AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2008 > February > 11 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USNo more weekends off: P’s & C’s reporting
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The great L.A. Times scribe Jim Murray once said, “Spring is the time of year when the ground thaws, trees bud, the income tax falls due — and everybody wins the pennant.”
And so it is that your correspondent, memorably dubbed as the faux “crusading everyman” by one of our angrier blog participants, has already done his taxes, an annual end-of-January ritual before heading to spring training and being immersed in a six-week world where normal life is put on hold and baseball takes precedence over all else.
We’ll be headed down Wednesday, a day before pitchers and catchers are officially required to report. Need some time to stock the fridge of the rental house and get a lay of the land in our new neighborhood, plus stop by the ballpark at Dark Star to see how many eager Braves arrived early.
First workout is Thursday, and you can bet plenty of eyes will be on Mike Hampton, whose every sprint will be scrutinized to determine if the hamstring is healthy, and every throw observed by the Braves with that crossed-fingers hope they have that he’ll be able to contribute something, anything, to the cause.
But we’ll also be curious to see newcomers Jair Jurrjens and Will Ohman, plus others such as injury-plagued relievers Phil Stockman and out-of-options Blaine Boyer, and also to see how wide-eyed prospect Charlie Morton handles everything in his first big league camp.
I’m gonna keep this blog brief, since not much new to report until we get down there and start daily blogs Wednesday. (No, nothing new to report on Teixeira or Francoeur contract extensions. I don’t expect anything on Tex for a while, and a new Francoeur contract could be kept leak-free private until it’s announced the way that Brian McCann’s was during spring training last year.)
I talked to Morton at pitching camp last week, and thought you might want to hear a little of what they had to say. If I had to bet, I’d say we’re going to see this kid in the majors at some point this summer. But that could just be me crusading again.
Charlie don’t surf: Actually I’m just assuming he doesn’t. It made for a good bold-face subhead in a note about Charlie Morton, the 24-year-old right-hander whose stock has risen dramatically since last summer. Charlie does pitch.
The hard-throwing, 6-foot-5 New Jersey native’s career made an upturn late last season after he was moved from bullpen to starting at Class AA Mississippi.
He impressed enough in the new role to get a spot in the prospect-laden Arizona Fall League, where Morton went 4-1 with a 2.57 ERA and .205 opponents’ average in six games (five starts) for the Peoria Javelinas, 20 strikeouts and eight walks in 21 innings.
He allowed five runs and two homers in one three-inning start, and only one run in the other games combined. Yes, he was quite impressive out in the desert.
Now he’s been added to the 40-man (Braves had to protect him or lose him in the Rule 5 draft) and will be in camp, trying to show the Braves that he’s worth consideration for a bullpen job and/or give them something to think about later this summer if they need a pitcher for any role.
He threw five no-hit innings in his final start, which happened to come with Bobby Cox, Frank Wren and Roger McDowell in attendance (and also me, asking the Braves officials who in the H this kid was and where he came from). Morton said he had no idea the Braves’ decision-makers were there until afterward, and agreed with me it was probably a good thing he didn’t — because he was able to relax.
“It was a good time, that last night,” he said, smiling. “I really wanted to finish strong. I didn’t find out they were there until after the game.”
At pitching camp last week, Morton didn’t try to hide his excitement and nervousness as he sat at a locker stall just down from Tim Hudson’s and John Smoltz’s nameplates, and looked across the way at Peter Moylan and other Braves relievers chatting about how they spent the offseason.
“It’s outstanding, just being in this atmosphere and working with Roger,” he said after a throwing session at Turner Field. “Things like this, and the Fall League, are helping me a lot.”
Asked about being invited to big league spring training, he said, “Yes, sir. I’m looking forward to my opportunity.”
Morton’s numbers last year at Mis’sip didn’t draw much attention — he was 4-6 with a 4.29 ERA in 41 games, including six starts. He had 67 strikeouts in 79-2/3 innings, with 37 walks and 80 hits allowed.
But look inside his splits and you understood why folks took notice late in the season. His WHIP was reduced steadily, from 1.92 in April to 1.56 in July and 1.31 in August. He went from 20 strikeouts with 17 walks in 24-2/3 innings during April-May to 27 strikeouts and 10 walks in 29 innings during July-August.
Then in the Fall League, he continued to prosper, now against better hitters.
Morton has a fastball that reaches 96-97 mph, along with three other pitches that are rated average to above-average: curveball, slider, changeup.
He’s a former third-round draft pick who fell from the top-prospect radar while going 12-18 over his first two minor league seasons in A-ball, and posting ERAs of 4.82, 5.20 and 5.40 in his first three. Last season (2007) was his fourth.
Morton said his breakthrough last season came after he went into the video room with his pitching coach and studied his mechanics closely, comparing what he did when he pitched well to what he was doing on nights he struggled. He worked on getting a better downward plane on his delivery, utilizing his height and leverage.
After that he shone in a couple more outings in the bullpen, then was moved to the rotation and really begin to prosper.
“To me it was about getting to where I could pitch consistently,” he said of his Fall League success, which wasn’t marred by bouts of wildness he’d experienced in the minors. “But then again, that was only 20-something innings. I hope to carry it over now.”
Though his fastball velocity is outstanding, and does allow him to get away with a few more mistakes than some pitchers can, Morton said he’s learned he can’t rely on simply trying to overpower hitters.
“Velocity is a good thing, definitely a plus,” he said. “But I’ve seen people throw 98 and not get people out. That was the thing with me. It was frustrating.”
OK, time to pack and choose CDs to take to spring training: It’s always an important part of the preparation, to make sure I’ve got the proper mix of music to cover it all, from early morning ease-into-the-day drives to late-night wake-your-a$$-up songs to keep from driving off the road on the Florida Turnpike (Metallica always good for that).
Picked up some good CDs this past week, including the new ones by Bob Mould, Lupe Fiasco and British Sea Power. Gonna have plenty of time to play them and a bunch of others between now and opening day (not any radio worth listening to in Central Florida, which isn’t a bad thing long as you’ve got tons of CDs on hand).
One that got lost in my pile and has been on my player the past few days: Instant Karma, the John Lennon tribute/covers album that’s a benefit to save Darfur. Love Green Day’s “Working Class Hero” and REM’s “Number 9,” and I’ve gotta say, Christina Aguilera actually does a solid job on “Mother.”
Oh, and has any REM fan got Finest Worksong, the tribute CD with other Athens bands performing REM’s songs during a 2006 show at the 40 Watt Club? I got it a few weeks ago at Schoolkids Records in Athens. Patterson Hood from Drive-By Truckers covers five songs solo, including So. Central Rain and Second Guessing.
Five Eight does a reworked version of Driver 8 called “Fiver 8,” which becomes a chronicle of their stint as REM’s opening band in California a few years ago.
And so….
”DRIVER 8” by REM
The walls are built up, stone by stone,
the fields divided one by one.
And the train conductor says_ “Take a break Driver 8,
Driver 8 take a break_We’ve been on this shift too long”
And the train conductor says_‘“Take a break Driver 8,
Driver 8 take a break. We can reach our destination,
but we’re still a ways away”
I saw a treehouse on the outskirts of the farm._
The power lines have floaters
so the airplanes won’t get snagged.
_Bells are ringing through the town again.
Children look up, all they hear is sky-blue, bells ringing
And the train conductor says, “Take a break Driver 8,
Driver 8 take a brea. We can reach our destination,
but we’re still a ways away”
Way to shield the hated heat.
Way to put myself to sleep.
Way to shield the hated heat.
Way to put myself, my children to sleep.
He piloted this song in a plane like that one.
She is selling faith on the Go Tell crusade.
Locomotive 8, Southern Crescent, hear the bells ring again.
Field to weed is stricken thin.
And the train conductor says, “Take a break Driver 8,
Driver 8 take a break. We’ve been on this shift too long.”
And the train conductor says, “Take a break Driver 8,
Driver 8 take a break. We can reach our destination,
but we’re still a ways away.”
Comments
By tee in benhill......
February 11, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this
lets go braves. i have hi hopes for thr jurrjens kid. just a suspicion that he will be special…
By McFann
February 11, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this
First again…? Really??
By N8
February 11, 2008 4:12 PM | Link to this
1st?
Probably not. But I had to try. :-)
By BlogZ
February 11, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this
The new Lupe Fiasco cd is sick, listen to a band called the Hold Steady and their cd Boys and Girls in America, should be a good one for you down there in Orlando
By brnt247
February 11, 2008 4:22 PM | Link to this
Excited to see what Morton can do. He seems like he is a real learner and really wants to better himself, and there is no better way to do so than pitch along side three completely different pitchers (Smoltz, Glavine, and Hudson) and try and feed off of how they pitch and try to understand the game through their eyes.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
February 11, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
Spring training , yes ! Let’s get this show on the road.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this
brnt247, it’s always interesting to see a kid like Morton, with a ton of talent, put it all together a little later than expected, and when he’s not even on any top-prospects list because of age and past performance. Because believe me, he’s a top prospect in the Braves’ view, and a few scouts who saw him that night in Arizona told me the same….
BlogZ, Hold Steady’s a terrific band. Did you see them in either of their last couple of shows at The Earl? Great live act.
By VaBravesfan
February 11, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this
I envy you guys who get to go Florida and work. I am stuck in Virginia where it is 23 degrees with 40 mph winds. Can’t wait for the Braves to get started. Thanks DOB for keeping us informed.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this
StingerSplash had a good post about Cobain at end of last blog, by the way.
By PocorobaNaharodny
February 11, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this
DOB I am hoping to make a trip down to spring training, probably the first or second week of exhibition games. I would like to be able to see workouts, probably more so than the games. Once the grapefruit season starts, does the team still go through morning workouts, and are they open to the public? Any recommendations on when and where to see some of the regulars take BP and fielding practice? It is kind of disappointing to see lyrics to an old REM song. I like their old stuff tons better than their new stuff but you could never understand what Michael Stipe was saying back then. My personal rule with REM is that if I can’t understand the lyrics, it is a good song.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 11, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this
“Take a break driver eight” — is this lyric a foreshadowing of the spring to come? The Braves are taking about 8 pitchers to compete for 5 spots…the 6th and/or 7th might go to Atlanta, and the 8th will be told to “take a break”? (Too much of a stretch? Yeah, I thought so.)
And DOB - for what it’s worth, isn’t the Instant Karma cd a John Lennon tribute album, not The Beatles?
For those of you who haven’t seen it yet, check out this video. I’m thinking that when he’s in Atlanta, the video people can cue it up so that “Ouch Charlie! Charlie, that really hurt!” comes on when Charlie Morton plunks a batter.
By Robert
February 11, 2008 4:35 PM | Link to this
I am excited to have a healthy Blaine Boyer back. He has that attitude that you look for in a late inning reliever. I am looking for big things from him and Acosta
By 22oz
February 11, 2008 4:41 PM | Link to this
The Braves rotation for the future looks bright. With Morton, Jurrjens, JoJo, Rohrbough, Locke, and others like the youngster Teheran in the system, it looks like the Braves will have some sho nuff depth for years to come. Hopefully one or two of these guys step up and become the ace that we’ll need after Smoltzy hangs it up.
The Braves website has the games that will be on tv, looks like we’ll get to see a good many, including Feb 29 against Andruw and the Dodgers.
By Some Blogs Have Jokes
February 11, 2008 4:45 PM | Link to this
The Mom Test
I was out walking with my 4 year old daughter. She picked up something off the ground and started to put it in her mouth. I took the item away from her and I asked her not to do that.
“Why?” my daughter asked.
“Because it’s been on the ground, you don’t know where it’s been, it’s dirty, and probably has germs” I replied.
At this point, my daughter looked at me with total admiration and asked, “Momma, how do you know all this stuff? You are SO smart!”
I was thinking quickly. “All moms know this stuff, it’s on the MOM Test. You have to know it, or they don’t let you be a Mom”.
We walked along in silence for 2 or 3 minutes, but she was evidently pondering this new information. “OH … I get it!” she beamed, “So if you don’t pass the test you have to be the dad.”
“Exactly!”
#Dad Lessons
By flange1
February 11, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Thanks for the new blog!
Was there any discussion about Pedro’s vist to the cockfights at Camp Roger?
By Wayne in Utah
February 11, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this
Robert The two guys you mention, plus Morton and Bennett are getting me pumped about our staff. We could have a good staff, with a little luck avoiding the injury bug.
Some of the guys that are 2-3 years out are looking good at this point too! Hope springs eternal at this time of year.
By TennesseePaul
February 11, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the blog DOB. I hope you enjoy your trip down south. I’ve never really enjoyed going to Florida, but then again, I’ve never traveled there to watch Spring Training.
According to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, the Pirates will send several pitchers each summer to Dr. James Andrews’ medical institute in Birmingham, Ala., for biomechnical analysis in hopes of detecting minor glitches before they spiral into serious problems.
—ESPN
Not a bad idea. Not a bad idea at all.
By Hedge Head
February 11, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this
13th!
By OrlandoFan
February 11, 2008 5:00 PM | Link to this
DOB, you should make sure your rental car down here has satellite radio. You can get into a lot of music — and other good stuff — there to ease the boring drives on teh Turnpike and the crowded and frustrating ones on I-4. You’re definitely right about our radio, though. Our better sportstalk station has merged with newstalk, so you have sports sometimes and Rush Limbaugh sometimes. Ugh.
By Bryan
February 11, 2008 5:04 PM | Link to this
Dave and Daybed, a few days ago i was leading a trip of school kids from a school in inner-city savannah on a trip on the Savannah river conducting water quality test (well, more like a focus on salinity intrusion from the Atlantic on a “fresh water” environment)
Of of the kids looked up at me and asked what are those red balls on the power lines?
With a straight face i told him “The power lines have floaters so the airplanes won’t get snared.”
No one got it but me …
By Alan
February 11, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this
Great stuff, DOB. Morton sounds like a nice, respectful young man. Like just about every other Brave. I’ll be curious to see how he does this spring - not to mention Jurrjens, Jo-Jo and, of course, Hampton and James. Those last two are critical in my view. If one is healthy, I really like our chances. If both are healthy (a huge IF - it’d be in bold-face if I knew how), the Braves’ pitching will be in great shape. See you in Dark Star. I have two ducats (front row, Sec. 106) for the split-squad game with the Astros on March 8. I have a feeling a youngster or three will be on the mound that day.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this
Daybed, yes, Lennon. I should change that. Thanks.
By Efrim
February 11, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this
TennPaul
If any team is to do something like that, it is the Pirates. They have had more pitching injuries to young starters than any other team in the majors over the last five years. They could sure pick em.
By Alan
February 11, 2008 5:11 PM | Link to this
DOB, how could I forget to wish you a safe journey? Bon Voyage!
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 5:12 PM | Link to this
OrlandoFan, some of the rental cars have it, some don’t. But either way, I’m all set. I end up listening to CDs rather than satellite radio anyway, but I do love a few of the alt-rock and outlaw country stations, for a song or three.
Your “regular radio” is just as bad as South Florida’s, and that’s as bad as it gets. Worst of any markets I go to all season.
By Cody
February 11, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this
DOB, so you were in Athens lately? Did you get a chance to catch Citizen Cope saturday night at The Georgia Theatre? Also, I find myself not worrying at all about Chuck James’ health and short turns in the rotation. Do you think, as I do, that even if Chuck and Hampton are both healthy, that Jair Jurrjens still takes the number five spot, leaving Chucky out?
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 5:16 PM | Link to this
Bryan, did the kid seriously say that? That’s cool, if he did.
TennPaul, I’m not a big fan of the area, but the weather this time of year? Oh, it’s very nice, indeed. And sitting out there at the ballpark, with the sun shining, the breeze blowing, the workouts over at noon or games over at 4 … not bad. Not bad at all.
If we could just figure out how to avoid I-4 and 192 and how to get the Disney people to merely smile and say an occasional hi, instead of going over-the-top cheery, which gets real old real quick.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this
Cody, I rode the bike over to Athens a couple of Sundays ago. Just got a cup of coffee, went into Wuxtry and Schoolkids for a while, then turned around and rode back. It’s a good ride over there on a nice Sunday with no traffic.
By Anders
February 11, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this
Efrim
The Mets have been going down to Arkansas for that biometrics stuff since Rick Peterson joined them. He’s big into it. Some of the pitchers like it some don’t seem to care. They are required to go though. He gets a read on them and then uses it for comparison throughout the year or if they’re getting sore or something. SNY did a piece on it a couple of years back. It’s pretty cool technology. Not sure if it’s effective though. I always found it ironic that a guy with a 1980’s mullet fancies himself so progressive in the art of pitching!
By N8
February 11, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this
DOB
Yikes. Sorry, didn’t mean to strike a nerve.
“Some people are unhappy. Very unhappy. And your saying they shouldn’t be doesn’t change that fact of life.”
I can live with that. But I’ve seen first hand what suicide can do to a family and friends left behind. The other guitar player in my current band is a triplet. Well, he was. One of his brothers hung himself when he was 13. I didn’t know him then. But I’ve seen what it’s done to him, his other brother, his sister and parents. It really sucks that some dads (like mine) worked at a job they HATED their entire adult lives, because they felt responsible for those relying on them to do so. Others “check out”. Francis (sp?) will live here entire life without knowing her father. That sucks. Don’t get me wrong. It won’t affect me AT ALL.
So when you say that I will never understand…. You’re right. I won’t.
I don’t claim to know Kurt Cobain. As I said in the post. For the most part, it really has no bearing on whether I like Nirvana or him. It is indirectly responsible for me not caring much for SOME of his stuff. If I can’t relate, it doesn’t make that connection for me.
Similar to Everybody Loves Raymond. Pretty simple humor. Not everybody likes it. Some hate it. But MOST of that humor hits home for me (and many married men with annoying in-laws).
That doesn’t mean I don’t respect it, or get why OTHER PEOPLE like (liked it).
When I was a angry teen-age boy, I absolutely LOVED Metallica. I’m not so angry anymore, so unless the melody of Hetfield’s voice or Hammett’s guitar riffs move me, it seems irrelevent to me now, other than nostalgia (which is VERY important to me). It’s that simple.
“I mean, consider yourself fortunate to have a stable existence, and/or inner happiness or contentment.”
Believe me, I do. But it wasn’t always that way. I’ve got plenty of issues in my life that need to be resolved (some that likely NEVER will be), yet once I had kids, I took control of what demons I had, because as a father, I felt I had NO CHOICE.
“But things like addiction, mental illness, inner demons … N8, they’re far, far more complex than you portray them. Doesn’t boil down so easily.”
The only way somebody is willing to change their “evil” ways, is if they TRULY want to change them, and have the supporting cast around them to do so. He had NONE of that (though I surely can’t speak for what he “wanted”). But being married to Courtney, playing in a HUGE band, having money and drugs thrown at him left and right, is not, was not, and certainly never will be the right setting to battle addictions.
“Sorry, but that just perturbs me, when folks try to judge whether others should be happy or just assume that money or success or whatever should satisfy others. I mean, from all I’ve read about him, he was extremely sad and lonely, and success did nothing to help him in that regard. If anything, it only allowed others to take advantage of him and use him.”
Nobody forced him to be a rock-star. Like many before him, and many more will after him. He could have simply walked away and attempted to set himslef on the right path for himself and his child.
“All those photos you have of yourself wearing ripped up (and dirty) jeans, with the �I�ve been wearing this for 4 days� T-shirt, with the flanel over the top and hair that hadn�t been washed for days, looks JUST AS SILLY NOW as the photos of your older brother wearing spandex, and the ones of your dad wearing bell-bottoms and giving the peace sign.”
“You go to small clubs and you’ll still see bands that wear flannel, and some of them are wearing it without irony.”
Yeah…..NOW! Not in 1994.
“And plenty of folks flash peace signs. I saw a few flashed last night on the Grammys, in fact.”
How ironic, in a time where our country is at war, huh?
“I did NOT see any spandex. At least not on dudes.”
Not yet. Just like the EVERY look before it, it will make it’s way back. Doesn’t mean I’m gonna wear it, doesn’t mean we have to like it. But mark it down. Look around. Within a decade, just like every other trend of yester-year the “80’s look” will be back with a new twist.
There is only so many “looks” society can go through before they start repeating themselves.
Anyhow. This wasn’t meant to start a Cobain/Nirvana “war”. I stated my point. Probably offended more people than I intended (wasn’t intending on offending anybody).
That’s all for now. :-)
By TennesseePaul
February 11, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this
Efrim: Yes. I’d say any team could benefit from that. Take Chuck James for instance. If he has an issue, send him down to get looked at. Maybe it can be corrected before it requires a 60 DL stint and major surgery.
Charlie Morton… He and Jeff Bennett are really showing promise with all 20 successful innings they’ve pitched. Maybe we can get those guys into the rotation this year…
OK I’ve put all the contraband down now…
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this
N8, flashing peace signs in a time of war is actually not ironic at all. That’s when people generally flash them, to make a point. That’s when they became popular before, when hippies were making a statement about the Vietnam war.
And I’m NOT getting political here. Just telling you, that was precisely the point then, and why some are flashing them now. Not ironic whatsoever.
By Efrim
February 11, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this
Anders
Its interesting stuff. Peterson is a good coach.
TennPaul
I worry about James. I mean, I’m not a doctor, but him still having soreness can’t be a good thing. He really needs to be healthy for us this year. Reason being because of Hampton and Jurrjens inury history.
Which begs the questions why people aren’t more concerned about it. Jurrjens has had shoulder trouble two consecutive seasons. It just worries me.
By B
February 11, 2008 5:33 PM | Link to this
N8,
Suicide, a majority of the time, is the final result of a person succumbing to a disease …
When was the last time you got upset about someone dying of a terminal disease? Ohh they didn’t try hard enough to beat cancer?
When people treat mental illness like what it is - an illness - there will be far more people wining the fight for their lives.
By richbrave
February 11, 2008 5:34 PM | Link to this
Well Dave between Rohrbaugh and Morton, maybe one of them will become that #1 SP I’ve been screaming about for the past five months. Here’s hoping.
By Lew
February 11, 2008 5:36 PM | Link to this
Far Out
By richbrave
February 11, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this
DAVID O’BRIAN:
Back then I was a straight-laced kid. Didn’t wear peace symbols on my helmet, just learned how to field strip a .50 cal. It’s really hard for me to fathom that you would have explain peace symbols to someone. The memories are too vivid still. National Guard, Select Reserve Force, but back then we just got called out for Newark. Detroit, or Kent State. We were baby-killers etc. Even in the rear-ranks it was pretty rough. Still liked the Braves though.
By JC FROM UT
February 11, 2008 5:54 PM | Link to this
DOB: In your opinion how would you predict Morton? Top,middle or back end of the rotation? Also who do you think is more expendable Yates or Boyer? If Boyer is good and healthy I wouldn’t be suprised to see Yates moved during the spring. Any opinions out there.
By couldawouldashoulda
February 11, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Have you ever listened to any Will Oldham/Bonnie “Prince” Billy/Palace? Particularly his collaboration with Matt Sweeney of Chavez called Superwolf?
I find that album to be perfect for an early morning drive. Those sweet guitar tones just sooth the soul.
Anyway, I’m stoked about daily blogs…
By TBraveFan
February 11, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this
ahhhhhh how I envy you DOB for heading down so soon… I still have a LONG 24 more days! Just reading your description of arriving makes me all the more anxious to just hurry up and get to the condo - I even look forward to heading to the Publix on I-92 for groceries!!!
By N8
February 11, 2008 6:08 PM | Link to this
B
Totally agree with you.
DOB
I know it’s hard to judge sarcasm in “text” format.
But my peace sign/war time comment was sarcasm at it’s finest.
I get it.
For the record, I’m giving the “blog” peace sign on this topic. I’ve proved my point (though you and others may feel I didn’t have one to begin with LOL!), you’ve certainly made yours.
No sense dragging it on any longer than it needs to be, though I’m sure we’re past that point already.
By Chippersgal
February 11, 2008 6:19 PM | Link to this
This question may have been addressed, but I just started participating the other day… Sorry if it’s already been asked… I was j/w what the deal might be with Javy. I know that Brian is the one with the contract, but I was hoping that Javy might play a kind of role that Eddie used to. What are y’all thinking?
By OrlandoFan
February 11, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this
Agreed on the regular radio here. It’s awful.
By Roman Gal
February 11, 2008 6:31 PM | Link to this
Chippersgal, it’s nice to have another gal on the ole’ blog! Anyways, I think Javy (if he makes the team) will be someone’s personal catcher…leaving McCann to catch 4 out of every 5.
By Kevin
February 11, 2008 6:35 PM | Link to this
Has anyone seen the article on ESPN about how Selig knew he was on roids in 2000? I’m sure it will make it’s way around soon enough.
By uga-brave
February 11, 2008 6:37 PM | Link to this
dont know if anyone heard the john rocker segment on 680 the fan this afternoon. he described his own steroid use and how common it was in the majors. he said the mitchell report should of contained at least 200 players.
i missed the begining of the interview, did anyone else here it?
By Eric from MO
February 11, 2008 6:40 PM | Link to this
DOB-just wondering, has there been any discussion on Hampton coming back as a reliever instead of a starter. I mean lets just say he does make it back, on a good day will go 5 innings and be done. I think it would make more sense to make him a reliever so he doesnt have to go so long in a game. Kinda like we did with Smoltz, except we would make him a long reliever or left-handed set-up man instead of a closer.
By StingerSplash
February 11, 2008 6:43 PM | Link to this
Much obliged, DOB. Worked with some folks who thought Pearl Jam was the shizzle over Nirvana. I like Pearl Jam. But … I’ve always preferred Nirvana. “Write off lines .. that don’t make a sense…” There’s the Dylan/Cash/Springsteen group of songwriters - might throw Kevn Kinney and Steve Earle into that mix, as well as Mike Cooley - and then the Costello/Cobain group, more wordplay at hand with them. Now, I’m preparing myself for the Van Halen show in Jacksonville, so lots of the first six VH discs are booming in the champagne room. Anyway, time to strap on the leotard again.
By Eric from MO
February 11, 2008 6:45 PM | Link to this
If Javy makes the team I am going to really wish we still had Maddux. Maddux always said he didnt hate Javy’s catching and said he always took the backup as a favor to the team. I wonder if Javy was the backup would Maddux still want the backup as his personnal catcher.
By DonCoburleone
February 11, 2008 6:46 PM | Link to this
One thing I am worried about as of this moment: If Chuck James’ shoulder injury turns out being serious (like season-ending) and Mike Hampton turns out to be Mike Hampton (aka - injured) then we will be relying on 2 of Jair Jurrjens, Jo-Jo Reyes, Jeff Bennett, and (I guess) Charlie Morton to fill out the 4 & 5 spots in the rotation right DOB… Now projections and “stuff” and hope aside, those 4 have combined to pitch about 180 innings at the major league level (70 of which are innings pitched by Bennett for Milwaukee as a reliever in 2004 BTW)… I just worry we are going to end up in a similar boat as last season where the #4 and 5 spots in the rotation were almost guaranteed losses…
By Kevin
February 11, 2008 6:46 PM | Link to this
uga-brave cleared it up for me but I was talking about John Rocker in my post.
By Fred Secunda
February 11, 2008 6:49 PM | Link to this
DOB, how’s Bowman for a roommate? He seems like the type to drink straight from the carton of milk.
By TennesseePaul
February 11, 2008 6:50 PM | Link to this
If we could just figure out how to avoid I-4 and 192 and how to get the Disney people to merely smile and say an occasional hi, instead of going over-the-top cheery, which gets real old real quick.
Ha! I watch HGTV on occassion, yes, I do. I admit it. There is one lady on there that fits this description. Her name is Constance somthing or other. It’s like she’s all packed full of Prozack and Soma. Never seen someone so excited to pick out a color pallet.
Efrim: why people aren’t more concerned about … Jurrjens has had shoulder trouble two consecutive seasons
Well that is concerning. I hadn’t really noticed the injury history of Jair. Couple that with his numbers which are freakishly similar to Kyle Davies (actually Davies had a slightly better minor league track record and better 7 game MLB debut record) on top of the fact that he’s only pitched 7 MLB game, and 7 games above AA it gets a little less exciting. There are a lot of question marks on this team…
Speaking of injured minor league pitchers, we do have that kid from the Royals we got for Tony Pena Jr. Wonder how he’ll pan out. He was supposed to be a stud… whatever that means.
By Gator
February 11, 2008 7:07 PM | Link to this
DOB, I don’t know if you like talk radio, but the Monsters in the Morning radio show on 104.1 is absolutely hilarious.
By Dadgum
February 11, 2008 7:19 PM | Link to this
Just my opinion and I hope I am wrong but my guess is that Mike Hampton will not be on the opening roster. Tough injury to rebound from and his inactivity will manifest into some poor showings in spring training. Doubtful the Braves will roll the dice with him in their starting 5 given Morton’s presense and desert success earlier. Not sure about you guys but I have written Hampton off already. Again, hope I am wrong. Just wish he was 24 instead of 34.
Just wondering —-why do they call it a building if it is already built.
Rock on…….is Kanye West that egotistical! Thank you Vince Gill for putting him in his place.
By Dane
February 11, 2008 7:35 PM | Link to this
On MLB.com they have been doing Division Perspectives and I have saw all the divisions except for the NL East. Does anyone know if they have done one for the NL East. If so could you please tell me where to look. Thanks.. GO BRAVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By Braveheart
February 11, 2008 7:38 PM | Link to this
Dadgum, if Hampton is healthy, he will be in the rotation. They have had too much money and time invested in him. And he has too much of a track record. Why wouldn’t they take a shot with him instead of the unproven Jurrjens and JoJo and Bennett and the enigmatic Chuck James? And Morton will not be leapfrogging Hampton, James, Jurrjens, Bennett, JoJo until he demonstrates more in the minors and the need arises later in the summer.
By KC
February 11, 2008 7:48 PM | Link to this
Dadgum: If Hampton is reasonably healthy… he’ll be on the roster. You can count on it. What else would they do? They can’t send him down.
The Braves (wisely) aren’t counting on anything from Hampton. And there’s nothing wrong with writing Hampton off if by that you mean simply that you’re not expecting anything from him. The Braves aren’t counting on him by any means. However, if he’s healthy, the Braves aren’t going to write him off in the sense that they wouldn’t give him every opportunity to bounce back.
If he’s healthy enough to pitch, he can still be an asset. Sure, he’ll be rusty… but if his body can hold up long enough, I’m pretty sure he can help.
By Nelson
February 11, 2008 7:49 PM | Link to this
Do not rush Mike Hamptom! I know that he wants to give the Braves something in return for the money they or the Insurance Co. paid him, but it will be better if he is not rushed!
By TennesseePaul
February 11, 2008 7:52 PM | Link to this
So here it is…
John Smoltz: 41 years old. stupendous. 4 arm surgeries.
Tom Glavine: 42 years old. good.
Mike Hampton: 3 years of injuries, 36 years old. whatever.
Chuck James: 27 years old, torn rotator cuff
Jair Jurrjians: 22 years old.
After the way he exited, in such pain that he was biting his glove, it’s good to see Jair Jurrjens throwing again. There’s some question over whether he’ll return this season, and if so in what role, though those answers are going to be dictated by the Tigers’ playoff chances as much as Jurrjens’ arm. The young pitcher has had arm problems at the end of seasons, making many wonder if he’s not more suited to relief work, though the Tigers haven’t yet given up on their young pitcher’s starting chances yet.
—Will Carroll Sept. 7th 2007.
JoJo Reyes: 23 years old, 2-2 6.22 ERA after 11 games.
Buddy Carlyle: 30 year old journey man, 8-7 5.21 ERA in 2007.
Jeff Bennett: 28 years old. 8 seasons in the minors as a reliever. 6 good starts in 2007.
Charlie Morton: 25 years old. 6 minor league seasons, 25-43 4.93 ERA. finished 2007 with 20 good innings.
Thank goodness we have Tim Hudson. Let’s hope for no strains or pulls. And then lets spread that hope around the whole rotation.
On a different note, that Jair Jurrjens site is interesting. The guy really likes him or he is incredibly bored.
By TennesseePaul
February 11, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this
Of course that was only the pitchers, add in Chipper and Kotsay…
Perhaps the philosophy is to increase the chance of “catching lightening in a bottle” by acquiring a large number of bottles.
By woogidy
February 11, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
hedge head, funny. very funny. and n8 I agree with you on mostly everything about the nirvana/cobain thing but the only thing is, you wasted a lot of typing on trying to convince others your point of view. I really think Nirvana sucked to be honest with you. I just don’t see it either. I will give it up to Cobain for having passion in his music, but musically, it seems like the same 6 notes over and over to me. And lyrically? “All in all is all we are” 20 times at the end of a song is annoying at best to me. That’s just me. Oh and Hampton not being on the roster? Not happening. He is AHEAD of where Smoltz and Chuckie are right now having thrown off the mound 6 or 7 times. He may be a long man, but will definitely be on the roster. Hey and is arm sure is rested.
By uga-brave
February 11, 2008 8:06 PM | Link to this
saw mike sweeney just signed a minor league contract with the a’s.
there was a time in the late 90’s when everyone thought this guy was going to be the next great a.l. first baseman. the guy had a hard time staying healthy.
it just makes what chipper does more and more impressive. chipper is two years older and producing like he is in his prime.
i really believe if he plays 145 or more he will be right there in the M.V.P.
i think having tex hitting behind him all year will make that big of a difference. he’s gonna see a couple more fastballs then he has in previous seasons.
By uga-brave
February 11, 2008 8:07 PM | Link to this
saw mike sweeney just signed a minor league contract with the a’s.
there was a time in the late 90’s when everyone thought this guy was going to be the next great a.l. first baseman. the guy had a hard time staying healthy.
it just makes what chipper does more and more impressive. chipper is two years older and producing like he is in his prime.
i really believe if he plays 145 or more he will be right there in the M.V.P.
i think having tex hitting behind him all year will make that big of a difference. he’s gonna see a couple more fastballs then he has in previous seasons.
By McFann
February 11, 2008 8:08 PM | Link to this
Oh yeah, the radio in Florida stinks. Whenever we would go to Disney World, we’d be sure to bring some good CDs. (Course, the first few times we went—late 90’s— we were still using cassette tapes!! That seems ancient, don’t it?)
Roman Gal—
Javy would prob’ly be Glavine’s personal catcher. Don’t know why I feel that way, I just do. Last year Chucky seemed to get stuck with all the backups. Could be why he didn’t always get good run support—Oops! Sorry. Did that slip out? Mea culpa.
A-Anyway…yeah, 1 day off outta five wouldn’t hurt (no pun intended there). That’d be almost six days off every month…And, of course, towards the end of the season, maybe he cann take a day off every four days or so. (Just not when Smoltz is starting, of course.)
By PatioDaddio
February 11, 2008 8:15 PM | Link to this
Jair Jurrjians: 22 years old. After the way he exited, in such pain that he was biting his glove, it’s good to see Jair Jurrjens throwing again. There’s some question over whether he’ll return this season, and if so in what role, though those answers are going to be dictated by the Tigers’ playoff chances as much as Jurrjens’ arm. The young pitcher has had arm problems at the end of seasons, making many wonder if he’s not more suited to relief work, though the Tigers haven’t yet given up on their young pitcher’s starting chances yet. —Will Carroll Sept. 7th 2007.
http://jairjurrjens.com/2007/jurrjens-911-start-versus-texas/ Saturday, September 15th, 2007…1:06 pm Jurrjens 9/11 Start versus Texas Jump to Comments
Using Enhanced Gameday, here is a break down of Jair Jurrjens September 11th start against the Texas Rangers. This was Jurrjens first start since coming off the disabled list. In his last start he left the game in the second inning with soreness in the back or his shoulder and neck.
Jurrjens lasted 5 innings picking up the win with a lone first inning run crossing the plate. He allowed only 3 hits and a walk, but he only struck out one batter. He induced 6 fly outs and 7 groundouts. Pitch Type
Jurrjens typical arsenal includes a fastball, a change up, a curve, and a slurve. My understanding is that the 4th pitch isn’t as refined and isn’t thrown very frequently. Looking at enhanced gameday data, it was tough to differentiate a 4th pitch, so the break pitches are grouped together as curves.
Sunday, September 16th, 2007…2:55 pm JJ Goes 5 1/3 innings of no hit ball Jump to Comments
Tremendous start for Jair Jurrjens against the Minnesota Twins today. He didn’t allow his first hit until there was one out in the 6th inning. His final line includes 5 1/3 innings of work, 2 hits, 1 run, 1 walk, and a career high 6 strike outs on 90 pitches.
By Roman Gal
February 11, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this
McFann, well Javy did catch Glavine when he was in ATL…so it would definately make sense.
By N8
February 11, 2008 8:37 PM | Link to this
woogidy
“…you wasted a lot of typing on trying to convince others your point of view.”
I seem to do that a lot.
“All in all is all we are” 20 times at the end of a song is annoying at best to me.”
:-)
By chuckw/deadjournalist
February 11, 2008 8:40 PM | Link to this
a few things:
1) i’m so sick and tired of steroids… i’ve gone back and forth from want to to discuss it to wanting to ignore it completely to being so frustrated at the whole thing that it literally makes me irate.
2) i think braves fans should really enjoy this year. i know i want to make a point to getting to more games that i have been to in the last few years. this might be the last time we see glavine and maybe smoltz. and maybe lopez if he makes the team.
3) i went to see the greenville braves play the chattanooga lookouts back in ‘91. it’s hard to believe that all the guys on those teams (and that greenville team was loaded) have retired. ryan klesko, turk wendell, al martin and for the lookouts, dan wilson.
4) there were times when i thought i was the only person who could enjoy a baseball game while listening to bands like the smiths and the talking heads. i’m glad i’m not.
By uga-brave
February 11, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this
roman gal,
javy caught everyone but maddux. maddux always said javy never got the ball back fast enough to him. always found that kind of strange. however i would not automatically concede the backup job to javy just yet.
once certain players hit the so called wall they rarely make it back.
By N8
February 11, 2008 8:45 PM | Link to this
Just got home to find the new issue of Guitar World in my mailbox, which has EVH and his son Wolfgang on the cover.
Now, I know that Wolf is “playing the part” of Michael Anthony on the current tour, but was/is it really necessary for him to actually LOOK like him? LOL!
GW cover
Secondly, is it just me or does EVH these days, resembling Matthew Glave (I had to look it up - MAN I love the imdb website!), who played Glenn Goolia (sp?) in the Wedding Singer with Adam Sandler?
By Roman Gal
February 11, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this
uga-brave
I know. I was answering a question earlier and said if Javy makes the team…but let’s be honest here…if Javy has a decent spring, he’ll make the team.
By N8
February 11, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
DOB
I saw somebody mention the kid we got from the Royals for Pena Jr, earlier.
After looking it up, his name is Erik Cordier, (You probably knew that though).
As the other poster asked, what (if any) is the word on him. If I’m not mistaken, his TJ surgery was in 2006, which would put him on the map to pitch in our system this season.
He was born in 86, so that makes him about 22 (good math, huh?).
Is he on the radar, or is a low-level prospect that we won’t see for a couple of years?
Scouting report (before the surgery) says mid-90’s fast ball and a “developing” curveball.
By McFann
February 11, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
Could be why I feel that way, Roman Gal. Then again, it could just be a product of my warped mind. Ya know, the whole “Glavine prob’ly wouldn’t want to pitch to McCann” crud.
Then again, Galvine might want Javy so he cann pitch to a fit catcher, eh? Kidding. Just uh…kidding.
8 >
By Roman Gal
February 11, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this
eh, Baby Huey is our yoga boy now. Maybe he’ll lose some of that baby fat, *McFann
By McFann
February 11, 2008 9:31 PM | Link to this
Yeah, Roman Gal. Good point. Guess we’ll find out sooner or later.
: )
By Metropolitan Man
February 11, 2008 9:58 PM | Link to this
John Rocker, the braves Ambassador!!!!
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this
N8, he’ll be in the system this year. That kid threw very hard before surgery, so no reason to believe he won’t now. He had some impressive numbers in the low minors.
I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s competing for a spot at some point in 2009. Would seem highly unlikely this season.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 10:07 PM | Link to this
Chuck, have you seen that documentary on the Smiths that just came out? It’s by the “other two” in the band (besides Morrissey and Marr) and it’s supposed to be a warts-and-all depiction that got great review across the pond.
By TennesseePaul
February 11, 2008 10:09 PM | Link to this
Kirk Radomski, the Mets Ambassador!
PatioDaddio… see that site is pretty interesting. The guy really has some time on his hands.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
Fred Secunda, you don’t really believe that I live under the same roof as Bowman during spring training, do you? Please tell me you don’t.
By N8
February 11, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this
DOB
Thanks for the info.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this
Stinger, hopefully you’ll see a better Van Halen show than some at the AJC saw here in Atlanta. One of the sports bigwigs told me it was the worst concert he’s ever been to. Ever.
By brian
February 11, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this
Richmond’s rotation will be rocking with James, Jair or JoJo (or possibly two of them if Hampton is healthy) and Charlie
By Metropolitan Man
February 11, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this
Kirk Radomski: Rockers “pick me up”!!
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 10:21 PM | Link to this
B: Excellent post at 5:33. Couldn’t agree more.
Couldawouldshoulda: I’ve got the Bonnie Prince Billy album that he did with Tortoise in 2006, called “The Brave and the Bold,” and the solo album “The Letting Go” from that same year. Both are great, and yes, particularly early morning or any time mellow is the preferred vibe.
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 10:23 PM | Link to this
Gotta get back to watching this KU-Texas game at Austin, which isn’t looking too good for the ‘Hawks right now. Longhorns just took 48-46 lead three minutes into second half. Great game, except for the score.
By Hunk Erdown
February 11, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this
Did any of ya’ll ever hear a local band called “Discord” a few years back? Had a friend named Ace that sang for the group… they were supposed to have a lot of potential but could never get past doing local gigs and a few self produced cds. I’ve got some video of them, but its not really my kind of thang. Anyway, Ace got killed in a car wreck. I don’t know if the rest of the group ever did anything else or not.
By Timothy J Bradley
February 11, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this
TennesseePaul - your 7:57 was absolutely LOL priceless! The bottles! Yes, indeed! On the other hand, what are the chances of all of these bottles emptying to injury and futility? If any three of them come through - given the proven vets - aren’t we sitting pretty? Never mind -too many variables, but I did riff on your expression of lightning finding the bottles. Keep on, man!
By Tonya
February 11, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this
For those of you that still remember me……
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23118590/
By uga-brave
February 11, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this
DOB,
still think the jayhawks get a one seed providing they win the big 12 and if they win the big 12 tourney they are a lock. memphis, acc, big 12, pac 10. i think the big east will knock each other off.
By ippississiM
February 11, 2008 11:27 PM | Link to this
Does anyone have a link to that stats prediction site mentioned on the last blog?
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 11, 2008 11:32 PM | Link to this
Bryan - I can definitely see that taking place, and nobody around getting the joke. I’m laughing just thinking about it!
Bryan, DOB, and anyone else looking forward to the new REM cd — here’s a song-by-song rundown of the new album
By Newman
February 11, 2008 11:36 PM | Link to this
DOB I stand corrected. Out Here In the Middle was not written by REK, but his take his much better. REK makes for great driving music, espicially around central FL.
By uga-brave
February 11, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
TONYA,
you have morphed into that talking dog from “men in black”
By David O'Brien
February 11, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this
Helluva game in Austin tonight, and the other one (besides road game at K-State) I knew the Jayhawks could easily lose. Texas is 89-6 at home in the past six seasons. Not bad.
Yes, they should be a No. 1 seed, but still a lot of ‘ball to be played.
KU will get severely tested in the last game of the regular season, at Texas A&M. Oklahoma State will also give the ‘Hawks a good game at Stillwater on Feb. 23 (they always play them tough down there), and much-improved K-State should give them another good game in Lawrence on March 1. Top half of the conference is very tough.
By uga-brave
February 12, 2008 12:08 AM | Link to this
whats the over under till we see john rocker on a reality show?
got a hunch that andy and roger will not be exchanging christmas cards this season.
sounds like andy spilled the goods. this is really very, very sad. lifelong frienships and reputations will never be the same
By Fred Secunda
February 12, 2008 12:17 AM | Link to this
I knew you had better taste than that DOB, but you just never know these days.
I thought I remember you writing something in the past about having to share a pad with the guy, but I guess I was wrong.
To borrow a line from Shawshank, Bowman seems like Elmo Blatch: “a big, twitchy f*, the kind of roommate you pray you don’t get.”
By Murphy
February 12, 2008 12:33 AM | Link to this
What happened to Bryan Pena?
By BosnianBaller
February 12, 2008 12:52 AM | Link to this
Everybody is talkin about the mets,but phily had a good offseason in my mind.Feliz always hits good against the Braves and Jenkins will benefit playing in that small ballpark.And Lidge could come around but i doubt it.Their pitching is a big question starting and pen
By ippississiM
February 12, 2008 12:59 AM | Link to this
Is anybody but me excited about the fact that the Bravos start the regular season against Washington, or about the fact that it’s the Sunday “early” game on ESPN?
By StingerSplash
February 12, 2008 1:02 AM | Link to this
Just read Rodney Ho’s review of the VH show. Sounds like a lot of the problems were technical in nature. Plus, they are almost ready for AARP benefits, for crying out loud. Saw VH with Sammy a couple of years ago and Eddie did not have a remote pack then, relying on an old fashioned and large cord to plug in his axe. But if the great “Romeo’s Delight” is on the set list, I am so there, dude!
By richbrave
February 12, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this
ippissisiM:
Yeah me. It’s one of the 18 Braves games that’s on local T,V.
By Coach(Lets Go Braves In 2008)
February 12, 2008 1:24 AM | Link to this
Another smoking gun pointed right at Roger Clemens.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3239471
By Teddy Jack Eddy
February 12, 2008 2:14 AM | Link to this
Regarding Mike Hamstrung,I mean Hampton.DOB’s 10 keys (#7 I believe) stated that he keeps himself in great condition.Well in the first inning of his first start of winter ball he pulled his hamstring.I’m not and never was a pro athlete but everybody with any knowledge recognizes that injury coming so quickly is often a bi-product of poor conditioning.It really gets old reading one excuse after another for a gready,selfish (lazy ?)player.For 120 million I could sit on my a* and cry about how sorry I was to let the team down.
By Coach(Lets Go Braves In 2008)
February 12, 2008 3:11 AM | Link to this
Braves baseball on TV in eighteen days. The February 29th exhibition game vs. the Dodgers is televised on ESPN.
By nOLIE
February 12, 2008 5:03 AM | Link to this
The affidavit of Yankees pitcher Andy Pettitte helps to support the account of Brian McNamee, Roger Clemens’ former trainer, that he gave Clemens injections of banned drugs, according to a ranking member of the congressional committee investigating the use of illegal drugs in baseball.HERE
Newsday.com first reported the story Monday night after interviewing Rep. Tom Davis (R-Va.) Monday. Davis said that in an affidavit given to the House Oversight Committee, Pettitte’s account matches McNamee’s in most details, but that in a separate affidavit to the committee Clemens said both are mistaken
By nOLIE
February 12, 2008 5:18 AM | Link to this
DOB, Escobar’s arm is a rated a 70 in the scouting reports I’ve seen (my personal rating was higher, but, hey, I’m not a scout), I give him plus hands and average-to-good range. He can pick it, no problem.Scoots
70 out of 80 is very very good Scoots
By ncscoots
February 12, 2008 6:18 AM | Link to this
nolie, thanks, I’m familiar with the scale. For those who aren’t (and I guess I should made that a little clearer, LOL), Furcal’s arm is rated 80, the top of the scale, just to provide a reference point. Escobar’s range is a little short of Furcal’s, though, so he probably won’t get to balls where that difference in arm would be a factor.
In any event, I think folks are gonna be happy with his defense. I didn’t see every game he played in Atlanta last year, but I don’t remember any really spectacular plays in the field from him. But I remember a minor league series I saw him play, in which he just made my jaw drop. He’ll be fun to watch, I think.
By nOLIE
February 12, 2008 7:11 AM | Link to this
nolie, thanks, I’m familiar with the scale. Scoots
I’m sorry. I thought you would be from your previous posts. I included that for some others who might not be that familiar and perhaps think it went to 100
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 9:17 AM | Link to this
Why doesn’t Clemens just admit it? Is he that stupid or is he like OJ and has convinced himself he didn’t do it? Or does he think we are all stupid?
I’ve got my problems with McNamee and with Mitchell. But the bottomline is that Clemens cheated. We all know it despite how much McNamee lacks in credibility.
The best way for Clemens to have approached this was to say, yeah, son, I did it. What did you expect? The whole darn league was doing it. The feats of those who were clearly using were being celebrated and basically endorsed by the league. I was washed up in 1996 because damn near every hitter in the league was using and I wasn’t. So, yeah, I used to compete. Was I supposed to lose out on the money, fame, and ability to compete in the environment that existed in the MLB at that time because I was gonna be a holier than thou martyr?
I think people would be very receptive to that. It is what Bonds and McGwire should have said 5 years ago. Chrissakes, Mitchell provided Clemens and any other roid freak this excuse in his report. Only a dummy like Clemens would not see the wink, wink out Mitchell was giving him.
The downfall of Clemens, McGwire, and Bonds won’t be the roids or cheating. It the enormous pride and ego and the resultant lies and stupidity.
By Random
February 12, 2008 9:32 AM | Link to this
PocorobaNaharodny: “I like their old stuff tons better than their new stuff but you could never understand what Michael Stipe was saying back then.”
Or doing.
He was always funny that way.
I remember this one time in I guess 80 or 81 — I was back for a month or so from grad school at UNC-CH) — and me and some of the guys were building Vic Chesnutt a ramp to the front porch of his house on north Chase Street.
(My main contribution to the effort was to provide the geometric proof that we needed to cut the bottoms of the frame’s 2x4s to make them flush with the horizontal sidewalk at the supplementary angle of the angle that we cut the tops of the 2x4s to make them flush with the vertical riser of the stop step.)
Anyway, Michael (already, he had become — locally, at least — a one-name celebrity like Elvis or Bono) drives by, stops and gets out to join us, and everybody’s quietly ooh-ing and whispering “It’s Michael, it’s Michael”. RFE had barely come out, but he was already a local godling.
He didn’t say a word, just kind of floated around observing for a while, and then left.
Pretty funny. Good times, eh, Lew?
(Michael used to get on me for taking flash pictures at concerts, and I’m actually thinking at the time, “Who does this jerk think he is?”. Well, I guess we all know which one the jerk was.)
PS: So, PocorobaNaharodny, are you also, like, the Eggs-Squire of Statesboro?
;-)
By Tomahawkin' Again
February 12, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
DOB, the Central Fla Braves Nation welcomes you back to Dark Star. I work at the JW Marriott/Ritz-Carlton here in Orlando and already am looking forward to this weekend heading out to pay my 11 bucks just to enter into Wide World to see grown men stretching and scratching themselves for a couple of hours. Are we in heaven? Yes!
By David O'Brien
February 12, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this
Random, that’s a rich story. Very cool.
By Random
February 12, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this
Teddy Jack Eddy — Here’s a couple of You tube links for Hampton’s One inning of Mexican league beisbol that might still work. You’ll be able to see for yourself what happened.
Imo, it was a freak (or perhaps stupid) accident.
Here and here.
By couldawouldashoulda
February 12, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this
DOB,
BPB’s “The Letting Go” was a little bit of a return of sorts to his roots, back to the same kind of vibe you get from “I See a Darkness” (easily his best and one you should check out, if you haven’t already). I never really got into that Tortoise collaboration although I did enjoy the Devo cover.
By Braves Fan in NYC
February 12, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this
DOB- have you tried the debut album from Vampire Weekend or The White Rabbits’ “Fort Nightly”? I just picked up the Selmanaires new release and am looking forward to getting into that.
Go Bravos!
By PocorobaNaharodny
February 12, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this
Random
I can tell that there is no way you were a student at UGA if you know what a supplementary angle is. I became an early REM fan after the fact. I worked with a guy who had gone to school in Athens before trasferring to Tech and we ended up working long hours on a project and he brought his REM collection in to work. He was the one who made the observation that it was better when you couldn’t understand the words. They had a fun, garage-band sound that was funny and smart (the parts that you could understand, anyway, like the floaters on the power lines). Now I am an old geezer who listens to talk radio most of the time.
I am really looking forward to this season. One thing I love about baseball is that there is a game almost every day, so you only have to wait until the next night for another chance for something good to happen. If you understand my handle, you know I have been a Braves fan for a long time, all my life actually, except for 1963-66, because they were not here yet and I was not old enough to know.
I am concerned about counting on 40+ pitchers so heavily, though. If we can get one more good year out of Smoltz and Glavine, that is probably all we can realistically expect. So this may have to be the year.
By masivatack
February 12, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this
It seems I remember a pretty impressive play by Yunel late in the season. It was a turn of a double play that Edgar started.
If my memory serves me correctly, ER fielded a slow grounder turned and fired a bullet (relatively speaking, of course) to second, and insted of fielding the the throw with his glove, YE barehands the ball behind his ear and unloaded to first. It was one of those “OH NOOOO…OH MY GOD” kinda plays.
On that note DOB, have you heard anything about YE’s conditioning or offseason workouts, and do you see him addding any more power? Seems like his swing, which I wouldn’t want to change in the least, dictates that he will always be a doubles hitter. He seems to have a frame, though, that would support adding some more muscle.
By "Neal Boortz"
February 12, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this
Roman Gal — don’t forget McFann and nOLIE.
By feltsoul
February 12, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this
DOB…you should add Ryan Adams Easy Tiger to the cd arsenal. really good album. Go Braves
By Eric from MO
February 12, 2008 10:49 AM | Link to this
Braveheart,”Why doesn’t Clemens just admit it?”
Well what if he didnt do it? What if someone says Smoltz or Glavine or Maddux used it. Does that mean they should just admit it? Even if they didnt use it. Im not saying he didnt, but Im really sick of this witchhunt. We have steroid testing in place now and we are working on HGH testing. Lets just move on.
Every era has an unfair advantage. We have seen the deadball era and there was also a time when blacks and foriegners werent allowed to play. This is just the steroid era. If Ruth had to play against black pitchers maybe he wouldnt have that many homeruns and if Cy Young wasnt allowed to throw a spit-ball maybe he wouldnt have 511 wins. Like you said, if everyone one is doing it, then its not an unfair advantage. Lets just move on!
By DAP
February 12, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this
guys, here is escobar’s nice play))
if you have trouble getting it, just go to escobar’s page on the braves site. click on the video that says “braves turn two”. boog loves the plays, and they show tex just staring at escobar in unbelief. its pretty sweet.
By ncscoots
February 12, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this
OK, guys, LOL…just because I didn’t see Escobar make super plays last year doesn’t mean he didn’t. :-) I must have missed that game.
By ncscoots
February 12, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
nolie, no apology necessary, my man, no offense taken.
By FJR
February 12, 2008 11:08 AM | Link to this
DOB,
I know you are old school and all, but man an Ipod would make your life 2109387498 times easier. Over winter break (im in law school) I just looked at the boxes and boxes of old cds and thought “well that was a pain in the rear” Now there are no scratches ruining impossible to find imports, no bulky reams of 200 cd books that seem to be magnets for spilled diet coke and I can ply my music anyway I want, strait through on the album or easily created mixes.
Additionally, having all your music centrally located on your computer makes it waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay easier to find stuff. I remember once taking an entire day off of studying because I just HAD to find Birds of Fire by Mahavishnu Orchestra. Now I just type mah and bam, right there on my computer.
Sure there are some CDs that come out where I buy the actual physical CD, but even in that case things are better because I can quickly burn it and then the CD becomes a collector’s item and doesn’t risk the abuse of constant use (or conversely the pain of proper care).
I was as hard headed as you about it, then I got an Ipod as an award for a job I was working at, tried and was immediately hooked.
By jed
February 12, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this
glad to see rocker putting his big mouth to good use. selig has positioned himself as a commisioner who had no knowledge of the steroid problem. what nonsense.
By Lew
February 12, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this
Random-I was at Wuxtry-not sure quite when, but they had moved from across from the Arch down to Baxter Street. I used to exhibit some of my art there. Must have been around 79 or so-not sure, but REM was still playing Abbott’s Pizza and had not even played O’Malley’s yet. Pete Buck was working behind the counter and while we were talking, he got a phone call.
Turns out it was from a guy who was in a band called Rapid Eye Movement, and he was disputing REM’s use of the name. The end result was that REM would remain REM and Rapid Eye Movement would remain Rapid Eye Movement. It always cracked me up in later years-never did hear from Rapid Eye Movement, did we? The other band? Well, we know Pete no longer sells used records and books. I think he uses his same amp, though.
By Goodoleboy58
February 12, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this
Spring is in the Air… well not here in the desert it rained like crazy last night with thunder loud enough to keep you awake.. but March is Spring training/sand storm season lol… I can’t wait to see how we shape up this year…
I read that Terrance Moore thinks Bobby should manage forever, is that some kind of reverse psychology? He never has anything positive to say lol…
Hey in other news John Rocker admitted to steroid use lol thats a shocker.. A shame too he was good while it lasted..
I’m so tired of hearing about all these steroid episodes.. I’m ready for the smack of the catcher’s glove from Smoltzie’s first spring training fastball…
By Cody
February 12, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this
DOB, some good albums for those foggy, early morning rides: John Legend’s - Once Again Fleetwood Mac - Greastest Hits Jackson Browne- The Very Best Of JB Jose Gonzalez - Veneer Kevin Devine - Circle Gets the Square Just to name a few. Pretty pumped about P’s and C’s meeting. I cant wait to see how Charlie Morton pitches, along with Hampton, and Jair. Im also pretty excited to see how Mark Kotsay’s back holds up. I know there are concerns about him, but if he stays healthy the man can put up some quality numbers and at-bats. I wouldnt be shocked to see him hit .287/16/78. DOB, if Kotsay has a year like that, would the Braves consider signing him to a one year extension? Just a though to maybe get Mr. Schafer all the time he needs to develop.
By Cody
February 12, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this
DOB, some good albums for those foggy, early morning rides: John Legend’s - Once Again Fleetwood Mac - Greastest Hits Jackson Browne- The Very Best Of JB Jose Gonzalez - Veneer Kevin Devine - Circle Gets the Square Just to name a few. Pretty pumped about P’s and C’s meeting. I cant wait to see how Charlie Morton pitches, along with Hampton, and Jair. Im also pretty excited to see how Mark Kotsay’s back holds up. I know there are concerns about him, but if he stays healthy the man can put up some quality numbers and at-bats. I wouldnt be shocked to see him hit .287/16/78. DOB, if Kotsay has a year like that, would the Braves consider signing him to a one year extension? Just a though to maybe get Mr. Schafer all the time he needs to develop.
By couldawouldashoulda
February 12, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this
FJR is right…an Ipod will change your life.
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this
I think Terrence Moore wants Bobby to manage forever because Willie Randolph has finished ahead of Bobby the last 2 years.
By doc
February 12, 2008 11:39 AM | Link to this
safe travels david, presume you were able to get the bike on board sunday. thanks for music assist, perfect as always.
By Random
February 12, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this
Thanks, DOB — seems like there’s been so much name-dropping around here lately, I thought I’d take a shot myself. More where that came from, but we’ve gotta pace ourselves. (Joking.)
There’s actually a fair chance I still have the scrap of paper I used for my gazinters. Probably in a box somewhere with my Chowder Shouters and Pressure Boys EPs. (Anybody remember The Arkansas Side?
By masivatack
February 12, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this
Good job DAP, I tried but failed to find video footage. I might have embellished a little with my re-enactment, but still pretty sweet.
Who wants to guess an over/under of how many times he gets hit by a pitch this year? My guess would be 15+. His swing, plus his seeming arrogant streak (not a bad thing in my book to have that confidence) should make for some drama this year.
By Cody
February 12, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this
couldawouldashoulda, you would agree. Man you cant beat a fresh CD or cassette to stick in the stereo.
By masivatack
February 12, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this
yunel that is
By Goodoleboy58
February 12, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this
Braveheart:
you are probably right lol…
By Murphy
February 12, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this
DOB Have you heard of this guy? He is originally from the Atlanta area. [http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=302370128]
By Some Blogs Have Jokes
February 12, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this
Shaun: Hey nOLIE, whatcha doin’?”
nOLIE: I’m sellin me hear sum of the fershest, joosiest yeller korn you’ll ever knaw awn.
Shaun: Sounds good — how much?
nOlie: Jist wun doller per 8 inch cob.
Shaun: A buck an ear? That’s piracy!
By McFann
February 12, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this
While we’re on the subject of music, here’s a little sound taken from a great song by Billy Joel:
It’s 8 o’clock on a We’nsday night
Our regular group’s hangin’ out.
Then U Kno Who show here to chat
There’s something new to talk about.
Around here it’s all ‘bout Braves baseball
But the other teams are thrown in, too.
And the Mets fans, oh sheesh!
All they want is to teach
Us to all shout “Go Mets and BIg Blue!”
La la la di dee da…La la di dee da…da dum.
Post us a blog, you’re the Beat Writer
Post us a blog tonight.
Well we’re all in the mood for some baseball now
And we love to chat on your site.
Now Wayne in Utah is a friend of mine
When we speak of Brian McCann.
DAP, Scoots and, F 1 should
Sometimes some things good.
Uga-brave thinks Braveheart is the man.
And Lew, he will give out a Wurlitzer
To those who cann make smart arguments.
Yeah, I’m sure Anders will never win one
‘Cause he does not always make sense.
La la la di dee da…La la di dee da…da dum.
10Paul’s not a fan of emoticons.
But I think they’re cute little guys.
Random makes smirky faces
In a few different places.
He taught me to make one with wide eyes. 8 )
Post us a blog, you’re the Beat Writer
Post us a blog tonight.
Well we’re all in the mood for some baseball now
And we love to chat on your site.
We get pretty good crowds in the off season
While we can’t wait for baseball to start.
Sometimes what we say
From baseball turns away
But ‘round here the Braves still are the heart.
And there are times when we all cann agree
Like the Braves should have a real good year.
And when Mets fans log on
Trying to say that we’re wrong
We say “Man! What are you doin’ here?”
Post us a blog, you’re the Beat Writer
Post us a blog tonight.
Well we’re all in the mood for some baseball now
And we love to chat on your site!!
By uga-brave
February 12, 2008 12:07 PM | Link to this
pocorobanaharodny,
how come no love for VIC CORRALL.
By Overlord
February 12, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
Hamptons arm looks really good in that you tube video….. I dont see any problem with that arm. And his leg injury doesnt seems to be something that bad. It would be scary to have Tom, Tom, John and Mike in the rotation. It was really encouraging to see that video. James might be #5 but that would be a waste of time, should go with bennett right away, why wait until james is 4-6 to let bennett show his talent??? Even JJ might not be ready but i could be mistaken.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 12, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this
Here’s some clippings from an MLB.com article, titled “Looking at the top stories entering ‘08.” This is not for the faint-of-heart Braves fans.
*Johan, Pedro and the mighty Mets: It’s tough to knock the Yankees off the back pages, but chances are the Mets will do that at least two out of every five days this summer. With the addition of Johan Santana to a staff that already included future Hall of Famer Pedro Martinez, New York’s NL team has two of the most compelling pitchers in baseball, not to mention the best in the business, alongside the best of the past decade.
The Mets scored plenty last year; they just weren’t quite good enough at preventing runs. Adding Santana changes the entire balance of power in the NL East and makes them must-watch baseball at least three times a week.*
And further down in the article is this paragraph:
Rising Rays and Reds? Fading royalty? For most of the past 15 years, the Atlanta Braves have set the standard in the NL. Over the last 10 or so, the St. Louis Cardinals have stood toe-to-toe with them, if not above them. But both are coming off down years, and both have watched division rivals make bold moves. It could be a losing year in both Atlanta and St. Louis, and that hasn’t happened since 1990.
By Roman Gal
February 12, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this
Neal Boortz, they may be ladies, but they’re not “gals.” Anyways, I haven’t read anything that says nolie is a lady.
McFann, good one :)
By Random
February 12, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
Great story, Lew!!! (Too bad Bowie didn’t negotiate so ably with the little Monkee — it might have spared Zowie some grief at boarding school.)
I “graducated” summer of 79, and only ever remember Wuxtry on the corner of College Ave — yeah, I guess that’d be about a block north of the Arch. (I used to always go to the comic shop — news stand actually, I guess; this was before Peter David revolutionized comics marketing — half a block west of there.)
‘Bout all I ever did on Baxter — west of Milledge, that is — aside from my Dad buying me a rib-eye each new quarter, was sell my plasma twice a week. You ever do that? $7 for the first pint of the week, $8 for the second pint in the same week, and $25 bonus for every tenth pint. That allowed me to buy comics and maintain my weekly Sunday evening at Sons of Italy. (Baxter east of Milledge = Krystal!!! Yay!)
By Goodoleboy58
February 12, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
I wouldn’t mind Chuckie in the 5th spot… as long as we pull him before the 6th inning… for whatever reason it just always comes unraveled in the 6th grr
By McFann
February 12, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this
OH CRUD!! I forgot a verse. DANG IT!! OK, it goes after the thing about—well, I’ll just give it to ya again (The verse I forgot is in bold):
It’s 8 o’clock on a We’nsday night
Our regular group’s hangin’ out.
Then U Kno Who show here to chat
There’s something new to talk about.
Around here it’s all ‘bout Braves baseball
But the other teams are thrown in, too.
And the Mets fans, oh sheesh!
All they want is to teach
Us to all shout “Go Mets and BIg Blue!”
La la la di dee da…La la di dee da…da dum.
Post us a blog, you’re the Beat Writer
Post us a blog tonight.
Well we’re all in the mood for some baseball now
And we love to chat on your site.
Now Wayne in Utah is a friend of mine
When we speak of Brian McCann.
DAP, Scoots and, F 1 should
Sometimes some things good.
Uga-brave thinks Braveheart is the man.
And Lew, he will give out a Wurlitzer
To those who cann make smart arguments.
Yeah, I’m sure Anders will never win one
‘Cause he does not always make sense.
La la la di dee da…La la di dee da…da dum.
10Paul’s not a fan of emoticons.
But I think they’re cute little guys.
Random makes smirky faces
In a few different places.
He taught me to make one with wide eyes. 8 )
Oh and Roman Gal, she’s goo to have around
And old Thirsty Horse, he rode away
Ah, but the rest of us don’t want to leave it here
‘Cause for baseball, it’s the place to stay.
Post us a blog, you’re the Beat Writer
Post us a blog tonight.
Well we’re all in the mood for some baseball now
And we love to chat on your site.
We get pretty good crowds in the off season
While we can’t wait for baseball to start.
Sometimes what we say
From baseball turns away
But ‘round here the Braves still are the heart.
And there are times when we all cann agree
Like the Braves should have a real good year.
And when Mets fans log on
Trying to say that we’re wrong
We say “Man! What are you doin’ here?”
Post us a blog, you’re the Beat Writer
Post us a blog tonight.
Well we’re all in the mood for some baseball now
And we love to chat on your site!!
Sorry about that. Even more sorry I have to repost it, heh heh. 8 )
By Overlord
February 12, 2008 12:38 PM | Link to this
I dont care what anybody says…….the braves are counting on hampton, they know hampton means playoffs and no hampton means lots of uncertainty.
By Braves20
February 12, 2008 12:55 PM | Link to this
Mr. DOB - Have never commented on music on this baseball blog but must agree with fellow bloggers about the glory of the Ipod.
It not only helps organize you music but allows you to playlist it to your particular taste that day - mellow; high energy for the gym etc.
In conjunction with the Ipod, I followed the advice of another blogger here (forget who - but thanks) and bought one of those Ion turntables that turns your vinyl into a digital format - great for the obscure old stuff you’ll never find in the stores or on line.
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this
Anyone hear moe.’s new album Stick and Stones? Far cry from their live show, but decent nonetheless. Cathedral is the first song in highlight in my eyes.
This album, instead of writing songs, touring for months on end honing the tunes and then releasing the record, they decided to go opposite, and write the tunes for the album first, then launch a tour.
As far as jam bands, they are the best since Phish, and I would recommend catching a show whenever possible.
Another great band is Outformation - a Panic disciple with great tone and Southern tightness.
-it’s so stupendous living in this tube.
By Random
February 12, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
PocorobaNaharodny: “I can tell that there is no way you were a student at UGA if you know what a supplementary angle is.”
Funny and perspicacious. However, you slid right by the critical caveat, viz, “I was back for a month or so from grad school at UNC-CH”.
Chapel Hill, that is. A place where the name “Michael” has a whole ‘nother meaning than in Athens.
I remember one day when Michael, James, Sam and me were playing horse, and Michael told me
No, of course not. I did see ‘em from afar here and there on campus.
“I have been a Braves fan for a long time, all my life actually, except for 1963-66, because they were not here yet and I was not old enough to know.”
You mean they weren’t here yet, but you thought that maybe they were, or at least they might could have been, but you just weren’t sure because wou weren’t old enough to truly know? You were a deep and complex child.
Yeah, I got your handle — did you pick up on my reference to a couple of other catchers that more or less sandwiched yours — Vic Correll (the Squire of Statesboro) and Bruce Bendict?
By Efrim
February 12, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this
Daybed Wagmoe
It is amazing. Everyone I talk to or everything I read makes it seem like the Braves don’t have a chance….
Fine by me though. I think it is much better to be the underdog.
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this
Who thinks Clint Sammons will win the backup catching job over Jarvey?
I do.
By Roman Gal
February 12, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this
Cartoon on Baseball America
It’s funny. You should look at it.
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 1:10 PM | Link to this
I much prefer the underdog role.
By Lew
February 12, 2008 1:17 PM | Link to this
Random-Never did sell my blood-always figured it was too toxic for public consumption.
Did eat many a Son’s of Italy House Special. Had one the night my son was born at St. Mary’s, as a matter of fact. Ate many meals at Yudy’s, Helen’s and The Sub and Steak at Little Five Points. Many pitchers of beer at TK Harty’s too, on Friday afternoons.
By Random
February 12, 2008 1:17 PM | Link to this
IMPRESSIVE, McFann!!!
Nice work — you’re going to make more than a few of us here blush, and everyone else green with envy.
How long have you been working on that? (I had noticed that you’d been kind of quiet lately.)
By Roman Gal
February 12, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this
2Parc Jarvey? Is that spanish for Harvey?
By Shaun
February 12, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,”Why doesn’t Clemens just admit it?”
Well what if he didnt do it? What if someone says Smoltz or Glavine or Maddux used it. Does that mean they should just admit it? Even if they didnt use it. Im not saying he didnt, but Im really sick of this witchhunt. We have steroid testing in place now and we are working on HGH testing. Lets just move on.
Yes, I mean is there any point in all the drama and scandal? The players’ union and players’ lawyers are not going to allow players to be suspended retroactively. All baseball can do is strengthen their testing policies and try to keep up with the science.
By Lee in S. GA
February 12, 2008 1:21 PM | Link to this
*Who thinks Clint Sammons will win the backup catching job over Jarvey?
Not exactly a trademark of Cox to go with a younger inexperienced backup catcher. If Lopez has a so-so spring and Sammons has a good one, I still think Lopez makes the team over Sammons.
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 1:25 PM | Link to this
Roman Gal… sure is… started calling him Jarvey (Harvey) around 97.
By cadd1951
February 12, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
ST countdown
In 16 days I will be in section 4, row 4, seat 10 at Dodgertown to watch my much anticipated Braves take the field. ST comes none to early for this baseball fan!
By Roman Gal
February 12, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
McFann I like it better now :)
By McFann
February 12, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
Thanks, Random! It took me four days to compose that. (Yeah, that’s why I’ve been quiet lately.) Glad ya liked it!! Thanks, again.
: )
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
Lee
But Cox has gone with Brayan Pena… so in the words of Jim Carrey, “So, you’re saying there’s a chance.”
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 12, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
Efrim - my thoughts exactly. I can remember reading comments by Chipper several years back, saying “people are picking these other teams to win the division - that’s fine, we like being the underdog.” They’re definitely the underdog of the division, but they should contend alright.
I saw the headline on the ajc Braves’ front page: “Big-spending Mets add another arm.” I thought, Kyle Loshe or Freddy Garcia or Livan Hernandez — guys that, while they’re not great pitchers, are pretty decent and could help the rotation. Then I saw it was Tony Armas, and I thought “HA!” Hey, fine by me!
By nOLIE
February 12, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this
By Some Blogs Have Jokes
February 12, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this
Shaun: Hey nOLIE, whatcha doin’?Mr Boor
Dear Niels. I think that you should stick to physics and leave the really hard stuff like baseball and joke telling to those of us who are intelligent enough to handle it. Thank you. Your friend, nOLIE.
By McFann
February 12, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this
Thanks, Roman Gal. I thought you might. ; )
By Lee in S. GA
February 12, 2008 1:40 PM | Link to this
2Parc
I’d say there is a slight chance.
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this
Lee Ultimately, I agree.
By beekay
February 12, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this
DOB I had posed a question over the weekend. I want to give you 3 scenarios and you tell me based on each what kind of contract will Hampton get based on the following performance 1. 15 wins, era in the 3’s less than 5 missed starts dure to injury 2. 10 wins era in the 4’s 10 missed starts due to injury 3. 5 wins era in 4’s misses half season due to season ending lingering injury
How many years and how much does he get offered with each situation
My guess is option 1 = 3 years 25 million 2. is 2 years 15 million 3. 1 year 3 million
Everyone please chime in
By Random Gal
February 12, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this
Roman Gal —
Thanks.
Check out this cartoon from a few months ago — before your time?
Anyway. It’s got a baseball flavored theme to it.
It’s funny. You should look at it.
By ncscoots
February 12, 2008 1:58 PM | Link to this
This is not for the faint-of-heart Braves fans.
Daybed would be right…that kind of analysis is fit only for baseball writers who wouldn’t be worth even a “your and idiot” among those with a functioning brain cell.
It’s one thing to call the Braves a 3rd-place team (they have been, for two years); quite another to drink the Mets-Are-Invincible Kool-Aid and project the Braves to win 80 games.
Just a guess…the writer of the article knows Dayn Perry and thinks the world of him.
By 2Parc
February 12, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
beekay
Tough to only have those 3 options… b/c he may win 10 games with a 4 ERA, but not miss any time due to injury.
But, if these are the scenarios, Hampton will only get a 1-year in my opinion regardless. Unless the guy spits out 20 wins, thinking a multi-year deal is improbable.
But hey that’s me.
Currently listening to: Drinkin’ Wine - The Beastie Boys - The In Sounds From Way Out
By AdirondackDave
February 12, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
Beekay - Even if Hampton wins 15, which would delight and shock me, neither the Braves or anybody else are likely to offer him more and a one year plus one option. He’s getting up in years and now is legendary for missing seasons.
By typical AJC
February 12, 2008 2:14 PM | Link to this
Hey, look at the poll question on the home page for the sports section concerning Rocker….All the answers support the AJC’s view of him. Why not have “I believe him” as one of the choices? Typical AJC.
By Random
February 12, 2008 2:19 PM | Link to this
beekay —
Hampton wins 25 games, doesn’t miss a day, wins the triple crown — no way any team gives him a multi-year contract.
By AdirondackDave
February 12, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this
Beekay — Ok, maybe the Yanks would offer him 3 years, they seem to print whatever money they need.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
February 12, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
Sign the petition , I did.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20607408/
By U Kno Who
February 12, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this
Wassup! Just stopped by to say Hey!. Been reading the posts from the last few days. Good stuff! All the talk about switch hitters was very flattering but u guys have to wait til I’m done to compare the four of us. Especially since we were all such different hitters and played in different eras.
Went to the stadium this week and saw some encouraging signs. Everyone that we have coming out of the pen throws 95. Saw Hamp throw and he looked free and easy. Saw this kid, Morton, WOW! He’s gonna be here soon if not sooner than people think. Stockman looked great. Moylan is flat out nasty. Nobody can even catch him, much less hit him. Resop looked great. He is a lot like Yates, only he has curveball instead of a slider. There is a lot to be excited about when yer talkin about pen. Should be solid.
Steroid talk is dominating. I saw where Rocker surfaced again and had some interesting things to say. Those were some facts that even I didn’t know. Not gonna make much of a difference though as MLB didn’t have a drug policy in place in 2000. Is it true that Pettite sided with the trainer in his deposition? I haven’t watched any TV so I’m not up to speed. Yikes! If it’s true….
Welp, heading out to take my son, Trey, to the Hawks game tonight. Hopefully they can get it back together in time to hold on to a playoff spot. Gotta lotta love fer yall! Go Bravos!
By Lew
February 12, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
Chipper-Just sent the deer painting to Orlando today. Hopefully, both the painting and I will see you on Friday at Wide World of Sports (or whatever they’re calling it these days).
By AdirondackDave
February 12, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this
Chipper - Welcome back. I may have started the switc-hitter talk or chimed in early anyway. I’m probably one of the few guys who have actually seen both of you play in your primes and I think you are equally scarry at the plate. Do you think you may play into your early 40s? If so, your numbers will probably equal or surpass the Mick’s.
By cricket
February 12, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this
HELLO CHIPPER !! I hope you will play the Clearwater (Phillies) or Sarasota (Reds) games in grapefruit league as those are the only games I can go to. Man, I wish braves were playing Rays.. Congressman Davis is now saying that his remarks were misunderstood and he didn’t say that Pettite completely sided with McNamee. BTW, I am still waiting for someone to suggest that we should have signed Livan for 5 m.
By Lee in S. GA
February 12, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this
U Kno Who
Sounds like the pitching is looking good. Good luck this year. GO BRAVES!
By Random
February 12, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
Hunk Erdown: “There is a connection between a hitter and a pitcher that takes place when the duel commences that is unlike any other sport.” (from last blog)
You are so right. The confrontation between the pitcher and the batter is the pure, unadulterated, crystalline essence of the game.
Nothing else matters — fielding, running bases, etc. Oh, all that’s interesting in its own way, but it doesn’t really matter. The heart and soul of baseball is pitcher against batter and batter against pitcher.
All the other guys are there just to chase down the ball and throw it back, like your Dad or little sister did when you were a kid practicing free throws.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 12, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
Hey Chipper, welcome back to the blog. Good to read your reaction to Morton - we’ve been hearing lots of good stuff about him, and it’s exciting to hear a player’s reaction too.
Great words about the pen. Now if you can let the other prognosticators know about it, maybe they’ll give a little more pre-season love to the Braves — though, as you’ve said in the past, you don’t mind being the underdog.
By U Kno Who
February 12, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this
Lew, Thanks for the painting. I’m looking forward to seeing yer talent on display. I’m leaving on Friday so I wont be at the park until Saturday morning. Make sure that you introduce yourself, so I can put a face with the name.
A-Dave, I’m looking at playin until 40 at least. Can’t comment on what comes after that. Depends on the body and the family.
By McFann
February 12, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
Hope those Hawks win tonight, Chipper!!
I’m so ready for Spring Training to start, I cann hardly stand it!! I looked on the Mets website this morning and saw that they had one less minute to wait than we did at the time. Not fair, I tell ya!!
: )
By Shaun
February 12, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this
cricket, Livan signed with the Twins.
By cricket
February 12, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this
Hunk Erdown / Random So true about the duel between pitcher and hitter. Baseball is also a sport that is a cross between an individual and team sport - a hitter is fighting his individual battle with the pitcher and is also opposed by the pitcher’s teammates at the same time. I would just like to correct one thing - there is another sport with this unique character and that is cricket, where an individual can completely affects a team sport, much more than baseball as the bateman (hitter) in cricket has to carry on for a long time. Sorry to bore the folks about cricket but I just couldn’t help it when someone mentioned this unique characteristic of baseball that made a fan out of me, along with my luck to land in ATL and being able to follow a great team.
By HuffBraves
February 12, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
Dunno why you guys are all so excited about coming down to the central Florida weather. We’re having tornadoes right now! Ack!
But seriously can’t wait to see y’all at the park next week. Chipper, any chance you can convince Tex to stick around long term? I gotta believe he loves hitting behind you as much as you love hitting in front of him.
By Random
February 12, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
Coach —
Of course you signed it — few Patriots fans wouldn’t, given the chance. That’s the problem, imo.
The petition itself, regardless of its merit (and I fully take your word for it) seems somewhat ill-conceived to me.
It starts out “We the fans of the New England Patriots demand … “
Now, what kind of credibility would such a petition have if it’s signed only by Patriots fans? And yet, that’s how it’s been set up.
If you have any influence at all with those guys, I’d suggest you get them to change the wording to something a little more inclusive.
By cricket
February 12, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this
Shaun I know Livan signed with Twins - that’s where I got the 5 mil number. I know some people would still feel that braves should have signed him since it is only 5 mil, never mind the fact that we will have a pretty deep rotation.
By Renegator
February 12, 2008 3:15 PM | Link to this
Chipper:
Thanks for returning. Let me ask you a question. Do you prefer to be the division favorite or the underdog that no one is talking about? Or do you even care?
Go Gators!
By ncscoots
February 12, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
Stockman is my ST sleeper this year. Completely off the radar because he hasn’t been healthy. Folks, if he can stay well, he can be a monster.
That’s a lot of “if” for the guy, I admit, but he’s had such bad karma the last couple of years, he’s due some good luck. Watch for him this spring.
By bigblackfurrycreaturefrommars
February 12, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this
Man, it’s so cool being able to converse with chip chip on a blog. If that’s not cool I don’t know what is.
U Kno Who, I would just like to be the first to congratulate you on your 2008 David Wright award..err, MVP award. Excuse me. They haven’t renamed it yet.
Heres a question for you, if the braves and the mets got in a fight - who would win, and who is the guy that could do the most damage? I heard Moylan looks pretty intimidating this year. But the “one two punch” of you and tex, seems formidable. Or maybe thats the “three four punch”. whatever.
By AdirondackDave
February 12, 2008 3:22 PM | Link to this
Chipper — Very glad to hear that you want to play ‘til 40 at least. I think that you are the most consistently productive player, year in year out, that I can remember even with injuries. We live about an hour north of Cooperstown and will be there cheering you in ten years or so when you are elected to the Hall of Fame on the first ballot. Hope to see you next month in Jupiter, Florida at the Braves-Cards games. Have another great year!
By U Kno Who
February 12, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
Trust me when I say that Tex will get top dollar. He is gonna have to be overwhelmed by the organization and the fans of Atlanta in order to take a little less from the Braves.
By Wayne in Utah
February 12, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
Just logged in for a few minutes, and noticed that “Hoss” was in the house! (WOW, Lew, that was fast on the deer pix!!)
If Hampton is healthy this spring, whaddya think about get him to catch a few grounders at third, so he can spell you at the hot corner when needed??? Dude can rake for a pitcher.
It is so exciting to hear about all the strong arms we have on the team this spring. You can NEVER have enough arms this time of year. Don’t believe it, ask Minaya.
Too often folks want to compare this hitter (switch hitter in this case) against that hitter, but when it comes down to it, it is just a game. To varying degrees, we all play it or played when we were younger. For those of us who love baseball, we live vicariously through our teams and their players. When I was a kid, the Braves picked up Clete Boyer, who immediately became my favorite player. Too bad I had a noodle for an arm!! I ended up being a good field, no hit first sacker, which there is ABSOLUTELY no need for.
Anyway, let’s all just let guys like Chipper play them out, lets enjoy the ride, and when the dust settles, then we can argue about who was the best and so forth. It really doesn’t matter, in the grand scheme of things. What matters is the game itself!
BTW, Hoss, your gonna love Lew’s work. Last year about this time, I scored a Dale Murphy and it hangs proudly in my office. Maybe when I win my next Wurlitzer I can order a Larry Wayne (great name, btw)!
:-)
thanks again for all the great times and memories!
By Wayne in Utah
February 12, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this
I will not be offended if my Braves friends start up a “Jazz” fan club in the southeast, or where ever you might live!
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 3:30 PM | Link to this
The refs stopped the clock because the batteries had run out on the camera Belichick was using to tape the Giants sideline.
By The Goche (A.J.)
February 12, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this
hi Chipper,
Around this time of year we all feel like we could win 110 games. It’s especially true this year when we finally enter the season without any major holes.
We being Braves fans are especially excited because we believe in guys like Escobar, Kelly J, Moylan and Diaz in ways that your Baseball Prospectus media types don’t.
I’m interested to hear what about our team excites you most this season.
By sean
February 12, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this
Hi #10, nice ranch. My son will be 5 in may and he likes to ride horses.I s the ranch just for hunters. I dont hunt but I love the outdoors.
By Wayne in Utah
February 12, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this
Just reading where the Mets added Tony Armas Jr. Ooooo. It must be time to worry???
:-)
By 22oz
February 12, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this
More power to ya’ll following pro basketball. I just can’t get into it. I do get to go over to the middle school my wife teaches at this afternoon to watch a basketball game with all the teachers playing, thats about as close as i’m gonna get! 2 more days!
By Matt
February 12, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
Hampton will be good in situations where we need someone to come in and throw one pitch…and an off day the next day.
By Wayne in Utah
February 12, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
BTW, I spent 3 of my 52 years in Texas, and I can’t imagine any macho Texan not liking the nickname “Hoss”, even if DOB is a douchbag! (not that there’s anything wrong with being a douchbag or a Texan!)
:-)
By beekay
February 12, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this
Armas to the Mets…Minaya trying to get the hispanic percentage back over 95 percent to overcome the Church and Scneider deals
By Lew
February 12, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this
Chipper-No problem. I’ll be there Saturday, too. I’ll be the fat, old Dude with the Pony Tail and piles of Braves’ art. DOB will let you know who I am-if you don’t hear me screaming maniacally at you first.
By 22oz
February 12, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
Great article on Maddux, I’ll try to link to it, if not, just copy and paste, old school style. Sounds like this may be the swan song for Mad Dog.
http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=133024=Daily Herald
By Lew
February 12, 2008 3:57 PM | Link to this
What is it about flying from Vermont to Orlando on Valentine’s Day? Last year we got 34 inches of snow and NY backed up. Tomorrow, we are due another foot. At least this time there is a direct flight from Burlington to Orlando-NO New York (I just love saying that). Maybe I need it on one of those signs with a line through it.
By woogidy
February 12, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
That Patriots video is interesting coach. You wouldn’t have believed anything fishy before the NBA ref story last year, but I gotta tell you, there was a TON of money for picking the Giants in that game.
I saw a post on here the other day about heckling, what do y’all think about heckling, as long as it is in good taste? I mean no cursing, mamas and wives, etc. Just something like “Julio Franco, brought to you by Depends” if you were cheering against him?
By Lew
February 12, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
Wayne-55 hours in four days (and I hope it is dry). I’ll be glad to boost any offer the Braves make to Tex by painting him the picture of his choice. Now what ML Player could resist such a thing. Tell Boras to put it in his contract-it’s a done deal.
By Mike S
February 12, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the insight on the bullpen arms, Chipper. That’s great to hear. Really excited to see some of those kids throw and see what Stockman can do if healthy.
Glad to hear Morton looks so good, which backs up what DOB’s been saying about him since fall ball.
This looks to be (at this point at least) one of the most well-balanced teams we’ve had since I can remember. Especially the last few years, one of the 3 main parts of the team (lineup, rotation, bullpen) was always falling behind the others. This team appears that it will be above average in all three areas, with the potential to be great in all three as well (if a few breaks go our way).
Very exciting to be a Braves fan. And I still can’t get over how cool it is that one of the faces of the franchise is blogging with the fans. Good luck in ST and thanks again Chipper!
By KC
February 12, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
Chipper: In light of the “Tex” topic (and I sure hope he stays)… I just wanted to thank you.
I don’t know if you hear it much, but I have a world of respect for your willingness to make sacrifices for this team and this city.
I think that shows a lot of character, and I most definitely appreciate it. I hope most other fans recognize and appreciate it as well.
In this day and age, it’s great to see a player show a level of commitment to his team, the city, and the fans.
By Wayne in Utah
February 12, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
Sad as it is, I must go back to work now. Good luck on the trip down Lew!
(can you tell how jealous I am of your FL trip?)
By McFann
February 12, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this
Wayne’s correct, Chipper: Lew’s art is fantastic. I’ve always had much respect for good drawings and/or paintings of people (something I’ve never been able to accomplish). His animals are pretty amazing, too. I’ve got my Wurlitzer up in my room (don’t even have to tell you who it is a portrait of, do I?). It was a big hit with the Grandparents last week, BTW. They were impressed.
I would love to see that deer, Lew.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
February 12, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this
Random , I’m not a Patriots fans. Hell , I’m not even a fan of the NFL. Truthfully , I won’t be watching another Super Bowl again anytime soon.
The NFL is as corrupt as the NBA. I’ll stick to baseball and rugby. O yea , I will be rooting for my Georgia Bulldogs even though the BCS is a sick joke of a system.
By Anders
February 12, 2008 4:25 PM | Link to this
Trust me when I say that Tex will get top dollar. He is gonna have to be overwhelmed by the organization and the fans of Atlanta in order to take a little less from the Braves.
This U Know Who guy is starting to sound a like like Anders. Looks like you can forget much of a hometown discount.You guys better buy a lot of hot dogs at this seasons games!
By uga-brave
February 12, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
lew,
nothing like the day before you leave on a much anticipated vacation. hope the delays are minimal. sounds like it should be a good one.
By Random
February 12, 2008 4:49 PM | Link to this
cricket: “I would just like to correct one thing - there is another sport with this unique character and that is cricket”
I just KNOW that you’re talking to Hunk Erdown, and not me.
Baseball IS cricket — the improved and/or adulterated yank version.
Cricket’s actually better in many respects, imo, in that the duel between the batsman and the bowler is more primeval, the field is symmetrical and why would anyone need more than two bases — Occam’s razor is definitely against the needless multiplication of entities like that.
8-)
When I was in Kuwait, we got all kinds of satellite channels from the subcontinent — Sky, Star, Jain, I forget what all.
And you know how popular cricket still is in the remnants of the Empire.
Games on every day and night — of course, I preferred the one-day matches to the test matches, mainly because they got to wear colored uniforms.
;->
This was in the late 90s, when Sri Lanka had such a phenomenal team — remember Jayasuriya? And the Aussie bowlers, and it seemed like all the WI players were named Rose-something.
In conclusion, it just goes to show you that compared to me, you have not yet begun to bore.
You wouldn’t have known bore if it had posted on a blog — but you do now. My pleasure.
You have met the bore, and it is … well, you get the picture. I just really like cricket — I’ve got Wisden and my own balls, bats, stumps and bales — I’ve never played though.
:(
By N8
February 12, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this
DOB
I know you aren’t “involved” with the poll questions that usually are on the Braves front page.
But todays question (what do you think of John Rocker’s latest outburst?), is a loaded one. At least from the standpoint of having actual CHOICES to answer to.
A) Typical Rocker
B) Why wait 8 years?
C) Who Cares.
All of those possible answers are geared towards ragging on him (like that’s really hard to do).
I’m just wondering why the AJC wouldn’t at least have the “option” to answer along the lines that you believe him, and are outraged at Bud Selig?
Before you think I’m off my rocker (heh-heh!), remember that the entire world thought that Canseco was full of it too, with his first book.
Like I said. It’s a loaded question. Similar to if a music magazine offered the question: WHICH OF THE FOLLOWING MUSICIANS “SUCK” MORE?
Then, giving us a choice between John Lennon, Johnny Cash, Jimi Hendrix.
The purpose of a poll is measure how society (or a select group of people - in this case Braves fans), feel on a subject or recent event. How the hell are you supposed to get a good “pulse of the people” when your poll question doesn’t offer answers for EVERY angle one could be thinking??
By Random
February 12, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this
Yeah, Coach, I was planning to boycott the Super Bowl for about a year myself.
I say go dogs!
By woogidy
February 12, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this
Just came across this, The lamest quote of all time… “The cheerful loser is the winner.” seriously.
By N8
February 12, 2008 5:11 PM | Link to this
typical AJC
I just scrolled up and saw your 2:14 post, after I had already posted my last question to DOB.
Glad somebody else saw the silliness in the “options” one had to choose between.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
February 12, 2008 5:11 PM | Link to this
When it comes to all-star or top dollar first basemen , 16-18 million per season seems to be the average salary.
I would anticipate Scott Boras asking for at least six years and one hundred million , bare minimum. And that is the low end of the scale.
By PocorobaNaharodny
February 12, 2008 5:11 PM | Link to this
Random and uga-brave
I remember Correll. Those were dark, dark days for Braves fans.
Random - I am ashamed to say that the Benedict / Correll reference went right over my head. With the REM discussion, I kept racking my brain trying to think of a lyric to an REM song that sounded like “Eggs-Squire of Statesboro.” Part of the fun of songs like Radio Free Europe was that everyone had their own version of the lyrics.
U Kno Who Watch out for those U Kno Whats on the basepaths this year. We need you in the lineup!
By Robert
February 12, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this
“A) Typical Rocker
B) Why wait 8 years?
C) Who Cares.
All of those possible answers are geared towards ragging on him (like that’s really hard to do).
I’m just wondering why the AJC wouldn’t at least have the “option” to answer along the lines that you believe him, and are outraged at Bud Selig? “
Cuz the AJC isnt interested in facts. It’s about supporting Bobby Cox. Cox got rid of Rocker. Rocker must be ridiculed.
By Robert
February 12, 2008 5:22 PM | Link to this
“The purpose of a poll is measure how society (or a select group of people - in this case Braves fans), feel on a subject or recent event. How the hell are you supposed to get a good “pulse of the people” when your poll question doesn’t offer answers for EVERY angle one could be thinking?”
The purpose of this “poll” is to suggest ways of thinking that the folks at ajc would approve of. You’re being told what you should think.
Now go buy a few more $6 hot dogs and stump for the HOF for Donk
By Anders
February 12, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this
Coach
When it comes to middle of the order 35 HR 145 RBI good glove guys $20+ mil seems to be more in line. Throw another mil or two in per year so Boras can get some of his swagger back. His ego needs to get back up that mountain. The Yanks and Red Sox will pay it and they will both need a middle of the order guy that can play first base.
By Anders
February 12, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this
Robert
I happen to agree with you. Not about the Cox part , but that none of the three choices even remotely give merit as to the fact that Rocker coming out now had good reason and he was being factual. Personally, I think Rocker was telling the truth about those guys being schooled on steroid use. Holy crap, I agreed with Robert and Rocker in the same post. I’m gonna go lay down.
By David O'Brien
February 12, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this
Chipper, thanks for the input on the relievers. Good for folks to hear it from someone who swings a bat.
Coach, six years, $100 mill? I think you’re at least $15 mill low in that estimate, if it’s six years.
Maybe FIVE years, $100 mill. But I agree with Chipper, the hometown discount is probably wishful thinking in this case. Boras is gonna make sure Tex gets PAID, and that’s all caps.
Folks, I agree with your concerns on the Rocker poll. I’ve just seen it for the first time, after being out all day for a meeting at the office downtown and picking up my taxes, waiting in line at the post office to mail them, etc.
By Lew
February 12, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this
Anders-Yeah, but the Yankees and Red Sox are not offering Tex one of my paintings. No way they can compete with that offer.
By Anders
February 12, 2008 5:44 PM | Link to this
DOB
Maybe FIVE years, $100 mill. But I agree with Chipper, the hometown discount is probably wishful thinking in this case. Boras is gonna make sure Tex gets PAID, and that’s all caps.
Oh sure, but when Anders says these things he’s just that crazy a$$ from NY.
Can we get Chipper’s take on Glavine’s September run? Maybe he can help me set you guys straight on that too. Just kidding, I swear.
By 704 Brave
February 12, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this
First time poster…
I live in Charlotte and I’m headed down for a 3 day weekend on Friday. When will most of the workouts be? Also, any tips on spur of the moment lodging? What about golf?
I’m pumped about the season and I can’t wait to see how the pitching pans out. Looks like a lot of promise in the bullpen, but hopefully our starters can go further on a more consistent basis this year.
Love the blog, kudos to Chipper for his time and insight! Go Braves!
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 5:52 PM | Link to this
Anders, did you just hear Mike and the Mad Dog talking the NL East?
It was kinda funny. Of course, they were obsessing over the Mets and Phils.
They talked pretty highly about the Braves when they eventually got around to them. Mad Dog is obsessed with Yunel Escobar. He loves Yuni. He also obsesses over Diaz as well. But it was funny. They seemed like they were ready to dump all over the Braves but then they started saying Tex, Chipper, Frenchy, McCann, that shortstop Escobar, Diaz, Diaz, Diaz (Mad Dog just likes repeating his name for some reason), and then Mike started obsessing over that lefty hitting outfielder that he thinks is real good and who he was later told was a second baseman now, Smoltz, Hudson, Glavine, Soriano, and that big kid they traded Renteria for. They seemed surprised that the Braves are alot better than they were thinking. Gotta admit that for some reason they got me more excited about the Braves than I have been all winter.
The funniest part though was when Mad Dog started talking up Hampton, Mike gave Mad Dog a big ole “Gimme a break with Hampton. The Braves aren’t leaving the porch light on for Hampton.”
Russo even tried talking up Gonzalez for some reason and Mike gave him a big old “Puh-leeeeeeeeeze. That guy has been a bust for them from day one. They’re not counting on a guy that was out for a season.”
It was kinda fun to hear people from outside the area talking highly about the Braves.
By Kev
February 12, 2008 5:52 PM | Link to this
Anders
Can you explain me, how could Tex go to the Red Sox, the dont need another guy at 1st with power, and besides they have so MUCH power in that middle of the order…Ortiz, Manny, Drew,Lowell,Youkilis…or what WERE do they move him, and forget about a trade.. Lowell is at 3erd, Drew LF, 1st Youkilis.
You realize they DONT need and arent going to overspend for a 1st baseman, being Youkilis a free agent in 2011… Next offseason i see them signing or trading for a Power OF or SS,either CF,LF,in case Manny retires or just leaves, like Adam Dunn(who could also play 1B for the Yanks or BoSox),Carl Crawford(club option), Bobby Abreu,Vladimir Guerrero,someone that they really NEED.
In the case of the Yankees, i agree with you, but you realize the Braves will throw some money at Tex, maybe enough so he considers to stay. Im not saying they are the Yankees but the WILL have Money to spend after this season…Hampton,Glav,etc off the books
By David O'Brien
February 12, 2008 6:00 PM | Link to this
Brought your concerns (which I agreed with) about the slanted Rocker poll to attention of AJC.com decision-makers, and the response was “agreed — we’ll remove it.”
So it should be gone soon.
Preferable poll would have had a response option that allowed people to agree with Rocker or say he’s just being honest, something along those lines, rather than just three responses all either slanted against or dismissive of Rocker.
But it’s too late to add such a response option, can’t do it after the poll’s been up most of the day, so taking it down altogther is the best option.
By Anders
February 12, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this
Lew
I stand corrected. Braves offer $12 mil per and one of Lew’s paintings. Deal.
BTW- You may not remember, but way back in October I told you to paint a picture of Chipper picking up Glavine at the train station coming home with his bags packed with NY money. I also added you could have Tex waving goodbye on the same train heading north. The paintings title could be “The Circle Of Life”.
All kidding aside. The Mets just gave Santana all that money to pitch every 5th day. Don’t think that’s not going to be Boras’ pitch to the Yanks just 7 miles away from Shea. Any deal wrapped around $100 mil is light. I figure he’ll want $115 to $130 for 5 or 6 years -dealers choice. If he gets the Yanks and Sox in a bidding war -Look out.
By AdirondackDave
February 12, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this
Chipper — The guys are dead-on about Lew’s artwork. I was fortunate enough to win a Wurlitzer a while back and selected a work picturing none other than you and I was bowled over when it came. I plan to give it to my son and grandson who live in Atlanta and (like me) are big fans of yours. Lew’s art is definitely as good as his excellent baseball blogs!
By McFann
February 12, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this
Lew is correct, Anders. No team cann compete with a contract that includes one of his paintings.
But I do agree with you on one thing: You should go lie down.
: )
By JT
February 12, 2008 6:06 PM | Link to this
Braveheart
Did you hear it today?????
By Anders
February 12, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this
Kev
Manny’s contract at $20 mil is up after this season. They could move Youkilis to left (no worse than Manyy out there) and put Tex on 1st for 6 years. Ortiz needs the protection. That became obvious when Manny was out hurt. Without the two gorillas in the middle that lineup can be pitched too. Their lineup is no where close to their 2004 team. I do think Tex is a better fit and more valuable to the yanks but both teams like to drive up the price on each other - Boras knows that.
By OrlandoFan
February 12, 2008 6:14 PM | Link to this
I don’t think there’s any way to sign Tex before the fall. See how the season plays out and if Boras even allows him to consider the Braves’ offer(s). I can’t see him pulling the trigger before that because the market value may not have been set. The Yankees and Mets both would bid on him heavily, I think. Delgado can be Delgon-oh. If Tex continues with the type of performance he did in the 50-odd games last year, his price will go up significantly every month. And Boras will remind all of that. No early-signing deal here.
By Overlord
February 12, 2008 6:16 PM | Link to this
How come livan has been signed by the twins? i thought he was already in the mets organization. Did i miss something?
By Anders
February 12, 2008 6:18 PM | Link to this
Braveheart
I didn’t hear Mike and the Dog today but I did hear them talking about the east either yesterday or last week - I forget. They gave the Braves good props, which I agree with. I think it will be a tight race with the edge now to the Mets injuries to guys on either team aside. I still say the two wild cards in this thing will be Hampton for the Braves and Sanchez for the Mets. If either of those guys comes back strong I think it will be a big difference maker.
By MetsPussycat
February 12, 2008 6:22 PM | Link to this
“By beekay February 12, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this Armas to the Mets…Minaya trying to get the hispanic percentage back over 95 percent to overcome the Church and Scneider deals”
beekay- Such a stupid comment! Stick to baseball and leave the race talk to the census bureau! But dont worry the Braves camp is still trying to keep their dumba$$ fan ratio down to 5% and YOU alone are helping that cause!
By richbrave
February 12, 2008 6:24 PM | Link to this
Orlando Fan:
Hope you’re wrong, but thinking what you say IS logical. Holding my breath. If he can’t be signed who’s out there that’s available as a replacement? Can’t be many. He’s a good fit here. We can always hope he overrides Boras like Rodriquez did.
By Anders
February 12, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this
Orlando Fan
I don’t think there’s any way to sign Tex before the fall
Sure there’s a way. 6 years $150 mil. Tex will sign that tonight.
Hey, you guys think Tex reads this blog? If so, fire Boras and give me a call - I’ll get you Santana money.
By MetsPussycat
February 12, 2008 6:47 PM | Link to this
“By Overlord February 12, 2008 6:16 PM | How come livan has been signed by the twins? i thought he was already in the mets organization. Did i miss something?”
Overlord- You missed alot! Wrong Hernandez! Refresh your browser dude! Hey theres a new blog up too! LOL!
LETS GO METS!!!
By N8
February 12, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this
SEEEEEE.
Even Chipper is getting excited knowing that everybody in the pen (or slated to be), is a flame thrower.
I’ll take the hint (coming from a guy who is paid to come up with big hits), that his excitement is due to him knowing that facing some guys that “bring it” late in a game, is no walk in the park.
As long as there’s nobody named Clontz, McMichael, Kolb or Wickman coming in in the 9th (or anybody with their “style” of pitching), I’m OK with it.
I don’t think it’s any coincidence that the years we got the deepest in the playoffs since (and including) the WS victory in 95, has been when their has been a flame thrower at the end (Wohlers and Rocker). You would think having Smoltz out there would have garnered more series victories, but without him in the rotation, who was gonna take charge to GET TO THE 9th INNING?
Guys that pitch to contact often have great success in the regular season, especially against lesser opponents. But to me there is nothing more safe than a nasty closer that can KEEP the hitter from putting the bat on the ball.
Good hitters (which most teams have in the post-season), are gonna be patient and sometimes that check swing blooper has cost us some games.
Just my opinion on what I like to watch and am very happy that our pen is loaded with guys like that now. Just so long as they can throw strikes, and keep the hitters off guard.
By woogidy
February 12, 2008 6:58 PM | Link to this
Sox sign Tex, they have to take Papi out of the lineup in interleague play, and in the World Series at the NL park. I think it will be an NL team personally, Some New York National League team can buyout the last year of their current first baseman. Giants and Nationals need a big name too, and the Reds only have Dunn one more year. Can you imagine Tex at Great American Ballpark? Also remember, $1mil in NY is like $800K here with cost of living, taxes, etc…
By MetsPussycat
February 12, 2008 7:04 PM | Link to this
Well Braves fans, as it is right now we all love to compare players …Glavine vs Maine, Chipper vs Wright, Smoltz vs Santana! In 2008 we say Delgado vs Tex, 2009 we will be saying Tex vs whomever you got to replace him! Better get the checkbooks ready…the NORTH is calling!
“I just spent 150 what?” Wilpon, “Larry” Henry, “Curly” Werner, “Moe” Lucciano, and “Mo-Money than you” Steinbrenner all have their private jets waiting!
LETS GO METS!!!
By JerseyGil
February 12, 2008 7:35 PM | Link to this
MetsPussycat….I a Hispanic from Puerto Rico, in it a say:”To Male Crabs in one cave don’t mix” In other word to many hispanic player in one dougout is for disater to happen, hope Willie took a lot of Spanish Classes in the Winter.
By Efrim
February 12, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
Anders
Tex is not ending up on the Red Sox man. I know you hate the Yankees, but face it man, he is wearing pinstripes next year. You talk about the Sox dropping 20 million off their payroll? How about the following contracts coming off those Yankee books:
Giambi- 22 Million
Pettitte- 16 Million
Mussina- 12 Million
Farnsworth- 6 Million
Abreu- 16 Million
That is 72 million coming off the books for that team.
I think they will sign Teixiera and Sabathia this offseason. They’ll get Tex for something like 23 million a year and they will get Sabathia for something like 19 million a year. They lower payroll and will actually get better in 2009.
By McFann
February 12, 2008 7:44 PM | Link to this
As long as there’s nobody named Clontz, McMichael, Kolb or Wickman coming in in the 9th (or anybody with their “style” of pitching), I’m OK with it.
N8, you forgot Reitsma. LOL. I think most of us would like to.
Sorry I didn’t mention you in my song. ; )
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 7:50 PM | Link to this
Signing Tex would be nice. BUT the Braves might be better off next season by using that $22, $23 million it will take to get Tex to add a guy like Nick Johnson (if healthy) AND a starter making $7 to $10 mil AND a reliever for the money that Tex is gonna be getting.
Tex is needed now but not necessarily next season and beyond. By 2009, Frenchy and McCann will be in their fifth seasons, KJ will be in his fourth, Escobar will be in his 3rd, Brandon Jones and Brent Lillibridge will be in their second, Schafer will be a rookie, Chipper will still be hungry chasing down Mantle, Rose, Murray, Schmidt, and Mathews.
A lineup in 2009 of Schafer, Escobar, Nick Johnson, Chipper, Frenchy, McCann, KJ, Brandon Jones with Lillibridge and Infante off the bench sounds pretty darn solid - especially when you can have perhaps Smoltz, Hudson, Glavine, Jurrjens, and another young pitcher making $7 to $10 million that the Braves can plug into the fourth spot.
I dunno. Nick Johnson being healthy is a big IF but the Braves would be better off with 3 guys or so making that $22 or $23 million.
The young hitters we have now, if they are ever gonna become what we think they are gonna become, should not need the Tex crutch and security blanket by next season.
By ncscoots
February 12, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this
I, for one, have said Tex should be overpaid, if necessary. But there’s a limit to even my lack of restraint.
McGriff left, Galarraga left…other players will come and go, too. If Tex decides to milk the market (and he’ll probably have the opportunity), Braves baseball will go on. And there are lots of circumstances that could mitigate against meeting Tex’s price, including the development of young players and the perceived other needs of the club.
But my hope is that Tex gets a ring this year (or, at least, close to it). I think a deep playoff run, for a guy who has never sniffed the postseason, would go a long way toward a decision to stay with the Braves.
By Efrim
February 12, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this
Braveheart
I heard Mike and the Mad Dog talk about the NL East as well. I didn’t hear them talk about the Braves though. I caught them around 530?, I think. I agreed with them saying that Brad Lidge and Pedro Martinez are the two most important players in the division. If Pedro goes something like 15-6, the Mets are going to be really difficult to beat. If Brad Lidge is the 2005 version, then the Phillies will be tough as well.
They have always had a ton of respect for the Braves and that is why I like listening to them so much. They both love BC as well.
By JerseyGil
February 12, 2008 8:02 PM | Link to this
And you metropolitanmug; you better start speaking spanish so you understand: “Bola y estria” or No puedo Mas,,,,Me duele el Brazo” You get it.
By BabyGoatEater
February 12, 2008 8:08 PM | Link to this
Face it Muts fans…..you guys aren’t the class of the east anymore. You had 1 year of supremacy. The Braves had 14 years of it. It’s kinda like that saying… “you can’t teach experience. As a organization….the Braves have experience at winning. The Muts have experience at losing. Who’s your money really going to be on?
By MetsPussycat
February 12, 2008 8:10 PM | Link to this
“By JerseyGil February 12, 2008 7:35 PM -hope Willie took a lot of Spanish Classes in the Winter.”
JerseyGil…..First- Get to an english class before your next post! And thats not about your race just your post…. Second- Since your from PR I will give you a small tip…in America most minorities don’t cosign on racist remarks!
LETS GO METS!
By Metropolitan Man
February 12, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this
Hey Jerseygil: Do you mean curve ball, I cant do no more, and my arm hurt. Those sound like brave mantras that will work for all the different ethnicities that you guys have. Dont test us METS fans, we learned alot in school and other languages besides southern grammar.
LETS GO METS LETS GO METS LETS GO METS!!!!
By MetsPussycat
February 12, 2008 8:20 PM | Link to this
JerseyGil- Since your testing spanish skills…I will answer you for METROMAN! Our rotation has no problems with curve balls! WE can and will continue to do much more than the braves! And this season the only one crying their arm hurts will be Chumper due to his excessive blogging!
By Efrim
February 12, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this
Braveheart
I agree completly on Tex. There is NO NEED to give Tex 20-23 million dollars a year on a payroll that won’t exceed 100 million. I just don’t see the sense in that. Now the downside of no Tex on the Braves is the lineup you just posted. Good lineup. Very good. But no one will be predicting that lineup to overcome the Phillies or Mets(especially when they start spending like the Red Sox). How are the Braves going to win in the future? Pitching. Developing pitching.
By MetsPussycat
February 12, 2008 8:30 PM | Link to this
BabyGoatEater -Money always on the METS! You are right we arent the class of the EAST…we ARE the NL EAST in 2008! Braves have 14 years of what -DISSAPOINTMENT! You put on that tux every year and then your limo driver stands you up for the prom! LOL! Dilusional you are! Its not too late to put your money on the right squad! Call your bookie now!
LETS GO METS!!!
By Metropolitan Man
February 12, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this
No METSPUSSYCAT, the limo driver didnt stand them up. They made it to the prom, they just didnt get any King votes, just Queen votes. (This means you got knocked out early and often). On a serious note, how is Chumpers arthritis coming along???
By unlucky charms
February 12, 2008 8:48 PM | Link to this
I hate to be lame and jump in just cause Chipper is posting now, but whatever. I’ve been reading this blog for a while, but this is the first time i’ve posted.
Anyway, I think its really cool that Chipper is posting here now. Its not like he is some nobody bench warmer. He is the biggest star on the team.
I doubt I’ll get a reponse cause there is so much crap to sift through. But Chipper if you’re reading this I would just like to ask if you play any video games? Are you ever on xbox live?
I’m looking forward to MLB 2k8 which comes out in March. To bad they put one of the Mutts (Jose Reyes) on the the cover.
Weren’t you on the cover of an old Sega game one time? World Series baseball I think it was.
Anyway, I know you got alot of people asking you questions. So I understand if you don’t respond, but It’d be cool to hear your answers.
By Metropolitan Man
February 12, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this
And another thing on the Tex situation. All jokes aside you guys gave up on A. Jones because of 1 season. If you would have given him somehting more than you were offereing, he would have stayed and been a fixture like Chumper and Smolzt. Loyal and willing to be part of the braves franchise. Now you have Tex (Boras client) who has yet to peep a word about where he wants to play. Nothing wrong with keeping options open but he is not harping openly about the braves. You basically let another fixture go (Jones) for another Sheffield/Drew guy who will go make millions and RBI’s elswhere after the season. Kotsay is the only new addition besides Glavine who wants to play for you guys. The rest are too young to know any better. Hope your GM is creative in making deals like JS, otherwise its going to be nice seeing the 1990 braves again!!!!
By ippississiM
February 12, 2008 8:50 PM | Link to this
Check this out
It’s an interesting notion.
By Tilt
February 12, 2008 8:52 PM | Link to this
Braveheart and Efrim-I happen to agree as well. As of right now, I dont see the need to throw more than 20 million at Tex for 5+ years. I can see a 6 year 110 milion deal working, but no more than 115. We could use the money to find a Adrian Gonzalez and a solid setup man or #3 or 4 starter. Or lock up a young starter for 5 or 6 years, maybe?
Tex is extremely valuable, but he will be more valuable at the trade deadline if we have some injuries and are not in the race, if need be.
By McFann
February 12, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this
How many Mets players take the time to chat with their fans?
Ah-ha, didn’t think so.
By Random
February 12, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this
McFann: “N8, … Sorry I didn’t mention you in my song.”
He needs several verses of his own, just to cover all the possible pronunciations of his alphanumeric handle.
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this
No METSPUSSYCAT, the limo driver didnt stand them up. They made it to the prom, they just didnt get any King votes, just Queen votes. (This means you got knocked out early and often). On a serious note, how is Chumpers arthritis coming along???
Yeah, the Braves may have only been prom king once but at least they had a date for 14 years in a row, went to the prom, got drunk, and got laid while you dorks were sitting at home because you couldn’t find a date.
Then you got lucky one year and somehow got a date, went to the prom, didn’t get voted prom king either, got laid and like the little virgins you are, acted like you invented getting laid ….. only to find yourself stood up the next year because well, in the infamous words of Carlos Beltran, you thought you were so good, it was boring …. but she countered that you weren’t any good and you were boring.
By Bill
February 12, 2008 8:58 PM | Link to this
I agree, would not pay Tex 23mil. I’d rather have 2 or 3 good players than tie that much up in one player. I was against this trade from the start. If he’s not signed by July, he’s gone.
By N8
February 12, 2008 9:04 PM | Link to this
McFann
“N8, you forgot Reitsma. LOL. I think most of us would like to.”
Reitsma was just fine before he got over-used and was never healthy, beyond the first two months he was a Brave. Not to mention, the guy actually threw pretty damn hard when he was healthy. It’s just that his out pitch happened to be a change up, instead of a slider or a split like Rocker and Wohlers respectively.
“Sorry I didn’t mention you in my song. ; )”
That’s OK.
Random
“He needs several verses of his own, just to cover all the possible pronunciations of his alphanumeric handle.”
:-) Too funny.
By Metropolitan Man
February 12, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
Sorry Mcfann, METS players are too busy getting ready for the upcoming season. You know conditioning the body so it can be ready for 162+. Wonder which player will have finger problems sitting on the DL, blogging from the dugout.
By Efrim
February 12, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this
I don’t think Tex will get traded because I don’t think the Braves will be out of it by July 31st. But again, I’ll take the two draft picks and use that 20 million on a number of things.
By Larvell "Sugar Bear " Blanks
February 12, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
los mets!
By McFann
February 12, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
Oh yes, MetMan, I’m sorry. Those guys have such busy lives. No job in the off season (unless you’re a healthy Chuck James), just gotta get that body ready. I understand that, yeah…sure…OK…
Or maybe you’re just jealous……
By StingerSplash
February 12, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this
Well, looks like we got the lowdown on the bullpen, straight from the Hoss’ mouth. (I can’t believe it took this long for that line. Maybe I wasn’t giving everyone else enough credit for not being cheesy.)
You know, for one of those insipid Gimme 5s, maybe Chipper could be prevailed upon for his top five fishing holes. Smoltz/Glavine have done their top 5 golf courses, no?
By N8
February 12, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
Metro-Man
“All jokes aside you guys gave up on A. Jones because of 1 season.”
If you think the Braves “brass” gave up on Andruw because of one season, you haven’t been paying attention.
He’s sacrificed his body (which deserves commending), by playing a fearless CF for over a decade. That body was (and probably was already beginning to) give out sooner, rather than later.
He’s maintained a 2 to 1 K to BB ratio throughout his career (if David Wright did that for more than 2 or 3 seasons the NY fans and media would “give up on him” faster than you can say MVP.
Tex is ALREADY a better more disciplined hitter, after 5 big-league seasons than Andruw is after 12 (11 full). Plus he has JUST AS MUCH POWER, and while probably not as dynamic at 1B as Andruw was in CF, Tex is no slouch around the bag.
He’s a switch hitter. And arguably could get better.
If you can’t see the logic in possibly investing our money in Tex vs. Andruw at this stage of each of their careers, you’re a lost cause.
It’s not about being disappointed in Andruw. It’s about having limited funds to build, not only a team, but a competitive team, and spending your money WISELY.
Not every team can spend 135 million on a pitcher who looked like he was hurt last year towards the end. We used to be able to. Believe me, I truly believe that if Ted still owned the team, not only would Andruw have been re-signed (maybe only for two years like his Dodger deal - as to no block Schafer), but Tex would ALREADY be signed, and we would have had Glavine LAST YEAR, without having to trade Hudson like JS was trying to do.
To top THAT off, we certainly would have been in the running for Johan. Certainly our farm would have had more lucrative prospects to give up, than the discount bargain crap you guys were able to steal him away from the twins for, right?
Ted Turner was loyal to his players (or allowed JS to give them money - as long as they were still worth it). But even then, JS never overpaid (in money and years) for ANYBODY on the free-agent market.
So PUUUUULEEEEEZ don’t give me the “you guys gave up on Andruw”.
Get back to me in about 3-4 years, and assuming you think we should have given him another long term deal, let me know who is the better “bargain”, Andruw Jones at age 34 and beat up, or a rising Jordan Schafer (or anybody else NOT costing 20 million per year).
By chucktown
February 12, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this
Sorry Mcfann, METS players are too busy getting ready for the upcoming season.
Yea, that and busy chicken fighting.
By The Goche (A.J.)
February 12, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this
I love Tex. I really think that it would make the Braves lineup a force for years to come if we were able to resign him. With him and the young guys who are already in the lineup, plus the young guys coming up, that would set us up for the future even when Chipper does hang it up to still have one of the top lineups in baseball, but we’d still need pitching.
I don’t see any top teir pitching prospects in our system (at least that are close enough to depend on), so when Smoltz goes, with Glavine and Hampton already out of the picture that leaves Hudson little help, esp. top of the rotation talent. And we’d really have almost no money to find it, esp while Chipper and Smoltz are still around.
In a future without Tex and Chipper we certainly would need someone to carry the load offensively. But if we do lose Tex we still have at least most of the makings of a good lineup in the future basically only needing a legit cleanup man. (and Heyward could become such a guy eventually, but thats several years away).
Still, without adding anything starting pitching-wise that certainly would be a major weakness in two or three years unless we have some major turnout from our prospects.
So in a way, we could end up being better off if we didn’t end up spending a ton on Tex, but that sure wouldn’t keep me from giving it a major go with a lot of money to resign him.
If we didn’t get him, I wonder if we would compete for someone like a Sabathia, though I think he would quite likely go for more than Tex anyway.
By Roman Gal
February 12, 2008 9:40 PM | Link to this
big black fuzzy creature man from mars very funny at 3:19.
By wiki
February 12, 2008 9:43 PM | Link to this
Guess who wrote this on the Sept. 30th (last day of the season) blog?
No matter what the METS do from here to eternity, some braves, stankees, or philthie fan will remind us of 2007 and METS fans will never live it down. So enjoy it braves fans becasue I know I would if the shoe was on the other foot. Thanks for a great season of banter (good and bad) braves fans. I take no pleasure in your demise this season because we are in a similar boat. The only difference is the METS boat sinking made history and will probably take some fans with them. Like I said before, win or lose, the METS will make you crazy because nothing is easy with this team. I’m still a fan today, but I dont know how long before this hurt will go away. - Met Man
Is the hurt gone yet? We Braves’ fans are enjoying it just like you wrote you would “if the shoe was on the other foot”.
You may want to save your presentation above. It might help in preparation of your 2008 concession speech.
You were right, we are reminding you.
Move over ‘64 Phillies……you’ve been trumped!
By N8
February 12, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this
woogidy
“Also remember, $1mil in NY is like $800K here with cost of living, taxes, etc…”
I think you would have a point with LOGICAL thinking people, that DON’T have the strongest union in the world pushing them to take the highest dollar amount, as to drive up the overall dollars being handed out to everybody in the union (not to mention some guys’ egos of being the “highest paid” so and so). After all, did Glavine factor in your “cost of living theory” when he took 13 million per year (and the Braves were offering 11 - and one less year)???
Not that I blame Glavine for that. Capitalism at it’s finest. It’s what this country is built on. But I find it too coincidental that he not only was the Braves rep, but the NL rep, and he chose the highest bidder.
Either way, water under the bridge (I was never that upset to begin with). I’m glad to have him back.
By Niels Boor
February 12, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this
Anybody know if any web sites will be streaming the Clemens hearings live tomorrow?
Maybe MLB.com?
By Niels Boor
February 12, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this
Anybody know if any web sites will be streaming the Clemens hearings live tomorrow?
Maybe MLB.com?
By Lew
February 12, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this
Anders-No the Braves won’t resign Tex for $12 mil and one of my paintings-BUT…..The $18 mil they didn’t pay Andruw AND one of my paintings is a whole ‘nother situation.
MetroDude-What Jersey Gil and Nathan said. Me too.
By N8
February 12, 2008 10:09 PM | Link to this
Metro-Man
“Letting A. Jones go and renting Tex while waiting on J. Shchaefer is no sure thing. If Schaefer is a bust, then you have problems in center for years to come.”
In theory, you are correct. Waiting on Schafer could be a mistake. But in our financial situation (and Andruw being a 10/5 guy), the BIGGER mistake would be to lock up Andruw and have no-place for Schafer to play, if he IS the real deal.
Of course, like when we had Lofton in 97 and Andruw was up full time, we could just move Schafer to LF. But what if Brandon Jones is ALSO the real deal, with Francoeur in RF?
How STUPID would we look with a 20 million dollar CF we don’t need.
Plus, you’re ignoring ANY OTHER player that may come along on the free agent or trade market by next off-season (if Schafer isn’t for real), that we will be able to afford if Tex was just a “rental”.
If Tex doesn’t re-sign, who’s to say that that 20 million dollars (give or take), isn’t better spent on another veteran (and less expensive) 1B, AND another pitcher?
It took me a while to accept the fact that by letting Andruw go, added to Tex possibly NOT re-signing, that the trade for Tex WOULDN’T be considered a bust.
JS took a chance to make a run last year. It didn’t work. Having Tex THIS YEAR allowed Wren to let Andruw walk, and not have the offense drop too much from one season to the next (if at all).
If Tex walks, we’ve got about 36 million to play with next off-season (assuming Hampton won’t be back and Glavine retires).
HOW IN THE WORLD could that be a “bad” situation to be in.
Wren deserves some credit (if we’re competitive this upcoming season), for not breaking the bank and mortgaging the future (by locking up big-dollars to Andruw).
I’m not trying to be an azz about this. Just logically asking questions that seem to make sense to me.
By Niels Boor
February 12, 2008 10:11 PM | Link to this
Anybody know, anybody know? ;-| Sorry about the dupes.
By The Goche (A.J.)
February 12, 2008 10:15 PM | Link to this
Wow, Mets fans are talking like the Braves are going to go 70-92.
It is really kind funny/pathetic how they rail on Chipper for blogging. Jealous much.
I know you already dislike him, but it is funny that your biggest argument against him (of the evening) is that all this blogging is somehow going to catch up to him.
I just wish that if the Mets fans are going to hang out that we could in some way intelligent discuss our teams, acknowledging, your team was pretty good last year and has gotten better, our team was pretty good last year and has gotten better. I wonder who is going to win. I mean obviously you’re going to pick your team and we’ll pick ours, but most of us really would enjoy an honest, if ridiculously optomistic, discussion.
The fact that your team could win and our team could win is why we enjoy the game in the first place.
By Metropolitan Man
February 12, 2008 10:26 PM | Link to this
N8, with 20 million guys on the roster and all stars in the wings you do 1 or 2 things. You move players around to benefit the team getting production from all positions or you trade your young’ins for a NEED you have right now. If your prospects are that good, then you can win NOW as opposed to later and get somehting worthwile in return. But count on Shcaefer, let Tex go, and let the chips fall where they may which is last place. Besides I just got a Rent-A- Center bill for Tex in the mail. Who in braves managment do I forwrd this to????
LETS GO METS Metroploitan Man OUT!!!!
By TennesseePaul
February 12, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this
I think a deep playoff run, for a guy who has never sniffed the postseason, would go a long way toward a decision to stay with the Braves.
Scoots: Isn’t that part of the sales pitch for teams such as the Mets and Yankees except with more money?
By Roman Gal
February 12, 2008 10:31 PM | Link to this
Mets Fans on the MIB blog
What are your thoughts on the Phillies…how would you compare the Mets and Phillies…Braves and Phillies? Just curious…
By TennesseePaul
February 12, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this
Wren deserves some credit (if we’re competitive this upcoming season), for not breaking the bank and mortgaging the future (by locking up big-dollars to Andruw).
N8: Wren really didn’t get a “say” so to speak in the Andruw factor as JS acknowledged the Braves intents prior to AJ filing for anything.
Though I would say this, if the Braves had “many millions more” to spend perhaps taking a one year bath on offering arbitration wouldn’t have been a bad idea. AJ almost certainly would have accepted and the Braves would have their one year CF so they could work in Schafer. It wouldn’t have cost them any players either. Just many millions more…
By Overlord
February 12, 2008 10:42 PM | Link to this
Sorry Mcfann, METS players are too busy getting ready for the upcoming season. I suppose shrinks might be busy doing that, trying to help mets players get out of their 2007 mental trauma.
By N8
February 12, 2008 10:43 PM | Link to this
Metro-Man
“But count on Shcaefer, let Tex go, and let the chips fall where they may which is last place.”
You mean like the Mets just did with the Glavine/Johan situation?
You let Glavine walk. Were relying on Pedro and youngsters. Until Johan became available. So you got him.
So why can’t that be the case with us and Tex?
At the end of this season (or before it if he and Bora$$ are willing to listen), Wren will offer him a FAIR price (between 18-22 million per year) to stay in Atlanta.
If other teams out-bid us and Tex chooses to leave Atlanta for said offer. Not much we can do about it. Except give that money ear-marked for him to the next best option.
I don’t understand why you think spending our money on multiple players as opposed to dumping it ALL on one guy, will put us in last place?
I actually tend to think it’s more of the opposite to be the case. With a limited budget, spending too much on one guy, could be death.
You act like Tex (and in your guys’ situation Johan), are the only guys available in the world to help teams win.
NEWS FLASH!!!! Neither of them have carried the teams they’ve played on to the WS, much less a WS title.
The other 24 guys on the active roster, matter a little too, don’t they?
I actually can’t wait for Johan to go all Hampton/Randy Johnson/Kevin Brown on you guys. It will actually be a hoot.
Then for 2 or 3 seasons we can listen to you guys preach to us every spring to “just wait until Johan is healthy”.
Meanwhile we’ll be giggling as insurance pays for his salary.
You would think that Minaya would have learned from past BUSTS (Brown, Hampton, Neagle, Chan Ho Park, etc, etc….), that you just don’t give that much many, and certainly not that many years to a pitcher.
Good luck.
By N8
February 12, 2008 10:53 PM | Link to this
T-Paul
Do you really think from the way Wren has acted as GM since taking over, that he would have done differently, and as JS’s right-hand man, they hadn’t discussed what future (or lack there of), that Andruw had with the Braves beyond 2007???
Not on your life.
Add to that, I’m of the belief, that JS made that announcement (about the Braves NOT re-signing Andruw before negotiations even took place), as to NOT have Wren’s tenure as GM start out with being recognized as the “guy who let Andruw get away”.
Maybe I’m reading into it to much, and assuming it was all calculated, but on the other hand, I don’t think your digging deep enough for the actual “truth” (like we’ll each ever actually know).
But I bet I’m closer to the truth than you are. :-)
No offense.
By Braveheart
February 12, 2008 10:58 PM | Link to this
You might giggle N8. I will chuckle. Men chuckle. Girls giggle.
By Metropolitan Man
February 12, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this
Roman Gal: been on the philthies blog and ripped them a new 1. They told me thanks for giving optimism to a pessimistic fan base..(lot of ranting from me). The braves have been a thorn in this METS fan side so long its hard to re-direct attention to other teams until the season starts. The philthies have defense, and offense but no pitching…its a joke and I told them. They are funny philthie bloggers but you guys take the cake, by far the best except for my METS fans on Talkback!!!!.
Metropolitan Man out for real this time.
By Lew
February 12, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this
Mets and Class in the same sentence? Give me a break. What a joke. I’m out of here for two weeks, y’all. See you around the 2nd of March. Hope some of you make it to Disney for Spring Training. The one time there will likely be no Mets’ fans anywhere around. All that and no snow. Later.
By Overlord
February 12, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this
Good luck Lew.
By uga-brave
February 12, 2008 11:53 PM | Link to this
for now i say lets worry about 2008. nothing we can do about tex until the end of the season. should be fun watching him and chipper hit 3,4 for a full season
want something to worry about? worry about who is going to hit in front of them. that probably is the most important thing IMO. gotta set the table for HOSS and TEX.
since we are going to be a station to station type team the 1,2 holes are going to really decide the potency of this offense.
to maximize hoss and tex it would help a ton if somebody is standing at 2nd base when they come to bat.
By DOB
February 13, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this
DOB, I live in anderson sc, thats about 2 hours away from Atlanta do you think i will be able to get the games that come own peachtree t.v.
By Hunk Erdown
February 13, 2008 1:05 AM | Link to this
uga-brave
speaking of Chipper and Tex batting 3-4… I would really like to hear Chipper discuss this (if he would), but i wonder how positive it will be for the preservation of Chipper’s health to have someone batting after him that won’t hit into so many double plays. You know all that sliding to break up the double play had to take a lot out of Chipper. Plus, when a righty is on the mound, Tex will be able to bat lefty, which will help Chipper when he’s on first. Paying extra to keep Tex may be a backhanded investment into the longevity of Chipper. I’m not a stat hound like a lot of you guys but i would sure be interested in knowing how many times Chipper was on first when Andruw came to the plate and hit a grounder to short or second. I’m not an Andruw hater by any means, but it didn’t hurt my feelings to see him move on to another team considering how much it would have cost in payroll to keep him, and you have to admit, we waited a loooooong time for him to ever have his real break-out year. It was tons of fun to watch him play center field, but he just neber really got there when it comes to offense. I hope if Chipper see’s this he will chime in as far as my point on him batting before Andruw and if there is any basis to what I said about injuries and just gettig banged up from all the sliding…maybe I’m off base, but it seemed like Chipper got forced out at least 7-8 times a week with Andruw following him in the line-up. What do ya’ll think?
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 1:19 AM | Link to this
DOB, I don’t like to talk to myself.
By Hunk Erdown
February 13, 2008 2:36 AM | Link to this
DOB
Did you ever hear a local band called Discord over the last several years?
By Coach(Lets Go Braves In 2008)
February 13, 2008 3:05 AM | Link to this
Well , it’s all over except for the inevitable.
Andy Pettitte has confirmed the testimony of Brian MacNamee.
WASHINGTON — Roger Clemens told Yankees teammate Andy Pettitte nearly 10 years ago that he used human growth hormone, Pettitte said in a sworn affidavit to Congress, The Associated Press learned Tuesday.
Pettitte disclosed the conversation to the congressional committee holding Wednesday’s hearing on drug use in baseball, a person familiar with the affidavit said. The person spoke to the AP on condition of anonymity because the document had not been made public.
According to the person familiar with the affidavit, who said it was signed Friday night, Pettitte also said Clemens backtracked when the subject of HGH came up again in conversation in 2005, before the same House committee held the first hearing on steroids in baseball.
Lying , perjury , prison.
It’s a sad way to end the great career of Roger Clemens.
By Moby Grape
February 13, 2008 3:52 AM | Link to this
oops
By nOLIE
February 13, 2008 4:01 AM | Link to this
Damaging Information Said to Await Clemens Sign In to E-Mail or Save This Print Single Page Reprints Share
Henry A. Waxman, chairman of the committee that will hear testimony Wednesday. Clemens will also be asked about corroborating information that committee staff members developed on their own that ties Clemens to such drugs, the lawyers said. That information, they said, stands separate and apart from the assertions made about Clemens by his former personal trainer, Brian McNamee, who contends that he injected Clemens with steroids and human growth hormone from 1998 to 2001 HERE
By nOLIE
February 13, 2008 6:08 AM | Link to this
Anybody seen Gone Baby Gone ? very noirish but with an even sadder ending cause it involved a child . Was our hero right to do what he did at the end?
By sam
February 13, 2008 6:22 AM | Link to this
YOU MAY HAVE READ OVER THE PAST WEEK OR SO ABOUT DAMAIN MOSS WORKING OUT WITH THE BRAVES. WELL HE IS IN THE BEST SHAPE HES EVER BEEN IN AND IMPRESSED BOBBY COX AND ROGER MCDOWELL ENOUGH TO SIGN HIM TO A MINOR LEAGUE CONTRACT AND INVITED HIM TO EARLY WORKOUTS WITH THE MINOR LEAGUE GUYS IN HOPES TO WORKING INTO A FEW MAJOR LEAGUE SPRING TRAINING GAMES. IF DAMIAN STAYS HEALTHY THIS COULD HELP THE BRAVES OUT ALOT LATER THIS SUMMER.
By Some Blogs Have Clever Insights
February 13, 2008 8:23 AM | Link to this
Coach sez:
Ordering breadsticks with your pizza is like getting a bucket of chicken with a side order of bones.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 13, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this
nOLIE: thanks for asking if anybody has seen it, and then immediately discussing/partially giving away the ending. nope, haven’t seen it yet, but now i know how it ends, somewhat. thanks a lot.
sam — where are you reading/hearing that the Braves have signed Moss to a minor league contract?
By 22oz
February 13, 2008 8:38 AM | Link to this
THANK YOU SAM. BUT I DON’T THINK DAMIAN MOSS is worth all caps.
we keep hearing about all these players who are in the best shape ever, and look like they’re throwing, hitting, fielding better than ever. I want to hear someone say-“John Doe is in camp, and he looks like crap. Good lord, this guys a joke. How did he get past security?”
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 13, 2008 8:43 AM | Link to this
For the REM fans here:
The video for R.E.M.’s new single, “Supernatural Superserious.”
and for those of you that haven’t heard the song yet — it’s better than their recent stuff, and the video’s pretty good too.
By Niels Boor
February 13, 2008 8:48 AM | Link to this
Does anybody know
if
any web sites
will be streaming
the Clemens hearings
live today?
Hunk Erdown — interesting take on the possible impact of Tex on Chipper’s longevity. Does sliding into a base really take that much out of you?
By nOLIE
February 13, 2008 8:48 AM | Link to this
nOLIE: thanks for asking if anybody has seen it, and then immediately discussing/partially giving away the ending. nope, haven’t seen it yet, but now i know how it ends, somewhat. thanks a lot.Daybed
huh? I didn’t tell how it ended, only that it was a sad ending. What would you expect from all the publicity that surrounded it, a happy one? They don’t call happy movies about child-kidnapping neo-noir. And there are enough twists that you now still have no idea what happens at the end anyway. Sheeesh.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 13, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this
nOLIE: As Frank Costanza said in an episode of Seinfeld: “I gotta go in fresh!” (George and his parents were at dinner with his fiancee and her parents when they began discussing a new movie, and Frank stopped them from discussing it. When the fiancee’s dad said, “it’s got nothing to do with the plot!” Frank said the above line, making it clear that he hates knowing anything about a movie before seeing it.)
No, you didn’t really give away the ending, and yes, you left it open by not mentioning specifics. (Which is why I wrote, “…discussing/partially giving away the ending” and “…know how it ends, somewhat.”) I do appreciate the vagueness, although when I do watch the movie, I’ll have knowledge — albeit it general and vague — about the ending prior to watching it. And that’s just plain no fun.
Another Seinfeld reference (in an old episode, one of the first ones I think): Jerry taped the Mets game one night, then comes home late and starts to watch it. Kramer comes in and says, “Well the Mets blew it tonight!” In that same way, this is what’s happened — Kramer didn’t tell him exactly how it ends or how the Mets blew it, just that it doesn’t end well. (Yes, it’s a different situation, but the similarity is still there.)
Perhaps you could’ve included a line that said something like, “Warning: ‘Gone Baby Gone’ spoiler here (or, at least, vague discussion)” as a courtesy to those on the blog who haven’t seen the movie yet. But hey — there are much worse ways that I could’ve started my day, and much worse things that could happen, so it’s really not a big deal.
By B
February 13, 2008 9:18 AM | Link to this
nOLIE, you just have to understand Daybed … one time i told him bruce willis was a ghost and he punched me in the face …
AND I WAS TALKING ABOUT DIE HARD 4
By McFann
February 13, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this
G’bye, Lew. Hope to read from ya sooner than March second!!
By Braveheart
February 13, 2008 9:44 AM | Link to this
Just yesterday, Daybed Wagmoe punched me in the face as well for uttering “Louis, I think this is the beginning of a beautiful relationship.”
But I wasn’t talking the end of Casablanca.
I was talking Lew and Chipper at spring training.
By richbrave
February 13, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this
Much ado about nothing. Thank God Thursday’s less than 24 away. And remember. It’s what Clemons says to Congress that counts.
By Bryan
February 13, 2008 10:24 AM | Link to this
I don’t know why i have been posting as B … should have been Bryan … weird …
I have been listening to the National album a lot more … man, thats some good stuff … and i like the Whigs - i think i hyped it up in my head a little bit
Daybed, thanks for the REM link.
O’b - how was the trip down re: the new music?
I still remember your post about the Hank 3 album and how you wanted to pull over and burn down a barn … ahhh spring training!
By chucktown
February 13, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this
Niels Boor
yOU can find it over at channelsurfing.net
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this
Just arrived at Dark Star Stadium.
Didn’t drive down this year, flew. 7:20 a.m. flight today.
Listened to some hard blues, James “Blood” Ulmer, on the drive from airport to ballpark (rental house isn’t ready until this afternoon).
First song on the ballpark P.A. system when I got out of the car? “Free Bird.” Kid you not.
OK, going down to see who’s here. There’s about seven guys playing catch on the field now, including McCann, Moylan and — get this — Matt Diaz.
I know he lives nearby, but still, that’s quite an early report by him.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this
Oh, and I’m with Coach on the idea of ordering breadsticks with one’s pizza.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this
Watching Representative Cummings question Clemens right now … wow. This is something else.
By DAP
February 13, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
as far as the tex talk…i think the braves need to offer him at least $120 mil for 6 years. thats 20mil per. tex is 27, a perfect cleanup hitter, and a guy you can really build your offense around. he also plays a position that isnt nearly as prone to injury as some others.
if you offer him more than $20 mil (which he probably wouldnt take anyways) you cant give him a no-trade clause, either. a guy like tex will always be tradable to the yanks red sox, cubs, angels, ect.
the thing im worried about is our other players. i would hate for tex’s contract to crowd out chipper from finishing with us, or smoltz signing another extension, lord-willing, or getting francouer locked up.
between glavine, tex and hampton, we have around 35mil coming off in 2009. i know alot of that will be used for raises for guys, but what if we didnt resign any of these guys, made a big push for sabathia, and then signed a guy like mientkiewicz (i didnt try to spell it, i just pasted it) to play first. he a good glove 1st baseman that wont kill us at the plate.
if we do that, we’d need frenchy to step up and be able to bate cleanup, or kelly to step up and be bale to bat third so chipper can bat cleanup. honestly, i think both kelly and jeff will prove this year that they are capable of those roles.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 13, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
B/Bryan - That’s because I had’t seen Die Hard 4 yet! And thanks for spoiling Casablanca for me Braveheart!!
The National’s album is great, and I’m looking forward to seeing them live again when they open for REM. I think half their show the time I saw them was from “Boxer,” and the rest was very good too.
By DAP
February 13, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this
i listened to the new REM song. ive never been a huge fan of REM, since they are slightly before my time, but i do appreciate some of thier music. i think thier reputation helps them out, because if they were a brand new band, and came out with that song, i dont think anyone would care.
By Anders
February 13, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this
DOB
I know a lot of folks have been saying enough about steroids etc but this hearing is historic and relevant in my opinion. Roger looks like he’s going down. His boy Pettitte chose his family and god over his maniacal friend as I said he would. Good for him. I must say watching Roger stand there and take fastballs at his head for a change is absolutely delicous! No hiding in the dugout when it’s time to answer for your actions on Capitol Hill.
By cricket
February 13, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this
Random I bow to you sir, that was an excellent post about cricket. I am glad to find a kindred spirit (considering cricket) here. Jayasuriya is still doing well at 38, just watched him take a one day match away from india on tuesday at 2 AM. India and Sri Lanka are playing in Australia. The current ragein cricket is the 20/20 - 20 over matches that take less than 4 hrs. to finish and are packed with action. A TX businessman is pushing this format in West Indies. You can watch his tournament on ESPN360.com, also there are many cricket leagues in US now. Just ask any desi (guys from subcontinent) in your area.
By cricket
February 13, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this
Just noticed that Anders has referred to himself in 3rd person couple of times. Looks like the mets fans’ yankization (necessary condition - being obnoxious) is proceeding very fast after the great success of finishing ahead of braves for couple of years. They can complete this process by digging out all the hidden yankee gear and burning it a la the burning bras of the feminist movement.
By Renegator
February 13, 2008 11:21 AM | Link to this
People who are watching the Roger hearing - keep us posted. I can’t watch it because I’m at work but want to know what’s going on.
Thanks
By DAP
February 13, 2008 11:22 AM | Link to this
anders i think the media-created “best friends” have shown their difference in character lately. you are absolutely right that pettitte made the right decision.
By Desert Brave
February 13, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this
Anyone else watching the Clemens hearing? I think he’s screwed!!
By BravesFanInRockies
February 13, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this
Welcome to Florida, DOB. I imagine the weather’s a lot nicer there than it is in the “Intermountain West.” Argh.
I’d love to see the Braves re-sign Tex if it can be done without tying up too much of the payroll (as with Andruw the past couple years).
If not, that’s not the end of the world. The Braves will get two high draft picks, which could yield two top-flight ML-ready players within 3-4 years. Money will be freed to lock up JF/Yunel/KJ, etc.
It would open a big hole in the batting order and at 1B (though Schaefer may be ready by ‘09 to bridge the offensive gap). Who then steps in to play first? We’ve heard rumors that Heyward might be headed there eventually? Is ‘09 way too soon to even think of that? Would it instead be “stopgap” time again?
By chucktown
February 13, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this
Renegator, the hearing is streaming live on channelsurfing.net. Don’t know if you can watch it here, just thought you, and others, might want to konw.
By Anders
February 13, 2008 11:53 AM | Link to this
Thanks god the writers strike is over. This will be classic stuff on SNL. No doubt they’ll combine this with a Godfather theme in front of congress.
BTW- Has anyone over the age of four ever said someone “mis-remembered” something other than the Rocket to Congress? What a weak a$$ attempt of not calling Pettitte a liar while covering his butt. No pun intended.
By Mike S
February 13, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this
Let’s not count out Scott Thorman in the “post-Tex first base plans” (which we really don’t need to worry about yet, let’s see what happens in 2008 first!). He still has the potential to be a middle of the order bat in my mind. I really hope we can get him enough ABs this season off the bench to keep him progressing as a hitter. This guy has big time power, if he can just hone that swing in a little… If he does, and becomes a legit power bat off the bench this year, then we might have an answer to the 2009 1B question that so many on here are asking about on February 13, 2008.
By Randy S
February 13, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this
Isn’t Diaz an emergency catcher? Pitchers and emergency catchers report?
By TennesseePaul
February 13, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
DOB: Didn’t drive down this year, flew. 7:20 a.m. flight today.
So were you at least able to get the bike shipped down again?
By cricket
February 13, 2008 12:09 PM | Link to this
For anyone interested, here’s a live blog about the hearing - Clemens hearing blog
By Desert Brave
February 13, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this
I don’t want to sound like I’m defending Clemens here because I’m not. But the more of this hearing that I watch, the less credible McNamee gets. They are catching him in quite a few lies.
By tlj
February 13, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this
I’m not sure if the Braves will sign Tex to an extention or not. A lot depends on Scott Boras. I don’t think yearly salary will be the problem. Based on everything that has been said the yearly salary should be $ 20 to $ 22 million per year. The braves are already paying him $ 12,500,000 per year. Hampton’s salary will drop off the books after this year and for Braves bookkeeping purposes it has been estimated between 6 and 8 million per year. Within a couple of million per year you already have the $ 20 to $ 22 million mentioned and it hasn’t affected money marked for other players.
This will depend on how many years Boras is looking for and is there hard feeling due to how the Braves treated AJ.
I hope the Braves are able to resign Tex. However, if they aren’t and are out of contention (which I don’t think will happen) by the trading deadline I would consider trading him.
Let’s hope he is resigned and has a long career in a Braves uniform.
By TennesseePaul
February 13, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this
N8: Do you really think from the way Wren has acted as GM since taking over, that he would have done differently
Not trying to say he would have acted differently, just saying I can’t give credit to Frank Wren for an action John Schuerholz took. Nothing more than that.
Perhaps Wren did some behind the scenes negotiating and analysis which aided in the decision to not retain Andruw Jones, but this is unknown. What is known though is that John Schuerholz took the mic and for the record stated publicly that the Braves would not retain Andruw Jones for future seasons. So I give the credit to JS, not Wren, for “not mortgaging the future (by locking up big-dollars to Andruw)”.
Yes, there maybe some truth to the position that JS did this so Wren’s introduction to the fan base as the new GM wouldn’t consist of ditching AJ and trading Renteria for two minor leaguers. That’d be a tough introduction to get past no matter the team outcome. I’ve speculated on that before. Perhaps if/when JS or Wren write a book on the changing of the guard this topic could be broached and the whole truth/behind the scenes discussions could be known. Until then though, the record has JS down as making the move and not Frank Wren.
By Anders
February 13, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this
Desert Brave
McNamee is obviously not squeaky clean, but Pettitte’s testimony is damning. If we’re to believe Clemens, everyone around him was injecting this stuff (including his wife) but him. Sorry, but that’s almost impossible to believe when considering what he accomplished on the field at the same time this was all supposed to be happening.
Now Clemen’s is throwing his agents under the bus. His wife, Pettitte, his agents etc.. This guy has no conscious whatsoever. How long before he starts blaming his kids. He sure ain’t doing his fellow Texans proud. Apparently they have the biggest liar to add to their proud heritage.
By TennesseePaul
February 13, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this
N8: Of course, it could have been that JS justed wanted to smack Boras across the face one last time on his way out…
JS: sheeeeeesh I gots a new op comin my way. Can’t wait. Can’t wait. Just one last thing this home boy has gots to do… Karen! Call the press. I got a score to settle.
By Anders
February 13, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
OK Roger if you and your family have such great anti-drug values how do you feel about your wife taking steroids? What will she say to your kids? Why don’t we have congressmen smarter enough to ask that question?
Did he really use the I ran both ways to school line? Hard to believe but McGuire is looking smarter every time Clemens opens his Robert Conrad “Go ahead and try to knock it off my shoulder mouth”.
By Desert Brave
February 13, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
Like I said, I was not defending Clemens. Just stating that McNamee is not as credible as I had originally thought.
By DAP
February 13, 2008 12:39 PM | Link to this
Mike S (which we really don’t need to worry about yet, let’s see what happens in 2008 first!)
you dont blog in the offseason much, do you? cause you would be really bad at it.
seriously, though, thanks for your input. you are right about thorman’s potential. if we let tex walk and for for top-tier pitching like sabathia,we can be more like those early 90s teams…great pitching, good defense, and timely hitting.
Mike, S, i know you hate talking about ‘09, but how about an ‘09 rotation of
thats pretty stout, and very very scary in the post season. how much do you think sabathia will cost?
By Mike S
February 13, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this
Watching this hearing is like watching the Pats-Giants Super Bowl, or the 2000 Subway Series. I want both teams to lose!
By Moby Grape
February 13, 2008 12:42 PM | Link to this
The lying hypocritical skunk is toast. Hope he goes to prison for trying to play us all for suckers. Just about everybody in that report has been proved guilty or admitted guilt but we’re supposed to believe they made a mistake with the guy who was mentioned more than about anybody else?
By Random
February 13, 2008 12:48 PM | Link to this
Clemens/McNamamee Hearing
By Overlord
February 13, 2008 12:55 PM | Link to this
sounds like clemens is lying. Poor guy. “All i can say is that you are going to heaven” that was a hard one by the congressman lady.
By Lee in S. GA
February 13, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this
Watching this hearing is like watching the Pats-Giants Super Bowl, or the 2000 Subway Series. I want both teams to lose
I know what you mean. Deep down inside though I want Clemens to go down though just as the Pats and Mets both did.
By Overlord
February 13, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this
Mike S im with ya!!!!!!
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 13, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this
DAP - These are just my thoughts, and how he does this year will obviously affect them, but I think that Sabathia would cost around the same as Teixeira, especially as a free agent. I would think he’d get a deal somewhat similar to what Santana got — I say “somewhat similar” because I don’t think it’ll be as high as Santana’s, though with several teams competing in free agency, it certainly could.
To me, I would think that they’d spend, within $5 million/year, roughly the same for Tex as they would for Sabathia. So the question is: do you want to go for an ace pitcher or keep the stud 1B? Because either way, one player will take up a LARGE percentage of your payroll.
It’s a tough choice, though if I had to choose, I might take Sabathia. A frontline starter like him would rival Santana and give us a better rotation (with Smoltz and Hudson etc behind/alongside him), plus ace starters are just harder to come by than a power-hitting 1B. Really, I’d love to have either one.
By The Goche (A.J.)
February 13, 2008 1:06 PM | Link to this
They both sound like liars…yet I can’t look away.
It was kind of funny though when Waxler went after him about the nanny.
Honestly, I can almost see that Clemens might be so naive to invite her to the house, but how stupid can you be. That was just a dumb idea. One thing for the attorney to call, but to have her over to the house…dumb.
Clemens has clearly never watched Law and Order.
In a related note, Sam Watterson I believe may be the only one who could sort all this out.
By Mike S
February 13, 2008 1:13 PM | Link to this
DAP,
Sabathia is a great pitcher, but he is exactly who I would not want to see the Braves go after in 2009. He is going to command TOP dollar on the FA market. We’re talking in between Zito and Santana type money. And the Braves just aren’t going to shell that out (nor should they). Those type of FA contracts are what kill teams (outside of the top 5 revenue teams that can afford to tie up so much money in one player that’s one pitch away from ending their career). It just doesn’t make sense to spend money on top FA talent unless you’re one of the big boys.
The better route to go i think (especially for pitching) is to develop or trade for young arms or guys that are under control at reasonable salaries for a few years. If you do go the FA route, it should be for bargain-type or short term deals. Fortunately the Braves seem to agree with this approach.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this
Talked to a bunch of Braves down in the clubhouse. Whole lot more of them here early this year than in the past.
Yes, Braves signed Moss to a minor league contract, but he won’t be in big league camp. He should get to pitch in some Grapefruit League games, though….
Just watched the hearing for a couple hours in the manager’s office with Cox, Bowman and a rotating cast of folks dropping by to watch a few minutes here and there — coaches, trainers, etc.
Someone is clearly telling a helluva lot of lies. Neither of them comes across as very credible, but the Pettitte stuff just really is hard to explain away. I mean, it’s his best friend. And his best friend’s wife. And no one has ever questioned Pettitte’s character, etc.
Hey, as some have pointed out, McNamee doesn’t exactly come across as a beacon of integrity, either. But how many believe Clemens’ story?…
TennPaul, yes on the bike. It’ll be arriving this afternoon or tonight….
By Efrim
February 13, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this
DAP and Mike S
Sorry to interject, but I think the Braves would be smart to go after Scott Kazmir next offseason. I think Tampa will make himm available, similar to how Baltimore made Bedard available. I think he is the smart acquisition.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 1:41 PM | Link to this
So true on every point you made, The Goche.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 1:43 PM | Link to this
Congressman Braley, the one questioning Clemens now, sounds like Mayor Carcetti on The Wire.
By doc
February 13, 2008 1:44 PM | Link to this
dob, i hope you will give a bit of a credible summary of your own and some of the takes by the ball players just maybe not in name. i hate watching train wrecks and this looks to be one in the making.
glad to hear you made it safe and the ride got down there as well. continued safe travels bud. let me hear about your take on the book if you get the chance to read it. guarantee it will be compelling.
By Elon Seth
February 13, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this
DOB, I’m sure I’m not the only one who feels this way, but I’m freaking out about the huge question mark concerning Kotsay’s back. Can you give us updates often on that, even if they’re just whispers you’ve heard? Even if you just have hunches?
By Mike S
February 13, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
Efrim, I think Kazmir could be a good target, although the price in prospects will likely be high and i’m a bit worried about his shoulder history and lack of control.
However, this brings me back to my point about looking too far forward. What if Jair and Jo-Jo (or Chuck and Bennett or Morton?) have great years in 08 and begin to blossom into middle to top of the rotation pitchers? All of a sudden looking to acquire an ace looks like the last thing the Braves would need to focus on. I think it’s way too early to focus on specific players to target for next year, because who knows what our needs will really be?
What if Thorman develops into an above average bat (or better)? All of a sudden 1st base is no longer a hole. What if a few of the half dozen arms that are on the verge of being quality ML starters realize their potential? Then we wouldn’t need to trade for a starter. I’m not saying either of those things are going to happen (although it would be nice!), but the truth is we just don’t know.
I understand it’s fun to look down the road and speculate on what might become, but in this game things change so much that it’s impossible to tell what you’re needs are going to be a year down the road.
I don’t mean to deny people from talking about 2009, I’m just really excited about 2008!
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this
Elon, of course we’ll be monitoring Kotsay and his back from Day 1. So far, all reports (including directly from him to me) are that he’s able to do all the stuff he’d normally do in an offseason, lifting weights, running, etc, and without pain for the first time in a couple years.
Until I see him in person, that’s all I can tell you.
By DAP
February 13, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
daybed and Mike S i agree with both of you that sabathia would cost top-dollar…so the question would i rather spend money on tex or the same amount on sabathia? my answer is that it depends on what we need. if francouer and johnson dont step up like i think they will, we are gonna really need tex’s offense to compete. if the guys do step up, we wont need the offense as much, but in both cases, we need pitching.
it takes time to develop pitchers, and i want to braves to be competitive each year. i would try to get sabathia for zito money (18 mil per) and give him 5 or 6 years. i think that will put us in a position to win more than signing tex (if the other offensive players are ready)
Mike S you dont want to pay sabathia that…do you think we should pay tex 20mil per? why tex and not sabathia? or do you think we shouldnt get either one…in which case, we need to find a way to get at least one great starter and a 1st baseman.
By TennesseePaul
February 13, 2008 2:04 PM | Link to this
Pettitte said Clemens responded by saying Pettitte misunderstood the previous exchange in 1999 or 2000 and that, in fact, Clemens had been talking about HGH use by his wife in the original conversation.
So… Clemens says his wife was the juicer, not himself… what a man.
By Efrim
February 13, 2008 2:12 PM | Link to this
Mike S
Understood. I agree on looking toward the future. Who knows what our prospects and young pitchers will do? Assessing our organization will come at the end of 2008. As far as Kazmir goes, yes it would take a ton of young talent to bring him in. Not to mention, Tampa already has a ton of talent.
By Mike S
February 13, 2008 2:14 PM | Link to this
DOB, did you know that the guy who plays Carcetti on the Wire is Irish? I saw one of the behind-the-scenes type specials after season 4 and had to do a double take when he was being interviewed and speaking in a thick Irish accent. I always think it’s funny (more shocking really) when an actor with an English/Irish/Australian accent gets interviewed in their normal voice when the only voice you’ve ever heard from them is the character they’ve been so associated with. (Dominic West, who plays McNulty, falls under this category as well)
By DAP
February 13, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this
Efrim i cant believe you interjected like that….you know youre more than welcome in our convo. yeah, kazmir would be good…what the braves lack in $$$$ they have in minor league prospects.
Mike S I think it’s way too early to focus on specific players to target for next year, because who knows what our needs will really be?
there you go again. what a kill-joy. :-)
By cricket
February 13, 2008 2:23 PM | Link to this
I agree with Efrim about Kazmir. There is a chance that he would be available and would be a good pickup. Rays have already locked up Shields with 7 yr / 44 mil when he’s 5 yrs away from FA. So the chances are good that Kazmir may become available. But as usual, negotiating with TB will test patience.
By Renegator
February 13, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
The problem is that players salaries are escalating like crazy right now and eventually the Braves are going to have to pay 20 million for someone (solid pitcher or position player). It’s only a matter of time. Might as well bite the bullet now with Tex rather than wait a couple years and have to pay someone else of equivalent talent 22 or 25 million because the market has escalated even more.
I hope that post makes sense. It’s a little confusing when I re-read it.
By chucktown
February 13, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
In a related note, Sam Watterson I believe may be the only one who could sort all this out.
And he’d have it sorted out in one hour!
By Renegator
February 13, 2008 2:27 PM | Link to this
In other words:
5 years from now when Tex is still getting paid 20 million - it will seem like a bargain because equivalent talent will be making more (22 - 25 million perhaps).
By Anders
February 13, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this
Efrim
I think it was you I told the other day that I think the Twins traded Santana too early. Based on what I’m seeing today, Andy Pettitte will be a bowl of jello for at least the first half of the season, if he doesn’t just retire which is not far fetched. He will have to answer questions regarding these hearings and Clemens’ denial in city after city. His self image took a big hit (for cheating). The crowds, especially Boston will be merciless. If he bolts or is inneffective, the Yanks are screwed.
By JEB
February 13, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this
Looking back a few years, when Clemens picked up the broken bat and threw it (supposedly at Piazza), I guess now we will call that “Roid Rage”!
By Brave New World
February 13, 2008 2:39 PM | Link to this
DOB:
Great post, yet again! I was dying to know about Morton since last blog people talked about our starting pitching candidates, yet left him out to my surprise.
I still don’t like Carlyle nor do I like Reyes as starters. Carlyle should go to the bullpen and Reyes needs more ‘seasoning’ in the minors. I prefer Chucky James as No.4 and either Bennett or Jurjens for No. 5. I guess I really want to see Jurjens start early in the season since that Renteria trade still hits me like a brick (hell, Jair sure better win a lot of games!).
Yet I’d love to see Morton be described as a very strong candidate when spring training ends. I’m not a pessimist, but I still don’t trust Hampton and his frequent injuries…
Finally, can you give us an update on cf Anderson?? Last couple of blogs I saw no one really brought him up. Knowing that Kotsay is injury-prone and that Infante will be in the DL for sometime, is there a chance Anderson will stay as a pinch hitter?
thanks
By Efrim
February 13, 2008 2:39 PM | Link to this
Renegator
It makes perfect sense.
It is just that I have no idea if the Braves will want to pull the trigger on a deal like that right now. It makes sense for them too, but only if they are going to increase payroll beyond 100 million. I heard some bloggers say that we could afford Tex if payroll is 100 million and he chooses to sign for 20 million a year, but I disagree.
I don’t think investing one fifth of your payroll into one player makes sense. 20 million a dollar a year players belong on teams like the Mets, Yanks, Red Sox, Mariners, Tigers, Angels and Dodgers.
I don’t think it is wise for the Braves to sign him for 20 million a year. But honestly, I think he will sign for more than that anyways. 23 million a year sounds about right if he duplicates his 2007 numbers.
By JEB
February 13, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this
DOB, ever listened much to the group “Little Big Town”? Good sound! A little like Fleetwood Mac with a southern rock flavor. Cuts such as “Bones”, “Boonedocks”, “Good as Gone” - recommend highly! GOOD stuff!
By McFann
February 13, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this
OK, I’m officially-officially excited!! And in less than 24 hours (there’s 21 hours, 19 minutes, and 30 seconds app.) Spring Training will officially underway!!
So who did you talk to, DOB? Who’s all showed up so far?
By Mike S
February 13, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
DAP, I think both Tex and Sabathia would be risky signings due to the sheer dollars and length of contracts. However, I think pitchers inherently are much riskier to sign to these type of deals, which is why I would avoid Sabathia. Then the question really comes down to (as you stated) what do we need at that point? Is Tex worth the gamble (admittedly he seems like a pretty safe bet. it’s more just can you afford to tie up that much of your payroll on one player [who plays first base])? If the young guys don’t keep improving or if Chipper has a tough year with injuries, then the need to sign Tex is greater. It also depends on what else you can get with that money, and ultimately, will we even be able to realistically afford him? There is some point where it’s just too much money to resign him, I’m just not sure where that point is.
Let me mention that I am a HUGE Tex supporter (having gone to GT and met him personally several times. I used to live with his now brother-in-law). He’s a great guy and I was ecstatic when I found out he was coming here (he was always the dream scenario guy for me when asked “who would you want the Braves to trade for?”). I think he’s going to have a huge year here this year, and unfortunately, probably price himself out of the Braves budget.
And frankly, I can’t blame either the Braves or Tex if he goes somewhere else after 08. It doesn’t make sense for him to take a significant discount to play here (I’d bet we could get him if it’s close, but I’m scared the big 3 will pull out all of the stops for him and blow our offers out of the water). Alternatively, it doesn’t make sense for the Braves to pay $20+ million for any one player if they’re payroll is below $100 million. If the price gets driven too high, it just makes the most sense for both parties to go there separate ways (unfortunately). Hopefully they’ll find a way to make it work, but either way I’m hoping for a big 08 out of both of them!
By The Bravery
February 13, 2008 2:46 PM | Link to this
Is ‘misremembered’ actually a word?
By flange1
February 13, 2008 2:52 PM | Link to this
Efrim,
I agree on Kaz, he might be the flame throwing Lefty that could lead the Braves to the promised land…
I am glad to see the reaction on re-signing Tex. I would love to lock Tex up forever, but I do think the Braves need to consider if it is worth 1/5 to 1/4 of your team’s salary tied up in one guy.
By Bryan
February 13, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this
The whole McNamee is a drug dealer isn’t really fair … he didn’t get into the business to deal steroids, he go into it to train player … and when your boss tells you to do something … you do it… . what if he had told clemens no? He would have been fired.
What he did was wrong … and if you break it down… yeah, i guess he was “dealing drugs” … i don’t know - that was a little extreme.
By Efrim
February 13, 2008 2:56 PM | Link to this
Anders
I agree man. I think both the Red Sox and Yanks are idiots in not trading for Santana. I think they could of made their lives a lot easier in the next coming years. They choose not too, and now Curt Schilling will be useless and Andy Pettitte, will be useless.
By I'm Chuck James, B$atch!
February 13, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this
Finally heard new ghostface, good stuff! Lupe is ma fave!! Man, I’m trying to like British Sea Power, but I can’t…Guess I haven’t really heard their new stuff. Their first album, in my opinion, was boring…
By Efrim
February 13, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
Flange1
I hope everyone feels the same way about Tex. I know we gave up a lot, but our farm system has rebounded quite well. I think Tex will cost 7 years and 161 million. 23 per year. I think the Yanks will be the team to give him that money. I’ll take the draft picks for him and pay above slot to those draft picks. Look at what the Tigers did to get Rick Porcello. They paid him above slot and now they have a great prospect who many think is going to become an ace alongside Justin Verlander.
I think the Braves should invest more in developing pitching. That is the only way that you are going to end up beating high revenue teams in the future.
By McFann
February 13, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this
I read that Billy Joel was gonna do a concert or something at the last game at Shea. Now he cann sing Pressure and dedicate it to the Mets and Shea Stadium:
You have no scars on your face
And you cannot deal with PRESSURE!!
By Dale Should Be Inducted
February 13, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this
Tex, don’t leave so soon!!! Hoss, if you are out there, PLEASE try to convince Tex to fire Boras and stay with Braves after 08 for a lower price!! Purty pleeez???????
By flange1
February 13, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this
Efrim,
Completely agree with your 3:04. I know going over slot gives Mr. Selig a bit of a problem, but, if it is what it takes to get a young stud pitcher or position player, then I am all for it.
By Tomahawkin' Again
February 13, 2008 3:19 PM | Link to this
DOB, Do you know if Friday’s session starts at 10am at Wide World of Overpriced beer, hot dogs and having to pay to watch a workout? I have the day off and want to head out to Dark Star. Thanks!
By Efrim
February 13, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
If the Braves had a payroll of 120 million, I would say go for it, offer his 7 for 160. But they don’t, so it just doesn’t make sense.
By Roman Gal
February 13, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
Dale Should Be Inducted
I don’t think it’s in Chipper’s job description to convince players to stay…he might charge extra for that service.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this
McFann, your idol is here. McCann’s in the house.
Early arrivals included catcher Brian McCann and pitchers Peter Moylan, Tyler Yates, Mike Gonzalez, Jeff Bennett, Blaine Boyer, Phil Stockman, Buddy Carlyle, Ryan Drese and Jeff Ridgeway.
Matt Diaz was first non-catcher position player in camp, a full seven days before position players were due to report. Diaz lives nearby in Lakeland, Fla.
The first workout for pitchers and catchers is Friday. The first full-squad workout is Feb. 20…
OK, folks, gotta go get moved into the rental house. I’ll start daily blogs tomorrow, but will add more here tonight after I get groceries and unpack, etc
Diaz is in great shape and MIKE GONZALEZ believes he’ll be ready by late May/early June, says Braves have told him that’s reasonable as long as he has no setbacks.
By McFann
February 13, 2008 3:30 PM | Link to this
Thanks, DOB! That Diaz, man, he cracks me up! I bet he’s been dyin’ to get out there. I think the Braves need to lock him up in a long-term deal.
By Anders
February 13, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this
MvFann
I read that Billy Joel was gonna do a concert or something at the last game at Shea. Now he cann sing Pressure and dedicate it to the Mets and Shea Stadium:
The concert is in July which is actually fitting. He can dedicate “Pressure” to Frank Wren who will be wrestling with wether to trade Tex for prospects right about then or roll the dice on the Braves making the playoffs. One of those Yanks/Sox young guns will look real enticing when the Braves are hovering at 5 games back. With all the AL fire power now those teams will be crawling all over each other at the deadline. Only 4 AL teams can make the playoffs and there’s about 7 that expect to go. - It’s gonna be a sellers market.
By Braveheart
February 13, 2008 3:35 PM | Link to this
Since when did “it is what it is” ever mean that I was telling the truth?
My interpretation of “it is what it is” has always been we’ve got ourselves in the middle of a clusterf0ck here, let’s not concern ourselves with who is right or wrong, telling the truth or not, let’s accept the situation for what it is and find a way to move on.
By Longwood's Finest
February 13, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this
Great news on Gonzo… Lets keep our fingers crossed
By richbrave
February 13, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this
RANDOM:
Yours of 10:53 a.m. This year will provide answers to McCann, Francouer, Escobar, Johnson and Diaz in the hitting department. Decision regarding Tex will probably be on-going through ‘08 depending on the performances of the new line-up. With breakdowns his stock in a Braves uni goes up. With breakout performances, his longevity goes down. I want him here, but its the same as a #1 SP - balance: payroll and line-up. We’ll use ‘08 to learn what we’ve got and that’s gonna’ determine whether he stays beyond his contract or not. At least, that’s my take.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this
T-Hawkin Again, haven’t gotten a time yet, but probably about 9:15 or so after a short meeting. Normally they’re on field about 9 a.m.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this
Someone should take away Kelvin Sampson’s phone while he still has a career. If he still has one.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this
Wrote a Braves notebook, should be posted shortly. Lead item about Cox saying he’s not ready to say this is his last year. Not approaching this as his last spring.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 13, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
DOB - great to hear that about Gonzalez. Hopefully late May/early June will pan out and he’ll be in there. That guy’s awesome.
Someone else already pointed this out, but isn’t Matt Diaz an emergency catcher? Wouldn’t that be why he’s reporting now?
When did the Braves sign Damian Moss? I hadn’t heard about it before that post early this morning. The last thing I heard about him was that he was working out with the Braves a week or so ago, but he wasn’t with the team.
By StingerSplash
February 13, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
This might be Clemens’ worst performance since the 1990 ALCS against Oakland. If the Congressmen had any guts or brains - insert own joke here - they’d summon special counsel Dave Stewart to the mound. Then watch Clemens shrivel like a week-old flower.
By Thrillhouse44
February 13, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this
first?
By ssiscribe
February 13, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this
Late May/early June for Gonzalez? IF that’s the case, then that’s quite a boost for the bully. If he’s ready by then, Braves could bring him along at a little bit of a slower pace, rather than trying to toss him right out there in August in the midst of a pennant race …
DOB, hope it’s warmer at Mickey’s Place than here. It’s dropped 20 degrees since this morning. Spring can’t get here fast enough.
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By McFann
February 13, 2008 3:57 PM | Link to this
Anders—
No, he cann dedicate to the Mets because they think that the Braves are gonna be in trouble and that the Mets have solved all their problems and have no worries.
You used to call me paranoid,
PRESSURE!!
But even you cannot avoid
PRESSURE!!
BTW—There’s no “v” in McFann.
By Brave New World
February 13, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this
He can dedicate “Pressure” to Frank Wren who will be wrestling with wether to trade Tex for prospects right about then or roll the dice on the Braves making the playoffs.
Anders
No, but I see Billy dedicating the song “We Didn’t Start the Fire” to Omar Minaya and Willie Randolph, who will be crying after Johan has a shaky first half, Alou and Pedro go to the DL and David Wright and Jose Reyes slump at the plate.
And when the Mets choke again this year, he’ll dedicate “For the Longest Time” to the Mets’ 2008 season choke.
By uga-brave
February 13, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this
EFRIM,
you said if the braves had a payroll of 120 mil in 2009 it would make sense.
the real question is why dont we? the payroll next year better be at least 107-110 million or its gonna be hard to compete with the phils and the mets.
the nationals will be big spenders in the next two years so either the braves prpare themselves to spend the money or prepare themselves for mediocrity.
the price of poker is going up. either ante up or dont play.
gets kind of old when your team always tells you that it is not fiscally responsible or not in the best interest of the franchise, funny never heard ted say that.
i know you cant live in the past, but CORPORATE ownership and its faceless involvement always makes you skeptical.
to be a consistent winner year in year out liberty media is going to have to make the commitment to winning.
By 22oz
February 13, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
I look at all these lineup possibilities, mainly in the pitching department, and am amazed at the depth we have in the rotation and the pen. I keep thinking “what are they gonna do with all these guys”? Thats the great thing about spring. I just have to keep telling myself that injuries WILL happen, and this stuff will sort itself out over the course of the season. Which is why the Braves’ depth will get us to the top this year, since we are better covered than the rest of the NL East. And to think, we traded away several bullpen guys this offseason. Can’t wait for the competition for these spots to begin!
By Brave New World
February 13, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this
Anders
He’ll also dedicate “Moving Out” to Carlos Delgado after he has an 0 for 32 slump. And while he’s at it, he’ll dedicate “Stranger” to Willie…
By Anders
February 13, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this
McFann
I’m not a number one pitcher anymore -PRESSURE. I’m not worth $13 mil anymore _ PRESSURE. I can’t get out of the 1st inning anymore _PRESSURE. I want to go home now _PRESSURE.
Guess who sang that tune in October?
By SeattleBravesFan
February 13, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
here’s my 2cents on the clemen’s deal. mcnamee is probably about half credible. which you would think would help clemens. however, i’m taking a “where there’s smoke, there’s fire approach”. there is just too much corroborating info from people like pettite and knoublach and the fact that clemens wife took a shot from the guy atleast once. how clemens doesn’t come away from this looking completely guilty i don’t know…where’s theres smoke, there’s fire
By McFann
February 13, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
Good one at 4:02, Brave New World.
Hey, uga-brave, the Braves’ first Spring Training game is on Feb 27th against UGA. Who will you root for?
By flange1
February 13, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this
uga-brave,
I agree that payroll has to go up to stay competitive. As fans, we have to support the team and spend the coin to go to the games.
We cannot complain about the payroll and NOT go to the games.
If attendance goes up and payroll doesn’t than I think we will all agree that Corporate ownership might be getting a little greedy, but WE as fans HAVE to support the team by buying tickets so we CAN afford to have a $120 million payroll.
My rant is not directed AT you! From hearing the restaurants that you attend, I am sure you go to games. I have season tickets. But the rest of the Braves nation need to COME TO THE GAMES!!!
By ncscoots
February 13, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
Maybe Hoss can get Tex to read the blog, if he doesn’t already. Maybe that could sway him into signing an extension now…could he really stand an entire YEAR of bloggers discussing the future of his career as we do?
I think NOT, LOL.
By Mark McGwire
February 13, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
Roger is lying and I know it! He is a lousy liar! I just know it!
By chucktown
February 13, 2008 4:28 PM | Link to this
Anders, don’t be petty. It’s not becoming, and besides, it’s beneath your normal standard.
By flange1
February 13, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this
Chucktown,
Did you say beneath Ander’s standard?
Is that possible unless he was sitting on it?
By Braveheart
February 13, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
flange1, it is kind of a chicken and the egg situation.
do they need to spend to get us in to the park or do we need to get into the park to make them spend?
By The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy
February 13, 2008 4:42 PM | Link to this
Let’s just hope that’s not same “Late May, Early June” target date that we got from Tanyon Sturtze last year.
By Braves N 08
February 13, 2008 4:45 PM | Link to this
nice to chipper back on here again. Salaries are getting out of hand these days. As someone posted above have said that soon we will be paying 20 mill for one player.
tomahawk-talk.com
By richbrave
February 13, 2008 4:49 PM | Link to this
uga-brave:
Yours of 4:13 p.m. I’ve been screamin’ those exact lines for over five months now. Rightous post.
By flange1
February 13, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,
Very true! But as fans at least in the beginning of the Liberty Media reign, I think we should “man up” and buy the tickets and hope that Liberty will spend accordingly.
If Liberty doesn’t spend accordingly, then the Braves will suffer the consequences…
What do you think?
By McFann
February 13, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this
Hey, Anders, if you’re gonna re-compose the lyrics of a song, at least get the tune correct.
But, in answer to your Q…
THE BRAVES DIDN’T GET GLAVINE TO BE THEIR #1 PITCHER. They greeted him with open arms because, if it hadn’t been for him, the Mets might have gone to the playoffs!! <:O (Kidding…just kidding. Really.)
So…because of one game he can’t get out of the first inning? Dude, the Braves are in trouble. LOL!
By uga-brave
February 13, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this
McFaan,
its safe to say the georgia-braves game and the gt-braves game is nothing more then a exhibition to start spring training. i think its a great tradition but i dont think the co-eds have ever won one. for me there are only two seasons college football and baseball season, and when they overlap nirvana.
By McFann
February 13, 2008 5:02 PM | Link to this
Gotcha, uga. Was just curious.
(BTW—there’s only one “a” in my name…two n’s. ; >)
By uga-brave
February 13, 2008 5:16 PM | Link to this
flange,
100 % agree that attendance is the #1 factor that determines payroll. hardcore fans such as ourselves want to see that money spent on the field. instead time warner gave us TOONER field and other senseless distractions.
all i am saying is if you spend the money on the product at hand people will show up. wiz in our ear and tell us that it is raining, and i think as consumers we will take our disposable income, buy a case of beer and watch the game on the couch.
all i am saying as fans it gets discouraging to watch players walk away or be available and us not being able to sign or resign them.
spending money does not guarantee victories, but it at least takes some of the sting out when you spend $12.00 for a beer and a hotdog.
By McFann
February 13, 2008 5:21 PM | Link to this
Oh, and, Anders,
Don’t ask for help, you’re all alone
*PRESSURE!
You’ll have to answer to your own
PRESSURE!
By Luther
February 13, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
In relation to the payroll discussion, I was curious about Turner Field. I just read about the $200 million the Mets are getting for Citi field which is around 20 million a year. I always kind of liked that the Braves had the TED and hadn’t sold out the name of the stadium; however, if it means an extra 10-20 million a year in payroll for a team that is thrifty to say the least then they can name it Coke field and play with a coke patch sewn on their rear ends for all I care. I guess my question is whether or not there was any kind of stipulation from Turner about not being able to rename the stadium.
By woogidy
February 13, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this
Spending more money only adds expectations. The more the payroll is, the more is expected of a team. Look at th ‘07 playoff teams and where they rank in payroll (1, 2, 5, 8, 14, 23, 25, 26) 4 in the top 10, 3 in the bottom, and one in the middle. It is less about payroll, and more about players. Usually better players cost more payroll, but not always.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
February 13, 2008 6:47 PM | Link to this
I watched the MacNamee/Clemens congressional hearings today , my opinion remains unchanged.
However , seeing the Republicans and Democrats turn it into a game of political GOTCHA was truly revolting.
The politicians came away looking even more disgusting than usual.
By Ben
February 13, 2008 7:34 PM | Link to this
Luther, that’s a good question about “Turner” Field, but, on a related matter, I think Mets fans are deluding themselves when they justify signing a guy like Santana to a huge contract by pointing to the $20M/year they get from Citigroup for the stadium’s name. If they think that $20M goes dollar for dollar to players’ salaries, they’re dreaming. There can be no doubt that the $400M guaranteed over the life of the contract (20 years) was already spent in constructing the stadium. The total cost of construction was about $800M, $618M of which was paid directly by the Mets (the city loaned $90M and the state $75M). That means that the Mets are somewhere around $618M in debt, though they may have had some surplus profits from the past couple years. Regardless, the team is hundreds of millions of dollars in debt because of this project, and will continue to have an annual payroll of at least $120M. Now, with increased ticket sales and revenue from SNY, they’ll have income there to offset the players’ salaries (at least one would assume), but it’s not like the debt from the stadium will be wiped out in a year or so. This leads me to believe that the $400M from Citigroup will be necessary to pay off the creditors. It’s just silly to think of that money as play money.
By JEB
February 13, 2008 7:46 PM | Link to this
The HGH issue is a real head scratcher! HGH is a NATURAL component in everyones chemical make up! If they find a way to test it - it will show up in everyone!! Especially someone in their twenties! As we all get older, then we start producing less of it. That is why it takes longer to heal from the regular aches and pains. As a player gets older, it takes them longer to heal (HGH level is decreasing) then it gets harder to play the game without hurting all the time and little aches and pains carry on all season. HGH is really a fountain of youth and is perfectly legal to get a prescribed shot. Also you can buy it in pill form and spray (under the tongue) form. Someone needs to open up the doors and pass along some REAL info on this! Everyone is just going down this path as if this is the same as steroids - it is NOT!
By Choppinmama
February 13, 2008 8:05 PM | Link to this
Coach - I watched every minute too, and I heartily agree with your comments about the politicos. Talk about being entrenched in their one-sided conclusions. Sheeeeesh!! That says a lot about listening to all of the testimony, THEN making up your mind.
Anyway, some points to consider that I have been wondering about: 1. So nobody got word to Mr- Available-At-All-Times Clemens that Mitchell wanted to speak with him for the report? No word from the player’s union or his two agents? Even though at least one letter was sent to the ballplayers directly by the Mitchell commission, seems like the PO didn’t make the delivery to RC’s address.
2.Clemens attorneys allowed the ex-nanny to come to Clemens home to be interviewed by his investigators? Hardly neutral territory, but surprising testimony nonetheless.
The nanny’s memory places the Clemens family and Mr. C himself at the Canseco’s on the weekend that McNamee said he had another steroid/HGH conversation with Roger - but the hosts and all the rest of the guests memory’s fail to place the family or Roger on the scene? An example of brain/memory damage due to drug ingestion? Score one point for the PhD.
Smells like Blue Jay cover-up by doctors and trainers when Roger was having his gluteal lump problems. I’d have to agree with Roger that the medical staff would have to know when the ace of their staff was having “lump/abcess” problems, had an MRI done, but labelled the problem a B-12 shot gone wrong or a pulled glute. Hmmmmmm???
Lastly - where was good buddy Andy to either refute or confirm McNamee’s assertions in person? Roger said he and Pettit were the best of friends and that he (RC) would know if Andy was doing HGH or steroids. Or not.
By Choppinmama
February 13, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this
OK - so counting from 1 to 5 is not my strong suit!
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 8:27 PM | Link to this
JEB, you need to check a little deeper into the scientifically tested benefits of HGH. Your point about it being produced naturally in the body — so what?
Testosterone is also produced by the body. But when you inject much higher than normal levels of that into your bloodstream, provided your chemist … er, doctor … knows what he’s doing, it can greatly enhance athletic performance.
Similarly, what about the old blood-replacement techniques that Lasse Viren and other Finnish distance runners were widely suspected of using in the 70s. They’d remove part of their blood months before the Olympics, then reintroduce it before the competition, after their bodies had compensated for the removed portion. It was said to have aided their endurance.
Nothing artificial about what they injected back into their bodies, but the effect was anything but “natural.”
Boosting one’s level of testosterone or growth hormone can provide a significant competitive advantage or advantage in training, according to the wide majority of doctors who’ve studied it.
By JJMB
February 13, 2008 8:33 PM | Link to this
Hey JEB, testosterone is a natural substance (in males and females). That is what an anabolic steroid is, or mimics. An anabolic steroid is treated by the body as more testosterone. Test also drops as one ages. Test also promotes fast healing.
If you guys (not necessarily you, JEB) can’t see the Rocket is lying to save his HOF credentials, then I can’t help you.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 8:33 PM | Link to this
Daybd, the Braves don’t announce minor-league contracts unless the player has been invited to big league spring training. Moss will be in minor league spring training, though he’s expected to get to pitch in some Grapefruit League games to show what he’s got. Braves liked what they saw in him last week, enough at least to offer a minor league contract. No risk there, just depth for the minors if nothing else. Don’t cost much, that’s for sure….
And in case anyone’s concerned, I’ve been reunited with the bike, which made it down in trailor luxury. Just went over and picked it up, then took a nice, cool night ride back to our rental house. Invigorating.
By chuckw/deadjournalist
February 13, 2008 8:42 PM | Link to this
Catching up on the blog since I haven’t had much free time the last couple of days.
Love hearing that Diaz is at camp. I really like the guy and how he plays the game. I’d love to see him get a shot to get 500 abs this year.
Going back to a post from U Kno Who regarding how impressed he was with the bullpen. The Braves have always had a knack of making a few bullpen moves that slip under the radar, and most years, like with Kevin Gryboski a few years back, they usually pay off. I’ve got to wonder if this won’t be the case with Resop this year.
Every year someone will get hurt or be ineffective early, so having two or three guys that can come up without missing a beat. Resop and Stockman strike as two guys who may be pitching meaningful innings by June.
A final question, that I hope someone with a closer pulse of the organization can answer. Is Buddy Hernandez going to be in the organization this year? Is there any chance he will get a look? His number in the minors have always been strong enough that I would have thought he would have gotten a look, but he never has. Anyone able to shed some light? I know it’s rather random, but it is something I’ve been curious about for a few years now.
By JJMB
February 13, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this
The comments about Dem-Rep break down. Yes I did notice the shrillest attacks against McNamee coming from Republicans. However, the two absolutely most ridiculous comments came from 2 Democrats. One wanted to know what “uniform” Clemens was going to wear at the HOF ceremony, and the other assured Rocket of going to “Heaven.” WTF?
By Niels Boor
February 13, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this
JEB —
You wanna know what the REAL “head scratchers” are? Here goes.
Why is use of syntetic anabolic steroids stigmatized, and not Tommy John surgery? Aren’t each equally “unnatural”, and each equally accessible to all?
Why is use of HGH stigmatized, and not Lasik eye surgery? Don’t both give an (unfair???) advantage to those who’ve had them over players who haven’t undergone either?
How soon will it be illegal to inject stem cells to accelerate healing? Ever? Never?
My solution? The dinosaurs and judgment freaks on this blog (and other blogs) should be given a lifetime’s supply of asterisks and steered to the corner, where they can sit and drool and endlessly debate baseball records that are meaningful only to themselves and their imaginary friends.
Harsh? Perhaps — hence the effin’ handle.
PS: Oh, and McFann — please please please don’t take the words of either David Bowie or Queen in vain. For dinosaurs like me, they’re on the level of friggin Psalms.
;-)
Joking, of course.
By Niels Boor
February 13, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this
JEB —
You wanna know what the REAL “head scratchers” are? Here goes.
Why is use of syntetic anabolic steroids stigmatized, and not Tommy John surgery? Aren’t each equally “unnatural”, and each equally accessible to all?
Why is use of HGH stigmatized, and not Lasik eye surgery? Don’t both give an (unfair???) advantage to those who’ve had them over players who haven’t undergone either?
How soon will it be illegal to inject stem cells to accelerate healing? Ever? Never?
My solution? The dinosaurs and judgment freaks on this blog (and other blogs) should be given a lifetime’s supply of asterisks and steered to the corner, where they can sit and drool and endlessly debate baseball records that are meaningful only to themselves and their imaginary friends.
Harsh? Perhaps — hence the effin’ handle.
PS: Oh, and McFann — please please please don’t take the words of either David Bowie or Queen in vain. For dinosaurs like me, they’re on the level of friggin Psalms.
;-)
Joking, of course.
By Random
February 13, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this
richbrave —
That was DAP, not me.
The way you can tell us apart on the blog is that he’s taller, smarter and better looking than you.
I’m not.
Thanks, anyway.
By N8
February 13, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
DOB
Apparently JEB would rather watch those “robots” that are part of the FOX broadcast graphics, than that ACTUAL football players. :-)
I say juice em ALL up. Especially in the NFL. Then give the players LESS protective gear. Add to that…..take the refs completely out of the mix.
Hell, while we’re going, juice up all of the UFC guys, and give them brass knuckles.
Good lord, people! If REAL & FAIR competition, between actual athletes ISN’T your idea of entertainment… watch the WWF or WWE or whatever the hell they call themselves these days.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 9:28 PM | Link to this
Niels, Lasik eye surgery is corrective surgery designed to essentially do what glasses or contacts do — get someone’s vision back to its original 20-20, or at least close to that level.
Tommy John surgery is surgery to replace a torn ligament, a ligament that no long functional for pursuits such as throwing a baseball. Should someone be forced to give up his athletic career rather than have surgery to repair the damage?
So what about rotator-cuff surgery? Should all those with torn rotator cuffs be forced to give up a career rather than have that, too?
How about hip-replacement surgery, if it allowed someone to continue a career. Bo Jackson tried, but didn’t last long with the artificial hip. But if he had, would you equate that to using ‘roids or HGH?
You’re reaching, comparing the use of performance-enhancing (and illegal) drugs to lasik eye surgery or Tommy John reconstructive elbow surgery.
By Jeb
February 13, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this
DOB I have been looking into and studied the use of HGH since the mid nineties. Long before it was even spoken of in the same sentences with steriods. Abuse of any medication is not healthy. (You can even overdo it on vitamin C, E, etc.) But, mark these words in the back of your mind: In the years to come HGH will be found to be the fountain of youth for us all! It would not take a very long search into the subject to know that this is already a prevailing thought! It’s not quacks making these remarks either! Be a real reporter and dig into this for awhile, and learn some truths about HGH. As anyone moves into their 40’s - HGH levels continue to decrease and the ability to exercise and continually increase in strength becomes more difficult. We can’t get over the aches and pains involved, not able to push as far. Our immune systems get weaker, so sickness and illness have more of an opportunity to take our bodies. The loss of HGH is the reason. I agree there can be an abuse. But, to replace what is lost is only a normal process of aging. We are ALL looking for the fountain of youth! Everyone in sports would like to play longer! Cna’t blame them for wanting to. Abuse of a drug is a different story.
By McFann
February 13, 2008 9:34 PM | Link to this
Niels—
Why should they stigmatize Lasik? That and HGH are two different things, IMO. A person doesn’t have to take HGH, but somebody might have to have Lasik. If a player is losing his ability to see clearly, that puts him at a disadvantage against those players who have perfect 20-20 vision. So then, if that “visually impaired” player has Lasik, that gives him 20-20 vision just like the dude who was born with great eyesight.
HGH is bad because it does, in fact, give an unfair disadvantage over other players. Some big guy might take some to make himself even bigger, and that of course is just ridiculous. Let your body grow naturally, ya know.
If you say Lasik is “unfair” to those who’ve never had it, cann the same be said then for other surgeries such as Tommy John? Well, maybe not, because Tommy John has its side-effects. But either way, Laisk is one thing, taking steroids is another, and very different thing. Steroids do unnatural things to the body; Lasik repairs something. Same thing with all surgeries. Should MLB force the retirement of anyone who is in need of being “repaired” because it might give them an “advantage” over other players?
Steroids, while being bad, are a choice made by some players. Surgery—while it is ultimately a “choice”—is something that sometimes cannot be avoided.
Perhaps I’m just being partial. ; )
Oh, and McFann — please please please don’t take the words of either David Bowie or Queen in vain. For dinosaurs like me, they’re on the level of friggin Psalms.
I don’t know what you mean, there. I was using a Billy Joel song.
By McFann
February 13, 2008 9:38 PM | Link to this
Man, DOB, you beat me again!! My post took so long to type, I didn’t see yours till I was finished. Very good, Chief. (You don’t mind if I call you “Chief”, do you? Ya know, ‘cause you’re “Chief of the blog”…I cann knock it off if it bothers you. : ) )
14 more hours……
By Niels Boor
February 13, 2008 9:42 PM | Link to this
Damn these friggin duplicate posts!!!
Sorry again — apologies to all.
Dem-Rep? Did somebody say “Dem-Rep”?
Non-partisan — totally — non-ideological — I swear — political link follows. Interesting as double double hockey sticks:
Who do you think you want?
By JJMB
February 13, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this
Jeb, HGH promotes new cell growth. That is normal in a young, growing body. Now, injecting it into an aging 40, 50, 60+++ year old body, with 40,,,,+ year old cells….well go ahead. I’ll just watch, thanks.
By Niels Boor
February 13, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this
McFann—
How can you say someone might have to have Lasik surgery when it wasn’t even available 10 years ago? (Or however long.) Ted Williams, I’m sure, did not need Lasik. But how ‘bout all the guys playing at the same time — don’t you think Lasik might have helped a slew of them?
Would that have been fair to the guys who decided that it was too risky?
Would it have been fair to Ted Williams (or others), who didn’t need it?
You’re not partial — you’re just young. You take for granted and accept as natural all kinds of surgival procedures that really aren’t. How can Lasik be more natural than HGH (or steroids)?
The body syntheizes, on its own, by its own self, both HGH and anabolic steroids. Eyes do not on their own subject themselves to laser surgery. Elbows do not on their own decide to and effect a ligament swap with another body part.
“Lasik … and HGH are two different things” Yeah — HGH is natural and Lasik is not.
Should a fellow whose body naturally produces more HGH than anothe fellow be stigmatized? No.
On the other hand, should the second fellow be disallowed from taking HGH supplements to bring him up to the first guy’s level? You say yes — think about it some more, and tell me why.
Your question (compare it to my version of it below):
“If a player is losing his ability to see clearly, that puts him at a disadvantage against those players who have perfect 20-20 vision. So then, if that “visually impaired” player has Lasik, that gives him 20-20 vision just like the dude who was born with great eyesight.”
My version:
If a player is losing his ability to heal quickly, that puts him at a disadvantage against those younger players who have better healing abilities. So then, if that “healing impaired” player takes HGH, that gives him good healing capacity just like the younger dude.
What do you think? (You’re not an age=ist, are you?)
PS: Billy Joel? Are you sure? Since you didn’t provide the notes, I just assumed you were parodying Bowie/Queen’s Under Pressure.
Sorry — my mistake.
By Ippississim
February 13, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this
I have two sons, ages 3 1/2 and 1 1/2. I’m already working with the 3-year-old on hitting a moving ball from either side of the plate (although tossed as slowly as I can manage and still keep it out of the dirt at 20 feet) and I’ve got him throwing sidearm accurately enough that I only have to take a step or two either way to field it at the same distance. My goal, based on his build and tendencies, is to produce a switch-hitting middle infielder with high OBP and decent power. Do you guys think I’m rushing him?
By Roman Gal
February 13, 2008 10:41 PM | Link to this
Neils, when players take HGH they are putting an unnatural amount of the the hormone into their bodies…as in, more than a normal person could possibly produce. When a person has, say lasik surgery, the doctors are making that persons eyes normal…get it? Lasik surgery doens’t give people supervision like Superman…just helps them see normally.
By Greg in TN
February 13, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this
Evening gang…
Spent most of the evening scanning through the past few blogs and have some comments and thoughts from the ‘Land of the Plume’. Sorry Random, the school system here is top notch if I say so myself. Got a chuckle though from the back and forth there. Roll Wildcats Roll.
Great to see our esteemed third sacker blogging with the denizens in the Braves/MIB blog, and to top it all off, the notorious one got to get a little counter time at Ella’s place. Add to all of this the fact we are almost through Spring Training eve and it all adds up to the typical buzz that the annual trek to Dark Star invokes throughout Planet Braves.
Are there any bruised sternums in the tri state area? Probably so after the amazin mediocres traded for and signed Santana which elicited the latest round of chest thumping. Bully for those guys. Santana is a big signing for flushing, but it’s not like he’s David Wright or anything.
Great to see Chipper blogging the other night. I really respect everything the guy’s done for this franchise over the years. His posts on the blog were another nice touch I’ll remember for some time.
To me, it almost sounded like two snake oil salesmen sitting behind the big wooden desk in DC today. Two diametrically different testimonies, two radically different stances. It does not look good at all for Clemens at the moment and ‘Ol Bud looks like he’s headed for another case of Tums after the events of the last few days. First Rocker, now Roger. As the world turns.
The pop of baseballs striking mitts are only a few scant hours away denizens. Spring has come to Planet Braves.
By chucktown
February 13, 2008 10:57 PM | Link to this
Ippississim,
Did you really wait until your kid was 3 before you started switch hitting drills with him? What’s wrong, don’t you love your kid? What kind of future in baseball do you expect he’ll have? I Hope your hopes aren’t set much higher than “recreational league”. By this stage he should have a wicked Uncle Charlie and a splitter that just dies when it gets to the plate. He should also be able to hit it over the playground fence, from EITHER side of the plate. (And when he does, don’t be afraid to pitch inside and knock him down. He might be just three but you have to remind him who his daddy is!)
:-)
By JEB
February 13, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this
JJMB - you said it correctly “HGH promotes new cell growth”. Of course it is common for someone in their twenties! But, those in their late 30’s, 40’s, 50’s, 60’s etc. also want new cell growth. It is what keeps us young. Now, who wants to get old, weak, sick … Are you going to line up for that!
Neils Boor - you make a good point about the difference in the levels of testosterone, steriods, and HGH in the same age of player. The difference is when one starts getting into their 30’s, HGH level goes down and it is hard to stay competive and be on a level playing field. That is the reason Andy Pettite did what did.
Roger Clemons is covering to protect his HOF rep. Whlie he is trying to hang on … everyone else is saying goodbye!
By BravesFanInRockies
February 13, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this
Look Niels,
There’s a distinction between treatment that repairs an injury (TJ surgery) and treatment that artificially enhances performance in an otherwise healthy athlete (steroid use). Otherwise, apparently, you’d have an issue with a player who did anything to treat an injury that required more than rest, or, you know, rubbing some dirt on it.
In that view, isn’t ACL surgery unnatural? Or any other medical advance from the past 50 years that athletes have taken advantage of (based on the rules of the authority that governs the sport, mind you)?
Come on, man. Use your noggin.
By woogidy
February 13, 2008 11:16 PM | Link to this
Enough Already! Steroids, HGH, blah blah blah. What is this? ESPN? Where is Bob Ley? and Jeremy Schapp? ugh!
By Ippississim
February 13, 2008 11:23 PM | Link to this
I bought him his first foam-covered bat for his second birthday, but I already had him fielding grounders by that point. I started him off a tee two days after his birthday, once he’d gotten the hang of holding the bat, and I’ve been making sure he spends equal time on both sides of the plate the entire time.
Seriously, though, the kid loves his baseball. He’s watched as many games in the past two seasons as I have, and my dad took him to a M-Braves game last year for his third birthday. He can’t read yet, but recognizes the team logos of about half the NL already and says “Mets Stink” when he sees theirs. I guess it’s like father, like son, though: I started following the Braves in the late 1980’s, when they were struggling, and he started watching in 2006, when they weren’t doing so well either.
The little guy idolizes Chipper, Frenchy, KJ, and McCann, and gets really excited when John Smoltz strikes someone out. I love being a dad.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 11:32 PM | Link to this
Always good to hear from Greg in TN….
By chucktown
February 13, 2008 11:33 PM | Link to this
and says “Mets Stink” when he sees theirs
So you’re not a bad father, after all.
:-)
Took my kid (he’s 10) to a banquet this winter. Jeff Francoeur was the speaker. He was very nice, signed as many autographs as were asked, photos, stopped to chat, etc. He was a good speaker too. My son is hooked. And this makes me happy.
By David O'Brien
February 13, 2008 11:39 PM | Link to this
N8, well said at 9:21.
Niels, sorry man, but our views are just so diametically opposed (had to use the phrase of the day) on this topic, no sense in me even trying to explain to you, or vice-versa. Seriously, I couldn’t disagree with you more on the subject. But that’s cool by me. No worries.
By N8
February 14, 2008 12:02 AM | Link to this
In Jeb’s world where any enhancement is “ok” with him, imagine the Braves cleanup hitter being on deck, and then his turn to bat comes…..
(Guns-n-Roses’ “you could be mine” roars through the Turner Field PA as he walks to the plate)
PA Announcer says: *Now batting….Model 101 Prototype, all the way from 2029, outfielder (yup that’s right…..this guys covers the WHOLE outfield by himself)….THE TERMINATOR!!!!!
Man….wouldn’t that be something?
By TennesseePaul
February 14, 2008 12:13 AM | Link to this
Ippississim: lol. That was good stuff. Hope the kid turns out alright. Had a friend teach his son at such an age. The kid grew up to be an artist in Chicago with no aspirations of playing ball.
How is it down in Mississippi? Are you near Pearl and the AA Braves?
Niels Boor: You’re comparing Lasik to ‘roids? You know lasik is akin to getting permanent glasses right? You’re saying it’s “artificial” for a person to see just the same as it is “artificial” for someone to hit 73 homers at the age of 37? Comparing Tommy John to HGH? So… by that logic then surgery and a cast on a compound fracture is “artificial” enhancement… I’ll be sure to tell the less fortunate as much when they’re laid up in a hospital awaiting a kiddney transplant… “you know you’re just as much of a cheater as a ‘roid ragin’ ball player… why don’t you just die.”
By Bravo Nam
February 14, 2008 1:35 AM | Link to this
G’day mates from the Bodge. Have been following all the news on the blog, but no opportunity to reply…after 7 years in Nam, 9 months in Cambodia, 3 months back in VN, I’m now back in Cambodia…hoping to be here for a while now.
Nice article DOB about Bobby Cox…Robert (AKA Donk), read it and weep!
By Moby Grape
February 14, 2008 1:57 AM | Link to this
You wanna know what the REAL “head scratchers” are? Here goes.NB
So here comes the sour grapes now that your boy Clemens has been proven to be a liar and a cheat after you have defended him so vigorously for so long? The guy is scum.Not just for cheating, but mostly for lying and bullying and throwing everybody but himself under the bus as someone earlier stated.
By ippississiM
February 14, 2008 2:54 AM | Link to this
I’m about as far from Pearl as one can get and still be in the state. I live in Alcorn County, and my house is 20 minutes from TN and 35 minutes from AL. There’s not much to do here but hunt, fish, ride 4-wheelers, and play ball, and I was never quite a big enough redneck to get much fun out of hunting or 4-wheelers, so I fish, and I used to play ball, but I’ve got a bad back from my USMC days, so now I just take a bucket of baseballs out in the backyard and pitch at a plywood backstop with a strike zone painted on it. I have a regulation mound, an old rubber home plate, and a good bit of backyard (5 acres in the country). I have 40-50 balls in the bucket, and I go through it twice, once a week, year-round. I’m a lefty sidearmer (used to throw overhand, but sidearm is easier on my arm), mid-80’s topend, very good vertical control, with occasional lateral wildness, but I generally keep it between the ditches—last time I videotaped myself, it was 100 pitches, 72 in the zone, and only two wild pitches (my plywood backstop is sized so that if it hits the board, it could reasonably be caught). I have a 4-seamer, a 2-seamer, knucleball, circle change, and palmball, in order of preference, and I tend to take “too long” between pitches. And I would have signed for cheaper than that pile of poo the Braves dug out of the basement last year.
BTW, pitches don’t “move” the same sidearm.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
February 14, 2008 3:24 AM | Link to this
Dave O’Brien , I have a couple of baseball related questions.
What is the status of Doug Clark.
Why are the Braves inviting Tyler Flowers to the big league camp and burning an option on a guy with just two minor league seasons.
Is Scott Thorman really out of options ?????? really , really , really….. I’m just yanking your chain , LOL !
By Moby Grape
February 14, 2008 3:35 AM | Link to this
ESPN has an article with a body-language expert reading the two dolts today. She is way on the side of McNamee
By ncgary
February 14, 2008 5:26 AM | Link to this
DAMN enuffs ey snuff fugeddabout all ythis dc scam where ewe have all these scumsuckin traitors up on their high horses about a few entertainers doping up to entertain. if they abused the steroids the damage will be evident later in their lives as their body unnaturally deteriorates, so what if the rocket juiced, if he would a just pulled a paul byrd and said yeah i was injured , the docs said this new junk would make me heal faster, and i got hooked on the feelin, well most of us are still human, any way enuffs enuff of the doping scandal its time to play ball,
go braves world series or bust
By Niels Boor
February 14, 2008 5:53 AM | Link to this
DOB and BravesFanInRockies —
It may or may not be a reach to compare anabolic steroids (muscle bulk enhancers) to corrective surgery, but I don’t think it’s a reach at all to compare HGH to corrective surgery. And what about stem cells?
“Should someone be forced to give up his athletic career rather than take HGH to repair the damage?”
“There’s a distinction between treatment that repairs an injury (TJ surgery) and treatment that artificially enhances performance in an otherwise healthy athlete (steroid use).”
I think it’s inevitable that soon that distinction will be more or less universally considered artificial — I do already.
Yes, TennesseePaul, that’s what I’m saying. I’ll try to say it more convincingly later.
By Some Blogs Have Jokes
February 14, 2008 6:13 AM | Link to this
Roger Clemens: With all due respect, sir, I know for a fact that my wife is dead set against the use of performance enhancing drugs!
Henry Waxman: How can you know that, Mr Clemens, in light of all the testimony we’ve heard today?
Clemens: Because, sir, she absolutely refuses to take aspirin for her “headaches”.
By Jared
February 14, 2008 7:04 AM | Link to this
Since Chipper Jones is now apparently reading this blog somewhat often now, I’ll throw this out there again.
Chipper Jones, 2007:
Left-handed: .378 batting average, .472 OBP, .699 slugging percentage, 1.171 OPS, 22 homeruns in 312 at-bats.
Right-handed: .274 batting average, .345 OBP, .458 slugging percentage, .803 OPS, 7 homeruns in 201 at-bats.
I know there is a small advantage to batting right handed against lefty pitchers and vice versa, but at what point do you maybe wonder if you could do better batting one-way all the time? Is the lefty-righty advantage greater than the difference between these split stats?
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 7:21 AM | Link to this
I don’t know how anyone can say they believe McNamee over Clemens or vice versa. They both came off like scumbags.
The only one you can believe is Andy Pettitte. I would not be shocked if Andy Pettitte announces his retirement after this debacle. The shame of what he did seems to be weighing heavily on his mind. It must have been tough for Pettitte to know he and his wife were the ones who put the noose around his best friend’s neck.
What we saw yesterday unfortunately is exactly why Congress is involved in steroids.
The roids issue was so bad, Andy Pettitte’s father went out and bought it for his son, Rocket’s wife went out and got herself injected, Brian McNamee who was just a dorky city kid who could play ball and played for the Redmen and grew up idolizing these guys, happened to get a job working with a guy who was a god to all of us when we were kids and did things he otherwise would not have done because he was still starstruck (too much so for any self respecting adult male).
None of those people would have been involved in roids without the influence of baseball. McNamee and Pettitte’s father did it because of their love of baseball players. Rocket’s wife, well, it sounds like she did what she did out of vanity and love for herself but also because she was in love with a man whose had lost his moral compass in order to compete and she lost hers as well.
So, the roid problem in baseball was something somewhat warranting the attention of Congress because it was no longer just an in house baseball problem. It started affecting private citizens.
Unfortunately, our Congressman are a joke. They even make a stupid issue like whether or not Rocket used roids a partisan catfight. Republicans have to stand up for Rocket because he is a Republican and good friends with 41 (which Clemens mentioned many times). And the Democrats took a mob mentality to Clemens. You would think it would be the other way around since the Republicans claim to be tough on crime while the Deomcrats are usually the ones who are supposedly trying to be soft on crime. But whatever.
It was an issue worthy of Congress but certainly not our Congressman and certainly not Democrats or Republicans.
But I gotta say, Elijiah Cummings - you da man!
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 7:37 AM | Link to this
Anyone who has watched Goodfellas, remembers the infamous opening line, As far back as I can remember, I’ve always wanted to be a gangster.
Take this steroids mess as it applies to the people involved, and substitute for everyone involved from Jose Canseco to Mark McGwire to Sammy Sosa to Roger Clemens to John Rocker to Andy Pettitte to Pettitte’s father to Brian McNamee and substitute As far back as I can remember, I’ve always wanted to be a baseball player and you can understand all of this alot more.
If ESPN had anyone with a pulse, they would pull a Scorsese and replay highlights of this sad ordeal with the end of Eric Clapton’s Layla playing.
What we saw yesterday reminds me so much of how things spiraled out control and downhill for the Goodfellas when Layla starts playing during that movie and how everyone goes down.
Whatever. Just some of my thoughts. Can never listen to that Layla song by Clapton without thinking of that song because Scorsese used it so effectively.
By nOLIE
February 14, 2008 7:46 AM | Link to this
Roger Clemens: With all due respect, sir, I know for a fact that my wife is dead set against the use of performance enhancing drugs!SBHJ
now that was funny
By PatioDaddio
February 14, 2008 7:48 AM | Link to this
Tyler Flowers future may be 1B, but he has experience as a catcher and he will be part of the catcher group that will be needed to catch all those pitchers.
McCann Miller Javy Flowers Pena Boscan
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 7:54 AM | Link to this
Someone gave Deavan George a no trade clause? Huh?
By JEB
February 14, 2008 7:55 AM | Link to this
N8 - and to any others. Let me state clearly (in case I did not make it clear) I do not believe that steroids should be used. It is an illegal substance - more harmful than most realize (those that used it cheated). But, to lump HGH in with steroids is not right. Study and check out ALL the scientific evidence concerning HGH. Mark these words: HGH will be the new “Fountain of Youth” in the future. There will not be (ever) a test to properly detect it and separate an injection of HGH and the real chemical substance that exists in our bodies.
By richbrave
February 14, 2008 8:48 AM | Link to this
Alright. We’re off. ‘08 has arrived!!!!
By The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy
February 14, 2008 8:49 AM | Link to this
Braveheart,
Perfect. I love it. I can see Roger in a robe getting the newspaper with his voice in narration talking about how much better he used to have it: “I’m an average nobody. I get to live the rest of my life like a schnook.”
By kdbanks
February 14, 2008 9:27 AM | Link to this
Here’s what I learned from the hearings yesterday - whenever my girlfriend accuses me of something, I’m going to suggest that she “dis-remembers it” and that should do the trick, right? Even if my best friend rats me out?
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this
Rhinestone Cowboy, that was funny.
I’m thinking McNamee might be Henry Hill though - not really an Italian but hanging with the Italians, not really a ballplayer but hanging with the ballplayers.
Clemens is probably the Deniro “Jimmy” character who Henry took down.
Remember the creepy scene where Deniro’s “Jimmy” is at the warehouse and keeps telling Henry’s wife to come over to him but she flees.
That even happened here with the Nanny.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this
My two cents on this PED, congressional hearings mess:
I would guess the statute of limitations has run out and there is really no way Clemens is punished for PED use. And I’m guessing he will not be charged with perjury because prosecutors don’t want to get tied up in this mess. This was all pomp and show. Yes, this was a waste but politicians are scared that if they don’t give the appearance of caring about the PED issue, they may become unpopular and/or get voted out of office.
I think the government is wasting our tax dollars because they think that we think that the government should be doing something about PEDs. They’re probably not sure what exactly to do, so they’ll just have hearings. That way the issue gets plenty of press and no one can say the politicians aren’t trying.
By DAP
February 14, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this
this guy could really have used lasik
By David-ATL14
February 14, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this
Coach, I’m not DOB but Clark was not resigned. Inviting Flowers to MLB camp doesn’t start the option clock ticking unless he’s added to the 40 man roster, and I’ll leave the Thorman missive alone as you have taken more than enough grief about that. Good to see you can laugh about it now.
By DAP
February 14, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this
and i just found this site. i got a really good laugh out of it!i think you guys will like it too, its pretty clever.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 10:12 AM | Link to this
JEB,
This from a NewsDay article published Tuesday:
The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, which will host Clemens and his accuser McNamee in Wednesday’s highly anticipated hearing, entertained the quartet of experts in what will likely prove to be a far more low-key environment than Wednesday’s heayweight bout. Only nine of the 40 committee members, including chairman Henry Waxman (D- Calif.) and ranking minority member Tom Davis (R- Va.) asked questions of the panelists.
…
Said Thomas Perls, an associate professor of medicine at the Boston University School of Medicine: “There is no credible scientific evidence that HGH substantively increases muscle strength or aerobic exercise capacity in normal individuals.”
Added Todd Schlifstein, an assistant professor at the NYU School of Medicine: “When studying the performance-enhancing effects of HGH by itself, it has failed to improve performance. It has been shown to increase muscle mass.”
Pettitte said that he used HGH to help rehabilitate an ailing left elbow, but Schlifstein said of HGH, “We really don’t have any proof that it is beneficial in that matter.” Schlifstein said that he had never heard of an athlete using only HGH, without mixing in steroids - except when an athlete was “cycling off” steroids and looking to maintain the effects of the steroids.
Nevertheless, Alan Rogol, a professor of clinical pediatrics at the University of Virginia and Indiana University School of Medicine, noted that much additional research needed to be done concerning the usage of HGH by professional athletes.
By McFann
February 14, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this
Niels, I’m sorry, but this is a bit ridiculous on your part. HGH is illegal. Lasik, like DOB said, is just like permanent glasses or contacts. Should Peter Moylen be kicked out because he wears glasses while he pitches? Should Matt Diaz be booted because he wears contacts? Should we take away McCann’s superb 2006 stats because he wore contacts while putting up those numbers? Like DOB said—and this is the way I feel about it, too—HGH produces unnatural amounts of those growth hormones that even a young healthy player’s body could not produce.
They’re two different things, dude. You sound like Niel Bortz.
By DAP
February 14, 2008 10:19 AM | Link to this
here’s another guy that could really use lasik!!!
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
February 14, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this
David -ATL14 , thanks for the info on Clark. I didn’t realize non-roster minor league players could be invited to spring training without using an option. Damn , I learned something new.
As for Thorman , the joke is on John Schuerholz , because he screwed up.
By Roman Gal
February 14, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this
DAP That guy could use more than lasik…
By richbrave
February 14, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this
In the next generation HGH is supposed to be indetectable in humans.
By McFann
February 14, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this
OK, I just thought up something else, and then I’ll drop the subject for now. If someone has corrective surgery, they are not guaranteed better performance, whereas someone who takes performance enhancing drugs, is going to enhance his performance.
Like another blogger said: Use your noggin.
By Renegator
February 14, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this
Shaun:
Were your thoughts on PEDs park adjusted?
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 10:49 AM | Link to this
Coach, is the joke really on Schuerholz with regard to Thorman? I mean coming out of the minors Thorman looked like he would at least be a decent major league firstbaseman. I’m not sure how you can say he screwed up except when you think you are smarter because you have the benefit of hindsight and he obviously did not.
By richbrave
February 14, 2008 10:51 AM | Link to this
RANDOM:
Yours of 9:17 last night(13th). Oops, sorry dude. My bad.
By DAP
February 14, 2008 10:57 AM | Link to this
i, for one, thought thorman was going to be just like adam dunn. he stll might be one of these days.
everytime he hits one out, it is amazing. you cant deny that.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this
Renegator, do you even know what park adjusted means? Do you even know what PED stands for?
By Renegator
February 14, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this
If Thorman is going to be our 1B next year after Tex leaves - we are screwed. He’s not going to develop anymore this year getting 2 ABs a week. He needs to be traded or cut.
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
Shaun, I think Coach is actually still a very BIG believer in Thorman ….
I think where Coach is saying JS screwed up was in calling up Thorman so early all those years ago and getting screwed with the options.
By Renegator
February 14, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
Sorry Shaun - I couldn’t resist.
By flange1
February 14, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this
I second the notion that Thorman should be traded. He is just not versatile enough to make a difference on the 2008 Braves and it seems a shame to waste a roster spot for him on the 2008 team so that he MIGHT be the starting 1B in 2009.
If we don’t sign Tex after this year, I think we can find a better player than Thorman to play 1B.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 11:36 AM | Link to this
Braveheart, from what I understand, if the Braves didn’t bring up Thorman in ‘06, he would have become a free agent. If they didn’t add him to the 40-man roster within four years of him being signed, he would have been subject to the Rule 5 draft.
I could be wrong, but best I can tell Schuerholz did what he had to do to avoid losing Thorman for nothing.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this
Braveheart and Coach, you see baseball set up rules like the Rule 5 draft and option rules and minor league free agency to keep teams from holding players in the minors for seven, eight, nine years when other teams may give him a shot. Thorman’s first pro season was 2000 so Schuerholz and the Braves it seems were backed in a corner with Thorman—bring him up or lose him. And Thorman showed enough promise that they didn’t want to lose him and get nothing back.
By flange1
February 14, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this
Guys, let’s start the Thorman options talk again. It was old last year!
Let’s worry more about if he is a fit for the team in 08.
By David O'Brien
February 14, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this
Sorry about the late blog start today, folks, but Cox was in a meeting with coaches all morning and we had to wait around to talk to him.
Just got back upstairs, so I’ll write a new blog now. Plenty of stuff to get in.
By the way, there has been some confusion about Bennett’s status this winter: He isn’t out of options. in fact, he has two minor league options remaining, so Braves could send him back and forth to minors for two more seasons if they wanted to.
But I should say, he’s still a likely candidate for that long man/spot starter job, and he wants to make his best push for the final job in the rotation. Braves like him a lot and are impressed by his conditioning.
By Renegator
February 14, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this
Why is everyone in the Braves organization so scared to lose Thorman? Let him eat up a roster spot on someone else’s roster. After Tex leaves - we can find a better option at 1B than Thorman.
By David O'Brien
February 14, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this
Coach: Clark is out of the organization, and Flowers isn’t on the 40-man roster, thus his option clock hasn’t been started.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this
flange1, I agree. I think Thorman does have a role and should definitely get a shot as Tex’s primary backup and possibly a backup corner outfielder. Give him a chance to possibly impress another team enough to get a full time job and give up something for him.
By McFann
February 14, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this
Hooray!! It’s officially Spring Training!!
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 12:07 PM | Link to this
Shaun, I thought Thorman was called up in 2003 or 2004 for a few days and never got to play and this started the options clock running. I could be wrong about that though. Maybe I was misremembering. Your rationale makes more sense. That options stuff is just too confusing except in the scenario you are talking about.
Flange1, you’re right. I really don’t want to get back into that Thorman options crap. I would just rather know he has none and deal with that going forward. Or in the now in the now famous words of McNamee, “it is what it is.”
By Braveheart
February 14, 2008 12:16 PM | Link to this
Renegator, I think the logic with the Braves is their understanding that Thorman has improved in his second year at every level of baseball. He spent two years each in A+, AA, and AAA and was much better the second go around.
In his second go around in A+, he hit .293, .349, 461
In his second go around in AA, he hit .305, .360, .506
In his second go around in AAA, he hit .298, .360, .508
I think the Braves are hoping he can repeat that …. or hoping that another team thinks he can. I understand he has been up for a year and a half now but ya gotta give him some learning curve perhaps due to the degree of difficulty in going to the majors and count this year as his second crack at the majors.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 12:17 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, I’m not sure when Thorman was put on the 40-man and his “option clock” started but I’m guessing it probably had to be 2003 or 2004 or he would have been subject to the Rule 5 draft, best I can tell.
At any rate, like Flange1 basically said, Thorman is on the team and can’t be sent down.
By Daybed Wagmoe
February 14, 2008 12:20 PM | Link to this
Renegator — I’m not a huge fan of Thorman, but the dude can rake. He’s spent time in two major-league seasons, and here are his stats:
415 ABS, 29 doubles, 16 HR, 50 RBI, 91 strikeouts, .222 BA, .260 OBP, .407 SLG.
While those stats don’t look too great, the thing to keep in mind is the doubles and HR totals. He hit 11 HR last season in 287 ABs. In the minors, he had 80 homers in 6 seasons and posted a .276 average.
And if Teixeira goes down (knock on wood) or on the DL, who are you going to put at 1st? DOB has said it many times - that if they tried to put Thor through waivers, he’d get snatched up in a second.
By StingerSplash
February 14, 2008 12:24 PM | Link to this
Wow. A Lasse Viren reference. In the words of Lord Vader, “Most impressive.” Yeah, Kip Keino didn’t need any PEDs, just Keds. Same goes for Shorter and Prefontaine.
By Lee in S. GA
February 14, 2008 12:26 PM | Link to this
After Tex arrived in Atlanta last season, every time a camera shot was taken of Thorman, he really seemed like a lost soul. I know he has to feel like he failed (which he did) last season by not seizing the opportunity of holding on to the 1st base job. You have to wonder if he feels his future with Atlanta is borrowed time. If the Braves can get anything for him they should… situation like Langerhans. By-the-way what did the Braves ever get from Oakland for Langerhans or did I miss out on something?
By Renegator
February 14, 2008 12:27 PM | Link to this
Braveheart:
That’s all well and good but how much can he possibly progress or learn when he gets 2 or 3 ABs a week?
By MGL
February 14, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this
I just hope Thorman did not spend the winter working out with Pete Orr again.
By Braves20
February 14, 2008 12:41 PM | Link to this
Interesting dialog on Thorman.
One only hopes that some of the forward thinking folks in the Braves front office are planning for the inevitable when Tex walks at the end of the year and the only slightly less inevitable that Thorman remains a bust.
Not much on the farm at this spot. Trade our excess at other spots to get a middle of the pack first baseman?
By The Mysterious Rhinestone Cowboy
February 14, 2008 12:43 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,
It’s all too mysteriously similar. Kinda like the whole “Wizard of Oz/Dark Side of the Moon” thing. I love it. Good Stuff.
By JEB
February 14, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this
Shaun your 10:03 post is right on! Your 10:12 post is good stuff! Which proves the point that HGH alone is NOT the issue. HGH is a good thing for the body. If anyone would take just a half a day and look into HGH (instead of the veil of daily reporting) I think there would be a surprise to the benefits of HGH. Studies are continually progressing about HGH.
By doug
February 14, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
Dave, If you see Lew down there, and he doesn’t get to read this blog before the new one gets up. Can you tell him that Braveheart needs a Whirlitzer for his Clemens Goodfellas comparison this morning.
Classic stuff Braveheart, you are in rare form today. I am from Al too, but the football team I pull for is on the other side of the state. We are all Braves fans though. Although, when I buy a Braves hat, I need to make sure it says Braves on it and not just the A, otherwise by son thinks it’s an Alabama hat.
By Shaun
February 14, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this
JEB, I’m no expert but it seems there may be some side affects to taking HGH, especially long-term use—problems with joints, carpel tunnel, high blood pressure, possibly cancer. From what I’ve heard and read, there are side affects and people probably shouldn’t mess around with HGH.
By nOLIE
February 14, 2008 2:10 PM | Link to this
415 ABS, 29 doubles, 16 HR, 50 RBI, 91 strikeouts, .222 BA, .260 OBP, .407 SLG.
While those stats don’t look too greatDaybed
you’re right they don’t look good, in fact to me they look rotten. I don’t care how much power he has or how many homers he hits, anybody who makes an out 74% of his ABs is a lead weight on any offense.
By David O'Brien
February 14, 2008 2:13 PM | Link to this
JEB, stop pimping/advocating HGH for all. I’d love to have a doctor refute your assertions that it’s some miracle drug we should all be taking. Preposterous.
StingerSplash, don’t forget Henry Rono. I had a Nike poster of Rono running for Washington State on my wall when I was a distance runner in high school. Had all his world records listed at the bottom.
Go Pre!
NEW BLOG IS UP.
By timmythebrave
February 14, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
To the people defending HGH: If no one thinks that HGH was wrong why is everyone hiding it. If you want to have an argument whether HGH is good or bad for a body I don’t mind having that argument. In the mean time Clemens, Bonds, Pettitte took illegal drugs to cheat to get greatness. End of story as far as I am concerned. Roger Clemens is so full of $hit the hearings needed to be held in the senate bathroom.