AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2007 > August > 15 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USBraves nearing three-quarter pole
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The season will be three-quarters completed when the weekend arrives, and the Braves aren’t where they had hoped to be, in first place in the NL East. They are a flawed team that could miss the playoffs for a second consecutive season.
On the other hand, all the other NL teams they’re competing against for the division title or a wild-card berth are flawed, too, and none of those teams added Mark Teixeira to their lineup at the trade deadline. Or made a move of similar impact by adding a pitcher or pitchers.
That’s why there’s probably more optimism in the Braves’ clubhouse than perhaps any NL team except Arizona’s. The Diamondbacks have the league’s best one-run-games record and have the look of one of those destiny’s darling teams, like the 2003 Braves.
The statistics say the D-backs should not be contending for a playoff berth — they’ve been outscored 537-507, for one thing — but the won-lost record says they are, and that’s all that counts. That and momentum, which the D-backs certainly have had in the past few weeks.
But can they maintain it? They were 17-4 despite hitting just .248 with a 3.73 ERA over a 21-game span before they got pounded by the Marlins last night, when Dontrelle Willis (he’s only 8-12) struck out 11 in seven innings.
Let’s keep an eye on Arizona in the next week, because what happens could provide a good indication of whether their magic will continue. But if they keep up what they’ve done lately, the Braves wouldn’t have to worry about them in a potential wild-card race anyway, because the D-backs would win the NL West.
But back to the Braves. Sorry for the detour there.
Last night’s game was exceedingly entertaining, if you could get past the gut-wrenching aspect from a Braves fan’s perspective, or the ulcer-inducing aspect from a beat writer cranking out an immediate story on Bobby Cox’s ejections record and then seeing Wickman blow a save in the ninth, forcing you to frantically rewrite the game story you’ve got going on another file that has to be punched as soon as the game ends….
And is it better to win 4-3, after scoring those four runs in the sixth inning after Teixeira leads off with his fifth homer in 12 games as a Brave, and Yunel Escobar comes through with yet another clutch hit, and Matt Diaz keeps up his ridiculous hitting clip with a pinch RBI single for the 4-3 lead.
Is it better to have won by that score, than to watch Wickman blow a save - the seventh blown save by the Braves since the All-Star break, matching their total blown before the break - and force the Braves to come back and score again in the ninth?
I don’t know, but a case could be made that responding to the Giants’ ninth-inning tying run off Wickman by scoring another run of their own in the bottom of the ninth on Chipper’s RBI double, that that was better for the team’s psyche than putting it away in the top of the ninth.
Or not. Who knows? Sure, they’d like to think their bullpen is lights-out every night, but the Braves have already seen Wickman struggle enough and blow enough saves - albeit none at home before last night - to know he’s not foolproof at this stage of the game. And to do that celebration after a walkoff hit, a game-ending knock by a team leader, that’s good stuff for a team. The stuff that the Diamondbacks have been enjoying on a seemingly everyday basis, including at the Braves’ expense a couple weeks ago.
Alright a quick rundown: Went back to where the Braves started playing better ball and wanted to see how their record since then compared to the other contenders for playoff berths.
Since June 25: Braves (25-18, .306 average, 3.90 ERA, 266 runs); New York Mets (25-20, .270, 4.23 ERA, 216 runs); Philadelphia Phillies (24-19, .291, 4.37 ERA, 261 runs); Arizona Diamondbacks (23-21, .239, 4.41 ERA, .178 runs); San Diego Padres (22-20, .242, 4.27 ERA, 187 runs); Los Angeles Dodgers (18-26, .281, 4.41 ERA, 195 runs); Colorado Rockies (23-20, .292, 4.38 ERA, 260 runs); Milwaukee Brewers (19-25, .257, 5.16 ERA, 210 runs); Chicago Cubs (25-19, .270, 4.38 ERA, 213 runs); St. Louis Cardinals (23-21, .285, 4.24 ERA, 207 runs).
Rough go for Ho: Horacio, that is. Horacio Ramirez. Might lose his spot in the Seattle rotation. The ex-Braves lefty is 7-4 with an unsightly 7.38 ERA and .341 opponents’ average, with more walks (32) than strikeouts (31) in 72 innings over 14 starts this season.
He’s 6-1 with a 4.05 ERA with huge run support in eight home starts, and 1-3 with a 13.50 ERA (not a typo) and .410 opponents’ average (and huge run support) in six road starts. He had a huge home-road disparity as a Brave, too, but nothing like that. That’s unbelievable.
Horacio, who the Braves traded for Rafael Soriano, is 4-4 with an 8.88 ERA in 10 night games. Right-handers are hitting .367 with a .988 OPS against him.
With runners in scoring position, he’s allowed a .419 average and .481 OBP.
He’s having, in other words, a Pacific Northwest nightmare.
More stats: Escobar has already had 18 multi-hit games in his 56 games in the majors, including three four-hit games. Only seven NL players have more three-hit games this season, including Edgar Renteria, who leds the majors with five. Escobar has been filling in for Renteria, who is probably at least another week from returning from a high-ankle sprain.
In his past 19 games, Escobar has hit .393 (24-for-61) with four doubles, 10 runs and eight RBIs.
Tim Hudson is moving up the list of Cy Young candidates. He’s still got an ERA a run higher than San Diego’s Chris Young (2.02), but Hudson is the hottest pitcher in the NL, notwithstanding Brandon Webb’s scoreless innings streak.
Hudson is 7-0 with a 2.26 ERA and no homers allowed in his past nine starts, and 4-0 with a 0.64 ERA in his past four home starts.
Andruw Jones sunk to an NL-worst .212 with his 0-for-4 Tuesday, and he’s also got a league-worst .192 home average and league-worst .212 average vs. righties. Next-lowest home average belongs to San Diego’s Marcus Giles (.202).
Jones has hit .138 (32-for-232) with 113 strikeouts in two-strike counts.
Chipper’s .358 average vs. right-handers would lead the NL by nine points if he had enough plate appearances to qualify. He will soon, but the Braves have faced more lefties than any team in the majors, by a wide margin. That and his DL stint have kept him below that particular qualifying standard.
Jones ranks second in the NL in OBP (.425), third in slugging (.593), and sixth in average (.335, eight points behind leader Hanley Ramirez).
Alright, gonna devote the rest of this blog to my thoughts on Willy Aybar, in light of yesterday’s news that he had surgery on a broken hamate bone in his right hand.
If you don’t want to hear sympathy for the kid, if you think he should just go away and that the Braves should cut the cord, I understand. I really do. So maybe you should just skip the rest of the blog. Not a problem.
If you’re still here, here goes:
No, I wasn’t expecting much if anything from Aybar down the stretch, when the Braves planned to add him to their expanded September roster. But he would’ve been a nice extra bat and pretty good infield glove to have on the bench.
But much more importantly, some who really take a look at the year he’s had feel for the kid, including me. If you’re of the opinion that addiction and alcoholism are a choice and you simply won’t empathize or sympathize with him or anyone else who suffers from it, I respect your opinion. Respectfully disagree, but I understand the sympathy and realize that a lot of folks feel that way.
But beyond that, if you had met this guy like some of us have, you’d know he’s a bit different that most other pro athletes. Painfully shy, speaks very little English, and had developed a few good friends in the Dodgers organization before he was abruptly traded to the Braves in July 2006.
Between the shift to new surroundings after the trade, and his insecurities and/or shyness, and then the left-hand fracture that he played with for a while before going on the DL late in the 2006 season, it was a rough couple months.
Then he hurts the other hand in winter ball, has visa issues that make him late for spring training (I’m thinking that a shy and withdrawn guy who doesn’t assert himself could probably get moved to the back of a line in a country like the Dominican, if he didn’t know the right folks to talk to and how to use his status, if you know what I mean).
Gets to spring training, can swing from only one side (he’s a switch-hitter) because of the hand, and probably doesn’t do a good job explaining to Braves officials and trainers what happened, how he got hurt, etc.
If it was the same injury he has now, it’s no wonder he couldn’t swing (and I’m betting it was, though Braves won’t say if they think so for obvious reason _ it’ll make the medical folks look bad for missing it on the MRI or X-ray in spring training).
Folks, you don’t play baseball with a broken hamate bone. If he did, even on a limited basis, he’s a tough hombre. Bobby Cox called him tough last September after revealing that Aybar had played hurt with the fracture left hand, because the kid thought he could help the team even if he could only slap at the ball (and he did help them, he hit over .300 and was on base four out of 10 times).
Anyway, like I indicated above, I know that defending Willy Aybar probably isn’t going to be popular with many, and that most denizens will wonder why even waste the space here and why bring him back.
But the Braves know he’s a talented player, and he’ll still be cheap. I could definitely see why they’d take a chance to bring him back. He’s harmless to others, believe me. He doesn’t say enough to be any kind of cancer in the clubhouse. He’s a good kid, just got some issues, including his extreme shyness and insecurity.
I’m taking the space here because I want to. And because I think any who’ve dealt with substance abuse or have a loved one who has, know what an insidious disease addiction can be. And because I’ve talked to this kid and come away thinking, you know what, that’s a guy who’s not comfortable in his own skin.
And that’s sad. Know what I mean, when you come away from a conversation with anyone and that’s what you’re thinking? Especially when you know the kid makes $400,000 and still, you wouldn’t want to trade places with him or be him. I mean, that’s just unfortunate. And I wish him the best, I really do.
He’s the kind of guy who could slip through the cracks to a bad place, even having a brother who plays baseball like he does (Erik Aybar of the Angels). Actually, having such a brother might even compound his own feelings of unworthiness or whatever.
If you’ll allow me to play amateur psychologist a moment, what I mean by that is, from all I hear, his brother is outgoing, full of energy and joy. Hey, if you’re the opposite of that it’s probably tough to see it in your own brother and deal with it, you know?
OK, that’s all. Sorry if that came across as bleeding-heart crap to some of you. I’m sure it did. I can take the inevitable blasts I’ll get from some supposed hardasses and tough-talking types here who can’t bring themselves to feel sorry for anyone making more money than themselves. Fire away.
But this kid Willy Aybar, I wish you folks could meet him and view it from another perspective. Because I’m telling you, there was something in that face, some innocence and fear and stuff that just makes you feel bad for someone when they struggle with their demons like this guy has.
Personally, it’d be good just to see him healthy and happy in spring training. Don’t know what the chances of that are, but sure couldn’t hurt any of us to hope for that — for his sake and, if it makes it easier for you to hope for that, then for the Braves’ sake, too.
”CINNAMON GIRL” by Neil Young
I wanna live/with a cinnamon girl
I could be happy/the rest of my life
With a cinnamon girl.
A dreamer of pictures/I run in the night
You see us together,/chasing the moonlight,
My cinnamon girl.
Ten silver saxes,/a bass with a bow
The drummer relaxes/and waits between shows
For his cinnamon girl.
A dreamer of pictures/I run in the night
You see us together,/chasing the moonlight,
My cinnamon girl.
Pa sent me money now/I’m gonna make it somehow
I need another chance/You see your baby loves to dance
Yeah…yeah…yeah.
Comments
By Colin
August 15, 2007 2:39 PM | Link to this
We need a sweep…Go Huddy…
By blazerpunter
August 15, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this
Good Blog DOB!! I agree about Aybar!! It is very easy to write someone off like that, but we truely never do know what demons people are fighting in their own lives, heck, in their own heads!! I think now more than ever he needs a group of fans, a city, an organization to just sit beside him and let him know they are going to fight with him and help him get back to the game of baseball!! I am definitely rooting for the guy!!
GO BRAVES!!
By joe
August 15, 2007 2:49 PM | Link to this
Nice read Dave! Especially the piece on Aybar. I hope things get better for him.
By Reid Davis
August 15, 2007 2:49 PM | Link to this
I have sympathy for Willy, but none for Andruw. He certainly hasn’t hit .300 by playing hurt, and has hurt the team as a result. (If I only had a quarter for every 2 out, RISP situation where he hasn’t delivered…)
Why isn’t he sitting? I’ll take my chances with Harris in CF at this point, and at the beginning of the season I never thought I’d say that.
By Coach (Hank Aaron Is The Real HR Champion)
August 15, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
August 20-29 we play ten games against the Reds , Cardinals and Marlins. Three teams with losing records. During August 21-30 the Mets play ten games against the Padres , Dodgers and Phillies. three teams with winning records. The Phillies play ten games from August 21-30 against the Dodgers , Padres and Mets. Again , three teams with winning records. I said all that to say this : The next fifteen days will make or break the Braves season , they will not get another opportunity like this one in September. It’s a total mismatch in scheduling , especially with the Mets/Phillies playing four games head to head leaving the Braves with a chance to make up a lot of ground. It’s do or die , sink or swim , put up or shut up time. To the 2007 Braves baseball team , are you pretenders or contenders ? You have fifteen days to show up or go home.
By Efrim
August 15, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
DOB
What were the players thoughts after hearing about Willy being done for the season? What were their thoughts on him overall?
I hope we bring him back. High OBP skills and a solid glove. Hope he recovers and gets through these troubles.
By Caleb
August 15, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this
I like it DOB, thanks.
By Chase
August 15, 2007 2:59 PM | Link to this
Repost for
RON ROBERTS and ROBERT (JITB)
The “LIST” I was referring to was announced on 680 the Fan abot a month ago on both the Morning and Afternoon shows!
You have to remember that the BRAVES can be seen all across the country as well as other countries via TBS and it has been that way for a long time.
This creates Braves fans everywhere, especially in markets with no team!
I was recently in California and was even surprsied myself at how many Braves hats I saw. (I realize part of that may be that it is trendy to wear the “A” hat in LA) but still.
Also the Braves finish every year in the Top 5 or 6 in attendence.
Don’t forget, some 36 thousand people were at last night’s game and that left some 20 thousand seats BUT at FENWAY that would’ve been a SELL-OUT!
By Robert
August 15, 2007 2:59 PM | Link to this
Coach, good points. One thing however on the losing records of those three teams. Watch out for St. Louis as they appear to be getting hot at the right time and see the Central division for the taking. Having Rick Ankiel on the team has seemed to put a charge in the World Champs
By BHP
August 15, 2007 3:00 PM | Link to this
I love how loyal Bobby is to his vets, but enough is enough. He needs to sit Andruw and play Harris and Diaz at the same time. If you doubt this, answer one question: Would Andruw have delivered last night like Diaz did in the 6th? Please Bobby, we’re begging you, put Andruw on the DL or just rest him for the remainder of the week.
By jon
August 15, 2007 3:01 PM | Link to this
nice blog dob!!!! you couldnt have put it any better! I commend him for getting help! A lot of people don’t do that!
By Madonna
August 15, 2007 3:01 PM | Link to this
Can I adopt Willy?
By doc
August 15, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this
dave, i am with you 100% on willy. said yesterday it is time for the braves to get a new york model mri that found the injury in hampton not the model that missed it in the case of both hampton and willy. it is either that or get a new radiology group to read the film. willy’s only out may have been the mask of “self induced medication” if you cant be heard and are doubted. besides we may need him more that woody next year.
last night could be huge if the guys follow up and gain momentum. yes, they hav been the best in the nl in the last 6 weeks. however, it will take to december to catch and pass the mets at that rate and the season just aint that long unless you play for the ring.
By Cody
August 15, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this
Great post about Aybar, the kid is struggling and all Braves fans should give him their support. Now lets go Huddy, bring us home a win tonight!!!
By Shaun
August 15, 2007 3:03 PM | Link to this
I often wonder how guys can go to a foreign country, not know the language, not know anyone, not know how to get around yet still play baseball at the level at which they do. I’m honestly surprised more guys don’t suffer from the same type problems. Maybe they do but most don’t reach the bigs before they hit rock bottom; don’t know.
Obviously I don’t know what kind of person he is but I liked him as a player from what I saw and, yes, his stats.
Would love to see him next year as the top backup, getting some key pinch-hits or making some key plays for the Braves. I think he could be that type of player if he can beat his demons.
By The Grinch
August 15, 2007 3:04 PM | Link to this
I asked for a new blog when I came back from lunch and I received. Thank you, Dave. I know some jackass (not you, SJA) will pop up somewhere and say all Aybar needs is a good swift kick in the rear, blah blah blah, but I empathize with the lad. Why do you think I stole christmas? :-)
By DonCoburleone
August 15, 2007 3:05 PM | Link to this
Need Hudson to keep it up. Tonight is another one of those games that the Braves should have absolutely ZERO chance of losing.
By TNRON
August 15, 2007 3:05 PM | Link to this
Kuddos on the blog Dave.Lets hope Willy can make it back completely healthy for spring training.We certainly could have used him this year.
By Jim
August 15, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
It’s all going to come down to whether the starting pitching holds up….gotta get more innings out of 3-5 starters or they’re going to kill the bullpen. Come on boys step it up!
Escobar is going to be one hell of a player, I do believe.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
August 15, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
think something that we all have to take some comfort in is that the Braves are only 3.5 games back with six weeks left. Remember 1991? As September approached the Braves were close, but far enough away that you had doubts. The Dodgers were the “best team in baseball”. Questions were being asked about how can the Braves overcome a team with such a great pitching staff and strong offense. I remember people saying the Braves have great young starting pitching but the bullpen is weak. Their offense is supsect. Otis Nixon is a great story but when will it end. Justice and Pendleton are the only “good” hitters in the lineup.
Now, bring this to 2007. The Braves are chasing the Mets and I suppose you can say the Phillies. Neither of these two teams are anywhere near as good as that 1991 Dodgers team was. I will argue this Braves team is just as good, if not better. No, this 2007 edition doesn’t have the starting pitching that the 1991 team did. However, that 1991 team didn’t have near the talented bullpen or the offense. Matt Diaz is no Lonnie Smith….thank God! While I love Pendleton he isn’t even in Chipper’s class. Rafael Belliard was a nice shortstop but Renteria and Escobar run circles around him. Lemke was a much better defensive 2B than Johnson but Johnson is by far the better all-around player. Sid Bream was a nice firstbaseman but could he even carry Tex’s jock? McCann is ten times the catcher Greg Olson was. Frenchy and Andruw aren’t as good as Gant and Justice but they are close enough. Wickman may struggle but he is better than Alejandro Pena. Mahay, Soriano, Dotel, Yates, Villareal, and Moylan are an infinitely better unit than the one from 1991. And, this team has veteran leadership with playoff experience which the 1991 team did as well. People forget that it was Glavine and Avery led that starting staff in 1991. Smoltz was good but had his issues. He became an ace during the NLCS. Glavine and Avery formed a two headed monster to drive this team to the playoffs ala Hudson and Smoltz.
My point with all this is that this Braves team is in this race as much as anybody. My comparison with the 1991 team was to point out that this Braves team is at the least as talented as that 1991 team and the team this Braves team is chasing isn’t as good as that Dodgers team was in 1991.
By Shaun
August 15, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
To continue the discussion about ESPN from the previous blog: I think they are suffering from the same problems as MTV (too much TV, not enough M) and VH1 (too much H1, not enough V). They are going for too much E and not enough SP (although The Bronx is Burning seems fairly entertaining from what I’ve seen).
That said, I do think their baseball coverage is pretty good, aside from Mr. Morgan and Sutcliffe. Don’t like to listen to those guys too much.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
August 15, 2007 3:09 PM | Link to this
Good post DOB, it is always good to remind folks that baseball players are human beings with all the frailties that beset us mere mortals.
On the Diamondbacks, do we need to remind everyone of the Nationals two years ago when their winning record in the first half of the season went for naught as the law of averages caught up with them? When a team wins a lot of one run games, they have more than their share of good luck.
It is the teams that constantly overwhelming their opponents who do not rely on luck. Beware of the statistics that simple show the number of one run wins, it is a house of cards.
By Jersey Gil
August 15, 2007 3:11 PM | Link to this
DOB Well done…kudos for you about Aybar Comment….It hard when you come from another country with no friend or Family near you to help you…I hope the Braves Organization support him and bring him back. I read a book that David Maraniss wrote about Roberto Clemente, his year in the MLB…and how difficult was for him to adapt to this country.In the book was a mention of this couple that help Clemente to adapt and learn english. …..well done DOB….Thank you for that Article.
By supa
August 15, 2007 3:11 PM | Link to this
Nice article DOB. This is exactly why I love this blog. Thank you for sharing your perspective on Aybar.
I seem to remember Chipper saying some unflattering things about Aybar when he was missing, but hopefully Aybar can make a comeback and show the team that he belongs.
By The Grinch
August 15, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this
Coach, I’m surprised you popped up at the beginning of THIS blog, considering the umpteen dozen posts you made about how JS was a fool for trading Horacio and how any of us who thought we wouldn’t be worse off without him in the rotation were idiots who knew nothing about baseball. I give you credit for courage.
By flange1
August 15, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Thanks for the new blog. I agree with your thoughts on Willy. Hope he can come back! Hope the Braves will bring back for another shot next year, he is a free agent isn’t he?
By the way, wouldn’t The Needle and the Damage Done be a better choice of songs????? :)
By Scott
August 15, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this
Hudson vs. Ortiz tonight. If we lose this game, we should be contracted. Hopefully Russ throws some gofer balls up there tonight.
By jeff
August 15, 2007 3:14 PM | Link to this
Dave—Interesting about Ramirez. Have you noticed the mediocre year that LaRoche, and the downright rotten that Giles is having? As disappointed as I was in the spring to lose both of those guys it’s obvious the Braves are better off at both positions. I guess that’s why the GM gets the big $$$.
By Yars
August 15, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
DOB….Thank you for informing us all on Aybar. I’ve never known anyone personally that has gone through substance abuse issues, but from what I’ve heard/read, you really need to have a strong mind to overcome it. I’m glad the Braves didn’t give up on him.
By Eric from MO
August 15, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
DOB I still dont feel sorry for Aybar but I will admit I didnt think about it that way. Hopefully he will turn ok.
By John Adcox
August 15, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
Frankly, I’m delighted to see Aybar on the road to recovery. If there’s a team anywhere on the planet where he can revive his career and make a meaningful difference, it’s the Braves. I’d love to see him fill a utility role next year, and I’ll welcome his bat and glove on (I hope few) days when Chipper needs a rest.
In fact, I’d have to say that Aybar is one of the reasons why I can’t help liking next year’s Braves team even better than this one. I know it’s awfully early to start thinking about next year, especially since I’m still picking the Braves to win the east.
As much as it breaks my fan’s heart, I’ve already resolved myself to losing Andruw, UNLESS he pulls a Maddox and accepts arbitration—which, frankly, wouldn’t surprise me in the least. The Braves have plenty of options in center without making a move, including bringing up Brandon Jones if he has the spring we all expect, splitting our left field platoon (I’d hate to see that, as well as it’s working), Lillibridge, and (my favorite) moving Kelly Johnson back to the outfield and starting both Escobar and Renteria in the infield. I don’t mean that as a knock against anyone, especially KJ. But man, I’d love to see those bats in the lineup every time I buy a ticket. Not a rally killer among them.
That leaves some good money to find a starter… okay, maybe not an ace, but a good arm. Assuming JoJo, Boyer, or Hampton doesn’t step up. And even if they do, depth is never a bad thing. I’d like to see Glavine back, too, although I confess that’s only for sentimental reasons. To me, the emergence of Glavine and Justice, more than anyone, marked the birth of the new Braves, the ones that won 14 straight. Anyway.
We look really, really good everywhere else, folks. Personally, I’d like to see more from Don’t Ask Dotel before decision time, but I wouldn’t mind making a run at keeping him. I have high hopes for Gonzo, too. Chipper is Chipper… he IS the Atlanta Braves now, maybe even more so than Smoltz. Maybe.
I don’t think Escobar, Frenchy, or McCann are anywhere near their ceilings yet. It’s downright scary to think those guys are still getting better. Can you say enough about Tex and Renteria?
Which brings me (at last) back to the main point. Aside from a starter, our most glaring need is on the bench. Aybar can be huge for us. And after what he had to beat… the NL East is nothing. I’m really looking forward to rooting for him.
John
By Fred Secunda
August 15, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
Well said DOB, thanks for putting things about Aybar into perspective.
By The Grinch
August 15, 2007 3:16 PM | Link to this
Madonna, I think you’ve had quite enough Willy for one lifetime. :-)
By Nurse Patty
August 15, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
You don’t have to be so snippy. You got your teeth back. The horse is nice about it, why can’t you be?
By bill
August 15, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the insight on Aybar… I definitely want to see him in a Braves’ uniform next Spring and hope that he gets all the support he needs from the team to be successful. It is so easy to write someone like this kid off when you don’t understand the underlying issues. I couldn’t believe it when Andruw went over Boras’ head during his last contract negotiation to sign at a “discount”, now I can’t believe that he isn’t knocking the door down with another offer to discount his services in exchange for a career contract. That is our only hope of seeing him back and, even though I remain a fan of his, I’m not sure he has what it takes to regain his position as a feared hitter. As a matter of fact, I would rather see some of our pitchers come up in a RBI situation than watch him right now…sad, but true. Here’s hoping Hudson pitches a gem tonight….Go Braves!
By Arkansas Hillbilly
August 15, 2007 3:20 PM | Link to this
Good stuff from the topic line all the way down to the last lyric line of a kick-### song. A little trivia for ya’ DOB and others: Neil Young wrote Cinnamon Girl, Down By the River, and Cowgirl in the Sand all in one day while sitting at home with the flu. Now I understand, there aren’t a whole lot of lyrics to any three of those songs, but still….That’s three timeless classics in one day, and a crappy day at that….
Now baseball. That’s odd that Horacio’s record really doesn’t reflect on those terrible ERA and Average-against stats you recited. 7-4 isn’t that terrble if you’re thinking in Buddy Carlyle terms.
By Bob, Journalist
August 15, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this
There’s most always a lot of good humor to be found on the blog … with the exception of the efforts of the genius behind the mask of the esteemed Ugandan journalist, most of the best is unintentional.
By Chris
August 15, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this
Tim Hudson would have a really good shot at the Cy Young if the bullpen hadn’t blown about 4 games for him already this year.
By Eric from MO
August 15, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this
Robert(Justice is Best) I agree with your 3:08 post and I also hope your right.
By kg
August 15, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this
Last night was a very good win. I’ve watched too many games where the bull pen blew a save and the Braves were not able to climb out of the hole with a win. They haven’t been very good in extra inning games. I would love to know what their record is in comeback wins after the 8th and 9th innings.
By NCBravesFan
August 15, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this
Nice post DOB. It’s nice when the curtain gets pulled back some in situations such as Aybar’s and we get to see the situation a little differently.
We see individual success and failure played out on the field every night, and often form our point of reference about players based on how much money they make. (As if no one who is making a certain amount of money should ever fail.)
Its easy to forget the humanity in each and every situation. Given what’s been said about Aybar since he arrived in ATL, your post was a much-needed frame-of-reference. Thanks.
By Coach (Hank Aaron Is The Real HR Champion)
August 15, 2007 3:28 PM | Link to this
Grinch , you were one of the damn fools wanting to trade Hudson this past off-season . If I were you , I’d shut up permanently.
By Eric from MO
August 15, 2007 3:29 PM | Link to this
Jersey do not compare Clemente and Aybar. Clemente is one of the greatest players and a hero. Aybar is a utility guy and addict. Clemente also had to endure much more hatred from race than Aybar could imagine. Lets not make Aybar into a hero cause he went to rehab.
By Julia
August 15, 2007 3:29 PM | Link to this
I remember when a fellow actor had to overcome ADDICTION to shrimp sammiches. The individual I am speaking of would eat shrimp sammiches to excess. It was while we were in New Orleans filming a movie. People who are addicted to shrimp sammiches cast an O-D-O-R. It is tell-tale and it is not pleasant. They also develop a little POOCH around the middle and require weight and diet training regimen.
By Yars
August 15, 2007 3:35 PM | Link to this
Shaun….Those over 21 have no business whatsoever watching mtv. I’m not gonna lie, back in the day that’s all I would watch. There was a time mtv was actually pretty cool. If it weren’t for mtv, I would have never gotten into bands such as The Cure, Depeche Mode, Metallica, Motley Crue, Nine Inch Nails, Megadeth, Ministry, ect… There was a time they did play good music. All they seem to play now is rap, hip hop, generic sounding bubble gum pop crap, & emo garbage. I stopped watching the channel in the mid 1990’s. VH1 is no different. The little credibility they had, they lost. In all honesty, the only reason I have cable is because of baseball. That’s really all I watch, except for maybe a couple shows like Top Chef on the Bravo Channel & No Reservations on the Travel Channel. When the season is over, I’m thinking about canceling my cable subscription, until next March.
By Lew
August 15, 2007 3:37 PM | Link to this
It certainly sounds like the young man has been behind the proverbial eight ball for some time. It is definitely not a fun place to be. I hope he recovers and can make the most of what lies in front of him. As loyal as the Braves can be, we’ll just have to see if they can be in his case, as well.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
I left an apology for my “horn tooters” jest on the old blog. If you need to, you can go back and read it. It will be hard to find among all the “novelettes”, but it is there. Now, a “carry over”:
The best way to stop SJA from attacking you is to stop attacking him. I agree with him. There has been plenty of that. You won’t get the best of him with words. I can attest to that.
By Jersey Gil
August 15, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
Eric Don’t be a moron…i never compare My Hero and Idiol Clemente with Aybar…i was compare the Situation of all Latinos Player suffer when they came to this country.
By Ron Roberts
August 15, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
Repost for CHASE…
Chase… we’ll agree to disagree. I’m betting there are more Red Sox fans; you disagree. TBS, by the way, isn’t showing nearly as many Braves’ games as they once did. Trust me, those and the FOX/ESPN games are the only ones I get to see.
Either way, you griping about an ESPN bias against the Braves is rather silly when you argue they should’ve been at or near the lead story on last night’s SportsCenter.
Between Michael Vick, the crooked NBA ref, Rizzuto’s death, the Detroit/Cleveland battle for 1st in the AL Central, the Red Sox/Yankee race (alluva sudden closer now), then the Mets and Phillies (both ahead of Atlanta in the NL East three-team race), I don’t see where the Braves’ game should’ve been ahead of any of those stories.
By Big Easy
August 15, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
You know, I never really felt for Aybar, because I figured he was like all of the rest of these guys…they play hard, they know the biz, and they get on with it. It felt like he was hiding something, or loafing on us. Take the money and run, so to speak. But, when you step back and really look at the events, backlit by his introverted personality, it really is a sad story. I know the kid has tons of talent (we saw it last year). And I hope that some of the guys on the Braves reach out to him. We have a lot of guys from Cuba, the Dominican, etc. Guys like Escobar, who had to defect on a boat that he wasn’t sure would stay afloat. I hope some of these guys go to Aybar and reach out to him; show him that he is better than all that, and that he has the talent.
I want to see him succeed, even if it isn’t here.
~E~
By Scalp 'Em Braves
August 15, 2007 3:41 PM | Link to this
Heartfelt epistle on Aybar DOB. I have no problem with you spending that much space talking about the situation and how you feel about it. It’s your blog, afterall, and that sort of information (and editorializing) is why I come here. I guaran-damned-tee you I won’t see anything in the Birmingham News about the injury or surgery, much less the background information on what led him to disappear to begin with.
Didn’t get to see the game last night - having work done at the house that ran us out for a couple of nights and the hotel doesn’t have FSN or SSN. Damned TBS and their constant Raymond and Friends re-runs.
While I have concerns about Beefy Bob (especially lately, when he has seemed especially vulnerable) and Soriano, who has found a penchant for tossing the occasional gopher ball, we’re still much, much better off in the pen than we were last year. At least we have a better than even chance of holding onto a lead after the starter leaves, which we couldn’t say last year.
No doubt, many here are ready to dump him, have asked “wonder what it would take to get Papelbon from the Red Sox”, etc. Patience people. Not likely going to be any quick fixes from here on out - we’ve just got to believe.
And the bleat goes on…..
By Richards Gerbil
August 15, 2007 3:42 PM | Link to this
sja/julia, I swear if you dont shut up Im gonna smack YOU with a shrimp sammich, ya dumb, irrelevant b!tch!
By Julia
August 15, 2007 3:43 PM | Link to this
I did not name the actor referenced above for obvious reasons. Would you wish to be known as a shrimp sammich addict? Neither would he. My comments also bear no relation to others on this blog and any similarities noted by anyone are purely coincidental. Any shrimp sammich ODOR, though, ya just gotta live with.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 3:43 PM | Link to this
Coach*(yada yada) Attacking Grinch on this blog is like throwing snow balls at Santa. Now stop it, you Phoolie.
By flange1
August 15, 2007 3:44 PM | Link to this
Grinch, great post at 3:16!
Poor Horatio! too bad he and Wilson Betemet can’t playing on the same team! probably in AAA ball. I hear Jose Offerman is out for awhile….
By Ron Roberts
August 15, 2007 3:46 PM | Link to this
Paladin, I rarely disagree with ya, but we disagree on that. I think I fared pretty well. :)
By Shaun
August 15, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this
The Diamondbacks will fall. Question is how far and how fast?
They’ve outperformed their Pythagorean record (their run-differential) by ten games! You’d be hard pressed to find any team that has done that in history.
My guess is they’ll flop the rest of this month—they play Atlanta, Milwaukee, Chicago and San Diego.
By Mark
August 15, 2007 3:49 PM | Link to this
I’m with ya on Aybar, DOB. The kid recognized he had a problem and tried to do something about it, in the wrong way be disappearing, but he did something about it none the less.
By The Grinch
August 15, 2007 3:50 PM | Link to this
Though my opinion of Hudson matched the opinion of almost everyone in the country (including Hudson) this last off-season, I admit I was wrong. Thanks for wording your comeback like a 12 year old girl in a junior high bathroom “put-down” contest though; you’re the height of unintentional comedy on this blog.
By flange1
August 15, 2007 3:50 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Just thinking out loud here, but having a loved one with a dependency problem, one of the things that my family recognized real quick is that my brother loved to hear supposrt from friends and family but preferred it by mail or email.
Is there a way the BravesNation can email write to Willy offering our support and prayers?
Thanks
By Ron Roberts
August 15, 2007 3:50 PM | Link to this
This blog’s gotten weird/ugly early. Unfortunate. Paladin’s right, about the Grinch, tho. C’mon… ya don’t attack him!
By Coach (Hank Aaron Is The Real HR Champion)
August 15, 2007 3:51 PM | Link to this
Chris , exactly my sentiments. Tim Hudson is 13-5 with about five more games where he deserved a winning decision. I’m afraid this bullpen will cost him the Cy Young just like they did to Smoltz last year.
By Bob, Journalist
August 15, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
TampaBrave, i think a lot depends on the horse’s VO2max and how quickly he reaches it … I suppose that’s why we have spring training.
However, 162 games is a lot and perhaps an Arabian might be a better choice than a Thoroughbred, Big Red excluded of course.
We need to be neither pacer or closer at this point in this year’s race; being a stalker works just fine … we know that we’re capable of beating both the Mets and Phillies “head-to-head” and they have to play each other too.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
Julia and Richard If y’all get in a fight, can I have the sammich? If it is a little “past its’ prime” I’ll feed it to the barn cat. Rodents(other than Muts trolls)are in short supply, what with the drought and all.
By TampaBrave
August 15, 2007 3:55 PM | Link to this
TBS is the sole reason that the Braves are the 2nd most popular team behind the Yankees. Moving away from TBS can only deplete our fan base. When I used to go to Philly every year in the 90’s to see the braves, there were hordes of braves fans there. Why would they want to tinker with such success. Oh yeah, immediate returns for MLB. Hey, I bought the internet package.
By Salty
August 15, 2007 3:56 PM | Link to this
Bob, J Your wordsmithing from the previous blog: …belaboring the oblique to prove the obvious
Could be an album title…er, CD for an appropriately named band!
By ncscoots
August 15, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this
I thought there was a team option on Dotel for 2008? No?
We can all snigger about the Pythagorean record as a valid indicator of ability, if we wish, especially when you see a team such as the D-backs exceed. But, I see their RS/RA and I remember Tom Cruise’s answer about what’s in there: “Doom.”
Putting a human face to a baseball player?!? My God, David, what other kind of bolshevik ideas will you come up with next? Logic and perspective instead of passion and rant, LOL? What kind of blog would THAT be?!? :-)
By MGL
August 15, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this
DOB - One of the best blogs ever. That is quite a story on Willy. I hope that he has a good recovery from the surgery and the addiction.
Hopefully some of the Latino players and coaches will support this young man and help him get over this terrible year.
I would encourage others who attend some on the Spring Training games to try to catch this guy and give him some encouraging words. I will make a point of that myself.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this
Ron Roberts But, from what I have seen—at least over the last 24—you have not attacked, you have counter-punched. There is a difference. Have a nice one, pardner. :-)
By journalist jimmy smith
August 15, 2007 4:03 PM | Link to this
horatio was a hornblower if this journalist ever saw one. horacio, on the other hand, was unable to keep the ball in the ballpark. much better to toot one’s own horn than to have no pie in the refrigerator. journalist is not well. depression is clouding this journalist’s creativity today. what could have been . . . “and now, american idol, jimmy smith!” alas, not to be. journalist is seeking full time work in journalism, though. have applied for a column at the ajc. sent a canned ham there this morning.
now, baseball … doc has a good read on aybar. if it went down that way, sad. journalist has known addicts that were redeemed. hopefully, aybar will be redeemed as well.
By lilman916
August 15, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this
It’s true that the other teams have gaps as well as the Braves, but the other teams have better starting pitching, and relief pitching that’s just as good as the Braves. The Phillies are starting to get healthy, and the Mets look to get a shot in the arm from Pedro. Once you get past Smoltz and Hudson, the starting pitching is a crap shoot. You never know what you’re going to get. Unless the Braves can get a starting pitcher from somewhere, I don’t expect them to make the playoffs. It will be interesting down the stretch, but the Braves just don’t have enough consistent arms.
By Coach (Hank Aaron Is The Real HR Champion)
August 15, 2007 4:05 PM | Link to this
Hey , I’m just returning the favor. You live in a glass house and throw rocks , well……….. be prepared to get stoned.
By russ in augusta
August 15, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
Can Escobar play outfield? I bet he can. If so, move him to right when Edgar comes back, switch Francouer to center, and continue the platoon in left. That would give the Braves the strongest lineup possible with the current personnel. And you could play Escobar without the expense of losing Kelly’s bat and everything that Renteria brings: great defense and professionalism.
By ryan bauer
August 15, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
DOB- Nice take on Aybar, I think he can still be a good player and for anyone who doesn’t want him on this team next year, you obviously don’t have the braves best interest at heart. Wouldn’t you rather have him pinch hitting than Orr or Franco even Langerhans earlier this year. I’m pulling for this guy and I agree with DOB, he’s been through a lot. Hope to see him next Spring. Rock Chalk
By kreedham
August 15, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
I’m sure, at least I hope, that the Braves are in somewhat constant contact with Aybar. With, what appears, to be fragile psyche, it wouldn’t take much for him to become depressed or return to his substance abuse problems. Hopefully the Braves have Dr. Jack or someone meeting with him twice a week or so.
Another thing that might help. If it’s allowed let him come to the games, in uniform, and just sit on the bench. Might make him feel part of the team.
Anyhow I agree with many that Andrew should be checked again and maybe even put on the DL. The Braves may be thinking that too but could be waiting until at least Edgar comes back. I also agree, at the very least, Diaz should spot start. Where would we be without him?
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 4:08 PM | Link to this
Scoots I thought we agreed not to talk dirty on here. CL may be doing some chores right now, but she will take a switch to you when she gets back! :-)
By RickNole
August 15, 2007 4:14 PM | Link to this
Would Druw do us a favor and sit down??? You would think he would be embarrassed.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 4:15 PM | Link to this
I am getting prepared, Coach, but it ain’t 5 o’clock yet. But when it is, I’ll be prepared.
By AthensBrave
August 15, 2007 4:15 PM | Link to this
Take a look in the mirror ya’ll… The majority of you are blogaholics.
Don’t worry, it doesn’t have to be this way.
Adjust your eyes and slowly step away from the computer. Grab some ice for your fingertips. Take a walk outside, go out to eat, spend some time w/ your family.
If you feel the urge to blog, then go ahead…just try and keep it under 30 posts a blog
By Efrim
August 15, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
Shelly Duncan just tied the game on a 3 run home run. I hate the Yankees!!!!
By David O'Brien
August 15, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
Thanks all. It’s what makes doing this thing worthwhile, the outstanding, intelligent audience/conspirators in this enterprise. Beneath it all, most here aren’t much different.
Flange1, I’m gonna check into your suggestion.
Headed down to clubhouse. Later.
By Robert (Justice Is The Best)
August 15, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this
DOB, this was an excellent blog. The piece of Aybar is one of the best I have ever read that you wrote. It really was.
I think as far as an addiction goes, we all have choices to make. Yes, it can be a sickness but one that is cureable. It is up to the individual to seek that cure. Aybar did that.
As someone who used to be shy and at times painfully shy,I can empathize. When you are that shy you have problems expressing yourself. I imagine it is only worse when you are somewhere most of the people speak a different laguage from you. Sometimes asking for help isn’t as easy as it sounds. You have all sorts of thoughts go through your head. You are worried that people won’t like you or will judge you. I’m sure Aybar felt that revealing his demons may cause him to lose his job. So, he attempts to take care of the situation himself, which of course is never a good idea. We all need help from time to time.
I never reverted to substance abuse or anything of the such. But, I did go into a hole and wouldn’t let people near me. My shyness caused enough problems. My embarrassment over it made it ten times worse and actually caused me to be even more shy.
Believe me, if you aren’t shy or have never been you just don’t know what it is like. You can’t imagine the courage it took Aybar to not only admit his problem but seek help for it.
I, for one, applaud him for what he has done. He has come a long way and anybody with a heart should stand up and acknowledge what this young man has done to get his life in order. It is a wonderful story and I hope the story hasn’t ended.
This sounds corny but I think JS and Cox should seriously think about getting somebody outgoing like to Escobar to hang out with him and help loosen him up. Perhaps, ask somebody like Diaz or McCann to help him assimilate into “American” society or the Braves “culture”. I hope Wily Aybar realizes all his dreams and I am very proud of what he has done.
From a fan prespective, anyone who doesn’t want Aybar here next year is crazy. Let me ask you this question. Who would you rather your utility player be: Chris Woodward or Wily Abyar. Personally, I would rather see Aybar than to see Woodward steal more money from the Braves.
By snowball's chance
August 15, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
Nice piece on Aybar. He could have helped the Braves this year but I will pull for him to make a comeback. He sounds like someone who wouldn’t complain about injuries and that can hurt a person with a serious injury that isn’t diagnosed properly. Maybe a physical recovery will help his mental state. 43 games to go and only 12 on TBS. Maybe I will have to get a life and get away from the tube now. I have been forced to watch other teams this year and they do all seem flawed. Whomever gets hot will take it.
By RedEyedAndBlue
August 15, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
Good pen. Soft heart. Nice job, DOB.
With all the recurrent posts in this and previous blogs from folks demanding that Andruw sit (read: lose his job) and Willie or someone else take over CF, I’ve been tossin’ back the bottle a few too many myself. It’s been said. [Hiccup] We get it. If you were manager, you’d sit your $12 million outfielder and nine-time Gold Glover for Willie Harris, who was in the Minor Leagues in mid-May. Those, my friend, are some brass cajones, and considering what AJ has given this franchise the last decade plus we’d all do it right? Sure. [Gulp] That’s what teams are all about, right? Or wait, maybe you’d ask the rest of the players to pick up the slack and help out their teammate like Diaz, Chipper, Tex, Willie, and Francouer have done. Seems to me that’s what AJ did in ‘05 when Chipper got hurt. But no, let’s bench the guy and take our chances with a player who is not a natural CF. Only 3 games back in a pennant race. Sure, that’s what we should do. [Barf]
By jed
August 15, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
you should be proud of that blog, DOB. even touched a cynic like me. valuable writing.
By Eric from MO
August 15, 2007 4:27 PM | Link to this
Jersey if Clemente was really your hero you wouldnt put him in the same sentence with a worthless piece of s**/drug addict like Aybar. If Aybar was any other person he would not have a job next year. If he was any other foreigner he would be kicked out of this country. The United States have enough drug abusers in this country, I say we ban him from this country!
By Jersey Gil
August 15, 2007 4:27 PM | Link to this
Robert (Justice is The best) Well said ……… GO BRAVES…. Hasta La Vista Baby….
By Efrim
August 15, 2007 4:27 PM | Link to this
DOB, this was an excellent blog. The piece of Aybar is one of the best I have ever read that you wrote. It really was.
I second that Robert(JITB). Good work DOB. Best stuff I’ve read from you since I started blogging early this year.
By The Grinch
August 15, 2007 4:28 PM | Link to this
I wasn’t throwing rocks; you said “Mark it down” a few months ago and I was just showing that I followed orders. As for getting stoned, now you’re talking my language. Let’s do that and throw some Sabbath on the turntable. :-)
By Randy
August 15, 2007 4:28 PM | Link to this
Whoa, brother.
That is a little too much information on Aybar. Talk about rambling. You sounded like an abused woman defending her husband to the cops. “You don’t know him like I do. He still loves me.”
I agree the Braves shouldn’t launch him but to write 17 paragraphs on him……just a bit too much…..and a little scary.
Maybe you can be his sponsor.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
Did I miss something? Is Athens Brave’s name now at the top of this blog? Even a Dawg like me, hopes not. Now, go study for your Sociology test.
By NRBQ
August 15, 2007 4:30 PM | Link to this
Another Neil Young story:
In the late 70’s Nicolette Larson found an audio cassette on the floor of a limo (taxi?) left by Neil. On the tape was a demo of “Lotta Love.”
She called him, he told her she could record it, and the song was a huge (and only) hit for her.
Unfortunately, she died in ‘97.
By Jesse
August 15, 2007 4:30 PM | Link to this
ron and chase…espn doesnt just have a vendetta against the braves they have one against the entire south. whether braves baseball or sec football, espn always down plays either groups’ accomplishments. whether referring to the braves unprecedented streak as mundane or making excuses as to why the sec has the best talent and teams, espn always speaks with a grain of salt. granted not every person affiliated with espn feels this way (kruck, gammons, steve phillips, kirk herbstreit, rece davis do not) but the majority do
By Adirondackdave
August 15, 2007 4:36 PM | Link to this
DOB - That was one of the most thoughtful pieces (Willy Aybar comments) that I’ve ever read on a sports page. Good for you and I’ll be pulling for Willy.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
Oh, Grinch and Coach, y’all were talking about that kind of “stoned”. I don’t do that. I get shut faced and open mouthed on bottled-in-the-bond stuff. It’s legal.
By Rain Man
August 15, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
Shaun,
Mom said we’re goin to KMART
By ObiWanKobe
August 15, 2007 4:40 PM | Link to this
I’m in Southern California, and there were similar stories about Aybar in the LA Times (him being introverted). It helped that his brother was playing for the Angels when he was with the Dodgers. From what I’ve seen, seems to be a good kid.
Anyway Yunel can play outfield?
By Steve from OH
August 15, 2007 4:45 PM | Link to this
Aybar sure gets his props from me for first admitting he has a problem and second actually takin the initiative to fix it. Good luck Willy. I’m rooting for you.
Baseball…
Can anyone find a stat of our win-loss vs. pitchers with a win-loss record above .500 vs. our win loss against pitchers with a below .500 win-loss record? I can’t find it, and I’m interested to know what it is. It seems that we can’t win the games that we shoud be winning, i.e. against Woody Williams, etc.
By Paladin
August 15, 2007 4:46 PM | Link to this
Rain Man And miss Judge Waupner? Don’t worry though, I’ll tape it for you. I wouldn’t miss it for the world.
By flange1
August 15, 2007 4:46 PM | Link to this
Hey Grinch,
How about holding the Sabbath and putting on some Floyd….
By bill
August 15, 2007 4:53 PM |