appropriate to tell him, “Atta Baby” when he makes a good play? Go Braves! Let’s win a few in a row! Although Clint did a great job tonight, hurry back Brian! McFann and I are waiting!

By JEB

July 31, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this

Could anyone check to make sure… I really don’t think we have won ONE game with Corky Miller as catcher.

I just can’t remember that we have - you stat chekers can find out for sure.

Check - see - and post.

After that, can anyone remember why we kept Corky over Bryan Pena, Javy, ????

By gotigers72

July 31, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this

Good “non move” in keeping Ohman, Mr.Wren. If there is a chance he would re-sign, then it’s worth keeping him for the last 2 months. He has been solid.

I think KJ should be traded for a middle reliever. At least bust up that awful Boyer, Ring, Tavarez triumvirate. Infante should be playing every day, and I think his natural position is second base. He is better offensively than KJ, won’t strike out near as much. Haven’t seen him play much defensively at 2nd, but could he be any worse than KJ? [Sorry, but I’ll never get over that dropped pop up]. The only thing KJ has on him is power and maybe speed.

So it took all of 2 games for Sammons to total Corky’s YEARLY total of 4 hits AND 1 homer? That is truly a joke. Two freakin’games!!! I know [and agree with] that Sammons needed to stay down and play daily rather than be a once a weeker at back up. But do you seriously expect me to believe that the Braves could not have gotten SOMEONE from SOMEWHERE that’s better than the Corkster? Mr..093. Below the O’Brien line. That just blows my mind.

Heard Joe Simpson say that in talking with BC one day that Mr. Cox was upset by the number of GOOD pitches some of the hitters are taking.I have to agree. i think some of them are ‘guessing too much. Particularly KJ and Frenchy. I read an interview with Eddie Mathews, a Hall of Famer and owner of one of the prettiest and most perfect swings ever. He was answering the interviewer’s question about ‘guessing. He said that you look fastball, then adjust if it’s a breaking pitch or changeup. He said you’re toast if you look for a slower pitch and then get a fastball. No time to adjust. He also said that the only time he ever guessed was occasionally when he had 2 strikes and felt he had a good chance of guessing right. Pretty good advice from someone that knew a little something about hitting.

I haven’t given up, am looking forward to seeing more of the young guys that are up, and seeing some more young guys when they are called up. Even looking forward to seeing Chuck tomorrow night, see if he’s made any changes. Because if he hasn’t, that Brewer lineup will light him up like a Christmas tree.

The only time I will forego watching the Braves will be on Saturdays starting at the end of August. If they were still in contention, it would be a close contest between them or college football, but with them out of it, no contest. Yes, I do have a life, but am disabled, hard for me to get around much, so watching sports and news and reading are about the only things I can do any more without it being painful. The Braves provide a lot of pleasure to someone in my condition, even in years like this when they are not so hot. And I am not a Johnny come lately. They have been my team since they moved to Atlanta and I could physically go to the games and see the great ones like the Hammer, Mathews, Rico Carty, etc. Even the great players from other teams like Mays, McCovey, Clemente, etc. Ah, the good old days.

By Doc Holliday

July 31, 2008 11:59 PM | Link to this

Watching LAs game……….AJ just stroke out….It just looks like he never left atlanta…….same approach………same lost-look AB.

By N Nine

July 31, 2008 11:59 PM | Link to this

I have not seen kotchi (cox’s new name). How does he look?..yes i know the stat so its early but does he look lost or is he hitting it to people? THX

By N Nine

August 1, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this

JEB

hey got the feeling once MCCann is ready ..SAMI will stay and corky will be excused. I can see it happening.

By Kentavo

August 1, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this

Wouldn’t it be Coxian to start Corky tomorrow after Sammons’ big night? Wouldn’t surprise me a bit. Okay, let’s start another thread of controversy: when Chipper gets back, how ‘bout platooning Infante with Kj to get Omar some more P.T.?

By Kentavo

August 1, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this

Wouldn’t it be Coxian to start Corky tomorrow after Sammons’ big night? Wouldn’t surprise me a bit. Okay, let’s start another thread of controversy: when Chipper gets back, how ‘bout platooning Infante with Kj to get Omar some more P.T.?

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this

Why dont you like Corky guys?????……….he is a great guy. ;-)

He loves playing for Bobby…….LOL

By uga-brave

August 1, 2008 12:10 AM | Link to this

klobber,

love the RROE.

gotta concur with alot braveheart said earlier today. we just dont have players in ther prime.

compare our lineup to the cubs. lee, ramirez, soriano, harden, f*******, dempster, zambrano, wood, lilly, all players in their prime years.

heck they even pay a super utility player like derosa well.

By JEB

August 1, 2008 12:13 AM | Link to this

This Corky experiment has GOT ot be over! BC is one of the most patient men there is with players - even his patience has got to be worn out!

N Nine I agree with you! Once BMac is up and running - ta,ta,ta bye-bye Corkster!

By N Nine

August 1, 2008 12:19 AM | Link to this

DOC

lets play a game regarding the dodgers game u brought up!

pick one of the following OF player that will get bummped once’s Manny’s plane arrives?

1.Kemp,.295, 2. JONES, .164. 3. Pierre, .283.

To me, looks like a tough one that will come down to the last at bat to determine.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this

Wouldn’t it be Coxian to start Corky tomorrow after Sammons’ big night? Kentavo

Do you think Cox could do that? Im not so sure, LOL. Of course he´ll do it. He already has, I saw tomorrows lineup on MLB.com.

About platooning Infante??? Come on man. He has done a superb job playing for Chipper, what are you thinking of??? Remember:

“The better you play, the less chance you have to make the lineup.” Bobby “Kick me out” Cox

By Shamus Thacker

August 1, 2008 12:24 AM | Link to this

Hey, Corky’s a GREAT, GREAT, player, he just doesn’t wanna upstage and embarrass his teammates..

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this

Nationals Release Lo Duca, Lopez By Cork Gaines [July 31 at 10:25pm CST] The Washington Post is reporting that the Nationals released both Paul Lo Duca and Felipe Lopez following tonight’s game.

By J.D.

August 1, 2008 12:30 AM | Link to this

save the corkster!

By J.D.

August 1, 2008 12:30 AM | Link to this

save the corkster!

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:35 AM | Link to this

N Nine

Are you kidding? Manny was brought up by the Dodgers to solidify their bench……he will be a good bat off the bench.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:38 AM | Link to this

I think the Tigers will pick up Lo Duca

By N Nine

August 1, 2008 12:40 AM | Link to this

doc

1.loduca?????2.Corky????3.sammons??/

backup for mccann??? Please think hard???

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:41 AM | Link to this

Our elimination number is down to 46……….but we can still do it.

IN COX WE TRUST

Go Bravos!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:52 AM | Link to this

Braves wont spend on Lo Duca………season is over……..

By N Nine

August 1, 2008 12:56 AM | Link to this

another shocking stat about corky..Takes 1/25 of braves roster.

its amazing he beats all odds, and somehow he gets more attention in the blogs.Corky: what an amazing creature.

A. JONES ends the game as the final out dodgers lost by one. this Jones to bench will hunt NED COLLETTI. guess zito contract wins since its a decade long but wow what a mistake after braves simply let him go with no regrets.

By Tyler Durden

August 1, 2008 1:02 AM | Link to this

The Rules of Braves Blog

By bravos2249

August 1, 2008 1:03 AM | Link to this

Wouldn’t it be Coxian to start Corky tomorrow after Sammons’ big night?

He may not because Campillo pitches on Sunday and I think Bobby would rather have someone whose caught him more and knows more of the bounces.

Granted we’ll be facing Sheets…but with what he does against the Braves there is no guarantee that Corky or Clint would get hits.

By Lew

August 1, 2008 1:04 AM | Link to this

Hampton and his 10.00 ERA are not going to be worth even a minimum salary. He should not be signed for any reason other than as a bat off the bench. Dude can pinch hit.

By Brave's outfielder Jeff Francoeur

August 1, 2008 1:10 AM | Link to this

thats right ugabrave

hit safely in four straight games

the goldenboy is on the comeback trail

im gonna jack one tomorrow and dedicate it to you

like the Babe with that sick kid

By Doug

August 1, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this

The Braves are a GREAT quad A team and nothing more. If Frank Wren or Schuerlotz want to argue that then they are dummer they they appear. Gregor Blanco, Omar Infante, Greg Norton, etc are all great AAA type players. Round out the roster and they are a quad A team. They wolf about injuries but all teams have injuries. We are back to the 80’s version pure and simple.!!

By The Scatman

August 1, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this

You would have thought that Manny would have demanded to be traded to the Braves so that he could play for Bobby Cox.

By Bravesfan78

August 1, 2008 1:24 AM | Link to this

Hey bravesfan79, should we be concerned about Chipper when he comes back? You know, they traded his “best friend” away. I sure hope he takes it better than Escobar.

By N Nine

August 1, 2008 1:30 AM | Link to this

dough

yes, each team deals with injuries. The braves dealth with 19 different players, which is almost the entire roster. By YOU naming players that you disslike is irrelevant. you dont have allstars in minors waiting to be called up.

By Formerly Known as Mark T.

August 1, 2008 1:31 AM | Link to this

I think the Braves did what they were supposed to do at the deadline. I thought we wouldve acquired Bay successfully if we were really in contention. Since we are looking forward to next year, I am thinking maybe the Mr. Wren and shouldnt be looking for a power bat or a bopper, per ser, I think if we were to try to acquire Josh Willingham, who is arb-eligible. He has a lot of power in his bat but also hits for average and plays a solid LF. I also know we will be in the market for 2 starters. I was thinking we could look to inquire about Oswalt, if we didnt this year already. Offer the same package we offered for Bay and see what happens. If that is shaky because I know he’s been getting pretty banged up these days, then here are 3 pitchers I would like to see us go after who we’d actually be able to acquire: **1. Brad Penny( who will be going on 31- has all the tools to be an ace), 2. Ryan Dempster(will be 32 next year- finally recovered from all the ineffectiveness and injuries would be a good #3 but move him to 4 as a luxury and 3. As a shocker who many people may disagree with- Oliver Perez(90+ mph fastball and good slider, I live in NYC and it seems like this dude always pitches well in big games).

By uga-brave

August 1, 2008 1:38 AM | Link to this

JF,

considering the fact that your slugging % for the month of july was .293 and you hit 1 HR. in the same span, 83 at bats.

i think i wiil take that bet. funny post though.

By Theo

August 1, 2008 2:08 AM | Link to this

Manny’s song for the last few years have been “Should I stay or should I go” by The Clash

By Wayne in Utah

August 1, 2008 2:16 AM | Link to this

ATLSports10 (hope I spelled that right)

Your welcome! And welcome to the blog.

(I apologize in advance for the length of this post.)

Winter Goals

Obviously, we can’t count on Hudson(injured), Smoltz(worn out), Glavine (retired?) or Hampton (worn out his welcome?) for 2009. That leaves us with what we are going with today. To be honest, the next two months might go a long way to answering a lot of questions about what we can expect out of some of these youngsters. Jurrjens is the real deal, but is he the #1/#2/#3 real deal?? Where does he slot?

Campy is your poor man’s Mad Dog. Will he be a Jorge Sosa or a keeper? Anybody’s guess at this time. We could sell high, or hang onto him to see if he sticks. I personally would keep him.

Morton and Reyes both have decent stuff, if they learn how to be pitchers. No telling how well or how poorly they will do. The next 2 months might help to answer some of those questions (at least for Morton at this time). I am hoping that at least one of them turns into a decent mid rotation arm.

Next up is Chuckie James. If he is healthy, and if he returns to his previous “healthy” performance, then he could be a decent 4/5 slot guy.

Others are too unproven to try to slot in, but might figure into the plans at some time in 2009 (Hanson, Lerew, and Redmond)

So without addition, here is the way I see it:

1) ———- 2) Jurrjens 3) Morton or Reyes 4) Campillo 5) James

I would feel much more confident if we were able to pick up a starter who, if not a true #1, could at least assume the role for 2009. Also, to feel even better about the staff, another arm who would be able to give competition to my 3-5’s above.

Jeff Schultz says we have enough money to sign CC. Maybe so. I am not opposed to such thought, but it is contrary to the Braves way, of not giving too much of our overall team salary to one player. This is one reason why AJ and Tex are no longer here.

I do not agree with Schultz. I think it is a huge risk to put that much money into a FA pitcher. CC and Sheets are the two big arms available. Lohse, Lowe and Penny are not too far behind. I would not give any pitcher over a 3 year contract, with a 4th option. Ask the Dodgers about Schmidt. Remember Kevin Brown. I would be OK with giving them up to 15 mil per year for 3 years. No more.

That will probably not land one of the FA pitchers.

Would someone like Halladay or Oswalt be available in a blockbuster trade. I might would make a play for Halladay, but Oswalt looks out of sorts.

I would make a reasonable play for one of the pitchers mentioned above, plus Wolf, Perez or Garland.

If unsuccessful, I think I would go for a lesser pitcher in a trade, and ride it out for 2009, instead of selling the farm for a pitcher who might break down 2 months later.

We have too many decent arms coming up. Let’s start to develop our own arms, and paying our players to stay, when they are deemed franchise types (like McCann).

For out hitting and bench needs, here are some thoughts. I really like the following players who might be available: Orlando Hudson (use KJ in a trade or as a roving utility man), Casey Blake, Eric Byrnes, Josh Willingham, Matt Kemp, Ryan Spilborghs, Alex Rios, Mark Teahan or Ryan Ludwick.

I think we might have our back up catcher in Sammons. As much as some do not think he would hack it, I like Jeff Baker as a potential off the bench, corner guy.

I think we have to use Blanco in center, until Schafer or Hernandez are ready.

If we sign Ohman, and the rest of our pen stays relatively healthy, I think we are ok there. Kris Medlen might be a sleeper.

One other player that intrigues me, though he is probably a year or two away, is Jon Owings at MB.

OK, I have been sitting here typing a frickin novel. Sorry about that. Probably nobody will read it. (no, this is not Braveheart or Savannah Guy in disguise!!) :-)

Good night my friends. If you did read this, let me know what you think. I do have thick skin.

By BA

August 1, 2008 2:47 AM | Link to this

Wayne, I’d classify Jurrjens as a strong number two starter, for what it’s worth. And I’ve seen a lot of this Kelly Johnson/trade bait thing, but I don’t like it for one reason: as lacking as the Braves have been in the power department, why would you move a second baseman with Johnsons power?

I’d say Sabathia AND Garland, or Sabathia and a big trade for a starter. And like the legendary Skip Caray suggested tonight, Atlanta might want to do a little business with the Cardinals, because they have a glut of power-hitting outfielders.

By Random

August 1, 2008 5:47 AM | Link to this

AdirondackDave: “Random - I’d take Tex over Manny every day of the week and twice on Sunday.”

To each his own — I think it’s mainly a matter of taste and personality, so we should be able to amicably disagree on this.

“He’s at least as dangerous with the stick and he’s, well, light years better with the glove.”

Definitely no argument on that latter point.

“And do you really want to discuss them off the field? Didn’t think so.”

Apparently not a concern to the Dodgers — in fact, as I’m sure has already been noted repeatedly by east coast scribes, ManRam should fit right in on the left coast in LaLaLand — may not even make a ripple, let alone a splash.

(And I myself would be much more concerned with his actions between the foul lines than off the field, as long as he kept it legal. But even then, MannyB’ll make it dicey for you. I admit that.)

But he’s still H&S above Tex as a hitter.

By Gil In Mechanicsville

August 1, 2008 6:35 AM | Link to this

Mike didn’t look very sharp tonight, he had better command during his rehab start in Richmond earlier this year. However, he kept the Braves in this one, a little better than Charlie Morton the night before last.

I doubt Sammons will see Richmond again, no need to return him as he will not get that many more at bats than if he just stays with the big club. He would be coming up to Atlanta in September anyway. The kid is not known for his power and I was very surprised to see him hit one out tonight.

Oh by the way, Richmond is 8-33 in its last 41 games, been a tough season for the AAA club. Something like 115 roster moves this year.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah

Hampton has only thrown 9 innings in 3 years and you are already jumping off the bandwagon? Come on man. I think he has done way much better than expected. It is no secret he has mental issues as well. He is afraid, he feels he could get his hair or his ears injured. He might be holding back and not throwing the ball as relaxed as he should. Take it easy, there is no need to rush anything. I have said all year he would be a nice surprise. He is back, not many thought he was gonna make it. Expect him to lower his ERA with every outing.

By Shamus Thacker

August 1, 2008 8:11 AM | Link to this

Corky is so popular on ye ole blog because he’s the everyman/woman. He can hit no better than 90% of us could. He’s got me defensively, but I bet I know more floozies and can drink him under the table.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 8:15 AM | Link to this

Gil In Mechanicsville

You are right, he didnt look sharp, but he didnt give in, and thanks to it, as you said, he kept us in the game.

By Random

August 1, 2008 8:18 AM | Link to this

AdirondackDave — Didn’t see your 2nd para:

“It won’t happen, but I’d love to see the Braves shell out the cash for Tex this winter and use Kotchman in a trade, he has value if he doesn’t implode over the next two months. As I say, it probably won’t happen but it does begin to address our serious rebuilding needs. Anybody out there agree… or disagree?”

Disagree.

We’ve already seen Tex for almost a full season — he didn’t make a difference for us last year when he was hot late, and he didn’t make a difference for us this year when he was cold early.

And I don’t think he, by himself, would make a difference for anybody ever.

I know, I know — you said only that he’d “begin to address our serious rebuilding needs.”

Thing is, with the money he would probably get, he’d be both the beginning and the end of our rebuilding — we likely wouldn’t be able to afford any additional quality players.

Just an opinion — since you asked.

By Shamus Thacker

August 1, 2008 8:21 AM | Link to this

All joking about Hammy aside, the dude can flat-out hit.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 8:36 AM | Link to this

Random, Tex didn’t make a difference? Where do you think the Braves would have finished in 2007 if they had to stick with Thorman and Julio Franco?

Where do you think they’d be this season without Teixeira?

Just because the Braves didn’t make the playoffs, doesn’t mean Teixeira didn’t make a difference. It’s probable that they would be worse without him.

By Cecil34

August 1, 2008 8:44 AM | Link to this

McFann

Watch out! See, there was a reason for wanting Mac at first - here comes Clint!!

Just kidding ;-)

Hey Cork-wad! Here comes Clint!

By TommyP

August 1, 2008 8:47 AM | Link to this

Well, I (and most others) got to see what we’ve all been begging for - someone other than Corky in there at catcher.

And he’s a rookie….gotta love that. Sammons should receive every start ‘til McCann gets back and then become the backup.

Seems I’m not the only one that believes we need to give some rooks a trial in the bigs these last two months.

Ridiculous thought to some.

Ahem…..apology accepted, Dave. :)

By ATLSports10

August 1, 2008 8:50 AM | Link to this

Thanks for the welcome Wayne in Utah!

I noticed that even the former Richmond Braves great Sal Fasano hit a homerun for Cleveland last night. His problem with the Braves was being trapped in AAA due to the hitting prowess of the one and only Corky Miller. Now we see Corky was also holding back Clint Sammons. Who knew how great of power Corky had in the Braves organization.

By JimD

August 1, 2008 9:04 AM | Link to this

Shaun : I bet I know more floozies and can drink him under the table.

Don’t be so sure about that!

By RedEyedAndBlue

August 1, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this

chrisklob

Tx. for your 11:08 post last night.

As someone noted above, Hampton’s 5-inning performance was enough to keep us in the game. At this point following 35 months and all the injuries, that’s all that I can ask.

Good to see Gonzalez recover last night following his 5 run debacle three nights ago.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 9:11 AM | Link to this

One of the advantages of being this far out is that the Braves have a better chance to claim and make deals on players that teams put through waivers. Obviously I’d take the alternative but that’s the positive spin.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this

Shaun

I agree on you point about TEX, I think the thing that didnt work out was Braves front office brain……its kind of what is happening to the yankees. There is no use to add only one BIG player like TEX, you have to surround him with BIGTIME pitchers and other big sticks. Cant expect he will do all the job. Look at the angels……..They have HUNTER, GUERRERO AND ANDERSON and they add TEX………of course they have more money but thats the point……look at the cubs rotation………it was good and then they add Harden. Yankees lose Posada and add Pudge. Brewers have Sheets and add Sabathia.

On the other hand, Braves having trouble scoring and they add Norton…………bullpen problems and they add Tavarez………. Cant expect much from a team that. I know we have not seen much of Kotchman, but he is not looking good, he has hit the ball out of the IF only 1 time (not sure but thats what I can recall) he is like 0 for 8. Good glove, I like that, but I have not seen anything close to clutch yet. Anybody could be named Mr. Clutch while playing for the Angels, they are all surrounded by very good players. Lots of pressure on opposing pitchers.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this

JimD, that was Shamus not me.

By Lee in S GA

August 1, 2008 9:20 AM | Link to this

Sammons may never have that good of an offensive game in the big leagues again but here is an insane thought. Instead of trading a decent young catcher away because we have McCann, how about keeping one as a backup and to play the games McCann is out. This way the Braves do not have to sign or trade for a defensive catcher who usually cannot hit a lick. I know this is usually not their style and Sammons could be trade bait next season but I would like to the Braves keep him.

By Random

August 1, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this

Wayne in Utah: “Campy is your poor man’s Mad Dog. Will he be a Jorge Sosa or a keeper? Anybody’s guess at this time.”

It may yet be a guess as to whether he’ll be a keeper, but I can tell you now that he’s no Sosa.

Surely you remember how Sosa’s “good” year was more or less a non-stop series of Houdini-esque escapes after getting himself neck deep in trouble? The next year, he had evidently lost his pick or something, but there was little escaping for him during that dismal season.

Campillo is nothing like that — he rarely if ever skates on thin ice. He’s more in control than Sosa ever was. I think he’ll continue to give us good innings this year and next.

“I would not give any pitcher over a 3 year contract, with a 4th option.”

I’m with you here — it only makes sense nowadays with pitchers dropping like flies or transplanting ligaments at the drop of a hat.

I’m not much familiar with many of the possible sticks you mention, but I do like Spilborghs and Teahen (06/07, not so much o8). I suspect neither will be easily available, though.

“I think we might have our back up catcher in Sammons.”

Have you heard anything about how he calls a game? I think that might be the critical criterion, assuming his defense is considered adequate.

“If we sign Ohman, and the rest of our pen stays relatively healthy, I think we are ok there.”

You’re assuming that Moylan will come back next year as sharp as ever, I guess? I sure hope he does.

That wasn’t too long at all.

Moby Grape: “you sure you ain’t a politician Randy? Way to cover your butt. Too lazy to check it out but you wanna be certain you don’t get bashed if it’s mistaken. My Man! J/K dude.”

I appreciate the jest — got to cover all my bases and constituents.

Seriously, though, I did glance at his splits, but I felt I should tip my hat to you anyway, as I’d never even heard of the guy before you mentioned him.

8-§)

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 9:22 AM | Link to this

Shaun

Do you picture Braves picking up Lo Duca?

By TK

August 1, 2008 9:24 AM | Link to this

Just think one day Jason Bay will get to tell his grandkids he was traded for Manny and two other players. Did the Red Sox want Manny to be Manny somewhere else or what!

By Mike

August 1, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this

Shaun

What left field options would you search for if you were GM?

I already know you like Perez and we disagree on his value and what he will actually get this winter.

By JimD

August 1, 2008 9:38 AM | Link to this

shaun Yes it was … sorry. Still too early to be typing.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

Doc, LoDuca really can’t play anymore so I’m not sure why they’d want him.

TK, Bay will be the better player from now until the end of the 2009 season.

By RedEyedAndBlue

August 1, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this

Not sure how authoritative this list is, but here is a list of available free agents. For those who aren’t already privy to it…

[http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2007/12/2009-mlb-free-a.html]

By Mike

August 1, 2008 9:46 AM | Link to this

Shaun

In the playoffs, who would you rather have, Ramirez or Bay?

By David O'Brien

August 1, 2008 9:47 AM | Link to this

Lee, I think there’s a good chance Sammons fills that backup catcher role next season. Braves wanted him to get a good year in at Triple-A, keep learning to handle pitchers. He did that. He’s probably got more value to them right now than he would in trade. I think we could (should) see him in that backup catcher role, perhaps catching one of next year’s five rotation starters on a regular basis.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this

Mike, Detroit seems to be stocked with outfielders. It would be nice if the Braves could pry away Matt Joyce, a 23-year-old who get on base and slugs.

Looking at their organizational depth chart, looks like they don’t have any shortstops on the horizon to take over for Renteria but they have several quality, young outfielders who can hit—Joyce, Brent Clevlen, Wilkin Ramirez. Lillibridge for one of these guys, anyone?

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this

Mike

There is no comparison between the 2.

By KC

August 1, 2008 10:00 AM | Link to this

Lew, I’m a little puzzled by your comments about Hampton’s ERA. As Doc Holiday pointed out earlier… The guy has thrown 9 innings in 3 years. Do you think we could give a few more starts before deciding that he’s worthless as anything other than a pinch hitter?

You saw him in the spring. He looked great! And he hasn’t even gotten back to his spring form yet. So for cryin out loud people… We’re in no hurry here are we? I mean, we’re not going anywhere this year. So why nor chill out and give this guy a chance?

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this

Mike, this season and next season, I’d rather have Bay…honestly. Especially if I already have a lineup with six good hitters.

Remember 2008 and 2009 are all that matters. Doesn’t matter what Ramirez did in 2004 or even last year.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:06 AM | Link to this

Doc, you are right. Bay is 29 versus 36, is only about five runs worse than Manny offensively this season and is much better defensively. No comparison. And that’s not even looking at Manny’s drama.

By geauxbraves2000

August 1, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

Glad to see Hampton finally back on the mound these last two starts. I personally didn’t think he’d ever pitch for the Braves again, but I’m glad to be wrong. He may be a little rusty right now, but apparently his bat is still polished.

Nice win last night, glad to see the bats come alive.

Geaux Braves!!

By David O'Brien

August 1, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

Andruw, from totaling 92 homers and 257 RBI during the 2005-06 seasons, to hitting .163 with two homers in 196 at-bats and fourth- or fifth-outfielder status with Dodgers in 2008….

In other news … I finally got around to seeing The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford. Now I see what all the fuss was about regarding Casey Affleck’s performance. Stellar. And Brad Pitt was solid, too.

By Pepperidge Blogs Remembers

August 1, 2008 10:10 AM | Link to this

Thanks, christklob for that blast from the past — PBR appreciates any and all help they get.

Here are some amendments to the Rookie Rules of Engagement from their creator:

By Rookie Rules of Engagement

July 5, 2007 7:10 PM | Link to this

Proposed Amendment Resolution #1 - Rule #12 will be amended to Lew’s liking. He seems to be offended although it was done purely out of love and as a homage to my favorite blog Enforcer. Rookie Rules-Better not p!$$ me off or I won’t nominate you for the Wurlitzer Prize For Rules Writing. See what I mean about not crossing Lew!!! If he wants it amended, then he shall have it amended although I think it is still a perfectly written rule as is.

Mets fans can post BUT they must act classy like the Metropolitan Man. But even when they are classy like MetroMan, each blogger who is a true Braves fan mus give ‘em hell anyway. When we give you hell Mets fans, don’t cry. What do you expect?….. IF you are a Mets fan and you are going to be arrogant and obnoxious about finally winning your once in a generation division title, then have the guts to post here everyday even when your team is stinking it up. For example, three game sweep by the Rockies, where did you all go?….. IF you disappear while your team keeps losing, don’t come back later to gloat about winning a few games when things get good again for your team…… IF you do reappear, don’t claim that you were in and out of the country on business matters when we know the reality is that you were in and out of the county jail during that time

ALWAYS ignore the gnats and the pests and the lowlifes who aim to ruin the blog. THIS IS THE HARDEST RULE FOR ALL BLOGGERS, EVEN VETS, TO ADHERE TO. Vigilante justice on the evildoers just turns the blog into a ghetto with drive by shootings and sniping all day and night. We so try to avoid turning this Nirvana into Beruit, Baghdad, or South Central Los Angeles …….. Have no fear and keep the faith……. Let Lew be our Charles Bronson…. He will take care of the scum for all of us…..

Don’t complain about the lengths of other people’s posts, especially when you rarely post anything longer than a superficial sentence or two that is instantly forgettable just like your moniker. HOWEVER, sarcastic remarks about Tolstoy, War and Peace, and the epic nature of the post are completely acceptable and hilarious (especially to the long winded blatherers who frequently post their diatribes).

Don’t dare mess around with SJA or the Most Honorable Southern as the HOFer loves to call him. SJA is Malkovich, Walken, Oldman, and bad, bad Leroy Brown all wrapped up in one bad mofo. He is smarter, much more literate, and much more of a badass than most of the rest of the blog combined. You f with the bull, you get the horns with that fella. You dare to mess with that jackal, be forewarned, ain’t no one jumping in to try to protect you……. But also be aware that he will pull six thousand Terrell Owens episodes every month and threaten to leave forever …. only to be back five minutes later….. He’s a badass but a drama queen nevertheless……. When Lew needs reinforcements, he can put his devil’s horn down every once in a while, and be a force for good

By Rookie Rules of Engagement

July 5, 2007 10:16 PM | Link to this

Rule #29: Walter’s Daddy is definitely a vet….. Not only a vet but also the Official Minister for the Men in Black…. Got religious issues you need to express but can’t express them here, confide in Matthew…. for he is a very good man and a good daddy

Rule #30: KC is the Eternal Optimist. Ye Shall Have No Other Other Eternal Optimists Besides KC For KC Is The Supreme Eternal Optimist. If only we could get him back blogging….. Sith Lord Grinch, it is incumbent upon you

Kentavo’s proposed resolution for Rules for Gloating is being debated upon the Senate Floor as we speak…. looks like it may have a good chance of being added

By Gil In Mechanicsville

August 1, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

Body language says a lot. Camera shots of Bobby Cox after Corkey threw wildly the other night to third spoke volumes. I saw that same look right before Kyle Davies was shipped to Richmond and beyond.

The Atlanta skipper will put up with not being able to hit from the back up catcher but passed balls and errant throws are a cardinal sin.

By David O'Brien

August 1, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this

No question in my mind: Given Manny’s erosion from absurd 140 RBI guy to 120-or-so, and decline in homers, coupled with the Bondsian-level baggage and price tag, I’d rather have Jason Bay now, too. Seriously. And I never thought a year or two ago that I’d say that.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

Shaun

Mike, Detroit seems to be stocked with outfielders. It would be nice if the Braves could pry away Matt Joyce, a 23-year-old who get on base and slugs.

Looking at their organizational depth chart, looks like they don’t have any shortstops on the horizon to take over for Renteria but they have several quality, young outfielders who can hit—Joyce, Brent Clevlen, Wilkin Ramirez. Lillibridge for one of these guys, anyone?

Don’t you think we need a veteran bat in LF? I understand where you are coming from, and I like Joyce as well, but a more experienced hitter would make more sense, right? We have a lot of younger hitters in the lineup.

Mike, this season and next season, I’d rather have Bay…honestly. Especially if I already have a lineup with six good hitters.

Remember 2008 and 2009 are all that matters. Doesn’t matter what Ramirez did in 2004 or even last year.

I am just speaking to the playoffs. Smaller sample size. I think Man Ram is far better bet than Bay to do damage against elite pitching. I understand what Boston did though, Bay gives them a better chance to get there in 2008 and 2009, but again, Ramirez has shown that he can hit good pitching in the playoffs.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this

Shaun

Once again…….is not only numbers………once playoffs arrive, manny is a guy that overexposes pitchers……he fouls off like 20 times during a game………He makes pitchers throw 20 pitches to get 3 outs out of him alone……..that is big, specially in playoffs. He is cold blooded.

You are right. Redsox got a great player and in 2 years they will be glad they did……….but not this year.

By McFann O

August 1, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

Brett Butler fan Although Clint did a great job tonight, hurry back Brian! McFann and I are waiting!

You’re not kidding! Glad to see the new kid “have a night”, but I want McCann back!

Is it Monday yet?

Cecil34—

Haha…Yeah, now you are kidding. ; >*

Random—

Hmm…Sorry you lost your sponsorship. Bummer…

Oh, and no prob about the link. Thanks for the apology, though.

Wayne—

I saw your list of players that you really like…Eric Byrnes? Really?

By Jeff R

August 1, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

I want to second a comment that DOB made last night, to wit, Hoefully, Wren will resign Ohman. I give Wren credit for not moving Ohman for just any prospect. In fact, sometimes it’s the things not done that are the most valuable.

The bullpen needs Ohman next season. Soriano has a suspect arm and only middling results in his tenure with the Braves. Ohman is proving everyday that he’s 1) durable and 2) effective. And, if memory serves, he’s only thirty.

As much as Hudson wants a miracle, what he’s going to get is surgery. And, as we all know, the Braves are going to have to dip into the free agent market for a bona fide #1/#2 starter, or swing a fairly expensive trade. Chances are, the front office will have to spend a good deal whichever way they go. Ohman’s contract demands aren’t that great. Wren needs to make the case to the higher ups and Liberty Media that not only is the price for a starter necessary, but that Ohman’s price is worth it too. With him, the Bravos can go into the 7th, 8th ad 9th innings with a heckuva better chance at holding leads.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

DOB, yeah, I think that’s what all the TV analysts and a lot of us baseball fans are overlooking. The Red Sox actually upgraded purely from an on-the-field standpoint. Everyone is talking about “Manny being Manny” but no one is talking about the fact that the Red Sox actually got the better baseball player. Not that Manny isn’t still a great hitter.

The trade was a win for all sides. The Dodgers got a dangerous bat they so desperately needed. The Pirates stocked up on young talent. Their new front office seems to know what they’re doing and is committed to building something there. They aren’t going to trade for guys like Matt Morris.

By DAP

August 1, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this

i think if sammons continues to do play well the rest of this year, he should be dangled as trade bait, and if we can get a good trade, we should do it. if someone wants him for thier everyday catcher, and will make a good trade for him, it could be good for us, then we could sign a veteran catcher. there are a few pretty good ones as free agents this offseason.

BUT i would not hate to keep him. he is a young guy, he isnt a terrible hitter, and he’s cheap and under our control for awhile.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this

Mike, the Braves need a leftfielder that can hit, preferably hit for power. I’m not all that concerned about anything else.

And regarding Bay, he can play. (No poetry intended.) You can’t go along requiring that a player shows he can hit in the playoffs. How is a team ever going to get anywhere with that kind of thinking? If a player is better than the one you’ve got and you can get him, then go get him.

By Jared

August 1, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this

It seems no coincidence that the Braves’ recent 5-game skid coincided with Chipper being hurt yet again. I’d be curious to see what Atlanta’s winning percentage is with him, compared to without him, for not only this season, but the last decade or so.

By RedEyedAndBlue

August 1, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

PBR

Tx. for listing the amendments and proposed resolutions. And yet I just broke rule numero uno. Please forgive.

I believe there is also a motion on the floor to add the “Your and idiot” rule.

By David O'Brien

August 1, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

How ‘bout Raul Ibanez for a year or two in left field? That way, Braves could plunge more of their available money into starting pitching and perhaps CF (if Schafer’s not going to be ready) for next year instead of getting an eight-figure LF.

Heyward could be ready in couple years to fill an outfield corner, and Blanco also looks capable of playing CF until Schafer’s ready (assuming Schafer bounces back) if you don’t want to spend more money in CF.

Lot of ways it could go. LOT of ways.

By DAP

August 1, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

mike manny also showed that he would possibly intentionally sabatoge the red sox. there was a good chance that he would strike out or hit into double plays on purpose at every at-bat. i know that sounds wierd, but manny is wierd, and i think he would have done it if the sox kept him, and he was unhappy.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:34 AM | Link to this

Doc Holliday, Bay is the better player. Do you want the better player or the guy who makes the pitcher throw 20 pitches to get him out three times in the playoffs (if he ever actually did that)?

You get obsessed with past credentials and your team isn’t getting anywhere.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this

Shaun

Getting Matt Joyce, an unproven left handed hitting left fielder who has a 650 OPS against left handers in Triple A, would not help this team for the 2009 season. You should sure be concerned about that.

Bay can hit. I agree. They are a worse team in the playoffs. That is my point.

By Pepperidge Blogs Remembers

August 1, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

Another Amendment to the RROE, and an early Dissent from the very Rookie Blogger himself who inspired, nay, necessitated the creation of the RROE.

By Rookie Rules of Engagement

July 5, 2007 10:40 PM | Link to this

The chrisklob proposed amendment to Rule #25 has been considered, well received and adopted.

The amended Rule #25 shall now state:

ALWAYS ignore the gnats and the pests and the lowlifes who aim to ruin the blog. THIS IS THE HARDEST RULE FOR ALL BLOGGERS, EVEN VETS, TO ADHERE TO. PLEASE DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS. TROLLS FEED ON ATTENTION. IF THEY RECEIVE NONE, THEY EVENTUALLY GO AWAY. Vigilante justice on the evildoers just turns the blog into a ghetto with drive by shootings and sniping all day and night. We so try to avoid turning this Nirvana into Beruit.

By Savannah Guy

July 6, 2007 1:19 AM | Link to this

Rookie Rules of Engagement Very nicely, albeit anonymously done. It would have been more poignant under a familiar moniker. Regardless, the rules were clever and mostly good points were made. Funny too. Your post voiced the some of the sentiments of many here, myself included.

That said, and in all due respect for the intent and humor of the effort, I caution against creating rules for this or any other blog forum. Rules tend be like laws…the ones who always break them with abandon don’t abide by them anyway and the ones who behave tend to get a bit put off or intimidated by them in fear they may break one inadvertently.

A “blog” is meant to…no, make that, HAS TO…offer unencumbered freedom of self-expression, idea and opinion exchange. It’s a new age medium of expression. There are societal norms and practices of acceptable and unacceptable language, appropriate and inappropriate behavior…but those are already mostly understood and mostly accepted by civil society. Anything more in the blog forum is merely a sentiment that, after a good chuckle, might actually stifle the interaction in negative ways.

Adding rules beyond legal and moral behavior to any blog creates a slippery slope. It condones a “good ol’ boy” mentality…a private club. It promotes a “we were here first” inoculation to some and promotes a hierarchy (pecking order) mentality like corporations and military. I was raised to believe that, “if you believe you are above someone else, then you also have to believe that someone is above you.”

Further, will we need to define “rookie”? Will “blog vets” be immune to reasonable criticism, even if they hit a long stretch of less than articulate, confusing, awkward self-absorption and babble?

Therefore, I propose an amendment to the “Rookie Rules”: Only one serious rule (No. 1.):

Don’t write anything that will get journalist and blogmeister David O’Brien in trouble with his boss.

Secondary rule but not cardinal: Don’t poke the badger. Serves no purpose and unless you enjoy combative relationships or being ignored or ridiculed, don’t do it.

Be natural, have fun and be original. You are what you write. Think before you post. That’s it.

If you want to join a community of interesting, witty, well-spoken wordsmiths and scribes…pay attention. Read the blog more than you post on it. Don’t be a drive-by “vent”elator or grenade thrower. If you just have to or are only capable of doing that…have at it. Get your kicks. But don’t expect respect or feedback. Besides DOB, there are some pretty savvy baseball aficionados and also some brilliant yet low-key writers of social and baseball commentary. Respect it. Enjoy it. Add to it.

Instead of “Rookie Rules”, call it “Blogger Practices, Advice and Guidelines”.

So that’s my suggestion for the “rookie rules”. Forgive if preachy but the blog rule subject punched a button here. Ok…serious hat off. Chipper just tagged a Braves record-breaking HR. Nice.

By TK

August 1, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this

Shaun…I agree with you that Bay now has more upside than Manny. BUT, to trade Manny and 2 kids very close to being ready for the majors for Bay? I have seen Moss play. It would not surprise me to see him do very well in Pitt. My comment was that Manny MAY end up in the HOF. Bay has a lot of work to do to be considered for there. One day Bay can say “Yeah kids your grandpa was traded for a HOF player plus two other guys.”

By DAP

August 1, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

jared It seems no coincidence that the Braves’ recent 5-game skid coincided with Chipper being hurt yet again.

the funny thing is, i dont think chipper being out had much to do with it. the braves have averaged over 6 runs a game in the last 7 games. because of the bullepn, we are 2-5 over our last 7 instead of 5-2. the offense, surprisingly, has done ok without chipper.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this

DOB, yes. The Braves have a need at a position that is relatively easy to fill. So they can go out and spend on rebuilding the rotation.

DAP, Mike, Doc, Bay is better, it’s as simple as that. You give me the option of two players, I’m going to take the better one. Whether it’s for a full season, two months or the playoffs.

By Braveheart

August 1, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Shaun, you didn’t want the Braves to trade for Bay. You went on and on and on about why they shouldn’t trade for Bay. But now your beloved Saint Theo has anointed Bay and your mind is completely changed about Bay?

By Efrim

August 1, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

It is obvious what the Braves need this offseason:

Starting pitching

Right handed hitting left fielder

I’m not sure if the Braves feel like Jo Jo Reyes and Charlie Morton should be in the rotation next year. But I know that Jorge Campillo has earned the right to be in that rotation opening day. Obviously Jurrjens will be in there too. Might have to go get two starters.

Also, I really hope we keep Kelly Johnson at second base in 2009 and beyond.

I’d say this team is set in their infield and bullpen. Right field is set. Center field should be able to be held down by ether Blanco, Anderson, or Schafer. Left field is a question mark. A big one. It will be interesting to see what Frank Wren does.

By champ

August 1, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Is one of the Braves bullpen cathers still Butts(don’t remember his first name)? If so, what’s the difference between him and Corky? They both can’t hit! ZING!!!!

By ADC

August 1, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this

If Smoltz is able to come back next year, is he only thinking it would be as a reliever, or is starting a possibility?

By Mike

August 1, 2008 10:54 AM | Link to this

DOB, yes. The Braves have a need at a position that is relatively easy to fill. So they can go out and spend on rebuilding the rotation.

As long as it isn’t on a 26 year old Boras client who is a head case and will be asking for 5 years and 75 million dollars. Right Shaun?

By DAP

August 1, 2008 10:54 AM | Link to this

DOB raul ibanez would be good, the only thing is he hits lefty. he’s hitting lefties well this year, but usually he does not hit them as well. if he hit righty, i think he is the exact kind of player the braves need right now. but yeah, he would be one good way to go.

if diaz still has a role on the team, we could have a platoon with ibanez, with blanco in CF. ibanez could take over norton’s spot, backing up first base, and playing some leftfield, with infante and prado still around to help out in the infield. could be a good fit.

By McFann Ô

August 1, 2008 10:55 AM | Link to this

BY THE WAY:

All-Star catcher Brian McCann, who hasn’t played since suffering a mild concussion on Sunday, met with Braves doctors on Thursday night and was cleared to at least take some swings in the indoor batting cages. He may be available to pinch-hit on Saturday and return to the lineup on Monday. —Bowman

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 10:58 AM | Link to this

Mike, how are they a worse team with a player that’s at least as good as (I think better than) the player they had? I just don’t get that.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this

Braveheart

Excellent points to Shaun at 10:46.

Theo is a good GM, but let’s not forget this is a man who said “I would of never made that trade if I was there”, in regards to Hanley Ramirez and Anibal Sanchez for Josh Beckett.

Beckett won the Red Sox the world series a year and a half later.

By DAP

August 1, 2008 11:04 AM | Link to this

shaun DAP, Mike, Doc, Bay is better, it’s as simple as that.

gotcha, we heard you the first several times. i didnt, and wont argue that opinion. i also think the for the red sox, bay is better than manny.

i love what skip caray said the other night on the radio broadcast. responding after reading that manny said “the red sox dont deserve a player like manny ramirez.” skip said “he’s right, and neither does anybody else.” amen to that.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this

TK, Manny will end up in the Hall of Fame. But that has nothing to do with the rest of 2008 and 2009. They gave up a relief pitcher and a guy who projects as a platoon/fourth outfielder on a good team.

Braveheart, I didn’t think the Braves should give up four good prospects for Bay when he’s a free agent after 2009. That doesn’t matter to the Red Sox. They don’t have to worry about money. And they are in the playoff race with a much better chance to win than the Braves.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 11:10 AM | Link to this

Shaun

J. Bay being the better baseball player?

Last 5 season (including this year) Bay has 654 K while manny has 523, and thats not all, his season K total has been dropping every year in the last 5 years.

In the past 5 years Bay has 1 season with a 150 OPS or better while manny has 3.

Bay highest RBI total is 109, while manny drove in 130 and 140 in 2004 and 2005. Bay is not the RBI machine manny is. He drives in a lot but is not in the same league.

Since 2004 manny has 19 errors while bay has 21…… I wont get into any discussion on this one because I know manny is not known because of his glove, but Bay is not exactly Willie Mays, he had 8 E last season, that is bad.

This year Manny has 1 error in 66 games in LF while Bay has 3 in 105.

This year:

Manny with RISP is hitting .309/.432/.536

Bay with RISP has .216/.333/.338

way too much difference, and we are not talking playoffs yet.

What about RISP w/2Outs

Manny .261/.424/.435

Bay .212/.395/.333

I´ll agree Bay is younger and with lots of potential……….Sox made a great deal, but this year theyll miss manny and maybe next year………after that………how knows.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this

Mike, I’m not arguing that Theo is perfect and I never talked about how good or bad a GM he was. I’m just saying they got the better player in this deal. Please, focus like a laser on my point.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this

Bay has been facing inferior pitching in the NL Central for years. The ball park change will probably help off set that, but I am not too sure how anyone can say Bay is better than Ramirez. We’ll find out soon enough. Getting Bay was better than getting a player like Matt Kemp, so Theo did a great job there.

By Random

August 1, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this

Shaun: “Random, Tex didn’t make a difference? Where do you think the Braves would have finished in 2007 if they had to stick with Thorman and Julio Franco? … Where do you think they’d be this season without Teixeira? … Just because the Braves didn’t make the playoffs, doesn’t mean Teixeira didn’t make a difference. It’s probable that they would be worse without him.”

Sorry, I thought it clear from the context that I did mean that Tex did not make the difference between play-offs and no play-offs.

And I maintain that that’s the only difference that matters.

The Braves did not trade for Tex last year in order to finish third rather than fourth (nor in a failed attempt to finish second, not third).

And no team will be bidding on him this winter with an eye to finishing any lower than first, or any sooner than the World Series.

Perhaps I should have said Tex did not make “the” difference (rather than “a” difference), and he likely never will on his own.

And yes, any team would be worse off without him than with him — but as I said, that was not the context of my comment. No argument there.

If you care to address the balance of my comment, if the Braves did sign Tex as a free agent this winter, who else that they might need do you think they could afford? (Since Tex by himself is not the difference maker, we would need other pieces to get us to the play-offs.)

That was the thrust of my comment to AdirondackDave.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

They are a worse team in the playoffs. Without question.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 11:25 AM | Link to this

Doc, doesn’t matter what they did over the last 5 years. All that matters is 2008 and 2009. Bay will be almost as good with the bat and better with the glove.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 11:26 AM | Link to this

Shaun

I disagree that Jason Bay is a better player than Manny Ramirez. Even with age considered. There. What would you have me say? Look at Doc Holliday’s 11:10 post. Bay is a 216 hitter with runners in scoring position. You are entitled to your own opinion.

Here is a little snip from Jayson Stark’s article:

“Don’t get me wrong,” said an executive of one AL East club. “The Red Sox do a great job. They utilize every advantage they have, and they use all their resources as well as anyone. But sometimes, I don’t think even they realized what they had in Manny. When Manny comes up, you feel like you have to pass out ex-lax to your whole team because everybody gets a sick feeling in their stomach — especially when he had [David] Ortiz there in the middle with him.

By RedEyedAndBlue

August 1, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this

Hard to argue that the Red Sox will be a better playoff team with Bay in the lineup. Bay’s never been there, and frankly as a Pirate hasn’t had to perform under such high scrutiny and pressure. Manny has helped the Red Sox win their first series in 80 somethin’ years (2x).

One thing’s for sure - if Bay does not perform well the next couple of months and the Red Sox either 1. don’t make the playoffs 2. don’t make the playoffs and the Yankees do or 3. don’t win in the playoffs, then he will be defiled by all those Red Sox fans who loved Manny.

Another consideration is how Bay will play in LF astride the Green Monster. Many a left fielder have been made to look ridiculous while learning to play the caroms.

By DAP

August 1, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this

doc holliday i agree with your post, but when it comes to rbi totals, it is unfair to compare bay to manny, since manny played in boston, with the big green monster, and a very good lineup around him with tons of guys to drive in, while bay played in pitsburg, where its a little tougher for righthanders, with a lineup not nearly as good as boston’s. a team like boston feeds off itself, and i think bay will put up better numbers in boston than in pitsburg.

By Lew

August 1, 2008 11:30 AM | Link to this

Uh KC-What exactly about his 9 IP, giving up 15 hits 6 walks while striking out one hitter and giving up 10 runs is there to not understand or be puzzled about? Pretty damn well self explanatory to my way of thinking. Not even someone with your overdeveloped sense of unbridled optimism can think his performance has been worthwhile to this point.

He’s been rehabbing (again ad infinitum) for the balance of the entire season and this is the best he can do? How many rehab starts did he make?
Now my comments weren’t directed to this season anyway. This season is shot to hell, so let him pitch and give us at least a little return on all the $$$$$$ we’ve paid him. But let that be that and wish him well in his future life. Dude has missed three full years-what exactly in the way of success do you expect to see from him? Do you actually think that (barring yet another injury) he will ever be more than a vague shadow of himself? He pitched well in Spring Training? Wow. I’m overwhelmed. Too bad Spring Training doesn’t count for anything.

While I do not now and never have blamed Hampton or denigrated him like many here have, I still do not want to even entertain any idea of signing him for next year. THAT was my point. Quite honestly, I don’t care if he goes 6-0 the rest of the year-let him be someone else’s problem. Let some other scatter brained GM offer him a contract for millions of dollars and write codicils prohibiting him from brushing his hair or teeth, or walking the dog for fear of injury. As far as I’m concerned, the Smoltz, Glavine, Maddux, and Hampton era in Atlanta is over and it’s time to move on.

Continued reliance on any of these pitchers is insane and will not move us forward from the past three year’s struggles. The future is NOW. Let us act accordingly. The 14 year streak is over. The new streak is three fruitless years. We need to change that and not indulge in yet another reunion tour.

By DAP

August 1, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this

mike They are a worse team in the playoffs. Without question.

not if manny is intentionally tanking, because he is mad at managment for not trading him. manny would do something like that, and they had to get him out before he sabatoged the whole team.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 11:40 AM | Link to this

Doc, doesn’t matter what they did over the last 5 years. All that matters is 2008 and 2009. Bay will be almost as good with the bat and better with the glove. Shaun

Who are you? Nostradamus? Manny is coming to the weaker NL and Bay is going to the tough AL east. We shall see. Of course, manny will be facing great pitchers in SF, SD, Colorado and Arizona.

By Mike

August 1, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

not if manny is intentionally tanking, because he is mad at managment for not trading him. manny would do something like that, and they had to get him out before he sabatoged the whole team.

I can’t disagree with that. Red Sox had to do it and came away with a very good player. But Manny Ramirez is still feared…..

By BT

August 1, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this

Was at last night’s game. During the first hour Braves were flat. When Hampton got his double the life seemed to come back into the Bravos. After Sammons burst out it looked like the old hustling Braves. Remember when the kids came up 3 years ago and got the Braves going that is how they played last night. Great to see.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this

DAP

That might be true, but as I said………only time will tell.

By Efrim

August 1, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this

An interesting debate(or maybe it isn’t), would you rather have Oliver Perez at 5 years and 75 million, or Ben Sheets at 3 years and 51 million. I was going to say 16 per for Sheets, but the guy is having a great year at the right time. I don’t expect anyone to give him more than 3 years with an option for a 4th. Sheets’ arm could fall off at any moment. He isn’t as injury prone as Rich Harden, but he certainly isn’t durable. Perez is strange. You keep thinking he is going ot turn the corner and be that dominant front of the rotation type starter, but he just isn’t there yet. Maybe it is his youth? Either way, those two pitchers should be more on the Braves radar than C.C. Sabathia, who may very well get more money than Johan Santana. If Burnett opts out, I’d throw him in the mix as well, but the guy seems to not be the right fit for the clubhouse.

Anyway. The Braves did the right thing in keeping Ohman. He will most likely qualify as a Type B, so the Braves will get a supp. pick. If the Braves sign a Type A this year, I assume they will, then they will lose their second rounder. So I think they have covered their rear ends.

By Random

August 1, 2008 12:21 PM | Link to this

Shaun: “TK, Bay will be the better player from now until the end of the 2009 season.”

Shaun: “Mike, this season and next season, I’d rather have Bay…honestly… . Remember 2008 and 2009 are all that matters.”

Shaun: “DOB, yeah, I think that’s what all the TV analysts and a lot of us baseball fans are overlooking. The Red Sox actually upgraded purely from an on-the-field standpoint. Everyone is talking about “Manny being Manny” but no one is talking about the fact that the Red Sox actually got the better baseball player.”

Shaun: “If a player [Bay] is better than the one you’ve got [Ramirez] and you can get him, then go get him.”

Shaun: “Doc Holliday, Bay is the better player.”

Shaun: “DAP, Mike, Doc, Bay is better, it’s as simple as that.”

Shaun: “Mike, how are they a worse team with a player [Bay] that’s at least as good as (I think better than) the player they had [Ramirez]?”

Shaun: “I’m just saying they got the better player in this deal.”

Okay, Stat-Boy, where’s your stats on that?

I think we’re all “prepared to be pounded”, iaw RROE.

What objective evidence, if any, are you basing your opinion on?

If none, that’s cool — just say so.

You occupy a singular position of high credibility around these parts, based on always being able and more than willing to prove (or at least factually support) your every position. You have raised the bar for everyone else here — now you must meet it yourself. (And this whole paragraph is intended as a sincere and well-meant compliment, not an accusation or put-down.)

Why do you think Bay is better than Ramirez (“… not even looking at Manny’s drama.”).

And don’t pretend that the Sox were just looking to upgrade LF, and found Bay to be the best player available — that really puts the cart before the horse.

The Sox were looking to get rid of Ramirez, and accepted Bay as the best available fill-in.

I agree with you that it was win-win-win for everybody concerned, including the Sox (for reasons other than the players’ comparative abilities); but they did not get a better player, only an adequate replacement (for this year and next). That’s my opinion, based on:

Bay: .282/.375/.519

Ramirez: .299/.398/.529

and on Doc Holliday’s sterling research above. Thank’s Doc.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this

Doc and Mike,

Ramirez: .299/.398/.529, 140 OPS+, 7.6 RC/G, 36.8 VORP

Bay: .282/.375/.519, 135 OPS+, 7.7 RC/G, 32.4 VORP

Ramirez has a slight edge with the bat. Bay is the better fielder by a significant margin and a better baserunner plus he’s younger.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 12:42 PM | Link to this

Random, I agree. The trade wasn’t just about player ability. But it’s hard to imagine the Sox would not have accepted “Manny being Manny” had he been significantly better than any other player they could have had. After all, they accepted it when they had little or no better options.

See my previous post for on what I base my conclusion that Bay is better.

Mike, no one is denying Manny is still a dangerous hitter.

By Steve from OH

August 1, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this

I agree that Manny is the better player this year. Over the long term, I’d take Bay, especially with Manny’s age and contract demands (4-5 years, 100 million). Bay is better in the field, but I’d take Manny’s bat in the playoffs right now over Bay, no question. Manny leads in the traditional BA/OBP/SLG. Bay has a slightly better BB/K ratio and a slightly higher ISO than Manny.

Looking deeper, we find Jason Bay has a .320 EqA and a WARP1 of 3.9. Manny has an EqA of .305 and a WARP1 of 4.3. Looking at these more advanced stats we find that Bay has a nice lead in EqA, and a marginal lead in ISO and BB/K ratio. Manny leads in WARP-1 by a decent margin. However, looking at JUST THIS SEASON, I’d take Manny based on the better OBP and SLG numbers. Over the course of the next 2-5 seasons, give me Bay, no question. (By the way, that .320 EqA is pretty darn good. I sure wish we could have gotten him.)

By Patrick

August 1, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this

DOB,

I’d like to see Pat Burrell in left next year…but that’s probably a pipedream huh?

By McFann O

August 1, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this

Actually, Random, maybe it’s a good thing you lost your sponsorship. Don’t wanna violate any rules.

Good goin’…

By olal

August 1, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this

not connected to this comment..DOB…but would like to hear your comments on Mike Hampton. Personally I admire the guy and really hope he makes it back. He could have been sitting on his backside all this time and collecting his dough. But he has tried time and again to make it back. Lots of smart cutting remarks made about him that I hope he forces down the throats of thos who made them. Next season’s staff consisting of Hampton, Jurgens, Campillio, and ?? doesn’t sound bad when you have Soriano and Gonzales in the pen. What do you think?

By Steve from OH

August 1, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this

[Baseball Prospectus}(www.baseballprospectus.com) has an execellent analysis of the ManRam-Bay trade. Y’all should check it out.

By Random

August 1, 2008 1:20 PM | Link to this

Shaun: “Ramirez has a slight edge with the bat. Bay is the better fielder by a significant margin and a better baserunner plus he’s younger.”

“Bay is the better fielder by a significant margin”?!?!? Or maybe not at all.

Like Doc Holliday already pointed out, “This year Manny has 1 error in 66 games in LF while Bay has 3 in 105.” That’s thrice as many errors for Bay in less than twice as many games (or innings — 921.1 v 537.2).

Their Range Factors are about the same (Bay — 1.77; Ramirez — 1.76), but Ramirez boasts a FPCT of .991 while Bay efforts to redeem his .984 FPCT with his bat. ;->

Finally, Ramirez has twice as many Assists as Bay (6 v 3) in significantly fewer games/innings.

“a better baserunner”? Oh, okay — no argument.

“plus he’s younger” Do you really think that their ages will be a factor in ‘08-‘09?

By LT-AA blogger

August 1, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this

I’ve got a question. Each and every time an AL player comes to the NL everyone touts- hey, they’re coming to the weaker divison and will dominate.

However, I have yet to see that happen. Tex and Santana come to mind off the top of my head. As a whole, yeah the AL has better teams, but I don’t think you can correlate individual performance between the two leagues.

By Steve from OH

August 1, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this

Ok, let’s try that again…Baseball Prospectus

By Big Easy

August 1, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this

While I agree with you Doc that Manny is a much more feared hitter, I don’t think you can really take into account the amount of errors in the field. Manny is a butcher in the field, as anyone who has watched him can attest. He has less errors simply because he doesn’t go for as many balls.

I think Boston will be better with Bay, in many respects, but there are intangibles that they lose with the trade of The Manny Circus. He may be a slacker, but he does strike fear into opposing pitching (justified or not) when Jason Bay simply cannot.

~E~

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 1:39 PM | Link to this

Random,

Here’s a spreadsheet with defensive stats: http://baseballanalysts.com/Fielding_ratings2%281%29.xls

Here is an article about defensive stats: http://baseballanalysts.com/archives/2008/07/deefensedeefen1.php

Manny is the worst leftfielder in baseball. Bay is slightly below average.

Their ages will definitely be a factor. Bay is in his prime or barely past it. Manny is well past his.

By timthebrave

August 1, 2008 1:44 PM | Link to this

Here is what I see the braves doing for next year. Not many changes in hitting but major changes in pitching staff. Need to get a CC sabathia/ben sheets type of starter 1B Kotchamn 2B K Johnson SS Escobar 3B C Jones Infante backs up all infield C B Mcann RF Francouer CF Kotsay, Blanco LF sign middle of road lf Pitching is where we need to make big moves 1. New guy-gotta spend some big $ and get a #1 guy…long term 2. JJ-I think he can be the man 3. New guy-Would like for them to spend money on solid 2a 4.. Campillo-solid young guy 5. Rookie-until Hudson comes back Closer-Mike Gonzalez-he has the closer mentality

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

Big Easy, I keep seeing the fear factor being brought up. But the Sox have six very good to great hitters. You don’t think facing a stacked lineup is fearful enough? Also fear doesn’t necessarily put more runs on the board.

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this

Slight edge with the bat…………….wow. That sure is something.

Shaun you are not convincing me on this one…… what about the errors? I showed you the money. ;-)

I´ll give you a list of what manny has done against the very best pitcher baseball has seen las 15 years with enough years in the league so both hitters could half AB against them either because of interlegue play or because the have played in both leagues and compare bays numbers……….we will do BA/OBP

Pitcher Manny BA/OBP Bay BA/OPB

R. Johnson .244/.346 .154/.155

J. Smoltz .286/-375 .000/.250

T. Glavine .250/.500 .333/.417

T. Hudson .257/.333 .385/.556

R. Clemens .180/.317 .150/.227

T. Lilly * .262/.340 .143/.200

J. Suppan * .348/464 .152/.194

El Duque .344/.476 .250/.250

Pedro .167/.194 .125/.125

G. Maddux .182/.250 .429/.452

C. Carpenter .273/.385 .077/.172

Irsinghausen* .500/.571 .182/.277

• not that great but good pitcher and some ABs by both hitters.

I listed 12 pitchers and manny has superior numbers against 75% of them (glavine, hudson, maddux the exceptions). If Bay is the better hitter, I just cant see it.

By McFann O

August 1, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this

A while ago somebody posted a link to a website that showed what pitches a player would swing at and miss or whatever. I lost the link—If somebody knows what it is, could you please post it here?

Thanks!

By Random

August 1, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

DOB: “Lee, I think there’s a good chance Sammons fills that backup catcher role next season… . I think we could (should) see him in that backup catcher role, perhaps catching one of next year’s five rotation starters on a regular basis.”

Bowman: “More importantly, during his past three starts, [Chuck] James has completed 17 innings, allowed four earned runs, recorded 17 strikeouts and issued just five walks… . Helping James realize this turnaround in Richmond was catcher Clint Sammons. Coming off his career-best three-hit performance, which included his first career homer, Sammons will be behind the plate again on Friday for the southpaw.”

A match made in heaven? Will tonight be a peek into next season?

We’ll see — here’s hoping they both can come through and be a big part of our success next year.

Shaun — thanks for the links — I’ll check them out.

S: “Their ages will definitely be a factor.” This year and next year?!?!? C’mon. Remember, that’s all we were talking about, 2008 & 2009.

Oh, well — that’s not so long a wait to see who guessed right. We’ll see next year, I suppose.

By Lee in S GA

August 1, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this

Not as convinced on the starting line-up being set for next season as most are on here. If a deal came along that really interested Wren, I feel any one, not all, of the following players could be dealt: Frenchy, Johnson, Blanco or Diaz.

Third base, catcher, 1st base and ss are pretty much set. But it is very possible a starter could be in any of the other places next season.

By Big Easy

August 1, 2008 2:14 PM | Link to this

Shaun, what I mean by that is, as a pitcher, would you rather face ManRam, or Bay? I would bet most pitchers would rather face Bay.

Same goes for all good to great hitters. Would you rather face Chipper or Francoeur? Pujols or Mather? We saw Mather tear us up this week, but every pitcher in the league will take their chances with him over Pujols. I agree that a stacked lineup is enough in and of itself, but when it comes to crunch time, most fans would rather see (and most pitchers would rather not face) Manny over Bay.

I know you love stats, and I do too — it is the best way to objectively judge the game. But there is a human element to the game that cannot be overlooked. With the possible exception of Chuck James, pitchers know who they are facing, and what those guys can do. And the stress of trying to be too perfect with your pitch because Manny is at the dish will often cause the pitcher to make a mistake. Not saying pitchers won’t pitch carefully to Bay, but I doubt they would be “sweating bullets” to see him coming up to the plate, or in the on-deck circle with the game on the line.

Again, Bay is a good-to-great player, and a good pickup for the BoSox. But he isn’t the same as Manny. I won’t get into track records, or past performances, because, as we saw with Andruw, what a player “used to do” doesn’t mean they do it anymore. It is the intangibles that make the difference.

~E~

By Doc Holliday

August 1, 2008 2:16 PM | Link to this

Efrim

Sheets I like him more than Sabathia, but man, after all the injuries this year and some will carry until 2009, Im not sure if we want him, Id love to, but Ill be holding my breath every pitch.

Perez muts will pay him what he asks for, they have the money, Pedro will be gone and they know that if they dont pay, we will. They dont want to have to deal with him in a Braves uni.

Sabathia Im against paying the kind of money he will ask for, just ask the muts about Santana. Pelfrey and Maine have the same record he does.

AJ not sure about him. His ERA is very high, his K total is solid though

Lackey he is not moving………..Angels will pay the $$$.

Garland not sure about him moving either. It will be tough for them to keep both and TEX.

Dempster he is not an ACE. He has never been this solid. Maybe is just a one year show.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 2:17 PM | Link to this

Doc, as someone else pointed out, Bay has two more errors because he gets to more balls. When you are able to go for more balls, you are going to miss more and you are going to be able to make more attempts throwing out runners which leads to more throwing errors. Please look at the fielding stats I provided.

Who said Bay is the better hitter? Bay is a slightly worse hitter but he’s not that far behind Manny. And Bay is better at pretty much every other aspect of the game.

Doc, a better way to look at what they’ve done against good pitching is to look at what they’ve done against all pitchers that have posted an ERA under say 4.00 for their careers or something like that.

I can easily look at Bay’s numbers and point to 10 good pitchers he’s hit well against. What does that prove besides what we already know, that Bay can hit? Doesn’t really tell us how much better or worse he is than Ramirez.

Bay has done very well against Zambrano, Marquis, Hudson, Lidge, Maddux, Penny, Glavine, Isringhausen, Orlando Hernandez, Matt Morris, Sheets, Oswalt, Wainwright.

By Jams

August 1, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this

Champ

Good question at 10:46am. What is the difference? ha!

By BravesFanInRockies

August 1, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this

Unlike Shaun, I’ll offer no guarantees about who will be the better player, Bay or Manny.

I’ll simply say that, if both are healthy, Bay will probably put up better numbers over the next 3-4 years because Manny is 36 and Bay is not quite 30. Players do, for the most part, decline in their mid- to late-30s.

Manny may beat the odds if he is rejuvenated by the move to LA — though Dodger Stadium has always been a pitcher’s park and we all know about Fenway. Bay may likewise flop in the Back Bay.

Also, will Manny play well in a park with an adult-sized outfield, rather than the band box of Fenway’s LF?

Those things I can’t predict and nor can anyone eise.

I think the trade was amazing in its intricacies and the Sox may well be a happier bunch with Manny gone. Will that translate into a World Series or a deeper playoff run than they would have had with Manny? We’ll find out.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 2:32 PM | Link to this

Random, ignoring contracts and clubhouse drama and all of that, who would you rather the Braves have from this point until the end of 2009? Ramirez or Bay?

By THB

August 1, 2008 2:39 PM | Link to this

To all those praising Manny in the playoffs-You do realize that he had 0 RBIin the entire 7 game series against the Yankees in 2004, right? And he has 1 career walkoff HR for them? I’m not saying he’s not a great hitter and that he can’t get it done in the playoffs, but I think you’re mistaking him with Ortiz. Big Papi would be sorely missed in the playoffs.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

Big Easy, yes, I’d rather face Bay. I’ve said all along Ramirez is the slightly better hitter. But Bay is the better player and he’s not that far off as a hitter.

BravesFanInRockies, I’m wrong to make it sound like a prediction. I should say Bay is more likely to be the better player, and in fact is already the better player.

By TennesseePaul

August 1, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this

I didn’t think the Braves should give up four good prospects for Bay when he’s a free agent after 2009. That doesn’t matter to the Red Sox. They don’t have to worry about money.

For this trade in particular it cost the Sox more than any other team. They gave up 2 prospects, covered all of Ramirez’s remaining salary and picked up Bay’s salary. Quite a hefty tab. The Pirates got their 4 young guys. The Dodgers have a free outfielder. The Sox picked up this tab.
I do have a question though, if the Braves shouldn’t give up 4 (or even 5) prospects for a player they have control over for two play off runs in this case, as would be the case with Bay, why was it the right move, as you so adamantly argued, for the Braves to acquire Teixeira for 4 or 5 prospects? In both cases they would have been fulfilling this mandate of yours:
If a player [Bay/Teixeira] is better than the one you’ve got [Blanco/Franco] and you can get him, then go get him

… seems like a double standard.

By Shaun

August 1, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this

Keith Law brought up some interesting points about errors in an espn.com chat.

Mark (Tempe, AZ): How are errors a meaningless stat?

Keith Law: (2:33 PM ET ) What exactly do they tell you? They’re totally subjective. They’re inconsistently applied (e.g., if the fielder doesn’t touch the ball, it’s not an error, even if he fouled up the play eight ways to Sunday). I’ve seen ridiculous home-team biases in error calls. Players with good range may be charged with more errors because they reach more balls in play. And so on.

By Random

August 1, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this

Steve from OH — Interesting analysis of the Bay-Man trade. Joe Sheehan is pretty funny — I hadn’t come across him before. Thanks.

Shaun — your Baseball Analysts link didn’t work, but I think I found it here. Later. (Check out taht Joe Sheehan article, if you haven’t already — good stuff.)

By David O'Brien

August 1, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this

NEW BLOGGAGE.

By Chad

August 1, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this

Any possibility that the Braves would take Andruw back in a Mike Hampton type trade. Where most of the salary is absorbed by the Dodgers and/or another team?

Or has that bridge (Scott Boras) been burned?

By DAP

August 1, 2008 2:58 PM | Link to this

really, the braves are up a creek without hudson. hudson getting hurt is worse for the braves than any other injury all year, because he is gone fo next season too. now the braves need to replace hudson along with the #2/#3 type pitcher they already needed. sheets and sabathia are both going to cost much more than the risk is worth, i think. sabathia, because he will get a contract that will be very difficult to love up to, and sheets because its is a very good possibility that he will get hurt and miss alot of games during his contract. if i were the braves, i would make reasonable offers to both pitchers.

i agree with the blogger above who said the mets will almost certinly resign perez, but he would be a good pickup for the braves. so would dempster, burnett, or garland.

so we will probably hope to trade for some pitching. our goal would have to be established starter who could be a co-ace. bedard, oswalt, halliday, Duchscherer, cook, should all be on the radar. i think wren is going to pull off a trade with someone, involving one of our young pitchers (james, reyes, morton, lerew) for a good starter.

By Random

August 1, 2008 3:15 PM | Link to this

Shaun: “Random, ignoring contracts and clubhouse drama and all of that, who would you rather the Braves have from this point until the end of 2009? Ramirez or Bay?”

Ramirez, even with the “clubhouse drama and all of that”. Seriously.

Aside from all the data we’ve been tossing around, my gut feeling is that Bay was a merely big fish in a small pond, whereas Ramirez is an effin shark. (The BB Prospectus article mentioned earlier is giving me a new perspective on Bay, though — I may not be so quick to dismiss him offensively as I was).

I do think Ramirez will still be able to get it done significantly better offensively than Bay thru next year at least, and would just hope that we could hide him defensively.

You know, maybe trade away all our LH pitchers, or something.

8-)

Just joking — I do like Ramirez better than Bay.

Also, per that BBP article, “Bay’s defense, per Clay Davenport’s rankings, has fallen off of a cliff the past two seasons, and he rates as worse than Ramirez in this system. Even if Bay’s knee injury has taken its toll, it seems likely that the difference between them defensively is exaggerated statistically.”

I read the article you linked — it is the easiest to understand article on esoteric BB stats I’ve yet seen. Do you think they have similar explanations of VORP, Wins Over Replacement, Babdabbings, etc, on that site? Thanks for the link.

By David O'Brien

August 1, 2008 6:19 PM | Link to this

It’s official: Corky designated for assignment.

By Jerome

August 3, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this

The Braves have come to that stage where they have to let go of that 90’s team and start building again. (1)Smoltz,Glavine time has past. (2) Trade Chipper while he still have some value.(3)Bobby Cox has been great for this team but it’s time to move in a different direction with a new manager.