AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2008 > May > 21 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USBraves’ rollercoaster in improbable ascent
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Now that we’ve had a chance to rest the carpal-tunneled fingers and let the laptop sleep a few hours following yesterday’s marathon of ‘ball and blogging, whaddya say we do it again, folks?
Hey, Braves schedule says they play again tonight, and my schedule says I’m covering it. So let’s do this.
Don’t know what I find to be more surprising:
— The Braves’ 17-3 record in their last 20 home games (11-1 in last 12);
— That Atlanta is first in the NL in starters’ ERA and third in relief ERA;
— That the Braves have won four of their past five games with just one extra-base hit and one RBI in that five-game stretch from Chipper Jones (still hitting over .400 to lead the majors despite the absurdly hot recent stretch by Houston’s Lance Berkman).
Anyway, the Bravos will try to keep the surge going while Willie Randolph will try to improve his chances of remaining employed with the Mets, who’ve lost eight of their past 14 games (and lost five of seven against the Braves this season, for those keeping score in the rivalry).
(While I’m thinking about it, who thought the House season finale was outstanding? I watched the second part of the two-parter last night at about 2 a.m., as the remnants of my coffee-and-deadline buzz wore off. Great show.)
OK, the Escobar situation: Teammates have to be crossing fingers as they drive to the ballpark today hopeful of an optimistic report on shortstop Yunel Escobar, who hurt his right knee on that spectacular and scary double play that ended the doubleheader late last night.
Ryan Church was taken to the hospital with a concussion after his head crashed into Escobar’s knee as the budding Cuban star hurdled over the awkwardly sliding Met to make the throw to first base.
“Esco” (nickname Bobby Cox and other Braves call him) had his knee and lefty hamstring wrapped in ice after the game and said “No DL” to reporters before heading back to the training room. “Tomorrow,” he added as he walked away.
“Tomorrow” (meaning today) might be too ambitious; I don’t expect him to be in the lineup for tonight’s game, despite his prediction he’d play. But the DL decision is the far more important matter, obviously.
Cox was non-commital, said they’d have to wait and see how Escobar feels today.
We’ll probably know a lot more soon after the clubhouse is opened this afternoon. Needless to say, the Braves can ill afford to lose Escobar for 15 or more days (although maybe I shouldn’t say that, since they’ve certainly managed to patch holes and dispel the notion that they couldn’t survive for significant stretches without John Smoltz, Rafael Soriano and Peter Moylan, among others).
Escobar is a dynamic talent who’s gone 7-for-12 in the last three games and hit .338 with a .381 OBP in his past 19 games. He’s given the Braves a spark since Cox moved him to the leadoff spot recently, and in the field he seems to produce a couple of highlight-reel plays every night, and a handful yesterday.
Take him out of the lineup and you’re scrambling to fill the leadoff role again, and either having to use utility man Omar Infante at shortstop (thus robbing the Braves of his defensive versatility) or calling up an inexperienced prospect (remember, Martin Prado is on the DL and still wearing a cast on his hand/wrist).
Impressive pitching: Ever since pitching coach Roger McDowell arrived in Atlanta, Bobby Cox has given him overwhelming positive reviews. Frankly, the time of some of his kudos for McDowell left us scratching our heads, seeing that Cox would often laud him when the pitchers were struggling and ranked in the middle of the pack in most statistical categories.
But talk to Braves pitchers and glance at the NL statistics this season, and you start to see what Cox has been talking about. The results are impossible to argue with this season, especially given the rash of injuries to key members of the pitching staff.
The Braves lead the NL with a 3.14 ERA in May (Houston’s 13-5 record is the only better league record this month). The relievers had a string of 20 consecutive scoreless innings snapped in the second game last night.
For the season, Atlanta leads the league with an overall 3.47 ERA, ahead of a loaded Arizona staff that has Brandon Webb, Dan Haren, Randy Johnson, Micah Owings, hotshot rookie Max Scherzer, et al.
Braves starters also lead the NL with a 3.53 ERA to Arizona’s 3.63. That’s hard to fathom, given that Atlanta has been without Smoltz for nearly a month, hasn’t gotten an inning out of Mike Hampton, and already had Tom Glavine do his first-ever stint on the DL and Chuck James not the same since his shoulder injury.
Jorge Campillo? Are you kidding me? Dude has a 0.99 ERA in 14 games including one start, a six-inning scoreless gem last night. This is a guy who signed as a minor-league free agent on Dec. 26, a guy that any team could have had for a song. Talk about your reclamation projects….
Even Braves relievers, despite being without Soriano and Moylan most of the season, rank third in the NL with a 3.35 ERA, behind only the Phillies and Dodgers. The Braves are doing this with a bullpen that has only one active pitcher making as much as $1 million (Will Ohman, $1.6 mill).
More disciplined hitting: The Braves are also winning without a lot of homers this month, though they got two big ones yesterday from Brian McCann and Mark Kotsay.
The Braves have only 12 homers this month — eight NL teams have 20 or more — but the Braves’ .290 average trails only Houston’s .293 this month, and the Braves lead the league with 40 doubles and a robust .370 OBP for the month.
They’ve increased their walks (75 this month, third in the NL) and reduced their strikeouts (101 this month, second-fewest in the league).
Now the Braves just have to figure out a way to do all this good stuff on the road, of course.
Because while they lead the NL by a wide margin in home ERA (2.73), the Braves are seventh in road ERA (4.30).
And while they lead the league with a .312 home batting average, the Braves are tied for eighth in road average (.251, same as those Astros).
OK, gotta get to the park. First, a tune. You know how you sometimes buy a few CDs, or a bunch of CDs, and get busy and forget about this one or that one for a few months? (No, this doesn’t happen to you? Well, humor me.) So I’d not listened to the Black Rebel Motorcycle Club CD from last year, Baby 81, in a long time. What a great CD. Been playing it for the past two days solid, alternating between it and Dwight Yoakam’s terrific Dwight Sings Buck, which I never get tired of. Best country album of the past couple of years.
Here’s my favorite song from that Yoakam-covers-Buck Owens album.
”CLOSE UP THE HONKY TONKS” by Buck Owens
She’s in some honky tonk tonight, I know
She’s dancing where the music’s loud and lights are low
In a crowded bar she likes to hang around
And as long as there’s a honky tonk she’ll never settle down
So close up the honky tonks, lock all the doors
Don’t let the one I love go there anymore
Close up the honky tonks, throw away the key
And maybe the one I love will come back to me
If I had the power I’d turn back time
And live again the hours when she was all mine
It hurts to see her running with that crowd in town
But as long as there’s a honky tonk she’ll never settle down
So close up the honky tonks, lock all the doors
Don’t let the one I love go there anymore
Close up the honky tonks, throw away the key
And maybe the one I love will come back to me
Yeah, maybe the one I love will come back to me
Close up the honky tonks, lock all the doors
Don’t let the one I love go there anymore
Close up the honky tonks, throw away the key
And maybe the one I love will come back to me
Close up the honky tonks, lock all the doors
Don’t let the one I love go there anymore
Services »
Comments
By Steeledawg
May 21, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
1st!
By Stephen
May 21, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this
First
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 21, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this
I’m going out on a limb here maybe but if the Braves sweep the Mets and the Mets look as ugly in these next two games as they did yesterday than I think Willie Randolph will be fired come Monday morning.
By Ben
May 21, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this
Last!
By Capt. Caveman (the original dawg)
May 21, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
I cant be first!!??
By braves fan
May 21, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
go Braves!!!
By Rico
May 21, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this
DOB, saw Stephen Marley at the Georgia Theater in Athens last Thursday. OMG…awesome performer. Sounds more like his ol’ man than any of his siblings (Ziggy, Damien, Julian, etc.)
When he sang any of his dad’s songs I could’ve sworn I was listening to Bob himself back in 1980 in Munich during the Uprising Tour. I actually worked that show as a stage hand while I attended Univ. of Maryland/Munich Campus (for military brats).
I highly recommend his show and his new cd, “Mind Control” to reggae fans.
By 22oz
May 21, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this
Did the other blog explode this morning? I couldn’t read any post past 10:55 am.
By 1957 Braves Fan
May 21, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this
Jair needs some run support tonight.
By Bravesfan79
May 21, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this
Ok … i say no matter Escobars knee…even if the guy cant but walk to freakin first base…. keep him on the roster. Who better to pinchit?? Kink Gibson jr….
By eware
May 21, 2008 3:05 PM | Link to this
DOB, that song from Dwight Sings Buck blew me away also. Great song.
Two days in a row you’ve posted outstanding songs. Jam out with your clam out!
GO BRAVES!
By Capt. Caveman (the original dawg)
May 21, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this
DOB
I just watched the replay on TV. Did it not look to you like Church stayed upright way too long?? We were always instructed to break up the DP but there’s a difference between using your head and ACTUALLY using your HEAD.
I thought it was a good try, completely legal, and an overall good baseball play, but in that situation it definitely wasn’t worth the result, obviously.
Can’t wait to hear the comments from the clubhouse about this.
Anybody questioning Church about being an idiot??
By DAP
May 21, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
what was with the last blog? i thought i got banned for awhile there.
By Seven Pitches
May 21, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this
From the last blog: you have a Willie Stargell bobblehead? I am so jealous!
By Efrim
May 21, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this
Overlord
Regarding an earlier post on the last blog. I thought that the Braves going 6-5 would be a good homestand, and I still think that is the case. Over the next 6 games, I would say the Braves have an edge in starting pitching in only tonights game against the Mets. Tomorrow is Hudson vs. Santana, Friday is Reyes vs. Doug Davis, Saturday is Johnson vs. Campillo(on 3 days rest), Sunday is Owings vs. Glavine and Monday is Brandon Webb vs. Jurrjens.
Tonight’s game is big because Johan Santana could be pitching knowing his manager’s job is on the line if they lose tonight. I would love to see the Mets in that type of spot tomorrow. Even though I think it is absurd that a manager can get fired this early when he is only like 5 games out.
By James
May 21, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this
Not going to lie. I sort of hope there is some sort of retaliation tonight (for the Esco/Church incident).
Thoughts?
By James
May 21, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this
Jurrgen’s needs to beam somebody. But who?
By RC
May 21, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this
While I truly don’t think that Church was trying to cause an injury on the last play last night, did anyone else think he waited a LONG time before starting his slide? Like to the point it was a borderline dirty play?
By BA
May 21, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this
It’s a shame about Randolph. Not really his fault that his team is made up of a bunch of soft, overpaid, past their prime type of players. I’ll bet Bobby could straighten that crowd out. Too bad Randolph doesn’t have “three HOF pitchers” to trick everybody into thinking he’s fourth all time in managerial wins. What’s that? Oh yeah, Cox actually IS fourth all time in wins. Too bad the Braves have already been eliminated by the prestigous Florida Marlins. What’s that? It’s May 21? Well, MAYBE they have a shot. If only Tex wasn’t having the worst year of his life. What’s that, DOB? He’s having the same type of year he has every other year? Guess all us dumb “homers” will just have to keep watching through our rose-colored glasses…
By BravesRule
May 21, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this
Charlie AlphaBravo,FlaBrave & Dr Suess(yeah I bet we all know who that is/how’s your mom Doc?) let me see if I understand this: Nolie finds an article at another source that deals with a topic that many on the board have been discussing for months and he goes to the trouble to post it. Because you three are ADD troubled and can’t sustain interest in it, instead of just passing it by you feel the need to ridicule the guy for it? I read it and N8 read it and I at least appreciated the fact it was made available. I really fail to see why you would attack someone for trying to make information available to the board whether you were interested or not. And since he didn’t create it how could he edit 60% of it anyway? Ignorance is sure bliss for you three I guess. Thanks Nolie for posting it.Braveheart was right.
By James
May 21, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
I’d like them to wait to fire Willie. They’ll have too much time to recover without him if he goes soon.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
braves need to treat pelfrey tonight the same way they treated maine. make him throw alot of pitches, get the pitch count up, and let him get himself in trouble. pelfrey strikes guys out about as often as he walks them, so some long at bats could go the braves way tonight.
if i remmember right, last time out, pelfrey ptiched pretty well against the braves until melting down in the 5th. if jair can hold down the mets early in this game, i think we will eventually get to pelfrey.
By jonny
May 21, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
On the Church play, that was the second time in the game that that occurred with Church and “Esco” - the first time seemed to affect Esco’s left thigh. Church did a stand-up after that slide, too, and I thought it a bit out of place, but was his way to attempt to break up the DP. Since he did it again, I would say that that is his way to play a hard game. Both guys play that hard game and hung in there - I just hope that it doesn’t keep them from much action over the next few games.
On a music note, during the rain delay I watched the Roy Orbison and Friends on GPTV - had T-Bone Burnette, Bruce Springsteen, Elvis Costello, and bonnie Raitt among others on the stage with one of the greatest vocalists of all time. I do not think anyone will ever match that voice. It was unique and makes one want to dig up the old “records” or the Traveling Wilburys CD just to hear it again. I don’t mean to get a Wilbury blog-trade going again - after all, this is a baseball blog, and the best in the USA.
Appreciate reading it early before all the negative blogs get on and we have to start reading, and then skip over, the hyper-critical blogs. I do look forward to the daily start of this and when I miss it because I am on the road, I try to read DOB’s entries. I miss the pie blogs and the Carolina Lady at times, though.
By Randy
May 21, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
JORGE SOSA RELEASED BY METS TODAY.
By TURTSNAP
May 21, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
I could be wrong here, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see a little retaliation on the events around second base last night. Don’t forget Church did it twice, albeit the first one was more on the allowable side than the second one. Kinda reminds me a little of the Angels player, I believe it was Erstad when he went in hard to McCann. Yes, it is baseball, but borderline baseball.
Add to it that it is the hated Mets, and things could get a little interesting, if not the last two games in this series, on down the line this year.
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this
Here’s hoping that Esco is in the lineup tonight. I want to see him hit off of Santana on ESPN.
By MikeC
May 21, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this
Church went in high twice in the second game. In the old days, the shortstop would drill him between the eyes with the ball. Also, Mike Jacobs would have taken one in the ribs for needlessly pushing Francoeur down a few weeks ago. God, I miss the era when the players policed the game!
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this
switch that to tomorrow against Santana….oops.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
James i doubt there will be retaliation. as much fun as it would be to have real stuff going on in this rivalry, i think both teams are to respectful to carry it over, and theyare guided by such level headed managers, they would never call for it or let it happen.
By SC
May 21, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
DOB, do you have any kind of an update on Hampton? I see stuff on Soriano, Gonzo and Smoltz but never Hampton.
By Braves20
May 21, 2008 3:34 PM | Link to this
DOB - Your comments regarding patience in the batters box are well taken. It’s almost as if a few of our guys were playing attention when Oakland was in town. While the A’s appear to be too passive sometimes, they certainly pile up pitch counts.
And Campillo - you can’t help but feel great about the guy. He’s one of those cats who makes you feel you should grab a bat but at the same time gets people out.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this
Bobby’s Cox there is pretty much a 0% chance escobar will get a hit off of santana tonight.
By Braves20
May 21, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this
jonny - amen to your comments on Orbison. Just had I’m Hurtin’ pop up on my shuffle playlist an hour or so ago on the iPod. Incredible voice and the show you mention is a classic as well.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 21, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this
If this Braves’ offense sticks to taking pitches instead of hacking at everything they will find themselves scoring tons of runs. The one thing that makes the Red Sox offense so tough is that they take pitches. Ellsbury, Pedoria, Youklis, Ortiz, Manny, Drew, and Lowell are some of the best hitters in the league at making pitchers work. Where a lot of Braves batters are lucky to have more than a two pitch at-bat, the Red Sox hitters consistently have six and seven pitch at-bats. That kind of patience drives pitch counts up and pitchers out of the game by the fifth inning.
By Truth hurts
May 21, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this
I’d love to see Francoeur bearing down on Reyes’ scrawny butt on a double-play ball; however, that’s not the Braves way. Won’t happen on a Bobby Cox team. I guess it really does show class to let it go, but I’d still love to see Reyes being knocked silly into left field.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
Going down to find out about “Esco” (and Church) now.
eward: “Jam out with your clam out.” That’s great.
By chris
May 21, 2008 3:44 PM | Link to this
Too bad BA doesn’t make any sense in his post. What’s that? He’s a moron.
By James
May 21, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this
DAP, I don’t know. I mean, nothing blatant, but what about hitting Reyes in the butt or something. I think that’d be kosher.
By Kentavo
May 21, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this
Hope Esco is okay, but Church got what he deserverd - especially after the first time.
As for Campillo - I suspect he did what’s often done to the Braves in making the Mets, who’d never seen him, look foolish. I loved it, but let’s see if he can make the necessary adjustments needed at this level. I will say this: loved it when Campillo rared back and threw ‘em down the middle when the pitcher’s were batting, i.e. no messing around. Hope some of the other Braves’ young hurlers took notice (Boyer), that you don’t mess around and get cute with guys who are no threat to get a hit anyway. Just pump it in there.
By Steve
May 21, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this
Try to imitate the voice of a retarded redneck named George and sing that honkey tonk nonsense. It’s kinda funny.
By Jonathon
May 21, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this
Here’s the video of last night’s game-ending double play. Church was too wide of the bag AND slid too high:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDQ-dxrIX58
By J-Dubb
May 21, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
I am glad to see the Braves winning without the long ball. I know we are a team that waits for the 3 run homer, but it is good to see them doing the little things to win games. The homeruns will be there, I’ve got no doubt about that. In the meantime, its nice to see them win playing small ball. That just gives us more ways to beat other teams. Can’t say enough about Campillo last night. And Escobar is as tuff as they come. What a gamer!
By hitsalot
May 21, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
Hey Mutts fans…
Campillo= Mexican for OWNED
By Charlie
May 21, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
I keep hearing that the Padres are about to start a fire-sale and that there is a good possibility that Maddux returns to Atlanta to finish out his career. Is there any truth to it? Just how much geriatric medicine will be needed for the trio to once again reunite?
By RC
May 21, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this
I agree with everyone else on the Braves need to take pitches. However, one of the overlooked parts of yesterday’s 1st game was how many good pitches they were able to foul off. As a team the Braves only had 2 K’s in the first game, which is a really low number for this team. There were multiple at bats that went 8+ pitches because batters kept fouling off good pitches until they either got something to hit or were able to walk. Patience AND contact is the best formula, in my opinion.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 3:58 PM | Link to this
james ha! yeah, sounds good.
By BA
May 21, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
Too bad “Chris” is a girl’s name. Maybe you should go read TMZ or something that’s easier for you too follow. If it’s too hard for you too understand something, doesn’t that mean YOU are the moron?
By Capt. Caveman (the original dawg)
May 21, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this
C’mon guys. It was a hard nosed play but not dirty or illegal. Church has already paid the price by getting “Knocked the F’ out”. And we won both games.
It wasn’t exactly smart but being in idiot and being dirty are two different things.
I think it is going to just add more pressure to the Mutts and to Willie’s job. They are killing themselves and all the Braves need to do is keep playing good ball.
The reason why BC isn’t in to the payback so much is it takes the focus off the game and puts it on the player. That’s not what the Braves need to do, especially when there is no reason to.
By Salty
May 21, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this
I think there was zero intent on either DP last night; more a case of not knowing what the other player would do. On the last play, I think Church was simply peeling off when he realized Esco’s momentum was taking him across the bag, and it was a bit late to get down. Unfortunate, but part of the game. For sure, though, Church likely remembers very little, if any, of the play…he was out cold. D’OB will be able to confirm soon enough, I suspect.
By AdirondackDave
May 21, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this
Mike and the Mad Dog talk show on YES this afternoon made a big deal out of some of Willie Randolph’s recent comments. Apparently, Willie suggested racism came into some of the Mets/fan problems but I didn’t get the specifics. Sounds like a pretty grim situation there. Valid or not its got to be a distraction for them. Mike discussed who would you rather have on your post-season team at 3rd, A-rod or Chipper. He acknowledged how Chipper was a great player and a clutch player. Sounded like he would have taken Chipper if he hadn’t been on-the-air with thousands of Yankee fans.
By RC
May 21, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this
Thanks for posting that video Jonathon. I’d like to revise my earlier statement….that was not a borderline dirty play, that was almost a tackle. If not for Escobar’s athleticism to get over Church, Church would have taken him out like a linebacker making a sack. I’ll never cheer an injury, and I hope both players recover quickly, but Church brought that upon himself.
By N8
May 21, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this
BA
Nice post. What’s that? OK. I’m lying. It wasn’t.
This team is playing GREAT right now. The lack of HR’s, yet abundance of runs, is a GREAT sign (unless you’re name is Shaun).
Campillo pitched his azz off last night, and CERTAINLY deserves another start.
The bullpen (minus Boyer’s erratic location at times), has been STELLAR.
The rotation (during most of their 5-6 inning starts), has been just as outstanding.
I’m STILL am not sold on the bullpen “big 3” all playing at the same time.j
I’m STILL disappointed in Tex’s start, regardless of what his past says, or what his future holds. His first two months were mediocre…..at best. Period.
I’m STILL confused as why Acosta pitched in game 1 of a double header when the score was 6-1.
Add to that, I’m STILL gonna have to see this team do “it” (“it” being what they’ve done for the past week or so), on the road.
They are obviously not gonna keep this torrid streak of success going at this pace at home. Common sense tells you that.
As for the road? I don’t expect them to go 20-60 on the road this year either. But playing .500 ball on the road isn’t too much to ask for is it?
As for your remarks about Willie Randolph/Bobby Cox?
You still haven’t answered the question from a few weeks ago. You just keep side-stepping it.
Name me a major league manager (ANYBODY), that couldn’t have won with Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz and Chipper on his team for a decade.
If you can find me one and convince me of it, I’ll let it die.
Let me guess. I suppose you think that Doc Rivers all of the sudden just became a GREAT coach in the past 8 or 9 months too, right?
How about my Chiefs? In 2003, they went 13-3. They had home-field advantage throughout the playoffs and lost a close game to the Colts. The following year with LITERALLY the same roster, they go 7-9 the following year? Did Dick Vermeil just all of the sudden forget how to coach? Nope the players didn’t play well.
What’s that? That’s different? A manager/head coach is only as good as his players. And Bobby Cox has had NOTHING but rosters FILLED with GREAT players since 1991. Period.
I have NEVER questioned Bobby’s ability to “manage” players, and their various personalities. I have NEVER questioned his ability to find talent (which is why he SHOULD be the GM), and evaluate, how to best use it.
However. I have questioned his in-game decisions (mainly calling for bunts with guys that DON’T bunt, playing the infield “in” too often IMO, and NOT sticking with relievers when they seem to be going good.)
He has also made decisions that could have gone the other way, had the players performed.
I definitely GET that all he can do is put guys in a position to succeed, and if they DON’T, it’s not his fault. But I can get on him, if I so choose, for being stubborn and NOT making changes sooner than he does (like leaving Andruw in the clean-up spot - like leaving KJ in the lead-off spot), etc…
But excuse me for not giving him “credit”, when 3 of his “decisions” he had to make for a decade, was penciling in Maddux, Glavine and Smoltz to start 3 out of every 5 days.
The toughest part of that decision in that, was which frickin’ order to put them in. Which was usually decided based on which one of them won the Cy Young award the previous year.
Don’t get me wrong. His “calming” affect on the guys over the years, has surely been good for a few victories each year. Never too high, never too low. Not like the fans (myself included).
Leo Mazzone was a GENIUS in Atlanta. Now he’s jobless, and his legacy looks to me like it’s severely damaged. If Bobby Cox AND Leo had gone to the Orioles, are you to lead me to believe that they would have beatin out the Yankees and Red Sox the past couple of years?
Please…..do tell.
By efuzz
May 21, 2008 4:09 PM | Link to this
I certainly hope Esco stays off the DL, but if he is going to nurse the hammy and the knee for an extended time, do you think it would be better for him long term to shut it down for a few days and let it rest? If it isn’t too serious then I’m ok with him sitting for a few and maybe coming in to PH only, but I’d rather he get healthy for the long haul -although he is really needed with Arizona coming in.
And DOB, your lyrics remind me of something my Dad said when Buck died. “I wanna go out the same way - play my guitar, eat a dinner of country fired steak and mashed potatoes, go to bed and never wake up.”
By CharlieAlphaBravo
May 21, 2008 4:09 PM | Link to this
Braveheart and BravesRule:
Wow, you guys really can’t take a joke, huh? Or, I guess, you can’t allow anyone else to take a joke.
For one, I was clearly complimenting N8 on his prose. Okay, maybe not clearly, but I’m sure he focused on the positive parts of my post.
And I’d like BH to clarify which part of me ragging on those guys for mind-numbingly long posts has anything to do with kissing up to DOB… You’re right, I should blindly disagree with him constantly, even when logic and reality aren’t on my side. To be honest, I think your irrational man-crush is getting the better of you.
nolie’s post was indeed a transferred article on second examination, but I still didn’t have an hour to kill to read it. I probably would have apologized to nolie if he/she wasn’t too busy whining about the mental distress caused by Dr. Seuss and I.
I’ll admit it, that Seuss is a total bast@rd (and Dr. S has a sense of humor, so I can say that)… But that rhyming post he made was one of the best I’ve read in a long time.
By RC
May 21, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this
Look, I’m not one saying that there should be any kind of “retaliation” for this…like Capt. Caveman pointed out, getting “knocked the f’ out” is punishment enough. But it was absolutely a dirty play by Church….he veered about 6 ft. from the bag, and then lowered his head and shoulder at the last second. I don’t think he even planned on sliding, but a knee to the head while running full speed will cause you slide, planned or not.
By Lew
May 21, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this
I think Church got exactly what he deserved. Hope Yunel is OK. That wasn’t even a borderline dirty play. The rule is that you’re supposed to be no more than arms length from the bag. Maybe he was, but he went straight for Yunel. There was no attempt made whatsoever to even grab for second base-he slid for Escobar, NOT the base. It was nowhere in his mind. That play was dirty-flat out.
By James
May 21, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
Ryan Church = Hater
BEAN HIM!
By A-ville Ranger
May 21, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this
Is there a reason the 2 best switch hitters are leading the majors in hitting ? I mean some change in pitching,managing,the ball,atmospheric pressure,the price of gas….anything ? I’m guessing it’s just 2 great hitters who got hot at the same time.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
Re: padres fire sale…
i read that they might go so far into rebuilding that even young might be available. id much rather have young than maddux, since it would be an investment beyond this year. he in a contract through 2011. it would take some pretty good position prospects.
they need infield and outfield guys, which we seem to have alot of, and they would most liekly want an arm or two as well.
of course, that is IF they go that far with the fire sale. they do have young under contract for three more years, but if they were looking to restock the farm….
By RC
May 21, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
N8 wrote: “Name me a major league manager (ANYBODY), that couldn’t have won with Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz and Chipper on his team for a decade.”
Umm….Dusty Baker? Simply because he’d have pitched them all for 350 innings a year for the first year and a half, and they would have all been out of baseball after that. And he’d have pitched Chipper at least 280 innings his first season…
By AdirondackDave
May 21, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
Man, I would like to see the Braves pick up Maddux for his last year or two. Smoltz coming in to save a few Glavine and Maddux games would be great.
By Random
May 21, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
TURTSNAP*—
The Angels’ Darrin Erstad went in hard on Johnny Estrada, not McCann.
It seemed to me that Estrada never really recovered from that play the whole rest of the season (I think it was 2005, his last with the Braves).
Amen to MikeC — Mike Jacobs needs a little come-uppance, retributional-wise. We’ve got a few more games left with the Fish — it may still happen. (I wish.)
By N8
May 21, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this
CharlieAlphaBravo
I really didn’t take much offense by your post. I’d like to think none of what is directed at me is personal, since nobody REALLY knows anybody here. The rudest of things that I’ve said to people on here, are all in good fun.
If things typed on a blog offend somebody so much as to cause hurt feelings, and what not…..STAY OFF THE INTERNET. Some people are mean.
On a side note, even though my 4:08 post is “to” BA, it’s length was CLEARLY drawn out as to annoy you. (I’d put that little “smiley” face thing at the end of this post - but that might really upset BA)
By James
May 21, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this
N8, you don’t struggle to find words/sharing your opinion, eh?
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this
Thanks DAP
caught my own error. I knew santana was pitching in this series, but when Efrim posted this: Tonight’s game is big because Johan Santana could be pitching knowing his manager’s job is on the line if they lose tonight, i got kinda excited.
Busy work week DAP. Hope u understand. I appreciate your scarcasm, but when you do it every post and on mistakes, it gets a little annoying.
By Billy
May 21, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this
It wasn’t a dirty play, just really stupid by Church. There’s no need to retaliate since he got the raw end of the deal anyway.
Also, funny how there’s no Tex-bashing so far today…how fickle of everyone. You non-homers really should stick to your guns. Even though he got on base 7 out of 8 times yesterday, he’s still only batting .264. I can’t believe no one has jumped on him yet today. Regardless of his slow start, it seems that his reputation is still intact and is at least partially responsible for Chipper Jones’ hot start…it was pretty telling when the Mets opted to pitch to Chipper with first base open in the bottom of the 7th. And this came with a guy on deck that some bloggers would like to see moved to the six-hole in the order.
By ncscoots
May 21, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this
IF get to do their own retailiation, if desired; they don’t need pitchers to do it for them. You can always perform a tag a little high, as in about forehead high, or whistle a throw by, about ear-high. That’s not dirty play, either; that’s baseball.
Just because Church is an OF doesn’t mean Escobar (or Kelly, or Chipper, for that matter, in his stead) won’t get a chance for a little payback, if they think it’s needed. And it won’t be nearly as obvious as a brushback pitch, thus a little more deadly in intent and delivery.
By James
May 21, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
DOB, where are you?! WE NEED AN UPDATE ON ESCO ASAP!
By AdirondackDave
May 21, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
Man, I would like to see the Braves pick up Maddux for his last year or two. Smoltz coming in to save a few Glavine and Maddux games would be great.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
has a new trend started on the blog, where we pretend some one is talking to us as we type? whats that? i did it just now?
hey, that was fun.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this
Kinda reminds me a little of the Angels player, I believe it was Erstad when he went in hard to McCann. TURNSNAP
Erstad went hard into Estrada, which made the Braves call up McCann. That was a very dirty play, too. (I cann still remember Eddie Perez staring down Erstad as the event unfolded.) Similar it was, but I think Estrada got hit worse than Escobar.
McCann got run over by Eric Byrnes in 2006 (oddly enough, the date was May 20), but that play wasn’t “dirty”—it was an accident. Eric almost tossed his cookies after that one!
What are the chances of the Braves facing Haren in the Arizona series? The last time the Braves faced him was June 10, 2005…
…(No, this doesn’t happen to you? Well, humor me anyway). DOB
Happens to me…sort of. I get hooked on a certain Playlist on my ‘Pod, and forget about “this one or that one for a while”.
22oz—
Something weird happened on my end, too, with the last blog. The “Post a comment” thingy disappeared! Very strange…
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 21, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
I wonder if B. Pena and a solid minor league prospect would be enough to get Maddux?
By Charlie
May 21, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this
DAP,
Thanks for the input. I just keep hearing about “all of the possibilities” and it makes me wonder. While I would love to see Maddux retire with Glavine and Smoltz in Atlanta, I agree that we would be better served with younger players.
I just don’t know what we would have to give up for Young. Might be mortgaging the future at interest rates that they can’t afford.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this
Random—
Yeah, Johnny never was quite himself after that play (it was 2005, his last year with the Braves).
Kind of a bummer that McCann basically stole the guy’s job because he got run over, but that’s baseball, I guess…
By DAP
May 21, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this
bobby’s cox yeah, man i saw that after i posted mine. all in good fun, blog buddy.
I appreciate your scarcasm, but when you do it every post and on mistakes, it gets a little annoying.
good thing i dont do that, then! :-)
By Tom in NYC
May 21, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this
Count me in as another who is a big believer on making the pitcher work, taking pitches, fouling off tough pitches, and basically getting a starter out of the game after 5 innings.
As someone pointed out, the Red Sox do this. The Yankees when they went on their run from 96 to 00 were great at doing this as well.
Of course, it all comes back to pitching, which we are getting right now from our starters AND bullpen. The starters are keeping us in the game, so if we are able to push starters out of the game early and attack the soft underbelly of teams bullpens, this is a great formula to win games.
On the other hand, our hitting coach wasn’t exactly Mr. Patience in his time…..
By Chop Chop
May 21, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this
Lew,
Might as well watch this video clip. No way in hell was that a dirty play. I don’t like the Mets, but Church did nothing on that play. He didn’t make an attempt to grab Yunel. He was most certainly in the base line (his hand is not outstretched when he hits the ground and it is still within a foot of the bag). Yunel did his job and just so happened to knee Church in the head. If Church had had any sense, he would have stayed on his feet to make the throw more difficult. He paid the price for his awkwardness.
I just chalk that one up to a good ol’ “s** happens”, but I hope we see some beanballs the next couple of games just for the hell of it. We need a good brawl with the Mets.
By James
May 21, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this
NCSCOOTS, I like where your head is at. That’s all well and good, but tell me you wouldn’t like to see a brawl between our boys and those poor excuses for human beings that are sometimes referred to as the NY Mets? I bet you Hoss would bust out with some knun chucks (spelling?)…
By RC
May 21, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this
I really doubt that there will be much chance for retailiation tonight anyway, since I’d be shocked if Church is playing. If he does, the Mets team doctor should be fired for malpractice. The best way for the Braves to get even is to win 2 more.
By James
May 21, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this
The prospect would have to be very solid. What about Flowers, Pena, and Chuckie?
By James
May 21, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this
ROBERT (CHIPPER IS THE BEST)
The prospect would have to be very solid. What about Flowers, Pena, and Chuckie?
By BamaBrave
May 21, 2008 4:37 PM | Link to this
The only thing that would make this Met Meltdown any sweeter, would be if Bobby Valentine was still the manager. Man, did I love to hate that guy…
Fingers crossed for Esco…
By Daybed Wagmoe
May 21, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this
James — I think that any consequences necessary for the Esco/Church incident took care of themself when Church got concussed. When you slide like he did — on your knees, leaving your head three or four feet in the air — then there are natural consequences, like being exposed to the ball (which just missed his head) or getting clocked in the head by the shortstop’s knee.
Now, if Church had all-out tried to take Escobar out or tried to knock him over, then I’d say that retaliation is something to think about. But the play wasn’t dirty, and he got hurt in the end as well.
By BA
May 21, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this
n8, nice post(I actually mean that _hole) and I’ll answer your Cox question- in the middle of the night, when I have time for my mistress baseballreference.com). Boyer needs to lay off that stupid curve, for certain. Got to plead ignorance on the Chiefs, for the most part. But I will say that football players seem to age(and blow up like Oprah) overnight. You know, comparing football and baseball; it’s too hard for dumb ‘ole me. As far as a roster filled with “great” players since ‘91…was the Lemer a “great” player? What about Belliard? Robert Fick? Was (when)Sid(slid) Bream a great player? Roberto Kelly? KERRY LIGHTENBURG?! I’ll be back…
By OrlandoFan
May 21, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this
Jonathan, thanks for posting that video clip. I hadn’t seen the entire play (and didn’t see the earlier one mentioned). Very, very close to being even worse than it was. Esco’s throw barely — inches — missed Church’s head. And at that range, it might have killed him. Someone suggested Church was peeling off…no way. The guy was taking out the pivot to try to extend the game on its final out. He went it too high and wide, yes. He would have been called for interference had the throw been lame, I’m betting. Going in wide and legs up is one thing, but he went in wide and high. Obviously, the Braves didn’t show any signs of anger about that (not yet, anyway). Will be curious if they do. Chipper was right there watching over the treatment of Church. Anyway, an awful sort of freak play that probably could have been worse but more easily could have been avoided with a low-and-hard slide rather than a high, body-block-type slide.
N8s post is a very good one about the Braves success and the qeustions still out there (N8, don’t forget Andruw among the players that carried the team for years).
If Tex and Frenchie starts to hit, more reality-based pitching won’t matter. The club will outscore most clubs. They play good defense.
The pitching will even out. Don’t look for Campillo to have a Jorge Sosa-type year. If he does, that would catapult this team to the divisional title for sure.
I think the weekend series with the Dbacks — facing 3 of their best pitchers — and the ensuing road trip will be more defining than the recent success (20-12) and spectacular pitching.
Those will show if this is cyclical or sustainable.
By Sammy Kershaw
May 21, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
Pena and a “solid minor league prospect” would be insane to give up for Maddux
By James
May 21, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
RC, if we are going to retaliate, why make it as obvious as hitting Church? Go for the face of their franchise. Jair should beam Reyes with the first pitch of the game. Just in case, as a preemptive precautionary measure, Bobby should warm up Bennett. That way he can pitch when Jurrgens gets tossed.
By RC
May 21, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
Robert,
Pena and a prospect might be enough for Maddux, but keep in mind that he’s making $10 million this year, and hasn’t pitched that well away from Petco. I’d love to see him back as much as the next fan, but I think for the price he’d cost (prospects and cash) we’d be better off getting someone else. Maddux is a 5 inning pitcher at this point.
By Michael Scharff
May 21, 2008 4:42 PM | Link to this
DOB - First, I liked the House season finale. It let you know that Cuddy still really cares about her main trouble maker. It also leaves you wondering, since House woke up but didn’t utter a line of dialog, how impaired he may or may not be. Music-wise, I’m not sure how old school you are, but I just picked up the Brand New Simon and Garfunkle 1969 Concert recording yesterday - Wow! The gents were in amazing voice, and they were performing for the first time cuts from Bridge Over Troubled Water. I highly recommend it.
By James
May 21, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this
Daybed Wagmoe, you can argue all day that the play wasn’t dirty, but I still think it is. Kind of pointless, eh? I think one thing, you think another. Anybody with umping experience have an opinion? If so, cite your experience and then give your opinion. Maybe even include how you’d have called it (i.e., let it go or call it interference).
For everyone: I am not condoning a fight here. Just a little retaliation. Just a little message. That’s it.
By Cecil34
May 21, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this
Escobar is definately a bat you don’t want to lose, because it should be obvious to everyone that since he was moved to lead-off, the Braves have really picked it up.
And what defense he has displayed!
If he can play and be close to 100%, then I feel that the Braves can sweep these suckers.
Willie Randolph was a Yank - has no business managing the Mess anyway. That is a contradiction in my mind.
You get the feeling as I did last night that the Braves are turning that corner and the engine is starting to run on all cylinders. (I won’t whip out anymore Nascar phrases on you)
The next road trip will tell that tale for sure.
That is why Escobar has to be there - otherwise it messes up the good mojo building….
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 21, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this
James, I think Chuck James would be a very good trade piece for Maddux. I think Chuck could actually thrive pitching in that park in San Diego.
By BA
May 21, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this
CharlieAlpha…your posts complaining about long posts are too long. Even my post about your too long posts that complain about long posts is, in fact, too long.
By ncscoots
May 21, 2008 4:49 PM | Link to this
James, I dunno, man…I learned long ago that all punk-whippin’s really accomplish is making your hands bleed, but not much else. Brawl with your equals, if you must, but best to ignore the lessers.
Some poster earlier said it best, best revenge is to win two more. Then ignore ‘em when they hit the bus.
By CharlieAlphaBravo
May 21, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this
Touche N8, touche…
By Gary
May 21, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this
Great day yesterday for the good guys and lets hope they keep it up tonight with Jair on the mound. Hope Escobar is doing better today and that Church is holding up ok as well.
On another note and since I cannot post anymore on last nights blog, I want to send out a congrats to everyones favorite Marlin fan ManofTeal. He called me out last night after the Marlins beat my former high school classmate Micah Owings and the D-Backs. Congrats on the win Teal, but I will be really impressed if they beat Webb and Haren over the next two days. Also, like my Braves, your Marlins need to learn how to beat the lesser teams because they count too. Losing 5 out of 6 against the Reds and Royals is not good for a contender or a team who thinks they can contend.
By ernesto
May 21, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this
How scary is that DBacks pitching staff by the way?
That’s a hell of a rotation.
Watching the NYC feed last night, they didn’t show ESCO being helped off and didn’t do replays - but from looking at the replay it was worse than it looked Live.
It sure does look like Church was trying to put a body on Esco - no doubt about it.
Can’t recall the Braves ever retaliating about something that happened in another game though.
I remember that time Glavine ever so softly plunked Murph though - too bad they didn’t have the radar gun on that pitch…35 mph?
By dack jerrick
May 21, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this
Church went in high twice on Escobar. Two Braves’ hitters were drilled by fastballs. This is a line in the sand to Atlanta from the Mets to see if the Braves can be intimidated. First time the Braves have a three-run lead and two outs, the Met in the batters box must be drilled! This is baseball the way it has always been played. If the Braves don’t do it, they want win anything.
By brian
May 21, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this
we are not going to get young in a trade. The price tag I am sure would be Lillebridge, Hernandez or Schafer, and Hansen/Rohrbaugh (sp). They would ask for top prospects - not pena and Chuck James
By OrlandoFan
May 21, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this
James: I don’t think I’ve seen the word “beam” used like that in many a year. Takes me back to my childhood when people would say that.
By RC
May 21, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this
How about this for retaliation: for the game tonight, have the AV guys draw fake mustaches on the Met’s player pictures that are shown on the big screen when they are batting. That would would be more effective than throwing at a hitter, and would give the fans a good laugh.
Also, I am VERY interested in how we do in this weekend series against the D-Backs. All three pitchers are guys who have OWNED the Braves in recent years (Johnson, Owings, and Webb). The scary thing for me is that if this team is going to have any chance to get to the World Series, I’d be willing to bet they’ll have to go through the D-Backs to do it. This weekend should show how whether we are in a similar class, or still have some catching up to do.
By deb
May 21, 2008 4:58 PM | Link to this
I haven’t really followed baseball this year….But Dwight Yoakam kicks a— , he was by far the very best thing about the Stagecoach Festival this year. And I will see Black Rebel Motorcycle Club in a couple of weeks, I’ve never seen them live , can’t wait. So Kudos to you for your stellar taste in music.
By Bud Brewer
May 21, 2008 4:58 PM | Link to this
I don’t see us trading for Maddog. I would love to have him but at 10 million,I just don’t see Wren going that route.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 4:59 PM | Link to this
BravesRule,
I take offense to your post calling me ignorant. I found his post funny and all of a sudden I’m ignorant? That makes sense
By brian
May 21, 2008 5:02 PM | Link to this
on ESPN.com
ATLANTA — Atlanta Braves shortstop Yunel Escobar and New York Mets outfielder Ryan Church were held out of the starting lineups Wednesday night after the two were involved in a collision Tuesday night.
Omar Infante was in the Braves’ lineup at shortstop. Endy Chavez was listed as the Mets’ starter in right field.
Escobar’s right knee was heavily wrapped and Church was taken to Piedmont Hospital with a mild concussion following their collision on the final play Tuesday night.
While turning a double play at second base, Escobar’s knee struck Church in the head as Church slid toward the shortstop.
Church was face down for several minutes before leaving the field with a mark on his forehead. Escobar needed assistance getting to the dugout.
Church said a CAT scan at the Atlanta hospital was normal. The Mets wanted the tests because Church also suffered a concussion in a spring training game on March 1.
Church, listed by the team as day-to-day, said he’d be available if needed on Wednesday night.
“I’d do it all over again,” Church said of his slide. “I was trying to break the double play up.”
Braves manager Bobby Cox said Escobar “is going to be fine.”
By pfunkatl2
May 21, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this
ESCO is a STRAIGHT-UP STUD! Took a bad slide not once but TWICE and got the DP. I really hope he is not hurt too bad…saw the game last night and been looking for an update since. I heard sum scouts say he needs to lose his “cuban attitude”…PLEASE DON’T. Those are PROBABLY the same scouts that said he would flame out quickly this year and go QUIETLY back to the minors. I LOVE his awareness and gamesmanship and “NO DL” attitude. The FIND of the decade(so far) for the home bois. Hang in there Yuni…like anyone could CONVINCE you NOT to!!!
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this
I was one of the people on the Maddux bandwagon but that was assuming Bennett/Campillo wouldn’t adequately fill the last remaining spot in the roation. But with the way everyone’s been throwing lately(staff and bullpen), there’s no need for a pitcher right now. Of course Reyes could struggle with inconsistency again and hitters could figure out Campillo’s junk so it’s something that bears watching. But we shouldn’t make a trade just to make a trade.
Btw, DOB, it was a great last two episodes to House. I’m a HUGE fan of the show. Amber’s death is yet another reason for House to be miserable. Is he impaired? With her death change him? What happens to “#13?” It set up another fantastic season of the show
By BBFCFM
May 21, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this
No way the Pads get 2 of our top prospects for Maddux. I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say that they have invested too much in Schafer to let him depart in a deal - unless itwas for a much better pitcher (in the prime of his career type of ting). I totally see lil bridge getting traded, perhaps Hernandez. But I bet they are looking at ol Gorks a little harder now that Schaffer got into trouble. I just can’t see them trading Hansen or Rohrbaugh for a pitcher however. Especially since it looks like we’re getting burned in the tex trade with Harrison coming of age. what would they trade, you ask? no more than one of those guys in a deal for a stopgap pitcher for this year i would bet. but then again, I dont work here.
And, after seeing the “play” again, Church was ridin durrty and got caught..upside ya head! Retaliation was already given in the form of a KO and a loss. doesnt sound like we need to do anymore unless those mutts try getting fresh again
By N8
May 21, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this
DAP
Your 4:26 was GREAT. What’s that? Oh…thank you. Your hair looks good too.
BA
“n8, nice post(I actually mean that _hole) and I’ll answer your Cox question- in the middle of the night, when I have time for my mistress baseballreference.com)”
Which part do you mean? That it was a nice post, or the _hole part?
‘Boyer needs to lay off that stupid curve, for certain.”
Couldn’t agree more. Though it is a thing of beauty with it’s 12-6 drop (that is if hitters lay off of it).
“Got to plead ignorance on the Chiefs, for the most part. But I will say that football players seem to age(and blow up like Oprah) overnight. You know, comparing football and baseball; it’s too hard for dumb ‘ole me.”
It was a bad reference anyhow. The 2003 Chiefs weren’t as good as their record showed. But that’s a different story.
“As far as a roster filled with “great” players since ‘91…was the Lemer a “great” player? What about Belliard? Robert Fick? Was (when)Sid(slid) Bream a great player? Roberto Kelly? KERRY LIGHTENBURG?! I’ll be back…”
The Lemer might not be in the HOF, but he was OUTSTANDING defensively and did EVERY little thing you could ask of a player.
Same with Belliard. He was the consummate “no-hit/all defense” player that gobbled up (thus the Skip given nick-name of PAC-MAN), everything hit his way, and gave stability to a position that was manned by Andres Thomas and his 68 errors over 3 seasons from 88-90 (only 72 games in 1990 and still had 10 errors). Belliard had only 18 errors in 1991.
Robert Fick. Can’t defend that guy. But he was “stop-gap” to LaRoche anyhow, just like Kotsay was supposed to be for Shafer.
Bream? Seriously. The guy couldn’t run anymore, and surely wasn’t a great hitter at that point.
But the free agent additions of TP, Belliard AND Bream brought defense to the table, which is a HUGE part of the “pitching, defense and the 3 Run-HR” style that Bobby manages with.
Those three guys replaced Presley, Blauser/Thomas and allowed Justice to STAY in RF, where he had moved once Murphy was traded. Since Nick Esasky only lasted 9 games at 1B that year. Sorry. Had to mention him.
Ligtenberg? Bullpen guys don’t count. EVERY year on EVERY team (that might be exaggerating), there seems to be a reliever that exceeds expectations.
I’ll be gone this evening so I’m sure we’ll go round and round later tonight.
By Nick
May 21, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this
I don’t think we’d have to give up anyone decent like Chuck to get Maddux.
He’s making $10 million, it’d be a pure salary dump on the Padres part.
By BBFCFM
May 21, 2008 5:21 PM | Link to this
an another note, looks like it’s shaping up to be a hell of a year on the old Braves Blog fantasy baseball. especially when you consider 2nd-6th place is separated by 2.5 points. If it weren’t for Atlanta Austin’s ridiculous lead, i might be in first. Especially when you consider that he has made 0 moves. and I have made 23
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this
Gotta agree with Captain Caveman here.
It was a dangerous play by Church obviously, VERY LATE slide following escobar off the bag, but it was a baseball play. If he breaks up the double play, there’s 2 on with 2 out, and the Muts are 1 baserunner away from bringin the tying run to the plate.
No one’s mentioned the way Church’s head hit the infield dirt after he took Esco’s knee to the forehead. It was a double whammy and the way his neck bent looked scary.
There should be no retaliation, but the next time a Mut goes in high at 2B like that at our 2nd best player, he should get the ball between the eyes.
By Brisket
May 21, 2008 5:25 PM | Link to this
110th?
By Lew
May 21, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this
ChopChop-Dude, go read the Official Rules of Baseball, Rule 7.08b. It states that contact with the bag be maintained or both runner and batter can be called out. It was a moot point last night, because the batter was out anyway, ending the game.
Church never even made an attempt to make contact with the base-only Yunel. It could and would have been called had it not been a moot point. Watch the video again. He went only for Escobar, hence an illegal play. Just because he COULD have touched the bag is immaterial-he never tried to.
The proper retaliation should be to dump their second baseman (or shortstop) on his butt on a similar play-maintaining contact with the base.
By Daybed Wagmoe
May 21, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this
James — you’re right, it may be best just to agree to disagree. You can think whatever you want, I’ll think whatever I want.
But ask yourself this: why would he purposely sacrifice his HEAD in a dirty play? That’s just dumb, and I don’t think that Ryan Church is dumb. I mean, he’s playing for the Mets, which automatically bring his IQ down a little, but not that much.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 5:29 PM | Link to this
Nick,
I don’t know why the Padres would want James anyway. Besides the fact he has little value right now, the Padres need bats. Bryan Pena, Gregor Blanco, Brandon Jones, Brent Lillibridge, Martin Prado, Josh Anderson, etc. Look at some of our blocked bats would could go to San Diego and start immediately.
By chris
May 21, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this
BA: Uh,no. The moron would be the one who doesn’t understand the difference between “to” and “too”.
By BA
May 21, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
Too bad “Chris” is a girl’s name. Maybe you should go read TMZ or something that’s easier for you too follow. If it’s too hard for you too understand something, doesn’t that mean YOU are the moron?
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 21, 2008 5:37 PM | Link to this
I wonder what the chances are that Brandon Jones comes up this year and takes over full time in left field if he continues doing well in Richmond?
By Lew
May 21, 2008 5:38 PM | Link to this
Daybed-You’re assuming that he thought about it at all. I guarantee the only thing in his head was to break up the double play or they lose.
By keylargo
May 21, 2008 5:39 PM | Link to this
San Diego will finish under .500 and maybe in last place with or without Maddux. Only difference is how much of his $10M salary they want to continue to pay. I think Pena or something close will be all it will take as the trade deadline approaches (July 31). And I think he would be a valuable asset for the team. He is a winner.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this
Escobar’s knee is sore and he’s not playing tonight, but it’s not a DL thing. He hopes to play tomorrow, but probably will miss a couple of games.
Cox said doc checked it out last night and it was stable.
Both Escobar and Cox thought Church came in late and that Escobar had no way to avoid the collision, but Escobar wasn’t upset, said he’s used to hard slides in Cuba, and this is a division rivalary, all that.
Bobby said Church needs to learn to come in lower, and said he thought the slide was very late, when he was almost even with the bag.
Church has a lump on his head and had a “mild” concussion, but not DL for him and he hopes to play tomorrow.
Infante’s playing SS and leading off for Braves.
Also, Smoltz is throwing in bullpen right now, second day in a row. Told Cox he felt really good yesterday in bullpen session, and Bobby said it was best he’s seen Smolt throw in a long time.
Even Bobby didn’t know he was throwing again today, though, at least not when we talked to Bobby a half hour ago.
Oh, and Campillo is on for Saturday. That’s official.
By huh?
May 21, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this
I received this email earlier. Does this mean anything to anyone? Maybe explain the blog mystery … ?
Today, we have received several calls reporting slowness with our systems. We have investigated the situation and received confirmation from our co-location provider, xxxxxxxx, that eight Level 3 backbone circuits representing approximately 60 Gigabits of Internet capacity in Chicago became non-functional sometime this morning. Level 3 is a very high capacity Internet transit provider for many carriers and ISPs and this outage is likely effecting much of the Internet traffic across the country. We will certainly continue to monitor this issue but at this time there is no action that can be taken by xxxxxxxxxxxx or our providers to resolve the problem.
Talk about an epic post :-), I would have settled for the internet is slow.
Go Braves.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 5:43 PM | Link to this
By the way, Smoltz is throwing mostly from a three-quarter style angle, which Bobby said he discovered he could use without pain yesterday. Dropping down a bit with the arm slot made that much difference, apparently.
By MGL
May 21, 2008 5:44 PM | Link to this
I’m with Lew on the play last night. If you slow down the replay to almost frame by frame, it is clear that Church is going after Esobar, not the bag. Watch closely and you will see Church turn his shoulder to Escobar to block him. Daybed, I’m sure he did not think he was sacrificing his head. He also had to know that Escobar had already toed the bag so he was out. He was trying to block the throw to first.
By Robin
May 21, 2008 5:48 PM | Link to this
On the first DP, Church used his arm to take out Esco. he got away with one. Typical “Chruch” behavior considering his well-documented attitude problem. The game-ending play? Karma’s a b*h.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 21, 2008 5:48 PM | Link to this
If Cox acknowledged that he felt Church went in “late” and Church said he would “do it again” then I think some retalliation may be in store. I bet Church doesn’t play tomorrow either.
By 3Pitch
May 21, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
We do not need a return of Greg Maddux. The Braves already have more pitchers than they have spots for as it is. What happens if Hampton gets healthy? Or Chuck James? Not to mention there are now too many relievers once they all get healthy. Plus there is Charley Morton at Richmond that should be up sometimes this year. Maddux needs to retire a Padre or whatever team team he happens to be with at time.
By Blauser " The Bud Man"
May 21, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
N8,
I’m not disagreeing with a majority of your post, but Belliard never truly “replaced” Blauser at SS. Yes, he was a defensive replacement in many games, but Blauser was an All-Star in ‘93 and ‘97.
By keylargo
May 21, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this
Bobby’s Cox
I agree with you and Captain Caveman on your 5:24 post. I hit a runner once upon a time and the second best (hitting the jackass was first) thing that happened was the runner was out on interference, completing the DP.
By DAP
May 21, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this
N8 haha! i love it! its my new favorite thing. oh, yours too? awesome!
By Chop Chop
May 21, 2008 6:09 PM | Link to this
Lew,
As you mentioned, the rule you stated had nothing to do with that situation. Escobar completed the play, but I still say Escobar hit Church a good five to six feet before the bag. Church would have needed a poll (Jimmy Smith reference. I need some pie. Holy Cornelia!) to reach the bag from there. If Escobar hadn’t completed the double play, maybe the ump would have seen it your way.
Anyway, since Feliciano hit two of our guys, we should hit a couple of them tonight.
And for anyone suggesting that we go in a little harder at second base tonight as a message, well, we should be doing that every night, dammit. That’s just good baseball.
By radoncbravesfan
May 21, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this
Escobar was trying to leap over Church. Church went after him, no doubt. That’s baseball. I agree nothing needs to be done but tonight could be interesting depending on what develops. Frankly, right now the Mets are not looking like they have the cojones for a fight.
By N8
May 21, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this
DOB
On the Buck and Kincade show yesterday, Boog was on and said that Smoltz mentioned that he could pitch now if went completely sidearm (which many have said is much more “natural”), but Smoltz didn’t wanna do that. Didn’t sound like Bobby did either.
Wouldn’t that be hilarious if he came back and got 20 saves by going a “Tekulve” on the NL hitters?
My guess is that were gonna see some side arm dandies once he does take the mound.
Blauser ” The Bud Man”
“I’m not disagreeing with a majority of your post, but Belliard never truly “replaced” Blauser at SS. Yes, he was a defensive replacement in many games, but Blauser was an All-Star in ‘93 and ‘97.”
In 1991, Blauser played in 74 games at SS, 28 games as 2B (don’t forget Treadway was the 2B to start the season - Lemke later took over), and 16 games at 3B, compiling 352 total AB’s.
Belliard played in 126 games at SS and had 353 AB’s for the year. Blauser is listed as having started 90 games “somewhere” in 1991. Belliard started 110 games at SS. Which means that not all 74 appearances at SS by Blauser in 91, were starts.
In 1992, baseball-reference.com has BOTH of them listed as starting 90 games (at various positions).
But you’re right. From 1993 on, it was Blauser’s job. Yet ironically, the 1995 WS was one without Blauser being active. I’ve mentioned it before, the first out recorded in the top of the 9th in the clinching game six, was a FANTASTIC running play in the bullpen by Belliard off the bat of Lofton.
I don’t wanna think about how the outcome of that game (and series) changes, if Lofton leads of that 9th inning with a hit.
Belliard’s defense played a role in that 95 post-season.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 6:14 PM | Link to this
HAPPY BIRTHDAY, BOBBY!!!!
By JC FROM UT
May 21, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this
DOB: If he comes available would the Braves have any interest in Paul Byrd? Also IYO will FW try to open contract talks with Boras concerning Tex as we get closer to the trade deadline? If no extention is worked out do you think Tex will be shopped?
By BravesFanInRockies
May 21, 2008 6:37 PM | Link to this
The way Jorge pitched I’m not sure why you’d want Paul Byrd. They’re awfully similar (except that Jorge doesn’t occasionally use that Satchel Paige windup) and of course Jorge’s a lot younger and a lot cheaper.
Kudos to McDowell; I’ve liked him from the start but he’s really sold me.
By 18 Wheels of Love
May 21, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this
PERFECT TIMING - to the tune of Perfect Timing
*With all due respect to The Drive-By Truckers
Here we go again, perfect timing,
Chipper’s swingin’ and the pen is firing
I used to like that guy Francoeur,
until he stopped performing
now I tolerate him all game long
Out in the bullpen, I see the changin’
Those young and retread pitchers,
you always see too often,
looking through those bullpen doors
at their teammates playin’ hard,
icing over that bum shoulder acting up
I might have played before
if I’d got this good before I thought
I got too old to give a damn
Those dudes you see warmup at night
do their best to bow out right
trying hard to live the blown saves down
Here we go again, perfect timing,
Chipper’s swingin’ and the pen is firing
I used to like that guy Francoeur,
until he stopped performing
now I tolerate him all game long
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 6:40 PM | Link to this
JC FROM UTAH: As I’ve said many times, in my opinion I don’t believe there is any conceivable scenario in which the Braves would trade Mark Teixeira in July unless they were hopelessly out of the playoff race. No other way it would happen.
You don’t trade a heart-of-the-order hitter in the middle of a playoff race, not without getting a similar hitter in return.
By Chop Chop
May 21, 2008 6:42 PM | Link to this
Rule 7.08(b)
Comment: A runner who is adjudged to have hindered a fielder who is attempting to make a play on a batted ball is out whether it was intentional or not.
If, however, the runner has contact with a legally occupied base when he hinders the fielder, he shall not be called out unless, in the umpire’s judgment, such hindrance, whether it occurs on fair or foul territory, is intentional.
If the umpire declares the hindrance intentional, the following penalty shall apply: With less than two out, the umpire shall declare both the runner and batter out. With two out, the umpire shall declare the batter out.
(Okay. After reading the italicized part of this rule, it makes me wonder why any player would ever go hard into second base. After all, he’d be hindering the fielder attempting to make a throw…and it would always be a double play with less than two outs. What’s the point? Ohhhh, yeah…I guess umps have the freedom to adjudge however they see fit to adjudge, huh?)
Lew, you were right. I stand corrected.
By Daybed Wagmoe
May 21, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this
Lew — I agree with you that for Church, it was either break up the DP or lose for sure. Breaking up the DP was the only thing to prevent losing at that moment.
“Dirty play” sounds, to me, like it was intentional/premeditated/whatever and thus, he would’ve had to think about it. On second thought, I could be wrong about that. Who really cares though?
I just hope that Jurrjens keeps up his good work and Pelfrey pitches like a right-handed version of Chuck James tonight!
By McFann
May 21, 2008 6:46 PM | Link to this
18 WOL
I don’t know the tune, but that’s a good one!!
By TennesseePaul
May 21, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this
DOB: Awesome news about Escobar and Smoltz. I hope the new arm angle for Smoltz works out well without hurting his elbow any. I’d love to find out it works out so well he goes back to starting. But I’ll be happy just to see him back whatever the capacity.
Missed the last few days so I caught up. Psychedelic Furs were a great group from the 80’s. Loved the double header sweep yesterday. Glad Francoeur got to sit for a game and the team still won. And I’m bummed Yunel is banged up but I hope he gets better soon and I’m glad it’s not that serious.
This team is hanging in there pretty well. If only they could do this on the road.
Chipper is in another rut. Last time he was 1 for 11. Now he’s 4 for 15 in his last 4 games, though he has been trending upward. I’d like to see that trend continue with a little more power.
Go Braves!!
By Dr. Seuss
May 21, 2008 6:58 PM | Link to this
Nolie & Braves Rule, I got the wrong end of the stick. I apologize.
By Deep Throat
May 21, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this
Kelly Johnson and Gregor Blanco both playing today and Bobby puts the guy with the career .298 OBP in the leadoff spot.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 7:07 PM | Link to this
For those that dont like RESOP:
Last 9 2/3 IP:
RESOP 1.89 ERA
BOYER 2.79 ERA
Im not a Resop fan, but he deserve a chance before his gets hanged. Good numbers last 3-4 weeks.
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 7:07 PM | Link to this
Bobby is right. Church was going after escobar. He was a at the bag and still hadn’t committed to sliding yet. That little half turn he did at the bag was not a slide.
watch it here.
it was a darn good DP by escobar. he toed the bag with momentum moving out of the base path, threw around Church’s head and was still acrobatic enough to leap church. Too bad church didn’t slide you’re supposed to.
Even if he ws close enough to touch the base, that was a dirty play by Church. But, it was a lot less dirty than darrin erstad taking out estrada in 2005. I still feel if we had a healthy estrada that year, the braves would’ve played in the WS.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this
By the way, it’s Bobby’s 67th birthday.
By John Rocker
May 21, 2008 7:11 PM | Link to this
I ain’t got no problem with Willie Randolph.
By MADDOG?
May 21, 2008 7:11 PM | Link to this
DOB…… can we get MADDUX? Dont we want 2 see them together again? He is a 350 game winner after all. He could help us I know. Your thoughts????? Thanks.
By KC
May 21, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this
nscoots: Not to bring up the past, but… obviously, Bobby wasn’t saving Stockman or Resop for game 2. =)
Grinch and a few other people here feel quite passionately that Bobby has overworked the bullpen. I have not shared that opinion for the most part. I feel BC’s done what he’s had to do with the pieces he has. But I don’t feel that way about yesterday.
When you have a double-header, and a 5 run lead late in game-1… you HAVE to try and avoid using your set-up man and closer. Particularly Boyer, given the fact that he pitches in nearly every single game.
That was a situation where BC needed to try and rest those guys.
I thought Cox’s bullpen use was shameful yesterday, and as a result, if we’re ahead by only a run or two late tonight, those guys might not be available (or may not be effective if the DO pitch).
By McFann
May 21, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this
AAAAARRRGGGG!!!
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 7:22 PM | Link to this
Yunels injury is not such a big thing. I mean, it could be worse. We are in the drivers sit in this series. He could be back when DBacks get to town. Anyway, he needs some rest, cant play every day, specially this stretch of about 31 games in 31 days for the braves…. It weakens bench but its not something that is going to kill us. Tex is performing better and Infante is doing well, that might be enough.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 7:22 PM | Link to this
Forgot to mention this in the blog:
Matt Diaz is 6-for-38 with no extra-base hits and two RBI in his past 15 games.
This after that four-game stretch (April 21-24) when he went 8-for-16 with a homer and three RBI.
Other than that four-game stretch, for the rest of the season Diaz has hit .220 (22-for-100) with one double, one homer, 11 RBI, three walks and 25 strikeouts in 31 games.
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 7:24 PM | Link to this
Ok…not to bring up an old story, but i was researching that play with erstad and estrada. Here’s what that lying POS Erstad said:
As I round third, I see that the cutoff guy has the ball, so I look at home and the first thing I see is Johnny’s legs. And I see the plate between his legs. In your mind you see that and you think, I just want to meet him
Bull. Johnny gave him the plate.He barely had a toe on the plate. He was up the 1st base line receiving the relay from Giles. Erstad went out of his way to deliver that blow to Johnny’s head and would’ve been safe anyways sliding to the back of the plate.
That was the epitome of a dirty play, and the play last night was pretty close. Damn Church for making me think of this Erstad incident again. Bobby’s teams have never resorted to that bush league garbage.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 7:27 PM | Link to this
See what I mean about TEXs luck? he is coming back pretty soon.
By StingerSplash
May 21, 2008 7:33 PM | Link to this
DOB,
The DI from “Full Metal Jacket” was none other than former real life DI R. Lee Ermey, also notable for his portrayal of evangelist/huckster Jimmy Lee Farnsworth in “Fletch Lives,” also starring Julianne Phillips. Of all of Springsteen’s brilliance, that’s one decision (Patty Scialfa over Julianne Phillips) I’m not sure I get. And if the Braves take 3 of 4 from the Muts, will they be allowed to go home? Or will their fans just find them road and skin them alive? I mean, the Yankees looked bad last weekend and last night, but this Mets team is listless. And that’s fine by me.
By Great Defense
May 21, 2008 7:34 PM | Link to this
wow…nice play KJ…you all think Prado is scared at second base? that was ridiculous.
Way to go KJ.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 7:35 PM | Link to this
Im not going to say much about KJ, his glove does the speaking by itself. Horrible fielding.
By 18 Wheels of Love
May 21, 2008 7:35 PM | Link to this
Ever notice KJ drops a lot of balls? I mean a lot of balls.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 7:37 PM | Link to this
Kelly tries to tag Delgado too fast and misses the ball. He needs to know to at least get the force out with the bottom of the order coming up, and he’s also has the catch running, no need to hurry that. That mishap is all mental- no matter what position you play you still have to be aware of the situation before the play so I don’t want to hear about Kelly still being new to 2B.
As usual, JJ keeps his poise, though, and gets out of the jam.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 7:39 PM | Link to this
This guy infante is like jose oquendo, only a better hitter.
I hope Glenn Hubbard helps KJ more, he is not doing a good job, he could have cost us the game very early. Worst defensive player on the team, easily. Thats saying a lot.
By John Rocker
May 21, 2008 7:40 PM | Link to this
OK, everybody. They just showed that clip of McCann’s debut.
The dude has put on some weight, McFann. Obviously hasn’t slowed him down any.
One would have to actually have been fast to slow down.
Seriously, it doesn’t matter. The guy can hit. But he has put on some pounds.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
Eesh…I don’t like remembering those plays at the plate…
By Jeff321
May 21, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
I do recall Kelly Johnson playing left field and think he had a really good arm out there.. prior to TJ surgery. Is there a chance the Braves would move him back out there? Because hit bat is definitely needed in the lineup. Also, I vaguely recall KJ throwing some people out at the plate from left field.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 7:43 PM | Link to this
With Frenchy hitting the way he has, he should be sprinting to 1B right now.
In all seriousness, I hope he’s ok and it looks like he is.
By radoncbravesfan
May 21, 2008 7:44 PM | Link to this
wow same situation with runner on first when KJ missed the tag, this time he tried to tag the runner before he caught the ball needs some more work on that play with hubbard
By N8
May 21, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
“By the way, it’s Bobby’s 67th birthday”
Maybe Robert can have him over for a game of pin the tail on the…..
Never mind.
By Shamus Thacker
May 21, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
Fine journalism DOB, and a fine-azz song to match!
Sorry to hear about Escobar. Every game he misses is one less opportunity to see a legend first-hand.
By eric the elder
May 21, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
Do you folks think Delgado is washed up? Does he just need to get out of NY?
If/when Tex goes to a NY team, might we make a run at Delgado to replace him? Just wondering …
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this
Looks like KJ problems at the plat have been solved now that he is hitting at the bottom of the lineup. Now maybe he could concentrate more on his D. Hope thats the case. Come on Hubbard, help the kid.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this
Cox on Campillo, after watching a video of last night’s game this morning:
“It was unbelievable,” Cox said of the performance by Campillo. “Some of the curveballs he threw, and the changeups, and he threw that 86 mile-an-hour fastball by guys. That’s called the art of pitching. He was like [Greg] Maddux.”
By N8
May 21, 2008 7:52 PM | Link to this
Bobby’s Cox
Hey dude, don’t be ragging my home state’s boy, Erstad! Just kidding. I thought the play was dirty as well.
But many would say that it’s “football” mentality coming out, which is why he played such a fearless CF.
Remember, Erstad was part of Nebraska’s National Championship Team. What’s that? He was the punter?
Oh. Never mind.
It always kills me when baseball announcers talk about Erstad’s “football player” mentality. One could say that about Brian Jordan. He ACTUALLY was paid to tackle people.
Erstad was a punter in college football. Big difference.
That being said, I wish we would have signed Erstad in the off-season. He can play all three OF positions and 1B. He’s hitting .308 with 1 HR and 11 RBI off of Houston’s bench. Not bad.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this
Jeff321,
I think the Braves put too much time and effort training Kelly for 2B to move him back. With that being said, if he is moved, I believe it’d more likely be to 1B to replace Tex next year.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this
Who showed a clip off McCann’s debut?? What?? How did I miss that?? NOT FAIR!!
pounds? Yeah, well…like you said, he hasn’t slowed down any. And you’re right, he never was fast.
Quote from him after he came off the DL in 2006:
“I just can’t…well, I never could run, so it doesn’t matter.”
By BravesFanInRockies
May 21, 2008 7:59 PM | Link to this
FlaBrave,
Agreed on KJ. Highly unlikely he’ll go back to the OF. First base, however …
By McFann
May 21, 2008 8:00 PM | Link to this
‘Bout had it with REYES!!
That’s 31 stolen bases off the Macster, and counting (unwillingly).
By TJ
May 21, 2008 8:00 PM | Link to this
I liked Boog’s description of Church’s slide: (paraprhasing) - It wasn’t dirty; it wasn’t malicious; but it was irresponsible and dangerous. Guys are gonna get hurt if you play that way.
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
Looked to me that KJ wanted to turn 2 then got scared of colliding with Delgado as he turned his head & body, though i need a replay to say for sure.
Either way, that ball wasn’t hit too hard. FloridaBrave is right. He should’ve knew the situation and backed off, getting the out at 1st.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:04 PM | Link to this
Moises just realized it was past 8 o’clock. Bed time.
(OK, that was a cheap shot. And I like Mo. Known him since he was a Marlin. But he’s … well … getting old.)
By Deep Throat
May 21, 2008 8:05 PM | Link to this
Looks like KJ problems at the plat have been solved now that he is hitting at the bottom of the lineup
Oh my Lord. Joe Simpson syndrome strikes again.
Blanco strikes out a lot. Strikes out are not a big deal; with a few exceptions (Pujols), the best players now usually strike out a lot and the worst (Juan Pierre) hardly ever do. Going the other way is not a big deal. And finally: players’ hitting performances have NOTHING to do with where in the order they bat.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 8:06 PM | Link to this
I guess KJ does not have lots of fans, specially after while he is with the glove on.
Whatever.
Some thought about the NL east.
Phillies are in deep trouble. I dont think they will hold on much longer. Checking out numbers….Their bullpen is phenomenal, but their starting pitching is so bad, there is no bullpen that can help such a bad rotation.
Cole Hamels has a 2.61 ERA, but after him none of their other inning eaters has an ERA equal or lower than 4.75. And only myers has more than 50 IP. That aint good. They have only used 5 starters this year. Its not like the braves that have used like 8.
Offensively, the mets are doing very similar to them, but their SP is much better, but at the same time their bullpen sux.
I think braves are going to leave this teams in the dust by june 15th.
Write that down.
The fish will start losing pretty soon. The are a .515-520 team, so they are gonna stay behind.
By Jeff321
May 21, 2008 8:07 PM | Link to this
Thanks - FloridaBrave
With Tex going for the big bucks next year and his disappointing hitting stats so far, I don’t want him back next year. The Braves can fill the position from within. Plus, any trades should be for pitching, period. Oh, and NO WAY to Delgado! Sheesh, we might as well put Scott Thorman over there if thats the case!
By Fred Secunda
May 21, 2008 8:08 PM | Link to this
DOB and everyone else, I know it’s early, but what do you think the chances are of Kotsay playing in Atlanta in 2009?
By scottbravesfan
May 21, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this
Church is an idiot for that slide last night. He didn’t even get down and could have seriously injured himself and escobar.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:12 PM | Link to this
Brian McCann, doubles-hitting machine. Man, has he turned it up in the past month, or what?
By radoncbravesfan
May 21, 2008 8:13 PM | Link to this
BMac makes em pay !!
CLUTCH
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 8:14 PM | Link to this
That one was cruel DOB, but its OK, he is a met.
By Yars
May 21, 2008 8:15 PM | Link to this
Ever notice after a KJ mishap at 2B, the camera always cuts to Bobby & he always has a bemused look on his face! At least the Mets didn’t score in that inning.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 8:15 PM | Link to this
.314!! The elevator is on the rise!!
An RBI for each stolen base…
And his MLB leading doubles raised to 18!!
By keylargo
May 21, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this
DOB
How does JF hit in batting practice? His power just seems to have disappeared. It’s just gone. Oh, there it is!!
By radoncbravesfan
May 21, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this
FRENCHY is Back with a great at bat, triple off the wall
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this
Francoeur crushed that ball. Him and McCann both would have had homers in a majority of parks with those shots off the walls in the power alleys here, which are deeper than most.
Standup RBI triple for Francoeur. After two-run double by McCann. Braves up 3-1.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 8:20 PM | Link to this
I told my buddy Frenchy was going to get a hit after the first swing of the at-bat, when he fouled it straight back. Much better poise and balance at the plate with less movement.
Good job, Frenchy…
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:24 PM | Link to this
Moises Alou left game with cramp in his left leg.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 8:24 PM | Link to this
Fred Secunda I would extend Kotsays contract and deal some of the youngsters for SP. Say anderson or maybe BJ, I like Shafer better. Or maybe deal Diaz and call up anderson or BJ and extend kotsays contract. Very valuable guy. He loves playing in atlanta. Very solid player, I didnt know he was that solid. Good arm, good range, good speed, bats LH, good AVG. Veteran, good power for a CF that is more of a fast guy. What else could you ask for?
By eric the elder
May 21, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this
Jeff321: The Braves can fill the position from within.. .Oh, and NO WAY to Delgado! Sheesh
Okay, I respect that opinion. My question is who this player is that we can use to fill from within?
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this
Soriano threw one inning for Double-A Miss with one hit, one walk, one strikeout, 19 pitches. Said to have felt “fine.”
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this
Overlord,
Completely agree. I want to extend but at the same time Shafer should be ready to be our starting CF next year so I propose moving Kotsay to LF(Obviously, this plan will change if Shafer doesn’t get back on track).
Kotsay’s the type of player that you find on championship teams.
By McFann
May 21, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this
Sure has turned it up Chief—well, with the bat, anyway.
Please…Don’t let Reyes get on base anymore tonight!
By keylargo
May 21, 2008 8:40 PM | Link to this
McFann
I was thinking if McCann was a little faster, maybe he could lead the league in triples??? OK, maybe a lot faster…..8)
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this
eric the elder,
Not really any internal options unless we move Kelly Johnson or Mark Kotsay there. Canizares is a lackluster fielder, Kaaihue is struggling in AA, and Mejia and Freeman are still years away. So unless w emove one of the players already on roster, I think we’ll fill the spot outside the organization.
By TJ
May 21, 2008 8:43 PM | Link to this
Kotsay’s the type of player that you find on championship teams.
Absolutely. Whether he’s starting in CF, or the 4th OF, he’s just a good baseball player. (and he’s played a little 1B too…).
He is hitting pretty well ahead of his career stats. That might mean we should expect a little dropoff, or maybe just that he’s healthy and coming into a late prime.
By Braveheart
May 21, 2008 8:45 PM | Link to this
Charliealphabravo, you just ticked me off in that moment throwing three bloggers I respect under the bus. Thought you were using N8 to score brownie points. But, eff it, who cares? You’re a funny dude and a good blogger. Not that you or anyone cares what I think
Interesting opinion from a blogger over metsblog.com at the present moment that provides quite the contrast from what we usually see here (sorry CAB - kind of long):
That Castillo play is a PERFECT example of what is wrong with this team. Why didn’t Castillo make that play?.. - Not because he is old - Not because he is slow. - Not because he has no heart. - Not because he is injured. He didn’t make that play because he wasn’t positioned correctly on that 2 strike pitch. If Pelfrey is going to bang Tex outside with sliders and changeups, why is the 2nd baseman deeply shifted to play the pull when it’s a pitch intended to make a lefthanded hitter top it off and ground out more up the middle? NO WAY does Babe Ruth even pull that pitch hard into the hole. Castillo should have been positioned normally, and this inning should be over. It’ that’s simple.
Cox had Francouer positioned PERFECTLY in the RCF gap in game 1 yesterday when Delgado lined out on a ball that is usually a hard hit run scoring extra base gapper. Why be positioned there with a lefthanded power bat at the plate? b/c Francoeur knew the pitch Glavine was going to throw. And that’s the difference between managing well, and just ‘trusting your boys’. So when ANthony DeRosa says ridiculous things like “Willie doesnt bat. He doesn’t pitch. It’s not his fault.”. Guess what, AD? There is a perfect example for you. RIGHT THERE.
And that’s why Bobby Cox is Bobby Cox, and why Willie Randolph is talking about unfair treatment and racism.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:46 PM | Link to this
Did Pelfrey really think Chipper would let that straight, thigh-high fastball go past two times in a row?
Yard.
4-1.
Chipper ties Murph for 45th on all-time list with 398 homers.
By Fade
May 21, 2008 8:46 PM | Link to this
DOB
As I sit and watch the game tonight, I am curious, what kind of time do have left with Jurrjens? Meaning, does he have another year or two before the Braves concern themselves with signing him. Oh look at the Chip just went deep…
By Shamus Thacker
May 21, 2008 8:46 PM | Link to this
Great news about Soriano.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 8:50 PM | Link to this
Muts = CAPUT
By eric the elder
May 21, 2008 8:50 PM | Link to this
FloridaBrave, I agree completely. That’s why I asked the question. I thought maybe Jeff321 knows something I don’t.
By Jeff321
May 21, 2008 8:52 PM | Link to this
eric the elder
Well, in an ideal world I would move McCann to first and use Salty for catching duties. But, we gave Salty and quite a few others away for Tex, eh.. And I don’t want Thorman there either unless he’s learned how to hit around 270 or better. So, I’d like to see what else is in the pipeline or just use anyone over there thats competent. Btw, isn’t first base a relatively “easy” position to learn? With all that said, I do appreciate Tex’s defense a whole lot.
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this
Same ol’ Larry Wayne Jones Jr…
Watch out NL, because Tex is getting hot. (What about that baserunning by him? You often see players run around the bases while looking at the ball, even if it’s in the opposite direction of the base they’re running to. Tex kept looking at his coach. That’s something we have to teach kids to do)
Maybe that ‘day off’ for Francoeur is going to pay dividends. A triple and a single and 2 RBIS.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 8:57 PM | Link to this
Thanks for sharing, Bravehart. That’s definitely something I didn’t think of. But I’m also not sure Castillo charged that ball all that aggressively.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
Fade, Jurrjens doesn’t even have one full year of service time yet.
Won’t even be eligible for arbitration until after the 2010 season.
By keylargo
May 21, 2008 8:59 PM | Link to this
A hit batter could cause a brawl now.
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this
bases loaded no out in the 5th, sac fly to make it 5-1.
This team’s playing great ball. The hitters are being a lot more patient than they were earlier in the year and it’s paying off.
Maybe it’s from playing at home, but this home series looks much better than the home series’ earlier in the year. I think that’s going to translate to road wins sooner than later.
We’re giving it to this mets team.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 9:01 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, obviously that Mets fan has just bought into the NY media hype about Bobby Cox….
By Braveheart
May 21, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this
Here are some more excerpts from the Metsblog:
we all hate chipper but he is absolutely incredible. A hitting machine.
Chipper hits a hr. Oh well, at least he helps my fantasy team
WOW CHIPPER JONES… Great Player… This guy is just insane…..
See, down the middle they crucsh it. Down the middle to the Mets and its a popup.
That’s it….I think I might join my wife watching American Idol. I can’t believe I just typed that.
I hate Chipper Jones so so so much. I don’t even think there are enough words in the english language to describe how much i hate him.
F.U. LARRY
if wright ever has a career like chipper;s i’ll be more than happy but Chipper doesn’t go on hitless streaks for 3 weeks at a time.
PUKE
jones owns us
F.U. Larry Jones
swear if i see one mets player in the dugout smiling i will just go nuts. i feel like i care 100x more than these bums whether they win or lose.
*IF this Met team was under Bobby Cox do you think he’ll put up with this BS???? NOOOOO… *
I completely agree with Keith and Ron. Chipper has to get plunked.
If David Wright ever wants to emmulate and follow a BASEBALL PLAYER he should go watch this guy CHIPPER JONES… WOW…
By Bud Brewer
May 21, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this
Man, this is funner than a car load of drunk monkeys.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this
Pelfrey threw 104 pitches and recorded 12 outs.
By richbrave
May 21, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
DOWN ON THE FARM
Can’t post info on CHOP CHICK’S BLOG. No box to sent info. R-Braves HAMMERED 11-1 last night. FRANCISLEY BUENO was “no muy bueno.” After two solid starts he took a step back in his progress toward the Bigs. Many earned runs in 3.1. Liz (Orioles) limited the hitting also. Chuck James on the mound tonight in Norfolk.
Later.
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this
If the D-backs don’t come back and win, we’re going to see Man of Teal on here shortly.
Marlins up 3-1 bottom of the 7th, looking to give Webb his 1st loss.
By Fade
May 21, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this
Awesome.
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this
I’m surprised the Mets fans are crapping on Wright. He’s not playing as well as Jones, but who is right now? Wright’s having a good season thus far.
And plunking Chipper would be the last thing you want to do to him. Chipper’s so dialed in that square up the next fastball and nearly decapitate the pitcher. Certain guys I wouldn’t plunk because they can do just that.
By Deep Throat
May 21, 2008 9:19 PM | Link to this
The Metrosexuals need to pack up their manbags and go back to New Yawk.
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
I wonder how many times Chipper will refer to the Mets fans or to the great Mets/Braves rivalry during his HALL OF FAME INDUCTION SPEECH. By the way… where are all those Mets fans that so often visit these blogs and drop a comment or two???
By uga-brave
May 21, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this
the sreak is over. holy cornelia.
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this
The refreshed Francoeur ain’t bad.
He’s a double from hitting for the cycle after that two-run bomb.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this
Jeff F. Day off = Wakeup call
By McFann
May 21, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this
keylargo—
Yeah, definitely a lot faster! ; )
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this
Nothing to complain about tonight, bloggers. Braves have been playing as close to perfect these last couple days as a team can play.
By radoncbravesfan
May 21, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
Frenchy responds to a game off with a triple and home run. nice Need to try that more often Mets look stunned
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
Francoeur’s first homer since his two-homer game at D.C. on April 12.
By Mitch
May 21, 2008 9:26 PM | Link to this
Look what a night off has done for Frenchy! His swing looks so much better tonight.
By AGTFan
May 21, 2008 9:27 PM | Link to this
Is it just me, or does anyone else think the rest might have ben good for Frenchy?
By TJ
May 21, 2008 9:27 PM | Link to this
How ‘bout a cycle for Jeff on his “first day back” from his (18 hr) layoff.
Just needs a double.
By Random
May 21, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this
McFann —
Yep — Wally Pipp ‘n’ all that.
*FloridaBrave: *”I want [Kotsay] to extend but at the same time Shafer should be ready to be our starting CF next year so I propose moving Kotsay to LF”
If he keeps going the way he’s going now, Senyor Ark-May Kot-Say (sprechen Sie Pig Latin?) may just play himself out of the Braves’ price range. Don’t be surprised — more power to him, I say.
PS: TESH!!!
By ernesto
May 21, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this
Jeez how far out of the base path was Reyes? He ended up 2 feet away from the bag. How is that not interference?
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this
DOB: I’ve always seen Chipper use a black bat while hitting from the right side, and this season he’s using the blonde bat from both sides of the plate. Any reason for that?
Also, what do you think about the use of instant replay in baseball? just heard that an unpire’s decision just cost A-Rod a HR. The guys broadcasting the Braves’ game on ESPN in spanish suggested the use of 6 umpires, like they do in post-season, for a better call on those plays.
And they give Chipper and error on that play?
By Jeff321
May 21, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this
Ya gotta love those quotes from McCann about having Jeff F. on the bench last night..
“He’s the most annoying bench player in the world,” said McCann, who also had the night game off after catching the first game. “I don’t ever want to have him on the bench again.
“He’s just annoying,” McCann added. “He talks the whole time, doesn’t give you your space. Every time you turn around, he’s there.”
http://tinyurl.com/6m3mdm
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this
That new ‘French’ guy is better than the old one. Isn’t he?
By Who's New York's Daddy?
May 21, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this
Chipper
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this
IDK about that Random, he’s playing great right now but he’s not one of those guys who gets to point to sexy stats when negotiating a contract- not to mention his injury history. I think we can get him back for 2-3 years, $6-7 mil per year. We love Kotsay, he loves us…I think we’ll find a way to get something done.
By TJ
May 21, 2008 9:48 PM | Link to this
Including tonight’s action:
Brandon Webb: 10 starts, 2.69 ERA
Jair Jurrjens: 10 starts, 2.64 ERA
Webb has gone about an inning per start longer, so I guess he edges Jair for the Cy Young.
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this
And Chipper gets plunked! FU Schoeneweis!
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 9:50 PM | Link to this
shoot…what happened to chipper?
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this
Ok, this is ridiculous…bring in Resop to bury his 96 mph heater in someone’s ribs.
By AGTFan
May 21, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this
Mets pitchers sure seem to hit a lot of batters. How many is that in the last 2 days?
By Greg
May 21, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this
That was intentional. I think we should repay the favor by plunking Wright.
By Random
May 21, 2008 9:52 PM | Link to this
Wright leads off the eighth— please God let the Braves have the balls to put one in his ribs!!!
By richbrave
May 21, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this
DOWN ON THE FARM
Chuckster takes a hit, and is now 0-1 after a 7.0 IP, 8 H, 2 R, 2 ER, 2 BB, 4 SO outing. He should sue for lack of run support. R-Braves lose 2-0. Pitched well enough to win. Double in six his undoing. I think he looked pretty good, except for a few too many hits. He was pitching high early, but the opposing batter hit a good low-ball pitch for the game winner. HITTING?? What hitting. Nothing to report!!!
By FloridaBrave
May 21, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this
Oh, Sutcliffe, you are so naive.
Apparently it’ll be easy for the Braves to sign Tex and there’s no reason the two parties can’t work out a contract.
Is he kidding?
By Random
May 21, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
Braveheart —
Thanks for the Mets blog link and the excerpts from it up above.
By H-Ram
May 21, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
Scott Schoeneweis….you Mother————…you should get you sorry @ss suspended….so this means that we can PLUNK David Wright now!!!!!!!!!
By McFann
May 21, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this
CHIPPER BETTER BE OK, that’s all I have to say!
Well, that and .328!! An infield single!
Well, keylargo, the league-leaders in triples better watch out!
; )
By Mark T.
May 21, 2008 9:59 PM | Link to this
Oh man I wanted Frenchy to get that double REALLY BAD!!!!! On another note, I know it’s not the Braves/or Bobby’s way but enough is enough. We need to retaliate tomorrow.
By Random
May 21, 2008 9:59 PM | Link to this
Dammit — bennett shoulda nailed Wright!
Instead …
By Mark T.
May 21, 2008 9:59 PM | Link to this
Oh man I wanted Frenchy to get that double REALLY BAD!!!!! On another note, I know it’s not the Braves/or Bobby’s way but enough is enough. We need to retaliate tomorrow. Exactly what Hudson did to Soriano last year and remember we won that game after that.
By eric the elder
May 21, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this
Okay, you guys are smarter than I am. How is Bennett pitching in a 11-2 game?
Where are Resop, Stockman, Ring, etc?
By AGTFan
May 21, 2008 10:01 PM | Link to this
OK. If we don’t see Resop with a 9 run lead late, we’re never going to see him throw another pitch for the Braves
By Braveheart
May 21, 2008 10:02 PM | Link to this
The least Resop could do to make himself useful is to be our goon
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this
and where is Chris Resop? Why pitching Bennett instead of Resop?
By Smokey
May 21, 2008 10:04 PM | Link to this
How many batters need to be drilled before the Brave retaliate? This is ridiculous. DEFEND YOUR GUYS!!
By richbrave
May 21, 2008 10:11 PM | Link to this
Blast from the past. ESTEBAN YAN pitched the 8th in relief of Norfolk’s starter. Yes folks, our 1990 draft choice hangs in.
By Random
May 21, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
I hope so, FloridaBrave. I’m with you on the issue, but if Mark Skot (Kotsay to the P.L.-literate) is able to prove himself fully recuperated from the back thing, AND puts up numbers near his top two or three career years, he’ll be sure to be offered more by another team. Question is, just how much does he love the Braves, in monetary terms.
Before people start kvetching about how come Cox doesn’t use Stockman to mop up, my guess is that Cox doesn’t want to expose Stockman prematurely to the Mets and let them get their scouting book started on him if he doesn’t have to.
PS: TESH!!!
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
Any news on Chipper? He seemed upset after being hit near the right knee that he tried (I think) to slam the bat that he almost hits himself with the bat.
By eric the elder
May 21, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this
Smokey, do you remember when Pendleton left his position at third base and walked off the field when out pitcher didn’t retaliate? I wonder what he is thinking now?
By Capt. Caveman (the original dawg)
May 21, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this
The last thing the Braves need right now is to be involved in a brawl. BC doesn’t need any more injuries or suspensions right now.
The Mutts are showing their desperation and are trying to throw the Braves off of their game. I don’t think Willie wants any trouble either. Not more than he already has.
The Braves are doing exactly what I said they would do, keep playing hard and win -baby- win.
Knocking Wagner around is just more fun for us.
We are sending a message with our bats, and that’s the most important thing.
By Overlord
May 21, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this
Good thing muts came to atlanta so the braves could have some batting practice before DBacks pitching gets here.
By Mark T.
May 21, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this
Smokey and everyone…..It doesnt make any sense to do something tonite. We dont need to fire these Mutts up at all, they are free falling and we are the cause. Now they are going to bring “Cy Young” out to stop what’s going on out here today. And I also know we will be VERY focused tomorrow. Let’s focus on drilling someone tomorrow. I have a strong feeling Hudson will do something tomorrow to deal with what happened to our guys tonite.
By A-ville Ranger
May 21, 2008 10:19 PM | Link to this
I get a wee-tad nervous reading that Smoltz is changing his delivery.I trust his judgement but still….it’s just a little bit scarey.
By TESH
May 21, 2008 10:19 PM | Link to this
Random, What do you want already? Stop calling my name!
By AGTFan
May 21, 2008 10:25 PM | Link to this
I do remember maddog making the comment that you don’t have retaliate right away, just have a long memory.
By MiamiBrave
May 21, 2008 10:25 PM | Link to this
Chris Resop Sighting
for all of you clamoring for him to come in and spare some of the other guys from pithing
By Chop Chop
May 21, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this
I remember that very well, eric the elder. The immortal Marvin Freeman was on the mound and wouldn’t hit someone. I can’t remember who we were playing, but Pendleton was incensed. I have a feeling we’d be in a few beanball wars if Pendleton were at the helm.
(After typing that, I googled Marvin + Freeman + Terry + Pendleton…)
I then found this little bit of info on a thread from Braves Journal…
“The game in question was played on 5/26/93 against the Reds. Tim Belcher had hit Deion in the top of the seventh, and Marvin came in for Maddux in the bottom of the inning. He struck out Reggie Sanders, then TP walked off the field during Joe Oliver’s AB, and was replaced by Bill Pecota. (thanks, Retrosheet)
You could make the argument that it was an unconventional form of leadership, I guess. But these things are usually dealt with in the dugout or locker room. For what it’s worth, Marvin stunk up the joint in his next three appearances, then went on the DL for a while.”
By Random
May 21, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this
Braveheart: “The least Resop could do to make himself useful is to be our goon”
C’mon now — is 2.1 scoreless, hitless, 1 BB, 2 K innings only four days ago so forgettable just because we lost the game?
He’s coming along better now, and can be a fully contributing member of the bullpen.
Goon could be “an additional duty as assigned.”
By Cecil34
May 21, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this
It appears that Francoeur needed was a game off!
Not because he was tired - he just needed to clear that young cluttered mind!
Very encouraging!
By Positivity
May 21, 2008 10:32 PM | Link to this
I like it here.
By Shamus Thacker
May 21, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this
Jurrjens has saved our butts. Period.
By Philliesuk
May 21, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this
I just looked at Resop’s stats since 4/13 (counting tonight):
10.2 IP 7 H 2 ER 3 BB 9 SO
That’s quite an improvement. Granted, he hasn’t pitched that much in the past month.
By Saltywoody
May 21, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this
Love seeing the Braves play this way.
Just thought I’d post something interesting I was looking at tonight.
Ron Mahay ERA 2.84 HOLD 6 SO 18 WHIP 1.42
Jose Ascanio 1-0 with a 2.08 ERA in 17 relief appearances for Triple-A Iowa and two innings of scoreless relief in the majors after a recent call-up.
Octavio Dotel ERA 4.00 HOLD 6 SO 28 WHIP 1.56
Tyler Yates ERA 3.05 HOLD 5 SO 11 WHIP 1.50
Oscar Villareal ERA 6.04 HOLD 2 SO 15 WHIP 1.57
Lance Cormier ERA 3.52 HOLD 0 SO 6 WHIP 1.17
Mark Redman Why bother?
Kyle Davies Ditto
Willie Harris AVG .176 HR 1 RBI 4 OBP .323 SLG .333
Salty AVG .209 HR 1 RBI 7 OBP .382 SLG .302
Edgar Renteria AVG .282 HR 4 RBI 23 OBP .314 SLG .399
My point in posting these numbers is basically to draw attention to the fact that every single one of these guys is not performing particularly well. If you look at our team and the players that replaced all of the above, it’s ridiculous how intelligent our off-season roster moves were, both in terms of production and salary.
By 234234
May 21, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this
Random: you must realize the mentality level of Braveheart…minus 4…alot of talk but can’t walk the talk…
By Random
May 21, 2008 10:43 PM | Link to this
Start hitting the damned ball!!!
(Okay, maybe you have actually started — we’ll see. But until your BA matches your career average (.285) and/or your SLG does the same (.532), you’ll still be Tesh to me.)
Good points, Mark T. Perhaps cooler heads should prevail.
Like the ineffable McEff says, I just can’t wait for the game tomorrow.
By Smokey
May 21, 2008 10:45 PM | Link to this
Eric,
I remember it vividly. I actually was thinking of that very event when I was writing what I wrote.
Pendleton walked off the field after Marvin Freeman didn’t hit a batter when he was instructed to do so.
At some point you have to defend your guys. Intentional or not, teams need to know that our guys won’t stand for it. But, sadly, our guys keep getting plunked with no retaliation.
Mark,
I hope the comeuppance is tomorrow. It will be well deserved.
By Saltywoody
May 21, 2008 10:45 PM | Link to this
Chop Chop
Thanks for making my night by reminding me of Marvin Freeman. So hilarious.
By fastasballs
May 21, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this
Wow did that day off do Frenchy a world of good. Tex is starting to heat up folks, good for us, really bad for the rest of the NL.
Usually I’m all for some retaliation, but the Muts are a team getting really desperate. No reason to give them some reason to actually play together as a team. The Braves are clicking, well the home version is, so I would leave it alone unless the Muts get up big tomorrow & Santana is cruising. Then by all means hit somebody.
By Don Kahn
May 21, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this
Ok this is where I wake up just as we run in a ditch.For the last 2 plus seasons everytime we’re convinced we’re out of the turd vat ”they pull us back in”.Oh what the hey,this does feel like a turning point with Smoltz and Soriano due back.Who knows how good it could get if the team gets relatively healthy.
By Saltywoody
May 21, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this
For those of you Marvin Freeman fans, wikipedia has this to say about him:
He is currently an assistant baseball coach at Homewood-Flossmoor High School in Flossmoor, Illinois
There’s also a good tidbit on there about him screaming into the microphone and not conducting an interview.
By Pete H.
May 21, 2008 10:55 PM | Link to this
Nice post, saltywoody. I have tracked a couple of them and Wren et al did a good job of reloading. Imagine what it is going to be like if Smoltz, Gonzo and Soriano all come back on schedule. Who gets the axe? I guess Stockman and Resop, but hard to think of anyone else.
Glad Chipper is OK. I thought he got hit in the foot, and that would have been awful.
Frenchy looked a lot better tonight. Maybe resting for a day, enforced resting, was what he needed.
And oddly, I sense an absence of fans of the National League representative of MLB around here. Strange, but true.
By Kentavo
May 21, 2008 10:55 PM | Link to this
Hey Braves fans, we gotta get Chip, Heap, Esco and Z-man on the All-Star team. Got to www.mlb.com and vote early and often.
By uga-brave
May 21, 2008 10:58 PM | Link to this
braveheart,
appreciate the mets posts. it’s kind of like bizzaro world from seinfeld.
francoeur looked like a different hitter tonight. he said after the game that he had been getting out on his front foot and not letting the ball come to him. it is a shame that it took him a quarter of a season to figure out he was lunging on every pitch.
he is the x factor on this team. if he hits, and hits for power we are gonna win some games.
By AdirondackDave
May 21, 2008 11:10 PM | Link to this
Tex just said in a tv interview that Chipper took one on the leg and would bruise but should be good for tomorrow.
By Tomas
May 21, 2008 11:19 PM | Link to this
DOB,
What do you think of Willie Randolph comments to the media? Do you think there is some truth to them or he was just full of steam? If i’m Omar Minaya, Randolph job would be on the line. First last years disaster, and now this.
By Gary
May 21, 2008 11:21 PM | Link to this
Well what a night for the Bravos. No need to retaliate tonight. The Braves did that with Tex’s 3 run triple right after Chipper got plunked. Now if anyone gets hit tomorrow, its on like Donkey Kong!
On another note, since I haven’t seen him here tonight, I want to leave a shout out for ManofTeal before I call it a night. I said that I would be impressed if the Marlins beat Webb and I am on here to say that it looks like the Marlins might be for real. Another thing is now that Webb has a loss look for him to pitch lights out on Monday. I hope Jair brings his A game.
By THB
May 21, 2008 11:23 PM | Link to this
Saw comments on Chris Young from the Padres before. Here are my thoughts:
He won’t cost what an ace would cost because, well, he isn’t an ace. He wouldn’t cost 5 prospects, but he would probably cost us Gorkys, B.Jones, and maybe more. They might want one of Reyes or Morton instead of B.Jones. But in all honesty, if Schafer comes back at the end of this month and is playing well through June, I’d say deal Gorkys a B.Jones (plus maybe another decent prospect-would they want Lillibridge? He’s still a solid trade chip, and would be expendable considering our situation.) So now that I’ve rethought it, maybe Lillibrige, Gorkys, and a lower prospect like Evarts for Young? He’s going to be 29 this year, isn’t his contract pretty reasonable?
By dack jerrick
May 21, 2008 11:26 PM | Link to this
Mets drill Chipper, possibly knocking him out of tommorow’s game and more. It’s in your face aggression from NY. Will the Braves continue to take it and smile? Santana should be drilled hard in the rib cage. It’s what any self-respecting big league team would do. We’ll see.
By MiamiBrave
May 21, 2008 11:28 PM | Link to this
The Bravos have made me winner’s on the pole winning 3 of 4, but here’s hoping that I was wrong and that they sweep the Mets outta here…
hope they give em the ‘ol “Esco Roundhouse”
A second win over Santana already this season would be icing on the cake for this series
Good luck Huddy, GO BRAVOS!!!
By Bobby's Cox
May 21, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this
That was intentional. I think we should repay the favor by plunking Wright.
I think we should return the favor by plunking Santana tomorrow.
That would be nice, but it might be best to do what Captain Caveman suggested.
By chrisklob
May 21, 2008 11:34 PM | Link to this
francoeur looked like a different hitter tonight. he said after the game that he had been getting out on his front foot and not letting the ball come to him. it is a shame that it took him a quarter of a season to figure out he was lunging on every pitch.
Hey uga, it could be worse. How long did it take Andruw to figure out his problem and fix it? What, oh, he still hasn’t fixed it?
By MiamiBrave
May 21, 2008 11:34 PM | Link to this
BTW DOB
I wanted to pose this question to you, wanted to see your opinion on this
Seeing as everyone has been talking about beaning a Met in retaliation for the Esco play and especially after the KJ and Chip HBP
But I’ve been a Braves fan for a long time, and I don’t really remember many if any bench clearings by the Braves as well as any retaliation HBP on opponents, I gotta believe this is maybe something that stems from Bobby and playing the game the right way with some class or whatnot.
Just wondering if you can drop some knowledge on the subject
GO BRAVOS AGAIN
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 11:42 PM | Link to this
I’d like to congratulate Mike Nichols (do you know who he is? because I didn’t know who he was until I googled his name. But, wait, nope, he’s not that movies director, he’s a blogger contributor at Metsblog.com). I want to greet him because he thinks Chipper “may hit .400” this season.
Mr. Nichols: you are a clown. You say Chipper misses enough games due to injury that he will still qualify with the required at-bats.
quoted: “Hate to say this, but I think Chipper Jones might just make a run a hitting .400 this year. I know it’s still May, but he misses just enough games due to injury that he may hit .400 and still qualify with enough at-bats.”
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 11:42 PM | Link to this
I’d like to congratulate Mike Nichols (do you know who he is? because I didn’t know who he was until I googled his name. But, wait, nope, he’s not that movies director, he’s a blog contributor at Metsblog.com). I want to greet him because he thinks Chipper “may hit .400” this season.
Mr. Nichols: you are a clown. You say Chipper misses enough games due to injury that he will still qualify with the required at-bats.
quoted: “Hate to say this, but I think Chipper Jones might just make a run a hitting .400 this year. I know it’s still May, but he misses just enough games due to injury that he may hit .400 and still qualify with enough at-bats.”
By Smokey
May 21, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this
MiamiBrave,
Playing the game the “right way,” meaning the old-school way, includes retaliation when needed. Don’t think Bobby Cox doesn’t know this. We’ll see what happens tomorrow.
By uga-brave
May 21, 2008 11:50 PM | Link to this
miamibrave,
the braves were in one of the greatest bean ball games of all time. granted it took place in say circa 1984.
pascual perez was right in the middle of it and bob horner left the press box (he was injured, or eating hot dogs) to put his uniform on.
champ summners sprinted toward the dugout to get at perez and horner cast and all stopped him in his tracks.
By LuisGuillermo
May 21, 2008 11:55 PM | Link to this
If Chipper can’t play tomorrow we should plunk somebody tomorrow. If so, since Chipper has been our most consistent hitter so far, we should see Santana getting hit, since he’s been arguably the best starter for the Mets, and they’re relying on him for the season. But I don’t think Bobby will play that way, that’s not his game. Hopefully Huddy makes what he did to Alfonso Soriano last June. Remember that?
By David O'Brien
May 21, 2008 11:57 PM | Link to this
Wow, nasty scene here tonight. A 25-year-old guy fell three or four levels to the field level and has critical head injuries. He was sliding on a handrail and slipped.
The spot where he landed is something I won’t soon forget….
Folks, Chipper got hit in his back leg by a breaking ball. There will be no retaliation for that.
Francoeur got hit in his first plate appearance. Given his recent performance, why would they hit Francoeur in the second inning of a scoreless game?
No, I don’t anticipate any “retaliation” from Braves. They retaliate when it’s appropriate, when a guy clearly throws at one of their hitters.
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 12:00 AM | Link to this
Chipper’s questionable for tomorrow, says he’ll try to play. But that’s a nasty, egg-sized (or larger) lump on his shin, at bottom of calf muscle. Hit bone and the muscle.
By MiamiBrave
May 22, 2008 12:02 AM | Link to this
Smokey
Playing the game the “right way,” meaning the old-school way, includes retaliation when needed.
Definitely, I believe that, I love seeing it, everyone who covers the game believes it too, that guys should go out and retaliate for teammates, I don’t disagree with that at all. I like that old school mentality, but that’s what I’m saying BC can be old school, but I never see that kind of retaliation from the Braves.
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 12:03 AM | Link to this
Saltywoody, well done in your 10:38 post, gathering all those stats for recently departed Braves. Solid info, my man. Thanks.
By Nail their AZZ
May 22, 2008 12:03 AM | Link to this
The MUTTS have now taken out our entire left side of the infield. Both of those guys hitting 300 and 400. Does Bobby think this was unintentional? They cant beat us playing baseball so they are beating us up by physical assault. F* being Southern gentleman! They could care freakin less about sportsmanship. COX—- they have sent your leadoff man and best hitter to the bench. If they kicked one of your dogs once,twice,three times,four times….wouldn’t YOU— BOBBY— protect YOUR dogs? The hell with being nice guys. Nice guys only have 1 world series in 18 years. JEEZ—- Even the fans at the TED knew the MUTTS were gunning for our guys and were booing. This isnt funny.
By Smokey
May 22, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this
Wow, I’ve never seen a breaking ball not actually break. I guess I was looking at something different.
I know there’s never intent with a breaking ball hitting a batter. But it appeared to be a heater to me, and I know what a breaking ball looks like.
By brent a.
May 22, 2008 12:13 AM | Link to this
MiamiBrave -
In 1991-2, Otis Nixon charged the mound after he was thrown at in a game against the Phillies. Apparently, the Phillies were upset that Nixon had been stealing so many bases. Nixon ran out and leaped feet-first at the pitcher and tore his jersey. There was a bench-clearing brawl.
The next series, in Philly, Nixon was thrown at late in the game (7th, or 8th), and walked to first, yelling at the pitcher the whole way.
The first batter up in the bottom half of the inning? None other than Dale Murphy. Tom Glavine proceeded to throw at Murph’s legs on 4 straight pitches - but there was no tussle.
I don’t remember much else in terms of fighting in the Bobby Cox era. (I’m sure there was something).
I do remember that in the early 80’s, (82, or 83, I think), Claudell Washington flung his bat on a swing and miss with Mario Soto pitching, and seemingly, somewhat surprisingly, a big fight ensued. As I remember it, that was early in the game (seems like it was the first inning). That was a fun fight, as I recall.
By LuisGuillermo
May 22, 2008 12:14 AM | Link to this
What the f*ck!?!?!?!
Albert Pujols just ‘injured’ a couple of Padres players in the same inning. First, he hit a liner off of forementioned (in this blog) Chris Young that struck on his face and had lo leave in the 3rd inning, bleeding. And then he collides at home with Padres catcher Josh Bard. Weird, huh? (Maybe some Braves hitter get to hit a liner like that, not in the face, that’s way too dangerous, but maybe on Schoeneweis’ RIGHT SHIN)
By chrisklob
May 22, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this
Smokey, a breaking ball that doesn’t break is sometimes referred to as a “hanger” or a “hanging breaking ball”. It happens all the time. Not saying that it wasn’t intentional. I’m just sayin’.
By jbutler
May 22, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this
Got a chance to see most of the game on ESPN…1st game all season I’ve had a chance to catch given schedule/CO programming offering nothing East of..well, Denver!!
Anyway— few musings that I thought were hilarious:
M. Alou should pack some Bengay and a No Doz in his back pocket instead of batting bloves. Is he J.Francos older brother???
The announcing team waxed poetic about how “all the hitters were carrying this team and that’s how winners are made!! Great team effort - all season!! ” Huh?
The Playboy Bunny/sideline reporter acted like she was covering the vietnam war, and the announcers were flat out mocking her. She breathlessly said that Chipper’s injury was something he could “shake off” and the “other” DOB basically said she should be on the receiving end of a fastball!! ouch.
Lastly…there’s something about the last stretch of games that has that “intangible” quality that allow teams to make a run at it. Superstar hitting (CJ) clutch pitching (Huddy/Glavine) and unexpected role players - (Bullpen, Campillo/Jurrens..) Anyway…fun to watch!!
By TexasBrave
May 22, 2008 12:28 AM | Link to this
DOB I was watching the game on ESPN and Suncliff mentioned he saw Smoltz throwing in the bullpen today and said in his opinion that Smoltz looked like he could come back in the next couple of days. Now I realize that Rick may be blowing smoke out his butt, but what do you think?
By Smokey
May 22, 2008 12:31 AM | Link to this
Chris, I know what a “hanger” is, bro. A hanger stays up in the zone and has very little break. It certainly wasn’t a hanger as it hit him in the shin. It could have possibly been a tight slider, but a slow hangar or breaking ball, I don’t feel, is accurate. JMO
By Pete H.
May 22, 2008 12:39 AM | Link to this
Smokey, that ball broke down and in. It was a hard breaking ball, and there was no way it was deliberate. When you want to plunk someone, they get it in the back or right on the arm. You don’t throw at their feet.
The Mutt blogger has a point. Not a good one, but getting a few days off from time to time due to tweaking injuries is a good way to stay fresh. The grind of the season leads to slumps. So his point is sorta valid.
I am so sad that the adherents to the New York Metropolitans base-ball club chose to ignore us this evening. I so enjoy their input and was looking forward to a lively discussion of the most recent contests. I am so upset I feel I must retire to my fainting couch.
I daresay that if the Metropolitans were to mount a rousing display tomorrow, our lost friends shall be found. Talking stupid ignorant Mutt-type trash, as usual.
By P-Town Brave
May 22, 2008 12:39 AM | Link to this
DOB
What do you mean not retaliate?!
I’m sorry, I really don’t care if that pitch was meant to hit Chipper or not, but after 4 HBP’s in the last two days, plus the Escobar/Church incident, someone deserves to be wearing one come 7:10 ET!
Thats just what you do when your best two players are injured upon acts from an opposing team…let alone a division rival.
For the love of everything in the unwritten baseball rule book, plant someone in the numbers Huddy!
By chrisklob
May 22, 2008 12:48 AM | Link to this
Smokey
I am not disputing what the pitch was. Frankly, without seeing the replay again, I don’t really know. If DOB says it was a breaking ball, then I’ll take him at his word. I was only commenting on your original post which was:
Wow, I’ve never seen a breaking ball not actually break.
I’m not being snarky. Just pointing out that breaking pitches don’t always break.
By uga-brave
May 22, 2008 12:54 AM | Link to this
it sure looks like randolph is losing that clubhouse. got the look of someone who feels his job is on the line.
all this b.s. about the mets throwing at us is b.s. schowenweiss threw a cutter down and just to far in. now if it had been a fastball above the belt, then you have got a point.
i said all winter the team to worry about was the phillies and i still believe that.
the marlins are probably gonna hang around a lot longer then many think.
ramirez, uggla, jacobs, willingham, and hemedia are all plus hitters.
five games left on this stand, i would be happy with 3 out of five.
By BravesDave
May 22, 2008 12:54 AM | Link to this
Since I am more than willing to rip Francoeur for his shortcomings, I am also willing to say that tonight he played an excellent game. He put some great swings on the ball. It was nice to see.
Hopefully, he really did figure out his problems in the batting cage, as he said after the game.
If he can get hot and stay hot for a period of time, while Tex is heating up, and Kelly is hot…..this is going to be an offense more like the one we were all expecting.
Maybe the Braves can keep this up against Santana and 11 HRs surrendered to date. I hope so.
Hudson needs to drill Wright in the back tomorrow in the first inning.
By jbutler
May 22, 2008 12:57 AM | Link to this
Brent A I can only recall one bench clearing brawl in the BC era- Smoltz was throwing..Charlie something or another (I truly don’t remember his name…but back in the early 90s) was catching and the guy (a Met I think) flew to the mound. There was a huge picture in SI of it with probably 15 players just having at it. Funniest thing is this Charlie catcher guy saying how much trouble he got in from his son for “picking a fight” after the game. Funny stuff.
By mr baseball
May 22, 2008 1:03 AM | Link to this
If the Mets are going to throw at Chipper, doesn’t it make sense for them to throw at his legs in the hopes that they might hit him in a vulnerable spot and avoid retaliation, which might result from throwing a little higher inside? No way to prove Schoeneweis did or didn’t hit him intentionally, but I don’t think the Mets are going to lose any sleep if Chipper is out of the lineup tomorrow.
I remember the Pendleton/Freeman brouhaha and recollect that Pendleton’s act was pure petulance. Pendleton got a lot of credit for his leadership in the early ’90s, but let’s remember that he was in a Marlins’ uniform when the Braves won the Series in ‘95, as opposed to the Braves’ teams in 91, 92, 93 and 96 that lost their final post-season game.
In the past week or two, some folks on here have opined that:
1) Francouer is never going to amount to much;
2) Johnson needs to take a seat on the bench;
3) McDowell just ain’t cutting it as pitching coach and we need Leo back.
Anyone willing to step up and admit their errors? Thought not.
By yupp
May 22, 2008 1:46 AM | Link to this
all frenchy needed was that one day off : ) Go Braves!
By Trippy Hippie
May 22, 2008 1:47 AM | Link to this
Hi all. Been too busy farming organic vegetables to drop by lately, but I really like what I’m seeing from this year’s team. Maybe now that most of the early-season work is caught up, I might be able to watch a few more games live, rather than just taping them and watching them in the middle of the night.
By Sarah
May 22, 2008 1:47 AM | Link to this
Church’s comments today about that, um… genius slide last night made me laugh. “And I’ll do it again. That’s good hard baseball.”
And to that I say… you’ll get knocked out, AGAIN!
After spending 12 hours at the ballpark (although I can’t think of any where else I’d rather be), I was ready to celebrate my boys’ sweep of a double header! But to my confusion, I saw Kelly Johnson frantically waiving over trainers, and Escobar being helped off the field.
And replay shows… RYAN CHURCH IS AN IDIOT!
That whole Mets team is a joke. Including the manager.
By BA
May 22, 2008 1:49 AM | Link to this
Jbutler- Charlie O’BRIEN, coincidentally. Coming in at number three with a bullet on my the list of my favorite Maddux catchers.
By BA
May 22, 2008 2:00 AM | Link to this
Oh, geez-I slurred my blog. Hope DOB doesn’t make me say my abc’s backwards. And I REALLY hope that girl Chris doesn’t see it and correct me.
By BA
May 22, 2008 2:27 AM | Link to this
n8, the first thing that comes to mind when you ask me that question(what MLB manager wouldn’t have won with the Big Three) I start thinking of some of the recent ones, like McCLendon, Bowa, the ghost of Trader Jack, Bobby Valentine, you know- your garden variety failed managers. But if I dig deep enough, I could probably find even BETTER(or worse?) examples than these guys. But who’s to say that drunken slob LaRussa could have won this much? Or Leyland(hell, I like Leyland)? Point is, it’s such an abstract question that you can’t really provide a definitive answer. But I say, in the modern era, he’s the BEST. And Torre’s right there, too. If you take away The Big Three’s wins under Bobby Cox, he’s roughly 150 games over five hundred anyway. He’s played the Columbo act for THIRTY years, and he’s still got ‘em fooled- he’s got you fooled! But you don’t pull this off with Cox alone. He’s no Big Tuna. He also had the best GM here for twenty years, but guess who was here first? And too wrap up the loose ends, he used Acosta twice because Acosta is something like seventeen, and everybody isn’t going to shatter like Hampton, certainly not a big Latin guy like that- those guys are made out of rubber. And I meant both parts, the latter was sort of a term of endearment, if you will.
By Roman Gal
May 22, 2008 2:29 AM | Link to this
Speaking of retaliation, I have a funny story from the game tonight: My friend and I got to the game a little bit early, and we were sitting in our seats while a couple of players were playing toss and stretching on the field.
Mark Kotsay and Jeff Francoeur were playing toss while Jose Reyes was on the other side of the field running sprints. So he takes off and Mark Kotsay throws the ball WAY past Frenchy and nearly hits Jose Reyes. Reyes just stopped and put his hands in the air like “what the heck?!” and then he and Frenchy had a good laugh as he went out to left field to get the ball.
DOB My friend and I tried to go down the stairs after the game and they had it closed off. I was wondering why. I hope that guy is okay but that was pure idiocy.
By BA
May 22, 2008 2:36 AM | Link to this
McFann- I take back what I said the other morning. I never see the blog during the game but I’ve been reading back over it lately, and your in-game stuff is top-shelf. And clearly, wherever you’re sitting at night is helping your boy. I’ve seen people on here talk about whether or not Frency will ever be a 3 hole hitter, but I think on a lot of other teams, McCann hits THIRD. And yeah, I know about the days off thing with catchers. Makes me wonder, as good a hitter as this guy is, how long can you keep him at catcher?!
By SeattleBravesFan
May 22, 2008 2:39 AM | Link to this
Charlie O’Brien…how do you forget Charlie O’Brien…i still have the SI cover with that one, classic…
By Shamus Thacker
May 22, 2008 2:44 AM | Link to this
At least Braves backers tumble off a deck and INTO the stadium like real fans!
What puzzles me is how Muts fans fall completely outa the damn stadium. Muts players have prolly installed ladders, so as many can jump, fall, and be pushed to their deaths as possible.
By BA
May 22, 2008 2:52 AM | Link to this
Oh, yeah-n8 Don’t get me wrong, I know the defensive jugernaut that was Lemke. Belliard was even better- and though he couldn’t steal a base(or beat out those bothersome pitch in the dirt strikeouts} he could absolutely FLY first to third, second to home. My point was, Bobby puts these type of players in roles where it’s hard for them to fail. And when they struggle, he’s smart enough to wait it out. Bobby Cox MADE Kelly Johnson, he came up and went 3 for 140, and Cox stayed with him, and he’s a far cry from that now.
By Random
May 22, 2008 5:50 AM | Link to this
LuisGuillermo —
You’re right — Mike Nichols is indeed a clown.
It’s a minimum number of plate appearances that needs to be met to win a batting title, etc, not a minimum number of at bats.
In fact, anyone who’s ever going to have a chance of batting .400 for a season is going to have to minimize their at bats by getting walks at a pretty good clip.
If you don’t walk much, it simply requires too many hits to wind up with a .400 average.
By Coach (Braves in 2008 to the playoffs)
May 22, 2008 6:46 AM | Link to this
Roller Coaster ride indeed ! Great at home, horrible on the road. Beating right handers (17-11), struggling against the southpaws, again ! (8-10). The bullpen started out terrible and now has it’s act together just in time to be torn asunder by the expected return of Smoltz, Soriano and Gonzalez.
I have to congratulate Bobby Cox. He finally took KJ out of the lead off role, demoted Chuck James, inserted Campillo into the rotation and gave Frenchy the mental breather he needed and it all helped.
The Braves are scheduled to face three straight left handers starting tonight followed by the righty on Sunday and the Brandon Webb on Monday. I think these next five games are going to be a great test for the Braves.
By Deep Throat
May 22, 2008 7:17 AM | Link to this
“A Braves fan is dead following a fall Wednesday night from the upper deck at Turner Field.
Atlanta police spokesman Ronald Campbell said Justin Hayes, 25, of Cumming, fell in the bottom of the 8th inning at Wednesday night’s Braves game, plunging from the upper deck concourse to the field level concourse behind home plate.”
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/16359548/detail.html
By McFann
May 22, 2008 8:03 AM | Link to this
Thanks, BA. I’m just sitting here at home! ; ) I think if Chipper’s ever out for a while (please NO!), Bobby might put McCann third—it’d be nice. I’m sure they keep him at catcher as long as possible, but I know what you mean…
BTW—Yeah, great quote from him about Francoeur as a bench rider!
Oh, and Random, I can’t wait for tonight’s game, either!!
Gotta go to the eye doctor. LATER!!
By Yars
May 22, 2008 8:07 AM | Link to this
If Chipper can’t play tonight, then we will probably see Gotay at 3B, & Infante at 2B, since Bobby doesn’t start KJ against LH pitching anymore. I would assume Yunel will have to play tonight, even if he isn’t 100%, being that Bobby will never start KJ against LH pitching ever again. Going to be an interesting night with both Gotay & Infante in the lineup.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 8:26 AM | Link to this
This team is playing GREAT right now. The lack of HR’s, yet abundance of runs, is a GREAT sign (unless you’re name is Shaun).
Over the last seven days the Braves rank 5th in the majors in runs, 8th in doubles, second in triples, 11th in total bases and 5th in on-base percentage. Sure, there is a lack of homers but they are earning plenty of bases, which is why they’re scoring.
Regarding McDowell, since he took over Opening Day 2006, the Braves have allowed the fourth-fewest runs in the NL (tied with Arizona).
By Jersey Gil
May 22, 2008 8:37 AM | Link to this
The Braves are in a roll baby, bat coming alive. Another mis call of the ump last night in yankee satadium in AROD Homerun call, this is the third bad call this week so far. In the media is a discussion special in ESPN this morning about bring the replay to baseball…Folks the game as now is to long for that. I think baseball have in the book the solution, The manager can protect the game it that bad call come as outcome of the game and the league in lest than 24 hours review the tape an reverse the outcome of the game, it that bad call it again the lossing team. OR send all this UMP to got an eye vision test.
By Tonight's Lineup
May 22, 2008 8:51 AM | Link to this
SS Infante
CF Kotsay
RF Francoeur
1B Teixiera
C McCann
LF Diaz
2B Johnson
3B Gotay
SP Hudson
Bomb Squad
By Random
May 22, 2008 8:55 AM | Link to this
Yars —
I think you’re full of it — ie, overstating your case (“Bobby will never start KJ against LH pitching ever again”).
Don’t be surprised to see KJ starting tonight.
“Doctor, mine eyes have seen mine ears?” Good luck with that, McFann.
8-)
By Efrim
May 22, 2008 9:00 AM | Link to this
Big win for the Braves. For them to win tonight, you have to figure Tim Hudson would have to throw a BIG GAME. I assume BC will give Chipper and Yunel a day off here, get them ready for Arizona. Also, great to see Frenchy respond and have a nice game. Heap has a 1.000 OPS. Kelly Johnson has a 287/352/490 line now, and had a nice walk against Feliciano last night. Tex is heating up.
Anyway, random comment, can someone help me out here? I heard this on the radio in the morning and I remember seeing a clip of it as well. I think Deion Sanders was a Brave when it happened, but what started the Deion/McCarver scene in the locker room? If I remember correctly, Sanders dumped water on McCarver. Just curious.
Go Braves!
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 9:04 AM | Link to this
the marlins are probably gonna hang around a lot longer then many think.
uga-brave, I agree that the Marlins are better than a lot of people think. But I don’t know how much longer they can keep this up.
They are 10th in the league in OBP, 9th in runs scored, hitters are last in walks, 8th in runs allowed, 15th in pitcher strikeouts, 10th in pitcher walks and 8th in ERA, only two of their starters have been particularly good and their other starters are pretty significantly below average. They have 8 wins against Washington and 5 against Milwaukee. That’s half their wins right there.
By ManOfTeal
May 22, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this
I don’t know where you are “Gary”, but the Marlins took game two of the Marlins vs Diamondbacks series and they also handed BRandon Webb his first loss of the season. Now do you consider the Marlins to be contenders???? The media seems to think that they are….FINALLY.
All I can say is that the Braves fans better not be worrying about the stupid Mets…..what you need to be worrying about is how angry the Diamondbacks are going to be when they play the Braves this weekend…..especially if the Marlins win tonight and complete the sweep.
Go Marlins!!!!
By Jersey Gil
May 22, 2008 9:09 AM | Link to this
To Bad that in this days fan go to the game of baseball to drink and didn’t pay attention of the game. Happen here in Phillis last year on College Day Promo, Kid drank to much, they get out of there seat 10,000 time bother other fans. My prayer are for the family of that fan the died last night.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 9:10 AM | Link to this
Efrim, McCarver criticized Sanders for playing for the Falcons and Braves on the same day during the ‘92 NLCS.
By Lee in S. GA
May 22, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this
Efrim
That is pretty much the way it went down with Deion & McCarver. Gotta love that Deion.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this
In the media is a discussion special in ESPN this morning about bring the replay to baseball…Folks the game as now is to long for that.
In the time that it takes for the umpires to get together for a conference or argue with managers, players and/or coaches about a close call, they could just look at a replay to get the call right.
By Jersey Gil
May 22, 2008 9:27 AM | Link to this
Shaun Either way take time of the game…we need to fast forward the game, average game len 2:42.No special gagget in baseball please.
By N8
May 22, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this
BA
I agree with you abuout KJ and Bobby sticking with him. Not many managers would have done that.
Let’s not forget though that Cox did have a line up where the top 5 was: Furcal, Giles, Chipper, Andruw (51 HR that year), LaRoche and Estrada.
He could “afford” to be patient with a rookie that was struggling. After all, this was the team that had Mondesi on the roster. I believe the O-for 30something streak was BEFORE McCann and Francoeur were called up.
Speaking of McCann. I too think he’s good enough to be a #3 hitter, in fact I think WHEN Tex leaves, he and Jeff will flip-flop in the clean-up hole instead of the #5 hole, unless whoever we get to play 1B is a clean-up type hitter.
That being said, if Chipper weren’t here, he’d be a perfect #3 hitter, though DOB has said in the past (when I suggested it when Chipper was hurt), that Bobby won’t do it as to NOT clog up the basepaths with McCann’s lack of speed.
Which is a good point, but I still think he’s the next best pure hitter on the team after Chipper (until Tex heats up I guess).
I too agree that at some point in McCann’s career he has to get moved to 1B, to preserve those knees so he can run AT ALL, to make use of his bat. But who really knows how he’d do at 1B? DH waiting to happen some day?
As far as Bobby. I like to pick on him and use him as the whipping boy. Deep down, I appreciate what he is (and even what he isn’t). It’s hard to judge what he does and doesn’t say to these player (or about them), because he DOESN’T talk publicly about them when they struggle. It’s kind of like Andruw’s smirk after striking out.
Sometimes I take the public silence as passiveness and not caring. Which I’m sure is not the case. As far as him being 150 games over .500 when the big 3 don’t pitch, that is impressive.
But I still think the “big 3” is sort of a chain reaction of success for everybody else around them. Having those guys pitch 3 out of every 5 games took pressure off the offense, it took pressure off of the other pitchers (4 and 5 man in rotation), because they didn’t have more pressure on them, other than to try and keep up.
See Millwood. He’s been “ok” as the Ace of the Phillies and Rangers, but NEVER as good as when he was our 4th starter. In 93, 94 and 95, Avery was STILL there. Neagle was around.
The staff was usually 4 men deep and often 5 men deep. The lineup was littered with all-stars (along with role players).
To NOT give Bobby credit for April - September each of those years, is silly. Yet there’s a double standard among fans, when it comes to judging Bobby. He’s thought of as the “greatest” manager of all time by many, yet with HIS success in the regular season, he’s failed to win more than one championship.
People wanna give him ALL the credit for the regular season, and then blame the players for the playoffs. Can’t have it both ways, right?
Shaun
Thanks on the info regarding the “extra base-hits”, in the past few days. Makes sense. I guess I’m not looking for them to be a “singles” machine. Walks, singles, doubles and triples will do just fine. I’d prefer it that way. I absolutely HATE it when they “wait” on the HR to carry them to victory. The homers will eventually come, but their “HITTING” in general has been better.
By N8
May 22, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this
Shaun
“In the time that it takes for the umpires to get together for a conference or argue with managers, players and/or coaches about a close call, they could just look at a replay to get the call right.”
TOTALLY agree with you. If they limit replay to HR’s and “traps” in the OF. With all the camera angles these days, it would take less than 30 seconds to get the call right.
By keylargo
May 22, 2008 9:46 AM | Link to this
Shaun
There may be a lot of stats that say the Marlins shouldn’t be where they are but they have 3 starting pitchers on the DL now. Josh Johnson, Sergio Mitre and Annibel Sanchez. I don’t know when the Marlins get them back, but I do know how much better we will be when we get 3 pitchers back from the DL. Smoltz, Gonzalez and Soriano will make us a much stronger team. (Notice Hampton is not on the list).
By Efrim
May 22, 2008 9:49 AM | Link to this
Shaun
Thanks. Did Deion play well in both games?
By KC
May 22, 2008 9:49 AM | Link to this
Why was Jeff Bennett used in that blowout last night???
Isn’t Phil Stockman sitting in the bullpen???
By Efrim
May 22, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
Lee in S. GA
Yea, Deion was a character. Didn’t he run his 40 at the combine in Timberland workboots? I believe he did, and ran it in like 4.2 seconds or something. Absurd.
By ncgary
May 22, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this
champagne, carver the twit he is went ballistic threatening to sue
By 82DAWG
May 22, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this
Braves’ rollercoaster in improbable ascent? They are playing the Mets for crying out loud. Of course they are going to ascend!
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this
I don’t know where you are “Gary”, but the Marlins took game two of the Marlins vs Diamondbacks series and they also handed BRandon Webb his first loss of the season. Now do you consider the Marlins to be contenders???? The media seems to think that they are….FINALLY.
I’m not Gary, but I don’t expect the Marlins to hang in there.
Again, the Marlins are 10th in the league in OBP, 9th in runs scored, hitters are last in walks, 8th in runs allowed, 15th in pitcher strikeouts, 10th in pitcher walks and 8th in ERA, only two of their starters have been particularly good and their other starters are pretty significantly below average. They have 8 wins against Washington and 5 against Milwaukee. That’s half their wins right there.
Regarding the Marlins beating Webb, it’s one freakin’ game! I don’t know how long you’ve been a baseball fan, but you probably know by now that it’s silly to assume a team is a good one just because they were able to beat a Cy Young candidate once.
By Random
May 22, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this
Slow down, Jersey Girl!!
Your fingers are getting all twisted up.
By Deep Throat
May 22, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this
No to instant replay. Once you give the proponents of it an inch, they’ll inevitably try to take a mile.
First it’s fair or foul homeruns. Than it’s down-the-line basehits. Than traps. Than safe-or-out calls at the bags. Than, no-doubt, after a really bad ball/strike call in a close Yankees’ game or in the playoffs, it will be something along the lines of allowing three contested ball/strike calls per game, per team to be reviewed via instant replay.
I prefer instant replay never get even the most little bit off the ground in baseball. Cause if it does, make no mistake, it WILL snowball into more and more things being “reviewable”.
This game has lasted just fine for well over one hundred years in this country without instant replay, thank you very much.
By Greg in TN
May 22, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this
Morning gang…
CSX couldn’t provide a train wreck better than what we’re seeing front and center with those amazin’ mediocres. To be sure there are lots to be said by the Flushing faithful when baseball is being played and the amazin’ mediocres are winning, but today’s met troll free zone is being provided by the longest continuously operating franchise in Major League Baseball, the Atlanta Braves.
Looks like Frenchy’s day off did him a world of good. Everyone needs a day off from time to time no matter what you do. I think that if Murph had a couple extra days off from time to time in the mid 80s, those last few years might have been written a little differently.
Congrats to the Offensive Assassin for tying the great #3 on the all-time home run list. Folks, clear off a spot for #10 on the facade of the 755 Club at some point in time not to mention a place in Cooperstown. Bravo Chipper.
Have to chuckle at Ryan Church’s comments following slide-gate Tuesday night, from his bed at Piedmont hospital. He said he’d do the same thing again. Somewhere in NYC, there must be dentists falling all over each other trying to get Ryan Church as their patient.
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this
you’re a real man, deion. a real man.
By timthebrave
May 22, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this
The Mets are starting to play dirty. The slide into escobar was dirty although church won’t get fined since he knocked his dirty a* out. Then they hit Chipper in a game when they are down by almost 10 runs. I think Hudson should hit Wright. An eye for an eye beetches
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
Greg in TN: Agreed on Church’s stubborn and/or macho assertion he’d do same thing again. If he does, then don’t be surprised if that rocked-armed throw from Escobar is aimed directly at his head instead of first base…
Braves WILL face Brandon Webb, by the way. I wrote otherwise here last night. He’s set to pitch Monday in the Memorial Day game, against Jurrjens, who hasn’t lost in 10 career home starts with Tigers and Braves.
Jurrjens is 4-0 with a 1.48 ERA in five home starts this season.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this
N8, right. I think any play that they now call a conference on, should be subject to replay, in my opinion. That would actually save time, in my view.
Efrim, Deion was 0-for-5 in the NLCS with 3 strikeouts and no walks. So maybe McCarver’s criticism was understandable (and for the record, I’m no McCarver fan as an analyst).
But he was 8-for-15 in the World Series against the Blue Jays with 2 doubles, 2 walks and 4 runs.
keylargo, the Marlins pitching may get better. But I can’t see those pitchers making that much of a difference and if not those same pitchers other pitchers will likely get hurt at some point this season. Also, their pitching getting better doesn’t change the fact that their hitters rank near the bottom in on-base and last in walks. Their pitching will have a hard time making up for that at some point; namely when they stop facing Washington and Milwaukee’s pitching staffs.
By Cecil34
May 22, 2008 10:20 AM | Link to this
116 left…
65 wins to go….
I expect a sweep of the Mess tonight.
By AGTfan
May 22, 2008 10:21 AM | Link to this
It’s almost the end of June. I have to think we need to start taking the Marlins seriously. Freddi is doing a great job getting the most out his players. They have done a great job of drafting, scouting, and developing a group of talented young players. This has really excited both of the Marlins fans.
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this
I know there�s never intent with a breaking ball hitting a batter. But it appeared to be a heater to me, and I know what a breaking ball looks like.Smokey
Do you? It was a hard slider, Smokey.
You throw at someone, you throw a fastball at their butt or midsection. You don’t “aim” a slider at their shins.
But why am I bothering to explain. You know already, apparently.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 10:24 AM | Link to this
It’s hard to me to take either side in the McCarver-Deion fiasco of ‘92. I think McCarver is a know-it-all and Deion didn’t exactly seem like the most mature human being on the planet (hopefully he’s grown up some).
Deep Throat, I don’t know about that. What makes you think there would be a slippery slope regarding the use of instant replay? It would be extremely difficult to use it on balls and strikes, so I don’t think that would ever happen. It’s just not practical.
People (Luddites, just kidding,) said the same thing about baseball on TV. “Fans will stop going to the park.”
And has everything been just fine without replay? Why don’t you ask Don Derkinger if he’s been just fine? Replay could have saved him a lot of grief.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this
Tonight is a big night for the Braves and the Mets. The Braves need to go for the kill! A sweep tonight could spell the end for Willie Randolph. Hell, he may get fired tonight!
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this
DOB and Greg, I agree. I almost think Church should have just peeled off and not bothered even going in to second. The Mets desperately need your bat in the lineup and you are going to make a foolish slide trying to break up a double play in a game your team has all but lost.
By Greg in TN
May 22, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this
DOB
I think Ryan will learn that discretion is the better part of valor. Either that, or he’ll be the one to go to when teammates need to whistle for a cab in Manhattan.
There was a brief video clip of Soriano on the mound last night at Smokies Park over in Sevierville. I am planning on making the drive over and that would be a nice bonus to see an inning of rehab work if the earlier plans that have him going again tomorrow night are still in place. If that is the case, I’ll have an update for the blog when I get back from the ballpark.
By AGTfan
May 22, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this
DOB
I don’t really think the hit batters were intentional, but there were so many of them the last 2 days. Do they maybe have a pitching philosophy of pitching nside a lot to move batters off the plate? I don’t ever remember seeing that many batters hit by pitches in 3 games when there wasn’t some purposeful beaning and retaliation going on.
By Thrillhouse44
May 22, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this
It’s obvious Chipper hasn’t had much practice flipping his bat in disgust. He may want to practice that at some point, because nearly knocked himself out last night.
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this
The inevitable Ryan Howard warming trend has arrived. Three hits, two homers Wednesday night.
By Random
May 22, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this
KC —
Why should Cox let the Mets see Stockman for free, and start a book on him before it actually counts for us?
I agree with your sentiment, though — I think Resop should have been used for two innings.
Yeah, Shaun — No special gagget in baseball please.
You got that, buddy?
By Jon
May 22, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this
Just read that Greg Maddux might approve a trade to a contender. Mr. Wren please rescue him from baseball purgatory (San Diego) to reassemble the “Big Three” for a last hurrah. They just might have enough left for one more time.
By Irrational Crazy Loon (tounge-in-cheek)
May 22, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this
Fo-get that logic DOB. It was intentamable! Reading the posts on this blog in rassponse to the two HBPs last night, it’s clear the only sane response is to hit Wright in the head with a pitch and make him the new Ray Chapman. That will show them thar Mets not to accidently hit any Braves’ hitters.
By kdbanks
May 22, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this
The Braves don’t play the Mets again until Aug. 19th, according to the poll question.
That is absurd. I hate the way the scheduling has been done the past few years. I don’t know if MLB uses a computer program or outsources it to Jupiter, but they need to fix it.
Teams should play their divisional rivals at least every six weeks or so. Don’t we play each team between 15 and 18 times?
I understand inter-league play disrupts some things, and I know the end of the year is backloaded with divisional games, but there must be a way to make the schedule more evenly spread out in terms of divisional games.
Maybe not, since I’m not a mathematician, but surely some smart kid at Tech could do a better job than this. And that’s from a UGA fan.
By 22oz
May 22, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this
From Jon Heyman on SI this morning:
Hard as it is for most to believe, the dirt-cheap Marlins have disrupted the expected two-team duel between the Mets and Phillies in the National League East.
Good to see not everyone jumped on the Braves bandwagon at season’s start.
By ContactBuzz
May 22, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this
I know it’s a game away but speaking of B Webb vs. Jurrjens on Monday - the DBacks are 8-13 outside of the NL West (20-5 vs. the NL West).
I hope the Braves can help the snakes maintain that discrepancy.
By Daybed Wagmoe
May 22, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this
Bill Shanks once again had a phone interview this morning with Athens’ radio station 960 The Ref. He’s all for some brawling tonight, and you can listen to the entire conversation here
Tonight’s Lineup — I hope that you have a makeover later today. The only two games that the Braves have lost vs. the Mets this year have been without Chipper and Escobar.
Coincidentally, Escobar is hitting .313 in 16 at-bats (.771 OPS) vs. the Mess this year. Chipper is doing his normal song and dance, hitting .364 (1.045 OPS) in 22 at-bats vs. them this year.
By keylargo
May 22, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this
I did some research on the Marlins pithing and found out the following:
Josh Johnson is recovering from Tommy John surgury and will return in the fall. He was 12 - 7 in 06 and is a top 3 starter.
Sergio Mitre is projected to be back in June from a forearm strain. He was viewed as a top of the rotation starter.
Anibal Sanchez had shoulder surgery and is expected back at the All Star break. Very high expectations; Threw a no hitter vs. Arizona Diamondbacks.
Those guys aren’t exactly Chris Reitsma and Bob Wickman are they? I am 100% a Braves fan but you Have to admire what the Marlins are doing with a payroll that is less than what Tex THINKS he is worth. I would be pulling for the young Marlins to win the wildcard - with the Braves obviously winning the division - if they didn’t have a history of winning the World Series once they get to the playoffs.
By Jon
May 22, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this
The slide by Church was a dirty play; he got what he deserved. He was so far out of the basepath he couldn’t have touched second base if he was Rubberman. But Cox was right in shrugging it off: no point if stirring things up, it might bring the Mets to life.
I do remember the game when the code of retribution required Glavine to throw at Dale Murphy. They were such soft tosses that you had to laugh.
By RC
May 22, 2008 10:57 AM | Link to this
Not to single out Jon Heyman for that comment, but I can’t even read Sports Illustrated online anymore. They CONSISTENTLY have wrong information, and make no apologies for it. I remember reading their season preview stuff and there was so much wrong information that I just knew off the top of my head, I quit reading them all together. ESPN can be annoying with their wide reaching web, as well as plugging the same stories (YANKS-SOX!!! YANKS-SOX!!! YANKS-SOX!!!) but they DO make it a point to be accurate in the information they print, and when I read their columnists I at least get the impression they actually watch baseball. Well, except for Keith Law.
By DAP
May 22, 2008 10:58 AM | Link to this
AGTfan This has really excited both of the Marlins fans.
very nice.
im against instant replay. very rarely do umpires really miss calls. they are trained very well, and know the game, and they usually do a great job. plus, i enjoy the human element in baseball. its not always going to go your way, it isnt even fair all the time(usually it is). but thats part of the game. i love love the human element that instant replay would limit.
i think a better way to go about it is to have more umps, like in the playoffs. i think someone mentioned this earlier. if youve got umps up the line in the out field, youll have extra eyes on those calls that are hard for the infield umps, traps, and fair/foul homeruns.
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this
I think you can see some of the fruits of the McDowell pitching philosophy in the groundball out to flyball out ratios of the Braves’ pitchers. Here are some ratios:
JoJo - 3:1
Jair - 2:1
Hudson - 2.4:1
Acosta - 2:1
Bennett - 2.4:1
Glavine - 1.5:1
Royce Ring only has a 1:1 right now but for his career has a 2:1
And the biggest wormkiller of all, Peter Moylan, has been out
It seems McDowell is surrounding himself with a bunch of wormkillers. It’s a big reason why the Braves have given up the least amount of homers in the NL and have the lowest SLG against
By Lew
May 22, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
Did anyone else notice that last night, not a single Mets’ player sliding into second actually aimed for the base? Every Damned one of them went directly for the player making the pivot to first. Not a single one even reached for the base. Not one.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this
Thanks on the info regarding the “extra base-hits”, in the past few days. Makes sense. I guess I’m not looking for them to be a “singles” machine. Walks, singles, doubles and triples will do just fine. I’d prefer it that way. I absolutely HATE it when they “wait” on the HR to carry them to victory. The homers will eventually come, but their “HITTING” in general has been better.
N8, here is something from Diamond Mind Baseball (http://www.diamond-mind.com/articles/proj2005.htm):
One way to evaluate team production is to compute total bases plus walks (TBW) produced and allowed. When we refer to TBW differential, we mean the difference between these two figures. History tells us that if you outproduce your opponents by 150 TBW or more, you have a good chance to be playing in October.
A huge part of baseball is obviously to “out-base” your opponents. So while homeruns are not necessary, they are extremely helpful and not many teams have good offenses without relying on the homerun.
(Not saying you, N8, deny this. But I know there are some who don’t like the power game.)
By nolie
May 22, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this
That being said, if Chipper weren’t here, he’d be a perfect #3 hitter, though DOB has said in the past (when I suggested it when Chipper was hurt), that Bobby won’t do it as to NOT clog up the basepaths with McCann’s lack of speed.N8
I think I’d have to agree with DOB on that one. McCann is too slow for the three hole, 4 or 5 would be better. Three guy is still looking to score about as much as drive in 4 & 5 are more RBI spots and McCann is more suited to that IMO.
By DAP
May 22, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this
shanks also said hed be surprised if escobar didnt go on the DL.
By nolie
May 22, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this
Why was Jeff Bennett used in that blowout last night???
Isn’t Phil Stockman sitting in the bullpen?KC
I don’t know why. Resop was available too. I am a staunch Cox advocate but the one thing he does that mystifies me at times is putting a good reliever in when he might not need to. I’m sure he has his reasons, and those are backed with 40 years of experience, but sometimes I just can’t figure it out either.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this
Rick Sutcliffe made an excellent point about the Mets last night that could also be used for the Braves at times. He said the Mets have no true leader. Every team needs a Jason Varitek. He made the comment that guys in the Red Sox clubhouse are afraid of Varitek and don’t want to slack because they know they will have to deal with him. He went on to say that David Wright has to be that player but is reluctant to do it much like Chipper Jones was and I think still is to some degree.
I totally agree. Every team needs that guy. Every sports team who is successful has that guy. I think Smoltz is like that with the other pitchers but the team as a whole. I believe Chipper Jones has to be that guy and possibly groom Brian McCann to take over for him once he is gone.
Just look at the situations and think about it. Varitek garners a lot of respect in that Red Sox clubhouse. He is the one guy who can keep Schilling in check. The Mets don’t have that guy. Billy Wagner can’t be that guy because he pops off a bit too much publicly. You never hear Varitek go off in public but it often gets publicized how he gets in his teammates a*! That is a true clubhouse leader. I hope Chipper does the same for the Braves and keeps this team focused.
By Random
May 22, 2008 11:23 AM | Link to this
intentamable
That certainly bears repeating —
INTENTAMABLE!!!
Good one.
By ukuga
May 22, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
Shaun,
If Denkinger-type plays were reviewable then Deep Throat is right, instant replay will have gone too far.
If we can’t let umpires make safe/out calls without a monitor, then what can we let them do?
By timthebrave
May 22, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
Dave O Brien, I don’t think he was trying to hurt him but I have thrown hard sliders at a player that hit a hr off of me. If I throw a fastball at his back it’s way too obvious.
By FJR
May 22, 2008 11:30 AM | Link to this
Here is my take on the whole slidegate thing. Ryan Church is frustrated. He comes over from the Nats and thinks he finally is on a talented team that will make the playoffs. He’s licking his lips at the kind of lineup he is finally going to hit in. Dreams of going to the world series are dancing in his frequently injured head.
Then he gets there and the players on his team, despite all their talent, just don’t seem to care and aren’t playing hard. So he plays even harder, because that is what he does. However, he starts playing so hard it occasionally goes over the line.
Is it stupid? Yeah, obviously. Is he going to get himself seriously hurt if he keeps doing it? A good chance. Would the mets be better off if more guys on their team played that hard? Absolutely.
Yes, there is a difference between playing hard and playing stupid, but when you look at it from how unbelievably frustrated Church must be right now, its somewhat understandable. Sure it sucks that Escobar got taken out, but Church’s second concussion was payback enough.
A 4 game sweep would be the best payback. If the Braves were playing listlessly like the mets right now, I’d be all for a little retaliation to get the team fired up. However, the braves are playing brilliant baseball right now and there is NO need to mess with that and risk some suspensions throwing the train off the tracks. Lets get a sweep and keep this train rolling and keep it rolling right through the best team in then NL, the D-Backs.
I can gurantee you that the Mets need a bench clearing brawl more then the braves do, so lets not give them exactly what they need. I’d be more than happy to see them continue to sleepwalk through the rest of the season with no fire in their play.
By AGTfan
May 22, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this
Maybe not, since I’m not a mathematician, but surely some smart kid at Tech could do a better job than this. And that’s from a UGA fan. Maybe the problem is they have a UGA grad doing the schedule. ;-)
I swear I’m just kidding. I just couldn’t resist that one.
I am 100% a Braves fan but you Have to admire what the Marlins are doing with a payroll that is less than what Tex THINKS he is worth. keylargo
You have to wonder what it takes to get people in Miami excited about baseball. You’d think they’d be packing the stadium now, but Most teams have more hot dog vendors in the stands than the Marlins have fans.
By RC
May 22, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this
Robert (CITB),
While I agree with you that each clubhouse needs a guy who will put someone in their place, I TOTALLY disagree that Chipper has ever been relucant to fill that role. I remember early in his career hearing a story about how his rookie season he went off on one of the veteran players (Gant maybe?) for not playing as well as Chipper thought he should. It was a big deal because everone was shocked to hear a rookie go off on a veteran like that, but because he played as hard as he did his words carried weight. As far as the guy who can carry that torch for the future, I don’t think there is any doubt that that player is Jeff Francouer. From all reports he’s very much the vocal clubhouse leader, already serving as the team players rep to the union in his 4th season (I think he started that role in his 3rd). Plus, there’s the great story from the World Baseball Classic in which A-Rod was giving a clubhouse attendant a hard time for messing up his sandwich order, and Francouer supposedly walked across the clubhouse, got in A-Rod’s face, and said, “Why don’t you shut the f* up?” I think anyone willing to do that to the best player in the game as a 23 year-old is more than qualified to be a clubhouse leader.
By N8
May 22, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this
Shaun
I completely agree with “out-basing” your opponent. How can you not agree with that? It’s just that IMO, the HR is so much harder to do against the elite pitching, that it seems to explain SOME of our failures in the post-season.
As a team under Bobby Cox, the team has feasted off of the lesser pitchers in games 1-162 (and even sometimes “gettint” to the great pitchers), but when the chips are on the table, it hasn’t gone so well in the post-season.
I think the truly GREAT power hitters, try to hit line-drives and the HR’s just come. It’s when guys like Andruw and occasionally Francoeur, (Klesko also comes to mind), go up their and swing for the fenses. That seems to fail everytime.
So you are right, I get it, and am NOT opposed to it. I just wish the hitters would be more selective and patient. Patience doesn’t always require that the hitter “take” 5 pitches, just “waiting” for their pitch, like Chipper said he’s been doing this year.
It appears as though the entire team has been doing so, the past week or so.
Let’s hope it keeps up when they hit the road again.
Deepthroat
Have to disagree with your 10:59 post.
“No to instant replay. Once you give the proponents of it an inch, they’ll inevitably try to take a mile.”
They haven’t in the NFL? There are certain things that CAN’T be reviewed. I would think any acceptance of replay in MLB, would NOT include balls and strikes. I wouldn’t be opposed to it being used on close calls at the bases. Why not get it right?
Why not treat it like the NFL, and give the managers “2 challenges”? Seems a little silly, but it seems to work in the NFL, doesn’t it?
Can’t imagine Bobby throwing out the red flag. Would he keep it in his sock like Beli-cheat?
But I do agree with you. It CANNOT be used on “judgement” calls like the strike-zone. Which is what it has come to. NOBODY calls it like it is in the book.
But foul balls, HR’s, traps, calls at the bases are NOT judgment calls. They are either RIGHT or WRONG.
I personally would have no problem with those calls being right all of the time.
By Salty
May 22, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this
I think I’d have to agree with DOB on that one. McCann is too slow for the three hole, 4 or 5 would be better.
He does lead the NL (majors, too?) in doubles. How many would be triples, if he had speed? Or, another way, maybe he does have speed, we just aren’t looking! LOL! How many singles did he leg into doubles?
By Gene Garbage
May 22, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this
HEY DOB-
Why is Shenks such a douche?
How do you like the new MMJ album? The Fox should be a heater. Ever heard of Jeff Innis- Mets middle reliever from 89-92? Works in our office- pretty cool to pick his brain
By Salty
May 22, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this
Three funny scenes in baseball so far this week: 1. Kelly and Reyes diving head first into second last night on the liner KJ caught…thought they were going to bang heads! 2. Edmunds laughing and dodging Carlos Lee’s ‘tackle’ after Edmunds catch in center field. 3. Kotsay hamming it up with the 3rd base umps strike call in the first inning…classic!
By AGTfan
May 22, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this
I’m pretty much opposed to instant replay for baseball. I don’t think there have been enough cases of truly atrocious calls to justify taking so much of the human element out the game.
One of the things I’ve noticed since I’ve been reduced to following the games online, is that I’m a lot calmer. I don’t spend much energy cursing the umpires. In some ways I miss that. Ragging the umps is a part of being a fan.
Back in the 6 or 7 thousand fans a game days at Atlanta Fulton County I got on an ump so bad he had me removed from my seat behind home plate. I’m not proud of that one, but I do miss being able to second guess the umps.
By nolie
May 22, 2008 11:53 AM | Link to this
I remember early in his career hearing a story about how his rookie season he went off on one of the veteran players (Gant maybe?) for not playing as well as Chipper thought he should. It was a big deal because everone was shocked to hear a rookie go off on a veteran like that, but because he played as hard as he did his words carried weight.RobertCITB
yeah I remember that. Chipper has also said a couple of times,once not too long ago, that he was really chastised in the clubhouse twice in the ‘95 or ‘96 post season for criticizing veteran teammates and that is much of the reason that he backed away some from being a vocal leader. I don’t really agree that every club needs one like that ,but some gung-ho players and most fans think that they do though.
By timthebrave
May 22, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this
I love good old fashioned brawls…I miss the days of Pasqual Perez throwing behind hitters and having a weekly sunday brawl. I don’t miss the sorry baseball I had to watch so maybe it is better to let sleeping dogs lie
By keylargo
May 22, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this
Salty
You got that last question backwards. It’s How many doubles did he leg into singles?
By David-ATL14
May 22, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
Greg in TN
I wnet to the Smokies game last night. Sat right behind the plate.
Soriano threw well and so did Parr.
Soriano is going to work the first inning again on Friday Night then give way to Hanson. Should be a good game to attend.
If you are going let me know ?
By AGTfan
May 22, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
I think the truly GREAT power hitters, try to hit line-drives and the HR’s just come. N8
I agree completely. I think the great hitters would tell you that trying to hit HR’s is the worst thing a batter can do. See the ball, hit the ball, HARD.
By KC
May 22, 2008 11:58 AM | Link to this
Random: You bring up a good point… but the Mets getting a good look at him would only matter if Bobby plans to use Stockman in close-game situations. If he’s pitching in a 10-run game… who cares whether or not they’re familiar with him?
But so far, he hasn’t even used with 5-8 run leads.
I’m just very frustrated by the unnecessary use of key bullpen arms over the past couple days (Boyer and Acosta pitching in game-1 of the DH, and Bennett throwing last night in a blowout), when he could have saved those guys and gone to other relievers to finish it out.
By Lew
May 22, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
AGTFan-Dude, if a UGA grad were doing the schedule, it would make sense (something apart from mathematical logic). There would be plenty of travel time, time to grab a brew or two and time to eat well, sleep well and have time left over for playing video games.
No. Must be a Tech Guy-they never think of practicalities. Comes from thinking like those machines they design.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this
ukuga, I actually agree about Denkinger calls; normal safe-out calls at first base. I guess the only reason I bring that up is to show that obviously umpires can’t make the correct call all the time and never will. Why not use replay in certain situations in order to increase the number of times they do get it right? Like whenever they must call an umpire conference to get the call right. Because conferring takes just as long as looking at a replay, but the umpires are sure to get it right with replay.
By Salty
May 22, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
keylargo Good one!
By timthebrave
May 22, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
I think the key tonight for Hudson is keeping Reyes off the bases. How ever he plays so goes the Mets. Since the middle of last season he has been slumping and so have the Mets. He seems to be a huge distraction on the base paths.
By chase
May 22, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
Does everyone know that The MET’s announcers, specifically Kieth Hernandez were actually saying THE METS HAD TO HIT CHIPPER and that was BEFORE THEY DID!!!!
What does that say about the Muts whole organization and everyone involved?
It’s like they’re saying “We can’t beat’em fair and square so we’re gonna try to hurt them”
That’s 4 hit batters in two days and two questionable slides at second base (one was dirty for sure)
Let’s sweep their dirty @zzes!!!
By TennesseePaul
May 22, 2008 12:09 PM | Link to this
Morning Blog. Great game last night. I love it when the Braves pile up the runs. I hope Chipper recovers swiftly.
I heard the chatter on ESPN about the idea of replay in the game and I see it here as well. I’m agin it. The beautiful thing about this game is it is three groups of men performing in an arena governed by 90 foot lines, 3 strikes, 3 outs, 330 down the lines, with success measured at .300 over 162 9 innings games. It contains the relationships and actions of men to be tested and tried against men and by men. This game was never intended to be fast paced. It’s an on going conversation. A pastime. I’d like to see it stay that way. The umpires’ botch call is just as much a part of the game as a second baseman’s botched double play attempt. You don’t want to see either on a regular basis but sometimes you need so on occasion.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this
RC, you could be right. I had never heard that story about Frenchy and Arod.
Nolie, every team needs that guy in the clubhouse or locker room. Look at some of the great franchises or teams in the history of sports and tell me one of them that did not have such a player. The Bulls had Michael Jordan. With the Lakers of late it was Derek Fisher. The Patriots have Teddy Bruschi. The Yankees have Derek Jeter. The Braves of the 90’s had David Justice and Mark Lemke. The Cowboys of the 90s had Michael Irvin (as much as it pains me to say that). The 49ers had Jerry Rice.
Every team needs a player who is a leader. Sometimes players won’t listen when it comes from management or coaches but will listen to other players especially if they are veterans. Besides, Nolie, saying “gung ho” players are the ones who say teams need a clubhouse leader is a bit ridiculous don’t you think. It is usually the “gung ho” players who have to be reigned in by the clubhouse leaders.
By Salty
May 22, 2008 12:12 PM | Link to this
KC…it may be Bobby doesn’t want to show the league what Stockman has if one of the relievers is due back quite soon. Joe Simpson actually voiced my thought when Wagner came in last night: why let the Braves see him when he may be needed Thursday night? That could benefit the Braves tonight, in my view.
By nolie
May 22, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this
How many singles did he leg into doubles?Salty
as hard as he’s been hitting the ball and as slow as he is it might be better asked how many triples has he floundered and stumbled into doubles. :-)
By Daybed Wagmoe
May 22, 2008 12:15 PM | Link to this
chase — yeah, I read something about the Mets’ announcers saying that earlier on in the blog. Was it right after the homer? What was the context? Did he say something like “I wouldn’t be surprised if they come inside to Chipper next time he’s up,” or was it more like, “They’ve got to go after Chipper and send him a message later on”??
By DAP
May 22, 2008 12:16 PM | Link to this
i think we’ll get a good start from hudson tonight. last time, he had an unusually bad start. if he had made a typical hudson start, or even a mediocre hudson start, we would have won that game and we’d be undefeated on the home stand.
he will right the ship tonight, and thorw a gem. im not gonna predict a braves win, cause im not sure, but i do predict that hudson will NOT get the loss.
id like to say that we need to have the same game plan with santana as the other guys, but santana is a much better pitcher. he dosnt walk alot of guys, and stikes out a bunch. the braves are gonna have to be a little less patient today, i think. foul pitches off, and hope he elevates a few changups to lefties (mccann, kotsay, johnson will probably all be in the lineup)
By ernesto
May 22, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this
Lew - I noticed Reyes was 2 feet from the base when he slid in causing the Infante error.
How was he not called for interference?
He couldn’t even touch the bag from where he slid to.
Even the Mets announcers up here said he interfered. You’d think the umps would be looking for it after last night. Yeesh!
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 12:19 PM | Link to this
N8, yeah, the “give them an inch and they’ll take a mile” argument is a really flawed one, in my opinion. I’ve never ever heard any proponent of replay propose using it on every single play or even every single close play or on balls and strike calls.
And I don’t think strikes and balls are judgment calls. Just because some umpires have their own strikezone and it’s “always been that way” doesn’t mean we should accept it. The strikezone is not subjective nor should it be.
Here’s an idea (that the umpires would probably never go for): Publish umpire statistics. Create a branch, headed by former umpires, that evaluates every aspect of umpiring and publish the results for all to see. Why shouldn’t the umpires be subject to the same scrutiny as the players?
If the umpires don’t perform to certain standards they are sent down and the best are called up from the minors.
I do think with the data that is becoming more and more accessible, someone with the time and skills is going to start publishing objective evaluations of umpires.
By AmazinsAgain08
May 22, 2008 12:20 PM | Link to this
Wow! youse guys have played three fantastic games. Most everything you’ve tried has worked out well. At least we have a chance to win today with Santana pitching even thou Hudson can be tough no doubt. Looks like youse guys are coming together while we are falling apart. I guess the telltale will be your Snakes series and then whether youse can start winning on the road. Youse sure look like heroes at home.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this
Yeah, I don’t know why Randolph brought Wagner into the game last night. I understand he hadn’t pitched since Saturday and I’m assuming that is the reason. He should’ve been on a pitch count though because the Braves made him work a bit and that could definitely benefit the Braves tonight. But, lets hope the Braves have a big enough lead where Wagner won’t be needed.
By BossLady
May 22, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this
Randolph Being Fired? Joe Simpson mentioned that the struggle in New York with the Mets front office and Manager is causing this destruction to the team.
The Latino influence of the players is going over Willie Randolph head to Minaya. The players are pouting and underperforming due to their showing up Randolph. If this is true it is bad for the major leagues. If the GM is intefering with Manager’s job (like Arthur Blank) it will only disrupt the game.
Understandable it is that David Wright, Billy Wagner and Randolph who have spoken out on this was criticized this way in New York. The media is adding fuel into this fire and it has become crazy.
Actually Bobby Cox would sit them and let some youngsters play if they don’t want to work. But, in New York the Manager has to answer to the GM, the owners, fans and to the media. There is no way that Randolph can control these guys play on the field.
By keylargo
May 22, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this
Salty
How good would McCann’s bat be mounted on Deion’s legs? Think he could hit .400?
By Salty
May 22, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this
When McCann hit the triple he legged into the ‘wheels up’ hard landing a few weeks back, I believe Joe Simpson asked him if the video did justice to his speed. Brian said something to the effect that, “Yes, I’m as slow as it looked.” Gotta like the sense of humor!
By DAP
May 22, 2008 12:27 PM | Link to this
10paul It contains the relationships and actions of men to be tested and tried against men and by men.
beautiful. and i totally agree with you.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 12:27 PM | Link to this
TennesseePaul, I guess I’m of the opinion that somebody botching something should never be embraced. If a second baseman botches too many plays, he’s in the minors or out of baseball.
Yes, I realize there is no way to stop all botched calls. But that doesn’t mean it should be embraced as part of the game or that no one should try to decrease botched calls.
By TennesseePaul
May 22, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
DOB: When are they going to put your picture up at the top of the blog like they do with all the other writers…?
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
I really don’t see the big deal about instant replay. Would it really take any longer than the umps all getting together and discussing the situation for five minutes? I highly doubt it. They got together for over three minutes the other night in New York and still got it wrong.
By FJR
May 22, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this
The more I’ve thought about this, the more its clear to me. We CANNOT give the mets exactly what they want. The Mets desperately need a big fight to put some fire in them. Having Huddy pelt somebody and inciting a HBP war and bench clearing brawl woudl take us out of our game and give the mets something to fire them up. If we do what a lot of denizens are proposing, we’d be playing right into their hands.
Right now the Mets seem like the idiot trying to pick a fight to show what a man they are and get the cool. calm and collected guy out of his element. In those cases, the worst thing you can do is let the idiot get his way. Just kind of laugh at them and sweep their butts right out of town.
By Lew
May 22, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
On Instant Replay-Y’all, people freak out when your team has a long inning at bat and your pitcher has to sit through it. What is going to happen if they have to sit through all those replays? I for one don’t want to have to listen to everyone b!tch about the delays and the adverse effects they have on the pitcher.
The Umpires make the correct call an amazing percentage of the time. Leave well enough alone.
By nolie
May 22, 2008 12:44 PM | Link to this
Nolie, every team needs that guy in the clubhouse or locker room. Look at some of the great franchises or teams in the history of sports and tell me one of them that did not have such a player.RobertCITB
Ive been around several teams that had no outstanding leader in the clubhouse that still won. The old A’s team that won a ton sure didn’t have one, all they did was fight and bicker with each other. I just don’t agree that it’s as necessity in baseball as it is perhaps in football and basketball , the approaches are different between different sports; and when there is one he usually does not spend all that much time reining in gung-ho players he usually tries to lead all players in playing the correct way and with measured enthusiasm, depending on the situation of course. He’s more likely to jump on a guy who is under-producing that someone who is too gung-ho. Smoltz himself is a gung-ho dude.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this
How good would McCann’s bat be mounted on Deion’s legs? Think he could hit .400?
keylargo, that reminds me of a chapter in the book Baseball Between the Numbers. Great book. In it there is a chapter “What if Rickey Henderson had Pete Incaviglia’s legs?”
The books uses these specific questions like these to answer broad baseball questions like how valuable is speed.
Probably learned more from that book than any baseball book I’ve ever read.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 12:47 PM | Link to this
Lew, the league could give each team one “challenge” per game. That way the game can only be delayed twice. And if the use for replay is limited to fair or foul and homeruns than the chances of the game being delayed twice is very minimal. Instant replay would cause no more of a delay than the umps getting together to disucss a call or pitchers who needlessly throw over to 1B ten times in an at-bat or the batter who has to adjust his nuts 15 times in one at-bat.
By Random
May 22, 2008 12:48 PM | Link to this
22oz: “Good to see not everyone jumped on the Braves bandwagon at season’s start.”
Or has yet, even.
Lew: “not a single Mets’ player sliding into second actually aimed for the base”
Who and how many would that be (besides Church twice)?
nolie: “I don’t know why [Jeff Bennett was used in that blowout last night??? Isn’t Phil Stockman sitting in the bullpen?KC]”
See here or here.
8-)
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
On Instant Replay-Y’all, people freak out when your team has a long inning at bat and your pitcher has to sit through it. What is going to happen if they have to sit through all those replays?
Lew, what do you mean by “all those replays”? Again, who is proposing using replay on anything other than plays that take a long time anyway? Plays that the umpires have to spend their time conferring on or arguing with managers, coaches and players on?
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
Gene Garbage, I haven’t heard the entire new MMJ album, only a couple of songs they played on SNL. Been too busy this week. Gotta say, didn’t like the songs on SNL as much as I’ve loved their previoius stuff, but need to hear the recorded versions probably….
TennesseePaul, AJC doesn’t run anyone’s photo at top of blogs except columnists. Not “all the other writers.” Just columnists. I’m a beat writer, bro.
Hey, that sounds like a good name for a band: “I’m A Beat Writer, Bro”
By FloridaBrave
May 22, 2008 12:53 PM | Link to this
DOB, I totally agree with your 10:13 a.m. post. When playing HS ball, our SS got beat up a little bit by hard, late slides so our coach pulled him aside and told him next time he got a double play ball to drop down sidearm and let the baserunner worry about getting out of the way. Lo and behold the team got the message after one guy nearly getting decapitated and their guys started sliding a lot earlier.
And I agree with RC as to our clubhouse leader. I love McCann but he’s pretty laid-back. Frenchy definitely has the football mentality and I LOVED the story about A-Rod. If Escobar learns English I wouldn’t count him out either.
By RC
May 22, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this
Robert (CITB),
While I agree with you that each clubhouse needs a guy who will put someone in their place, I TOTALLY disagree that Chipper has ever been relucant to fill that role. I remember early in his career hearing a story about how his rookie season he went off on one of the veteran players (Gant maybe?) for not playing as well as Chipper thought he should. It was a big deal because everone was shocked to hear a rookie go off on a veteran like that, but because he played as hard as he did his words carried weight. As far as the guy who can carry that torch for the future, I don’t think there is any doubt that that player is Jeff Francouer. From all reports he’s very much the vocal clubhouse leader, already serving as the team players rep to the union in his 4th season (I think he started that role in his 3rd). Plus, there’s the great story from the World Baseball Classic in which A-Rod was giving a clubhouse attendant a hard time for messing up his sandwich order, and Francouer supposedly walked across the clubhouse, got in A-Rod’s face, and said, “Why don’t you shut the f* up?” I think anyone willing to do that to the best player in the game as a 23 year-old is more than qualified to be a clubhouse leader.
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this
I just don’t see the need for instant replay. Missed calls are missed calls. They happen. It’s not fun being on the wrong end of a Jeffrey Maier play but I still don’t see the need.
And it will waste time. One manager will come out and argue. The replay will be done. If it is reversed, the other manager will then be obliged to come out and argue for purposes of putting on a show, saving face or pretending to fight for his team.
There aren’t enough missed calls and the severity of the missed calls is not enough to justify the wasted expenditure of valuable time, labor and monetary resources. The game already takes way too long to play as is because of television.
What you are likely to see too is what you see in football. Refs are just calling things catches, fumbles and touchdowns because they know it can be reversed if they get it wrong. They are no longer as worried about getting it right on the field. They have become too dependent upon replay.
If there is a fumble but the guy’s knee might have been down, they don’t blow the whistle anymore. They just let it play out and let the booth take care of whether the knee was down first.
Instant replay will probably just cause umps on the field to be more inaccurate than they already are because they know the booth will get it right.
Also, in football, they do quick snaps trying to avoid a play from being reviewed. In baseball, they will just try to quick pitch if there is something semi-controversial on the prior play.
The opposing manager will know this, so he will be more likely to come out and waste a whole mess of time arguing than he normally would have so that his team is not quick pitched against. He will do it because the booth otherwise will not have a chance to review a call if he is quick pitched against. These extra arguments will waste even more time.
By TexasBrave
May 22, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this
FJR completely agree with your 12:35. A fight might band them together. Let’s whip their butts tonight against their best pitcher and send them into an even greater tailspin.
By McFann
May 22, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
Salty—
Exactly what McCann said! I have that in an article somewhere. Love that one…
Interesting debate happenin’ here. McCann to first base……I can’t see it. I don’t know why…I just can’t. (Maybe it’s my will power. I don’t want it, so I don’t see it.)
Would be sad but not too shocked to see him as a DH someday. (Very sad to think of him somewhere else—especially the AL.)
McCann does lead the Majors in doubles. And, yeah, if he had more speed, I’m sure there’d be a few more triples in there. But hey, he got another infield hit last night! Better keep an eye on him—he might start stealing bases next. LOL
I like McCann in the 4 or 5 spot. He’s gotta be where he cann drive in runs. He’s scored 24 runs already this year after scoring only 51 last year, but he’s definitely more of an RBI guy—there’s no argument there.
I believe Chipper Jones has to be that guy and possibly groom Brian McCann to take over for him once he is gone. Robert (CIB)
I totally agree.
Tonight’s Lineup
Are you serious, or are you just guessing?
By Efrim
May 22, 2008 1:00 PM | Link to this
RC
Did Frenchy really say “Shut the f*** up” to Alex Rodriguez? Like, seriously? Maybe a “Hey, leave the kid alone” or “take it easy, he is a kid”. But “Shut the f*** up”? I didn’t hear that. I heard he confronted him and said something, but “Shut the f*** up” seems strong and probably would of resulted in a fight that would of been more of a headliner than just Peter Gammons talking about it on Baseball Tonight.
By TennesseePaul
May 22, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this
Yes, I realize there is no way to stop all botched calls. But that doesn’t mean it should be embraced as part of the game or that no one should try to decrease botched calls.
Payne, that make no sense … “that no one should try to decrease botched calls”. Who said this? Instant replay doesn’t decrease botched calls. Replay would occur after an ump made a call that one side contested was botched.
And Lew has an excellent point. For 140 years baseball has managed just fine with no replay because the umps get the call right more often than not. The most frequently contested call in baseball is the ball/strike. The Homerun call that was botched… let’s see I can think of Delgado and then that Yankee game with the fan that’s 2 in the last 12 years… about 63,707 HRs and 2 were botched. That’s a success rate of 99.997%
By McFann
May 22, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this
In terms of leader, I don’t think Mccann would be the vocal leader type, but more the quiet, fallow-his-example type guy.
By TennesseePaul
May 22, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this
AJC doesn’t run anyone’s photo at top of blogs. That’s columnists. Not “all the other writers.” Just columnists.
What about celebrity beat writers? No love that way?
By Salty
May 22, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this
keylargo How good would McCann’s bat be mounted on my legs? LOL!
Lew…with ya, Dude…I’m willing to go with ‘missed’ calls as part of the game. Now, in some countries, that’ll get an official shot; so far, we’re cool in the ol’ US of A!
By fastasballs
May 22, 2008 1:11 PM | Link to this
Anyone think Smoltz is getting close to returning? If he’s dropping to 3/4 & not having the pain he’ll likely be back & rather quickly. The guy is a gamer for sure.
Here’s the question though IF he can throw 3/4 delivery without the pain would he consider starting again? Maybe later in the season, after he gets some innings in & is effective?
By DAP
May 22, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this
shaun i strongly disagree with you on your position. it would be a tragedy for the game of baseball to become automated.
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this
McFann, I can assure you the lineup for a 7:10 p.m. regular-season game could be found in only one place at 1:10 p.m., and that’s in Bobby Cox’s mind, where he’s surely formulating at least two — one with Chipper it in, one without.
And possibly three or four, considering Yunel’s status, too. But after the game last night Bobby said he didn’t know if Yunel would be able to play today. And Yunel told me yesterday “maybe two games.”
I don’t expect to see Yunel in the lineup tonight, and I’m 50-50 on Chipper.
By RC
May 22, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this
On instant replay:
I know the current proposal is only to review with a ball was a HR or not, and I’m fine with that. However, I can think of two other instances in Braves history which I REALLY wish instant replay had been in effect.
1) 1991 World Series, Game 2: Kent Hrbek pulls Ron Gants leg off the bag. Braves lose the game by 1 run, lose the Series by 1 game.
2) 1997 NLCS, Game 5: Livan Hernadez is given a strike zone that extends 2 feet into the left handed batters box by umpire Kevin Gregg, and strikes out 15 Braves on the way to taking a 3-2 lead in series. If there was ever an example of a game in which you’d have to suspect an umpire of being on the take, this is the game. Kevin Gregg is an honorary member of the Tim Dounaghey All-Stars.
By RC
May 22, 2008 1:15 PM | Link to this
On instant replay:
I know the current proposal is only to review with a ball was a HR or not, and I’m fine with that. However, I can think of two other instances in Braves history which I REALLY wish instant replay had been in effect.
1) 1991 World Series, Game 2: Kent Hrbek pulls Ron Gants leg off the bag. Braves lose the game by 1 run, lose the Series by 1 game.
2) 1997 NLCS, Game 5: Livan Hernadez is given a strike zone that extends 2 feet into the left handed batters box by umpire Eric Gregg, and strikes out 15 Braves on the way to taking a 3-2 lead in series. If there was ever an example of a game in which you’d have to suspect an umpire of being on the take, this is the game. Eric Gregg is an honorary member of the Tim Dounaghey All-Stars.
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 1:15 PM | Link to this
In terms of leader, I don’t think Mccann would be the vocal leader type, but more the quiet, fallow-his-example type guy.
That would be an expensive team to feed if they followed his example too much
By bigchiefrg
May 22, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this
Here are a few of Greg Maddux’s high school scouting reports. I thought it was really cool and decided to share them with all my beloved Denizens.
GREG MADDUX HIGH SCHOOL SCOUTING REPORT 1 GREG MADDUX HIGH SCHOOL SCOUTING REPORT 2
By LT-AA Blogger
May 22, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this
DOB,
With Soriano, Gonzales, and Smoltz possibly back in the bullpen in 2-3 weeks, who will be the odd men out on the roster and/or pen?
Also, it’s good to see this team start hitting like I thought they were capable of at the beginning of the season. The move to put Escobar at the top of the lineup seems to really be paying off, and Tex finally starting to heat up is a very good sign.
Here’s to the Bravos bringing the broom tonight and stepping on the Mets throat!!!
Peace
By Salty
May 22, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this
McFann…don’t you know Brian is letting anyone who doesn’t have an infield hit know that ‘speed kills’! LOL!
By TJ
May 22, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this
Here’s an idea (that the umpires would probably never go for): Publish umpire statistics. Create a branch, headed by former umpires, that evaluates every aspect of umpiring and publish the results for all to see. Why shouldn’t the umpires be subject to the same scrutiny as the players?
Shaun, while I agree with you generally on instant replay, I don’t think publishing ump stats would be a good thing.
No matter how good they may be as a group, some umps are gonna be at the “bottom” of that list, and would be subject to a lot of pressure, even disrespect, from fans and even players and managers. I think generally umpires should be as “anonymous” as possible, and a list of their accuracy percentages would defeat that.
I imagine that the league office (or whoever is in charge of the umpires) does have statistics of some kind… like you say, it wouldn’t be that hard with today’s technology to create them.
I’m all for them being evaluated and held accountable, just not publicly.
All that said, I’m surprised some enterprising (private) baseball stat farm hasn’t already created the type of list you describe.
By RC
May 22, 2008 1:20 PM | Link to this
Efrim,
I cannot confirm whether that’s what was actually said. I orginally saw the mention of the story when Gammons wrote about it in one of his columns. I later read an account that said that’s supposedly what was said. Obviously, Gammons couldn’t have printed that even if it is true. So I guess I should have specified that while I have no doubt there was an encounter, the actual language came from much less reliable sources.
By Capt. Caveman (the original dawg)
May 22, 2008 1:20 PM | Link to this
You guys are just making up stuff now.
McCann to 3rd base??? Are you freakin’ serious???
He doesn’t have the talent to play at 3rd. You have to play that bag for years to be able to play at the major league level.
He’s a good catcher. Leave him there.
Why do ya’ll invent stuff like this??
It’s freakin’ hilarious!!
By Salty
May 22, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this
RC Eric Gregg…Kevin was the brother he ate on his way to 350 pounds!
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this
TennesseePaul, you are the one who brought up botched calls. Here’s what you wrote: “The umpires’ botch call is just as much a part of the game as a second baseman’s botched double play attempt. You don’t want to see either on a regular basis but sometimes you need so on occasion.” You brought botched calls in to the replay discussion so I’m assuming you think there is a relationship between botched calls and replay or lack thereof.
And I wouldn’t want replay used only on homerun calls nor would I want it used on ball-strike calls. I would like to see it used on whether a ball was fair or foul. Whether an outfielder trapped a ball or caught a ball. For fan interference calls. Basically plays in the outfield that are tough for umpires to get to and see clearly. And I wouldn’t be opposed to using it on close calls on the base paths in the post-season.
By RC
May 22, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this
Sorry, that should have been ERIC Gregg in my earlier post, not Kevin Gregg.
By Yars
May 22, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this
If both Yunel & Chipper aren’t in the lineup, I guess that means there is a possibility that KJ may start at 2B, even if the southpaw Santana is pitching? We could see Gotay at 3B, Infante at SS, & KJ at 2B. I thought it was against team rules to start KJ against a LH? Hell, we may just see Norton at 2B, or even Blanco. Didn’t Diaz take ground balls at 2B once during his sophomore year of high school? He could fill in at 2B in a pinch. I don’t want to see the Braves getting fined for starting KJ at 2B against a LH. :P
By Salty
May 22, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this
Braveheart What you are likely to see too is what you see in football. Refs are just calling things catches, fumbles and touchdowns because they know it can be reversed if they get it wrong. They are no longer as worried about getting it right on the field. They have become too dependent upon replay.
Spot on!!!
By Random
May 22, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
RC: “Plus, there’s the great story from the World Baseball Classic in which A-Rod was giving a clubhouse attendant a hard time for messing up his sandwich order, and Francouer supposedly walked across the clubhouse, got in A-Rod’s face, and said, “Why don’t you shut the f up?””*
Wow. First I’ve heard of that.
Where can I get the full gouge?
BossLady: “If this is true it is bad for the major leagues. If the GM is intefering with Manager’s job (like Arthur Blank) it will only disrupt the game.”
What about Billy Beane of Oakland? Do the As even have a field manager?
Quick!! What’s his name?
By DAP
May 22, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this
shaun i think i misunderstood a previous post of yours…i thought you would be a fan of the ump not calling balls and strike, but a “k zone” type of situation dictating balls and strikes…which would absolutly be a tragedy if you ask me. the K zone is a bunch of Krap.
i also thing the the strike zone IS subjective even if it shouldnt be…because the human element is involved. different umps look at it differently and understand the zone differently ect. to me, its a dynamic of the game that makes it more interesting.
according to the rules of baseball, the strike zone would change for each batter… which wouldnt always really be fair to the pitcher, would it? remember the kid in little league who would do an exagerated bagwell stance so it would be immpossible to throw “strikes” as the rules say?
anyways, i think misunderstood you. sorry about that. but i still disagree. :-)
By McFann
May 22, 2008 1:40 PM | Link to this
Thanks, Chief. I hope Bobby cann go with the lineup with Chipper in it!
Salty—
Exactly! LOL!
Caot. Caveman—
Uh…Nobody said McCann should move to third, did they?
Oh…Oh yeah, wait…No, we were saying third in the batting order! That’s what it was! Sorry for the mixup. Yeah, no way McCann could play third base.
Braveheart, don’t…
By StingerSplash
May 22, 2008 1:41 PM | Link to this
Blue Mountain tomorrow night? Jason Isbell Saturday night? In Savannah? There. Is. A. God.
By Jersey Gil
May 22, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this
No Instant Replay….In the history of Baseball one of the Famous incident was the “Pine Tar Incident” between the Yankee & Royal. The famous & brillant decision of the League President at that time Lee Macphail was that the Games should be Won and Lost on the field.
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this
And I wouldn’t want replay used only on homerun calls nor would I want it used on ball-strike calls. I would like to see it used on whether a ball was fair or foul. Whether an outfielder trapped a ball or caught a ball. For fan interference calls. Basically plays in the outfield that are tough for umpires to get to and see clearly. And I wouldn’t be opposed to using it on close calls on the base paths in the post-season.
What the result will be is that umps on the field will call whatever call needs to be made to keep a play live.
They will no longer call people out at first so they can keep the play live ….
They will no longer call outs on diving catches in the outfield so they can keep the play live
They will no longer call homers so they can keep the play live
THey will no longer call fan interference so they can keep the play live
If they call a play dead by calling an out, a homer or fan interference, how does replay really correct the play? It doesn’t. The runners stopped running and the fielders stopped fielding and throwing and catching
So replay doesn’t much help because umps will be much more inclined to get a call wrong in order to keep a play live.
This causes more wrong calls, more arguments and more time wasted in a game that hardly needs more wasted time
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this
DAP, have I expressed a desire for the game to become “automated”? Don’t think I have.
TJ, hopefully if stats were published, people would look at the actual numbers and not just who is at the top and who is at the bottom.
By DAP
May 22, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this
shaun Basically plays in the outfield that are tough for umpires to get to and see clearly.
how about just having two extra umps down the lines?
re: jeff francouer vs. Arod…i heard the story a while ago, and today was the first time i heard jeff said that. i highly doubt he did.
yars looks like lefties actually hit santana better than righties. not much better on average, but with much more power. if it were me, id play diaz in left, but leave kotsay, kelly and mccann in the lineup.
By Efrim
May 22, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this
Jayson Stark’s Rumblings and Grumblings said the following about Jeff Francoeur’s contract negotiations:
In the spring of 2007, the Braves approached both Francoeur and his buddy Brian McCann with similar long-term offers, contracts that could have tied them up through 2013. McCann said yes. Francoeur said no. So this spring, the Braves tried again, offering a contract believed to be in the same range as Curtis Granderson’s new deal (five years, $32.25 million). Francoeur said no again. Eventually, the two sides couldn’t agree on even a one-year contract. So the Braves wound up renewing him (at $460,000). That makes two years in a row that Francoeur has gone the renewal route. And that sets the stage for a much more intriguing negotiation next year, when Francoeur finally becomes eligible for arbitration. The Braves will be out to keep him from turning into their version of Ryan Howard. And though Francoeur will continue to love being a Brave, and the Braves will continue to work at keeping him around, there’s a word for where this is headed: Expensive.
Not sure why Frenchy would turn that down. Everyone is different. Oh well, I hope they can settle something this offseason. I really hope he isn’t looking for a similar deal to what Alex Rios got…..
By Random
May 22, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
McFann: “In terms of leader, I don’t think Mccann would be the vocal leader type, but more the quiet, fallow-his-example type guy.”
Did you mean follow or wallow? (Probably the latter, considering the subject.)
;->
By StingerSplash
May 22, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this
Who would have thought that Reyes, Wright and Beltran would have the kinds of nights they had last night (a combined 6-for-12) and the Braves take em out behind the woodshed? With Chipper and Yunel in the lineup, I like Hudson’s chances against Santana? Without them … gonna be tough. Hudson will have to have his top-level stuff because I don’t think they’ll get six-plus runs off Santana.
On instant replay, I take the two plays at Yankee Stadium this week and compare to a play from the 2004 ALCS. Mark Bellhorn hits a homer in Game 6 that hits some guy in the gut and bounces back onto the field. The umps - picked on merit - get together and get it right. Sunday night, the only possible way that ball could have kicked that hard in that direction is if hit something, like, say, a foul pole, and yet they botched it - badly. The A-Rod play last night was a little tougher because it bounced down in such a manner that it could have done the same from the top portion of the wall. But the umps in the postseason are there for a reason. Some of the umps in the regular season I think are just there.
By Capt. Caveman (the original dawg)
May 22, 2008 1:58 PM | Link to this
YO Braveheart
Sorry — but you are way off base on the replay.
First of all your obviously wrong with your “quick pitch” senario. In football the offense can hike the ball at the whistle, but in baseball the defense is the one pitching. That is why the batter is allowed to call time from the umpire to get himself set in the box. The ump only allows a pitch to be thrown w/o a batter if the batter has refused to step in the box or has stepped out w/o asking for time and getting it from the ump.
As far as the rest, it’s a simple process of watching replay. It is quicker than an umpires conference. But your only gonna use it for homeruns and maybe runner placement on dead ball plays, or something of that nature. Other than that you can’t really use replay b/c in baseball the game is about runner advancement and they do that individually not in tandem. Some runners can score from first on a double and some can’t score from second on a single.
Baseball can also just make a rule that replay calls are final and you can’t argue about them just like they do for balls and strikes.
It’s not as hard as you guys are making it out to be.
By MEB
May 22, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
Don’t like replay for many of the reasons already discussed. However, getting the call right on home runs, fair/foul, and fan interference can easily be accomplished without much of a delay. The rest of the stuff is all rub of the green just like golf and the umps do get it right a vast majority of the time. With the money baseball is getting I think they could afford to add two additional umps… just like the post season.
DOB… speaking of getting it right how about that error they charged to Chipper last night? Any chance they review that bad call by the official scorekeeper?
By RC
May 22, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,
The proposed use of instant replay (to my understanding) would ONLY be to determine if a HR is foul or fair. Either way play would have been stopped by the result, so it shouldn’t add any more “incorrect” calls on the field in order to keep the play live. I think any use beyond this is pretty impractical though.
By Gary
May 22, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this
To ManofTeal, Dude give it a rest. If you look at my earlier posts on here from last night you will see that I said I was impressed with the Marlins beating Owings and Webb. If you sweep them then great all the power to you. Just make sure you show up next time they get swept by the Reds and lose 2 out of three to the Royals. Don’t be like the Mets fans, (outside of Amazin of course) who don’t have the marbles to show up on here or any other message board when their team is getting its lunch fed to them.
By McFann
May 22, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this
Random—
Yuk yuck… ; >
Capt Caveman—
Sorry about the “o” in your name up there!
By N8
May 22, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this
DOB
After watching Campillo’s start on tape Bobby said the following:
“His stuff is fun to watch from the dugout,” Cox said. “But on TV it’s like [Greg] Maddux. Some of the curveballs he threw, and the changeups, and he threw that 86 mile-an-hour fastball by guys. That’s called the art of pitching.”
I know Bobby doesn’t “tip his hand” too much, when discussing future moves or non-moves. But while reading between the lines, is it safe to assume that until he blows up and or loses it, that Campillo has earned himself a spot in the rotation for the foreseeable future?
For Bobby to compare ANYBODY to Maddux, you would have to think that he truly liked what he saw. Add to that, I’ll assume they’d rather give him a few more starts since he’s 30, and already here, than rush Hanson or Morton up to the big club.
I’m not so sure that with what he’s done in the pen, combined with what he did in that start, that he hasn’t moved ahead of Jo-Jo in the short term pecking order.
By TennesseePaul
May 22, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this
Payne: What made no sense was the implication that “no one should try”. None of my previous statements were written in the spirit of preventing people from trying.
On all those non-strike/ball calls you listed, I still see the ump getting them right with a high degree of success. Very high degree. I posted the HR totals over a 12 year span incorrectly. It is actually 64,326 Home runs in the last 12 years including the post season. 2 miscalls by the umps. Yet that level of success isn’t good enough… and therefore we should get instant replay? Please.
Umps should always try to get the right call. I believe they do try. I think they take a great deal of pride for getting the call right 99% of the time. I don’t think instant replay is necessary. Nor do I think it is good for the game to include it.
By FJR
May 22, 2008 2:14 PM | Link to this
I hope to God we don’t overpay Francouer. He’s a great defensive player, and from time to time he’s an offensive force, but for large stretches of the season, all he is is an out machine. He’s not even a league average offensive player right now, and I just don’t see his judgment of the strike zone ever allowing him to be an elite offensive plaeyr. Having a cannon for an arm is only worth so much.
And let me say I like Francouer and I hope we can keep him, but if he gets an inflated salary and keeps us from getting a power bat financially, it will not be good for the old W-L record.
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this
First of all your obviously wrong with your “quick pitch” senario. In football the offense can hike the ball at the whistle, but in baseball the defense is the one pitching. That is why the batter is allowed to call time from the umpire to get himself set in the box. The ump only allows a pitch to be thrown w/o a batter if the batter has refused to step in the box or has stepped out w/o asking for time and getting it from the ump.
Caveman, sorry but pitchers would try to quick pitch to avoid replay. They’d be negligent not to. This would cause hitters to step out or delay getting in the box so that replays can be shown and decisions can be made to appeal or review it. Hence, a cat and mouse game that results in even more time being wasted by hitters in a game that already wastes far too much time.
The proposed use of instant replay (to my understanding) would ONLY be to determine if a HR is foul or fair. Either way play would have been stopped by the result, so it shouldn’t add any more “incorrect” calls on the field in order to keep the play live. I think any use beyond this is pretty impractical though.
RC, I understand that is the topic du jour right now because there was a controversy in a darn Yankees/Mets game. Heaven forbid anything go wrong in a Subway Series game.
But Shaun and others want to extend replay to fair/foul calls down the line, fan interference, trapped balls on diving catches, out/safe at the bases and/or home runs.
That’s where my argument is that umps would intentionally get calls wrong to keep plays live because plays kept alive can be fixed by replays but there is no way for replay to adequately fix a play already deemed dead by an ump on the field.
If the only issue was whether a home run was fair or foul, then replay would make some sense ….. except that these calls happen so rarely, is it really worth the time, labor, monetary expense to have it available at every game? Probably not.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this
If Chipper doesn’t play tonight, I would think Norton will play 3B with Gotay at 2B. The interesting thing will be to see if Kotsay starts. He looked awful last night against Felliciano and Wagner. I’m betting Blanco starts in CF with Diaz in LF.
By 1957 Braves Fan
May 22, 2008 2:23 PM | Link to this
It’s pretty bad when they keep showing the ball ARod hit bouncing off the stairs in back of the outfield fence and all 4 umps missed the call. I think there were more than just 2 missed home run calls in the last 10 years. There are some that just don’t appear on tv or in the papers.
By Robert (Chipper Is The Best)
May 22, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
I live near Oklahoma City and work in OKC. I’m currently listening to the Oklahoma AAA team (Rangers farm club) and they are playing the Mets AAA team. Even the Mets’ AAA affiliates are having issues. They have lost 10 of their last 11. It looks the Mets orginization is going through a tough time right now. That is really too bad. (He says with a smile)
By Braveheart
May 22, 2008 2:27 PM | Link to this
As far as the rest, it’s a simple process of watching replay. It is quicker than an umpires conference.
Caveman, if you put in replay, there would be more instances of replay conferences than there are umpire’s conferences at the present time. Thus, more time wasted.
And, judging from football, I hardly believe that replay will be faster than an umpire’s conference.
By Saltywoody
May 22, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this
BigChiefRG
That was cool stuff, man. Thanks for posting that.
By brent a.
May 22, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this
If a UGA grad were doing the schedule, then the Braves would never have to leave the Southeast!
By justdoit
May 22, 2008 2:32 PM | Link to this
watching the replay of the braves games here in ny and so far chippers first at bat all kieth was saying is that chipper looks way to comf at the plate and pelfrey should pitch him way inside. chipper walked and he said pelfrey didnt accomplish anything because he didnt pound him inside. i will keep watching to see what else he says.
By Random
May 22, 2008 2:38 PM | Link to this
Frenchy v A-Rod
Here’s one version, (by Crasnick not Gammons):
“Francoeur made an impression with Team USA in the World Baseball Classic when he confronted Alex Rodriguez after A-Rod berated a clubhouse kid for bringing him the wrong sandwich. That’s one way to earn points with your peers.”
Here’s another (this is from Gammons, but you’ve got to be an ESPN “Insider” to access it).
Can anybody here sneak in and smuggle us out a quick cut-and-paste?
By David O'Brien
May 22, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
NEW BLOG IS UP. Tear into it, ladies and gents. Let’s get some serious posting volume tonight.
By Shaun
May 22, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
TennesseePaul, no one is saying umps don’t try. Of course they do. And I know they get calls right probably 99 percent of the time.
But on the few plays where the umpires have conferences and arguments, wouldn’t it be much more simple to just spend 20-30 seconds looking at a replay?
Why is it so bad for the game to use replay on those plays?
By Chop Chop
May 22, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this
Imagine a Game 7…
The Braves are trailing the Yankees by one run in the bottom of the ninth. Brian McCann waddles up to the plate with a runner on first and one out. He steps into the box as future Hall of Famer Mariano Rivera gets his sign. Rivera comes set and delivers the pitch. There’s a long, towering flyball deeeeeeeeeeeeep down the right field line! Did it hit the pole? Did it?
Well, the folks watching at home clearly see that the ball hit high on the outside of the pole and that it was a homer. The umps rule it foul. They then start to conference in the infield. As they do that, the folks at the Ted finally play a crucial replay on the big-a* Jumbotron in center field. Now, everyone in the park knows it was a homer. A couple of the umps happen to see the replay on the big screen, but they realize that they are not allowed to use video replay. Since none of the umps actually saw, with their own eyes, the ball hit the pole, they call it a foul ball.
Bobby Cox makes his way out of the dugout and gets tossed. Pendleton throws numerous bats onto the field and gets tossed. Roger McDowell hot-foots a couple of the umps and gets ejected. John Smoltz and Tom Glavine high-low the first base ump and are hauled off by security. Order is eventually restored, but it sure as hell doesn’t sound like it in a rabidly-booing Turner Field.
Rivera throws a few warmup pitches and play is ready to get underway.
Next pitch, McCann hits a groundball to Cano, who tosses to Jeter, who makes the throw to first for the easy 6-4-3 double play.
After the game, some people blame the umps for blowing the call; still others blame the lack of instant replay; a relative few blame someone called “Donk”; one or two blame Fate. However, all of these people eventually realize that, “Aw, shucks. It’s just baseball, folks. Video replay’s un-American. Better to lose because humans don’t have very good eyesight. After all, them eyes is American.”
See? A happy ending.
By monty
May 22, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this
I too look for a good start from Tim Hudson tonight. However, if we get the “Mr.Hyde” Hudson then I’m worried about our starting staff. He is supposed to be our ace. And if he has an erratic start tonight then there is definitely something wrong. Hopefully not arm trouble. He has great stuff but seems to really have to be in just the right mechanical positions to be effective, more so than with other pitchers. Here’s hoping that all the arm angles are in the right place tonight!
As far as Hudson hitting someone tonight as payback, I would think you would have to pick the right moment. The last thing you want to do is hit someone in the 1st inning and receive a warning that if he throws at another batter he’s out of the game. That would take away his ability to pitch inside and keep them honest.Maybe if the Braves get a big lead and it’s late in the game and Hudson is going to be pulled or if the game goes their way(God forbid) then you send your message, but be smart about it.
By Random
May 22, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
Frenchy v A-Rod
Here you go, from the Braves/MIB blog circa March of last year:
By tkg
March 6, 2007 2:06 PM | Link to this
Don’t know if anyone saw this on Peter Gammons’ blog that was posted on ESPN.com yesterday, and if it’s already been posted and discussed in a previous blog, my apologies. I thought the next-to-last graph was most interesting … except for that part where Peter’s subliminally trying to send Francouer to the Red Sox!
Seriously, if the next-to-last graph is true, it shows the kind of person Francouer is … hopefully the money he’ll eventually make will never change him.
From Peter Gammons’ blog No one is looking forward to the May 20 Braves series at Fenway Park more than Jeff Francoeur is. Look, he loves being a Brave. He grew up in Atlanta. But says, “I really always wanted to play for the Red Sox because of my family. I still use the Red Sox credit card my father gave me when I was 17. It’s going to be great.”
In 2002, Francoeur was considered unsignable because he was signed to play football and baseball at Clemson. However, before the draft, he reached a deal with the Red Sox, who were picking 57th. Atlanta scouting director Roy Clark found out, was able to get the money to sign Francoeur and took him at No. 23, ahead of Boston, which then took Jon Lester.
“My father [Dave] used to take the train from Springfield to Boston to see the Red Sox,” says Francoeur. “He went to Chicopee Commerce. All the family’s out there. My brother and sister were born up there, then my parents moved to Atlanta.”
Talk about a perfect personality for Fenway Park… Team USA players like to tell the story of Francoeur confronting Alex Rodriguez during the WBC for trashing a clubhouse kid who brought him the wrong sandwich.
“It’s going to be wild because of all the family I’ll have there,” he says. “Problem is, they’ll all be rooting for the Red Sox.”
End of text
I guess that was “the Gammons version”.
By TrueBlueBravesFan
May 22, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this
DOB
I was just thinking about this the other night when I read that post in the blog speculating that Tex would be either a Met or a Yankee next year. How do you think one of the NY teams fans would react if their 25Mill a year plus free agent started the season the way Tex has this year.
Just curious to hear yours and other Fans thoughts on this. (My own opinion is it wouldn’t be purty).
By TennesseePaul
May 22, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
I think there were more than just 2 missed home run calls in the last 10 years. There are some that just don’t appear on tv or in the papers.
OK. I’ll allow that there may be more than 2 botched home run calls. Just looking at the number of home runs that were hit over the last 12 years, 64,326 and applying the math… If the umps were incorrect 5% of the time that would amount to 3,216 bad home run calls. I think that many calls would be noticeable in the news. Just 1 full percent would result in about 645 incorrect calls over the last 12 years. I can’t think of that many bad calls. These umps that apparently need the replay to get the call right are getting the call right 99.997% of the time from what I can tell. Perhaps in actuality the rate is only 99.9%, meaning they botched 64 HR calls over the last 12 years. That still seems more than what I recall from watching the game. Maybe it is more like a straight up 99.99% correct, meaning they botched 6 calls over a 12 year span. Even still that’s an incredible amount of success. The umps don’t need a crutch.
By Lew
May 22, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this
Random-Did you watch the game last night? Every player that had occasion to slide into second went for the fielder, not the base.
By Mark T.
May 22, 2008 9:10 PM | Link to this
instead of instant replay, why not use 6 umps like they do in the playoffs? I don’t see the point in adding all this equipment