AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2007 > June > 15 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USSmoltz recalls ‘95 World Series … and all the ones that got away
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
You might think coming back to play in Cleveland for the first time since the 1995 World Series would cause a flood of great memories for John Smoltz.
You would be wrong.
This correspondent was quite surprised by the initial reaction when I asked Smoltz for memories of the ’95 World Series, which the Braves won in six games for Atlanta’s first and only World Series championship.
Instead of smiling and excitedly recalling how the Braves captured their sport’s ultimate title, Smoltz seemed almost melancholy. He really did.
Then I began to realize that, viewed from another perspective, that ‘95 memory could conjure visions of all the unrealized opportunities rather than the one the Braves actually fulfilled. Stay with me here. I’ll explain.
Smoltz said the Braves viewed the 1991 World Series vs Minnesota as a “win,” though they had lost the series seven games. A win because of how far they had come, from last in their division in 1990 to NL pennant winner.
“It’s a little bit different there [in the 1995 Cleveland series],” Smoltz said. “Because it’s about in ‘95, the year we won, and what we’ve done since.
“It’s our only one [World Series title]. Everybody knows the story on that. It’s neat that we won one, but we had a lot of chances to win more. So when you think about Cleveland, that’s when we won.
“It’s the only time you can feel good about a city or a team, when you think, that’s when we won.”
But at the same time, Smoltz was saying, he couldn’t think of winning vs. Cleveland without also thinking of losing the last game of every other postseason they went to over 14 years.
After losing to Minnesota in ‘91, the Braves also lost in return trips to the World Series vs. Toronto in 1992, and to the Yankees in 1996 (ding-ding-ding, huge disappointment alert) and 1999.
The Braves haven’t been back to the World Series since, and they lost in the first round of the playoffs in four consecutive years (2002-05) before ending their streak of 14 consecutive division titles last season.
“In’91, we don’t feel like we failed,” Smoltz said. “’Ninety-one felt like a win. ‘92 was the closest thing to feeling like we failed, then ‘93 was, of course, the first real major disappointment [six-game NLCS loss to Philadelphia, after the Braves had a 2-1 series lead].
“To win it in ‘95 was so gratifying, took all the pressure off. But then ‘96 was horrific [the Braves’ epic World Series collapse vs. the Yankees, when they lost four consecutive games after winning the first two].
“And really,” Smoltz said, “nothing’s been the same since then.”
Wow. You want candor, you got it. I’m standing in a hallway outside the visitor’s clubhouse at the Metrodome in Minnesota on Thursday, listening to Smoltz. And I’m thinking, damn, the only player who’s been through every one of the Braves’ postseasons isn’t glossing over anything.
Sure, it’s nice to have the unprecedented run of division titles. But if you don’t think there’s a hole in Smoltz’s competitive heart where another couple of World Series championships belong … folks, he feels this.
Maybe it’s been this recent Braves’ skid - they’ve lost nine of 12 games before tonight’s series opener at Cleveland — and his recent sore shoulder that caused him to be so open about the sting that lingers from all the postseasons that ended in defeat. Whatever it was, I found it to be revealing.
And I couldn’t help but think how many fans would probably like to see the look on his face when he’s sitting there laying this out there for me. I mean, he really looked down.
Anyway, he went on to talk about how much it hurt to lose in the postseason with some loaded Braves teams in the mid-90s.
“The last few years we were in the playoffs and World Series, a lot of things had to go right [if the Braves were to win],” he said. “In ‘95 and ‘96, those were two of the toughest [best] teams that we’ve had.”
Then he seemed to realize what I had initially approached him about, which was nothing more than some memories about Cleveland as the Braves prepared to return for the first time since 1995.
“Not to take anything away from going back to Cleveland,” he said. “What did we do there, we won one game?”
Yes, one game. The Braves won the first two games of that ’95 Series in Atlanta, and won Game 4 in Cleveland sandwiched between two losses.
They went back to Atlanta up 3-2, and Tom Glavine had a performance for the ages in Game 6, holding Cleveland to one hit in eight scoreless innings. Dave Justice’s sixth-inning supplied all the offense in a 1-0 clinching Braves win.
“You think about Cleveland, what an awesome hitting team they had,” Smoltz said. “That was one of the great games Glavine pitched.”
In his only start in that ’95 World Series, Smoltz allowed six hits and four runs in 2-1/3 innings of Game 3 and got no decision in an 11-inning loss. It was one of the only less-than-stellar starts of his career for Smoltz, the all-time leader in postseason wins (15-4 record ) and strikeouts.
Since that game Smoltz has gone 10-3 with a 2.57 ERA and 4-for-5 saves in 27 postseason games (14 starts).
There’s no disputing one thing he said: It’s never been the same for the Braves since they blew that 2-0 lead vs. the Yankees in the ‘96 debacle.
The Braves went 35-24 with a .262 batting average and 2.61 ERA in postseason games from 1991 through the first two games of the 1996 World Series.
Beginning with the four straight losses to the Yankees in ’96, the Braves have gone 28-38 with a .239 batting average and 3.71 ERA in their past 66 postseason games.
They are 11-23 in their past 34 postseason games going back to the Yankees sweep in 1999, and 5-13 at home during that stretch.
Not taking advantage of Mets’ woes: For now, most Braves aren’t too concerned with history. They just want to start winning games and give themselves a chance to be in the playoff race down the stretch.
That’s why they’re upset not to have capitalized on the NL East leading Mets’ 1-9 skid.
“Without a doubt, we look at the standings and say, we’re playing this bad and we’re still only two games out?” left fielder Matt Diaz said. “Then we’re like, waiting a minute, they’re playing that bad and we’re still two games back?
“The Phillies have obviously caught us. We thought going in that it would be close, because there’s a lot of parity in the division. We welcome it being close, because we think we’ve got the veterans to pull us through in a close race.”
Smoltz said of the Mets, “They’re good, and they’re in a rough stretch. It’s really disappointing because we’re only two games out, but everybody’s bunched together now.
“We just didn’t take advantage of our [7-1] start, we didn’t take advantage of this [Mets skid]. We’ve just got to find a way to do that.”
Salty gets another start: Top catching prospect Jarrod Saltalamacchia is back in the lineup at first base for tonight’s game, after going 0-for-4 with three strikeouts and a ninth-inning bobbled grounder Thursday in his first start at 1B since high school.
Cox said Saltalamacchia “didn’t make a bad play” on the Justin Morneau grounder in the ninth inning. He ranged right, knocked it down and quickly picked it up, but what would have been a difficult play to begin with was no play by then.
“He did alright” in his first start at the position, Cox said. “One ball bounced up on him. He tried to keep it in front of him because the [runner] was on third.”
Michael Cuddyer held at third on what was ruled an infield hit. Torii Hunter followed with a fielder’s choice grounder that rookie third baseman Yunel Escobar fielded coming in, then threw a bit high to catcher Brian McCann, who tried to make the tag before the ball was in his glove. Escobar was charged with an error.
Mike Rdmond followed with a single to left to drive in the winning run, making it four hits and three runs allowed by closer Bob Wickman in his third blown save in 14 opportunities.
By the way, Wickman has allowed a .308 opponents average in his past 14 games beginning with the April 25 blown save at Florida, just before he went on the Dl for a back strain. Tim Hudson was denied wins after sensational performance in that April 25 game and again last night, when he allowed two hits in 7-1/3 scoreless innings.
Hudson’s shoulder OK: Hudson said the knot in his shoulder is the kind of thing he wouldn’t normally have even said anything about. But when Cox noticed an awkward movement during a pitch in the eighth inning, he went out and asked Hudson how he felt and the pitcher confided the shoulder was sore.
But Hudson said it’s nothing more than a knot and that he had no doubts he’d make his next start.
OK, that’s all the time I have. Now some music. One more from another seminal Minneapolis band:
“BED OF NAILS” by Bob Mould (of Husker Du)
I can walk the bed of nails/I’m not the only one
But some, they cannot walk the jagged line
Callous, concentrating/For nails are sharp as lies
I run the jagged line
From years and years of practice/I know just how to stand
Alone with perfect balance, hand in hand
Prepared with boards and hammers/And several bags of nails
I could build a wall to lean on/Roof above my mind
I can see you’ve got your own plans
Please don’t drive your nails into this heart of mine
I can walk the bed of nails/Grin and bear the pain
But some, they cannot deal with all these things
Always sacrificing/For lies are sharp as nails
And all the pain it brings
Sometimes I just pretend that all the lies are true
And I know I might depend on you
But if my concentration breaks/I’m washed away with pain
And then my feet begin to bleed upon my only bed of nails
And I’m stuck here in the middle of a sea of lies
Inside my bed of nails
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Comments
By Yars
June 15, 2007 6:57 PM | Link to this
DOB…since you’re in Cleveland this weekend, try picking up the new Nine Inch Nails album, Year Zero. The band is from Cleveland. You will not be disappointed with the album. Noisy, dark electro-rock. The best album released so far this year, in my opinion. Good to hear Hudson is ok, Salty making another start at 1B, but not having KJ in the lineup tonight hopefully won’t hurt us. Woodward always looks overmatched at the plate.
By Kentavo
June 15, 2007 7:02 PM | Link to this
First!
By Rosalynn
June 15, 2007 7:03 PM | Link to this
Hello, Bloggahs. Ah asked Jimma about that ball that was hit to Escobah last night and Jimma said Escobah should have been guadin’ the line. That’s when one of the Secret Suhvice boahs muttered that Jimma should have been guadin’ the boaduhs when Jimma was in office. I have nevah seen Jimma so mad! Jimma leaped on that boah and was just about to bite him with Jimma’s impressive mouth full of teeth when that boah apologized to Jimma. Moah latah.
By Chop Chop
June 15, 2007 7:05 PM | Link to this
A lot of Braves fans were walking a bed of nails right along with Smoltz in ‘96 and still haven’t recovered. It’s a little sad, yet very heartening to know that Smoltz feels the way he does about the Braves’ run of success. Any player that wants it as bad as the most rabid fans do is a godsend to any organization. That’s why Smoltz has been my favorite player on this team for so long. When he is on the mound, in the dugout or in the clubhouse, all he wants to do is win. That is what he lives for.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 7:06 PM | Link to this
I think Yars stands in line …
Ron, unbridled passion is good, especially for self gratification, but in the case of your 5:57, methinks the one to whom you’re giving the most satisfaction is Robert … there are other, more effective, means available.
Robert’s a deft fisherman with patience, who’s well aware of Bobby’s strengths and weaknesses … as well as how both he and Bobby are perceived … at least me so thinks.
When the gambit is offered, politely decline to accept and offer one of your own if you so choose; tread lightly, he seemingly knows where the rocks are.
By Carolina Lady
June 15, 2007 7:08 PM | Link to this
David, thanks for sharing these moments with us. IMO, John is this team’s heart. You’re definitely the best!
By Jim Leyritz
June 15, 2007 7:09 PM | Link to this
I am sorry Mr. Smoltz for taking the dog out of the Braves in 1996. You were about the only Brave tough enough to be a Yankee. Maybe if the homeboy upstairs had thought it important enough to stock your team with some bench and bullpen players, the Braves might have been able to hang with us Yankees all those years. With Orr and Woodward, looks like the penny pinching homeboy upstairs is still sabotaging the team again, eh? We had Rivera and Wetteland in the pen, we had Strawberry, Leyritz, Oneill, Tino Martinez, Wade Boggs, Tim Raines, Charlie Hayes coming of the bench in that 1996 World Series. Who was on your bench? Who was in your bullpen? Your general manager failed you all those years just like he is still doing by never giving you an adequate pen or bench, at least compared to the Yankees.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 7:12 PM | Link to this
Someone said in the prior blog that “this team is snakebit”
Y’all gotta understand that good luck and bad luck happen, but that the chances of them happening are influencable.
Greg Maddux was the best example ever. During his 7 or so year peak, the guy not only pitched great, he seemed to get every bounce and every break. He did that by staying within himself, and minimizing the opponent’s chances of getting lucky. He himself once talked in an interview about how even at his best he’d make 15 or 20 mistakes a game - but that all but three or four or five would be SO bad that the hitter couldnt capitalize on em - they were just balls.
I remember another interview where Glavine or Smoltz talked about Maddux got the same kind of breaks playing golf - Bottom line, intelligence knows how to work the situation to give oneself a chance to get lucky
In the same way, stupidity will find ways to allow bad luck to happen. If you put the wrong players in in the wrong situations at the wrong times, something bad is gonna happen
If the Braves have had an unusual run of bad playoff luck, it’s because they’ve had an incrediblly long run of stupid management.
They arent snakebit. They donkeybit
It’s nice to know that Smoltz sees it. It’s moving to know that he feels it.
It would be awesome to know that he “gets” it, but if he does, and if he revealed it, he;d be off the team as fast as , oh, I dunno, Lofton, or Sheffield, or Rocker, or anyone else who got on the wrong side of the Big Donk
By Michael Procton
June 15, 2007 7:14 PM | Link to this
Wow…there’s a new kind of double play for Andruw…
By jason310
June 15, 2007 7:14 PM | Link to this
Any chance we can take the money to sign Andruw and use it to clone a Smoltzie?
Even a mini-me version could give the boys a kick in the pants…
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 7:14 PM | Link to this
What’s with this stealing 3rd stuff? First Kelly, now Yunel - - with a guy up who we all know will strike out.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 7:15 PM | Link to this
NICE. What a frickin swing. I see now why Andruw Jones is so underrated.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 7:17 PM | Link to this
It is not seemly to make the third out at third base … and it’s plain dumb to assume that Andruw will make contact … oh well, time for more ribs!
By Bob
June 15, 2007 7:20 PM | Link to this
How many runners has Andruw left on base in the past 2 weeks. I am at a loss for how much longer we are going to have him in the cleanup slot. I have always been a defender of Bobby Cox and I love Andruw’s defense, but what does it take to see that he is KILLING us at the plate?????? We have got to get him out of the cleanup slot. Tonight he didn’t hit into a double play he just struck out into a double play. Sheeeeeeeeeeeesh
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 7:21 PM | Link to this
By the way, I meant to address the Salty thing, why he was in in the ninth inning last night, after seeing so many of you ask or complain about him not being replaced for defense in the ninth last ninth.
I’m surprised you guys seemed so surprised or upset, because as I said all along, that’s the problem Cox will run into as long as there’s not a third catcher up here: He’s got to leave Salty in the game in case something happens to McCann and Salty has to move to catcher.
If Thorman had replaced Salty in the ninth and the game goes extra innings, what if McCann gets hit by a pitch, a batter’s swing, turns his ankle — anything.
What if the game goes 15 innings. You go five innings with someone who’s never caught at any level, like Diaz? I don’t think so. Long as Pena’s not up here, Salty pretty much has to stay in at 1B when he starts, I’d imagine is the way Cox sees it.
By Me
June 15, 2007 7:21 PM | Link to this
DOB: at one point about the Yankee WS, you have 1995 in the story; it should be 1996.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 7:22 PM | Link to this
“and it’s plain dumb to assume that Andruw will make contact”
And, um, do you think Escobar stole third on his own? Or do you think Cox scratched his behind, put his finger in his mouth, and tasted an idea?
By Ron
June 15, 2007 7:24 PM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist Good Point!!!
By chrisklob
June 15, 2007 7:28 PM | Link to this
Or do you think Cox scratched his behind, put his finger in his mouth, and tasted an idea?
LOL!
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 7:29 PM | Link to this
Here’s a stat for you DOB :
Indians cleanup hitter Victor Martinez is hitting .329 w/ 13 hr and 57 rbi AND has a .389 avg w/ RISP
Our cleanup hitter Andruw Jones now at .214 w/ 11 hr and 42 rbi and a sub .200 avg w/ RISP
By Robert
June 15, 2007 7:30 PM | Link to this
DOB - Did you hear Smoltz? I know you typed the words, but did you HEAR Smoltz?
Smoltz’s own words can now be used to confirm that the decision-making that went into the 1996 WS fiasco is what killed a potential dynasty.
How in the world anyone could continue to associate that this genius, or excellence, or even a semblance of competence, is beyond the ability of rational minds to fathon
By N8
June 15, 2007 7:32 PM | Link to this
DOB
“By the way, Wickman has allowed a .308 opponents average in his past 14 games beginning with the April 25 blown save at Florida, just before he went on the Dl for a back strain.”
I know you like Wickman, and he seems like a throwback guy to be around. But judging by your quick “drop” of that statistic, and the fact you didn’t RIP anybody for second guessing Soriano staying in for the 9th (or being the closer), that you don’t completely disagree with some of the comments.
But as always, the homers have the rose colored glasses on, and want to look to more distant statistics to judge on “who is the best” for the job RIGHT NOW.
Now on to the other bloggers.
While realizing that Smoltz is more entitled than ANY Brave other than Cox to be dissapointed with the lack of WS titles for the Braves.
I’m wondering when all the Braves fans that are “OK” with just the division title streak, are gonna accuse Smoltz of being a cry-baby for not appreciating what took place, rather than what “could have” taken place.
The 14 division titles in a row SHOULD NOT be dismissed as failure. It was, is, and will always be one of the most amazing streaks in ALL professional sports, that in my opinion, will NEVER happen again. But when a guy who’s played on all of those team (minus the year he missed with Tommy John surgery), it’s clear that he’s bummed out by the near misses.
He is right in his assessment that the 91 team did not “fail”. I stated the other day that NOBODY lost that WS, and I stand by that. But he clearly is not content with what this team accomplished, or failed to accomplish.
I for one, completely respect his candor. He has NEVER been one to conceal his emotions or thoughts. I respect him more than I did before reading your story, and I respected him a lot before reading it.
The guy is a winner, who hates to lose, and more than any of the Braves that have come and gone, he isn’t afraid to say it.
Good for him.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 7:35 PM | Link to this
N8, you said in a previous blog that Omar Minaya could not do nothing about Montreal. Well it sure did not help when he traded Grady Sizemore, One of the BEST YOUNG PLAYERS in all of Baseball!!!, and Cliff Lee a very good YOUNG LEFTY Starter when HEALTHY!!! and traded Brandon Philips(not with the Tribe anymore, but producing for the Reds)!!! He traded all that talent for Bartolo Colon, and he knew he could not sign him and then traded him for Rocky Freakin Biddle!!! WHO??? Omar Minaya is the 2nd Worst GM in Baseball behind the GM in Seattle!!! But you know what Im glad he is a pathedic GM because I dont have to see those guys in Washington!!! Minaya could not even wear Billy Bean’s Shirt!!!!!! Minaya can only be an effective GM for a team that spends BIG BUCKS like the Mets!!!
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 7:36 PM | Link to this
Hey DOB, dudn’t you see the Giants game about a week ago?
If you have to, someone else will have to catch…If my memory serves me correctly, the Giants had to move Pedro Feliz in to catch through a paper-rock-scissors contest he lost (i.e. he’d never caught a single inning before then and they then moved Randy Winn in to play 3b, which he’d never done before, and they then put pitcher Noah Lowery out in RF…
If my memory also serves me correctly, Pete Orr has caught before, so we’re ahead of the game there…besides, its the 9th inning and if you’re going to lose the game anyways, does it really matter who you stick behind the plate?!
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 7:36 PM | Link to this
New formula for beating the braves … let them get the first two on base … if that doesn’t work … try for two out of the first three.
By Carroll Rogers
June 15, 2007 7:37 PM | Link to this
can’t resist…..robert, you’re going to wax eloquent on greg maddux and slam bobby in the same post? if you had any idea how much maddux respects bobby cox, you might change your thinking. bobby is a big part of the reason maddux came here, stayed as long as he did, and wasn’t in a huge hurry to leave when he did….he loves the guy, and he’d take your compliment and let it drop on the floor if he knew you were putting cox on the other end of the spectrum. just ironic to me for you to say that.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 7:40 PM | Link to this
Are we at all close to a record of most guys left on 2b that were there w/ no outs in an inning…
Oh, and does anyone know what our team avg w/ RISP w/ less than 2 outs is…cause it really can’t be pretty considering all the times the last 3 games we’ve led off an inning w/ our 1st 2 guys on and then proceed to not score
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 7:42 PM | Link to this
N8 - - calm yet passionate. Excellent!
By MBATL
June 15, 2007 7:43 PM | Link to this
Bobby’s tried running in a hitter’s count with men on - and AJ struck out into a DP. He’s tried not running on a hitter’s count, and Salty hit into a DP. Players gotta make plays, at some point.
And Chipper got hosed on that strike 3 call. Carlyle looks pretty good though.
DOB, really good interview with Smoltz. Funny to think that he, Chipper (who was a rookie) and Bobby are the only ones (that I can think of) in that dugout who were around in ‘95.
By NASCARfan
June 15, 2007 7:44 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Wow. All I can say is that I’m glad that at least one of the Braves players, and might I add the most important Braves player of the last 20 years and my personal favorite, is every bit as forlorn as us fans without blinders on about the lone wolf World Series this team won, when it should have at least won 3 if not 4 World Series in the 90’s. I am sick and tired of hearing the overrated Bobby Cox defend his and his team’s performance in the post seasons with his innane and asinine excuses about crapshoots, et cetera, et cetera. I am glad one Braves player has the cajones to stand up and say, “You know what, it SUCKS that we only have one championship when we should have had more.” In 20 years, baseball historians are going to look back on this team and declare them the biggest underachievers in the history of MLB, with Bobby Cox held accountable for his terrible postseason performances as a manager. Or should I say mis-manager? You cannot escape history, and to try and make excuses for it is folly.
By Josh C
June 15, 2007 7:44 PM | Link to this
Hey DOB
Blogging from the cheap seats at the Jake. Guess that’s what happens when you buy tickets as you walk in. Oh, well. Carlyle actually looks a little better than C.C. so far. Two on and none out twice without scoring… ouch. Mentioned last night I’ve been here four years. Winters suck but how bout this summer weather? High of 82 today with a cool Lake Erie breeze. Scenery at the park is outstanding tonight as well, don’t you think?
By Braves Fan 79
June 15, 2007 7:45 PM | Link to this
NOW AT BAT…..the automatic out!….WOODWARD!
By gotigers72
June 15, 2007 7:47 PM | Link to this
I don’t want to sound like Robert here, but how much longer will Bobby remain stubborn and leave a .214 hitter in the clean up spot? And then called for a hit and run with a guy that swings and misses A LOT.
It would be different if he had no other options, but he has about 4 guys hitting better than Andruw that could hit in the clean up spot. He continues to just be a rally killer. Get him out of there and hit him 7th or below until he comes out of this funk. He has to have the lowest average of any regular player in baseball, much less the lowest average of any clean up hitter. Way overrated [offensively] Borass.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 7:48 PM | Link to this
Carroll,
It is not worth trying to talk to Robert. He knows all and he just wants to get you riled up. He is dumber than dirt, so just ignore the guy.
By Braves Fan in PA
June 15, 2007 7:50 PM | Link to this
My biggest grip about Bobby Cox is (until the past couple years anyway) he managed the playoffs as if they were any other games. A case in point is the order he’d pick the starting pitching. Early on it became apparent that Smoltz and Avery were the big name pitchers (OK I’ll offend the Glavine and Maddux lovers) but they just could not dominate like Smoltz and Avery. Going with Veterans or he bought you there may have been the politically correct thing to do but after seeing Avery dominate Pittsburgh in the playoffs how could you not pitch Smoltz and Avery 1-2?
By Braves Fan 79
June 15, 2007 7:50 PM | Link to this
Being a Braves fan right now is so fustrating….Bobby seems to only care about winning 2 out of 3 so all the times we should of sweep a team on the last game hell throw out the crap players….hell do something crazy like start orr and woodward, or bring Redmen in to pitch when the game is still in reach (3rd inning against the Red Sox). This really sucks pple…i love my team but right now the players are sucking…and the managnment is sucking!
By MBATL
June 15, 2007 7:53 PM | Link to this
I know it’s not gonna lead to anything, but since the night is young, and the negatistos are out, I’ll throw out the question:
Who’s a better manager than Bobby Cox? Keep it reasonably modern day, please.
By Rosalynn
June 15, 2007 7:56 PM | Link to this
Well, things have settled down a bit and we can talk some baseball. Ah am personallah disappointed with Bobba Cox and some of his boneheaded decisions like battin’ Andruw clean-up. Jimma is mad, too. Jimma said he just despises weak and ineffective leadahship. Jimma thinks Bobba is in a malaise or somethin’. Did y’all see that Diaz slidin’ all ovah left field? That boah can slide! And he caught one of those balls. It seems to Jimma that even the Amehican League teams plah a little bettah small ball than a Bobba Cox team plahs. Oh, well, a 3-run homah will put us up by 2. And heah is a shout out to Carroll Rogers. Carroll, aah you anah relation to that nice Rogers boah who was once Secretarah of State? Or that Rogers boah who was King of the Cowboahs? Well, back to the game.
By Braves Fan in PA
June 15, 2007 7:59 PM | Link to this
Sorry a lot of typos/bad grammar in my earlier post! To answer MBATL I would have taken leland over Bobby in the playoffs. He didn’t care about hurting someones feelings he just wanted to win. And if a guy didn’t have his stuff he’d get pulled not leave him in to give up 5-6 runs.
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 8:01 PM | Link to this
Oh no, MBATL, now Robert will post a list of 273 names, and we’ll have to ask for a new blog.
By chrisklob
June 15, 2007 8:07 PM | Link to this
Don’t know if anyone is watching the game or not but they’ve shown the dugout several times. Man, there are a bunch of long faces in there. Tense looking group. McCann was sitting on the bench looking like his dog ran away. Maybe Bobby needs to take his boys out to Sonic for a rootbeer float after the game to cheer them up!
By Jim Leyritz
June 15, 2007 8:07 PM | Link to this
yes. i recall leyland doing so darn well against Cox in 1991 and 1992.
By A-ville Ranger
June 15, 2007 8:09 PM | Link to this
How bad do I hate the Skankees ? I hope the Mutts sweep them.I know, I’d chew my own foot off.I can’t help it I just hate’em, go Mutts !
By N8
June 15, 2007 8:09 PM | Link to this
Ron
I don’t disagree with your statement of Minaya. After all, he does pretty much have an open checkbook at his disposal in NY.
However, to rip on him for the guys he gave up for Colon, is a little harsh in my eyes.
Hindsight says it was a HORRIBLE trade, can’t argue there. Having said that, if you recall, the Expos were in the race at the time of that trade. Now when I say race, there were two races they were in at the time.
1) The Playoff Race, which was in reach and they did what they felt they had to to “make a run”. MANY teams (GM’s) have had this backfire on them.
2) The race for a new stadium and (or) new owner. I’m guessing their thinking was that if the did what they could to get to the playoffs, they could make the franchise more attractive to the locals, thus upping the possibility of getting a stadium deal. If that didn’t work, worst case scenario, with a playoff caliber team, might’ve upped the bidding war for prospective owners and (or) locations to move the team to.
Pretty elementary move if you ask me. It didn’t work, so after the fact, it looks like complete incompetance.
VERY similar to how JS might look in a few years, if he trades Salty and (or) Escobar for anybody other than a starting pitcher that will anchor our staff for years to come after Smoltz leaves, IMO.
In fact, one could say that the deal for Mike Hampton, very well might be the reason that we missed the playoffs last year (couldn’t afford a closer before last season), and if we miss the playoffs this year (couldn’t afford Glavine this past offseason). In fact it might very well cause us to miss the playoffs next year as well, if we can’t find more starting pitching, with our payroll issues, and that’s not even getting into the Andruw Jones sweepstakes. Which I could care less about, at this point. But most of the homers will have a heart attack once Andruw leaves, even though it’s been an apparent forgone conclusion for about the last year.
By The Truth Hurts
June 15, 2007 8:10 PM | Link to this
With all due respect, Smoltz’s feelings about past postseason failures—historic failures—are old news.
Of course he feels that there was more to be done. Who doesn’t? Why should he feel differently? He simply mirrors what every Braves fan has felt about each postseason run since ‘91. Is this candor? Are we so influenced by the Tiger Woods of the world that anything other than a cliche is applauded as “candor.” Wow.
Should we expect, “We’re happy with losing 4 World Series?”
What do you think Glavine and Maddux would say right now? Happy with one, but disappointed about the 4 others, maybe?
Let’s see…felt like a win in ‘91? Check.
Choked away ‘92? Check.
Choked away ‘93? Check.
Won in ‘95. Gratified. Check.
Choked in ‘96? Check.
Choked in ‘97 and ‘98? Check and Check.
2nd best team in ‘99? Check.
Nothing the same after ‘96? Gee, you think so? Anybody with a pulse has said the same thing a million times.
This is old ground. Really really old ground. And hardly unsurprising. I mean, come on…
By The Truth Hurts
June 15, 2007 8:10 PM | Link to this
With all due respect, Smoltz’s feelings about past postseason failures—historic failures—are old news.
Of course he feels that there was more to be done. Who doesn’t? Why should he feel differently? He simply mirrors what every Braves fan has felt about each postseason run since ‘91. Is this candor? Are we so influenced by the Tiger Woods of the world that anything other than a cliche is applauded as “candor.” Wow.
Should we expect, “We’re happy with losing 4 World Series?”
What do you think Glavine and Maddux would say right now? Happy with one, but disappointed about the 4 others, maybe?
Let’s see…felt like a win in ‘91? Check.
Choked away ‘92? Check.
Choked away ‘93? Check.
Won in ‘95. Gratified. Check.
Choked in ‘96? Check.
Choked in ‘97 and ‘98? Check and Check.
2nd best team in ‘99? Check.
Nothing the same after ‘96? Gee, you think so? Anybody with a pulse has said the same thing a million times.
This is old ground. Really really old ground. And hardly unsurprising. I mean, come on…
By N8
June 15, 2007 8:12 PM | Link to this
Man, you gotta LOVE Skip.
On radio he just said:
“Somebody must’ve woke up the drunk with the drum.”
Which was followed by:
“Not a jury in the world would convict you, folks. How would you like to sit by that all night?”
You go Skip!
By bravefansince54
June 15, 2007 8:13 PM | Link to this
God knows that was a tough loss last night. I fight the tendency to be pessimistic this year knowing as I do that there is much baseball left in this season. As my moniker might intimate, I first call the miracle Braves of ‘48 mind, but this isn’t August, and we’re not 14 games behind the Dodgers. So I buck up and blog.
(Why do I hold my breath when he takes the hill - I didn’t do it for Soriano and I didn’t for Pena, Wohlers,Mr. Diversity, and a host of others!) But Wickie doesn’t inspire me, and - there is no other way to put it - I want him gone)… But for all his 3 runs and 4 hits, he obviously isn’t entirely responsible for last nights heartbreaker. No, this was, as it oftenis, a team loss:runners not advanced in earlier innings, third base not holding the line, rookie at first base knocks it down, but doesn’t get the out (tough bounce, yes), and, then, of course, a poor throw or a catcher brings the mitt down a bit too quick (give ‘em each a half an error!) - anyhow…the problem with Wickie is this: the Twins had not managed to overcome ANY of their previous TWENTY SEVEN “behind after 7 innings” experiences, until when? Yeah, you guessed it, Wickie picked up the resin and let a few fly. He was on his and not pitching behind…ok, I am there now: their is a skill to blowing games, he has it down (but not like Reeksma, who designed the mold): 4 hits, 3 runs - against a team that was previously 0-27 in similar situations - gimme a break! In fairness, he had help, but why, as they say, am I not impressed.
Wickie, we hardly knew ‘ye. Fare-thee-well. Peace.
By Oh My
June 15, 2007 8:14 PM | Link to this
Uh oh. the flood gates might be opening here in the 3rd. 1 out….can we get 2 more before a run scores…..
By journalist jimmy smith
June 15, 2007 8:15 PM | Link to this
several managers win a division. some, then, win in the first round. two, win a league championship. one wins the world series. bobby cox teams have won a lot of division signs, a few pennants, and one world series. ironically, bobby cox teams have had more opportunities to advance than others because of 14 straight. that they did not advance must be recognized for all that it may be worth. was there a better manager or job of managing done in any of those years by someone else? who wears the ring?
By MBATL
June 15, 2007 8:15 PM | Link to this
eric, no, I expect Robert will say “anyone but Valentine and Hargrove.”
Braves Fan, thanks for answering. Leyland’s an attractive candidate, but has a .495 career winning pct. He lost to the worst-to-first Braves in ‘91 despite having the best record in the league. Had the best record in the league in ‘90 too, but lost to the Reds, 4 games to 2. Lost the Braves again in ‘92. Took a store-bought Marlins team to a WS title in ‘97 (credit to him!); and lost a WS to a very mediocre Cards team last year. Otherwise, a lot of 3rd and 5th place finishes. I really don’t dislike the guy, but do you think there are no decisions he made, with those great teams, that fans couldn’t question? I reject him as better than Cox (for whatever that’s worth :)). Next!
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 8:15 PM | Link to this
Have you ever seen so many bloops that land behind the infield?
By A-ville Ranger
June 15, 2007 8:16 PM | Link to this
Escobar is too passive with the glove for a third baseman,he’ll learn.
By NASCARfan
June 15, 2007 8:17 PM | Link to this
Sparky Anderson, Tony LaRussa (hey, at least he has two, even if he’s almost as big a choke artist as Cox), Joe Torre, Billy Martin, Casey Stengal, Ralph Houk, Earl Weaver, Tommy Lasorda, Jim Leyland, Whitey Herzog, Tom Kelly, and Dick Williams.
Now, that’s the short list. That’s the list of managers that would have won at least one more title with the Braves teams of the ‘90’s that were grossly mis-managed by one Bobby “Nose-picker” Cox. That’s the list of guys who’ve won more than one title, and guys who I’d rather have than Cox as the manager of the Braves during that run of postseasons, because they, unlike Cox, aren’t going to get outmanaged with the talent this team had from 1993 - 1997. This team should have won 3 WS’s in a row, from 1995 to 1997. They should have at least made the Series in 1993. Blame Cox, much like he should be blamed for the insane lack of offense from this team because he refuses to put overrated players lower in the batting order.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 8:17 PM | Link to this
Yeah, Leland is so much better. Lets see, lost face to face with Cox in 91 and 92 and last year against one of the worst ever teams to play in a World Series found a way to lose it in 5 games. So he has won one world series (sound familiar) and won one League Championship vice 5. This one is not close.
By Braves Fan 79
June 15, 2007 8:18 PM | Link to this
I agree with Braves fan in PA: Jim Leland is a great postseason manager.
2 me Bobbys biggest mistake ever was starting hampton in game 5 against the astros a few years back ….even thou we all knew hamptons NEVER been a big game pitcher…and we had our BEST big game pitcher in the bullpen in Smoltz. Im sorry but Leland in that situation goes against convention and knows that smoltz will give him at least a good 5 or 6 solid innings. Instead we start hampton and the game was over by the time Bobby yanked his sorry a$$ out. Was i the only one sick to my stomach the night before when it was announced hampton was gonna be the starter?
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 8:18 PM | Link to this
Three runs on two bloops and a fielder’s choice. Shows what can happen when the batter makes contact, though. Right, Andruw?
By Oh my
June 15, 2007 8:19 PM | Link to this
That would be a big no on getting out of the 3rd unscathed. Could have been worse though.
By Oh my
June 15, 2007 8:19 PM | Link to this
That would be a big no on getting out of the 4rd unscathed. Could have been worse though.
By Oh my
June 15, 2007 8:20 PM | Link to this
That would be a big no on getting out of the 4th unscathed. Could have been worse though.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 8:20 PM | Link to this
Hate to say it, but its now 3-0 through 4 innings and we’re looking like the team that got in at 5 am this morning…Sad, but this team needs a trade BAD to spark them or a major kick in the a* from management…bench somebody, do something bc nothing else seems to be working…3-0 and it already seems like its over…unfortunately thats just the way the mentality is for us Brave fans these days
By Fire T. Moore!
June 15, 2007 8:21 PM | Link to this
This new Braves announcer Joh Shaumbe (sp) kills me. He is AWFUL!
By Oh My
June 15, 2007 8:21 PM | Link to this
OOPS! Make that the 4th on the flood gates.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 8:25 PM | Link to this
N8, I remember that year, they were right in the race, but they were owned by Major League Baseball at the time, they had no real owner, and they knew that MLB was not going to open up the Checkbook for them to resign Colon!!! You cannot give up the Future for ONE Season trying to win!!! They also traded for Cliff Floyd that year and gave up Pavano, and then later on in the year when they were out of the race they traded Floyd to the Red Sox!!! I remember in offseasons they were talkin about being contracted(or however you spell that) the Twins and the Expos!!! But when you are a GM you cannot think they will dispose completely of your team!!! That was a bonehead move at the time, I remember sayin what a damn bonehead!!! The difference is if we trade Salty for a very good young Pitcher THE BRAVES can afford to keep the Guy for a long time, and the Expos at the time could not afford to sign anybody, I knew that, You knew that, and EVERBODY in Baseball knew that!!!
By N8
June 15, 2007 8:26 PM | Link to this
And heeeeere comes Woodward.
This aughta be good.
By Michael Procton
June 15, 2007 8:27 PM | Link to this
Wait a minute…how did Frenchy even know that he could go forward during a Woodward AB…props to him!
By N8
June 15, 2007 8:29 PM | Link to this
OMG! Woodward get’s a hit!
(said while holding hand over my heart and stumbling backwards) “Elizabeth……I’m comin’…I think this is the BIG ONE!”
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 8:30 PM | Link to this
Did Chris Woodward really just get an RBI single off Sabathia? Elizabeth, it’s the big one!
By Fire T. Moore!
June 15, 2007 8:33 PM | Link to this
Surprise, Surprise Braves leave two mien in scoring position!
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 8:38 PM | Link to this
Let’s see, The Truth Hurts saying that nothing’s been the same since 1996, or John Smoltz saying it … humm … Good point, Truth Hurts. Since folks here have said it, who cares if Smoltz says it. Strong point.
If you could, find me all the quotes — or just a few — from longtime Braves over the years, the Glavines, Madduxes, Joneses or Smoltzes, saying that nothing’s been the same since 1996.
Sorry to have wasted your time. Just skip the blog and post your wisdom next time, chief.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 8:39 PM | Link to this
“Who’s a better manager than Bobby Cox? Keep it reasonably modern day, please.”
For the umpteen hundreth time - anybody not named Mike Hargrove, Bobby Valentine, Carolina Lady, Tennessee Paul, or Head Coach
ANY-body and just about any-THING - Your boss at work. The tv weatherman in Omaha Nebraska. The weird kid down the block who dresses all in black and paints his fingernails purple. The mold covered slice of pizza in the back of my ‘fridge.
What part of this is so darn hard to understand? or should I add your name to the shortlist?
By Robert
June 15, 2007 8:42 PM | Link to this
“While realizing that Smoltz is more entitled than ANY Brave other than Cox to be dissapointed with the lack of WS titles for the Braves”
N8 - Cox has ZERO right to be disappointed with the lack of WS titles for the Braves, since he is the primary cause
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 8:43 PM | Link to this
I have to believe that was the last inning for Carlyle…gave us another fairly decent outing, but he’s coming up on 100 pitches (95) and he’s starting to be hit harder…leave it to the bullpen and lets hope we can rally…
In other news, the Tigers just put up a 5 spot in the 5th to lead against the Phils 7-2, while the Mets lead the Yankees and Roger Clemens 2-0 in the top of the 5th
By Bigmuddy
June 15, 2007 8:44 PM | Link to this
I am sick sick sick of seeing the Braves get the first two men on and refuse to move them over with a sacrifice. Been going on for 15 years under Bobby. Wonder why they never win the Big One against teh good pitchers???????
By N8
June 15, 2007 8:44 PM | Link to this
Ron
“I remember that year, they were right in the race, but they were owned by Major League Baseball at the time…”
I don’t disagree with you. But that comment right there, pretty much says it all. Do you REALLY think that he made that move on his own without MLB approving it?
Every season is filled with trades by GM’s trying to make a push, that don’t do what the trade set out to do, and leave the other team with some GREAT prospects to build around.
What about the trade the Giants made for A.J. Pierzynski for reliever Joe Nathan and minor league pitching prospects Boof Bonser and Francisco Liriano?
If that trade was EVEN UP Pierzynski for Nathan, it STILL favors the Twins, IMO.
But when (if) Liriano is healthy, he is NASTY and will have an effect on the AL Central, Bonser is similar to Davies. He’s on the fense right now. Could go either way. But Nathan has arguably been the Top closer in basebal the last 4 years (140 saves and a 1.95 ERA).
“The difference is if we trade Salty for a very good young Pitcher THE BRAVES can afford to keep the Guy for a long time…”
You just lost a little credibility with that one. LOL!
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 8:45 PM | Link to this
OH MY GOD…Hold the phone…first two on w/ nobody out
Anyone got the over/under on whether Chipper advances from 2nd?
By Robert
June 15, 2007 8:47 PM | Link to this
“robert, you’re going to wax eloquent on greg maddux and slam bobby in the same post?”
Why yes I am. I could care less how much Maddux (and all the rest of ‘em) love Cox.
Hey, as a player, I might love Cox too, especially if I valued my off-day tee times more than a WS ring\
I’ll put Cox and Maddux in the same sentence, if for no other reason than to highlight opposites.
Maddux and Cox. Einstein and Bozo. Platinum and dung.
You get the idea
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 8:48 PM | Link to this
WOW…and apparently we aren’t the only team giving teams extra chances tonight
By Oh My
June 15, 2007 8:48 PM | Link to this
Is this a sign? Could it be? Let’s all hope! Chipper, Andrew and Jeff all single back to back to back.
Now Matt! Back to Back to Back to Back 1 run and the bases loaded.
By MBATL
June 15, 2007 8:49 PM | Link to this
NASCARfan, thanks for the list! I’ve asked that question before, and never gotten an answer. (well, just got the one I expected from Robert). I’d argue with some of ‘em (Herzog, Leyland, off the top of my head…), but at least it’s a list. You’ve really made my point: those guys are in Cox’s league, but no one currently managing (unless you count Leyland - and maybe Torre, but how much talent has he had to work with?) is.
By Braves Fan in PA
June 15, 2007 8:49 PM | Link to this
MBATL since you will obviously find a criticism with whomever anyone suggests (are you related to Bobby?) I suppose a more objective questions is when (if?) Bobby retires who’ll be the manager?
I am not sold on Terry Pendelton but in fairness don’t know much about how he’d do.
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 8:49 PM | Link to this
Diaz 3-for-3 tonight makes him 5-for-8 in his career vs. C.C.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 8:50 PM | Link to this
Refuse to lose … is an important element of winning!
Nathan, the post from which the following is taken is well said and understood … but on what is “more than any of the Braves that have come and gone, he isn’t afraid to say that he hates to lose” based?
That seems like a contest, the winner of which would be next to impossible to select … and yet you have so done.
John’s not by himself … most all winners hate losing, and many, if not most, are quick to so say … it’s part of the package.
I really doubt that many of those not broadcasting the fact are so doing out of fear … though I also suspect that some are/were even bolder in their so attesting than they were in their so feeling.
Somebody please email me when we have the same lineup 2 games in a row … I understand the over is for some time in 2008.
got to install some new fans …
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 8:51 PM | Link to this
Now lets see if Bobby makes the mistake and brings Buddy back out for the 6th
By Oh My
June 15, 2007 8:54 PM | Link to this
Tied 3-3. Although a strikeout , fly out and ground out with the bases loaded and no outs is not the most productive way to win a ballgame or score, it’s a start.
By A-ville Ranger
June 15, 2007 8:54 PM | Link to this
The last few games have shown the price of slow base-runners.If Diaz has decent speed he’d be safe at second.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 8:54 PM | Link to this
Braves Fan in PA,
I think MBATL really only turned down Leland. Seeing Leland’s post season record, especially against Cox, that was pretty much a no brainer. If you came up with someone good, he might buy.
By Braves Fan 79
June 15, 2007 8:54 PM | Link to this
Great woodward somehow got a miracle hit tonight by a few inches… unfortunalty bobby will probably think hes on fire now and get him more starts and at bats in clutch situations. ;( crap.
Woodward just did what he usually does…which is help kill a rally with runners on base.
Man i hope bobby pitchits for woodward next time around. Did i ever mention i REALLY dislike the guy?? ex met piece of trash….
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 8:57 PM | Link to this
Braves Fan in PA
Its been well speculated that the job will first be offered to Ned Yost, who I would absolutely love to have…he also may want to leave Milwaukee as he would have more to work w/ in Atlanta in a bigger market and he may also get paid more here
Also on that list was Grady Little, but I’m not sure I could see him leaving LA unless he’s asked to do so.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 8:58 PM | Link to this
P-Town Brave,
Guess Bobby made another bad mistake by bringing Buddy back out for the 6th inning didn’t he?
By Josh C
June 15, 2007 8:59 PM | Link to this
Well folks from my Uecker seats it looks like we have one bottom rotation guy. Looks like we can expect a fairly consistent 4.50 from this guy. Gimme that.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 8:59 PM | Link to this
“I am glad one Braves player has the cajones to stand up and say, “You know what, it SUCKS that we only have one championship when we should have had more.” In 20 years, baseball historians are going to look back on this team and declare them the biggest underachievers in the history of MLB, with Bobby Cox held accountable for his terrible postseason performances as a manager. Or should I say mis-manager? You cannot escape history, and to try and make excuses for it is folly”
HEAR HEAR HEAR! YES!
Smoltz is candid, and I almost posted that I wish he had the balls to go further and call out Cox. But I cant say that, cuz I cant expect Smoltz to cut his own throat (not to mention the multimillion dollar per year gravy train)
God willing, Smolztie will live to a ripe old age - I can picture it now. A crotchety but spunky 90-year old Smolztie thinking back on his days with the Braves, rubbing his elbow and saying “Three or more rings if it werent for that stupid &*^%$. And I had to nod my head up and down and pretend reverence like the rest of the lemmings. But truth be told, every time he went out to bray at the umps, I wanted to march in out of the dugout, drag him off the field by his long donkey ears, and ship him to the glue factory. “
By cricket
June 15, 2007 8:59 PM | Link to this
Is it just me or anybody else thinks Carlyle has the mindset and stuff to be no. 3 in our current rotation? Looking at the way he pitches, I would any day pick him over Davis and James - their so-called better stuff be damned.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:00 PM | Link to this
I stand corrected…8 pitches and out of the 6th…great inning and by far his most efficient of the night
LETS GO GET SOME RUNS!!!
By MBATL
June 15, 2007 9:00 PM | Link to this
Braves Fan in PA, fair question. Admittedly, I’m in the “defensive” mode regarding Bobby. I like Ned Yost a lot - but don’t know if he’d leave the Brewers - but beyond that would have to give that some thought. Didn’t mean to be overly critical - I really did appreciate hearing some ideas - just defending a manager I like a lot, against a lot of shots.
My point is, and has always been, that you can’t show me any manager in the modern day that has learned how to win championships consistently. Torre is the closest thing to a “model” and he was about to be fired until the Yanks decided to wake up a couple of weeks ago.
By journalist jimmy smith
June 15, 2007 9:01 PM | Link to this
since andruw has begun to throw the ball, after a catch, back to the infield almost underhanded - could this be detrimental to andruw’s ability to throw to the bases when needed? those strikes to the plate of years past this year seem to be up or down the line. not sure if it means anything but coach bukombo used to say you play like you practice - do it right all the time. how many outfielders return the ball to the infield this way? can only think of one. and now, who would be a worthy successor to bobby cox? ned yost?
By Johnny R
June 15, 2007 9:02 PM | Link to this
Robert, you’re right about Cox. Thanks for the wit, sarcasm, and laughs.
JJS, you really make this forum what it is. Man, you are creative.
I usually just skip King O’Brien’s stathead drivel that really tells me nothing inside about the team I can’t figure out on my own.
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 9:03 PM | Link to this
Those 92 Jays were pretty damn good. They had great pitching and the 93 Phils could hit and had Schilling and Tommy Greene (former Braves farmhand, no less). I still think that run they had to make to win the division in 93 drained them, even though that might have been the best Braves team ever put on the field.
By N8
June 15, 2007 9:05 PM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist
I guess what I should’ve said, is that he’s never been one to express what’s on his mind.
Especially last year, when he questioned JS.
Uncalled for? Maybe. Distraction? Maybe. But he said it. Name another Brave, since David Justice, that spoke his mind, without worry of being tarred and feathered for it. Chipper occasionally tells it like it is. But he picks who (JD Drew or LaRoche….a guy in his first year in a Braves uni, and a rookie), rips on, carefully.
But you are right. I would HOPE that all professional athletes hate to lose.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 9:06 PM | Link to this
“eric, no, I expect Robert will say “anyone but Valentine and Hargrove.”
There you go, chief. You know the answer. One of these days, you’ll get it.
DOB - Why havent other Braves made similar comments? Well, some were on the golf course on their off days, some were at the Gold Club, Chipper was on the trainer’s table, and once they werent on the team anymore they helped perpetuate the joke
Gotta point out that technically, Smoltz is wrong in saying that nothing has been the same since ‘96.
One look at the dugout and you realize that a certain long-eared, carrot munching, tantrum throwing something has stayed exactly the same since ‘96. Still stupid, still unaware of it, and still making it frustrating as crap to be a Braves fan
Here’s hoping nothing’s the same starting in ‘09
400-something.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:12 PM | Link to this
7 PITCHES! Great inning for Tyler tonight…we need to get something started…Unfortunately we have Bad-druw leading off the 8th
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:15 PM | Link to this
Another interesting fact…
In about 85 more ABs and 22 more games played, Andruw and Chipper have the same exact amount of hits this season (53)
By Jake The Snake
June 15, 2007 9:17 PM | Link to this
since you’re in Cleveland this weekend, try picking up the new Nine Inch Nails album, Year Zero. The band is from Cleveland. You will not be disappointed with the album. Noisy, dark electro-rock.
Does NIN really need to be described to anyone under the age of 50?
By Ron
June 15, 2007 9:18 PM | Link to this
N8, you said this You just lost a little credibility with that one. LOL! What are you talkin about dude!!! MLB was running that team with about a 30-40 Million dollar Payroll, and we have a 80 Million dollar Payroll!!! Why could we not resign a Good Young Starter that want be a free agent in 2-4 Years!!! We will have Hamptons and Andruws contracts off the books!!! You just lost a little credibility not knowing that we will have money to spend!!! If JS decides to trade Salty, we will be able to resign that Pitcher, especially with other contracts coming off, and plus by then Smoltz will probably retire, or about to retire. How are we not going to be able to sign a very good young pitcher that want be a free agent for 2-4 years!!!
By N8
June 15, 2007 9:19 PM | Link to this
StingerSplash
” I still think that run they had to make to win the division in 93 drained them, even though that might have been the best Braves team ever put on the field.”
Won’t argue with you there, it very well may be true. But on the flipside, what’s the excuse for all the years that we coasted through September with nothing to play for?
But back to that 93 Phillies team, they weren’t neccesarily built to beat the Braves, but they most definitely had the right type of hitters to get the job done against our soft-tossing, pin-point control dart throwers.
Dykstra, Stocker, Daulton, Hollins, Kruk, Morandi…those guys were perfect guys to face them.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 9:19 PM | Link to this
Easier than I thought … now if only they will work!
Perhaps, without so knowing, JohnnyR has provided us with the root of the Braves’ hitting woes I usually just skip Terry’s drivel that really tells me nothing I can’t figure out on my own” … methinks “Terry” could if only he would … do something about it; if indeed that’s the case.
Well, maybe it needs to be peeled, just a bit …
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 9:20 PM | Link to this
Robert, you’re incredibly boring.
Johnny R, why don’t you just skip all of “King O’Brien’s” drivel and blog elsewhere? You’re not adding anything to this discussion.
You and Donk get your own blog up and humming. Might find two or three other interesting, pleasant happy folks like yourselves to blog with you.
By cricket
June 15, 2007 9:23 PM | Link to this
Can AJC please grant Robert his own blog so that he takes his crap out of here? That will save us a lot of time skipping his illogical and childish one trick vitriol. Johnny R and other like-minded idiots who come to DOB’s blog to read what Robert writes, and know more than the blog writer about the team insides (is this guy the jock sniffer / stealer in that advertise?) can also just go to that bobby-obsessed blog and leave us alone.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:24 PM | Link to this
And as stated before by another blogger, bad teams find more and more ways to lose games
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 9:26 PM | Link to this
You know it’s going bad when Soriano gives up a run of any kind, especially a homer.
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 9:27 PM | Link to this
Could be wrong, but I’m betting Sabathia is back in the 9th to avoid having to pitch to Kelly versus Woodward.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 9:28 PM | Link to this
Well said “Terry”!
By Bob
June 15, 2007 9:31 PM | Link to this
Cricket, Amen
By Braves Fan 79
June 15, 2007 9:32 PM | Link to this
If we loose this game look no further than Cox not pitchitting someone for woodward with risp….anyone…..id rather see a pitcher hit than woodward! I mean were in the midst of a loosing streak and BADLY need to win…and with 2 guys on the bench hitting over .300 (johnson and harris)…and yet he lets a .200 hitter hit!?? WHY!
I knew orr or woodward in the lineup today would come back and bite us. Even when we hit them 9th we still cant hide there suckiness! If i was manager no way orr or woodward see playing time in a game unless were down by 10 or up by at least 5…THATS WHEN U REST YOUR STARTERS BOBBY!!! And if a guy pitches a lights out 8th inning…why in the world would u take him out before the 9th? (soriano last night).
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 9:33 PM | Link to this
CC goes THREE BILLS and he’s striding out there for the ninth inning for the third start in a row. That’s a horse (don’t get excited, Mr. Happy, I said horse, not donk)
By Stinger Splash
June 15, 2007 9:34 PM | Link to this
Best thing about NIN is John Cash’s cover of “Hurt.” Sorry, just not a big Trent Reznor fan. OK, so let’s see if Eric Wedge’s decision comes back to bite him in the ace by leaving CC out there for the ninth.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 9:34 PM | Link to this
Get him to Third Base McCann!!!!!!!!!!
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:35 PM | Link to this
Are Robert and Johnny R one and the same, or were they twins separated at birth??? Who know? Who cares!
By brent a.
June 15, 2007 9:35 PM | Link to this
I don’t view the Smoltz comments as anything enlightening, or necessarily in need of deep explanation.
John basically feels like the fans do, especially those of us that followed this team through years of doldrums, only to see this team become the “team of the ‘90’s”, yet with only 1 world championship to show for it.
Smoltz was there before it got good (traded to the organization in ‘87), and has been through everything since that time.
We feel it, and he feels it.
Understood.
By journalist jimmy smith
June 15, 2007 9:35 PM | Link to this
COMPUTER FAN RECALL - just kidding! well, a 3-run homer is most important now. how many men have been left on base tonight? let’s say there are 2 men on base in the first inning and nobody out … hmmm. and now, flasH! salty has doubled and a canadian baserunner is entering the game! nobody out. small ball or 3-run homer? hmmm….
By Braves Fan in PA
June 15, 2007 9:36 PM | Link to this
So much for not wanting to pull Salty for lack of a catcher eh?
Glad to see Bobby go for the win and worry about “saving” a player.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:36 PM | Link to this
Eric
Kelly hits LHP better than righties though Eric
By Robert
June 15, 2007 9:37 PM | Link to this
For the love of god, lay down a sac bunt
By Johnny R
June 15, 2007 9:38 PM | Link to this
I’ll blog here if I want to, tough guy. Let’s see. I have a computer. I have an internet connection. I live in a country that has FREE SPEECH.
Are you on meth, or coke, King?
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 9:38 PM | Link to this
I know Sabathia’s a big strong kid, but to leave him in after 111 pitches? That’s the ultimate no confidence vote in a bullpen.
By http://tucradio.org/new.html
June 15, 2007 9:39 PM | Link to this
Does NIN really need to be described to anyone under the age of 50?
Uh, yeah. That band was terrible. Never liked any of their songs. Pretentious crap. Get a little melody guys. A little rock and roll. Something to shake the booty. A little disco flavor. A little rump shaker. Move the money maker. A little boom boom boom and a zoom zoom zoom. Know what I’m saying, yo. No one cares how much you hate yourself, your mother, and everything in your life. People wants to party. When I hear NIN, what I hear is wah! wah! wah! I am a pretentious self involved, self indulgent momma’s boy who hates everyone and everything. NIN says I like to listen to music all by my lonesome self. It clearly says that I don’t have a girlfriend and I never intend to get one because I could never be understood by anyone because I am so freaking deep and angry and disturbed that I don’t even need an entertaining song with some melody to it. No, I prefer music that is just noisy and loud and that has no flow. At least that is the way I justify it because no girl who ain’t a blue haired, tongue pierced freak with a gazillion tats would ever want me. Give me soul. Some funk. Some R & B. Something with a catchy beat. A little Elvis. A little Buddy Holly. A little Richie Valens. Yeah, man. That is some real music right there. Some real rock and roll. The way it was meant to be played. Not that psycho suicidal I hate myself and mutilate myself NIN crap. At least if you are going to tell me that you hate your momma, tell it to me like Jim Morrison, Father, I am going to kill you, Mother, I am going to …………….. La Bamba, baby. La Bamba.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:40 PM | Link to this
YUNEL you are my HERO!
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:40 PM | Link to this
Ron congrats on your teams victory last night, albeit against a much more inferior team, but championship, none the less….
By brewdawg
June 15, 2007 9:41 PM | Link to this
This would be a nice comeback after last night’s ugly finish. (Obviously)
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 9:41 PM | Link to this
There’s been some mighty fine thoughts and feelings expressed during these trying days and nights … but if there’s one veteran that can get us through it methinks it’s 10Paul … come on Tin Man, cheer me up!
By TennesseePaul
June 15, 2007 9:41 PM | Link to this
DOB: Thanks for the new blog. Loved the Smoltz interview.
Way to go ESCOBAR!!
By N8
June 15, 2007 9:41 PM | Link to this
Skip just said on radio, for those not listening:
*Escobar goes into 2nd with a double, the Braves take the lead 5-4….THAT quiets this crowd and the Yo Yo with the drum!”
Have I said tonight, how much I enjoy Skip?
By A-ville Ranger
June 15, 2007 9:42 PM | Link to this
Bunt ‘um over and bang home ! yeee haaaw !!
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:42 PM | Link to this
Way to go Yunel, now lets see if we can tack on some more, and give Wicky another chance to save one for us!
And who was saying this team can’t come back???
By Gil in Mechanicsville
June 15, 2007 9:42 PM | Link to this
This Braves team is wearing me out…..
Great clutch hit by Escobar.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:43 PM | Link to this
I’m sorry but for those who want to send Yunel off somewhere else, thats a really REALLY bad idea! I’d love to keep this kid around for awhile…his makeup, his swing…he’s just got really great TALENT!
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 9:43 PM | Link to this
Get ready for Wicky! Which way will it go this time?
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 9:43 PM | Link to this
I’ve been holding off on commenting on young Mr. Escobar, but I will say this now: This kid is the shizzle.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:43 PM | Link to this
Now lets hope (as always) that McCann doesn’t get creamed in the head now that Salty is gone.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 9:44 PM | Link to this
Braves Fan 79,
Pretty damn good bunt by Woodward dude. I have been as critical as anyone of Woodward but he has played well tonight. Give the guy a break!
By brent a.
June 15, 2007 9:44 PM | Link to this
Hooray for the kids!
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:46 PM | Link to this
Looks like we need to really rail on Soriano tonight, since he did give up a run! Can you believe that guy, the nerve……………… Come on bloggers, lets get negative here!!
By N8
June 15, 2007 9:46 PM | Link to this
Robert
I’m staying out of the Cox aruguement tonight, however this next line is classic. Only you…..only you. LOL!
“Give Leyland the teams Cox had,only Antonio Alfonseca could wear all the rings”
Funny.
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 9:47 PM | Link to this
StingerSplash, so true on leaving CC out there, especially after the double off the wall to start the inning.
Johnny R, you go, son. Fight the power! Exercise your freedom of speech.
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:47 PM | Link to this
Would love to be able to move Kelly back to LF and keep Yunel and plug him in at 2b.
Would be a great lineup then w/o Bad-druw
1) Johnson lf
2) Escobar 2b
3) Renteria ss
4) C Jones 3b
5) Francoeur rf
6) McCann c
7) Saltalamacchia 1b
8) Harris cf
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 9:48 PM | Link to this
Bob, had the same thought about Woodward. Criticize, but give credit when due.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:48 PM | Link to this
This dude can’t seem to get the ball over the plate. Let’s hope Hoss unloads on one, as we have Mr. Rally Killer up next in the “clean out” spot!
By journalist jimmy smith
June 15, 2007 9:49 PM | Link to this
andruw is about to have a chance to drive in some runs. loaded!
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:50 PM | Link to this
Come on Andruw, a strikeout might be a good thing here! Or, do I dare suggest it??? Maybe a double to the right-centerfield gap???
By Bob
June 15, 2007 9:50 PM | Link to this
Bases loaded for Andruw. Well, at least no double play.
By GermanBravesFan
June 15, 2007 9:50 PM | Link to this
Nice going… Braves took the lead in the ninth thanks to the hitting of the two youngsters. Let’s hope Bob can nail it down tonight! GO BRAVES!!!!
By Michael Procton
June 15, 2007 9:50 PM | Link to this
Andruw can’t get a single run in with bases loaded and less than 2 outs…I’m shocked…SHOCKED!
By journalist jimmy smith
June 15, 2007 9:51 PM | Link to this
oh, the humanity! andruw is a mess! get andruw out of clean-up.
By Lew
June 15, 2007 9:51 PM | Link to this
It is past time for Andruw to step up. Does he need a new leotard?
By brewdawg
June 15, 2007 9:51 PM | Link to this
DOB and fellow bloggers,
Let’s make a stand against Robert (A.K.A Donkey in the Blogout). Let’s just stop responding to his ASSinine remarks, since he obviously loves the reaction he gets. I’m really tired of reading his post ( it’s the same one over and over, so I refuse to say posts ). So let’s all just ignore him as you would a child and maybe he will go away.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 9:52 PM | Link to this
I am sooooo tired of Andruw batting 4th, BC move him to 7th in the order!!! All Andruw had to do is hit a ball deep enough in the outfield and we get another run, he cant even do that no more!!!!!
By P-Town Brave
June 15, 2007 9:52 PM | Link to this
Man Bad-druw and Frenchy have absolutely killed us lately w/ their p**-poor AB’s
By chrisklob
June 15, 2007 9:52 PM | Link to this
For anyone interested:
NYM 2, NYY 0 bottom 8th DET 12, PHI 6 bottom 8th
By N8
June 15, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
“It clearly says that I don’t have a girlfriend and I never intend to get one because I could never be understood by anyone because I am so freaking deep and angry and disturbed that I don’t even need an entertaining song with some melody to it.”
CLEARLY this is spoken by somebody who has never been in a hotel room in some town in the middle of nowhere, with “Closer” by NIN playing at full volume, while two extremely hot chicks, are battling over who gets to……
ooops. Almost forgot that this was a family blog.
(sigh)
Oh to be young again.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
Dang Jeff, the guy was having trouble getting the ball over the plate. Let one or two go by!
Go Wicky!
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
Cato, we do have something in common … though I sometimes wish it wasn’t true … your grandson and Salty look alike, as do my son and Bob Wickman; though my son is older than any of the players.
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 9:54 PM | Link to this
Andruw had better hope that Wicky can hold a 1-run lead.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Thank goodness for Gameday. No thanks to TBS for not covering a Friday night game.
By Michael Procton
June 15, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Woo…Wickman sure did a fine job of not being able to strike anybody out against Garko…but right after, shockingly, a single lifted to the short OF.
By N8
June 15, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Hey….what do you know?
Thorman in at 1B in a save situation with a 1 run lead?
Of course he was pinch-run for, so not much choice tonight. Curious if he’d bet in there, had he not got the hit?
By Gil in Mechanicsville
June 15, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Whew!!!! Still beer to be sold folks. Not over yet.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Robert, you truly are stupid aren’t you. Seems to me those Pirate teams had guys like Bonds, Bonilla and Van Slyke among others. They lost to the Reds and the Braves 2 years in a row. Cox beat him with his worst to first team. Last year the worst team in the modern era whupped his Tigers in 5 friggin games. He did a great job in 97 with his Herz Rent a Player Marlins. Your ridiculous fascination with Bobby Cox affects your logic dude.
By GermanBravesFan
June 15, 2007 9:57 PM | Link to this
Hey, DOB… how did Buddy Carlyle’s performance look (kinda hard to follow the game on yahoo)? Do you think he’ll have a spot from here on out? His last two outings seem to have been pretty good.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 9:57 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah Appreciate it Man!!! Your Jazz are a good team though, they will be that much better next year!!!!
By knowitall
June 15, 2007 9:58 PM | Link to this
And you all complain that Bobby leaves his starters in too long.
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 9:58 PM | Link to this
I hate it when the Yankees play the Mets because they both can’t lose. And look, Oliver Perez is sticking it up someone’s tailpipe besides the Braves! Yikes. This is getting scary with Sizemore up.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 9:59 PM | Link to this
Lordy, I thought he was gonna say “almost forgot that was a family reunion”
By Robert
June 15, 2007 10:01 PM | Link to this
If Delucci reaches base, game over.If Blake gets to bat, game over
By N8
June 15, 2007 10:02 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah
“Looks like we need to really rail on Soriano tonight, since he did give up a run! Can you believe that guy, the nerve……………… Come on bloggers, lets get negative here!!”
I realize you’re being sarcastic and all, but I still have to respond.
Soriano gave up 1 RUN off a HR, in 1 “full” inning pitched. Giving up the lead in a tie game. Good outing? Nope. But surely not horrible.
Wickman last night (with some help from his young defense and the coaches - with the defensive alignment), gave up 3 runs in 1/3 of an inning pitched…..That’s 1 OUT to you and me, Russ. The winning run scored on a basehit, with STILL only 1 out. I’m venturing a guess that if it would have been a 5-0, or even 7-0 game last night going into the 9th, the lead would have more than likely been surrendered at some point.
Good, bad or indifferent, last night was not Wicky’s (or the Braves) night.
By GermanBravesFan
June 15, 2007 10:02 PM | Link to this
I agree with brewdawg…
By David O'Brien
June 15, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
Brewdawg, I’m with you. Done….
Now, if you can just find a solution for getting Soriano moved into the closer role (notwithstanding the homer tonight, just the sixth hit and second run off him in 22 games)
By TennesseePaul
June 15, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
Wicky you better close this thing.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 10:05 PM | Link to this
This has got to be interesting for Wickman, going up against the team he was a big part of for so long. Go get em big Bob! Don’t worry about all those mean bloggers talking about your girth. Remember Mickey Lolich was not a small guy either. Big guys rule!
Now what were you guys saying about Wickman not being able to strike out people?
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 10:05 PM | Link to this
In the words of the much younger Skip Caray
It’s cocktail hour, folks!
By Lew
June 15, 2007 10:06 PM | Link to this
Alright-For a moment there I was wishing bad things about the ump. That first two strike pitch was perfect. Great win for a change. We needed this one.
By TennesseePaul
June 15, 2007 10:06 PM | Link to this
GO BRAVES!!!
Helluva game tonight. Helluva game.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 10:06 PM | Link to this
Gutsy damn win, especially after last night.
By snowball's chance
June 15, 2007 10:08 PM | Link to this
DOB gives more ink to Robert than any other blogger.
By N8
June 15, 2007 10:09 PM | Link to this
DOB
“Now, if you can just find a solution for getting Soriano moved into the closer role (notwithstanding the homer tonight, just the sixth hit and second run off him in 22 games)”
Are you “mocking” me? Or are you seriously on “my side” with the thought that Soriano would currently make more sense as the closer (NOT to be confused with “Closer” by NIN)?
By Robert
June 15, 2007 10:09 PM | Link to this
Bonds yes - but Bonilla and Van Slyke. No pitcher ever quaked at the thought of facing Andy Van Slyke
Meanwhile, Wickman (and Cox) got out of it
“Last year the worst team in the modern era whupped his Tigers in 5 friggin games”
I assume you mistyped and meant worst playoff team - therefore (mistakenly) referring to the 2006 Cardinals and not the 1962 Mets.
Bob, the Pirates of the early 90’s had Bonds. They had Doug Drabek too. And lo and behold they had a few other guys who could hold major league starting gigs for half a decade or so. To compare their rosters with that of the 91 or 92 Braves and think they are even near equal, is to show ignorance of Coxian proportions.
I suppose you were equally awed when we rolled over the Cubs in the first round in 98 in round one
By BravesDave
June 15, 2007 10:10 PM | Link to this
Nothing like a nice, easy 1-2-3 save in a 1-run game. Can someone please explain to me why Wickman nearly falls over after every pitch?? Someone needs to convince this guy that it is not smart to weigh 300 lbs.
By StingerSplash
June 15, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this
Is anyone else struck by the absurdity of someone proclaiming their freedom of speech in an online forum behind the cloak of anonymity? DOB, I think you’ve talked about what a good guy Mike Lowell is before. Have seen you Gammons’ piece on him recently? Just read a snippet tonight on another forum. Good stuff from a good guy on a good guy.
By Robert
June 15, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this
“Wicky you better close this thing”
Why are you thinking. “Donk, Wicky better close this thing”?
Why are the players responsible for what happens when the manager misuses them?
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 10:13 PM | Link to this
N8 Yes, I was being sarcastic, but no, you are wrong. Last night was not Wickman’s fault, any more than Soriano was at fault tonight.
To be honest, any innning where you don’t retain the lead is a bad outing, no matter how well one pitches. I hate hearing major league pitchers who have just lost coming on and saying they were getting their pitches over, and the other team just hit a couple of mistakes. A loss is still a loss. You lost, just shut up and accept it.
Granted some losses are worse than others, but I would have to disagree with you that Wickman was any worse last night than Soriano was tonight.
By BravesDave
June 15, 2007 10:14 PM | Link to this
Nice at-bats by Andruw and Francoeur in the ninth tonight with the bases loaded. Francoeur swings at another first pitch after the chump pitcher comes in and walks the first two hitters. Notice no comment on Andruw Jones swinging on a 1-0 against same said pitcher who walked the first two hitters. That is because Andruw Jones is a hopeless cause.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 10:15 PM | Link to this
Was Wickman reading the blog last night when everyone was railing on him for not striking out enough hitters?
By Gil in Mechanicsville
June 15, 2007 10:15 PM | Link to this
Mets win their game, Philles down 12-8 bottom of ninth.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 10:16 PM | Link to this
Robert,
The Braves had Terry Pendleton that first year. Look at their lineup and it did not make anyone quake at all. They had good young pitching but the lineup was nothing other than TP. Yeah, I meant worst playoff team. What about Leland makes you think he is so great? He had far better players last year than the Cards.
By MBATL
June 15, 2007 10:17 PM | Link to this
Great win tonight. We should’ve beat Santana last night, and did beat Sabbathia tonight. Playing some good baseball, for a change.
Robert, too much there to respond to all of it, maybe later. But you bring up the ‘99 team as one that was as good as any: yeah, a great team! Won 103 games. Great pennant drive to beat out the Giants, back when division championships mattered.
But in the WS, AJ hit .077, Chipper hit .231, Jordan hit .077, Klesko hit .167, Gerald Williams hit .176, and give him credit, Bret Boone hit .538. Those were the guys who had the majority of AB’s in that series.
As for pitchers, I won’t list ‘em all, but the Braves’ team era was 4.37, vs. the Yanks’ 2.19.
I still don’t know who could manage around those numbers. Anyone but Cox, I guess.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 10:17 PM | Link to this
N8 this comment was hillarious: CLEARLY this is spoken by somebody who has never been in a hotel room in some town in the middle of nowhere, with “Closer” by NIN playing at full volume, while two extremely hot chicks, are battling over who gets to……
ooops. Almost forgot that this was a family blog.
Classic that was funny, hahaha!!!
By eric the elder
June 15, 2007 10:18 PM | Link to this
Let’s not forget that the big 9th was started by Salty.
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 10:19 PM | Link to this
Wait a minute, was that a foul fart I just smelled on the blog??? Nah, it was just Robert posting again and stinking things up again.
By N8
June 15, 2007 10:20 PM | Link to this
Wayne
If you think that Soriano’s outing was as bad as Wickman’s was last night. Then I’m actually at a loss (YEAH…you read that right), for words.
OK.
By Rosalynn
June 15, 2007 10:21 PM | Link to this
Vera nice win, Wicka!
By http://tucradio.org/new.html
June 15, 2007 10:22 PM | Link to this
La Bamba baby, la Bamba from my 9:39 post will be my rally cry from now on since it worked so well tonight.
Every time, they’re in trouble, I am just going to say to myself a little Elvis. A little Buddy Holly. A little Richie Valens. Father, I am going to kill you. Mother, I am going to …………… La Bamba baby, La Bamba.
Might not catch on with the rest of you, but it will be my own personal rally cry.
By GermanBravesFan
June 15, 2007 10:23 PM | Link to this
A win is a win - especially if you come back in the ninth inning! Let’s hope this will build some momentum. GO BRAVES!
By N8
June 15, 2007 10:24 PM | Link to this
“Notice no comment on Andruw Jones swinging on a 1-0 against same said pitcher who walked the first two hitters. That is because Andruw Jones is a hopeless cause.”
Uh…when you make a comment about NOT making a comment about Andruw sucking……that’s STILL a comment.
:-)
Of course, I agree with you about Andruw being a lost cause. Though I’m not sure why you’re ragging on him, he did hit a “foul ball” HR tonight. Doesn’t that count for something?
Just giving you a hard time.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
June 15, 2007 10:28 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah I really cannot agree on your comment regarding a pitcher giving up the lead as a bad outing. Often a team’s defense lets a pitcher down. The only alternative would be to say a pitcher must strike out the side to be effective.
I agree with most of your observations but it is just not realistic to expect perfection.
By Stuart
June 15, 2007 10:31 PM | Link to this
Good win tonight. Now here comes the hard part, and that is building on it and starting a streak. Andruw is a completely lost cause and singele handily ruined the ninth, but a win is a win, now bravos, build on it, dont lose 4 of the next five.
By §
June 15, 2007 10:31 PM | Link to this
Good stuff from a good guy on a good guy.
When you mention good stuff and Mike Lowell, are you by chance referring to the good stuff Giambi recently referred to? No? You think it was coincidental that Lowell shriveled up in the last few years, had a mysterious illness in his last year with the Marlins, and has lost power? Probably a good man but good stuff is exactly right.
By N8
June 15, 2007 10:33 PM | Link to this
thanx ron.
I’ve never understood why people feel the need to judge what music people listen to, or why they listen to it.
If it moves you, listen to it. If it doesn’t….don’t.
Different Strokes, I guess. There is a LOT of music out there that I don’t like. But I’m not dumb enough to NOT get why others would and do like it.
Now if we’re talking why somebody might still have faith in Andruw, then we’re talkin a topic that can be up for debate. :-)
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 10:34 PM | Link to this
Cato, do you think Plautus ever visits this forum?
A funny thing happened … we won!
By Wayne in Utah
June 15, 2007 10:37 PM | Link to this
N8 Soriano gives up a home run, and Wickman gives up ONE solid hit, the winning hit to left. All other batters hit the ball on the ground where sometimes they get through, but hey, that’s what we want our relief pitcher to do. Either strike them out, or get them to hit them on the ground or pop them up. So, how was Soriano’s effort any better than Wickman’s, because Wickman’s grounders that SHOULD have been fielded weren’t???
They both lost or potentially lost games for their team, so both outings were not good ones, but neither was much worse than the other.
Gotta run tonight. No more computer time for me.
Happy Birthday Shaun!!
Give ‘em heck tonight, Nate!
By Ron
June 15, 2007 10:41 PM | Link to this
Right on Brewdog, but will be hard to always ignore him!!!
By bruce
June 15, 2007 10:44 PM | Link to this
ok, who are the best bunters on the team? After tonight seeing Woodward, he gets a vote from me and I’d vote for Smoltz from memory. I am not really remembering too many others with great bunting skills.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 10:50 PM | Link to this
Robert,
Dude you were right about one thing tonight. If Blake gets to bat, game over. Right for once anyway. LOL
By parks
June 15, 2007 10:51 PM | Link to this
*“Wicky you better close this thing”
Why are you thinking. “Donk, Wicky better close this thing”?
Why are the players responsible for what happens when the manager misuses them?*
Why do yall respond to this clown when he makes comments like this? He is a clown that gets his jollies when the players make a mistake. This will be the one and only time I respond to thisclown. Robert use are the biggest tool I have ever come across, plain and simple. The fact that you come on this blog every day and think you really make any kind of difference is straight comedy. *GET A FREAKING LIFE. * Really I feel bad for you.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 10:54 PM | Link to this
N8, NIN is a pretty damn good band!!! You like Disturbed and Korn?
By N8
June 15, 2007 10:55 PM | Link to this
Wayne
I know you said you gotta run, but I’ll reply anyhow. I’ll wait for your response at a later time. LOL!
I don’t disagree that the outings were no different, in that the ultimate result could’ve been the same. But that’s the key word…”could’ve”.
Soriano, while giving up the lead, rebounded and KEPT IT TO ONE RUN ALLOWED. Wickman failed to pick up his teamates mistakes. PERIOD. You may make comments about ground balls, and what not. You may even comment on the BAD defensive alignment. But whether Wickman agreed with or didn’t agree with Escobar being off the line, or Diaz playing in RF on the Cuddyer triple, Wickman FAILED to get the pitch in the right spot to take advantage of the alignment, or do you disagree?
On a side note (actually two of them).
1) The guy on ESPN (not sure of his name) didn’t come CLOSE to pronouncing Salty’s name right…..TWICE. Shouldn’t that be part of their job description? If the guy is gonna be in the highligh, make sure you know how to say his name?
2) Did anybody see the highligh of Soriano’s HR for the Cubs today? Aparently that SOB, STILL doesn’t get it. Hits the HR, holds his bat about 3 feet above his head, while standing about 3 feet from home, absolutely STARING at his feat. I really dislike that guy.
Guy needs a 100 MPH fastball in his temple. Actually what would be better is if the next time he does it (like it won’t happen), if the catcher just starts beating on him. Lou needs to sit that guy down.
By Chuck Uga
June 15, 2007 11:00 PM | Link to this
We will not see the Braves in the World Series anytime within the next 10 years. Probably longer. The glory days are a thing of the past. They could not take advantage of the farm system and still can’t. Oh well.
By La Jolla Dawg
June 15, 2007 11:00 PM | Link to this
What was the name of Glavine’s shrink? Remember when he couldn’t get out of the first inning without wetting himself? He had a sports psychologist, I think his name might of been Lewelyn or something like that, anyway, I think Andruw needs to take a spin on that guys couch. He is so messed up right now! Boras needs to keep quiet, I am sure that’s not helping. Hey DOB do you like the Waterboys?
By brian
June 15, 2007 11:00 PM | Link to this
Great point DOB about Salty having to stay in the game mainly so he can still be a reserve catcher. That is why you are the Braves beat writer and I am, well, obviously I am not.
Anyway, great win for the guys today. Not only the simple win, but the way the Braves kept fighting back to win it. It also does not hurt the confidence to hold on the 9th. Last June, that game was a loss without a doubt.
I did note that Yunel was guarding the line tonight. Cox also rolled the dice with Pete Orr pinch running for Salty and Thorman coming on in the 9th.
Nice game for Salty. Hopefully tonight will earn him more starts. Salty is quickly proving last year was an aberration and that Salty is a cornerstone for the Braves along WITH McCann and Frenchy. Yunel is also playing his way into the untouchable category.
By Bob
June 15, 2007 11:01 PM | Link to this
Amazing,
Haven’t heard from Mets Drool and No Chop in ages. “Amazing” what losing 9 of 10 will do to your bloggers. Heard Met fans are as upset with Delgado batting cleanup as Braves fans are with Andruw doing same. Production wise they are about equal. Delgado slightly higher avg but fewer homeruns and rbis than Andruw. Cox really needs to bump him back down to 7 or so.
By N8
June 15, 2007 11:02 PM | Link to this
Ron
I’m not huge fans of either, but I like songs by each of them. I’m actually not that big of NIN fan. I think Trent Reznor is pretty amazing, while being a little out there. But you totally gotta be in the mood for NIN.
Sadly enough, one of my favorite Korn songs is the “Word Up” cover. Absolutely HATED the original version of that song, but for some reason the Korn guy’s voice is just cool on it.
Down with the Sickness is actually a really cool tune, and it’s fairly difficult on guitar as well.
Like I said before, not a huge fan of either, but I completely get why people like them. Just not my bag.
Hey parks!
I thought I was the comedian on this blog?
By Todd A
June 15, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this
I’m still laughing at Robert’s 9:33 post.D,JD…..LOL.
By B9
June 15, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this
I’m here tonight, too. I am, however, benign.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this
Cato, we don’t SS but it’s interesting to hear that Bobby started Salty in the ninth, I didn’t realize he could pitch … we’ve been looking for a way to keep him in the lineup!
Nathan, you don’t really have to tell folks when you’re giving them a hard time.
StingerSplash, Is anyone else struck by the absurdity of someone proclaiming their freedom of speech in an online forum behind the cloak of anonymity … now, now, it’s unfair to expect our founding fathers to have anticipated the Internet!
The people so doing are generally those who know they wouldn’t be so allowed if it were treated as a responsibility carrying privilege rather than parasitic entitlement.
My 9:41 said it all … thanks 10Paul, that did the trick!!
By Todd A
June 15, 2007 11:05 PM | Link to this
Nathan,I have to give you credit,man.You know your S* when it pertains to the Braves.
By Ron
June 15, 2007 11:14 PM | Link to this
DOB, And OTHERS, Here is something about the Sopranos ending:**
Fans of “The Sopranos” are seizing on clues suggesting that the controversial blackout which abruptly ended the TV mob drama meant that Tony Soprano was rubbed out, and HBO said on Thursday they may be on to something.
One clue in particular, a flashback in the penultimate episode to a conversation between Tony and his brother-in-law about death, gained credence as an HBO spokesman called it a “legitimate” hint and confirmed that series creator David Chase had a definite ending in mind.
“While he won’t say to me 100 percent what it all means, he says some people who’ve guessed have come closer than others,” HBO spokesman Quentin Schaffer told Reuters after speaking to Chase
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www.fade11black.com “There are definitely things there that he intended for people to pick up on,” Schaffer said.
Chase suggested as much in an interview on Tuesday with The Star-Ledger newspaper of New Jersey when he said of his end to the HBO series, “Anyone who wants to watch it, it’s all there.”
In the final moments of Sunday’s concluding episode, Tony, the conflicted mob boss who has just survived a round of gangland warfare, sits in a diner with his family munching on onion rings as the 1980s song by rock band Journey, “Don’t Stop Believing,” blares from a juke box.
Tension builds as a suspicious man wearing a “Members Only” jacket eyes Tony from a nearby counter before slipping into a restroom. Then, as Tony looks toward the restaurant’s entrance, the screen abruptly goes blank in mid-scene — with no picture or sound for 10 seconds — until the credits roll silently.
Stunned viewers, many initially believing something had gone wrong with their cable TV reception, were left wondering whether Tony ended up “whacked” or whether his sordid life went on as usual.
The jarring, fill-in-the-blank finale, concluding a show widely hailed as America’s greatest television drama, sparked a furious debate about whether Chase had conceived of an actual ending and whether he left the audience any clues.
The biggest hint, according to a consensus taking shape on the Web, is a scene from an earlier episode in which Tony and his brother-in-law, Bobby Bacala, muse about what it feels like to die.
“You probably don’t even hear it when it happens,” Bobby says while they sit fishing in a small boat on a lake.
“I think that is one of the most legitimate things to look at,” Schaffer said when asked about theories that the flashback was meant to foreshadow Tony’s death.
By rocketman
June 15, 2007 11:16 PM | Link to this
If we had a manager who held the players accountable he’d be all over Jones’s and Francouers’ a** for swinging at the first pitch after the relief pitcher just walked the first 2 hitters to load the bases in the 9th. The game should have never been only 5-4 but the braves continue and will continue to play this way until we get new leadership. Would you have your little leaguer swing at the first pitch in that situation. How about when that hitter is also batting .220 We need an on field coach not someone constantly yelling encoragement to his players. How about tough love?
By BravesDave
June 15, 2007 11:17 PM | Link to this
By the way, I noted that DOB ripped on me last night for saying that McCann was ‘in a funk offensively and defensively’ just because McCann hit his SECOND homer since the first week of the season last night. I still maintain, as much as I like the guy, that he is killing this team. Two bad strikeouts tonight, plus a weak ground ball in the ninth that would not have gotten the runner to third with one out…but Peralta managed to boot the grounder and completely change the inning for the Braves.
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 11:20 PM | Link to this
Nate, Guy needs a 100 MPH fastball in his temple … now you don’t really mean that. It’s almost all good, Braves won … be nice!
By BravesDave
June 15, 2007 11:22 PM | Link to this
N8, I love to comment without commenting. And also to not comment with a comment. In any event, Andruw is horrendous. I am just glad that Escobar and Salty have not yet been corrupted by Terry Pendleton and are still able to win some games for us. The longer they are around TP, the worse the news will be for the Braves.
By parks
June 15, 2007 11:23 PM | Link to this
N8 you are for the most part the comedian. The difference is I respect your passion. Even though I disagree with you 95 % of the time at least you make some sense.
By Todd A
June 15, 2007 11:25 PM | Link to this
Well,we can chew on the conclusion all we want.Chase will eventually cave in to the demand and produce a movie in the next 2-3 years imo.
By Berigan
June 15, 2007 11:26 PM | Link to this
Johnny Rat won’t be here long I predict….
By parks
June 15, 2007 11:35 PM | Link to this
By the way, I noted that DOB ripped on me last night for saying that McCann was ‘in a funk offensively and defensively’ just because McCann hit his SECOND homer since the first week of the season last night. I still maintain, as much as I like the guy, that he is killing this team. Two bad strikeouts tonight, plus a weak ground ball in the ninth that would not have gotten the runner to third with one out…but Peralta managed to boot the grounder and completely change the inning for the Braves.
maybe we should bench him, play salty at Catcher and play Thor at first!! N8! this why I can’t stop laughing!
By Bob, Journalist
June 15, 2007 11:38 PM | Link to this
Johnny R, you’ll note that I wasn’t being specific … just an opine covering the usual … though methinks it could have been a posit.
However, if you should feel it accurately describes your situation, it is rectifiable. Simply refrain from doing and saying those things that would not make past, current and future generations of your family proud … it’s a simple formula that, though you’ll surely fall short of the mark, will bring honor to your name, meaning to your life and friends to your funeral.
By N8
June 15, 2007 11:45 PM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist
YES, for the most part, I do mean what I said about Alphonso Soriano. Don’t like the guy, never have. I hate hot dogs. If it’s game seven of the world series and your team is down by 3 runs, bases are loaded and you hit a walk off grand slam, it is STILL not acceptable to stand at home and gawk at it with your arms in the air. RUN THE FRICKIN BASES with your arms in the air if you want, but act like you’ve hit a homerun before.
It’s no more or less ridiculous than Carlos Perez doin his little “dance” after EVERY strike out.
What’s gonna end up happening to him (Alphonso), is that since HE doesn’t get it, and won’t stop posing after his HR’s, one of his teamates is gonna get drilled. Until SOMEBODY sits him down and tells him how to behave, I have ZERO interest in what he does.
Just don’t like him.
parks
“Even though I disagree with you 95 % of the time at least you make some sense.”
How can I get you to lower that to about 83%?
By BravesDave
June 15, 2007 11:49 PM | Link to this
parks, I never said that I thought Salty should be moved to first, so your point does not apply to me. I do not mind that he is over there now getting some time because he is obviously a more professional hitter than Thorman, but I make my points about McCann more because I think it needs to be pointed out that he is having arguably a worse season than Andruw. He is now hitting 60 points below his average from last season, with no power, and terrible defense. He is not throwing out base stealers and the pass ball/wild pitch totals are abysmal.
Andruw may be hitting .215, but he is a career .260 hitter. Andruw is also playing flawless defense. I think he stinks with the stick, but jeez, McCann has been terrible with the stick since the first week of the season.
By Matt
June 15, 2007 11:50 PM | Link to this
I see Robert is spewing more of his idiotic,Cox hate-filled drivel again.
You need help.
And BravesDave,if you think McCann is killing this team,then I laugh at you.
By Michael Procton
June 15, 2007 11:56 PM | Link to this
Langy apparently had a good game tonight…SC Top Ten catch and a 3-run homer…good for him, wish WE could have seen a little of that, though.
By brian
June 15, 2007 11:59 PM | Link to this
I do not want to believe that Tony was whacked. What a bummer of an ending for a great series! The more I watch it, the more I believe that was the ending. The show was always told through Tony and after all, he would not have heard it coming.
I also agree with above that there will be a Soprano’s movie. Give everytime to look around at other parts for a while and baddabing a Soprano’s paycheck will be welcome.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this
Nate, methinks that over time, his teammates will take good care of him, if lou doesn’t beat them to it … no outside interference will be needed.
By BravesDave
June 16, 2007 12:04 AM | Link to this
Matt, what is McCann contributing to this team right now? I am not saying there are not other players on the Braves that are not living up to expectations, but I don’t miss a game, and I have seen a steady succession of terrible at-bats by McCann this season. He is one of the chief culprits of this team’s inability to move a runner to third with less than two outs. And his defense, as I said above, hurts the eyes. He is hitting under .270 with 4 HRs. Is that special? I like the guy a lot, but honesty compels me to say he is a huge disappointment this season to date.
By Mike from the coast
June 16, 2007 12:13 AM | Link to this
I haven’t read a single previous blog just getting in, but I watched the game. My thoughts are last night’s game P.O.’d many on the Braves team. Rather than put pressure on themselves they got mad and were determined to take it out on someone. Great ninth inning. The new blood, Escobar and Saltlamacchia obviously aren’t afraid and showed major league heart, ability, and desire tonight.
The only thing about the night I hate is I am convinced Soriano should be THE closer. I agree with whatever blogger last night said the same thing, Wickman should be the 8th inning man and Soriano closing. Unfortunately, knowing Bobby and his thinking, he’s going to keep Wickman there forever after tonight. Not being negative on a great victory tonignt.
By N8
June 16, 2007 12:14 AM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist
“Nate, methinks that over time, his teammates will take good care of him, if lou doesn’t beat them to it … no outside interference will be needed.”
One would think, wouldn’t they. If they haven’t YET, I’m not sure they will. But I agree with you.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 12:27 AM | Link to this
‘Twas not a banner night for McCann, for sure. The situations where he was close to automatic last season, he stumbled in tonight. Twice took a called third strike with a runner at third, once with NO OUTS and the other time with two outs (remember, last year he led the majors with, like a .470 or so average with RISP and two outs).
Hey, you gotta let him play his way out of it. if he can play, you play him. Like I’ve said, he had a similar power outage last year (not this low average and OBP though), and then went on a surge after the break that didn’t really stop until the end of the season. What, 19 homers after the break? So we’ll see….
Man, Salty and Escobar are special talents. Really are. Escobar, you can tell is older than most prospects and been through a hell of lot more. No fear whatsoever….
OK, folks the T-shirt slogan thing. If we’re gonna do it, gotta get some better ones. All those great ideas folks were throwing around the other day, like the list of 7-8 or so from Savannah Guy and so many other good ones, aren’t showing up in the submissions.
I mean, nothing personal to Jimmy, but when his “Put me in coach, I’m ready to blog” might be a daily winner … well, the promo might not even last long enough to get actual T-shirts made if that’s what we’re working with.
Later
By ColoradoBravesFan
June 16, 2007 1:03 AM | Link to this
Great win By the Braves. Hey DOB what can you tell the denizens about this kid Kristopher A. Medlen, pitching down in Rome for the Braves single A team. The guy has a 1.29 era, but what stands out is the 25 strikeouts in 14 innings, 2 BBs. Then I checked last year when he pitched at Danville, 0.41 ERA and 36 Ks in 22 innings, 2 BBs. Plus in his last apperance, 2 innings 0, 6Ks, no walks. Can you give us some inside scoop?
By parks
June 16, 2007 1:20 AM | Link to this
BravesDave your theory of Mccann’s demise if laughable. The funny part is you think he is hurting the team.HE IS NOT HAVING A WORSE SEASON THAN ANDRUW Andruw is making 1/6 of the payroll and hitting 4TH!. Mccann will be fine. Oh wait BravesDave, compare him with the rest of the NL catchers. Tell me what you find.
N8 never 83.4%, I was being nice with 95% lol
By The Truth Hurts
June 16, 2007 1:24 AM | Link to this
DOB, geez, a tiny bit of criticism and you lash out at my 8:10pm post. Actually, I’ve never known a journalist or writer that wasn’t hypersensitive. I’m not criticizing your effort or your “quotes.” But, Smoltz saying he’s disappointed in the track record…I mean, really? Candor? Wow, I must have different expectations.
Please don’t call me “chief.” I didn’t belittle you nor was I condescending. I’m not talking music and I’m not criticizing Johnny Cash, heaven forbid.
Maybe since you haven’t been on the Braves bandwagon since ‘91…the 80’s…the 70’s…this is different for you than it is for me (and others). Seriously. That’s not breaking news, is it?
I’m sorry, but neither is Smoltz saying that everything changed from ‘96 on (Atlanta fans have felt it quite tangibly since that Wohlers breaking ball). Braves fans know this…I’m quite confident that’s been mentioned before ad infinitum. If you’re surprised that the return trip to Cleveland stirs up nostalgia…fine. But postseason disappointment IS the Braves franchise since ‘91. You don’t play for division titles. 1 out of 14 isn’t good. You don’t have to be smarter than a 5th grader to know this. It’s an abysmal percentage.
What would you expect Smoltz to say? “Yeah, great job? We’re a dynasty.” Um….an NL dynasty, yes.
My main point, DOB: I really don’t know how long you’ve been covering the Braves. He’s disappointed in not winning more than 1 out of 14. Okay. So is every person who is a Braves fan who has been alive since ‘91. It has nothing to do with me saying it or Smoltz saying it. Geez.
Writers. Sheesh.
This is not personal. So, please don’t fall prey to the temptation to make it so. I didn’t talk about 13 disappointments first…Braves Nation has been there, done that…plenty. That’s all. I will find the quotes, if that is what is your issue.
I mean, come on…save the “chief” for the Roberts of this world.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 1:31 AM | Link to this
“Put me in coach, I’m ready to blog” … that little plagiarist! I was saving it for Father’s Day … remember my telling you of my computer problems … methinks it t’warn’t no Trojan Horse, ‘twas my exfriend Jimmy Smith!
David O’B, that’s unbeatable, top drawer stuff so it’s understandable that the temptation was just too much … you go ahead and give him the recognition … see if I care! All I ask is that you just remember whose idea it really was … fair’s fair!
By Chop Chop
June 16, 2007 1:31 AM | Link to this
Might wanna fix that typo, DOB.
I’ve been thinking about T-shirt slogans, but it seems like the AJC kinda killed the buzz for the slogans when they took the idea seriously. Before that, it seemed like it was under ground. Seemed like the thing to do before “The Man” shone a light on it.
That being said, I’d buy a shirt that said “Strap on the leotard, Hoss!” and mentioned you and the blog on the back. There are too many funny ideas that have been posted here for the AJC to go with bland ones that could be on any other stinkin’ T-shirt.
By Coach (NOT DRINKING THE KOOL AID)
June 16, 2007 1:39 AM | Link to this
Good job , Bobby Cox. Putting Wickman right back in the saddle. Nine times out of ten the veteran closer will get it done. I just hope that if and when he blows another one it’s not when Hudson starts the game. Escobar leading off ? interesting , but I think KJ just got the night off. Buddy throws pretty good junk , not bad for a guy who has knocked around the minors and Japan for eleven seasons.At least , he knows how to pitch effectively.
By The Truth Hurts
June 16, 2007 1:52 AM | Link to this
Gosh, for all the numbers nerds on here, I’m surprised Wicky’s don’t measure up over the last year (even w/ the injury and last night’s blown save).
What is the measure of success in this town, anyway? No wonder no one shows up for playoff games.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 1:53 AM | Link to this
Of course you play for division titles … and if you fail, you hope your record is good enough to make the playoffs knowing that you failed.
If you’re lucky enough to get in the playoffs, you try to win each of those mini-series too!
Assuming playoff teams of equal strength, methinks the most likely number of World Series wins in 14 tries is one … but ask Shaun, it was his birthday we were celebrating, and he’s the resident stat guru.
Regardless, methinks a player’s innermost feelings are best left private, if only because of the impossiblity of truly expressing one’s innermost feelings so that they’re understood and appreciated by others … such things just don’t properly translate.
By BravesDave
June 16, 2007 1:57 AM | Link to this
Hey parks, what part of my theory is laughable? The last three seasons, Andruw has hit no higher than .263. This season he is hitting .215 and is one pace for 26 HRs and 100 RBIs. Awful numbers to be sure, but his defense is impecable. In addition, he has hit .251 and .231 in prior full seasons. No one would expect Andruw to hit .320. We would expect him to drive in 100 runs and he most likely will. He also will not hurt us on defense.
CONTINUED….
By Coach (NOT DRINKING THE KOOL AID)
June 16, 2007 1:58 AM | Link to this
the flip side , Cox has hit Andruw in the cleanup spot all month. AJ is 10 for 60 with 3 HR 6 RBI 5 RUNS 6 BB 11 K’s and a .166 batting Average. That’s called professional suicide by most , Bobby calls it covering for his players. What does the blog think ?
By BravesDave
June 16, 2007 2:04 AM | Link to this
McCann is on pace to hit under .270 with 10 HRs and 71 RBIs. He hit 24 HRs and drove in 93 last season. In addition, his OBP is down 50 points this season and his strikeout total is higher. His slugging % is down over 150 points. He also has a .980 fielding %, which is downright disgusting. He leads the team with 7 errors.
By BravesDave
June 16, 2007 2:07 AM | Link to this
I am not comparing McCann to other catchers, I am comparing him to himself. Comparing him to other catchers is pointless, because as Braves fans we felt we had the best catcher in the NL and he is not performing like it this season to date. I am also comparing Andruw to himself. His average is abysmal, but he has never been a high average hitter. If he is still on pace to drive in 100, he is meeting some expectations. Look, they are both having weak seasons, I am just pointing out that McCann not being the McCann we expected is certainly affecting this offense (and defense).
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 2:07 AM | Link to this
Chop Chop: “Might wanna fix that typo, DOB.”
Thanks for the specifics. I’ll just go over all of the thousands of words I wrote today until I find it…
By The Truth Hurts
June 16, 2007 2:09 AM | Link to this
Bob, don’t be sensitive, but youthinks wrong. 1 for 14 is NOT good. Ever. Ecstatic over ‘95, absolutely. But crushed b/c those 13 chances are gone and nothing more was gained. Except a funny little banner at Turner.
Playoff teams of equal strength? When does that occur? The Yankees were just lucky? Florida is 2 for 2 in 10 years. Rebuilt after the ‘97 firesale and winners again in ‘03. Lucky? Nope.
Smoltz’s feelings don’t translate? Huh?
Justice was right. He’ll always be right. Glavine and Maddux have talked about the disappoinment in any one of a number of televised interviews they’ve done over the years. Chipper, too. Those translated just fine.
What other feelings are there for 1 for 14? Glee? Satisfaction? Contentment?
The Marlins have a 14 year history and have 2 world titles. Toronto was 2 for 2 in ‘92-‘93.
Cox mismanaged in many of those series’, but the responsibility is on the players who throw, catch, hit, and run.
By Chiefknockahoma
June 16, 2007 2:20 AM | Link to this
Johnny R. You are a ignorant and a disgrace to the human race.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 2:22 AM | Link to this
Nathan, it could be that he’s stubborn like our centerfielder … and his behavior could be manufactured for effect, like that of some of our bloggers … that’s not to say that he’s finding favor behind closed doors, in the friendly confines or on the road.
You’ll notice that, while there was some show of team support … the Cub reaction to what transpired at the Ted was mild. It’s complex but we’ll most likely never really know the extent to which that was related to the player in question being Alphonso Soriano, a cheap hotdog, ready for serving. Well, cheap is a relative term and a matter of perception …
Think I’ll listen to a bit of the WGST replay … given that we won!
By BravesDave
June 16, 2007 2:29 AM | Link to this
Other catchers around the majors:
Victor Martinez .330 w/ 13 HRs and 57 RBIs Bengie Molina .302 w/ 6 HRs and 33 RBIs Jason Varitek .269 w/ 7 HRs and 31 RBIs Jorge Posada .351 w/ 8 HRs and 41 RBIs Ivan Rodriguez .293 w/ 6 HRs and 34 RBIs Kenji Johjima .328 w/ 7 HRs and 27 RBIs John Buck .271 w/ 10 HRs and 21 RBIs Miguel Olivo .236 w/ 5 HRs and 31 RBIs Johnny Estrada .294 w/ 6 HRs and 22 RBIs Russell Martin .288 w/ 7 HRs and 41 RBIs Mike Napoli .253 w/ 7 HRs and 24 RBIs Paul LoDuca .299 w/ 3 HRs and 17 RBIs Michael Barrett .247 w/ 9 HRs and 28 RBIs
McCann is middle-of-the-pack this season.
By Wayne in Utah
June 16, 2007 2:34 AM | Link to this
Nate I know it’s probably to late to respond. I think we will have to agree to slightly disagree. I still don’t think you can hold a pitcher any more guilty when he actually does what he is supposed to do, but the particulars do not produce good results; and the other guy who strikes out 2-3 guys, but gives up a dinger. They definitely got to HIM, and not to the team. Can’t blame the dinger on anybody but the pitcher, whereas on Wickman’s behalf, he probably pitched not appreciably different than most of his performances. I don’t think you can ask the pitcher to throw it to where the batter hits it to only the 75% of the infield where a guy is able to get to it. (does 75% sound like a reasonable percentage of the infield that can be covered?).
Anyway, it is your birthday tomorrow???? (actually, today now) Just wondering, since everybody seems to be a June baby.
Talk with you soon.
It feels good to win, huh!
By Wayne in Utah
June 16, 2007 2:40 AM | Link to this
Anybody’s question: We know that BC is a players manager, so we know he is not going to make drastic changes to try to shake things up. Do you think that by continuing to bat AJ fourth, he thinks that if he doesn’t, AJ might NEVER come out of his funk. Is this his way of using positive psychology on AJ to get him out of this funk. “AJ, you are my man, I know you can do it” kind of thing?
Just thought I would throw that out for comment. I think that is the case, but darn it, I am a strict disciplinarian, and sometimes I think a swift kick in the keister is good motivation. Maybe AJ has been spoiled too much over the past 10 years, and it’s too late to change him any other way than to “love” him back to productivity.
I will defer to tomorrow to check for responses.
Gonna go out and watch my tomatoes grow tomorrow!
By Wayne in Utah
June 16, 2007 2:43 AM | Link to this
Nate’s idea of “one to the temple” might be a bit drastic. I would definitely confine it to “under the chin” myself.
Nite all.
By Chop Chop
June 16, 2007 2:53 AM | Link to this
Hahahaha, DOB. I wasn’t being a jerk. I just meant the typo in the first sentence of the fourth paragraph of your 12:27 post. That’s all, dude. If you read it, you’ll know what I’m talking about. I was just watching out for ya…what with all them prudes in here…
By Chop Chop
June 16, 2007 2:58 AM | Link to this
12:27 A.M., that is.
And it’s almost 3 a.m. and I’ve sobered up…I’ll sleep when I’m dead…yeehaw!
By Bravo Nam
June 16, 2007 3:09 AM | Link to this
Robert & JohnnyR
Boys, boys, boys. If you don’t like the blog (and methinks you don’t particualry like the Braves that much either- just a couple of Mutts enamored with the sound of your own voices), get outta here and don’t come back! Both of you are tools, no doubt about it.
Wickman as closer
Despite the theatrics, tears and gnashing of teeth, Wickman has done a very good job since coming to the Big A as a closer. Yes, he could lose some more weight and yes it would be nice if he made things a little less interesting, but overall he has gotten the job done. Good thing Cox knows a bit more than the rest of you think you do, coz it would be asinine to move Wickman out of the closer’s role unless he sprials towards Reitsma proportions. Yes, Soriano is a better pitcher…but the man can both set-up and close…Wickman is only suited as a closer at this juncture…the man has been doing it for years, and to move him back to set-up and Soriano into closer not only would dent his confidence, but also cause chemistry problems in the bullpen (next year may be the year Soriano closes, we’ll see).
Sure lot of bloody whingers here
If I didn’t know better, I’d think half of this blog is made up of whinging Poms. Some of you dudes need to grow up and get a life…we are SOOO lucky to be Braves’ fans, having a CHANCE every year to go to the big show…stop piss*ing on the players and Cox every time things don’t go your way, coz at the moment it’s you guys who are pathetic…and I promise, if you can show a little restraint, DOB might let you have your teddy bears back!
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 3:26 AM | Link to this
The Truth Hurts, you know I’m not insensitive to the feelings of others … and also know better than to think that I carry my feelings on my shoulder … or so I hope.
I wasn’t suggesting that 1 for 14 was good, only making an observation that I think it is the most likely outcome, given teams of equal strength … an obvious oversimplification not representing reality. However, I consider that less inane than suggesting 1:14 to always be unacceptable; regardless of circumstance.
Most players on the winning team are happy and most who do not win are disappointed. Chrushed when, in their mind’s eye, they should have, and expected to win, and failed to so do … probably!
However, if all one takes from a season is disappointment that they failed to win the world series … then they are indeed a losers and deserve their fate.
And, methinks that if all they take from a season is self gradification because they won a ring … then they are still a loser.
We seemingly have different perspectives but I find it difficult to imagine that luck is not involved in determining the outcome of most games … so too is skill.
I wasn’t suggesting that you couldn’t get a directional idea of what someone was feeling when they attempt to express those feelings … only that I thought it best to leave such things private … for many reasons situation specific reasons … including the fact that it is impossible to convey deep felt feelings with words. Again, we may have a different perspective, but that’s what I was attempting to opine … cause that’s what I think.
As an aside, what one felt when an event occurred and what I recalls feeling are different animals.
I would humbly suggest that one must know the original text before one can evaluate the translation.
I can certainly understand reflection on missed opportunities … but each situation must be considered on it own and … evaluating the experiences from purely a won/loss ratio perspective somehow seem trite.
Make no mistake, John wasn’t being trite … David’s reporting certainly wasn’t being trite … but our preoccupation with evaluating what transpired during that 14 year run; from my perspective … definitely is!
Goodnight Miss Allen …
By Running Circles
June 16, 2007 3:38 AM | Link to this
Wow, you guys are BRUTAL. I mean, Druw is NOT ever going to hit .300. Hell, he’s not ever going to hit .280! But we ALL knew that going into the season. He also lets some things get to him. You can almost HEAR it in his comments, that he doesn’t WANT anything to do with leaving Atlanta. He LOVES it here, and, in the end, don’t be surprised if he does something like he did in the last contract negotiations, and gives us a pretty decent hometown discount. I mean, the guy BYPASSED the great Scott Boras last time, so that his FATHER could negotiate his contract. As soon as the season ended last year, he was all about talking how he was NOT giving a hometown discount, he’s EARNED this contract, and since it will be his LAST big one, he’s going to take it, wherever it may be. But EVERY time I hear or see him talking about it now, his tone seems to have really changed, as he ALWAYS makes sure to state that he WANTS to stay in Atlanta, no matter what. I would just absolutely LOVE to hear he resigned with us TOMORROW. I’m almost POSITIVE his numbers would skyrocket. Plays HELLA defense, drives in 100, with 30 bombs, year in, and year out, yet the whole fan base is ready to give him his walking papers. Tough crowd.
As far as Cox is concerned, he’s as good as it gets. I KNOW Braves baseball, I’m sure alot of you guys do. Can’t everybody SEE that this team is ABOUT to go on a roll. Cox is FINALLY finding ALL of his pieces to the puzzle, and where they fit best. IF Chuck continues to do as he has, which is produce quality starts, and Buddy can continue to keep us in the games he pitches, we’ve got the end of the rotation solidified. If we could somehow find a TRUE number 3 starter, without having to give up Salty OR Escobar, this could be a magical season. I really think the KEYS to this season will be Tyler Yates AND whether or not we can find a #3 starter, and one that will be effective. Unless somehow Chuckie and Buddy can become solid #3 and #4 starters, which would allow Kyle to be the #5 he’s DESTINED to be.
Anyway, Cox is very close to finding the right way to piece together this team, and, once he does, this TEAM, with it’s starting pitching, bullpen, AND offense can really go on some kind of run.
By Michael Procton
June 16, 2007 3:48 AM | Link to this
OK…from a mathematical standpoint, we should have stood to win 1.75 WSes during our run, and unfortunately, someone wrested our 3/4 of a share and added it to theirs. Still, the 1 is better than none, as is the 14.
Nobody’s mentioned this, but Soriano’s been quoted on several occasions as wanting to either close or start next year, and I think that second option don’t sound half bad. 90 of his 99 minor league games were as a starter, and his numbers were equally sick. Among all levels, up to AAA: Sub-3 ERA, sub 1.10 WHIP, 1+ K/IP. I know it only seems like he’s got that one pitch he uses on a regular basis, and stamina could be an issue, but it’s an interesting thought, because he’s got amazing stuff, and the mentality to go with it…unlike some other pitchers of ours from the Dominican (see: Sosa, Jorge.)
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 4:01 AM | Link to this
Sincere apologies to The Truth Hurts and others … the painful truth is that my previous post was sloppy and contained numerous errors; the most consequential being …
I thought it best to leave such things private … for many situation specific reasons … including the fact that it is impossible to adequately/properly convey deep felt feelings with words.
and …
what one felt when an event occurred and what one recalls feeling are different animals.
and …
our preoccupation with evaluating what transpired during that 14 year run in terms of the number of World Series titles, regardless of number; from my perspective … definitely is!
I even have trouble adequately expressing myself when just writing casual comments for the Blog … but, when they represent my deep feelings … forget it, it’s impossible, at least for me!
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 4:13 AM | Link to this
Michael, it’s much ado but I wasn’t looking at the expected value.
As memory serves, and it’s been some time since quickly putting the pencil thereto, the distribution of expected outcomes does reflect a slightly higher probabity for 1 than any of the other possible outcomes … again, as memory serves.
By serbok
June 16, 2007 4:35 AM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah, Bob, Journalist I just wanted to thank you guys for last nights?(yesterday mornings?) Posts~ I just kinda want to apologize (a Lil’) I had a good buzz going on? And sorta put my nose into Wayne’s business, where today I dont think (my nose) belonged. I didnt even know what led Wayne to * post: Maybe I just won’t post anymore here, but that statement sorta triggered me into action? LOL I enjoy your posts Wayne as well as Your’s, Bob, Journalist. Loved your response Bob about that sounds more like an agenda
I like to enjoy something that I once heard of as “automatic writing” So I really didnt have anything in mind when I wrote those posts, other than N8 feelings? (this time N8 being innate?) LOL innyway~ Wayne I do enjoy your posts~ most of the time? :o) And Bob, You are quite the perceptive Braves fan:o) Keep posting till we Win the wild card~ or A BIG maybe the division! Great Win tonight huh?
By serbok
June 16, 2007 4:41 AM | Link to this
DOB Excellent blog, one of the best I’ve read that you have written. Must be cool to talk to Smoltzie, about his perceptions of the braves run over the Braves unmatchable run to playoff history. And later 2day~ Mr. Smoltz gets game 2 of our winning streak in gear ;O)
By Caleb
June 16, 2007 5:36 AM | Link to this
Like I said the other night, I’ll definitely take winning 1 out of 2 games against those lefties. I think the Braves would (will) be a good post-season team this year because they seem to play up (or down) to their opponents. If we can just win enough against the teams like the Nationals to get to the post-season, I think we have a good shot.
Johnny R is an idiot (sure is nice to practice that free speech!).
By serbok
June 16, 2007 5:56 AM | Link to this
Bobby is the reason this team is NOT in first place right now! I know you guys despise ROBERT However~ if he knew how to communicate as opposed to incite? You would take him more seriously, I am NOT A ROBERT I DO However agree with most of what he says! There was a post earlier, that I appreciated very much, somethin about Bobby tryin to fit the pieces 2gether? Alas, I can’t swallow that~ It would be too much of a miracle, given Bobby’s Track record:o( Fact of the matter here is There seems to be A great many fan’s on this blog who are finally waking up! COX is the major problem on this team! He just doesnt know how to manage a ballgame!!!!!! Set a lineup. I’ve said this b4~ BOBBY WATCHES A GREAT GAME!
By Braveheart
June 16, 2007 7:31 AM | Link to this
The Magic Number is 99!
By TheCutMan
June 16, 2007 7:48 AM | Link to this
That’s some good journalism in getting the comments out of Smoltz that you did, O’Brien. Good job.
By jerry
June 16, 2007 7:49 AM | Link to this
Cox is not the only reason for their failures. The owners, GM, and Cox are because they just did not do what was neccessary to win it all. The one time they did win it all they were facing a team that has never done what it takes to win it all.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 7:57 AM | Link to this
” still don’t know who could manage around those numbers. Anyone but Cox, I guess”
That aint the way to look at it. Consider instead that, if the players had been used properly, their numbers wouldve been better
For example, not letting Maddux start the eighth in game one
Bobby trying to ffit the pieces together - When I think of that, I imagine him sitting in a diaper, chewing on one of the pieces of one of those big 4 piece puzzles, TRYING to make it fit, while drooling it into oblivion
By Jeff R
June 16, 2007 8:05 AM | Link to this
The past is the past. Beating the Yankees in ‘96 would have been sweet, but what about ‘07 and beyond? It’s about winning now and positioning this franchise to be successful, year in and year out. I’m more interested in knowing if Liberty Media will open its check book (even a bit more) to buck up the starting pitching (in the 2nd half and next season).
By jerry
June 16, 2007 8:09 AM | Link to this
DOB: If you really believe that excuse that you used for Cox’s failure to replace Salty in the 9th I would suggest that if you ever confront what you think is shinola that you avoid it or you could be surprised.
By Richard Cory
June 16, 2007 8:10 AM | Link to this
DOB—Did you really mean to call it a “t-sh#t thing”. If so, words well spoken. :]]
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 8:34 AM | Link to this
I agree that we should stop responding to Robert’s attention-seeking tirades, but in all fairness we should take turns going out to the home and visiting him. Don’t go when Judge Waupner is on, though.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 8:45 AM | Link to this
Paladin, Robert is at home? I thought he was in a cell with Paris Hilton.
By Gil in Mechanicsville
June 16, 2007 8:59 AM | Link to this
Mornin’ ya’ll…. Happy birthday Nate
The apparent decline in McCann’s numbers might have more to do with his youth than anything else. A lot of folks seem to forget that other than Chipper and Smoltz and select others this is a very, very young ball club.
Most kid’s their age are still playing AA ball and learning the ropes. Tough crowd when 100% perfection is expected from a bunch of rookies. Not saying I don’t wish for them to be successful, just that I am a realist.
We become very spoiled by repeated success perhaps to the point our expectations become unrealistic.
Now, if we can just get through June this season with out a major melt down we have a real shot at our division. Too bad I will not get to see today’s game. I am sure it will be the Mutts and the Stankees in my market.
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 9:01 AM | Link to this
No, Bob, I meant the home, not his home. As for being in a cell with Paris Hilton—throwme in that briarpatch!
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:10 AM | Link to this
Serbok, while I’m not always sure that we all dance to a different drummer … I do think that we are all unique, that for sure. The main thing is to keep dancing … in a way that makes our families, close and extended, proud.
I too found those exchanges interesting and enjoyed at least some of them since I’m always looking for the why rather than the what … and you certainly got my attention.
I’m also relatively sure that you know I don’t usually engage just for the sake of engaging … except for my occasional futile attempts at humor.
Good healthy exchanges are what makes life interesting here in the neighborhood; just so long as reasonable rules of properiety are observed … and just about everybody knows how I feel about that.
The perceptive part is a bit much but you’re right about my being a real Braves fan … folks have been smoking that in their pipe for a long time! Those kids are my heroes, most each and every one … though I have my favorites, that’s for sure. I know that sounds like corny, idle rhetoric … maybe it is idol rhetoric, I don’t know … but, can you imagine giving your best and then being harshly criticized and ridiculed for each and every misstep … or failure to meet fan expectations?! Goodness! Like I said, they’re heroes, each and every one!
I can understand and actively share in the frustration but the harshness is beyond my level of comprehension; hard as I might look for the “why” for such rhetoric and behavior.
It’s no secret that my background is technical and my education limited to the mathematics arena with emphasis on probability and statistics … so it may seem strange and a bit pretentious for me to say that I feel privileged to engage folks on different subjects and gain from theiir insights. I’ve honestly found that I can learn from just about anybody if I’ll just take the time and make the effort … and that’s what it’s all about.
I know that I’m sometimes arrogant and abrasive but it’s seldom intentional … probably a byproduct of my lifelong technical problem solving activities where providing solutions required a certain amount of assertiveness together with separation of Church and State … or rather fact and feeling.
Ego too … I grew up feeling that I was right in my thinking; at least to the Ivory Soap purity level … and that when people disagreed, it was not because I was wrong but because they just didn’t understand what I was trying to say. That was close to being true but the primary reason they didn’t understand was because I didn’t know how to properly explain.
It seemed like an eternity, but it really didn’t take very long to come to the realization that I wasn’t infallible … certainly not as long as it took to figure out how to keep that fact a secret.
The real secret to that is actually very simple … keep your mouth shut and smile a lot. The smiling came easy … but I gave up on the other part and finally decided that since God only saw fit to make me smart enough to realize that I didn’t have all the answers, I’d best take the hint and start listening to others who might.
I found that I have three ears, two that hear the “what” and one that’s always listening out for the “why” … methinks that if I can hear the why, then a few missed “whats” ain’t gonna matter much. Of course, on the Blog, I use my three eyes instead.
Most everybody has a reason for saying what they say … and behaving as they they do. Concentrate on the “why”, rather than the “what” … and you’ll understand the person … that’s the key! I’m proof that it doesn’t take natural talent, just being more like Avis than like Hertz!
I’ll let you decide what I’m trying to say … and why. I gave up trying to figure me out long, long ago … but, to the extent that I’m perceptive, I think about that’s it.
Thanks for listening!
Time for eggs, coffee, bacon … and, the hot tub!
By 59bulldawg
June 16, 2007 9:16 AM | Link to this
Smoltz has the heart of a champion. He’ll never ever give it anything less than his best and he knows what should have been! That’s why Braves fan love and appreciate him so much. Atlanta fans should treasure and enjoy each one of his starts because we’ll be able to say to our grandkids someday, “Yeah I saw THE MAN pitch and he was great!” Yeah I’m disappointed in that we’ve not won more World Series titles than we have but having Smoltz as one of our own somehow eases that pain. If any one person personifies the accomplishments of the team since 1991 it’s John Smoltz and shame on the Braves if after he retires there’s not a statue in his honor at Turner Field.
By Jason
June 16, 2007 9:18 AM | Link to this
I wanna be in a cell with Paris Hilton too.
By Vonshawn
June 16, 2007 9:18 AM | Link to this
Andruw and Franceour batting back to back is like the baseball version of the movie “Dumb and Dumber”.
Jeff will come through more often than Andruw and should bat higher in the lineup, but Cox HAS to put Druw somewhere near the bottom (7th?) so that he can stop killing rallies.
By Tomahawkin' Again
June 16, 2007 9:19 AM | Link to this
That ‘96 World Series against the Yanks remains the one for me, the one that still causes me to mutter expletives in disgust. In retrospect, it almost takes away from winning against the Indians the year before because of being up 2-0 in the series (plus the lingering effects of us winning the World Series in the post strike year of ‘95). Good God, never mind the infamous 3-2 slider by Wohlers, think back to those last 3 games of the ‘96 WS: up 6-0 in gm 4, an umpire getting in the way of Klesko making a key out that instead started that Yanks rally, TP hitting a potential gm-tying double that is caught against the fence in the 10th inn; gm 5, the only run scored in a typical 1-0 Braves of the ’90s postseason by NY is unearned, in the 9th, a gimpy Paul O’Neill catching Polonia’s double in deep right center (why was he even shading him that way & playing him so deep?!?) that would have scored 2 runs & won it for us in the last game ever played in Fulton-County Stadium; gm 6, Braves having Mr. October, Lenke, up in the 9th with the game-tying run on 3rd and popping up. Man, oh man, the Braves had outscored NY 16-1 in the 1st 2 games (after outscoring St. Louis 32-1 to win the last 3 gms of the NLCS). Just brutal and then yes, Smoltzie is right, it all was never the same. The failure to win the World Series each October simply overwhelmed the glorious regular seasons this team had (5 years of winning 100+ games in ‘97-99 & ‘02-03, beating the Muts in the ‘99 LCS, which remains my all-time, non 1991-92, playoff triumph). Would not trade any of that however, because the good times outweigh the bad for this Braves fan, but it still stinks thinking back to ‘96. Liberty Media, please let JS spend some money this summer because I want to experience that rush one more time come October. Go Braves!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 9:23 AM | Link to this
Paladin,
I know, thats what I mean too. I think if I were in the same cell as Paris, I would not be fantasizing about Bobby Cox and Donkeys 24/7.
By CMC
June 16, 2007 9:36 AM | Link to this
DOB,
You are correct in that Salty and Escobar are special talents. They appear to have the same qualities that we saw in Chipper, Javy, Klesko, Justice when they arrived in the big leagues and evolved into key pieces of the puzzle. I just hope that JS allows them to play out their enormous potential in Atlanta. The way I see it, there is absolutely no #3 starter in the market worth either of these guys and what they bring to the table.
As for McCann, it appears that his production - offensive and defensive - has declined dramatically since the finger injury earlier this year. The recent ankle injury can’t help, either. Wouldn’t it make sense for him to go on the 15-day DL, get well, and then gear up for a strong second half as you mentioned earlier? He certainly isn’t going to get well soon crouching behind the plate 5 nights a week.
Finally, have you checked out Tim McGraw’s new album? Track #5 is a re-make of Eddie Rabbitt’s “Suspicions” from years past. Great tune, and McGraw nails it. Check it out!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 9:41 AM | Link to this
Just noticed this:
By P-Town Brave June 15, 2007 7:36 PM | Link to this Hey DOB, dudn’t you see the Giants game about a week ago
REPLY: How is what the Giant did relevent to what Bobby Cox does in similar situation? Let me make it clear, I wasn’t at all suggesting that Cox SHOULD follow the always-safe strategy and not take Salty out of the game in the ninth because it might possibly leave him without a proven catcher in extra innings. Was simply stating that’s what he WOULD likely do because it’s what he’s always done and it’s how he approaches it, hence his reasoning for many years of adding an extra catcher for the postseason roster.
Again, not saying it’s what I’d do at all (I wouldn’t, in either instance, but that’s irrelevent because I’m not the manager).
So when you cite an example of what another manager did in this instance or that one, really, you don’t need to try to show me or others it can be done. I KNOW it can be. But I’m telling you that Cox is usually or always going to do it his way, and trying to explain his reasoning. NOT trying to say I agree, but trying to explain why he does things this way or that.
And NO, Pete Orr has never caught. Neither has Diaz, although Diaz at least did during extended spring to get experience in case ever needed in a bind.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 9:46 AM | Link to this
CMC, I don’t know because I have no idea how much he’s hurting. All I have to go on is what McCann says, and he says it’s not a big deal.
No, uh, haven’t checked out McGraw’s album. Sorry, not on my list. Not my cup of tea.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this
Hey obsessed weirdo, I’d rather not imagine the manager in a diaper. To each his own (he says, while silently wondering what accumulation of incidents could lead a seemingly sane person so far off track).
By Shaun
June 16, 2007 9:57 AM | Link to this
Robert,
Last blog you said the following:
Pythagorean computes won-lost based on run differential - doesnt account for individual games
Deviations from Pythagorean won-loss has more to do with whether you outscore a team by a little a lot of times vs outscore them by a lot a few times and lose by a little a lot of times
Any statistic that is used to show that Cox is a good manager is either the result of a flawed analysis, misinterpretation of date, or by having been taken out of context
It’s easy to see Bobby Cox’s impact on this team from 1993-2006 by noting how they consistantly underachieve in the playoffs, even when on multiple occasions they have had the best roster in baseball, sometimes far and away the best roster in baseball
Actually, Robert, the best and most talented teams often lose in the post-season in baseball. Because it happens as often as it does, I doubt it has much to do with the managers of all the teams it happens to. How long have you been a baseball fan and you don’t know fluky things can happen in a period of 5-7 games?
Is there any analysis that shows Cox is a bad or mediocre manager, besides your flawed logic of looking at only a handful of his games managed? If there is, I haven’t seen it. And you are the one making the outrageous claim, so I believe the burden of proof would be on you, if this were science.
And, finally, yes Pythagorean record is based on runs scored/allowed. But the idea is maybe Cox had something to do with the Braves outperforming their Pythagorean record. Maybe Cox could squeeze wins out of a run differential that didn’t show they should have that many by putting in players at the right time allowing them to score/prevent runs when it mattered instead of in blowouts.
You can’t see past a handful of Cox’s games to see even a possibility that Cox is what everyone except you say he is, a Hall-of-Fame manager.
By Da Homeboy Upstairs
June 16, 2007 10:01 AM | Link to this
Robert, stop blaming Donk. It is my fault. I never gave Donk the players he needed to win it all. I was always a day late and a dollar and a man too short.
Since 2000, it has been convenient for me to blame the corporate ownership. The truth is they put me in financial cuffs because I would spend millions and have no bench and no pen and we would never win as a result.
You blame Donk for putting Wohlers in too early in 1996 but blame Cox for leaving Maddux in too late in 1999. you like it both ways, anyway you like it, with the cake you’ve eaten too
The Yankees pen had names like Rivera, Nelson, Stanton, Mendoza, Grimsely. The Braves pen had Mulholland, Rocker, Springer, McGlinchey, Remlinger. Reading those names, it is funny how Torre would have more faith in his pen than Cox would. Also, Torre could go to Rivera for two innings a pop. 3 appearances, 4.7 innings, 2 saves, and a victory.
Perhaps, I should have made Donk force Smoltz to be a closer back then. Then, Donkey Kong could have trusted taking the ball out of HOFers to put the ball in the hand of another HOFer for 2 innings instead of the clowns I was always stocking his pen with. Nope, of course, I waited until it was too late. His HOF pitching brothers left, and then I decided to put him in the pen. Very bright! As dem Guiness boyz sez Brilliant!
The Yankees bench/platoon had Strawberry, Curtis, Posada, Girardi, Chili Davis, Sojo, Ledee, Leyritz. The Braves bench/platoon had Howard Battle, Jorge Fabregas, Guillen, Hernandez, Hunter, Weiss, Lockhart, Myers, Nixon, Perez. Stop blaming Donkey Kong. Look at those bench/platoon players compared to the Yankees. That is a joke. Donkey King was handicapped by the homeboy upstairs, who always forgot to complete his rosters.
On dey flipside, 1996. I gave Eeyore * the following pen: *Avery, Wohlers, Bielecki, Clontz, McMichael, Wade. Bob Watson gave his Yanks Rivera, Wetteland, Nelson, Lloyd, Weathers, Boehringer HA! HA! HA! What a cruel joke to play on Eeyore and have the Donk pitch those as@clowns. The Yanks pen pitches 24 innings and gives up 6 earned runs. The Braves pen pitches 11.7 innings and gives up 7 earned runs. Poor Eeyore. I never gave the donkerrific one a quality pen. But yet dunces like the Robot keep blaming Eeyore and leaving the homeboy upstairs, The Teflon john without an ounce of criticism.
The 1996 Yankees bench at different parts of the series featured Boggs, Strawberry, Leyritz, Charlie Hayes, Tino Martinez, Paul Oneill, Tim Raines, Mike Aldrete, Andy Fox. The Braves bench featured such crap as Polonia, Belliard, Klesko, Pendleton, Perez, Mordecai. Oh poor Donk, bless his sweet soul, been taking all that horsecrap from people for 10 years for my shortcomings in the 1996 and 1999 seasons. Heck, he has been taking the heat for me every season. Orr and Woodward and Langerhans? Like I was giving the team a chance at the beginning of 2007. What a bunch of suckers Braves fans are.
The funny thing is I have been convincing people for 10 years that the 1996 Braves were better than the 1996 Yankees. Even dopey Smoltz believes it. Just check out the rosters morons. I failed you then as I have failed you every year. If you just reviewed the rosters for the 2 teams, you would realize that you have been sucked into believing my propaganda for the past 17 years. I never learned how to complete a roster that won World Series titles.
BTW, tell Smoltzie that I sure as heck did not appreciate very much Smoltz letting Clemens sweep us in that 1999 Series game 4.
With regards and best wishes, The Homeboy Upstairs, a.k.a., The Teflon John
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 10:10 AM | Link to this
oh, the humanity! baby seal has submitted tee shirt ideas each day without success. pies, toes, yellow shoes, cheese, ham, dead monkeys … nothing has worked for baby seal. yes, perhaps a few have been disrespectful of the ajc - but hey, so was gene talmadge. then, baby seal saw the winning entry, “you down with dob?” and an epiphany occurred - baby seal’s slogan need not make blog sense. so, baby seal has prepared several new ideas and here is a sample: you be dob or you be down with dob or you be done.
baby seal is hopeful a winning slogan may emerge from these efforts.
and congratulations are in order for colby jessop for the slogan, “in blog we trust.”
journalist will get this old favorite out on the table for consideration - give me blog, or give me death. or the canadian tee shirt may read: the royal canadian mounties always get their blog. or the ugandan tee shirt: you down with idi amin? now, that is a serious tee shirt. can idi amin keep you down? oh, the humanity! cannabilism has reached the blog! now, there’s a tee shirt idea …
and what is in a canned ham can?
and now, baseball … wicky proved wicky’s mettle last night. struck out three batters. and how about that balk? nothing subtle there - avoiding the force so wicky could strike out the side. and whither carroll rogers? baby seal needs some more tee shirt ideas from a feminine perspective. remember the pink blog?
By N8
June 16, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this
Gil in Mechanicsville
“Mornin’ ya’ll…. Happy birthday Nate”
Thanks. But it’s not my Birthday. I’m not sure where that came from.
But, awfully kind of you, anyhow. :-)
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 10:28 AM | Link to this
DOB, you are letting this Robert guy play you like a finely tuned violin. Despite your litany of resolutions to stop responding to him, he continues to get more of your ink (pixels?) than any other blogger.
Push the “off” button, my friend. It won’t make him go away, but it might result in a 10% decrease in the quantity and length of his one-dimensional tomes. That is advice all of us might heed.
Besides, there are a couple of psychos who have shown up recently who are much more worthy of your attention.
By brent a.
June 16, 2007 10:37 AM | Link to this
What this team needs is to go out and knock the snot out of somebody, just once.
Get a big lead, and keep the hits and runs coming.
By BT
June 16, 2007 10:39 AM | Link to this
Tee Shirt idea:
Forget Robert DOB!
By Lee
June 16, 2007 10:44 AM | Link to this
What the Hell?!? in ESPN’s rumour central they list the braves as a team interested in adam dunn and willing to give up pitching in exchange for his services.
hmm. well, last i checked, LF seems to be one of our strengths and pitching one of our weak spots. but, hey, ESPN obviously knows what they are talking about, apparently it was originally posted on SI.com but i couldnt find it.
picture how awesome our lineup would be with andruw and dunn hitting 4 and 5!!!
do people actually get paid to write this stuff? if the braves had a scout at a reds game, i can guarantee it wasnt to scope adam dunn.
kinda nervous and curious what the next month will bring. my heart beats a little faster everytime i get to see yunel and salty play, if i lost that opportunity in the near future i would be kinda sad.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 10:48 AM | Link to this
Shaun, sometimes you frustrate me to no end, because frankly you’re stubborn (like me) and difficult to argue with (a credit to you, I’d have to concede).
But then sometimes you put things as succinctly as possible, hit the nail right on the head with your logic and reasoning. And you did with your last post, especially these perfect paragraphs directed at our odd serial poster:
“Actually, Robert, the best and most talented teams often lose in the post-season in baseball. Because it happens as often as it does, I doubt it has much to do with the managers of all the teams it happens to. How long have you been a baseball fan and you don’t know fluky things can happen in a period of 5-7 games?
“Is there any analysis that shows Cox is a bad or mediocre manager, besides your flawed logic of looking at only a handful of his games managed? If there is, I haven’t seen it. And you are the one making the outrageous claim, so I believe the burden of proof would be on you, if this were science.
“And, finally, yes Pythagorean record is based on runs scored/allowed. But the idea is maybe Cox had something to do with the Braves outperforming their Pythagorean record. Maybe Cox could squeeze wins out of a run differential that didn’t show they should have that many by putting in players at the right time allowing them to score/prevent runs when it mattered instead of in blowouts.
“You can’t see past a handful of Cox’s games to see even a possibility that Cox is what everyone except you say he is, a Hall-of-Fame manager.”
Bravo, Shaun.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 10:52 AM | Link to this
Lee, in case you’ve not noticed, that rumor central thing is completely wrong about 9 out of 10 times. any rumor floated anywhere by anyone, from blogger to beat writer and everything between, is fair game for them to pluck and throw up there without sourcing and, as you noted, without logic.
By TheCutMan
June 16, 2007 10:52 AM | Link to this
Has anyone noticed what a pleasant surprise Buddy Carlyle is turning out to be? He’s had some tough luck go against him but overall, a pretty solid performer since he first emerged in a Braves uniform.
Last night’s game is a good case in point, what with all those dying quail type hits that fell in along with an Escobar boot in the early part of the game. That’s pitching in a bit of bad luck.
Carlyle just puts his head down, throws hard, is always around the plate and for now, seems to be the best of the rest after Smoltzie and Hudson.
Keep it up Buddy!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 10:56 AM | Link to this
Braves seriously need a win tonight, because the ‘ol Davies vs. Fausto Carmona matchup tomorrow looks ugly for the Bravos. For some idea what I mean:
Davies’ last 10 road starts: 3-6, 8.20 ERA.
Carmona’s last four home: 3-0, 2.08 ERA.
By joebrave
June 16, 2007 11:06 AM | Link to this
Guesssss who’s here,Afternoon,to wayne in Ut,Lew,SJA,DOB,etal,been a few days taking care of the auto crashes,sit down,this morning to rad the blog,and what do I see,A couple of $marta$$,knuckleheads,Now mind you DOB has got on me a few times in the past,even gave me the boot for awhile,but that never dhanged my respect for the man,He is adamn great Beat reporter,keeps us informed and has very insightful views on things as they pertain to the Team.So here goes my shout out to Johnny R and Robot the $hithead,look you little pi$$ant androids,if you Illiterate inbreds could do a better job Than DOB or Cox,don’t you think somebody would have noticed and gave you a better job than the one’s you have at Booger King, Your inane babbling is getting you nowher fast,noone here respects you,nor even cares what you have to say,so Here is an idea put up your keyboards,and go finger FK yourselves and quit Rambling incoherently here with your ignorant inuendos that Cox is a poor Manager,The real Problem has been J.Schuerholz,and continues to be….
By CMC
June 16, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this
DOB,
I stated earlier that I didn’t think Salty or Escobar EITHER warranted a #3 starter, straight up in a trade. Too much upside for both, and a #3 starter contributes once weekly in a 5-man rotation. These guys can make a difference on a daily basis. Plus, a #3 can be inconsistent, as we have seen this year with Chuck James. If Salty and Escobar were still in the minors and had not showcased their potential on the big stage already, I may feel differently. But you never know how things will play out. I remember when the Braves parted with Melvin Nieves in the McGriff trade. I was afraid Nieves would someday be a star for someone else - although we know McGriff was a steal at any cost with what he brought to Atlanta - but it never panned out. Same for Capellan and Marte. Your thoughts?
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 11:10 AM | Link to this
And for a couple of folks here who’ve said Harris should be the every-day LF:
Matt Diaz has only hit .400 (36-for-90) since May 5. Where do you propose he play if Harris plays every day? (never mind that Harris is absolutely thriiving in his platoon role facing almost exclusively righties, and the arrangement seems to be working perfectly).
By Joe Fan
June 16, 2007 11:11 AM | Link to this
How long will Diaz have to hit over .300 before he becomes nationally know, or a star even? And do you think outfield next year could be Diaz (LF) Harris (CF) Francouer (RF)?
By CMC
June 16, 2007 11:12 AM | Link to this
DOB,
I once had a traveling job, and it was always cool to discover the best food in each town. What does Cleveland have to offer? Never heard of its cuisine of choice. Did you try any walleye in Minneapolis while you were there?
By Jim
June 16, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this
I take issue with the “conventional wisdom” on this blog (not to mention Robert’s obsessive ranting) that Bobby Cox’s managerial decisions cost us opportunities to win more than 1 WS. What decisions are we talking about? Not making Smoltz and Avery the 1-2 pitchers in 91 - 95? Avery started game 6 and Smoltz game 7 in 91 (after we were up 3 games to 2) and Smoltz and Avery pitched in game 7 of the Cabrerra-Bream playoff win in ‘92. BTW Glavine outpitched Morris in game 1 of the 92 WS and it was Glavine who beat Cleveland 1-0 in ‘95.
Pitching Liebrandt in the 11th inning of game 6 in ‘91? Liebrandt was a 14 game winner in ‘91 and we would not have been in the series without his contribution during the season. By the 11th inning we had already been through the back end of the bullpen, so who else do you pitch?
Bringing in Wohlers to get a 2 inning save in game 4 of ‘96? Occaisionally a closer is asked to get a 2-(or more in the days of Fingers and Sutter)inning save. Every manager has done it, and it was not a mistake for Cox to do it here. (It was in the first inning of relief, not the 2nd that Wohlers gave up the HR to Leyritz).
Letting Maddux start the 8th inning in ‘99? If Cox had removed him for somebody in the pen who would then give up the lead, imagine the fodder for criticism that would have generated. Leaving Maddux in to start the 8th may or may not have been the right decision at that point, but it was not a bad decision, and it was a decision that many other managers would have made given the same situation. Besides, the ‘99 team played above itself to get to the WS and had little chance against one of the best Yankee teams of that era. In ‘99 we lost Galarraga to cancer and Javy to a knee injury and Smoltz was pitching side arm and throwing knuckleballs to preserve his elbow (that went the next spring).
Starting Hampton in game 5 against Houston instead of Smoltz? Come on!! Smoltz was in the bullpen in a short relief role all year long. Unlike a long reliever such as Oscar V. he could not have been asked to start game 5 of the playoffs with that kind of preparation. Besides, to undercut Hampton in that kind of spot would be to go against the managerial style that makes Cox so respected by his players. Hampton was the best option we had in that situation, maybe Houston just had a better team.
Cox is a great manager, not a great strategist, but he is more the reason that we got to 14 consecutive playoffs than he is the reason that we didn’t win more!!
It is interesting to note that Robert’s short list of mgrs. who are worse than Cox includes Bobby Valentine — a very innovative strategist who did not relate well to his players, but then consistency, objectivity, and logic are not part of his thought process.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 11:25 AM | Link to this
CMC, yes, I had the pan-fried walleye in Minneapolis. Quite tasty.
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 11:29 AM | Link to this
CMC, I’m with you - - maybe even stronger.
Six weeks ago there was a flurry of ideas about which pitchers we could get for Salty, etc. I felt in a minority when I said never, never, never, ever trade Salty - - not for ANYone.
I felt so strongly about it that I created a macro so I could post the same thing everyday.
Now, as I see more and more bloggers digging in against trading him, I feel somewhat vindicated. I know that some would still trade him for the “right guy,” but at least the bar seems to be going higher. My hope is that the bar will disappear from sight.
There is not an ounce of rational logic in my position. I just have a feeling in my bones that Salty might very well become our next Chipper.
In my head, I realize I could be wrong, but in my heart, I don’t want to risk being right.
By Amber
June 16, 2007 11:32 AM | Link to this
DOB, thanks for the peek into Smoltz’s mind. I always appreciate his candor. May I quote a song?
Honesty… is hardly ever heard
“And now it’s all up to Andruw Jones” - some of the scariest words in baseball.
I can’t handle too many wins like that. It took me about 20 minutes to calm down after it ended!
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 11:39 AM | Link to this
fausto carmona - now there is a good baseball name. if fausto carmona played on the braves team what sort of nickname might bobby have for fausto?
and this journalist has never to this day (as this journalist can recall) acknowledged a robert post … however, bloggers must accept that bobby cox has flaws (as do all - even journalists) but somehow, especially in a short series, the manager must give the team its best opportunity to win. bobby cox doesn’t always do that in the opinion of this journalist. bobby will sit hot players and play others - and boom! sudeenly the braves are down by a game to start the short series.
the last playoff series is a case in point. mccann had been hot, langerhans had been hot, laroche had been hot. bobby started estrada, jordan, and julio. same thing with the pitching - starting a guy because its his turn rather than starting someone who likely can win the game.
dance with who brung ya? sure, and the dance is over at midnight. and no more dances ‘til next year - maybe.
robert has successfully poisoned robert’s pen to the extent that robert’s points well-made are left in donkeyland. sad.
and, yes, it did take 5 hours and 50 minutes to decide game 4. and yes, they were there. and yes, other teams weren’t there. and yes, they were there only for 4 games. and then they were home, again, a huntin’.
By KC
June 16, 2007 11:54 AM | Link to this
DOB: “Where do you propose he play if Harris plays every day?”
Second base.
I’m not down on Kelly Johnson. I think he’s going to be a solid big league hitter, BUT… since May 1st (a stretch of 158 AB’s), he’s hit .259 with an OBP under .330. He’s stolen 2 bases over that stretch while getting caught stealing 4 times. And after showing some real power back in April, he’s hit only 3 homers over the last 6 weeks.
I think it is time to let Willie Harris AND Matt Diaz play every day.
By Miss Manners
June 16, 2007 12:13 PM | Link to this
Having JoeBrave lecture us on political correctness pretty much takes the cake and it reminds me of when my late, dear father was trying so hard to be politically correct and decided to attend sensitivity training classes. On the way home from class one night, daddy rear ended a car. The driver of that car got out and he was a DWARF!! And boy was he was p**! He looked up at my daddy and said “I am NOT happy!”
Daddy just snarled and said, “Then just which one are you?”
By BT
June 16, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this
Ok, since DOB did not take my suggestion on forgetting Robert, I have a new suggestion. When we clinch (division or wild card)maybe Bobby C. would let Robert pick the lineup and tell Bobby when to make pitching changes substitutions etc. Then Bobby Cox and the rest of us could blog about exactly how dumb Robert’s decisions actually were.
Just a thought.
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this
It distresses me to turn on this blog and see people using filthy words and phrases under the mistaken assumption that this will somehow dissuade the young man who wants to turn this into the Bash BC Blog. In the first place, I don’t think anything will dissuade Robert until we improve intra-galatic communication. But, most importantly, the sender of these potty-mouthed tirades loses whatever “high ground” to which he feels entitled. I,for one, would like to see DOB delete any blogs that contain filthy or offensive language AND any continuing cat fights between individuals where the subject matter is no longer about baseball. I realize that, if adopted, the latter could bite me, from time to time, but, hey, I have endured sharp-pencil editing before. My regards to all—Paladin
By snowball's chance
June 16, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this
eric the elder’s 10:28 AM post. Amen
By bravesfanbob
June 16, 2007 12:30 PM | Link to this
Smoltzie is one of a handful of players in baseball who has the right to speak honestly. A lot of people can’t take that.
Maybe this will cause an influx of honesty to overwhelm the MLB community, and suddenly all players will be honest. Then McGwire, Sosa, Palmero, and Bonds will all be honest to George Mitchell. Scott Boras will come to the Braves and say that Andruw’s year 2007 has meant that he only deserves $5 million for 6 years. Bud Selig will come forward and return all his pay for the last 10 years and admit he was worthless to baseball. And the player’s union will ask to have the designated hitter removed as the stupidest rule in the history of baseball.
I believe this will happen, and I would like to take the time to explain why, but I have to go repair my roof where Santa’s reindeer damaged it last Christmas Eve.
By Metropolitan Man
June 16, 2007 12:30 PM | Link to this
Hello there braves fans. Isnt this season fun. Anybody blood pressure off the charts yet??? Just checking in to see how you guys are handling the swoon, not here to talk shi*. The philthies and Fish have made things interesting again but one thing is for certain, all three teams have gone through a real tough patch, which team is for real??? Dont get it twisted, I beleive the METS are for real but losing 9-10 in the fashion they did was scary. Most weapons for us was available and still got only 1 win in 10 games. No more bragging from this guy until the opponents are mathematically eliminated. If it wasnt for the Brewers, my faith might be low right about now. Here to hoping the teams survive the inter league schedule!!!
Hey Grinch: Keep your bloggers faith high, they seem to abandon ship more often than not. Get them to rally behind the troops or take off that FAN mask and stop pretending to be loyal to their team!!!
By Ron Roberts
June 16, 2007 12:33 PM | Link to this
Sorry, but I’m not down with putting another player out of position (Willie Harris at 2B???) next to a catcher playing first.
The LF platoon is working perfectly, folks. Stop trying to split ‘em up to cover a failing elsewhere, okay?
Chipper’s back and hitting, our starters are starting to put it together (aside from Chuck’s last outing, he’d been fairly good for over a month) with Smoltz always giving his best, Hudson’s gem was a positive, Buddy Carlyle might just be the 4/5 guy we’ve been looking for, and our bullpen’s doing what it’s supposed to do, by and large. We’re gonna be alright.
Don’t see much of those folks i call “The Irrationals” blogging today about swapping Soriano and Wickman. Funny how that works, eh? They’re both good; they’re both good at what we got ‘em doing, and there’s no reason to go switching things up.
By Coach (NOT DRINKING THE KOOL AID)
June 16, 2007 12:36 PM | Link to this
Hey KC , Kelly Johnson is essentially in his rookie season , this was to be expected. He is a good hitter and will eventually make the necessary adjustments that he needs to make in order to be successful. I seriously doubt that Willie Harris is an everyday player , he doesn’t hit lefties well enough (Career .201 AVG) to play everyday but he is doing just fine in the platoon system. Maybe Cox should put Harris in the lead off spot in a few games against right handers ( Career .264 AVG). For the record , Willie’s split this season is : Lefties .273 Right handers .411 , Willie does play 2B but for some reason Cox has refused to play him anywhere else but LF.
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 12:39 PM | Link to this
OK, so I had a typo. I’m older than fossilized dirt and by the time many of you get to my age you’ll be lucky to find the keyboard, much less a little ole “c”. My profuse apologies—Paladin
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 12:51 PM | Link to this
Paladin, “c” or no “c,” I thought it was a great post, and I agree with you completely.
By Jim
June 16, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this
Jimmy, I am the first to acknowledge that Bobby has flaws, and that his decision to start the 3 veteran righthanded (and switch) hitters against Pettite in game 1 instead of the 3 lefthanded hitting rookies may or may not have been the correct one. But it is a leap for anyone to say that if he had used the alternative lineup, the Braves would have won game 1 of that series. Leaving a tired Pedro in to pitch to Matsui in the last game of that playoff series was a BAD decision that cost the Red Sox the series. Starting 3 veteran righthanded hitters instead of 3 lefthanded hitting rookies was a debatable decision that may or may not have had any effect on the outcome of the game. Given that Smoltz was hurt and could only pitch 1 game of the playoffs that year and the other options were not too intimidating when matched against Oswalt, Clemens, and Pettite, I think it is a stretch to blame Bobby’s choice of starters or lineup decisions for losing that series. Smoltz has said that the Braves overachieved to get into the playoffs those last two years.
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 1:05 PM | Link to this
Of all the sometimes bogus statistical methods that we apply to the grand old game, I think “on pace to” is the least sensible.
When I was 20 years old, I thought I was on pace to live to 150. Now I’m happy to think that I’m on pace to make it to tomorrow.
At the end of the day, the world appears to us, and probably is, quite different than it was in the morning. Placed on graph paper, the vicissitudes of life would look like an active Dow Jones.
Unless we believe that everything is preordained - - in which case, why play the games? - - nothing is on pace to anything. It’s just another excuse to carp at players whose pace is not what we though he was on pace to.
By fastasballs
June 16, 2007 1:23 PM | Link to this
It would be nice to see Andruw get the day off, maybe tomorrow as well. Play Willie in center. What do you think of this line up
2b KJ SS Edgar DH Chipper RF Frenchy 1B Salty c McCann LF Diaz 3B Escobar CF Harris
Against a contact pitcher like Paul Byrd that line up would be a run producer. Will it happen? Not in a million years, but Cox needs to play the hot bats right now & that’s the only way I see getting them all in the same line up without killing the defense with guys playing out of position aside from Salty.
Andruw is killing the line up right now. He’s costing them way more runs with his bat than he is saving with the glove. You want Andruw to get going, sit him down for a few games & let him watch his team win with without him. Keeping him at clean up is doing nothing but rewarding him for failure.
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this
We have two posts—one in which the village idiot wastes his time, and ours, typing his name over and over. In the next, we have an esteemed elder sharing with us some excellent thoughts to ponder. Who was it that said, “Youth is too precious to be wasted on the young?”
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
Jim, a good response to jimmy smith - however, journalist did not say the other lineup would be a winning lineup - only that the manager must give the team the very best chance to win. bobby sat players who were going really well for players who had not played so well. and in one critical instance julio did not have the needed stretch in the field that laroche demonstrated all year. could jordan be considered better than laroche at that time either at-bat or in the field? could julio play as good a first base as laroche? was a damaged estrada superior to mccann? jimmy smith is only second-guessing - and that’s what we do here. bobby has this journalist’s respect for all that bobby has accomplished in baseball. jimmy smith would never call bobby cox a donkey. still, bobby could make better use of tissues in the dugout than thumbs. oh, the humanity!
By Dr. Jay
June 16, 2007 1:31 PM | Link to this
Sigh… Robert is clearly off his meds, again.
I know what you mean about Davies’ chances tomorrow, DOB, but almost every time I’ve written him off this year, he puts together some strong innings. Here’s hoping history repeats…
By SourPatchKid
June 16, 2007 1:34 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Any idea if the braintrust is planning on sending down a reliever or a middle infielder to make room for Pena, so that Salty can focus on 1B and Bobby won’t have to leave him in during the late innings (though he was replaced last night)?
By spinelli
June 16, 2007 1:40 PM | Link to this
Fastballs: I also think AJ needs to be sat down for a game or two. Yes his defense helps win games but right now his offense is killing us. He at least needs to be dropped in the lineup again. I think BC’s loyalty is admirable but he needs to stop at some point in order to win games.
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 1:48 PM | Link to this
Paladin, this lady is in full agreement with your post
By Jim
June 16, 2007 2:08 PM | Link to this
Agreed — Bobby did not start the wrong lineup in game 1, based upon his preference for vets and the fact that a lefty was starting, but he may not have started the right one. That is what keeps discussions on blogs like this one going. In game 1, Jordan made a great catch that kept the game close at that point, but hit into a dp in a critical AB. Julio’s “stretch” came in game 4 after he replaced LaRoche because of his illness or baserunning gaffe. Had LaRoche still been playing he probably would have completed the dp that would have aborted the big inning that led to the Berkman slam and the eventual loss, but it was LaRoche’s health or lack of hustle that led to his removal, not Bobby’s flawed strategy.
Maybe we can get Robert to donate a mongrammed handkerchief for Bobby to use in the dugout.
By Coach (NOT DRINKING THE KOOL AID)
June 16, 2007 2:19 PM | Link to this
For the record , Andruw is hitting .166 this month with 3 HR 5 RUNS 6 RBI 6 BB 11 K’s and 31 runners left on base. Cox is committing professional suicide by keeping AJ in the clean up spot.
By Frank
June 16, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this
The bottom line with Andruw is this: He has been worn down by years of playing, even at the relative young age of 30 by baseball standards, he has lost a step, has more aches and pains we don’t know about, feels them all with each dive to the ground or slam on the wall, but still has the fire to play the best center field he can play, every day. The problem with Andruw is not his defense, but his bat. He has had so many people tinker with his stance and his approach at the plate, he must have 100 different fragments of advice spinning around in his brain. Not to mention the flair to be flashy, ie - tatoos. What is that supposed to be? A distraction from his woeful discomfort at the plate. Yes, he is a pull hitter, always will be, and attempts to change that are usually met with confusion, slumps, and uselessness. Just let Andruw be Andruw at the plate. Yeah, he will strike out plenty, but hit plenty of homers for the clean up spot, and his average will be sub .250. So what? He may be overrated as a whole player, but not as a center fielder. Wish he would study the tapes of the last couple of years, go back to that stance, and let the balls fly …
By Yars
June 16, 2007 2:31 PM | Link to this
I still don’t understand why there are still some KJ bashers out there. Man, you can crunch numbers all you want. The fact is, KJ ain’t going nowhere. He is Atlanta’s starting 2B, hopefully for years to come. Study his overall stats. If my fantasy team were looking for a 2B, I’d still take him over Marcus Giles. If he finishes the season with .280/17/68 type numbers, 15 SB, 100+ runs scored, and a OBP around .390, how can anyone be disappointed. Now Playing: Paralyzed by Finger Eleven
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
Soriano’s watch them fly attitude is turning ugly… Why is AJ batting cleanup? Because he likes to air-dry his bat!
By Caleb
June 16, 2007 2:41 PM | Link to this
Hahahahahaha, neither the mets or yankees have any pitching. Jeter just took glavine out for a two run homer. 6-5 yankees and still in the 4th inning.
By Jim
June 16, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this
Frank, I don’t know that its just the stance. If he goes back to the ‘05 stance. I don’t think he would be able to capture the same ‘05 magic because the body will not respond in the same way if did back then. The wear and tear have taken a toll and Andruw may no longer be able to be the dead-pull power hitter he was only a year ago. Andruw has to adapt his game to his new realities (as every other player is forced to do during the course of their career)and be a 25 - 35/year home run hitter that uses all fields. His uppercut swing is producing too many popups and fly balls on pitches he should be able to drive, and he is getting beat too often on fastballs that get a lot of the plate.
By fastasballs
June 16, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this
Yankees 6-5 over the Muts. Glavine being pounded once again, 6 earned after 4 innings.
By snowball's chance
June 16, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this
I just found MLB pre game notes for Atlanta. If you are feeling negative it is a good site to visit. Atlanta is actually a pretty good team on paper.
http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/presspass/index.jsp
By MBATL
June 16, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
Wonder if the Cubs players are getting tired of being plunked as payback for Soriano’s hotdogging. Chris Young drilled Derrek Lee today; Young, Lee, Gerald Perry and Jake Peavey all ejected.
Between weekly “payback” ejections, and Barrett’s inability to avoid fighting with his starting pitchers, the Cubbies can barely field a team.
By Chop Chop
June 16, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
Let’s see here…
Padres pitcher Chris Young hits Derrek Lee in the arm. Derrek Lee says something to Young as he’s walking down to first. Young responds in a way which infuriates Lee, which leads to some missed punches and a bench-clearing skirmish.
Why did this happen?
According to the AP:
“The Padres were not happy Friday after Alfonso Soriano homered off David Wells, stopped at the plate to admire the ball and then started his home run trot with a few steps backward.”
I’m not a baseball genius like Robert, but I can’t figure out why the Padres would hit Derrek Lee if they were mad at Soriano. Just doesn’t make a whole lot of sense to me. Of course, if Soriano is the reason Lee was hit, maybe Sweet Lou should take Alfonso aside and tell him to stop showing the other team up.
By P-Town Brave
June 16, 2007 3:20 PM | Link to this
So Bad-druw is dropped to 5th in the lineup today…still way too high for him…and can anyone figure out what exactly Thorman has done lately to warrant batting ahead of Yunel?!?!
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 3:24 PM | Link to this
For those of you who wanted the Braves to spend big money to get Glavine back here, I think it would be well for ya’ll to compare his and Davies’ numbers—particularly the $$$$.
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this
Punctuation like everything else about me is slipping southward. Y’all is what I intended to type.
By snowball's chance
June 16, 2007 3:33 PM | Link to this
P-Town Brave, I think a lot of American League managers take advantage of DH rules by putting someone with speed in the 9 hole. That gives the team a second “leadoff” spot.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 3:41 PM | Link to this
The reason Derrick Lee gets plunked is so that maybe the Cubbies will get ahold of ole Soriano and get it through his thick skull that showing up another team has its consequences. You would think the Cubs would have figured this out by now, but I guess that the 100 years of futility clouds their judgement. I think N8 correctly predicted this last night…and I think he even mentioned Derek Lee.
By snowball's chance
June 16, 2007 3:42 PM | Link to this
P-Town Brave, Also it sets up alternating righty lefty batting order.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 3:48 PM | Link to this
Snowball’s Chance, you wrote: “I just found MLB pre game notes for Atlanta. If you are feeling negative it is a good site to visit. Atlanta is actually a pretty good team on paper.”
I was just noticing in the standings that Atlanta is 2-1/2 games out of first place in the East and two games out of the wild card.
Remembering what a blogger wrote a couple days ago about blowing up the team and building for the future. I could be mistaken, but I think they’d be the first team in baseball history to give up on a season when 2-1/2 games out of first on June 16.
By Lew
June 16, 2007 3:51 PM | Link to this
KC-Dude,Welcome back. I’m sorry, but Willie Harris against RH pitchers is one thing, but he doesn’t hit lefties. His lifetime BA has risen from .238 to .264 with his surge this season. However, his career BA against LHP is still .201, with a sub .300 OBP. There is a reason he’s platooned (not to mention Diaz’s BA against LHP). Playing everyday will only reduce Willie’s effectiveness. I still think you either invented or discovered an alternate life form and substituted it for the real Willie Harris. You got to realize, he has to come back to earth. Even if he were to end the season with a .300 BA, which will thrill everyone, how much of a slide will he experience to get there? Playing him against LHP only assures it will happen sooner than later.
By The Truth Hurts
June 16, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist (3:26am post)…we’ll just agree to disagree. Perhaps we measure success differently. Perhaps you’re more forgiving than I am when it comes to the 14 postseason appearances. Being a National League dynasty is a descriptive term that offers little significance for me.
This is the crux of the issue and has been for 16 years: the Braves since ‘91 are known more for their failures than for their success against a really good Indians team in ‘95 (I think they were 100-44 in that strike-shortened year).
Can you say that about any other franchise in sports? Except the Buffalo Bills?
When the organization is known more for wasted opportunity than for seizing it, you’ve earned an ignominious distinction one would rather forget.
My original point, which predictably got me the condescending label “chief” from DOB, is that Smoltz’s expression of the above sentiment is anything but revealing…for me.
However, I’m concerned that anytime a blogger dares to disagree with a) the prevailing sentiment or b) the author of such sentiment, that we are given pejorative labels that seek to diminish our contribution. In reality, and in my humble opinion, such labels do a greater disservice to the speaker than the intended target.
The only “chief” around should be “Knock-a-Homa.”
By Ron
June 16, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this
That damn Alfonso Soriano is gettin the Cubs in alot of trouble with him staring at his damn home runs!!! The Cubs are Thugs!!!
By snowball's chance
June 16, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this
I was watching the pregame on fox and Boston is disappointed in Lugo at SS. Meanwhile they are picking up a bunch of Edgar’s salary who is Atlanta’s only lock for the allstar team. As John Prine wrote It’s a Big old Goofy World.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 4:03 PM | Link to this
KC, let me get this straight: Kelly Johnson’s batting .283 with five triples, eight homers, 35 RBIs, 40 walks and a .384 OBP.
He’s on pace for 19 homer and 83 RBIs, while hitting close to .300 with an OBP close to .400. He’s surpassed all pre-season expectations.
And you would remove him from the lineup for Willie Harris, who’s thriving in a platoon role against right-handers, and who has a .201 career average in a total of 186 at-bats vs lefties?
Brilliant. Sheer brilliance. And when you sit K.J. down, do you say, Sorry, Kelly. You’ve done great. Better than we’d hoped. But Willie’s just killing righties and we’ve got a hunch he can hit lefties, too, even though 864 of his 1,000 career at-bats have come against right-handers and probably for a reason, but we’re going to ignore it.
And oh, if he struggles, please be ready to jump back in there and pick up where you left off surpassing all our expectations. Thanks, K.J.
Brilliant. That’s the kind of reasoned moves the Braves need.
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 4:03 PM | Link to this
Small point: we are 2.5 out of 1st, but we are 4 down in the loss column, which might be a better indicator.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:05 PM | Link to this
Gotta Love good ole Robert, because you know he will say nothing bad about Bud Black(the Padres Manager) for Chris Young hitting Lee!!! He will say it is all alright, or something that will be respectfull to Black, but yet he wants to crusify Bobby Cox!!! Gotta Love it, The P!ss Ant Robert!!! Aint it something that Atlanta is not the ONLY team that retaliates the NEXT DAY!!! I guess alot of other teams think like the Braves do!!! Im glad they retaliated, the Cubs are a bunch of THUGS!!! Soriano is a little B!TCH!!!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
Oh, and KC: Kelly Johnson has a .276 career average vs. lefties and .286 this season. By all means, turn his spot over to the guy who’s never hit lefties. Do it now.
By DirtyDawg
June 16, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
Would somebody tell me why Paul Byrd didn’t get a ration of crap when he left Atlanta? The Braves went out to get him…he turned up lame that first season…sat out the next recuperating from surgery or another…then didn’t seem to care for the offer the Braves made him to stay on. I mean where’s the loyalty? They pay him the big bucks for a couple of years and get nada in return.
Of course I may have the whole story wrong, but that’s what I recall.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:12 PM | Link to this
Did anybody see on FOX when Matt Diaz was introducing the lineup, and he said about Andruw’s new book about Jayson Stark being an overrated Sports Writer!!! Now that was FUNNY!!!!!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 4:16 PM | Link to this
Eric the Elder,
Eric you are right about the 4 games in the loss column. But there might also be other indicators. Right now the Mets are losing again and Glavine is now routinely getting hammered and he is their #1 starter, at least until Pedro comes back.
By MBATL
June 16, 2007 4:19 PM | Link to this
DirtyDawg, I think the Braves waived Byrd. I’m not sure either, but that’s what I recall…
By Braves Fan 79
June 16, 2007 4:19 PM | Link to this
NO JIM….houston did NOT have the better team and if Smoltz would of started we would of gone to the world series that year! Smoltz is not your average pitcher(only one of the best postseason starters ever!) and to act like he couldnt of gone 5 strong innings is stupid! I was sick to my stomach the night before that game when hampton was named the starter…i mean we all know hamptons not a big game pitcher.(and when hes bad…hes REAL bad!) While i love bobby and what hes done for my team….that to me was his biggest mistake. Oyea…ps my intuition was right…and the game was over by they time he yanked hamptons sorry a* out of the game. Ex mets have done nothing but curse the Braves….i say dump hampton and woodward SAP! did yall just see that slider from Smoltz….thats my BOY!!
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this
I am soooo glad that I am not an Indians fan, because I could not listen to that dude beaten on that DAMN drum all game long!!! That is sooooo irritating!!!!!
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:28 PM | Link to this
MBATL, I think Birdawg had it right! I think the Indians offered him more and he said no thanks to the Braves. But not sure though, you could be right I dont know!!! DOB, might know if Byrd was waived or just got more money to play with the Indians!!!
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 4:32 PM | Link to this
I predict a golden sombrero for our underrated center fielder, that guarantees he will hit 4th tomorrow!
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 4:33 PM | Link to this
Yanks up 10-5 over Mets.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:35 PM | Link to this
Smoltz got it today!!!
By Jbutler
June 16, 2007 4:37 PM | Link to this
So I’m apparently out here in the middle of nowhere..cause we don’t have the game on FOX. They have ‘roids Bonds on instead. But I can watch the US Open eat alive the worlds best golfers. May have to do that. Too bad…#29 is my favorite!!
By Berigan
June 16, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
Bobby confuses me…just every once in a while ;) Why is Brian McCann catching a day game after a night game?
By MBATL
June 16, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
Ron, Dirtydawg: just took a look at BB reference: We traded McMichael for Byrd before the ‘97 season. He pitched 53 innings, mostly in relief. Hurt the next year, pitched just 2 innings for us, and we waived him; Philly picked him up off waivers in August ‘98 … and he did a pretty good job for them.
We signed him as a F/A in ‘04; didn’t resign him, and he signed with the Angels for ‘05. I don’t know if we made any effort to keep him then, but that was well past his injury days - so who can blame him for going with the best bid?
By Bob
June 16, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
Boy that ball off Kelley’s leg had to hurt. Hope he is ok.
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
RON, Of course we didn’t see that. Don’t you know everybody receives a different feed, broadcasting 101!
By N8
June 16, 2007 4:40 PM | Link to this
Bob
I’ve been shooting out and about all afternoon, just stopped by the office and fired up the blog, and MLBradio, during my time to kill.
I’m ELATED that somebody drilled another Cubs batter. Derek Lee seems like a great guy, as DOB has said, so in no way do I wish harm upon him.
I didn’t specifically mention him, just that it apparently NEEDS to be another Cub that get’s “popped”, since Hudson hitting Soriano didn’t wake him up. Maybe somebody should have hit Zambrano, HE seems to have no problem kicking one of his players butt in the dugout.
Not sure if any of you saw the Soriano highlight from last night, but it was SO BUSH of Soriano, that if I was one of his teamates, I would’ve beat his butt, the SECOND he got to home plate.
Good for Chris Young. If Lou doesn’t wanna have his OTHER players be targets for the rest of the season, he best sit Soriano down and let him know that what he’s doing is putting his teamates in harm’s way.
Perhaps a “rewind” of the Pinella/Dibble clubhouse incedent is coming soon. We can only hope.
KC
Of all people, I would never suspect that YOU would say something so silly as to “get the goat” of DOB. Shame on you. LOL!
Uh-Oh! Let’s hope KJ is OK, or KC may get his wish. Be very careful for what you wish for, my friend.
By Berigan
June 16, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
By Ron June 16, 2007 4:12 PM | Link to this Did anybody see on FOX when Matt Diaz was introducing the lineup, and he said about Andruw’s new book about Jayson Stark being an overrated Sports Writer!!! Now that was FUNNY!!!!!
Ron, that’s great!!!! (Though to be fair to Stark, he was right on the money on Andruw’s swinging!)
By Michael Procton
June 16, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
DirtyDawg: As a matter of fact, I remember specifically Byrd saying that he would absolutely resign with Atlanta in ‘05 after they helped him through his rehab during his injuries. Really p** me off.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:49 PM | Link to this
Is it me or does Chipper Absolutely SUCK with RISP!!! Same ole Chipper with RISP, he gotta get it done with Runners on!!!
By Chop Chop
June 16, 2007 4:50 PM | Link to this
Actually, we signed Byrd to a two-year deal before the ‘03 season, but he had to have Tommy John surgery and missed all of that season. He came back for us in ‘04 and pitched pretty well. He signed a one-year deal with the Halos in ‘05, had a decent year and translated that into a two-year, $14.25 million deal with the Indians. Despite the fact that he’s giving up some hits today, I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets another two-year deal for decent money somewhere. Byrd generally can give you a solid six innings and his arm seems to be in good shape. In this day and age, that’s valuable.
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 4:51 PM | Link to this
AJ is half way there!
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 4:53 PM | Link to this
With 2 strikes on Andruw, Mark Grace said that Byrd was only one strike away from getting out of the inning. Wrong. Byrd was out of the inning the moment he got Chipper.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 4:57 PM | Link to this
Why the Hell are they showing Bonds Bat on FOX? That is so much BULLSH!T, I dont want to see that Steroid Freak!!! They had a split screen while Bonds was battin.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 5:02 PM | Link to this
eric the elder, Wrong Byrd was out of the inning the moment he faced Chipper with RISP!!!
By JasonInMaine
June 16, 2007 5:08 PM | Link to this
We have to be the worst team in baseball at getting a runner in from 2nd and none out as well as from 3rd with less than 2 out. I just don’t get it…
By Berigan
June 16, 2007 5:10 PM | Link to this
I checked out sonsaofsamhorn.com (Red sox fanatics site) and they mentioned that there was a big fight in Chicago, started after Chris Young hit Derrick Lee on the same wrist he had broken last year(I think) why haven’t we seen a clip of that yet? They also mentioned it must have been the tallest fight in ML history! ;) No punches were connections, it sounds like….
By Greg O.
June 16, 2007 5:12 PM | Link to this
I’m listening to the game and Pete Van Wieran keeps talking about how Smoltz looks uncomfortable, is walking around the mound a lot, isn’t going at his normal pace, and is stretching his shoulder occasionally… I live out of market, so I can’t see this on Fox… can anybody back up what Pete is saying?
By JasonInMaine
June 16, 2007 5:14 PM | Link to this
One more thing…Paul Byrd already has 6 K’s…Paul Byrd…how do tou swing and miss at an 85 MPH fastball that is right down the middle?
By Elements
June 16, 2007 5:14 PM | Link to this
Nice article on Smoltz above. Gotta love a true competitor who is still passionate about winning after all these years.
By jbutler
June 16, 2007 5:15 PM | Link to this
Hey Ron…at least you got a split screen. I have all Bonds. All the time. Now that TBS doesn’t show as many games- I get to watch either tons of Rockies..NOT..or Barry. Hmm. Static is preferable to that!!!
By StingerSplash
June 16, 2007 5:16 PM | Link to this
DOB, I have one question for you. How good is your Spanish in trying to interview some of the Braves’ players whose English is still limited or non-existent? Just curious.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 5:20 PM | Link to this
jbutler,
I’d voter for the Rockies.
By MBATL
June 16, 2007 5:21 PM | Link to this
Greg O, in the 3rd, I was wondering if Smoltz had maybe tightened up during our long top-half; he was doing a lot of roaming around after pitches, had a couple of pitches where he seemed to come off the mound wrong. Gave up some hard hit balls, too. And just didn’t look “happy” out there. I was wondering if we’d pull him after the 3rd… but he looked a lot better in the 4th.
JasonInMaine, I think it just feels that way. Braves are tied for 2nd in the NL in BA with RISP, and have the highest OPS in the league with RISP. Amazing, isn’t it? I guess fans of most teams must get the same feeling.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 5:21 PM | Link to this
Greg O, I can’t hear Pete, but I can tell you I’ve been commenting to Bowman since the first inning that Smoltz has been walking around behind the mound more between pitches than usual, is working his shoulder after every pitch, and actually appears to be throwing more from a 3/4 to sidearm angle than usual, and almost short-arming his delivery, not reaching back as far or going as high overhead.
Even when he was striking out five consecutive batgters after the leadoff double, he wasn’t throwing the way we’re using to seeing. It was effective, but looked different. Shoulder’s clearly bothering him.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 5:23 PM | Link to this
Make that “I would vote for the Rockies”. I guess Kelly’s leg is ok.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 5:24 PM | Link to this
Stinger, my Spanish is worse than their English, let’s put it that way. Married to a Colombian woman for six years and I still didn’t pick up much Spanish at all. I’m a dumba$@.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this
Miss Manners, the mild mannered Doc was never known for being grumpy, but while sure that he was very proud of you, methinks that it’s unlikely he would have been very happy with your dopey post … however, it made my day!!
The Truth Hurts Agreeing to disagree is agreeing and I’m agreeable to that! I also agree with … and truly share your concern regarding the casual bestowing of pejorative labels.
God may have been the the first to say Youth is too precious to be wasted on the young … sometime around day six.
You’ll notice how Cato’s perspective dramatically changed when he reached 150.
KC, As I’ve indicated, I somehow feel that it’s a different Kelly I currently see donning the leotard … maybe it doesn’t fit, but I strongly suspect that will resolve itself, regardless of whether it’s real or imagined.
I don’t think second base is the answer but the real only problem I have with “I think it is time to let Willie Harris AND Matt Diaz play every day” is that it’s a bit too verbose and could be made more succinct by removing the “I think* and replace “let” with something less passive.
Of course, it’s not what you say … but how and why that really important … some suggest that since we’re going to lose anyway, we should go ahead and play the kids … I suggest that if we don’t want to lose, we should go ahead and play the kids. It just goes to show that it’s often possible to agree, even when you you don’t!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 5:28 PM | Link to this
Berigan, glad to hear Diaz went through with that. Talked to him before the game and he said he wanted to do that, but didn’t have the (blank) to go through with it because he didn’t want to p anybody off or anything. I told him Jayson would actually get a kick out of that if he saw it (he would, really) and that he HAD to do it. So he said he would. Very cool that he went through with it.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 5:29 PM | Link to this
Smoltzie looks uncomfortable to me too, but haven’t seen anything on FOX to indicate we have the Pen is working. Dave can you tell from your vantage? I would surely think John would tell Bobby if he is having a problem.
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 5:33 PM | Link to this
There is an old saying that anyone who steps in there with a bat is dangerous. Andruw is the only counterexample I can think of.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 5:34 PM | Link to this
We need to sit Andruw for at least a game or two. This is getting to be criminal.
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 5:35 PM | Link to this
hat trick!!!!!
By sri
June 16, 2007 5:36 PM | Link to this
damn Druw!!!!
By Ron
June 16, 2007 5:39 PM | Link to this
Why the HELL is BC still batting this SLUG 4th? DOB, can you please tell me what BC is thinking? This is B******!!!
By Goodbye Mr. Chips
June 16, 2007 5:39 PM | Link to this
I suggest that if we don’t want to lose, we should go ahead and play the kids. It just goes to show that it’s often possible to agree, even when you you don’t!
Since we are learning how to be more succinct, drop the I suggest that, we should go ahead and, and the it just goes to show that. it should read:
If we don’t want to lose, play the kids. It’s often possible to agree even when you don’t.
By Johnny
June 16, 2007 5:40 PM | Link to this
Have you ever noticed that Robert always refers to Cox as a donkey, but it’s Robert that does all the braying like a jackass?
By bruce
June 16, 2007 5:41 PM | Link to this
Hey blog regulars/main guys… an observation from a relative newbee… (end of last season) It seems to me that Dave gives you guys a hard time when you write thought/suggestions that Dave finds unreasonable for his understanding of your individual baseball knowledge… that is he expects more from you and then gives you a hard time when you come up short. I’d call that high praise. What do you think of that thought? Thanks, Bruce
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 5:41 PM | Link to this
Some asked about Byrd’s departure from Braves. If I remember correctly, they didn’t really pursue him hard at all to try and re-sign him. He went to Angels for a year, then got two-year, $14.25 mill deal from Cleveland with an option that would push it to $22 mill.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 5:42 PM | Link to this
Ron, He is batting 5th.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 5:43 PM | Link to this
Did anybody hear what McCarver(or however you spell it) said about Bonds: he said if Bonds thought the pitch was a ball then it was a ball!!! Can you believe that sh!T!!! I hate listening to that dude talk!!! Yeah while your at it you might as well call Bonds GOD!!!
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 5:44 PM | Link to this
BobJ, I was fine through the first 149 years, but turning 150 gave me a midlife crisis. I try to be selectively grumpy, but as in so many things, I routinely fail.
By The Grinch
June 16, 2007 5:45 PM | Link to this
What’s up with this Bonds nonsense? I could understand if he was sitting on 755, but 8 or 9 away? WTF? Honestly, I don’t even want to see it then.
By JasonInMaine
June 16, 2007 5:46 PM | Link to this
This just in…
Andruw sux!!!
Glad to see edgar and willie doing it yet again!
By Greg O.
June 16, 2007 5:48 PM | Link to this
Call of the day by Skip: “THAT BALL’S GONNA GOOOO!!! IT IS… caught at the wall by Nixon.”
By MBATL
June 16, 2007 5:49 PM | Link to this
DOB, do you know if Soriano and/or Wickman are available today if needed? I know both pitched the last two games… just wondering.
It is almost sad to watch AJ right now. He’s completely lost up there (which, of course, probably means a HR coming). He’s hitting 5th, btw, not 4th, Ron. But really, really bad. Clueless.
Great catch by Nixon on Thorman - who has looked really good at the plate today. Good for him! I can live with a 1B platoon, plus Salty resting McCann every few days. Hope he (Thorman) keeps swinging well.
By Braveheart
June 16, 2007 5:50 PM | Link to this
Mets lose!
The Magic Number is 98!
By Ron
June 16, 2007 5:51 PM | Link to this
YEAHHHH!!! The Mets lost today!!! Come on Atlanta, lets win this game!!! Still hard to believe we are still in this NL EAST Race, after struggling sooooo bad!!! Maybe this is our year!!!
By Michael Procton
June 16, 2007 5:55 PM | Link to this
Ron, it’s tough to argue that Barry Bonds has one of, if not THE, best batting eyes in baseball.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 5:56 PM | Link to this
Bob, My bad, but 5th is still tooo good for him, bat him 7th!!!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 5:57 PM | Link to this
Well, if John is hurtin, he sure has pitched a hell of a game.
By fastasballs
June 16, 2007 5:59 PM | Link to this
How the hell can you stikeout against Paul Byrd three times? I think Redman could stike Andruw out right now & I’m being serious.
Great game by everyone else so far.
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 6:02 PM | Link to this
Any pitcher who throws AJ a fastball on the inside should be ridden out of town, buck-naked on a rail. That said, I hope someone does—soon.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:02 PM | Link to this
Ron, Agree, at least for now. Maybe even 8th.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:04 PM | Link to this
Wonder What Andruw will do now? Strikeout, or Hit into a double play?
By MBATL
June 16, 2007 6:06 PM | Link to this
DOB, they’re talking about you on Fox (in connection with Stark/Boras)!
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 6:07 PM | Link to this
bobby has something in bobby’s ear, and is digging away. now 2 men on base and andruw is up. please, andruw …
oh, the humanity! mighty andruw has failed again to advance the runners. now, mccann …
By Robert
June 16, 2007 6:08 PM | Link to this
“But I’m telling you that Cox is usually or always going to do it his way, and trying to explain his reasoning”
I just looked in Webster’s dictionary, and as an example of an oxymoron they have “Bobby Cox’s reasoning”
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:08 PM | Link to this
DOB, DUDE They Just mentioned you on FOX!!! They mentioned this blog as well!!! Now That is COOL!!!!!!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:09 PM | Link to this
Can’t stand to watch Andruw at the plate anymore.
By Randy
June 16, 2007 6:09 PM | Link to this
Well, that’s it. Braves/MIB mentioned on Fox. The blog has gone Hollywood. It was a good run….
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 6:09 PM | Link to this
el sombrero waits…
By Braveheart
June 16, 2007 6:11 PM | Link to this
Boras and Stark can play Tom and Jerry with each other about this: Offensively, Andruw is neither overrated nor underrated. He no longer is rated at all.
By fastasballs
June 16, 2007 6:12 PM | Link to this
The DOB & Boras conversation was mentioned by the Fox announcers in the top of the inning.
That was yesterday’s news, wasn’t it? LOL It’s great to be in the know. Seems we have access to better information sometimes than the guys announcing the game.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:13 PM | Link to this
Michael Procton, Agree about that, and he was a hall of famer before he started using the steroids, but I still dont like him!!! I bet Robert absolutely loves Bonds!!!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:14 PM | Link to this
What an inning by Yates!!
By raykelsey
June 16, 2007 6:16 PM | Link to this
How many guys left on base is that for Andruw in the last week, 17? Folks, I think we can all agree that Andruw’s days in Atlanta—and perhaps baseball, even—are finished. He has either already packed up and left mentally, or he just reached the Dale Murphy phase of his career and is officially old. He looks utterly lost. The trademark smile has somehow vanished from his usually imperturbable face, too. Dare we say, he is…upset? About time.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 6:16 PM | Link to this
“DOB, can you please tell me what BC is thinking? This is B**!!!”
What in the world makes you believe that Bobby Cox IS thinking,has ever THOUGHT, or is even CAPABLE of thinking?
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:18 PM | Link to this
DOB, Now that FOX has mentioned this blog, everybody is gonna be here, and that means more Met fans, and People like Robert!!! oh the humanity!!!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:19 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Yeah you got national pub on FOX. Can’t understand though why Mark Grace did not mention your most frequent blogger, that baseball genius, Robert.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 6:22 PM | Link to this
Miss Manners, I apologize for failing to applaud your recognition of Joe’s impassioned comments … political or no, there’s sometimes correctness to be found in the strangest of places … I first thought he was submitting his Father’s Day slogan entry.
Well, if he’s already taken the cake, I don’t guess there’s any reason for me to resubmit mine … Jimmy did that for me anyway!
Here’s another one, just for you Jimmy!
Tired of bland diets of straight baseball talk? Chef O’Brien mixes it with Puddin’, Pie and good country music for desert!
Just remember, you saw it here first folks, regardless of who gets the credit!
By raykelsey
June 16, 2007 6:22 PM | Link to this
I am elated I found such a great Braves blog! Does AJC stand for Andruw Jones Calamity?
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 6:22 PM | Link to this
this journalist must brush up on this journalist’s journalism now that this blog has become the little engine that could. soon, the old journalist and others will wish to blog here and this journalist may drop in the pecking order of blog journalists. for now, there are many journalists on this blog - but only a few doing toe journalism. jimmy smith specializes in toe journalism - and in transition. now, music … is an example of this journalist’s ability to transition. and now, will ms. anne cox chambers be watching today’s game and will anne cox chambers note the mention of dob and this best of cox blog? and did bobby ever get that little songbird out of bobby’s ear? will bob emerge in the ninth inning? no, not bob wickman - journalist bob emerging from the tub. and congratulations to dob who now has a tee shirt under development and a mention on national television. soon, dob will want his wurlitzers done in color.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:24 PM | Link to this
Barry Bonds time again. Sheeeesh. And I thought ESPN overdid it by showing Roger Clemons everytime he went to the bathroom.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 6:27 PM | Link to this
I dont LOVE Bonds, just like I dont HATE Cox.
It appears that Bonds made some bad choices in regards to performance enhancing substances and as regards his stance when confronted with damning evidence.
On top of that, he can be a surly mofo
But steroids or not, Barry Bonds is one of the elite of the elite to ever play the game. If you can appreciate baseball, and can appreciate a man who could execute every facet of the game with skill and precision, then you will (as I do) respect Bonds for his undeniable greatness
In the same way, but as the opposite example, Bobby Cox may endear himself to his players and his colleagues. He may also give kids the best ride at the county fair. But I have watched him turn enough WS rosters into division champions that I have CONTEMPT for his fictional ability to manage a baseball team
I have said it before and I’ll say it again. Those who look at Cox’s quantitative numbers do themselves and baseball a tremendous injustice. Bobby Cox has been the manager of a winning regular season big league ballclub 2207 games. Given the same rosters, I’d lay money that Willie B would have at least 2208
By Greg O.
June 16, 2007 6:30 PM | Link to this
Ron,
Good news… I live in the New York media market and they’re showing the Red Sox/Giants game. No need to fear an influx of Mets degenerate fans suddenly gaining knowledge of the blog.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:30 PM | Link to this
Is it me or do we do pretty damn good against good teams!!! This Indians team is very good, and we might win 2 or 3 against them!!! The Twins are solid but we got manhandled against them!!! And we played the Dodgers earlier this season and beat them 2 or 3, and took 3 of 4 from the Padres, and yet we get beat by the Nats!!! Well we get ready for the Good teams, now if only we can get up against the Bad teams, we will be pretty damn good!!!
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:36 PM | Link to this
What a game by Edgar!
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 6:41 PM | Link to this
Surprise that Moylan comes in to face lefties when McBride was warming up?
By Homeboy Upstairs
June 16, 2007 6:42 PM | Link to this
Robert stop being so hard on yourself. You know it was my fault more than it was yours. But heck if you want to continue to take the blame go right ahead. Have you still not been able to realize that I never gave you the complete roster you needed to win the World Series more than once? Deflect the blame Robert, deflect it over to me. I am Teflon John and nothing sticks to me.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:42 PM | Link to this
Robert, Dude since you had such a big problem with BC and Tim Hudson for throwing at Soriano last Sunday, what do you think about Bud Black(the Padres manager) after the Padres Pitcher Chris Young hit Lee after Soriano stared at his Homerun Last Night? I guess The Braves are not the only team that retaliates, huh!!! They did the Same exact thing that the Padres did except the Braves hit Soriano!!! Dont you give Bud Black any slack now, because you crusified BC!!!
By Baby Seal
June 16, 2007 6:43 PM | Link to this
Happy Father’s Day to Jimmy Smith!
By Braveheart
June 16, 2007 6:47 PM | Link to this
LOS BRAVOS WIN!
METS LOSE!
THE MAGIC NUMBER IS 97!
By Ron
June 16, 2007 6:47 PM | Link to this
Greg O., Good to hear!!!
By ElbravoX
June 16, 2007 6:48 PM | Link to this
AJ ran out of OUTS…
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 6:49 PM | Link to this
Eric, my Father never had a problem with turning 60, 70, or even 80 … but, maybe there’s something about “5”, regardless of the zeroes … Mama made him a huge cake, his favorite, and literally put 50 candles thereon … it was never eaten … though I’m sure he badly wanted more than just a taste … it may have been all those candles but I think that half a century was just a bit too much for him to acknowledge!
Oh, but to be 50, … or at least able to remember so being!
As a quick aside, I knew that I’d matured when I came to realize the wisdom in refraining from asking older folks how they feel!
No, not with their hands ….
By Chop Chop
June 16, 2007 6:53 PM | Link to this
Fellow bloggers…
Who in the hell do you think you are? A superstar? Well, right you are!
By A-ville Ranger
June 16, 2007 6:53 PM | Link to this
That game ending pitch by Moylan was all star stuff.If he stays healthy and keeps control,he can be an important contributor for years to come.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 6:55 PM | Link to this
Idiots! Bob, journalist is actually 5 Martha Berry College students.
By Michael Procton
June 16, 2007 6:58 PM | Link to this
Moylan hadn’t pitched in a game that mattered in a week…not really a surprise, and Bobby’s trusted him a lot to finish games with comfortable leads.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 6:58 PM | Link to this
Ron, Maybe, just maybe we will hear that Bud Black is a worse manager than BC. But then again, don’t hold your breath.
Good win today.
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 7:03 PM | Link to this
Did you notice that Andruw is featured in the All Star Game promo?
MBATL, agree that he has reached the point of just being sad.
By VandyBrave
June 16, 2007 7:05 PM | Link to this
Andruw really, really looks bad (and has all year).
He does not need to be batting behind Renteria and Chipper - they get on base….and then AJ strikes out. Runner on third, less than 2 outs, AJ comes up…80% of the time its gonna be a pop out or a strike out.
AJ needs to hit 7th (‘hit’)
By Lew
June 16, 2007 7:09 PM | Link to this
DOB-It’s interesting-I heard the Indians feed today on XM and all they could say was how dominant Smoltz was and what a great closer Yates would make. They also feel that we stole Soriano from the Mariners.
By teoa
June 16, 2007 7:11 PM | Link to this
I’m not sure whether Andruw is overrated in the context of baseball history, but he is definitely overrated in the mind of his manager if Bobby still thinks he’s a 4/5 hitter.
That said, great game from Edgar today and yet another gutsy performance from Smoltz. I have to say I’m a little concerned about what effect the shoulder’s going to have the rest of the year though. I’m afraid that kind of injury might be tough to heal without taking significant time off.
By joebrave
June 16, 2007 7:13 PM | Link to this
Miss Manners,I don’t remember ever calling you out,I do believe I’m probably the first to,take up the anchor when,and once anyone starts on a woman here.Maybe you should ask Lew,SJA,DOB,and Carolina lady,about that before you sling your insults my way…
By the way I don’t think that was a lecture as much as a cleaned version of a good ol @ss chewing..
Edgar looked good today 5 hits,maybe A.J. should go see if Edgar will tutor him..
Mutts lose,Braves win,and I didnt’ have to listen to Tim Mccarver rant and groan all day,Life is good..
To all the Fathers,here Happy Fathers Day guys……..
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 7:16 PM | Link to this
Well, at least I went to college … imagine that!
AtlantaBraves.com and a lot of others may be giving John the credit … but I think it ought to be shared with a lot of folks today! Kudos!
before getting excited about the publicity given to David and the Blog, just remember the source … they also said Cleveland was in the most difficult division in Baseball. Of course, division was always difficult for people in Cleveland … except for those folks out at Case.
For those folks who don’t know anything about case, it’s nothing to worry about, you’re obviously in the majority,I assure you! Cato, I won a scholarship to that Cleveland trade school but Daddy thought it was too close to Canada worried that I would come with a French speaking wife … he did so posit but the real reason was the cost of living.
By A-ville Ranger
June 16, 2007 7:19 PM | Link to this
The interview of Smoltz has been dancing around in my head (non-erotic…I swear).The Moment the Skankees stole the Braves mojo was oct 23 1996 game 4 world series 8th inning 2 on 1 out Jim Leyritz against Mark Wohlers..BANG!!! bye bye mojo.In the words of Smoltz it’s never been the same since.The 98 team was the best we.ve had and one of the best in all baseball history,beat by a pedestrian San Diego team.I lived in Colorado in 99 when once again the hated Skanks spanked the Bravos.That Atl team was very close in talent and performance to the NY squad.How many people thought we had a real chance ? not me or anybody I knew in Colorado,the belief in and more important by this team was(is)gone.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 7:21 PM | Link to this
Were I to have gone to Berry, Miss Martha would not have tolerated such sloppiness … apologies to all!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 7:23 PM | Link to this
Let’s see, 1-1/2 games out of first on June 16. I guess they can hold off a week or two from blowing it up and rebuilding, huh?
Hey, Smoltz was outstanding today. He just told us he was taking more time between pitches and abandoned his split early in deference to the shoulder, but that it felt good all things considered, and there doesn’t appear to be any concern about his next start, etc.
He also said he wants to get back to where six innings is just the starting point. He hates coming out after six, but said he wanted to be smart and let this thing get healthy completely.
EDGAR freakin’ RENTERIA, hitting .329 with 10 homers, 35 RBIs, and a fat ‘ol .919 OPS (.394 OBP).
I’d say pencil him onto the All-Star team. They can take four NL shortstops if they have to, but you can’t leave him off.
Did the Fox cats say Braves/Man In Black blog, or just something generic like “Braves blog” or whatever? That’s pretty cool.
Bob J, turn those good suggestions in for the T-shirt thing, man. Or someone else steal ‘em and turn ‘em in.
By Train Wreck Bystander
June 16, 2007 7:29 PM | Link to this
I am so glad we didn’t blow up the team and start over this week. EDGAR FREAKING RENTERIA.
I love it when Fox airs the games - HD baseball rocks the house.
And, for the trifecta, the Mets lose and we gain ground.
Great day to be a Braves fan.
By Eric C.
June 16, 2007 7:31 PM | Link to this
Tomahawkin’ Again,
I agree with you about the 96 WS…very frustrating. Btw, It was actually rightfielder Jermaine Dye who was shielded by the umpire on the pop-up…not Klesko…which started the Yankees comeback from 6-0 in game 4.
Great couple of games Braves…I hope to eat my words of doom & gloom from recent posts.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 7:34 PM | Link to this
Teoa, always the master of the understatement … methinks it would best read “he is definitely overrated in the mind of his manager if Bobby still thinks he’s a hitter” … I still say let him hit ninth when playing under NL rules and 10th under AL rules … at least until he has a better understanding of our rules.
By A-ville Ranger
June 16, 2007 7:40 PM | Link to this
DOB I’m not saying these guys are losers.BC teams are as resilient as they come.It’s that little bit of magic that makes champions that’s gone missing.
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 7:42 PM | Link to this
The 2005 MVP runner-up is hitting .211 with 11 homers, 69 strikeouts in 251 at-bats, and a .312 OBP.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 7:43 PM | Link to this
Thanks David … I would but for three problems … my ex-wives, the IRS and the police!
I don’t dare come out from behind the mask!
Happy Father’s Day all!
You too Mama!
By fastasballs
June 16, 2007 7:46 PM | Link to this
DOB Fox didn’t get specific, just mentioned you & Boras had a long cenversation & you had written extensively about the conversation & Starke’s book.
Where do you turn in the T-Shirt suggestions? I must have missed that somewhere along the line.
Folks, Edgar is flat raking the ball. I liked that Thorman had some good swings as well. And how about the top of the order? I really like when KJ, Harris & Edgar leads off the game. It’s even better with Chipper back in there. If Cox will slide AJ down to 7th I think they become more of a force.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 7:48 PM | Link to this
Joebrave, Miss Manners wasn’t being insulting just observant … it’s an onion thing thing, Joe.
By Bob
June 16, 2007 7:48 PM | Link to this
We haven’t heard from No Chop or Mets Drool in two weeks or so.
By gd from NZ
June 16, 2007 7:53 PM | Link to this
I read all the negative comments when we lose and the positive ones when we win. Sometimes a little perspective is a good thing bloggers. It a long, long season.
I for one have always thought this is a good team, it just seems that twe have been thorugh a time where a number of players have gone into a funk at the same time, we’ve had nagging injuries - hopefully everyone is going to hit from here on in.
Major, major worry with Smoltz’s shoulder. i hope this is not one of those cases where it is hurting him for a awhile, he tries to play through it, goes on the DL, has an MRI, it shows up a problem, then we find he’s gone for the season.
Have we heard that scenario before…
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 7:53 PM | Link to this
Who left the screendoor open? Robert got in again.
By Bill
June 16, 2007 8:00 PM | Link to this
How many Braves fans out there would like AJ back next year? I sure as he— don’t. I wish we could give him his walking papers now. You can tell that TP is frustrated with him. He needs to be be benched for about two weeks and maybe he could get his head screwed back on.
By Jimbo
June 16, 2007 8:03 PM | Link to this
Hey Bobby….in case you haven’t noticed Fat Head Jones is in the dumper again and he’s killing you and the team. Do something about it.
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 8:03 PM | Link to this
(Everyone, please scroll past this. I need to respond to BobJ, and it will be of no interest to you. Please scroll!)
BobJ, I’m sure you know that Case merged with Western Reserve University, sometime around 1970, I think. I feel certain that your reference to Case as a “trade school” was tongue in cheek because you, more than anybody, would know that it is a highly respected engineering school.
My wife was accepted in Western Reserve’s medical school, whose stock went very high when it affiliated with the Cleveland Clinic. (She changed her mind and became a computer systems engineer instead. That’s how I know where to find the ESC key.)
I earned my first master’s degree at Case-WRU, which, by the way, is right next to Severance Hall, home of the world famous Cleveland Orchestra, and to the magnificent Cleveland Museum of Art.
The Emerald Necklace is one of the finest metro park systems in the country, and urban development has transformed the downtown area. The Ted and the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame are just two examples.
Years ago, standup comedians began singling out Cleveland as a hick town because they were unable to find many all night clubs where they could go get sloppy drunk following their gigs. Apparently, they felt this was an entitlement. Thus began such epithets as “The Mistake on the Lake.”
Sadly, a lot of people thought that these “celebrities” knew whereof they spoke, but I think they are the same people who become agitated when three minutes have passed without the latest news on Paris Hilton.
To borrow from JJS, Cato is not miffed or wounded because Cato is confident that what you said was in jest.
All you did was give me the opportunity to express some pride, shared by most Clevelanders, in a city that holds many wonderful memories.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 8:09 PM | Link to this
DOB, Got a question for you. You think BC will move AJ to 7th? It is time for him to move down in the order, this is BULLSH!T!!! He is killing so many rallies, that it is not even comical anymore!!!
By Alex
June 16, 2007 8:10 PM | Link to this
DOB you are now famous all across america, they mentioned the whole Scott Boras/Jason Stark deal and the blog here at the AJC.
By Jimbo
June 16, 2007 8:17 PM | Link to this
Bill
I’m with you. I can’t wait until that Fat Head is history here and I don’t care how well he plays CF. We can get someone almost as good defensively who is a much better hitter with a good plate IQ. Maybe someone like Torii Hunter?!?
By joebrave
June 16, 2007 8:22 PM | Link to this
Well the Braves won 2 in a row,wonder when Robot will start with his usual donkey rants and isms? I’m quite sure Bobby did something today he didn’t like….
DOB good piece on Smoltzie I feel much the same way..
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 8:28 PM | Link to this
I missed the game today but reading about Smoltz tells me that those who know how need to put in some overtime prayer for him!
Had some of the best just-out-of-the-Atlantic seafood you can imagine this evening! Flounder, shrimp, crab cakes, cole slaw and absolutely delicious Hushpuppies - with sweet tea and coffee. Ooooh, my goodness! )I would have invited you but couldn’t find your number……. :-) )
DOB, did you ever imagine that one little ol’ blog could bring so much attention?? :-) Who woulda thunk it?
By Paladin
June 16, 2007 8:38 PM | Link to this
Ms. Lady, You make me hungry as one who, in my “other” life, had that same menu in Morehead City. Enjoy! Paladin
By Ron
June 16, 2007 8:43 PM | Link to this
Jimbo, you said this: I’m with you. I can’t wait until that Fat Head is history here and I don’t care how well he plays CF. We can get someone almost as good defensively who is a much better hitter with a good plate IQ. Maybe someone like Torii Hunter?!? Dude Tori Hunter is having a great year, but his Career Average is 271!! Andruw’s Career Average is 264!!! And Andruw has way more Homeruns than Tori!!! Tori is not that good of a player offensively, he is doing great this year, but he is 32 years old!!! How is Tori’s 7 points Average much better than Andruw? Tori is not that good of a hitter trust me!!!
By A-ville Ranger
June 16, 2007 8:45 PM | Link to this
Eric instructing an underdeveloped mind to move on is a futile exercise.I’m confused, it seems that you’re suggesting there are better measures of a cities worth than the number of places to top off a buzz at 3 am.What am I missing here.
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 8:48 PM | Link to this
Evenin’, Paladin! There is some really fine seafood in Morehead! I love to go through there on my way back and forth to the Banks.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 8:55 PM | Link to this
I read the piece by “Da Homeboy”
It is certainly true that the league has wise up, to some extent, to JS, which has made it more difficult for him to operate.
In other words, he cant trade Melvin Nieves for Fred McGriffany more. He now has to trade at least a viable prospect, and sometimes they pan out, which opens him up for second guessing.
The budget constraints also mean that he cant resign everybody. The net is that whereas we used to use the weak and ineptly managed teams as a one way supply line, now sometimes real talent escapes.
But noone can be expected to be able to do what JS did for so long forever. Billy Beane doesnt have it as easy these days either.
Having defended JS to this point, I’ll now turn and offer one huge criticism- which has nothing to do with who he has brought in.
The only thing I can fault JS for is that he has always even failed to CONSIDER that Cox was the problem.
When something is just plain noy working, as evidenced by repeated failure, you have to go back and rethink it from square one, assuming nothing. This goes for any problem, not just playoff baseball. And JS’s assumption that Cox was the right guy - well, with my attitude about Cox’s ability, it qualifies for negligence.
To put it in short form, it didnt MATTER what players he shuffled or how he shuffled them. Until the joker was removed from the deck, it will remain forever impossible to deal a winning hand
By A-ville Ranger
June 16, 2007 8:58 PM | Link to this
Eric some of the best classical recordings ever are of George Zell conducting Cleveland orchestra performances of Mozart.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:02 PM | Link to this
Eric, just in case you missed it, my preoccupation was with the lack of familiarity with case without regard to Upper or Lower … and certainly nothing disparaging was intended to be directed toward Cleveland’s highly renowned institution, regardless of the case … or the name.
I applied to Case … and the scholarship, just in case I were to be accepted; back in the fifties when the only thing I knew about the Western was that it was held somewhere near Chicago.
On a less serious note, it was then and is now … one of my favorite schools, maybe because it hasn’t prostituted it’s dedication to learning as have so many … that you were my only reason for its mention is probably to belabor the obvious.
By way of possible explanation, I recently emailed a distinguished senior member of the MIT engineering staff and referred to it as the Boston Trade School … and I doubt that no Yellow Jacket takes umbrage to my referring to the North Avenue Trade School … I got used to so writing ‘cause I never could remember how to spell Institute before they invented the spell checker.
Just in case some folks decided not to scroll, there is no question that anyone having been graduated by the institution in question are the better for having been so done, regardless of their chosen arena.
As a bit of personal confession, had my grades in physics been above Case’s threshold, my scholarship would have covered living expenses … and I might have become an Indians’ fan … well, braves are Indians too so I guess that wouldn’t have changed.
As you know, I don’t believe in trading … but were I to have so done, methinks afternoon tea at Case would have suited me just fine!
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 9:03 PM | Link to this
carolina lady, that sounds delicious! please mail jimmy smith some fish. and carolina lady must submit a tee shirt idea. today, this journalist’s feeble efforts at a winning tee shirt slogan were disparaged in a public forum by a now nationally know blogmaster. oh, the humiliation! but baby seal has been at work today and has submitted what could be a winning slogan. no telling who may be reading these posts now so this journalist is going to have to improve this journalist’s image just in case a job in journalism is proffered. james smith out.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 9:06 PM | Link to this
“Robert, Dude since you had such a big problem with BC and Tim Hudson for throwing at Soriano last Sunday, what do you think about Bud Black”
Ron, I dont condone bush league behavior from any player on any team. I didnt come out and blast Bud Black or Chris Young cuz I dont a hoot how the Padres conduct themselves. That’s for Padres fans.
But I am not about to use one team’s bad behavior to justify the same from our team. I want my team to play hard, play well, and play with class - regardless of how the opposition conducts themselves
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 9:07 PM | Link to this
Carolina Lady, you’re making me long for my home state with talk of Morehead. Ah, our annual trip when the parents would pack us three kids in the car, both mom and dad smoking with the windows up or barely cracked (dad wouldn’t want to waste the AC, you know) and head to Atlantic Beach and Morehead City. Absolute paradise for a middle-class kid from Greenville, N.C.
Dinner at Captain Bill’s, which as a kid was like eating at the Waldorf-Astoria for this lad. Didn’t get much better than that.
Caught my first fish, a flounder, while fishing with my dad and brother right off the beach. Ahhhh…
OK, back to work
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 9:10 PM | Link to this
Joe Brave, thanks.
Fastasballs, go to the Braves page on AJC.com and there’s a place to click on to give your T suggestions.
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 9:14 PM | Link to this
Distinguished journalist James Smith, I’ll send fresh flounder, but unless you can hide its presence from You-Know-Who, you have little chance of enjoying it yourself! Give my love to Baby Seal!
I submitted a suggestion today, but don’t expect it to be a winner. Isn’t it interesting that the harder you try, the worse the results?? :-)))
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:16 PM | Link to this
Winning is good, don’t you think … especially in June!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 9:18 PM | Link to this
Robert, guess you want “your team” (now THAT is truly laughable) to play with as much class as you show in your sophisticated critiques of said team’s manager (hee-haw).
Whatever. Sorry about the two wins, by the way. I know it makes it harder for you to rip (oh, wait, no it doesn’t. You don’t seem to care much, if at all, what the final score is.)
OK, back to barnyard noises if you must. I’m packing up and logging off from Jacobs Field.
By Ron
June 16, 2007 9:18 PM | Link to this
Robert, read my 6:42 Post? Tell me what your oppinion on that situation is, because that is very interesting to know!!!
By Da Homeboy Upstairs
June 16, 2007 9:24 PM | Link to this
I dont condone bush league behavior from any player on any team…… But I am not about to use one team’s bad behavior to justify the same from our team. I want my team to play hard, play well, and play with class - regardless of how the opposition conducts themselves
Robert, you don’t think it is bush league behavior to come on here and call yourself a Donk and to incessantly ridicule yourself. Is that blogging hard, blogging well, and blogging with class?
Again, Robert. You need to stop blaming yourself so much for these postseason failures that were inevitable due to my shortcomings as a GM. Really, with those benches and bullpens I kept giving you, you and your boys never had a shot against evenly matched teams. Sorry about that. But Robert you need to stop coming on here and blaming yourself so much. Calling yourself a Donk everyday on here is about as bush league as it gets. Send a little blame and ire towards the homeboy upstairs ‘cause the Teflon John can handle it.
By I'M A LUMBERJACK
June 16, 2007 9:24 PM | Link to this
THE BALLAD OF SCOTT THORMAN
SCOTT THORMAN WAS TALLER THAN A MAPLE TREE
BIGGER THAN KING KONG IN THAT OLD MOVIE
WHEN BIG SCOTT SWINGS HE TAKES AN AWESOME HACK
AND STIRS UP THE DUST BUT HE DON’T HIT JACK
CHORUS WELL SCOTT’S THE KING OF LUMBER, HE’S A MIGHTY MENSCH
TOO BAD THAT LUMBER IS ATLANTA’S BENCH
WE ALL KNOW HE IS WAY OVERDUE
HOW CAN HE BE HITTING ONLY TWO-TWENTY-TWO
WHERE EVER SCOTT TRAVELS HE BRINGS HIS FRIEND
PETE, HIS FELLOW CANADIEN
WHO’S AVERAGE IS ALSO WAY TOO LOW
SOON THEY’LL BE PLAYING TOGETHER DOWN IN MEXICO
REPEAT CHORUS
BOBBY COX STILL GIVES HIM LOTS OF LOVE
JUST LIKE ANDRUW HE’S NEEDED FOR HIS GLOVE
HE’LL KEEP PLUGGING AWAY ‘TIL HIS BATS ARE ALL BROKE
EVERYONE KNOWS HE’S A GOOD HEARTED BLOKE
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:25 PM | Link to this
My Lady, that’s perceptive! As you know, I often say that it’s the unprepared student who finds the test to be easy.
However, in today’s environment, it may well be the teacher who makes the test easy for purposes of personal survival … and, of course political correctness.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 9:28 PM | Link to this
Ron, I did just that. I dont know the whole story on the Padres incident, but it doesnt justify how the Braves conducted themselves against the Cubs.
Two wrongs dont make a right.
Except when two donkeys managing against each other in a WS means one donkey will be credited for a WS win. (see 1995)
By Da Homeboy Upstairs
June 16, 2007 9:28 PM | Link to this
I am kind of angry with the Almighty right now. Noah is on my sh!t list as well. Why did God have to tell Noah to bring two of every animal? That means there is another Robert out there.
By MEB
June 16, 2007 9:28 PM | Link to this
Carolina Lady… inquiring minds want to know what was for dessert? Nothing real heavy so maybe some home made peach ice cream would hit the spot.
Braves have had a roller coaster ride the last couple of weeks but I like where we sit. Speaking of roller coasters its been a long time since I’ve been on a good one. Busch Gardens in Tampa has some first class coasters. Of course you might want to ride before such a fine supper.
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 9:35 PM | Link to this
Those were indeed wonderful times, David! A kid could drop a line in the ocean or in the sound and bring home supper any time you wanted. Crab along the waterline to your heart’s content. Come in salty, sunburned, happy right through to your soul, and starving! What precious memories those are!
Now, you have to have a LICENSE for that! Shame on the state for that! They never overlook an opportunity to impose another tax!
Which reminds me of a story:
Ol’ boy was caught by the Fish & Game warden leaving the beach with a bucket of fish.
Warden asks him for his license and the ol’ boy tells him he don’t need one ‘cause he ain’t fishin.
The Warden gets red in the face, points the the bucket and says, “Well, just tell me what you’re doing with that bucket of fish!”
The ol’ boy says, “These are my pet fish and I bring them down for a swim now and then. I whistle and they all jump back in the bucket and I take them home again.”
Warden says he ain’t never seen anything like that - and the ol’ boy says, “Well, come on, I’ll show you.”
Back down to the water’s edge, in go the fish, and they stand there for a few minutes while the fish disperse in all directions.
The warden says,”OK, whistle the fish back.”
Ol’ boy says, “What fish?”
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:36 PM | Link to this
Robert, It’s a shame you can’t come out behind the mask more often!
I am not about to use one team’s bad behavior to justify the same from our team. I want my team to play hard, play well, and play with class - regardless of how the opposition conducts themselves is extremely well said!
David O’B was saying the same thing about bloggers!
Kudos to you both!
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 9:39 PM | Link to this
A-ville Ranger
some of the best classical recordings ever are of George Zell conducting Cleveland orchestra performances of Mozart.
How true! I still remember a music critic from Los Angeles, which I understand is not far from Hollywood. He panned the Cleveland Orchestra for being “too perfect.”
BobJ, I enjoyed your reflections, my friend. Trust me, I would never take you more seriously than you take yourself.
By journalist jimmy smith
June 16, 2007 9:39 PM | Link to this
oh, the humanity! the humanity! baby seal has a winner! but those ajc folks credited jimmy smith instead. well, they have to credit a real person, right? and baby seal is, alas, a seal. but baby seal does subscribe to the ajc now so that baby seal can read mark davis. and where is all the jubilation for baby seal tonight? jimmy smith must admit this recognition is somewhat tarnished by dob’s earlier comments about this particular slogan. still, when dob sees what else baby seal sent in, dob will be grateful this one was selected. and now, a fresh flounder is in order for baby seal. now, andruw … andruw looks sad. andruw has become an easy out. when jimmy smith was growing up, jimmy smith’s buddy, earl, was an easy out. earl was dropped in the order and one time the team tried to skip over earl altogether. it did not work. being an easy out is not fun. being an easy out in a walk year is especially not fun.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:42 PM | Link to this
Woman, you made me pee!
By bravesfan
June 16, 2007 9:43 PM | Link to this
If Edgar Renteria does not make the All Star team they should quit letting the fans vote because among NL SS he is 1st in average, 4th in home runs, 4th in runs, 2nd in doubles, 3rd in RBI’s, and 2nd in OPS. He is the best all round SS there is. Everybody vote for EDGAR!!!
By eric the elder
June 16, 2007 9:44 PM | Link to this
BobJ, and of course when I said “the Ted” I meant “the Jake.” Apparently 23 years of living in Atlanta has cut the Cleveland umbilical.
By Robert
June 16, 2007 9:45 PM | Link to this
“Is that blogging hard, blogging well, and blogging with class?”
You know, I have made posts that I wish I hadnt. Stupidity annoys me to no end, and the battle I am waging to open the eyes of Braves fans puts me against very deeply entrenched and very cleverly presented misinformation that is very vehemently defended by the moderator, as such,of the blog.It’s frustrating
If I were to be blunt,I’d say that I find it hard to debate respectfully with people who worship an idiot
Dont think I havent noticed that DOB constantly vows to and encourages others to ignore me, and then responds to something I have said -
Why do you think this is? Folks,if what I said was bs, DOB WOULD ignore it. But truth cant be ignored.
Predictions.
No Cox managed team will ever win another WS
The first year the Braves are managed for the full season by someone other than Cox will see them at least 10 games better than they perform in the last full season being managed by Cox
3.The Braves will not only go to, but will win, a WS within the first five years of the post-Cox era
Time will vindicate these predictions
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 9:45 PM | Link to this
MEB, fresh cold cut-up strawberries with sugar on them. Mine are still in the refrigerator - ‘cause I just didn’t have room for them! :-))
(Hope you’re well!)
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
Apologies, My Lady, it’s been a long day and your story reminded me of some of Virgil’s actual encounters with the Game Warden! It may have been what inspired him to give up fishing and write poetry!
Cato, you are my personal AllState!
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 9:55 PM | Link to this
CONGRATULATIONS, Baby Seal….I mean, Jimmy Smith!!! Way to go!!
BobJ,????
By Ron
June 16, 2007 9:55 PM | Link to this
Jimbo oh Jimbo, Got some stats for you dude: This compares Torii Hunters numbers with Andruw Jones numbers:
Torii Hunter Andruw Jones
G- 1137 1675 AB- 4129 6087 R- 617 993 H- 1120 1609 2B- 233 319 3B- 25 32 HR- 178 353 RBI- 658 1065 TB- 1937 3051 BB- 294 681 SO- 813 1325 SB- 118 136 CS- 55 53 OBP- .325 .343 SLG- .469 .501 AVG- .271 .264
That is their career numbers!!! I do realize that Andruw has almost 2000 more AB than Torii does, but look at the numbers, and plus Andruw is almost 2 full years YOUNGER than Torii is!!! Andruw came up when he was 19 years old, and Torii came up when he was older, so consider all of that!!! By those numbers Andruw is Clearly the Better Offensive Player than Torii is and Is Much Better defensively!!! Yes I know tha Torii is having a better offensive year than Andruw, but remember the last few years when Andruw had 51 homers and 44(or however many that was) homers last year and Torii with at the most 30 homers in the Homerun Park!!! Andruw is CLEARLY the better offensive player!!! But we should use that money for some Pitching, not Andruw and Certainly not Torii Hunter!!!
By Robert
June 16, 2007 9:58 PM | Link to this
Bob, I wish I was perfect to the point that I could always hold the high ground in the way I conduct myself on the blog.
It’s a conundrum - to find a way to debate respectfully about someone you hold in contempt (which implies a lack of respect)
Would it be better if I used incompetent every time my gut is use stupid when referring to Cox?
I have said before that the reason Cox for Cox’s popularity is easy to explain. The ever scheming but hapless buffoon is a beloved icon in American culture, from the Stooges, thru Gilligan, Maxwell Smart,Charlie Brown, and Bobby Cox.
By KC
June 16, 2007 10:13 PM | Link to this
DOB (and others):
Look… as I said before, I’m not down on Kelly Johnson. I think KJ will be a fine major league hitter, and I’m not saying you give up on him now. I’m not saying that at all. And I suppose I would like to see KJ remain the everyday 2nd baseman a little while longer to see if he can recapture what he had at the plate in April.
But if in a month or two from now, KJ hasn’t regained his April form, and Harris is still getting on base anywhere near his present clip… I think in a pennant race, you’ve got to field the guys that are going to help you win NOW. Maybe the best option at 2nd base for winning now IS Kelly Johnson. Maybe not.
Tell ya what, I’ll simmer down and reserve judgment right now. If over the 4-6 weeks, KJ regains anything resembling his April form, then you leave him right where he is!! But if KJ hits.259 (with an OBP under .330) over the next 6 weeks as he has over the last 6 weeks. unimpressive at the plate, and Harris keeps doing his thing… I’ll be sounding the gong.
Many of you are quick to point out Harris’ career batting average against lefties. Let me ask you this (and please don’t miss this question)… Does anything Harris is doing right now bear ANY resemblance to the career averages compiled through years past???
No, I don’t think Harris is a .387 hitter. But at this point, is it silly to think that maybe Willie’s turned a corner in his career… that he’s not exactly anemic hitter he used to be? Could Willie Harris hit in the .280’s or .290’s and post an OBP in the mid or upper 300’s if he were playing everyday?
Harris (from what I hear) made some adjustments at the plate back in the spring at Terry Pendleton’s behest, which certainly seem to be bearing fruit. Also, this is only the second opportunity of Harris’ career to play on a regular basis, and he’s playing in a situation that he’s far more comfortable in than he has at any other point in his career. Does he look like the same old Willie Harris to you?
I agree that KJ appears more capable against lefties than Harris’. But it’s at least worth noting that Harris’ OBP against lefties this season is actually 1 point higher right now than KJ’s. I happen to feel that Harris could post an OBP in the mid-300’s against lefties if he were given the opportunity to play everyday. I could be wrong, but that’s my gut feeling.
Consider something else… Harris playing at 2B (be it playing every day or sharing time with KJ) is the only way to get Diaz in the lineup everyday. Matt Diaz now has 445 at-bats as a Brave, over which he has hit .333. Does a .333 hitter who wears out both righties and lefties, deserve to play every day?
By JasonInMaine
June 16, 2007 10:23 PM | Link to this
The NY papers are reporting the Mets have inquired about Beurhle and Lidge…ah, the endless pockets!
By MrC
June 16, 2007 10:28 PM | Link to this
Robert wants baseball teams to act with class yet his posts are far from “classy”.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 10:37 PM | Link to this
Robert, you don’t need to explain … many of us share your contempt of stupidity and I think your persistent redundancies do assist in the fight against apathy … but some of the pearls may be wasted … especially your bold predictions.
If Bobby does retire as indicated, the probability that you’re right about winning another World Series under his leadership might be reasonably estimated as 94%, were we to know nothing about any of the teams.
I will be interesting to see when it is that he actually does leave … and how the team responds. Given the youth and raw talent level of the team, steady and even drastic improvement in its record over the next few years is to be expected.
The probability of the team winning the World Series in the first five years following his departure only bespeaks what many of us think of his lasting influence … and the enduring quality of the organization he helped to establish.
That is to say, we directionally agree in our predictions and in a lot of what we have to say … it’s some of the “whys” and most of the “hows” that differ.
It’s amusing, interesting and sometimes bemusing … so many different Roberts … one thing for sure, it ain’t as plain and simple as some folks seem to believe.
By Wayne in Utah
June 16, 2007 10:37 PM | Link to this
KC Where ya been? A question for you? Do you think that maybe the reason Willie and Diaz are hitting so well is that they are somewhat protected from the rigors and pressures of playing everyday? You might be right about them, but I am not sure you pull your starting second baseman just because you THINK you might have one that might hit better. It’s a long season, so lets see how Willie and KJ are doing in mid to late July.
Look at Bobby’s patience with AJ. I don’t see him sitting KJ for Willie Harris any time soon.
I keep thinking about Marrero and Thomas from 2004.
Good win tonight. I would love to stick around, but I am fighting some sort of bug tonight, and I am going to be early. Let’s hope Davies gets back on track tomorrow.
What is that foul smell on the blog tonight?? Is “he who must not be named or responded to” bashing our manager again?
By Wayne in Utah
June 16, 2007 10:40 PM | Link to this
Jason Are they offering their rap star outfielder for pitching help????
By StingerSplash
June 16, 2007 10:41 PM | Link to this
DOB, Don’t get down on yourself for your poor grip of Spanish, since I have none. I’m surprised more papers don’t have their writers, particularly those covering business or baseball, take or set up some Spanish instruction for them. My brother’s firm did that for him when he was stil in the shirtmaking industry. I would start a barbecue war here (I lived in Carolina and just couldn’t get the hang of the vinegar on the meat. Couldn’t do it. Gotta have my sauce, man), but why run down anyone’s taste in an otherwise acceptable staple of life.
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 10:43 PM | Link to this
Congratulations Baby Seal! I knew he who shall not be named would take credit … but, we know the truth!
By snowball's chance
June 16, 2007 10:43 PM | Link to this
Edgar is a lock for the allstar team. But will it be because he deserves it, which he does, or will it be because the Braves have to have one player representing them. ESPN has some sabermetric formula for who should be on the team. Edgar is highest in the standings for a Brave. The next Brave on the list is Kelly Johnson. If he is sent to Triple A or benched can he still be an allstar? How about waiting till he gets back from the Allstar game to bench him. Tim Hudson was on the list but now he isn’t. He had a good game in the meantime so maybe the statistical model is broke.
By KC
June 16, 2007 10:48 PM | Link to this
Wayne In Utah: Hey man! Schedule has been crazy lately. Not much time to hang in the ole Braves blog of late. =(
I think you certainly bring up a valid point. I think it’s much more valid in reference to Harris than it is to Diaz. Diaz hits righties, he hits lefties, he hits when you start him, he hits when you bring him off the bench. He hits at home, and he hits on the road. I’ve seen enough from Diaz over the past 2 years to be confident that he’s a .300 hitter through and through.
Harris… I have to admit that the jury’s still out. All I’m saying is that if KJ hits around .259 over the next 6 weeks as he has over the last 6 weeks… it’ll be time to give Harris a crack at it (assuming Harris is still looking good in 6 weeks).
Hopefully, KJ will regain his April form (or something close to it), and there will be no reason to have this conversation!
By Bob, Journalist
June 16, 2007 10:51 PM | Link to this
Wayne in Utah, you’re right! He should leave Kelly out of it …. Kelly knows how, he just isn’t … put Willie in Center and Andruw on the Bench!
Then give Andruw a hug and resign him after he gets the message. He’s currently being done a great disservice … but, it’s been going on for years.
By chrisklob
June 16, 2007 11:00 PM | Link to this
Jason, where are you seeing the reports on Buehrle and Lidge going to NY? None of the main-stream sites are reporting that. Any idea who they’re trading away?
By choppinmama
June 16, 2007 11:01 PM | Link to this
Toe news! Toe news! Baseball Tonight has officially bestowed the title Master Toe-Tapper on our very own Chipper Jones. Hoss was used as the BEST example of using the toe-tap as a timing device. No head-bobbing while using the toe-tap however.
Today was more like it! Can Edgar do it any better? What a great way and great time to pick your team up and keep those baserunners in motion. C’mon denizens, keep those All-Star ballots for him pouring in. He deserves a spot.
AJ - 0-fer, 3 K’s right? Boras has to be using a page out of Bobby’s Positivity Manual to keep the PR surrounding Andruw in a positive vein during this mighty struggle. Flashes of recovery up at the plate, then another night like this. Still behind you 100% though, ‘Druw. (not so much your underhand flip back to the infield, however)
MR. John Smoltz, you are HOF material without a doubt.
Bye bye, Byrdie!!
By fastasballs
June 16, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this
JJS, So are you the inaugural shirt contest winner? Are there any actual T-Shirts or are they all of the virtual variety?
Your story of earl reminded me of my Pee Wee league, I may have been 10 at the time. We were up a run in the last inning of the game. I don’t recall all the specifics, but they had a few guys on base & there were two out. We were relieved to see one of their bench warmers grabbing a bat. Our league had a rule that every kid had to play an inning or two so that’s why he was in the game.
Their coach proceeds to call time, says the kid had to go to the restroom. The kid heads off to the restroom with about 3-4 teammates. A minute later here they come, but to our surprise one of their best hitters is now striding to the plate. The coach had sent them in their to swap jerseys so the good hitter got to hit instead of the automatic out. We didn’t have names on the back, just #’s so the scorer wouldn’t know the difference. We couldn’t believe what was happening.
Our players are raising hell & so are the parents, but our coach just stands there doing nothing. We knew what was going on (because a bunch us went to school with those kids), but why didn’t our coach? Parents are really giving our coach hell, but he never moves or says anything except to instruct the pitcher to throw the ball. Being 10 we figure he’s too old or he can’t see what had happended so our pitcher yells over to the coach about what’s going on. Our coach just points to home plate & says pitch or I’m taking you out for someone who will.
Our confused, angry pitcher finally gives up and toes the rubber. First pitch, ping! Lands near or against the fence, two come in to score. Game over, we lose. At that point gloves, hats & wrist bands are being thrown in disgust. I’m sure the parents were raising hell, but being 10 we’re not going to notice during the greatest moment of injustice in our young baseball careers.
While the other team is jumping up & down celebrating, our coach strides to home plate. He and the umpire are talking, then both turn to the scorer of the game behind the fence. We are already lined up for the after game hand shake when the umpire calls the opposing team’s coach over.
About 30 seconds later the umpire raises his hand & yells “out” # 3 game over. Our coach grinning ear to ear walks over to us & tells us we won the game because they batted out of order. He said he had to let a pitch be thrown before going to the ump. The weak hitting kid was not even due up, he had jumped the gun & I guess their coach in a fit of panic, after seeing him grab a bat, didn’t bother to check his score book to see who was suppose to be batting.
Anyway it was a great leason for us in how to be patient & that in the end cheating isn’t worth it. After that we all thought our coach was the smartest man alive & never questioned anything he ever told us for the rest of the season.
Sorry for the long post.
By Greg in TN
June 16, 2007 11:05 PM | Link to this
Evening Friends and Neighbors…
Got to say that our trip back to the land of the Cuyahoga has been both fun and profitable to this point.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, your next Mayor of Atlanta/Governor of Georgia…. Edgar Renteria. He’s come up clutch more than a few times this year. There are a lot of SS candidates out there for All Star consideration but I’ll be disappointed if Edgar isn’t named to the NL squad.
Great comeback last night thanks to the ninth inning double by Escobar and great work today by Smoltz and the aforementioned Edgar Renteria. We’ve shaved another game off the met’s lead. This is certainly good to see after the Twins series.
Good to hear the mention in the broadcast today of DOB and his ‘As The Blog Turns’ episodes during the week with Stark going up against Bora$.
Telling comments from Smoltz on the post-season frustrations we’ve all felt. Thanks for bringing them to us DOB.
The Mississippi Braves will be up here during the last weekend in June. Already have tickets to the Saturday night game and will likely go again either Sunday or Monday. I am anxious to see both Brandon Jones and Matt Esquivel and hope that I’ll be able to see Jo-Jo Reyes.
Let’s not ease up on the throttle folks, we need to come out tomorrow and do more of the same. Two of three in Cleveland is great, but a sweep would even be better.
By Carolina Lady
June 16, 2007 11:26 PM | Link to this
Fastasballs, excellent story!
By David O'Brien
June 16, 2007 11:42 PM | Link to this
Snowball’s Chance, you cracked me up just now. I’m reading your post and see this regarding the All-Star formula on ESPN:
“The next Brave on the list is Kelly Johnson.”
And I immediately think I’ll post a line saying, should they let him get back from the All-Star Game before they tell him his starting job’s going to Willie Harris?
Then I see you beat me to the punch with your next couple lines: “If he is sent to Triple A or benched can he still be an allstar? How about waiting till he gets back from the Allstar game to bench him”
Good stuff, man. And perhaps the most ridiculous non-Robert assertion of the day, surprising in that it came from a sane person (KC I’m talking about).
By Greg in TN
June 17, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this
Hey DOB,
Can you give me a little insight on Chino Cadahia? I didn’t expect him to be the one to succeed Pat Corrales as bench coach so I’m kind of curious as to what are his strengths as seen within the organization.
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 12:02 AM | Link to this
KC, seriously, what you’re suggesting is so far beyond the pale, so illogical, I honestly just don’t understand how you can say it and expect me or others to agree with you:
Over the past month (since May 15), Kelly Johnson has hit .297 (33-for-111) with four doubles, four triples, three homers and 15 RBIs in 28 games and a .356 OBP, and you think he’s “slumping” enough to warrant even CONSIDERING giving his job to Willie Harris? And you’re serious about this? Really?
For the season, K.J. has hit .285 with 13 doubles, six triples, eight homers, 36 RBIs and a .384 OBP and .482 slugging percentage, a pace that would yield 30 doubles, 14 triples, 19 homers and 84 RBIs — FROM THE LEADOFF HITTER.
And you, with a straight face, are suggesting it’s time to consider giving his job to Willie Harris?
Wow. That’s a head-scratcher. Hey, to each his own. Fortunately, there’s not even a remote chance anyone in the organization is thinking or discussing that possibility. So no big deal. Harmless of you to suggest it. Just seems so odd.
By The Truth Hurts
June 17, 2007 12:06 AM | Link to this
This is Kelly Johnson’s first full year in The Show. He’s playing pretty competently at a new position. He’s leading off for a potential playoff team. He hits lefties as well as righties. He gets on base.
What exactly is one’s measure of success these days? Ricky Henderson? Ty Cobb?
I’ll tell you what…if Cox puts Willie Harris at 2nd to “get his bat in the lineup,” I will change my name to “Robert” and walk around braying all day.
By KC
June 17, 2007 12:19 AM | Link to this
DOB: Yes, I agree that there’s no chance of that happening, regardless of what anyone thinks.
All I can say is, once again… give KJ and Harris another 6 weeks. If KJ hits .259 with an OBP in the 320’s over the next 6 weeks as he has over the last 6 weeks, and if Harris continues to look good over that stretch… you have to consider it.
And again, I’m not down on KJ overall. I think he’s going to be a good one. The fact that he’s hit .297 over the last month (I didn’t realize that) certainly makes me feel better. I just saw what he’d done since May 1st and was a little discouraged, after he looked so damn good in April.
I hope KJ swings a great bat between now and the all-star break, and then there will be absolutely no reason to have this conversation. Of course… as I mentioned before, there probably isn’t anyway since you’re absolutely correct in saying that the thought hasn’t even crossed BC’s mind and surely won’t anytime soon.
By choppinmama
June 17, 2007 12:21 AM | Link to this
Toe news! Toe news! Baseball Tonight has officially bestowed the title Master Toe-Tapper on our very own Chipper Jones. Hoss was used as the BEST example of using the toe-tap as a timing device. No head-bobbing while using the toe-tap however.
Today was more like it! Can Edgar do it any better? What a great way and great time to pick your team up and keep those baserunners in motion. C’mon denizens, keep those All-Star ballots for him pouring in. He deserves a spot.
AJ - 0-fer, 3 K’s right? Boras has to be using a page out of Bobby’s Positivity Manual to keep the PR surrounding Andruw in a positive vein during this mighty struggle. Flashes of recovery up at the plate, then another night like this. Still behind you 100% though, ‘Druw. (not so much your underhand flip back to the infield, however)
MR. John Smoltz, you are HOF material without a doubt.
Bye bye, Byrdie!!
By N8
June 17, 2007 12:23 AM | Link to this
DOB
What’s your take on what happened in Chicago today, with Young and Lee?
I know you think highly of Lee, so personal feelings aside, do you think what was done by Young was justified, since Soriano “doesn’t get it”?
I find it interesting, that both Young and Hudson, chose the next day to do something about it.
On a side note, have you ever seen the movie The Commitments? Watched that last night. Not as good as Spinal Tap, but super funny, none the less. Took me about 4-5 times watching initially to “get it all”, due to the very heavy Irish accents in the movie.
Did you check out the Rescue Me episode from last week yet?
Now two baseball questions.
1) Any “more” word or newer info, with our “DH games” of interleague play ending tomorrow, on whether Pena is gonna get called up, as to better utilize Salty at both 1B and Catcher, while NOT leaving us without an ample backup for McCann?
2) Honestly, HOW MUCH LONGER can Bobby actually leave AJ in the cleanup spot?
By my “unofficial” count, that’s only 5 questions.
Sorry. It’s late, I’m bored and am waiting for my wife to finish watching her “home makeover” shows (I think she watches about 700 of them), so I can go watch the game, which I DVR’d today.
KC
Is that REALLY you posting? I thought you were Mr. Optimism? The old KC would be saying something like:
“Man, KJ, while still being productive, sure has fallen off from his April pace. I’m sure he’s got at least a couple of those streaks in him, yet.”
You get the picture. Just ironic/weird, if you ask me. Normally YOU would be the guy ripping somebody for saying somthing so negative about a Brave that for the most part, has had a VERY nice season, in his first full season. Especially for a guy playing a position he has NEVER played professionally, until this year.
Like I said….weird.
By fastasballs
June 17, 2007 12:30 AM | Link to this
With right handers scheduled for the next 6 starts against the Braves I’ll assume the line up we saw today will be the same for a while. Of course Chipper will play when they get back home & Escobar will go to the bench.
I really like the line up from today & think they can get in a groove a little bit. Andruw has to move down a spot or two, a no brainer at this point. They need either Frenchy or McCann to get hot & runs will come in bunches. Enough to counter what Davies & James allow? I’m not sure.
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 12:38 AM | Link to this
Robert I appreciate the sarcasm, and I too so wish, but perfection cannot be achieved, even for the persona … at least not by me or mine.
Methinks it’s impossible to really judge, from the outside looking in … but, successfully managing a large group of divergent personalities is quite complex and requires genius that few of us possess.
Were I to think that Cox enjoys his reputation with players because he gives them freedom to be themselves … then I would probably share more of your opinions … kids lack the necessary planes of reference for that to be viable; certainly not without strong leadership and direction. We may not agree with how he accomplishes his objectives or with his time table for so doing … but accomplish them, he has.
I see Bobby as a stern prowerbroker, deft in leaving such an impression with his charges while getting close to maximum effort. We’re on the outside looking in … we see what he wants us to see and hear what he wants us to hear.
Granted, a lot of what we see and hear … is not what we see and hear … but rather for what we are looking and listening.
I also think it’s fair to suggest that each season presents different challenges and that he has shown considerable dexterity in adjusting as necessary to meet those challenges. It would be inconsistent for you to herein agree but I would hope that you also so think.
While perfection cannot be achieved, even for Bobby or Wally Cox … Bobby’s a master with few equals when it comes to managing people and he’s also been a good field manager … I personally continue to so think though I would prefer more evidence of the strong leadership and direction for which I have given Bobby and staff credit.
However, we’re on the outside looking in, and not in a good position to judge … were that not to be the case, we could see the master at work and learn how he does his tricks … but then the all the magic would be lost!
Robert, there’s little question that neither of us are bashful about making posts that are considered heresy in some quarters and draw the ire of the majority … this may be one of them … we just play to different majorities.
Goodnight Miss Allen
By Ron
June 17, 2007 1:01 AM | Link to this
Some of yall have asked how can you find the Buerhle and Lidge to Mets Rumors!!! mlbtraderumors.com they have Milledge and Humber or Pelfrey, one or two of them may be goin there!!! But that is a rumor, and most rumors never amount to anything!!! Although I do think the White Sox will trade Buerhle, and the Mets would probably have the most to offer!!!
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 1:07 AM | Link to this
N8, just got back from a visit to the Warehous District a few blocks from the hotel. Wow, was that hoppin’. Folks wall to wall, of all ethnicity. Good scene. And tons of bikes (of the motor kind) everywhere. Niiice.
Anyway … will watch Rescue Me when I get home tomorrow on DVR…
Andruw hit fifth today behind Edgar and Chipper, has been bouncing between 4-6 spots. Tough to justify a .211 hitter in middle of order, agree….
No pitcher’s justified in throwing near the head. If he meant to come inside, that’s fine. Even put one in the guy’s ribs; that’s part of the game, and I have no problem with it. If your teammate going to be jackball like Soriano is, someone else might have to pay to get it through to him (think about it, hitting D Lee could, in the end, sending an even stronger message than hitting Soriano; you want D Lee, the most respected guy on the team, angry at you if you’re Soriano?).
If it just got away from him, that’s one thing. But D Lee is 6-5, and that’s really getting away from you, to throw it that high and at his ear. I find it hard to believe he wasn’t trying to go way up and way in. You can’t throw at guy’s heads. No way, ever. Ribs, shoulder, butt, legs, fine _ but not at the head.
Since I can’t say for certain if he was aiming there, I’ll reserve judgment. If D Lee felt the need to do what he did, Young had to have said something else unwise to provoke it. Hey, man’s gotta do what he feels he’s gotta do….
Don’t know about Pena. But heard something to keep an eye on _ Mendez, the older catcher/1B at Richmond who’s hitting .289 (has always hit in the minors), could be a third catcher/1B called up instead of Pena.
They might be trying to show another team that Pena can play a lot of positions. I heard that from someone today who usually has good info. We’ll see.
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 1:17 AM | Link to this
Cato, another reason I chose Tech over Case was because I didn’t like the idea of shoveling and driving in the snow!
However, fifteen years later, in the late sixties, I lived in South Dakota for two years … and 1985 - 1992, lived in Columbus, OH … proof positive that survival is possible … though my attitude toward Ohio State is somewhat different than toward CWR!
By N8
June 17, 2007 1:25 AM | Link to this
DOB
“Andruw hit fifth today behind Edgar and Chipper, has been bouncing between 4-6 spots.”
Haven’t watched game, nor did I check the box score, so I appologize for b!tching about a detail I was wrong about. Agreed though, that even batting 6th is too HIGH.
“No pitcher’s justified in throwing near the head.”
Absolutely agree. Even with my sarcasm the other day, I really don’t wish harm upon anybody. Throwing at the head is NOT cool. I was more so referring to retaliating in general.
Interesting info on Pena/Mendez. Appreciate it.
Alright, time to go watch the game.
Have a good night, thanx for the info.
By Trav in Alpharetta
June 17, 2007 1:42 AM | Link to this
DOB
Anything on the Griffey to the Braves rumors? I’m just curious if there is anything of substance to all the talk.
thanks
Trav
By A-ville Ranger
June 17, 2007 1:47 AM | Link to this
KC I don’t think in any way Kelly should be demoted.On the other hand it wouldn’t be the craziest damn old thing to ask if Harris at one and KJ at two might maximize the yield of both better.I’m not advacating the change be made as I’m trying to quit on doctor’s orders.Well he didn’t exactly order me,he just said I have some dumb assed opinions.I’m not really even sure he’s a doctor, he was a guy wearing a smock in a bar.Come to think of it he could be an escaped mental patient or something…..what was I saying…. oh yea, good game. go Bravos !!
By DonCoburleone
June 17, 2007 1:51 AM | Link to this
Huge back to back wins… Now lets get the sweep! HE’S CHUCK JAMES B!TCH!!!
By GermanBravesFan
June 17, 2007 2:06 AM | Link to this
Two in a row and counting! Got home a bit late tonight and wasn’t able to follow the Blog… But I can see that it’s the usual stuff: AJ not hitting (yet), Robert being Robert (will he ever give us a break?), etc.
Good to see we got two in a row from a good team! Things will come together once Andruw starts hitting (being it in the 6 or 7 spot) and we trade for a number three starter (any leads on that, DOB?). I think the rotation will be fine with Smoltz, Hudson, #3 starter, James and Carlyle.
GO BRAVES!
By DonCoburleone
June 17, 2007 2:41 AM | Link to this
I love tequila… This next shot of Patron Silver is for John Smoltz. The old man struck out the first 5 batters in the game (if you don’t count the Sizemore double)…
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 2:45 AM | Link to this
DOB
What is the possibility that we get a decent starter for Pena and any of Reyes/Boyer/Harrison? I at one time heard the Chi Sox are most interested in a younger catcher to replace Pierzynski a either a young starter or a major league ready reliever…and would be willing to part w/ Buehrle if those two demands were met.
Any of those guys I wouldn’t have a problem giving up, other than I have heard really good things about Harrison and I still feel Boyer could be really useful to this team…I just do not want to give up Salty or Escobar for ANYTHING really…unless they’re giving us a quality bat and a top-line pitcher for the stretch run and beyond, I’m not interested
By College Football Blows
June 17, 2007 2:53 AM | Link to this
I hope cox dosent go back to his “well im happy to take 2 out of 3” …… lets start woodward and orr! Almost as fustrating as watching redmens starts. Even thou we all knew he sucked since his 1st start. Ahh the fustration….harris, diaz and salty are making this bench look alot better lately…but still we gotta dump orr or woodward….(i perfer ex met trash woodward). Actually i perfer dumping both….neither are any good for anything but mediocure defense and laying down a bunt.
Go Braves! and please Bobby…..NEVER START WOODWARD OR ORR AGAIN! hey a fan can dream right? And i wanna make it clear…i was calling for escobar to be up here this whole entire season because i hated seeing orr/woodward start. A BIG TOLD YA SO! haha…. im glad it worked out thou….him and salty are impressive!
By Wayne in Utah
June 17, 2007 2:58 AM | Link to this
Hey, where is my buddy Serbok, the late night poster! I won’t be on long, just trying to get my head to drain for a few minutes.
BTW, I have been around the sun 3 more times than you, my friend!
I think our bud Bob, might have us both beat though. Quite the sage, he is!
I am looking for anybody in Utah named Robert, who might be a Braves fan. If found, I would like to get him hooked up with the DOB/MIB blog, so that we can once and for all dispell the myth that not all Robert’s are brain-dead!
By jed
June 17, 2007 3:13 AM | Link to this
i like to read bob, journalist’s posts in in the voice of stewie from “family guy.” yall should try it.
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 3:37 AM | Link to this
Just so long as you read them, Jed!
My Blog persona is one thing, some folks who know me call me Barney … I suppose for reasons of voice, character, and actions … however, I don’t see the connection. It’s true that I sometimes shoot myself in the foot but, unlike Barney, I carry more than bullet in my pocket.
By Coach (NOT DRINKING THE KOOL AID)
June 17, 2007 3:50 AM | Link to this
Nothing has changed in the world of Andruw Jones. He is still getting pitched fastball’s up and way , breaking balls down and in. He still can’t hit it and he should be dropped to eighth in the batting order. At least benched. Our best CF may be playing in Richmond. Andruw’s defense is no longer making up for his lost bat , he has become a liability. Yo, Drew ! Hey buddy , the advance scouts have your number. Isn’t it amazing what happens when Chipper gets back into the lineup ? Bobby , Andrew is 10 for 64 this month ( .156 AVG ) , he has now left 37 runners on base while totaling just 6 RBI in 16 games. anybody want to tell me what is wrong with this picture ?
By Double Deuce
June 17, 2007 3:50 AM | Link to this
Don C…Good job buddy, my kind of drink!!I’ll have one with ya!
Don’t know if anyone else listened to the Indians announcers today, but they were very complimentary to Tyler. Don’t even know who they are but both raved about him, yesterday and today. Funny that we don’t hear much about him from the Braves side. 6’4’, 250 and sits 94-97 range. He’s a huge part of the ‘pen and no one really knows who he is.
Haven’t weighed in on the Andrew Jones issue because for so long I didn’t know where I stood, and I’m not really sure where I stand right now. A very complex problem. I’m sure I’m not alone when I say I keep waiting for him to break out of whatever you call this funk he’s in. Is it the decline of a sometimes good hitter, or is it just a temporary slump? I think it’s to the point where Andrew was waiting to break out, and he has shown flashes of coming out of it only to regress to the point he’s at today, and I think he’s lost right now. You can have a #4 hitter who has occasional bad days, but when your supposedly power hitter strikes out and consistently chokes with runners in scoring position, then we have a problem. What does Bobby do? If you bench him you run the risk of really getting into his head, and if you move him down to the 7th or 8th slot his ego might get the best of him and that’s not what the Braves need. No matter what you think of Andrew, the Braves need his bat to win their division. Don’t give me the Willie Harris stuff either. He has been a huge surprise and is by all accounts, a gem of a person. But you don’t replace 40 hr’s a year with Matt Diaz and Willie Harris. So Bobby has a real problem here, one not easily dealt with as most bloggers here believe. I believe he needs to completely rethink his approach, forget he’s a #4 hitter, and concentrate on contact first and then go from there. Problem there is when you’ve been where Andrew’s been, how do you revert to a contact hitter and forget about stats until you can hit the ball again? Answer is, you don’t….and that’s his and Bobby’s dilemma.
By teoa
June 17, 2007 4:02 AM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist — agreed. I would’ve felt better about the Braves offensively today if they let Smoltz hit 9th and DH’ed for Andruw. That’s a huge handicap to have to include the most overrated outfielder in history (according to Stark) in the middle of your order. Hopefully Bobby will wise up and stop overrating him soon. Maybe when he’s hitting 8th, then I’ll agree with Borass that Andruw’s not overrated. Although after seeing what guys like Harris, Diaz, and Escobar have done in the 8th spot all year, I probably even expect more out of that position in the batting order than Andruw can offer right now. It’s amazing that people talk about Andruw as a future hall of famer when I’d rather see anyone else on the team (pitcher included most of the time) at bat in a crucial situation. That sounds like the definition of overrated in my opinion.
How many times has an alleged future hall of famer been considered the worst hitter on the team at the age of 30 by most fans? Sounds like a good Aflac trivia question. I’d put my money on Andruw as the one and only.
By teoa
June 17, 2007 4:23 AM | Link to this
DOB, nice work here…
‘Smoltz gets credit for a win and a quote — “Expect the unexpected, and vice versa”? — worthy of Yogi Berra.’
Hilarious. What exactly does this mean? What is the vice versa? “Expect the unexpected, and don’t expect the expected”? As the Guinness guys say, “Brilliant!”
By jed
June 17, 2007 4:26 AM | Link to this
What the double-deuce—
sorry…i got a new collection of family guys, so it’s on the brain. i agree AJ’s a problem but i dont think it’s that complex. bat andruw 8th until he picks it up. you know he cant be enjoying this, so he may actually welcome it.
bob,journalist—are you really a journalist? or is that part of the persona? gotta say…the persona sounds less journalistic and more patrician to me. but i have no problem with persona. it’s an endless series of personas, best i can tell. making a face for the faces, ts eliot called it.
By serbok
June 17, 2007 4:29 AM | Link to this
fastasballs Excellent! 11:03 pm post Thanx man:o)
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 5:04 AM | Link to this
Jed, I’m no journalist but I have been called Patricia too, though never before by T.S. Eliot! I just react to mind triggers like most folks do … it’s just that mine has one of its owon and I never know what it’s thinking.
Some people think I make this stuff up but i don’t … I just have a wierd way of talking … if I lied, I’d have to remember what I said and I have to check the cumputer to find out what day it is.
Coach, the problem with the picture is that it’s a snapshot that’s actually a moving picture that doesn’t move.
By serbok
June 17, 2007 5:23 AM | Link to this
Wayne Hope ya feel better soon~(head drainin’?) sounds loud? Bob, the journalist is quite the sage! I do agree! I was having a discussion 2night with my father who tried to enlighten me on the”intangibles of managing the braves”~ As you know~ I havent been in Bobby’s corner? seems he and Bob see what I havent seen? lol
By serbok
June 17, 2007 5:35 AM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist
Coach, the problem with the picture is that it’s a snapshot that’s actually a moving picture that doesn’t move.
Umm would that be considered existentialism? 12:38 post was Spot on Lad! :o)
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 5:36 AM | Link to this
Jed, apologies for the sloppiness!
I wouldn’t want you to think badly of me … when I said I didn’t lie, that wasn’t exactly 100% correct … what I meant to say was that there’s usually an element of truth somewhere to be found.
Happy Father’s Day everybody, especially the girls! If it weren’t for the girls, there would be no Father’s Day to celebrate!
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 5:49 AM | Link to this
Serbok, thanks, but the only thing I know about sage is that it’s good in potato salad, sausage, and cornbread dressing!
Time for coffee and a hot tub!
By serbok
June 17, 2007 5:51 AM | Link to this
Back to the game, Seems to me, Bravos are slowly getting it together~(don’t know about Bobby) :o) Carlysle looked good? james, looked good, and hudson? Did ok, did’nt he?:o) I worry that the braves are not telling everything about Smoltz, as I’m sure you all do. Braves have Always been a little less than forthcoming when it comes to “nagging” injuries. Pitched a helluva a game tho. Which i’m sure is SOP I am an optimist, we were fortunate to have the mut’s crash when we did. If it Ain’t broke don’t fix it? First Base hasnt been brokin lately? Question is? Will Bobby try to fix it? Sux there isnt any room for escobar:o( Has he ever played second base? LOL What a wonderful conundrum?
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 6:18 AM | Link to this
Lordie, what happened?
I beg for KC to come back because we needed him to bring balance to the force with his eternal optimism.
Somebody speculates that he has gone all Anakin on us and been led astray to the dark side of the force by Sith Lord Grinch.
Turns out the speculation was right.
KC comes back and he is now an eternal pessimist, making N8 look like the eternal optimist.
We have officially entered Seinfield’s Bizarro World.
Black is white, up is down, left is right.
Keep it up guys. It is working.
Switching N8 to the eternal optimist role and switching KC to the eternal pessimist role was a stroke of genius by Bobby Cox.
It has given us a two game winning streak.
Who says Bobby’s platoons don’t work?
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 6:49 AM | Link to this
For MLB second baseman, KJ is:
3rd in runs scored with 46.
6th in hits with 71.
8th in doubles with 13.
1st in triples with 6.
5th in homers with 8.
5th in RBIs with 36.
7th in stolen bases with 5.
1st in walks with 40.
4th in batting average at .283.
2nd in OBP at .384.
3rd in SLG at .482.
2nd in OPS at .866.
4th in pitches per plate appearances at 4.10.
4th in total bases.
5th in extra base hits.
3rd in Total Bases + Walks + HBPs.
But yet, there are those who say he should be benched in favor of Willie Harris?!?!?!?!? Bizarro world indeed.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 7:06 AM | Link to this
For MLB leadoff hitters, KJ is:
5th in runs scored with 46.
7th in hits with 71.
8th in doubles with 13.
4th in triples with 6.
6th in homers with 8.
1st in RBIs with 36.
26th in stolen bases with 5.
2nd in walks with 40.
10th in average at .291.
5th in OBP at .391.
5th in SLG at .492.
4th in OPS at .883.
5th in pitches per plate appearance at 4.10.
7th in total bases with 120.
4th in extra base hits with 27.
4th in Total Bases + Walks + HBPs with 160, behind only Grady with 176, Reyes with 164, Rollins with 162.
KJ, as the Guiness fellas would say, is BRILLIANT!
By Coach (NOT DRINKING THE KOOL AID)
June 17, 2007 7:16 AM | Link to this
There is just one problem with all those figures. Reyes plays for the Mets and Rollins plays for the Phillies. Speed does not slump.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 7:38 AM | Link to this
In a Bizarro World tribute to all the fathers out there, remember what Eddie Vedder often says at the beginning of Better Man, this is dedicated to the bastard that married my momma.
Or remember the 2pac lyrics in Dear Mama, Ain’t nobody tell us it wuz fair, no luv for my daddy, cause tha coward wuzn’t there, he passed away and I didn’t cry, cause my anger, wouldn’t let me feel for a stranger, they say i’m wrong and i’m heartless, but all along I wuz looking for a father—he wuz gone
If you have a good daddy, thank him with all you got in ya today. Not everyone is so lucky.
It takes half a second of lustful commitment to become a father and a lifetime of loving commitment to become someone’s daddy, dad, pops, poppa.
No more glorified sperm donors, please!
By Robert
June 17, 2007 7:50 AM | Link to this
“but, successfully managing a large group of divergent personalities is quite complex and requires genius that few of us possess.
Were I to think that Cox enjoys his reputation with players because he gives them freedom to be themselves … then I would probably share more of your opinions … kids lack the necessary planes of reference for that to be viable; certainly not without strong leadership and direction. We may not agree with how he accomplishes his objectives or with his time table for so doing … but accomplish them, he has. “
I disagree in two major ways
The primary job of the manager is to be the team’s startegist, not to be the team babysitter
Accomplish them he has? NO! Screamed from the rooftops no. Turning WS rosters into division championsahips is FAILURE, not accomplishment
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 7:53 AM | Link to this
Speed does not slump, eh?
You are the one who gives KJ a hard time about his performance in May, ain’t ya?
Reyes: .268 AVG, .349 OBP, .348 SLG, .697 OPS in May. Yes, speed does not slump. You are incorrect yet again.
Rollins: .250 AVG, .279 OBP, .400 SLG, .679 OPS in May. Yes, again, speed does not slump. You are incorrect yet again.
KJ: .259 AVG, .322 OBP, .426 SLG, .768 OPS in May. So, while KJ was slumping in May, he still was more consistent and his slump was not as bad as either Reyes or Rollins slumps in May. BUT speed does not slump right. Not to get all Shaun on ya, but speed is useless if you don’t get on base.
In April, these were the runs they scored: Rollins 26, Reyes 26, KJ 24.
In May, these were the runs they scored: Rollins 17, Reyes 16, KJ 16.
In June, these are the runs they are scoring, Rollins 10, Reyes 4, KJ 6.
Rollins is scoring more runs because of power and not because of speed. The differential in runs scored between Rollins, Reyes, and KJ is almost directly linked to the home run disparity.
Coach, seriously, call us when you want to come back from Bizarro World.
By ssiscribe
June 17, 2007 7:58 AM | Link to this
Good morning, denizens, and a Happy Father’s Day to all of us out there who are blessed to be daddies. Little Scribe and Baby Scribe already have made their request for where Dad’s lunch will be. Hint: Features great potato soup with cheese (a journalist staple) and hot rolls (another favorite of all scribes).
Now, scribes (wow! What transition from the noted Scribe): This Scribe, who technically is between jobs (but unlike some bloggers, Scribe is between jobs by choice and the status is just temporary; old job ended Friday, new gig begins Monday), has not had time to work on a T-shirt slogan. I see where the noted Journalist Jimmy Smith won the T-shirt contest. This Scribe tips the fedora worn by all classic old journalists to JJS. After setting up the home office today — there’s just something really cool about the words home and office together in the same sentence — the Scribe will begin work on a slogan that hopefully will win.
(After all, I haven’t been published by the AJC in five years, but anyway …)
Now, baseball: The Braves have played like crap for three weeks and find themselves 1 1/2 games out. Smoltz pitched well. The Braves have won two games against the best home team in baseball. Renteria and Johnson continue to prove they belong on the All-Star team. What do the bloggers who wanted to blow this team up three days ago say now, the Scribe wonders?
Off to teach Sunday school, then eat potato (and cheese) soup and hot rolls, set up the office and get ready for a big day tomorrow. And tomorrow night, Mrs. Scribe and myself will be in the upper deck, cheering on the boys as Red Sox Nation comes to town.
Selah. The Scribe abides.
—30—
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 8:03 AM | Link to this
There is just one problem with all those figures.
Yes, COach, they paint an overwhelming picture of how incorrect you are with your bizarre KJ position.
By Paladin
June 17, 2007 8:21 AM | Link to this
I’m turning over a new leaf: No more shots at u-no-who. It’s a standoff really. He knows more baseball than I do and I know a whole lot more about life than he does. But, this is a baseball blog, not This is Your Life___. So, I’ll just take my place on the rail with the rest of the elders and leave the in-fighting to you young studs and studettes. But, I leave with this thought. When BC is inducted into the HOF, and he will be, do you think they will have u-know-who be his presenter?
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 8:37 AM | Link to this
A Paladin putting down his sword. Braveheart says that is not permitted.
By Paladin
June 17, 2007 8:51 AM | Link to this
I , with permission from Charlemagne and the other douzpers, tap you, Sir Braveheart, on the shoulder with said sword. From here on out, defense of the realm is upon you.
By sri
June 17, 2007 9:03 AM | Link to this
Runs scored is highly dependent on the hitters behind you. Reyes has the ability to manufacture runs even if the hitters behind you dont hit. so even when he is slumping and doesnt get on base as much, he still managed to score the same number of runs in May/Jun. Reyes is also slugging lower than Rollins/KJ and still managed to score the same number of runs as them while the Mets 2-4 hitters are in a slump.
I have nothing against KJ, and am very happy with the way he is playing for the Braves. That he has 36 RBI from the leadoff spot (2nd on team) is a testament to how good a hitter he is. So why not maximize the opportunities for him to drive in a run by batting Willie leadoff in the games he plays. Willie has twice the number of stolen bases in half at bats, hopefully he will distract the pitcher. Currently he is the hotter bat between the two. I dont think the switch will hurt KJ’s ego/confidence. This just reflects how hesitant BC is to change/tinkering the lineup. I guess a too much tinkering the lineup is bad for a team, but in this case I dont think it hurts.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 9:44 AM | Link to this
SRI, It has nothing to do with speed. Rollins has 164 Total Bases + Walks + HBPs. Reyes has 162 Total Bases + Walks + HBPs. KJ has 160 Total Bases + Walks + HBPs. That is why as leadoff men, Rollins has scored 47 runs, Reyes has scored 48 runs, and KJ has scored 46 runs. It is not a coincidence.
You guys keep talking about how this speed is making all this difference. But if their total bases and their walks and their HBPs and their runs scored are all about the same, does that not tell you that the speed is meaningless as well as the stolen bases.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 9:50 AM | Link to this
One last thing. KJ has seen more pitches this season (1164) than any other leadoff hitter in the National League. That is what a leadoff hitter is supposed to do. Tire pitchers out, get in their pens, and pound their pens. Also, gives the other hitters more of an opportunity to see the pitcher.
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 10:02 AM | Link to this
Paladin, I’m moved. I think I’ll try, honestly, try, to join you on the sidelines in that regard. So I can stop feeling so in need of a shower every time I engage in debate with you-know-who.
Talking to such an inexplicably resentful person is bad karma for me, I believe. So thanks for the motivation.
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 10:27 AM | Link to this
Robert, sadly, methinks I’ve given you a bit too much credit. Your onion has far fewer layers than I had imagined … change the post’s leading adverb to a noun and morph it to and interjection.
By The Grinch
June 17, 2007 10:30 AM | Link to this
I must have missed the speculation about what I did with KC’s optimism…Dammit! There’s a failure in my intelligence network. Braveheart, only half a second? The average male OG lasts about 6 seconds(8 if you’re in to yoga)…try taking an extra zinc supplement. :-) Good point about KJ fouling off lots of pitches and working the count; there ought to be an important stat related to that.
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 10:55 AM | Link to this
Cato, another reason I chose Tech over Case was because I didn’t like the idea of shoveling and driving in the snow!
When my snow blower was no longer able to throw snow over the tops of the drifts, I arrived at the same conclusion, and that, in part, is how I became a Braves fan.
By Jim
June 17, 2007 10:59 AM | Link to this
Rollins is scoring more runs than KJ because he has Utley and Howard hitting behind him, while for KJ Chipper has been missing for the last 3 weeks and he has Andruw hitting behind him.
By Jim
June 17, 2007 11:18 AM | Link to this
Is Fausto a righty?
If so, here is the lineup I would like to see today: KJ, Harris (CF), Edgar, Chipper (DH), Salty (C), Frenchy, Diaz (LF), Thorman, Escobar.
I asssume McCann will be rested and I’d bat Escobar behind Thorman because I like the sequence of Escobar, KJ, and Harris better than Escobar, Thorman, KJ, Harris. Andruw needs to be rested (benched), but if he plays instead of Diaz, he should bat just ahead of Thorman in this lineup (where Diaz is slotted).
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 11:25 AM | Link to this
The hideous, well-documented performance of Andruw at the plate goes beyond Andruw, I think.
If there is not a shred of confidence that he will contribute, doesn’t that put increased and massive pressure on the likes of Francoeur, McCann, and Salty/Thorman to pick up the slack? Might that not partially explain some of their recent struggles, especially for Francoeur and McCann? (Salty seems relatively immune to it.)
I think the problem is bigger than Andruw himself. I see a ripple effect that poisons the well. Benching him or moving him to the bottom of the order would only make the need for others to step up even more obvious, which could result in others pressing even more.
Lacking a sudden and dramatic reversal by Andruw, I don’t see this problem going away.
By robdawg06
June 17, 2007 11:26 AM | Link to this
Good news is Braves are only 1.5 games back in the East. The bade news is Andruw is hitting .211 in late June and we have only 2 starters that can ba counted on (Smoltz & Hudson). But things can turn for the better. Andruw is capable of getting on fire and the Braves should look to get at least one starter from teams like the Rangers,Royals,Devilrays,etc. that are out of the playoff races. Kevin Millwood,Gil Meche,and Scott Kazmir come to mind (one from each team). I realize it would take a whole lot in trade to get Kazmir. But he could be the ace of the team the next 10 years too.
By Salty
June 17, 2007 11:35 AM | Link to this
What a neat quote by Paul Byrd, from the FoxSports site: “He was throwing 95 miles per hour, with 89 mile per hour sliders from hell,” Byrd said. “I would love for my shoulder to feel bad and take that out to the mound. He shut us down. He had great stuff. That was the dominating John Smoltz we know.”
Amen to that! Maybe 40 is the new 30-something!
By robdawg06
June 17, 2007 11:38 AM | Link to this
I’m with the OF of LF-Diaz,CF-Harris,RF-Francoeur too. You basically have to ask yourself would who is the weakest hitter of the 4 ? It’s a no- brainer that its Andruw (sad to say because I like him as a player).
By N8
June 17, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this
Eric
I think you’re pretty close in 11:25 post. Especially this line:
“Might that not partially explain some of their recent struggles, especially for Francoeur and McCann? (Salty seems relatively immune to it.)”
That’s why the kids did so well last year when Chipper was out, when Andruw was carrying the team.
I think (hope) we’ll see Francoeur and McCann step it back up, now that Chipper is back in the lineup.
As for Salty? Remember, he’s fighting for playing time, so he’s focussed right now. He literally has NO presure to carry the team, because he’s not in the lineup everyday.
Pressure, none the less, because I’m sure he wants to prove he belongs in the lineup. But those situations (wanting to play & feeling the need to pick up Andruw’s slack), are definitely two different animals, IMO.
Braveheart
“Switching N8 to the eternal optimist role and switching KC to the eternal pessimist role was a stroke of genius by Bobby Cox.”
I wouldn’t call me an optimist, much less and eternal one, just yet. LOL! Let’s put it this way, I always HOPE we do well. I’m NOT always optimistic, it will happen, and finally when I’m in the “not so optimistic” mood, I’m usually not surprised when we fail.
Also Braveheart, very nice posts regarding “fathers” in general, and the post referring to “speed not slumping”, (a theory I actually agree with), while showing how KJ has done compared with two guys with a LOT of speed.
Well done.
By Amber
June 17, 2007 11:48 AM | Link to this
bravesfanbob - hilarious!!
Ron, I have to say I said some of the same words as you while watching the game last night. I didn’t realized that Barroid was suddenly capable of hitting 8-9 home runs in a single game. WHY must we be subjected to every AB from now through (probably) the rest of the season??? And WHY the $)(&#$ does the Fox website need “minute by minute” updates?? Is he going to hit a home run in his sleep??
I could barely see our game at all, and I was far more interested in Smoltz’s extra stretching after pitches. Very concerning.
I did realize why Chipper and Smoltz are such great players, leaders, and faces of the franchise. Notice how they both come right back after sitting out with injuries? And even more, that they know when to stop. Players would do well to really listen to them and learn.
I know we promised to ignore Robert, but really now - Bonds can “execute every facet of the game” perfectly? Seen him in LF lately, Robert? You must be blinded like everyone else by the shine off his huge head.
A tale of opposites: Renteria is 5-5 with a homerun, while Andruw is 0-4 with a hat trick. He’s making me not sorry to see him go after the season.
By robdawg06
June 17, 2007 11:48 AM | Link to this
What about Andruw Jones & Scott Thorman traded to the Devilrays for Carl Crawford and Scott Kazmir ? That would give us a CF replacement and true leadoff hitter in Crawford plus a dominant #3 starter in Kazmir ! The Braves would have to eat a huge chunk of Andruw’s salary but it could be done. I’m just thinking out loud. I’m sorry if it offends the Andruw fans.
By chrisklob
June 17, 2007 11:53 AM | Link to this
Eric, I agree with your last post. It’s well-documented that the line-up is better with Chipper in it. The same must be true with Andruw when he’s hitting well. Those two are difference-makers when they are playing, and playing well.
Looking at the numbers from a previous poster, could you imagine how many runs scored KJ would have if Chipper hadn’t missed so much time and Andruw was hitting (at the very least) his own weight?!
By joebrave
June 17, 2007 11:55 AM | Link to this
Good Mornring ,to all,Here’s hoping fora sweep today,now if only I could smuggle Robots gameplan to Bobby somehow?NAH,We’d lose by 10 or more if I did that…. Once again Happy Fathers Day guys…..
And A.J.straighten your @ss up son and hit the damn ball….
By chrisklob
June 17, 2007 12:11 PM | Link to this
I wonder when AJ had his vision checked last? Maybe Diaz could give him the name of his optometrist. It made a world of difference for his defensive play this year!
I make this comment in jest — partially. Andruw’s 30 and I know that my vision started deteriorating at about that age. Might not be a bad idea.
By calibravesfan
June 17, 2007 12:13 PM | Link to this
regardding AJ: since the AL has a DH, perhaps its time to lobby for a DF (designated fielder) in the NL.
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 12:14 PM | Link to this
Elder Cato,
Folks what never experienced 101 inches of snow in their first winter north of Chattanooga, can’t relate to my wife’s comment that North Atlanta is far enough north for anybody!
Your comments regarding the hideous, well-documented plate performances of Andruw Jones is well received.
However, methinks a well deserved rest on the bench would also be well received by the players, for, as Houseman said, he earned it! Perhaps they have as well.
Herr Smoltz said that we should expect the unexpected … and it certainly would be unexpected if Andruw were to change … so maybe it will happen.
I understand the potential of added pressure with him out of the lineup … especially upon the French one, but at least they would have the benefit of one or two more chances during each potential rally with which to overcome that little obstacle … and the rest would do him good.
Strange how calls from grandkids can make you feel old and young at the same time.
Happy Father’s Day!
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 12:15 PM | Link to this
Andruw’s batting average is like the president’s approval rating of 29, which some have observed is below freezing.
Could it get any worse? Not really. Thermal properties aside, ice is still ice for all practical purposes. Bush could drop to 17 and Andruw to .185, and there would be no discernible difference.
If the kind of deal that robdawg proposes could be pulled off, which is highly unlikely, then at least Andruw would be out of sight and out of mind. As long as he’s with us and utterly failing, the pressure is on everyone else, although marginally less so with Chipper back.
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this
Today’s LINEUP IS:
Matchups for Boston: Chuck vs. Schill tomorrow, Huddy vs. Beckett on Tuesday, and Carlyle vs. J. Tavarez on Wednesday.
By Jim
June 17, 2007 12:27 PM | Link to this
robdawg, The Devil Rays are NOT going to trade Kazmir!! They have had high draft picks for the last few years and have made good selections. They are a young team that has some very good position players and need pitching. They are not going to trade away their young ace. (Based on their young talent, Baseball America projects them playing in the World Series in 2010 in their crystal ball forecast.) They have a surplus of young outfield talent and don’t need a struggling player who will be a free agent at the end of the year and who they would not be able to afford to re-sign. You are also ignoring the fact of Andruw’s right of refusal for any trade.
Also KC just paid Meche a large free agent contract to be the cornerstone around which they would like to build their rotation. I doubt he would be on the market for anything less than a very one-sided trade. Millwood is struggling this year and is expensive. We’d probably have to overpay to get him and he wouldn’t be a large upgrade.
We have players like Orr and Woodward on our bench because we have an $80 million payroll and cannot afford to have a more productive 24th & 25th man. When we talk about the payroll being kept at $80 million we are really talking about the payroll being reduced by inflation every year.
By snowball's chance
June 17, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this
DOB, Before all the recent publicity for The Blog you might have had a use for the one who will be nameless- Shake up the denizens, keep ‘em talking. Now with the recent influx of new blood it is time to discard him like an old pair of jockey shorts. You know the ones with the holes and the skid mark stains that the wife can’t get clean anymore. A single guy could of got another good year out of em but,no, the wife threw them out. But there is a time to let things go and it is past time for the one who will be nameless to go- Banished to the racist cretins on the other AJC blogs.
By Lew
June 17, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this
Coach of the Non Kool Aid Drinkers-No, speed does not slump, but the Mets and Phillies damn well did.
By Paladin
June 17, 2007 12:30 PM | Link to this
I wonder if any of the players, or BC himself, ever read this blog? I doubt it. But, if they do (and one in particular) please, Andruw, get your donkey in gear! We need you, son!
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this
Snowball’s Chance, agreed, but can’t banish him for merely being wrong. Sorry, just can’t do that. Folks are entitled to opinions, dunderheaded though they may be. When he goes over the line with the hate-filled comments towards the manager, that’s one thing. But merely being resentful or illogical isn’t reason enough.
But Paladin’s lead on this, I can certainly follow.
By the way, Paladin, they read the blog. At least severral of them do.
By Tyler
June 17, 2007 12:50 PM | Link to this
DOB Have you heard anything news about Griffey to Atlanta? Bill Shanks makes the point the Braves need a cleanup hitter, maybe even more than another starter. What are the real chances this gets done? Thanks!
By mr baseball
June 17, 2007 12:54 PM | Link to this
Another day, another Braves lineup with a .211 (and dropping) hitter batting 5th. We need to start a little pool here guessing how low AJ’s average needs to dip before our “Hall of Fame” manager finally decides to sit his well-fed rear on the bench.
One reason Cox is held in such high regard by national baseball “experts” is that they don’t observe him on a nightly basis. They know 2 things about him: (1) His teams finish first a lot; (2) His players love him. Hard to argue with (1), but it is pretty evident that none of his 14 division champions overachieved apart from maybe the first two.
As for (2), why wouldn’t his players love him. He defends ‘em, never rips ‘em and may be the best cheerleader in the history of the game. Unless they play their music too loud in the clubhouse, they can pretty much do what they want — starting pitchers playing golf, star players not running out ground balls, anybody who feels like it getting fat. No fuss, no muss.
Another reason Cox is so admired outside Atlanta is the absence of criticism of him here. Since no media person of any stature here will voice or print anything even remotely negative about the manager, national writers and broadcasters aren’t going to go against the local “wisdom.” How would Cox survive in a larger (and more critical) media market, where he is asked every night why he left his starter in too long; kept playing Andruw; had a runner try to steal third in the 1st inning, etc., etc?
DOB, I understand your situation as a beat writer; if you start asking too many provocative questions, your relationship with the manager and players will be much more difficult. But does ANYBODY — columnists, out of town writers, talk show gabbers/producers, EVER question his bonehead strategic moves, even in the mildest of queries?
It is an apparently unwritten rule at the AJC that any discussion of managerial strategy regarding Mr. Cox is strictly off limits. Anyone who disagrees with that, please cite the last time someone with a published opinion at the paper addressed the subject. There is never any mention of strategic decisions in game stories, which may not be a proper forum for such discussion, but I don’t think I’ve ever read a live column mention anything of the sort.
Instead, we get some drivel about Gary Sheffield’s ignorant comments, the mindless tripe about the Braves pursuing Torii Hunter, or Dale Murphy lamenting way too long after the fact about steroid use in baseball.
I would love to here Cox defend some of his very questionable decisions, but since no one is appatently going to ask him about them (or print them if he does), I guess we’ll all remain in the dark, just like those who watched the Sopranos’ finale.
One more question for the Homeboy Upstairs. Once Chipper is able to play 3B, if he isn’t already, what reason is there to keep Pete Orr on the roster? Unless, of course, Escobar returns to AAA. And what does Cox do with Yunel once Chipper can play? Another question that may not be asked, and probably won’t be answered if it is broached.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
Grinch, I’m 30 now, my stamina ain’t what it used to be. As for turning KC to the dark side, us jedi knights had counseled KC when he was a young Padawan to stay away from women because they lead one to the dark side of the force. Being the Sith Lord that you are, you laughed at us, called us crazy ole queens, and told KC not to listen to a word we said, get all the woman you can get your hands on. Now KC is married, has 3 toddlers, and a job and does not have time to dedicate to the blog. He has completely disappeared over the last month or so. The Braves were 11-20 because of it. It truly has been a disturbance in the force. Without KC, there is not enough balance in the force. Too much negativity. The blog badly misses his daily doses of sunshine. Hence, why the Braves go on losing streaks. Now that KC has reemerged since abandoning the blog for his darn woman and children, he has been tearing apart Kelly Johnson. Grinch, you have truly led him to the dark side. Bobby, being the great manager that he is, has asked N8, being the great blogmate that he is, to switch his role in the platoon and become the positive one to balance out KC’s new dour tone. N8, as you see above and below, was initially about as resistant as Giles was to hitting leadoff or Andruw to hitting sixth, but he is coming around, understanding that there needs to be balance in the Force. So, in our new Bizarro World platoon, our HOF manager is going to pencil N8 in as the eternal optimist and KC as the eternal pessimist. We’ll see how it works. we got a two game winning streak now.
I wouldn’t call me an optimist, much less an eternal one, just yet. LOL! Let’s put it this way, I always HOPE we do well. I’m NOT always optimistic, it will happen, and finally when I’m in the “not so optimistic” mood, I’m usually not surprised when we fail.
As Master Yoda JJS would say, **Do or do not. There is no try.” The skipper has asked you to take the eternal optimist role, just do it at least until KC gets back to being himself, no matter how painful it is for you. (just busting your chops N8. your posts to me sound like what Skip Caray would probably be saying if he did not censor himself at all).
As for what Master Yoda JJS says about some others on here, Truly wonderful, the mind of a child.
By Tyler
June 17, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
DOB What is the latest on the Griffey rumors? Shanks thinks the Braves need a cleanup hitter more than another pitcher. What do you think? Thanks!
By Lew
June 17, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
Coach (and Others)-I don’t know what your problem with KJ vis a vis speed is. The guy has 6 triples and 6 stolen bases. The stolen base total may not be in the Reyes category, but BC doesn’t have his players run much, either. The triples indicate KJ can move it on down the line quite nicely. There is a major difference between speed and stolen bases. They just aren’t the same. Whether or not KJ has had people driving him in really doesn’t do much to take the runs he scored away, does it? He still scored them. Everyone who scores runs is batted in by SOMEONE. The fact you score is the significant factor, not who knocked you in. Apparently only two others in MLB have been knocked in more. I think that is success. Time to accept that the KJ at 2B/leadoff has been quite successful. It even exceeded many of our wildest dreams. Time to back off on the Dude. He done good.
By ElbravoX
June 17, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
Did Mr. Cox just took a shoot at AJ on the BC show? Interesting…AJ is a lock for a hat trick! And to Orr’s horror, he is going down tomorrow. GO BRAVES…
By chrisklob
June 17, 2007 1:01 PM | Link to this
Dave, you say that several of them read your blog. I’m curious what, if any, comments they may have about it. Do they agree with anything said here or do they disregard the commentary because it comes from people who aren’t “insiders” to the clubhouse/MLB and therefore don’t truly understand what’s happening?
I’m a frequent reader and very infrequent blogger to your blog. I enjoy your commentary very much especially since it comes from someone who’s with the team almost every day. I think we get a better feel for what’s happening from you than from other sources (such as ESPN.com, Foxsports.com, etc.). I also enjoy most of the commentary from fellow bloggers (except for you-know-who).
If I could offer one suggestion/constructive criticism. After the blog has been up for a day or so, the refresh rate is very slow. Outside of you writing a new article each day (probably not realistic I realize) is there a way to create a new blog? Thanks, and keep up the great work.
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 1:03 PM | Link to this
DOB
By the way, Paladin, they read the blog. At least severral of them do.
That’s quite a revelation! I’m sure you won’t tell us who, but I’m interested in reactions, if any of those readers have some. What effect, if any, does it have on them?
I’m guessing that our anonymity must be matched by theirs, but this is awfully interesting.
By Bear Grylls
June 17, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this
I’m one tough little bugger.
By snowball's chance
June 17, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this
Banished was too harsh a word. I go with many others, the most recent was eric the elder who advised all of us not to take the bait from the one who will be nameless. I didn’t know that he had anything worth reading as I have skimmed over his posts for months.
By Paladin
June 17, 2007 1:08 PM | Link to this
Dear Mr. Baseball, opinions are like belly-buttons, everyone has one. That is as close to a “rise” as you’ll get out of me. Regards, Paladin
By JasonInMaine
June 17, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this
This guy looks tough…let’s hope Kyle is on!!!
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this
Kyle Davies takes the mound. Be afraid, very afraid.
By Train Wreck Bystander
June 17, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this
Maybe I am being naive, but if I was on the team I would never read [i]any[/i] online forums.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 1:17 PM | Link to this
If I was a player, I would readn’t the blog either. Hell, I am too sensitive to read when other bloggers tear me up for something I have said.
By JasonInMaine
June 17, 2007 1:22 PM | Link to this
The Bravos are 10th in the NL in attendance…that’s awful!
By Mark
June 17, 2007 1:24 PM | Link to this
Drew trying a new approach…watch 2 straight fastballs right down the middle.
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 1:26 PM | Link to this
Wow that was pathetic! I think Bad-druw has gotten to the point that he doesn’t even know where the strike zone is! He takes 2 fastballs right down the middle to leave himself down 0-2…He seems to take A LOT of 1st pitch fastballs right down Broadway…and once again, he should NOT be batting FIFTH, or even SIXTH!
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
I really hate having guys on and expecting Bad-druw and Frenchy to get them home cause for Bad-druw all season and Frenchy the last month, I just get disappointed
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
Chipper’s 2,000th hit on that single to center.
Still 1,600 behind Hank — yet another indiciation of Aaron’s greatness and unbelievable consistency and longevity….
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this
It takes some discipline, but watch Davies’ follow through. When his right hand is low to the ground, he keeps his swifties low, and his curve is exceptional.
It’s when his follow through starts to go high that his pitches do, too, and his breaking stuff doesn’t. So far, so good.
By JasonInMaine
June 17, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this
We are going to score this inning!
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 1:40 PM | Link to this
Tyler, methinks pitching is still the main concern … we have several potentially good cleanup hitters … it’s jsut that the number four position in the order is usually occupied by one having a longterm lease on the position who could be but isn’t … the lease is about up and most likely won’t be renewed … however, those expecting the unexpected might disagree.
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 1:47 PM | Link to this
Seems like we are running ourselves out of a lot of innings recently.
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 1:50 PM | Link to this
Here’s to wondering how long Kyle can keep this up as Carmona is making us pound everything into the ground…we need to hope he leaves some pitches above the knees…only Kelly and Chipper have gotten the ball at least semi in the air
By VandyBrave
June 17, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this
Davies looking good.
the questions is: in which inning does he implode?
How huge was that blown hit n’ run??
Go Bravos!
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 1:53 PM | Link to this
Chrisklob, there’s a new blog at least five days a week (every weekday) and usually once on the weekends. I might crank out a quick one now to give a new slate, but didn’t know how much response there’d be on father’s day, etc…..
Mr. Baseball, you really don’t believe that about an “unwritten rule” regarding criticism of Cox, do you? You can’t be serious.
I think Cox is wrong to have stuck with Andruw so long in the cleanup role, and wrong to have given Redman those last couple starts, and wrong to have stuck with Reitsma so long, and was wrong to have left in Smoltz a few times last season when he was clearly out of gas, and probably should have caught Salty in the day game yesterday after night game, etc.
But so what? You want me to work that into the game story? Into the blog? Every single manager makes moves that are questionable. Every one, without exception.
But the number of good moves Cox makes, and especially the incredible relationship and ability he has to run a smooth-sailing ship without the kind of crap you see on other teams, the disruptions and fights and controversies, is what makes him one of the best managers in history, and why he’s still a very good manager.
And you think the “local wisdom” sets the agenda for the national press? Are you serious? The NY and Philly writers, not to mention all the national writers online, would LOVE to take a chance to rip the rubes in Atlanta for sucking up to some bumbling manager, if that’s how they felt about him.
I mean, seriously, we visit NY, Chicago, Philly, LA, and every other major city every year, most of those places for three series a year, and how many times have you seen national baseball writers in those places, guys like Tracy Ringolsby in Denver and Peter Gammons and Murray Chass in New York, guys in the freakin’ Hall of Fame, how many times you see them rip Cox? There’s a reason they don’t. Because he’s good, see. That’s why he’s won so many manager of the year awards and 14 straight division titles, etc. I know you apparently find that hard to believe, but he really is viewed by almost everyone in the game and observers of the game as really, really good at what he does. (No, that’s not an invitation for your friend, what’s-his-name, to get on here an opine; we know how that pull-my-string contrarian feels about Cox).
Anyway, the folks I listed above have been covering him since before I came on the baseball beat in 1995, since his days at Toronto managing the Jays. So you’d have to ask them why they don’t rip Cox. Maybe it’s a conspiracy, like Robert said. That is, if you really believe he’s not good, like you seem to be suggesting.
By fastasballs
June 17, 2007 2:05 PM | Link to this
Let’s see if Davies can get through the order a second time. His last start he was crusing along until the second time through the order.
By Lew
June 17, 2007 2:14 PM | Link to this
Mr.Baseball-I fail to see anything to be gained by asking BC what will happen when Chipper is no longer our DH. For one, it is a moot point for another couple of series since we still play the Red Sox and the Tigers-Chipper, will of course, be the DH. When the time comes, the club will inform DOB and everyone else, what their roster move is. Asking now will only garner an answer of “We’ll see when it’s time.” When they do decide, DOB’s feelings, your feelings and mine or anyone else on the blog’s feelings will not enter into the equation at all. There is nothing to be possibly be gained from asking questions like these with the possible exception of p!$$ing off the people you need to do your job. How often do you p!$$ of your co-workers, on whom you depend for your livelihood?
By Salty
June 17, 2007 2:16 PM | Link to this
Davies is doin’a nice job ‘gettin’ his knuckles dirty’!
Transitioning…music. DOB and other audiophiles…my wife’s been after me to get rid of my vinyl. After 23 years, there are very few grounds for divorce…that might be one!
But, she’s seen the light…or at least with help from the kids. I was given a USB turntable for Fathers’ Day…time to digitize. I’m jazzed to convert my jazz, rock, etc., etc. Anyone out there have experience with these things…any gotchas? For those bloggers under 30, vinyl is…oh, never mind!
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this
Perhaps Bobby’s just waiting until they’re back in front of the home crowd so as to assure the desired effect … the earlier booing should have been a wakeup call … may have been for management but not for Andruw.
However, I personally think that Andruw’s emotional makeup is far more complex and delicately balanced than most of us realize … and would not be surprised if the Braves were playing the long con, at least until their plans for centerfield are better formulated, if not effected.
Different folks have different priorities … we just don’t know what they are or upon what they depend.
By Salty
June 17, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this
Lew Aren’t national league rules in place in ATL for interleague games?
By mookie
June 17, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this
Hey O’BRIEN, YOU DON’T GET ENOUGH CREDIT FOR DOING A GREAT JOB HERE’S TO YOU!! The braves will be fine if we can keep everyone healthy? I would like to pick up another starter for the second half. The young pitchers are getting alot of experience but, we need someone to step up and give us 2 out ot 3 in the win department down the strech!!
By Over Andy
June 17, 2007 2:22 PM | Link to this
If, as many suggest, we must keep Andruw in the lineup every day for his defense, maybe it’s time to Cesar Geronomo him.
Cesar Geronomo hit eighth in the Big Red Machine lineup. He was clearly in the lineup for his defense. Can anyone honestly say there is a hitter in the Atlanta order who isn’t a bigger threat than Andruw right now?
Actually, I would put Harris in center and get Diaz’s bat in the lineup at the same time. And yes I saw Andruw’s catch in the first. Nice catch but geez lots of the game’s center fielders make that catch. I still don’t buy the “saves a run a game” kool aid either.
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 2:22 PM | Link to this
Lew
We won’t have the DH as of tomorrow bc those games are in Atlanta
Question is, 64 pitches going into the 5th…how much longer will Good Kyle last?
By Train Wreck Bystander
June 17, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this
After that play when no one covered the bag, BC looks like he just wants to bust loose…
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this
What in the world are we doing?! A leadoff walk to a .240 hitter and then Kelly doesn’t get over to 1st to cover the bunt…Thank god they bailed us out w/ a bad runner at 2nd and mediocre bunt by Barfield…NO MORE WALKS!
By ElbravoX
June 17, 2007 2:27 PM | Link to this
LEW, no DH in Atlanta. I think Orr will be sent down.
By Steve from OH
June 17, 2007 2:30 PM | Link to this
DOB, that was a great post. I know it won’t silence the critics, but it needed to be said. Let me ask the bloggers a hypothetical…would you rather have BC, and have a few questionable decisions but a team that gels and has little disturbance or a Lou Piniella lead team that may make a few decisions a week but are fighting with each other and with the opponent? I know which one I would take.
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 2:30 PM | Link to this
And THAT just proves Kyle’s inability to think…ahead 0-1 in the count w/ supposedly his best breaking ball of the season in tact, Michaels already proving he can’t hit it and will chase it and he throws a letter high fastball…just awful!
By Mitchie-san
June 17, 2007 2:35 PM | Link to this
Please let Orr be sent down.
By GermanBravesFan
June 17, 2007 2:37 PM | Link to this
Good Morning, all, from California. Just woke up and FINALLY got a game on TBS again… I guess one of these days I’ll have to buy the Major League package from DirecTv!
While reading some of the comments on today’s Blog, I had some thoughts regarding people’s opinion on Bobby Cox. The obvious thing that NOBODY can deny is that he was the manager that lead the Braves from obscurity to prominence (with a “little” help from JS)! Yes, the Braves did win only one World Series title, but there are a lot of teams out there who didn’t win any during that time period and, quite honestly, didn’t even get close! I take making the play-offs 14 years in a row over finishing outside the playoffs ANY TIME!
Of course, with making the playoffs so many times in a row come expectations and, to some of us, the Braves have fallen short of those expectations. This, I guess, is just human nature. Who is to blame for those “shortcomings?” Obviously for some, like you-know-who, it’s easy to blame the manager. But I have one question: is the manager responsible for hitters not hitting? Wasn’t that the main problem of the Braves in some of the playoff series? It’s the same in every sport: if a team doesn’t live up to expectations, who is the one who gets blamed for it? The manager/coach… hardly ever will you see players or parts of a team let go. Thankfully, Braves management realized this and kept Bobby Cox. Without Cox, there would NEVER have been the streak of 14 straight division titles!
As for Bobby’s style of managing his players: in today’s day and age, the hard-nose approach does not work anymore. Times have changed and coaches/managers had to adjust their ways on how to handle a team. I have noticed that it’s easier to get more out of one’s players when we treat them like adults. And, let’s face it, major league baseball players are adults. This does not mean that discipline doesn’t matter anymore, but how one enforces discipline on a team makes the difference. I firmly believe that a coach/manager will get more out of his team if players believe in him. Well, that’s just my opinion…
Now to other things. Looks like Andruw’s slump continues. DOB, what’s the theory of the coaching staff (Terry Pendleton?) on Andruw’s struggles? I remember that last year, Andruw changed his stance and reaped major benefits. Anything to that avail going on this season?
Also, what do you think might happen in regards to the starting rotation? Any talk/theory about possible trades? Or will the Braves try to fix the problem internally?
By mr baseball
June 17, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
DOB: Things are about to get going in the US Open, so this will be it for me for a while. Wasn’t directing my comments at you as much as the guys who offer opinions for a living. I know there’s no “unwritten rule,” just being facetious. But I find it strange that a topic that is a staple for baseball fans — managerial strategy, is NEVER, and a I repeat NEVER, a topic of any person who writes about baseball in the AJC.
As I have blogged here on more than one occasion, I recognize Cox’s skills in areas other than strategy. But I think anybody who watches the Braves with any regularity, which excludes every alleged baseball expert from outside Atlanta, will have to admit that Cox’s decision making in a variety of areas is not exactly at the level of Earl Weaver, Joe Torre, Tony LaRussa, Jim Leyland, etc.
That may be an opinion shared by few here, but as far as the Atlanta media is concerned, that’s an opinion that isn’t even considered. The last time the topic was even broached in your publication was at least 5 years ago, and came in response to some criticism of Cox that was voiced on sports talk radio. The dismissal of the critical opinions was so condescending and patronizing that even a condescending and patronizing blogger like myself was taken aback.
The basic response from those who think Cox is one of the greatest managers ever is to haughtily dismiss any dissenting opinion. I recognize his strengths AND his weaknesses. His supporters see only his win-loss record and his reputation and brush off the aspects of his managerial performance that don’t support their views.
The leaders at Oakmont are about to tee off, so I’m out of here, which I’m sure will come as great relief to many of you who don’t like having people you revere subjected to unkind observations.
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
Carmona at 70 pitches through 6 and its safe to say that we may be in trouble trying to get the sweep
By MBATL
June 17, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this
P-Town, I’d think that McCann has a lot to do with “calling the game.” At least that’s what I’ve read here many times.
By P-Town Brave
June 17, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this
And THAT was for you Thorman LOVERS who kept complaining about Salty being in Thursday night…way to go Scott!
By GermanBravesFan
June 17, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this
Another thought I forgot to list in my last post: can anyone imagine how difficult it has to be to manage a team of multi-millionaires? I am sure there are some big egoes to control and Bobby Cox has the right mentality to do that! In today’s age of the gazillion dollar contracts, he’s the right man for the job (as is Joe Torre!)!
By Robert
June 17, 2007 2:46 PM | Link to this
“Robert, sadly, methinks I’ve given you a bit too much credit. Your onion has far fewer layers than I had imagined …”
Now wait a minute Bob. Let’s discuss the babysitter role for a minute.
I would think that it is the job of the scouts and the GM to make sure that they employ players who have the makeup to be able to conduct themselves in a professional manner, and to understand that the team comes before the individuals. This is NOT the manager’s job
Now, if you want to debate back that Cox did this as GM, then fine, we agree Cox did a good job at GM
The manager’s job is to take the pieces he is given and work them to maximum success. Cox APPEARS, to those who dont take things in context, to have done this well during the regular season. But come on, how much of a genius do you have to be to win 90 games a year when your top three starters for a decade solid are all future HOFers?
A great manager turns a horrible team into a respectable team, a mediocre team into a decent team, and a playoff team into a champion.
A bad manager turns a WS roster into a division champion. The worst managers do this repeatedly.
There has been a lot of debate back and forth about just how good the Braves really were - with some arguing that most of the 90’s they overachieved. Well, hardcore-Brave-for-life Smoltzie himself sadly admitted that he knows deep down that the Braves ultimate legacy is one of serious underachievment.
Leaders are ultimately responsible for legacies. Generals dont fire the actual shots. Managers dont throw the pitches and run the bases. But the ultimate responsibility rests with them
Cox is the lovable and well meaning but ultimately hapless buffoon that America and Americans find so endearing.
Andruw Jones is hitting .210 and loves his manager. I’d rather he was hitting .300 and wanted to wring Cox’s neck.
By JasonInMaine
June 17, 2007 2:46 PM | Link to this
Well, that play sure sucked.thor has the range of a turtle. He might be too bulky…it appears he has a tough time moving in the field.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 2:47 PM | Link to this
Am I the only one who does not live in a black and white world, where there often is no right answer, where very often you can be damned if you do, damned if you don’t? IF you have the kind of job where there are only right or wrong answers, then you most likely do not have a job worth having. At most, you have a job and not a career. Most likely, you see the world that way because the biggest decision you have to make all day is paper or plastic.
By Over Andy
June 17, 2007 2:47 PM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist
I think you are dead on about Andruw’s makeup. I can honestly say that he showed no indication that he was made to produce in the clutch until his breakout year two years ago. When a game was on the line, especially in post season, you felt he was an automatic out. The only exception was his first WS game in NY when he was 19. He also hit well in the playoffs in his great year of 2005.
This year, Andruw is looking like the player he was prior to the last couple of years proceeding this year. Actually, he looks worse than I’ve ever seen him. I know he has a few rbi but he’s also come to the plate a lot of times with men on base. I think his struggles are directly related to this being his walk year and the publicity surrounding that and his stuggles.
Andruw is shrinking in the clutch.
By Lew
June 17, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
I thought I had heard discussion of using the DH throughout interleague play, but apparently not. However, it remains that the Braves will tell us of roster moves when said moves are made and usually not before. Also still remaining is that there is nothing to be gained by trying to push them into doing things differently than in the past. Telling them that they are doing things wrong or that you mightily disagree with them is not going to endear your presence to them, hence making your job almost impossible to do. For those who speculate, Escobar will likely sit on the bench or provide days off for infielders when Chipper returns to third. Kelly Johnson will remain at second and Willie Harris will not be moved to an everyday position, batting leadoff.
By David O'Brien
June 17, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
NEW BLOG IS UP (and so is the braves’ little winning straek, it would appear)
By A-ville Ranger
June 17, 2007 2:55 PM | Link to this
It looks like Thor can’t field and chew gum at the same time. Maybe Salty should have been in for his defense ?Man! youth is really costing them this inning.Kyle deserved better this time.
By Braveheart
June 17, 2007 2:57 PM | Link to this
At this point, I am just saddened watching Druw. He looks so lost. It is no longer him. What happened?
THORMAN IS NOT A GOOD FIELDER. Can that myth please stop on here? Stop talking about fielding percentage when you talk about a first baseman. There is so much more to evaluating a first baseman defensively.
Crap, Edgar just hurt his back. He seemed to be wrenching it after that great diving catch and throw from his knee.
Brian McCann needs to be DL’d. But we have all been saying that for over a month now. Pride is getting in the way there. Too proud to let Salty play while he is DL’d but not too proud to throw balls into center, let balls pass by him, and for his hitting to suffer. This is where Bobby and John need to say take a seat kid for two weeks.
By Ron Roberts
June 17, 2007 2:57 PM | Link to this
Kyle Davies deserved a better fate today, folks.
And Paranto-bashers note: That’s why we keep him up. He’s working his way out of his injury-funk and is getting back to dependability.
Imagine how good this team would be if Andruw were hitting at least average for him?
By Bob, Journalist
June 17, 2007 2:58 PM | Link to this
For those under 65, Genuine Leather is …
I would be genuinely surprised is anyone doubts the presence of the Braves’ management and/or players on the Blog … participating and/or routinely observing.
After much serious consideration methinks that’s a good thing!
That is, so long as the support and optimism is strong enough for them to be able to keep things in perspective and enjoy the thrashings given to the invaders from the north and those of us who venture over the line. They share our passion though their perspectives are of leather while ours frequently are of plastic.
It would be extra special, super good if the Blog could have a positive rather than a negative impact on our young gladiators … if we build it, the will come!
Yes, I didn’t come up with that line, I stole it from Jimmy Smith … fair’s fair!
By ElbravoX
June 17, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this
Yeah sure, Bmac is ok—dude’s struggling in offense and defense, or maybe he is just playing like in the minors. The hype is slowly dissolving on the guy. Francour with single digits in HR’s is also playing up to par with minor league numbers. AJ is Mendoza bound. Painful and sad to watch, even I cringe when he swings.
By Steve-O
June 17, 2007 3:04 PM | Link to this
For everybody saying ANDREW it’s ANDRUW!!!!!!!!!!! PLEASE, it’s not like he just came up. You’re supposed to be real Braves fans spell the names right. It is just annoying to read, sorry I’m just ranting because ANDRUW S-U-C-K-S!!!! He wants market value? Let’s give him a 5 year 30 million dollar contract tonight.
By MEB
June 17, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this
Braveheart… excellent observation! I’ve avoided Robert’s posts for some time now, but if ever there was someone that was black and white its him.
I hate it when poor fielding takes away any chance for victory. Of course if we fail to score any runs its all over anyway.
Brian McCann is killing my fantasy team and its his errors that really hurt. Andruw really needs some help. Is there a sports psychologist in the house?
By Paladin
June 17, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this
Dear Mr. Baseball, I’m afraid I will have to add this: Your choice of the US Open when the Braves are playing a pivotal game may say much about your status as a “fan”. “Fore”, y’hear?
By MEB
June 17, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this
Aaron Baddeley starts out with a stinking triple bogey. Talk about needing a sports psychologist. Tiger intimidates every one of these guys right out of the gate. I think all Tiger has to do is shoot around par and the rest of these guys will bow out of the way.
Well at least we didn’t get skunked.
GO BRAVES!!!
By eric the elder
June 17, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this
I might be wrong on technicalities, but I think we got a “quality start” from Davies - - 3 earned runs on 6 hits. Oh wait, I guess he didn’t complete 6 innings. Well, real close to a quality start. A lot of bad stuff going on behind him, and he deserved better.
Elbravox, you’re right at 3:02, but I still think Andruw is poisoning the well. Just a run-scoring single by Andruw would have reduced the notion that BMac and Francoeur HAVE to take up the slack. Self-imposed pressure maybe, but these guys are really young.
By Steve-O
June 17, 2007 3:32 PM | Link to this
If Andruw somehow blows this…….
By Steve-O
June 17, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this
Wonder whats gonna happen??
By JasonInMaine
June 17, 2007 3:43 PM | Link to this
2nd and 3rd, 0 outs, and the heart of the order coming up…0 runs…wow! KJ should have tagged up and Andruw should absolutely not be batting higher than 7th. Wow, should be 5-4 at the minimum
By Daxxed
June 17, 2007 3:45 PM | Link to this
When you have a chance to bust a game wide open and there is a right handed hitter that is hitting above 300, why do you leave in a hitter that is almost a guaranteed strike out. AJ needs to go…WH needs to play CF and MD needs to play LF…that is 2 hitters the have over 300 averages compared to the whiff king Jones.
By JasonInMaine
June 17, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this
Chip just made a good point…let’s not forget the leadoff double in the 7th that got wasted…this team isn’t good enough to overcome such mistakes…but, the 8th inning really, really hurt and we left 2 .300 hitters on the bench.
By MEB
June 17, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
Well we blew one today Braves fans. Poor fielding and inability to get hits at key moments cost us. Terrible at bats by Andruw are becoming more and more common. I think the Braves are a much better team than the Indians but give them credit today for some great play in the field and a couple of timely hits. Cinch them leotards a little tighter boys because the Red Sox are coming to town tomorrow.
GO BRAVES!!!
By MEB
June 17, 2007 6:21 PM | Link to this
Have I killed the blog? If I blog by myself can it still be called a blog? If its just me… maybe I will be the blog denizen of the day. If a baby seal can win then certaily I have a chance now.