AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2007 > November > 19 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USGlavine’s back, and Cox is thrilled
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Just got off the phone with Bobby Cox, and as you might imagine, the old manager is quite pleased to be headed down to Turner Field this afternoon to welcome Tom Glavine back to the Braves.
“I’m very excited,” Bobby said as he hurried to finish errands and get to the ballpark for the 2:30 p.m. press conference with Glavine. “Tommy’s going to be a tremendous addition. He’s just one of those class pitchers who can win, who doesn’t miss turns, who’s ready to go all the time.
“He’s a guy you can rely on all the time. I think Tommy’s got a lot of pitching left in him, and now that he’s back in Atlanta he might consider going another year [after 2008].”
The word reliable keeps coming up when you ask anyone connected with the Braves about Glavine and why it was important that they bring back the soon-to-be 42-year-old lefty, who signed a one-year, $8 million contract after declining a $13 million option with the Mets.
The 303-game winner has pitched at least 198 innings in 12 of the past 13 seasons, including 200-1/3 innings last season when he went 13-8 with a 4.45 ERA in his fifth season with the Mets.
It’s not a stretch to say that if Glavine had produced those kinds of numbers for the Braves last season, they would have made it to the postseason instead of sitting at home for the second consecutive October.
Because while the Braves got 30 wins and 430 innings out of John Smoltz and Tim Hudson at the top of their rotation, Chuck James (11-10, 161-1/3 innings) was the only other starter to produce more than eight wins or as many as 105 innings. And after James, Buddy Carlyle (8-7, 104 innings in 20 starts) was the only other Braves starter to record as many as five wins or 90 innings.
“It’s extremely important that your starters give you innings,” Cox told me. “Tommy can do that. Now we have depth. Last spring we were down to the bare minimum of starters. Now we probably nine legit guys who can go into the rotation and do fine. Tommy allows us to do that.”
Many observers have pointed to Glavine’s final three starts for the Mets as a red flag, a sign that the aging lefty was/is out of bullets.
There’s no doubt he was bad — very bad — in those starts, going 0-2 with a 14.81 ERA while allowing 25 hits (four homers) and 17 runs in 10-1/3 innings, including seven runs with just one out on the final day of the season, a loss to the Marlins that completed the Mets’ epic 5-12 collapse and knocked them out of the postseason after they’d led the division almost from start to finish.
But it would be highly unusual for a pitcher’s career, his effectiveness, to end so suddenly without an injury as the cause, and Glavine has passed a physical and been adamant about having nothing wrong physically, no injury at the root of his struggles down the stretch. To his credit, he said he just stunk in those games.
Was he out of gas? I’m sure he was. And he might run out of gas at the 185-190 inning mark again in the 2008 season. But if Glavine gives the Braves 13-15 wins and 185 good innings, that would be a huge improvement over what they had in the No. 3, No. 4 or No. 5 rotation spots last season.
The effect on the bullpen and the team would be a major plus, because last season the weary bullpen had stretches when key relievers were simply too overworked and went through rough stretches because of it.
The only NL teams with fewer innings from starters than the Braves were the Cardinals, Nationals and Marlins, all teams whose injury-riddled rotations undermined their overall team performance.
To say Glavine is finished, to suggest he’s no longer effective based simply on his struggles in the last three starts, is to be blinded by his and the Mets’ woeful finish and avoid the body of work that Glavine produced over the course of the season. It’s not a very reasonable or astute to simply dismiss everything that came before those starts, to suggest that Glavine was a different pitcher then than he’ll be now.
Bottom line is this: Before those last three starts, Tom Glavine was 13-6 with a 3.88 ERA and 23 quality starts in 31 games, while averaging nearly 6-1/3 innings per start. In half of those six losses, the Mets scored zero runs while he was in the game.
Glavine was saddled with back-to-back losses in June when he allowed two runs in six innings against the Braves and Smoltz in Atlanta, and when he allowd three runs in seven innings against the Giants.
Was he bad in those last three starts? Yes, dreadful. But here’s what Glavine did in the 16 starts immediately before those three: Went 8-1 with a 3.20 ERA and 13 quality starts - again, that’s in the 16 games before those last three.
Is the same Glavine who won 242 games, two Cy Young Awards and a World Series MVP trophy as a Brave? No, and Glavine would be the first to tell you that.
But is he a quality pitcher, and could he be one of the best No. 3 starters in baseball? Absolutely.
Can he be a great influence on lefties Jo-Jo Reyes and Chuck James? Absolutely. Ask Damian Moss how much Glavine helped the Aussie lefty when he was a Brave, and how much Moss missed him after they were no longer teammates.
“Tremendous influence,” Cox said. “Tommy always has been that kind of guy.”
Glavine initially struggled after he left the Braves and joined the Mets in 2003, and no team beat him up like the Braves did. But he made adjustments midway through the 2005 season, finally relenting and acknowledging he could no longer get by with his changeups and pitching away, away, away.
After going 24-35 with a 4.21 ERA in his first 80 starts for the Mets through June 19, 2005, Glavine reinvented himself to a significant degree and went 37-21 with a 3.74 ERA in his last 84 starts. The Mets were 52-32 in those games. Yes, that includes those last three Glavine starts.
Glavine’s back, and the Braves and their manager are thrilled. If he’s got as much left in the tank as Cox believes, it could be a fun summer for Glavine, for his good friend and golf partner Smoltz, and for the Braves and their fans.
And if he doesn’t? Well, we can always throw on some classic Elvis Costello:
“PEACE, LOVE AND UNDERSTANDING” by Nick Lowe
As I walk through
This wicked world
Searchin’ for light in the darkness of insanity.
I ask myself
Is all hope lost?
Is there only pain and hatred, and misery?
And each time I feel like this inside,
There’s one thing I wanna know:
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding? Ohhhh…
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding?
And as I walked on
Through troubled times
My spirit gets so downhearted sometimes
So where are the strong
And who are the trusted?
And where is the harmony?
Sweet harmony.
‘Cause each time I feel it slippin’ away, just makes me wanna cry.
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding? Ohhhh…
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding?
So where are the strong?
And who are the trusted?
And where is the harmony?
Sweet harmony.
‘Cause each time I feel it slippin’ away, just makes me wanna cry.
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding? Ohhhh…
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding? Ohhhh…
What’s so funny ‘bout peace love & understanding?
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Comments
By mike
November 19, 2007 1:27 PM | Link to this
great article DOB, I couldnt sleep last night because I was so excited Tommy was coming back
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 19, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
Beautiful , absolutely beautiful !
By Don
November 19, 2007 1:31 PM | Link to this
I’m glad TG is back, now I can start liking him again.
By BravesFanInRockies
November 19, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
Great news, DOB. Glad to welcome TG back to the fold.
But I’m sure you were so overcome by enthusiasm that you neglected to note that Nick Lowe, not Elvis, wrote “What’s so funny …”
Happy Thanksgiving …
By gobraves
November 19, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
Good blog as always DOB and I am thrilled to have him back too.
By azbrave
November 19, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
first
By chrisklob
November 19, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this
*….from the last blog….
brian kelley, I visited a Mets blog a week or so ago just to see what those folks had to say about their team. Most of the posts had an angry overtone to them. Not sure if they were mad about the price of gas, the writers’ strike or the fact that the Mets roster looks like Swiss cheese because of all the holes in it or what. But they were upset. One of the recurring themes was the fact that Minaya has so many Hispanic players and only seems to want to bring in more. But it didn’t seem they were mad from a racial standpoint, rather they feel that limiting himself to Hispanic ballplayers eliminated a lot of other guys from contention.
By BossLady
November 19, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this
WELCOME HOME TOMMY!!!!!!!
By Jim H.
November 19, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this
It’s great to have Glav back. I look for him to improve from last year. It will be great to have a stable innings eater back in the middle of the rotation. The people that are criticle of this signing, just really don’t understand the situation
By brian kelley
November 19, 2007 1:34 PM | Link to this
Does Minaya ever go after a non-hispanic player? Delgado,Alou,Castillo,Torrealba,Beltran,ElDuque,Mota,Castro,Sosa…and on and on….SJA you might want to play the race card over on the Mets site because they aren’t hiring whites or American blacks
By ppaddy123
November 19, 2007 1:35 PM | Link to this
AHHHH! Virgin blog space, or at least almost virgin blog space:D
By jrjags
November 19, 2007 1:40 PM | Link to this
Getting Glavine back leaves the Braves with no major holes to fill. What other team can say that at this point? Yes, center field doesn’t have an all star, but at least we have speed right now, something we lacked since Furcal left. What’s not to like? Any moves we make from here on will just be for improvement, not desperation. Good job Frank Wren for identifying the problems and fixing them early before the free agent bidding wars started.
By Reid in EAV
November 19, 2007 1:40 PM | Link to this
Hooray! Welcome back Glav!
And forgive me for nitpicking — while Costello owns the definitive reading of that song, we have Nick Lowe to thank for writing it in the first place.
By ppaddy123
November 19, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this
Coach your 1:30 post reminds me of a “Little Johnny” joke: The Teacher asked Little Johnny to use a sentence with the word beautiful in it twice. To this, Little Johnny replied, “last night at supper my sister told mom and dad she was pregnant. And my dad yelled out BEAUTIFUL! F*** ABSOLUTELY BEAUTIFUL!
By jlpoll1984
November 19, 2007 1:43 PM | Link to this
The Braves just gave me an early Christmas present!!! Thanks for bringing Tommy back…I sure have missed him!!!
By BB FAN
November 19, 2007 1:43 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Would the Braves consider limiting the starts of Smoltz and Glavine in 2008? I say this only because it’s obvious that guys in their late 30’s, early 40’s run out of gas faster. I would think that if they each got 30 starts, both would be much more productive down the stretch and into the post season. They could each spend a little time on the DL due to the famous “tired arm”(at separate times of course).
I remember thinking that when Glavine pitched well for the Mets in the 2006 post season. I wondered what the hell got into him because he picthed well for the Braves in 2002, but stunk in the post season. Then I remembered he only made 32 starts in 2006 because he spent a little time on the DL.
Even the releivers should spend a little time on the DL, so none of them get burned out. We all know that Cox likes to use certain relievers over and over again no matter how tired they look. I can’t blame Cox for that considering that up until last year, the Braves never had a deep, solid bullpen.
Although, I think in 2002, they had a good bullpen with Smoltz, Hammond, Holmes, Spoonybarger, Ligtenberg and Remlinger among the best. If I remember right, Gryboski was pretty solid that year too.
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 1:43 PM | Link to this
Not good news about Mahay. Surely he doesn’t want to be a Yankee. Sure the money would be great, but very few relievers have done well in that atmosphere.
Even if he doesn’t join the Yanks, his price just went a little higher making it even tougher for the Braves to sign him.
If Mahay can’t be signed, do they then go after Dotel? I know he is not a lefty, but he was pretty effective vs. lefties. Are there any quality lefty relievers out there to be had? The price for their services probably also went up.
By Topher_24
November 19, 2007 1:45 PM | Link to this
Awesome! Tommy will bring the depth the Braves missed so greatly last season. As of this moment, the Braves have the best rotation in the NL East, arguably the best ‘pen, and a formidable lineup. Hope they’re not finished, though.
How strange would it be for the Braves to increase payroll and be finished with their “big” moves before the Winter Meetings, only adding a backup SS?
Maybe they can add a high risk, high reward guy (Rich Harden/Mark Prior type) that comes in a package with a CF (Kotsay, Pie) for the possibility of having a super rotation???
By boone7
November 19, 2007 1:48 PM | Link to this
David, like the blog and Peace, Love and Understanding is a great song. FYI, it was written by Nick Lowe and not Elvis. Elvis C. in my book is the “real” Elvis!!
By Mike Honcho
November 19, 2007 1:49 PM | Link to this
**DOB, In the spirit of T-giving wanted to drop a line and say thanks for the prolific blogs and continuous updates on our beloved Bravos. I’m a law student and in need of a great deal of procrastination (and now that Bill Simmons has crossed over into intolerable for me) you have continuously stepped up to the plate to keep me sane. Keep up the good work (the scribe truly abides!)
And do me one favor since the Braves are going back to the future: will you tell Smoltzie to bring back the late 80s porn stache and Glavine to re-grow the sweet hockey mullet. ’91 returns! Somebody find Otis Nixon for center. I’m pumped, Mike Honcho**
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 1:50 PM | Link to this
It’s not secrete my view on this deal. I’m not bummed it’s Glavine, I just would have perferred Glavine and Haren or something of that nature.
However, I think Glavine will pitch well in Atlanta. I think he’ll do well being back in the dugout with Cox, Chipper and Smoltz. I think he and Smoltz will have a blast competing which will help both in proving to be good pitchers in 2008. Plus, the lack of Questeq (sp?) should help some.
Posted this on the last blog, so here is the repost:
Can anyone with good baseball sense do a comparison of the Garland-Cabrera trade, and the Renteria trade? How did the Braves make out by comparison to what the Angels got for Cabrera?
Braves saved money.
This type of comparison depends mainly on needs. The White Sox received a gold glove short stop (surprising since the only team that needed a short stop was the Tigers). The Angels got a pitcher who’s thrown over 200 innings every year for the past 5 years. Garland put up back to back 18 win season the two years prior to 2007. In 2007 he had a miserable record due to his team, but was still a valuable pitcher, 12% better than league average. He’ll be 29 next season. He has one more season left on a 3/29 deal. He’ll make 12 million this season.
Orlando Cabrera has 1 season left on a 4/32 deal. He’ll make 9 million this season. They don’t appear to have an “Escobar” in the waiting. Eric Aybar was the back up short stop and he isn’t the good Aybar.
If the Angels pull off a move for a new 3B, Figgins could move to short and they’d have a solid club. Right now they have an even weaker offensive club than they had last season. They need to make more moves. Garland though is a solid pitcher and should do well in Anah— I mean Los Angeles.
By Howie from Poughkeepsie
November 19, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this
The risks in bringing back Glavine are very very small.
The only ‘old’ part of the Braves is the starting rotation. Tommy is not expected to be the ace of the staff as he was with NY last year - he can be our number 4 starter and not be counted on for 200 innings in 2008. What if he fails? The Braves will move up a Jurrjins or a Reyes into the rotation. What if he succeeds as a number 4 starter? Then Jurrjins and Reyes spend 2008 at Richmond - mature there - and become ready in 2009 when Glavine and Hampton have left. Well worth the risks.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 1:53 PM | Link to this
chrisklob: From the previous blog. I wondered if any Mets fans noticed Omar’s trend. I never visit their blogs. Figure the golden rule applies in the the cyber world as well. But it’s hard not to notice the way Omar builds his team
By brian kelley
November 19, 2007 2:00 PM | Link to this
chriskolb Do you think they will make a run at Pena or Guillen (if he gets fired) to take Randolph’d place assuming he gets canned as well?
By Bob, Journalist
November 19, 2007 2:03 PM | Link to this
David O’B, it’s interesting that you would immediately connect my looking for the 3 September post with your 15 November post to Utah’s Wayne for it was that post that prompted the renewal of my search for the earlier ones … but not for the reasons you imagine. I think your exact words were … I will assure you once again went down exactly as I said (in other words, I didn’t know about the man’s personal life; and what I said to him given that information was not at all out of line)
I appreciate your current post too for it provides additional insight into your 28 October posted comment to me “I can honestly say I just read your most recent post, and I have no idea what you’re talking about. Honestly” … showing that although you claimed not to understand my post, you actually thought that you did … “I had simply forgotten in the moment that I was responding to his offensive post” … for had you not so thought, you could not have found it offensive. But, indeed the statement was actually true … for had you actually understood it, you would not have found it offensive.
That changes everything … for while I consider your attempt at mockery to be as inept as it is derisive, it shows that the post did indeed trigger the mockery and that you did feel justified in so doing … something with which I had been struggling to understand … and allowing me to put it into better perspective.
As an aside, the end of that paragraph in your 15 November post to Wayne “that did offend me, because you’re suggesting I lied, and that p’s me off something fierce because I absolutely did not and will not again defend myself on that one” brought tears to my eyes from having laughed so hard … not because of the expression of strong feelings but the notion suggested by the construct that the reason it “p’s you off” is because you absolutely “did not and will not again’ defend yourself.
The actual motivation behind the search was an effort to update Carol’s electronic scrapbook that, among other things, will include emails and posts from those offering moral support, prayers and expressing their good wishes … we have all of those following My Lady’s “NEWS OF BOB JOURNALIST” 30 August post up until the Blog change on 31 August … and some of those forward from shortly after her surgery and release from the hospital. As time permits, I am reading the archives and completing the task.
My notes referenced your kind thoughts and the 3 September post … which I noted before they were archived … but, had not been able to find it and your 15 November post did serve to bring that to mind … and my efforts were then renewed, perhaps with the additional purpose you suggest … for, I found the posture expressed by your later 11:34 Post of 15 November offensive … and the notion that “Bob (J), sincere well wishes to you and yours. We’ll be here when you have the time. God bless” meant so little that you didn’t even recall having expressed those feelings truly hurt!.
Apologies to Gil for having so used my response to his unconnected post of last evening but his post served as a mind trigger prompting my request for help in finding the missing post.
I’m sincerely appreciative for the greetings received and for all the help received … for we would like any and all posts in the 31 August Blog, appropriate for inclusion in the scrapbook, and it sounds as if some of you have been able to access them … thus encouraging me to continue to so try … and, especially for Grinch’s and Sir Guy, Earl of the Savannah having provided copies of your post … for the scrapbook, and all to better evaluate.
By 22oz
November 19, 2007 2:04 PM | Link to this
Its great to have Glavine back. Stability in the rotation is a great thing. IF Hampton is healthy, there is gonna be one helluva good competition in spring training for the #5 spot. Between Jurrjens, Chuck, Bennet and Jojo, we should finally be solid on the back end. My money is on Jurrjens, i like another hard throwing righty in the five hole.
By 1eyedJack
November 19, 2007 2:07 PM | Link to this
Everything else is just gravy.
By kevin
November 19, 2007 2:10 PM | Link to this
royce ring looked good and would more than fill in as the 2nd lefty in the pen. Gonzalez will be back and you have the aussie gyro ball that makes lefties looks silly as well. all should be fine. With Glavine back and cross the fingers hampton, having two guys fight it out for 5th start/long relief and two young guys as backup in triple a is a luxury really no team has anymore. An 8th hitter with good defensive skills in center pretty well seals it.
By 22oz
November 19, 2007 2:11 PM | Link to this
Its also great to see Frank Wren wasting absolutely NO TIME making our team better for 2008. Forget these preset notions that all good moves need to wait for the Winter Meetings to be done. Hurry up Spring training!
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 19, 2007 2:12 PM | Link to this
If little Johnny was half as happy as me , you can call me a child because I feel like a kid in a candy store. After watching , knowing and predicting the outcome of the 06-07 seasons , this 2008 season has a rosy playoff smell to it already. I know the team is still a work in progress , but considering that we are only seven weeks removed from the end of the season , this is fast work on the part of Frank Wren and the rest of all the hard working Braves folks.
By Koz
November 19, 2007 2:12 PM | Link to this
I bet we could sign Steve Avery real cheap
By USMCDAWG
November 19, 2007 2:14 PM | Link to this
I’d rather see GLavine back at 60-75%, than Mike “I’ll just sit here and cash my check” Hampton.
By ncscoots
November 19, 2007 2:15 PM | Link to this
Plus, the lack of Questeq (sp?) should help some.
Yes…will Chipper now reverse his shrill call for umpiring accountability, LOL? The boy ain’t be wantin’ none a that, not with Glavine slab-toeing. Ya think?
But I’m not going to bash the signing, at least not anymore. Too many people here are happy about it for me to rain on the parade. Here’s to hoping TG is the savior so many think him to be.
By Britt
November 19, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this
It’s great to have Tommy Back. He give’s us a reliable lefty and experience. While some people point to his age as something to worry about, I think it can actually be a good thing. He is older and wiser now, and he improved greatly in his last few years with the Mets. He never belonged there and thats obvious by mets fans comments. Home is where the heart is, and his never left Atlanta. Besides, he could be of great importance to the young lefties like Chuck, Jojo, and Jurrjens. I would personally like to say Welcome home to the only man who ever won a championship for Atlanta.
By Steve C.
November 19, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist
Geez…dude, let it go, my god…this is like some sort of soap opera that keeps coming back. what in the world does this have to do with baseball?
By Leroy
November 19, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this
WHAT ARE YOUR PEOPLE SMOKING? THIS IS A HORRIBLE DECISION. THE GUY WILL NOT WIN 10 GAMES THIS YEAR. DID EVERONE FORGET HOW HE SCREWED US 5 YEARS AGO FOR 3 MILLION BUCKS MORE. NOW THE UNION STEWARD WILL BE RUNNING THE CLUBHOUSE AGAIN. NICE. HAMPTON ARE YOU KIDDING ME THE GUY IS DONE. SORRY THIS WAS A HORRIBLE MOVE. 8 MILLION BUCKS WHAT A WASTE WE CAN DO MUCH BETTER
By Dave
November 19, 2007 2:25 PM | Link to this
Being a Brave fan who lives in Colorado, but was raised in Georgia I love tracking the blog for insight and information. I only rarely chime in. DOB has provided me a way of staying connected with my team while living in the land of the Rockies. Having said all of that can guys like Bob,Journalist, SJA, and all the others who seems to put the blog way to far up their priority scale in life get over whatever it is that so offended you. This is a blog! Not a daily soap opera. If I wanted to follow drama I’d get into Days of our lives or something. I get it…you were all offended. Quite frankly I don’t think most of the people here really care because their interest is in Braves, Music, BBQ, CFB, and a few other basic subjects that are not critical to their daily lives, because they have the ability to separate the two. Jesus…GET OVER IT AND MOVE ON!
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 19, 2007 2:31 PM | Link to this
GE, the Braves orginization might very well be prejudice in their player acquistion practices. I have never seen it but that’s not say it isn’t there. However, citing the fact that Braves didn’t go after area players like Corey Patterson does nothing for your argument. I think that has proven to be a wise move. I also don’t think not keeping Andruw Jones proves anything. The Braves would be crazy to even entertain those contract demands of him and Boras. C’mon!
Its not as if the Braves don’t go after blacks or minorities. Ever heard of Dennis Dixon? Brandon Jones? Yunel Escobar? Jo Jo Reyes? For God’s sake the likely next manager of this team is Terry Pendleton. Last time I checked that man is black. No doubt about that! So, where is there tangible evidence for your claims.
Also, I didn’t mean to call you an idiot but your assertions that the Braves intentionally don’t go after black players is. I am not speaking to any kind of audience. Just speaking my mind and what I think. I have been a Braves fan since I was four years old. I’m 33 now. I don’t see the racism that you and a few others on here are always saying exists with this orginization.
Fact is blacks just don’t play baseball. Like you I would love to see more blacks in baseball but I don’t know if its going to happen and it has nothing to do with racism. Young blacks prefer basketball and football. Besides, am I not mistaken that the two biggest targets the Braves are after for CF are Coco Crisp and David DeJesus. Neither one of those guys are white.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 19, 2007 2:33 PM | Link to this
The press conference is live on MLB.com. right now !
By Mark
November 19, 2007 2:34 PM | Link to this
Bring back Leibrandt, Avery and Pete Smith and our rotation will be set.
By Mike
November 19, 2007 2:35 PM | Link to this
Glad Tom’s back, solid move for the staff. Great blog…one minor item, isn’t “Peace Love and Understanding” written by Nick Lowe? I know Elvis Costello did an awesome version of the song.
By doc
November 19, 2007 2:36 PM | Link to this
no steve c, instead of it being a parallel universe we have a parallel blog. one gets to choose how he participates and in what dimension. it had been just as interesting for a while there and the info flow continued maybe to some’s dismay when it was one but whatever turns folks on is acceptable for me.
not a big glavine fan but if he brings what he had for the last two years then fine. i just hope we dont get the dr jekyl and mr hyde show. he tended to be very streaky in atlanta with good halves for the last few years here, just couldnt predict which half it would be. maybe he can help james turn into an inning killer himself. he really isnt that far away.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 2:37 PM | Link to this
Scoots: You have a fine point. Never fear though, Wren said he wasn’t done dealing and it looks like Crisp is still on the radar. What a wonderful thing to hear!
1. Escobar (.326/.385/.451)
2. Johnson (.276/.375/.457)
3. Chipper (.337/.425/.604)
4. Teixeira (.306/.400/.563)
5. McCann (.270/.320/.452)
6. Francoeur (.293/.338/.444)
7. Diaz/Jones (.338/.368/.497)
8. Coco Crisp (.268/.330/.382)
Of course, it could take Kelly (17% above average) to get Crisp (17% below average) and then Prado (27% below average) can replace KJ.
By GT81
November 19, 2007 2:41 PM | Link to this
I think they ought to pull a Clemens and give Smoltz and Glavine some time off in April and May. Already before 2002, Glavine would be gassed by the post-season. Whatever…it’ll never happen, but it’s frustrating when those guys can’t get it done in Sept. Braves need another young power arm I guess.
By DAP
November 19, 2007 2:41 PM | Link to this
22.oz welcome back, your post this morning cracked me up.
the braves bring back their prodigal son…and there was much rejoicing.
meanwhile, the mets fill 1 and a half of their holes, by bringing back alou (half a hole filled, since he will likely miss at least half the season) and signing castillo for 4 years. they could definetly have done worse for 2nd base than castillo. i think he is a great player, though i think 4 years might be a long commitment for him. hes not that old, but he might be using a walker by the end of that contract.
the casillo signing was a pretty good one, but the mets have yet to make any improvments on thier team. they still need a couple of pitchers, a right fielder, and a catcher at LEAST! i wonder what they will do?
DOB thanx alot for the new blog!
By Big Donnie
November 19, 2007 2:48 PM | Link to this
great job DOB — best #3 in the game? You’re DAM RIGHT!
By Chris
November 19, 2007 2:50 PM | Link to this
DOB Could you please check the IP addresses of all our “regulars” who just happened to be back at the same time. I’d be willing to bet that they are all one and the same. I know you’ve said in the past one of the easiest ways to get banned was to assume the identity of another blogger. Just a suggestion…
By Bob, Journalist
November 19, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
Steve C, where were you when I needed a straight man?
Surely you jest … but simply put, between and me and leaving your god out of it, that’s for others to say … methinks it means absolutely nothing and absolutely everything … depending upon perspective … my last post was but a response to David O’B’s post on the previous Blog.
I truly appreciate both the opportunity to have so done … and the Blog’s indulgence, regardless of how it might be perceived.
Happy Thanksgiving all!
By TN-MAN
November 19, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this
What all did Glavine have to say at the press conference?
By Jared
November 19, 2007 3:00 PM | Link to this
O’Brien, do you think Chipper Jones will ever consider just batting left-handed?
Chipper, 2007, left-handed: .378/.472/.699 in 312 at-bats.
Chipper, 2007, right-handed: .274/.345/.458 in 201 at-bats.
There is an advantage batting right-handed and a lefty pitcher, no-doubt. But it’s pretty small, and Chipper Jones’ left-right batting splits are huge. The difference in stats suggest Chipper Jones might want to at least consider it anyways.
By Young
November 19, 2007 3:01 PM | Link to this
While they are at it, bring back Phil Neikro and Rick Camp as well, we want to get the #1 pick for 2009-2020.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this
Ah, I almost forgot. Crisp would be a 5% reduction in offense from Andruw Jones last season. Hard to imagine it possible to get even worse than AJ’s 2007. AJ in 2007 had an 88 OPS+. Crisp had a 83 OPS+.
By Steve C.
November 19, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this
Bob,
Methinks the way you speak makes you sound like a douchebag…whilst I jest you so more?
By geauxbraves2000
November 19, 2007 3:03 PM | Link to this
KJ for Crisp? No stinking way. I’d rather go with Anderson or one of the other youngsters. KJ I think would excel in the #2 hole.
KJ should getter better defensively as time passes. Going to his right seems to be an issue, but maybe Hubbard can work with him more on that problem.
Geaux Braves!!
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 3:03 PM | Link to this
TN-Man: Still going on.
By Big Ed
November 19, 2007 3:05 PM | Link to this
I worry about Smoltz and Glavine being injured during the season. Age can do that to you. Hey if I show my AARP card can I get a contract. I think I can still pitch.
By Another Arkansas Braves Fan
November 19, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this
This is great news. Welcome back Tom!
By DAP
November 19, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this
Dave Jesus…GET OVER IT AND MOVE ON!
no religion on the blog, dave!
that goes for you, to, Robert(JIB)
the Braves are after for CF are Coco Crisp and David DeJesus. Neither one of those guys are white.
jesus aint white? did muhamed ali know that?
and Bob im very glad youre back as long as you give that a rest. A song for you
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
Hey Dave, I got an idea; why don’t you mind your own f-ing business and don’t attempt to speak for other people? You’re not qualified. And Chris, if DOB were to check the ip adress of all the “regulars” yours wouldn’t be included, so the same advice applies.
Like I said before, I won’t boo Glavine anymore because I don’t boo the uniform, but I’m not as happy as some of you obviously are. I do hope he’ll eat some innings, but I also hope there’s a contingency plan in case Hampton doesn’t work and the last three Glavine starts ARE an indication of the future (not to mention this might be the year Smoltz’ arm falls off). I think we should trade some of the four or five number 5’s we’ve got (with others, if necc.) to aquire someone under 35 who can fill the # 3 or better spot, maybe for a good while.
By KC
November 19, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
GT81: “I think they ought to pull a Clemens and give Smoltz and Glavine some time off in April and May.”
GT, you are wise my friend!! I agree 100%. If you can’t afford to give both Smoltz and Glavine a month off to start, then at least wait until May to crank Smoltz up! He’s our #1 starter and the proven post-season horse.
Personally, however they do it… I would REALLY like to see BC limit both Smoltz and Glavine to no more than 170-180 innings over the regular season. If the Braves could clinch a post-season berth with at least a couple weeks to spare in September… shut them down!!!
We need those guys to have something left in the tank late in the season/October!!!
By jacko
November 19, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
SO I GUESS HIS “FAMILY” DID NOT MATTER WHEN HE LEFT FOR THE METS? PLEASE—- IT IS ALL ABOUT $$$$$. I HOPE YOU BOMB!!!
By Dave
November 19, 2007 3:10 PM | Link to this
Your statement regarding Bob’s speaking ability is spot on!
By ncscoots
November 19, 2007 3:11 PM | Link to this
Of course, it could take Kelly (17% above average) to get Crisp (17% below average) and then Prado (27% below average) can replace KJ.
Good grief, sir, that’s a thought best not even formed, much less articulated! 348 bloggers will take such a thing and run with it, to our everlasting dismay, LOL.
That WOULD get us further down the road to having our own “Scrub Of The Month” club, though, so I guess the idea’s a keeper. At least, in abeyance. :-)
By TN-MAN
November 19, 2007 3:11 PM | Link to this
Is it on tv or on the internet anywhere? I cant find it?
By MakeMan
November 19, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this
DOB Is there any chance that KJ can man center and the Braves stick Prado at 2B?? And what is with the sudden need to trade for a bunch of the same type of players?… Speedy OF with little power. I’m in love with the Glavine deal, not too many #3’s can hang with us now, especially with out Andruw-less lineup.
P.S. - I go to IU and recently saw Elvis Costello and Bob Dylan at Assembly Hall. Old as helllll, but still tight.
By JEB
November 19, 2007 3:14 PM | Link to this
DOB, what is the status on Lance Cormier & Buddy Carlyle? I see mention of Reyes, James, Juirgen, Bennett… but, no Lance or Buddy. Are they still with the team? A free agent? Released? What?? When you get time, if you don’t mind update. You may have in the past, I just missed it.
By Random
November 19, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
Hey, DOB—
ahem, I’m sorry, I meant “Pardon me, Mr O’Brien—”
Anyway — hey, whatever happened to Jeff Denberg? Did your tenure overlap with his at the AJC? I miss him on the Hawks, and especially his gig before that.
Also, is Rick Davis still around? That was one sharp dude — sharp-looking too.
No, not Rick Davis — I meant to say Rick Allen.
Sorry.
By 22oz
November 19, 2007 3:16 PM | Link to this
Just got through watching the press conference: It was great to see Glavine don the ol’ Braves hat and uni. He said “time to put on my work clothes”, and that he was glad #47 was still available.
Another interesting note from the conference: Bobby mentioned Morton and Schafer,and “push comes to shove”, they could play a big part next year.
By Lew
November 19, 2007 3:16 PM | Link to this
Now Now-If we sign Crisp it will just negate GE’s contention that all we do is jettison players of color.
DOB-What is the possibility of using a “5 1/2 ” man rotation? Not a true 6 man, but using a sixth pitcher to start games when the schedule tightens upo and there are fewer off days? I remember Joe Simpson giving stats on Hudson when he pitches with 5 days rest and I believe I saw the same stats for Chuck James and Glavine, as well. They all performed substantially better than when on four days rest. With Hudson, in particular, the difference was over a run per game average.
Given the age of Smoltz and Glavine and the inevitable stress JS’s shoulder will experience, isn’t this a good idea? Especially since we have those 9 starters?
By daveGT
November 19, 2007 3:21 PM | Link to this
Welcome home #47!
By Tonight on Lifetime
November 19, 2007 3:21 PM | Link to this
The Obsession
An Internet baseball and music blog is the setting for the relentless pursuit of vindication by one man crushed under the weight of self importance.
“Creepy” - One Reviewer “Stunning” - Another One “What I’ll Do When I’m Bored and Retired” - Passerby
By KC
November 19, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this
JEB: Lance Cormier still has options left I do believe, so he’ll likely start at Richmond. Buddy will have to choose between Richmond or leaving the organization.
Either way… the reason there’s no mention of either is that neither of them have any real chance of making the rotation this spring. Lance has a small shot at it, but only if there is significant injury or underachievement with those in line ahead of him.
Lance has shown some potential, but the upside seems to be greater with the other guys (James, Jurjen, Reyes, and Bennett) in line for that 5-starter job.
Carlyle is a AAAA pitcher. He’s started his last game as a Brave.
By Rodger
November 19, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this
Grinch,
Gotta agree on the aging rotation, but you’ve got to agree Smoltz is a freak. He could pitch off & on ‘til he’s 50!
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 19, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this
Glavine had a few things to say , you should have tuned in. I don’t know if he was kidding or not , but Brian McCann might have to find a new locker , Tommy wants his old one back. Bobby Cox and Frank Wren were clear on one thing , they are done with the rotation. They have eight guys projected to compete for five spots. Glavine repeatedly said the number one issue for him was family and the importance of being able to be closer to them during the season. He was so honest and frank , saying that he didn’t feel like he was worth 13 million anymore. He is basically very happy with eight million and didn’t want an option year included in his new contract. Glavine , his Wife , Frank Wren and Bobby Cox were there for the press conference. I’m sure you will read about this tragic news , John Schuerholz would have been there but his mother passed away today. Everybody send up a prayer.
By CAR3BOOGIE
November 19, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this
Where any other Braves at the news conference?
By ncscoots
November 19, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this
would REALLY like to see BC limit both Smoltz and Glavine to no more than 170-180 innings over the regular season.
In other words, just a few more innings than Chuck James, LOL?
And just who would you have make the 10-12 starts you’ve just taken away from your top starter and mid-rotation savior? Your 7th and 8th starters? Or would you rather just add on another 60+ innings to the bullpen?
Wasn’t the oft-trumpeted reasoning for the Glavine signing centered on his ability to pile up innings?
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 19, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this
The top eight starters in 2007 : Smoltz , Hudson , James , Davies , Carlyle , Redman , Reyes and Cormier.
The projected top eight in 2008 : Smoltz , Hudson , Glavine , Hampton , James , Jurrjens , Reyes and Bennett.
Can you see the difference ?
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 3:34 PM | Link to this
Oh, no! Mr. Whipple died yesterday at age 91. Now EVERYONE’S gonna be squeezing the Charmin with no-one to stop them! Armageddon will surely ensue.
By Chris
November 19, 2007 3:34 PM | Link to this
Ya know what Grinch? I really didn’t think you were such a douchebag as to pull a lame stunt like that. My bad, I guess I was wrong. Anyway, I’ve been reading the blog since it started, and just because I don’t post every fifteen minutes like some of you “regulars”, doesn’t mean I’m not here. To be honest, you were the only “regular” that I missed during your self-imposed exile from the blog. Whatever dude. This crap y’all keep bringing up is old news. Give it a rest.
By ncscoots
November 19, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this
Methinks the way you speak makes you sound like a douchebag…whilst I jest you so more?
You mean, as opposed to your posts, in which the content reveals you as a douchebag?
Bubba, you’re messing with the wrong guy, and just don’t know it. I’d move away from that position, were I you, in the interests of blog harmony.
By TheSouthernJackAss
November 19, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this
SteveC and Dave…it takes big men of true grit and character to stick your noses where they don’t belong, and to say ignorant trash like you just did about a man like Bob,J…a man who has never had anything good or bad to say about either of you insignificant punks…you two are now most likely O’Brien’s favorite little, A$s kissers…pucker up boys!…you both will go far on this blog…
By BravesFanInRockies
November 19, 2007 3:37 PM | Link to this
Lew,
I can’t recall any team using a 5-man, 6-day rotation before — in other words, guaranteeing each guy in your rotation 5 days’ rest between starts. But it’s so crazy, it just might work!
The sabermetrician in me doesn’t like the idea (why give any starts to your 6th-best pitcher— in principle I’d prefer a 4-man rotation but that ain’t happening again in our lifetimes), still, given the age of Smoltz and Glavine, the delicate state of Hampton’s health and the depth the Braves seem to have entering the season, it may be worth a try.
By Kieran from Long Island
November 19, 2007 3:38 PM | Link to this
David O’Brien…
You emphasized Glavine’s durability and reliability as far as eating up innings throughout the entire season. Anyone who has followed Tom Glavine’s career knows that he has never gone on the disabled list, outside of the one incident he faced in a New York Taxi cab accident. Often teams will give pitchers a few weeks off toward the end of the summer, Pedro Martinez, Curt Schilling and Orlando Hernandez are examples off the top of my head. My question for you is do you think that the Braves, despite Glavine’s track record of eluding the Disable List, will give him a few weeks off in order to preserve his arm and avoid the situation he saw at the end of this year?
Though I understand this is probably a “wait and see” situation, it would be nice for Cox (Who has the tendancy to overuse and abuse pitchers arms) and braves upper management to consider this practice.
Also, great Elvis Costello song, I know your take on Tool but I have not heard your opinion of A Perfect Circle, Maynard James Keenan’s other band. They do a fantastic version of “Peace, Love, and Understanding” on their album “Emotive”. I highly recomend you check it out.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 3:42 PM | Link to this
Now Now-If we sign Crisp it will just negate GE’s contention that all we do is jettison players of color
I don’t think we can sign Crisp. But, to negate the point, just look at the top draft pick last year. I believe Jason Heyward fits the bill.
By Joe
November 19, 2007 3:45 PM | Link to this
Hey I hear Dave Justice is available too. What a dumb move!!!
By Oregon_Braves
November 19, 2007 3:46 PM | Link to this
Grinch - No disrespect, dude, because you have always been one of my favorite bloggers, but the minute you guys put (and keep putting and keep putting…) this crap on a public blog it becomes everyone’s business. If you don’t want people to comment on it, take it offline and e-mail Dave directly. I’m getting a sense of deja vu here, y’know?
And truthfully, I also found it very odd that almost all of you disgruntled bloggers showed up at once. Please, pretty please with sugar on top, can we, for the love of all that is holy, just move on?
By Lew
November 19, 2007 3:49 PM | Link to this
Scoots-I don’t know, Dude-Allowing Smoltz, Glavine, James and Hampton (if he does come back) to take one start a month off, might not be a bad idea. It might enable them to go longer into their starts and would save them for the stretch run and the playoffs, where likely only three starters would be used.
That’s four pitchers getting six starts off per the entire season. So you have 24 starts, max (April won’t really be a strain, especially with the off days built in), to give to the other three or four starters that are available -in any combination. If someone distinguishes themselves over the others, you go with the hot hand as the sub-starter. The rest of the time you leave them in the bullpen or shuttle them back and forth from Richmond, should options exist.
I have the feeling that MLB may move towards the six man rotation, anyway-especially now that you have so many 40+ year old pitchers. Since we have the depth, then why not use it and save our older pitchers some wear and tear? Sounds like a worthwhile situation no matter how you view it.
By Steve C.
November 19, 2007 3:49 PM | Link to this
Here’s an idea…
ncscoots, Bob, and SJA…you all can go start your own blog, where the topic can forever be…how clever you construct sentences, and impress each other with your extensive vocabulary, while at the same time expressing nothing of substance, and certainly nothing concerning what everyone else is here for…talking about the Braves, music, BBQ, and other topics that have nothing to do with past affronts to your overly sensitive personalities. If you are so miserable, why not just move on? Please? For the love of deep-fried Cajun Turkey and pumpkin pie, will you please move on???
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 3:50 PM | Link to this
Scoots: Don’t know if you read it before, but the truth is that 40% reduction in output at 2B would make you forget real quick what we had last season. Especially when coupled with a 5% reduction in output from CF. You wouldn’t remember a thing. Total black-out is what I’m thinking.
By Kentavo
November 19, 2007 3:52 PM | Link to this
What about Brandon Jones, who is likely going to make the roster?
By Scott
November 19, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
Welcome home Tommy. I’m glad he’ll finish his career as a Brave. Too bad he couldn’t have won his 300th game here.
By Renegator
November 19, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this
I love how all the people who supposedly “left” the blog are all back already. That was quick. Boy, they really showed us - they stayed away for a whole two weeks. I guess your blog is so good that they came crawling back…
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 3:55 PM | Link to this
Sorry, Chris; didn’t recognize you. If you’ve been on here that long though you ought to know by now Jimmy and Bob and I (which were the only three that posted last night you could have been referring to) aren’t the same person. And also, I haven’t been beating anything into the ground. I said my peace a long time ago. All I’ve done today is defend a friend from an unneccessary personal attack, talk baseball and toilet paper. I’m trying to be nice. Anyhoo, if I just lumped you in with two others who were really being dicks and you really weren’t, I apologize.
I’m not saying Glavine’s not a good idea or that Hampton and Smoltz might not both win 15+ games, I’m just sayin’ the potential is there (worst case scenario) for three of our starters to come apart. I hope there’s a backup plan, is all. And I hope that by not persuing another pitcher that means we’re really gonna try to re-sign Tex.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 3:56 PM | Link to this
What is this talk going on? All off season up until this moment was about signing Glavine because he can give you 200 innings. Now that the deal is done, yet the ink isn’t dry, there is talk of reducing the number of innings Glavine will give the team. What was the point in spending 8 million if this is the way to go. We could have gone with an 8 man rotation and saved 8 million.
By Dave
November 19, 2007 3:56 PM | Link to this
Cormier and Cruddy Carlyle will probably compete for the spot starter/long reliever role now that Villareal is gone. Prado is a light-hitting utility guy: not starting material. I’m worried about who will fill in when Chipper misses his obligatory 30+ games. Anyone know when/if Mike Gonzalez is expected back? He could be the difference between an ‘07-type bullpen and another of those horrible ‘06-type bullpens.
By ssidawg
November 19, 2007 3:56 PM | Link to this
I might actually keep up with the Braves now that Tommy’s back in Atlanta where he belongs!
By Braveheart
November 19, 2007 3:57 PM | Link to this
Have no fear Mets fans. After 41 year old Tom Glavine decided to get nostalgic and go back home, Omar Minaya decided to get all nostalgic and headed over to cell block 6 in the Florida state penitentiary to see if 42 year old Dwight Gooden still had anything left in his once golden right arm.
By rammerjammer
November 19, 2007 3:57 PM | Link to this
Really, really interesting how the “old guard” has returned to reclaim some real estate, I suppose, and right away the personal attacks and vulgar language are back.
Ah, well. That’s the way of the world.
Excellent news on the Glavine signing. I expect a four-plus ERA but when you think about the Redman, Carlyle, et al numbers, well, it is a huge improvement over what we had.
Curious that the Coco Crisp talk continues. If the Sawx asked for KJ (and didn’t get him), perhaps Prado and a prospect will float their boat.
By 22oz
November 19, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this
A-Rod opts out of contract with Yankees, agent says he will not come back. He then comes back to the Yankees, doing the exact opposite of what was said.
Bloggers denounce blog, say they are gone for good. They return to blog after only a week or so.
Do we have a bunch of A-Rods on this blog?
By ppaddy123
November 19, 2007 4:02 PM | Link to this
I think someone on the previous blog mentioned the idea of using a 6 man rotation. I like the idea. If not a 6 man rotation, I’d like to see the Braves keep 13 pitchers on the staff. This will leave us 1 short “bench” player, but when you stop and think; if Hampton is OK, he’s one of the best hitting pitchers in the majors. Also, Tom Glavine lays a bunt down as well as anyone. Smoltz, Hampton (if he makes it) and Glavine will need some rest during the “grind” of the regular season. Let’s not forget that Hudson isn’t a real big guy and tends to wear down in the summer. Having a guy (a 6th starter, long reliever)that can spell these guys, just makes sense to me.
I know starting pitchers are supposed to start at regular intervals (5 days). But, if they got an extra day 3-5 times a season, it can only help to keep them fresh. (Somebody please find Hudson’s numbers when pitching with extra rest. That sinker of his becomes extra “nasty”)
By GermanBravesFan
November 19, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this
Nice to see that Glavine will end his career as a Brave!
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this
Oregon Brave, I’M TALKING BASEBALL. If someone had said something ugly about you this morning I would have done the same thing I just did. I’m starting to wonder who wants to let it go and who doesn’t. Jesus. Renegator, we’ve always gotten along to this point; please tell me that wasn’t aimed at me.
By Tonight on AMC
November 19, 2007 4:05 PM | Link to this
The Seven Faces of Jimmy Smith
A disturbed man finds peace posing as numerous personalities on the Internet. Anthony Perkins stars.
By ppaddy123
November 19, 2007 4:05 PM | Link to this
22oz, Did you say A-Rods or A-Holes?
By atown
November 19, 2007 4:08 PM | Link to this
Great to have you back Tommy! Great blog DOB.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 19, 2007 4:10 PM | Link to this
I am happy to have Glavine back. I know many here are still mad at him for leaving but its time to just get over it! However, I am not that thrilled with the fact Wren and Cox said there will be no additions to the rotation. Yes, the rotation looks at the very least very solid. But, it is very tenuous. We have to be real about things. Smoltz, Glavine, and (Lord knows) Hampton are all injury risks. I know Glavine has been healthy all his career but he is 42 years old. I would still feel better if a Carlos Silva could be signed or if somebody like Joe Saunders from the Angels could be acquired.
I look at like this. Lets say Hampton and Smoltz have to endure 15 day DL stints at the same time. All of a sudden the rotation is: Hudson, Glavine, James, and some combination of Reyes, Jurries, Bennett, Cormier, and Carlyle (?). Then we are right back where we were last season. I would just feel better if a proven innings eater and low health risk guy like Livan Hernandez, Silva, Saunders, or somebody of their ilk was acquried. Can never have enough pitching.
By DAP
November 19, 2007 4:10 PM | Link to this
Oregon_Brave i will echo your post to SJA and others. What is posted on this blog is the business of everyone who reads and contributes. if you guys still have beef, take it up with the individual you have it with, and dont make us sit through your argument, please. thank you.
LEW i dont really like the idea of a 6-man, although it might happen that way one day. i definetly dont see it as a no-lose. teams have a hard enough time finding 5 good starters, to have to find 6 would be really tough. i can definetly see wanting to save smoltz and glavine for the stretch or for playoffs, but on the flip side, you are preventing your best starter in smoltz to miss a game, maybe a game we desperately need to win, or one that we wish we could get back later in the season.
i think the best idea is to win as many games as possible as early as possible, clinch as soon as you can, so that once you have the playoffs clinched, give your guys rest.
By BravesFanInRockies
November 19, 2007 4:11 PM | Link to this
22oz,
ROFL
By dack jerrick
November 19, 2007 4:12 PM | Link to this
Wine? Wine anyone?
By ncscoots
November 19, 2007 4:14 PM | Link to this
Hey, Steve, here’s an idea: get a clue about the people you’re trying to insult. There have been no affronts to my overly sensitive personality, and I’m certainly not miserable. You have me confused with someone else.
Bob’s doings are his own affair, and he can deal with them as he wishes. But he’s been bringing good posts to the blog a lot longer than the six minutes you’re been reading it, and your snappy repartee of “douchebag” kinda raised my ire.
As for my own contributions, and their lack of substance, you’re certainly welcome to that opinion, and to its expression, and hurrah says I. I’m guessing you’re not alone in holding that position.
It is interesting that you have such a clear vision of what “everybody else is here for”. Is that posted somewhere so that we of so little substance might find it, and thus be redeemed? Thanks in advance.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 4:15 PM | Link to this
Lots of stuff to get to, but first I’ve got to write my Glavine story for the paper. Just got back from the press conference, which went on and on and on (you’d have thought this guy had a history here or something, from all the questions….)
Suffice to say, what you guys will be interested in other than Glavine stuff: Frank Wren said that if spring training opened today, CF job would be a three-way competition between the newcomer Josh Anderson, prospect Jordan Schafer and … drum roll please … Gregor Blanco. That’s right, Wren named him, unsolicited. Cited his stats this winter, too. Blanco’s stock is rising.
And the other matter, Hampton is to make his first start in Mexico on Thursday (Thanksgiving) and is scheduled to make seven down there. Wren said they’re expecting him to be in the first four rotation spots, leaving the fifth spot as a competition among these four guys: Chuck James, Jair Jurrjens, Jo-Jo Reyes and Jeff Bennett. Again, Wren cited Bennett’s performance in the Venezuelan Winter League. I asked him specifically about Chuck, to make sure I was clear, and he repeated there’d be competition for that fifth spot, if Hampton’s healthy and in the rotation along with Smoltz, Hudson and Glavine, obviously.
Also, Braves are done acquiring starters, unless some unexpected deal developed. More likely, I think you’d see them trade one in spring training when another team is in situation Braves were in last spring.
Oh, and I asked him about options: Anderson has at least one, can be sent down. Jurrjens and Jo-Jo also have options. Bennett does not.
He also said Gonzalez should be back at “midseason,” but no more specific than that.
OK, gotta get transcribing my tape and writing the Glavine story.
By Renegator
November 19, 2007 4:17 PM | Link to this
Grinch
Nothing was aimed at you - you’ve always been in cool in my book.
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
W
By Steve C.
November 19, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
Didn’t the Red Sox have something in the news recently about possibly going with a 6-man rotation?
By Jared
November 19, 2007 4:20 PM | Link to this
Bloggers denounce blog, say they are gone for good. They return to blog after only a week or so.
Did anyone believe that at all anyway? They can’t possibly pull themselves away from this blog. They probably only did that so they could get attention and hopefully read comments from people begging them to stay.
By Oregon_Braves
November 19, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
…sigh…You were defending Bob, I was sticking up for Constant Reader Chris…the beat goes on. In the spirit of reconciliation, I can guarantee I’ll never mention it again and am quite glad you have moved on too. All other Quixotes can chase their windmills.
Now fire up the Iron Maiden, my friend!
By DAP
November 19, 2007 4:22 PM | Link to this
whats with all the religion on the blog today??? c’mon, grinch! i know that YOU know better!! :-)
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 4:22 PM | Link to this
well the hatfields vs. mccoys are back.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 4:22 PM | Link to this
Lew, I think the “5-1/2 man rotation” is really a good description for what they’re gonna end up having, perhaps with Bennett as the half-guy, a long reliever and spot starter. Someone will be in that role, I’m sure….
Hey, just skimmed over the posts. Wow, don’t know how we carried on without the self-obsessed trio. Good that they rode back in on their white horses to straight us out.
Please. We beg you. Get over yourselves. Pleeease.
By ppaddy123
November 19, 2007 4:23 PM | Link to this
Sorry, ncscoots, but I agree with Steve. I don’t post that often but I read daily. Bob needs a good b!tch slapping cause we’re all tired of his crying!!
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 4:25 PM | Link to this
Honcho, I like the idea of Smoltzy in the porn-star ‘stache and Glav in the mullet. Don’t think old Tommy’s gonna go for a graying mullet, though.
By kdbanks
November 19, 2007 4:26 PM | Link to this
Crap. I thought Gonzalez was going to be ready this Spring, not midseason.
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 4:26 PM | Link to this
So DOB does that mean that either Chuck or Bennett could possibly involved in a trade or moved to the bullpen in long relief?
By cgb
November 19, 2007 4:27 PM | Link to this
Welcome back Tommy. Now I don’t have to boo you anyomore. I hope you retire in a Braves’ jersey. I truly hate the Mets and it pained me to no end to see Tommy wearing that jersey on his back!
By Stinky
November 19, 2007 4:27 PM | Link to this
An awful lot of bile from an awful lot.
By Dan
November 19, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
DOB,,,,any rumors to suggest that the Braves will be adding yet another veteran starting pitcher to the 2008 roster? Any comments on the make up of the bullpen for 2008?
By Steve C.
November 19, 2007 4:31 PM | Link to this
ncscoots…
it is titled Braves Blog after all…
look, I get that you and others are coming to the defense of someone that you obviously have respect and admiration for. That being said, myself and others, as you can see for yourself, are getting a little tired having to read all of it, when that is not what we cam here for. I have been following this blog for a long time, and I am usually content with just reading it to get some good information and insight on Braves baseball and sometimes other topics, like food and music, when the news is slow. I don’t normally post, only every once in awhile, but I guess enough is enough at some point. I truly felt this blog had gotten past all of this, until this “homecoming” of sorts. The Braves just brought back Tom Glavine for Pete’s sake!!! This is a great day for Braves fans, enough already. I apologize for my jevenile use of “douchebag”, but quite frankly, I didn’t like reading Shakespeare back in school, definitely don’t want to read it on a Braves blog.
By DAP
November 19, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this
wren mentioned blanco? man, where is wayne!?! i cant wait to tell him!
thanx for the updates, DOB.
By mo in the boonies
November 19, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this
By ppaddy123 November 19, 2007 1:35 PM | AHHHH! Virgin blog space, or at least almost virgin blog space:D
LOL, there is no such thing as “almost virgin”! :-)
Grinch I think we should trade some of the four or five number 5’s we’ve got (with others, if necc.) to aquire someone under 35 who can fill the # 3 or better spot, maybe for a good while.
Right! But I’m betting it’s not gonna happen.
RE: a six man rotation, didn’t Boston announce not too long ago that they planned on doing so next season? One team did I know, and I think it was Boston.
Wish we could send some water down to Atlanta, we’re getting snow or rain everyday up here in the boonies. Be glad to send some of it south.
By TheSouthernJackAss
November 19, 2007 4:35 PM | Link to this
Sometimes it’s a little hard to tell which side ol’ Grinchy is on…
By Neon
November 19, 2007 4:37 PM | Link to this
Glad to have Glavine back. He’s always been one of my favorite braves. I think it’s a good situation for him to be in. Not coming back as a #1 or #2 guy. That takes a lot of pressure off him. Plus, I don’t see Glavine winning 15 or more wins. It would be good to get 13 or 14 wins and get innings out of him more than anything. I think he will have a lot of no decisions. He’ll give up some runs and will be bad in some stretches but he strengthens the rotation with his presence and will be a great mentor for all the younger players who looked to him before they got to the majors. WELCOME BACK GLAV!!!
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
Oops, you’re right, DAP…I capitalized the “J” word. :-) Sorry Or. Brave and Renegator; with stinky posting every third insult around it’s hard not to wonder who means what. I’m in agreement about the 5 1/2 or 6 man rotation; I don’t see how sacrificing Woodward or Orr’s spot for the benefit of the rotation and bullpen could have any drawbacks of any kind. As someone mentioned earlier, Glavine actually knows how to bunt which automatically makes him more valuable as a utility man than either of those losers. Plus, Cox always used to pinch hit him in the past if I remember correctly; shouldn’t be a problem there. Stick Jurgens or Jurries on the roster instead and I think we’ve got a winner.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
By the way, Bobby Cox said he talked to Andruw on the phone this morning, Andruw called him from Hawaii and asked Bobby if the Braves had signed Glavine yet. Bobby said they were about to, and that he wished they could bring back Andruw, too, “but that’s not gonna work.”
Again, team officials made it clear today there is no way, no chance, that Andruw’s coming back on any one-year contract or anything else.
By For What It's Worth
November 19, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
There’s something happening here What it is ain’t exactly clear There’s a man with a gun over there Telling me I got to beware I think it’s time we stop, children, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down
There’s battle lines being drawn Nobody’s right if everybody’s wrong Young people speaking their minds Getting so much resistance from behind I think it’s time we stop, hey, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down
What a field-day for the heat A thousand people in the street Singing songs and carrying signs Mostly say, hooray for our side It’s time we stop, hey, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down
Paranoia strikes deep Into your life it will creep It starts when you’re always afraid You step out of line, the man come and take you away We better stop, hey, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down
Stop, hey, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down Stop, now, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down Stop, children, what’s that sound Everybody look what’s going down
By Austin
November 19, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
This Just In
Keith Law is an absolue idiot. He said David Wright should win the NL MVP. He also said that Glavine had nothing left in the tank, and that the Braves should have offered him a 1 million dollar contract with incintives.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 19, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
From what DOB said Wren said today I’m getting the impression that Blanco and Anderson could platoon in CF with Schafer being given the opportunity to win it outright in spring training.
I wonder what the plans are for Prado and Thorman. I think Prado has another option but Thorman does not. What are the Braves going to do with those two guys?
By CAR3BOOGIE
November 19, 2007 4:41 PM | Link to this
What Braves if any were at the press conference?
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 4:41 PM | Link to this
Dan, we’ve said it and Frank’s said it about 10 different ways: They’re not pursuing another veteran starter, or any other starter, for that matter. They made a point to cite four guys going for one spot, provided Hampton’s healthy. If not, it’ll be four guys going for two spots, I imagine.
By What's Going On?
November 19, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
Mother, mother There’s too many of you crying Brother, brother, brother There’s far too many of you dying You know we’ve got to find a way To bring some lovin’ here today
Father, father We don’t need to escalate You see, war is not the answer For only love can conquer hate You know we’ve got to find a way To bring some lovin’ here today
Picket lines and picket signs Don’t punish me with brutality Talk to me, so you can see Oh, what’s going on What’s going on Ya, what’s going on Ah, what’s going on
In the mean time Right on, baby Right on Right on
Father, father, everybody thinks we’re wrong Oh, but who are they to judge us Simply because our hair is long Oh, you know we’ve got to find a way To bring some understanding here today Oh
Picket lines and picket signs Don’t punish me with brutality Talk to me So you can see What’s going on Ya, what’s going on Tell me what’s going on I’ll tell you what’s going on - Uh Right on baby Right on baby
By Jared
November 19, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
Bennett does not.
So that means he’s going to have to be on the team unless they decide they’d rather just release him? Oh, Whoopie!
I find it hard to believe, assuming the other four spots go to Smoltz-Hudson-Glavine-Hampton, that James would be on an EQUAL playing field with the others. His major league experience likely gives him a big edge over Reyes, Bennett and Jurrjens for that fifth slot. I surmise James would really have to tank in spring training for him not to have that spot.
By Chop Chop
November 19, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this
DOB, this is why I try to stick to an offseason for blog posting. I know that Rock Chalk is heading toward Armageddon in K.C. against Mizzou, but you’d think everyone here could contain their excitement. I think the Jayhawks have whipped everyone here into an unhealthy frenzy. We will know the fate of the Magical Manginos soon enough, so let’s put our animosities, real (or perceived) slights, and harebrained roster projections aside for a little while and keep your eyes on the prize: spring training.
As far as Glavine’s signing goes, I think his presence in the clubhouse will make next season more interesting. Smoltz will have a golf partner, Cox will get confused and think that Glavine can still pitch 7 innings every night, and the Braves will have a couple of Hall of Famers around in the rotation to make the fans yearn for the days when this team was truly the team to beat.
By the way, I’m still wondering when we’re going to see a legitimate spike in payroll to improve the club for next season. If this “rising payroll” just means adding up raises in pay (Huddy’s contract jumping up to $13 million, Tex’s arbitration - I have no idea how much he’ll end up getting…maybe 13 million or so, a possible deal for Francoeur) and Glavine’s deal, that’s a f*** joke. I think there’s been more subtraction than addition so far. I’ll give Wren the benefit of the doubt for now, though. He’s got plenty of time left to construct a likely playoff roster.
I just won’t be blogging about it every day.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 19, 2007 4:49 PM | Link to this
I think its becoming quite apparent why Keith Law is no longer JP Riccardi’s assistant GM in Toronto. A one million contract. I suppose the Yanks should’ve offered Arod a $5 mil contract with incentives. What a freakin idiot!
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 4:49 PM | Link to this
Request granted: “Revelations” by Maiden now playing. Speaking of now playing, saw “Beowulf” on I-MAX last weekend. It’ll make you mad if you’re an English teacher, but as for special effects kick-a*******edness it did pretty well. It also gave me this strange urge to have “relations” with Angelina Jolie, even though she had claws and a tail (there’s a joke there for someone; I’m too innocent to post it on a family blog).
Mo in Boonies, the water would be well appreciated (get it? well?). The fish in Lanier can now be recognized by their above-water expressions.
By dcarp23
November 19, 2007 4:49 PM | Link to this
DOB-Sorry because I’m sure you’ve covered this before. Where did Blanco play this winter, and what team is Hampton playing for in his winter league stint?
By Chop Chop
November 19, 2007 4:54 PM | Link to this
If Glavine grows a gray mullet, I’ll forgive him for the 2002 NLDS. In addition, Smoltz should grow a horseshoe mullet and the pornstache. These things need to happen.
By Don
November 19, 2007 4:56 PM | Link to this
Welcome back Tom Glavine. I think he can help on many things even if he does only wins 10 games but I think 14 is more like it. He not only can help the young pictures but if I remember right we had a team that could not lay down a SAC bunt this past year. Tom is a answer to this as he is the best and maybe he will teach. This will be worth a few more wins..Go Braves we are on the way back….
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 4:56 PM | Link to this
Austin: Law already made it clear he has no expectations for Glavine. He implied in his list that it’d be a better buy to bring Weaver into a rotation than Glavine. The only way that could possibly be true is if Glavine’s last three starts are all he can provide AND he turns into a full blown roid head pain in the neck. Doubt either of those will happen.
But it’s good to see we just procured a starter under the guise of the 200 innings he can give us only to learn the team intends to limit his innings to about that of Chuck James.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 4:59 PM | Link to this
By the way, Schuerholz’s mother died this morning. He had talked to Tom and his wife in recent days and planned to be at the press conference today.
Very sad stuff. Wren told the crowd there, only because he didn’t want people jumping to conclusions about Schuerholz’s absence.
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 5:01 PM | Link to this
Wow, I can’t catch a break from either side, huh? SJA, I’ve already defended the man twice today. Should I now kill everyone on the blog with a battle-axe? He’s said his peace and so have I. Let it roll, bro.
By TNRON
November 19, 2007 5:01 PM | Link to this
Robert(JIB) correct me if I am wrong but isnt Blanco a LH batter as well? You would need a RH batter to platoon with Anderson,who bats LH,which again is why I suggested Lillibridge,and you could always put Anderson in as a late inning defense guy early in the year until Lillibridge gets more experienced at the position.
By Austin
November 19, 2007 5:06 PM | Link to this
Thoughts and prayers go out to JS.
I beleive Law had Glavine ranked 50th on his top free agents. I think Glavine ranked in the top 6 or 7 in quality starts last yeat. Law is a BRAVES HATER!!!
By StingerSplash
November 19, 2007 5:10 PM | Link to this
DOB,
I had that song going through my head all day today, starting at about 10 a.m. I was wondering, gee, “Radio, Radio” got posted, why not a little “(What’s So Funny About) Peace, Love and Understanding.” If you go to CBS’ Letterman Web site, I think they still have Elvis’ mini concert in their archived clips and he closes with that gem. Abso-freakin-lutely freakin brilliant.
By Braveheart
November 19, 2007 5:11 PM | Link to this
I don’t care whether Glavine personally wins 5, 10, 15, or 20 games. All I care about is that he gives the Braves 6 innings a start with an ERA under 4.50 and the Braves win 55-60% of his starts. If the Braves go 18-14 or 19-13 in Glavine’s 32 starts next season, I will be extremely happy.
By ncscoots
November 19, 2007 5:13 PM | Link to this
I didn’t like reading Shakespeare back in school, definitely don’t want to read it on a Braves blog.
fine and dandy…that’s why they make scroll bars.
But here’s the deal: no one, NO ONE, gets to make decisions on what people post here, within the bounds of decency and the stated ground rules. You don’t like the content? No problem, just scroll past it. You think I don’t give that scroll bar a workout on here sometimes? Smoke comes off that humper.
You want to take someone to task for a post’s content, and make an argument for your own point of view? Have at it, that’s kinda the whole idea.
You want to start slinging “douchebag” because you don’t like something in a post, and make like a high school hall monitor? That’s beyond the pale, and that I can’t just let slide.
Frankly, I didn’t see any bile or name-calling or anything else untoward until your 3:02. After that, well, that’s on me.
By slim
November 19, 2007 5:13 PM | Link to this
The Glavinator is back baby!
By The Grinch
November 19, 2007 5:14 PM | Link to this
Keith Law also said the reason Glavine wouldn’t work out here is that “….if he doesn’t get six inches off the outside of the plate then he has to come inside with stuff that’s very hittable.” Umm, that’s been true since 1987, Keith. Good job.
Now, back to writing papers…
By roan st
November 19, 2007 5:17 PM | Link to this
DOB, Why would the braves consider trading any of the young pitchers in spring training? Is there not a good possibility that in 2009 glavine, smoltz, and hampton will all be gone? Maybe smoltz will return but the other two are good possibilities to be gone. I hope we send jurrjens and reyes to richmond for the season and keep bennent for long relief and spot duty. Because we will need these young arms in the not so distant future. What about that Morton kid where does he fit in next years plans? I just hate to see the Braves give up a good young arm because they are being blocked for only one season.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 19, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this
Bennett and Cormier , out of options. I would say the chances of somebody getting traded just went up to one hundred percent.
I had an epiphany last night or it could have been all the caffeine.
It was a totally insane idea , giving the Braves a long term CF solution right now. Remember Colby Rasmus ? The Cardinals heir apparent to Jim Edmonds.
How to pry him away from St.Louis ? Well , they desperately need pitching but not at the expense of trading a first round five tool stud CF. Unless , we give them another CF.
Chuck James and Jordan Schafer for Colby Rasmus and Mitchell Boggs. Maybe get the Cardinals to throw in a third minor leaguer.
I told you it was an insane idea.
But , it makes sense in a twisted sort of way. It gives the Braves a CF for 2008 who can step into the line up and lead off right now.
The Braves have the depth to absorb the loss of Chuck James and the Cardinals get a young lefty who will step right into their rotation. Jordan Schafer could take over for Jim Edmonds in 2009.
I know , it makes to much sense and it’s crazy as hell. O’well , I had to try.
By Braveheart
November 19, 2007 5:28 PM | Link to this
I don’t respect Keith Law’s opinions on a few things like Glavine signing for only $1 mil but does anyone else get that he knows how popular this blog is and how much we all talk about him when he says negative stuff about the Braves which causes other bloggers and readers of the blog to go to ESPN to read what the latest thing he has said to pi$$ off Braves fans is?
Some of his opinions are idiotic but I don’t think he is an idiot or a Braves hater. I think he fully understands how popular the blog is and how much he can get people to head over to his articles if he pi$$es us off.
If he ain’t pi$$ing off Braves fans then he is pi$$ing off his editors for not pi$$ing us off enough.
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 5:28 PM | Link to this
It is curious that Wren mentioned Anderson, Jordan Schafer and Blanco and not mention Lillibridge in that mix also. So I suppose that they are not thinking about giving him a shot at CF.
I could have swore from all the talk on this blog, especially from DOB and Gil in Mech., that Blanco would not fit will in CF. I would be interested on hearing anyone in the know take on that.
By rammerjammer
November 19, 2007 5:31 PM | Link to this
Man, Chuck James is competing with Jeff Bennett??? Have mercy, ol’ Chuckeroo’s stock has slipped in the front office! It sounds like someone might want to pick up some change-of-address forms on the way home.
So, it’s Prado and James for Crisp then?
By Tankarelli
November 19, 2007 5:33 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Any idea what if any draft pick compensation we have to give to the Mets as a result of signing Glavine before Dec. 1st? Thanks.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 19, 2007 5:39 PM | Link to this
TNRON, I think Blanco is a switch hitter but I could be wrong.
By Greg in TN
November 19, 2007 5:40 PM | Link to this
Afternoon friends and neighbors…
Lots of opinions on the inking of #47 which was announced today just south of Ralph David Abernathy. I feel like we’ve gotten a little deeper in the starting rotation, and added a guy that can give us 200 innings. The bullpen had to trot out from right field at the Ted an awful lot in the 2007 season and short starts really made things difficult for us later in the season.
I am fine with going into the spring with the options we have under contract to us right now and see what happens.
It’s also interesting to me that Blanco is being mentioned as a CF option by FW now. If we are able to bring in another guy to play CF until Schafer is ready, that will work, but I’m also open to trying out Schafer/Anderson/Blanco at Dark Star and then waiting to see if another team is up for dealing for a CF’er in the late stages of the spring like what we did with Otis in ‘91.
I’m also interested in seeing how the bench will be constructed for 2008 since the bench we had in ‘07 wasn’t quite what we were aiming for and then some.
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 5:42 PM | Link to this
I have to agree with some on here that we should not be trading away our young arms. We are most definitely going to need a lot of them in the near future. It is unfortunate that Bennett is out of options, but it sounds like DOB has it on good athority that both James and Bennett can be kept on the major league roster.
Barring an utter (Davies like) start by James or Bennett and/or inability of Hampton to start the season,Jurrjens and Jo-Jo should be kept at AAA for proper seasoning.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 19, 2007 5:44 PM | Link to this
As far as I’m concerned, Lillibridge along with Wily Aybar should be used as super subs. Aybar can play any of the infield positions but is weak at SS. Lillibrdige can play anywhere on the field but catcher.
By AuburnBrave
November 19, 2007 5:45 PM | Link to this
Glad Glavine is back with the team. I feel like he’ll be a great asset both on the mound and helping bring some of the younger pitchers along, especially Chuck James, who was compared to Glavine when he first came up.
I posted this on the last blog right before it was replaced with this one, so here are my thoughts again on the ChiSox trading John Garland to the LA Angels for Orlando Cabrera:
I’m a little miffed at this move because we tried to get Garland at the deadline last season for Edgar Renteria, and here they ship him off for a similar SS weeks after we “settle” for a rookie starter in Jurrjens. I’ve read the reports on Jurrrjens and I feel like eventually he’ll be a great addition to the team, but Garland is a proven “innings-eater” and a good 3-5 starter who’s had experience in the playoffs and won a World Series.
By JasonInMaine
November 19, 2007 5:54 PM | Link to this
If anyone is interested, you can watch the Glavine press conference at braves.mlb.com
By Ron
November 19, 2007 5:55 PM | Link to this
Well, looks like Tommy’s plaque in the Hall of Fame will have an asterisk on it: “Also played for the Mets from 2003-2007.” He’s going in as a Brave, which is as it should be. Okay Tom, you made a mistake five years ago, but we forgive you. Your (and Smoltz’s, and Maddux’s) presence in the dugout was why we always had such good pitching. I’m looking for a big year from Chuck James, because he’s going to have that veteran left-handed mentor next to him all year. Welcome home, Tom.
By JasonInMaine
November 19, 2007 5:57 PM | Link to this
Speaking of rotation depth, look at the Angles now:
Garland
John Lackey
Kelvim Escobar
Jered Weaver
Joe Saunders
Ervin Santana
I am a little surprised that the White Sox valued Orlando over Edgar. They passed up Edgar last year.
By Bob, Journalist
November 19, 2007 6:07 PM | Link to this
Esteemed and succinct Scoots, Grinch and Most Honorable Southern … while I had hoped that my response to Dave O’Brien’s post would have been well received … and that he would have by now responded, I now see that neither is the case; somewhat disappointing but not totally unexpected.
Thinking of the Most Honorable and Distinguished Journalist from Cordele, Uganda, “this and my last post to David were not intended to be esoteric … unfortunately, methinks pragmatically they most probably were.
I truly appreciate each of you, your words and that seen with my third eye!
Regardless of how I’m viewed, I would hope that those interested in the best interests of the Blog will further reflect upon what they perceive to be the issues associated with this situation so that the blog is improved as a result of those efforts.
By Kieran, Long Island Brave Fan
November 19, 2007 6:15 PM | Link to this
November 19, 2007 3:38 PM | Link to this
David O’Brien…
You emphasized Glavine’s durability and reliability as far as eating up innings throughout the entire season. Anyone who has followed Tom Glavine’s career knows that he has never gone on the disabled list, outside of the one incident he faced in a New York Taxi cab accident. Often teams will give pitchers a few weeks off toward the end of the summer, Pedro Martinez, Curt Schilling and Orlando Hernandez are examples off the top of my head. My question for you is do you think that the Braves, despite Glavine’s track record of eluding the Disable List, will give him a few weeks off in order to preserve his arm and avoid the situation he saw at the end of this year?
Though I understand this is probably a “wait and see” situation, it would be nice for Cox (Who has the tendancy to overuse and abuse pitchers arms) and braves upper management to consider this practice.
Also, great Elvis Costello song, I know your take on Tool but I have not heard your opinion of A Perfect Circle, Maynard James Keenan’s other band. They do a fantastic version of “Peace, Love, and Understanding” on their album “Emotive”. I highly recomend you check it out.
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 19, 2007 6:16 PM | Link to this
DOB…did you catch the sidebar on the Jerry Crasnick Boras article on espn.com today? regarding stan kasten and his talk with andruw? did i read it right that andruw may be a bit perturbed at how his exit was handled and that maybe boras screwed that one up to? i’m not in the camp thinking andruw should get 20mil a year and that using the money elsewhere, i.e. tex, is a better strategy…but could this have worked out somehow if boras was not in the picture?…any inside info from DOB or others out there??
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 19, 2007 6:19 PM | Link to this
well, i just reread it and maybe i misread it at first…seems maybe andruw was more perturbed at the braves…but that he was reaching out to kasten maybe says something more about his mindset…i don’t know..whatever…it’s all said and done now
By mr baseball
November 19, 2007 6:19 PM | Link to this
A few things to consider regarding the Glavine signing and the possible return of Hampton. Our esteemed manager is going to have to be very shrewd about how he handles the geriatric/studless group of starters. And we all know Bobby doesn’t do shrewd very well.
Glavine, Hudson and James all have a tendency to lose it all at once, although Hudson tends to do it a little later in the game than the other 2. Instead of waiting until it’s too late to get a reliever up, Cox needs to be pro-active with the bullpen, something he has an aversion to — James being an exception.
The bullpen is going to have TO be structured with one starter/long reliever (Bennett or Carlyle) who is capable of taking over in the 6th or earlier and pitching for a while and also spot starting. This one inning per reliever garbage has got to stop, or Cox is going to burn out what’s left of the pen (Mahay, Dotel, Oscar, Paronto all gone; Gonzalez unlikely to contribute until late this season, at best). Acosta, Moylan and even Soriano have the ability to pitch multiple innings and Cox needs to use them in that capacity when needed, especially the first 2. A second lefty to join Ring would be nice, but don’t see any room in the pen at the moment, and the Braves won’t pay for a decent one anyway.
Braves still need a RH hitter who can play CF and a utlity guy who can play SS. Also would be nice to have an experienced PH like Sweeney, Anderson, Ward, whoever. Thorman is not cut out be a PH. With Tex, the Braves don’t need a backup 1B capable of playing a lot in the field.
No trades involving Braves pitchers should be considered (Cormier the exception if anybody wants him). Nightmare scenario: Hampton goes down for good; Glavine doesn’t have it any more; Smoltz’s elbow finally explodes. Rotation — Hudson, James, Jurrgens, Reyes, Bennett.
YIKES.
By mr baseball
November 19, 2007 6:31 PM | Link to this
Musical interlude: DOB — with the signing of Glavine today you missed the obvious — Little Feat’s “Old Folks Boogie.”
“And you know that you’re over the hill/when your mind makes a promise that your body can’t fill.”
Dozens of great Elvis lyrics to choose from, no need for a cover. Check out some of Nick Lowe’s wonderfully warped but slightly obscure efforts. I think most of us already knew the lyrics to this one.
By kinley
November 19, 2007 6:31 PM | Link to this
DOB:
What’s the latest word on Willy Aybar? Last I heard he was entering a substance abuse program, but I haven’t heard anything lately.
By journalist jimmy smith
November 19, 2007 6:37 PM | Link to this
“Hey, just skimmed over the posts. Wow, don’t know how we carried on without the self-obsessed trio. Good that they rode back in on their white horses to straight us out.”
there you go again with the “us”, dob. all the posts seemed directed to you.
oh, you forgot.
posture as you will. bob’s wife is consumed with cancer and you well know that this blog was his one diversion. you mistreated the man, then piled on, and now those of us who take exception to your boorish behavior are lumped together against the blog. well, it ain’t the blog baby, it’s you.
it’s more than 3 and probably fewer than 15 that deemed you not worth much more of our time.
sadly, bob wanted to revisit the posts from his friends. probably was inadvisable for any of us to return or any of us to think you would ever show any class.
sja had the right of it months ago. you have lost what little respect some had for you. but it does seem you’ve found some new followers.
you’ve taken cheap shots at a fine gentleman who deserves better.
there, did i “straight” you out?
By Thrillhouse44
November 19, 2007 6:42 PM | Link to this
Signing Glavine was a great move. He was never my favorite Brave the first time around, and I’m sure he won’t be my favorite this season. But we in Braves/MIB/BBQ Nation need to realize that we got a #3 starter on the cheap. He’ll be a big improvement on our #3 from last year and will provide some insight and guidance to the younger pitchers. $8 million for a number 3 starter? I think Wren did a great job.
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 6:43 PM | Link to this
An Update on Tom Glavine His head is oddly shaped. His wife looks like a slightly younger Kim Basigner.
Leading to the conclusion that maybe, just maybe…Tom Glavine is Batman.
There’s certainly a weird resemblance between he and Michael Keaton.
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 6:52 PM | Link to this
OHHHHH, and I forgot.
To any of the bloggers here that continue to pursue this ridiculous “he said, she said” nonsense:
I’ve remained mum on all your personal attacks and vendettas and whining and the like for a while now. I assumed you’d shut up eventually.
But, as it’s turned out, your incessant complaining is actually getting worse.
So, here’s an idea: GO BACK TO JUNIOR HIGH
Junior High would love to have you back. There, you can whine and complain and feel wronged and mistreated all you want.
And, you know what the benefit is? The rest of us that are here to talk about the Braves and other such juvenile subjects don’t have to listen to your absolutely atrociously solipsistic and aggravating crap.
Grow up. Please.
By brian
November 19, 2007 6:53 PM | Link to this
Glavine is BACK IN THE SADDLE AGAIN!
Welcome home Tommy! I cannot believe all the naysayers. Tommy needs to be a #3 or #4 starter for the Braves. If we get his stats from last year, especially prior to the last 3 starts we will be rolling. I can only imagine that those last 3 starts will fire up Glavine and have him work hard in the offseason. No way that is how he wants to be remembered. Tommy will want to have a successful year and lead the Braves back to the post-season and hopefully to post-season glory. TOmmy will carry his fire to the Braves and it will be contagious. You will see a different attitude for the Braves this next year and we will like it. glavine is not only the pitcher we sorely need but also the leader we need.
Go Braves
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 6:55 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave: If the Yankees offer Mahay about, say, $11 mill over three years, he might be willing to endure the klieg lights and tabloids….
To all of those who correctly pointed out that Nick Lowe wrote that great tune that his buddy Declan McManus (Elvis C.) made into a huge hit, very strong. Glad to know we have so many fans of fine music.
(By the way, if you haven’t heard the new Nick Lowe, which is a few months old now, then by all means take a listen somewhere. It’s great. But not a rocker, by any means. More Bachrach-type of sound, but with more of an edge. Great stuff).
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 6:57 PM | Link to this
Saltywoody, I think it might be the pic making his head look funky-shaped. I haven’t noticed that.
But the other point you observed: oh, yes.
By Braves Fan in PA
November 19, 2007 7:03 PM | Link to this
Listen/watch the Press conference and you may get a better appreciation for Glavine. I was one of those not too happy with his (Outspoken) involvement with the Union and his leaving to NY for what seemed like money. He appears like a much more greatful and appreciative person not looking to squeeze every last nickel. I admire him a lot more now!
Yeah him isn’t the same pitcher (and I still think Bobby should have went Smoltz-Avery in all playoffs not Maddux-Glavine) but hey nowadays 8 million for a number 3 or even 4 pitcher is not that ridiculous. Plus its not my money :).
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 7:04 PM | Link to this
Mr Baseball, I know I know. Costello’s got to be considered one of the best 10 songwriters in rock or pop music. But Lowe’s very strong, too, and I really have always put that song at the top of my list from Elvis’ vast catalog.
Others of Costello’s that I love, stuff like Man Out of Time, I’m not sure how it goes over here, and by that I mean in this particular forum. He’s got the UK in him big time, especially in the early stuff, and on paper the lyrics don’t always work quite as splendidly as when he’s singing them, don’t you think?
Not that they’re any less awesome, just that you need the accent and all on some words and context we don’t use commonly in the States. No? Maybe I’m wrong.
From Oliver’s Army, Green Shirt, My Aim Is True and Pump It Up, to Brilliant Mistake and King of America, and all the stuff on the newer albums, he just keeps cranking out greatness.
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 7:07 PM | Link to this
DOB So Glavine IS Batman?
Or Mrs. Glavine is a babe and a half?
Or BOTH?!
By Mets Stink
November 19, 2007 7:07 PM | Link to this
Some people here seem to think everything should revolve around their thoughts and feelings. I guess when someone gets offended, your little clique will all stand together and whine and complain until you get what you want. I guess your loyalty to each other should be admired, but you need to understand that what you’re after will never be attained. Get over it. I’ve always enjoyed reading your posts, but at this point most people on the blog would rather you leave not come back.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 7:10 PM | Link to this
Tankarelli, it’s a first-round draft pick the Braves have to give the Mets, the 18th overall pick. I didn’t have room in my story for this, but I asked Wren about it, and he said he’s told his staff they will apply that money, the money they’d have paid to sign that pick, in other personnel area, not have it go unspent.
Also, Braves only get a sandwich pick between first and second rounds for Andruw (if they offer arbitration or someone signs him before that date) and a sandwich pick for Mahay, since both are only Class B free agents. I know, hard to believe Andruw’s status fell that far.
They only use past two years to determine free-agent status, and the standards got a lot tougher with the new collective bargaining agreement. Andruw would’ve been a Class A under the old agreement.
By Braves Fan in PA
November 19, 2007 7:14 PM | Link to this
I am not too familiar with the players the Braves got for Renteria but the Glavine trade and the Villarreal trade I definitely like.
Villarreal was not a good pitcher for us last year and two years ago was an OK spot starter. He really did show anything and spectacular. I think there is a good chance he wouldn’t make the team anyway so at least we have a prospect even if he doesn’t turn out to be our CF.
I understand the trading of Renteria and like Escobar as much as the anyone, my only concern with the trade is perhaps it would have been better to package him for a higher quality proven starter. Edgar had a pretty good year and may have been one of our better trade commodities (that we could afford to trade with weakening our team or getting rid of top-prospects).
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 7:17 PM | Link to this
SeattleBravesFan, we’ll probably never know on the Andruw matter, regarding Boras and whether it might possibly have worked out differently here.
By Oregon_Braves
November 19, 2007 7:18 PM | Link to this
Saltywoody - BOTH
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 19, 2007 7:24 PM | Link to this
gotcha…thanks for answering DOB…appreciate it…
By JC FROM UT
November 19, 2007 7:24 PM | Link to this
DOB: Where would you rank Prince as a song writer? Also has anyone mentioned signing Mark Loretta as the back up SS? He could also play 2ND against tough lefties.
By JasonInMaine
November 19, 2007 7:26 PM | Link to this
I thought Michael Barrett was a Type A FA…that can’t be…not if Andruw is a Type B
By BravesFanChris23
November 19, 2007 7:29 PM | Link to this
I am so happy Glavine is back. Both from a nostalgic standpoint and a baseball standpoint (meaning the rotation just got better). Glavine’s inning eating ability along with him possibly being a mentor to say James/Reyes as fellow lefties, Glavine has quite a bit to offer and both him and Braves will benefit from it. So its a win win situation for both sides.
Like it was said in 93….
“Welcome To Atlanta Fred McGriff”
Now we can say in 08….
“Welcome Home Tom Glavine”
I was at work during the PC, so I couldn’t watch it till I got home, just finished watching it to be honest. Glavine back in his 47 Jersey made me happy. Also, I’m pretty sure Smoltzie is happy too. Has his golfing partner back in the saddle so to speak (as in same team) and they don’t have to worry about facing each other again lol.
As far as the other area is concerned….
DOB, Who from a realistic standpoint going too be the back up SS picked up via trade? Also, if Aybar can go, will he be a back up in the infield?
All in all, I would say its a good time for the Braves right now. Good luck for 2008 and perhaps they’ll be finished at the Winter Meetings to get the final pieces to the puzzle.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 7:29 PM | Link to this
Saltywood: Glavine isn’t Batman. At least I don’t think he is.
The other part, you got right.
JC: I don’t know. I know I’d rank Prince among the greatest live performers, and he’s done some of the best music of the past 25 years. And he has written some great songs, especially on the Sign o’ the Times album. Just never really thought of him as a songwriter, but you’re right — he’s a damn good one.
Loretta has probably gotten consideration, though I haven’t heard his name specifically. Just that the Braves are looking for an experienced utility infielder, not one who’s just a backup shortstop. That from Wren today.
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 7:30 PM | Link to this
Really weird hearing about Andruw calling Bobby to ask him about Glavine.
Is that because their relationship is still congenial? Or is it because Andruw wants to know what’s going on and hasn’t completely separated himself from the team yet?
I don’t know if I misread that bit of information or not…but it sounded like Andruw is rethinking his decision a little bit. And that stinks for him because it also seems like the Braves have quickly moved on…
By tfbrave
November 19, 2007 7:31 PM | Link to this
Blanco is in fact a lefty. In VWL through 30 games Blanco is batting .310 with OBP of .414, 2 HRs and has stolen 4 bases in 8 attempts.
By T 2 the D
November 19, 2007 7:32 PM | Link to this
EC’s “Olivers Army” at his best.
Him on SNL, second only to Andy K.
“G” man, welcome home.
Braves’s 08 story beginning to unfold in charming fashion.
By Jared
November 19, 2007 7:32 PM | Link to this
So, it’s Prado and James for Crisp then?
That trade makes no sense.
I wouldn’t trade James straight-up for Crisp, ever. Also, with the pitching depth that Boston has, why would they want James? Or for that matter, the fairly-useless Martin Prado. They have that rookie, I forget his name, who’s really good and won the AL rookie of the year award this year.
(Why is Prado included in every proposed trade? I’d like him to be traded too, so to stop Cox from being tempted to start another platoon. But I hold no delusions that Prado would bring anything useful in return.)
By rmf
November 19, 2007 7:32 PM | Link to this
Add me to the group who are glad to have Glavine back and who thinks we should hold on to all of these pitchers. Smoltz and Glavine are both going to need to skip a few starts and it sounds like we can keep a couple of these guys stashed at Richmond.
I kind of feel sorry for Andruw (to the extent you can feel sorry for an MLB player who has made millions of dollars). Its clear he never wanted to leave and that he is bitter about it, but its also clear that he played his way out of Atlanta and the Braves did not want him back at all. Boras just made it easier for them to let him go with no bad pr. One of the ESPN writers recently took a poll on the available centerfielders and only one rated him even with Hunter —- no one really seemed to want him. I am guessing the market is so bad that the Braves will not be able to risk offering him arbitration to get the draft pick compensation.
Do we owe the Mets any picks from Glavine’s signing?
I also like a lot of these young guys the Braves have acquired and/or drafted and developed. It looks like we are going to get a lot faster and more athletic. It seems like we have been a slow, plodding team for several years and it will be good to see some speed on the base paths.
The window of opportunity is wide open in 08 and in the future (particularly if we can get Tex long term).
By JC FROM UT
November 19, 2007 7:35 PM | Link to this
I think Aaron Boone would also be a good veteran off the bench and could spell Chipper or Tex and give some pinch hitting pop.
By tfbrave
November 19, 2007 7:35 PM | Link to this
Blanco is a lefty. In the VWL through 30 games, Blanco has a .310 BA, .414 OBP, 2 HRs, and has 4 steals in 8 attempts.
By JB
November 19, 2007 7:40 PM | Link to this
DOB, Do you honestly think we are going into spring training with our CF already on the club, or are we going to acquire someone else?
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 7:42 PM | Link to this
Saltywoody, I think it was more Andruw just calling the guy he considers a father figure, calling him from vacation to see if the Glavine thing was done and how other stuff’s going. He’s got that kind of relationship with Cox, he’ll probably keep calling him in the future, at least for a while after he leaves the team.
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 7:42 PM | Link to this
You know, Loretta’s not a bad idea at all. He seems to hit wherever he goes and plays serviceable defense. That said, there’s got to be a reason he’s bounced around between so many teams, right? Despite hitting and fielding well?
And I guess Glavine probably isn’t Batman…otherwise he never would have left Gotham, errr New York.
But if he IS Batman? Then that makes Omar Minaya the Riddler. And Chuck James is Robin.
By Braveheart
November 19, 2007 7:44 PM | Link to this
Also, with the pitching depth that Boston has, why would they want James?
Also, with the amount of homers Chuck gives up, why the hell would Boston want a lefthanded Chuck pitching to righthanders with the Green Monster only 300 feet away?
I love Chuck and he should not have to compete for a job against freaking JoJo Reyes or Bennett but Chuck pitching in Fenway in half of his starts would be freaking scary.
Whoever said Chuck and Prado for Coco, sorry, that ain’t happening.
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 7:44 PM | Link to this
well galvine gave us a hometown discount? DOB, you forgot to mention that glavine wants his contract paid in euro-dollars. no kidding aside, i am very happy with the move. no way this goes south unless glav has nothing left.
i also agree with a previous post that we need a RH hitting center fielder. got into too many situations last year when we had late game matchup problems against LH relievers.
By Jack Nicholson
November 19, 2007 7:54 PM | Link to this
Saltywoody, did you ever dance with the devil by the pale moonlight?
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 8:02 PM | Link to this
I too feel bad for Andruw. He hasn’t gotten any serious offers or we would have heard about it. I believe he got some pretty crappy advise from Boras last season because it was a contract year. He should have placed himself on the DL to totally heal instead of trying to play through it which ended up costing him and Braves.
I am probably the only one who would like to give AJ one more chance while we are still waiting on our future star to get here. Offer him a one year contract at a home town discount and see if he bites. If he doesn’t, so long. If he does then we have our veteran CF for one or two years while we wait on our future CF. Who knows, perhaps he turns it around and carries us like he has a time or two before.
Got to get rid of Boras though!!!
By A-ville Ranger
November 19, 2007 8:06 PM | Link to this
When it comes to pro athletes some of you know I’m a tad jaded ( and disco was a ‘tad’ tacky).This is a really good story though..welcome home Tom.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 8:07 PM | Link to this
I think James could get it together and turn out just fine. Trading him would be a miserable idea. Especially if the trade only returns a stop gap. Terrible terrible idea. Trade 4 years of service time from a good starter for a crappy CF who had a worse OPS+ than AJ last season. A guy you intend to only keep for a season. Trading James little sense as well if the justification for signing a 40+ year old starter to a one year deal was so he could help our young left handers. We’d be hiring a teacher and expelling the student.
If we trade for a stop gap it better be a position player we have absolutely no use for and has a relatively low ceiling (Prado fits this description).
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 8:10 PM | Link to this
DOB Thanks for the clarification on Andruw. I actually always wondered what kind of relationship he had with Bobby. That’s cool that he’ll still call and check in and such, and he’s still got an interest in the way things are going. At the very least, I guess that speaks to his time in a Braves Uni having been a great one and for there being a lot of mutual respect there. And that’s good for both parties.
Actually, it does lead into a question I’ve been meaning to ask…both to DOB and the rest.
Have you heard anything about the way the Arod/Yankees debacle played out? Maybe it was discussed on here and I missed it.
But I was reading on Buster Olney’s blog that he thought it really hurt Boras’ stock and that maybe GMs and owners were finally drawing a line in the sand and daring Boras to cross it.
Did Boras disappear from the negotiations because he screwed up and ARod handled things himself? Or do you think that was a farce and that was part of Boras’ play all along?
That’s the funny thing about Boras now, I guess. He’s so highly esteemed and hated that everyone gives him no credit or too much credit. Be interesting to hear how much of it he actually deserves.
By Saltywoody
November 19, 2007 8:13 PM | Link to this
Jack Nicholson
“Wait’ll they get a load of me…”
By Jmart
November 19, 2007 8:22 PM | Link to this
For all of the “old” Glavine haters, it sure doesn’t seem like its all about the money. His heart has always been in Atlanta. Even though I was luke warm on his resigning I do feel that he makes us a better team today than we were yesterday. I never booed him and I’ll be happy to stand up and cheer him the next time I’m at the park and he is pitching. There are a lot of intangibles in baseball and the make up of a team. It appears that Glavine is one of those guys that understands the intangibles. He has more to offer than just his pitching.
By Niekro35
November 19, 2007 8:27 PM | Link to this
TennPaul: James is only going to get it together if he learns a third pitch. That and maybe reading the scouting reports before the games. His brain dead approach is what’s got him down to battling for the fifth spot after two years in the rotation. I suspect he’ll be traded.
By Wide Right
November 19, 2007 8:27 PM | Link to this
I watched the Glavine press conference and was really impressed by him. In particular, I was impressed when he said he turned down the 13MM extension on his Mets contract partly because he felt he was no longer a pitcher worth 13MM a year. I actually think he still is…but thats beside the point. I was floored by that. Can you imagine Clemens admitting that his value has gone down. In fact, can you imagine any other pro athlete saying he didnt feel he could live up to the expectations of his contract and therefore chose to sign for less elsewhere? I don’t know…i found that (and the other reasons he gave for coming back) to be very admirable.
And I have changed my opinion on what the best Elvis Costello is numerous times over the years. It’s a testament to his talent: every album he made for a period there differed completely from the prior one. And they were all great: the Stax sound of Get Happy, Punk of This Year’s Model, country of Almost Blue and that kind of Beatles/George Martin influence thing of Imperial Bedroom. But I think I lean towards King of America…great country/blues kinda stuff.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 8:29 PM | Link to this
Last season our Rotation was a 7 man deal. At least, 7 guys started 9 games or more. Average age was 29. If Hampton is healthy and James keeps his spot, next year the rotation will have an average age of 35.2 years. This should be ample enough reason not to deal any of the young pitching we may already have. Just the 1-4 spots alone average 37. This rotation got old in a hurry.
By Brad in MT
November 19, 2007 8:33 PM | Link to this
DOB, thanks for the good work today. Its really nice to have Tommy back. Hearing Bobby say that Andruw called him today sure got me to thinking how nice it would be to have him fire Boras and come back, even if it will never happen, you can hope though right?
By [/\][][][]Berigan[][][][/\]
November 19, 2007 8:35 PM | Link to this
Grinch,
I’d like to ask you a question via email…. my free email is ziggyelman@excite.com
Thanks!
By Oregon_Braves
November 19, 2007 8:35 PM | Link to this
All of this talk of Prince and Keaton as Batman has gotten P’s Batdance stuck in my head.
Please tell me I’m not the only one who remembers that? Vicky Vale…V-V-V-Vicky Vale…
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 8:40 PM | Link to this
Wide Right, I had the same reaction when Glavine said he wasn’t worth $13 mill a year, wasn’t that kind of pitcher anymore. Extreme honesty. Not what we’re used to hearing in these situations.
King Of America is great, start to finish. I’d go with Imperial Bedroom as my favorite, though. Most say My Aim is True or This Year’s Model, right? I’ll go Imperial Bedroom. Saw that tour, too. Great stuff.
By Salty
November 19, 2007 8:41 PM | Link to this
I know , it makes to much sense and it’s crazy as hell.
:-< ??? I’m confused!
By Braveheart
November 19, 2007 8:51 PM | Link to this
But Neikro35, Chuck James is actually a good pitcher. Yes, he only pitches 5.4 innings. Yes, he gives up too many homers. Yes, he needs to learn a third pitch.
But he’s 22-14 in 48 starts. The Braves are 28-20 when he starts the last 2 years. He has an ERA of 4.00 which is really pretty good - especially for what he should be now in this rotation - a fourth or fifth starter.
With starters over 100 innings pitched in the NL last season, Chuck ranked #33 in ERA. With 16 teams in the NL……. that is pretty darn good.
WIth Glavine, James, Hudson, and Smoltz, the Braves now have 4 starters who ranked in the top 37 in a 16 team NL in terms of ERA.
I do not think he should be forced to compete with Reyes or Bennett. That makes no sense to me. Jurrjens supposedly has good talent and had decent results in the majors last year so maybe I could see some competition there.
But for me this Tom Glavine signing only makes sense if Chuck James is a member of the rotation. We have no idea what the Braves will get out of Hampton next season and no idea what they will get out of Jurrjens, Bennett, and Reyes.
We do have a pretty darn good idea that Chuck will have an ERA in the high 3s, low 4s and the Braves will win 58% of his starts. I’m going with the sure thing instead of these other fellas.
Maybe the Braves are just trying to throw a scare into Chuck so that he actually gets the point and starts working harder on studying hitters and gets working on a third pitch.
But for a guy who does not know much about hitters and does not have a third pitch, he is somehow pretty darn good.
By Niekro35
November 19, 2007 8:53 PM | Link to this
Bennett, Jurrjens, Reyes, Carlyle, Cormier, James — one gets the 5th spot and another gets 10-11 starts if all goes right. Three start the season in Richmond; at least one gets traded; two at the most head north with the big team. There’s no way Wren keeps them all.
By Lew
November 19, 2007 8:53 PM | Link to this
Well-Y’all know I love you all like Brothers and Sisters (yet another not so obscure Southern Rock allusion), or else I wouldn’t keep drawing free masterpieces for assorted and sundry Denizens. However, reconciliation and understanding would be promoted if we all came to the realization that every single one of us has the potential to be full of crap on a regular basis and are certainly not afraid to reveal this fact.
Time to get over ourselves, y’all. As a certain blogger once remarked “We’re all incomplete fools.” Damn right we are-and apparently proud of it.
By tankarelli
November 19, 2007 8:53 PM | Link to this
So, Glavine was a Type A free agent while Andruw is a Type B? Wow!! Who da thunk it.
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 8:56 PM | Link to this
i don’t know if all the other superfriends back at the hall of justice are gonna like batman’s honesty.
By #2bravesfan
November 19, 2007 8:57 PM | Link to this
DOB do you have any idea if the braves plan on making an offer for Coco Crisp? - i think he would be a great fit for the cf job.. as long as it dont mean trading KJ..
By Lew
November 19, 2007 8:59 PM | Link to this
SaltyWoody-I read somewhere that ARod was advised on the framework of the deal by none other than Warren Buffet. Boras better damn well stand aside and defer to HIS expertise. Boras is doing the final embellishments on the contract. Also Kenny Rogers, wanting to stay in Detroit, fired Boras because he wanted to shop him around. Between those two deals and Andruw, Boras has, in my opinion, lost much face, and when he can’t get Andruw the mega bucks he thinks he is worth, we’ll see just how much power the guy really has.
By flange1
November 19, 2007 9:00 PM | Link to this
Good Evening all,
First, Baseball,
Welcome back Tommy G! Never my favorite player or person, I do think you will help this team next year. Great job Frank Wren.
Interesting CF observations from Mr Wren. We have 3 guys who might be able to play CF next year already in the fold and still looking. Depth is a good thing. Find a righty who can play center and lets have some fun.
Finally, in temrs of this Bob, J soap oprea that continues to come up, here are a few thoughts.
JJS, first off, your posts were the main reason that I kept coming back to thisdblog. You always had a way of phrasing something from a slightly different perspective that was cute and then funny, but also had some merrit. Today, all you have to say on this is that Bob J’s wife has cancer so therfor DOB should have not made him follow the rules that the rest of us must follow? Seems funny to me when we consider Bob’ J/’s post that posting on the blog is like “strapping on the leotard” and that it is no holds barred.
Jimmy, you are far smarter than that! Come up with a better reason DOB can’t tell Bob to follow the rules.
SJA, I have always found your posts to be funny and a bit off the wall, similar to JJS. You also act as if DOB spit in someone’s face. PLEASE, in every day english, tell all of us the terrible deeds that DOB did to Bob J. Fellow blogger RANDOM and I both posted the exact words that were typed by DOB and by Bob J. Bob got political and DOB said not here. You have been rebuffed MUCH harder on many occasions. Why does Bob J. deserve special treatment? If it is because Bob’s wife is sick, then see above.
Finally, Bob J., I repeat again, we are all sorry about your wife and wish you and her nothing but the best. I will speak for the entire MIB blog that we all want her to come through this with flying colors.
In terms of your post and your outrage, I ask 1 question of you, please tell all of us fin first grader language exactly why and how you feel you were harmed by a post by DOB. With all of the outrage and venom, maybe I missed the deeper meaning of this and we all should feel the outrage. PLEASE respond to me like a first grader, because I don’t want to have to interpret your response. Let me know exactly what you think happened. I don’t want to hear about a tapestry that was weaved and now has a bad spot like CL posted, I want to hear what you think happened.
I have made it clear what I read and I posted it. I will be glad to cut and past my response from a few days ago if you don’t remember.
It is obvious that all of you are here daily “lurking” and we all know that you email each other regularly. EIther tell us how you were harmed or just be quiet.
I look forward to your prompt response..
By Tankarelli
November 19, 2007 9:02 PM | Link to this
DOB,
The way I understand compensatory picks is that you get them only if the current team offers arbitration by Dec. 1 or if you sign the free agent before that date. Since the Mets weren’t gonna offer arbitration, why not wait until after Dec. 1 to sign Glavine? Doesn’t make much sense to give up the 18th pick for a one year rental of Glavine when you know you would’ve still had Glav if you waited 2 weeks.
The question is moot if I don’t have the rules down pat. Thanks.
By Braveheart
November 19, 2007 9:02 PM | Link to this
Glavine said he wasn’t worth $13 mill a year, wasn’t that kind of pitcher anymore.
NO! Anders was right after all. I was pretty mean to Anders when he said Glavine had that mentality. SO, Anders I owe you a big apology. Damn, Glavine of all the times you picked to start being honest, did it have to be on this one?
By Metropolitan Man
November 19, 2007 9:02 PM | Link to this
Glavine the Baseball Player-
Good Riddance
Glavine The Man-
Thanks for the good times, you’ll be remembered for the bad!!
Now lets see if the magician can re-invent himslef again becasue Pedro and Rick Peterson made him a winner when he lost his mojo, or was he just sabatoging an already shaky METS ship? Who knows but I’m glad YOU guys have him back. It wont hurt having him gone unless we get something less glamorous to replace the VET. Take care of your family Glavine, and when you come back to Shea/Citi field, you get a standing O form me the 1st time, and then boo’s until you retire.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 9:06 PM | Link to this
If Wren has to trade one of Bennett, Jurrjens, Reyes, Carlyle, Cormier, or James, he better start that list off with Carlyle and/or Cormier. I appreciate what Carlyle gave the team last summer. The Braves wouldn’t have finished 5 out if not for his help. But James has been better, and is even younger and under control for longer.
We all keep over looking Lerew. When’s this guy coming back? Probably about the time Gonzo comes back and at that point it’d be in the minors.
By flange1
November 19, 2007 9:17 PM | Link to this
Tenn Paul,
I agree with your pitcher trade observation. DO you ever think Lerew will pitch for the Braves after the way he came out in the press when he was injured? I think not.
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 9:22 PM | Link to this
tnpaul,
i think lerew is pretty deep in the braves doghouse.
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 9:26 PM | Link to this
flange,
you beat me to it, got a hunch that lerew has meathead status.
By TK
November 19, 2007 9:31 PM | Link to this
Welcome home Tom! Wish you could have got your 300th as a Brave. I like the idea of the 5 1/2 starter. I do wish the Braves would still talk to the A’s about Dan Haren. A young pitcher under contract for 3 years that could bridge the gap for the young guys. Maybe, Chuck James, Martin Prado, Brandon Jones, and a minor leaguer for Haren.
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 9:33 PM | Link to this
JC from (the great state of) UT
(couldn’t resist!)
I think that the Braves have third and first covered, with the likes and combo of Brayan Pena, Scott Thorman, and Willie Aybar.
Now, all three of those guys are not locks to be here on opening day, as they are all possible trade candidates. But, until they are dealt away, I would think Boone might be overkill.
TNRON and RobertJITB Guys, I will give my buddy Frank Wren a call and see if he can add Lillibridge to the CF mix, so we can have a righty in the hunt!
:-)
By Salty
November 19, 2007 9:37 PM | Link to this
Braveheart Your 8:51…spot on…no joshin’ whatsoever! I’d wager if other teams with their own ‘MIB’ blog would be filled with ‘Hot Stove’ posts clamoring for James…and here he’s a candidate for the recyle bin. Crazy!
Of course, this time a year ago, I was ‘chorusing’ with KC about keeping HoRam. In keeping with Lew’s: *“We’re all incomplete fools.”, that was a full disclosure moment for me! There are others as well, but I’m not so foolish as to want to revisit them…not when the future holds so much promise for even better mis-steps!
By Kyle
November 19, 2007 9:45 PM | Link to this
DOB one thing that I think should be mentioned is the fact that Glavine should be going against “weaker” competition in terms of him being the #3 starter vs. other teams #3’s. I think it fair to assume he will be a take a slight regression because of his age. But one positive is we should be able to score more runs which may allow him to stay in a game longer than one he might not be able to if he gave up four runs to somebody’s ace.
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 9:51 PM | Link to this
Man I had forgotten about Thorman until Wayne brought him up. Please please someone tell me he will not be on our roster next season. He has got to go. He is just one big hole on the bench and a waste of a roster spot. If Lillibridge is not on the Big team heading into the start of the season then someone needs his head examined.
Please no more Woodward’s, Wilson’s, or Thormans that will do nothing for us but take our money and cost us outs and games. If some of these kids are as ready as some of you say they are then options and seasoning be damned bring them up to help us win games. We already have most of the future with us now at every position except pitching, CF and third and Chipper is hopefully be with us a while longer.
By Braves4Ever
November 19, 2007 10:00 PM | Link to this
Gorky was rated the 2nd best baserunner in all of theminors, 1st in the AA level. Lillibridge was rated 4th best in AAA by Baseball Prospectus.http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6931
By Adoro los Bravos
November 19, 2007 10:01 PM | Link to this
Flange, Uga-Brave, what happened with Lerew?
By Efrim
November 19, 2007 10:04 PM | Link to this
I don’t think Carlyle or Cormier will factor into the 2008 Braves.
I think Chuck James would have to have a bad spring to lose his job next season. Not to mention, I think it wouldn’t hurt if Jo Jo Reyes and Jair Jurrgens began the season at Richmond next year.
Jeff Bennett would make a fine swingman, similar to Oscar Villareal.
Not sure how the rest of the bullpen will play out, but hearing that the Yankees really want Mahay makes me think he will be too pricy. If that is the case, I am sure Wren will go into the Winter Meetings looking for a reliever.
Personally, and this may seem odd, but why not give a call to Pittsburgh for Damaso Marte? He has progressed over the last 3 seasons. It might cost a little more than we want, but I think Marte would be pretty valuable. Brian Fuentes would be a serious reach though. The Rockies would definetly want too much and I think he is owed about 5 million next year. Marte would be the better option.
By Random
November 19, 2007 10:05 PM | Link to this
TheSouthernJackAss, October 28, 2007 6:47 PM:
TheSouthernJackAss has nothing else for this blog, and this blog has nothing for me, you won’t need to ban me, for I won’t be back.
Little ambiguity or “nuance” there, is there?
TheSouthernJackAss, November 19, 2007 1:30 PM:
One last word … you pukes listen up…and listen real good…there is quite a difference between blogging here on a regular basis versus an occasional comment from time to time…terrible reflection on the state of educational quality and effectiveness in the public school system that TheJackAss would have to explain that simple, elementary concept to you nosy A$skissers…and know this…TheSouthernJackAss will blog here as often as he wants…and there is nothing that anyone can do about it
Am I the only one smirking?
By Austin
November 19, 2007 10:14 PM | Link to this
I think Hampton’s recovery is pivitol to the succsess in ‘08.
After the all-star break in Hampton’s 1st year and when he has been healthy as a Brave he has been great. If he pitches effectivley than (assuming Chcuk wins the 5th spot) James will be the best 5th starter in baseball. He had a 4.24 ERA last year which is pretty darn good.
By Ricardo
November 19, 2007 10:22 PM | Link to this
Don’t post much but read comments several times a day. Looking at Efrim’s comments, I think that Bennett just might have whatever that mystical “something” is and heretofore has been a victim of bad luck, or a late bloomer (or both) that we got lucky enough to find. In his limited time in ATL he certainly had the physical stuff to compete and while I understand the point of comparing his potential role to that of Villereal’s I think he stands a good chance to improve on that as the season movers on. I wouldn’t be blown away to see him move into a 4-5 role during the year next year and be sucessful. Just an somewhat educated guess….
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 10:28 PM | Link to this
Guys, concerning the possible fringe rotation guys. Personally, I don’t see Carlyle being a factor at all. Also, I wouldn’t be surprised if Cormier isn’t traded, or non-tendered. He has been a decent prospect, but with the likes of Jurrjens, Reyes, Bennett and James being in the mix, I don’t see him making it.
Also, as far as Lerew goes, you guys might be right about him s’ing in his mess kit, but I would love to see him given one more chance.
Enough of my rantings, it is time to bring some religion to the blog: I want either Ryan Church or David DeJesus as our next CF acquisition!
How ‘bout that! Just daring the blog monitors!!!
:-)
PS: TexasBrave Thorman is an interesting player, in that if we drop him, he might come back to haunt us, if Tex does not resign. I agree that he had a bad year, but as someone has pointed out a few times, he has taken a year or so to get used to each level. Wouldn’t it be a shame if we traded him for next to nothing, or dropped him, and he came back to be a 260-25-85 guy!
Thorman had 50% of the AB’s that AJ had last year. If he had batted as much as AJ, their numbers would have been similar, ESPECIALLY, if Thorman had batted in the cleanup hole as much as AJ did. Now, I am not saying those numbers from AJ were any good, but just a comparison.
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 10:35 PM | Link to this
Ricardo Agreed on Bennett. That’s why they play the season out, so that the cream can rise to the top.
I also like Austin’s comments on the rotation. If Hampton does make it, then he and/or Glavine will be going up against the #4 on the other team, and CJ goes against the #5.
I like the idea of extending out the rotation, so that guys get a little extra rest. That would be a good subject of discussion some night.
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 10:40 PM | Link to this
A thought on available third basemen. Does anyone else have serious misgivings about any team that might pursue Cabrera of the Marlins? He has gotten REAL heavy, and he is a poor fielder.
Glad we have Hoss in the saddle!
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 10:41 PM | Link to this
wayne,
i agree on your assesment of thorman. i believe he will have a major league career, just have a hard time believing that he is going to be our primary LH on the bench.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 10:42 PM | Link to this
I recall the “scandal” with Lerew. I’m sure he didn’t please anyone with his vox on the subject. But I gotta think that, if he comes back well and produces, he’d still get a look. This team has given players second chances many times before for worse offenses.
By Random
November 19, 2007 10:44 PM | Link to this
OK folks, NEW BLOG is up. All Glavine.
Okay! All right!! ALL Glavine!!!
So, like, what’s the deal with salt and pepper, anyway? Is pepper, like, 10 times as expensive as salt?
‘Cause, like, the little salt and pepper packs you get at food joints? There’s like about 10 times as much salt in the salt packs as there is pepper in the pepper packs. There’s hardly any pepper at all.
Or, you know, is pepper like maybe 10 times more powerful than salt? Or maybe 10 times as many people like salt as like pepper? Or maybe everybody likes ‘em both, but they like salt 10 times as much? Or a tenth as much. Whatever.
What gives, anyway? Anybody know?
Maybe the subminimum wage workers filling the little packets prefer pepper to salt 10 to 1, so are ten times as likely to pilfer pepper as to salt the salt away? Or maybe it’s 10 times easier to fill the salt packets?
By Austin
November 19, 2007 10:50 PM | Link to this
I’m sorry but I dont ever see Thorman as anything other than a back up 1B. Yes, he is still young, but his hitting style kills me. I love his hustle. I just dont think he can be a productive starter at this level.
By TheSouthernJackAss
November 19, 2007 10:55 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the cut and paste RANDUMB…those comments of mine did bear repeating…
By BraveNess
November 19, 2007 10:55 PM | Link to this
RANDOM > You may be the only one that would admit to smirking. Smirking is, well, how do I put this…NOT admirable. Neither is mocking a good denizen. You may need a standup guy like SJA to back you up one day or compassion from others when life throws you or a loved one a random curve. Trust me on this.
Best leave it alone and find something else to talk about.
By kinley
November 19, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this
DOB:
Just wondering what the word is on Willy Aybar. Haven’t heard anything about him since he checked into a substance abuse program or something.
Thanks
By Random
November 19, 2007 10:57 PM | Link to this
OK folks, NEW BLOG is up. All Glavine.
Oh, OK.*
Who here besides me (maybe me, I’m not sure) thinks that the main reason Glavine turned down the Mets $13M is because he knew that the Mets were planning to decline to exercise the option themselves?
*FYI, DOB: “Oh, OK” was a local Marietta/Atlanta band, probably a bit before your time in “the city too busy to hate”. (As in, “I just can’t bring myself to hate Atlanta – it’s such a busy city”???)
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 11:00 PM | Link to this
Wayne I hear you man, but it is not something he is going to be able to work out coming off the bench. He might come back and be the next best thing. But do you really want him back next year with the hole in his swing where he either hits it out or strikes out with more of the latter?
Also being as young as he is and not a big headed vet (AJ) he should have been able to work on it with Terry and at least improved before the years end. I saw nothing to show me that he had been making any changes.
If Tex does leave then we will probably have to go out and get someone. Thorman’s current swing tells me he is not the guy.
I don’t quite get your point about the comparison with AJ. But I think it only helps my arguement against Thorman because we will need to replace Tex’s numbers and Thorman will not come close.
By Paul Hamilton
November 19, 2007 11:02 PM | Link to this
Is it true the Braves have to give up #18 overall pick next June plus a supplemental pick as compensation for signing Glavine??? Are you kidding me? Two picks??? Baseball has some really stupid rules! This trade doesn’t look that great when you take that into account.
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 11:04 PM | Link to this
Braves are going to set their 40-man roster this week, so we might know Braves futures of a couple of guys real soon…
Braves now have three of the NL’s top five last season in number of quality starts (Glavine was fifth)….
Lew, that Warren Buffett angle is priceless, isn’t it? I love that. Remember we were talking the other day about the differences between rich and wealthy? Compared to Buffett, even ARod is merely rich.
By Kentavo
November 19, 2007 11:09 PM | Link to this
I still don’t like the idea of the Braves thinking they’re gonna get something out of Hampton. With Smoltz and Glavine’s age - this is a very creaky rotation. Yes, it’s nice to see Tom back, but I wish they would go for the jugular and get another young-ish proven starter. Wasn’t it last year they were telling us that the rotation of Smoltz, Hudson, Hampton, James and Davies was the best in the East, and perhaps the N.L.?
I guess that’s the way it is - with bums like Gil Meche getting $50 mil we’re never gonna see the Braves sign a marquee pitcher again. The only hope is through trades and player development.
By Bob, Journalist
November 19, 2007 11:09 PM | Link to this
flange1, I hold you in high regard and sincerely appreciate your comments. I share the thought and belief that the vast majority, if not everyone on the Blog shares your feelings relative to our situation as it relates to my wife’s health.
Some have expressed the view that under the circumstances, it would be appropriate for some consideration to my circumstance in evaluating my behavior on the Blog … while I am appreciative of such sentiment and my Blog persona champions the notion that we should always use our third eye and give more weight to the “why” than to the “what” in evaluating the behavior of the blogger … as I have previously stated, I expect absolutely no quarter be extended as a result of our situation when I put on the leotard.
Following a responding post to ChrisKlob some time back, in which I expressed the desire to do as it appears you may now be requesting, I made the conscious decision not to further impose upon the Blog, opting instead to distribute that presentation to selected residents, including David O’Brien and the AJC … with the Blog’s knowledge that I was so doing, and with each recipient given permission to distribute that presentation, in whole or in part, at their discretion.
Circumstances have not permitted completion of that agenda and the prevailing attitude may preclude unbiased evaluation, regardless of individual view, but it shall be done.
I recognize the blog as one intended for a general audience, including children and the genteel and, while it is my intent to clearly address the issues, the intended audience for my presentation will be neither the first grader nor the mentally challenged.
That said, I certainly intend that it address the issues associated with the situation from my perspective to your full satisfaction … however, it is not my intent for it to in any way be prostituted in order to achieve that result.
The conclusions you reach are your own but, regardless of what may appear obvious, I assure you that I have had neither the time nor inclination to visit the Blog on a regular basis … and when I so do, it is generally to read the opines of selected friends of long standing.
“I am finding that giving respect is the price of receiving same” … Bob McBrayer, 1956
By Paul Hamilton
November 19, 2007 11:10 PM | Link to this
Err sorry had trade on my brain. I meant signing.
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 11:11 PM | Link to this
Austin You might be right about Thor. For my money (and it is NOT my money!), I wouldn’t be so quick to cut him loose just yet.
Lots of folks wanted to quit on Pete Rose early in his career, but he worked his tail off and made it happen. What do you wanna “bet” that Thor could do the same? (a little Pete Rose gambling humor!)
:-)
By David O'Brien
November 19, 2007 11:16 PM | Link to this
Kinley, you missed a lot on Aybar. He got out of substance-abuse rehab in August, then was just about to start playing in the minors when he broke the hamate bone in his right hand. Had surgery, then started playing in Dominican Winter League last month. He got off to a real good start, but I looked today (stats were very hard to read on the bad website) and it appeared he was hitting about .260, couldn’t tell anything else in his stats.
Braves haven’t indicated what his status is, his odds of being on next year’s team. But he doesn’t play shortstop anyway, and neither does Prado. So they’ve got to get a utility guy to handle that.
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 11:20 PM | Link to this
Bob, J I have missed our late night conversations, although I too have not visited as frequently as in the past, due to family obligations and such.
Give my best to your beloved, and please remember that the two of you are in my thoughts and prayers.
By TheSouthernJackAss
November 19, 2007 11:32 PM | Link to this
Better keep your finger on that delete button…
By TK
November 19, 2007 11:37 PM | Link to this
I guess Willie Aybar’s brother Erick will be the SS for the Angels?
By uga-brave
November 19, 2007 11:40 PM | Link to this
how about those thrashers getting back to .500 before thanksgiving. and to think they started 0-6.
still hope that wren has something more up his sleeve. hard to believe this offense is going to be better minus renteria and jones. if thats the case francoeur and mac are gonna have to be much better.ya gotta figure chipper’s only gonna play 140 at best. gotta find a reliable backup there and at short.
By TexasBrave
November 19, 2007 11:41 PM | Link to this
Bob, J I don’t have a clue as to what is going on and what has been or not said nor do I want to know. As the school year starts my blog time gets cut down somewhat although I do get on to read the ongoings of the vets of this blog from time to time. However, I do know that your presence has been and would be sorely missed if you decided to curtail your opines.
Know that I also will keep you and yours in my thoughts and prayers.
By GSU-Lee
November 19, 2007 11:42 PM | Link to this
DOB, You talk to Smoltzie yet about Glav comin back?
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 11:43 PM | Link to this
If the Braves are thinking about Lillibridge in a similar role that Escobar had in 2007, then they are certainly not tipping their hand.
What utility SS’s are out there to be had??
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 11:45 PM | Link to this
they’ve got to get a utility guy to handle that.
Yes. So long as it is not Woodward or any other Miami Vice character. This includes Cesar Izturis.
By TennesseePaul
November 19, 2007 11:48 PM | Link to this
TK: I think they are speaking of moving Wood over there (a prospect). But I wouldn’t be surprised if they made a trade for one of the Miguels. Tejada would work seamlessly into the line up. Cabrera would still need Wood or Chone to move to a new position. Chone is a great utility guy, but his exprience is most robust at non-SS positions.
By Wayne in Utah
November 19, 2007 11:56 PM | Link to this
uga: Just a thought or two. Escobar for Renteria, is close to a wash. KJ must keep it together. If you consider that Tex is replacing what we hoped to get from AJ, then all that the CF needs to do is to replicated Thorman’s output to put us equal to last year.
Nothing scientific, but if we have a CF’er who can get on base, and maybe hit 15 dingers, that wouldn’t be so bad (Ryan Church, anyone?).
I too would love to see a blockbuster deal for a top flight pitcher, but I am not sure I would want to give up what it would take to get one. Does that make sense?
Next year we will still have some question marks, but if things fall into place, it could be a very good year.
I think you are going to be surprised by what we get from guys like Jurrjens, Reyes, and Bennett. (yes, Jared, Bennett!)
:-)
Gotta run tonight, as I have other work to do.
Maybe tomorrow we get some religion in Blogsville, ie. Church or deJesus!
By Ghost of Rico Petrocelli
November 19, 2007 11:58 PM | Link to this
Can we put the posts of those arguring over hurt feelings in color so they’d be easier to scroll past?
By uga-brave
November 20, 2007 12:03 AM | Link to this
speaking of super-subs, who would of thought that mark derosa would be enjoying his current success. the guy made the rangers as a non roter invitee a few years ago and parlayed that into a very nice contract with the cubbies. he sure looked DOA after that one bad year for us. couldn’t happen to a nicer guy.
By kinley
November 20, 2007 12:06 AM | Link to this
Thanks for the update DOB. I had heard about him breaking his hand, but for some reason thought that was before he entered rehab.
By wgcallahan
November 20, 2007 12:07 AM | Link to this
welcome back Tommy but let us not be overjoyed because the Braves have shown that over the last several seasons that there is intention to keep players that keep this team winning, Remember the Braves choose not to bring Tommy Back alone with Greg and now Andrew. We keep a player like hampton who has not earned a Dollar in a Braves uniform,pitchers in the bullpen that cannot deliver chipper who has not had a season without getting hurt in several years and we will lose bobby next year alone with tommy, and john our furture in Atlanta Baseball is very dim and can only get worse.
By Overlord
November 20, 2007 12:13 AM | Link to this
Has glavine missed any starts last 2 years?
How is his arm doing? no pain there?
By N8
November 20, 2007 12:17 AM | Link to this
Niekro35
While assessing the Braves 2008 rotation, and the cast of characters to fill the 4th and 5th spot, you said:
“There’s no way Wren keeps them all.”
I wouldn’t be so sure of that, the way the rotation has gone the last couple of years. After all, there is no guarantee Triple-J can handle on of the spots, Chuck needs a 3rd pitch, Bennett is an unknown commodity (over the long haul), Jo-Jo barely has half a season under his belt, and god knows we shouldn’t rely on Hampton for ANYTHING (if he pitches, GREAT, but I’ll believe it when I see it - I am rooting for him though).
I think it really depends on how the CF situation pans out, whether we move a pitcher or not. If we NEED to we will to fill a void elsewhere on the roster. But Wren won’t (and shouldn’t) give away pitching just because we have “too much”. There is NEVER too much pitching.
As somebody said earlier this week, I’ll second the notion that Richmond is gonna have one helluva rotation next year.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 20, 2007 12:18 AM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist If I have not done so in the past, please give my most sincere best wishes for a full recovery to your bride. I can hardly fathom the depth of feelings I would have if I were to be in your shoes and have such a horrible illness befall my spouse. It is with warmest regards that I extend to you my extreme for your musings on this blog.
That being said, I also understand the principal for which Dave O’Brien has tried to adhere in keeping those two hot bed topics of religion and politics out of the blog. I myself was a bit taken aback by the sharp retort of his admonishment towards you on that fateful day but who among us has not said or written things in the heat of the moment not realizing the impact words and the tone in which they are spoken may have.
This is the last I will speak or write on the matter as the topic has become a pall over the blog defeats the very purpose of the blog to begin with and that is to enjoy the banter of all things Braves.
If you wish to correspond with me, I would enjoy doing so vis email if you are so inclined to become infrequent to the blog. I miss all of you, yes even you SJA when you are less inclined to be vulgar but please guys, let’s get back to the business at hand.
My email address is elliotgm@aol.com
Please guys, no hate mail and I already have enough spam……
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 12:22 AM | Link to this
wgcallahan: are you kidding me! a post like that doesn’t really deserve a detailed response. You show your lack of baseball knowledge on several fronts, whether I agree with your ascertions or not.
We kept Hampton because we were paying him anyway. And he pitched extremely well when healthy. And it must be Chippers fault he gets injured? And we chose not to keep TG and MadDog, and now Andruw. Were you watching AJ last year. You wanna spend 15+million for that type of performance?
All I can say is, WOW!
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 12:27 AM | Link to this
Gil. Oh heck, now you may have to endure the wrath of the stinkmeister!
By Bob, Journalist
November 20, 2007 12:27 AM | Link to this
Braveness methinks you are indeed a wise man!!
Most Honorable Southern might say that what he says needs no defending and that he needs no champion … that may well be true but … he has more than one defender and champion … behind the mask is honesty, integrity, and a pure heart … and I think even his harshest critic would agree that his loyalty to his friends is to be envied! We may frequently disagree on form and matters of self expression, but methinks rarely on substance.
His delightful honesty, integrity, and acumen often lost in the colorful self expression of the SJA persona but we’d all benefit by taking time to look behind the mask and and take advantage of his insights and wisdom.
That’s my view … I’m most proud of our friendship and of him!
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 20, 2007 12:28 AM | Link to this
Okay fellows, time for this old horse to call it a day. I don’t think anymore breaking news is forthcoming tonight. DOB Thanks for the updates and info on Tom Glavin and his return. I was fortunate enough to see him when he came up through Richmond but he is the only one of the “Big Three” I have not seen pitch in person in an Atlanta Braves uniform. Hopefully that will happen this year.
By N8
November 20, 2007 12:28 AM | Link to this
wgcallahan
Wow! You complained about roster moves that literally had NO bearing on us NOT continuing to win.
I’m surprised you didn’t complain about Murphy being traded to make room for Justice. Hell. I’m still mad about the Brett Butler trade.
Sorry had to give you crap.
BTW: AndrUw is spelled with a U, not an E.
As far as you saying Hampton has “not earned a Dollar in a Braves uniform”??
Ironically, until this upcoming season, he literally hasn’t cost us a dollar to have him on the roster. Between Colorado, Florida and insurance, the Braves have spent very little on him. Besides from 2003-2005 he made 72 starts, going 32-20 with a 3.96 ERA. Seems to me that he earned whatever we payed him those years, and since insurance paid a big portion of the 2006 & 2007 salaries, what are we really out? Spooneybarger? Whoopie!
So if he comes back succesfully this year and wins 15 games, that salary this year won’t seem so bad in today’s market, will it?
Educate yourself before posting something so silly.
By N8
November 20, 2007 12:33 AM | Link to this
Wayne
I hit “POST” on my last post, then read your 12:22.
Great minds think alike, huh? Right down to the use of the word “wow”. LOL!
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 12:36 AM | Link to this
All of joebrave’s acquaintances,here know that I’m not particularly,stoked at the fact Wren decided to Bring T.Glavine back,however:I do think it makes the Team a little better,that being said,I would personally like to invite Keith Law on down to these here North Ga.Mountains,so I can introduce that Stankee/Mutts lovin SONSABITCH,to a Damn good dose of My Boot Leather..I really don’t know who’s worse,Terrence Moore,Keith Law,or those Whiny @ssed Tennessee Titan Fans!!!geesh,get a damn day job pathetic losers!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By Random
November 20, 2007 12:37 AM | Link to this
TheSouthernJackAss (Nov 19, 10:49 PM)—
So the “every day english” bottom-line for you is that DOB did NOT “simply [tell] Bob,J that politics and religion aren’t welcome subjects on this blog”, and furthermore did NOT “merely [say] ‘not here,’” but rather DOB “[went] a bit beyond” and “even more beyond” and actually “talked down to [a grown man] in that manner.”
Well, that explains it – I daresay the whole blog is now rallying to your cause. We all know that grown men “take exception” to being talked down to (immediate addressee et freres excepted).
Sure, DOB gave Bob, J “a little more than a simple reminder to not talk politics or religion” – but as Bob, J himself confessed, he was a repeat offender. He was well deserving of a series of rebukes of escalating severity (your context-free reinterpretation makes it seem that 28 Oct was the first time that the no politics “rule” had ever come up).
SJA, I have read and considered both parties’ remarks, and posted my comments. Have YOU read or considered anything but your own ever-shifting positions?
Give it a rest – nobody would be beating the dead horse if you three did not keep dragging it back into the barn.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 12:41 AM | Link to this
Overlord, Glavine had the blood-clot scare in his shoulder in 2006, but missed only one start, if I’m not mistaken (I know he didn’t go on DL, because he never has). Turns out it was easily treated with nothing more than baby asprin, if I’m not mistaken. Other than that, hasn’t had anything more than the typical pitchers’ arm soreness that I know of….
GSU-Lee, I talked to Smoltz tonight, he was out when I called earlier and by the time he called back, I’d already punched my story. Put a quick quote from him in the online story later. I’ll put some more stuff from him in the next blog later in the week.
Suffice to say, he’s extremely happy to have Glavine back, and somewhat surprised, he admitted, that it got done, that it got done this quickly or perhaps at all. He’s encouraged by the moves Wren has made and the comments from McGuirk about payroll.
By Random
November 20, 2007 12:42 AM | Link to this
BraveNess—
Thanks for the advice – it rings true and I do trust you.
However, in this case, I think SJA is quite worthy of mockery – as are we all who post here, depending on what we say and how we say it.
Thanks again. And I guess we’ll just have to agree to disagree about the value of a well-timed smirk.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 12:45 AM | Link to this
Top of the Evening,Lew,Savannah Guy,Klob,SJA,jjs,Bob journalist,hope all goes well with your better half sir,Carolina Lady.
SJA how’n the he11 ya been my friend?????????long time no blog..Hope all is well with you this Holiday Season…
Ransom,dude lay off,I have been dealing with the Earthly Trolls as of late out in the Real World..Don’ want to del with your pining for lustful attention!!!!
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 12:53 AM | Link to this
Now about that CF problem,one has to wonder,if Nate Mclouth,could be had????deal say,Eric Campbell,and Joey Devine,to Pitt,for Mclouth,and Damaso Marte?????
By BabyGoatEater
November 20, 2007 12:57 AM | Link to this
WOW!!!
Thats what all this crap is about?
NOTE TO CASUAL BLOGERS
If you finally got tired of all this non-sense (for lack of a better word) and decided to go check out what all this “disrespect” all the great almighty consistent bloggers are talking about……don’t. It’s all over politics. Yeah….I know, we aren’t supposed to blog politics but someone did. Then he got yelled at by “the powers that be”, and he and some of the other knights of the round table went to war with Dave.
WOW!!!!! That was it……so very disappointed. Thought it was actually worth my time.
now on to Glavine.
Guy deserves to retire a Brave. Hope he pitches like the Tom I remember from my youth (only 24 here). Don’t think he will, but then again, never thought he out-pitch Smoltz or Maddux and he did a few times.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 12:57 AM | Link to this
And what becomes of Sir Lancelot now?????alas,it appears that a mighty boot is about to swing,and lift the river dust from some random breeches!!!!!!!!
By Random
November 20, 2007 1:03 AM | Link to this
Here’s some lustful attention for you, good buddy:
joebrave
10:46 PM Random,I would also inform you,that the same Mr.Asselstine,was traded to the Blue Jays,along with an obscure pitcher,for Doyle Alexander’s first go around with Atlanta,yes the same Doyle Alexander that brought John Smoltz to the Braves………
11:40 PM December 6, 1979: Traded by the Atlanta Braves with Pepe Frias to the Texas Rangers for Doyle Alexander, Larvell Blanks, and $50,000,
Excuse me I was wrong about the Blue Jays,but rght about the players!!!!!!!!
11:43 PM with the exception of Asselstine,who did make the Blue Jays roster after a release by the Braves in 1982
11:54 PM Duane Ward was traded to the Blue Jays for Doyle Alexander….
Ahem… .
Yes, joebrave, you WERE rght — if by ‘Asselstine’ you meant ‘Devine’, and if by ‘rght’ you meant ‘repeatedly and obnoxiously wrng’. Thanks for clearing things up for us, buddy.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:10 AM | Link to this
Random,just ynking your cord my man,so don’t be offended,however,we are all here to pass the off-season,and discuss,BBQ,Music,and Braves Baseball,not be judged by merits other than our own,take some good advice,let it rest,don’t be so uptight,and enjoy a healty dose of Braves Baseball…A fight with SJA,Myself,Lew or any one else here is not a healthy diet to be on..I should know,While SJA,needs no defender of His honor,I will state that He,and I have butted heads before,been banned before,and I’d like to think earned respect for each other,and finally became friends….It happens that way,when you take a look at the Whole picture and put away your False securities!!!!
Everyone here knows,joebrave takes no gump,nor does SJA,but on the same note if you are SJA”S friend,or joe’s friend,Yo @ss is always covered,don’t believe me Ask,some of the Fine folks on this MIB blog!!!!!
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 1:13 AM | Link to this
GoatEater, glad you pointed that out about Glavine pitching well against Smoltz and Maddux. Reminded me about a stat I wasn’t able to get in anywhere today.
People have the impression that the Braves killed Glavine just about every time they faced him as a Met, and it’s not true. They beat him like a rented mule the first couple of years, but after Glavine made adjustments in his approach, going inside a lot more, expanding the pitch repertoire a bit, he improved against everyone including the Braves.
He was a remarkably bad 1-8 with an 8.91 ERA and .364 opp. avg. in his first nine starts against the Braves in ‘03, ‘04 and early ‘05. But after June 2005 Glavine had a 2.47 ERA and .232 opp. avg. in his last 10 starts against the Braves.
He was only 3-3 in those latter 10 games, in large part because the Mets scored two runs or fewer while he was in six of those seven games he didn’t win.
So his overall stats against the Braves (4-11, 5.15 ERA in 19 starts) are a bit misleading.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:14 AM | Link to this
See what I mean,You insist on being the class jerk,Your the kind of tough guy that likes to sneak up on,Freshmen an roll your dime store claa ring around and give them a good lick on the head,thn think its funny….Well tough guy once again,I give you a chance to heed some good advice,just food for tought….let it rest!!!!
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:19 AM | Link to this
DOB,what is the status on Neifi Perez??? Could he be a possible solution at reserve SS for Los Bravos?????
By nOLIE
November 20, 2007 1:20 AM | Link to this
Between those two deals and Andruw, Boras has, in my opinion, lost much face, and when he can’t get Andruw the mega bucks he thinks he is worth, we’ll see just how much power the guy really has.
unfortunately that might make him even more aggressive in shopping Tex next season trying to prove that he still has it,
By mr baseball
November 20, 2007 1:27 AM | Link to this
Not sure if he would be willing to pay for what the Braves are likely to offer, or accept reduced playing time, but Loretta would absolutely be a perfect fit here. He could platoon as needed at 2B, provide a solid veteran backup up 3B and SS and can also play 1b for the handful of games Tex needs a breather.
Ex-Brave Tony Graffanino would also be a good choice if healthy. If nobody else is available, Martinex from the Dodgers would be a barely acceptable fallback choice.
Not much affordable OF help available on the free agent market. Any upgrade to CF will probably take a trade.
By uga-brave
November 20, 2007 1:28 AM | Link to this
joe brave,
last i heard nefi perez was serving a banned substance suspension.
By BabyGoatEater
November 20, 2007 1:31 AM | Link to this
Dave,
Does Mike Hampton have a no-trade option in his contract. I see maybe trading a mid 30’s lefty as soon as he has value…..say when he has a good start next season…
Any chance?
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:32 AM | Link to this
One other piece of advice,Random,accept it or not,you keep on with you meaningless banter \,and keep putting sand spurs in the sand box,and sooner ,and sooner than you think,if your not banned,you’ll probably be 95% censored,not by IT,but by the other bloggers!!!
Last time,I offer,Sir,and I only do so out of repect for others here,that I have the utmost respect for…..
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:35 AM | Link to this
Thanks UgaBrave,didn’t know what became of Perez. I like the Loretta idea,that may be a very good option….
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 20, 2007 1:36 AM | Link to this
Aybar is hitting .265 in 49 at bats , 3 RBI’s , no HR’s. He has played in just 14 games for the Tigres Del Licey Dominican winter league team. O’Brien , I’m not sure what website your accessing , but it’s much easier to use the Braves/MLB home website. Just dig into the Roster/minor league affiliates/Richmond/stats. Then click on the corresponding players name and his winter league stats will show up. You will have to go back to the 2006 stats for Aybars name and current winter league numbers.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 2:10 AM | Link to this
GoatEater, that’s funny.
Yeah, I’d say after more than two years away from pitching in a major league game, and two elbow surgeries, one or two starts ought to have teams lined up to take on his $15 million salary next year. Braves should have no trouble dumping that chunk of change on someone, and maybe getting some good young talent in return, right?
(OK, I know you’re kidding, which is why you won’t mind my sarcasm. You were kidding, right? Right?)
By Scooter McNutts
November 20, 2007 3:21 AM | Link to this
Uh-oh!!
This isn’t going to be pretty!
A couple of pending smackdowns!!!!!
Things might ugly, head for cover!!!
By Caleb
November 20, 2007 3:33 AM | Link to this
DOB, I know you’ve answered “options” questions a ton this year, but if a player is out of options, does that mean he just has to be on the 40 man roster and can play in AAA, or does he have to be on the 25 man roster playing at the major league level?
I don’t post much, but I read the blog almost every day. Is there anyway to ban idiot posters (i.e. Robert)?
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 3:54 AM | Link to this
Robert,you’re a Stupid Ba$tard!!!!!
By Caleb
November 20, 2007 4:26 AM | Link to this
Also DOB, what’s Carroll up to during the offseason? Haven’t seen her on the blog in a while.
Thanks for all the work and info.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 20, 2007 4:41 AM | Link to this
Caleb , options are confusing to say the least. Just ask Scott Thorman :>)
If a player is already on the 40 man and out of options , he cannot be removed from the roster without passing through waivers.
A player can be added to the 40 man while still on AA or AAA minor league teams.
The situation of (being out of options) usually occurs when a player is already on the 40 man or both the 40 man and 25 man rosters.
I’m just going to cut and paste the following information and you can read it.
An option (optional assignment) allows a club to move a player on its 40-man roster to and from the minor-leagues without exposing him to the other 29 teams.
After 4 or 5 years as a professional, a player must be added to his club’s 40-man roster or exposed to the 29 other clubs in the Rule 5 draft. (A club has 5 years to evaluate a player who signs his first pro contract at 18 years old or younger, but only 4 years to decide on a player who signs at age 19.) For purposes of calculating years as a pro, the counting begins the day a player signs his first pro contract, not the season he begins to play.
When a player is added to the 40-man roster, his club has three “options,” or three separate seasons during which the club may to move him to and from the minor leagues without exposing him to other clubs. A player on the 40-man roster playing in the minors is on optional assignment, and within an option season, there is no limit on the number of times a club may demote and recall a player. However, a player optioned to the minor leagues may not be recalled for at least 10 days, unless the club places a Major League player on the disabled list during the 10-day window.
After three options are exhausted, the player is out of options. Beginning with the next season, he must clear waivers before he may be sent to the minors again. See Waivers. Additionally, a player with 5 years of Major League service may not be sent to the minor leagues on an optional assignment without his consent.
Counting option years
By richie
November 20, 2007 7:47 AM | Link to this
Good Pick up….Now let’s get Tommy and John to talking Maddux into coming back here to be the #4 starter at the trade deadline…Bring the Old 3 back together for 1 more run…and help tutor the young guys even more.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 20, 2007 8:31 AM | Link to this
Serbok Ask me to tell you a joke about LBJ and Ho someday…..
I will leave everyone with this bit of advice, take it or not but it has served me well.
Everyone has a different definition of friend and just how far you go to defend that person. A real friend tells an individual what he needs to know, not necessarily what he wants to hear.
By Sam
November 20, 2007 8:32 AM | Link to this
Wow, Robert (or is it Bob?) - a new low. I didn’t think you were capable.
By tfbrave
November 20, 2007 8:35 AM | Link to this
Coach If you want a little easier way to access a players WL stats. Go to www.milb.com. Near top of the page in player search key in “Aybar” or whomever your looking for. You will get a list of players matching including Willy’s point and click and you get his stat sheet.
By Random
November 20, 2007 8:41 AM | Link to this
richie—
Nice idea (7:47 AM) — I’m with you on that.
By The Grinch
November 20, 2007 8:52 AM | Link to this
Morning, all. On my way to school and just thought I’d inquire if Serbok’s rant is ok because it’s anti-Bush? I didn’t realize it depended on the viewpoint.
Nolie, I was worried about the same thing, that Boras might take out his frustrations on the Tex negotiations. I kind of wish he’d find a new line of work.
Later.
By chrisklob
November 20, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this
Grinch, Nolie…. With this “bad” offseason that Boras is experiencing so far, it makes me wonder if some of his clients won’t take a hard look at his style and tactics and ask some difficult questions of themselves. Is Boras the type of agent that I want representing me? Has he lost credibility with GM’s around the game? Can he still get me the best deal?
Next year Tex is a free agent. It is well known that the Yankees and a couple of other clubs will be in need of a slugging first baseman. Will Cashman and the Steinbrenners be willing to negotiate with Boras or will he have to do it himself?
Boras loves to get multiple teams engaged in bidding wars. He also loves to create “demand” for his product, or at least the perception of demand. Boras needs the deep-pocketed Yankees to be in the bidding for Tex next year.
Nothing would please me more than for Boras to lose a bunch of his marquee players and for Tex to sign an extension during the season.
Grinch, I am also a little perturbed by Serbok’s little rant. We havent’ seen him in forever and he pops up from nowhere and spews this political stuff out??!! Whiskey Tango Foxtrot! I thought we had some rules around here!
By flange1
November 20, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this
Good Morning All,
Never seen it so ugly in this blog.
Think I need to call the principal and tell on all the bad guys who hurt my feelings…Maybe I can get them banned….
By flange1
November 20, 2007 9:29 AM | Link to this
DOB,
Could you possibly see about removing the posts from Serbok abd Robert? They are both not approprite for this blog.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 10:09 AM | Link to this
Grinch i believe serbok was ignored because he was clearly being abrasive, not trying to engage in dialog. it wasnt worth addressing. but youre right.
serbok dont be stupid and bring that junk on here.
By StingerSplash
November 20, 2007 10:11 AM | Link to this
So a 41-year-old pitcher whose last three starts were, well, bad is a Class A free agent, and a CF who might be one of the best defensive outfielders ever and isn’t that far removed from a 50-homer season is a Class B type? That’s no knock on Glavine — glad he’s back, hope he enjoyed the Thrashers game last night, guess the private box wasn’t a part of this deal either.
By chrisklob
November 20, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this
Stinger, those ratings are from Elias and are based on the past two years performances. Face it, AJ stunk it up for the last year and a half. Defensively, still great, but offensively, well, let’s just say his offense was offensive!
By Carolina Lady
November 20, 2007 10:26 AM | Link to this
Well, I heard there was something going on over here and decided to check it out. Probably would have joined in had it not been for a Mexican on a backhoe with a penchant for cutting utility lines out on the highway. That was probably for the best because once a person loses someone’s respect, it’s almost impossible to earn it back. :-)
We should all be so blessed (can say?) to have friends who will stand up in the face of certain storm on our behalf in matters, including matters of principle. How many here would garner that degree of support?
As to what can be posted, it has long been apparent that posts filled with vile language and cursing are accepted with impunity. And politically, it depends on which ‘side’ is presented; one is acceptable, the other is not. Decidedly one-sided.
There is much I would LIKE to say but discretion and restraint prevent it, as well as the fact that others have done admirably in that regard. I’ll only say, based on some comments I’ve read, that several here need a long, thoughtful look in the mirror with some honest self-examination. Some masks have slipped and revealed more than was intended, it appears, and has left me with a real sense of disappointment in them.
Whatever. Y’all enjoy your baseball stuff. I’m going back where I was before this quick visit. Happy Thanksgiving to those who participate in giving thanks. CL out.
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 10:27 AM | Link to this
Lets get some religion this morning: how ‘bout a trade for Ryan Church or David DeJesus!!!
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 20, 2007 10:29 AM | Link to this
Oh, Robert, what would this blog be without you? Why you attacking DOB, man?
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 20, 2007 10:33 AM | Link to this
Serbok, DOB has repeatedly asked that politics and religion not be brought up on this blog. Why are you doing it? Are you just trying to incite conflict? I’m not saying you were wrong in what you said, but there is absolutely no place for it here. Keep your politics to yourself or go on other blogs and chat sites where those topics are perfectly acceptable.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this
if anyone thinks we need to trade chuck james this offseason…for ANYthing, they need to reconsider. james definetly has somethings to work on, but his stats say he is one of the elite young pitchers in the majors right now. there is absolutly NO WAY the braves should trade him. he is NOT tradeable as far as im concerned.
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this
How many years removed from a 50 HR season is George Foster?
By tim
November 20, 2007 10:37 AM | Link to this
I think glavine is a good pick up for 8 million. I don’t see another pitcher of his talents going for 8 million
By chrisklob
November 20, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this
Greetings CL! It is always a good day when you grace this blog with your presence!
By DAP
November 20, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this
wayne tsk tsk… you know better than to bring that on here! And if you arent deleted, this will only fuel Carolina Lady, Grinch and other to feel even more victimized… youve open a can, wayne. of worms.
by the way, did you read that wren brought up blanco as a possible CF next year? unsolicited! vindication… :-)
By Thrillhouse44
November 20, 2007 10:48 AM | Link to this
DAP, I think we need to be very careful before we trade any starting pitchers. Remember last year right before the start of the season when we thought we had a surplus of starting pitchers? Then Hampton went down and Cormier followed. The the “bargain” we got in Mark Redmon blew up in our face.
By tim
November 20, 2007 10:49 AM | Link to this
Chuck James is a solid 3/4 right now. I think in 1-2 years he will be a solid #2 and he doesn’t cost an arm and a leg. He is only tradeable for a #1 or young #2. IMO Glavine and Smoltz will both have great years. Glavine because he won’t have to travel and will be closer to his family. Also, Glavine and Smoltz have a big rivalry. They will try to outdo each other in friendly competition. Glavine pitches 3 hit shutout 1 night. Smoltz needs to get a no hitter to beat him. I hope anyways
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 10:50 AM | Link to this
Stinger, Klob said it: Based only on past two seasons. And really, far as I know, almost solely on statistics, which don’t include defensive stats.
Glavine had pretty strong totals in innings, quality starts (fifth in NL last season) and winning percentage over the past two seasons.
That said, I, too, was shocked to hear Andruw wasn’t even in the top category. A guy who hit 92 homers and drove in more than 250 runs during 2005-06. Alas, the ratings have gotten tougher under the new CBA, and his 2005 stats are not figured in whatsoever….
Flange1, it’s a shame, isn’t it? Blog was absolutely the best and most civil it’s been for the past several weeks. Just a pleasure to come on every day and converse with folks.
Then the clique that apparently couldn’t care less about the announcement of the return of one of Atlanta’s all-time pitchers and anything else to do with baseball, brings back its personal agenda and its hurt feelings and anger, and succeeded in turning the entire blog back around and angering many, many others.
Oh, but don’t you know: The dozens of other regulars, and hundreds if not thousands of casual bloggers, don’t count as much as The Four.
And those angered or offended by one guy’s renouncements of some others’ morals, lifestyle choices and political bents, those folks don’t matter nearly as much as that one guy because he had — we all agree on this point; it’s inarguable — a very rough, sad, real-life situation in his personal life, but one that apparently was supposed to give him carte blanche to repeatedly — not once, repeatedly — bring up said personal/political beliefs that offended many others, even after being deleted and/or warned in the past.
And it was also supposed to apparently warrant kid-glove treatment by all others, who should be fully aware of his personal situation at all times, whether the rest of us are working all day, on deadline, writing from a crowded pressbox at a World Series game, or anything else. (It’s a blog, folks. Lighten up a bit. Take the grave, serious stuff to more appropriate venues where it won’t color, or be expected to color, all other conversations).
Sad. Absurd, how long this whole thing has continued. And a couple of the ones who’ve exploited the situation should truly be ashamed of themselves. Sorry, but it’s true.
Do friends don’t exploit situations like the worst offender in this situation did last night at 6:37 p.m.? I’d suggest they don’t. But this particular guy’s used this situation from the get-go, bent it, twisted it, exploited it for all its worth. And now seems hurt and surprised at the backlash.
Hey, when you’re doing your e-mail writing campaign, make sure to mention the multiple rants (I’ve saved the deleted posts) that triggered my frustrated and angry response to this thing, and how those posts condemned certain lifestyles and political views.
I’m betting those posts won’t garner a lot of sympathy for you from the higher-ups. Or have you not heard of a little something called diversity training, and how extremely important ours and most companies view it these days?
So make sure to mention the details. If it comes to that, I certainly will.
Now, you can get back to whining and pleading for attention.
The rest of us will try to ignore you and get back to talking about enjoyable subjects that aren’t centered around ourselves and our personal problems and issues. Because that’s not what the Braves/MIB blog was meant to be.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 20, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this
tfbraves, I’m not looking for his(Aybar) stat sheet. I can google that information. The MLB/Braves link leads to his current winter league stats. That is what I was referring to.
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this
DAP Yeah, I saw that bit about Blanco. I just wished he would have included Lillibridge in the mix, but oh well. Good luck to Gregor this spring!
BTW, just trying to even out the blog from my friend Serbok’s rant from last night. Gotta get some religion now and then…..
:-)
see ya later….
By Alan
November 20, 2007 10:56 AM | Link to this
‘Morning, all. Methinks everyone needs to take a chill pill or something. Anyway, how about this guy for the backup SS job: Wilson Betemit! I can’t believe his name hasn’t come up in the past 24 hours or so. I’m hoping this will stoke the hot stove just a bit and get folks’ minds off less important matters. Oh, and by the way, the Glavine signing is terrific in my book.
By DdOoUuBbLlEe SsTtAaNnDdAaRrDd
November 20, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this
Well it looks like I’m going to be around here for a long time!
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:03 AM | Link to this
The two offensive overnight posts are being removed. If I’d seen them before now, they would already be gone. I didn’t. We don’t have enough staff to catch most of this stuff 24 hours a day.
I posted last night at 2:10 a.m., shut down computer, and slept like a rock. Got up late. Just now catching up with posts.
Serbok, even if you’ve had a long night, don’t bring that stuff here. How can you expect to post that and not have others with differing views posts theirs? We don’t want that crap here, man. Say it to friends, say it on other blogs, say it on e-mails, put it on a bumper sticker, shout it to the heavens, but keep it off here. Got it? No more.
As for the other guy, he’s a joke nobody takes seriously anyway. We’ll have him banned again, hopefully he said just enough to get his brilliant self back on the banned list.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 11:03 AM | Link to this
Thrillhouse44 right on, man. i dont really see a reason to trade any pitching anyways. after this year, glavine and hampton will both be gone. weve got to have guys ready to take those spots, unless we resign one of the veterans. if we DO trade a starter, to me its gotta be carlyle or cormier. other than that, we need to hold on as tight as we can to these young pitchers.
tim absolutly agree on james. the kid isgreat for a #4 NOW, thats before he gets any better. i think he will get better, and i think he will learn a new pitch he can use effectivly. his stats right now are comparable to jared weaver, and who wouldnt be pumped to have him?
By Carolina Lady
November 20, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this
DAP, I’m not in the least bit victimized. You’re making incorrect assumptions. Shame on you.
By Austin
November 20, 2007 11:12 AM | Link to this
Tommy has done pretty well in the wifr department, she is beatuiful!!!
By uga-brave
November 20, 2007 11:14 AM | Link to this
i think wyatt justed gunned down the clantons at O.K. corral.
By ncscoots
November 20, 2007 11:14 AM | Link to this
Jeez Louise. How’s this for a plan: why don’t all the self-anointed blog police give it a rest?
Some here clearly labor under the misapprehension that their likes or dislikes of other posters’ content actually matters a tiny tinker’s damn, and thus feel compelled to admonish, reprove, and otherwise beat the rest of the blog about the head and shoulders. News flash. This blog doesn’t have a moderator, and it isn’t accepting applications for the job.
Scroll past any offending posts, if you know how to use a scroll bar, but spare me the indignation, otherwise. I don’t care for blog drama, either, but I care even less for the self-righteous arrogance displayed recently by some posters here.
At last report, this blog isn’t ruled by the mob, and content doesn’t require consensus. Deal with it.
Or, in the words of so many blog police recently, “get over it”. And yourselves.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 11:14 AM | Link to this
Alan betemit….? interesting. i hadnt thought of him. whats his contract status? i think we would have to trade to the yankees for him…but he wouldnt be a bad pickup. hes a good bat off the bench, to. maybe the yankees would take some relievers for him. im sure they arent gonna make him their starter at 3B.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:18 AM | Link to this
DAP, Thrillhouse: I’m pretty certain Braves wouldn’t even consider trading one of the starters until spring training, and only then if all were healthy and a trade might fill another need while still leaving the Braves with seven starters for five spots.
And I don’t think they’d trade one of the young prospect pitchers, because those are guys you don’t deal unless it brings you an impact player at another position — and the Braves seemingly aren’t going to be looking for big-impact position players between now and opening day, since their regular lineup is going to be comprised of guys now in the system.
By j-School Dropout
November 20, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this
DOB:
Please tell Tommy that this is one Atlanta fan who never wanted to see him leave and is glad to have him back. I cringed at the thought he might go in the HOF in a Mets cap. Hopefully, he, John, and Greg will be in their in Braves caps. I never rooted against Tommy personally, but I hate the Mets. I’m so glad that I can now embrace Tommy as one of my favorite players again. I know he’ll have some bad games this year. He had some atrocious ones in his prime, but maybe he’ll also throw a few gems. I can’t wait. Wish we had Greg again, too. But that would be too much to ask for.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:22 AM | Link to this
Caleb, Carroll is quite busy this winter helping out with coverage of all our pro sports teams. She’s had multiple stories on the Hawks and Thrashers, and yesterday she did one of the Glavine stories.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 20, 2007 11:22 AM | Link to this
Here is something I thought about last night. The Braves say they are increasing payroll but not adding any more starters and there are very few relievers worth spending a ton of money on. Francisco Cordero could be the exeception. Could you imagine him in the 9th with Soriano in the 8th and Gonzales in the 7th and 8th when he gets back? Anyway back to my point. If the payroll isn’t going toward pitching then it must be going toward offense. Now, this may sound crazy but it could possibly work. The Braves trade Diaz and Prado/solid mid level prospect to the Yanks for Johnny Damon and the Yanks agree to eat around $12 mil of the remaining $26 on Damon’s contract. The Braves can put Damon in LF where is less of a defensive liability. That would leave CF to a battle between Anderson and Blanco or even Schafer. Damon gives the Braves a solid veteran presence in the outfield along with his presence in the clubhouse which can only be positive. This would allow B. Jones to ease into the position without much pressure. Also, I would hate to see Diaz go but Damon is a good hitter with 20 HR power. The Braves could have him leadoff or even hit down in the lineup to protect guys like Francoeur.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 11:23 AM | Link to this
Carolina Lady no im not. and im not ashamed.
Alean i just looked at some more info on Betemit. dude is a free agent! i did not know that. i think he would be a good signing! he is a guy that can play 3B, 2B and SS, he switch hits with power…his avg is down but he hit very well with the braves before. i know aybar was supposed to me his mini me but aybar doesnt play SS. i wouldnt mind having him back at all. plus, he didnt even make half a mil last season.
By Lew
November 20, 2007 11:27 AM | Link to this
Well-It’s snowing pretty hard up here in Central Vermont right now-the first big snowfall of the year this far south (it IS relative, y’all). With three Doctor visits today in the cold, white stuff, I don’t have time to worry about the political climate (the cold white one is enough for now, thank you) and the closest I got to religion was yelling “Good Lord”, when the car in front of me started sliding across the road (wish THEY would get the snow tires put on like I did).
However, there is no shortage of heating oil and gas came back down to $3.05 here in town, if only for a day, so that is certainly SOMETHING to rejoice in. Not too sure how much I’ll rejoice in the $700 I will hand to the garage tomorrow, though, but at least I will know that the car will stop when I put on the brakes.
Like I said last evening-There is major potential in all of us here on the blog (and anywhere for that matter)to be not only full of ourselves, but full of crap as well. We would all do well to be aware of this and perhaps for all of us to have a modicum of tolerance for others. However, that being said, I really am glad NoBrain Zone has seen fit to absent itself.
By chrisklob
November 20, 2007 11:29 AM | Link to this
j-School Dropout, rest assured, all three that you mentioned will be enshrined with a Braves cap! The HOF is a museum. THEY decide which cap a player will wear in the HOF from a historical standpoint. The player no longer has the right to choose.
By MGL
November 20, 2007 11:30 AM | Link to this
DOB - Thanks for the efforts to keep things straightened out, the drama has been a little much the last couple of days.
By uga-brave
November 20, 2007 11:31 AM | Link to this
dap,
i think betemit is kind of in that lerew category. neither are bobby favorites.
By chris
November 20, 2007 11:31 AM | Link to this
Don’t count me among the Chuck James backers here. His ERA last year was respectable, but deceiving. It was the worst 4.3 ERA I’ve ever seen. He was inconsistent, often had trouble getting through the fifth inning, and was a major participant in killing the bullpen. All of this is because he has never learned a 3rd pitch and doesn’t read scouting reports.
The fact that after two years in the rotation, he’ll be battling for a fifth spot should tell us everything about how he’s regarded by Cox and co. And he’s not exactly in competition with the likes of Warren Spahn for that spot.
If you read the comments of praise for Glavine by Wren and Cox, you can infer their criticism of James.
My guess is that they’ll see how Hampton holds up in the Spring and then trade him.
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 11:32 AM | Link to this
I know he didn’t go on DL, because he never has
Wait, Glavine has NEVER gone on the DL? Or was that a figure of speech? If so, that’s truly amazing.
Oh, and I like the idea of personal attacks and such being in a different color so we can scroll through them. Kudos to that.
By Austin
November 20, 2007 11:33 AM | Link to this
Glavine never wanted to leave the Braves. I beleive he was 36 at the time, and I’m pretty sure that he wanted one more big payday. Who can blame him?
DOB Is anyone going to give Julio a job this year?
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:37 AM | Link to this
DAP, Betemit only made $405,000 last year because he wasn’t eligible for arbitration. He is now, has over three years of MLB service time now.
Betemit’s got some pop (14 homers last season), but let me ask you: If you didn’t know him from his Atlanta years, would a guy who hit .229 with a .332 OBP season, with 82 K, 38 walks and only 12 doubles in 240 at-bats, really be attactive?
By Arkansas Hillbilly
November 20, 2007 11:43 AM | Link to this
Lew, Please, for the love of __, don’t eat the yellow snow.
By Overlord
November 20, 2007 11:46 AM | Link to this
DOB thank you for that info, i asked that q because i think i read somewhere that there was something wrong with his arm in recent years (2006-2007), but maybe it was that event you are mentioning. If that was the case, it is nice to know it was only that. But it is really weird that a 40 YO goes through a blood-clot, even more as he is an active guy and is not obese.
In the other hand, Wren and Bobby said Hampton has progressed so good, that the glavine move apparently is the last pitching move they will do during the winter. I just hope they are right because if not, i dont think we are going to be in a position much more better than last year (glavine and smoltz might not do any better than last year, and theres a good chance their numbers will fall a little more…… thats nature).
By KC
November 20, 2007 11:48 AM | Link to this
Kentavo:
Yes, the Braves do believe they’re going to get a contribution from Hampton this year. But the difference between this upcoming season, and where they were heading into spring last season… is that they are not COUNTING on Hampton.
If Hampton makes it back as expected this year, he should be help to help. It would be a HUGE stretch to expect 200 innings or an ERA of 3.30… but if healthy, he should improve as the season progresses. There will be ups and downs, but if all goes well, maybe he’ll be back to performing at a reasonably high level come September.
If he gets hurt again… no big deal. After all, he’s our 4th starter. We would still have 3 solid starters, and 4 good young arms to vie for 2 open jobs.
As for Smoltz’s and Glavine’s age… I think the Braves have a good situation. They have some veterans holding things down while the young guys develop.
And Smoltz and Glavine have been a couple of the most reliable starters in the business over the past few years. Not to mention the fact that they’ve been pretty damned effective (especially Smoltz). No reason to think this is the year when their arms will suddenly fall off from old age.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 11:50 AM | Link to this
LEW There is major potential in all of us here on the blog (and anywhere for that matter)to be not only full of ourselves, but full of crap as well. We would all do well to be aware of this and perhaps for all of us to have a modicum of tolerance for others.
you are absolutely right. thank you for that reminder. i think many people, myself especially, need to be reminded of that often.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
November 20, 2007 11:51 AM | Link to this
I wouldn’t be one to get all giggly at the notion of getting Betemit back, but we’re looking for a backup, not a cornerstone. Be careful how high you set your standards for a backup shortstop…else you might end up getting Woodward-ed. That said, I’d still go the Lillibridge route, me.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 11:54 AM | Link to this
DOB youve got a point, but i think the fact he switch hits, plays all infield positions and has that pop would get my attention. he came off the bench with some big homeruns against the braves i would have remembered for sure.
either way, hes not the worst back-up SS option. but, clearly not the best either.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 11:57 AM | Link to this
In the last 3 years combined:
Frenchy: .280, .319, .463, .782
Betemit: .265, .337, .455, .792
At least with betemit there would not be too much of a dropoff when he fills in. betemit should not be a starter but he is a very valuable backup to me. PLus, Betemit’s teams are 115-87 when he starts the last three years. Shows how much things don’t drop off when he starts.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
November 20, 2007 12:00 PM | Link to this
Lew, I potentially would respond to your “major potential” statement, but I’m too busy trying to look up the word modicum.
By Wilson
November 20, 2007 12:01 PM | Link to this
Remember, it is Bet-a-meet, not Bet-a mitt!
By DAP
November 20, 2007 12:01 PM | Link to this
Chris james is “battling” for the 5th spot, but i think it will be alot like how kelly johnson “battled” for the 2B job last year. the 5th spot is james’ to lose, and thats mostly because of the other guys in the rotation.
smoltz and hudson obviously deserve a spot, glavine was just signed and of course he isnt gonna be “battling” for a spot, and hampton’s getting paid a hefty amount, so there is no way he is sitting.
THAT is why chuck will be in the 5th spot, not because he isnt good. again, i dont think there will really be a competition. the spot is his. i challenge to find a pitcher better than james with around 48 starts in the majors. one that is JUST a starter and didnt relieve for a long time. youll only find one, and its no shame for jared weaver to be a little better than you.
there is always a possibility that aplayer will get worse and not better, but it to early to say one way or the other on james. hes been really good so far, thats for sure, and i think he WILL get better.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
November 20, 2007 12:06 PM | Link to this
modicum—a small portion: a limited quantity.
We don’t get talk like ‘at ‘round here in the oil patch. We have a lil bit of tolerance or jus a hair of tolerance.
By wjones
November 20, 2007 12:06 PM | Link to this
Someone on the blog recently was asking about Jeff Densberg. I don’t know if anyone ever answered them , but I believe he died within the last couple of years, though I can’t remember the cause. If I’m wrong on that, I’m sorry, but I do believe I read that.
By eware
November 20, 2007 12:14 PM | Link to this
DOB, I’m a little worried about my boy, Chuck. I really want him to be a part of the rotation, as he’s fun to watch. He won me over that first game he pitched (where Todd Pratt coached him through it) and after every inning he couldn’t keep from smiling. Great baseball.
Anyways, people say that Chuck needs to go more than 5-6 innings. It doesn’t seem to be that he loses his stuff in the later innings, just that hitters figure him out by the 2nd or 3rd time through. My question is, how do pitchers work to get around this? Learn more about the batters/lineup? Just wondering…
Also, thanks for the req on the Dwight Sings Buck album. Fantastic. A friend of mine asked me the other day, “If you could have the voice of one musician, whose would you want?” (Not necessarily who you think has the best)
I’d have to say that Dwight’s would be in my top five with: Waylon, Muddy, Plant, and Merle. I’d probably have to lean towards Waylon though.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 12:20 PM | Link to this
Attention fans of The Band: Levon Helm’s new solo album, “Dirt Farmer,” is really solid. If you haven’t heard it, check it out. If you like them, you’ll love it. Same vibe. Great stuff….
Oh, and Brave are setting their 40-man today, as required for Rule 5 draft. Wouldn’t expect anything major, since they have a couple of spots available now. They’ll add Morton and perhaps a couple other pitching prospects, I’d imagine. Only need to protect guys they fear would be snatched up by other teams willing to keep those players on their 25-man rosters the entire season (usually that’s pitchers, since teams can stick them in bullpen as last guy and carry them during season to develop a guy who might have great stuff but is still raw).
They might have to designate a player or two to make room, but won’t be anyone major, I’m sure. Woodward’s not on the roster anymore, for those keeping score on him.
Guys like Schafer and Lillibridge don’t have to protected yet, so I’d expect them to be invited to spring training as non-roster guys.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this
eware, that’s a terrific list. great idea, too.
hard to move aside any of those, but I’d absolutely, positively have to have Johnny Cash, Joe Strummer, Frank Sinatra. Elvis Presley and George Jones on my list. So it’d have to be 10.
And let’s throw in Bob Marley and John Lee Hooker and make it a Big 12, if you will.
By nOLIE
November 20, 2007 12:27 PM | Link to this
I wouldn’t be one to get all giggly at the notion of getting Betemit back, but we’re looking for a backup, not a cornerstone. Be careful how high you set your standards for a backup shortstop…else you might end up getting Woodward-ed. That said, I’d still go the Lillibridge route, me.AH
I’m not so hot on Betemit. i always thought he was way overrated coming up and believe me I took a lot of hits on boards for that unpopular opinion. Mainly at this point I don’t think he is agile enough to still play short regularly, and he is eligible for arb this year I believe . I agree that they should give it to Lillibridge, but that is not Bobby’s usual modus operandi.
By uga-brave
November 20, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this
wjones,
pretty sure your right about that. denberg covered the hawks and the nba in the 80’s early 90’s. before the braves got rollin, ninque and the hawks were the best (only) show in town.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 12:31 PM | Link to this
Chris If James stays the same that he was last year he will be one of the best fifth starters around. Does he need a third pitch, yes, but working on one during the season would have been difficult, especially to develope enough confidence in it to use it.
Right now we know what we can expect from him and for a fifth starter that is not half bad at all. The hope is that he will listen to Glavine and pick up a few things to make him better. If he does it will make him a valuable asset in the years to come when all the old vets retire or go to other teams (Hampton).
Keeping James in the rotation will also allow the others to get valuable seasoning down on the farm so they are ready when called on if an injury occurs or better yet next year when we lose one or more of our current starters.
Anything can happen over the course of a season, see last year as a good example, and we will need all hands (and arms) on deck just in case.
By chris
November 20, 2007 12:31 PM | Link to this
DAP: Maybe you’re right, but I’m highly doubtful that the 5th spot is James’s to lose. It’s not like 2B. It’s marginal enough that it usually goes to a rookie or a veteran trying to hang on. James is more valuable in a trade than there. I suspect that it’s going to go to Bennett. We’ll see. Anyway, there are plenty examples of young, soft tossing Braves left handers who fail to improve after their initial season. Chen, Moss, Ramirez — Schuerholz managed to get something in return for them before they completely imploded. I think that a guy with two pitches is not one with a long shelf life. We’ll what Wren thinks.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 12:31 PM | Link to this
Wait, how’d I forget Van “the Man” Morrison.
OK, a Lucky 13. A baker’s Dozen of all-time (male) voices.
You add females, and you’ve got a lot more on the list: Patsy, Aretha, Loretta, Tammy Wynette….
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 12:32 PM | Link to this
Now that Woodward’s going to be officially gone, I’m crying inside because my blogname no longer has any relevance to our team anymore.
I’m going to hold this against the rest of the bloggers and complain about it from now until the end of next season to DOB as punishment.
So there.
By kdbanks
November 20, 2007 12:33 PM | Link to this
Hey Gang,
Happy Thanksgiving early. I’m off to Green Bay to see family.
Couple of thoughts:
Lots of talk about how Glavine changed his approach and got better. Anything more specific than he started pitching inside and added pitches? What pitches? What can we expect to see him throw this year?
Also, it’s very possible that Glavine will be the steal of this free agent period. First, $8 million a year is a good deal for a mid-level starter, and he may be better than that. Second, it’s a one-year deal so money isn’t locked up into 2010 or whenever.
DOB, I respect the heck out of you. Keep up the good work.
Gobble! Gobble!
KDB
By Steve C.
November 20, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
Hey DOB,
Not sure if this up your alley or not, but have you checked out the double CD of Bruce Springsteen and The Sessions Band Live in Dublin? Pretty cool songs, some Irish folk, but really solid musically…
By Renegator
November 20, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
DOB:
Speaking of Big 12 - this is the weekend of the big game. Got any predictions on the big game?
Are you going to the game?
By chris
November 20, 2007 12:39 PM | Link to this
DAP: I also disagree about Chuck being really good. He wasn’t much last year. He killed the bullpen. I doubt that the Braves would have signed 41 year old Glavine — another soft tossing left hander — if they thought James was up to the job.
By geauxbraves2000
November 20, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this
I agree, if Hampton is healthy, one of the biggest “IF’S” in history, CJ is the #5 man. I have no problem keeping him in that slot if he can come up with another pitch. He gives up way to many HR to stay on a big league roster, and if they start adding up again in ‘08, then it’s time to give someone else a chance.
As far as Hampton, I honestly don’t think he’s going to be ready when the gates are opened, putting CJ #4 and whoever at #5.
Geaux Braves!!
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 12:46 PM | Link to this
I think a problem with Chuck is that he is just too inefficient because of the lack of pitches in his arsenal and because he might not understand the hitters because he does not study them.
If he had a third pitch or studied hitters more, he could go for the out pitch earlier in the count and finish the hitter off faster.
He averages 3.89 pitches per plate appearance and 16.6 pitches per inning. This brings him closer to the 90/100 pitch count earlier where pitchers generally start to lose their effectiveness.
Not understanding hitters or not having a third pitch to help out when you are fatigued or losing your stuff helps lead to a quick hook and inability to get maybe an extra half inning or extra 5-10 pitches.
Chuck - 3.89 pitches per plate appearance, 16.7 pitches per inning, 89.7 pitches per start.
Glavine - 3.91 pitches per plate appearance, 16.7 pitches per inning, 98.3 pitches per start.
Hudson - 3.41 pitches per plate appearance, 14.1 pitches per inning, 93.1 pitches per start
Smoltz - 3.60 pitches per plate appearance, 14.9 pitches per inning, 95.9 pitches per start
They all tend to hit the wall at the same number of pitches. Hudson and Smoltz just tend to get there later than James and Glavine do.
Although James and Glavine tend to get there at about the same time, Glavine is better able to tough out an extra half inning or so and 9 extra pitches out of his start when his stuff is running out than James probably because he has extra pitches and a better understanding of hitters to get over that last little bit.
By Jim
November 20, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this
I agree with DAP,
It is way too early to write off Chuck James. His record before August last year was quite good — comparable in ERA and wins to pitchers like Matt Cain with similar time in the majors. I am willing to attribute his fall-off after August to a tired arm. He may have only given 5+ innings per start, but he threw way too many pitches in that span. He was at, or near 100 pitches by the 5th or 6th inning in practically every start ( and in 158 innings probably threw the equivalent number of pitches as somenone closer to 200 innings). Hopefully he will become more efficient with his pitch count with experience.
If you looked at Dice K in many of his starts, you would notice the same thing. Dice K throws harder and has a greater variety of pitches, but by the 6th inning his pitch count is near 100 and he becomes very hittable the third time through the lineup. Even with his assortment of pitches, he has trouble putting hitters away and gets a lot of foul balls and deep counts — very reminiscent of Hudson in 2006. The point here is that, while a third pitch would be nice, there have been some very successful major league pitchers that did not throw hard and relied on 2 pitches almost exclusively that have been very successful (Maddux & Glavine for instance), and having an assortment of pitches and throwing hard is not a sufficient condition for success. Chuck needs to improve his location and work ahead to get better results. Most importantly he seems to have the makeup to be successful with what he has. (Last year was the first time in his career that he experienced any real lack of success. Let’s see how he deals with it and how it affects his confidence next spring.)
By Overlord
November 20, 2007 12:50 PM | Link to this
Chris,
I think James spring is his last chance to prove himself, otherwise he will be shipped for some bench help, i just keep hearing he is really good, but he keeps showing nothing more than 4 strong innings and collapse in the 5th. He might have tons of talent, but his place right now is nothing better than 5th spot on a strong pitching staff that wont torture its bullpen. Braves werent exactly that last year, they could be this year, but they are not as we speak.
By Dan
November 20, 2007 12:55 PM | Link to this
Who are the most likely candiates for the braves bench in 2008?
By DAP
November 20, 2007 12:55 PM | Link to this
DOB the big 12 hunh? everyone knows the SEC of music is far superior! :-)
By wjones
November 20, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this
While we are dealing with “ifs”, IF Hampton is maybe not ready to go 5-6 innings out of ST, and IF we don’t land Mahay or another comp lefty relief specialist, might Hampton work in that role until he gets to the point where he could comfortably go the distance as a starter? Maybe even a situation where he and James could “piggy-back”, i.e., rotate back and forth between starts and the pen. I know it’s unconventional and probably will never happen, but someone will try this in a similar situation one day and they will be declared a genius.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
Steve C, I love that Springsteen sessions album from Dublin. Terrific stuff.
By chris
November 20, 2007 12:58 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave: You make some good points about Chuck. I don’t get the sense that the brass is high on him, though. Neither Cox nor Wren have said the 5th spot was his to lose. You have to admit that that’s telling for a guy with two years on the rotation with his stats.
I’d be interested to know if there are similar pitchers who needed a third pitch after two years in the league and went on to have success.
By eware
November 20, 2007 12:59 PM | Link to this
DOB, Good call on Elvis, man. How could I leave off Elvis?!! Heck, I’m even from Memphis - this is embarrassing.
Speaking of Memphis, how awesome are Booker T and the MG’s? That’d be my backing band, fo sho. Green Onions, baby.
Long live Stax.
By tim
November 20, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
chris, you don’t have to be a huge fan of chuck james. Just imagine we had a #5 starter that had a .500 record instead of the 5-25 record(guess) that our 5th starters had last year. We would win the division by 5 games. You need to compare him to other #3-5 starters in the league and you will see he is a good pitcher to have on the team. If you compare him to Smoltz and Hudson he looks like garbage but who doesn’t
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 20, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
DOB…i’m gonna have to add Chris Cornell to the list, although maybe a sub-set list as he may not be on a legendary level of the ones you have noted, but he deserves recognition for being one of the more recognizable and impressive rock vocalists around…if i could sing like him…man..being a pacific northwest guy i would be shameful to not add eddie vedder..
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
…. and we didn’t even mention the great soul/R&B singers that HAVE to be on any such list: Otis, Marvin, Wilson, Soloman Burke, James Brown….
I can’t do it, eware. I can’t do it in less than a Top 20.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 1:03 PM | Link to this
I also would not be against if the Braves feel that Jurrjins, Bennett, Reyes or anyone else is ready to compete against the big boys and have nothing to gain by staying on the farm, to replace Oscar with Chuck and move one of those other guys into the fifth position.
Chuck was almost always good for three innings which is the most you need from your long reliever anyway. And if something were to happen to one of the main guys he could slip back into the roll of a starter.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this
I also disagree about Chuck being really good.
But yet Chuck somehow ended up ranked #24 in a 16 team league in ERA for pitchers with over 160 innings pitched. Glavine was ranked #26. Smoltz was #4. Hudson #7. The Braves now have 4 starters in the top 33% of all NL starters.
A #5 starter ranked #24 in the 16 team league. Shouldn’t the number 5 be ranked more like 65-80 in a 16 team league?
And even if you take it down to 100 innings pitched, Chuck is still ranked #33 in a 16 team league. Again, if he is so terrible, shouldn’t a #5 like Chuck be ranked somewhere between 65-80 in a 16 team league?
By chuckw/deadjournalist
November 20, 2007 1:05 PM | Link to this
of the available free agent (back-up) shortstops, wouldn’t chris gomez be a good option? maybe royce clayton? one would think either of these guys could be had for the minimum.
too bad luis hernandez, the all field, no-hit, prospect who is with the o’s isn’t in the braves’ system any longer.
By Jim
November 20, 2007 1:07 PM | Link to this
Lew,
The folliage has been very late to change and fall this year in the Hudson Valley (hello Howie from Poughkeepsie). Are the leaves down in Vermont before your snowfall?
By chris
November 20, 2007 1:07 PM | Link to this
Good stuff, Bravehart.
By flange1
November 20, 2007 1:08 PM | Link to this
DOB,
You heard the new Fogerty? I bought it and the new Neil Young from Ella Guru last Saturday and I can’t get the Fogerty out of my CD player. Yes, it is a little rehash, but I do enjoy a littele Creedence song!
By Brandon
November 20, 2007 1:10 PM | Link to this
DOB,
A lot of things about the Glavine signing worries me.
After seeing the deal the White Sox just made, why not do Renteria for Garland straight up instead?
The deal must have been out there as Renteria is miles ahead of Cabrera.
Is there any reason?
By Lew
November 20, 2007 1:15 PM | Link to this
Hillbilly-Not even a tad bit, son? No yellow snow for me. I don’t eat much of anything these days and where I live, it’s hard to tell whether it was deer, a fox, a coyote or my Golden Retriever/Border Collie mix that left the yellow trail. Send me an email at lewhartman@comcast.net Got something I want to discuss with you.
Overlord-Chuck’s last chance to prove himself? Are you serious? The guy has won 11 games both of his first two years in MLB and the Braves have won 58% of his starts and who is under team control for four more years. All of this for a team that came in third two years in a row. He might have to prove he can go an inning longer per game, or that he can make it through the batting order the third time, but his last chance to prove himself? I don’t even think so.
By beachcomber
November 20, 2007 1:16 PM | Link to this
Enjoying the singer’s names being thrown around in addition to a little ball.
May I submit for consideration a contemporary of many of those names and my personal favorite - Roy Orbison.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 1:19 PM | Link to this
Chris no doubt Chuck is on shaky ground. IMO I see so much potential in him especially if he develops at least one more pitch and will listen to Glavine on how to read and study hitters. I really see him as a solid #2 someday if he will continue to develop.
However, with that being said if he is not working on a third pitch during the offseason and going into spring then he might just be shipped or as I said before moved to a long relief role. For progress to be made he must have confidence in a third pitch before going into the start of the season.
By Oregon_Braves
November 20, 2007 1:21 PM | Link to this
Dave - Don’t know if this is on your radar or not, but the 20th Anniversary of The Joshua Tree is out today. It has the remastered original, an extra bonus outtakes disc, a DVD of a concert from 1987 and a 56 page hardback book. JT is nearly as holy a CD as I own.
All of this begs a question, though. How in the hell can Joshua Tree be 20 years old?!?
By uga-brave
November 20, 2007 1:22 PM | Link to this
braveheart,
i think the negative bias toward chuck is because how he really faded down the stretch. i remember one start against the giants in august where he basically was looking in the dugout to get out of the game, granted he already had given up three dingers in two innings, but he looked like he had no answers.
one of the reasons we could not string anything together after the tex trade was because we just did not have that solid three guy.
it was probably a little unfair to believe that james was going to be a three guy in his 2nd year, but there were a couple games where he looked pretty indifferent.
By Alan
November 20, 2007 1:24 PM | Link to this
DOB, I’m the guy who raised Betemit from the dead, as it were. I figured just the mention of his name would fire up some dialogue, and it seems to have done just that. For a mediocre player, he sure has a lot of fans. Kind of the Larvell “Sugar Bear” Blanks of this era. I like him myself, actually, and I’m sure he’d be a big improvement over last year’s backup SS - plus he’s versatile and a switch-hitter. I didn’t realize he’s a free agent - I thought the Braves might have to trade someone like Thorman to get him - the Yankees can use a left-handed hitting first baseman with power. It’ll be very interesting to see the Braves’ 40-man roster. Something tells me that Willy Aybar won’t be on it. Therefore, it would be poetic justice to bring Wilson B back, wouldn’t it?
By Lew
November 20, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this
Jim-We have been in stick season for several weeks, now. Usually by the middle or end of October, the rain puts all of the leaves on the lawn up here in the North Country. There are parts of Vermont that have not had temperatures over freezing for the last two and a half weeks. All of the ski resorts are open and some have been for a couple of weeks (even with no snow, it’s cold enough for them to use the machines).
Now music-I was at the Music store last night and they were playing the new CD by The Decemberists. I had never heard them before and I walked home with the CD (the latest Graham Parker, too). Got plenty of music to listen to when the snow is too deep to venture out in.
By chris
November 20, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this
It was the weakest 4.3 era I ever saw, Bravehart. He gave up over 30 HR’s in 160 innings. Geez. Look guys, I admit I’m not a huge fan. But I love the Braves and I want him to do well. I just think he’s more valuable in a trade than in the 5th spot. And I don’t think a guy who’s dumb enough not to think he needs to read scouting reports is going to get any better.
By tim
November 20, 2007 1:26 PM | Link to this
Texasbrave, maybe not even a 3rd pitch if he can throw the other 2 with better control. I noticed that he will be flying threw the first 4 innings looking unhittable. He gets in trouble a lot around the 90 pitch mark(guess) also a lot of the home runs are hit when he is behind in the count. If he could pitch the 5th through 7th innings like the first 4 he could be a #2
By rammerjammer
November 20, 2007 1:29 PM | Link to this
I floated the James/Prado for Crisp trade but agree with the suggestion that ANY trade of a starting pitcher should wait until spring training at the earliest.
As it stands today, we have five proven starters and three additional starters with potential. That’s a good mix, with enough possibilities to sustain us in the event of injury or diminished performance (both of which are possible, if not probable).
Maybe Wren’s just trying to light a fire under Chuck by grouping him with a trio of unproven pitchers.
But you have to watch this. Bobby’s M-O is to stop talking about a guy just before that guy is sent packing.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 1:29 PM | Link to this
chris disagree if you want…the stats dont lie. james has made 48 starts in the majors. thats a little less than a season and a half, and his record is 22-14. thats not even simply decent. thats really good. in 2007, he wasnt as sharp, but still pitched well for what was his first full season in the majors. he showed flashes of brilliance and what i would call dominance in some of his starts, as well.
just a snapshot ,
sept. 19 he went 7 innings, gave up 2 hits walked 1 struck out 6. that is awesome.
may 12th he pitched 7 innings, gave up 1 hit, no runs, and walked 3 to get the win.
games like this dont happen very much with him, but they does happen, which i think shows he is capable of alot. a bad pitcher doesnt just get lucky and throw gems like these. he might not pitich deep into games, but often, he will pitch a quality 6 innings and give the team a chance.
find me a starting pitcher with only around 48 starts with better stats, and lets talk about that.
By tim
November 20, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this
I think betemit is not what the braves need. I love his swing and the power he shows and he seems to have all the potential in the world. Potential doesn’t get hits. We need someone that can get base hits to drive in runs and get rallies started off the bench. I’ll take a bunch of base hits over the 9 K and 1 HR every 10 at bats that we PROBABLY would get from him. I kept thinking that Betemtit would fulfill his potential but after this many years I’m starting to give up on him.
By chris
November 20, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this
Braveheart: By the way, your 12:46 post was good stuff.
By Efrim
November 20, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this
DOB
Any chance the Braves are looking into any of the Japanese relievers that are available?
I know the Indians are close to a deal with Masahide Kobayashi.
Is there a chance that they would spend some cash on a reliever from the far east?
With Okajima’s success in Boston, I’m sure many major league teams will be looking into that market for pitching. I can’t imagine they would cost more than the relievers from the States.
By Lew
November 20, 2007 1:41 PM | Link to this
Chris-You don’t think that crack about not studying the hitters wasn’t just a sarcastic retort ( I mean, we’re NEVER sarcastic here, are we)? I will absolutely guarantee you that he goes over hitters with the pitchers, catchers and Roger before every series, at the very least. You don’t make it all the way through the minors and through 22 wins in your first two seasons without paying attention to what you’re doing.
As far as the third pitch-he worked on one all last spring and just wasn’t comfortable enough with it to use it during the season-with the HR totals he gives up, would you prefer he master a hanging breaking ball, or wait until it has some bite to it? I would imagine that he will continue it’s development.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:48 PM | Link to this
DOB,when one mentions Musical abilities and talents,Jeff Healey cannot be overlooked my man!!!
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 1:49 PM | Link to this
Oh, come on, it’s the holidays and no mention of Nat “King” Cole or Bing Crosby on that list of voices? I wish I could steal their voices every December so that I could make a boatload of cash.
I would love to have Louis Armstrong’s voice at least one day in my life so I could sing some of those sings like he does - especially Wonderful World. Every singer in the world tries to cover that song but fails miserably because after hearing him sing it the rest of them just seem like terribly weak amateurs IMO.
Same goes for Ray Charles. I would love to have his voice for one day so that I could sing Georgia and America like he did. After hearing him sing those songs, there is no point in anyone else attempting because they sound so darn amateur with their voices.
If I was a rapper, I would want to have Biggie’s big booming powerful voice.
If I could be a rocker from the 90s, I would probably want Billy Corgan’s voice. Not a powerful voice but a distinct one that I love to try to imitate.
BTW, the latest Smashing Pumpkins CD was absolutely horrible IMO. That’s the first time I have ever had that opinion of a Pumpkins CD. It didn’t rock or move me at all. It seemed to have no heart and soul and there was nothing raw about it. But from what I heard they rocked at the Fox on Halloween.
By Mr J
November 20, 2007 1:53 PM | Link to this
wjones,
Jeff Denberg died of brain cancer in 2004.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 1:54 PM | Link to this
Mr.Wren is starting to remind me of the fat Kid,in the candy store,who eats half the gumballs,and then buys the rest before anyone else can make a purchase,I love the fact he is rat hoarding players,however what is Bobby going to do with all these pitchers?????????
By Thrillhouse44
November 20, 2007 1:56 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, agree with you on Biggie’s voice. Some have tried to copy it - Shyne, Guerilla Black - but have failed. I, however, think Method Man has probably the best rap voice.
By tim
November 20, 2007 1:57 PM | Link to this
DOB, Any word if the Braves are going to try to sign Texeira before or during this season? IMO they would have a better chance of signing him and his wife are in town as opposed to trying to get in a bidding war with the Yankees and whomever else after the season.
By chris
November 20, 2007 1:59 PM | Link to this
Lew: Last year, I remember reading an article — probably in AJC — where James was quoted as saying he doesn’t read scouting reports. I bet DOB knows whether this is true or just posturing.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 2:13 PM | Link to this
Thrillhouse
Very good point about Method Man. Yeah, come to think of it, you might be right. Meth might really have the best voice in the history of rap.
Big Pun was another guy who I thought imitated Biggie’s voice and delivery style as well.
It’s a shame what happened to Shyne. Is he out of prison yet? I blame that one on Puffy. He should have been more responsible in watching over Shyne and then should not have sold Shyne out like he did at that trial either. I really liked Shyne’s voice despite the obvious attempt by Puffy to use Shyne to sound just like Biggie.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this
Chris, thanks man.
Lew, I think DOB did have a story on Chuck last spring about how he did not know many of the hitters in baseball - not even the famous ones. There was one famous player in particular he had no clue about that was pretty puzzling. Comments like that make fans wonder how studious he is about what he does for a living.
It might not be a big deal though. If you read the Moneyball book, there were significant parts of it where Billy Beane discussed the difference between him and Lenny Dykstra and why Dykstra became a big time player and Beane was a bust as a ballplayer. Beane of course was a smart guy who thought about everything but Lenny Dykstra would go up there with a blank mind and have no clue in the world who the hell Steve Carlton was.
Knowshon Moreno is the same way. They told the story during the game the other day where they asked him if he went to Georgia because he loved the history and prestige of the SEC and so forth. Knowshon said something like nah I don’t really follow football. I’m a basketball guy.
I think Brett Favre has at times talked about the struggle of studying game tapes too much and suffering paralysis by analysis or just letting his instincts and skills dictate what he wants to do.
But then on other hand Curt Schilling has said he never became the pitcher he could be until he stopped relying upon tapes and he started religiously studying film and scouting reports of hitters and himself.
Someone like Chuck - whose job is being threatened right now - should do anything he can to get an edge - including knowing who the hell every hitter in the NL is and what he can do against them.
By nOLIE
November 20, 2007 2:21 PM | Link to this
I have mixed emotions about James. I honestly do not like the way he pitches with that no followthru motion of his. It can strain the arm and I’m more than old enough to have been trained that followthru is an important part of consistency and control. I will grant however that for the most part he has done pretty well his first two years in the bigs. I do not however see him as ever being more than a decent #4 pitcher, especially with current limited pitch selection and style of pitching. I’m hoping Jurrjens proves to be a better pitcher and gets the 5th spot. James in long relief is an interesting option. As many have remarked he always seems to do well the first two times through the batting order at least. I would not trade him just to trade him as he does offer a decent backup option if one or more starters gets hurt or is ineffective.
By flange1
November 20, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this
All of this Chuck James talk is very interesting.
Let’s take a hypothetical situation here, I am not saying this is fact or how things are but in the IF world:
If Hampton comes back and is able to start and be a successful part of the rotaion, we will have Smoltz, Hudson, Glavine and Hampton + a fith starter. Let’s hold on #5 for aminute and look at who should be in what slot.
I have read a couple of analysts who suggest that the rotation should be Hudson, Glavine, Smoltz Hampton and then a 5.
I can see Smoltz accepting being a 2 but not a 3.
So I see Hudson, Smoltz, Glavine, Hampton + a 5. If you want to flip flop Hudson and Smoltz, that is fine with me.
So the point of my hypothetical is if Hampton is healthy you would have some combination of Glavine, Hampton and a #5.
If Chuck was that 5, do you really want to have a combination of Glavine, Hampton and James back to back to back?
From todays posts, we have learned from DOB that Hampton CAN’T be traded and that the young arms won’t be traded, and that leaves Chuck.
I wonder what Chuck would do in the pen? Again, if Hampton is healthy, why not run out a rotation of Hudson, Smoltz, Glavine, JJJ then Hampton, put Bennett in long relief and put Chuck in the pen.
Rumor mills suggest that Mahay ig going to the Yankees, putting Chuck in the pen and having him on the roster could benefit the Braves depth and let him learn from Tommy G.
Do y’all remember when Mike Remlenger came to Atlanta, he went and watched Maddox and Glavine warm-up and practice on a daily basis. Rem said he learned tons from just watching and listening to Glavine and Maddox.
Wonder if that might work for Chuck?
By brent a.
November 20, 2007 2:27 PM | Link to this
It’s kind of funny, I’m on here way too much, yet I have very little sense of what the “big issue” is.
It’s probably due to the fact that I have learned how to ignore what it is I don’t have any interest in, and simply move along.
That being said, it’s still pathetic that it happened.
I truly believe that DOB provides a unique insight into a proud, MLB franchise - that the majority of us are passionate about - in a way that perhaps no one else anywhere is offering for any sports team.
I would absolutely hate to see this end!
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 2:29 PM | Link to this
Tim, true James needs to have better control to cut down on the number of pitches so he can last longer. But he is already having good success with the 2 through 4 innings it is when he is going through a line up for the third time that he needs a third pitch so hitters don’t set on the other two. A good third pitch would also cut down on all the deep counts he gets into.
Also how many good pitchers that have quality starts only have 2 pitches. Ask any pitching coach and they will tell you to be effective in the Major Leagues you got to have 3 pitches.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
THIS JUST IN: Pete Orr was designated for assignment today, and three prospects, all right-handed pitchers, were added to the Braves’ 40-man roster today: Jairo Cuevas, Charlie Morton and Zach Schreiber.
Braves also activated Willy Aybar, Mike Gonzalez, Mike Hampton and Anthony Lerew off the 60-day DL, as required to set 40-man roster at this point in offseason. (Some asked about Lerew; he had Tommy John surgery a month or so after his incident in the majors when he spoke a bit too openly about pitching while hurt at Boston).
We’ve talked about the hard-throwing and fast-rising Morton, last week he pitched 5 no-hit innings in that Fall League game I attended.
Cuevas, 23, was only 6-12 in 25 starts at high-A Myrtle Beach, but had a 3.55 ERA and is highly regarded.
Schreiber, 25, split the season in bullpens at Double-A Miss and Triple-A Richmond, posting sub-2.50 ERAs at both places, and five saves at Miss.
Teams had to set 40-man rosters today for next month’s Rule 5 Draft. Pitchers are most susceptible to being taken by other clubs in the Rule 5, since the team that takes them has to keep them on its 25-man roster all season.
Teams are more likely to do that with a hard-throwing pitcher who’s not quite ready for the majors, than they are with a position player. You can stick the pitcher in the final bullpen spot, for instance, and bring him along slowly.
By tim
November 20, 2007 2:39 PM | Link to this
texasbrave, good point about the third pitch allowing to cut down on the number of pitches allowing him to go farther in a game. As far as the rotation you don’t want to go righty righty.lefty left left. I think the line up would be Smoltz(righty) Glavine (left) Hudson (right) Hampton (left) if healthy or Chuck James if not healthy and then your #5
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this
Flange1, I can’t see Chuck in the bullpen, but you never know. Just gives up too many homers and has too many big innings to be a bullpen-typle guy, it seems. And not the type who can go down there and crank it up for an innings, throw 95 mph. But we’ll see what happens. Just don’t know right now, need to see how Hampton does, etc.
As for Smoltz in No. 3, I saw Buster suggest that, and it make sense only in that Bobby might want to give teams a different look each day, go from sinkerballer Huddy to lefty soft-tosser/control guy Glavine, to Smoltz, then another lefty (Hampton?) and then maybe a rookie or Bennett or yet another lefty, Chuck, who’s a different type of lefty than Hampton.
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 2:48 PM | Link to this
I have a question that’s totally off-topic.
Does anyone know how Terry Francona’s vow to quit chewing tobacco ended up? I thought I saw him chewing during the the ALCS and World Series…and remembered that he promised to donate some pretty significant money to charity or something if he broke his promise.
Anyone know about this?
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 2:49 PM | Link to this
And no, Chuck doesn’t do much if any advance scouting stuff on hitters he’ll face. Really takes that to the extreme. It helped him get to the majors and succeed early — him not being intimidated or giving hitters too much credit and trying to be too careful the way so many other young pitchers do when they get to the majors.
But it’s probably caught up with him now, and it’s time Chuck did more studying and knowing hitters’ tendencies. Can’t go with the ignorance-is-bliss thing forever. Smoltz told me as much at end of season, how he hoped Chuck would work on some things this winter, make some adjustments…
Thrillhouse, Braveheart: Great article in the new Spin magazine about the Wu-Tang, going through their history, album-by-album, listing the best five group and solo albums, the next five, etc. And a timeline on them as a band. Good stuff.
The new Wu album’s out pretty soon. I heard they were the first band to get permission to sample a Beatles tune, for a song on this upcoming album. Forgot which Beatles hit it was.
By tim
November 20, 2007 2:49 PM | Link to this
That’s another reason signing Glavine is a good deal. I think all the pitchers can learn something from Glavine. It’s like they got a left handed pitching coach in the deal. I think Glavine will help Chuck James and also will let a fire under Smoltz since they are so competitive with each other. It will help the Braves build their left handed pitching for the future as well as helping them win next year.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 2:52 PM | Link to this
flange1 - IMO the fifth spot should be Chuck’s to lose unless one of the other rooks prove they have nothing else to gain by going back to AAA. For me to give him the fifth spot he just need not explode during spring training even if he has not developed a third pitch. Because the James of old is good enough for that last spot.
Again for me it all depends on how Major League ready one of the other rookies are. If one of them is ready then move Chuck to long relief and give the #5 position to one of the rooks.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
Lew, that Graham Parker CD is outstanding, the best he’s done since Mona Lisa’s Sister, in my opinion. And he’s another voice I’d have to put on the top 25 list. Great rock-and-roll voice.
And yes, Ray Charles obviously belongs there, as someone pointed out….
I have the first Decemberists CD, but not the latest one. Good band. Not as good as Arcade Fire (sort of a similar vein), but good….
Oregon-Braves: I want to get that U2, but not gonna pay the full freight. I’ll wait to get a used copy at Ella Guru. Yes, it’s been 20 years. What an all-time classic album. Still put it on and get a rush listening to several of the songs….
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 20, 2007 2:56 PM | Link to this
I, too, have mixed emotions about James. I think he is an good pitcher who could be above average. However, I have doubts about his ability as a starter. His inability to go past the fifth inning is troubling. I think if he developed a third pitch some of that would be alleviated.
Now, I think he is the most tradeable of the starters because he will yield more than Bennett or Cormier would and I think for now Reyes and Jurries shouldn’t be traded.
Again, I will bring up guys like Elijah Dukes and Ryan Church. I know Dukes has issues but he also has immense talent! In Atlanta he could possibly straighten up. He would have influences like Chipper, Smoltz, Hudson, Glavine, Frenchy, McCann, Tex, and Soriano. Guys who are family guys (leave the Chipper jokes in your hip pocket) and team oriented guys and most of them are veterans. He doesn’t have that in Tampa. Most of those guys are kids like him. I think a James for Dukes trade if the Rays would go for it could be a steal for the Braves.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 2:58 PM | Link to this
Seattle: Vedder and Cornell might be the best two rocker voices in the last 20 years or so, huh?
And to the legendary list, I’ve gotta put Springsteen on there. And many would cite the beautifully “bad” Dylan voice, totally eccentric, love-it-or-hate-it croak that is is. For his songs, it’s perfect. Listen to the covers record of 34 of his songs from that new Dylan movie, and only about three of them sound as good (in different ways) as Dylan’s own versions.
By Thrillhouse44
November 20, 2007 2:58 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the early info, DOB. Anyone know anything else about Schreiber? I work pretty closely with his uncle and was curious about what he brings to the table.
Braveheart, I think Shyne is still in the big house. I’m not sure when he gets out though. It was definitely weak of Puffy to sell him out like that. I still bump the two Shyne CDs. He’s definitely solid, dude.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 3:00 PM | Link to this
By the way, Lew: It’s 70 degrees and sunny, breezy in Atlanta today. Leaves are all yellow, orange and red, and falling. Spectacular day for a motorcycle ride, which I just did after lunch….
By ncscoots
November 20, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this
Glavine pitching at 2. You bet. Gives him a chance to go up against Brett Myers, Derek Lowe, Chris Young, and the like, on a regular basis. There’s a plan.
By tim
November 20, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this
As far as rapper voice I have to go with method man. I saw Wu tang play with rage against the machine in atlanta. Usually when I go to a hip hop show I am disappointed. I wasn’t impressed with all of the Wu tang but method man and rza were awesome and I saw Rza and Zach dela rocha from Rage do a battle. Method Man is just smooth with his delivery, he doesn’t get too excited like most rappers. Amazing show
By Mac
November 20, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this
I am thrilled that De-Orrification is apparently finally going to be completed. How many punchless reserve infielders can one team need?
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this
And Thrillhouse, I can never call him Diddy or any of the other ridiculous names he wants to go by. He’ll always be Puffy to me.
By tim
November 20, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this
Another good rocker voice is Ben harper. You gotta hear his first album fight for your mind. I saw him recently in Atl but it was too mellow of a set for me, I prefer when he rocked the Tabernacle a year or two ago
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
Tim, what about Chuck D? Saw PE live in early 1990s, and Chuck could absolutely bring it, man.
By Jared
November 20, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
Sigh. More knee-jerking. Dump James because he had a sub-par season. People, look at some of the early years of Smoltz and Glavine. Not saying James is going to be either of them, but some of you probably would want the 1988 Glavine traded now if he was on the team.
Keep James. Hampton can’t be relied about. Reyes, Jurrjens and Bennett are question marks. Cormier will probably be non-tendered.
By Jared
November 20, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
Sigh. More knee-jerking. Dump James because he had a sub-par season. People, look at some of the early years of Smoltz and Glavine. Not saying James is going to be either of them, but some of you probably would want the 1988 Glavine traded now if he was on the team.
Keep James. Hampton can’t be relied on. Reyes, Jurrjens and Bennett are question marks. Cormier will probably be non-tendered.
By TennesseePaul
November 20, 2007 3:20 PM | Link to this
Morning. Couple of things.
betemit should not be a starter but he is a very valuable backup to me
This was a line posted after comparing Betemit to Francoeur. I noticed the number of games for each player wasn’t listed, nor the number of starts. It’s obvious why, Francoeur has played all but 10 innings of the last two seasons, (I could be off on the number of innings). Nevertheless, he’s started them all. Betemit has been a sub. I don’t believe for a second that Betemit would have good numbers if he were playing as much as Francoeur.
I doubt that the Braves would have signed 41 year old Glavine — another soft tossing left hander — if they thought James was up to the job
I think this had more reasons than just Chuck James. Mike Hampton I believe is the biggest factor in this process. Had Hampton been healthy last season, the woes of the pitching staff wouldn’t have appeared so pertnent to correct. We’d be getting a healthy Hampton this season with 1 year on the mound under his belt back from surgery. That’d be a lot more promissing than what Hampton is now.
However, I’d still think the Braves would have picked up Glavine. He can only help the team. Plus, it’s a huge PR move. Especially after letting AJ go and JS moving up. This is still a business. They’ll probably make back his entire salary from T-shirt sales alone.
I think a problem with Chuck is that he is just too inefficient because of the lack of pitches in his arsenal and because he might not understand the hitters because he does not study them
I agree that Chuck wasn’t efficient. Had he been more efficient, he wouldn’t have throw as many pitches and would have had less HR’s given up. But I think his inefficiency was due to his inconsistency.
He struck out a good bit of hitters, but he’d get to real high counts on batters. His delivery changed multiple times this season, sometimes in one inning. He’d follow through, then he’d wouldn’t. If his mechanics stay consistent, he’ll be a fine pitcher.
I think part of the reason the 4.24 ERA seemed so poor was because he’d run up big pitch counts in fewer innings by taking the majority of his batters to full counts.
He had a 3.70 ERA at the end of July then he hit the DL with arm trouble. This too can be attributed to an inconsistent delivery. But those few starts heading into the DL inflated his ERA. His second to last start he went 7 innings and gave up zero runs.
And then there is his minor league track record:
G GS IP W L ERA BB K 4 Seasons 74 69 378.1 26 13 2.09 109 443Not saying they translate exactly to MLB, but honestly, these are the best minor league numbers this team has as far as young, major league ready pitching. JoJo has nothing on this. Neither does Bennett. Or Jair Jurrjens for that matter. Ironically, Jair’s minor league HR/9 is exactly what Chuck’s Major league HR/9. Chuck had a 5.5 HR/9 in the minors. Jair had a 8.5 HR/9 mark in the minors.
Chuck has the most trade value for this team because he’s the best young pitcher with the most MLB experience this team has. Trading him for a stop gap CF would be a miserable move. Especially after hiring a Vet lefty with 2 Cy Youngs, a WS MVP, and a whole boat load of nostalgia to train the kid that was dubbed a “young Tom Glavine”.
Add to that this was only Chucks second full season as a starter. There is another young player on this team who had a bad second full season as well. He actually made more outs than Juan Pierre.
I hope this team holds on to Chuck. They gave HoRam more time than this and HoRam never gave them anything close to as good as this.
What are the Braves going to do with all these pitchers? Look at the options, experience and track record and it’ll pretty much answer itself. Chuck James hasn’t been assured the job publicly, but this doesn’t have to be perceived as simply a call out to Chuck. Perhaps it also is intended to give all those other starters hope and make them really try to earn it. I’m not sure any team announces in November that the rotation is set.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
November 20, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this
Lew, Mail coming your way. Maybe slowly, but it’s sent.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 3:31 PM | Link to this
Man DOB I don’t know about having Tommy as our #2. #3 for sure. Perhaps Hudson, Smoltz, Glavine, Hampton then James. Does it really matter having 3 lefties in a row since you rarely have all three pitch in the same series?
But having John going against most teams #3 starters, I could seem him coming close to getting twenty wins. I guess either way is ok as long as John is ok with it.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this
early prediction for NL MVP 2008
Mark Teixeira
Chipper comes in 4th
but reality is
David wright 08 MVP, GOLD GLOVE, SILVER SLUGGER, TIME MAN OF THE YEAR, PEOPLE MAGAZINE SEXIEST MAN, NEW CHARMIN MAN, and somehow also CY YOUNG, and ROY.
By tim
November 20, 2007 3:37 PM | Link to this
Braveheart Thrillhouse.. I can’t call him Diddy or Puffy or P diddy. He will always be a garbage rapper to me. Smart business man but sorry rapper. DOB. Never got to see Chuck D in concert so I can’t truly compare. I got the old Public Enemy cd’s though. With most rappers you get to the show and you can tell that it’s 100% produced garbage. There are a few good ones out there but most are just image behind a huge advertising machine. (Calmly stepping off soap box)
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 3:38 PM | Link to this
10Paul, I was the one who posted the Frenchy vs. Betemit comparison. Obviously, I understand that if Betemit plays everyday he is exposed big time and his numbers go down. We saw that especially in Los Angeles.
But my point is that if you get Betemit as a backup he is valuable because in limited exposure he can bring you similar numbers to what the full time starter can bring. That’s why I said what you quoted me as saying: betemit should not be a starter but he is a very valuable backup to me Implicit in that statement for me is that he can’t produce on a full time basis like a starter because he is not good enough but on a limited basis where his weaknesses are not as exposed, he provides similar production to the starters which is terribly valuable.
By DAP
November 20, 2007 3:46 PM | Link to this
for those talking about a third pitch for chuck james helping go deeper into game ect. keep in mind, the only way that is true is if he gets contact pitch.
chuck already doesnt strike many guys out. he get outs by having his pitches hit weakly in the air. sometimes, not weakly enough.
a third pitch will have to be one he can get ground balls with. he doesnt have the power arm to get strike outs. (when he strikes guys out its usually fooling them with his awesome changeup)
i will be shocked if james isnt the #5 guy. i think it would be a bad idea to put him in the bullpen, and TERRIBLE to send him to richmond. i sincerely believe hes a shoe-in for #5.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 3:49 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave, many times by the second month (or sooner) of the season the No. 1 is going against other teams’ No. 2 and No. 3 vs. 5, etc, because of off days in schedule, rainouts, etc. By midseason it’s often a case where the No. 1 or No. 2 is facing as many Nos. 3 and 4 starters as he is Nos. 1 and 2.
Other years, Smoltz faces Glavine or Pedro four times in one season. You just never know how it works out, but more often than not, the No. 1s seem to miss each other often by second month of the season.
By Thrillhouse44
November 20, 2007 3:51 PM | Link to this
Tim, agree with you. I don’t have much respect for Puffy, the rapper, or Puffy, the producer, but the man is doing something right. Even if I don’t dig his music, he knows how to sell it. The All About the Benjamins Rock Remix is a bumper though. It gets me more amped than drinking 3 blue Monsters.
I definitely agree with you about live rap concerts. They’re usually not good. And unlike traditional bands, their concerts are usually better in bigger venues; at least that’s been my experience.
Braveheart, “he’ll always be Puffy to me.” Definitely. To me, he’ll always be the skinny dude sitting in the hot tub talking in the Big Poppa video.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 3:51 PM | Link to this
Oh, and I have no idea if Bobby is actually going to do that (nor do I think he does yet; he’ll talk to Roger, Smoltz and the other pitchers, I’d imagine).
We probably won’t know that until the first week of spring training games when Bobby lays out the rotation and we count forward every five days and figure out who’s where when the season begins.
By nOLIE
November 20, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
Man DOB I don’t know about having Tommy as our #2. #3 for sure. Perhaps Hudson, Smoltz, Glavine, Hampton then James. Does it really matter having 3 lefties in a row since you rarely have all three pitch in the same series? TB
how much does this really matter? After the first few weeks everybody’s staff is already strung out a little what with weather and differing schedules and already #1s are not necessarily confronting #1s. It just continues even more as the season goes on. I can see #1 opening day starter as a perk of sorts but after that I’m not so sure it really matters does it?
By ObiWanKobe
November 20, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this
Rev. Zoldars, You forgot the Nobel Peace Prize & an Oscar…
By TennesseePaul
November 20, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this
Braveheart: Get your point. But the idea of trading with the Yankees is bothersome. However, perhaps they will be interested in Tyler Yates. It might have a double bonus. If they’d take Yates for Betemit, perhaps they back off Mahay and we could get him. Doubt it. Not a chance in hell. But well, whatever. If we are going to trade for a stop gap, Yates seems like the perfect one to ship out.
By Jared
November 20, 2007 4:01 PM | Link to this
Perhaps Hudson, Smoltz, Glavine, Hampton then James.
John Smoltz is the Braves’ #1 starter. Smoltz has proved it every single year since he was moved back into the starting rotation before the 2005 season.
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 20, 2007 4:02 PM | Link to this
DOB…absolutely right on with Chuck D…he is in a class at the top…and the zack de la rocha mention is worthy too…Outkast deserves mention, those guys are pioneers…
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 4:08 PM | Link to this
tim, puffy is indeed a horrible rapper. and i also agree with you about hip hop concerts. i don’t even bother going to them because i am usually extremely disappointed. they usually sound nothing like they do on cd or on the radio. they either sound like they are boring because it sounds like they are just talking the lyrics or they sound bad because they scream and holler the lyrics throughout. you’re right. you do realize that alot of them are nothing more than well produced studio creatures.
must have been cool to see rage and the wu together though. in college, the wu, rage, the pumpkins, biggie, pac, dre, and snoop wore out my walkman on a daily basis more than any other groups.
thrillhouse, for me, puffy will always be the guy talking to biggie on the suicidal thoughts song. BANG hey yo big…hey yo big. puffy really annoyed me when he sold out shyne but he also really annoyed me when he capitalized on biggie’s death too much by dragging that casket around until he had sucked every last dollar out of the sympathy.
By Steve McP
November 20, 2007 4:11 PM | Link to this
DOB - you mentioned the 3 pitchers that we have placed on the 40-man roster. Does this leave any decent prospects exposed that you can see getting picked up?
The new roster is not up on the Braves site, anyone know where to find it?
By ncscoots
November 20, 2007 4:14 PM | Link to this
Tommy as our #2…how much does this really matter?
well, I guess not much, since EVERY TEAM IN MLB SLOTS IT’S STARTERS!
Good grief. It matters because you want the matchup in your favor as often as possible, not the other way around. If it didn’t matter, why not Chuck at 2 and Smoltz at 5? Does that work for ya?
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
ObiWanKobe My goodness I did forget those. I also predict female vocalist of the year, and cod fishing champ 08. Outside shot at the purple heart.
By MikeS
November 20, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
I’ve seen Outkast live several times and they never disappoint. Also, Tribe Called Quest (on their “reunion” tour last year) at the Tabernacle was flat-out awesome. So much energy in that show; probably had a lot to do with the fact that we hadn’t seen them live together in 10+ years).
The Tabernacle is such a great place to see shows (obviously some of the smaller places are even better, but the Tabernacle is probably the most intimate place that fairly big bands will still play at). I saw Avenged Sevenfold there Sunday night and they absolutely rocked. Operator (one of the bands that opened for them, who i didn’t know much about) was also pretty impressive (they did a spot on cover of GnR’s ‘It’s So Easy’, which made their set for me).
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 4:19 PM | Link to this
Yeah, 10Paul, I think the Yankees went pretty hard for Betemit for 2 years, so I don’t see them wanting to give him up without being unreasonable with the Braves. And as much as I love Betemit and wish he was still here, it is time to move on from him anyway.
DOB, will definitely have to go to the bookstore and check out the Spin article on the Wu. They do have a new CD coming out in two weeks. They apparently are going to attempt a cover of George Harrison’s While My Guitar Gently Weeps. I love the Wu …. but, uh, good luck with that.
By timmythebrave
November 20, 2007 4:24 PM | Link to this
There are too many just plain tim’s on the blog so I’m changing my name. I’m heading out. Done with work(blogging). See you
By J-School Dropout
November 20, 2007 4:25 PM | Link to this
DOB:
Interesting mention of Chuck D. I saw the PE in Tokyo one night. Strange show. Flava Flav kept saying “Domey Gato” to the crowd. He was wrecked. It also convinced me that live rap concerts are generally pretty poor. Because much of the sound is created in the studio through sampling and other tricks, it just can’t be reproduced on stage. Lots of energy though. And I still love the PE.
By TommyP
November 20, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
How can Hanley Ramirez not garner any MVP votes? I mean c’mon.
That kid is a super stud and his stats are as good or better than Rollins.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
I’m gonna chime in on the all time artists here. And since we’re on the subject of hip hop I concur that outkast were pioneers in their field. Really made “rap” music more than a beat and a rhythm. They did more than just sample a horn and loop it. They orchestrated great music. Kinda like Frank Zappa did, but polar opposites. Speaking of Zappa and orchestration, I mean, he ultimately did just that, when he bacame a composer of music mainly nearing the end of his life.
By BamaBrave
November 20, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
I’m still in shock over the candid comments from Glavine in the SI article. Wow. Four little words regarding the ‘94 strike (“I was too visible”) was all I ever really needed to hear. I, for one, can finally Get Over It…and forgive. Really. It’s something I never thought he’d acknowledge, much less admit. So, welcome back no. 47. Kick arse, and don’t forget to bust ‘em inside every now and then…
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 4:30 PM | Link to this
Rev. Zoldars It will be an election year. David Wright will be elected President of the United State of America in 2008.
By timmythebrave
November 20, 2007 4:31 PM | Link to this
I’ve seen a tribe called quest on the smokin grooves tour up in va beach and at lollapalooza. Gotta agree with you on that. The tabernacle is my favorite spot in the ATL. Small venue with a good sound. I saw ben harper few years back there. Primus rocked the house on the sailing the seas of cheese tour 2 years ago.
By Lew
November 20, 2007 4:32 PM | Link to this
Yeah-I read the same Chuck piece about him not studying the pitchers and just didn’t pay it much heed. I’ve known MLB coaches for years and have also heard DOB discuss the preparation routine pitchers go through prior to a series and always thought he didn’t really go in completely unprepared. It’s all likely a moot point if he develops a good breaking ball and gets some stamina. I would advise Chuck to work out with Hudson-apparently his routine helped him considerably from 06 to 07 in the stamina department.
Hillbilly-e mail received and responded to. Thanks.
Well, I’m glad the weather is nice in Atlanta, but we actually have water in Vermont. Of course, we also have snow, slush and no leaves on the trees, freezing temperatures and it is likely to remain that way until May or June-But we DO have water-lots of it. Most of it is just frozen.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 4:35 PM | Link to this
And tonight Aesop Rock at MJQ….worth a look…
And someone tell mos def to quit skipping ATL
Speaking of “while my Guitar gently weeps” Phish covered that song numerous times and positively killed it a few of them. And they should be up with greatest bands ever IMO…without a doubt…
By Lew
November 20, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
Reverend- I was lucky enough to see Zappa around 73 in Macon and had a front row seat. His lineup that night included Aynsley Dunbar on drums, Jean Luc Ponty on violin, Ian Underwood on sax and ZGeorge Duke on keyboards, I’m not certain who was playing guitar with Zappa, but that was one incredible show. His music was not for everyone, but he was quite an unrecognized musician-much better than many give him credit for. His bizarre side shows tended to obscure his virtuosity.
By Lew
November 20, 2007 4:41 PM | Link to this
So Pete Orr is gone, but we added a Tequila manufacturer?
By Hammy the Brave
November 20, 2007 4:42 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Aren’t you concerned that the Braves only brought up 3 minor league pitchers for protection, on the 40-man roster? Shouldn’t they have also protected Dan Smith, a lefty, and Van Pope, a 3rd base prospect also? Do you have any kind of list as to what prospects needed protection this winter, and thus which prospects could potentially be lost in the Rule 5 draft? This just seems like a small number of prospects to protect, when I guess we still have Cormier and Carlyle, who IMO shouldn’t be on the roster.
Also, why didn’t the Braves decide how to delay the announcement of Glavine’s signing, to avoid losing their first round pick? Seems like that kind of pick would be considered even more valuable under FW than under JS. The Yankees delayed such an announcement when they signed Sheffield from us, and we never got compensation, so I know there is precedence for such action.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 20, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
Pete Orr gets the Axe(not surprising), three young pitchers are added to the 40 man and I understand both moves. However , why does the 40 man have 41 players on it ? I just checked it , there are 41 players listed , GO FIGURE ????
By Salty
November 20, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
Interesting read on the top lists of singers. Hate doing those things, regardless the topic, as whatever limit is imposed, I have five more that should be there. Frustrating! Even if you do a list be genre, still the same dilemma.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this
Braveheart
My Goodness, you are absolutely correct.
He will be the first African American female bi-partisan president America has ever had. With a cherry on top
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this
rev. zoldars fully agree on mos def. alot of people i know don’t like him but i love that guy. his music puts me in a trance.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 4:54 PM | Link to this
Lew
Thats incredible man. Front row and the finest musicians Frank could find. Cause he only played with the best and most skilled…
That really takes me back to days I never existed in…
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 4:55 PM | Link to this
LEW Has the rest of Vermont had much snow up to this point? My sister had a season pass at Okemo last year and hardly ever was able to use it…so I’m wondering if things bode better for her this year.
Unfortunately, Tahoe has been barren this year. I was up this past weekend and it was 60 degrees the whole time. Scary for the upcoming ski season.
And 3 dollar gas sounds amazing. I paid $3.75 a gallon this morning near the Bay Bridge.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 20, 2007 4:55 PM | Link to this
Lew Speaking of artist, I made a score today at one of my sales. I picked up a Dalhart Windberg original oil. I would have purchased a signed print too but the wife was along and for the life of me could not convince her of the value. Oh well, I suppose one should not be greedy.
I was glad to see the Braves add Zach Schreiber to the 40 man roster today. I like this kid and I think he will be in a big league uniform soon.
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 20, 2007 4:58 PM | Link to this
timmythebrave…never thought i would see a primus reference on here…love it, glad i’m not alone….i saw the frizzle fry redux tour a couple years back…was so great…hadn’t seen them in years…
By flange1
November 20, 2007 4:59 PM | Link to this
Lew,
Toatlly right on Zappa. I was never a huge fan, but saw him twice and his performance was amazing. As you alluded to, his band was always A or A+ list musicians nad they were an incredible experience live.
Phish…Not so much…
By OrlandoFan
November 20, 2007 5:00 PM | Link to this
About Chuck James: I’m hoping Glavine will be a positive influence on him. They both seem similar in their pitching — not hard throwers, lefties, control guys — and I’m hoping Glavine can help him develop a better approach to his work, an ethic. Glavine, Smoltz and Maddux set the tone for so many for so long, that more of that professionalism has to rub off on the young guys. I know some don’t have the concilliatory attitude to accept advice from their elders, but James may well benefit greatly from having Glavine beside him every day.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 5:02 PM | Link to this
And if you wanna talk reggae
King tubby Junior Murvin Lee “Scratch” Perry, eek a mouse, steel pulse, buju banton, black uruhu, The Gladiators, Peter tosh, toots, burning spear, the congos, the upsetters (many collaborations), barrington levy, jimmy cliff, Sister nancy! Ah! I could go on forever.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 5:05 PM | Link to this
Yea thanks for the perspective DOB.
But how about having 3 lefties in a row? I know each of them throws a little differently. But the only advantage I can think of that the other team might have is that they would have their left hander pitching batting line up in for three straight days and that is if all three are facing the same team. I just don’t see a huge problem with three lefties in a row.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 5:11 PM | Link to this
Zoldars, big fan of Tosh, Burning Spear, Black Uhuru and Jimmy Cliff. One of the first stories I ever had published was for the college paper at KU, when a photographer and I were allowed backstage with Third World at an on-campus venue to do a photo page/story on their concert there. Let’s just say, they were doing things backstage that weren’t supposed to be done in a campus building.
It was great. That was around the time when “Try Jah Love” was a big hit for them.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 5:15 PM | Link to this
flange1
I’m not going to get into a big debate over this, buuuuut, Phish live was an incredible experience. I could name specific shows, but i doubt anyone really knows or cares. Pre 2000 had some true gems. I mean, I almost think it’s insane to shortchange them at all, considering how accomplished musicians they are and how well orchestrated and played their shows were. but of course, it’s not for everyone…
Secondly we are not going to go into the new season with a lefty weighted starter rotation, and an almost all righty reliever rotation (especially considering gonzo won’t be back till june (hopefully))
If Mahay leaves, which I imagine he will, what are our options? I heard a couple kicked around, but I don’t know if we have any on radar - lefties that is..Dave?
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 20, 2007 5:17 PM | Link to this
Hammy the Braves , the Rule V draft doesn’t occur until after the winter meetings conclude on December 6th. The Braves have another two weeks to hash out the roster. Guys like Buddy Carlyle and Willie Harris are still on the 40 man because the Braves are considering trade scenarios.
By Caleb
November 20, 2007 5:22 PM | Link to this
Coach, thanks for the info/answers. That clears it up a bit.
DOB, thanks for the update on Carroll.
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 5:23 PM | Link to this
Maybe we pick up somebody in the Rule 5 draft that could help next year???
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 5:24 PM | Link to this
Hammy the Braves: I wondered about Van Pope, too. But you know what? He probably hasn’t hit enough for most or any teams to consider taking him in the Rule 5, because remember, that team would have to keep him on its 25-man roster all season (sort of like Braves did with Thor…but that’s another story).
I’d think Dan Smith might get taken in the draft. Hey, tough decisions have to be made every year, especially when you’ve got a lot of upper-level minor league talent, guys who’ve been in there 3-5 years, guys nearing major league readiness. That’s a good problem to have, compared to the flipside, of not having enough players that any go unprotected who are good enough for other teams to take….
BAMABRAVE, the Glavine press conference was so long, and he’s such a great talker, that there was enough for five or six stories. I’ll run a lot of the quotes in the next blog Thursday or Friday. We all had the same stuff, but I didn’t use the quote about him not being worth $13 mill because I thought it was going to be used by Mark Bradley in his column, etc. Anyway, I’ll run a lot of the strong quotes in the blog….
Mos Def … now that is a man with versatile talents. Great recording artist, very good actor. Love his “Black Star” album with Talib Kweli….
By nOLIE
November 20, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this
Good grief. It matters because you want the matchup in your favor as often as possible, not the other way around. If it didn’t matter, why not Chuck at 2 and Smoltz at 5? Does that work for ya?
well I guess thats the theory alright, but Good Grief how far into the season does that really play out? Not very long in reality. and if there’s so little difference between them you can’t decide whether Tommy or Hudson or whoever deserves to be #2 and/or #3 what in the deuce does it matter at all other than something to argue about? Good Grief.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this
well, if the No. 2 BCS jinx doesn’t kill us, then this surely will:
http://www2.kusports.com/photos/2007/nov/20/136099/
Now it’ll be a miracle if my boys win Saturday.
By flange1
November 20, 2007 5:33 PM | Link to this
Rev,
I could never get into the Phish thing. I agree with you that the guys are VERY talented, but the whole live thing just kind of turned me off. Saw them twice and lost interest. Not much of a Panic fan either, although I caught some early shows in Athens.
I love guitar based music, but really didn’t like Trey’s tone of his style. Probably my loss!
By godawgs
November 20, 2007 5:41 PM | Link to this
Alright DOB, I am picking KU against Missouri. You think yall can handle them right or do you think yall will be the next #2 team to fall. And who are you gonna go with in the Tennessee vs. Kentucky game? I hated the Cats last weekend and now I am all for them. O yeah, I know what the Colts are having for Thanksgiving dinner, do you? P.S. it’s not Turkey.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 20, 2007 5:44 PM | Link to this
Guys and gals, some of you just do not have a clue as to how far the Braves baseball organization has come in the past two decades. I can remember when the Braves 25 man roster was not set until the final day of spring training so they could pick up players cut by other teams so they would have outfielders.
Washington would be a likely club to pick up a player like Dan Smith because they don’t have any real world beaters on their staff to begin with. It would be a very low risk situation for them and a great opportunity for Smith as I don’t see him getting in the Atlanta line up anytime soon.
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 5:49 PM | Link to this
Is there somewhere to check to see what players would be available for each team for the Rule 5 draft?
OK stats gurus, do your stuff.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 20, 2007 5:50 PM | Link to this
O’Brien , Don’t sweat it. Win or lose , Kansas has had a great season.
By Austin
November 20, 2007 5:51 PM | Link to this
DOB
I know it’s way too early to tell, but what would you say the rotation would be?
Oh, and I would love to see Tommy start March 31, opening day against the Pirates. Then pitch game 3 against the Mets Aug 6 in Atlanta.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 5:52 PM | Link to this
flange1
Hey, we agree on Panic. I never liked them one bit.
And if you saw a Phish show during their “reunion”tour(s), or you saw the last show, there is a good chance you came away thinking they sucked./. And I don’t blame you. However, during that time, Burgettstown, PA in 03 might have been the highlight of all the post hiatus (except for encore), and a top 10 perhaps, of alltime.
I said my piece, and i’ll stop now i promise.
And Dave
If you have any more of those stories, I’d love to hear em:) good stuff…as you can attest? just kidding….
By Bring Me the Head of Francisco Cabrera
November 20, 2007 5:53 PM | Link to this
What a beautiful KU photo on that SI cover, though!
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 5:58 PM | Link to this
Is there somewhere to check to see what players would be available for each team for the Rule 5 draft? OK stats gurus, do your stuff.
Coach is the head of the Rule 5 and 40 man roster department.
I hate to see Dan Smith go …. if he gets picked. He had some really good K numbers at the lower levels of the minors. But Gil is right …. he most likely won’t get his chance here.
As much as I like Chuck James, I would love to see if that Morton kid can come on strong in the second half of the season ……. if the Braves get to the postseason, it will be a great asset if Morton has developed into the kind of power pitcher that dominates in the postseason ….. outside of Smoltz, the Braves have never really had that.
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 5:58 PM | Link to this
Flange/Rev I’ll chime in on the Trey/Phish argument as very pro-Phish. I would say they have to be considered in a conversation of some of the most influential artists of the last 20 years or so (if not some of the best) just because of the enormous size of their following. I would totally agree that their music is not for everyone.
But, I would say that Trey borders on a revolutionary guitar player…just in terms of his compositions, if nothing else. I’d say his playing pre-2000 bordered on virtuosic at times, and was always way above good.
Unlike Flange, I LOVE Trey’s tone and have tried for a long time to emulate it. But, unfortunately, I don’t have Paul Languedoc making my equipment…nor do I have Trey’s brilliance.
As far as best rock voices go, I’ll go with Eddie Vedder and Chris Kornell, for sure. Both of those guys blow me away with their pipes. Particularly Vedder…that guy’s voice was just tailor made to sing rock songs.
Rap artists…heartily agree with Method Man. I’d also throw Warren G in there only because he was so smooth, not because his body of work was prodigious or anything. Also like Zac de La Rocca.
Funny that De La Rocca went to Harvard, huh?
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 20, 2007 6:04 PM | Link to this
saltywoody…it was actually the guitartist Tom Morello that went to harvard…
By Austin
November 20, 2007 6:04 PM | Link to this
Good article on espn about Andruw. One assistant GM has said “If you would have asked me two years ago, I probably would have said Andruw (over Hunter) but I can’t defend the year he had. It was pretty bad.”
Another executive says he hasen’t hears anyone but the Nats express intrest. He also said that he thinks that Boras will wait for Rowand and Hunter to sign, and hope a team gets desprete.
My Prediciton, Cubs or KC
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 6:12 PM | Link to this
Saltywoody
Obviously, I agree with you, and I think you bring up some fantastic points on the subject.
And as far as La Rocca goes, people don’t realize he’s smart as a whip. Talk about genius; become highly educated, concentrate on real world issues that people want to dismiss or sweep under the rug, bring them into the spotlight with music. forgo trying to convince the masses or squares,and relate to a wide audience of young disillusioned youth, who just so happen to relate to hard guitar rifts and screaming. Then wait ten years until they become the future leaders of America. Sit back and revel in your now revolutionary, legend status. Yeah. that dudes awesome.
By Rev. Zoldars
November 20, 2007 6:18 PM | Link to this
Hey La Rocha did go to UC Irvine….
even if it was farm school
By Kieran, Long Island Brave Fan
November 20, 2007 6:21 PM | Link to this
DOB
Great Nugget about Chuck James not studying film before games. Looking at it you can kinda see it. I agree the ignorance is bliss is great to say when things are going well, but when you don’t full have a grasp on what your up against, how can you be the best you can be? What kind of pitcher would Mike Mussina have been throughout his career if he wasn’t such a maticuless(sp?) film analyzer? What kind of Quarterback would Tom Brady be?
An example of a hitter who refuses to look at any film before a game is Miguel Cabrera. He says that it’s their job to study him, he just needs to focus on seeing the ball and hitting it(Gee it must be nice to have super human powers like he and most major league hitters have). Its certainly an interesting topic, and I can understand agruements both ways. WIth Chuck i tend to agree with Smoltzie. They’re getting to him 3rd time through the lineup, it’s time to learn how to adjust.
On the topic of singers who’s voices I would liek to have, Certainly Chris Cornell of Soundgarden/Audioslave, Billy Joel, Maynard James Keenan of Tool/A Perfect Circle, Elvis Presley, Ray Charles, and R Kelly(voice not bladdercontrol— sorry shamless, i know).
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 20, 2007 6:26 PM | Link to this
I agree , Dan Smith is buried way down the depth chart. But , as much as I respect and appreciate the effort that Buddy Carlyle put forth in 2007 , he has should not be eating up a roster spot. Ditto for Phil Stockman.
Rule NUMERO UNO ! You can never , ever have enough pitching. That said , exposing Dan Smith to the rule V draft while protecting a couple of career minor leaguers like Carlyle and Stockman is a bit of a brain fart.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 6:27 PM | Link to this
Then wait ten years until they become the future leaders of America. Sit back and revel in your now revolutionary, legend status. Yeah. that dudes awesome.
Then wait 20, 30, 40 years after Woodstock and ……… well, what happened to all you hippies? Where did they go? They became what they hated. 401Ks, kids, wives, jobs, mortgages have a way of doing that you I guess.
By SeattleBrave'sFan
November 20, 2007 6:29 PM | Link to this
DOB…yeah, you are right on, Vedder and Cornell just might be, voices were god given talent for rock music. the seattle scene produced some serious rock talent…and underrated guys like layne staley from alice in chains…
By dcarp23
November 20, 2007 6:30 PM | Link to this
There are 41 names on this 40 man roster. Who doesn’t belong?
By Randy
November 20, 2007 6:37 PM | Link to this
DOB - What are your thoughts on Scott Podsednik for CF? He was designated for assignment by the White Sox today. Not the sexiest choice, but he would come very cheap.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 6:41 PM | Link to this
Isn’t it completely comical,the situation Scott Bor-@ss has himself in these days????He’s kinda like ol Forrest Gump,peddling his box of chocolates,only Forrest did have something left,in His box,Andruw Jones for more than one Year????? Any General Manager that would throw that kind of contract his way needs to be tarred,feathered,and run slam out of Baseball,like Boras should be!!!
By Metropolitan Man
November 20, 2007 6:46 PM | Link to this
DOB, checking some facts here. Is this how the Glavine signing breaks down???
Glavine is a type A FA who signed prior to Dec 1st. The Mets will receive the Braves #1 pick (#18 overall) AND a Sandwich pick following the first round. In most years you could put the disclaimed “unless the Braves sign someone ranked higher” but in this FA crop there is not ONE FA ranked higher then Tom Glavine other then A-Rod. Even if the Braves DID sign A-Rod the Mets would get a sandwich #1 and the Braves second rounder. Only a type B FA awards a team only a sandwich #1. Rotoworld confirms this- Braves signed LHP Tom Glavine, who had been with the Mets, to a one-year, $8 million contract. The Mets get the 18th overall selection in next year’s draft, as well as a supplemental first-rounder, in return for losing Glavine to one of their rivals. Glavine joins a rotation that will also include John Smoltz, Tim Hudson and Chuck James. Mike Hampton is l .
By David-ATL14
November 20, 2007 6:49 PM | Link to this
At the risk of waving the “red flag” in front of the proverbial thrashing bull full of fury but no knowledge.
40 Man Rosters had to be finalized today for all teams. No changes can be made to the 40 man list that is submited today until after the Rule 5 Draft. Information is available in several different areas, MLB.com under the important dates heading to name just one of many.
Shades of the Thorman/options fiasco.
You can’t make this stuff up. LOL
By Randy
November 20, 2007 6:49 PM | Link to this
I retract my interest in Podsednik. No upgrade over Anderson, except in experience.
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 6:56 PM | Link to this
Seattle Braves Fan Crap. Thanks for enlightening me. Always thought it was De La Rocha who went to Harvard…
In either case, both guys are brilliant and geniuses in their own right. De la Rocha because of his lyrics and his delivery. And Tom Morello because he does stuff with a guitar that I’ve never seen other people do, nor could I ever imagine coming up with myself.
Honestly, I always forget how awesome and creative Morello is in discussions of great guitarists. But, whenever someone mentions him, I always go “Oh yeah.”
Rage really kicked some tail during their run. Still do…
Oh, and totally agree on Layne Staley, as well. That guy has such a great, gritty voice.
By JasonInMaine
November 20, 2007 6:58 PM | Link to this
I asked this a while back, but can someone please help me understand the following:
How in the heck is Andruw, based on two years, a Type B FA when Michael Barrett is a Type A?
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 7:05 PM | Link to this
Juan Uribe This may be a preposterous suggestion, I don’t know. I had an early Thanksgiving lunch today at work and I’m on the verge of falling into a coma. But the idea is that everyone’s saying it wouldn’t take much to get him…and he’d be good insurance against a sophomore slump out of Yunel.
Anyone have any thoughts?
If the White Sox would pick up some of his 4.5 million, he could definitely provide some pop of the bench, and could probably play spell both Yunel and Kelly in the middle of the infield.
By Yars
November 20, 2007 7:07 PM | Link to this
The Smashing Pumpkins peaked with Siamese Dream in my opinion. It’s hard for bands to have longevity these days, & still be relevant. How many bands that came out in the 1980’s are still successful? U2, Metallica, REM, Depeche Mode, Nine Inch Nails. Those type bands never really went away, & still release music that is cutting edge. Yes, that’s right. I included Metallica. I don’t get why some dislike Metallica nowadays. I guess they are p** that every album doesn’t sound like ……And Justice For All. A lot of these crap bands today such as Fall Out Boy, All American Rejects, Saliva, Linkin Park will all be forgotten in 5 years. now playing Capital G by nine inch nails.
By SeattleBravesFan
November 20, 2007 7:09 PM | Link to this
saltywoody…completely agree, the stuff morello does with a guitar is borderline crazy. he might be the most unique player in rock history. i’m not a musician so i can’t speak technically, but nobody makes the sounds he does…
By Randy
November 20, 2007 7:12 PM | Link to this
JasonInMaine - The Elias rankings splits players into 5 categories: Starting pitchers; relief pitchers; 1B, OF, DH; 2B, SS, 3B; C. So the bar for Type A is much lower for catchers than for 1B, DH and OF. But yeah, the Braves got hosed.
By SeattleBravesFan
November 20, 2007 7:13 PM | Link to this
by the way…is anybody else surprised that Moylan didn’t receive even one vote for ROY…if this was covered already and i missed it my bad.
DOB..if i am not mistaken you mentioned in a blog before season’s end that you thought he merited some consideration. happy to see escobar get a nod or two, but really surprised our tatooed aussie was shut out…he was lights out…
just thought i would throw something out that wasn’t F.A. talk…and again if i missed this topic last week, my bad…
By Dan
November 20, 2007 7:17 PM | Link to this
Mets get Johnny estrada for Mota. wtf kind of trade is that? wow some1 got jacked and it aint the muts.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 20, 2007 7:18 PM | Link to this
David ATL-14 , don’t even try to rain on my parade.
It’s November , spring training is four months away. I’m already predicting playoffs for my team eleven months in advance.
I correctly predicted the demise of the Braves playoff run in May of 2006 , I called it right on the money when I said the 2007 Braves were a wild card contender in April of 2007 ( they were , right up to the last week of the season).
I’m the king of prognosticators , you just can’t make this stuff up.
By Austin
November 20, 2007 7:18 PM | Link to this
METS TRADE MOTA FOR ESTRADA
I personally think he is a downgrade from Paul. Estrada couldn;t throw me out an im 15 :)
By David-ATL14
November 20, 2007 7:32 PM | Link to this
I agree with you Coach. Braves should be playoff worthy.
A slight tweak for the bench and maybe a young inexpensive right to compete for the CF job. Everything else looks solid.
By Steve C.
November 20, 2007 7:36 PM | Link to this
Hey guys,
Why no love for Panic? I am actually a fan of both Phish and Panic, but for different reasons, as they both couldn’t be more different from each other. I dunno, always liked Panic’s sound, maybe its Schools jammin’ or John Bell’s voice, but it just addicting to me…
By JasonInMaine
November 20, 2007 7:37 PM | Link to this
Randy, thanks. I still think it is foolish that Andruw got Type B status!!
By Saltywoody
November 20, 2007 7:39 PM | Link to this
SEATTLEBRAVESFAN I fancy myself somewhat of a guitar player, although certainly not in the vein of Morello.
But, having seen him play a few times (once from about 10 feet away), I have to say that he is just totally unreal. His knowledge of chord structure and scales and such is awesome, but that is true for many guitarists.
I think what distinguishes him from everyone else is his ability to layer different pedals and effects on top of each other. Some of the combination of sounds he comes up with are things others just would never dream up in their wildest imaginations.
And his technique is like nothing I’ve ever seen. For example, muting the strings with your bottom (rhythym) hand, and using your top hand to turn the guitar into a turntable is just plain wild. And that’s one of the many tricks up his sleeve. Just a total innovator in every way.
P.S. Looks like our boy Estrada is going to be turned against us. Personally, I’d rather have Glavine than Estrada. But, hopefully Johnny continues his downward trend and doesn’t put up a year like he did with the Bravos. And I agree with whoever said someone got fleeced, and it wasn’t the Mets.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 7:50 PM | Link to this
Seattle, I didn’t think Moylan would be in top five, thought maybe top 10. Just too many every-day position players who were more deserving. I’d have voted Tulowitzki, even knowing playoffs don’t count for voting.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 7:51 PM | Link to this
… and good call on Layne Staley.
By JasonInMaine
November 20, 2007 7:57 PM | Link to this
I think James Maynard Keenan also has a distinct voice and has an impact on the music seen in the last 15 years.
By Jared
November 20, 2007 8:27 PM | Link to this
Here is what Chuck James should practice on making his third pitch this offseason:
CLICK HERE
By Jared
November 20, 2007 8:39 PM | Link to this
Why IS Buddy Carlyle still taking a roster spot? The Braves are usually very good at not trying to turn their reclamation projects into long-term solutions.
By superman
November 20, 2007 8:42 PM | Link to this
Jared that is the craziest pitch I have ever seen. I wish Chuck James would try that!
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 8:56 PM | Link to this
Jared: I think the ump was giving him a liberal strike zone!
Looks like you are onto something good!
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 9:05 PM | Link to this
Did anyone every figure out how we can have 41 guys on the 40 man roster. I know that during the season, 60 day DL guys don’t count. I also thought the DL had to be cleared at this point.
So, is Aybar still on the disqualified list or something?
By Metropolitan Man
November 20, 2007 9:54 PM | Link to this
Ok, Johnny E still has a score to settle with the braves so this will be interesting. Estrada hopefully lights you guys up while Glavine gets lit up. If we get Estrada for Thanksgiving, can you imagine what METS fans are getting for Christmas???
By SeattleBravesFan
November 20, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
Yeah, i didn’t think Moylan was gonna get much more than a couple votes at most, was just surprised he didn’t even get a whiff of a vote….well, anyways that was my 2 cents…
By TennesseePaul
November 20, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
The Smashing Pumpkins peaked with Siamese Dream
I don’t get in much with these rankings of music. Personally I see them all as pretty superficial. People like what they like. But this comment, to me, just pidgeon holes the listener and as a result, deprives them of having heard some great material.
The Smashing Pumpkins Adore is a fabulous album. It’s hard for some, I understand, to get past the fact that other objects/instruments make sound which can be incorporated into a great song. Adore is a master piece and pretty much The Peak of Smashing Pumpkins. Machina I and II were far below prior work but were still worth listening to. The latest album is OK. Not the best work. But after seeing him live in SF at the Filmore and listening to him explain the direction and purpose of the new Pumpkins I get where it’s going and it at least has the potential to lead to something new and great.
But back to the main point, to leave it off at Siamese Dream is to leave yourself with the same level of musical education of Britney Spears fans, “whatever is popular is the best”. And Siamese Dream had the biggest hit Pumpkins ever put out. Doesn’t mean the rest weren’t good. More or less speaks to the attention spane of the average music consumer.
Nevertheless, Mellon Collie and Adore both did well as far as sales. And all throughout this period the Pumpkins kept getting better, better live.
They’ll have a hard time going down as a “classic” considering the goth image they put out. But Billy knows music. He can right a brilliant song.
Whatever. Don’t mean to stick my nose up, but I will at least encourage those who might disagree to go back and listen with a more open mind. Try not to give the Guitar the status of lightening bolts and Thor. There is more to music than just the instrument.
Adore and OK Computer are two of the most important rock albums of the late 90’s.
By SeattleBravesFan
November 20, 2007 10:06 PM | Link to this
saltywoody…good info there, being into his music, that description makes complete sense
By N8
November 20, 2007 10:31 PM | Link to this
Maybe this was posted already by somebody, maybe not (I don’t have time to scroll the whole blog today to see), but I found it interesting either way.
ESPN.com has a story about Boras stating emphatically that Andruw will NOT sign a one year deal, and that it’s pretty scary how good Andruw is that his worst season consisted of having 26 HR, 94 RBI and winning another gold glove.
But this quote was in the story (which was done by Jerry Crasnick):
“During the recent general managers’ meetings in Orlando, Fla., ESPN.com asked 15 front office executives if they would prefer Jones or Hunter as a center field option. Fourteen respondents chose Hunter, and one official said he would be content with either player.”
“”If you would have asked me two years ago, I probably would have said Andruw,” said an American League assistant general manager. “But I can’t defend the year he had. It was pretty bad.”“
Yet, MANY on this blog still question why we’re letting him go, when it’s apparent that around 93 percent of managers that were asked, said they’d choose Hunter over him?
Oh, how the mighty has fallen, huh?
By Oregon_Braves
November 20, 2007 10:36 PM | Link to this
T Paul - Right on about Adore. It is criminally overlooked by not only the casual listener, but also most other Pumpkins fans I know. Even Corgan himself said at one point that he would be surprised if someone ten years later felt that Adore was there best. It’s probably my overall favorite. It was released a few days before my daughter was born and I still have vivid memories of her as a newborn sleeping on my chest as I listened to it.
By N8
November 20, 2007 10:45 PM | Link to this
DOB
Earlier you said:
“Seattle: Vedder and Cornell might be the best two rocker voices in the last 20 years or so, huh?”
Couldn’t disagree with you more. LOVE LOVE LOVE Chris Cornell’s voice, can’t stand to listen to Vedder…AT ALL.
In fact, I tried to “enjoy” Pearl Jam many times, (bought every album - CD - as it came out thinking my mind would change), and couldn’t do it. Loved the “music” hated his voice.
In fact just the other day, I was telling a buddy that if Chris Cornell had been the singer in Pearl Jam, they might have been one of my all-time favorite bands. Because most of the early Soundgarden (before SuperUnknown) was too “collegie” for me. Too wierd.
Which is also why Audioslave is a GREAT band. Cornell thoroughly rips it up, along with the “better half” of Rage Against the Machine. PERFECT MATCH, in my opinion.
But ultimately, that’s all it is….my opinion.
However, I will concede that Ten is one of the GREATEST rock albums of all time (with or without my dislike of Eddie Vedder). In fact, I put it ahead of Nirvana’s “Never Mind”, as the premiere Grunge album. To me, it’s the one that stands up today.
That’s where they differ (Nirvana and Pearl Jam). I think Pearl Jam has faded other than with their die-hard fans, where had Cobain lived, Nirvana would’ve found a way to roll with the times, without resorting to conforming to the “hip” sounds of today. Just look at Foo-Fighters. Dave Grohl is pretty “hip” while still doing his thing and not selling out, IMO.
By Niekro35
November 20, 2007 10:50 PM | Link to this
Gee, Met Man. Estrada for T-day. Oh the excitement! Maybe you’ll get Jaret Wright for x-mas!
By Oregon_Braves
November 20, 2007 10:54 PM | Link to this
N8 - Try giving Soundgarden’s Badmotorfinger another listen. Fantastic album. I saw them open for Guns ‘N Roses in Biloxi, MS on that tour and they tore the place to shreds. Even Axl was impressed! :)
By johnr
November 20, 2007 10:54 PM | Link to this
yo Dave What do you ride?
By Steve McP
November 20, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this
Why not have a worst voice in music - I will start with Stevie Nicks
By Steve McP
November 20, 2007 10:59 PM | Link to this
Followed by Phil Collins
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 11:09 PM | Link to this
Final Score Saturday,Mizzou24,Jayhawks12…..
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:11 PM | Link to this
johnr, a 2007 Harley-Davidson Street Bob (with a 103 c.i. Screamin’ Eagle engine kit) and a 2003 Triumph Bonneville.
Steve McP, I nominate Getty Lee.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:14 PM | Link to this
Oregon, Badmotorfinger’s their best album, but I can still remember putting on the vinyl LP Louder Than Love when it came out in 1990 and just going, ‘Wow. This is something new entirely.’ Loved that song Loud Love.
Saw them at the old Sunrise Musical Theatre outside Fort Lauderdale on the Badmotorfinger tour. Great live show (what I remember, at least).
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:25 PM | Link to this
TennPaul, agree with you on the Smashing Pumpkins criticism.
I mean, “peaked with Siamese Dream”? Come on.
To me, Mellon Collie and The Infinite Sadness was an even better album than Siamese Dream. Incredibly sprawling, ambitious double album, and the songs range from raging rockers like “Bullet With Butterfly Wings” to the brilliant pop of “1979.”
I also thought Adore was a great album. Stands up strong when you play it today.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:30 PM | Link to this
MetroMan, correct on Glavine and the draft picks scenario you asked about.
By joebrave
November 20, 2007 11:31 PM | Link to this
http://www.armchairgm.com/Rumor-AndruwJonestoFireScott_Boras, Try this one on for size,may be something to it,maybe not…
By jjschiller
November 20, 2007 11:33 PM | Link to this
Worst voice?
Nico, of the Velvet Underground and Nico
By Oregon_Braves
November 20, 2007 11:36 PM | Link to this
Our old friend Dayn Perry is up to his crazy shenanigans again. Head over to foxsports (if you dare) and check out his diatribe on the choice for NL MVP. By now, it shouldn’t be a surprise what is said, but here is how his article ends: “That’s also why David Wright, without question, should have been the NL MVP.” Yes, he apparently says this with a straight face (or at least as straight as his face can contort).
But he’s not a Mets fan. Just ask him. Right…
Thankfully, once more, Dayn Perry has proven to be the douchiest of all douchebags. Mr. Perry, I’m glad you are at least consistent. Keith Law, we’re watching you, too.
By David O'Brien
November 20, 2007 11:39 PM | Link to this
By the way, that Zwan side project that Corghan did also put out one pretty solid album, “Mary Star of the Sea.”
And have you Pumpkins fans got the box set of five CD singles that came out in limited edition, in a vintage 45 RPM singles case? It’s called “The Aeroplane Flies High” and it’s definitely worth finding if you don’t have it. Has all the singles from Mellon Collie, plus a bunch of B-sides and stuff that didn’t make the album and is every bit as good as what did make it. Also has this weird, cool 25-minute medley of unfinished stuff and riffs.
And it’s got covers of songs by the Cure, the Cars, and … yes, Missing Persons.
By TexasBrave
November 20, 2007 11:42 PM | Link to this
N8 - With the state at which our options are in CF I would take AJ. I just don’t think he can do much worse and will most likely return to his .260ish average with the homers and RBI’s.
I have said this before and I will say it again. Offer the man a one year deal and a discounted rate. If he doesn’t take it, its no skin off our noses. If he does then we fill a need for another year until one of the younglings are ready to go. If he returns to the AJ of 3 or 4 years ago reavaluate our options and decide whether or not he is worth keeping.
Either way I think it is a win/win situation for the Braves and potentially for AJ also. He wants to prove that last season was a fluke and has a lot riding on this season. I say give the man a chance.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 11:45 PM | Link to this
The IPOD is on the fritz. All I get is a white screen - that is, if I get a screen at all. Anyone know what to do with that? I’ve tried every reboot trick and nothing works. Really don’t feel like buying a new IPOD and rebuilding a 5000 song library.
By Braveheart
November 20, 2007 11:52 PM | Link to this
Yes, he apparently says this with a straight face (or at least as straight as his face can contort).
OregonBrave, be careful. It’s best not to stare too long at Dayn Perry’s face. The glow off his frighteningly pale face might blind you.
By Wayne in Utah
November 20, 2007 11:55 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave & N8: I would say if (and only if) he fired Scott Boras, then I would offer him a 1 year, 10 million dollar contract. No more, for sure.
If he doesn’t like that, then trade to Washington for Ryan Church. (is the blog monitor going to block this one??)
BTW, some posts are being blocked tonight on the blog. No sense of humor.
By joebrave
November 21, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this
http://www.armchairgm.com/Rumor-AndruwJonestoFireScott_Boras, Try this one on for size,may be something to it,maybe not…
By joebrave
November 21, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this
http://www.armchairgm.com/Rumor-AndruwJonestoFireScott_Boras, Try this one on for size,may be something to it,maybe not…
By The Church Lady
November 21, 2007 12:06 AM | Link to this
OK now, let’s all push for DeJesus, or if not, then at least we can go to Church.
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 12:08 AM | Link to this
Wayne - The way Boras’s clients have been going around him, it would not matter to me if AJ fired him or not. Andruw could do just as he did last time and go around Boras with his father.
Oh and 10 million is a little high, how about 7 or 8 million. Wasn’t he looking to get 10 mill a year anyway?
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 12:08 AM | Link to this
Joe: Sounds like Scott is having a bad month!
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 12:10 AM | Link to this
Holy cow, what a long day at the orifice. These 12 to 14 hour days are killin’ me! Just a few notes after reading todays posts……
Rev. Zoldars early prediction for NL MVP 2008 Mark Teixeira Chipper comes in 4th but reality is David wright 08 MVP, GOLD GLOVE, SILVER SLUGGER, TIME MAN OF THE YEAR, PEOPLE MAGAZINE SEXIEST MAN, NEW CHARMIN MAN, and somehow also CY YOUNG, and ROY. Rev. Zoldars, you forgot the Congressional Medal of Honor and Playboy Playmate of the Year.
By TommyP How can Hanley Ramirez not garner any MVP votes? I mean c’mon.
Tommy, if he hadn’t been on such a bad team, he would have gotten some consideration. I don’t agree with this concept necessarily, but historically speaking, the MVP typically goes to someone on a team that either goes to the playoffs or gets very close.
*Wayne in Utah * Maybe we pick up somebody in the Rule 5 draft that could help next year??? Wayne, unless the Braves 40 man roster is set at less than 40, they will not be eligible to choose anyone in the Rule V draft.
And so the Mets have a new catcher. What is Doug Melvin thinking? Who’s going to be their #1 catcher, Mike Rivera? Come on!
I always kind of liked Estrada but in the past few years that guy’s been passed around more times than the last lighter in a crack house!
By Brad in MT
November 21, 2007 12:11 AM | Link to this
I am in agreement with many of you here, if AJwould fire Boras and accept a one year deal thats reasonable and fair, I think that we should jump on that. After that who knows, maybe he has a big year and then gets the contract that rewards him either from us, esp. with Hampton coming off the books maybe Tex, or with someone else. AJ is without a doubt one of my favorite players and I may be dreaming, but I would still like to have him back!
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 12:11 AM | Link to this
Wayne, I don’t know what you’re talking about as far as posts being blocked. Not by any human, they haven’t been. Not one all night (now that I’ve said that, I’m sure some clever dude will post one to test that).
If they have been blocked so far tonight, it’s simply a word that didn’t get past whatever automatic filter they have set up to catch stuff. No one’s monitoring this thing live.
Can’t help you with that battle you’re waging with an automatic filter. If whatever you’re posting is so witty it needs to get through, I’d advise you to do like so many others do and just change a letter or two to a symbol or something.
You must really be eager for the world to see it. You’ve only posted DeJesus and Church three or four times already, with the Jesus part bolded. I mean, Wayne, we’re not 10, dude. We get it.
Anyway, just busting your chops. But it’s just not that much of a knee-slapper.
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 12:19 AM | Link to this
Braveheart, I hope you’ve got your 5,000 songs in your computer somewhere too, right? In case the Ipod’s stolen or, as it is now, perhaps fried? Then you just get another, plug it into the old computer and let it sync away with all 5,000 songs.
I had an Ipod lock up last year during spring training. Called Apple IT folks (they’ll help you once, then charge you after that, unless you’ve signed up for the service plan).
I have the Nano, not this year’s bigger model but the thin one from past few years. If I remember correctly, when it jammed they had me lay the thing flat, then push down the menu and select buttons simultaneously for about 5 seconds or more, until the Apple logo appears.
And it didn’t even delete my songs. They were all still there.
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 12:24 AM | Link to this
In all seriousness though, can you guys name me any other potential CF’ers not named Andruw Jones (at a discounted salary), Ryan Church or David DeJesus that would be better pickups?
Sorry if my attempts at humor have not been humorous. To be honest, this blog needs an infusion of something tonight!
Where is Serbok when you need him?
:-)
By ColoradoBravesFan
November 21, 2007 12:28 AM | Link to this
DOB… I thought I read on the Braves MIB blog where Hampton was suppose to begin pitching tonight in the Mexican winter league. I was just checking the box scorces on MLB.com and he doesn’t appear to be pitching tonight. Is there any news or update on his rehab I might have missed?
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 12:30 AM | Link to this
Braveheart: Dave is right on the ipod, as my 15 year old had a similar problem last summer. Got hosed (that is a technical term) but he and his friends were able to reload it all from the laptop.
Good luck.
We need another trade or a signing, as it has already been about 34 hours since the Glavine announcement!
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 12:36 AM | Link to this
TexasBrave,
Offer the man a one year deal and a discounted rate. If he doesn’t take it, its no skin off our noses.
Oh and 10 million is a little high, how about 7 or 8 million. Wasn’t he looking to get 10 mill a year anyway?
Dude, Boras was looking for more like 20 million a year in a long term deal. And by the way, his “slump” wasn’t just last year. It extends back to the middle of 06. In July, August and Sept of 06 he hit .250, .227, and .250 respectively. Sorry, I don’t call that a “slump”. It’s much worse than that. I see him as a very old 30.
If he DOES take it, what is he going to offer us? Another .222 BA? More frustration of not listening to Pendleton? He said after the season that he’d figured out what he was doing wrong at the plate. WHY DIDN’T HE MAKE ADJUSTMENTS DURING THE SEASON WHEN HE ABSOLUTELY STUNK THE PLACE UP? Another dollar spent on Andruw Jones is just another dollar wasted. Yes, he was once a great hitter, feared by many pitchers. He is no longer that. He killed so many rallies this year I can’t even count that high.
Sorry for using the CAPS but AJ’s gotta go. I truly wish the best for him. He was a great Brave for so many years but we’ve got to let him go. I sincerely hope that he finds a new team that he’s comfortable playing for and does well. But his time in the ATL is over. Accept it.
By the way, click here for his 2007 splits. You’ll see exactly how pathetic he was. And please don’t try to tell me how many rbi’s he had. Woodward would have had a ton of rbi’s too if he’d spent most of the year hitting behind Edgar and Chipper with their high OBP’s.
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 12:37 AM | Link to this
Colorado: I thought he was going on Thanksgiving night??? Not sure though.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 12:43 AM | Link to this
ColoradoBravesFan, I think Hampton is due to pitch on Thursday, not today.
Keep your fingers crossed. If he can stay healthy, he’ll potentially be a huge part of our success next year.
By Josh
November 21, 2007 12:53 AM | Link to this
ipod I don’t know if it’s the same for the nano models, but a buddy of mine has a video ipod and his recently froze up. On his model, you hold the menu and select models like DOB said, but you have to toggle to hold switch on/off before you press the buttons or it won’t work. Worked like a charm
By K Mann
November 21, 2007 12:54 AM | Link to this
I am glad Tom is back in a Braves uniform. BUT keep in mind that Tom got $3M for declining his option with the Mets, so in effect he only gave the Braves a $2M discount, not a $5M discount as the media would have everyone believe. So with that, it is much more believable! So now he can live at home for $11M a year..hum. Anyone would have taken that deal!!!
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 12:59 AM | Link to this
C’mon Chris, tell us how you really feel!
:-)
I too have felt that AJ is an OLD 30, but for him, I would venture ONE more opportunity, and if he wasn’t working out, you could always release him and eat the $$’s.
Could you make as a part of a contract offer, that you could trade him whenever you wanted to, even though he is/was a 10-5 guy?
Just thinking out loud.
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 1:08 AM | Link to this
* chrisklob*
Not even going to point to his RBI’s from last year. Your right most hitters could have gotten that and more in the same position.
Hey I was one of those people complaining about why AJ didn’t listen to Terry and make adjustments or even why he did not put himself on the DL when his elbow was killing him. Being selfish instead of a team player.
I also realize that the Braves have already said that they want nothing else to do with AJ and nothing I or anyone elso on this blog can say or do to change that. All I am doing is trying to fill up this blogosphere with something other than just music chatter. Like music, just not the type most like on this blog. Much rather talk about my Braves.
Back to AJ. Has he stunk it up the last couple of years? YES - But I think he has a lot left in the tank to contribute to an organization. At last look we are still trying to find a one to two year solution until one of our young guns makes it up. I don’t quite like any of the possible choices out there or even what we may have to give up to get said choices. So why not give a proven gold glove CF a chance to correct his wrongs for a year and if he does or doesn’t let him go off to greener pastures once the kids arrive? We need something to grip about next year anyway, AJ looks as good as a choice as any.
:)
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 1:18 AM | Link to this
Wayne, I don’t know that AJ is completely done but I don’t know if he can be successful as a Brave any more. He’s shown absolutely no ability to adapt or be coachable. Maybe he just needs a fresh start, a new approach.
Why would the Braves sign him under those circumstances and “eat the $$’s”? We’re not the Mets or Yankees. The Braves generally (key word) make good fiscal decisions. And the ones that they make that aren’t good aren’t typically high dollar deals. Yes the Woodward, Wilson, and Redman deals were not good ones in hindsight but they seemed like pretty fair ones at the time. Some would argue that the Hampton deal was a bad one but who could have foreseen the injuries he has incurred.
Andruw Jones has proven over the last season and a half that he can’t/won’t hit for average or in clutch situations. Actually, he’s never been known to be a much of a clutch hitter. But recently he’s been downright bad.
As for the no-trade clause being waived, I don’t know, but I suspect that would violate the CBA. Kind of like how they won’t let you take less money once you’ve signed a contract (think A-Rod going to Boston.
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 1:20 AM | Link to this
ColoradoBravesFan, as reported Monday, Wren told us Hampton’s first Mexican Winter League start is scheduled for Thursday….
K Mann, that salary/buyout situation is not clear as you say there, as clear as we’re officially led to believe. This won’t ever come out on the record, but here’s what I’m told by someone close to the situation is how it worked:
Mets had already paid him the $3 mill last year. The two sides agreed last year when he signed to call it a buyout for the option so it wouldn’t count against Mets 2007 payroll.
In other words he was going to get it either way, as a buyout if he didn’t return or as a chunk of his salary if he’d gone back for 2008. But no one will acknowledge that publicly.
In effect, he would’ve been paid about $10 mill in 2007 and again in 2008 by the Mets if he’d returned after hitting those escalator clauses, instead of the official, for-the-record breakdown which would have been $7.5 mill in 2007 and $13 mill in 2008.
That’s what I was assured is how it happened, after I had said the same thing as you initially — that Glavine would, in effect, get $11 mill if he signed an $8 mill deal with Braves because of the $3 mill buyout.
Someone who knows how the contract with the Mets worked said no, that’s not correct, and explained it as I tried to explain it to you (I know it sounds confusing, but that’s as clear as I can explain it, as it was explained to me).
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 1:38 AM | Link to this
Oh, and folks: Andruw’s not coming back.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 1:39 AM | Link to this
DOB, I thought “you know who” was getting banned?
TexasBrave, it seems we agree on most points regarding AJ. Except for one.
why not give a proven gold glove CF a chance to correct his wrongs for a year and if he does or doesn’t let him go off to greener pastures once the kids arrive?
Simple. What other choices out there are going to be WORSE than AJ? When you answer that question, think about what he’ll want to get paid next year. Maybe he’d only ask for $10m. Is he twice as good as Coco Crisp? Twenty times (or so) better than Josh Anderson or Gregor Blanco?
Sorry, I can’t justify throwing good money after bad. AJ’s just been too bad offensively to justify giving him that kind of contract.
I’m not saying that either of those guys, or anyone else we’ve been discussing, will be significantly better than what AJ was the past year and a half. What I AM saying is that it is time to move on, to try someone else. I’m sick of watching him flail around at the plate, augering himself into the batter’s box while trying to pull ever outside slider into the left-field seats.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 1:46 AM | Link to this
DOB, regarding your 1.20 post…
Did the Mets do that as some sort of evasion tactic from a luxury tax hit? Do buy-outs not count again the luxury tax (I think that’s what they call it)? I’m trying to understand what difference it makes what they call it. I mean, a $3m cash outlay is still $3m, no matter what you call it, right?
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 1:58 AM | Link to this
DOB - We know, just something to talk about and get opinions.
chrisklob - I hear ya - thanks for the friendly banter.
And with that folks I wish all a good night. Hopefully I can get a few more chances to blog with you good people during Thanksgiving break before I have to go back to school.
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 2:27 AM | Link to this
Been doin a little research on possible utility infielders tonight. Lots out there. Not a lot of good, available ones though.
Some names to talk about some other time (it is late, even here in the west): Brendan Harris (TB), Ryan Theriot (Cubs), Mark Loretta (FA), Cesar Izturis (FA), Brendan Ryan (STL), Jorge Velandia (FA), Ben Zobrist (TB), Juan Castro (CIN), Angel Berroa (KC) just to name a few…..
Nite
By wjones
November 21, 2007 6:44 AM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah
On your list, the only ones I see worth taking a flyer on are Theriot and Loretta. What are your thoughts? I certainly don’t want us treading the same waters that brought us Woodward last year. Coming off a wrist injury, I was hoping that Woodward would be ok, but apparently it was still bothering him. What really surprised me, though, and I don’t know if this was a wrist/bat strength issue also, was his inability to bunt.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 21, 2007 6:54 AM | Link to this
DOB The dreaded SI cover….. They may as well hang an albatross around the neck of the Kansas quarterback. If the Missouri Players were not already up for this game. I guarantee they will now be trash talking like nobody’s business. The may as well have called their mommas names.
It is a double whammy I am not sure the Jayhawks can overcome……
Of course I have my own worries with Virginia playing Va Tech this weekend in Hooville.
Wayne I wish I could pull a rabbit out of the hat as far as names of possible utility players. Braves could go with an all glove, no bat type ala Raphael Belliard again but I think they want a bat off the bench too.
I have a sinking feeling it is going to cost us someone we don’t really want to give away to gain the last two position players needed for the Bravos.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 21, 2007 7:19 AM | Link to this
Looks like our old friend “Chips” Estrada has been signed by the Mets. Did anyone really think he would stay in Brewtown after the dust up with the manager? If you are interested, here is a link.
Estrada to Mets
By tfbrave
November 21, 2007 7:51 AM | Link to this
Gregor Blanco hit his 3rd HR in 32 VWL games, which matches what he hit in Richmond the entire season. I doubt it means anything more than the pitching is not as good or the ball carries better down there. But thought it might be worth mentioning. .308BA 3HRs 4SB 4CS .400+OBP
By wjones
November 21, 2007 7:54 AM | Link to this
I know this was mentioned earlier by someone, but I didn’t see an answer to it. There are 41 names on the 40 man roster on mlb.com. I would think either someone needs to come off, or they already have and the site hasn’t been updated.
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 8:28 AM | Link to this
Thanks for the IPOD help. That damn thing keeps giving me the white screen and nothing I do seems to get rid of it. Gotta take it to the IPOD store. And yeah, they’re backed up - unfortunately on my laptop that is fried because I spilled iced tea all over it. Time to go buy an external hard drive, take the IPOD to the Apple store, and laptop to the Geek Squad. Fortunately, the music is still on the IPOD and I can still play it. Unfortunately, I can’t see the menu so I have no clue which songs will get played because I can’t control it. Gotta love technology.
By ssiscribe
November 21, 2007 8:29 AM | Link to this
Top of the morning, denizens, as I ponder the following question that I always seem to have as a holiday approaches:
Why does it seem we have to work twice as hard in advance of a few days off?
At any rate, it’s been busy here the past few days. No, I’m not protesting anything (as a couple of folks have asked me recently). I’m merely participating in something that’s kinda time consuming … life.
Work. Freelance work. Family. Church. Getting ready to go out of town twice in the next 10 days. Ramping up the job so I can shut it down later today. Busy times.
But I won’t complain. Busy is good. And busy is good, too, when it’s November and your favorite baseball team has been active in gearing the roster toward the upcoming season.
(How’s that for transition?)
Now, Glavine: Glad he’s back. Know some of you are not happy with the move. As I’ve opined for the past few weeks, what’s not to like about adding a crafty, durable, future Hall of Famer who was among the NL’s most reliable pitchers last year to the MIDDLE of your rotation, in the spot where the quality and quantity slid noticeably in the second half last year?
I heard Keith Law on ESPN Monday afternoon embarrass himself and his network by saying the Braves should’ve invited Glavine to spring training to try and win a roster spot. What, did he hear Mark Redman throwing in the basement and get confused?
Folks, this is a very good move, for a guy whose impact will go beyond wins and innings pitched. And I saw Chop Chick — who has posted one thing in the past four months — talk about this move being based on remembering yesteryear. That blog is a joke; is she knows ANYTHING about baseball, then she can see this move is about shoring up a rotation that bled the bullpen dry last year, the end result being the entire apple cart falling apart in August and early September.
But enough about blowing the cobwebs off that lame fan blog …
Now, center field (more transition): I really like the Josh Anderson deal. You trade Oscar Villarreal, who wasn’t going to make the team in spring training and who was used only when the Braves were out of pitchers in the second half last season, for a kid who has speed, good range and a good stick.
Granted, Anderson only played 25 games in the majors. But that’s 25 more than Brent Lillibridge and Jordan Schafer combined have logged at the big-league level. I think you give both of those kids a shot in spring training, certainly. If they prove to be as good as I think they eventually will be, they go north.
Otherwise, based on what I’ve read and seen since Friday, I’m fine with Anderson hitting leadoff and playing center field on opening day. His body of work through the minors and in his cup of coffee with the Astros is enough for me to pencil him in as the starter for now, and we’ll see what the kids can do in camp.
Now, turkey (Thanksgiving transition; if you are of the opinion that the Braves/MIB/Pie/BBQ/Toes/MusicDuJour should be only Braves, then skip this part of the post): It’s time to get the bird ready to put into the oven. The Scribe is a pretty good cook, but being back in the shadows of the capital city, I’ll let my dear mom do the bird this year.
And to sit down tomorrow afternoon in the house where I grew up dreaming of baseball and writing, breaking bread with my folks and my kids and my bride, makes me feel blessed and thankful. It is my sincere wish, as duty calls, that all of you feel that warmth as our day to give thanks dawns in less than 24 hours.
And maybe perspective will allow all of us to carry that spirit of Thanksgiving forward into every day, and not just on the fourth Thursday in November.
Warmest wishes from the Scribe to denizens near and far.
Happy Thanksgiving!
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By 22oz
November 21, 2007 8:44 AM | Link to this
A MUST-READ on Foxsports.com for all you Dayn Perry lovers out there:
Mr. Perry has an article in which he gives his opinion on who should have won the awards this year. The interesting one is the NL MVP. He says that Rollins, Holliday,nor Fielder deserved to win the award, citing their defense as a weakness. He then gives his pick for this award.
Drumroll please….
David Wright. Shocking, i know.
On the year, Wright authored a batting line of .325 AVG/.416 OBP/.546 SLG with 74 extra-base hits, all while playing his home games in a park that’s quite tough on right-handed batters. Throw in his Gold Glove defense and his 34 steals in 39 attempts, and you’ve got an MVP season.
Gotta love it!
By doc
November 21, 2007 8:51 AM | Link to this
dave, then am hearing you correctly that glavine didnt really turn down 13 mil to play with the mets next season? that he would have gotten “only” 10 mil and that it’s a bit of reality distortion for anyone to say he turned down 13 mil. further his comment about being “no longer a 13 mil a year pitcher” is a figment of all’s imagination including his own in a way because he may never have been one or even considered to be one as it was never a part of the true equation?
thanks for the clarification and appreciate what you bring every day, through the day, ALL of it.
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 8:52 AM | Link to this
KU is 11-0. That defies all odds. Surely they can overcome the SI jinx as well. That was a really cool picture on that cover.
And you never know if Andruw will pull a Constanza and just keep running out there to center without a contract.
If Bobby called him up and said forget about your wife and kid, forget about how Americanized you have become, forget about the lifestyle you have become accustomed to, forget about about your moron agent, and get your a@@ out into center, Andruw would be sprinting his butt out into center with a big smile on his face.
Andruw might never listen to another thing Bobby or the coaches ever say but when his Skipper told him to run his fat butt out to center, he ran out there everyday with a smile (or a smirk) on his face.
I really believe Andruw would play if he was only getting paid $1500 per month. But, hey, if you can get someone to offer $1.5 mil a month for you to play, you have got to try to get that. This is Druw’s last big payday and he’s no longer single without a kid like he was during that 2002 contract negotiation.
I hate it. But I imagine Druw and Cox hate it much more. The kid had to grow up someday and make grownup decisions that make sense for him and the future of his family and not just what makes sense for the Braves.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 21, 2007 8:56 AM | Link to this
Sscribe Many thanks for your always enlightening and entertaining post.
Spring training should be fun this year with all those young guys competing for the center field spot. This could be Blanco’s make or break opportunity with the Braves. I don’t think he will get a better shot at making the team than this year with all those young speedsters right behind him.
By Bob, Journalist
November 21, 2007 9:09 AM | Link to this
For everyone on the Blog, regardless of view or team you support, … the McBrayers sincerely hope you have a safe and happy Thanksgiving … turkey, baked or country ham, wethinks it’s all good!
By chris
November 21, 2007 9:20 AM | Link to this
I liked the Anderson/Villarel trade, but Anderson’s minor league OPS’s are very poor and that doesn’t bode well. I like him as a fourth outfielder.
Anderson also gives Wren some leverage when it comes time to bargain for the real 2008 CFer.
By doc
November 21, 2007 9:22 AM | Link to this
bob j be cool. you are in all our heats this t’giving. there is no division among men (mankind) or “enemies” unless some want it so. we are all one, in spite of ourselves, at all times. you too jjs, as i know you are peaking. heh heh, have a goooood pie tomorrow. found any toekey, it might just be in the mirror. kidding, dude. i hope you can still laugh, if not what is left?
peace all.
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 9:41 AM | Link to this
Gobble, Gobble, Gobble. Maybe Kansas City’s Jimmy Gobble becomes the lefty reliever for the Braves.
Last two seasons combined: 137.7 innings, 130 strikeouts, 151 hits, 52 walks, 4.31 ERA, 1.47 WHIP.
Gives up too many hits, flyballs, and extra base hits but his strikeout totals are pretty impressive. He’s only 26 years old and a Southern boy from Tennessee. He seems to be getting better and may be worth a look if for no other reason than it is Thanksgiving time
By ssiscribe
November 21, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this
Bob J: Indeed, a good baked ham is a nice way to follow up the turkey onslaught. We will enjoy ham at some point over the weekend, per tradition at the Scribe’s abode. I continue to pray all things good for you and your bride.
Back to work, so I may kick back and relax with my kiddies and my bride tonight, cheering the Thrashers on via TV as we plot where to place ye ol’ Christmas tree (we decorate tomorrow night; will take our mind off the Colts/Falcons rout that surely will play out at the Dome downtown).
Peace — and pie — to all.
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By timmythebrave
November 21, 2007 9:52 AM | Link to this
My $0.02 on Andruw. I was glad that I had a chance to watch Andruw in cf. He is the best cf at catching the looping liners over 2nd base(I think better than Willie Mays although I’ve only seen video footage of him). He seemed to always make the catch when missing it would mean a triple going against the wall. It was a beautiful thing to watch him in cf and he seemed to make the catches with little effort. That said he is NOT worth 15 million or so. Back to the earlier conversation on jam bands. I’ve always been a widespread panic fan from my days in Athens and will see them on new years this year. I like Phish’s and Trey’s guitar but never got into them like Panic.
By David-ATL14
November 21, 2007 9:55 AM | Link to this
I second wjones 7:54 AM post
Braves have 41 names on the 40 man roster. I tried to come up with some info yesterday, but all roads seem to be a dead end.
Hate to obsess over minutiae but with the 40 man Rosters having to be submitted league wide yesterday, something is amiss.
Maybe DOB can clear this up for us in good time?
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this
DOB
Now I understand that the Braves are set with their starting rotation, and to some extent, their RHP out of the bullpen.
But if Billy Beane decides to blow it up…..
You have to think Frank Wren will make a call to Beane to at least discuss what it would take to land either Dan Haren, Joe Blanton or Huston Street.
I mean, if they are available, he has to look into that situation, right?
Maybe I am wrong, but after 2008, it is going to take a lot more in terms of prospects to land the arms of Jake Peavy or Erik Bedard through trades. Haren and Blanton aren’t as good as them, but they won’t cost as much.
And I truly believe that the Braves will be big players on Peavy or Bedard if they are made available next year( I don’t think either will be traded this offseason or at the deadline. The Padres are a contender, and Angelos will hold onto Bedard for as long as he can). Especially if they don’t resign Tex. Neither of them are Boras clients, and Peavy is from the South…..
By Overlord
November 21, 2007 10:22 AM | Link to this
Lew,
You think James can beat bennett, Jurrjens and jojo for the 5th spot? The only reason he will do so is because cox will carry him forever in the roster just as he carried AJ and Woodward, not because he will do better than others…….. things will end up like kyle and wickman…….I hope james does good, specially because he has worked hard,fortunately for him he will be competing for the 5th spot, so braves wont be asking for much, and as he has the most experience……..he will be chosen.
By Renegator
November 21, 2007 10:32 AM | Link to this
BobJ and ssiscribe
Great Posts on this morning before a holiday.
For those who have noticed that there are 41 players on the Braves 40 man roster - I would bet that Willie Harris will be the one dropped to make it 40. We have too many outfielders on the roster and he is the odd man out.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this
Well, Dayn Perry is like so many others. He has this “New York fascination”. How in the hell he could say David Wright deserved the MVP over Rollins, Holiday, and Fieleder is beyond me. Hell, I would argue that Chipper deserved to win the MVP more than Wright. And, Perry saying Wright’s “Gold Glove” defesne is laughable. Just because he won the award doesn’t mean it was Gold Glove caliber.
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 10:37 AM | Link to this
Braveheart, Gobble’s definitely on their list of possibilities, and there’s obviously the connection to KC — the Royals’ GM knows a thing or two about the kids in the Braves minor league system.
Oh, and I dug the 8:52 post….
22OZ, of course Wright should’ve won MVP. It’s an award, right? And he’s the fair-haired boy from NY. Give ‘em all to him while you can, whenever he puts up stats that even have him in the conversation of who should actually win the thing.
By Bob, Journalist
November 21, 2007 10:38 AM | Link to this
doc, Scribe, methinks you’re both wise men … doc, those who cannot laugh at themselves are doomed … as are those who derisively or scornfully laugh at others … it’s been too long since thinking of Longfellow “a scornful laugh, laughed he” … but the hope of the Blog and the world may well lie in the sharing of our laughter with others … especial thanks to the both of you providing me with ever so many laughs … and for sharing your humor and insights with us all!!
Again, Happy Thanksgiving!
bye
By chris
November 21, 2007 10:42 AM | Link to this
How the rotation shakes out is going to be fun to watch. I can see Bobby keeping Buddy C around in long relief/swingman because he likes his aggressiveness. Having the ability to throw strikes doesn’t hurt his cause, either.
Does anyone know what the deal is with Cormier? Is he out of options?
By geauxbraves2000
November 21, 2007 10:51 AM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!
My prayers are out for those who have lost loved ones (including myself, for I lost one of my best friends in an auto accident last year 11/26/06 & I lost my dad this year), for I know this can be a tough time of the year.
A lot of bad things happen in life, but so do a lot of good. Please try to remember the positive. Everyone have a great Thanksgiving!!
Maybe this time next year we’ll be reflecting on the parade that strolled down Atlanta’s streets in late Oct or early Nov.
Geaux Braves!!
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 10:51 AM | Link to this
Robert, JIB,
I meant to tell you a couple of days ago that I appreciated how you handled that guy the other day who said that Braves personnel decisions were racially motivated. Nice job.
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 10:56 AM | Link to this
Some might be wondering about Andruw as Type B free agent. Reason being, in the latest collective bargaining agreement, it stipulated that the Type A pool be reduced from the top 30 percent of free agents to the top 20 percent. So Andruw, I’m guess, fell in between the 20-30 percent range, using whatever stats they use to figure it….
Chrisklob, I can’t answer that, regarding the motivation for doing it that way. Luxury tax threshold was $148 mill, and Mets weren’t near that. So if it was done the way I was told, then it was probably to keep payroll within limits team had set for itself, or to keep his salary at a certain level for appearances. I don’t know. And since no one will acknowledge that publicly, probably not going to know….
By 22oz
November 21, 2007 11:02 AM | Link to this
Good to see a few people chiming in this morning, looks like some are stuck at work like me.
I just thought it was hilarious that Perry included the “Gold Glove defense” in his choice for Wright being the most deserving MVP candidate.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 21, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this
I think the 41 players listed on the 40 man is a glitch. Chris Resop was claimed off irrevocable outright waivers after he was removed from the Angels 40 man roster. The Braves claimed him , but where they actually assigned his contract to is a question that begs an answer ?
By TNRON
November 21, 2007 11:08 AM | Link to this
DOB,how about Chuck James and Dan Smith for DeJesus and Gobble?
By TennesseePaul
November 21, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this
Finely is trying to make a come back. Please tell me that Frank Wren, if given the choice, would rather sign AJ to a 1 year minor league deal rather than pick up Finely. Not saying AJ would sign such a deal, but I’d rather have the priorities list in the order. I don’t want to see another Raul Finely fiasco in the out field.
DOB: Agreed on both Mary Star of the Sea and Mellon Collie. The one that I can’t get into is Billy’s solo album. That was about as hard to take as Thom Yorke’s solo album.
By timmythebrave
November 21, 2007 11:18 AM | Link to this
I thought Matt Holiday deserved the MVP. I guess they think just because he plays in Colorado his stats are inflated. He had a way better year than Jimmy Rollins. I don’t think that Jimmy Rollins was the best SS in the national league much less the MVP of all positions. Hanley Ramirez had a better year than him. Northeast biase on the voting since they couldn’t give the award to David Wright. Gold glove my a$@, chipper plays a bettter 3rd than him
By Greg in TN
November 21, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this
Morning denizens…
Scribe, enjoy your turkey day and have a safe trip to your family Thanksgiving festivities and again to the land of the one-armed bandits. I know you’re heading out probably later today, so wanted to get that out to you beforehand. Always enjoy your posts as well as many others here.
It’s plan B behind the plate for the amazin’ mediocres in the stead of former Brave Johnny Estrada. I liked Estrada’s tenure in the ATL and was a little surprised that things didn’t work out with Ned Yost in the land of cheese and beer. I had to laugh at the Met’s beat reporter on MLB, Marty Noble, mentioning in this story that the chokesters will actually be saving money by getting rid of shell-shocked at Shea Guillermo Mota and his $3.2 million salary and in taking account the difference in what Lo Duca was wanting and what Estrada could earn in arbitration. Really? After all of the braying being done by a certain mediocre apologist here about the Braves pinching pennies. Ummmm, Mr. Kettle, Mr. Pot is on line two…
Jimmy Rollins is the 2007 NL MVP, keeping the award for the top player in the league in Philly after Ryan Howard won last year. Chipper came in 6th in the voting. The first place votes were distributed between the three front runners (Rollins had 16, Holliday 11 and Fielder 5). I’m mildly surprised that Rollins wins it but it’s not a complete shock.
Charlie Morton parlayed a 4-1 record with an 2.57 ERA into a spot on the 40-man roster. Nothing like a dominating performance with the big club’s GM, manager and pitching coach watching to boost your chances. Morton is joined by Jairo Cuevas and Zach Schreiber. Very quietly in terms of the Braves/MIB blog standards, Pete Orr has been designated for assignment.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 11:21 AM | Link to this
Chriskolb, thank you. I appreciate that!
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 11:27 AM | Link to this
TNRON
Chuck James and Dan Smith for Dejesus and Gobble? I would do it in a second. Not sure Moore would.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 11:39 AM | Link to this
The Cleveland Indians have signed Kobayashi to a deal to strengthen their bullpen. Wow, it’s going to be a good year to be a hot dog vendor at the Jake this year! :-)
By jon
November 21, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this
DOB!!! Don’t post often, but I do have a quick question for ya. Can you give us some information on Mike Gonzo??? He could be a HUGE part of our bullpen, especially with the almost certain departure of Mahay. I know he had Tommy John last year and that is a slow recovery..but what is the plans for him? How is he doing?? When are they projecting his return?? And when he does return, will he be on a strict count??? Thanks DOB, keep up the good work bro!
By DAP
November 21, 2007 11:47 AM | Link to this
Efrim and TNRON
chuck james and dan smith for dejesus is crazy. a young lefty starter with a great major league track record and a pitching prospect for a stop gap CF and a bullpen lefty with a not as good major league track record… whats wrong with you guys?
trading chuck james is not a good idea.
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 11:51 AM | Link to this
Chris - I don’t know if they can afford to keep Buddy. Meaning that they are going to have to keep or trade both James and Bennett. Depending on who wins the 5th starter spot (my money is on James) that means we will already have one starter in the bullpen (baring a trade) and Buddy would be the second.
Bennett could be used as a short man and Buddy as the long man, but we already have a long line of good relievers and we are trying to keep Mahay. Buddy may be one of a few odd men out at the end of spring training if Wren doesn’t trade someone away first.
By Saltywoody
November 21, 2007 12:00 PM | Link to this
Agree on Mellon Collie as well. That was one of the most ambitious and sprawling albums that’s been put out in the last 20 or so years in that genre.
The artistry behind every song and the way they work together as a whole is unreal. Every time I listen to that (not as much lately, but still once in a while), I find something I hadn’t noticed before.
In fact, the first couple songs on the first disk stand out as some of the best compositions they’ve ever done.
By flange1
November 21, 2007 12:02 PM | Link to this
Morning All,
Happy Thanksgiving to everyone!
On Baseball,
The more I think about it, the more I think that IF Hampton is back, it might make sense to let a righty take the #5 slot and put Chuck in the pen. Not as a closer or 8th or 9th inning guy, but as the long man and the guy that comes in to start an inning.
As DOB has said, he is prone to HR balls, but he does a great job for the first 2 times through the order. Let Ring be the lefty specialist for late in the game. Let Chuckie take over for Villareal and learn from being around Glavine.
That would fix our second lefty need for the bullpen, keep Chuck on the ML team and open up a rotation spot for JJJ or Bennett or Morton and give the Braves an additional spot starter if needed.
Just a thought!
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
DAP,
trading chuck james is not a good idea.
I have to agree with you there. In 09 when Hampton and Glavine are probably gone, James is going to be a major part of the starting rotation.
There have been a lot of Chuckie haters on here. Y’all need to look at the Elias Sports Bureau rankings. Chuck came in as the 20th best SP (out of approximately 100) in the NL. If he were a free agent, he would be considered a Type A player (take THAT, AJ!) Yes, clearly a third pitch will help him and I hope he’s working on that right now. But he’s still not as awful as some of you would believe.
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
DAP
You’re trading from a strength for a need. We need a cheap CF stopgap and a left handed reliever. Gobble and Dejesus are just that.
DeJesus actually takes pitches as well. Something that a lot of the Braves don’t do. Or at least the young ones…..
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 12:04 PM | Link to this
I’m going to assume, DOB, that Buddy Carlyle is off the radar. He is name is not mentioned at all. He did fall out of favor toward the end last year. What is the deal on him?
By chris
November 21, 2007 12:10 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave: So you think it’ll be Chuck in the 5th spot; Bennett in the pen; and Buddy C gets traded. What about Cormier?
By chris
November 21, 2007 12:18 PM | Link to this
flange: as DOB posted earlier, Chuck isn’t all that well suited for the pen.
Buddy C had success from being willing to throw a 91-92 fastball up high and getting batters to chase it. It was gutsy, aggressive pitching. I didn’t see him pitch in August and beyond, so it may be that hitters started laying off that out pitch and that’s why Buddy started to suck badly.
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this
If Chuck is truely in the future plans as chrisklob thinks (as do I), then putting him in the bullpen is not a viable option. To be effective in the future he has to keep starting to improve. Meaning Bennett goes to the pen.
By uga-brave
November 21, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this
braveheart,
your 8.52 post about andruw pulling a costanza cracked me up. hey it worked for raphael belliard for about 4 years. he just kept showing up.
By DAP
November 21, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this
chuck james is not expendable. i dont believe a lefty reliever and a center fielder are needed ENOUGH to trade one of the best young pitchers in the game. and lefty relivers and soft-hitting CFs are much more common than good starting pitchers.
there is not a desperate need to trade james for anything, so it wouldnt be smart to do that.
but im not worried about, it i believe james is already penciled in in the #5 spot and the managment knows better than to trade him.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this
Saltywoody, please accept my belated congratulations on receiving the prestigious Wurlitzer! Very funny stuff — keep it coming. The blog needs a little levity from time to time.
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
Yea Chris there are going to be some tough decisions to be made this spring to be sure. A good problem to have for sure.
With all that pitching one or two of Buddy, Cormier or Lerew and possibly Stockman or Yates will be traded for a small piece of the bench puzzle. Out of those named I can see Buddy and Lerew not in next season’s mix for sure.
By Austin
November 21, 2007 12:38 PM | Link to this
I just can’t get over Wright’s Gold Glove He made 21 errors which is good for a .954 fielding percentage.
Garret Atkins deserved the award.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 12:47 PM | Link to this
DAP, I agree with you to a point. I wouldn’t go as far to say that James is one of the best young starters in the game. He gives up way too many homers and doesn’t work nearly deep enough into games. He seemed to regress in ‘07 but that could have been due in part to the league making adjustments to him. Now, I think James could develop into the Glavine “light” but he has to develop another pitch and work on his stamina. I think he needs to hit the weight room like Hudson did last offseason.
However, with that being said very few players are not expendable and James is no different. If a deal came along that would give the Braves an impact CF even if he is a stopgap or better yet a quality starter the Braves would be fools to hang on to him. If the A’s call up and ask for James, B. Jones, and Prado/Holt in a deal, for instance, in exchange for Joe Blanton Wren would be a stone fool not to take that deal.
Also, I agree about James being the #5 starter. Its his job to lose. Bennet, Reyes, or Jurries would have to pitch Cy Young caliber ball in the spring to win the #5 spot. Cox will have his mind made up long before spring training starts. I think the Braves prefer Reyes and Jurries to spend at least part of the year in Richmond.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 12:49 PM | Link to this
TexasBrave, I believe that Lerew had ligament replacement surgery and is going to miss all of next year. No reason to trade him.
By Lew
November 21, 2007 12:50 PM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving wishes from the land of slush, mush and slow glaciation.
Can’t trade Chuckie-sorry, y’all. As some have correctly pointed out-In 09 Glavine is gone (unless they re-up on a one year), Hampton is gone (unless he performs well and re signs at a reasonable rate), so Chuck will figure prominently. Now Jurrjens and Reyes, at the very least, still have options remaining and can spend time in Richmond until needed or until the 09 rotation becomes clearer. Just because we have a wealth of pitching, I would remind everyone of the injury situation over the past two years and of the fact we will have two 40+ year olds going for us this year. Keep the arms. They may be invaluable.
By Saltywoody
November 21, 2007 12:55 PM | Link to this
ChrisKlob Thanks very much for your congratulations. I’m honored to receive this award.
I’d like to thank God, my momma, my agent (Scott Boras), all the people in my management and pr teams, and, of course, the fans and bloggers that make all this possible.
I’d also like to announce that until DOB offers me a 5 year contract with incentives and a buyout clause for the 6th year, I will be holding out from blogging spring training. I know this may disrupt the flow of the blog and the synchronicity of our posts…but, let’s be honest. I’m in this for me, not for the general good of the blog.
My emotions and feelings are paramount, and integrity and quality of discussion be damned.
By ppaddy123
November 21, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
2 days……2 days of intelligent and insightful conversation on the blog with nary a foul barb tossed at anyone. Baseball, music, Kansas football, turkey, ham……it’s all good. Hope everyone has a great and safe Thanksgiving! Go Braves!
By blazerpunter
November 21, 2007 1:01 PM | Link to this
What is funny when you think about Perry’s assessment of the MVP voting, he argues himself out of David Wright argument by arguing Ramirez was a better shortstop than Rollins. Chipper Jones was a better 3B than Wright was. Chipper’s avg, slug, and obp were all higher than Wright’s. Chipper struck out 40 fewer times. Chipper was actually within a point or 2 in most other categories away from Wright while playing in 30 FEWER GAMES (1 HR shy, 5 RBI’s shy, ties in doubles, etc.)Also, Chipper was a much better defensive 3B. We all need to start commenting on these people’s blogs and letting them the err in their ways!!
GO BRAVES……………..
By Hammy the Brave
November 21, 2007 1:02 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Thanks for your comments on the Braves’ 40-man roster.
What do you think about the following possibilities for the Braves bench?: Barajas/Leiberthal for catcher; Abraham Nunez/C. Izturas for 2B-SS; Mike Lamb/Corey Koskie for 3B-1B(I don’t trust Aybar for power and Thorman should be traded, and I really want a veteran with power to back up Chipper, with all his injuries).
Also, don’t you think Ryan Freel would be a nice righthanded complement in CF/leadoff, and could help at 2B also? I wonder if they could get him for Yates and Harris, w/o giving up a true prospect, given his salary. Norris Hopper with Cincy might be another option.
Lastly, I firmly believe the Braves need a right-handed power bat in LF, to replace Andruw. This would be easier than finding a power bat for CF, IMO. Is there a chance the Angels could release or trade Juan Rivera, since their OF is pretty well set? DOB, do you know of other right handed power bats that might be fairly easy to obtain this winter/spring? To me, Diaz won’t ever be a true run-producer, and is better as a PH/platoon option.
Have a great Turkey Day,
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 1:09 PM | Link to this
10Paul: Fully agree with Adore & Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness. Billy is my favorite from that era because of those 2 CDs. It does take repeated plays of those CDs to fully appreciate them. I’ve been trying real hard to do that for the past 6 weeks with the latest and just can’t get into it. It’s really ticking me off.
Buddy and Cormier are goners. Buddy did a great job for the Braves this season. When all was horrid at the bottom of the rotation, the Braves went 11-9 in his starts and he gave the Braves a chance to win most times out there. I just think that was his one season in the sun like the run Aaron Small had with the Yankees a few years ago. As for Cormier, I love Bama boys but gimme a break already. See ya!
We all agree Chuck James is the most valuable trade bait. But why would the Braves announce he has to compete for the fifth spot? Doesn’t that decrease his trade value? Make him look like he is damaged goods and possibly a failed starter that even the Braves are giving up on? Maybe the Braves are trying to increase the trade value of one of the other three by saying look how good Chuck is - we think one of these three can be even better than Chuck? The Braves probably don’t want to trade any of their young pitchers if they do not have to.
I understand why Hampton is being guaranteed a spot if he is healthy. He makes alot of money that can’t be wasted but I also think the Braves want to give Hampton a goal to work towards and a reason to believe. It’s hard enough coming back from injury and all the doubts that go through your mind when injured without feeling like the franchise is losing confidence in you. He was a starter and a damn good one. As the saying goes, you should not lose your spot due to injury.
As much as I like Chuck James and believe he should be the fifth starter until his performance dictates otherwise, competition is good for young fellas - especially ones like Chuck who could go either way depending upon his attitude and work ethic and improvement in skills. Gotta keep the young ones hungry - the old ones as well - but you go about it differently.
Not all personnel moves or promised personnel moves are based on performance and finances. Alot of times, management and the manager are psychologically testing or rewarding their players depending upon their circumstances.
Throwing Chuck James a scare about losing his job could be a very good thing. If he responds, then great. If he does not, then he was never gonna be a big time pitcher we could count on in a big spot anyway.
By uga-brave
November 21, 2007 1:11 PM | Link to this
all this talk about chuck developing another pitch, gaining stamina, or going over scouting reports is fine and dandy. the only problem is this is the same guy that would rather install windows in the offseason then work on his pitching skills. this is the same guy who broke both his arms jumping off a pool house the day before he was supposed to pitch in front of a lot of scouts.
smoltz saying to the MEDIA that chuck needs to make adjustments just about says it all. players dont call out players in the media often.
we all assume that every player has competitive fire, not to sure about chuck. there were a couple of games last year when he looked like he was begging to come out of the game.
well we will see what kind of make up he has this spring beacause i dont think bobby is going to hand that spot over to him without earning it.
By ncscoots
November 21, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this
Lew, unless Chuck went down last year and I’ve forgotten about it, he has an option year remaining, also. Richmond’s the place for him, IMO, not tail-end-Charlie in a three-lefty sequence.
By nOLIE
November 21, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this
Why would Gobble be on their radar? He had one good year last season but the rest of the time hie ERA and his WHIP have been atrocious. I’m not sure I see any reason to think that he wouldn’t regress to the norm and throw a 1.45 / 5.20. I would not like to see them trade anybody of ant value for him. Relievers are relievers for a reason, and in most cases inconsistency is a big part of it.
By chris
November 21, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this
Right, Lew. Smoltz and Glavine will need to take a rest here and there and someone will have to fill in. And no way is Hampton, even if he stays healthy, going to be able to go much past 150 innings. So that’s about 20 starts that will need to come from someone.
By DAP
November 21, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this
Robert(JIB) I wouldn’t go as far to say that James is one of the best young starters in the game.
i would like to extend a friendly challenge to you to find someone better. they must have been used primarily as a starter, have around the same number of starts as james, and the same or better W/L, ERA, ect. let me know what you find, and then lets talk about it.
By Austin
November 21, 2007 1:15 PM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving To ALL!!!
Before I head out with my parents to Alabama, about a 6 hour drive from Svannah, just wanted to wish all a Happy Thanksgiving!!!
By uga-brave
November 21, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this
final comment on chuck, if he develops a cutter, CHUCK JAMES= JIMMY KEY. that would be just fine.
By TexasBrave
November 21, 2007 1:23 PM | Link to this
chrisklob - Yea I knew that I just forgot. Thanks for the reminder.
I still don’t trade Chucky unless we get someone of equal or greater value (pitcher) in return and I just don’t see that happening. We can ill afford to lose any of our young pitchers with so many older ones on the verge of retirement or going somewhere else. Not to mention the prospects that Smoltz or Hampton could be out of the picture for a while during the season.
By OrlandoFan
November 21, 2007 1:28 PM | Link to this
I think this blog has come full circle at least 3 times. May be time to start over with a new top!
By ppaddy123
November 21, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
My opinion on the idea that’s running lately about trading Chucky……Why would you take your best girl to the dance only to watch other fellas dance with her? He’s the best young arm we have. Spending time with Glavine and Hampton this year, in a non pressure situation like last year, will help him in the long run. Everyone wants to compare him to Glavine, but I think he throws more like Hampton. Again, just my 2 cents worth…..
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
happy thanksgiving Austin. for a 15 year old or any fan of any age, you are one pretty sharp dude and astute baseball fan.
By chrisklob
November 21, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this
ugabrave, I believe that DOB said that Chuckie isn’t working for Home Depot this winter. And I don’t know that it’s fair to criticize him for a lapse in judgement YEARS AGO! We all did stupid things when we were young. Some of the youngsters on this blog are still doing stupid things! It’s what people do when they are young.
When I was in high school and college I thought I was ten feet tall and bullet proof! Hopefully Chuckie has matured to the point where he’s taking his profession a little more seriously. With a little time to look at his 07 performance, he should be able to learn from some of his mistakes and improve in 08.
By DAP
November 21, 2007 1:38 PM | Link to this
uga-brave agreed on a cutter for chuck james. i think it would be a good one for him. other breaking pitches dont seem like they would fit him as well.
what pitches does glavine throw? i know he got a fastball and a changeup too. what else? maybe chuck can try to do exactly what glavine does.
anybody know glavine pitch selection?
By mr baseball
November 21, 2007 1:40 PM | Link to this
Sorry if this comes off as a bit too much of a downer for the holiday, but judging by some of the post-Glavine signing posts, there may be a need to curb some of the enthusiasm regarding the Braves’ starting pitching. Anyone assuming that Hampton is going to be in the rotation is in clear violation of the prime directive of the well-known warning about assumptions.
The Braves have to go into spring training with a strong mindset that there are 2 open spots in the rotation. James is the front runner for one spot; Jurrgens, Reyes & Bennett are competing for the other. Because of his history, Bennett would be the most likely one of the group to take Villareal’s spot as long man and emergency starter so the team does not have to juggle the roster every time a spot starter is required.
If Hampton can come back anywhere close to his past form, that’s a bonus. In that case, someone gets bumped from the rotation, and the need to have someone on the staff available to spot start becomes even more important. Essentially, the Braves need to leave ST with 6 potential starters, not 5 starters and 7 relievers, regardless of Hampton’s situation.
Considering the ages of Glavine & Smoltz, the health/contract status of Hampton and the possibility that Tex is gone after ‘08, not to mention a looming managerial change, this could be the last shot at a championship with this core group. I hope the organization is taking the attitide of hoping for the best and expecting the worst, something it did not do going into the season last year, particularly in regards to the latter half of the equation.
While most of us are paying attention to the “big” things — signing Glavine, trading Renteria, dumping Andruw — it’s those pesky little details that frequently make the difference between qualifying for the playoffs or finishing a few games out. A lot of the “little” things cost the Braves big time during the latter years of Schuerholz’s reign as GM. Let’s hope the new guy has a little more success in the bench/bullpen areas, and doesn’t get caught with some obvious holes and no one on hand to fill them.
Just be thankful we’re not diehard Falcons fans. That must really be depressing.
By ncscoots
November 21, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this
My emotions and feelings are paramount, and integrity and quality of discussion be damned.
Salty, sounds as if you’ve slipped over to the dark side and joined the blog police. :-)
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 1:46 PM | Link to this
Some of the youngsters on this blog are still doing stupid things! It’s what people do when they are young.
Klobber, ease up on the youngsters. Some of you geezers on the blog seem to say and do stupid things every once in a while as well!
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 1:48 PM | Link to this
Thought you folks might get a kick out of the kind of back-and-forth going on in Kansas City, which is pretty evenly split between KU and Mizzou alums (though more KU in the well-heeled suburbs on the Kansas side, of course).
I don’t know if these pix will come out or not, but here goes:
/Users/dobrienajc/Desktop/mizzoufancb5.jpg
/Users/dobrienajc/Desktop/pic12113.jpg
By TNRON
November 21, 2007 1:49 PM | Link to this
Ok guys I just got home from work for the holidays and didnt realize I opened a can of worms so to speak.First off I am just not sure what the market value on Chuck is at the moment.As noted he failed to make adjustments after the league caught up and frankly,if he doesnt add a third pitch and learn to prepare for his starts,he will never be better than average.I understand he has good stats,but and until he adds a third pitch to get the hitters off his changeup he will continue to be inconsistant.As far as DeJesus goes he is getting a lot of interest I understand thru other sources.And while I dont think he is an impact CF he would be far better than mediocre,I believe,batting in the 8 hole like Chuckie Thomas did a few years back.It seems the Braves dont value Dan Smith as much as the stats would indicate they should.I of course have never saw him pitch (he possibly pitched against my hometown team the TN Smokies in the past,I am not sure)but would rather trade him than lose him in the rule 5 draft.And Gobble just appears to have some upside and as we all know leftys develop late sometimes.
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 1:50 PM | Link to this
Salty, sounds as if you’ve slipped over to the dark side and joined the blog police.
Scoots The irony is that doesn’t your commentary on the blog police mean you are the blog police of the blog police who themselves are policing the original blog police? I believe that makes you Internal Affairs. :o>
By Thrillhouse44
November 21, 2007 1:54 PM | Link to this
Why is Chuck taking heat for working at Lowe’s? I too would rather him study and condition in the offseason, but it’s not like he’s at home boozing it up and playing PlayStation. (That’s my second job, chrisklob. I’m still doing stupid things.)
Often professional athletes are criticized for forgetting their roots and believing they can do anything because they have money. Well, Chuck James decided to work at a freakin’ home improvement store. I think that says a lot about his character. That he’s not afraid of hard work and enjoys rubbing elbows with the everyday man. Don’t hate on CJ for keeepin it real!
By ppaddy123
November 21, 2007 1:55 PM | Link to this
mr baseball certainly agree with you about assuming anything. However, that being said, with $15 million invested in Hampton this year, if he can throw, he’s gonna’ be in the rotation. Kinda’ like playing Andruw everyday last year……sure would’ve been nice to see him take a week or two off!
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this
Jon, re: Gonzalez, Wren reiterated this week that Gonzo should be back at “midseason.” I’d guess July, no sooner than late June. Beyond that, you’re seeking answers to questions to questions too premature to answer. NO ONE knows how he’ll respond to TJ surgery, because it’s different with every guy. If he’s done any throwing, it’s only soft-tossing, nothing where you can measure or put together a timetable on his return based on how he feels lightly tossing a baseball now.
It’s just too early. And whether he’ll be a on strict pitch count? No one can possibly know that either. If he comes back and feels great and is throwing gas, then I’d guess there’d be less limitations, obviously. But it’s all guessing now. Braves don’t know, he doesn’t know. Just gotta wait and see how he progresses. But no way he’ll be back before June, I think it’s safe to assume.
By ncscoots
November 21, 2007 2:02 PM | Link to this
Braveheart, not hardly. That makes me the conscientious objector, I guess. Death to the tyrants!
Or, at least, the narcissistic would-be tyrants, LMAO.
By chris
November 21, 2007 2:07 PM | Link to this
I would have rather seen Chuck boozing it up and hanging with loose women.
By Andy
November 21, 2007 2:07 PM | Link to this
DOB: Is there any news on Doug Clark? Is he still signed to a minor league contract? Because I have heard he was a big part of Richmond’s leadership on and off the field, and he did fairly well.
By realyellowblood
November 21, 2007 2:11 PM | Link to this
This is incredible ! This is the longest string of blog responses I have EVER seen in the AJC. Amazing ! Getting Tommy back is a no-brainer. He obviously wanted back and took a big cut to do it. Scott Boras must be ready to cut his own throat. Everyone in ATL was angry about Tom leaving;not angry at Tom. He is ours and always has been . Terrific ! I’ll take 13 wins and an ERA under 4 right now and believe that the Braves can get back to the top on this alone. The Mets proved that the Minaya method does not work and we can surely top the Phils.
By BossLady
November 21, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this
All of those 1500+ people on the poll still hating Tommy should really think about if their lives are fulfilled.
Baseball is a sport, the Braves are our home team and the players really do have their own personal lives.
Just enjoy the game and be a good fan and stop hating people.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this
DAP, okay here are some guys. John Maine. Cole Hammels. Rich Hill. Ian Snell. Tom Gorzelany. Matt Cain. Noah Lowry. Jeff Francis. Jared Weaver. Fausto Carmona. Justin Verlander. Is that enough names?
By BossLady
November 21, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this
Actually we have had over a 1000 blogs before.
HAPPY THANKSGIVING!!!!!!!!
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this
This is incredible ! This is the longest string of blog responses I have EVER seen in the AJC.
Dude, just another day in the neighborhood. Welcome!
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 2:31 PM | Link to this
Rotoworld.com
ESPN’s Jayson Stark says the Reds are aggressively shopping Ryan Freel and will entertain offers for Josh Hamilton.
Freel’s value is at a low point after he missed so much of 2007 due to injury. Hamilton could bring in a nice return if some GMs can be convinced that he’ll stay healthy. Should the Reds move Hamilton, they could put Jay Bruce in center and use Freel and Norris Hopper as reserves. Bruce will eventually end up in a corner as a replacement for either Adam Dunn or Ken Griffey Jr.
Go get em Frank…..Hamilton that is. Stay away from the overrated Freel.
By Lew
November 21, 2007 2:35 PM | Link to this
Scoots-You may be right about Chuck’s option status. However, if it came down to a choice of Reyes, Jurrjens and Chuck getting sent down, I just don’t see Chuck and his 22-14 record being the one packing his bags.
By uga-brave
November 21, 2007 2:41 PM | Link to this
braveheart,
actually another day in the nut house. we have our manic depressives, or ocd’ers and of course our friends with muliple personalities. i guess that is why we are all here, aint it great. happy turkey day to all.
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this
I guess one good thing about Chuck not working for Lowe’s anymore is that there is no danger of him getting the top of his finger cut off like Bob Ojeda did with an electric hedge clipper.
But, of course, if he left his job at Lowe’s and decided to spend more time on his boat, Chuck could almost get decapitated like Bob Ojeda.
Sorry to make light of a horrible tragedy but Ojeda was one unlucky SOB.
By ssiscribe
November 21, 2007 2:48 PM | Link to this
Lew, gotta agree with you on that one. Reyes and Jurrjens both have a ton of potential (I believe if Hampton is a no-go, then you’ll see Jurrjens in the starting rotation; love his stuff a lot).
But Chuck’s won double-digit games in each of his first two seasons. His arm getting tired late in the season, his inability to keep the ball in the yard and the fact he needs to develop a third pitch are things we all are concerned about.
But he has been, in stretches, very good at the major-league level. And with two 40-somethings in the rotation, I don’t think you toss James and his experience aside, at least not right now.
If Hampton comes back and has a healthy spring, then there’s gonna have to be a decision made. I would expect the Braves would keep James as the fifth starter and send Jurrjens to Richmond in that scenario. I don’t know what I’d do if it were my call. I really think Jurrjens is going to develop into a top-of-the-rotation type guy.
Enjoy the snow up there, esteemed Wurlitzer creator. Happy Turkey Day to you and yours.
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By uga-brave
November 21, 2007 2:50 PM | Link to this
hamilton is an interesting option. a lot of baggage but what he did in one year after basically being on skid row is flat out amazing. the guy is a freak of nature.
By DAP
November 21, 2007 3:03 PM | Link to this
Robert(JIB)
DAP, okay here are some guys. John Maine. Cole Hammels. Rich Hill. Ian Snell. Tom Gorzelany. Matt Cain. Noah Lowry. Jeff Francis. Jared Weaver. Fausto Carmona. Justin Verlander. Is that enough names?
if its enough for you, its enough for me. lets look and see how chuck compares to these guys.
Rich Hill he is thought to be a very good young starter. hes made 52 starts compared to chucks 48, and hes 17-17 lifetime, compared to chucks 22-14. he also got a higher ERA than chuck.
ian sneell many bloggers think we should try and trade for this guy. he has almost a years worth of starts more than chuck james, and has 2 more wins than chuck. snell’s life time is 24-26. also, his ERA is 4.40 to james 4.00
Tom Gorzelany has a lifetime record of 16-16.
Matt Cain in about 20 more starts than chuck, he has the same number of wins, 22-and 29 losses.
noah lowry has twice as many start in the majors as chuck james.
jeff francis twice as many starts in the majors as chuck
all of these guy i just listed are not fair comparisons to chuck. either they simply arent better than chuck, or they have way more experience than chuck. thats leaves verlander, hamels, maine, weaver, and carmona.
so the guys that are fair comparisons and are better than chuck james are maine, hamels, verlander…all three the ACES of thier teams, carmona, who would be the ace if his teamate wasnt cy young, and weaver, who is definetly an ace in the making.
by the way. this is innings pitched per start… here is roughly average for each pitcher(i rounded decimals)
maine 5.8
james 5.9
weaver 6.0
hamels 6.1
verlander 6.2
carmona 6.7
so carmona is a horse, but james isnt that far off from some of these guys.
my point is robert, he is in company with these guys, so i think it can be said hes one of the best young pitchers in the game, if you get guys with comparable experience.
By Salty
November 21, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this
Hey, Guys! With all due respect to his posts, it’s Saltywoody…I’m Salty!
I scrambled all over this blog trying to figure out when I’d made that post; in fact, trying to recall when I was ‘blogged in’! Then realized, it’s quality far exceeded anything I could write! Oh, and well done, young ‘un, from a (semi) geezer! You done the Wurlitzer proud!
By Robert
November 21, 2007 3:16 PM | Link to this
DOB
I just read on another Braves site and a brewers site, that the braves have Francoeur on the block. is there anyway we trade francoeur. please tell me no
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
DAP
Chuck James is not in the same league as Hamels, Cain, Verlander, Carmona, or a lot of the guys you mentioned. Stuff and projectability are pretty important. Chuck really doesn’t have great stuff and he is about 5 foot 9.
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 3:20 PM | Link to this
Great stuff here today, ladies and gents.
I’ll post a new blog tomorrow, not wait until Friday, since it now appears I’ll be attending the biggest game in the not-so-illustrious football history of my alma mater. My buddy’s got an extra ticket, and I scrambled to get a flight to KC on Friday. So I’m gonna be there (alas, not blogging. Sorry, folks, there are limits to my dedication, and taking a laptop to a game as a fan is way over said limit).
Alright, going to see No Country for Old Men now. Be back later.
By the way, Before the Devil Knows You’re Dead is a great movie. We saw that a few days ago.
By ppaddy123
November 21, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this
DAP not trying to tread on your comments, because they’re very informative, but you should also point out that all the guys you listed (Maine, Weaver, Hamels and so on)are all #1 or #2 starters where Chuck will be a #5. I don’t know about you, but having a #5 with those numbers is stronger than new rope!
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 3:25 PM | Link to this
DAP, wouldn’t you agree in fairness to guys like Gorzelany, Snell, Lowry, Cain, and Hill that they have been on inferior teams. Those guys respective teams (Pirates, Giants, and Cubs) have all had worse records than the Braves over their time in the majors. I am sure some of Chuck’s wins were the benefit of a terrific offense. Now, don’t get me wrong. I think James is a decent pitcher now and can be a helluva pitcher with some hard work and studing. But, I don’t think he is as good or better than any of those guys. He just isn’t there yet.
I’ll put it like this. In a must win game who would you rather have on the mound? James or Hammels? James or Caromna? James or Snell? James or Lowry? I’m not putting down Chuck James. I’m just saying he isn’t so good as to say he isn’t tradeable. At this point Smoltz and Hudson can be classified as “untradeable”. But, James isn’t.
I think a balanced view of James has to be taken. He isn’t as good as 2006 and as bad as 2007. And yes I understand he has double digit victories in his first two seasons but I wonder how many of those games featured 7+ run output by the Braves. I compare it to Wang of the Yankees. Yes, he is a good pitcher but he isn’t the ace he’s made out to be and that has been proven in back to back postseasons. His ERA is good and his win-loss total is phenomenal but are just as much the result of having a great offense as it is ability. That’s all I’m saying.
By Saltywoody
November 21, 2007 3:32 PM | Link to this
Salty Thank you for making the distinction/clarification.
You wouldn’t want to be associated wtih my lowly, uninformed comments anyway. It would be like Robert Deniro getting inappropriately included in a discussion of “Not Another Teen Movie” or something…
By DAP
November 21, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this
Efrim youre right, chuck isnt in the same league as verlander and carmona. theyre american league.
seriously, though…im not saying chuck is better than these guys, but the stats are comparable enough that you cant say he isnt at the same level. at least not right now.
besides, you are talking about his size…hes not smaller than maddux, glavine, or pedro, three of the all-time greats.
forget about how players are projected, and forget about stuff and size and just looks at results.
chuck wins ball games. period.
By timmythebrave
November 21, 2007 3:38 PM | Link to this
Robert (Justice Is The Best), you are trying to prove that Chuck James is not a #1 or #2 pitcher. I don’t think anyone would disagree with that. We are talking about a solid #4. Compare him to a depth chart of any other teams #4 and you will see what we are talking about. The guys you named are teams #1 and 2 guys and I am sure they get paid more than the 400,000 that chuckie makes
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 3:41 PM | Link to this
Robert, I hope those claims are bogus. I can’t see the Braves trading Francoeur because of the PR nightmare alone. That would not be a move that would ingratiate Wren to the masses, you know what I mean. No way Francoeur should be traded unless its for the following players or combinations: Hunter Pence & Lance Berkman; Albert Puljos; Billingsley/Kershaw, Kemp/Ethier, and Andy LaRoche; Cain/Lowry, Fred Lewis, and Lincecum; Phillip Hughes, Melkey Cabrera, and Robinson Cano; Ellsbury and Bucholz; Alex Rios; Bedard, Markakis, and Penn; Carl Crawford; CC Sabathia; Johan Santana; Figgins, Weaver/Saunders; and Kotchman/Morales or Rivera; Haren or Blanton. Now, if none of those players come back in return then there doesn’t even need to be a conversation about a trade.
By ncscoots
November 21, 2007 3:45 PM | Link to this
Lew, surely you’re not part of the crew that think Chuck is gonna suddenly wake up with a Roy Oswalt curve, LOL. I won’t even comment on the suggestion that he throw a cut fastball.
He is what he is. Oh, he could surprise, I guess, Mario Soto got along pretty good with just two pitches. But otherwise, if Hampton is healthy, Chuck’s spot is gone. Any righty who has any kind of decent spring will make the rotation.
By timmythebrave
November 21, 2007 3:45 PM | Link to this
And that’s all I got to say about that. I’m off work and headed to the beach for Thanksgiving. Nothing but eating, sleeping, drinking, and watching some football. Talk to ya’ll next week
By JasonInMaine
November 21, 2007 3:49 PM | Link to this
Robert, what site would that be?
By DAP
November 21, 2007 3:52 PM | Link to this
Robert(JIB) i might take the poor team defense on gorzelany and MAYBE on rich hill.
lowry just has to many starts to even compare with chuck twice as many
cain and snell both have 70 starts in the majors, cain has the same amount of wins as chuck and snell has 2 more than chuck. if they are that much better than chuck, they would have found a way to get a few more wins in 20 games.
if chuck pitches 20 games you can expect him get a win in 7 or 8 of them.
and the other guys all would get my vote in a big game over chuck except for snell. id take chuck over him.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 21, 2007 3:52 PM | Link to this
I agree with that Timmythebrave. I think if you compare James to other young #4 and #5 starters he is above and beyond. But I think the Braves are hoping James becomes at least a solid #3. And, you are wrong about what those guys are getting paid. All of the guys I mentioned have three years or less MLB service which means they haven’t even hit arbitration yet.
By Kentavo
November 21, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
Francouer will sign with the BoSox as soon as he hits free agency.
By Salty
November 21, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this
SaltyWoody Lowly, uninformed comments? That’s what we blog for; sense and sensibility merely fills the void between!!!
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
DAP
I’m not a Chuck James fan, nor will I ever be. I am going to be rooting for Jair Jurrjens or Jo Jo Reyes to take a rotation spot away from him the spring training.
The guy gave gives up way too many long ones. It’ll never change. Chuck is what he is. A #4 starter in the NL.
By JC FROM UT
November 21, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
The only way you trade CJ is if he is in a package to bring back another young pitcher who is signed to a relatively budget friendly contract. The present rotation has a lot of age and 2009 we will need some youth injected into the rotation and I would take CJ over a number of pitchers who have been mentioned earlier.
By ncscoots
November 21, 2007 4:13 PM | Link to this
Salty, I’m guessing a few of my posts had the Woody One furrowing his brow, LOL. Thanks for the clary!
By Steve McP
November 21, 2007 4:14 PM | Link to this
My second job seems to be scrolling down this blog - at least it is occupying more time than anything i am paid to do
By Salty
November 21, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
Scoots Actually, he knew you were referring to him. I thought I was having a ‘senior moment’; blogging without consciousness! Or is that normal…I don’t know anymore.
May DOB feel much better after the Jayhawks game than we felt watching the ball dribble to the ground on the 3-yard line last Saturday night. Oh, oh, … ouch!
By Fred Secunda
November 21, 2007 4:26 PM | Link to this
DOB, I’m actually about to leave to go see “No Country for Old Men” too. I haven’t been this excited about a movie in a while.
What do you think the chances are the Braves take a flyer on Scott Podsednik? He was just released by the White Sox and sees like he’d be a good fit at the top of the order.
By ncscoots
November 21, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
Salty, that was a long drive home Sunday, bubba. Just more of that late-game BC voodoo: blown coverage, a drop at the 2, and a sack out of FG range, all in the last 1:50. You can’t make this stuff up.
Maybe there’s something to those St. Patrick’s medallions, after all.
By Saltywoody
November 21, 2007 4:41 PM | Link to this
The Woody One
I love it.
By JB
November 21, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this
DOB, What are the chances we get JOSH HAMILTON or Nate McLouth mainly HAMILTON though.
By Braveheart
November 21, 2007 5:02 PM | Link to this
hey it worked for raphael belliard for about 4 years. he just kept showing up.
ugabrave and showing up is half the battle. of course that prick GI Joe always insisted that knowing was half the battle.
By Wayne in Utah
November 21, 2007 5:02 PM | Link to this
Salty & Scoots
Last Saturday night was brutal. A game that definitely should have been won. What was that FTJ crap anyway? Didn’t seem to work.
Ah, maybe we can take down Spurrier and the Gamecocks!
By Saltywoody
November 21, 2007 5:03 PM | Link to this
Happy Turk Day, Everybody. I’m off to the land of naps, pies, burgeoning stomachs, and turduckens.
Enjoy and remember to give thanks for how lucky all of us are…we could very easily be in Bangladesh or Chile or a thousand other places much less fortunate.
Much love.
By French Lillybridge
November 21, 2007 5:15 PM | Link to this
Many Happy Thanksgiving Greetings to Braves fans all over cyberspace!
By Rev. Zoldars
November 21, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this
to whomever suggested picking up Podsednik:
He’s an experienced outfielder with lots of speed… maybe he had a down year last year, but at 31, he might be a good reclamation project. I mean besides last year, in 2006 he stole 40 bases I believe, and in 2005 he stole 59! or something close to that.
And, he missed 100 games last year and he still stole 13 bases. Hell, thats good for around 30 - 35 stolen bases. I smell experienced backup outfielder for the bench.
But if you claim these guys, you have to keep them on your 25 man the whole year, right? And, do you incur all remaining salary? or is it a work out a new deal type of thing?
If he’s cheap and doesn’t cost us anything in the way of prospects/ draft picks, lets do it and hope for a willie harris “lightnin in a bottle” type o dealy. Or not. I don’t care that much I guess.
food for thought
By mo in the boonies
November 21, 2007 5:34 PM | Link to this
Grinch Got it! :-) Our well will never run dry. It is only about 150 feet away from Lake Huron, which measures 206 miles across, and 183 miles long, with an average depth of 195 feet. BTW, I have read references on here concerning you and college, are you attending or teaching? Noisy mind wants to know.
TexasBrave No, you are the only one who feels bad about Andruw. I do too. Especially if they get some one’s garbage to take his place for one year.
Wasn’t on the computer yesterday, so apparently the “infamous Serbok post” was deleted before I got to read it, since I haven’t been able to find it. Now I’m left forever wondering what was infamous about it! Also will never know who the rant was about, Robert?? See mo rolling eyes.
Lew we had our first snow storm on the 8th of Nov. But now it is back to rain.
All I have to say about Chucky is, he makes me nervous when he pitches.
Saltywoody I watched Franconia during the series, that was a huge wad of bubble gum in his mouth all the time, unless they are making pink chaw now? He sure did a lot of spitting though, and I figured it was just a habit, or else he didn’t want to swallow all that sugar.
I’ve run out of computer time for today, and still am only on yesterday’s posts, have a lot of blog reading to do. Well, as Scarlett said, Tomorrow’s another day! Happy Thanksgiving everybody!
By N8
November 21, 2007 5:58 PM | Link to this
DOB
Congrats on the extra ticket to the game. Enjoy Arrowhead stadium.
I listen to 610 sports radio online everyday (because I thoroughly enjoy listening to hotheads call in b!tching about the Chiefs everyday), and they’re saying that it’s gonna be the biggest crowd in the History of Arrowhead Stadium.
In fact, you should hear them all (the talk radio hosts), it’s almost like they’re pizzed off with Priest retiring, (looks like the Kolby Smith era is gonna start one week after the Brodie Croyle era did…..YIKES) becuase it’s interupted the 2 week long BSing that’s led up to this game.
It’s been fun listening to the callers calling in from both schools trash talking each other. Definitely good radio (even though I could care less about the game - I’m actually sick of hearing about it - for the record I’m not a huge college football fan).
Anyhow. Have a good Thanksgiving, cool that you’re puting up a new blog tomorrow, and enjoy the game. Sounds like it’s gonna be a good time.
By doc
November 21, 2007 5:59 PM | Link to this
dob, like the no country for an old man. i hope there is a sequel. saw it sunday, excellent, just hope it is like kill bill in that there might be a follow up.
if you would, clarify the glavine contract stuff you discussed earlier.
By Salty
November 21, 2007 6:17 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah and Scoots The other thing that burned me was the interference call…absolutely brutal. Spilt milk, many will say, but doggone it, all LB’s doing is covering his guy; at worst, if he turns, he intercepts. I knew right then and there that was going to burn us. Oh, well, chicken this weekend! (I hope!).
By Deep Throat
November 21, 2007 6:33 PM | Link to this
Mitt Romney: the official candidate of the Atlanta Braves?
SEE THE PROOF HERE
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 21, 2007 7:24 PM | Link to this
Just caught up on the blog and wanted to wish all my fellow denizens a happy turkey day !! Yes , Chuck James does have an optional assignment for 2008 , not that it matters because the fifth spot is his to lose.
I prefer to think positive and believe that Mike Hampton will be back and effective in 2008.
Frank Wren and Bobby Cox have made it crystal clear that the Braves are not shopping for anymore starters.
The Braves number one priority right now is getting Ron Mahay back. Until it does or doesn’t happen , everything else is second fiddle.
The Braves MBL home website still has 41 players on the 40 man and Glavine isn’t on the depth chart , whoever is responsible for updating the information , YOUR FIRED !
The Reds are shopping Josh Hamilton ? YEA and I’m the Easter Bunny.
If all the starters that are projected to make it to spring training actually show up (Hampton), somebody will almost certainly be traded. After all , the Braves are currently ten deep in starters.
Mr.Baseball , please get out of LF and join the rest of us in the clubhouse. The Braves are hip deep in pitching , the defense is in place and the offense is fine. It all equals PLAYOFFS !
By Fellow Tiger
November 21, 2007 8:17 PM | Link to this
Salty, Wayne in Utah and Scoots. Now FTJ stands for Flush Tickets to Jacksonville. Maybe next year. We better beat SC or it may be time for Tommy to go.
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 8:26 PM | Link to this
Doc, the movie was outstanding, did the book justice.
I don’t really no how they’d do a sequel, though, unless they just took it beyond the book. Obviously they could do that, but doesn’t strike me as something the Coen Brothers would do.
Anyway, how great was that cast? Everyone in the movie was perfectly cast. Anton Chigurh was about the most evil, chilling character to come along in a movie in some time.
That’s two great acting performances for Tommy Lee Jones this fall, this movie and Valley of Elah.
By jon
November 21, 2007 8:34 PM | Link to this
DOB, thanks for the reply!
By Daybed Wagmoe
November 21, 2007 8:58 PM | Link to this
i know it’d be pretty risky considering his injuries, but…
scott podsednik was released by the white sox today. you think there’s any chance that the braves will consider him to fill CF?
can’t wait to see “no country for old men.” i finished the book last week and loved it, glad to hear that the movie is outstanding as well.
By bwash21
November 21, 2007 9:01 PM | Link to this
I’m still on the CoCo Crisp bandwagon but a couple suitable temporary (and cheap) replacements or platoon guys have surfaced. I’m not crazy about Anderson as an everyday guy but we would need RH hitter to platoon. If we needed a LH bat and leadoff, Podsednik is one guy that would be adequate. Another guy I thought of the other day and now just saw on ESPN that is looking for a job is Steve Finley. I don’t know if he can still do it at 43 but he’d come cheap AND would probably be willing to sign a minor league contract and make a play for CF in spring training. AND, whoever is floating these Franceour rumors, forget about it and don’t worry. He’s going to be a Brave for a long time. Besides, IF the Braves ever did talk about trading him, it would NEVER get out until it was done. The PR nightmare and consequently 10,000 season ticket holders that would immediately cancel their tickets would never be worth it. No way the Braves will trade Chuck James right now. After struggling to fill the rotation all last year, and with Hampton, Glavine, and Smoltz careers hanging in the balance, we’lll need all the SP’s we can get our hands on for 2009.
By Shaun
November 21, 2007 9:02 PM | Link to this
to whomever suggested picking up Podsednik:
A .299 OBP last season!!
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 21, 2007 9:07 PM | Link to this
O’Brien , I was going to see No Country For Old Men. Predictably , it’s not showing on a silver screen within 500 miles. I’ll just have to wait for the DVD. I saw In the Valley of Elah and it tore me up inside , it’s just a gut wrenching movie. Let us not forget that War is a necessary evil and it corrupts the soul.
By Efrim
November 21, 2007 9:16 PM | Link to this
Say no to the following:
Podsednik
Freel
Lofton
Say yes to the following:
Dejesus
Hamilton
Dukes
Why???
A little thing called OBP and talent. (I guess Lofton is okay, but been there done that)
By Choppinmama
November 21, 2007 10:02 PM | Link to this
With Glavine back and donning the ol’ #47, will he also be donning the title of Player Rep? I’d say he wouldn’t touch that job with a 10-ft. putter.
Who was the player’s rep for the ‘07 season?
Holiday transition: I’m thankful for an intelligent, informative and lively spot to come to each day to get my fill of Braves talk. Thanks to all you denizens who participate - blogging and lurking! For all those flying or driving this holiday weekend, safe travels and a happy turkey day to all.
By doc
November 21, 2007 10:08 PM | Link to this
dob, the ending took me by surprise as i am reading little other than what i need to expand my professional knowledge base right now. the comment about wanting a sequel was just that of someone caught off guard by the ending. agree, that is not the style of the coen bros at all so i wont wait for someone to create the sequel. just a wonderful creation of cinematography and acting. couldnt have been done better and one of those movies where time stands still. enjoyed american gangster for the same reason. 2.5 hours that flew by.
yeah, all anton needed was a chain saw. no, he really didnt need any props, just the last shot of him was amazing.
got to admit, you put this one, as well as others, on my radar screen dude, thanks!
again, safe and PEACEFUL holiday all.
By joebrave
November 21, 2007 10:21 PM | Link to this
DOB,Carolina Lady,Savannah guy,Lew SJA,jjs,Wayne in Utah,Robert(jib),Klob,UGA Brave,TennPaul.may all you guys have a blessed and wonderful Holiday Season,and Happy Thanksgiving.I am thankful to have you all as what I consider friends this joyous Season……….
By Andy from Norcross
November 21, 2007 10:48 PM | Link to this
Dave, any rumors regarding OF the Braves are currently looking at? Are Brandon Jones and Matt Diaz going to platoon in LF? Will Scott Thorman be traded or is he insurance in case we can’t keep Tex after next year?
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 10:51 PM | Link to this
Same to you, Joe. And to all the fine denizens in all corners of this country and several of you regulars abroad, don’t eat too much (unless you want to) and be cool. Enjoy the thankin’ and eatin’ holiday….
Doc, the ending took me by surprise, too, and I read the book. But yes, that shot of him walking away, that could have ended it right there. My girlfriend and I were talking about that ending, that dream of the sheriff’s and what it meant, for the next 20 minutes after the movie.
Hey, go see Before the Devil Knows You’re Dead, if you haven’t already. I gotta feeling you’ll love it, since a little violence (not just for the sake of violence, but necessary to the movie) obviously doesn’t bother you.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 21, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this
According to Jason Stark’s latest ESPN article , the Reds really are shopping Josh Hamilton. Primarily because they have Adam Dunn , can’t move Griffy Jr. and the Reds want Jay Bruce in CF for the 2008 season.
I guess the Easter Bunny costume is coming out of the closet.
The Reds need pitching , the Braves have it. lets make a deal !
By David O'Brien
November 21, 2007 11:13 PM | Link to this
Coach, loved your post, but the last line can’t fly here right now, especially in light of recent events here on the ol’ blog. In the interest of fairness, I had it deleted. Hope you understand; better than having the whole thing deleted, right?
I’d ask you, implore you, to please refrain from that one area you hit at the end. Not because of my own views either way (that’s not important), but because it’s just not where we want this thing headed. Is that cool? I hope so.
I know you tried to balance it by pointing out your own affiliation and all, but still, please just don’t go there. It’s not right for me to ask that some refrain from political discourse here and not others.
You haven’t done it repeatedly, so I’m just asking nicely.
By RiverDawg
November 21, 2007 11:14 PM | Link to this
Smashing pumpkins Gish in my opinion is the best album they put out. Badmotorfinger soundgarden grab it and listen to it again…Metallica will be around for ever they just change with the times…Phish is a band that you had to see live best show I ever saw was back in 94 in bham they came out dressed as crayola crayons and jumping on trampolines and dave mathews opened up for them. Oak Mtn ampitheatre what a great venue the best outdoor venue in the southeast in…Alpine Valley in wisconsin the best outdoor venue I have ever been to…
By doc
November 21, 2007 11:18 PM | Link to this
yeah, i am going to have to go back and listen closely to the sheriff one more time before i can pull it together in my mind. it was kind of like, now EXACTLY what did he say?
i’ll check before the devil within a week, always looking for something different and good. cant keep up with all your music suggestions, try to get to check the movies, too old to eat too much of the bb-q without esophageal spasm and finding honkie tonks start too late for my well being the next day.
By TK
November 21, 2007 11:21 PM | Link to this
DOB I saw Brandon Jones in a spring game in CF. Is he not in the mix for CF? Or do the Braves see him as a corner? Would not trade James unless it was for Haren, Peavy, or Bedard. btw DOB and everyone have a great and filling holiday!!!
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 21, 2007 11:22 PM | Link to this
No problem Dave , I understand. Kinda figured that would happen.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 21, 2007 11:30 PM | Link to this
Anyway , back to baseball. Josh Hamilton and Jeff Keppinger for say , Lance Cormier and Buddy Carlyle ? or Jeff Bennett and Buddy Carlyle. Thats a fairly doable trade , assuming that Hamilton really is on the trade market.
By doc
November 21, 2007 11:35 PM | Link to this
david, i lost a few apostrophes the last few days. they hooked a bit to the left. did you have them deleted?
its cool if you, did just checking. :-))
By ssiscribe
November 21, 2007 11:37 PM | Link to this
Top of the evening, denizens, as I relax and look ahead to the fact I have nine of the next 11 days off.
And three of those days will be in Vegas, and a couple will be in the mountains.
After looking over the posts from this afternoon and tonight, thought I’d say once more a very Happy Thanksgiving to all of the good denizens out there. It is my prayer all of you enjoy a great day with family and friends.
Man, isn’t baseball great? Isn’t caring about a baseball team great? Indeed it is. One of so many things to be thankful for on this Thanksgiving Day.
Everybody take care.
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By Braveheart
November 22, 2007 12:01 AM | Link to this
the problem with scott podsednik is that we already have scott podsednik, jr. on the team in josh anderson.
podsednik, lifetime: .272, .338, .377, 55 stolen bases per 162.
josh anderson, minors: .290, .337, .373, 64 stolen bases per 162
gregor blanco, minors: .274, .371, .377, 37 stolen bases per 162.
plus, anderson and blanco are centerfielders and podsednik has been a leftfielder for the past few years.
happy thanksgiving everyone.
g’nite
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
November 22, 2007 12:07 AM | Link to this
Geesh , ssiscribe. I’m off till Tuesday , but nine out of eleven ain’t bad. The plan is , football , football and more football. O’yes , turkey too along with mama’s best pumpkin and pecan pie.
By Braves4Ever
November 22, 2007 12:33 AM | Link to this
I am hoping we go after Hamilton. Been talking about him for a while now. I’d trade Chucky and Yates for him in a minute. I think Jair or Bennet or even Morton would be a better 5th.( I know they don’t have the proven history) I understand the arguments for and against Chuck. I just don’t feel he will improve. I think what you’ve gotten is all You are gonna get. A 5th starter that ain’t bad. I rather use the 5th hole this year to prepare someone who can be an eventual 2 or 3. Plus just my preference but the three I mention all throw harder with good control. I would rather see that personally. Chuck just wears me out. I am sure this will get some negative response, but I think it’s a deal that could get done. Wouldn’t think iit would take but 1 starter and 1 or 2 relievers( Boyer, Yates, or even maybe a prospect like Smith.)
By ssiscribe
November 22, 2007 12:37 AM | Link to this
Coach: Yeah, I’m quite lucky. The past 16 years, I’ve always has to work through Thanksgiving. Honestly, I’m working part of the holiday weekend this year, too, but it’s a freelance assignment that won’t take but five hours total time, from beginning to end.
It really worked out well for me, I’ll admit. Of course, I busted my butt to earn the time to take off, and having a bunch of friends with birthdays in late November/early December (and all of them saying hey, let’s all get away for a few days) helped the cause.
So, I’m on major shut-down mode at this point. I’ve got some stuff in the work hopper to get to first of the week before I fly to Vegas. At that point, I’m on a 48-hour rush to enjoy Sin City with my very best friend, then fly home and head straight to the mountains for three days of straight chilling out at a mountain cabin. No better way to get over jet lag.
But before I get to that, I have three major projects to close out before Tuesday afternoon, and five freelance stories to finish, and a game to cover for a newspaper. It’s all good, though. I spent part of tonight playing Chutes and Ladders with my 5-year-old while watching the Thrashers … yes, I’m very blessed and fortunate.
And the best part of all this is I get to enjoy Turkey Day in the house in which I grew up tomorrow afternoon. Moving back to Atlanta last summer gave me the chance to enjoy the holidays with my family without having to rush 320 miles away on a moment’s notice. For that, I consider myself truly blessed.
Time for bed. Happy Thanksgiving to the blog that is so much more than that to many of us. Our Braves lifeline, and a forum for us to interact with one another. Wow, what a cool thing … something for which we all should be thankful for as we head into Turkey Day.
To all of you, best wishes on this, the fourth Thursday in November. It is my hope that, come 12 months from now, we all reach Thanksgiving Day with World Series champs T-shirts hanging in the closet, and AJC Sports fronts with a DOB gamer telling the tale of the Braves the World Series hanging proudly in our abodes.
2008 … dare to dream, denizens. Dare to dream.
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By JB
November 22, 2007 12:47 AM | Link to this
WE BLEEPIN NEED JOSH HAMILTON
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 12:50 AM | Link to this
braveheart,
if you are there dawgs - 3& 1/2 MINUS TECH WEIRD LINE
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 12:59 AM | Link to this
BRAVEHEART,
I always said you are the pulse of the blog, but i am watching BORAT ON HBO, borat kinda weird.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 1:08 AM | Link to this
braveheart,
3 and A HALF would bet on the dawgs or NOT,
By NOLIE
November 22, 2007 1:12 AM | Link to this
why do so many posters not just on this blog think that we can get a decent player in a trade for our trash? Bennett and Carlyle for Hamilton? No GM in their right mind would accept that trade even if it was the only one available. And surely some other team would offer more. It’s not a vacuum out there where out offer is the only one around.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 1:19 AM | Link to this
straight up guys the DAWGS are only 3 points favs jackets tmmrw.
does anyone really believe that tech will beat the dawgs?
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 1:27 AM | Link to this
TOLD all you guys along time of ago.
TOLD BRAVE-DAVE NOT TO PLAY WITH FIRE.
SAID IT A LONG TIME AGO
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 1:40 AM | Link to this
WARRENN BUFFETT,
told guys like LEW, that it was coming. it is about to get really bad. I TOLD BRAVE-DAVE THAT there was the possibility that citibank cant pay their debts.
look guys,
i always said i was pragmatic.
By joebrave
November 22, 2007 1:46 AM | Link to this
Looks like Arte Moreno got his big bat,Torii Hunter signed with the Angels. HUH??????? Man that one makes no sense!!!
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 1:54 AM | Link to this
told all you guys to re-examine your 401-k’s. one thing i do know this aint good.ntr BRAVE-DAVE i called it, i told all you guys that companys like country wise was in trouble. BANKRUPT.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 2:07 AM | Link to this
lew,
i hope that everthing is is good in vermont, my point is realeste in GA SUX. BUT NO matter what happens GO DAWWGS.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 2:18 AM | Link to this
I DO THIS FOR A LIVING, I HAVE MADE A LOT A LOT 0F MONEY BETTING WITH OIL.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 2:18 AM | Link to this
I DO THIS FOR A LIVING, I HAVE MADE A LOT A LOT 0F MONEY BETTING WITH OIL.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 2:33 AM | Link to this
PRAGMATIC,
OR NOT i called it, you guys laughed at me when i said it was coming. gotta pay a debt. just ask the stock market?
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 2:36 AM | Link to this
Nolie , about this time last year you would have asked Josh who ? Hamilton was a low risk/high reward investment that the Reds picked up for about twenty thousand in cash. Basically , the Reds got him for nothing.
Josh Hamilton is a five tool athlete with super star potential. But , he missed sixty-two games due to injury and that is part of the reason why the Reds are trying to trade him and a couple of other players for pitching.
The other reason is , Dunn and Griffy are almost untradeable. Both OF have big contracts , Griffy is a huge injury risk and Dunn is the heart of the Reds offense.
Then there is Jay Bruce , another young CF that the Reds are high on and they want him in the line up everyday.
Jeff Bennett is not garbage. In fact , he is the guy with the most potential to knock Chuck James out of the rotation , assuming that Hampton is healthy.
Cormier is a steady arm when healthy , both in the bullpen and as a spot starter who has shown flashes of great potential.
Carlyle is a bulldog who brings everything he has to the mound and leaves it all on the field. Unfortunately , we all know he is a career minor leaguer with marginal talent.
Believe me , few teams are in a position to offer up two potential starting pitchers. The Reds know this and so do the Braves.
It’s all about need and value. The Reds need pitching. They also know that two pitchers have more value than one position player.
like I said , it’s a doable trade assuming that josh Hamilton is on the trading block.
Bennett , Cormier and Carlyle for Hamilton and Keppinger sounds about right. In fact , it’s a trade that would favor the Reds in potential.
On the other hand , it gives the Braves the CF and SS/untility player they are needing.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 2:48 AM | Link to this
WELL i have betting with oil. the bottom line is the dollar will always be based on commodites. just like gold. and other commodites.
By mr baseball
November 22, 2007 2:50 AM | Link to this
Must be nice to be the GM of a team that has enough money to shrug off signing a mediocre player to a totally exorbitant contract, and then sign an actual quality player at the same position for even more money the next year. Nice move by the Angels, but what are they going to do with Matthews? Put him in LF maybe and let Anderson DH? Maybe they’ll eat a huge chunk of his salary and include him in the package to the Marlins for Cabrera. An example of how little stock to put in the stock of the “experts” who project where free agents are going. Most of the talk about Hunter centered around the White Sox & Rangers.
Love some of the proposed trades being floated here. Not sure if the people conjuring up their fantasy deals think other GMs are absolute morons, or if they truly think what the Braves would be trading away is comparable to what they’d receive? At any rate, there is some quality unintentional humor on the blog, kinda like O’Reilley’s talking points.
Happy Turkey Day all, even you Coach.
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 3:03 AM | Link to this
pragmatic,
i called it a long time ago, told you guys that it was happens when you believe in tne banks. citibank is yielding close to 7 percent. aint gonna happen for long.
By NOLIE
November 22, 2007 3:30 AM | Link to this
Jeff Bennett is not garbage. In fact , he is the guy with the most potential to knock Chuck James out of the rotation , assuming that Hampton is healthy.
I GUESS I OVERSTATED MY CASE A BIT. THE DEAL YOU PROPOSED WAS CERTAINLY NOT THE WORST ONE OF THAT KIND THAT I’VE SEEN. YEAH HE,S NOT REALLY GARBAGE, BUT HE HAS NO TRADE VALUE RIGHT NOW EITHER CAUSE HE IS TOTALLY UNPROVEN. NEXT YEAR HE MIGHT HAVE OODLES OF VALUE, BUT RIGHT NOW HE AND CARLYLE ARE NOT AN OFFER THAT IS LIKELY TO REAP HAMILTON. THERE ARE GONNA BE SOME TEAMS OUT THERE THAT WILL OFFER MORE THAN THAT TO THE REDS. THERE ARE ALSO QUESTIONS ABOUT HOW WELL HE WILL PITCH IN THE MAJORS OVER THE LONG RUN. HE SHOWS SOME PROMISE BUT I THINK JURRJENS PROBABLY HAS MORE. WE’LL SEE. AT LEAST THEY BOTH HAVE MORE PROMISE THAN SEVERAL OF THE BUMS WE RELIED ON LAST YEAR. EXCUSE THE CAPS BUT THIS COMPUTER IS LOCKED INTO THEM.
By BossLady
November 22, 2007 4:17 AM | Link to this
DOB, as I sit here chopping celery and onions I hear a song on 98.5 that’s “calling on angels” and “I’m getting old” I know you know these songs and I say ROCK ON” heart ache to heart ache. Love is a subtley.
I have no idea if what I hear is the true lyrics but you know if what I mean. “Because of you I don’t give up” is playing now.
Have a good time at KU and remember I’m not a stranger to baseball in Atlanta because of you.
By NOLIE
November 22, 2007 5:27 AM | Link to this
I think it is a long shot for Carlyle to even be on the team going north next spring. If you don’t count the last 3 starts, Tom’s ERA was under 4 and he was 4th or 5th in the league in quality starts. I’m not thrilled with getting him, but he should be an upgrade over everybody we had last year except Smoltz and Hudson. For the price he is the best FA option available if he can still pitch something like he did most of last season. Like many I wish they had taken the different approach of trading for a younger proven starter, but they chose not to go that route. At least with Jurrjens, Reyez and perhaps Bennett they have some guys who MIGHT do fairly well if one of the old f*rts falters
By Metropolitan Man
November 22, 2007 5:58 AM | Link to this
Happy Turkey day to ALL. Enjoy the day bloggers, eat drink and be merry, and not just today. Count your blessings and fret not over what you dont have today.
METS FANS: Keep hope alive and pray for pithcing.
By NOLIE
November 22, 2007 6:05 AM | Link to this
I wish you health, I wish you wealth, and happiness galore. I wish you luck for you and friends; what could I wish you more? May your joys be as deep as the oceans, your troubles as light as its foam. And may you find, sweet peace of mind, where ever you may roam. HAPPY THANKSGIVING1
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 22, 2007 7:14 AM | Link to this
Good morning all, I hope each and everyone of you have a blessed day as we remember to give thanks for all of the bounty to befall us whatever our lot in life may be.
I also wish to give thanks to the many people of the extended DOB/MIB blog for sharing their thoughts and perspectives about all things baseball. We all may have different thoughts on what is best way to go but we all share the common wish for what is good for our team.
DOB Happy Thanksgiving to you and thank you for keeping the blog interesting. It is your interaction that makes this blog successful.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 7:27 AM | Link to this
Gil, BossLady, et al, you’re welcome, and thanks to you and everybody else here.
Now, off to see my girlfriend run the Atlanta Half-Marathon (7 a.m. start — whew.)
By chrisklob
November 22, 2007 8:03 AM | Link to this
Good morning denizens. I would like to wish everyone here a wonderful, fulfilling (in more ways than one), peaceful Thanksgiving.
Dave, you do hear this from time to time, but probably not often enough. Thank you for providing this medium in which we are allowed to express ourselves, not only about the Braves, but on almost any subject we see fit. You do a great job keeping us informed about so many things and help to maintain a balance to this blog when the ideas get a little whacky! Your efforts are truly appreciated by me, and I believe, many of the other bloggers and lurkers as well.
Have a great day. Eat, drink, be merry, and be safe everyone!
By wjones
November 22, 2007 8:29 AM | Link to this
I figure that DOB is gone for a while, but I never saw any explanation for the 41 players on the 40 man roster. Does anyone have any knowledge on that? I read from someone that the rosters had to be set, so it has to be a glitch, but inquiring minds like me are anxious to know who gets cut.
By Johnny5
November 22, 2007 9:01 AM | Link to this
Seems to me that the Halos have a nice surplus of outfielders with Hunter on board an are in need of an infielder. Any chance Figgins could be dealt? His contract has one year left is a reasonable (not great) $4.75m for ‘08. Any thoughts DOB?
By Greg in TN
November 22, 2007 9:29 AM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving Denizens…
So much to be thankful for on this day. I am thankful for having a job I enjoy, a family I dearly love. I am thankful that I am a fan of the greatest franchise in Major League Baseball.
I am thankful for Rabbit Maranville and the 1914 miracle Braves, for Spahn and Sain, for Niekro and Burdette. I am thankful that Hank and Eddie vanquished the Yankees in 1957.
I am thankful for Rico Carty, Felipe Alou, for Tony Cloninger and for Bill Bartholomay. I am thankful for Andy Messersmith with CHANNEL 17 stitched on his back until Bowie Kuhn forced Ted Turner to take it off.
I am thankful for Joe Torre’s Braves of ‘82 which came out of nowhere to win the West, of Murphy, Horner and Chambliss, of Claudell Washington, Brett Butler and Glenn Hubbard.
I am thankful for JS, Bobby Cox and the ‘91 Braves with Smoltz, Glavine, Avery, Pendleton, Greg Olson and Mark Lemke.
I am thankful that Sid slid safely after Francisco Cabrera’s line drive found green at the Chop Shop.
I am thankful for a David Justice homer and Tom Glavine’s eight shut-out innings. And yes denizens, I am very thankful that Carlos Baerga’s fly ball found Marquis Grissom’s glove for the final out that signaled nirvana has arrived to Planet Braves.
I am thankful for this current crop of Braves, of Chipper, of Smoltzie and Tex, of Glavine, of Frenchy, of McCann and Huddy.
And I am also very thankful of having a place to throw my thoughts out to fellow fans. To Lew, ChrisKlob, TennPaul, Carolina Lady, Braveheart, Wayne in UT and to the many others that have made me feel welcome in the past year or so I’ve traveled here, thank you. To Carroll Rogers, who makes an excellent blog leader in relief, thank you! And last, but certainly not least, to the leader of the blog, the Notorious one, the one and only DOB. Thank you and good luck to KU this weekend in the land of Royals and Chiefs.
Have a wonderful and safe Thanksgiving denizens.
By chuckw/deadjournalist
November 22, 2007 9:33 AM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving - Here’s a mixtape play list from DeadJournalist.com for those of you who enjoy these kind of things: Kevin Drew - Backed Out On The … The Polyphonic Spree - Running Away (Radio Edit) Shout Out Louds - Normandie The Rosebuds - Get Up Get Out CCS - Knife (Grizzly Bear cover) Small Sins - It Keeps Me On My Toes Phoenix - One Time Too Many Mew - Special Eskimo Joe - London Bombs Young Galaxy - Outside The City Feist - I Feel It All Midlake - Roscoe The Raveonettes - Dead Sound
The new album by the Raveonettes is going to be amazing. Any the recently released Kevin Drew album is in my top five of 2007.
I just wish it was time for Spring Training already … and where are you, Jeff Blauser?
By chuckw/deadjournalist
November 22, 2007 9:38 AM | Link to this
I’m also thankful that Walt Weiss made that amazing play in’99 against the Astros that saved the game in the 10th.
That may be the most forgotten, great defensive play of the Braves playoff run.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 9:42 AM | Link to this
wjones , I’m about 90% sure that Chris Resop isn’t on the 40 man. The Braves claimed him off the irrevocable outright waiver list after the Angels removed him from their 40 man roster. He probably has been assigned to Richmond. it’s a glitch , for sure.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 9:56 AM | Link to this
Back from a rainy morning of watching folks run past me….
Wjones, Wren told me yesterday just a typo on part of whoever typed it in on the website. And no, I didn’t ask him to go to the website, read the list and tell me which guy didn’t belong. He’s got better things to do than that.
By Buddha
November 22, 2007 10:05 AM | Link to this
Let us rise up and be thankful, for if we didn’t learn a lot today, at least we learned a little, and if we didn’t learn a little, at least we didn’t get sick, and if we got sick, at least we didn’t die; so, let us all be thankful.
By Thrillhouse44
November 22, 2007 10:09 AM | Link to this
You’re a good man, DOB! My girl is a runner too and it can be boring sometimes watching them run. However, there’s usually a lot of good, in-shape scenery. Plus it’s a small sacrifice considering she goes to all my softball, wiffle ball, touch football, and dodgeball games.
Enjoy your Thanksgiving everyone!
By Braveheart
November 22, 2007 10:31 AM | Link to this
However, there’s usually a lot of good, in-shape scenery
Thrillhouse, are you saying that perhaps DOB’s morning was not only raindy but randy?
By chrisklob
November 22, 2007 10:35 AM | Link to this
While searching for some information on why Braves 40-man is currently at 41, I stumbled across a page that gives definitions and explanations about quite a few terms that are used pretty frequently but most folks don’t really understand. It’s pretty informative and I recommend it.
Check it out here
Coach, I checked out the Braves’ roster on SI.com, Foxsports.com, mlb.com, and Sportsline.com. They all show Resop on the 40-man. Kind of a head scratcher, isn’t it?
By Thrilllhouse44
November 22, 2007 10:38 AM | Link to this
I’m thankful the Pirates had second thoughts about sending us Barry Bonds.
I’m thankful John Burkett, John Thomson, Russ Ortiz, and Jaret Wright decided to have career years while with Atlanta.
I’m also thankful Chop Chop brought up Smoltz’s pornstache. Do you think we could start a petition to have him bring it back for ‘08?
Although I got called into work this morning, I’m thankful have DOB’s Braves/MIB blog to help pass the time as I’m problem solving.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 10:41 AM | Link to this
Well , one thing for is for certain. When comparing value , the 80 or 90 million five year contract that Torii Hunter is about to sign with the Angels equals out to a pay cut for our buddy Andruw Jones.
If Torii is worth 16-18 million a season and Aaron Rowand is rated just a bit below him in value. Then A.J. is is going to lose money because no team in their right mind will pay him the 14 million he made in 2007.
Opinions , anybody ?
By Thrillhouse44
November 22, 2007 10:41 AM | Link to this
I’m just saying, I doubt he would stand out in the raind to watch either one of us run.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 10:51 AM | Link to this
Here is a link that everybody should bookmark.
http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/
By Drummerdad
November 22, 2007 11:12 AM | Link to this
Can’t stand Scot Boras. Andruw should consider his history and take a real good look at what has just happened with A-Rod and Kenny Rogers. SB had humiliated A-Rod and messed things up. The contact he made with the Yankees went through 2 advisors at Goldman-Sachs. At Rogers’ age he concluded he didn’t need Boras anymore. Andruw did well without Boras 6 years ago. He should do the same thing again and dispense with all of this bellowing from Boras. SB has reached this line of thinking that his clients are bigger than the game that treats them so well. Hence the “unintended” leak during game 4 of the WS. The old saying about somebody like this was they had gotten “too big for his britches”.
By Drummerdad
November 22, 2007 11:16 AM | Link to this
Almost forgot: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3120831
worth the read.
By nOLIE
November 22, 2007 11:21 AM | Link to this
Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
Here is a link that everybody should bookmark.
http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/
Yeah I did long ago and so far it has proven accurate every time I’ve checked it. Goos site
By Jared
November 22, 2007 11:40 AM | Link to this
Bennett , Cormier and Carlyle for Hamilton and Keppinger sounds about right. In fact , it’s a trade that would favor the Reds in potential.
Just wow. The Reds would never do that in a thousand years. Bennett, Cormier and Carlyle? It’s possible that if the Braves released those three outright, none of them could get anything more than a minor league contract. Maybe Cormier could get a major league deal, but I kind of doubt it.
Also, keep James. He’s not half as bad as some here pretend is he. Aside from innings pitched, he really was a third starter for the Braves. If James is the #4 or #5 all through the 2008 season, it’s a plus for the Braves and show they have a really deep rotation.
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this
Coach - That will most definitely cut down on what Boras wants to get AJ. He will be lucky to get 15 mill as a class B player. Most likely will get maybe in the 12 to 13 range if he is lucky.
Which is another reason I think he might want to come crawling back to the Braves (without Boras)ask for a one year deal at a discounted rate to right himself for a better payday next year. I know that the Braves said in no uncertain terms that they will not deal with AJ, but I think that has everything to do with what Boras was going to ask for him and did not want the headache of dealing with him. If AJ comes back on his own like A-Rod did perhaps they listen. I know A-Rod is a little different story, but he has to shed Boras for the Yanks to listen.
I know a lot of you said he is not worth the headache for another year (and perhaps your right), I would like to give him a chance to prove he has still got it while we wait on our future CF to get MLB ready.
By GermanBravesFan
November 22, 2007 12:02 PM | Link to this
I agree with Coach’s assessment: now that Hunter is off the market, teams have a better idea about how much to pay Andruw. I agree that he’ll be happy to make the $14 million he made this past season. Would it make sense, under these circumstances, to try and bring Andruw back after all? Maybe he’ll bring his dad again to negotiate his contract with Frank Wren… With the addition of Texeira last year, the Braves could now afford to bat Andruw 6, 7 or 8. I know, I am just dreaming or (probably more accurate) I am delirious from enjoying the red wine while cooking… Actually, I think I am just a sentimental fool and I would like to see Andruw back with the Braves!
By robdawg06
November 22, 2007 12:12 PM | Link to this
Taking a flier on Glavine next year is risky at best. It looks like a cover up ploy to put people in the seats and make fans forget letting Andruw go. Of course, its fair argument to say Andruw made his own bed (release) by his lack of production overall (.220 average). The difference in the two players is that Andruw still has 12 good years left in him and Glavine has maybe 2 years left in his career. Will the Braves go after Joe Crede or Miguel Cabrera to play 3B since they went after Mike Lowell to play 3B ? It wouldn’t be a bad idea to give Scott Podsednik a spring invitation either. This guy has speed and just a couple years ago was the main cog in the White Sox World Series offense. Jeff Passan (Yahoo writer) said that Andruw may be headed for the Dodgers or the Giants. The obvious hole on the team now is center field. If the Braves sign or trade for a stud in center then I like their chances next year. They still need Andruws 35 hrs and 100 rbi’s replaced. Maybe Aaron Rowand ?
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 12:17 PM | Link to this
GermanBravesFan - Count me as one of those sentimental ol’ fools. At least for one more year, just to see if the last year and a half were a fluke.
I just think so much of the last year and a half was him pressing to do more because his contract was coming up and wanted to show everyone that he was worth 20 mill a year. Where if he would have just done what he has been doing two to three years ago he would have gotten what he wanted.
In a non-contract year I believe AJ listens to Terry and also perhaps places himself on the DL to heal. But instead he listen to his agent and hurt himself more both physically and future contract wise also.
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 12:18 PM | Link to this
GermanBravesFan - Count me as one of those sentimental ol’ fools. At least for one more year, just to see if the last year and a half were a fluke.
I just think so much of the last year and a half was him pressing to do more because his contract was coming up and wanted to show everyone that he was worth 20 mill a year. Where if he would have just done what he has been doing two to three years ago he would have gotten what he wanted.
In a non-contract year I believe AJ listens to Terry and also perhaps places himself on the DL to heal. But instead he listen to his agent and hurt himself more both physically and future contract wise also.
By Lew
November 22, 2007 12:26 PM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving to all Denizens-Don’t eat too much!!! Someone eat a big piece of pie for me-I’m not supposed to be eating it.
Why would anyone want Andruw back on a one year contract? I still think that screwing his head up over his last season and not knowing what the future held is what led to his terrible year. Do we want to go through that all over again? I sure as hell don’t.
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 12:32 PM | Link to this
Sorry for the double post. I am on the Outlaws computer and not only is it dial up, it also does do well handling this blog.
My appologies.
By robdawg06
November 22, 2007 12:37 PM | Link to this
Speaking of the Red Sox Coco Crisp, why didn’t the Braves get him in trade for Edgar Renteria instead of two single A prospect pitchers ?
Mike Hampton owes the Braves bigtime. He sat on the DL 3 years drawing millions. If he gets hurt again this year let him be the batboy and shag fly balls during BP. He’s got to earn that money somehow…
By doc
November 22, 2007 12:38 PM | Link to this
will be sorry to see aj go ememering the positives. i hope he ends up in la with the dodgers as torre would probably be his best bet for a manager, someone to continue to see his worth and make sure he knows he is appreciated. he would also deflect the spotlight from aj during the lean times at bat that he is going to continue to have. it would also keep him in the national league, close enough to see regularly in person but not too close. a situation where we can continue to appreciate him without having to consider him a nemesis as he would become if he ends up with the nationals.
By Brad in MT
November 22, 2007 12:39 PM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving DOB and fellow bloggers, I hope you all have a great day!
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 12:40 PM | Link to this
Lew - No doubt AJ has given us quite a few headaches over the last year and a half. But I would like to think we as Brave fans were better than the “what have you done for us lately” Yankee fans. Instead I would like for us to look at what he has done for us over the course of his Braves career and give the man one last chance.
By chrisklob
November 22, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this
robdawg, Edgar Renteria spent a year in Boston and by all accounts it wasn’t a good experience. WHy on earth would the Red Sox want him back?
Second of all, the Braves did NOT get two A ballers. Hernandez did play in Low A but Jurrjens played at AA and got a call up to the bigs this year where he did reasonably well.
TexasBrave, DIALUP? I didn’t know they still made that stuff anymore! :-)
By JB
November 22, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
DOB ARE THE BRAVES INTERESTED IN JOSH HAMILTON
By uga-brave
November 22, 2007 1:01 PM | Link to this
happy turkey day to all. i think i had to much fire water last night.
By nOLIE
November 22, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this
Speaking of the Red Sox Coco Crisp, why didn’t the Braves get him in trade for Edgar Renteria instead of two single A prospect pitchers ?
probably because the Red Sox traded him to us because he did poorly there and they paid extra for us to take him. I seriously doubt they would be interested in turning around and trading again to get him back. Besides we got two pretty good prospects from Detroit, either or both of whom might end up more useful in the long run than the cereal man
By JB
November 22, 2007 1:11 PM | Link to this
Anthony Lerew,Jose Ascanio,Blaine Boyer for Josh Hamilton.
If that doesn’t satisfy them, throw in Thorman and or another young minor league arm.
By NorthBeachScott
November 22, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this
Enough with the sappy longing for the old Andruw posts. Frank Wren and DOB have made it clear we are done with Andruw. Anyone that saw more than a few games live or even on TV in 2007 can tell you how hopeless he looked at the plate. A great lesson that raw ability, even as great as Andruw’s has its limitations an age is the great leveler. His inability to actually learn how to hit (i.e. adapt at the plate) as a younger player is now paying off. I believe Andruw will be retired by 2010 as he does not have much to offer.
The young Braves CF prospects look exciting. Let’s give them a chance.
Happy Thanksgiving to all.
By Braveheart
November 22, 2007 1:21 PM | Link to this
yeah ugabrave i was gonna give you a lay off the eggnog comment this morning but decided to leave it alone…..
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 22, 2007 1:36 PM | Link to this
I don’t see the Braves getting Hamilton unless they give Reyes and likely Lillibridge or Prado. I like Hamilton a lot but I don’t know if I’m willing to take one season and say he is worth giving up that much.
Happy Thanksgiving!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By chrisklob
November 22, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this
ugabrave, Dude, what were you drinking last night? I know for fact that pinot noir does not make you have conversations with imaginary people, as it appeared you were doing last night!
Did you find my stash of Knob Creek?
By Braves4Ever
November 22, 2007 2:23 PM | Link to this
Just FYI an opinion from a Reds blog(we know how valid bloggers opinions are don’t we). But thought it was of interest.
“Hamilton’s name has been heard in enough trade rumors this off-season that there can be no doubt Wayne Krivsky is shopping him. As I’m sure you know, Josh has all the potential to be an absolute beast, but he hasn’t shown the ability to play for long stretches of games. This season he also had a “coach”—Jerry Narron’s brother Johnny—whose job consisted almost entirely of baby-sitting Josh (even simple stuff like distributing his per diem and holding his car keys). Johnny will not be coming back with the Reds next year. So, there are obviously worries about him back-sliding.”
Just food for thought. I mentioned Hamilton a lot, and I believe Lew said it might be better to leave him in his comfort zone. Anyway, might be a lot to that.
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this
chrisklob - Yea they live out in the boondocks were technology hasn’t reached yet. I guess I should give thanks that they have a computer and the internet at all. : )
By nOLIE
November 22, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this
I don’t see the Braves getting Hamilton unless they give Reyes and likely Lillibridge or Prado. I like Hamilton a lot but I don’t know if I’m willing to take one season and say he is worth giving up that much.
Finally a fairly realistic trade proposal for this point in the careers of these young players. As you say, that might prove too much after those guys get some MLB time, but right now it would likely be close to what would be needed. The Reds are not gonna trade a 290.365.550 hitter for unproven or injured pitching prospects.
By JB
November 22, 2007 2:43 PM | Link to this
I’d trade Lillibridge (along with pitchers) in a hartbeat for Hamilton. Lillibridge is gonna be blocked, and Hamilton is a much better player anyway. Josh Hamilton is the type of player that could really push this team to an elite level.
By JB
November 22, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this
As far as Hamilton’s troubles, keep in mind he’d be playing for Bobby Cox. Also we know Chipper Jones would take him under his wing and use personal expeience to help him ie. Hooter’s Waitress, and Teixeira would also serve as a leader type, not to mention Glavine and Smoltzie. Also if we picked up a bench vet like Mark Loretta, he’d also act as a big brother. Plus I’m sure our level-headed young guys would look out for him. In a few years we could have a 3 headed 5 tooled outfield monster of Shafer, Hamilton, and Francoeur, not to mention a young Gorkys waiting in the wings. Imagine a lineup of Escobar, Johnson, Chipper, Tex, Frenchy, McCann, Hamilton, Diaz/Jones/Anderson/Shafer/Lillibridge/Blanco. We’d have .300 30 homers 100 RBI 10 stls comming from our #7 hitter potentially.
By JB
November 22, 2007 2:58 PM | Link to this
Also take into consideration, the reds are looking to open up a spot for star OF prospect Jay Bruce.
By Salty
November 22, 2007 3:03 PM | Link to this
Denizens…in the spirit of Thanksgiving, Carroll Rogers has a great, personal story in today’s edition. Carroll, hope the run today was good…how can we contribute to the cause? http://www.ajc.com/search/content/holidayguide/events/stories/2007/11/21/rogersonline_1122.html
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 3:09 PM | Link to this
Hey , I like Josh Hamilton’s potential. The problem is , his past(drug history) and the 62 games he missed is 2007 due to injury. Those are legitimate concerns for any team when considering trading anything of value in return for him.
By Deep Throat
November 22, 2007 3:10 PM | Link to this
Lillibridge OR Prado? Prado and Lillibridge are not the same level prospects. Lillibridge is way, way better.
Hamilton would give the Braves two amazing outfield arms; Hamilton and Francoeur.
By JB
November 22, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
i see this as they type of risk we took when we got JD DREW. And i’d think we’d get 2004 JD. DREW out of our 7 hole next year and for a few more years to come.
By JB
November 22, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this
As far as somebody to get to spring training to compete, how about the 2nd greatest defensive outfielder we’ve had. CHARLES THOMAS. Not saying we we make him the starter or even make the club or anything. Just see if we can get him here to try and revive his career.
By GermanBravesFan
November 22, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
robdawg06: why would the Red Sox take Renteria back after trading him in the first place? Edgar struggled in Boston and it would not have been a good fit.
Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!!!
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 4:01 PM | Link to this
Just read Carroll Rogers story and it really warmed my heart. What a wonderful tribute.
By nOLIE
November 22, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this
As far as somebody to get to spring training to compete, how about the 2nd greatest defensive outfielder we’ve had. CHARLES THOMAS. Not saying we we make him the starter or even make the club or anything. Just see if we can get him here to try and revive his career.
What career? He had two good months here and that is the sum total of his ‘career’. Just like Harris, he played way above his head for a little while and then fell back into the abyss from which he sprung. No thanks.
By robdawg06
November 22, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
Edgar is back to being a dang good player so I figured Boston would give him another shot. He and Chipper were in the top 5 for the batting title all year.
We will see how good these minor league Detroit pitchers become… We should have got at least one MLB ready player for Renteria not two MLB hopefuls IMO.
I’ll bet you right now that Andruw returns to hitting .280 40 100 next year for some team. I hated his play last year too. he is a quandry because we all know he could return to MVP caliber play with more effort. The talent is there.
By JB
November 22, 2007 4:17 PM | Link to this
DID YOU SEE THE PLAYS CHUCKIE T MADE! Hell I’d give him a chance based on defense alone. Willie Harris is not overpowering defensivly and has less power than Thomas anyway.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
robdawg, Boston is the very last place that Renteria would have been traded to. Perhaps you weren’t aware of just how badly that went, of how he was booed like no other Red Sox player that year, how he disliked it there almost much as they disliked him. Their front office dumped him a year into a four-year contract, responding to Red Sox Nation’s collective opinion, basically….
And Braves didn’t get minor league “pitchers” from Detroit, they got a minor league center fielder who was one of the Tigers’ top prospects, and a pitcher who fared well in seven starts for the major league team last year in a playoff race, when he was thrust into the big league rotation straight from Double-A. That right-hander, Jair Jurrjens, is a top prospect who throws hard and has very good command of three pitches.
You can bet if he’s not in the opening day rotation, he’ll be in it at some point in 2008. And for my money, I just have a strong feeling he’s going to be in the opening day rotation.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 4:28 PM | Link to this
JB, Charles Thomas? Dude will be 29 in a month and didn’t make it out of Triple-A the past two years. Hit .231 with three homers in 263 at-bats for two Triple-A teams (Brewers and A’s) last year.
By JB
November 22, 2007 4:31 PM | Link to this
back to JOSH HAMILTON though, thats who i reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyy want
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 4:33 PM | Link to this
Just had a thanksgiving feast over at my buddy Don’s house. He and his wife Melissa could probably open a restaurant if the indie-record store business keeps slipping (he owns Ella Guru CD store here in Atlanta). Delicious food spread they put out for about 20 of us….
Now I’ll try to put together a new blog if I can stay awake.
By JB
November 22, 2007 4:36 PM | Link to this
Im sayin trade some a* like Wes Wilkerson to the brewers for him and give him an invite to spring training. Anyway DOB how about JOSH HAMILTON
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 5:11 PM | Link to this
Haven’t heard Hamilton’s name mentioned by Braves people, but that doesn’t mean anything, since it was only yesterday when the rumor first circulate that Reds MIGHT be shopping him.
It’s Thanksgiving, all baseball and team offices are closed through weekend, and today’s not the best day to call people at home and ask if the Braves might have an interest in Josh Hamilton. Not everybody works on the 24/7 schedule of blogging and such.
Do I think the Braves have interest? Don’t know, honestly. All kinds of red flags, obviously. I mean, just take a look at home much baseball (or rather, how very little) the guy has played the past four years.
He’s not 22 or 23 (he’s 26). He’s come to grips with and been honest about being an addict, so that’s something that will always be there, that he’ll always have to deal with. More power to him, hope all goes well, but it’s obviously a huge concern for any team taking a gamble on him.
And on top of that, he still hasn’t played a full season since he was drafted in 1999. Last year’s 101 games were his most in a season, at any professional level.
He’s 26 years old, didn’t go to college, and yet has only 1,398 career at-bats in pro ball at any level, because of all the time he lost to drug problems.
Is he worth a gamble? I’d say so. But not an expensive gamble. I sure wouldn’t give up top young talent to get him.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 5:23 PM | Link to this
Robdawg, you really think Andruw will hit .280 next year? Last time he hit for an average that high was in 2000.
Since then he’s hit .251, .264, .277, .261, .263, .262, and .222.
In fact, until last year’s .222, he’d become one of the most predictable batting averages in the majors — three consecutive seasons of .261, .263 and .262.
In 257 games since June 3, 2006, Andruw has hit .232 with a .333 OBP. That’s a .232 average in his past 937 at-bats.
No, I’d say it’s highly doubtful he hits .280 next season.
That said, Braves are going to miss his power and run production, no question. Whoever they have in center isn’t going to come close to Andruw’s HR and RBIs, I’d be willing to wager.
By mike
November 22, 2007 5:54 PM | Link to this
I know I might get attacked here but I think if the Reds do have prospects that they see as better than Hamilton I think the Braves could get him for Lillibridge and Chuck James. Lillibridge is blocked at short anyway and the Reds definitley need starting pitching. Hypothetically speaking, if the Braves were to acquire Hamilton then they would be stacked with him and outstanding young outfielders such as Francouer, Schaeffer, and Hernandez so that might make Brandon Jones expendable if the Reds wanted him added to a package with Lillibridge and C James. I think its a good gamble since Lillibridge is blocked and Jurrjens and Reyes are probably going to be better pitchers than James
By chris
November 22, 2007 6:24 PM | Link to this
I hope they keep Lillibridge around this year. He’s good insurance to have around.
I doubt Chuck is going anywhere before the end of spring training. We have to see how healthy Hampton is.
I presume that the Reds would want pitching in return for Hamilton. That’s not a thrilling prospect.
By superman
November 22, 2007 6:36 PM | Link to this
The reds would want pitching but not chuck james. He gives up way to many homers to pitch in cincy.
By Braves4Ever
November 22, 2007 6:38 PM | Link to this
Mike I am not sure we would or should offer so much. B Jones, Lillibridge and James IMO is WAY to much for a Suspect guy. His potential and his brief history is good but lots of ifs too. Maybe James or Reyes, and maybe Cormier or Yates should be enough. The Reds have OF so they aren’t going to value them as much as what they don’t have, Pitching. Just my opinion of course.
By BravesFanInRockies
November 22, 2007 6:40 PM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving, Denizens —
Doing my best to get us toward 900 comments before DOB gets the next blog up.
With the Angels signing Hunter, and all sorts of rumors that they’re going hot and heavy after Miggy Cabrera, you have to wonder if Chone Figgins will be available at the Winter Meetings. The Angels should be willing to move him for a song if they get Miggy, and he would solve the leadoff man/CF issue for ‘08 and be an ideal super-sub after that.
By Tyler
November 22, 2007 6:43 PM | Link to this
If Hamilton comes cheap, he’d be our best bet for CF next year.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 6:46 PM | Link to this
Mike, you CANNOT be serious. Have you seen Brandon Jones’ numbers in the minors? Have you seen Lillibridge’s?
The kid Jones is 23, has improved at every level as he’s risen through the system, and last season hit nearly .300 with 7 triples, 19 homers and 100 RBIs between Double-A and Triple-A before his September callup to the bigs, where he got just 19 at-bats.
Lillibridge is also 23 and has a .285 career average and .369 OBP in three minor league seasons, with 17 triples, 30 homers and 104 stolen bases in just 132 attempts.
He, too, has gotten better as he’s risen higher in the minors, and hit .287 with 10 homer sand 28 stolen bases in 87 games in Triple-A.
So based on a little over a half-season the majors by 26-year-old Josh Hamilton, who missed the previous three seasons entirely, you’d trade Jones, Lillibridge AND Chuck James — two of the Braves’ best and closest-to-the-majors prospects, plus a lefty who’s won 11 games in each of his first two seasons in the majors — for a troubled OF who’s 26 and has barely 400 at-bats above the A-ball level?
Wow. That’s all I can say to that “proposal.” Wow.
Because “Lillibridge is blocked anyway” you’d just go ahead and trade him now, along with another of your best prospects (Jones, who might be in LF next season) for Hamilton, who’s hardly a proven commodity himself, and you’d throw in a young lefty who’s won 22 games in his first two season, and who will undoubtedly draw trade interest from pitching-needy teams during spring training if the Braves decided to shop him then.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 6:46 PM | Link to this
Mike, you CANNOT be serious. Have you seen Brandon Jones’ numbers in the minors? Have you seen Lillibridge’s?
The kid Jones is 23, has improved at every level as he’s risen through the system, and last season hit nearly .300 with 7 triples, 19 homers and 100 RBIs between Double-A and Triple-A before his September callup to the bigs, where he got just 19 at-bats.
Lillibridge is also 23 and has a .285 career average and .369 OBP in three minor league seasons, with 17 triples, 30 homers and 104 stolen bases in just 132 attempts.
He, too, has gotten better as he’s risen higher in the minors, and hit .287 with 10 homer sand 28 stolen bases in 87 games in Triple-A.
So based on a little over a half-season the majors by 26-year-old Josh Hamilton, who missed the previous three seasons entirely, you’d trade Jones, Lillibridge AND Chuck James — two of the Braves’ best and closest-to-the-majors prospects, plus a lefty who’s won 11 games in each of his first two seasons in the majors — for a troubled OF who’s 26 and has barely 400 at-bats above the A-ball level?
Wow. That’s all I can say to that “proposal.” Wow.
Because “Lillibridge is blocked anyway” you’d just go ahead and trade him now, along with another of your best prospects (Jones, who might be in LF next season) for Hamilton, who’s not exactly a steady, proven commodity, and you’d throw in a young lefty who’s won 22 games in his first two season, and who will undoubtedly draw trade interest from pitching-needy teams during spring training if the Braves decided to shop him then.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 6:46 PM | Link to this
Mike, you CANNOT be serious. Have you seen Brandon Jones’ numbers in the minors? Have you seen Lillibridge’s?
The kid Jones is 23, has improved at every level as he’s risen through the system, and last season hit nearly .300 with 7 triples, 19 homers and 100 RBIs between Double-A and Triple-A before his September callup to the bigs, where he got just 19 at-bats.
Lillibridge is also 23 and has a .285 career average and .369 OBP in three minor league seasons, with 17 triples, 30 homers and 104 stolen bases in just 132 attempts.
He, too, has gotten better as he’s risen higher in the minors, and hit .287 with 10 homer sand 28 stolen bases in 87 games in Triple-A.
So based on a little over a half-season the majors by 26-year-old Josh Hamilton, who missed the previous three seasons entirely, you’d trade Jones, Lillibridge AND Chuck James — two of the Braves’ best and closest-to-the-majors prospects, plus a lefty who’s won 11 games in each of his first two seasons in the majors — for a troubled OF who’s 26 and has barely 400 at-bats above the A-ball level?
Wow. That’s all I can say to that “proposal.” Wow.
Because “Lillibridge is blocked anyway” you’d just go ahead and trade him now, along with another of your best prospects (Jones, who might be in LF next season) for Hamilton, who’s not exactly a steady, proven commodity, and you’d throw in a lefty who’s won 22 games in his first two season, and who will undoubtedly draw trade interest from pitching-needy teams during spring training if the Braves decided to shop him then.
By Cooper S
November 22, 2007 6:51 PM | Link to this
DOB, Upon researching transaction rules I realized that 6 months has passed since the Langerhans trade for a PTBNL. Who did we get for him? Or did we just get cash? I’m sure it’s not anyone exciting/very much money, i’m just curious. Thanks
By BravesFanInRockies
November 22, 2007 6:53 PM | Link to this
BTW, the logic for going after Figgins would apply if the Angels get Miggy Tejada rather than Miggy Cabrera. In both cases the club trading the star will want cheap prospects or cheap guys with some ML experience. Figgins would cost too much in salary to serve that purpose but he might be the ideal fit for what the Braves are after.
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 7:13 PM | Link to this
Happy Thanksgiving everyone…yes i back…with my new Cumputer…powerful….If anyone want to keep track on Mike Hampton pitching tonight down on Mexico,,,go to : Mayosbeisbol.com…clik on Juego en linea (online games)anf follow inning by inning of Mike Comeback….
By BravesFanInRockies
November 22, 2007 7:16 PM | Link to this
I think that some of the indifference the fans show to Chucky is a reflection of his presumed lack of interest in doing the mental prepration necesssary to improve his game — his “ignorance is bliss” attitude that DOB has talked about.
Fans read about that and see him in action and think he’s expendable.
Obviously he has talent, or he wouldn’t have put up the stats he’s logged over his first two seasons.
But you see a player like a Buddy Carlyle, for instance, and he’s much easier guy to pull for. Even though he’s obviously less talented an probably has no business being in a major league rotation.
So if Chucky would give the hammer and tool belt a rest and spend some quality time in the video room this winter, he might not only become a much better pitcher but be more valued by the club and the fans, too.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 22, 2007 7:38 PM | Link to this
Jersey Good to hear from you. Happy Thanksgiving to you and your bride. I know she gloated over the Phillies’ sucess in the NL East but tell her not to get to comfortable just yet. A Brave New World is coming.
mike I am trying real hard to be nice about this, but… get a clue dude. That sounds just like the kind of trade Ted Turner would make. I don’t know if the organizational mindset is going to change much with Frank Wren calling the shots but the Braves generally do not like players with poor histories. See Tim Spoonybarger as an example.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves in 2008)
November 22, 2007 7:46 PM | Link to this
I agree with Dave O’Brien , Josh Hamilton is a high risk/high reward type of player. You don’t go trading top prospects for him.
The Reds are hunting for pitching and maybe , just maybe , if the Braves were to offer up a Cormier/Carlyle or Bennett/Carlyle or even all three for Hamilton and Keppinger the Reds would have to give it some thought.
It puts the Reds in the same position as the Braves , making it a high risk/high reward trade for both teams. Cincinnati might get a lot or nothing , same as the Braves.
The turkey and all the fixings was fantastic , I can’t say the same for the two football games……BORING !!!
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 7:46 PM | Link to this
DOB - If you are predicting that Jair Jurrjens is going to be on the opening day rotation, then what is to become of Chucky? I know he has an option left, but do you send him down to learn that third pitch and get his innings per start up? Or perhaps long relief out of the bullpen? Or perhaps traded?
How about Bennett who doesn’t have an option?
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 7:46 PM | Link to this
Mike: you forgot that we need an strong bench next year…Lillibridge will be our back up on ss and coming from the bench with Aybar and Thorman,and also B. Jones…Last year ours bench was none to nothing.
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 7:55 PM | Link to this
Gil…..Thanks…she was so happy and also for JRo win the MVP…but you right, i alredy told her so…next year is Brave all the way…I fill sorry that the braves schedule next year don’t coming to Phillys till June.I have to go to atlanta for a few games and also to DC, and to the New Met Park.
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 8:04 PM | Link to this
I Like ours New GM…i think he got his agenda to bill a good young talent for the Future of ours Braves..Gil you going to enjoy this year Ours Richmond Braves with all the talent they get.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 22, 2007 8:04 PM | Link to this
Jersey Thanks for the great link. Your English is much better than my Spanish but I discovered some familiar names on the Mayo’s roster. Looks to me Barbaro Canizarez is having a very good year at first base and Scott Thorman is playing in the outfield. Doug Clark is also having a decent winter hitting .303 and is still playing in right field. He is a bit older than most of the players but is still only about 31 I think. He can hit and has a good arm. He is a solid player who we hear little about but he could be a factor. You don’t suppose they have a ENG button to translate do you? :-)))
By TexasBrave
November 22, 2007 8:08 PM | Link to this
JerseyGil - Thanks for the website. Unfortunately I don’t read or speak spanish. Although I did notice Brandon Jones is playing CF for them and went 2 for 3 last night.
How about an update on how Mike Hampton does when you get a chance.
Thanks
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 8:20 PM | Link to this
Gil..i think Thorman came home for the holiday..he just hitting 239…and last night he did not play…yes canizares is playing first.Brandon Jones also has a great year down in mexico…I think my english is better, but sometime i tried to write fast…i went to Puerto rico and for the first time they was not baseball there…i saw Javy Lopez and he say he will tried a come back next year.
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 8:28 PM | Link to this
:TexasBraves…i will do that…Game doesn’t start until 7:30 central time, 9:30 Eastern time.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 22, 2007 8:32 PM | Link to this
So many places to hide ball players these days. I am surprised the genius who own the cable networks has not come up with a baseball channel which features winter baseball. At least we would not know the outcome like classic baseball channel games. Sure it would be low ratings but I doubt it would be any lower than Speed showing reruns of truck races or motocross.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
November 22, 2007 8:41 PM | Link to this
Torri Hunter signed with the Angels! Could this open the door for the Braves to acquire Figgins? The Angels have six outfielders for 3 spots and DH and Figgins. Rumor has it the Angels are still after Cabrera from the Marlins and are asking for Wilits, Kendrick, and either Saunders or Ardenhart. Now, if the Braves believe Lillibridge is ready for the majors would they consider trading Kelly Johnson for Figgins. Johnson would fill the 2B hole left by Howie Kendrick. Figgins gives the Braves a stopgap CF and a bonadfied leadoff hitter. Something they may have not honestly had since Otis Nixon was here. What do you think DOB?
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 8:45 PM | Link to this
Gil…I think the Baseball channel coming soon..or next year on Cable, similar of the NFL & NBA..we Can have baseball year around…Winter Ball, japanese, etc
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 22, 2007 8:45 PM | Link to this
The Braves have so much more invested in Scott Thorman than Barbaro Canizarez but havind seen both of them play, I think Barbaro is actually the better first baseman of the two. The guy looks well built, no body fat and confident and plays a very good first base. He is not as good as Texieria but he could be a good player to have as a back up.
It is impossible to judge from just the line scores but it appears Scott is still an all or nothing type hitter which accounts for the low average and high strike out totals but 18 home runs.
My wife worked with several guys who were from Ponce. I had an opportunity to purchase a Javy signed baseball this week at an auction but let it pass as I am not really into baseball memorabilia. Was a good box though, Had a Bob Feller autograph in there too.
By David O'Brien
November 22, 2007 8:55 PM | Link to this
Robert (JIB), Figgins would seem expendable now that Angels have their four main OFs. Just a matter of whether they want to use him to get a bigger piece than what Braves would offer.
No, I don’t see them trading Kelly and handing 2B to Lillibridge, who’s played SS his entire pro career and in his last three years of college. He could play 2B, but can ‘t see him being thrust into a new position to begin his big league career.
And regarding leadoff: You waying Furcal wasn’t a “bonafide” leadoff hitter? I would completely disagree with that. He was a damn good leadoff hitter.
NEW BLOG IS UP
By JerseyGil
November 22, 2007 9:03 PM | Link to this
Gil…i was Born in San Juan…i play ball in HS with the Cruz’s Brother(Jose(Cheo)Cirilo,Hector)there are from Arroyo PR close to Ponce…i have a few memorabillis my self..like Clemente Authograh Picture after he hit the 3000…also i Have Javy Practice Jersey signed when i was living in Atlanta.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
November 22, 2007 9:04 PM | Link to this
Okay folks, last post for me tonight and then spend some quality time with the wife who did an outstanding job today with “The Feast”.
After thoughtful consideration. I would rather have Lillibridge in a utility role for a year than to waste him as a trade piece for some stop gap player who has little upside.
The only question mark about Brent to me is if he can hit major league pitching with consistency at this point in his career but I’ll bet $10 to a donut that he can hit at least as well as the dozens of names thrown out so far as possible back ups for Escobar.
Yunel has the advantage of age over Lillibridge so he has more experience but I cannot say he has a higher ceiling. Knowing now that Brent played hurt the last few weeks of the season and still played at a high level showed me something.
He is the type of player you hold onto for dear life because if you like some of the young talent you have seen come to Atlanta in the past few years then hold onto your hat because you are going to drool all over yourself for this guy. He is just that good and the Braves stole him from the Pirates plain and simple.
Have a good night all and I will catch up with you all in the morning.
By robdawg06
November 23, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this
I hope you are right about these Detroit tradees DOB. I expect Renteria to put up .320 20 95 batting second for Detroit. We can compare value soon enough when 2008 starts !
I’ll stick with my .280 prediction for Andruw. A change of scenery and having something to play for (pride and a new big multi-year contract) might energize Druw !
By JudiasIscariat
November 29, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
I find it odd that Braves Manager Bobby Cox is so thrilled about the return of Glavine, but is silent about the Braves getting rid of by ignoring Edgar Rentaria and Andrew Jones (both black ballplayers who are heading for the hall of fame). Andrew Jones is by far the greatest defensive center fielder in the history of major league baseball. That in itself is an incredible feat! Edgar Rentaria missed the batting title by a few points to Chipper Jones his teammate (who incidentally is white). Why did the Braves trade Renteria? He is only the second best shortstop in the league behind A-Rod. The Edgar Rentaria trade was such a foolish trade for the Braves and in my mind the only reason why the Braves disposed of Edgar Renteria and Andruw Jones was so that the Braves can field an all-white team. Why not bring back Tommy Glavine, he is a white ballplayer. I think the Braves are racists and I will never watch them again.