AJC > Sports > Braves > Blog > Archives > 2007 > June > 12 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USOverrated? OVERRATED?! Boras upset by Andruw critique
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Shortly after landing in Minneapolis today, I got a call from Scott Boras (Andruw Jones’ uber-agent, for those who’ve been away for a decade), which was a bit unusual because I hadn’t called him in several weeks, and last time I did call him he didn’t return the call.
So when I answered today and hear that distinct voice on the other end of the phone (he’s got one of those inimitable voices you know right away), I thought, “Oh, God, what did I write that he’s incensed about?” I was braced for a shouting match, since I’ve had a couple with Scott in the past over things I wrote that he didn’t like and/or believe to be accurate.
But it quickly became apparent this would be a pleasant call, at least as far as Scott aiming his fire elsewhere. He wanted to talk about Jayson Stark’s new book, “The Stark Truth: The Most Overrated and Underrated Players in Baseball History,” in which the baseball writer calls Andruw Jones the “most overrated center fielder of all time.”
Before we get to that, let me tell you guys that Boras told me there’s been no negotiations, not contract talks whatsoever between him and the Braves regarding Jones. And they don’t plan to have any until after the season.
“We’ve all agreed we’re not going to discuss anything about contracts until the season’s over,” Boras said. “Andruw is an Atlanta Brave and he’s going to work through the season to help his team win, then we’re going to discuss all the contract stuff and what Andruw wants to do. Andruw’s preference was to not negotiate until after the season.”
(I have to admit, I was wrong in this respect when I told a blogger here a couple days ago that Andruw had not said he wouldn’t negotiate during the season. He said this spring, specifically when I asked him, that he would negotiate any time).
(Oh, and I’m going to give you my educated guess again and say, ain’t going to be any hometown discount. But that’s just me talking.)
As another aside, I’ve gotta tell you, this assertion by Jayson has drawn a lot of incredulous reactions from writers I’ve talked to. Everyone respects Jayson, who is very informative and entertaining, but I haven’t run into another writer who really believes Andruw Jones to be highly overrated. Or overrated at all.
Not in the past, and not since the book starting getting a lot of attention.
I don’t need zone ratings and putout totals to tell me when I’m seeing a great defensive player. I know what I see, and in Jones I see one of the best two or three center fielders of the past 25 years (I’m 43, so I’ll confine it to a period I’m very familiar with), and perhaps the best.
But anyway, Boras obviously has a dog in this fight (or maybe that’s a poor choice of words in an Atlanta-based blog these days, huh?). Uh, he has a vested interest, obviously, since he represents Andruw and his client can be a free agent after the season.
And Scott is hardly one to talk about bending stats to fit his needs. The man is an absolute negotiating beast. Takes no prisoners. None better.
But I gotta agree with him on this. I’m watching Andruw make plays this season and thinking, this is not the most overrated center fielder of all time. This is not an overrated center fielder. An overrated hitter? That’s open for debate, certainly. But that’s not what Jayson was talking about.
No, he specifically cited Andruw’s decline in defensive “putout” totals in recent years, the fact that he had about 100 fewer outouts in each of the past few years - 390 in 2003, 389 in 2004, 365 in 2005, 377 in 2006 - compared to his peak, jaw-dropping totals of 493 in 1999 and 461 in 2001.
Well, Boras has a law degree, a very large and well-paid staff, and a statistical database that, I kid you not, is managed by a former NASA dude that Boras hired to come over to his firm.
So Boras, peeved over the portrayal of his client as some sort of broken-down fielder who doesn’t get to half the balls he once got to, went to work to try and disprove Stark.
Boras said he was up late last night crunching numbers and doing statistical analysis between Andruw and Willie Mays — have I mentioned that Boras thinks very highly of Andruw? — and after finding just what he was looking for, he called me and, I’m sure, a couple other writers today and spewed forth the stats.
He went on an ESPN show this morning and did the same.
A few of Boras’ main points of emphasis: Mays was the only other outfielder to have five consecutive seasons of 400 or more putouts, which he did from 1954-1958 in 154-game seasons. Boras added a generous 25 putouts for the eight-game difference and said Mays still never would’ve matched Andruw’s 493.
But what was strikingly - or starkly? — similar to Andruw’s stats was how Mays then had three consecutive seasons with fewer than 400 putouts from 1959 (he had 353 that season) through 1961.
“Then when Willie was 30, he went back over 400 [putouts] just like Andruw is doing,” said Boras.
Indeed, Willie jacked his total back up to 429 in 1962, the first 162-game season. This year, Andruw leads the majors with 190 putouts, on pace for 475, which would be his second-highest total.
OK, I know, your heads are spinning. But just bear with me a second longer.
Boras went on to talk about how Stark didn’t compare Jones with other top fielders of today’s game, or to note how “indexes” affect the nunbers from year to year, which is reflected by all the top fielders having lower totals in recent seasons.
“His failed research, the only way he could manipulate the numbers to stir up some kind of controversy … was by comparing Andruw to Andruw,” said Boras, who pointed out that Jones had 45 more putouts last season than Toronto’s Vernon Wells and 34 more than Minnesota’s Torii Hunter, who both won Gold Gloves (Andruw won his ninth consecutive Gold Glove).
“He fails to point out that none of the center fielders are getting to 400 [in recent seasons],” Boras said. “You have to look at indexes of baseball.”
Hey, folks, don’t ask me to define the indexes. Google it and see if that works.
Boras pointed out that Hunter’s total last season was far below his best, “and no one is saying Torii Hunter is in decline.”
He pointed out that the great Mickey Mantle’s peak was 372 putouts (again, in a 154-season, not 162).
Boras said Jones and Carlos Beltran (another horse in the Boras stable) were the only outfielders with 1,500 putouts in the past four seasons.
He pointed out that Andruw has played with 37 different left fielders as a Brave, and that it hasn’t affected his defense.
He got into a rant on “zone ratings” (Stark also cited that defensive stat), with Boras explaining, “The fallacy of zone rating is if you have greater range you’ll have more attempts used against you, and not be credited for the greater range.”
(His longer explanation made sense, but I can’t find it in my notes. I think I spilled part of my chicken sandwich on it or something. He explained how good fielders are actually penalized for getting to balls out of their zone, like Andruw does. Boras said he had reduced a negative zone rating to shreds in someone’s arbitration hearing.)
He went on and on. The man doesn’t tire — Boras, I’m talking about — and I’m fairly certain he does not require sleep.
“I have no problem with people taking opinions,” Boras said. “But when you say things about Andruw Jones, you’re talking about hallowed ground. You’re talking about a Hall of Famer.”
(Thank goodness he doesn’t read the Braves/MIB blog, huh?)
Boras was particularly upset by the reference to an unnamed “old scout friend” whom Stark wrote was the one who initially told him he thought Jones wasn’t the player he’d been made out to be and why, and told him how he wasn’t getting to balls he used to get to, etc.
“There is no scout in the world who would watch this man play and say what [Stark] said he did,” Boras said. “He would be a fool, and the statistics bear that out.”
OK, I’m not even going to get into the discussion of offense, which Boras said clearly made Jones a better all-around player than Wells or Hunter or other center fielders in today’s game.
“His standard of greatness is so high, and when you add the offense Andruw is clearly better,” Boras said. “Andruw’s offese in 2004, ‘05 and ‘06 is dramatically improved over his offense of 1998 or 1999. He’s in fact a better all-around player because of that.”
(Perhaps, but if he hit better with RISP he’d have an MVP award.)
When I asked Boras if he thought the book could possibly hurt Jones’ reputation and maybe hurt him at the bargaining table next winter, Boras scoffed.
“I don’t in any way think it hurts him,” he said. “I think it’s going to draw attention to the fact that this book is based on analysis of greatness vs. greatness. To suggest that Andruw Jones is not the greatest center fielder in the game….
“[Stark] takes a narrow, myopic view for the purpose of profiteering off this book. He uses the ‘old scout crap,’ and just comes in with these numbers without comparing them to anything else.”
And he added this little nugget: “Willie Mays told me, and I quote, ‘The only player I’ve ever seen play center field that I consider comparable to me is Andruw Jones.’
“And I’ve got Jayson Stark telling me Andruw is overrated based on putouts over four seasons.”
Uh, I think I’ll hold off on that article criticizing Boras’ handling of first-year drafted players….
OK, news of the day, Edgar scratched: I gotta keep it brief so I can get to writing my notebook. That Boras tome just took too much time.
Edgar’s hand still was sore and he’s out of the lineup. The Braves had two lineups on the board when I got to the clubhouse this afternoon, one with Edgar and one without. When he told Bobby it was still too sore, he was scratched. They think he’ll be ready tomorrow.
Chipper doing better. Much better. If you could’ve seen him launching balls over the fences at the Metrodome in batting practice, you’d never know he’s been on the DL the past three weeks.
Bobby said before BP he didn’t think Chipper would be ready today or tomorrow, but maybe Thursday. But Chipper sounded more optimistic, and said if he generated bat speed and hit balls hard in BP, he’d probably ask to play Thursday.
I’m betting he’s activated and in the lineup DHing on Thursday.
By the way, that’s going to be the position-player move Bobby had promised for the Minnnesota series. Since Chipper’s getting back a few days earlier than previously thought, they’re just going to wait and send a pitcher down when Chipper’s activated.
Smoltz not definite: But Cox sounded like he’s counting fully on Smoltz pitching Friday’s series opener at Cleveland. I can tell you more after the game, because Smoltz tested his sore shoulder with a bullpen session before the game tonight, but the clubhouse was closed by the time he finished.
It was the first bullpen session in more than a week for Smoltz, who skipped his last turn in the rotation because of his shoulder.
Turnaround in left field: We all knew that the left-field platoon has been dramatically improved since the arrival of Willie Harris to replace the traded Ryan Langerhans. But here’s just how dramatic the change has been.
In the pre-Willie era before April 29, Braves left fielders hit .163 with a .229 on-base percentage.
Since Harris joined Matt Diaz in the platoon, Braves left fielders led the majors with a .376 average and rank second with a .416 OBP. That deserves a “wow.”
Comments
By Me
June 12, 2007 8:06 PM | Link to this
First???
By TennBrent
June 12, 2007 8:08 PM | Link to this
Great work, DOB. Glad you came across those Willie Harris numbers. Now, if we can just spark the 1B position…
By T 2 the D
June 12, 2007 8:09 PM | Link to this
First, dammit, first! A. Jones, according to my late father, greatest defensive center fielder EVER. My Dad was never wrong.
By Terry Williams
June 12, 2007 8:16 PM | Link to this
We can all debate whether A. Jones’ skills have/have not declined. What is not up for debate is Boras. He’s the same horses patoot he’s always been. As I’ve said before, if I’m GM J.S., I communicate this: you use Boras…we don’t negotiate. Period. Jerks like Boras would be out of business and he would be back ambulance-chasing in 6 months.
By Johnny R
June 12, 2007 8:21 PM | Link to this
Now this is more like it, skipper.
By ncscoots
June 12, 2007 8:22 PM | Link to this
Sounds as if there might have been a little smoke coming out of the old cellphone. The man’s a zealous advocate, I’ll give him that.
Andruw is the best CF that I have ever seen (I didn’t see Willie, Mickey, and The Duke in their primes). T2, my father said Joe D was the most “gifted” (his word) CF he ever saw, but he also said Andruw “played” the best CF he ever saw, including Willie. His opinion only, of course, but he knew a smidgen or two about the game.
By SteelCav
June 12, 2007 8:25 PM | Link to this
Mac got lucky there…..toss that mask son!
By OddJob
June 12, 2007 8:25 PM | Link to this
No way is Andruw over rated defensively.I had done the math on total chances so I wasn’t surprised when I saw he has the most put outs in the outfield in all baseball during his time in the league.I’d bet a chili slaw dog he’d be tops over his career in put-outs to errors ratio.If anybody has that info please post it.
By N8
June 12, 2007 8:26 PM | Link to this
“…the fact that he had about 100 fewer outouts in each of the past few years - 390 in 2003, 389 in 2004, 365 in 2005, 377 in 2006 - compared to his peak, jaw-dropping totals of 493 in 1999 and 461 in 2001.”
OK. You all know that I’m not one to back oof of raggin on Andruw’s bat. I have even suggested that he has “lost some range” in recent years. Oh Boy. So What!
So the guy has gone from being absolutely THE BEST in the game, to only one of the best 3 or 4 in the game. Bummer for us, I guess.
Like I said, I’m not one to normally stick up for Andruw, not with the season he’s having. But, hmmmm. Let me look at the year of his “decline”.
Yeah, that’s what I thought. 2003 huh? Wouldn’t that be the first year without Glavine, and the LAST year Maddux was here, BEFORE Smoltz came back to the rotation?
I’m not saying Andruw’s defense was great because of the pitching….well…not ALL the way, anyhow. They go hand in hand.
Corrales would “set” the defensive alignment. Then something happened, that hasn’t in recent years. THE PITCHERS ACTUALLY HIT THEIR “SPOTS” as to not cross up the defense.
NOBODY is gonna get to a ball in the LF gap, when they were shaded around towards RF and the pitcher missed his spot by 2 feet, thus having the ball HAMMERED to the opposite spot that the fielder was positioned.
Has AJ “lost” a step out there? Absolutely, NO MATTER WHAT Bora$ says. He’s 30 and hit the turf enough to rattle his bones in his sleep the last decade. But he hasn’t lost THAT MUCH.
Like every other problem that has been blamed on them the last 3-4 years, I too will blame AJ’s “declining” (alleged) defense on poor pitch location as well. Not all of it, but MOST of it.
By J-Dawg
June 12, 2007 8:27 PM | Link to this
Great stuff, DOB! Scott Boras never deserves that much ink (or keystrokes in this case), but the man is persuasive. We’ll find out just how much and what Stark was smoking at season’s end when the offers flow in for Andruw and Boras continues printing money. Love him or hate him, this is an example why Boras is a great agent! … And can we just bury the dog jokes — oh, wait, maybe that’s not appropriate for an Atlanta-based blog now either!
By geauxbraves2000
June 12, 2007 8:28 PM | Link to this
Braves hitters saw 11 pitches in the first inning w/KJ seeing 6 of them. Twins hitters saw 23 pitches.
Just an observation.
Geaux Braves!!
By SteelCav
June 12, 2007 8:33 PM | Link to this
atta boy frenchy
By SeattleBrave'sFan
June 12, 2007 8:34 PM | Link to this
DOB…thank you…thank you…thank you…I for some odd reason had started to let Jayson Stark’s words seep into my consciousness. I started to wonder if we were watching a player on his way down. Thank you for picking me back up. I have seen him make some plays this year that are phenomenal, nobody else makes them. But I do love how Boras says he doesn’t think it would hurt Andruw at the bargaining table…Ha!..So why the media tour to refute the book? Obviously he is worried to some degree. Having said all that, there has to be some concern with Andruw’s offense this year, or do you think teams will take the approach Bobby seems to take in that his superior defense outweighs the myriad of slumps he endures on offense? Again, great stuff, thanks…
By Bob
June 12, 2007 8:35 PM | Link to this
Oh my Lord, I never, never, never thought I would agree with Scott Boras on anything, but he is right about Andruw…at least on the defensive side of the game. I wish Jason Stark would name the “scout”. Oh well, Stark has been so ripped by his book that it is not funny. Friends in NY said that even the fans up there think he is crazy and that Andruw is the measuring stick for others to compare to and Beltran, while very good, is no Andruw.
By Sports Writer Reporter
June 12, 2007 8:39 PM | Link to this
Jayson Stark had 29,455 words in his first book, however, in the “Stark Truth” that decreased to 27,732. Even worse the number of complete sentences fell by almost 20% showing an over-reliance on statistics and graphs to compensate for his diminishing vocabulary range and lack of focus. Privately critics whisper that he is past prime of an overrated career and should be optioned to write minor articles.
By Gold Club
June 12, 2007 8:39 PM | Link to this
Andruw we miss you and love and you are best CF ever. By the way we miss those big tips.
By SteelCav
June 12, 2007 8:40 PM | Link to this
kyle’s breaking stuff looks good tonite….keep that heater down though
By N8
June 12, 2007 8:41 PM | Link to this
It’s too bad Andruw’s range has diminished. In 1997, he would’ve be STANDING there drinking a Coke, waiting for that ball to fall from the sky….er….roof.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 8:42 PM | Link to this
Davies looks to have good form so far.I like where he’s finishing.
By jch
June 12, 2007 8:43 PM | Link to this
‘druw over-rated? Probably not. He still makes incredible catches in the field even though he’s probably, and naturally, lost a step or two.
Offensively he’s struggling - it looks like he’s letting Boras act as hitting coach instead of listening to TP. Hopefully he can get it turned around but we haven’t seen anything consistent yet.
Of course, if he keeps going at this pace we won’t need a “home town discount”, he’ll be affordable!
Maybe that’s his plan this time - instead of he and his father going around Boras like last time, he’s just going to “sandbag” for a year so the Braves can still afford him!
By N8
June 12, 2007 8:44 PM | Link to this
Does Pete Orr ACTUALLY swing in slow-motion?
It sure looks like it to me.
YIKES.
By Dave
June 12, 2007 8:44 PM | Link to this
What a lot of info. Boras just wants the big $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and he will get ti somewhere.
By Dave
June 12, 2007 8:45 PM | Link to this
What a lot of info. Boras just wants the big $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and he will get it somewhere.
By The Grinch
June 12, 2007 8:45 PM | Link to this
(With apologies to Pet Shop Boys): “I’ve got the pie, you’ve got the toes…Dave’s blog’s always money.”
Oh, the humanity! Two Canadians in the starting lineup!
By N8
June 12, 2007 8:47 PM | Link to this
Yeah….
Harris is NEVER gonna keep up his good hitting.
By jch
June 12, 2007 8:49 PM | Link to this
Can anyone explain why Pete Orr is still on this team????
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 8:50 PM | Link to this
Anyone else getting the feeling the Braves are going to tee off on Slowey in the next few innings? Second time through the order has not started too well so far.
Does Willie ever quit producing?
By Bob, Journalist
June 12, 2007 8:51 PM | Link to this
Elder Cato,
Thanks, it’s nice to know that one’s back will always be so capably covered!
However, I responded to the wordsmith lost at the end of the previous Blog … much ado but … lost, but not forgotten, David O’B deserves better but here it is …
“Johnny R, I wasn’t suggest that you were … you won’t get any argument from me regarding pretentious and boring.
However pretentious that I may be, it would exceed even my level not be concerned with the perception of others and makes me ponder how you would yourself describe … and how you perceive the perception of others.
Puddin’, Pie, and P Players”
Tell Brian that bloop singles are better that warning track homeruns; especially with runners on second and third.
By N8
June 12, 2007 8:52 PM | Link to this
I see McCann too, is perfecting the Warning Track Power swing.
If only we played our home games in Houston.
Side note: Davies actually looks pretty good so far. But I’ll reserve judgement, until he goes through the order the second time.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 8:53 PM | Link to this
I know I have been a little negative lately, but I think the Bravos are going to sweep the Twins…
Especially if we get b-Mac going and get Hoss back!
Regards,
Jason
By Chad
June 12, 2007 8:55 PM | Link to this
well jch, who u would rather to have, Pete Orr or Chris Woodward?
By Gil In Mechanicsville
June 12, 2007 8:57 PM | Link to this
Funny thing about those who do not like Scott Boras, if they were a player, he would be the guy they would want to represent them.
True in life, true in law, those who do their homework best usually come out on top.
Nice job so far by Davies so far tonight.
By Oil Soap
June 12, 2007 8:58 PM | Link to this
one of your best and personally most needed blogs I’ve read, DOB. I am the only living Braves fan in New York (Paul Simon has nothing on me) and I cannot wait to pass this along to all the Mets fans who have baited me with this Stark thing for the past month. Much obliged.
By Drew
June 12, 2007 8:58 PM | Link to this
Just heard the OVER RATED chant from the Twins fans with Andruw at the plate.
By Yars
June 12, 2007 8:58 PM | Link to this
Boras is only defending his client. He can crunch all the numbers he wants to. In any case, I’m still preparing for Andruw not being in a Braves uniform in 2008. Even if Andruw finishes with .250/33/110 type numbers, there will be some team that will throw a $17-$18 million per year package his way, and it ain’t gonna be Atlanta.
By MBATL
June 12, 2007 9:00 PM | Link to this
Over rated? Never understood the question. If you rate him as the best CF ever to play the game, yeah, he’s probably over rated. If you say he’s a decent OF with some power, he’s under rated. Never read Stark’s book, but “most over rated” seems like a very vague term to me. Certainly a vague term to write a whole book about.
If Stark’s point is that AJ is not better than Willie Mays, Ken Griffey Jr., or God Knows Who Else, then that’s a fair argument - just make the point. But who rated him so high that he should be singled out as ‘most over rated?’
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:01 PM | Link to this
Hrbek is in the booth on the Twins broadcast. He said the first thing Bobby said to him today was “HEY. You pulled my ‘little guy’ off the bag!”
He STILL denies pulling Gant off the bag. Priceless.
By Coach
June 12, 2007 9:01 PM | Link to this
Andruw is vastly under rated with the glove and over rated with the bat , so I guess it evens out. Pete Orr at third ? that completely defeats the the offensive lift of having Salty DH. Davies is on his game tonight , looks like Dr.Jekyll showed up again. If you think the Braves announcers can be annoying you should have to listen to the twinkies broadcast. BOOOORRRING ! Hrbek is guesting in the booth tonight. He still won’t admit that he pulled Gant’s foot off the bag , the cheating bastard.
By Randy
June 12, 2007 9:03 PM | Link to this
I think Andruw knew what the blog topic was today, the ball is finding him tonight.
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 9:04 PM | Link to this
They must have forgot to cut the AC off before Morneau batted, I was sure that was gone when it left the bat.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:06 PM | Link to this
It’s almost laughable the difference in where Davies finishes on a good pitch and a bad one.
By MEB
June 12, 2007 9:06 PM | Link to this
Great stuff DOB! I’ve made it a habit to e-mail that loser Jayson Stark every time Andruw makes a great play. I think the whole premise of his book is low-brow journalism and I feel it reflects poorly on ESPN. This is a matter about which I have e-mailed ESPN as well.
Got Blog?
Braves baseball and the finer things in life. Strap on your leotard and have some pie as you blog with DOB and company.
ajc.com/braves/baseball
By Tim
June 12, 2007 9:07 PM | Link to this
This is a little off topic, but only slightly. And stay with me here. Do you think it’s possible that Andruw is tanking this season at the plate in order make himself more affordable to the Braves in the offseason? I don’t necessarily mean he’s f’ing up on purpose. Maybe he is, but more likely he really, truly in the depths of his heart wants to stay in Atlanta and play for Bobby. And somewhere on a subconscious level he is allowing himself to stay in his slump so that the price on him goes down? Just a thought.
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 9:07 PM | Link to this
I meant Joe Mauer, I had an early evening brain fart.
By DNice
June 12, 2007 9:08 PM | Link to this
By Sports Writer Reporter
June 12, 2007 8:39 PM | Link to this
Jayson Stark had 29,455 words in his first book, however, in the “Stark Truth” that decreased to 27,732. Even worse the number of complete sentences fell by almost 20% showing an over-reliance on statistics and graphs to compensate for his diminishing vocabulary range and lack of focus. Privately critics whisper that he is past prime of an overrated career and should be optioned to write minor articles.
Best blog I ever read. Andruw will turn it around. Kyle Davies p** me off. I had him on my fantasy team but his on then off cant help me win my division. I had to drop him and hope that Buddy will produce.
By G. Alan
June 12, 2007 9:09 PM | Link to this
DOB
Long-time reader. Love the stuff you do on here.
I’ve just been wondering about the “putout” argument. I see Boras says that the putouts haven’t been affected by the different outfielders the Braves have gone through. But…isn’t it possible that those ridiculous numbers he put up were thanks in part to Chipper’s stint out there? Langerhans and Frenchy come in, and suddenly Andruw doesn’t have to cover as much ground. With Diaz out there, perhaps he gets more chances now.
I don’t specifically remember the years Chipper was out there, so I could be grossly wrong.
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:10 PM | Link to this
Hmmmm. Looks like the 2nd time through the order didn’t go so well.
SHOCKER.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:10 PM | Link to this
DOB Can you point out to Mcdowell that Davies fingers were almost raking the dirt in the 1st and 2nd and now he’s finising 2 ft up.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:11 PM | Link to this
How do you go from retiring 10 in a row to not being able to throw a strike? Those two walks certainly came back to hurt.
Son of a…
By Matthew At The SLC
June 12, 2007 9:12 PM | Link to this
DOB,
Boras had me a believer until he made the ludicrous claim that Andruw’s offense makes him the best CF in the game today, and of all time.
Dude, what is Boras smoking, and can I get some?
I’ll always say that Andruw Jones is an overrated BALLPLAYER based on his lack of consistant (consistantly good, that is) offense. Why? I give you his crappy BA, OBP, and OPS, and his ability to kill innings and rallies with ill-timed SOs and DPs. Honestly, with 1 out in the bottom of the ninth and a man in third and a man on first, does anyone… ANYONE want to see Andruw come up to bat? I know I don’t. In fact, when he does come up in 1 out situations with runners at the corners, I just pray for a SO instead of a DP. Has anyone ever had a more worthless 50 homer season in the history of MLB than Andruw Jones? I mean, seriously, were any of them memorable? I don’t remember a single one. I’m sure he had a few game winners in there, or ones that gave the team a lead, but did any of them really mean anything? To me, his 50 homers two years ago were eclipsed by his terrible BA, OPS, and OBP. That’s way Andruw isn’t half the BALLPLAYER that Poo-Holes is, and why he rightfully didn’t win the MVP. Andruw is by definition of his career thus far, half a ballplayer. He’ll get into the Hall all right. But it’ll be for the exact same reason that Ozzie Smith got in: defense. In fact, if Andruw gets in for being half a ballplayer, then why can’t Andre Dawson get in? He was a more complete ballplayer than Andruw. He had a rifle arm in right field. He played good defense. He hit over 400 homers without the benefits that Sosa, McGwire, Bonds, and many, many others have enjoyed. He played during a time before expansion stretched out the pitching talent in the game almost to the breaking point. He played before bandbox ballparks became all the rage. Can you imagine what kind of numbers The Hawk would have had if he got to play road games at Minute Maid Park or Coors Field as a Cub or Expos, or how about playing games at Camden or Jacobs when he played for the Sawx? He’d have well over 500 homers then.
Andruw is overrated. As a complete ballplayer. I’ll give Boras the defensive argument, but he’s insane is he thinks Andruw is any kind of offensive force. He’s streaky. He has way too many SOs, hits into way too many DPs. He’s more offensive farce than force.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:13 PM | Link to this
Okay, I am done being positive…the last time I was we got killed as well.
We will not sweep.
Regards,
Jason
By Chad
June 12, 2007 9:13 PM | Link to this
i prefer to have salty catching than mccann.. let mccann dh and salty do the catching
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:13 PM | Link to this
Sh!tty job of Davies, holding Hunter at 2B. Sh!tty throw by McCann, Sh!tty job catching the ball by Orr.
This is gonna get ugly fast.
By Braveheart
June 12, 2007 9:14 PM | Link to this
For the tee shirt, how about a photo of AJ on the front saying the line that should have ended the Sopranos, “What? No Fing ziti?!?!” Not appropriate for this blog’s tee but we gotta try to end that show the right way.
When Boras calls, do you answer by saying Why Hello Satan? Or do you say can you be my agent? Next time tell him that any schmuck can get an Arod or Beltran a big contract. Tell him to call you back when he gets Pete Orr a big contract. I forget the details now but how did Boras feel back in 2001 when Andruw and his dad negotiated that hometown discount contract?
By ernesto
June 12, 2007 9:16 PM | Link to this
Orr keeps rallies going with his glove, kills them with his bat - I’m so tired of seeing him and Woodward. Is that really the best we’ve got in the whole organization - if so, that’s just sad.
By Memphis
June 12, 2007 9:16 PM | Link to this
Is our bench going to be
for a while after Chipper comes back?
I think it is wasted spot with Orr and Woodward both in there. I was really hoping to get B. Pena back up to Atlanta so that would allow a little more flexibility and in my opinion an overall better bench. He would be a valueable bench player in my opinion. A lot more valuable than Orr or Woodward.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:16 PM | Link to this
I’ve got’a think all these pitchers being inconsistent with their delivery has something to do with Mcdoweell vs Leo.
By Caleb
June 12, 2007 9:17 PM | Link to this
Davies, throw some freaking strikes!
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:19 PM | Link to this
“i prefer to have salty catching than mccann.. let mccann dh and salty do the catching”
Uh-Oh. Looks like Chad just opened up a whole can of Whup-a$$ on himself.
Better him than me.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:20 PM | Link to this
Verlander just completed his no no
By The Grinch
June 12, 2007 9:21 PM | Link to this
Eighty odd pitches in the 4th, and bases loaded. Now that’s the Davies we all know and love.
By DNice
June 12, 2007 9:21 PM | Link to this
ORR is pathetic. Having him on a major league roster gives the Rainbow/PUSH something to be mad about. I know of about 5 players to include myself on my Little League team in the inner-city who can play better than Orr, and also we can run faster than him which seems to be his only asset (running back to the dugout) (LOL). Something tells me that Betemit would be doing a whole lot better if he was here and not in LA. He is not happy and would be best served to be traded back to Atlanta that way we dont have to see Woodward and Orr. Add Betemit then out weakness of terrible bench goes to a strength with Salty, Harris/Diaz, Betemit, Escobar.
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 9:21 PM | Link to this
Tim, I don’t think that idea is reasonable. Would you stink up your job intentionally so your company could bring you back at less than what you’re worth on the market? Do you want to tarnish your stellar relationship with your co-workers with a lackluster performance? Do you want other potential employers to know that you’re a hack? Your current employer might not want you back and then you’re forced to take a reduced contract from a team that is, at best, your second choice of employment.
I think that if he was hell-bent on remaining a Brave he would have told Boras to get bent and he would negotiate his deal with his dad like he did last time. As much as I think he wants to remain a Brave at heart, I think he really wants to test free agency.
By Braves Fan 79
June 12, 2007 9:21 PM | Link to this
wow….your talk with boras has to be one of the most boring blogs ive ever read. No offence of course. But i dont care what boras has to say…the mans the perfect example of greed in sports.
This is the man trying to get andrew out of atlanta…so screw em! And yea its doubtfull the Braves would get a hometown discount if they did negotiations in the offseason…i think if we did it now thou theres a much better chance! Once u allow other teams to start creeping in with offers of course hes going to want the most $ offered. That after all….is how we lost Glavine…and how we almost lost Smoltz. I think Scherultz should rethink his policy regarding this.
Man 3-1….Davies was pitching good 2….we gotta have the WORST backup infileders in baseball (orr..woodward)….owell id rather see orr in the lineup than woodward, thou both are pretty much guarnteed outs!
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:22 PM | Link to this
I really don’t like to pile on but Orr has no arm to go with his no hitting.This team needs a pitching coach.
By Bob
June 12, 2007 9:22 PM | Link to this
Getting real ugly now.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:22 PM | Link to this
Game over folks…
By bocabrave
June 12, 2007 9:23 PM | Link to this
davies is garbage. absolute garbage. i’m switching to a rerun of “House”. garbage.
By eric the elder
June 12, 2007 9:23 PM | Link to this
About 90 pitches for Davies thru 3 2/3 innings.
By geauxbraves2000
June 12, 2007 9:24 PM | Link to this
When I keep trying the same thing over and over, and over and over it doesn’t work, I try something new. I mean, what have I got to lose?
Geaux Braves!!
By Carolyn Wilder
June 12, 2007 9:25 PM | Link to this
Heck no Andruw is NOT overrated!!! The very BEST center fielder ever! I really hate it that his agent is Boras. That means he’ll probably be gone from ATL. I’ll still be a fan tho’.
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:25 PM | Link to this
If Thorman would’ve been standing on the pitcher’s mound, that throw from Orr would’ve been right at him.
It never fails. You CAN’T hide your weakest link in the field. The ball will find him.
In our case the ball does find him…..EVERYTIME McCann throws it back to him.
What, you thought I was talking about Orr? Nope. Kyle is our weakest link tonight.
Oddly enough, Bobby comes out 1 pitch too late, like he seems to always do.
(sigh)
Right when Davies has ME starting to believe, he pulls the football away RIGHT when I was about to kick it.
Just another sign of proof that the whole “Orr - Woodward - Salty - Escobar - Pena” debate has NOTHING to do with how far the Braves go this year.
I wonder how Davies would fair if HE EVER GOT TO FACE A TEAM the 3rd time through the order.
By Davies Blows
June 12, 2007 9:26 PM | Link to this
Well, that was a good hour of entertainment. You knew with Davies it was just a matter of time.
The guy is way too inconsistant to be in the big leagues right now. Unfortunately, we don’t have anyone better.
By The Truth Hurts
June 12, 2007 9:27 PM | Link to this
DOB, you’re responsible for telling Davies that this was supposed to be Good Start Kyle.
I will give Kyle some propers: he motivates me to drink during his starts. Otherwise, the pain of 100 pitch, 4 inning outings would be almost too much to bear. I like to drink. I really like to drink when Smoltz isn’t pitching.
Maybe Kyle should try the Drew Gooden haircut to change things up a bit.
I was almost willing to bet that Paris would get out of jail before Kyle did the 4th.
By eric the elder
June 12, 2007 9:27 PM | Link to this
About 90 pitches by Davies thru 3 2/3 innings.
Thor, take a look at how Castillo hits.
By MAKING OUTS ISN'T A GOOD MEASURE
June 12, 2007 9:28 PM | Link to this
We’ve all seen Andruw Jones catch balls that other players should have/could have fielded.
Catching fly balls in front of your left and right fielders isn’t impressive.
By eric the elder
June 12, 2007 9:29 PM | Link to this
Thor, never mind … har, har.
By jch
June 12, 2007 9:29 PM | Link to this
Chad
touche
But I still don’t have to like him!
By atliens1217
June 12, 2007 9:29 PM | Link to this
I’m done with Kyle Davis. We need to go out there and get 2 more legitmate starters. I’m seriously done with Kyle Davis.
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 9:29 PM | Link to this
I can’t recall the last time I saw a guy throw 40 pitches in an inning, that’s a full count to 8 guys.
Well I had better be right about Slowey getting hit hard or it’s going to be a long night.
By Ed Glennon
June 12, 2007 9:31 PM | Link to this
I think it is insulting to Willie Mays to mention any modern day player and Willie in the same sentence. How about Jim Edwards. Aside from putouts you might check Willie’s batting average with Andruw’s. As I have also mentioned a number of times when experts under 40 try comparing any centerfielder to Willie is that Willie spent two years of his prime in the Army.
By David O'Brien
June 12, 2007 9:31 PM | Link to this
Well, I guess you get close enough to Canada and the big dog will hunt. Thor strikes a mighty blow….
OK, one more thing on Boras, since I think a lot of you are as confused as I am by zone ratings. He pointed out to me that if a fielder goes out of his zone to make a play, he’s not credited with that play for purposes of zone rating. But if he doesn’t make the play when he’s out of the zone attempting to, he’s penalized for it.
At least I think that’s what he said. It would make sense, would explain why some of the guys who I consider the best fielders usually show up well down the rankings in zone ratings, and some rather mediocre fielders are often near the top.
Anyway, I just added these graphs to the original blog, in case you care:
He got into a rant on “zone ratings” (Stark also cited that defensive stat), with Boras explaining, “The fallacy of zone rating is if you have greater range you’ll have more attempts used against you, and not be credited for the greater range.”
( Boras said he had reduced a negative zone rating to shreds in someone’s arbitration hearing.)
By geauxbraves2000
June 12, 2007 9:32 PM | Link to this
Are the Braves in a hurry to get somewhere?
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:33 PM | Link to this
“I’ve got’a think all these pitchers being inconsistent with their delivery has something to do with Mcdoweell vs Leo.”
Uh. Yeah, that’s it. Because Leo did such a FINE job refining the skills of Marquis, Odalis Perez and Jason Schmidt. Not to mention that he “solved” Steve Avery and Mark Wohlers’ issues, didn’t he?
Do I need to go all Let me tell you about the Big-3 pitchers on your a$$?
Not saying that McDowell is the greatest, but let the “Leo” crap go already. He’s gone.
David Copperfield could not make Kyle Davies a good ML pitcher. Though it sure would be nice if he could stop by and make him dissapear. I’d rather like that.
By TennesseePaul
June 12, 2007 9:33 PM | Link to this
What’s up with Smoltz for real? All this smoke and mirrors and destractions and stopping short. All we get is “he tweaked it”. That’s one helluva tweak to keep him out so long.
By StingerSplash
June 12, 2007 9:35 PM | Link to this
Well, that certainly was bad. Given the Braves’ injuries and other starting staff shortfalls, if Davies is told to hit I-85 and not stop until he gets to Richmond, who fills the gap? And why doesn’t Lucifer just call Stark himself? Is he going to bee-yotch to other writers who cover players who were likewise mistreated in Stark’s book (and how are those sales going anyway?)
By Coach
June 12, 2007 9:36 PM | Link to this
Jykell pitched the first three and then Hyde showed up in the fourth. I swear , Davies really did look like a completely different pitcher in the fourth inning than the guy who pitched the first three. What a frigging head case this kid is.
By Chad
June 12, 2007 9:37 PM | Link to this
I wonder if this would benefit the Braves better with the situation we are in: Oscar Villreal be assigned as the starting pitcher, kyle davies as short reliever. Perhaps Kyle will benefit there better since he still does have the good pitches but his durablity issues conflict the idea for him to be a starter. Just a thought.
By MEB
June 12, 2007 9:37 PM | Link to this
Our fourth starter has a first name its… O S C A R
Our fourth starter has a last name its… V I L L A R R E A L
GO BRAVES!!!
By Braveheart
June 12, 2007 9:39 PM | Link to this
I agree that making outs is not exactly a great measure but Catching fly balls in front of your left and right fielders isn’t impressive. What are you smoking? He is the centerfielder. The centerfielder is supposed to call off every other fielder in his way when it is time to catch a ball, including the leftfielder, the right fielder, the shortstop, and the second baseman. If the centerfielder can catch it, he is supposed to catch it and call everyone else off. If you played above tee ball, you would know that. So, it is impressive that he gets to balls in front of right fielders or center fielders. he is supposed to do that.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:41 PM | Link to this
McCann really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really needs to get going…both offensively and defensively…
By David O'Brien
June 12, 2007 9:41 PM | Link to this
The Truth Hurts, that was Carroll who pointed that good start/bad start thing out with Kyle. Not yours truly.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:42 PM | Link to this
n8 you’re ranting fella.
By MEB
June 12, 2007 9:44 PM | Link to this
Is that Luis Castillo’s game face or does he have some pretty severe indigestion?
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:44 PM | Link to this
DOB
““The fallacy of zone rating is if you have greater range you’ll have more attempts used against you, and not be credited for the greater range”
So that’s similar to when Bobby used to say that while Ryne Sandberg was a great 2B, who made many great plays, he often had to dive to make plays that Blauser made standing up.
No sh!t. He really said that once.
The man was dillusional BACK THEN, as well. Blauser better than Sandberg. That’s funny.
Well, McCann is an equal opportunity hitter these days. Showing his versatility by having Warning Track Power AND the ability to hit into a DP on an 0-2 count.
Nice of Andruw to TAKE A FRICKIN PITCH after seeing the 1st two outs come on 4 pitches.
This Slowey guys IS NOT GREG MADDUX!!! He shouldn’t be only at 60some pitches in the 6th inning.
GOTTA LOVE Hack-n-Jack.
No biggy I guess. After all we DO have 2 HR’s tonight. So at the end of the year we can be left scratching our heads as to why we’re near the top of the league in HR, yet can’t score any runs.
FOR THE RECORD…..Hunter scores on that Francoeur single. Andruw might’ve as well……..in 1997. Or if there was a dognut sitting on Mauer’s helmet. He would’ve dove into home plate mouth first.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:45 PM | Link to this
Coach Davies lost his delivery in the third.
By David O'Brien
June 12, 2007 9:46 PM | Link to this
Let me state the obvious: Salty won’t be going back to the minor leagues.
By Salty
June 12, 2007 9:47 PM | Link to this
Yea Me!!!
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:47 PM | Link to this
Can Thor actually get hits in consecutive ABs???
By Thorman Blows
June 12, 2007 9:49 PM | Link to this
Well, you knew that was coming when Thorman stepped into the box. This lineup just has way too many holes to get any kind of sustained rally.
By The Truth Hurts
June 12, 2007 9:49 PM | Link to this
A guy named Slowey had a quality start against us.
$1 to the blogger that can pinpoint, within one calender year, the exact date that Thorman will hit an outside pitch to left.
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 9:49 PM | Link to this
Or if there was a dognut sitting on Mauer’s helmet. He would’ve dove into home plate mouth first.
Thanks N8, I really, really needed a good laugh!
By Bill
June 12, 2007 9:51 PM | Link to this
Who gives a sh— about Scott Boros staying up late and crunching numbers on Andruw. The Braves don’t need AJ at his big salary. I’m beginning to believe Andruw is overated. He’s never going to hit over .265. His defense is great but strikes out to much. I hope the Braves comes to a conclusion that he is just not worth it. Spend the money on pitchers. How much longer are we going to have to put up with Davies. He’s garbage. He’s a head case. He’s had enough chances to get himself straighten out. Send him back to Richmond or trade him if they could find someone that would have him.
By Coach
June 12, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
Hey Thor , nice at bat. The pitcher throws the first two way off the plate and you swing at the third one trying to hit it into the next zip code and ground out to 2B , killing the rally.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
Esco-bar…..gooood stuff !!!
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
Truth, that’s a trick question because the answer is NEVER (unless it’s an accident)
By Braveheart
June 12, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
good lord, N8, luv you man but geez, you are one negative sonuvagun. why don’t you tell us how you really feel already? you have really got to learn to express your frustrations more. I gotta go up to Minnesota sometime to watch a game with you. that has gotta be one hilarious experience watching you scream about every little thing. you should be more a football fan than a baseball fan. that way you could get your rants out one day a week. this daily ranting and raving has got to be taxing on your body. you’re gonna have a heart attack someday.
By Salty
June 12, 2007 9:53 PM | Link to this
DOB You couldn’t have timed your comment any better!
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 9:54 PM | Link to this
I never thought that I would actually get sick of watching Brian McCann hit. He used to never have a poor at-bat. Now it just seems like he grounds out to second base in 2 out every 3 at-bats. I know that is not the case, but jeez, it sure feels like it. He hasn’t an important hit since the Brewers series. If these injuries are really affecting him, the go on the DL and let Salty catch. McCann certainly isn’t doing the Braves any favors with his defense…7 errors is 53 games and 5 out of 27 base stealers thrown out. Ouch.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 9:54 PM | Link to this
When do Davies and Oscar switch roles??
By N8
June 12, 2007 9:55 PM | Link to this
I have to say DOB, that while he might not be as consistant defensively as Renteria, Escobar seems to have more range, and ya gotta love the cannon.
Of course statistically because he appears to have more range than Edgar, he’ll NEVER be rated as the higher defender of the two. LOL!
ZONE SCMONE!
By ernesto
June 12, 2007 9:55 PM | Link to this
If Davies would just come out and go after guys he’d be better off - he even says that’s his problem - so why, why, why…Delilah, I mean Davies, do you keep doing the same things that get you in trouble. I mean the kid can obviously pitch when he gets out of his own way.
By Chad
June 12, 2007 9:55 PM | Link to this
How about that Oscar!!
By eric the elder
June 12, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Aville Ranger, props for this observation:
Davies fingers were almost raking the dirt in the 1st and 2nd and now he’s finishing 2 ft up.
Exactly right. I’ve noticed this in all of his recent outings.
It’s like his back gets lazy, and that’s when his fast ball goes up, and he loses control of his breaking balls.
It’s called video, Roger. Look at it.
By Bill
June 12, 2007 9:56 PM | Link to this
Who gives a sh— about Scott Boros staying up late and crunching numbers on Andruw. The Braves don’t need AJ at his big salary. I’m beginning to believe Andruw is overated. He’s never going to hit over .265. His defense is great but strikes out to much. I hope the Braves comes to a conclusion that he is just not worth it. Spend the money on pitchers. How much longer are we going to have to put up with Davies. He’s garbage. He’s a head case. He’s had enough chances to get himself straighten out. Send him back to Richmond or trade him if they could find someone that would have him.
By jch
June 12, 2007 9:57 PM | Link to this
I got an idea for our 4 & 5 spots in the rotation - just start the game in the bullpen…
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 9:57 PM | Link to this
Lebron just got his 3rd foul and it’s 6 minutes till half time.That could seal it for S.A.
By ernesto
June 12, 2007 9:59 PM | Link to this
Pete Orr sucks.
for anyone who’s been living under a rock since April.
By Orr is worthless
June 12, 2007 9:59 PM | Link to this
Does anyone remember that last hit Orr had? i know he had an RBi single in one of the Mets series back in April, but this guy is unbelievable.
By The Truth Hurts
June 12, 2007 10:00 PM | Link to this
Watch Verlander’s curve tonight. Seriously.
Fastball hit 102mph in the 9th. Seriously.
Hey, the Twinkies have a right-handed Pete Orrrrr on their team and his name is Lew.
I’ve got an idea: let’s not face Nathan in the 9th.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 10:01 PM | Link to this
Seriously, for all that is sacred in the world…get Pete Orr off of this freaking team. He is as useless as snow shoes in Atlanta. The guys is plain AWFUL. Combine Orr and Woodward and you have a single A player….
By David O'Brien
June 12, 2007 10:01 PM | Link to this
I hear ya. I’m gonna have to get a look at their zone ratings before I pass judgment.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
That out by Harris shows why Kelly is the better base runner.
By SteelCav
June 12, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
oh willie
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:03 PM | Link to this
Man, this team is just plain stupid. No plate discipline…ever. Now we get thrown out at second with two outs and the heart of the order coming up.
By N8
June 12, 2007 10:04 PM | Link to this
” this daily ranting and raving has got to be taxing on your body. you’re gonna have a heart attack someday.”
Nope. Calm, cool and collected.
How many times do I have to say to you guys…I don’t yell, get wound up or freak out. It doesn’t happen.
Just get a little long winded, that’s all.
Believe me, if this team actually had anything GOOD to talk about, I would be “overstating” those facts as well.
You want me to stop the negative posts. All you gotta do is wait until this team stops sucking.
I’ve got the patience…..do you?
By Jim
June 12, 2007 10:04 PM | Link to this
Maybe we should be killing McCann more than Orr. The absence of McCann’s bat in this lineup is having more of an impact on the offense than the presence of Orr’s.
By Savannah Guy
June 12, 2007 10:05 PM | Link to this
Couldn’t help but continue my 10:23 morning t-shirt post (it’s not out of my system):
O’BRIEN AIN’T LYIN’ (blogging the other side of baseball)
O’BRIEN’S BLOG (enter at your own risk)
O’BRIEN’S BRAVO BLOG. (home of the brave, land of the free)
BLOG ON DUDE. (you talk baseball?)
DON’T CLOG THE BLOG. (be original)
on that note…
By Calvin
June 12, 2007 10:06 PM | Link to this
So I have MLB extra innings on comcast cable right…they game is being televised via FSN North, the Twins station. Anyway, they had Kent Hrbeck(I’m sure I butchered his name) on and he was talking about the play in the 91 world series where he lifted Gant’s leg off the bag for an out. Anyway, he constantly says that he didn’t pull Gant off the bag and they should clips of the play and it is clear(at least to me) that he pulled Gant off the bag. It was just funny for him to continue to deny that…oh well.
Btw, once again, Davies has a bad outing after a somewhat good one…talk about inconsistent.
By MEB
June 12, 2007 10:08 PM | Link to this
Playing baseball indoors with a baggie for an outfield wall is not how its supposed to be. What a piece of crap!
By journalist jimmy smith
June 12, 2007 10:09 PM | Link to this
pete orr is now hitting .184 - listed at 185 pounds on the roster. this is epic. not sure how much that is in canadian weights and measures. where is hk? now, could pete orr be over-rated? woodward?
pete orr and thorman combined weight (US) 420. combined batting averages +/- .410
By Ed Glennon
June 12, 2007 10:10 PM | Link to this
It has been a lousy game so far but at least we had two big laughs: Andruw hitting 4th and Orr in the starting lineup.
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:10 PM | Link to this
My point exactly, Jim. McCann is killing us.
By MBATL
June 12, 2007 10:11 PM | Link to this
I don’t expect much of Pete Orr. Chipper’s hurt, Edgar’s hurt, so Pete’s in for defense.
The big problem I have is McCann. He’s hit 3 HR this year… 2 in the FIRST TWO GAMES of the year. That’s 1 HR since April 4. I love the guy, but at some point, he’s got to contribute to the effort. There is in fact some competition.
By ElbravoX
June 12, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this
Burn metrodome burn. High school-army nightmares are back!
By jed
June 12, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this
Late reading the last blog. Funny stuff. But I suggest a shortened and even more oblique version of DOB’s message, just to screw with people’s heads:
“Strap on the leotard, Hoss!”
Could eventually become the next “Git ‘er done”.
By N8
June 12, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this
JasonInMaine
“When do Davies and Oscar switch roles??”
What’s the diference? Neither of them can go longer than 3-4 innings without losing it. If they happen to be pitching on a day when they “had it” to begin with.
6 of 1, half dozen of the other, if you ask me.
Oscar’s “role” is fine. Davies should be in AAA. Can’t really sum it up any clearer.
By Braveheart
June 12, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this
Nope. Calm, cool and collected. How many times do I have to say to you guys…I don’t yell, get wound up or freak out. It doesn’t happen.
Well, damn. That ain’t any fun.
By JasonInMaine
June 12, 2007 10:14 PM | Link to this
Goodnight Irene…
By Braveheart
June 12, 2007 10:15 PM | Link to this
Can someone tell Pete Orr to finally make himself useful by taking those pictures that Lockhart gave to him and pass those on to Oscar so that Oscar can finally get a start or two?
By Ron
June 12, 2007 10:15 PM | Link to this
That is why Boras makes the BIG CASH!!!!!! Love em or hate em, he is absolutely the BEST Agent in Baseball, hands down!!! I think he probably was a little bit worried about the book, and that is why he did research on it, and now if a team has concerns about it, Boras will show his stats that he discussed with DOB. Boras will say I will give you my research and we will get back with you. Boras is a Fantastic Agent!!! Boras is one of the reasons why Andruw is not going to be with us next year!!!
By N8
June 12, 2007 10:17 PM | Link to this
Anybody wanna take the over/under on McCann leading of the 8th with a solo HR?
I’ll ALL but guarantee it.
Timing people. Since the 7-1 start, we don’t have any. Unless you count the melt-down by Dempster on Sunday “good timing”.
Yup. We sure can take a wild pitch with the best of them.
We’re special.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 10:17 PM | Link to this
What is the record for innings pitched by the pen in a season by a Braves team ? Unlike N8 I’m optimistic, this team can break that sucker.
By Braves Fan 79
June 12, 2007 10:18 PM | Link to this
Good Job Oscar…2 bad he wasnt brought in one pitch earlier….why does Bobby not trust his gut when things start going wrong? It should be 3-3 right now. Man how many games have we given away this year…from giving redmen so many chances to the rally killers woodward and orr. Its amazing were still in it….owell i shure hope we smarten up soon and impove our bench by dumping woodward!
Boy bobby loves his rightly lefty matchup thing dosent he….sometimes 2 much. He should of just left oscar in.
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:18 PM | Link to this
Glad to see the bullpen removing all the drama from the game.
By B9
June 12, 2007 10:22 PM | Link to this
Welcome me to the blog, everyone. My name is B9, and my posts will all be benign. You will never see a negative post from B9. Here is my blogging style:
You want me to stop the negative posts. All you gotta do is wait until this team stops sucking.
I’ve got the patience…..do you?
Yes, I am benign.
By Bob, Journalist
June 12, 2007 10:22 PM | Link to this
10Paul 9:33. you think so to, huh?
Absolutely, positively, definitely, almost for sure …
And turning the page, Archie once told me that leverage is everything and I agree, though what he said was mostly Greek to me … I still think it’s nice to have McCann tied into a reasonable package but timing is, like location, location, location … important.
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 10:22 PM | Link to this
JJS Canada is on the metric system.I’m fairly sure 184 American is under a Canadian ton.
By eric the elder
June 12, 2007 10:23 PM | Link to this
I doubt that we can ever know, but I would like to know what McCann’s weight is today compared to this time last year.
By scribe
June 12, 2007 10:23 PM | Link to this
jayson stark is a total hack. He’s a gammons wannabe without the breadth or depth of knowledge.
By Johnny R
June 12, 2007 10:24 PM | Link to this
Savannah, you’re a real hoot. I’m dying here. Funny, funny, funny stuff. Thank you SO much for typing that. Goddam, that was hilarious! FUNNY FUNNY FUNNY! You thought that up on our own? By yourself? No way. No way anyone is that smart, witty, and funny. Bobjournalist helped, right? He had to.
By ernesto
June 12, 2007 10:26 PM | Link to this
nice approach for that last at bat from AJ - just a laughin’ and a whiffin’, and a laughin’ and a wiffin’. Good times.
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:26 PM | Link to this
Nice, big 8th inning out of our lumber. 1-2-3 from McCann, Andruw, and Frnechy (man, I hate that nickname).
By Aville Ranger
June 12, 2007 10:27 PM | Link to this
Latter mates,there’s work to catch up on.keep it real.
By Davies Blows
June 12, 2007 10:27 PM | Link to this
Let’s just hope the Mets continue sucking. That’s the only reason we are in it still. The phils are coming on strong and we’ll be in 3rd soon.
Come back Chipper!!
By Chris
June 12, 2007 10:27 PM | Link to this
Boras is the greatest agent to get top dollar for players. He is not only crazy about Andrew Jones but about anyone that gets him his commission. DON’T FORGET HE GOT J.D. DREW, THE BIGGEST OVERRATED PLAYER, UNDERACHIEVER, ALWAYS ON THE DL A HUGE CONTRACT!!!HE IS GOOD, HE WILL NEVER ADMIT THIS GUY IS NOT WORTH THE MONEY. THATS WHAT HE IS PAID FOR. HE IS GOOD AT FOOLING TEAMS INTO CONTRACTS!!!
By The Truth Hurts
June 12, 2007 10:34 PM | Link to this
At least we have the bottom third of the order facing Nathan in the 9th.
Another superb at-bat from AJ. Do they play with a right field in Curacao?
The central nervous system on any baseball team is its pitching staff. This has been, and will continue to be, the Braves’ core weakness. Orr and Woodward don’t inspire confidence, but they’re only a distraction from what is really hurting this team.
All the talk about the good work of the Braves bullpen…true…but check out the numbers on Minny’s bullpen. And they’re not fat, either.
By jed
June 12, 2007 10:34 PM | Link to this
I think i’ve figured out Jayson Stark’s problem. He hired Shaun to do the stats breakdown on Andruw.
By B-H
June 12, 2007 10:36 PM | Link to this
N8 aka B9 OH B-HAVE !!THE FRENCH CANON STRIKES,BONYPARTS WOULD B-PROUD.
By Edd
June 12, 2007 10:36 PM | Link to this
Too much money for an always streaky center fielder who has lost a step or two when we can get a .285 with very few errors for about 1 mill a year, love him but it’s time to move on Braves. Smoltz is still great even if he has lost a few mph.He just plays Smarter unlike Andruw who needs to try to hit for average instead of for the fence.. Go Braves………
By Ed Glennon
June 12, 2007 10:37 PM | Link to this
If there is anything worse than being in a row boat without any Orrs it is playing a baseball game with one. We have a lot more problems that McCann. We have about 4 people on the roster who should be in the minor leagues and none of them are named McCann.
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:37 PM | Link to this
Punto and Bartlett…two chumps hitting in the .220’s and they are now a combined 4 for 8 tonight.
Forget Andruw Jones being overrated…this bullpen is overrated.
By ernesto
June 12, 2007 10:38 PM | Link to this
at least Boyer looks good tonight….oh wait….
By Coach
June 12, 2007 10:39 PM | Link to this
Andruw hitting cleanup. Bobby , you have your head up your butt. Macay McBride goes to Richmond and makes four starts , gets called back to Atlanta and becomes a one out pitcher. his head is so screwed up right now it’s not even funny. Well , 7-3 Twins and I think this VHS tape will definitely be erased(Taped over).
By Jay
June 12, 2007 10:41 PM | Link to this
You cant convince me that he has slipped some in center. But most overrated? I can think of better canidates. Kenny Lofton comes to mind.
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 10:41 PM | Link to this
Who is this A%# clown Johhny R? Isn’t this the same moron demanding DOB issue him a new canvas to spew his crap?
By Matthew At The SLC
June 12, 2007 10:46 PM | Link to this
I have absolutely no problem saying it.
Andruw Jones:
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
A .211 BA!!!??? I’ll say it again… a .211 Batting Average!!!??? He’s at the Mendoza line, people. For all you people killing McCann for playing hurt… he’s not killing this team half as much as Andruw Jones does every stinking day. And Bobby the Nosepicker keeps on running him out there in the middle of the line up day after day after day. Any sane manager would have this moron head - case hitting 8th. Remember AFraud hitting 8th last year to send him a message? Bobby the Nosepicker doesn’t have the balls to do that. Reason number 327 why Bobby the Nosepicker is consistantly out - managed in the playoffs: lack of balls.
Andruw Jones:
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
By B9
June 12, 2007 10:47 PM | Link to this
at least Boyer looks good tonight….oh wait….
I can wait. I have all night. I am benign.
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:48 PM | Link to this
Even roookie pitchers must get excited thinking about facing this team. They don’t even need a scouting report. The Braves have less discipline than a minor league team.
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 10:49 PM | Link to this
Funny, Classic Coach…Haven’t been up in here in a grip, but I see ur up to ur rants…No beer cans thrown at the TV Tonite, eh???
By Darrin "The Vent King"
June 12, 2007 10:49 PM | Link to this
Anyone who thinks Andruw Jones is “over-rated” should be scheduled for a CAT scan. He single-handily made some scrubs the Braves had posing as #4 and #5 starting pitchers look like All-star material. He also helped make very good pitchers like Glavine, Smoltz, and Maddux look like legends for years. Don’t get me wrong Smoltz, Glavine, and Mad Dog were good in their own right, but with Andruw patrolling centerfield for them, it wasn’t even fair. When it’s all said and done, this writer, like so many before him, will end up looking real dumb. Jones JUST turned 30 yrs old (still can’t believe that) and has at least five or six good years in him. His “put out” totals will be ridiculous by then. If he ever learns some dicispline at the plate like he did when he single handily carried the Braves while nearly winning the MVP a couple of seasons ago, he’ll be right there with Mays.
GO BRAVES!!
By Stuart
June 12, 2007 10:50 PM | Link to this
This team sucks. The coaching/managing sucks. The bullpen sucks. They have no heart. They do not battle. They do not throw strikes. They do not have a SP beyond Smoltz. They cannot take advantage of opportunities. They are terrible baserunners. They are terrible in the field. This team will be lucky to win 85 games. They are mediocre at best. This is a game they should have won, if they didnt suck so bad. They have let games slip away that most average teams would have won, and tonight was no exception.
By eric the elder
June 12, 2007 10:51 PM | Link to this
fastasballs, yep that’s the one - - the one who called DOB “numbnuts” and got after our guy, the Journalist. He’s a coward.
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 10:54 PM | Link to this
Actually, I lost any love that I had left for dat turd Stark…For hating on Andruw, just to make more cheese…He’s got mu f-ck-id up to even think of buying that piece of crap he calls a book…Please! Typical ESPN
By MEB
June 12, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this
Braves lose and in other news… flying sturgeon in the Suwanee River knocked a women unconscious on Sunday. These prehistoric critters which can reach 8 feet long and weigh 200 pounds have been flying into people recently. A woman back in April, who was minding her own business, lost a finger and a tooth to one of the creatures. Oh, the humanity!
Journalist Jimmy… can you offer any explanation to such events? Could there be a larger prehistoric critter in the water scaring the sturgeons bad enough to make them fly?
By Seasontickets
June 12, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this
WOW! Did anyone else notice —-
Glenn Hubbard and Ron Gardenshire - separated at birth???
By Neked in Doody
June 12, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this
Oh damn, we’re in it now !!
By Coach
June 12, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this
Matthew , thats great stuff ! Andruw Jones , OVER-RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP !
By BravesDave
June 12, 2007 10:57 PM | Link to this
Another night of hoping the Mets lose. Let’s figure this out. The Braves are 35-30. At one point, they were 24-12. That means they are 11-18 in their last 29 games. If they played even one game under .500 over that stretch, they would be 38-27 and would have a 1/2 game lead in the division. Instead, the Braves have watched the Mets play the worst ball they are going to play all season and have not capitalized. They have actually played worse than the Mets. Shameful.
By Stuart
June 12, 2007 10:59 PM | Link to this
Oh yeah, KJ sucks too. He hasnt done sh1t since that stretch in may. Andruw is god awful. Willie Harris is terrible in the field. He is reckless on the base paths. McCann got fat counting his money, and sucks this year. Chipper and Edgar are too damn fragile. Edgar is going to get worn down in the second half. The league is cathing up with Escobar. I have given up on telling people Thorman sucks. Chipper is not dependable. The only two in the lineup tonight that looked like major leaguers were Frenchy and Salty. Davies is the biggest joke ever and I wish he would just go away. I never want to see him or Cormier ever again. They blew yet another winnable game. Since the 24-12 start, the braves are 7 under .500. That is disgraceful. This team is a joke and a disgrace. I am sick of watching them.
By Matthew At The SLC
June 12, 2007 11:00 PM | Link to this
Darrin, I’m sorry, but you’re an idiot if you think Andruw will ever learn plate discipline. To learn, someone actually has to WANT to learn. Andruw has been playing for 10 years. He’s never wanted to learn and he never will want to learn. He’s even said he won’t ever change his ways. He’s lazy. He doesn’t listen to his coaches. He is overrated because he’s half a ballplayer.
Andruw Jones:
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
OVER - RATED CLAP CLAP CLAPCLAPCLAP
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 11:02 PM | Link to this
For all da people who think we play stupid at times, Watch a couple of the Rangers games, and You find out what a dumb team is, Cheesewhiz….
But Orr, Gawd, he may be the worse bench playa, I’ve seen…Send Him to Mississippi, when Chipper gets off da DL
By Johnny R
June 12, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this
Oh my, we have a toughie. fastballs.
By serbok
June 12, 2007 11:05 PM | Link to this
*By Ed Glennon
June 12, 2007 10:37 PM | Link to this
If there is anything worse than being in a row boat without any Orrs it is playing a baseball game with one.*
I could not AGREE more!!!!!
By Jimbo
June 12, 2007 11:06 PM | Link to this
Hell yes Fathead is overrated. Why is everyone just now realizing this. He’s become a joke at the plate. He’s a atrike out or a double play waiting to happen and he’s never hit well in the clutch. Maybe they can take Torii Hunter with them when they leave Minny and leave Fathead behind. One can dream.
By The Truth Hurts
June 12, 2007 11:07 PM | Link to this
You don’t condense an 11 year career to 65 games to say anyone is “overrated.” That’s inane.
Three hours of my life I’ll never get back.
By meansonny
June 12, 2007 11:09 PM | Link to this
Great blog, DOB…
I’m not a Boras fan, but I’d definitely like him in my corner when I negotiate my next contract.
Jed, That’s a good one. I’ve honestly never been a big fan of Stark either. It’s not uncommon for me to wonder if he watches anything more than sportscenter before he writes.
By monty
June 12, 2007 11:13 PM | Link to this
Andrew does incredible things even when he clearly doesn’t have a clue what he is doing at the plate. He will still have a 100 rbi and hit 30 homeruns this year, wait and see. For most any other player those would be great numbers but the bar is set so high for him. If he ever regains his 2005 form and keeps it, without forgetting what he was doing right. He wll be the greatest centerfielder of all time, Mays included.Currently he is keeping his balance better but only swinging with his arms and no leg drive. In other words not really juicing the ball. If he was a golfer I would recommend another swing coach!
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 11:13 PM | Link to this
Stuart, if watching the Braves is that painful for you, then do yourself a favor and stop watching. While you’re at it, stop blogging here too. Your feedback is not helpful as you are pointing out what is either very obvious or very exagerated. Dude, you’re starting to make N8 look like an optimist!
Just kidding N8! I like many of your blogs. While some may call you negative others see you as a realist and instead of spewing garbage onto the blog your thoughts are well developed and usually well documented.
By TJ
June 12, 2007 11:13 PM | Link to this
Do not trade Saltalamacchia.
By Neked in Doody
June 12, 2007 11:13 PM | Link to this
I know DOB said McCann is about the same weight as last year.I swear though, he looks like he ate that fat contract.
By MEB
June 12, 2007 11:15 PM | Link to this
Gulls… how come we don’t have any gulls at Turner Field. They have gulls in Detroit and they apparently helped Verlander throw a no-hitter. During his post game interview on the field I could have swore that gull was gonna take the mic from the reporter.
By Johnny R
June 12, 2007 11:15 PM | Link to this
Oh, and I picked little erictheelder along the way. brave little eric.
yeah, spike, he’s da one. he’s da one.
oh man, how pathetic.
By serbok
June 12, 2007 11:15 PM | Link to this
*By Stuart
June 12, 2007 10:59 PM | Link to this
Oh yeah, KJ sucks too. He hasnt done sh1t since that stretch in may. Andruw is god awful. Willie Harris is terrible in the field. He is reckless on the base paths. McCann got fat counting his money, and sucks this year. Chipper and Edgar are too damn fragile. Edgar is going to get worn down in the second half. The league is cathing up with Escobar. I have given up on telling people Thorman sucks. Chipper is not dependable. The only two in the lineup tonight that looked like major leaguers were Frenchy and Salty. Davies is the biggest joke ever and I wish he would just go away. I never want to see him or Cormier ever again. They blew yet another winnable game. Since the 24-12 start, the braves are 7 under .500. That is disgraceful. This team is a joke and a disgrace. I am sick of watching them.*
ARE YOU SURE you are a braves fan? I suggest you stop watching!
By Memphis
June 12, 2007 11:15 PM | Link to this
Someone tell Stuart it is a 162 game season please. OK I will.
“Stuart, it is 162 game SEASON” Take it easy.
To say Kelly Johnson has done nothing and Willie is terrible in the field and reckless on the bases (after he basically won a game by being aggressive on a wild pitch Sunday) is a little much.
Amazing how everyone gets so down over 1 game. If the Braves had won tonight everthing would be too positive. The truth is somewhere in between.
By Tad
June 12, 2007 11:18 PM | Link to this
When Jayson Stark’s excerpt showed as the top story on ESPN, I wrote this rebuttal as a “User comment” that you may be interested in reading. I put it on the Amazon.com user comments. It was removed (I am sure) when he read it.
Here goes:
Jayson Stark uses flawed logic and skews statistics to try to support his unfounded opinions comparing selected players to a mythical baseball popularity rating system influenced by his employer’s industry. It is very apparent in his arguments that he does not have a very deep knowledge of the history of baseball and doesn’t attend or watch many games outside of the Philadelphia / New York / Boston area. Ironically, Stark is a voter for the Baseball Hall of Fame and the word “truth” is in the title of a book about his perceptions.
A more relevant topic for a reputable sports journalist would be a book that actually focused on the careers of the best baseball players at each defensive position in the history of baseball and their statistics, rather than overrating and underrating players compared to their position in a fictitional popularity contest. However, it is apparent that Stark’s view of “baseball history” is vastly skewed towards the present day and his view of player performance does not involve entire careers.
A sample segment, cited on a national sports media website, attempts to support his opinion that Andruw Jones is the “most overrated centerfielder of all time,” a position Stark defends by using “zone rating,” which baseball experts know was invented by John Dewan, the former CEO of STATS, Incorporated, then altered to eliminate extra credit for double plays, then changed again to penalize players for catching balls caught outside a subjective “zone” (OOZ) area of the field. These formula changes, along with the fact that the zone calculations are performed by many different people with different opinions of proper fielding zones while negating defensive positioning changes and irregularly shaped ballparks, would cause differences in the calculation of this statistic over time. This is the reason it is considered by many as an inadequate formula for true comparisons of defensive ability, particularly for players who make plays in the OOZ area, like Andruw Jones on a daily basis.
Based on his lack of understanding on the zone rating statistic, Stark claims that Andruw Jones lets 100 balls over a 162-game season drop that he was supposed to catch. I challenge him to show me 10% of that in a season, although I would be shocked if he was able to count them on one hand. Then we could look at the countless highlight-reel catches that Andruw Jones makes, all of which are “out of zone” and not included in the second revision of the zone rating formula.
A more consistent, fact-based defensive statistic is fielding percentage, but it contains data that contradicts the opinion of the author. Andruw Jones has a higher career fielding percentage (.991) than the other legendary, perhaps accurately rated, although maybe underrated centerfielders included in this chapter: Willie Mays .981, Mickey Mantle .982, Joe Dimaggio .978, Ty Cobb .961, Kirby Puckett .989, & Ken Griffey, Jr. .986.
Stark also misquotes that Joe DiMaggio has the highest slugging percentage of any retired right-handed hitter at .5788. This is simply incorrect as Jimmie Foxx (.6093), Hank Greenberg (.6050), and Mark McGwire (.5882) are all retired right-handed hitters with a higher career average.
The book does not accurately represent the history of baseball and is merely the unjustified opinions of the author, who is a baseball journalist and voter for the National Baseball Hall of Fame, but is more suited to be selling peanuts and hot dogs at baseball games than writing about them.
This book is a waste of time and paper. It contains unfounded, biased opinions that are supported by citing “a baseball scout” and giving incomplete and incorrect statistics rather than fact and sound logic.
I gave the rating 1 star, which is “overrated” because it deserves zero.
By Jimbo
June 12, 2007 11:19 PM | Link to this
If they trade Salty and/or Escobar they are Nuckin Futs.
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 11:19 PM | Link to this
For all da fans in here, it may sucks now, but its gonna get worse having to see Cleveland and Detroit, I think they are gonna wipe the floor wit our as-us, If we don’t get everyone back, and stop being complacent, Same shyt that happen June of last year, and we never recovered from it….
Hope I’m wrong about the last 2 weeks of this month, but It ain’t lookin good rite now, just Good that the mutts are strugglin…
By journalist jimmy smith
June 12, 2007 11:19 PM | Link to this
yes, MEB, journalist was about to break the sturgeon story last night when a violent thunderstorm approached and this journalist left the computer.
for prehistoric matters jimmy smith normally turns to journalist bob.
but journalist jimmy smith will venture to guess that michael vick is somehow behind this fighting sturgeon business.
now, baseball… that last plate appearance kept pete orr’s average from dropping into the .170’s. call it clutch hitting.
By Coach
June 12, 2007 11:20 PM | Link to this
Third place and a losing record by the end of the month. Watch it happen.
By N8
June 12, 2007 11:21 PM | Link to this
100% agreed, Tad. Stark is a loser.
By Chiefknockahoma
June 12, 2007 11:23 PM | Link to this
Johnny R., you are showing how ignorant and retarded you can be. Try coming up with some intelligent words to use in your sentences besides the crap talk.
By Chiefknockahoma
June 12, 2007 11:24 PM | Link to this
Johnny R., you are showing how ignorant and retarded you can be. Try coming up with some intelligent words to use in your sentences besides the crap talk.
By B9
June 12, 2007 11:24 PM | Link to this
Chrisklob, I hope you like my posts, too. Do you notice a similarity with N8’s posts? I’m always benign. Your Buddy, B9
By Todd A
June 12, 2007 11:25 PM | Link to this
I would like to lock up Boras and Drew Rosenhaus in Guantanamo Bay,and hold them indefinitely.
By Wayne in Utah
June 12, 2007 11:28 PM | Link to this
Does anybody really care that much that Scott Boras is upset? I don’t think that Andruw is overrated defensively, Stark was only trying to sell a book and be controversial. Andruw has probably lost maybe a half a step on defense, but that just brings him down enough where the other centerfielders can see him with a high powered telescope. He is still way out there from them.
As far as Andruw’s offense, and Scott B’s desires for a humongous salary, I think he is overrated offensively. Two years ago, he was one of the top 5 sluggers in the league. Now, maybe he is top 25.
Would I love to see him in an Atlanta uniform next year? Yes. At his current salary, with a reasonable number of years. Otherwise, I think it would be best for the Braves to move on, unless the new ownership is willing to sink another 10 million to the payroll, and I just don’t see that happening.
Stranger things have happened though.
Despite being ripped yesterday by my idol of the blog, I still contend that I would sit his tail on the bench for a few days, just to send a message. Then, when he came back, no way would he hit before Frenchy, McCann, or Saltalamacchia in the lineup.
So, whaddya think bloggers???
BTW N8 I skipped over all the blogs tonight, too frickin busy trying to do my regular job. Did listen to the game on XM (I hate listening to other broadcasters!), so I am guessing you were in prime form tonight.
Without reading anything you wrote, I will make a statement, that will probably make you feel better tonight: “Nate, are you crazy, you think that ……………(fill in whatever you said tonight)??? I can’t believe what a goofus, uninformed baseball wanna be you are!!”
Was that ok? :-)
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 11:28 PM | Link to this
B9, Lol.
By Bob Montag
June 12, 2007 11:29 PM | Link to this
STUART you are sick! Boras BS! Good job DOB.
By Eric C.
June 12, 2007 11:33 PM | Link to this
Lol…Stuart, tell us how you really feel. I have to agree with you on most points…this is one pathetic team right now. Davies is never going to be more than a flash in the pan.
And how bright was putting McCann and Jones 3,4 in the lineup…great move!!
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 11:33 PM | Link to this
For anyone interested, Mets trail LA 3-1 in the bottom of the 5th.
By meansonny
June 12, 2007 11:34 PM | Link to this
Big game tomorrow. McCann and Thor need to strap on the leotards and produce some runs. I think they’ll have a good opportunity against Silva. Hopefully, they’ll get opportunities with runners on.
Anyone who thinks Andruw Jones is over-rated doesn’t deserve to claim to be a Braves fan. They are typical and classless fans whose expectations of players supercedes logical production.
Andruw is playing for Atlanta at a discount this season. That’s a lot more than can be said for Glavine, Fookie, Sheff, & JD Drew.
His OBP, SLG, & OPS are right there with Francouer in what will be known as a bad year (top third in the NL and MLB for outfielders in OPS). He’s 9th in OF for MLB in total RBI’s (again, right with Francouer).
DOB’s brilliant blog points out that Andruw’s on pace for another great season in the OF (stats or no stats).
I really wish those who claim to be sick of this team would just take their own advise and just stick their heads in the toilet for the rest of the season. It’s a long season, and I’m growing very tired of stupid fans.
By Savannah Guy
June 12, 2007 11:35 PM | Link to this
Not exactly a Smoltz/Morris matchup tonight. The good news…we still have Smoltz. Kyle’s problem is not his stuff or his talent. It’s the head. Not ready for prime time. He needs more experience. Hopefully in Richmond or on another team…for his own good.
Orr is no Lockart and Woodward is no Ozzie Guillen. They are liabilities that take up space on the bench. To the moon, Alice.
Johnny R: Thanks for the backhan…er…slap. The new lines I posted were intended for blog newcomer promotional purposes and DOB branding, not big-Har humor. But thanks anyway. I know you have talent and a good, cynical eye, but since you have such a low threshold of humor, try this: I got your funny right here…
By B9
June 12, 2007 11:35 PM | Link to this
Third place and a losing record by the end of the month. Watch it happen.
If it happens, I’ll be watching. Your Buddy, B9
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 11:35 PM | Link to this
CoachI think Ur rite, unless Bobby can do sumptin and lite a fire in their a*—is, make them do push-ups or something for bullshyt At-bats, Or Something, this season started out like 95, and has hit a 2006 point rite now…
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 11:36 PM | Link to this
The Muts are doing their best to hold the Braves right where they are. 3-1 Dodgers. Bait-A meat went deep as part of a back-to-back-to-back homer outburst that concluded with a 420 footer by the pitcher.
Maybe if the Muts can lose another 9 of 10 we can catch them.
By Johnny R
June 12, 2007 11:37 PM | Link to this
Chief, the terms “retarded” or “retard” aren’t used in intelligent company.
Just to let you know when you go for that upscale dinner at McDonald’s.
By RDL
June 12, 2007 11:39 PM | Link to this
Simply stated, Andruw Jones is still the best centerfielder in baseball…Comparisions to Willie Mays are difficult…However, Andruw is easily comparable to Willie with regards to overall athletic ability…
By Scalp 'Em Braves
June 12, 2007 11:40 PM | Link to this
DOB
You call that a “tome”? Man, that was a freakin “Epistle”. Either BorA$$ talks at light speed in a five minute conversation, or you flat wore your hand out scribbling notes during what sounds like a long conversation with one of the highest paid windbags in the country. Sounds like a waste of good chicken salad that dropped on your notes.
BorA$$ scoffs at being concerned that Stark-Raving-Mad-Crazy’s claim that Druw is the most over-rated CF of all time, and he isn’t concerned about it affecting Druw’s free agent value? Then why the hell did BorA$$ call you spewing all this crap? I wish BorA$$ would just become an agent, and not be identified as an agent/lawyer. He gives the rest of us lawyers a bad name, and we’ve already done plenty to besmirch our profession. God knows we don’t need him and his rep - that’s nothing more than piling on.
In defense of what the loudmouth says about Druw, though, I agree that the accusation is completely baseless, and borders on sensationalism designed to do nothing more than generate debate, and sell books. There has definitely been much of the former, and probably some of the latter.
Anybody who has watched Druw as much as those who come here (at least the non-Mut types who pop their heads up like prairie dogs when things are going well for our apple headed brethren), and who have watched him track “balls to the wall” from his shallow play in CF cannot seriously accept this idiot Stark’s claims, or those of his “Deep Throat” scout. I read his take on Druw, laughed, and immediately dismissed the conclusion, as well as the so called factual basis for same. I’m not going to lend any credence to this drivel any longer.
I wonder why our Braves seem to wait until there are 2 outs to threaten? It is uncanny. Earlier in the year, we were scoring runs in bunches with 2 outs. Now, outside of a solo homer, we don’t seem to get anything going until there are 2 outs, and the hits ain’t a coming folks. Gotta figure out how to change this. Otherwise, there will be a lot more endings like tonight, and I don’t think that will portend a deep run into the playoffs.
I’m tired - nigh-tall
And the bleat goes on…..
By Lucille Willoughby
June 12, 2007 11:43 PM | Link to this
Andruw would be a better hitter if he didn’t swing at the the first pitch every time, no matter how crappy it is.
By chrisklob
June 12, 2007 11:44 PM | Link to this
JohnnyR, until you have something worthwhile to say on this blog you should just shut your trap. For the past couple of days all you’ve done is insult fellow bloggers. Stop being an idiot, it’s not becoming.
By Lew
June 12, 2007 11:48 PM | Link to this
Nathan stays cool and collected on the blog because he takes out all his aggression barking at his neighbors walking down the street. He claims this is not so, but we only have his word for it.
By Kentavo
June 12, 2007 11:48 PM | Link to this
Okay, I think we can all agree that Andruw is stellar defensively, even if he’s lost a step. But is he worth the $15 mil-plus he’s going to demand? No way. It’s time for the Andruw era - which so far has netted zero world series rings - to come to a close.
On another note: everyone talks about configuring a Braves lineup that would take advantage of the best/hottest hitting players. Has there ever been any thought of moving Renteria to 2B and moving KJ back to OF? I don’t think it’d be a mid-season move, but maybe over the offseason.
How’s this for a 2008 lineup?
KJ - RF Edgar - 2b Chipper - 3b Frenchy - CF McCann - C Salty - 1B Yunel - SS Willie/Diaz - LF
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 11:49 PM | Link to this
“Third place and a losing record by the end of the month. Watch it happen.”
I’ll still be watch B9, but furthermore I’ll be P**-ud, We’d better not go out like some Suckas…
By gotigers72
June 12, 2007 11:52 PM | Link to this
Is Kyle Davies maddening or what? Lerew should get a couple of rehab starts, and if he does okay, he should be brought back and Davies should be sent to Richmond. I know he’s young, trying to learn, blah, blah, blah. But he’s not getting any better. Some time in AAA may give him some confidence. His stuff is still outstanding, he had a great fastball tonight. But you have to throw the ball over the plate, and you have to keep it down and on the corners to ML hitters.
What’s, up with ALL of the Braves pitchers tonight staying up in the zone tonight? Villareal can be forgiven because he kept it down until the last 2 hitters when he was tired due to having to pitch 3 innings. But the others. YIKES! Those 4 consecutive hits Boyer gave up were all up. Does McDowell not have a tip to give pitchers that will help them keep the ball down? No pitcher this side of Nolan Ryan can pitch up and get away with it at this level. And even Ryan kept the ball down for the most part.
I heard the announcers say that only 3 teams have committed more errors than the Braves, and they said McCann now has 7 errors. He also has 5 or 6 passed balls, a couple of which can be excused due to his finger, but that is a lot of poor defense by him. He also has only 3 homers, 2 of which came in the first week of the season. 24 homers last year, 3 this year. That’s a serious power outage. He was much better in the 2nd half last year as far as power numbers. I hope that’s the case this year.
By Chiefknockahoma
June 12, 2007 11:52 PM | Link to this
Johnny R., you are a far cry from intelligent company.
By Tomahawkin
June 12, 2007 11:52 PM | Link to this
Dude, I’ll still take the Current A. Jones over someone like Jim Edmonds, gawd he fell off, he sucks…
And I’m out
By Chiefknockahoma
June 12, 2007 11:56 PM | Link to this
Johnny R., you are a far cry from intelligent company. I will see you at McDonalds. Are you working there tonight?
By fastasballs
June 12, 2007 11:57 PM | Link to this
I hate the Metrodome, it’s even a bigger home field advantage for them against NL teams who never play on turf. At least when Montreal was around the Braves played on the stuff 10-12 times a year. You can’t see the ball against the roof, can’t hear if the fans get going, & if the AC is blowing in you lose 10-15 feet on towering shots to left. They use to cut it off when the Twins were batting, not sure if that still goes on or not.
I can’t fault Harris for getting thrown out at second because the baggy has no bounce, wherever the ball hits, it is going to fall straight down. Odds are McCann was not going to knock them in anyway, he looked really bad at the dish tonight.
I can’t say enough good tings about Harris & Salty. I was a bit perplexed with the line up tonight, I think Salty hitting third was a better choice & probably would have produced several more runs. I don’t see why you stick two guys in the heart of the order who have not been hitting that well. KJ, Harris, Salty, Frenchy, McCann, Andruw, Thorman, & Orrless would have been my order. It’s weak at the bottom but at least the top would produce quite well.
By Wayne in Utah
June 13, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this
Kentavo: Problem with KJ in the OF is the Tommy John surgery he had a bit over a year ago. To be honest, if I were going to move Escobar to SS over Edgar, I would trade Edgar instead. I think he still has value for a lot of clubs. Do you think he could bring a mid level starter? If he could, would you trade him tomorrow for someone like Noah Lowry of the Giants? Just curious.
By Chiefknockahoma
June 13, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this
I will see you at McDonald’s Johnny. Are you working there tonight?
By P-Town Brave
June 13, 2007 12:02 AM | Link to this
Kentavo
If you were going to do that, then you wouldn’t put Kelly in RF and move Frenchy to CF, you’d put Kelly back in LF, play Willie everyday in CF, and keep Edgar at SS and place Yunel at 2b…A good lineup yes, but way too much a liability for a Cox team defensively…I myself agree w/ wanting that extra bat in the line-up…two if you count your Thorman benching…which I feel is much deserved…
Anyone notice our 2 players w/ the most hits tonight aren’t everyday players…doesn’t that say something about what we’re doing wrong??
By chrisklob
June 13, 2007 12:03 AM | Link to this
Dodgers 4-1. Top of the 7th.
By Todd A
June 13, 2007 12:04 AM | Link to this
I said it last year,and I’m saying it again this year:Schuerholz needs to bring in the wrecking ball and blow this roster up.We’re caught in no-man’s land.We have too much payroll tied up among 5 players,forcing us to try and get by with too many kids who aren’t quite ready for the bigs,and bargain basement roster fill-ins,several who shouldn’t even be in the Major leagues.Chipper and Andrew aren’t all that,and a bag of chips anymore.Sorry.We haven’t won a WS since Andruw Jones has been here.Chipper was a big contributor in ‘95 as a rookie,but he can’t get on the field enough anymore to justify his salary.It’s time to move on.We do have some young talent to build around if the organization would make them their focus.We need to bid farewell to the Jones’ Boys.Time to to free up some salary and try to get some young arms in here.Dump Hudson and Davies.As much as I love Smoltz,he wouldn’t be on board with this movement,and would surely ask for a trade.Something has to give though.We can’t win at the highest level with this roster.And ownership ain’t going to increase the payroll anytime soon.It would be a gamble,but if the fans saw a hungry,gritty,scrappy ball club,attendance may actually improve(certainly not in the short term).
By Ron Roberts
June 13, 2007 12:08 AM | Link to this
Too bad Kyle (which pitcher will I be tonight?) Davies blew this game for us before we even hadda chance to win it.
I’m a patient fan, but it’s almost time to throw in the towel on this guy getting it together. One-way to Richmond, please.
Gimme what Oscar gives us when he inevitably follows a Kyle Davies/Mark Redman/insert-most-Richmond-call-ups here in the fourth slot and Buddy Carlyle in the fifth spot and I like our chances.
By Carroll Rogers
June 13, 2007 12:11 AM | Link to this
Hey Truth Hurts, you answered a question for me tonight. i wasn’t sure anybody read the on deck boxes we write every day. fabulous! so he was good kyle then bad kyle in the same game. i was a little off in my prediction.
By snowball's chance
June 13, 2007 12:12 AM | Link to this
Damn, a new blog and already 226 posts. Sorry,but I haven’t scanned the posts yet. I hope DOB told Borass, I’m DOB beeeyatch. Borass is trying to ride on the blogs coattails. No Freeekin way
By Wayne in Utah
June 13, 2007 12:15 AM | Link to this
Todd A Are you saying with almost 100 games to go, and only 2 games out, you are ready to throw away any chance to win it all? Look at some of the teams who have won the WS in the past 5 years. Not necessarily the teams that the prognosticators were predicting all throughout the season.
For my money, let’s ride it out a while. If we are totally out of it in mid July, then I would say to unload a few guys (Wickman, Hudson, Renteria, etc.). Otherwise, let’s play it out for now.
Whaddya think?
By chipdip
June 13, 2007 12:20 AM | Link to this
JASON STARK…..MOST OVERATED SPORTS WRITER!!!!!!!!!!! FRIGGIN’IDIOT.
By bocabrave
June 13, 2007 12:24 AM | Link to this
guys, face it: mccann had his good year-he’s a .270 hitter-he’s cute and a local boy, but his pillsbury doughboy routine will not even be up to javy perez standards. smoltz (when he’s not disabled) is terrific and hudson and james are pretty good; but our starters suck beyond those guys. andruw is playing like someone from the islands, e.g. “no worries mon”; chipper is the sick-bay-commando; edgar is a stud; but not enough to make up for all the youth and inexperience in our lineup. And by the way, is there a way of knowing how many games cox has cost us by insisting on playing langerhans, orr, woodward, et al…BTW, betemit has a home run and a sharp single tonight vs. the mets. And don’t look now, but the Phillies are about to overtake us
so, what’s the message: JS has lost his magic-no tricks up his sleeve (sorta like his last 2 years in KC; BC’s loyalty stuff ain’t working; and there are too many kids in the lineup looking for leadership, which isn’t there.
as for the T-shirts: front: BASEBALL’S BEST BLOGGERS, and back: DAVE O’BRIEN: BRAVES, BANDS, and BURGERS
that, DOB, gives you the opportunity to franchise this stuff and make some real money!!!
By Chop Chop
June 13, 2007 12:25 AM | Link to this
I mentioned this yesterday, but this Boras blog adds a little juice to it…
Assuming that A-Rod opts out of his deal with the Yankees, Scott Boras is going to be very involved in A-Rod’s free agent negotiations. A-Rod will trump Andruw in terms of length and size of contract and you can expect Boras to be quite busy with A-Rod and his considerably more “hallowed ground.” It’s hard for me to imagine that Boras would be as rabid about trying to squeeze every last dime out of GMs for Andruw if he knows A-Rod is going to get a gigantic new deal somewhere else. An agent can spread himself thin, you know. I just happen to think that what happens with A-Rod will affect the tenor of Andruw’s negotiations.
By snowball's chance
June 13, 2007 12:26 AM | Link to this
Braveheart, we nailed the best headlines earlier.
By A-ville Ranger
June 13, 2007 12:27 AM | Link to this
gotigers72 Up in the zone does seem to be a theme now.Good point about not being able to pitch in the bigs if you can’t keep it down.One exception to the rule is Mariano Rivera. I’m trying to thing of a top starter who couldn’t pitch low when needed.Keven Brown at his best could stay up a lot for similar reasons to Rivera.Still Davies ain’t Keven Brown. His career depends on getting control over his elevation.
By jed
June 13, 2007 12:29 AM | Link to this
Strap on the leotard, Hoss!
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 12:33 AM | Link to this
gotigers,
I was about to remind you regarding McCann’s 18 homeruns after the All-Star break last season until I read your last sentence. He was banged up a bit last year, too.
Let’s give him a little more time before we start knocking his power. He’s still leading NL catchers with 16 doubles. And he has the potential to put up 8 HR’s per month when healthy and seeing the ball well.
fastasballs, I agree with you about Willie’s stretched single. Every baseball player is going to push that one. Especially a player with speed. That’s just a great defensive play (what a throw!) with a very “hometeam” friendly rebound off the baggie.
I do like your lineup. For some reason, I don’t see Bobby putting Salty that far up. Salty’s started 6th in the lineup three times (counting today). That’s the highest he’s been placed.
Bobby puts KJ, Willie, Prado, & Escobar at the top of the lineup with little to no MLB experience. But seems to find room for Salty ahead of only the pitcher and the #8 spot 72% of the time he starts (8th in the order 7% of the time).
Infer from above what you will. But I don’t see Bobby putting Salty at #3 in the order.
By Todd A
June 13, 2007 12:34 AM | Link to this
Maybe it’s just me,but does it seem to anyone else that Snitker is possibly the worst 3rd base coach we’ve had under Cox not named Bobby Dews?Andruw should have been sent from second on a two out hit tonight(down 5-2 at the time).Thankfully,Salty followed with a base hit to get the run home.But,it just seems to me,that we have had an inordinate amount of runners thrown at at the plate this year.Can we get Jimy Williams back?
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 12:38 AM | Link to this
If our gladiators were to focus on getting runs home rather than getting home runs, we would win a lot more games; plain and simple.
Methinks a pitchers mechanics should result in a consistent delivery. While we don’t get Sports South, from what you guys have said, Davies’ delivery was anything but.
Bobby and/or his pitching coaches and catchers have long been credited for quickly recognizing such things.
It sounds like it is they who should share the blame for tonight’s loss. I haven’t seen Shaun’s statistics on this but I’d be willing to wager that when the consistency of the pitcher’s delivery isn’t oscillating like a sine-wave, teams don’t have to get as many runs to win.
I wish I could have seen the game, for delivery inconsistency and pitch tipping are good friends … where you find the former, you often find the latter.
I don’t know about the discrediting of Andruw’s defensive play … but I did see the catch that first made Willie famous. Andruw may have peaked but if anything, he underrated … he makes things look easier than they are.
Andruw uses his instincts in the field and his brains at the plate … nothing wrong with Andruw’s instincts.
Speaking of books and such, any bets against “The Willie Harris Story” ?!
I’d break a rule and sign him now.
By Scott
June 13, 2007 12:40 AM | Link to this
Calling Andruw Jones the most overrated center fielder ever just makes you lose credibility. Stark is a joke.
By fastasballs
June 13, 2007 12:41 AM | Link to this
Look 2 games out at this point is more or less even, same as starting the season over except JS & Cox knows what the team needs to be better. Will JS make the right moves to make this team better? Stay tuned
The Braves have been given a gift by the Mets, they should have the Braves down by 8 plus games right now.
The Mets look a lot worse than the Braves right now, I’m not even being my usual biased self either. I have watched all of their games of the past week. Their offense makes our’s look like the all star roster. Their starters have been getting beat around especially Glavine. Jorge Sosa looks the best right now, what’s that tell you?
By Ted
June 13, 2007 12:42 AM | Link to this
Frustrating loss tonight…but tommorrow’s another day. That’s why baseball is so much like life. How do some of you “this team sucks” people get out of bed in the morning with such a negative attitude?
As for Andruw, he has lost a step. You don’t do what he’s done for ten years and not lose a step. But most overated is a big stretch. Boras is proving why he may be the best agent ever (he’s not paid to build a winning team, he’s paid to get the most money for his client). I would have him negotiate my next contract, but I don’t thing 3% of my salary will get him out to Nebraska.
Andruw has been a great Brave for a long time, and I hope Boras gets him a truckload of money…somewhere else. Unfortunately, the team that signs him probably won’t have the financial flexability to do much else to put a winning product on the field (unless it is the Yankees).
I hate to say it, but the Braves may have the potential to be a better team without AJ (please God…or DOB…do not strike me down). They will have the money to put a more complete team together. We’ve heard for years that the Braves were handcuffed by the 80M budget and the fact that 3 (or 4?) players eat up like 1/2 of it.
This is why the Braves never seem to give long-term contracts. My bet is JS has been waiting for years to get out from under AJ’s contract.
Here’s to hoping that Andruw, the Braves and the fans can enjoy this last year together and best of luck to him in the future. Good night. And good luck.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 12:42 AM | Link to this
Todd A,
No offense, but in one statement you blast the 3rd base coach for not sending the runner. In the next, you blast him for sending too many runners.
Somewhere in between, you mentioned that a hot Salty plated Andruw anyway.
Are you seeing anything in your own statement? Looks like Snitker did OK today.
By bocabrave
June 13, 2007 12:43 AM | Link to this
A’ville, i’m showing my age here, but the guys who could pitch up in the zone and get away with it, were the guys with serious heat: gibson, drysdale, koufax, etc. and, more recently, clemens; but, you’re right-those guys are few and far between, and all of them had strong second and third pitches. Davies has the pitches, but he lacks the command and the courage to throw them when he needs them. there is a huge difference between a nibbler likes glavine and someone who is just afraid to make the pitch (and the names would fill an encyclopedia because so many of them last 2 or 3 years and vanish) Unless the Braves make a big deal, e.g. a serious proven hitter or a serious number 4 starter (much harder to find), they are toast. it’s 162 games, and all weaknesses are exposed.
By N8
June 13, 2007 12:43 AM | Link to this
Ho Hum. Another day at the office for the Bravos. Just another loss to a sub-.500 team. Which is EXACTLY what to expect from a mediocre team……mediocrity.
Oh, and FOR THE RECORD….
The 11:21 post WAS NOT ME.
So whoever did it….Please stop it.
Couple observations. Salty and Escobar must stay.
Davies, Orr, Woodward, and Andruw must go.
McCann needs about 2 weeks off, to clear his head, cuz it aint in the game right now. His hitting is average right now (that’s being nice), his defense is shaky to say the least. Does somebody “feel the pressure” of the uber-prospect being on the roster? I hope not.
Last, but not least..CHIPPER needs to do whatever it is to get on the field. Hell, call bonds and have him send him a little “package”. Of course I’m kidding, but man alive, this offense is LOST without him. If I was Bora$$, I’d be worrying about why my superman client can’t carry the team while the REAL star is injured.
If I’m Chipper, and I come back in the lineup and everything “takes off”, I’m walking up to the homeboy upstairs and DEMANDING that Andruw’s money be direct deposited into my account.
NOW does everybody believe that there ARE other great defensive CF’s out there that can “play a little”, too?
Hunter is EVERY bit as good as Andruw (defensively), and, oh by the way….He can hit the ball around as well.
Looks like one guy can handle the pressure of a “walk year” and one can’t.
“But N8, why the negativity? We’re only X ammount of games back.”
Whatever helps you sleep at night. I sleep fine, because around the middle of May, I realized that this team is doomed. Talented? Absolutely. Gonna win the WS? LOL! Gonna win the East? LOL! Gonna make the playoffs? Not without Chipper and Smoltz dominating. Gonna fall of the face of the “playoff” map? One more major injury would guarantee it.
If JS trades Salty or Escobar for anything other than a pitcher that is CURRENTLY in the top 10 in ERA, in good health, and affordable for the next 2-4 years, he’s a fool doing nothing more than chasing fool’s gold.
Go Braves in 2008. Good Luck Andruw, wherever you “land”. Ask Glavine how his first year away from Atlanta was. Have fun.
By fastasballs
June 13, 2007 12:45 AM | Link to this
Muts Lose! Muts Lose! Muts Lose! Muts Lose!
By snowball's chance
June 13, 2007 12:47 AM | Link to this
Do the mets have a lead? There are a lot of negative posts with new names tonight.
I have some advice for Andruw. It is obvious to most of us that you are not happy. You like Atlanta. You like Bobby. You handled your previous contact without some scum sucking agent. Don’t tell me he took a cut last time. My only experience in high finance is buying two houses without a scum sucking real estate agent. I used the fact that there was no agent in the middle to knock down the price big time. So, Fire Borass, and what is his take, at last count he had 125+ employees,what is it 15, 20% or more. Whatever his cut is dump him and tell the homeboy he gets a discount.Maybe it’s a 1/4% under whatever Borass is lifting from you. Everybody is happy in Bravesville.
By chrisklob
June 13, 2007 12:47 AM | Link to this
Mets lose 4-1.
By Tad
June 13, 2007 12:49 AM | Link to this
DOB Can’t sleep for the surprising lack of roster change today. Edgar’s out, we’re down to 11 hitters in the game, but glad to see Salty DH and glad McCann stayed in for 9 innings.
I truly believe Salty needs to be in the lineup everyday, however we can position him. Please do not trade this great hitter for some temp. Willie Harris was hitting great tonight as usual.
However, I don’t feel the same for Pete Orr. Glad he got 1 hit tonight. Something’s got to change tomorrow to give us another hitter / backup catcher especially with Edgar on the sidelines and Chipper out indefinitely.
PS: Have you been watching Dmitri Young lately? How great would that be if he was producing like that for us?
PPS: Jayson Stark is an uninformed journalist from a town (Philly) with the most losses in major league franchise history.
By Todd A
June 13, 2007 12:51 AM | Link to this
Wayne,I’m saying this team ,with this severely flawed roster,ain’t winning a WS ring anytime soon.After that,who cares?We haven’t even won a WS game since the great choke of ‘96.And,if we somehow sneak into the back door of the playoffs this year,it will be just another first round exit.I don’t see this rotation catching fire in Sept-Oct like the Cardinals staff did last year.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 1:01 AM | Link to this
N8,
I’d say that PHI, NYM, FLA, & ATL are all 1 major injury away from falling out of the playoff picture.
Same can be said for about 6 other teams. I’m not sure what your definition of “major” is. But I’m going out on a limb and saying that your negativity is being proclaimed by every team’s fanbase right now. And by fans not named Nathan.
Yours is the negativity that claims in May that the team didn’t have a chance. Then you claim that the 1st round playoff loss was so evident (in the 9th inning loss of a 5 game series).
I can care less how you sleep. I get disgusted by your type who lives by the negativity card. Because only 1 team can win the World Series (and it usually won’t be the home team), you and the Roberts of the world feel so omnipotent with your “May” proclamations.
Do us a favor and find a team who you can root for. It’s obviously not the Braves.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 1:02 AM | Link to this
And you thought Francoeur had a gun. Michael Cuddyer has an absolute cannon in RF , Minnesota has a solid young team that they have built with the draft and a few very smart trades. Such as what is arguably the most one-sided trade in Twins history , Joe Nathan , Boof Bonser and Francisco Lariano for A.J. Pierzynski. That trade is an accurate measuring stick when assesing the market value of Jarrod Saltalamacchia. I have asked this question three times before : Bob Gibson did it 1968 and Johan Santana repeated this amazing feat of consistency in 2004. It took 36 years in between in the modern era since the mound was lowered. It’s only been done twice and I’m gonna spill the beans during Santana’s start on Thursday because I don’t think anybody else will figure it out.
By snowball's chance
June 13, 2007 1:03 AM | Link to this
I’ve heard the Minneapolis music scene compared to Portland’s. I don’t think we’ll be hearing from DOB tonight. Good night all.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 1:04 AM | Link to this
While I don’t agree with the forcast, I can understand the frustration in Todd’s “ain’t winning a WS ring anytime soon. After that, who cares”
Hopefully, the After that, who cares has a lot of takers. Count me as one who does!
By Wayne in Utah
June 13, 2007 1:14 AM | Link to this
Todd: You maybe right, but when have you seen the Braves organization give up? I haven’t in 15 years. They fight with the resources at their disposal to put up as good of a team as possible.
Do you really like the Mets roster that much better than ours? I will choose to stay positive, until Chipper goes down for good one day, then I will admit all is lost. Until then, I think we have as good of a chance as any of the other top 10 teams in the majors.
Let’s talk again in September.
By MBATL
June 13, 2007 1:14 AM | Link to this
Coach, guessing it has to do with 100 or more consecutive starts of at least 5 IP, though Schilling and Cone are also ahead of Santana on that list. Otherwise, got no idea…
By Michael Procton
June 13, 2007 1:16 AM | Link to this
Coach: I don’t know the exact stat (and I haven’t nor am willing to look it up), but I’m willing to bet it’s got something to do with the ridiculous string of consecutive starts Santana had without picking up an L.
By jed
June 13, 2007 1:16 AM | Link to this
N8 figured out in mid-may that this team was “doomed.”
Mid-may? That’s crazytalk. How can you “watch” and “study” baseball, as you often say, and think this particular Braves team was “doomed” 6 weeks into a 6-month season? Basically, all we need to win the East is a 3-starter and a new first baseman (who could easily come from in-house). Pick up a spare RH bat for the bench and you’ve got a solid team. But you gave up back in mid-may? Such a statement seems to belie your claims of grand baseball wisdom.
Here’s what baseball teaches you: Dont get too down when you lose, and dont get too up when you win. What matters is that you learn from what you do so that you can keep making progress. The Cards only won 83 games last year, right?
By David O'Brien
June 13, 2007 1:23 AM | Link to this
Salty really impressing me. If I’m the Braves, I settle for nothing short of an impact young pitcher still under team control for 3-4 years at cheap to reasonable price, or a more expensive ace-caliber guy who’s still young. Other than that, I keep Salty and get him ready to play first base….
This loss is one guy, fellas. Sure, Braves should’ve scored more runs when they had chance. But Kyle just let that game get away with those walks before facing Torii. He was ahead 0-2 and 1-2 to those two guys and walked them. Yikes.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 1:25 AM | Link to this
Well, the team seemingly playing the best is still one game behind us … it might be a good time to make a statement!
Good Night Miss Allen
By jed
June 13, 2007 1:25 AM | Link to this
meansonny—i just saw your 1 am post…the N8-ster ticked you off too? we must be on the same wavelength today…
By Todd A
June 13, 2007 1:25 AM | Link to this
Meansonny,the point is,you have to know your personnel well enough as to who you can send,and when you can send them.Too many base running issues at third and home right now for a already mediocre team to have to deal with.We still have 100 games left to play.Hopefully,Snitker will grow into his job.If not,maybe you’ll take notice what I’m talking about.Besides,I was merely making an observation that I haven’t seen anyone mention to date.The 3rd base coach wasn’t the story of the game tonight.It was the ever so inconsistent Kyle Davies.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 1:30 AM | Link to this
Coach,
I’ve looked and looked. But I’m not sure I could find the answer.
I did notice that Gibson averaged 8.96 innings per start back in 1968. There were only 3 games the whole season that he didn’t finish his start. You have to remember that most road losses will only have 8 innings pitched. He pitched more than 9 innings 5 times (as many as 12 innings of unearned runs in a game).
I still couldn’t figure out your question though. My guess is that it has something to do with ERA (league leaders that season). But I don’t see what’s so special about that in that there are league leaders every year.
Anyway, I’m looking forward to Thursday. Thanks
By Chiefknockahoma
June 13, 2007 1:31 AM | Link to this
I appreciate the great blog you have hear DOB. Thanks for keeping us updated on everything. Also, want to say thank you to the great bloggers here. You provide very interesting comments to read.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 1:37 AM | Link to this
MBATL , your getting hot ! C’mon , I know somebody else will spot it. I mean , I was at baseball reference.com and was looking at Santana’s 2004 Cy Young season and it just about jumped out at me. I thought , I wonder how many pitchers have done it ? Then I started looking and the more digging I did it dawned on me just how nearly impossible the accomplishment really is. Doc Gooden would have done it in 1985 and then some , except mother nature threw him a curveball on July 4th of that year(I was there , the baseball game from hell , a 16-13 loss to the Mets , 19 innings , ended at 3 a.m. and then they set the fireworks off.), anyway , I think it’s an amazing feat for a starting pitcher. You may not , but I do.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 1:39 AM | Link to this
I agree with DOB tonight on Davies.
Looked great until those 2 walks (which came back to roost in the scorecard).
Coach, that was one of the best throws I’ve ever seen. Probably not as good as the one from Bo at the warning track to homeplate. But good enough to be of that calibre.
That was perfection from Cuddyer.
Jed. I don’t know what’s wrong with me. A little over a week off the board (watching the Angels almost sweep the Twins), and back home I just don’t have the patience for that type of drivel. Maybe I’m not used to the Atlanta humidity yet.
Go Braves!!!
By Todd A
June 13, 2007 1:45 AM | Link to this
No,Wayne,I haven’t.But I would rather rebuild than trade guys like Escobar and Salty(esp with JS’s recent track record with trades),just to squeak in to the playoffs and lose in the first round.
And,yes,I do like the Mets roster better than the Braves.Not substantially,but I do like their team better.There are not a lot of easy outs in their batting order 1-8 when Shawn Green is healthy.Their rotation isn’t much better/if at all.But,if Sosa maintains his good work,and El Duque returns to form,we won’t be able to stay with them over the course of a season imo.I don’t expect Pedro to help them down the stretch,however.Perez and Maine are average.
By Randy
June 13, 2007 1:51 AM | Link to this
DOB, I agree completely on Salty. He looks like a franchise player and it should take a major arm to keep him from being our first baseman. His approach at the plate makes him look like a seasoned player, very much like McCann in his ability to use the whole field. His hit to left today was a prime example. I could even see him having more power than Mc, though his minor league numbers don’t exactly suggest that. And his defense will only get better. I’d say he is average defensively now, possibly slightly above average given what I see as a decline in the defense of catchers in the last 10 years.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 1:54 AM | Link to this
O boy , not another word . you guys are getting to close for comfort.
By MBATL
June 13, 2007 1:56 AM | Link to this
Coach, can’t find the needle in the haystack. Santana, Gibson, Schilling and Cone are the only pitchers to have 100 consecutive starts of 5 IP or more - which is pretty amazing. Santana had a ton of consecutive ‘quality starts’ that year, but I can’t find a record that ties to Gooden (almost) or Gibson. Anyway, tomorrow’s coming on fast, so I give up. Look forward to the answer…
Brian McCann has 1 HR in his last 174 AB’s (going back to the 3rd game of the year). I’m not saying trade him, send him to the minors, bench him, or even talk bad about him… just that that’s a number that’s really hurting the Braves’ offense. If he and AJ were hitting to expectations, we’d be in good shape right now.
By N8
June 13, 2007 2:02 AM | Link to this
jed
“How can you “watch” and “study” baseball, as you often say…”
I’m quite certain that I’ve NEVER said that I “watch and study”, but if you say so….
“Basically, all we need to win the East is a 3-starter and a new first baseman (who could easily come from in-house). Pick up a spare RH bat for the bench and you’ve got a solid team.”
Is that all? Where (how) do suggest we get our 3rd starter? I’ll assume you are adding Hudson into the equation of the “3” starters? OK. I’ll assume you are NOT AT ALL concerned about Smoltz? I’ll assume that you think Chipper will be “fine”? OK
You are entitled to your opinion, as am I.
What part of this team has you so confident? 1B? Chipper’s health? McCann’s production? Andruw’s production? Hudson’s April? (because I’ve actually been watching his May/June instead - you see….it’s more recent). Smoltz’ health? Chuck James’ ability to go deep in games? Davies in general? It must be the bench, right?
Please tell me you haven’t pinned your “hopes” and optimism on Buddy?
By Jon
June 13, 2007 2:03 AM | Link to this
Yes he is overrated, that’s a fact. Having people in Atlanta comment on a blog about Jones is a joke. They will always defend him. Good luck to him next year where ever he goes.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 2:13 AM | Link to this
MBATL , it’s not even a record or stat. I’t’s more or less the by-product of a Cy Young caliber season and you almost answered my question :>)
By Wayne in Utah
June 13, 2007 2:25 AM | Link to this
Todd: You might be off to bed by now, but if you get this, I don’t think we are too far off in our assessments. I too like the Mets lineup, WHEN healthy. I like our pitching staff better though, and maybe that’s due to my optimistic view.
We BOTH agree that we don’t trade the young guys. Actually, I can see us trading either Escobar, Renteria, or Salty before the end of July. I hope it is not Salty or Escobar. For Salty, I don’t think the Braves trade him unless they get someone like Jake Peavy or Matt Cain type.
You state that JS has a track record of trading away top prospects. I can’t remember one that has been a total disaster though. Wainwright might be the exception, but the jury is still out. (BTW, I rented my basement to a kid a few years ago that went to school with Wainwright.) Marte for Renteria to me seems to be a win, and worse case in the long run, a wash.
So, let’s don’t throw JS under the bus quite yet.
Hang in there, I think we are going to see some changes that might make a difference. A righty off the bench for 1b/lf, and a 4/5 starter will emerge from the pack.
The biggest key is Chipper’s health. Our problem is not so much pitching as it is hitting at this point in the season.
Last thought: I agree with your assessment of Snitker at third.
Nite all……..
Jed and Meansonny, keep the faith!
By Wayne in Utah
June 13, 2007 2:45 AM | Link to this
Coach: I can’t figure out what you are talking about. I went to the Baseball Almanac and review both seasons. Santana started off mediocre, while Gibson’s season was one of the greatest pitching feats in baseball history.
BTW, I was at one of the two games that Gibson pitched against the Braves that year. Both were shutouts, but I can’t recall if it was the one on June 11th or on August 9th.
Have a good nite!
By Wayne in Utah
June 13, 2007 2:51 AM | Link to this
Coach: I can’t figure out what you are talking about. I went to the Baseball Almanac and review both seasons. Santana started off mediocre, while Gibson’s season was one of the greatest pitching feats in baseball history.
BTW, I was at one of the two games that Gibson pitched against the Braves that year. Both were shutouts, but I can’t recall if it was the one on June 11th or on August 9th.
Have a good nite!
By jed
June 13, 2007 3:09 AM | Link to this
hey N8—
yes, actually, i expect a freakin’ renaissance from andruw eventually. i expect mccann to get over his injury and resume his form. same goes for chipper. i think chuck james will get better as the season progresses. i hope salty takes over 1b. or chipper moves to 1b and escobar stays at 3b. as for a 3-starter, there’s already rumors of AJ Burnett for escobar/jo jo reyes. so that’s do-able too.
you’ve got a young team here, man. there’s upside & potential all over the place. you just cant see it for some reason. or youre more interested in whether your team’s gonna win the WS than who’s developing and what direction we’re headed in. go pull for the mets or yankees or boston, if that’s all youre interested in. and i’ve got one name to combat all your negativity: willie harris. mr mopey didnt see that one coming did you?
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 3:52 AM | Link to this
Stats don’t lie!
The Mets deserve to be leading the Division … after all, they have the best divisional record at 15-14 while Florida has the worst at 17-18.
Willie Harris is only hitting .412 … but at least he and McCann both hit homeruns in May.
Maybe we should platoon Brian too … he’s hitting .250 against lefties, Salty’s hitting .346.
Upon further reflection, since Harris, Thorman, and Diaz all hit better against right handed pitching, why platoon?
What’s wrong with this picture?
Scott … .239R - .200L
Matt …. .340R - .326L Willie .. .430R - .273L
Well, Scott’s playing virtually every day … Willie and Matt aren’t. Makes good sense to me, especially since Scott is such an accomplished defender and Willie isn’t hitting .430 against lefties … yet.
My biggest disappointment is Willie’s baserunning, he’s only 8 for 10 in stolen base attempts. Watching him in the eighth against the Cubs … methinks he coulda, shoulda, woulda stolen home … no guts, but he still got the glory!
By Berigan
June 13, 2007 3:58 AM | Link to this
Coach,
I was sure I knew what it was when you mentioned Santana and Gibson. If you combined hits and walks, it was still less than one per inning. But, I saw Good den did the same thing in 1985!!
Damn, look at Gooden’s innings(276) and complete games(16) in 1985! And 1985 was his second full season in the big leagues, at the age of 20. Man, no wonder his arm was shot a few years later. No one, no one ever looked sweeter throwing a ball. Kolfax said at the time, he’d rather have his(Gooden’s) future, than his past. Just shows to go ya…..
By A-ville Ranger
June 13, 2007 4:17 AM | Link to this
bobcabrave I had to get up for work reasons and checked some post.I didn’t mean that a good pitcher couldn’t get by with high pitches.In fact it can be a great tactic.My point is these guys with a few exceptions mixed the high heat on command along with low pitches.That’s why I put Rivera as the prime example of the rare guy who basicly uses the high heat alone.I’d go so far as to say the high inside pitch is critical for a power guy like Clemens.It’s the inability to get the ball down on command that ends careers.
By CrimeDawg
June 13, 2007 6:08 AM | Link to this
Count the Crimedawg as someone ready to say good bye and good luck to Andruw after this season!!…
All Andruw has to do is hit 30+ bombs with a .260 BA at season’s end and Boras will get him a Carlos Beltran type contract!…He’s not worth that type money even if we had it…
Boras will market him as the greatest defensive CF of all time and a guy who will hit you 35-40 bombs and some franchise will eat it up!!…
Meanwhile the braves need to save their money to acquire a number 3 starter (we canNOT afford to count on Mike Hampton again)…
Next year’s outfield?…Willie Harris to start in CF and Diaz as our every day LF…
Everyone who cares enough about the braves to read this blog has figured out by now Salty needs to be in the everyday lineup and untouchable in trade talks unless we’re getting a starter who can win us 20 games for several seasons…
Meanwhile I love Yunel Escobar but he’s our best asset (that we are willing to let go of) in trade talks and he absolutely must be dealt if we have an opportunity to pick up starting pitching…
By FSSikes
June 13, 2007 6:21 AM | Link to this
Great! We have the greatest outfielder in history. Great! Does his defense REALLY save 1 run per game like people say? I don’t think so. Now move Andrew to the bench, Harris to center, and Diaz or (insert name) to left and play the game. After a full year- now compare the numbers. What were the differences? The other fielders making a few more plays and center making a few less. How did all that change the wins vs. losses? I agree, not over-rated on defense, but I would sacrifice defense for more offense and Andrew just doesn’t have it anymore. Yea, he leads the team in RBIs, but how many times has he left the runners on-base when he’s had a chance to add to his totals. I’ve seen too many times where a single would suffice to score runs and yet he’s up there trying to hit the 5-run homerun. Braves - Let this guy hit the free agent market running. He isn’t worth 18 mil for his defense. You can find someone to fill his shoes for less and still get the offensive numbers. We could use the extra money for pitching.
By JasonInMaine
June 13, 2007 6:31 AM | Link to this
Wow, another lost opportunity. The Mets have lost 8 of 9 and are playing their worst baseball of the year, but we can’t take over the division lead. We should be about 3 games up by now. This team hasn’t played .500 ball for a quite a stretch. It will be interesting to see what JS has up his sleeve to try and fix this team.
By JasonInMaine
June 13, 2007 6:33 AM | Link to this
From Kyle Davies:
“It [stinks] to lose a game that I felt I pitched well,” Davies said.”
Well, if he thinks he pitched well last night, he has bigger issues than just last night’s game!
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 6:38 AM | Link to this
Be nice Jason!
By ben
June 13, 2007 6:40 AM | Link to this
i think the other jones is extremly overrated. trade larry!!!!
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 6:48 AM | Link to this
Jason, look in the rearview mirror … the people to worry about play half of their games in Pennsylvania and it ain’t the Pirates.
By JasonInMaine
June 13, 2007 7:18 AM | Link to this
I am trying Bob, Journalist; I am trying!
By JasonInMaine
June 13, 2007 7:22 AM | Link to this
Bob, Journalist:
Very true. Man, it is depressing to see that the Mets are 2-8 in their last 10 and we have picked up 1 stinking game. 1. That’s awful! The Phils on the other hand have picked up 5 games.
(sigh)
Will the Braves ever put together a good stretch of baseball this year? You know…one of those 11-3 stretches or one of their famous prolonged runs of excellence? I have to admit that I highly doubt it. When we used to go on those runs we either had a dominant line-up or a dominant pitching staff. Presently, we aren’t even close to having either.
Regards,
Jason
By aka
June 13, 2007 7:22 AM | Link to this
Andrue is not overrated, but he is just about the laziest ballplayer I have ever seen in a braves uniform. He wont make adjustment and kills an inning ralley in 2 out of 3 games. He wants to much money and I dont care if they raise the budget to 200 million, the braves should take their money and spend it on pitching. Make Salty the 1st baseman, trade Renteria and put Escobar at short. Move Harris or Francoeur to center and fill the hole that move creates.
I am sick of not having a whole complete team. This year we have hitters and guys defensive but no pitching after Smoltz and Hudson. They need to say bye to Andruw and the 20 million want to be and use the youth. These kids can play. Buy some pitching and lets start winning a championship.
Oh but I am also one that thinks Chipper is a waist of money and energy so what can I say.
By Hooters Girl
June 13, 2007 7:27 AM | Link to this
Andruw is much better than Chipper, but the media and “so called fans” continue to want to trade Andruw….I see a patern here!! Chipper gets hurt every 2 months.
On the other hand, Chipper keep leaving the big tips at Hooters…we love u!!
By Don!
June 13, 2007 7:35 AM | Link to this
The thing that truly upsets me about Jayson Stark is that he now holds the Atlanta-area ballot for the BWAA. Like many other ESPN writers, especially in his published work, he’s not exactly immune to writing for attention as opposed to news.
Granted, this book is an opinion piece, but he’s held a relatively negative view of Andruw and the Braves as a whole in several pieces in the past. In his article, he seems to hold some angst against Andruw for almost ‘stealing’ the MVP away from Albert Pujols. While Andruw may not have had the better overall numbers, there’s no doubt he carried that Braves team to a division title that season — and there’s no way they win it without him. On the other hand, you couls have replaced Albert Pujols with a borderline average first baseman for the Cardinals that season, and they still win their division.
Anyway, there are few times I’ll agree with Scott Boras — but this is one of them.
Later,
Don!
By p
June 13, 2007 7:45 AM | Link to this
Star was right. And you don’t need zone ratings and putout totals to tell us that for the past four years Andruw got progressively worse in CF. Last year was embarrasing to see the number of balls land on the warning track over his head. Give him credit for getting in shape this year, finally.
He looks great out there once again, and it’s great to have him in CF but that doesn’t make up for the fact he was fat and slow the previous four years.
By Alan
June 13, 2007 7:55 AM | Link to this
You people are out of your mind. Anybody that is paid 13 to 15 million dollars per year should not be batting 218 and in the clean-up spot. He is a joke. That is the problem with the Braves, attitude. Their mind set is “Well, we’ve won 14 ‘DIVISION’ championship. Other teams focus on the ‘WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP’. Andruw, to them ,is the greatset CF ever and in reality ‘OVERALL’ he is just above average! Braves should trade him now and get something for him because he will not sign with Atlanta after this year. GO GET SOME STARTING PITCHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By Savannah Guy
June 13, 2007 8:00 AM | Link to this
Once again, we got the good/evil twin pitchers last night: JeKYLE and Hyde. Fitting, being in the twin cities.
Oh, where might we be right now with a few more starting pitchers? 10 games in front of the Mets? Nevermind…just a passing fantasy of what if….more coffee please.
By David
June 13, 2007 8:00 AM | Link to this
Andruw is not overrated. He is one of the best IF NOT the best defensive OF of all-time. HOWEVER, his hitting is NOT going to get him into the HOF. He is a garbage hitter. He is not a clutch player. Look at his avg with runners in scoring position compared to the elite players. Because of his longevity he will have some big stats and compared to the rest of baseball he is a very good power hitter but he is not close to Papi, Manny, Jeter, A Rod, Utley, Howard, Beltran etc……..but that is elite company.
By Daniel
June 13, 2007 8:04 AM | Link to this
One note on Andruw as overrated: I don’t think Stark takes into account that Andruw’s been playing for most of his career behind a ground-ball pitching staff. That should be a consideration too, no?
By Braveheart
June 13, 2007 8:10 AM | Link to this
Is anyone else starting to wonder whether last year was a fluke year for McCann, a career year? I am really starting to wonder.
His first year: .278, .345, .400. A homer every 36 at bats. A double every 25.7 a bats.
His second year: .333, .388, .572. A homer every 18.4 at bats. A double every 13 at bats.
His third year: .272, .333, .408. A homer every 61.3 at bats. A double every 11.5 at bats.
In the other 360 at bats of his career besides last year, he’s hitting .275, hits a homer every 46 at bats, hits a double every 15.8 at bats.
In the minor leagues, he was a .275 hitter, hit a homer every 30 at bats, hit a double every 12.9 at bats.
You also have to break down the first and second half of last year.
First half, 2006: .343, .406, .505. A homer every 34 at bats. A double every 13.6 at bats.
Second half, 2006: .324, .372, .630. A homer every 13.2 at bats. A double every 12.5 at bats.
Excluding his second half last year, in his other 568 at bats, he is hitting .299, hits a double every 14.9 at bats, and hits a homer every 40.6 at bats.
He only has 14 homers in his other 568 at bats of his career other than the second half of last year.
Whatever. It seems that when he came up everyone thought he was going to be a solid .270, .280 hitter who would pop you 15-20 homers a season. Because last year was so great, we may have all gotten carried away with how good McCann really is. Not that a .280 hitting 18 home run popping catcher is not damn good.
But maybe we should not have crowned his a@s. Maybe he is what we thought he was.
By george
June 13, 2007 8:15 AM | Link to this
NO ANDREW IS NOT OVERRATED.
By JasonInMaine
June 13, 2007 8:23 AM | Link to this
Braveheart,
I have been wondering the exact same thing. While I think b-Mac is a good player…is he as good as last year? I am not so sure.
Regards,
Jason
By Will
June 13, 2007 8:25 AM | Link to this
If Jayson Stark would have said Andruw was overrated at the plate i may have agreed, but being overrated as a defender is laughable. His “zone rating” isnt that high?? That is BS, any braves fan knows A.Jones zone is the entire outfield!! By the Way another great outing for Davies, is anybody else as sick and tired as i am about Bobby Cox’s ho-hum attitude after Davies gets shelled time and time and time and time again. They act like he is all the sudden gonna snap out of it and become a great pitcher. Whatever!!
By Savannah Guy
June 13, 2007 8:26 AM | Link to this
If you could erase Andruw’s worst 30% of AB’s and 50% of his AB’s with RISP from “the books”, AJ would be an HOF’er. If Boras slept ocassionally we would not know his name. If lizards had wings jjs could watch them flutter around his back yard and write about them…. more coffee please.
By Minny Fan
June 13, 2007 8:28 AM | Link to this
Hunter was injured most of the early part of last year, which made his HR production more amazing. He was also coming off a broken foot from the year before.
Stats without context are meaningless.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 8:35 AM | Link to this
Alan, who is going to trade starting pitching better than the likes of Mark Redman (a cast-away) for a soon to be free agent making $13M per season.
Where is the point in that trade? If everyone knows that Atlanta is not keeping Andruw, wouldn’t every team just wait out till the off-season so they don’t have to give up any talent (not even a young Redman)?
We seriously need to get off the trade Andruw talks (10/5, free agent in the off-
I don’t mind people complaining about his batting average. Or his production with runners on. Or his spot in the batting order. He deserves criticism.
But his OBP, SLG, & OPS are comparable to Francouer. And place him in the top third of MLB OF’ers in those production categories. He ranks in the top in RBI’s. And his defense is still stellar (slower step or not) because he puts himself in position to make plays as well as anyone in the game.
I’m excited about this team. We’re young (on budget) and in the hunt. That is in spite key injuries to Hampton, Chipper, Gonzalez, & Cormier. We can’t ask for too much more than that with a straight face.
By ssiscribe
June 13, 2007 8:36 AM | Link to this
Good thing we had that big thunderstorm roll through the southern rim of the capital city last night, so I didn’t have to scream at the TV watching the Pride of Stockbridge implode again. No power. No wireless. No worries.
Unless you’re Kyle Davies. Then you have plenty of worries.
I’ve watched a lot of pitchers with far worse stuff do far better. I just don’t get the loss of focus I see in Davies. I just don’t understand how a guy with that much talent — and I’ll say it again; he’s got the stuff to win 15-18 games a year in the majors — can’t put it together.
It’s frustrating, because he could cement himself as one of the anchors of the rotation right freaking now, if he would just pitch the way he’s capable of pitching. I know he’s trying, and I wonder if he’s trying too hard, thinking too much, analyzing every pitch like the fate of the world hangs in the balance.
Kyle, just pitch, bro. Get it, get your sign and pitch.
At least the Mets lost. At least Chipper’s on his way back. At least the power’s back on and the trees in our neighborhood that fell didn’t hit anybody or anything.
At least tonight’s game is 12 hours or so away, meaning we’ve got 12 hours or so for the really important stuff:
T-shirt ideas!
My parents went to the AJC Braves/Man In Black Blog with DOB and all I got was this stupid T-shirt
THIS JUST IN: The AJC/Braves/Man In Black Blog rules!
Baseball, barbecue, apple pie, DOB (to the tune of baseball, hot dogs, apple pie, Chevrolet)
Denizen: (noun) Inhabitant; or, a person who spends their days and/or nights blogging with DOB about the Braves, baseball, pie, toes, cheese, journalism, barbecue, music, HBO and KU basketball
Q: What do you get when you mix a Braves beat writer, the biggest newspaper in Georgia’s biggest city, the Internet, a Grinch, an artist, a bunch of journalists (including a Scribe), a Lady, a preacher, and a motley assortment of baseball fans, hangers-on and other folks? A: The best damn blog in the world. The AJC/Braves/Man In Black Blog with DOB.
Just Do It: Strap on the Leotard and hit them keys, Hoss.
Alright, tell them marketing folks to get on it!
—30—
By Eugene
June 13, 2007 8:37 AM | Link to this
Andruw plays 150+ games a year and hits 30+ HRs and drives in 100+ RBIs. He wil never hit .300, but 9 Gold Gloves makes up for that.. He will not be a Brave next year and then we will see how great he was when the next CF we get can’t cover any ground and barely hit 10 HRs. Be careful what you ask for. When you get its not what you wanted.. KEEP ANDRUW!!!!!! GET SOME PITCHING AND A FIRST BASEMEN AND LEFT FIELDER!!!!
By Eugene
June 13, 2007 8:38 AM | Link to this
Andruw plays 150+ games a year and hits 30+ HRs and drives in 100+ RBIs. He wil never hit .300, but 9 Gold Gloves makes up for that.. He will not be a Brave next year and then we will see how great he was when the next CF we get can’t cover any ground and barely hit 10 HRs. Be careful what you ask for. When you get its not what you wanted.. KEEP ANDRUW!!!!!! GET SOME PITCHING AND A FIRST BASEMEN AND LEFT FIELDER!!!!
By ChampDawg
June 13, 2007 8:48 AM | Link to this
OVERRATED as a defensive player…… NO. OVERRATED as an offensive player…….. YES. Worth the kind of money he will demand…… NO. OVERRATED means his percieved market value relative to his talent and performance. Good, maybe great player, yes. Worth that kind of money, NO WAY.
By Berigan
June 13, 2007 8:51 AM | Link to this
Heres a question for y’all. Right now, who would you rather have as your center fielder? Torii Hunter, or Andruw Jones?
I while I wouldn’t sign either to a 5 year, 15-20 Mil a year Contract, Hunter looks to be in much better shape than Andruw, and actually thinks when he is up at home plate.
I forget who it was last week, but I recall some pitcher throwing 3 straight breaking balls to Andruw, and he seemed fooled each time! After the 2nd swing and miss I thought, why does any pitcher throw him anything but breaking pitches? The guy could have thrown 20 in a row, and Andruw would never touch one! If he was on a AL team right now, he’d be hitting .180.
Soriano, after hitting 2 straight homers, was tossed a hanging curve. You could see him pause, for just the slightest moment, then pound the pitch. Why is Andruw forever fooled by sliders low and outside, and curves over the plate??? I really do wonder if his vision is messed up, and he doesn’t even know it yet? Do the braves check players eyesite in spring training????
By Ron Roberts
June 13, 2007 8:54 AM | Link to this
I’m with you, Braveheart. I think the major league pitchers and coaches might’ve caught up to McCann; the only catch is he’s had a stretch of games this season where he played with a bad finger (hard as hell to swing a bat with a bad hand) and now he’s probably tenuous at-best on an ankle he can’t possibly be 100% confident on.
It happened to Francoeur, too. He came up, hit like gang-busters, then cooled off considerably. He’s just now getting back to where I think his expectations should be. I think it’ll happen to Yunel and Saltalamacchia, too.
Incidentally, he’s 1-for-11 in the last week. Maybe it’d be wise to rest him fully and let his backup(s) play while we’re in AL cities, leaving him available for pinch-hitting duties. We can then use the other half of the Diaz/Willie Harris platoon at the DH and get both hot bats in the lineup and throw in Saltalamacchia’s too. IF Chipper’s coming back today, all the better reason and opportunity to let McCann get fully well.
Don’t look now, but guess which Braves’ player is hitting .333 with 1 HR, 1 2B and 2 RBI the past week?
Scott Thorman.
Gotta say, though, we keep talking about how good our offense is, and yet we’ve all been frustrated by their performance against lefties, and I think what many haven’t noticed is that, after a hot April start, many of our big guns have been struggling or been average, at-best.
For example…
Jeff Francoeur hit .279 in May, and .255 so far this month, after a .306 April.
Kelly Johnson hit .259 in May, and .268 so far this month, after a .326 April.
McCann? hit.257 in May, and .259 so far in June, after a .289 April.
Thorman: .200 May, followed by a .214 (so far) June (although he’s hot the last week) after a .288 April.
Hey, let’s look at ol’ Andruw. How about a .202 May, followed by a .167 June so far, after hitting .261 in April. Ouch!!!
The only opening day guy who’s truly hit consistently well is Edgar Renteria. Additions of Willie Harris, Saltalamacchia and Escobar have helped, and Matt Diaz going from .249 (April) to .424 (May) was key, too, but by and large, our big guys have been muted since April.
Yeah, our starting pitching’s declined, after Smoltz, since a nice start, but our offense has declined fairly well in that same time-frame, which explains why this team’s been tepid, at-best since the 7-1 start.
Last night was squarely on Kyle Davies, though. I mean, the patchwork lineup, missing Chipper and Edgar, wasn’t worthy of a “must” win, but the way the Mets are playing, it hasn’t hurt us that we’ve struggled, so no sense dwelling on it. The key is realizing how fortunate we are to still be within reach of ‘em and improving upon ourselves from this point on.
By ChampDawg
June 13, 2007 8:55 AM | Link to this
BOOBY COX and Davies……. Cox is well known as a “players coach”. That means he is ignorant and bone-headed enough to keep telling you how great you are and things are gonna get better even though you know you suck. The Braves need pitching desperately!
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 8:56 AM | Link to this
Hey guys..i need some help…as much of you know my wife is a phillis fan..last night she was so much noise…i have to tell to shout off..or keep her tv low..i was tried to watch my braves games…What to do with this phillis noise fan? Anyway that it my problem not yours….We need Chipper Jones to have a meeting with all the player…we need to bring some one from the minor and send dowm Davies…couple year ago i went ro a Phillis games and the bravesand in the bulpen wasa section with Johm smoltz was teaching Davies some of his pitching and the guys look to me that he is a slow lerning.he has to go to the minor.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 8:59 AM | Link to this
Here’s something JC Bradbury wrote a couple of weeks ago:
The basic problem [with Zone Rating] is that defensive shifts allow fielders to catch more balls outside of the zones, but also causes them to give up balls hit in zones. Fielders are asymmetrically punished and rewarded for players made and not made in and outside of the zone. I’m not going to rehash the argument, but the quick summary is that the way outfield defense is played today, zone rating has some problem evaluating players, especially when they are catching balls outside of assigned zones.
Jayson Stark did his research but he didn’t do enough. If he did enough, he would have found that John Dewan, the inventor of Zone Rating, realized the problems with it and came up with much better ways to measure defense (including one that uses video, and takes into account trajectory and speed of batted balls).
Stark would have also realized that Jones still deserved Gold Gloves every season since 2003 going by Dewan’s updated analysis.
Writing a book about who is underrated and overrated is pretty brave, and I give Stark credit for trying. But if your going to do it, you better have all your facts straight and do a lot of research to back up your points or you are going to be eaten alive. By writing a book like his you are basically telling a lot of people that they are wrong; so if it turns out you are the wrong one, it’s going to get ugly. And I’m sure it has for Stark with concern to AJ.
By Bill
June 13, 2007 9:02 AM | Link to this
I agree with some of my fellow bloggers that it’s time to blow this team up but wait until the middle of July and if they are 6-8 games out lower the boom. Don’t trade any young players. Hudson, Wickman and Renteria are some that I would consider trading. The Jones boys are going nowhere. Let AJ walk after the season and approach CJ about a trade in off season to American League as a DH.
By Frits
June 13, 2007 9:05 AM | Link to this
What keeps on amazing me is the fact that you guys in here are so quick in taking your conclusions about AJ. Fathead, lazy, brainless I see the qualifications coming by in here. You guys should be ashamed. . Obviously it is damn’d easy to forget all the times he carried the team in the last season when a whole lot of other guys underperformed. Obviously he did not find his way yet and yes, it does take a long time this season, but I think that Cox is right in putting his trust in him, time for the team to carry him for a while. And yes he weill come around, and yes, he most probably will stay in Atlanta. It is simply ot all about money, there is also something as loyalty, love of the team. Only thing I wonder is if most of the guys in here really deserve good players.
By SlimG
June 13, 2007 9:05 AM | Link to this
Think Andruw may be in decline, but he still can hurt a pitcher’s mistake. This happens with all players and we should hold onto ‘druw unless we can get a couple of starters in return.
By Bruce
June 13, 2007 9:10 AM | Link to this
Andruw IS a great defensive center fielder. His field coverage and timing are outstanding. Comparisons to the past, though, are risky. Willie Mays played in many larger stadiums, especially the Polo Grounds when starting out, and played with some weak fielding fellow outfielders. He also had a fabulous arm.
By The Grinch
June 13, 2007 9:13 AM | Link to this
Scribe, if my name’s in there I want royalties.
Observations: I think Andruw’s performance at the plate has something to do with a general unhappiness I’ve detected since the beginning of the season. He’s barely smiled all season (in comparison), got his first highly visible tatoo at age 30 along with that show showing off all his cars (I don’t think he would have considered either last year)…I think he’s going through baseball’s equivelent of a mid-life crisis. He’s always been happy and comfortable here, and now he’s finally realizing that all the loafing hasn’t done his body any good, the plays don’t get any easier, the ground starts hurting a little worse, gotta work harder to maintain the bat speed, etc. and the team that doles out that fat contract Boras wants won’t put up with him being himself. If he doesn’t work harder than he’s ever worked to put on a show in a city he doesn’t want to live in he’s gonna get booed, but he can’t take less to stay here a second time or the player’s union will break his kneecaps. Crappy situation that’s causing him to press and try to reinvent himself into something he isn’t.
McCann started this season like he ended the last one (on fire), then got hurt and Salty came up. Whether it’s justified or not, I think McCann thinks Salty’s playing him out of a job and it’s causing both his offense and defense to suffer greatly. He’s not nearly as calm and deliberate as he was, and the results are obvious. Keep in mind, he’s only 23 and he’s human.
Kyle Davies is a seamstress in a pitcher’s body. Seriously. Have you ever seen anyone less suited to their talents? It’s like John Holmes being scared of sex. The guy just needs to find out what it is in life he really wants to do (it damn sure ain’t pitching), and do it. He isn’t helping the Braves, and he certainly doesn’t look happy. Go fill out one of those long forms at the job councelling center that asks lots of helpful questions. Take a year off and go to a shaolin monastary and beg a bowl of rice. Do SOMETHING, but quit assin’ around here if you don’t have the temprament. You’re hurting yourself as much as the team and fans.
Psychology session over. :-)
By DirtyDawg
June 13, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this
The amazing thing to me is why baseball players all over the league would give their ‘eye-teeth’ to play with the Braves. Amazing in that even though the organization is without doubt the finest in MLB…front office…minor league system…scouting…on-field management…you name it…the fan base is second rate. We/they have become absolutely complacent…we don’t show up unless there’s some other team we want to see - and/or root for. We constantly criticize one of the all-time great managers. We stay on Chipper’s back even though he’s a true clubhouse leader and on-field producer who interrupted his HOF career at third base - for the good of the team - and moved to left field. A position with which he was never comfortable. We complain on radio talk shows and blogs about first one thing and another to the point that the players know that the Atlanta Braves fans haven’t earned, or deserved, the loyalty of the players for some time. Glavin knew it…Maddux knew it…John Smoltz knows it. If the organization had the money to play with they never would have let these guys get away, and if they don’t spring for a little more this next year, still more will be headed out the door.
Remember, for the past 15 years the Braves have given us the one thing that every other team in Baseball strives for - give the hometown fans exciting, winning, baseball right through September and October…send them home happy more than any other team in the game…give ‘em a reason to come back for more…and we don’t appreciate it. So tell me, why should they care to give us a ‘home town’ discount anyway? After all it’s simply the American Way to ‘go for the money’…everybody knows that.
By Dick
June 13, 2007 9:18 AM | Link to this
Here is line up 1B-Salty 2B K Johnson 3B Escobar SS-Edgar R LF Diaz (full time) CF W harris (full Time) RF Francouer C B McCAnn Jones boys are gone
By Jamie
June 13, 2007 9:22 AM | Link to this
This is the problem that you run into with young pitchers, It just take them longer after they get to the Bigs to make their ajustments that they need to make to stay. Look at The Big Three that the Braves have had in their 1st years in the bigs. They didn’t fair to well either. A pitcher has to adjust to 9 player ever night. While a position player has to adjust 1-3 pitchers most nights. Kyle has good stuff, he just has to learn to make the adjustment that keep batters off him. I think it took Glavine 3-4 season before he was able to consistantly do this. I give Andruw his credit for the defense. I am just not sure how much he has hurt the Braves with his hitting.
By Frits
June 13, 2007 9:23 AM | Link to this
I agree with DirtyDawg it becomes time that we really start to back our team, through good times and through bad times !! Time to show e have a heart as well !!!
By Ron Roberts
June 13, 2007 9:29 AM | Link to this
Yeah, I like Andruw Jones fine as a person; think he’s an outstanding defensive CF whose better days are in the rear-view mirror in that regards, but his offensive ineptitude this season is, to me, a display in counter-productivity.
He doesn’t listen to coaching until he’s completely exhausted all of his own devices. Sorry, but there’s a reason they have as many coaches on an MLB staff, and he’s shirked their advice too much.
Until I see footage of him before and during games, sitting or standing next to Terry Pendleton, actually conversing and making swinging motions, then I’m just not interested in my fiscally-prudent franchise re-signing this guy. That’s that.
By Epinephrine
June 13, 2007 9:30 AM | Link to this
Anyone else getting excited about the lineup with Chipper and Edgar back? I just wish Salty was playing 1st, so Chipper could be DH and Escobar at 3rd. Oh well-Thorman as the worst in the lineup aint bad.
By Tony Dobson
June 13, 2007 9:30 AM | Link to this
Where did Stark work before ESPN? Yep, Philly. I sense jealousy.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 9:31 AM | Link to this
The Grinch,
I’m not dumb enough to think psychology doesn’t play a roll in player performance, but if all those players had the problems you seem to think they have, I doubt they would be playing even as well as they have.
Unless you have sat down with these players and have some kind of background in psychology, I think speculating on their psychological state is just silly for the most part.
These players have been through the filter of the minor leagues and a couple you mention have performed well at the major league level in the past. I doubt deep psychological issues are the main culprit in any struggles they are going through.
For example, you say McCann is affected by a push from Salty. Well, Salty’s been around for the past two or three years. Don’t you think McCann would have looked over his shoulder before this season?
By ssiscribe
June 13, 2007 9:34 AM | Link to this
Wow. The Grinch has spoken. Your royalty check is in the mail!
Now, other thoughts (noted transition from the Scribe): The thought of blowing this team up is silly. Just look at the standings, folks. TWO games out of first. TWO games out of the wild card. It’s the second full week of June! Chipper has missed almost a month. The Braves do not have a fourth and fifth starter. Gonzalez is gone for the year. Hampton is gone for the year. And you are a few weeks away from blowing up this team?
Even if the Braves are six to eight games out in mid-July, you don’t blow up this team. No way. There are 74 games after the All-Star break, plenty of time for a team to make up a six- or eight-game deficit. The Braves play the Mets nine more times after the break. If Atlanta were six games out in mid-July, yet went 6-3 in those nine games, that cuts the deficit in half right there.
Come on. Trade Hudson? Trade Renteria, one of the most underrated and underappreciated players in all of team sports, who is having an All-Star season, who you have ON THE CHEAP for the rest of this year and next year? Trade Wickman? Sheer silliness and a ridicilous notion.
People, please get a grip and look at the standings, and the calendar. The Braves are not 12 games out of first. It’s not late August. There is plenty of time, and is there anybody out there who doubts with a healthy Chipper, with ANYTHING resembling life from the back end of the rotation, that this team will play better than it has of late?
The Scribe abides.
—30—
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 9:36 AM | Link to this
Grinch and I have disagreed on Davies in the past, but maybe it’s time I came around to his way of thinking. The young man just doesn’t seem to be able to get out of his own way.
When he has had good starts, he hasn’t been able to build on them. I don’t expect him to throw quality starts every time, but I would expect improvement in his ability to follow one good performance with another more often. He just hasn’t shown that.
Every pitcher, HOF caliber or journeyman, is going to have spots in a game where things go south. The ability to limit the damage and then restore order defines the quality of the pitcher, IMO. Davies is caught in a Catch-22: to have success if troublesome game situations, you need confidence that you can fight through it. To get that confidence, you need some success in those very situations. Kyle seems to unravel, sad to say.
Frankly, I don’t think a stint at Richmond will help. He’s proven to be great at AAA, so he probably wouldn’t face many of the very game situations in which he needs work. That will only come at the ML level, but I don’t know if the Braves can afford to give him the time to succeed, granted the possibility of failure.
Maybe it’s time to consider him in a trade package, I don’t know. You hate to give up on a kid with his tools, but he just may be in the right place at the wrong time.
By Efrim
June 13, 2007 9:38 AM | Link to this
Can we get rid of Davies?
I know there is no one else, but come on.
We have to acquire to starting pitchers at the deadline.
By Drew
June 13, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this
Here’s the thing…he’s a great centerfielder that has credibility with a bat. When you bat fourth for a team as highly recognized as the Atlanta Braves and are supposed to be the “leader” out in center, and are supposed to be able to carry the team on your back; and then go out and tell people that you’re “a pull hitter now and thats the way it is” and have your borderline HOF batting coach tell you that you could “bat .300 if you wanted to” and then go out and tell your coach you need to sit because your back hurts from that audacious swing of yours…well you are overrated my man. When you are batting .220 (lower than your weight) in a contract year, people have every right to be suspect about your depreciating performance, regardless of how many damn baseballs you catch over a season. Andruw needs to use the investment he made in putting a batting cage in his basement and take some more balls off the tee because right now all he’s worth to us is a hometown discount that we won’t see next year.
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 9:51 AM | Link to this
Don’t you think McCann would have looked over his shoulder before this season?
I don’t know if Salty is in McCann’s head or not. But I can tell you for certain there is a HUGE difference between feeling pressed by someone still in the minors and feeling pressed by someone dressing next to you in the locker room. There is absolutely no comparison.
By The Grinch
June 13, 2007 9:51 AM | Link to this
Shaun, I DO have a background in psychology. As for Salty, did ANYONE on here think even as recently as six weeks ago that he’d even come close to McCann’s level anytime soon? Yeah, he’s been in the system for two or three years and shown a lot of promise, but last year he hit .230 in AA while McCann hit .330 up here. That’s a big difference between all of a sudden having someone who didn’t look even vaguely ready for prime-time in the minors show up while you’re hurt and suddenly look a hell of a lot better than you do on the big stage, especially when the rest of the team’s in a big slump and fans are screaming for a solution. The rigor of the minors may give you some preparation for that, but it’s not the same as the big show, especially for a 23 year old. Anyhow, I understand where you’re coming from. I just disagree. I think there are very, very few people that age in this kind of incredibly intense, competetive environment that are too cool to be affected by it when things go bad, especially when it’s a very young team in general and there are precious few veteran leaders to help out. This is perhaps the only situation where Todd Pratt in the clubhouse might be of some value.
By Efrim
June 13, 2007 9:51 AM | Link to this
NcScoots
Davies is soft. There is no use in sending him down. We have seen that the guy just can’t hack it with us. Probably will with another team. We can’t get a thing for him right now, but lets try to get something of use. Maybe include him in a deal for another starter.
I think we are in trouble. We now really need two starters. I can’t count on Buddy Carlyle every fifth day. But he has looked a lot better than Davies. This team has to hold on until July 31st. And I do mean hold on. I can’t see them going on any win streaks.
Like I said before this 12 game stretch began, I would take 6-6 in a heartbeat. We started 0-1 against the team I was hoping to take 2 of 3 from. With Santana going on Thursday, I expect to now lose two of three and I wouldn’t be shocked if we got swept.
By trademe
June 13, 2007 9:52 AM | Link to this
Jayson Stark’s job is to create controversy. His paycheck depends on how much crap he can stir up, as with all media personel! Who cares what his opinion is? How many Championship rings does he own???
By Doug B
June 13, 2007 9:52 AM | Link to this
Defensively, I have to lump Andrew Jones with Willie Mays and Mickey Mantle. However, he is allowed to do things that Mays and Mantle weren’t. He is allowed to dive for balls when Mays and Mantle were not encouraged to do so. Further Jones’s glove is different from the era of the 50’s and 60’s. The great highlight catches of Mays and Mantle were related to speed and catching up with balls that nobody thought they could catch up with. Mantle with his fragile knees would have probably shortened his career even more had he laid out like Jones and other modern outfielders do.
My issue is hitting. The same Jones who will do whatever it takes to catch a ball, even to the point of possible injury, refuses to do whatever it takes to hit one. He resists his hitting instructor and flabbergasts fans.
Trade rumors about Andrew Jones used to be disappointing to me. Now I say great. There are other outfielders who may not be as flashy. However, even the best may not get to field a ball at all during a game. Yet, most of the time starters will get at least 3 times at the plate. They need to be willing to find ways to get hits. Jones doesn’t come across as willing to make the adjustments necessary to get hits.
So yes, Jones is overrated, but I believe it is because of his lack of willingness to find ways to get hits, not about loosing a step or two in the outfield.
By CrimeDawg
June 13, 2007 9:53 AM | Link to this
Scribe,
great point about underrated Renteria…
I feel like Escobar has potential to have a Renteria caliber career himself and accordingly it shouldn’t take more than Escobar+maybe a throw-in prospect to land a guy like Noah Lowry, Mark Buehrle, Justin Germano…
It couldn’t be any more obvious we need a 3rd starter and Escobar as the bait let’s hope something materializes…
By BossLady
June 13, 2007 9:53 AM | Link to this
Sounds to me like Jayson has been talking too much to people like Terrence. Negativity breeds negativity. When you look at anything in this era you have to look at the big picture. We are all upset with Andruw for offense, but, when we see him take that swing and go out the park then we love him all over again. This season I have seen him make a lot of spectacular plays and he is always in the ESPN highlights. He has highlights that will shut up someone like Jayson. Since Boras is a lawyer why don’t he just sue this a$$ for defaming of Andrew. Freedom of the press is far too broad and it is damaging because some folks only believe what they read.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 9:54 AM | Link to this
After this season, I don’t think Davies will have any options left.
Personally, I don’t want to give up on him (keep him on and give him a shot at a roster spot next year). He is young. And I think he has made progress since 2005. Jeckyl & Hyde implies that there is hope and upside. He has the talent. He has the pitches. He needs to mature with his mechanics and control.
But if we do not feel that he will make the club next season, I presume that means he must be on the trading block before any other pitcher.
By derek
June 13, 2007 9:54 AM | Link to this
Andruw will make the hall based on his defense, Just like Ozzie Smith. However in the Braves lineup with injuries he needs to bring the Batting Avg (.217 this yr and a .250-60 hitter for career) to earn the kind of money Boras is gonna want. I mean at the prices were talking you could’ve paid Albert Puljos! Also he strikes out twice as many times as he walks and is on pace for 160! So when you add it up, low average,low hits with RISP, High strikeouts, low walks I’ll take the chance and pitch to him, Trade him if you can! Plus every year he gets fatter and slower (ie if he is quick how’d did he go from averaging 20+ SB’s and then averaging 3? Hope his OBP doesn’t slip below 300!uhhhh
By Mr. Consistency
June 13, 2007 9:55 AM | Link to this
Andruw was trying to hit a grand slam at every at bat even with no runners on early in the season. It appeared to be trying to get another 52 HR season and the BIG contract. He failed miserably in the clutch and looked ridiculous falling down on every swing. Let him go chase the dollars, get us a hustling .300 hitter that can hit in the clutch, with 25-30 hr and 100 rbi, sign Franceour long term, get solid at 1st base, and go for it.
By BossLady
June 13, 2007 10:09 AM | Link to this
Andruw is like all other executives in American industry. He averaged 20 sb when he was working his way up to his position. There is no reason for him to injure himself when he has the “interns” that should do that stuff. Chipper never beats it to first. When he hits a ground ball he just trots out and heads to the dugout. I hear Bobby hollering take it easy to them and his pitchers. They are much more valuable to him and to us healthy. Andruw’s attendance is excellent as he learned if you are successful you show up everyday rain, shine, cold, heat, whatever and that is rewarding to me. Players of his caliber around MLB are alway laying around the bench with days off and nursing sore fingers, etc.
By meansonny
June 13, 2007 10:13 AM | Link to this
Derek,
Andruw Jones is 21st in all of baseball in walks. Get your facts straight.
He doesn’t get pitched to. He’s been hitting clean up most of the year. Conventional wisdom (and Boras) tell him to drive in runs.
I posted it earlier. Despite the horrific batting average, his OBP and SLG are right there with Frenchy. And despite this being an off year for a .260 lifetime hitter, he is still ranking in the top 1/3 tier of MLB outfielders in OBP, SLG, & OPS. He is in the top 1/10 in MLB OF in RBI’s.
As bad as it has been for Andruw, it isn’t that bad (for a clean-up hitter, yes. But there are several clean-up hitters having those same struggles at this point of the season).
My solution is to keep him out of the clean-up spot for a bit. Try to keep the best production up at the top of the lineup. Right now, he’s not one of our best production guys.
But by year’s end, he’ll be fine.
By Frits
June 13, 2007 10:13 AM | Link to this
It is easy to say that he does not listen to his hitting coach. First, not all people react in the same manner to a situation where you just does not seem to find your swing. A lot of people will also state that the last thing you should do is to let it bring yourself down, so you display a certain nonchalance but underneath the insecurity nags on. Second, what if you really really believe that your hitting instructor does not make any sense, that you really really believe that the way he wants to make you change things only makes you feel even more insecure. Problem is you are stuck with the guy since he’s the club’s coach and maybe he does do wonders with others, it is just not working for you. Besides, if I think back on the haydays of Pendletons carriere he sort of was a certain out in his last couple of seasons with the Braves as well……leading by example. And I can assure you guys that AJ is very professional and wll be working very hard to improve himself. Don’t forget that the way he positions himself against the load of critiique he’s being confronted with might very well be his nonchalant composure. First of all he will have to find patience within himself in order to see the pitches again. Believe me he feels the pressure to perform way more then we here behind our keyboards…..
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 10:22 AM | Link to this
ncscoots,
True. But why not believe that would motivate McCann and that his injuries are causing the problems? Why just assume and jump to the conclusion that his decline from last season is due to Salty being in the big leagues?
Yes, Salty never played with McCann, but for the last two seasons everyone has known that Salty was capable of being a big league caliber player either this season or next.
I see your point but I just have a hard time believing McCann has never had any competition or never thought about Salty playing the same position.
If anything, shouldn’t it have affected McCann more in 2005 when he first came up? Wouldn’t he have thought, “if I fail, they have this young stud ready to take my place”?
It’s possible that Grinch is right, but you have to make some assumptions.
By geauxbraves2000
June 13, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this
Checking out the standings this morning, it appears we have a 4 team race. I guess whoever stinks the less is going to win.
Geaux Braves!!
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this
Let him go chase the dollars, get us a hustling .300 hitter that can hit in the clutch, with 25-30 hr and 100 rbi…
LOL, love the thought, but just how much cheaper do you think such a player might be? :-) Your criteria might be met by a dozen OF in all of ML baseball, so I wouldn’t expect to get one (in the present market) on the cheap.
By JasonInMaine
June 13, 2007 10:29 AM | Link to this
The Braves have recently had scouts at Reds’ games as well:
Click Here
Regards,
Jason
By Braveheart
June 13, 2007 10:32 AM | Link to this
From 2001-2007, Andruw Jones stole a combined 41 bases. Andruw Jones, while in his twenties, had the talent to be stealing 41 bases every freaking year, never mind having a combined 41 stolen bases over the span of 7 seasons. Coincidentally, when his stolen bases dropped off in 2002 that is also when his putouts dropped dramatically from 461 to 404 to below 400. That 100 putout dropoff has to be disturbing. Come on, this guy is a dog, an absolute waste of talent. And don’t lecture me about the problems with range factor and defensive stats because I already know what they are.
Andruw was once the Tiger Woods of defensive centerfielders. He has now just slipped down to Phil Mickelson levels, which is still pretty darn good but it ain’t on a GOAT level either.
And it is all because he is lazy. And no I am not a psychologist. But when I watch a 25 year old in 2001/2002 get a big ole contract start getting himself a big ole gut and he starts looking like a fullback playing center and his stolen bases for a 30/30, 40/40 caliber player start dropping down to 5 a season and his putouts drop by 100 over the course of an entire season, and this all occurs when a player is between the ages of 25 and 30 just after he signs his first big contract, you really have to question the desire of the fella.
I am sure he works hard, he lifts weights, and he takes alot of BP. But he also let himself get fat and out of shape, which is a disgrace. BUt it is great to hear that in a contract year that his range factor is back up over 3, his pre 2002, pre prior big contract levels. WOW! Boras, way to point out that Andruw plays better when motivated to make money. It’s funny too because he also tends to be slimmer. What a shocker!
By BamaBrave
June 13, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this
Ugh…I guess I never realized that part of DOB’s job was to interact with reptiles like Borass. You don’t get paid enough, DOB!!
By KJ
June 13, 2007 10:35 AM | Link to this
Stark is an NYC toady, his columns don’t warrant this sort of attention, yawn.
By Bill
June 13, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this
If you would read the post, I only suggested trading Renteria, Hudson and Wickman after the middle of July if the Braves didn’t have a chance. McCann is one of my favorites. He has alot of nagging injuries and plus he’s out a shape. He needs to firm his body up some. He still has his baby fat. I think having Salty around is putting alot of pressure on him.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 10:51 AM | Link to this
The Grinch,
You obviously probably know a lot more about psychology than me, but wouldn’t you need to sit down and talk to and be around these guys in different types of settings and environments to get any kind of read on what’s going on in their heads? I mean watching them play baseball for 2-1/2 to 3 hours or looking at their baseball stats or reading comments and quotes here and there I don’t imagine can tell you much about their psychological state.
Yes, Salty had a low AVG in the minors last season but he was injured and he picked it up in the second half of the season. Baseball America still rated him by far the top catching prospect in baseball before the season and had him at number 18 overall before the ‘06 season. I don’t think anyone in baseball or in the Braves organization were fooled by Salty’s poor batting average (likely due to injury). His numbers that measure control of the stikezone were still pretty good—OBP, BB/K.
Plus, I’m sure McCann has faced competition before, growing up.
Also, if McCann’s psyche is that fragile, don’t you think he would have struggled when he first came up—replacing an All-Star catcher in Estrada or facing Roger Clemens in the post-season or dealing with the pressures of playing for his hometown team?
Not saying it’s impossible that Salty may be in his head but I would tend to think any struggles he is having have more to do with his injuries, given that he’s handled seemingly as much or more pressure in the past with relative ease.
Also something to consider—he played so well last season that we shouldn’t be surprise to see decline some.
Actually, his numbers this season look pretty close to what he did his first 50-plus games in the bigs.
By 1957 Braves Fan
June 13, 2007 10:53 AM | Link to this
I just hope wherever Andruw goes next year he keeps hitting .220 and striking out 180 times. And he keeps thinking he’s helping his team by leaving runners in scoring position.
By Lee
June 13, 2007 10:58 AM | Link to this
Checking out the standings this morning, it appears we have a 4 team race. I guess whoever stinks the less is going to win. Geauxbraves2000 - that may be the best way to sum up this division this year Mets bloggers have sure vanished from the blog……………….N.L. East is turning into what most pictured at the beginning of the year which is a dogfight between, Braves, Phillies and Mets with the Marlins as a dark horse never being counted completely out of the picture.
Overrated or underrated - does it really matter. Boras is only doing his job and should be mad and upset at every derogatory comment said against Andruw. Boras is a agent with a law degree (a mouthpiece lawyer in other words). He is only doing what is best for his client and that is to promote him for the highest possible bid offer available. No way the Braves will be able to resign him without breaking the bank. Angels, Yankees, Red Sox, Dodgers get the check book ready.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
June 13, 2007 10:58 AM | Link to this
“This is perhaps the only situation where Todd Pratt in the clubhouse might be of some value.”
Aw HELL naw!!! Grinch, I sentence you to 30 days in the hole for terroristic threatening. The fact that you said “in the clubhouse” and refrained from mentioning anything about him wearing a uniform is the only thing that has saved you from a long, slow walk to the gallows, my friend. : -)
By N8
June 13, 2007 11:01 AM | Link to this
jed
“yes, actually, i expect a freakin’ renaissance from andruw eventually.”
So do I. It will come next year, AFTER he has his new contract, that he says he is NOT thinking about. Unfortunately, that renaissance will come with another team.
“i expect mccann to get over his injury and resume his form.”
Don’t disagree with you on this statement. McCann is TOO GOOD of a hitter, with the right approach to NOT rebound to form. Unfortunately, without some rest (possibly the offseason), he too might not recover fully from his nagging injuries until next year.
“same goes for chipper.”
Chipper is the BEST hitter/overall player, this team has had during the entire “run” that ended last year. No doubt that when healthy, he will continue that status. I’m not gonna pretend to know when he will or will not be healthy, but I’m also not gonna pretend that WHEN he comes back, it will be for ALL of the remaining games.
“i think chuck james will get better as the season progresses.”
I don’t. I believe Chuck is doing EXACTLY what he is capable of. He’s a fly ball pitcher, that occasionally (when his control is a “little” off) will give up some runs. But more often than not, he’ll keep us in the game. The 3rd or 4th spot in the rotation is where he will be most of his career because of it, and he’ll be a very servicable guy in those to spots. If MORE is ever expected of him, we’ll be dissapointed in the results.
“i hope salty takes over 1b.”
As do I. We actually agree on something.
“or chipper moves to 1b and escobar stays at 3b.”
Not gonna happen this year. Might happen NEXT year. But my guess is that if Escobar is NOT traded, it will be because Renteria WAS traded, and Escobar will be our SS next year.
“as for a 3-starter, there’s already rumors of AJ Burnett for escobar/jo jo reyes. so that’s do-able too.”
Burnett is making 13.7 million dollars this year. NOT A CHANCE IN HELL of us taking on that salary, without a Renteria/Mike Hampton type of cash “kickback” by the Blue Jays. If that is the case, you may be on to something.
“you’ve got a young team here, man. there’s upside & potential all over the place. you just cant see it for some reason. or youre more interested in whether your team’s gonna win the WS than who’s developing and what direction we’re headed in.”
You’ve apparently NEVER actually read ANY of my posts, and quite possibly are accusing ME of being to negative, but while making that statement are actually AGREEING with me without even knowing it. I have NEVER been dillusional enough (like all the homers) to think that last year or this year, we’ve had a legitimate shot at winning the division, or the WS. I’M OK WITH THAT!!! My “negativity” is purely to refute everybody claiming we’re “going somewhere” THIS YEAR. I absolutely LOVE the nucleus of this team. I wish we would get younger, yet. I’ve said MANY TIMES, that I would put up with a 60 win season, if it meant dumping the “dead weight” salaries, and putting us in a position to do what we did in 1991. Which is have a couple of “take our lumps” years (which very well could be last year and this year), then when the time is right, sign a couple of TP/Bream/Belliard type of free agents to take us over the top right when the young guys are peaking and begin another RUN. JS is the one naive enough to trust guys like Hudson, Hampton, Kolb, Reitsma, Wilson, etc… to continue the run, and start another one. JS is the one unwilling to trade guys (Andruw last year) for prospects, to take the neccesary steps backwards, to take a BIG step forward. He’s the one who “retools” for a “chance” at the playoffs every year. DOB is the one saying the Braves will NEVER be sellers at the deadline, because they refuse to believe we’re ever out of it. NOT ME. I’ve never demanded that we win the world series. Just refuted all of the homers assertions that we’ve got a chance, based on what I’ve seen so far this year.
“go pull for the mets or yankees or boston, if that’s all youre interested in.”
NO THANKS. I’ve got ZERO interest in buying a shot at the title. I like our approach. As I said above, I wish we were younger, yet (pitching staff). But with GOOD young talent. NOT Kyle Davies. Buddy Carlyle might help out this year. But a 29 year old guy that just picked up his 2nd victory in 10 years, isn’t my idea of young. Smoltz is fine. Hudson is not, IMO.
“and i’ve got one name to combat all your negativity: willie harris. mr mopey didnt see that one coming did you?”
Now I KNOW you haven’t been reading my posts. I’ve been pining for about 3 weeks for Willie to play EVERYDAY. Even with his drop off against lefies. I like the speed/defense he brings to the table over what Diaz offers.
Hope that clears it up for you.
By ssiscribe
June 13, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this
Bill: Hey man, hope you didn’t think I was jumping on you, although your post in part sparked my response.
I’ve seen a lot of comments from people on here lately, and if you didn’t know better, you’d think the Braves were 11 games out of first place and fading fast. You’d think we were talking about the Rangers or White Sox.
Went back and looked at your post again, just to make sure I didn’t jump to any conclusions. You said if the Braves were six to eight games back, you’d lower the boom. I’ll contend again even if the Braves are six to eight games back in mid to late July, they still are in the race. Once you slip into double digits, the hill gets remarkably steeper.
Also, if you are in third place or further back, the slope gets tougher because you’re chasing two teams. I’ve seen nobody in the East pack that appears capable of running past the Braves, although the Phillies have closed ground after their brutal start.
If the Braves are eight games out on July 21st and in second place, I don’t think you change plans and start thinking about 2008. Blowing this team up at that juncture, with so many games left against the Mets, would be pulling the plug way, way, way too early.
—30—
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this
Braveheart,
Do you know that he’s not trying to keep himself in shape and that he’s lazy?
I mean, I do roughly the same amount of exercise I did in my early 20’s and I’m more beefy.
And if his pending free agency is motivating him to get as many putouts as 2002, why is he struggling with the bat? Seems like if money was motivating him and he could play better that easily, he would also do it with the bat not just the glove.
This just speaks to what Atlanta fans have always thought of Andruw—many have actually underrated him in many ways. They think he’s lazy and doesn’t try. I don’t know if it’s his style or they still think he’s the same guy he was when he was 20 or 21 or, dare I say, his color and nationality or the tatoos or the rap music he comes to the plate to
By journalsit jimmy smith
June 13, 2007 11:11 AM | Link to this
this just in - chipper jones sustained another injury this morning while strapping on the leotard. it is not known exactly what was injured but a high pitched wail was heard throughout the clubhouse when chipper pulled the leotard into place.
toe blog - or not toe blog.
did journalist bob comment on the sturgeon? expert on sturgeons.
and the dead whale shark? float to the top? drop to the bottom? where to go to flush such a fish?
ham can key. say it real fast a few times. sounds like a pitcher for the yankees. right?
now, cheese. it is well known that journalists eat too much cheese - but cheese is so darn good on a cracker when facing a deadline. wouldn’t a cheese beverage be nice?
how about cheese shakes? that’s right, cheese shakes. how long will it be before dob joins skip and pete with dob’s cheese shake stand?
try saying that fast a few times.
By Gary
June 13, 2007 11:12 AM | Link to this
I was a huge Willie Mays fan when I was a kid in the 60s. I remember being amazed by not just his bat, but the way he played center field. No, Andruw is not Willie at the plate, but there is no way you can watch him play center field and not be awed by how much better he is than anyone else in the game today. Just like Mays, he makes it look so easy that you sometimes don’t realize how much ground he covers and how quick a jump he gets on every fly ball. Stark can write what he wants, but if you want to see how center field is supposed to be played, just watch Andruw.
By Braveheart
June 13, 2007 11:15 AM | Link to this
Magic Number is 101!
Let’s get that sucker under 100 tonight boys!
By eric the elder
June 13, 2007 11:15 AM | Link to this
McCann SHOULD be looking over his shoulder, and a good place to start is with physiques. Look in the mirror, Brian, and then look at Salty. Any difference?
A guy can be overweight and play well, but not if he BECOMES overweight, and so quickly. It changes all the mechanics.
I don’t believe I’ve seen McCann hit anything to right field in weeks. Lots of grounders to the second baseman, though. He can’t get his hips out of the way, he if he has to get his gut moving first.
This is a bit simplistic, I admit, but baseball is a game of fractions of inches and seconds. If the motor functions are being slowed down by an increasing excess of roundness, everything goes out of kilter.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 11:24 AM | Link to this
Lots more overnight frustration abounding and frolicking down the aisles. Eugene-Center field defense. Uh, Dude, do you remember Deion, Otis Nixon and Marquis Grissom? We haven’t had poor CF defense for almost two decades-when factoring in Dale Murphy, maybe longer. It won’t change-just who’s plaing there. Berigan-Yes they check eyesight during the spring. Remember Diaz and his contact lens? If Andruw’s eyesight was off, you’d see it reflected in his defense, which remains excellent. Bill-Dismantle the team? You’re nuts, Dude. They aren’t bad enough for a firesale (not that you’d get much). Need I remind you Chipper, for one, is going nowhere without his permission. He won’t give it. Shaun-about psychology-You don’t really need proximity to figure out what’s happening (Don’t need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows). We’ve never met you, yet I feel many of us have you figured out pretty well and have for some time. As a matter of fact, I think we figured out most of our foibles. It’s one thing when a player is at A ball and his promotion is an abstraction-quite another when said player is batting right after you and hitting .300. Grinch-Don’t you think a session or two with the sports shrink would help Davies? First he needs to be like Smoltz-get pi$$ed when he’s in trouble and take it out on the hitter. The fact that he’s good almost half the time indicates talent. When you can’t see, you go to the eye doctor, when you’re feet hurt, to the podiatrist (for toes are not to be trifled with-I KNOW). When your head doesn’t work you see the shrink.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
June 13, 2007 11:33 AM | Link to this
A comment on Verlander’s no-hitter lastnight: Did anybody notice all of the white birds flying around during the game? No wonder the Brewers couldn’t hit the ball. They were playing in an Alfred Hitchcock movie. Esteemed Bird-calling Journalist Jimmy, your thoughts????
By ssiscribe
June 13, 2007 11:34 AM | Link to this
When you can’t see, you go to the eye doctor, when you’re feet hurt, to the podiatrist (for toes are not to be trifled with-I KNOW). When your head doesn’t work you see the shrink.
Words to live by from the greatest artist in Braves Nation. Hope you are well, Lew. Your wonderful portrait of the much-discussed center fielder will overlook a new desk I’ll be getting this weekend in my home office, as I begin to start working from the house Monday morning.
Selah.
—30—
By CJ
June 13, 2007 11:36 AM | Link to this
In BLOG we trust!
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 11:39 AM | Link to this
eric the elder,
Yeah, no overweight player has ever succeeded in the big leagues, huh?
Babe Ruth, John Kruk, Cecil Fielder, Mo Vaughn, Bob Wickman.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 11:40 AM | Link to this
Lee-If Boras is upset about Stark’s article, he better not come to the Man In Black Blog. He might just encounter Nathan. If Boras read any of his ungoing anti-Andruw rants, he’d have a contract put out on Nathan. I gurantee Nathan can out talk any Journalist on the subject (or any subject, for that matter-LOL).
By eric the elder
June 13, 2007 11:43 AM | Link to this
Lew, I think you’re close on Davies’ problems. There is a mental aspect, but I doubt that a shrink would help.
A pitcher loses his confidence when he stops trusting his stuff. And that comes down to mechanics. I wonder what Rick Petersen could do with this kid?
A couple of us spotted it very clearly last night. When his follow through is close to the ground, his pitches are located well and with movement. When he gets lazy and his release point goes high, his pitches are up in the zone, and his breaking pitches are uncontrolled frisbees.
It might be silly, but were I McDowell, I would signal the catchers to go out to the mound every time his release point goes up and remind him in no uncertain terms.
A major league pitcher probably shouldn’t need this, but maybe Davies does for a while. Once he is able to stay focused on his mechanics and see that he is getting good results, his confidence will soar and so will his effectiveness.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 11:43 AM | Link to this
Lew,
Yeah, I’m sure McCann’s psyche is so fragile that he can’t handle another good catcher being on the roster. Even though he could handle Roger Clemens and the Astros pitching staff in the post-season his rookie year just fine or he could hit 24 homers and bat .333 as a 22-year old. But I’m sure it’s his fragile psyche that’s causing any struggles.
By David O'Brien
June 13, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this
SHAUN, good post at 8:59. You said it a lot better than I did, and I agree wholeheartedly….
Unfortunately, your post was followed directly by this from BILL at 9:02:
“I agree with some of my fellow bloggers that it’s time to blow this team up but wait until the middle of July and if they are 6-8 games out lower the boom.”
Bill, 6-8 games out in the middle of July, and you’d “lower the boom?” Good thing you’re not running a franchise. The list is quite long of teams who’ve overcome deficits between 6-8 games at the middle of July. I mean, there’s quite a few teams that have overcome such deficits from the middle of AUGUST.
Sorry to disappoint, but the Braves, and few if any other teams, are not going to dismantle their team if they’re 6-8 games behind in the middle of July….
DEREK wrote: “Andruw will make the hall based on his defense, Just like Ozzie Smith.”
Derek, Andruw’s 500-600 career homers will probably have a lot to do with him getting in, too. Ozzie had a .268 career average with 28 homers (that’s not a typo) and .337 OBP and .328 slugging percentage in 19 seasons….
Andruw has a .265 career average with 353 homers and a .344 OBP and .502 slugging percentage.
Derek, that was not a very good point you made. Not very good at all. But at least you were right about Andruw striking out twice as much as he walks. (Ozzie, on the other hand, walked twice as much as he struck out. But then again, since they were completely different types of players, it also doesn’t matter much.)
For the record, I agree with those of you who point out, without going over the top to do so, that Andruw has transformed himself from a 30-30 threat to a guy who doesn’t want to go through the wear and tear of stealing bases and being a pest on the basepaths, to a guy content to hit .260 with a ton of homers and RBIs. And I agree he’d be a lot better if he chose a median between those two approaches, a guy who could hit .280 with 30-35 homers, 130 RBIs (which he’d do if he only hit .300 with RISP (most other elite sluggers hit at least that), instead of his usual range of .220 to .270.
By Baron
June 13, 2007 11:47 AM | Link to this
Not dismiss Starke out of hand, because I don’t know the numbers, but nowhere have I seen him taking into account the other Braves outfielder’s putouts and zone ratings over the period of “decline” that he posits. I’d like to see the performance of the entire outfield considered- perhaps Andruw has not NEEDED to range as far. Nor have I seen him look at the pitching staff’s numbers, particularly the grouldball/flyball/strikeout numbers that would indicate the number of potential chances a centerfielder might have. Also, remember how Glavine and Maddux worked the outside of the plate on both lefties and righties- likely to induce less pull-hitting and more action in the opposite field power alleys.
In short, isolating Andruw’s fielding numbers from the broader context is kinda simple minded. And
Starke mostly misses the overrated part of Anndruw’s game that any Brave fan can point out in his/her sleep- that is, his raging and infuriating inconsistency at the plate.
By phillyfanatic
June 13, 2007 11:48 AM | Link to this
here come the phillies…move over met pretenders and brave has beens…YOUR 2007 NL EAST CHAMPION…PHILADELPHIA PHILLIES….and by the by…THE FISH
By ktmain02
June 13, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this
NO HE IS NOT OVERRATED! MAYBE CHIPPER IS - THAT IS IF HE’S NOT ON THE DL FOR A HANG NAIL.
By phillyfanatic
June 13, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this
here come the phillies…move over met pretenders and brave has beens…YOUR 2007 NL EAST CHAMPION…PHILADELPHIA PHILLIES….and by the by…THE FISH will be runnerups…PHILTOWN RULES!!!
By Braveheart
June 13, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this
Shaun, you just got incredibly weak and lazy with that racial crap. That is a bunch of garbage, at least when it comes to me.
The ironic thing in all of this is that you act as if you believe in Andruw when you don’t. If you knew Andruw you would be an enabler. You would be the enabling relative that never helps the drug addict kick the drug habit because you think he is an okay kid who is just being himself and that’s the best we can hope for. We on the other hand would be the relatives who demand that he get off the drugs because we see all the potential the guy has and how much he is wasting it.
Don’t ever throw racial crap at me again, Shaun. That was just about the most pathetic thing you have ever done. You have no idea about my life experiences or how I am dressed right now or what the skin color of many of my friends are or what kind of music I am listening to right now. You really have no frigging clue.
When I bash Andruw it is because I see someone who has all time talent within him and I see him wasting that because he has become lazy once he started making really good money. The reality is Shaun is that I am hard on him because he was my favorite player. I think that is what most fans think of him and why they are so frustrated with him. It has nothing to do with race because a racist would expect nothing out of Andruw because of skin color, and a racist would not expect him to work harder because a racist wouldn’t believe he had it in him in the first place, right?
Actually Shaun, since you are the one slinging around racial discrimination accusations today, why is your perception of Andruw so low that you don’t think he should be much better than he has become and that you don’t expect him to have a better work ethic about him or that you merely think that a work ethic that has allowed him to get fat is good enough for what you can expect out of him?
Ahem, Shaun, you’d better look at what your own perceptions are of Andruw and why they are what they are before you start accusing others of having certain perceptions of Andruw because of his skin tone.
Shaun people don’t develop double chins, big bellies, stop stealing bases and catch 100 less balls in center in their twenties unless their work ethic has fallen apart. The coincidence of the timing of the first big contract and all those things occurring is too obvious.
As for his glove, he lost weight Shaun. Go ahead Shaun go drop 25 pounds and see how much faster you run. I never said he was not trying in the field either Shaun. I am merely saying that he was not trying off the field, let himself get fat, thus slower, thus less able to steal bases and less able to cover as much ground out in center.
By phillyfanatic
June 13, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this
here come the phillies…move over met pretenders and brave has beens…YOUR 2007 NL EAST CHAMPION…PHILADELPHIA PHILLIES….and by the by…THE FISH will be runnerups…PHILTOWN RULES!!!
By Kieran from Long Island
June 13, 2007 11:52 AM | Link to this
I’m guessing tehres little to no chance of Davies going back to Richmond this season? Last night he showed he is still having very serious control problems… but at the same time showed that when he makes his pitches he’s tough to hit. This kind of inconsistancy tells me that this 23 year old pitcher needs some more time to develop his stuff and that he may have been rushed into this.
The Braves seem to Have trouble sending players down once they have established major league Jobs. Not that I think that that is totally a bad thing. I’m sure it makes players play comfortably without having to worry about being sent away. I think its time to send Orr down though. Woodward suplies anything that Orr gives your, except perhaps his speed, but i just dont see that as enough to keep him around anymore. The dude has Options let him play everyday down in Richmond and bring up Pena who has already earned a spot on this team. Pena could start for some teams around the Majors, he’s just in an unfortunate position of being behind two stud young catchers.
Somethings gotta give with Thorman too. The Canadians are wearing thin on me. Yea he hit a solo homer last night, great. If you swng like that you’re bound to hit one out eventually. You just can’t have a firstbaseman as a true 8 hitter in this league. You’ll get burned. He’d be a great guy to have pinch hit off the bench but an everyday player? I dont think so.
By Johnny Evans
June 13, 2007 11:56 AM | Link to this
I say=once again==who is Stark==I think he is a idiot=just trying to make money off of Andruw==But=he is a writer==so he can say anything he wants==true or untrue=Stark you idiot
Johnny CHESAPEAKE, vA
By eric the elder
June 13, 2007 11:57 AM | Link to this
Shaun, I might deserve the sarcasm had I said that. Here is what I said:
A guy can be overweight and play well
My point was that a rapid gain in weight can mess up mechanics, at least until the player adjusts to it, which is what McCann might be in the process of doing.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 12:00 PM | Link to this
I don’t know, Shaun. Maybe you’d better come up with some stats to back up your anti-psychological ideas. Better yet, what does Billy Beane have to say on the subject?
By journalist jimmy smith
June 13, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
mr. wizard is dead. dead. norton the whale shark is dead. dead. cormier’s arm is dead. dead. what is with all this death? death?
and now, the little birds on the field. yes, this can be arranged. journalist jimmy smith is a very successful bird caller and can call a few birds or a flock of birds as needed. which braves pitcher would benefit most from birds on the field?
and more on the leotard injury to chipper jones … it is believed that chipper may have put the leotard on incorrectly. also, potato goes in front.
now, where is journalist bob today?
and, more topical news - can say topical on a baseball blog? here, rub some of this on … will make the thumbs tingle.
and here is that news as pomised …
By Robert
June 13, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
Some tidbits
First this regarding baseball’s “code”
http://www.sportsline.com/columns/story/10222796
Not everyone thinks Hudson was a stand-up guy for what he initiated
Second - Terrence Moore is out in left field or under contract with Mr Boras. Andru is hitting .217, chief. That’s hard to underrate.
Third - Anyone think Mr Verlander might fire another no-no or two before he is done?
Fourth - The Mets recent cold spell has given us a golden opportunity which we have failed to capitalize on. You’ll note they have Pedro’s return to look forward to, while we can look forward to having Donk blow at least another half dozen games before the season is over.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,
All I’m saying is I don’t think there is any reason to believe Andruw is lazy.
And I’m the last person that would pull the race card. I do think people see Andruw’s relaxed style (and possibly perceive an acceptance of “hip-hop” culture) and judge him on that, interpreting it as laziness.
Wasn’t saying that’s you but I think people judge the Andruw book by its cover and make assumptions about what’s going on in the pages.
Also, DOB, why don’t you ask McCann or his teammates about his fragile psyche, sense so many people want to assume that is the reason for his struggles? Any reason to believe he can handle Roger Clemens in the post-season at age 21 but can’t handle another good catcher on the team?
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
Jimmy, Journalist Bob is not an expert on Sturgeon though I caught a few … hard to beat the taste and their eggs ain’t bad neither!
Of course you probably mean the Sturgeon whose book and formulae I studdied when learning my trade … still have his book somewhere … ain’t no way I’m expert on that Sturgeon neither … and the taste it left in my mouth wasn’t nearly as sweet as that of the fish.
By David O'Brien
June 13, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
Andruw Jones batting .217 on June 13, alligators in the Chattahoochee River north of Atlanta …
By Robert
June 13, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this
Some tidbits
First this regarding baseball’s “code”
http://www.sportsline.com/columns/story/10222796
Not everyone thinks Hudson was a stand-up guy for what he initiated
Second - Terrence Moore is out in left field or under contract with Mr Boras. Andru is hitting .217, chief. That’s hard to underrate.
Third - Anyone think Mr Verlander might fire another no-no or two before he is done?
Fourth - The Mets recent cold spell has given us a golden opportunity which we have failed to capitalize on. You’ll note they have Pedro’s return to look forward to, while we can look forward to having Donk blow at least another half dozen games before the season is over.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 12:06 PM | Link to this
PhillyDude-Don’t get your hopes up so high. I was born a Phillie’s fan-even went to loss #7 of the infamous ten game skid in 64. One thing I learned-The Phillies will find a way to lose. Your starting and relief pitching are some of the worst in the division and that’s saying something. I promise, they’ll find a way to blow it-they always do.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 12:07 PM | Link to this
Braveheart,
Not trying to accuse you of anything. I was just throwing out reasons as to why Andruw gets the reputation with some Braves fans that he is lazy.
I think you are just reading too much into 2-1/2 months worth of play and what he doesn’t do anymore instead of looking at the adjustments he made and what he did better than ever (except so far this season).
By M-Sector
June 13, 2007 12:10 PM | Link to this
Greatest defensive center fielder discussions, and not a single mention of Garry Maddox - Philadelphia Phillies 1976-1986. To quote another great center fielder (Richie Ashburn) “Three quarters of the Earth is covered by water, the other third is covered by Garry Maddox…”
By Lew
June 13, 2007 12:13 PM | Link to this
Shaun-There’s considerable difference between having a fragile psyche (Is that really your problem?) and looking over your shoulder while you’re slumping, allowing yourself to become somewhat distracted. That’s called being human and young. It’s normal, especially after being hurt twice. My God, if he read this blog, he’d probably run off screaming to go swim with the alligators in the Chattahoochee. Come to think of it, is there anyway we could convince you Wet and Wild changed it’s name?
By N8
June 13, 2007 12:17 PM | Link to this
DOB
How do you like the press boxes at the Twinkiedome?
On the Twins broadcast last night, they were showing how far “in” Blyleven and Bremer are inset into the booth. Blyleven was basically saying that they absolutely cannot see popops as they go into the air.
Nice. Whoever designed that dump should drawn and quartered. LOL! I was actually semi-impressed that none of the Braves had trouble with the roof. Seems like every team coming in there for the first time, loses at least one pop up or fly ball, though I guess Willie and Andruw have played outfield there before. Not to mention that it’s considerably tougher, from what I’ve seen to handle popups during day games there. So we lucked out (except for you not being able to go to 1st Avenue), by having night games.
They showed an interview with Jack Morris last night. Damn, he looks better than he did in 91, with the bad porn mustache he had goin back then. He made mention of having lunch or getting together with Smoltz, which I thought was really cool, being he was Smoltz’ idol and all.
The one memory of many that stands out to me about that Game 7 in 91, was Smoltz’s dad being interviewed from the stands talking about how nervous HE WAS watching his son face his idol in Game 7 of the WS. That’s a moment that not too many will ever get to encounter. Good stuff. It’s gotta be right up there with McCann becoming Smoltz’ catcher after watching him for so many years.
Have you gotten a chance to talk to any of the Twins guys about the 91 series and their memories of it, or is that something that only us fans care about?
I just think of that WS as being the WS that didn’t have a loser. Those teams had the ultimate respect for eachother. I doubt we will EVER see the handshake that took place between Lonnie Smith and Brian Harper at home plate before the 1st pitch of Game 7, EVER again in MLB. That is a GREAT moment in baseball history, IMO.
Bremer also mentioned last night that he remembers saying late in Game 7 that it would be a shame if the WS was decided on a bloop or broken bat hit, after how hard both team had fought. Then sure enough, Gladden leads off the 10th inning with a bloop/broken bat double to start the rally.
I consider that WS to be simliar to when a band has a FANTASTIC debut album. Guns-n-Roses anybody? It sure makes it hard for ANYTHING to ever compare again. In fact, I actually have more fond memories of the 91 WS, than the 95 WS that we won. How odd is that. 91 was quite simply, IMO, the greatest WS of my lifetime so far, if not one of the greatest ever.
That’s why I believe that if we miss the playoffs for a couple of years (if not more), the post-season (and the streak), will be much more appreciated than it appears to be for Braves fans.
Way too much takin’ for granted during the streak. Especially the PRIVELAGE of watching 3 HOF pitcher dominate in their primes 3 out of 5 nights for the better part of a decade.
By snowball's chance
June 13, 2007 12:18 PM | Link to this
Headline from ESPNU
Reporter tossed for blogging NCAA baseball tourney game in Louisville
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=2901003
By faninva
June 13, 2007 12:18 PM | Link to this
DOB -
regarding sports writers and their opinions not matching Stark - I ran into Bob Ryan at a bar in DC a couple of weeks ago. I brought up the fact that i was a braves fan and that I thought the assertion that AJ was overrated defensively was a joke. He said “well, i disagree, the numbers don’t lie”. When I asked what numbers he was referring to, he brought up zone rating. Too bad this blog didn’t come out until now. I might have been able to set him staight.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this
Shaun-Is there any truth to the rumor thatr you were born totally aware (like some character from Dune), having passed your CPA exam while still in the birth canal? Was your first book Sabremetrics? Dude, we’ve been trying for two years, at the minimum, to convince you of the existence of intangibles, such as human nature. Were your first words truly “Mom, I want solid food-I have a perverse desire to count the beans” ?
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this
Shaun, re your 10:22, I don’t weigh in either way on whether Salty is causing McCann’s struggles or supplying McCann’s motivation. You and Grinch were having that conversation.
I took exception to your point that a stud in the minor leagues provides the same pressure as a stud in the same locker room, given that the incumbent FEELS said pressure at all. Your perception was that it was the same. It ain’t.
Whether any of that factors in whatsoever for McCann, I don’t have a clue.
By Braveheart
June 13, 2007 12:20 PM | Link to this
Alright, Shaun, I will leave it alone. I have never seen you take a personal attack on anyone, so I was a little taken back when you included the racial discrimination generalizations in a post directed at me. He’s very frustrating for me. Obviously, you are very content with him. But as you have said in the past, when you really get down to it, you are watching a great fielding centerfielder who can pop a bunch out of the park. What more can you ask of him? The problem is that was fine when he was not hitting cleanup and is fine when he is not hogging up almost 20% of the payroll. But I am going to leave it alone now.
By snowball's chance
June 13, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this
What if Bud Selig reads about baseball blogs and shuts them down like he has superstations? On the other hand, maybe he will decide to give home field advantage in postseason play to the team with the best blog. Makes as much sense as his other ideas.
By Arkansas Hillbilly
June 13, 2007 12:25 PM | Link to this
Andruw Jones batting .217 on June 13, alligators in the Chattahoochee River north of Atlanta…
“…dogs and cats living together,…MASS HYSTERIA!!!”
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 12:26 PM | Link to this
I think Andruw’s struggles have more to do with maybe him pressing and trying to make adjustments (realizing he’s not as quick as he used to be) and nothing to do with laziness on or off the field.
Also, Andruw is hitting higher than Carlos Beltran, Johnny Damon and Jim Edmonds with RISP this season. He also ranks second to Torii Hunter among all CF with 34 RBI with RISP. His OPS with RISP is 6th among CF.
Also, among all cleanup hitters, he’s 6th in RBI and 10th in homeruns. He’s only three homers behind the number two homer-hitting cleanup guy. He’s 12th in TB and 9th in extra-base hits.
Not saying Andruw has been good by any means but it’s not quite as bad as it seems.
By SR
June 13, 2007 12:27 PM | Link to this
Ok DOB, re: 12:03 post, I’ll bite.
Answer must be in the form of a question: Is it, name 2 of the unlikeliest events that have occurred in the Southeast during the summer of 2007?
By Lee
June 13, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this
I have always thought and still think the Braves should have held off on signing McCann for at least one more year. Not saying he could not duplicate last years numbers but it seems in baseball the sophomore jinx continues to show its ugly head from time to time. I realize he is not playing at 100% also. I just simply think Salty is going to be a step above McCann as a major leaguer catcher. Maybe McCann got a little too comfortable after the Braves signed him.
Please Philly fan run your mouth on and on. Everytime someone says something positive about the Phillies coming around they self-destruct. Maybe Rollins will fell free to start his bashing of the NL East teams also.
By Richard Cory
June 13, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this
Grinch—you’re biggest connection to psychology is-you’re crazy as hell. :]]
By Braveheart
June 13, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this
Since Salty came up, is McCann afraid to sleep without a nightlight?
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
Shaun Payne, methinks you’ve outdone yourself!
Your response to Cato ” Yeah, no overweight player has ever succeeded in the big leagues, huh?” is farther from the mark than you’ve ever been before … stay closer to home son, the Enterprise already has a skipper … for it was Eric who said “A guy can be overweight and play well”
By Arkansas Hillbilly
June 13, 2007 12:35 PM | Link to this
Third - Anyone think Mr Verlander might fire another no-no or two before he is done?
Robert, yes I do…
Question for everyone, how many no-hitters has Ivan Rodriguez caught? At first, I figured it would be quite a few, but the more I think about it, I can’t think of any others except maybe AJ Burnett, if Pudge was even on that team that year. I wonder who has caught the most no-hitters in MLB.
By N8
June 13, 2007 12:35 PM | Link to this
As for the struggles of McCann, Andruw, etc…
I truely believe that all “slumps” are either mental or mechanical. Sometimes (if not most) are both. Because one can fuel the other, especially if the wrong adjustment is made. Or the pitcher sees the adjustment, and then RE-ADJUSTS his approach the hitter.
No other reason to explain a guy swinging and missing on 3 straight pitches, only to let the 1st two pitches of the next AB, go by right down the middle. The pitcher/batter battle has always been, and always will be a mental struggle between the two. THEN you add in the actual abilities of both parties to execute a gameplan/approach.
I honestly believe, this lineup needs only ONE person to turn it on and carry it. Thus relieving pressure from the others. Can we expect it from the rookies? Probably not. Andruw has obviously shown that he isn’t gonna put the team on his back anytime soon. McCann looks confused, not lost, just a little off, at the plate.
We have NEVER needed Chipper more than we do right now. That could be the snowball effect that this lineup needs. Yet in an interview with Joe Morgan on Sunday, even he, didn’t sound optimistic that WHEN he does return, thing will just click. He said his timing will be off.
Will his presence make the lineup better? Absolutely. Will the effects be noticable visable immediately? I’m not sure. But until he comes back in a big way, or somebody else get’s over their mental block and steps up, we could be in for another couple of weeks of futile offense.
If we don’t score some runs tonight, you might as well sit back and wait to see what we do on Saturday in Cleveland. Because we more than likely, will not be hammering Santana or Sabathia into submission.
This could be one UGLY interleague stretch.
YIKES.
By Truthman
June 13, 2007 12:36 PM | Link to this
Greatest center-fielder of this generation.
However, I would fine hime $10,000 per at bat that he struck out while not trying to hit to right field.
Half the ballpark is to the right of second base, Andruw!!
By Lee
June 13, 2007 12:37 PM | Link to this
N8 -
Agree that the 91 Woeld Series is one of the greatest series of all time. I only wished Otis Nixon would have been able to play in the post-season that year. Not saying we would have won it with him but he was an excitiing player to watch that year. That whole team was exciting to watch that year.
By Mountain Man
June 13, 2007 12:39 PM | Link to this
I grew to despise agents when the Bucky Woy fiasco concerning Bob Horner took place. I know that agents have no loyalty to any team and Boras in particular has loyalty only to his own pocketbook. Andrew is probably the greatest center fielder in the game today if only he would not be so hard headed about his hitting and batting stance. He could be a 300 hitter if the pitdhers knew he would go to the off field on outside pitches rather than attempting to pull everything to left,
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this
Lew and ncscoots,
I’m just saying, McCann reached the majors, he played well over the equivalent of almost two full seasons in the majors, he hit well in the post-season off probably the best pitching staff in the league that season, he’s dealt with all the pressures of playing for his hometown team, he had the pressure of replacing an All-Star catcher, he had the pressure of playing for a team trying to keep the legacy of division titles going…I seriously doubt having another good catcher as a teammate really has that much of an affect on his play.
I’m just saying you have to make a rather big jump to the conclusion that McCann’s struggles are due to Salty being there, based on what he’s been able to handle so far in his pro career.
By Mountain Man
June 13, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this
If you really want to be honest with yourself, you would trade Francour for a starting pitcher. He has a swing like a wash woman. Play Willie in right field and bat him leadoff. Things would start looking up in a hurry. If Chipper doesn’t want to play then give him his release. Baseball winning teams are made up with players who want to play every day.
By nonnie
June 13, 2007 12:52 PM | Link to this
from a Twins fan who watched this game in Mesa, Arizona: It’s so fun to watch you guys chasing your tails around. The Hrbek thing? Get over it, already! YOU LOST!
By Dwayne
June 13, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this
Andruw is a great center fielder and that is the only reason he is a premier player. He has never hit for average and this year he is just plain awful. I think we are the only team is baseball that has a cleanup hitter with a .217 average. Right now Andruw is not worth $20 million, maybe $2 mil but don’t worry Boras, someone will pay, probably the Red Sox.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 12:54 PM | Link to this
Shaun-Actually, I think McCann’s struggles are a result of his injuries and mechanical and strength issues secondary to the injuries. However, you steadfastly refuse to beleive in anything more nebulous and unquanitifiable as human nature and the psychological aspects of life in professional sports. It’s an extremely competitive business and it would be totally normal for McCann to look over his shoulder with all the hype surrounding Salty. It could easily cause him to press. You need to accept the possibility that it’s a factor. I mean, everything is processed through the brain, isn’t it? Well, with most people, anyway. You were born without a keyboard, weren’t you?
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this
Folks, you can talk about Davies’ mechanics all you wish: arm slot, release point, angle to the plate, grip and finger pressure, pronation, supranation, hip turn, shoulder flow, repeatability, etc., etc., etc. I’d even be happy to join in that conversation, because it makes for an interesting technical discussion.
But to paraphrase Stephen King’s Gunslinger, “I throw with my arm…I pitch with my head.” Mechanics are about throwing, and there’s nothing wrong with Kyle’s mechanics. He’s getting killed because of his baffling and frustrating seeming inability to wrap his head around pitching to the situation. What some folks see as his “mechanics” failing is really a case of his head failing…to repeat the good mechanics he DOES have.
The kid can throw, no debate. But that “pitching” thing, I’m afraid he’s finding elusive.
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
Hey Phillyphanic You are not my wife did you??????Holly Toledo…. And i agree with lew…your team going to found there way to loss…First your GM is going back to Seatle to be The VP…second no bullpen(that old guys with big belly and six finger, just have lucky the other day.
By Richard T Hill Jr
June 13, 2007 1:01 PM | Link to this
No. Stupid question.
By me
June 13, 2007 1:03 PM | Link to this
Lew,
McCann has 32 million guaranteed no matter where he plays and Salty has played in 10ish ball games. I don’t think he’s too worried.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 1:05 PM | Link to this
Lew,
I don’t deny psychological aspects. I just think if a player has made it as one of the best amateurs in the country or world, has made it through the minor league filter and has succeeded at the major league level, he’s probably capable of zoning out distractions like competition from another player. Yes, some distractions are worse than others but I think a vast majority of major league athletes are more than capable of not letting many outside things significantly affect their performances.
By Torpedo
June 13, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this
Overrrated, and the fact that he put himself on the spot saying he won’t give the team a hometown discount has him on a worst spot!!! hell be lucky at this pace if he gets a 1 yr offer!!!!! go listen to Boras, get top dollar and be miserable somewhere else!!!!!!!!!!!!
By Lew
June 13, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this
Nonnie-On MLB Extra Innings last night, I saw the Twins feed. Seems to me that Hrbek’s play was much more of an issue with y’all. That’s about all he talked about during his two inning interview. BTW-What have the Twins done since he threw Gant off the base? Does wallowing in mediocrity despite Hunter’s defense and Santana’s Cy Youngs ring a bell?
By Torpedo
June 13, 2007 1:17 PM | Link to this
You have to give Boras credit, he might make more money than David Copperfield fooling GM’s into big contracts for players that aren’t worth them.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this
Mountain man want’s trade Francoeur….. HAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAAAHHHAAAA , no really , are you crazy or just trying to get me to laughing hysterically ?
By kerrell goolsby
June 13, 2007 1:21 PM | Link to this
Andruw overrated? I DON’T THINK SO! If anything, he’s underrated. He’s probably the best center fielder to walk on grass since Willie Mays.
As far as the no-hitter last night, you’re right. There were a lot of birds on the field and one of the SportsCenter guys made a reference to Hitchcock. Sort of reminds me of that blooper with Randy Johnson blowing a bird away to kingdom come.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 1:21 PM | Link to this
Shaun-I’m sure that’s why there are sports psychologists-because pro athletes are so sound psychologically-just like the rest of the human race. Wasn’t it Satchel Paige, one of the greatest pitchers in history, who said “Don’t look back, someone might be gaining”? It’s human nature. McCann’s situation could easily be construed as a team signing him to a cheap, long-term contract to improve his tradeability. Now, as I said before, I think his problems are injury related and will be straightened out with a couple of Daddy McCann sessions, nothing more. But for you and the poster known as ME to suggest that there’s no way this is a factor is naive at best. Just like a young John Smoltz didn’t need a positive thought session, or two, back in 92. Didn’t help him at all, did it? I think Davies could use a session or two. McCann just needs healing and BP with Dad.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 1:29 PM | Link to this
Lew, that we don’t always totally agree is well documented but on “I just simply think Salty is going to be a step above McCann as a major leaguer catcher. Maybe McCann got a little too comfortable after the Braves signed him” we are as one.
That said, it’s also possible that the Braves were sending a message to Jeff, protestations notwithstanding, … and possible that Brian’s trying too hard to live up to expectations.
I still think that Brian’s contract makes him a good trade package, provided his stock doesn’t drop so fast that the Braves find themselves dealing from an empty shoe.
And, yes my friend, I do remember when!!
By Lee
June 13, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
Watching the game last night really made me notice how much Chipper means to this line-up. When Orr or Woodward starts any position being 3rd base, ss or 2nd base you pretty much get the gut feeling from the start the Braves cannot score more than 3 runs in that game. These 2 players provide about as much offense as a 8 year old kid that has never picked up a bat before. And with Thorman at the bottom of the line-up also there is very little hope of anything except an occasional solo home run or a meaningless single in a no win situational game. I have been trying to support Thorman but I tell you I am starting to really get fed up with this guy. Seems like we are seeing a rerun of the Langerhans situation - well maybe a little better that that. Do we play out this year with him and be content with what he provides the team, do we keep saying he needs more time and we need to show more patience, do we trade for a 1st baseman, do we put Salty at first and deal with the consequences for the remainder of the season………………………… What do we do ??? We also have to win some high scoring games also and this team does not have that luxury with these holes throughout the line-up.
Nonnie - If you are a Twins fan you have enough problems to worry about these days. For example Indians, Tigers and White Sox come to mind.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this
The Twins have won their division four out of the last five seasons and have nothing to show for it. So , we are not alone when it comes to playoff failure. Kyle Davies and Brent Lillibridge for Mark Buehrle , or is that a bit much for a pitcher who could be gone after just Half a season?
By Lew
June 13, 2007 1:36 PM | Link to this
Bob-My friend, you’re right-we don’t agree with everything. However, that quote never came from me. You better go back and check your source. I never said it. Glad you enjoyed the reminiscences, though.
By Lee
June 13, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this
Bob journlist
That is Lee not Lew that siad that.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this
I wonder , could the pitcher bat for himself and Salty be the designated hitter for Andruw ? Seriously , no really , I’m kidding.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 1:38 PM | Link to this
Lew,
One more thing and then I’ll give it a rest (unless someone says something I think is outrageous concerning this topic): As a major leaguer, I’m sure you are aware that someone is always looking to take your job. Not saying major leaguers never feel relatively comfortable that their job is safe (after signing a contract, etc.) but I’m sure they realize that if they don’t perform, the team will find a way to get rid of them , even if they do have a big, long-term contracts.
This is a generalization. I’m sure there are players that come along once in a while that think once they’ve reached the bigs, that’s it and they don’t want to work as hard but I would guess 99.9 percent of the guys who reach the big leagues understand there is too much at stake to loaf once they reach the big leagues.
This is my educated guess of how pro ballplayers think based on what I’ve heard and read and based on my own limited experience.
By N8
June 13, 2007 1:38 PM | Link to this
Shaun
As per your 12:41 post about McCann struggling because of Salty.
For the most part I’m with you about his mental state towards “competition”.
On the other hand, similar to a boxer. It’s easier to be the “hunter” than the “hunted”. He had NOTHING to lose, coming up from AA ball. Then in the offseason after his rookie year, they trade away Estrada. Esentially telling him that it’s his job (and rightfully so). THEN, this spring they give him a longterm contract, again, telling that the job is his….FOR THE NEXT SIX YEARS.
The contract alone might be enough “pressure” for a young kid to live up to. After all, look at 29 year old Andruw in a walk year, he surely hasn’t handled his first “pressure” situation (when it comes to contract), he’s had in half a decade. So why is it that far out of reality for a 23 year old to be putting more pressure on himself over a big, new contract?
Add to that, Chipper is down and Andruw is struggling. With the fire and grit McCann plays with, you know damn well the kid is trying too hard to do too much, to show he’s worth the money they gave him.
Then (literally out of nowhere - the same way it was when he and Francoeur came up), Salty get’s the call, looks pretty good, and wins the fan’s praise right off the bat.
I’m not gonna sit here and say that McCann is “shaking in his boots” about losing his job, but I think you’re way off base to think the thought hasn’t crossed his mind at least once.
By eric the elder
June 13, 2007 1:38 PM | Link to this
nscoots, I rarely if ever disagree with you, and this is no exception. The McCann thing might just be a chicken and egg debate.
Suppose a child learns a piece on the piano and practices it perfectly 20 times in a row. But then he messes it up at the recital. Was it a mechanical flaw or was it a case of mind wandering, nerves, etc.? I would choose the latter based on his continuously good past successes.
However, if the practices were often flawed, then I would almost expect problems at the recital, and I would blame it on technique.
That is my dilemma with Davies. While he has episodes of brilliance, he does not have a record of continuously good successes, so I lean toward thinking that he has simply not consistently mastered the techniques.
I can go either way with this, and your position is every bit as good as mine.
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 1:38 PM | Link to this
This is my opinion on Andruw Jones…i just want to compare his number with another HOF and my idol…Roberto Clemente…Clemente in 18 season play 2370 games with 4696 PO, 266 A , and 140 Error and 42 DP fileding % 972. Andruw 12 season 1668 Games 4285 Po 110 A and 43 error with a % 990 fielding. In batting Clemente Avg was 317, OBP.359 and SLG 475 Andruw..265, OBP 344 and SLG 502 So is my conclution that Mr Boras Genius have a Point.Andruw jones is the Best Defense Center field ever…and also Andruw play RF with 198 Po in 115 games.
By parks
June 13, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this
If you really want to be honest with yourself, you would trade Francour for a starting pitcher. He has a swing like a wash woman. Play Willie in right field and bat him leadoff. Things would start looking up in a hurry. If Chipper doesn’t want to play then give him his release. Baseball winning teams are made up with players who want to play every day.
Wow I don’t think I have laughed harder in months. Some people just have no clue
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this
Lew,
Kind of got off track. I know you were in no way suggesting McCann is loafing.
Guess I got carried away thinking about the AJ haters.
But I think McCann realizes he’s always going to be pushed and is always going to have to look over his shoulder somewhat.
Coach,
I think it’s too early to give up on Davies for good, especially for an expensive free-agent to be.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this
Heck Lew, I agree with your 12:54 too!
The kid can throw, no debate. But that “pitching” thing, I’m afraid he’s finding elusive … Jeepers!
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 1:44 PM | Link to this
Phillys 1 Chi Sox 2 in the second inning
GO Thome…Go thome…
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 1:46 PM | Link to this
UUPPS Phillys tied Wes helms homer Tied games
By spyder714
June 13, 2007 1:46 PM | Link to this
Andruw is overrated. Yes he can run ,throw ,and catch with the best but that’s where it ends. I for one am tired of the yearly 260BA 130- 150 Ks a year and the adjustment to his swing every year. The team deserves a complete player.
By Johnny Evans
June 13, 2007 1:48 PM | Link to this
WITH SO MUCH MONEY HINGING ON HIS PERFORMANCE THIS YEAR=ACCORDING TO SOME=HE IS JUST SHOWING UP=WHAT A SHAME=PEOPLE WILL BELIEVE THAT ANDRUW IS JUST SHOWING UP==THIS NUT STARK=IS TALKING THROUGH HIS REAR END=CAUSE HE KNOWS=HE CAN CREATE HEADLINES==
THERE ARE MANY STARS PLAYING IS ALL SPORTS=THAT WAS CREATED TO BE STARS IN THE NEWS MEDIA==AND WITH SOME NEVER HAVING THE TALENT TO BEGIN WITH=BUT YET THE MEDIA MADE THEM STARS ON PAPER=NOW THEY WANT LASH OUT AT TRULY STARS=WHO HAS A FIELD RECORD=AND NOT MOUTH RECORD SUCH AS THIS WHACKO STARK==STILL I NEVER HEARD OF HIM UNTIL HE GAINED THIS PUBLICUTY REF ANDRUW JONES= HEARD JUST TODAY ON TV=WHAT I JUST JUST SAID ABOVE=THAT MEDIA GETS A HOLD OF A NAME==THEN ALL AT ONCE THAT NAME BALLOONS=AND THAT PERSON=IS A HUGE STAR=WHETTHER IT BE SPORTS ARE WHAT==THEN THE EXPECTATION WRITTEN NEVER MATERIALIZES=THE WRITER HAS TO LOOK FOR SOMEWHERE ELSE= GUESS ALL CAN SHARE THERE OPINION=WHETHER IT IS TRUE OR NOT==STARK=WHOEVER HE IS==SHOULD RUN FOR PUBLIC OFFICE=HE HAS THE EGO OF A POTITICAL PERSON== FORGIVE=I WILL NEVER TAKE UP SPACE AGAIN REF EGO STARK== AJC WRITERS KEEP UP THE GOOD AND WORTHWILE REPORTING== JOHNNY EVANS CHESAPEAKE, VA
By BossLady
June 13, 2007 1:49 PM | Link to this
Actually, Boras is getting too much press out of all this himself. Why should agents get any face time or print time? He should just go and do his job by getting his clients the best contracts. He is not a publicist and all of the hoop la is meaningless. Andruw will do just fine and will be alright in the end.
By Lew
June 13, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this
Gotta go with Nathan on this one. No one’s calling McCann a head case, but the fact remains, for whatever reason, he’s pressing. These guys are human, just like the rest of humanity. It wouldn’t be normal if they didn’t react to pressure in the workplace. It just takes a slightly different form in MLB and requires a different skill set than being an accountant. Does H&R Block feel pressure prior to April 15 every year, despite being professionals at what they do?
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this
Shaun, speaking of outrageous, As a major leaguer, I’m sure you are aware that someone is always looking to take your job … kid, Lew’s an artist, not a major leaguer … and I doubt that he’s seriously concerned with job security!
I will however agree that his stuff is indeed major league.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 1:59 PM | Link to this
N8,
Again, I think there is too much at stake as a major leaguer to think you don’t have to look over your shoulder a little bit all the time.
I think most major leaguers have the attitude that someone is always looking to take their job.
I even think most realize that if they don’t perform after signing a long-term contract, the team will find a way to get rid of them, so they better play as if someone is gaining on them at all times.
Again, that’s just my guess. Maybe DOB can shed some light on the subject.
By Mountain Man
June 13, 2007 2:03 PM | Link to this
OK Parks, have a good laugh. You don’t have a clue to what dedication and effort are. You only think a player is great if he plays when he takes the whim to play. C. Jones is just like Bob Norner, great when he plays but when does he play. I’ve lived around baseball since the days of Mantle, Mays, Banks, Williams et al. What they had in common is the fact they wanted to play every day. Speaking of Francour, if you want another laugh, until he gets control of himself and learns the strike zone, he will fade, fade, fade.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 2:05 PM | Link to this
Lew,
Actually McCann’s number now look extremely close to his first season in the big leagues (in roughly the same amount of games).
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 2:09 PM | Link to this
Top of the 4th Chi Sox 3 Phillys 2
By N8
June 13, 2007 2:13 PM | Link to this
Shaun
“I even think most realize that if they don’t perform after signing a long-term contract, the team will find a way to get rid of them, so they better play as if someone is gaining on them at all times.”
I think this is a fair assessment. I wouldn’t want somebody loafing it, assuming the job is there’s. That’s what I love about tough football coaches. EVERY training camp is an audition for your job, for every player NOT named Tom Brady or Peyton Manning. Teams are seemingly always trying to get younger and cheaper.
Like I said, I’m fairly certain that McCann isn’t going home at night and “talking to himself” in the mirror saying: “Come ON! Don’t BLOW IT! There’s a young phenom waiting to take your job.”
If he was tearing it up (like last year), and Brayan Pena was the on the roster as the backup catcher, he would more than likely, NEVER think about it.
But since Salty is here and in 59 AB’s has 2 HR & 8 RBI, as compared to Brian’s 3 HR and 28 RBI (1 HR and 24 RBI, after the first 2 games of the season), the thought has crossed his mind, I’m guessing.
But that’s all it is, is a guess. So I suppose there is literally ZERO point in us arguing based on guesses. LOL!
I’ll side with you, and wait until DOB “chimes in” on the subject.
By Johnny Evans
June 13, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this
DAVIES////////THORMAN WHAT HAS TAKEN ALL OF YOU SO UCH TIME TO REALIZE THAT NEITHER SHOULD BE IN THE BIG LEAGUE
LEAVE a JONES ALONG==
DOES GREYHOUND STILL COME THROUGH ATLANTA==IF SO=CHIP IN AND GET DAVIES==THORMAN AND WELL YES FAT BOY MCCANN A TICKET OUT OF TOWN==mCCANN’S CONTRACT WAS WAY TO EARLY==HE HAS NOT PROVEN HIMSELF FOR ANY LENGTH OF TIME==HE IS GETTING BIGGER AND BIGGER=
JOHNNY CHESAPEAKE, VA
By Robert
June 13, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this
“Indeed, Willie jacked his total back up to 429 “
Talking about raw putout numbers is flat out stupid. Like anything else, it needs to be taken in CONTEXT.
I know that the arguement is going to be that more putouts means a better fielder, but it’s not so simple
What Boras is trying a case for is that Andruw makes plays to record outs on balls that other guys field on the bounce after they are hits - but equating that by raw putout numbers is simplistic and can be very misleading
Not that I wouldnt try it if I was Andruw’s agent
But (like the Braves) we can to remember the source, and instead of just believing blindly, we should do our own research
That said, let’s talk about Andruw Jones not just as a hitter, or as a center fielder, but as a PLAYER.
I gotta agree with Stark. A very good player, but never was and never will be the superstar he is sometimes touted as.
In other words, overrated
Not NEARLY as overrated as the donkey who manages him day to day, but overrated nonetheless
By David O'Brien
June 13, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this
Some of you folks really are spending a bit too much time worried about McCann’s pysche. He’ll be fine. He got into some bad habits while playing hurt, started pressing, and he’s trying to work out of it and get back on track.
If you’ll recall, he hit nothing but singles for a month or two last season after his ankle injury, then went on a power-hitting binge beginning in July that pretty much carried through the rest of the season. No reason to believe he won’t get hot again soon and make everyone forget these first couple of months.
By Coach
June 13, 2007 2:27 PM | Link to this
The mountain man wants to trade the iron man , brilliant ! Francoeur only plays every inning of every game , leads the team in RBI , plays solid defense , is cheap as hell when you think about what he is currently being paid and is only part of the future face of this franchise. Yea , Parks is right , YOU DO NOT HAVE A FRIGGING CLUE !
By Robert
June 13, 2007 2:33 PM | Link to this
DOB, you served Boras’ purposes well. The man’s job is to sell BS that gets his guys big money contracts. And the fact that you reacted to his phone call with a blog gave him exactly what he wanted - it gets his biased recitation of misleading out-of-context stats publicity
The proper response to Boras’ phone call wouldve been “Go sell Andruw to the Braves, but spare me”
Or would that mean no more cigars with Mr Boras?
By The Grinch
June 13, 2007 2:33 PM | Link to this
Ok, I’m back. Distracted by people who actually wanted me to do work in exchange for financial security. Presumptuous bastards. Shaun, perhaps I expressed myself badly. It’s only my opinion, I never intended it to come across as “fact” (hence my prefacing every obsevation with “I think”). I also don’t consider the looking over the shoulder as the only problem McCann’s having; I’m sure injuries and “coming down to Earth” play parts as well (perhaps the greater part). I’m just saying I think his particular situation is different now than it has been, and a large number of coincidental happenings are causing him to press. Of course I’d have to sit down with him for a while to be sure; I didn’t mean to imply I can read any of the three like a book through the tv set (except Davies). Just offering up what my intuition tells me. Lew and N8 and Scoots already pointed out much of what I was going to upon return, so I won’t pile on. Let’s just agree to disagree (though I do agree with you about McCann’s career stats playing a factor).
Hillbilly, I meant Pratt in an administrative capacity. Don’t worry; I wouldn’t put a bat in his hands at a kid’s party to try to break a pinata sans blindfold.
Richard Cory, thank you for noticing! I contend most people involved in psychology out of personal interest are bat-%$it. Normal, well-adjusted people don’t need to care. Take your calm, collected, serene Psychologist that sits there and listens to you, tells you what’s wrong, reassures you and sends you on your way happy, healthy, and sound. Follow them home and watch them interact with their family and you’ll see their head is a nest of snakes. You don’t usually spend the countless thousands of hours nec. to be good reading about and working with crazy people unless you have a vested interest beyond money; it wouldn’t be worth it to someone normal.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 2:34 PM | Link to this
BossLady, ma’am … He is not a publicist and all of the hoop la is meaningless … we have seemingly similar sentiments regarding mister bore us … but it’s not meaningless to Boras, just so long as they spell his name right.
By Robert
June 13, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
Gil, if Clemente is your idol, you are dissing him. Andruw Jones might compare to Clemente in terms of defense, but as a hitter, overall as a player, and most of all overall as human being, Andruw Jones couldnt hold Clemente’s jock
By Soul Man
June 13, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this
Johnny Evans, three rules for a blog:
1) Don’t write in all caps. 2) Don’t separate everything you write with “equals signs.” What the heck does that mean anyway? 3) Don’t sign your name at theend. You’re not writing a letter and your name’s already at the beginning.
By Soul Man
June 13, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this
Johnny Evans, three rules for a blog:
1) Don’t write in all caps. 2) Don’t separate everything you write with “equals signs.” What the heck does that mean anyway? 3) Don’t sign your name at the end. You’re not writing a letter and your name’s already at the beginning.
By Rasta Man
June 13, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this
‘Drew’ is de best fielder ever, as good as Willy in his prime,I am so very clever, I can even rhyme ;->
By Mitchie-san
June 13, 2007 2:43 PM | Link to this
The more I think about it, the more I come to the realization that neither Yunel OR Salty are going to be traded.
By Soul Man
June 13, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this
Johnny Evans, three rules for a blog:
1) Don’t write in all caps. 2) Don’t separate everything you write with “equals signs.” What the heck does that mean anyway? 3) Don’t sign your name at the end. You’re not writing a letter and your name’s already at the beginning.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this
N8,
I agree. I don’t doubt it’s crossed his mind that the Braves have two major league catchers. But is that reason to believe he is more motivated or less motivated. Or more confident or less confident. I could see it going either way.
Seems that maybe he would see that the Braves have this younger, potentially great catcher and they picked McCann long-term.
I know it’s a cliche you hear the players use all the time but I believe players actually think this way: “I don’t worry about what I can’t control. I just have to go out and work hard and do my job.”
I think this is especially true in baseball where you play over 100-162 games a year and may come to the plate 400-500 times. It’s a game where muscle-memory and technique come into play so much, so I think by the time players have reached the majors they have trained themselves to tune out all the stuff going on around them and all the stuff that may be going on in their head and they just go out and perform.
I guess this is why I get accused of tuning out the emotional, intangible side of the game. I believe the majority of players have trained themselves to tone out things that greatly affect their performance in a negative way.
By Turnin2
June 13, 2007 2:47 PM | Link to this
Hey ncscoots
I agree with you on your 12:19 post. You have to wonder if the ‘Estrada injured/McCann call up replacement’ is a playing havoc with now ‘McCann injured/Salty call up replacement’.
Not sure, but I still think Brian’s injuries to his finger and ankle are the cause, but it does make you wonder what is going on deep down inside his subconscious mind….
By Steeledawg
June 13, 2007 2:48 PM | Link to this
DOB- I am flying up to the land of Cleve for the series this weekend. I plan on hitting the Rock Hall, but do you know of any good pubs, taverns, holes in wall, dives, etc. to see some good live music? Keep up the good work, and put me down for a T-shirt! (XL)
ps. McCann is a keeper, he will be an all-star many times over before he hangs ‘em up. Move Salty to first, and dangle some minor league infielders for a middle of the road starter to get us through the season.
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 2:50 PM | Link to this
Robert I agree with you…i just tried to compare Andruw Defense not his offense with another outfield …But i desagree with Andruw human effort to help others…clemente teach that(give to other)Andruw not just help other in the atlanta Area but in other country to.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 2:52 PM | Link to this
Lee, my eyes are in a state of disrepair and I sincerely apologize … I thought at the time that it did seem strangely logical … maybe my third eye is ailing too … unfortunately I’m not a famous artist who can afford to have them fixed.
By ElbravoX
June 13, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
Why is McCann given such leeway with projected stats. He had great numbers for 4 months—that’s it.
By N8
June 13, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this
Shaun
“I guess this is why I get accused of tuning out the emotional, intangible side of the game. I believe the majority of players have trained themselves to tone out things that greatly affect their performance in a negative way.”
Fair enough. Makes sense to me, why you would hold that opinion.
I would suspect though, that this is more true with veterans, more than younger guys, still trying to prove something.
Even look at Bonds. I believe it’s quite obvious that the “pressure” is beginning to mount on him. Which is just fine with me. :-)
By BamaBrave
June 13, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this
Effin’ A, Robert. Clemente was the full package, Andruw, alas, is not.
By Chop Chop
June 13, 2007 2:56 PM | Link to this
I say that it doesn’t matter whether Andruw hits the ball to all fields or not. There are plenty of good power hitters out there that pull the ball all the time. The problem for Andruw is when he’s chasing pitches off the outside corner and trying to pull them. For whatever reason, breaking balls to the outside of the plate always have (and probably always will) tempt Andruw to swing away. He has his own batting cage and pitching machines at home and he still hasn’t corrected that problem. He just has a Pavlovian dog urge to swing at those pitches and try to pull them. I personally don’t care if Andruw hits .300 or not, but he’d be a much more valuable power hitter if he would just spit on those outside pitches. He’s not wired to hit the ball the other way, so if he ever stops offering at those breaking balls off the plate, pitchers will have to give him more pitches that he can pull.
By The Grinch
June 13, 2007 2:57 PM | Link to this
So, DOB, you’re saying his problems are purely McCannical? :-)
Mark Davis is at it again! “Fishes flashed silver and gold like coins tossed in a fountain…” And once again the magnificent conclusion “A shaft of sunlight penetrated the tank, penetrating the depths. It illuminated four whale sharks, swimming in big loops.” Watch out Dave!
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 2:59 PM | Link to this
In case you fan don’t know…Andruw Jones is the honorary Director of Jaden’s ladder…he donate time & money to survivor of Domestic Violence and also his native coracao benefit of his sponsorship to all Little league Team. That the legasy of Roberto clemente teach to all latin player.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 3:00 PM | Link to this
Turnin2,
One major difference: Estrada was a 29/30-year-old in the last year of his contract when he got injured and McCann come up to replace him. Everyone pretty much knew Estrada was a lame-duck. I think McCann realizes as long as he continues to work hard and perform like he is capable, he’s here to stay.
If McCann’s injury was serious, I think it’s more likely something is going on in his mind. (Not that you are suggesting something is definitely going on in his mind.)
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 3:00 PM | Link to this
Turnin2, you sure you got me pegged correctly? My 12:19 actually says I don’t have a clue as to whether McCann feels any pressure from Saltalamacchia’s presence or not. Is that your point of agreement?
Don’t worry, it’s just my normal midday attack of confusion. :-)
By jed
June 13, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this
N8
i have read your posts. not all of them. you post so much, there’s no way to read all of them. yeah i know you like willie, but my point was more that if you despair in may and say the hell with it, you’re being shortsighted. ie—i was dreading a season of langerhans, and we ended up with willie harris. presently, i’m dreading a season of thorman and woodward, but that doesnt mean i shouldnt be optimistic about salty rescuing first base. whatever…i just couldnt comprehend somebody cashing in chips on a team in mid-may. still cant. not this team. and i do think we’ll find a 3-starter, yes. 1b will be resolved. yes, i agree what hudson does will be significant indeed. but i still say that we’re a team that can win THIS year, as well as build to the future.
By MGL
June 13, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this
Soul Man - Bravo on the 3 rules post, Johnny is annoying. You forgot rule 4 - don’t hit post three times.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this
N8,
I don’t know. Bonds has the second-highest OPS in baseball behind Mags.
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 3:10 PM | Link to this
Top of the 7th Chi sox 3 Phillys 3
if the phillys win today i moving out my house….ha..ha..ha
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this
Jersey Gil, that’s good to know … I don’t think anyone thinks badly of Andruw … he seems to have a good heart. I just wish he wasn’t so stubborn; a trait with which I’m well acquainted … inherited from my father, according to my mother.
By scooter11
June 13, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this
Soul Man: One rule for the blogs: Hit ‘Post’ once, and be patient.
By Lee
June 13, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this
Bob Journalist
No problem. Some of these blog posts will make anyone’s eyes get crossed-up. I’m getting a headache reading serveral of these.
By ncscoots
June 13, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
Well, first, I doubt he’s having many existential upheavals about his place in baseball and the universe, LOL. I think it’s probably more like “(expletive), you dumb (expletive), just swing the (expletive) bat, (expletive). Ah, (expletive). (expletive)!”
(Notice that I do not say this as an indictment of Brian’s language skills. Frankly, the above is about as eloquent as you can get, given some contexts and circumstances, LOL.)
By Mitchie-san
June 13, 2007 3:18 PM | Link to this
Does anyone think that Escobar and Salty have shown TOO much promise in the bigs and now the Braves realize it might be foolish to trade either of them?
By David O'Brien
June 13, 2007 3:18 PM | Link to this
Baron, great post at 11:47 a.m. You know your stuff, my man.
Grinch, not saying that. He’s pressing because he got into a slump, so yeah, that part’s mental. And having Salty around, I’m sure, could give him a tinge of doubt, even if it shouldn’t.
But all I’m saying is, you worry too much about his pysche. He’ll be fine. He’s tough, man. Very tough.
By Turnin2
June 13, 2007 3:27 PM | Link to this
ncscoots LOL!! Yep, I am just being a tad nonchalant about it. But I came up with yet another reason to panic — I’m sure it’s getting engaged!! ;)
Yep — I vote for blaming that!!!
By (.Y.)
June 13, 2007 3:28 PM | Link to this
A few things to ponder:
The Braves record is 4-9 when Chris Woodward starts the game and 4-4 when Pete Orr starts the game. So if you see one of them in the starting lineup, the Braves have a 36% chance to win. LOL.
I am tired of waiting on Scott Thorman. 1B is an offensive position! Ours hits .228 and bats in the 8th spot. We could sure use Dmitri Young. There are 22 first basemen in the NL with a higher batting average. (there are only 16 teams in the NL) It’s crazy that he’s hitting better than Adam LaRoche this year at only .216.
Our “cleanup” hitter batting .217. If Andruw gets his typical number of at-bats in the 24 games before the all-star break, he has to bat about .380 in that span to raise his average to .260. If he hits .250 in that span, his average at the break would be .225.
If I was Boras, I would be on the phone with AJ about his lack of hitting, rather than phoning the Braves beat reporter about Jayson Stark hurting his feelings.
(.Y.)
By Richard Cory
June 13, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this
Soul Man—#1 rule of blogging-DON’T DOUBLE POST!!:]]
By BamaBrave
June 13, 2007 3:33 PM | Link to this
Just to beat a dead horse on the whole Clemente-Andruw comparison… Had Clemente played in this era of favorite-song-soundbites for batters, I’m reasonably certain his song would NOT have been “Drivin’ Dirty”, like Andruw has used from time to time. I’m sure Andruw is a good guy, but the gansta mentality doesn’t exactly conjure up notions of teamwork or sacrifice on behalf of others.
By The Grinch
June 13, 2007 3:33 PM | Link to this
I didn’t mean to imply in any way that McCann had a fragile psyche; far from it. If anything, I was trying to say despite appearing 100% unflappable most of the time to this point, he’s still a human being and a kid at that. I wasn’t crying doom or suggesting he’s a wuss. I was just offering up an alternative viewpoint as to why he might be struggling. Now DAVIES is a wuss…:-) Just kidding. He’s just a kid, too. I don’t know the guy at all so I may be totally off, it just seems to me like he might be better suited mentally to something else, despite his obvious physical talents. The kid who grew up being forced to play violin because of his skill set, but who really wants to be a welder, or whatever. Just stirring the pot.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 3:35 PM | Link to this
ESPN has the Braves listed among teams possibly interested in Adam Dunn (as a firstbaseman?)
This is obviously just a rumor but it’s pretty intriguing. I think it’s still a little too early to give up on Thorman but it will be interesting to see if those rumors get “louder.”
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
For you guys that think BC make somtime bad decision…hear this….In the Games of the Chisox & Phillys..Phillys have men in first & third one out and Guillen left the Pitcher(lefty) Matt Thornton to pitch to a righty Nunez(he has a hit)and then to the righty Rowand(grans Slams)8-3 Phiilys in the 8th Ossy want out of chicago or what
By The Grinch
June 13, 2007 3:40 PM | Link to this
(Y), the reason we’re carrying so many pitchers and so few hitters is because nobody knows if any of our starters besides Smoltz and usually Hudson can get out of the third inning on a regular basis. We also only have a handful of players who can hit that aren’t on the DL and they’re all starting; if your best two bench players are Woodward and Orr what do you do? Add someone worse? Off to the gym.
By Chop Chop
June 13, 2007 3:44 PM | Link to this
Yeah, Grinch. I hear that Davies blows up in innings because he’s very interested in studying the psychological impact of sports on Internet bloggers. We’re nothing but pawns, dude. Nothing but pawns.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 3:52 PM | Link to this
I’d be surprised if Brian’s thoughts included many big words like “expletive” … maybe a few cuss words though.
Johnny Evans, I havent’t read any of your posts but, if you’re putting your name at the end … you’re not alone … Nathan usually gives his regards too and it’s a rather refreshing signature. Some guy named Selah does it too.
You must understand that most of us hide behind the mask and never give our name.
However, Caps aren’t seemly, especially indoors and multiple postings are truly a bore.
By Rubbin's Racing
June 13, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
I didn’t mean to imply in any way that McCann had a fragile psyche;
Oh, b.s. Grinch, you basically accused him of being found naked one morning under Bobby’s desk in the fetal position, holding his favorite blankie from when he was a child, crying, and incoherently mumbling Salty, Salty, Salty, make him go away over and over again.
By dave
June 13, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this
First base is a serious hole in the line up. Someone call up Sid Bream. I’m sure he’s not doing anything constructive.
By dave
June 13, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this
First base is a serious hole in the line up. Someone call up Sid Bream. I’m sure he’s not doing anything constructive.
By Jay
June 13, 2007 3:55 PM | Link to this
The Braves don’t need to resign Andruw Jones after the season. He strikes out to much and I just don’t trust him in the playoffs for the braves.
They Need to either get Torri Hunter.
Torri Hunter playes the same position and he is only 1 year year than Andruw and he shows more passion at the plate too me.
Andruw has been overrated for some years now.
The Braves need to get some new exciting players to play for them not the same ole players cause they always lose in the first round of the playoffs.
By Soul Man
June 13, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this
wiping egg off my face Blame the multiple posts on the crappy, Windows-based PC I use at work. Were I on the super-smooth MacBook I have at home, the Soul Man’s face would be much less red.
By N8
June 13, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this
jed
I’m with you, in thinking that this team has a “chance” (as they did in May), if certain things happen and the stars align.
1) Chipper MUST return and contribute. PERIOD.
2) Hudson needs to look much more like the guy in April than the guy in the last 3 weeks.
3) Andruw has to at some point contribute other than with his glove. Just a little, that’s all I ask.
4) 1B needs to be resolved somehow. If it’s Thorman, Salty, Conine, Diaz….whatever. There needs to be consistancy (the good kind - because one could argue that Thorman has been consistant….consistantly aweful)
5) McCann needs to be healthy. If he’s healthy, he’ll contribute. PERIOD.
5) Wickman and (or) Soriano have to both stay off of the DL for the entire season.
6) A third starter needs to be found, along with somebody in the 5th starter spot that can “keep it a game” beyond the 3rd inning. Though if the offense ever begins to click again at full strength, the need for a better 5th starter may be diminished, some.
7) The Mets need to continue to falter.
8) We have to hope that there isn’t any expensive hired guns out there to be had, if the Mets do falter, because they WILL go get them at all costs to outshine the Yankees in a summer when the Yankees are struggling.
9) If the Mets do take off and run away with the division, we need to hope like HELL that the Dodgers win the west. Because if the Diamondbacks and Padres are leading the division, leaving the Dodgers to chase the wildcard, THEY TOO will spend at all costs to upgrade their roster. Where if the Dodgers are winning the West, it is less likely (not out of the question), that the Padres or D-Backs will add significant payroll mid-season.
10) Last but certainly NOT least. Smoltz needs to take the mound EVERY 5th day, and he needs to be the dominant, ACE/Stopper that he is, when he’s healthy. No Smoltz. No October baseball, IMO.
So there. I’ve laid it all out, in my “not so” professional opinion, what I think has to happen for the Braves to get to the 2nd season. If you disagree, that is cool. EVERYBODY is entitled to their opinions. If you are naive enought to think that ALL of these “wishes” will come true, good luck in life.
Can they succeed if only some of them happen? Sure, if other guys I didn’t mention absolutely EXPLODE (in a good way). KJ going off on a tear for a month would help. Francoeur could carry us for a while, even Salty might be a lift. Maybe Joey Devine comes up and takes some pressure off of the remaining two of the Big-3 in the bullpen. (Yeah….that made me laugh a little too.)
Lets just say, I’m not too optimistic that ALL of that is going to happen, thus leaving WAY TOO MUCH room for things to get worse, before the get better…..if they do get better at all.
Call me a pessimist, if you will. I just don’t want ANYTHING sugar-coated. I see right through Bora$’s BS. That crap might work on other teams looking to bid and upgrade their CF situation. But with all the crap and numbers Boras is putting out there about AJ, I have one simple question for him:
Has he EVEN watched Andruw play this year??? If he has, he’d surely just shut his mouth, don’t you think? This guy is the same guy that if he saw some dollars to be made for his client and him, would try and sell an autographed picture of OJ Simpson to Fred Goldman. He’s a WEASEL. He’s barking up the wrong tree, IMO, calling DOB, in the hopes that DOB will write a story trying to convince us how NOT overrated Andruw is. His defense ISN’T THE FRICKIN ISSUE MORON!!!!! It’s the .217 batting average when we are 16 games away from being HALF WAY through the season.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this
Reasons to believe Andruw will turn it around offensively:
His Isolated Power (SLG-AVG, basically his extra-base power) is second on the team behind Chipper. He’s still hitting the ball hard fairly regularly.
His BB/K ratio is getting better. He’s approaching Renteria in this category and he’s about at his career ratio.
His batting average on balls in play is pretty low at .244 (compared to his career BABiP of .281). Those hits will likely eventually start finding the where-they-ain’t more often. The idea is that not much seperates a batted ball that finds a hole from a batted ball that finds a glove as far as batter and pitcher are concerned; so eventually, with enough chances, those balls that have been finding gloves will start to find holes.
He’s just too good a hitter to be this bad over the course of a full season. Yes, he’s always been a high K guy but he’s also been a much better power hitter than he’s even shown this season. Eventually his talent has to put him back to his normal levels (I think).
His slow start may have cost him any chance at his numbers getting to where they have been the past few seasons but there are some good reasons to be optimistic.
I think if you believe Andruw was ever an elite hitter, you probably overrated him to begin with. But you realize what he is, an above-average hitter, you can be a little more optimistic about Andruw turning it around.
By Bigboi
June 13, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this
Bama what does Andruw having the song “driving dirty” have to do with the type of person he is? Would u prefer him having say um country or bluegrass music?
By BossLady
June 13, 2007 4:03 PM | Link to this
Okay, DAVE when ,Sid Bream gets here then we’ll take over the East.
By Renegator
June 13, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this
Phillies up 8 to 4 in the 9th. Get ready to be in 3rd place in the East.
By Jersey Gil
June 13, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
Phillys 8 Chisox 4 game over Philadelphia 2 1/2 games for the Mets and 1/2 games from braves.
By Double Deuce
June 13, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
Never a dull moment on this blog, which is why it is such a fun one. Andrew Jones…I find it odd that the reason stated for being overrated is for his defense. You would think it would be the offense. I don’t know how anyone who has watched Andrew over the years could even make a small case that he’s an overrated defensive center fielder. Don’t care what stats say. He almost never is out of position and when a ball is hit it seems as though he has already taken two steps in the direction its hit. There are a lot of great outfielders around, and Andrew is one of them. I would think the one area to criticize Andrew would be the seemingly under achieving with the bat. That may be unfair also only because when you see how athletic he is defensively, you automatically expect him to be a great hitter, which he is not. Kyle Davies…Davies has the tools to be a major league pitcher, but those tools need to be developed. That’s what AAA is for and that’s exactly where I see him right now. He needs the opportunity to be able to fail without the weight of Atlanta on his shoulders while he becomes a major league caliber pitcher. It is unfortunate for him to be in the spot he’s in right now, which is the Braves don’t have anyone else to turn to while he’s learning his trade under the scrutiny of his peers and the press. If he survives he will be stronger for the ordeal. Let’s hope he doesn’t read the papers or this blog. Bobby Cox…Great man, great history in the game but he makes me scratch my head with his patience(which also could be called stubborness)with his pitchers. Can’t count the times when he should have pulled his pitchers one batter earlier and saved some runs. Its as if he waits for them to fail completely before pulling them instead of protecting them by getting them out.Just my opinion. Brian McCann…For all you out there wondering whats up with McCann, don’t forget he’s only 23 himself. Don’t know if he’s ever been in a slump, or been this injured for this long of a period. But I do know that he’s the type of catcher organizations look for and when they find them they lock them up, and we should feel fortunate to have him. He’ll improve defensively, his offense will come around again and a few years down the road we will appreciate him all the more. I see him as a Jorge Posada kind of figure for the Braves, not the same body type obviously, but leadership and ability wise. Salty..This is a tough one here. What do you do with a guy as gifted as this guy? With McCann locked up behind the plate the obvious spot is 1st base, and I hope this is what the Braves do with him. I wouldn’t trade him. Period. With McCann, Francouer, Salty, and Escobar you have a glimpse of what the future could be for the Braves. Take Salty out of that mix and it looks a lot less imposing. Just some observations from a Braves fan.
By Shaun
June 13, 2007 4:10 PM | Link to this
With concern to Andruw never being an elite hitter:
His career OBP is average. His career AVG is…average. His career SLG is pretty good but he’s never finished in the top 4 and has only finished in the top 10 once (in 2005 he finished 5th).
I would say Andruw has been overrated offensively in that people look at his HR totals think he’s an elite hitter but everything else is fairly ordinary. And he is underrated offensively because people see his batting average and stikeout total and aren’t impressed but his overrall offensive game is fairly solid, especially when you take his position into account.
Andruw is a complex player because of his fairly unique skill set. You really have to look closely and maybe dig deep to see what he is and what he is not offensively.
By N8
June 13, 2007 4:11 PM | Link to this
Grinch
I really think that Davies is more suited to the bullpen for now. I’m not talking “pressure” situations, like coming in with RISP. Far from it.
But essentially the roll that Oscar is in.
On occasion, Davies will get hammered in the first inning, but more often than not, it’s his second (or on the really good days - the 3rd), time through the order that gives him trouble.
If we actually had another starter anywhere that could outperform Davies, I’d be REAL interested to see what Davies could do in Oscar’s roll, and then let Oscar have a roll similar to Yates. Comining in, in the 7th or 8th inning and letting it all hang out for an inning at a wack.
Like I said, for this to happen, we’d have to have a better option for the rotation. Which I believe we currently don’t, or that person would be pitching every 5th day.
Call me crazy on the “Davies to the pen” talk, but if I recall correctly, Millwood was in the pen for a while, wasn’t he? Not to mention that Davies occasionally hits 93 or so on the gun. If he wasn’t woried about going 6-7 innings, he might be able to air it out a bit more, making his offspeed stuff more effective. Of course, that leads us to his control…..
YIKES.
By Steve McP
June 13, 2007 4:16 PM | Link to this
In a way I quite miss NCZ and Metroman, they were always good for a laugh and just because the Mets have been so awful (even worse than the Braves although you might not think that with some of the posts here) it is hardly fair that they deprive us all of the fun that we could have with them offering up their views.
By Steve McP
June 13, 2007 4:16 PM | Link to this
In a way I quite miss NCZ and Metroman, they were always good for a laugh and just because the Mets have been so awful (even worse than the Braves although you might not think that with some of the posts here) it is hardly fair that they deprive us all of the fun that we could have with them offering up their views.
By Vee Vee
June 13, 2007 4:16 PM | Link to this
I have been watching baseball my whole life and for those that do not believe Andruw Jones to be the BEST center-fielder in baseball need to find a new sport to watch.
By Bob, Journalist
June 13, 2007 4:23 PM | Link to this
Lee, gettin’ headaches from reading some of these posts has nothing to do with eyesight … poor vision maybe, theirs not yours; at least that’s what I tell myself.
Which Grinch tries to be serious he’s very funny … so when he says he just kidding, don’t believe it! However, his points about them being kids are funny … that is to say, me thinks he’s being serious! Well said!
Cato mentioned practicing earlier … I was taught that the reason why we have coaches is because improper practicing is far, far worse than no practicing … yet it seems that most are left to their own devices.
If your soapbox derby racer get beat in every heat, it’s usually better to design and build a new one than try to fix it … a young Fireball Roberts told me that! … I’ll let you guess the reason why.
By Chop Chop
June 13, 2007 4:26 PM | Link to this
Just noticed this Yahoo! article about Jorge Sosa…
Sosa’s extreme makeover
Just warms the cockles of your heart, doesn’t it?
By BossLady
June 13, 2007 4:30 PM | Link to this
McCann is a good catcher and he is a good offensive player. His contract is solid and he will achieve success in his position. Orr, Woodward, Thorman should be discussed about losing their jobs. McCann is as stable with Braves as Chipper and Smoltz. Controversy with Boras is a big media play that will have every team thinking Andruw is unhappy in Atlanta and looking to change. I think he is trying to drive up the cost and get offers on the table. I don’t know why Andruw is mixed up with this Lawyer and we know they are snakes. If there is any way that they can make money on anybody head they will. I think someone said that Boras was Beltran’s agent too. You see how they s(!^ on Houston after it was too late to make adjustments. NY fans didn’t appreciate him when he got there. Everybody knows that a snake is a snake no matter if his suit cost $7K
By Baron
June 13, 2007 4:31 PM | Link to this
Shaun, those are good and comforting numbers, and a wise assessment all around. If he stays healthy, we WILL see one of those ridiculous streaks Druw goes off on: 30-40 games of 1.400 OPS with 20 HR and 45 RBI. And we will probably see another ridiculous streak of 20 games at .500 OPS with 1 HR and 30 SO. It’s Andruw. He’s not done anything this year he hasn’t done before on several occasions.
By Caleb
June 13, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this
Looks to me like T. Moore is piggy-backing off DOB’s blog. Just a thought.
By DC Braves Fan
June 13, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this
DOB Any news on Chipper? Is he lineup tonite?
By Steve McP
June 13, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this
We already have so many pitchers, who do you want to get rid of from the pen to fit him in?
By David O'Brien
June 13, 2007 4:40 PM | Link to this
THIS JUST IN: Chipper activated and in the lineup tonight. Boyer optioned to Richmond.
Edgar’s in one lineup, not the other. Gonna decide after he tests his hand in pregame, I guess.
By Sonny
June 13, 2007 4:43 PM | Link to this
A. Jones is one of the top 3 defensive center fielders of all time, but as a hitter he has always been, and always will be too erratic to be considered one of the greats of all time. Great players don’t slump half of almost every season, they are consistent year in, year out, throughout their careers…that’s what makes them great!
I really thought Jones had turned a corner in 05, he looked disciplined and in control at the plate. But those days are long gone. Now the guy falls down on half of his swings, and doesn’t seem to have the will or desire to change what is wrong.
I love the guy and want him to remain with the Bravos until he retires, but he doesn’t deserve a raise from $14 mil, much less