AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2008 > March > 11 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USOn lefties, Thorman, Maddux, Schafer….
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Lake Buena Vista, Fla. — After taking advantage of the first opportunity to sleep in during spring training (first night game is tonight), I thought it’d be a good day to clear out some stuff from notebooks that are beginning to stack up on the kitchen table here in the rental house.
So let’s fire it up while the sounds of Uncle Tupelo fill this otherwise bland living space….
Lefty relievers: I asked Bobby Cox a week or so ago about the importance of having more than one lefty reliever, since the Braves have a veteran lefty (Will Ohman) in their ‘pen and a few other options to choose from, including out-of-options Royce Ring and hard-throwing but unproven Jeff Ridgway. They also have Mike Gonzalez expected back from the DL in June.
“It just depends on how many right-handers you have that are good against lefties,” Cox said of the multi-lefty question. “It kind of makes the other manager think some if you do [have more than one]. La Russa always likes to take three…. I’ve got a bunch [to choose from].”
Dews, an American original: Couple of the most memorable moments of spring involved Bobby Dews, the venerable former bullpen coach and now special advisor, who still suits up for pregame work. This week he got behind the plate to catch a few pitches from Hall of Famer Phil Niekro, who put on full uniform and tossed some strikes from the mound before batting practice.
Then there was the vintage “Dewsy” moment a couple weeks ago, before the Grapefruit League opener at Dodgertown. I’m standing with Terry Pendleton at the batting cage during B.P., and Dews is hitting fungoes to fielders. A big black bird flies overhead, pretty low over Holman Stadium. Dews ducks and laughs.
“Got to watch them buzzards, at my age,” Dews shouted. “He might know something I don’t know.”
I asked Dews about his first visit to Dodgertown, and he said he came here when he was too young to remember, just after the place opened and saw his dad, Bobby Sr., then a Dodgers minor leaguer.
“He always loved the Dodgers organization because they mixed the minor leaguers with the major leaguers” in spring training], Dews told me. “They were one of the first to do that.”
Thorman’s potential: The Braves would like to upgrade their backup first base situation, perhaps with a slugger like Juan Rivera, an Angels outfielder who’s been working out at first base and is on the trade block.
But if they don’t trade Scott Thorman, who’s out of options, the Braves might have least one reason to believe the big Canadian will improve. Call it his second-year trend.
During his minor league career, Thorman showed marked improvement in his second season at Class A Myrtle Beach (.243 with 12 homers and 79 strikeouts in 445 at-bats in ’03, then .299 with 4 homers and 19 strikeouts in 154 at-bats games in ’04) and at Triple-A Richmond (.276 with 6 homers and 42 strikeouts in ’05, then .298 with 15 homers and 48 strikeouts in 309 at-bats in ’06)
I had a scout point this out to me last summer, in the middle of a season that saw Thorman hit .216 with 11 homers and 70 strikeouts in 270 at-bats, and lose the starting job that was handed him after Craig Wilson’s early season flameout.
When I mentioned the second-year thing to Cox, the manager said: “That’s what I’ve been told, too. Could be true. He’s swinging the bat better — not trying to it hit it 700 feet.” Bobby’s emphasis was on “700” when he said that, as if to say, the violent-swinging Thorman’s only tried to hit it about 500 feet this spring.
The Great Maddux: You guys wouldn’t believe how many times the name Greg Maddux still comes up in conversations with Braves and with Cox. His legendary control, his pitching-savant genius, his desk-job physique, his genuine decency, his dry sense of humor, and his notorious pranks (can’t say what he once did with a pair of sanitary hose, the white socks that old-school players wear under stirrups, other than to say there was nothing sanitary about them afterward).
Recently ESPN Jayson Stark stopped by camp and asked Cox if he could believe it when Maddux threw a pitchout on a 2-2 count, something almost unheard-of among the mere-mortal pitching population. Cox said Maddux didn’t surprise him with the move; to the contrary, the manager actually called for it.
“We did that all the time, because we knew he was going to throw a strike on 3-2 if we didn’t get the runner at second. That’s why it’s a great count to run on — nobody picks off.”
Pitchers hitting eighth: Someone mentioned to Cox that his former third-base coach, Brewers manager Ned Yost, was talking about batting a good-hitting pitcher eighth in the order, like the Cards’ La Russa has done on occasion.
“[Bleeping] Ned, he got into the stats - look out,” said Cox, who loves Yost, but isn’t quite on the same page as the younger manager when it comes to innovative use of stats.
Don’t expect Cox to bat a pitcher eighth anytime soon. “Might cost you more games than it helps,” he said.
Hampton facing long odds: Speaking of Stark, he had a great note in a recent blog about the last time a pitcher, age 35 or older, won more than 10 games after being out more than two years (Mike Hampton fits this description).
Stark had Elias Sports Bureau research it, and they had to go back to 1946 to find one: Schoolboy Rowe went 11-4 for the 1946 Phillies after missing all of 1944 and ’45, while seriving in the Navy during World War II.
Hampton’s 2-1/2-year absence has resulted from two elbow surgeries, so I’d think he faces an even more difficult assignment than ol’ Schoolboy.
OK, he gets it. He looks young: Just about everyone who sees Brent Lillibridge for the first time is shocked by how young the 24-year-old shortstop looks. So I asked him if it’s a blessing or curse to look so young.
“Well, I don’t think it’s a curse, at all. When I’m 33, 34 and they’re saying I look 26 — better than the other way around,” he said, smiling. “It’s a joke. I get kidded all the time.”
He really doesn’t seem to mind the kidding. It hasn’t exactly scarred him.
“I play baseball, and I’ve done well,” he said. “Fact is, it’s not going to be a determining factor in whether I make it. It’s cool. I’ve heard that I’m a batboy. I get carded a lot. I get carded with my wife.”
Schafer and the Hummer: Had to share this story about Jordan Schafer, the 21-year-old top-rated Braves prospect who’s still, well, 21. He drives a huge Hummer, but laments it’s a gas-guzzler.
He’s from nearby Haines City, only about 15 miles from the Braves complex. Yet Schafer is staying at the Marriott a couple of miles from camp during spring training, not at home. Why, besides the fact the team pays for it?
“All that gas,” he said. “I can’t do it.”
And now, a tune while I enjoy a cigar before heading to the ballpark:
”WHISKEY BOTTLE” by Uncle Tupelo
Persuaded, paraded, inebriated, and down
Still aware of everything life carries on without
‘Cause there’s one too many faces with dollar sign smiles
Got to find the shortest path to the bar for a while
A long way from happiness
In a three-hour-away town
Whiskey bottle over Jesus
Not forever, just for now
Not forever, just for now
There’s a trouble around, it’s never far away
The same trouble’s been around for a life and a day
I can’t forget the sound, ‘cause it’s here to stay
The sound of people chasing money and money getting away
A long way from happiness
In a three-hour-away town
Whiskey bottle over Jesus
Not forever, just for now
Not forever, just for now
In between the dirt and disgust there must be
Some air to breathe and something to believe
Liquor and guns the sign says quite plain
Somehow life goes on in a place so insane
A long way from happiness
In a three-hour-away town
Whiskey bottle over Jesus
Not forever, just for now
Not forever, just for now
Comments
By reron
March 11, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this
Here’s to hoping Thor gets it cause Tex ain’t comin back…
By eware
March 11, 2008 1:39 PM | Link to this
Lew, thanks for the Black Crowes review. You’ve recommended some great stuff in the past, so I respect what you say. I’ll pick up the album, as I’m a pretty big fan…
By Home of the Brave
March 11, 2008 1:39 PM | Link to this
I see Dan Meyer was just sent to the minors. Yikes!
By SNIPER-69
March 11, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this
I wanted to carry this post over from the previous blog DAP, I can’t see how anyone can pick the Phils to finish ahead of the Mets. It took a major collaps by the Mets for them to finish 1st by ONE game. The Mets went out and signed maybe the best left hander in the game. Pedro returns for a full season. Duaner Sanchez is back in the bullpen. What have the Phils done? There’s also the X factor of a chip on the Mets shoulder because of how the phils played them last year as well…..I don’t get it. There’s no way the Phils have a better season than the Mets. I guarantee it dude.
By Phils20 (but only this once)
March 11, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this
I laughed until I cried a few weeks ago when someone tried to compare Thorman with Mike Schmidt.
Even if we buy into the theory that Thorman’s second year at a level is better than the first, he is still going to be a .250-.260 hitter with 20 some home runs and five or six times that in strikeouts.
We need to be shopping.
By Steve McP
March 11, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this
Have they announced the cuts today?
By 18 Wheels of Love
March 11, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this
DBT’s on Conan TONIGHT!
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this
Steve McP, no, they’re meeting now. Clubhouse isn’t even open until 2:30, then a big union meeting for an hour when clubhouse will be closed. We usually don’t get cuts until after the night game, so don’t expect them until then.
If I get ‘em earlier, I’ll give them. If you don’t hear it, then you know they’ve not been announced.
By taylor s
March 11, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this
DOB any idea what it would take to get Rivera? Also do you feel he would play over Diaz? Average wise I doubt he would be any better but he adds a litle more pop to the lineup.
By ncscoots
March 11, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this
Phils20, you got the Thorman-Schmidt “comparison” as wrong as Lew did the same day it was made, LOL. I made the original post, only to show that a bad rookie season does not necessarily foretell career doom. And I SPECIFICALLY said I was not comparing Thorman to Schmidt. Guess that was lost in translation, but I’m certainly pleased you got a chuckle, if not understanding, from the post.
By DAP
March 11, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this
Sniper ill repost yours from the last blog, then respond.
DAP, I can’t see how anyone can pick the Phils to finish ahead of the Mets. It took a major collaps by the Mets for them to finish 1st by ONE game. The Mets went out and signed maybe the best left hander in the game. Pedro returns for a full season. Duaner Sanchez is back in the bullpen. What have the Phils done? There’s also the X factor of a chip on the Mets shoulder because of how the phils played them last year as well…..I don’t get it. There’s no way the Phils have a better season than the Mets. I guarantee it dude.
you cant guarantee anything in base ball, sniper. ill tell you why i honestly think the phils will finish better than the mets.
i think the mets will have injury problems, and they dont have the kind of resilient team to over come them. pitching is going to be better than last year, but the offense will be worse.
early injuries will have the mets coming out of the gate really slow, and they will spend the rest of the year trying to dig out of a hole, which they will do and finish a respectable amount of games over .500
also, they have no X factor, because they got santana and think they are the team to beat. when they start losing, they dont have the fortitude to keep going.
last year, the phillies had as many if not more injuries than any other team, and they came out on top. they have a special fire, and an amazing offense that will make kendrick and moyer look decent as far as W-L records go. also, they have two very good pitchers at the top, in meyers and hamels. they arent as good as the braves or mets top two, but with their offense, it makes them just as challenging.
the phils will NOT get off to a slow start, neither will the braves, and the mets will be in a hole all year.
thats just what i think, sniper, anything could happen, obviously.
By BossLady
March 11, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this
Maddux best story that can be repeated in a blog was the challenge to the grounds crew to hit his pitches. Just get the ball on the MF, he says.
By Daybed Wagmoe
March 11, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this
A few things:
“Whiskey Bottle,” great song. Really like Uncle Tupelo, especially “Anodyne.” That’s a great cd, especially for summer weather.
eware/Lew: for what it’s worth, I’ve been listening to the new Black Crowes cd some, and I gotta say that I haven’t been too impressed. I thought it was kinda boring. I wouldn’t say that I’m a big BC fan, although I love Southern Harmony and a few others cds.
And some stats to support Bobby saying “we knew that [Maddux] would throw a strike on 3-2,” here are Maddux’s career stats on a 3-2 count (courtesy of baseball-reference.com):
1452 plate appearances, 205 hits, 338 walks, 423 strikeouts, .187 batting average.
The key there is the 338 walks in 1452 plate appearances, which equals 23% amount of the time that he didn’t throw a strike (and who knows how many of those “balls” should’ve been called strikes). 77% of the time, Maddux threw a strike with the count full. Amazing.
It should also be noted that, at the top of that section on baseball-reference.com, it says, “Count/Balls-Strikes (Incomplete or missing for many seasons before 2000).
By TennesseePaul
March 11, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the notes DOB. Interesting stuff to read.
GO BRAVES
By Renegator
March 11, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this
Does anyone know if the game is telvised tonight?
By Mark Fanxeira
March 11, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this
Daybed Wagmoe
I’m thinkin, “how many of those strikes should have been called balls?” Considering he was known to get the calls as much as anyone.
But then again, how many of those base on balls were intentional as well?
Still, no disputing the fact that he was a god here for a few regular seasons
By Steve McP
March 11, 2008 2:32 PM | Link to this
Game is on FSN tonight
By chrisklob
March 11, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this
TennPaul, regarding your 12.40 post on the previous blog……
Don’t know if you saw the interview that JJ gave to the SportsSouth guys after he came out of the game yesterday, but “pitching to contact” is exactly his game plan. Gaudy strikeout numbers are nice sometimes, but not necessarily the most efficient way to record outs.
By the way, that interview was the first time that I’d seen him speak. Comes across as a bright and nice guy. I hope he does well, for his sake and for the Braves.
By Daybed Wagmoe
March 11, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this
Renegator — I’m pretty sure it is being televised by Fox SportSouth
By BT
March 11, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this
Televised on Fox Sports South tonight.
By Eric from MO
March 11, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this
Sniper,” I can’t see how anyone can pick the Phils to finish ahead of the Mets. It took a major collaps by the Mets for them to finish 1st by ONE game.” Whats to say you dont have another collapse?
By taylor s
March 11, 2008 2:38 PM | Link to this
the game is on tv tonight. eather fox sports net or sports south.
By Hammy the Brave
March 11, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Do you think it possible that both Boyer and Resop could make the bullpen, leaving Yates out? I’ll admit I like their fb/curveball combo better than Yates’ fb/slider combo. Also, I believe he has more problems with lefties than them.
In the backup catcher race, who do you see as more of a threat to Lopez, Pena(Is his defense really improved?) or C. Miller(Will he hit enough?)?
With all this discussion about Thorman’s strengths(such as they are) and weaknesses( they are legion), don’t you think it would be wise for FW to trade for another team’s roadblocked 1B power prospect to put at Richmond, as a better “backup” plan to losing Tex? KC( Huber), Detroit(lefty at AA last yr), or Colorado, come to mind as trade options.
I’m intrigued to hear these rumors of trading for J. Rivera of the Angels, something I’d suggested earlier. However, I find it hard to believe you’d be ok with him as a bench player, since he has no experience that I know of, at 1B. It makes much more sense to put him in LF, try to sign him longterm(if he produces), and trade M. Diaz, since I consider him a much better run producer than Diaz(what we need to pay attention to, if Tex leaves).
On to the bench. I believe strongly that FW should trade the Bravos excess for both a righty and a lefty power veteran for the bench( assuming Thorman is dealt- he brings precious little as a bench player, IMO). Guys like the aforementioned W. Helms( 157 games played at 1B, also plays 3B, kills lefties, good ph); J. Baker( good power potential, can play 1b/3B, stuck in multi-player 2b battle in Colorado), Morgan Ensberg (still has power potential, and if J. Rivera is being tried at 1B, Ensberg sure should be able to handle it, as a 3B’er. From the lefty side, I’d like Borcherd to be given a real shot by Bobby to try yo learn 1B. What do you hear from Terry P. about Borcherd- has he cut his swing down, could he be a more consistent hitter off the bench, than he’s been in the majors so far? Also, could Sean Greene be coaxed out of retirement, to be a veteran lefty off the bench( can play LF/RF and had at least 1 full yr. at 1B)?
Wat say yea, DOB?
Hammy the Brave
By Daybed Wagmoe
March 11, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this
Mark Fanxeira:
True, Maddux did get the calls. You’re right about that.
0 of the 338 walks were intentional (just went back to baseball-reference to look it up). I’ve never heard of a manager or a pitcher that has ever, on a full count, called for an intentional walk. Who would want to waste 5+ effortful pitches on a batter only to then intentionally walk him?
By KC
March 11, 2008 2:45 PM | Link to this
Renegator: Yes, it is. Either Sports South or Fox Sports Net… can’t remember which.
By Renegator
March 11, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
Excellent.
Thanks guys.
By Drew
March 11, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
**Music and (Braves) baseball…I really don’t think there’s a better combo out there other than chicken wings and cold beer…anybody agree?
This is the best Braves blog by far gentlemen and ladies…wish I was down there in the sun puffin on a stogie with you Dave
PS-remind me never to come back to Dayton OH on business**
By sean in columbus,ga
March 11, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this
Hi David, I always look forward to your post. It’s fun to guess what may be the opening day roster. I was wondering what you that of my guess. Pitchers 1.Hudson,2.Glavine,3.Smoltz,4.Hampton,5.Jurrjens. Bullpen.6. Soriano 7.Moylan 8.W.Ohman,9.T.Yates,10.M.Acosta,11.Bennett,11.Boyer 1ST.12.Teixeria,13.Thorman(only because the braves dont have any power from the bench on the left side). 2nd.14. Johnson,15.Prado, SS.16.Escobar,3RD.17.Jones,18.Lillbridge,19.LF.Diaz. CF.20.Kotsay, RF.21.Francoeur,22.Lopez,23.Anderson,24.?.25?
By Choppinmama
March 11, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this
DOB: as TBravesFan commented, we were out at 2:30, peering over the palms and condos to see the sky light up, but nada. I stayed up instead of setting the alarm, so I’m expecting to experience a sinking spell about the 7th inning tonight!
Sure hope the Nats bring Orr, Langy and Estrada over, just for old time’s sake, and of course, I’m looking forward to greeting Pat C. And…… my first view of Tommy in the correct uni.
By TennesseePaul
March 11, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this
chrisklob: Missed the video but gathered as much from DOB’s fabulous reporting and Bowman’s crafty copying skills… (is Bowman a lefty?). But anywho, that’s where the premise of my posts was coming from. That statement from Jair and the analysis of both Jair and James careers.
By Wayne in Utah
March 11, 2008 2:58 PM | Link to this
I hope the game is on XM tonight, as I am “on the road again”!
As for Thorman, if you can’t get anything for him, or you can’t get a serious upgrade for your backup first sacker, then you gotta keep him for a while. Who knows, he might actually start to hit???
The Braves could always try to sneak him under the waiver wire in late April/May. A pinch hitter and backup firstbaseman/left fielder is probably not as crucial in the first 6 weeks as he will be later on in the summer.
By McFann
March 11, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
30th?
By bill
March 11, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
Daybed Wagmoe:
Your stats on Maddux understate how often he throws a strike with a full count. The stats do not keep track of the number of 3-2 pitches thrown that result in foul balls. What you’ve reported is that 23% of the batters that get to a full count with Maddux end up getting a BB. It might have taken several pitches to work the walk out of Maddux. Similarly, some of the outs are from at-bats that had several 3-2 pitches. By definition, all of these at-bats had multiple strikes thrown while the count was 3-2.
By Choppinmama
March 11, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this
McFann: I have the sign packed, but unless DOB does some serious ‘splainin’ to the broadcasters, I doubt it will be mentioned. I’ll try and jump on this borrowed desktop tonite after the game and let you all know if Chipper saw our little token of thanks.
By DAP
March 11, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this
i studied communications in college. an example or perception and schemas in one of my text book sais this (general interpretation):
“in baseball, there are three kinds of umpires. one says ‘some are balls, and some are strikes, and i call ‘em like they are.’ one says ‘some are balls, and some are strikes, and i call ‘em like i see ‘em.
but the last type of umpire says ‘some are balls and some are strikes, but they aint nuthin til i call ‘em’!”
By Random
March 11, 2008 3:05 PM | Link to this
Steve McP—
Great minds DO think alike!
;-)
Epinephrine: “B Pena has snowball’s chance in hell of making this team. It has absolutely nothing to do with Escobar.”
Well, we’ll just have to wait and see, won’t we?
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this
Wat say yea, DOB? Hammy the Brave
About which of the numerous points/questions you made am I supposed to comment on? (keeping in mind that we only have about a half-hour to devote to your post)
By David
March 11, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this
I’ve been sucked in! Long time Braves fan, but this is the first season I’ve gotten into reading this blog….at first I checked it a couple of times each week for new news…..now I am addicted and find myself looking for a new one every morning!!!
By bravesfaninCT
March 11, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this
what is the best way for me to watch the braves this season? the XM radio just isn`t cutting it for me anymore. is the mlb.tv deal the most viable option? comcast offers the extra inning package, but it costs a fortune. does satellite carry braves games or will they be blacked out?
By Bawlmer Brave
March 11, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this
I’m the same way David. Virgin voyeur on the blog this year. My “Refresh” button gets quie a workout while I’m at the office these days. I can’t wait for the season to start. I’m a long-time Braves fan, but I’m more excited about this season than the last 10 or so. Should be an exciting/fun team to watch, regardless of predictions or “sure-thing” final standings.
By Weldon
March 11, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
@ Daybed: Interesting post overall. But a little piece of minutia on the 3-2 intentional walk as I just saw one last night. Runners on 1st and 2nd in the 10th inning with one out. The 2-2 pitch was wild, so they decided to just go ahead and walk him to keep the DP in order. Rare, sure, but it happens. In case you care how it turned out, the next batter hit a single just past the glove of the second baseman. Go Cocks!
By Lew
March 11, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
Sniper-You keep making the assumption that you WILL get a full season from Pedro and Sanchez. Not too sure this is all that safe an assumption.
Sanchez has just missed more than an entire year. Pedro has missed closer to 18 months by the time the season starts. Neither has not pitched a complete season since 2005.
This leads to two questions 1. Why do you think they will pitch a full season now, all of a sudden (and don’t EVEN mention that Pedro threw 28 whole innings last year)? 2. What exactly, do you consider a whole season? Maybe if you think 130-140IP is a full season for Pedro, but if I were you, I sure wouldn’t count on that 180+ that I keep hearing mentioned.
By The Man
March 11, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
I would not bet on Thorman’s average improving much this season. He will get very little playing time this year with Tex at first. Don’t see how an occasional pinch hit will help him develop much as a overall hitter. However on the positive side, he bring the ability to provide the Braves with that occasional pinch-hit homer. Will a 1st baseman really be that hard to find if we need one next season!
By richbrave
March 11, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this
SNIPER69:
Yours of 1:47p.m. “I can’t see how anyone can pick the Phils to finish ahead of the Mets”…Well, Sniper, you wouldn’t being a METS FAN. But as you so often point out here when we post such incredulity about the Braves, others see things differently. So, go suck on a lemon sour-puss.
By hammy the brave
March 11, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Are you saying I’m a little too verbose about my Bravos, I’m hurt?(just kidding)
Ok, can you comment on my Boyer/Resop/Yates and trading for lefty and righty power bats for the bench questions?
Hammy the Brave
By KC
March 11, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this
Sniper: I agree with you… barring major injury trouble in NY, there’s no way the Phillies finish ahead of the Mets (or the Braves).
The Mets have Santana, and (Mets fans HOPE) a full season from Pedro. They are a much improved team.
The Braves have an entirely new rotation after Smoltz and Hudson. Glavine, Hampton, and Jurrjens will replace a combination of 3/4/5 starters last year that posted a collective ERA of about 6.30… so that’s a HUGE improvement.
Assuming Lidge gets/stays healthy, the Phillies improved their team by adding Lidge and moving Myers back to the rotation. But they are nowere NEAR as improved as either the Braves or the Mets.
Phili simply doesn’t have the pitching to hang wither their division rivals late into Sept.
By OrlandoFan
March 11, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this
DOB I responded to your question about the notes on the other blog, as requested.
By richbrave
March 11, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this
METS FANS:
Fired the “Editor” of your Mets Blog - Metropolitan Man 1. That sorry azz in draggin’ you down. No wonder you come over here to get some fresh air and vision of reality.
By richbrave
March 11, 2008 3:39 PM | Link to this
DAVE:
Yeah, Dave. Is Boyer still sulking, or is the real lefty standin’ tall in Atlanta? Think he’ll make it, and if not what’s to do? He’ll NEVER clear waivers.
By Steve McP
March 11, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this
Random, clearly you too are a very wise man!
By The Man
March 11, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this
Phili simply doesn’t have the pitching to hang wither their division rivals late into Sept.
KC - Agree completely. It would not even surprise me to see the Phillies in a tight race for 3rd place with the Nationals by season’s end.
By BravesFanInRockies
March 11, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this
CT,
I’m afraid if you live outside the Southeast you’ll have to suck it up and pay for a premium package. I was tempted to get mlb.tv, but since I already have that 37-inch flat-panel screen, I’m going to pay the extra dough for the extra innings package.
It’s what — $180 a season? That ain’t cheap. But it is cheaper than going to sports bars 2-3 times a week. Plus it’s better for your waistline and your liver and your family to not spend all your spare time in bars.
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this
Just heard a great one from the inimitable Earl Weaver, from a guy who covered Orioles when he managed.
Outfielder, Pat Kelly, who was a committed Christian, said to Weaver, “Earl, aren’t you glad I walk with the Lord?”
Weaver replied, “I’d rather you walk with the bases loaded.”
By Lew
March 11, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this
KC-And yesterday the Phillies announced that although he would continue pitching, Adam Eaton has a herniated disc and arthritis in his back. Granted his plus 6 ERA last year was nothing to write home about, but it certainly does not strengthen what is already a weak spot.
By DAP
March 11, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this
KC barring major injury trouble in NY, there’s no way the Phillies finish ahead of the Mets (or the Braves).
you should read this
here a sentence from that article
At last count, 17 Mets were nursing injuries of one kind or another, and only two position players and half of the catching platoon are actually capable of playing.
thus my prediction that the mets finish third.
the phils can afford to have 3 pitchers with high four ERAs because of that offense.
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this
Boyer isn’t sulking, he’s pitching quite well. But who’s “the real lefty”?
Gonna be some tough decisions, because Resop throws right below 100 mph and, as Bobby said, “You don’t want to lose an arm like that.”
But as another Brave told me, some guys are asking each other why Resop has bounced around with that great arm of his. Usually there’s a reason….
By Lew
March 11, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
The Man-Yes, the Phillies have sever problems in the pitching department-both starting and relievers, but NEVER discount that offense.
Don’t know if Pedro Feliz will fill the void left by Rowand, but he definitely shores up their third base problem. He could easily hit 30 HR and drive in 100 in that little stadium. Their offense is quite dangerous.
By Lew
March 11, 2008 3:53 PM | Link to this
BravesFan In Rockies-At least MLB Extra Innings gives you a $20 break by signing up the first week and then breaks it up over four payments. That helps a lot.
By DAP
March 11, 2008 3:54 PM | Link to this
The Man It would not even surprise me to see the Phillies in a tight race for 3rd place with the Nationals by season’s end.
did you watch this team at the end of last year? this team has heart and can score a ton of runs last year. theyve got three players who are MVP candidates about every year, and lots of awesome supporting players. they’re players would all have to have andruw jones-slumps to be fighting for third place.
By Lew
March 11, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
DAP-It would be great if the Phillies HAD three pitchers with high four ERA;s. Last year, Jamie Moyer’s was in the high fives and Eaton’s was in the sixes. High fours would be a major improvement.
By KC
March 11, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this
DAP: Well… I did say “barring major injury trouble”.
I would define that as any of their top-4 starters or Wagner missing substantial time.
I think they can overcome injuries to position players if their pitching is healthy.
By Random
March 11, 2008 3:57 PM | Link to this
McFann: “School’s going good. Getting into some tough algebra, but I like math—history…not so much. I’m taking Latin this year, and I like that. Grammar’s good, too.”
Go for it!! Math, that is.
My niece is majoring in math at Belmont U (Nashville) — she was just accepted for a 5-week intern program this summer at George Washington U.
(Don’t mean to brag — well, yeah, I do, but just a little.)
8-)
(PS: I took some Latin in HS, too, and majored in Lingusitics @ UGA/UNC-CH. I’d recommend it highly.)
By Braveheart
March 11, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this
why do mets fans keep talking about duaner sanchez like he was some special pitcher?
pitchers like duaner sanchez are like duane reades in new york.
there are hundreds of ‘em.
By MGL
March 11, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this
Dan Kolb just got the save in the BoSOX win over the Mets today.
By richbrave
March 11, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
DAVID O”BRIEN:
I’m picking DIAZ as the batting champ in the National League IF he gets enough bats to qualify. The dude is unconsciously cold as a hitter. Man!
By ncscoots
March 11, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this
You guys are awfully quick to write off the Phils pitching. Hamels and Myers at the top are strong as anybody (assuming health and innings, as with all pitchers), Kendrick could be the real deal (despite his spring troubles while he works his secondary pitches), and ERA on the back-end is not as meaningful because of their offense. If they play .500 with whatever combination of 4 and 5 starters they throw out there, and they’ll be around at crunch time. Their bats make up for a lot.
I agree they may not have as much margin for error as Braves and Mets, but they may not need much.
By geauxbraves2000
March 11, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this
Pardon my ignorance of the “waiver wire”, but on the subject of Thorman, could the Braves put him on the wire and pull him back if he gets claimed?
By Random
March 11, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this
DOB: “some guys are asking each other why Resop has bounced around with that great arm of his. Usually there’s a reason….”
And not only that — consider that for the Braves to have claimed him off waivers from the Angels, twenty-three (23) other teams had to take a pass on him, including the entire AL. (I think.)
By DAP
March 11, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
Lew Last year, Jamie Moyer’s was in the high fives and Eaton’s was in the sixes. High fours would be a major improvement
good point, but the phils won 89 games and the division with those pitchers. now throw in meyers and i see no reason they shouldnt at least repeat that (89 wins, while i predicted they win 90) i dont think lidge will be great, but i dont think he will be bad enough to do them in.
KC I think they can overcome injuries to position players if their pitching is healthy.
you could be right, but i dont think the mets have the guts that the phils have to overcome injuries to position players. one of their big guys is already down, alou. i think they will have trouble scoring right off the bat, and if beltran, or delgado go down (before or after alou gets back) i dont think these guys are mentally tough enough to win alot of games.
then again, like i said, you could be right. i suppose we’ll find out, hunh? :-)
By flange1
March 11, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this
Hammy,
Not to jump in for DOB, but I don’t see the Braves dropping Yates for Boyer/Resop/Ring. Yates has never been my favorite, but he is a known commodity and Resop/Ring is not. I don’t disagree with your thoughts on these guys at all.
I also don’t think that FW will make whole sale changes to the bench (like trading for a lefty and righty power hitter). I think Javy will make the team as a backup catcher and right handed power hitter and if Thorman makes the team, then you have left handed power.
My perspective would be to acquire a good pinch hitter whether he hits for power of not. Those guys are not always easy to find.
We had one in D. Ward, but let him go…..
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this
geauxbraves, you’ve got to be kidding, right? Or you really didn’t see the discussion above, and yesterday? if not, look back, because i can’t keep answering the question. no, they can’t pull him back is the short answer.
By TJ
March 11, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
ncscoots, you beat me to the punch … but I’ll go ahead and post.
Folks, keep in mind that the same small ballpark that inflates the Phillies’ hitting stats also inflates their pitchers’ eras. I think Hamels/Meyers/Kendrick is a pretty good top 3 (though we’ll see if Kendrick doesn’t have a sophomore slump). After that, it’s pretty slim pickins, but all they need is about a 5.50 era out of those spots and they’ll be tough.
I don’t like their bullpen at all, though. That might be their biggest weakness. We’ll just have to see what Lidge can do; JC Romero had a great era, but 25 walks to 31 K’s tells me he’s living on the edge. Madson’s not bad… but after that???
It’s amazing how consistently they have gotten off to bad starts over the past few years, and then come on strong. If they come out of the gate well (don’t fall 10 games back in June), they’ll be formidable come September.
By BravesFanInRockies
March 11, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
Lew,
The early bird discount and the payment plan do indeed help. I suppose if I subscribed now I could get a few ST games when I’m not watching March Madness …
By Random
March 11, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
TOO FUNNY!!! — “Lingusitics”
Linguistics, of course.
By richbrave
March 11, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
flange1:
Rightous post. Always want that rare pitch-hitter who can wear out an opposing pitcher, go deep in counts, and get hits when the game’s in the balance. And you’re spot-on, they’re hard to come by.
By BillsNV
March 11, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this
DOB, If we were to trade Thorman wouldn’t his new team be in the same boat as the Braves? Basically they would need to keep him on the roster or pass him thru waivers to put him into their minors. That would seem to make it hard to trade him to a real good team like the Angels.
Thanks for all the great information!
By geauxbraves2000
March 11, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this
Sorry DOB, my bad, I should’ve read.
I’m at work taking a break and the thought just crossed my mind. Thanks for the answer though.
Geaux Braves!!
By WarParty
March 11, 2008 4:45 PM | Link to this
Nice information here. VERY nice and it is appreciated DOB. I love following the Braves even more when I get the insider type skinner in these pages.
By McFann
March 11, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this
Ah! Back to the blog…
Choppinmama—
I was somewhat kidding about the sign, but U never Kno…There was that article about Chipper blogging with us on the AJC back when it first happened…
Random—
You like math? I sure do! My brother doesn’t, heh heh. But he likes history and I do not…unless it’s baseball history, of course.
Latin’s great, because you cann learn so much about where words come from with it. (But then again…where do the Latin words come from…)
: >
By Nate
March 11, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this
I’m not sure why everybody is so quick to throw away Thorman. Yeah he had a horrible year last year. But, he improved in the second half. And he’s got that trend of improving in his second year at various minor league levels. Plus, we’re talking about a back-up first baseman here. He’s like a spare tire. You hope you never have to use him, but you don’t want to drive around without one, and its not where you want to spend your money.
I’m much more concerned that the Braves don’t really have anybody at 3rd who can give them 30-50 good starts. Chipper is much more of a liability than Tex.
By Bravosimos
March 11, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this
DOB,
You should check out The Black Keys if you haven’t already. A fairly new group. They had a song on the Black Snake Moan soundtrack that was phenominal called, When the Lights Go Out.
By McFann
March 11, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this
Oh yeah! Game’s on FSN South tonight at 7:05!!
Sure y’all knew that, but just in case…
By Nick
March 11, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this
I don’t think this was posted elsewhere (forgive me if it was), but DOB do you know the lineup and pitchers for tonight?
By DonRose
March 11, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this
I cannot understand why everyone is so high on the Mets. Let’s compare the Braves and Mets position by position: Starting Pitching 1. Smoltz (15-16 wins)- Santana (17-18 wins)- slight edge to Mets in regular season but not in post season 2. Hudson (15-16 wins) - Matinez (13-14 wins)- slight edge to Braves since Martinez is coming off injury 3. Glavine (14-15 wins) - Maine (15-16 wins) - very slight edge to Mets but this is tenuous at best 4. Hampton (Yes, I am assuming that he pitches and wins 12-13 games) - Perez (who knows, when he is good he is very good when bad …) - edge to Mets due to unknown on Hampton but if healthy then edge to Barves 5. Jurrgens (12-13 wins) - Duque (11-12 wins) slight edge to Braves due to Duque altering style etc
Bullpen - fairly even but have to give Mets slight edge for Waggoner even though I do not trust him in critical situations
1st base - Braves edge 2nd base - Braves SS - Mets 3rd - pretty close but I would take Chipper over Wright, so edge Braves LF - Braveds due to Alou injuries and limited playing time CF - Mets RF - Braves Catcher - Braves
Bench - ? Manager - Braves
Overall I would have to say that if you asked me to pick one of the two teams as they are I would go with the Braves. I believe that they are better in position players and stack up very well in pitching
By Bravosimos
March 11, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this
And DOB,
My dad ripped me a new one, thanks for telling me to tell him to get to the park at Sarasota at 9:30. They wouldn’t let him in ‘till 11. He asked me, ” Is O’Brien your sports writer or your bartender, cause he doesn’t know what the f**k he’s talking about!” I found the whole ordeal pretty funny, actually.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
March 11, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this
O’Brien , here is the answer to why Chris Resop is already with his third team.
He only became a full-time pitcher in mid-2003 (Resop was originally drafted as an OF by the Marlins). Command has been a problem for him so far. He got hurt last season with the Angels (triceps injury to his pitching arm) and the Halo’s thought they could sneak Resop through waivers.
Somehow I don’t think the Braves picked him off waivers , put him on the 40 man roster while releasing Chad Paronto , fully knowing Resop was out of options unless they believed that he would make a valuable addition to the bullpen.
Resop does have 39 saves during his minor league career and possesses a closer’s mindset. Resop throws hard (98-99 MPH) and mixes in a strong curveball along with his changeup.
Picking this kid off waivers was a steal for the Braves. If he is healthy and learns to harness that blazing fastball , Resop projects as a strong sixth or seventh inning set up man.
By BA
March 11, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this
Wow, that was almost as good as hearing it in the radio, DOB! I’m honored at the selection. I’ll admit, I resisted at first, but this blog has got me hooked. Can I get a glass of that kool-aid? I wish they would expand the rosters, because I’m going to hate seeing these kids get sent down, and there’s just too many of them. I wonder, who will be the Melvin Nieves in the next big trade? Or the other way around, who will be the next Wainwright? For that matter, who is the next Frenchy? I think Lopez has all but won his job, so that’s one less spot. I’m not crazy about Thorman but Bobby loves power. I like Anderson already. I hope Cox keeps at least two lefties, preferably Ridgeway and Ohman. As I get older, spring training is more exciting every year, is it time for the game yet?!
By DonRose
March 11, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this
By Coach
Good information. Thank you.
By Murphy
March 11, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this
On Thorman: I posted this a few days ago, but there was some article that came out last year about Thorman being compared to Justin Morneau with the Twins. Apparently thier numbers were comperable at this point and that is why they hoped Thorman would follow the 2nd year plan that DOB talks about above.
I really hope Resop is as nasty in the regular season as he is in ST. That would be awesome! Both Smoltz and Hudson would have competed for the Cy Young award last year if it had not been for the bullpen.
By Jon
March 11, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this
Hey Dave I might have missed it, not sure, but would you mind telling me what would happen to Thorman if he were claimed by another team on the waiver wire? Thanks.
note - this was a joke and only a joke, no innocent bystanders and blog specialists were hurt in the making of this joke. Please carry on about your normal business
But seriously Dave, could you explain the waiver wire procedure.
again, see above note
;)
By Lew
March 11, 2008 5:38 PM | Link to this
Scoots-Aren’t you one of those always yelling about K per IP? kendrick struck out all of 49 batters in 121 innings pitched. Just how long do you really think his 3.87 ERA will last in Philly’s Little league stadium.
Not to mention that Lidge has already undergone two knee surgeries since last season. Do you really think that Flash Gordon will regain the form from about ten years ago when he was in his mid 30’s? It wouldn’t surprise me in the least to see Myers back in the pen, or the Phillies will lose a lot of games in the late innings.
By rd
March 11, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this
Dave,
Enjoyed the story on Jordan Schafer, but it was scarily similar to two stories of phenoms from past eras. Both, like Schafer, were outfielders … Barry Bonnell (from the 70’s) and Brad Komminsk (from the 80’s, I think). I remember Eddie Haas, long-time coach and short-time manager, saying about Bonnell in the AJC “He reminds me of Joe DiMaggio.”
Both Bonnell and Komminsk had great numbers to go with apparently great skills through AAA, but didn’t last beyond a few weak years in the bigs.
Point is, Schaefer is 21 and hasn’t played above A ball. I haven’t seen him play and I hope he turns out to be all he and his hummer promise to be. But if history is any guide, I’m hoping Kotsay stays healthy all year and maybe next year, too.
By BA
March 11, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this
The only way Myers is going back to the pen is if he needs to rough up his old lady where nobody will see! Let’s see, Braves/Mets comparisons: Jones/Wright- guy who hits the Mets, guy who can’t hit the Braves. Diaz/Alou- .300 hitter, guy who pees on his own hands. Hudson/Pedro- guy who donates to charity, guy who fights chickens. Need we continue? At this second, Pedro is busy making up an injury to avoid the all star game. The Mtes collapsed like Mike Piazza’s Judy Garland dollhouse last year and I promise you, they won’t be a factor this year.
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this
Soriano just threw a bullpen without pain, said he’ll ask to throw in a game in a couple of days….
Cuts will be announced after game or tomorrow….
Just watched the most impressive BP since Mark McGwire — Wily Mo Pena. Absolute thunder in that monster’s bat. He was hitting ball after ball off the top of the scoreboard or over the entire thing. Hit a LINE DRIVE that struck just beneath the clock. With a slight wind BLOWING IN….
Bravosimos, guess that’s what you get for asking a sportswriter what time to get to the ballpark. Your dad sounds like my kind of guy, though. Still feisty, huh?
By Yars
March 11, 2008 6:08 PM | Link to this
Does anyone know yet if those 50+ games that are on PeachTree TV will be televised for those that live in the South, but do not get Peachtree TV? Any truth to Fox Sports South or SportSouth possibly broadcasting them?
By David O'Brien
March 11, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
Gotta love it: Afternoon Delight playing on the stadium PA. Listen to those lyrics closely….
By QueensMetsFan
March 11, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
BA - mets won’t be a factor?
Really? You mean the team that finished ahead of you the past two seasons? The team that swept you AT HOME, beating your two ‘aces’ in must win games during the stretch run? The same Mets team beat your team that had Chipper, Tex, Escobar and Johson in the the line-up you love to keep chirping about? The same team Mets team which improved itself by adding the best pitcher in baseball won’t be a factor?
Dude, I want whatever cool-aid you’re drinking. Give the Mets a little more respect than that.
By DonCoburleone
March 11, 2008 6:23 PM | Link to this
Everyone says that if you give Wily Mo Pena 550 AB’s in a season he’s a lock to hit 35+ bombs (and strikeout 180+ times)… Only question is can he draw enough walks and get enough hits (therefore increase his OBP) enough to make him a power hitter who strikes out a ton but still has real value (Ala Adam Dunn).
One thing is for sure, that young outfield for the Nationals (Dukes, Milledge, Pena) has the potential to be the best outfield in baseball in another 2-3 years. Of course, it also has the potential to blow up in their face BIG TIME.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
March 11, 2008 6:27 PM | Link to this
Speaking of Komminsk. If what the AJC has reported proves to be accurate about Scott Thorman , the Braves must believe that Thorman is the second coming of Brad Komminsk and not Ryan Klesko.
When considering that Scott Thorman is a former 1st round pick (drafted 30th overall by the Braves in 2000) and that the Braves don’t seem to have a more qualified back up at 1B , this speaks volumes about Thorman being on the trading block.
He is a 6-3 left handed dead fastball hitter with monster power. Can’t hit lefties (career .181 BA) and has problems with the breaking ball. His 19 walks and 91 strikeout ratio is abysmal.
Thorman’s plate discipline is all but AWOL. He did show some improvement defensively last year around 1B and can play LF in a pinch.
But , when considering that Bobby Cox gave Julio Franco a look at 1B before the Teixeira trade , it sort of gives me the idea that Thorman doesn’t have a future in Atlanta.
I doubt that the Braves could get much in a trade for Thorman. However , they did pawn Oscar Villarreal off on the Astros for Josh Anderson.
By brian
March 11, 2008 6:29 PM | Link to this
back to an earlier debate and please remember I am not the one who suggested Tyler Hansbrough is the best ever in the ACC….
Tyler Hansbrough was named unanimously to the 1st team All ACC team for the 3rd straight year. Tyler is the 3rd person ever to be unanimous 1st team All ACC for 3 years. David Thompson was the 2nd and some Duke player I had not heard of (I do try to block them from my memory but this guy was pre Coach K and pre Giminiski) was the 1st.
Still not in the same “league” as Thompson but quite an honor nonetheless.
Also sporting news player of the year. Tyler will be the 8th Tar Heel to have his jersey retired. That also is quite an honor. That list really is a Who’s Who
By OrlandoFan
March 11, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this
RD, great note about Bonnell and Komminsk (boy, was he going to be the savior!). Bonnell was so much like DiMaggio they moved him to third base to make room for — who? — Brian Asselstine.
By 18 Wheels of Love
March 11, 2008 6:34 PM | Link to this
Afternoon Delight…reminds me of that GREAT Arrested Development episode!!
By BA
March 11, 2008 6:34 PM | Link to this
The Mets get no respect here! I have no respect for a franchise that has some of the worst booger eating fans this side of Philly. An ancient team of third world washed up dirtbags. Queens mets fan, you’re just mad because you were one of those girls that David Cone roughed up his suspect in front of! Hey, don’t throw any batteries at Chipper this summer when he’s jacking homers in your toilet bowl of a stadium this summer! You mouthbreather! Santana’s not the best pitcher in baseball, he’s just the best pitcher in baseball who grew up on a dirt floor. The Mutts will finish fourth this year. Absolutely not a factor, even if they bring Piazza back to troll the secret bath houses of New York! Even if Randolph grows a spine.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
March 11, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
Dave OR