Braves

By J-dogg

March 2, 2007 12:33 PM | Link to this

Graet job DOB. Hope Adam has a great year in Pitt and Gonzy has a great year for us. Trade looks like a winner for both teams.

By sri

March 2, 2007 12:36 PM | Link to this

nice reading abt rochy.. hope we dont miss him too much..

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this

DOB,

Enjoyed all the Johnny Cash music this week. Did you ever go to Aces Bar & Grill in Kirkwood for their Johnny Cash night? I’m actually moving over to that area soon, and wondered what the bar/crowd/music was like.

Take care!

kdbanks

By Lew

March 2, 2007 12:43 PM | Link to this

RobDawg-To answer your question from the last blog-If you truly think that Koufax, Drysdale, et al couldn’t get Guerrero and the like out these days, then Dude, you just don’t have a clue. Back then there were 16 teams, not 30. The stadiums were bigger. There was much more foul territory than today. You mention Dale Berra as an example of a lousy hitter back then. First of all, he played a decade later than what I’m talking about, but why do you think his average was that low? It’s the pitching, stupid (and no that wasn’t a rip on you, personally). Lokk at some of the players today. What about Langerhans .240? In the sixties, that would have translated to below the Mendoza line (which term wasn’t even in use then). No, the reason a .330 BA is so prevalent today, is not because the players from the sixties were so bad, but because most of today’s pitchers couldn’t hold the resin bags of most from the 60’s. Dude, you’re definitely delusional if you believe what you stated. Period.

By eric the elder

March 2, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this

Hello friends. It’s good to be back - - good to be able to be back. At my age, it’s good to be anywhere.

I’ve enjoyed lurking and soaking up this blog over the off season. These are always the best of times for the blog. Cool heads and warm hearts. Outstanding posts, so much knowledge and lore and history and perspective. You, my friends, are the best.

The snarly stuff is at a minimum in the off season, but I know it will reappear when the real season gets underway. I, for one, am resolved to ignore all the insults and nastiness and just enjoy the game for which I have much passion.

Let’s play ball, boys and girls. Let’s play it fairly and well.

By Hunter

March 2, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this

Hey DOB, any word about whether or not they’re getting the game in? I hope so, I cleared my DVR and Friday night so that I could watch it.

By Kentavo

March 2, 2007 12:49 PM | Link to this

Is it time yet? I’ve got ESPN on at the office and my boss is gone. There’s even some Coors Light over there in the office fridge. Play ball!!!!!!!!!!!

By Car3boogie

March 2, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this

That’s good Stuff.

By Arkansas Hillbilly

March 2, 2007 12:57 PM | Link to this

Kentavo,

Silver Bullet in the fridge, huh? Where do you work, and do they have a job opening? >=-)

By 22oz

March 2, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this

Scott Thorman has as much of a chance of not being platooned as i do of making the opening day roster. Welcome to Atlanta, young left handed hitter.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 1:06 PM | Link to this

We’re playing ball. It’s clear out for now. Smoltz will certainly get in his two innings. Hopefully weather holds off long enough for Gonzalez and Wickman.

By Adam

March 2, 2007 1:12 PM | Link to this

Just read that Kelly Johnson got drilled in the chest from a line drive from Pete Orr while he was practicing turning double plays.

By Matthew

March 2, 2007 1:12 PM | Link to this

Are we playing ball yet? Is that why the blog went dead?

Thanks for the Laroche story, DOB. It’s a shame it had to be Laroche and not Giles and Reitsma. Can you imagine this team with Roachy and Gonzo? Anyway, I hope Adam hits 40 homers in PIT, and that the Braves meet them in the NLCS (us winning of course). Good luck Adam!

Go Braves!

By N8

March 2, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this

WOW!

Smoltz looks to be in mid-season form.

Of course throwing those offspeed breaking balls at the minor leagures is about as fair as Michael Jordan showing up at the YMCA youth league taking it to the youngsters. LOL!

Brings a smile to my face.

By rammerjammer

March 2, 2007 1:16 PM | Link to this

DOB, thanks for the article on Adam. Really sounds like a cool, regular guy. So does Gonzalez (Gonzo? Gonzy?). A couple of super class acts.

By N8

March 2, 2007 1:17 PM | Link to this

Anybody else out there think that Diaz’s little “rock back” at the plate as he’s getting ready for the pitch is reminiscent of Bob Horner?

LOVE IT!

By Eric from MO

March 2, 2007 1:17 PM | Link to this

Look hitters are better today. They are stronger and in better shape. Thats not because of steroids but because in the offseason they work out and lift. Back in the day all the players had to work to make ends meet. With that being said Pitchers also arent as good and more importantly the stadiums are super small. My High School baseball field is bigger than the Phillies.

By DonCoburleone

March 2, 2007 1:20 PM | Link to this

Athletes today in ANY sport (meaning hitters, pitchers, running backs, lineman, forwards, goalies… anything) are bigger, faster, stronger than athletes 20, 30, 40, or 100 years ago. Now I’m not saying that Sandy Koufax and Drysdale and Gibson couldn’t get out todays hitters and be successful in todays game, but to say that pitchers back then were so much better than pitchers today is a joke! Pitchers simply had a much bigger advantage 30 or 40 years ago than they do today. No hitters regularly worked out and made themselves stronger during the offseason. Studying pitchers by watching tape wasn’t around back then either(and don’t say pitchers watch tape now today too, cuz I know they do, but they don’t benefit nearly as much from that as hitters do). Hitters today are stronger, in better shape, and more prepared for every AB. Plus, parks are much smaller today than 40 years ago so naturally the offensive stats are going to be deflated… Bottom line, for example, Johan Santana is every bit as good (if not better) than Sandy Koufax was…

By Eric from MO

March 2, 2007 1:20 PM | Link to this

Well Thorman isnt going to be platooned so I guess in a month I will know who you are 22oz. Let me guess you are Kyle Davies. No wait Kelly Johnson.

By Armstrong

March 2, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this

Hey does anyone know of a website online that I can listen to the game for free??? Ive got DSL so it should be able to pull it. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

By rammerjammer

March 2, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this

That media guide cover tells me not to count on AJ or Smoltz beyond this season.

By N8

March 2, 2007 1:27 PM | Link to this

Saw that knucklball coming on the first pitch to LaRoche.

Aswesome.

Gotta love the ribbing from Smoltz as Roche walked off the field.

Gary Thorne, Kruk (who happens to be sporting the “soul glow” look today), and Steve Phillips were just laughing at LaRoche for forgetting his jersey.

Aaaah! Spring is here.

MAN does Smoltz have the slider working today. Save some of them for April John.

By michael

March 2, 2007 1:27 PM | Link to this

DOB, thanks for the kind word on yesterday’s post. You’ll be happy to know the goats and the doublewide survived intact. Actually they’re not my goats.

Enjoyed today’s story about Davies and the blog on LaRoche. I remember when John Smoltz had his crisis of confidence way back when. You’re dead on it concerning the Cash video. Gives you a feel for the arc of the man’s life and the starkness of death, all that. Powerful stuff.

According to accuweather.com, the rain will start at 4 p.m. but its supposed to clear by 6 p.m. Rain returns at around 10 p.m.

By 22oz

March 2, 2007 1:31 PM | Link to this

Can’t wait to watch the tape when i get home from work!

By 22oz

March 2, 2007 1:34 PM | Link to this

i think Pete may have hit that ball at Kelly on purpose. ah, you gotta love competition.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 1:36 PM | Link to this

Smoltz was sharp for two innings _ three strikeouts, 23 pitches, 19 strikes _ and gave up one hit, a two-out sinking liner to right that Francoeur turned from a single into a triple when he dove for it in the gap and the ball landed a few inches in front of his glove and rolled to near the warning track.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 1:38 PM | Link to this

DonC-You are certainly entitled to your own opinion, but after almost 50 years of watching baseball, Sandy Koufax is the best I ever saw. Hands down. Yes, there are some good pitchers today. Clemens, Smoltz and yes, probably Santana (though it’s much too early to tell) as well as several others like Maddux, Randy Johnson and Pedro in his prime, would probably be successful in any era. But unless you really saw Gibby, Marichal and Koufax pitch in their prime (and even then), you’ll never convince me of that point of view. If the hitters of today really had to worry about Gibson putting a 97 MPH fastball in their ear, their approach would not be as confident as they are now. Anybody today comes close to brushing back a hitter and both teams get out on the field and pretend to fight each other. Back then, you dusted yourself off and took the next pitch. Players today may be stronger, but they don’t have as much in the way of pitching to deal with, either.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this

Oh Yeah-Smoltz is nasty today.

By N8

March 2, 2007 1:40 PM | Link to this

WOW.

What a throw by Andruw.

My oh My!

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 1:41 PM | Link to this

Andruw just made a perfect throw home from shallow center to nail a dude trying to score from second on a single, which would’ve been first run if he hadn’t gotten him.

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this

When will people learn not to run on Andruw?

By N8

March 2, 2007 1:43 PM | Link to this

Well. I guess that throw is why Andruw is one of the reasons Andruw is so good, and that foul ball, is why Diaz might be a liability in LF (defensively). That was a nice bit of hustling on the foul/fly, but that could’ve turned out bad for Diaz, running into the wall like that.

Take it easy guys.

By John Adcox

March 2, 2007 1:50 PM | Link to this

It sounds like McBride is getting hit hard. Is that the case? Of course, no runs scored, so the hits don’t matter….

By RP

March 2, 2007 1:50 PM | Link to this

At Work!! does anyone know if the game is on the web? in any form! please help!

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 1:53 PM | Link to this

So glad to be watching ball today.

Lew: When was the mound changed. I know it was, but don’t recall the date. It changed in height. That affected hitters and batters dramatically.
Koufax was amazing. Just mind blowing. I read once that his ERA was around 1 run lower than the league average during his prime years. Maddux’s ERA during his prime years was about 2.00 runs lower than league average. Craziness indeed.
All my statements on Santos are not meant to be taken as me saying he wasn’t good. It’s just that I don’t think it is unfathomable that he isn’t in the Hall. I never saw the man play. But looking at his numbers, even compared to players of his day, it doesn’t look like he was the best of his day. He was good though.

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this

What a play Pena!

By braveheart

March 2, 2007 2:01 PM | Link to this

was it 1967 or 1968? i think it was right after gibson’s 1.12

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 2:05 PM | Link to this

Just realized you all are watching yourselves, or at least providing color for those not, so I’ll stop with that and get to work on my Smoltz story. The one day I don’t need to provide commentary, since some of you good folks can help out the others not at their TVs.

DONC, you wrote: “Bottom line, for example, Johan Santana is every bit as good (if not better) than Sandy Koufax was…”

That party from a couple nights ago must still be going, my friend. You just said Santana was as good or better than arguably the best pitcher of my lifetime, certainly the best over a span of 5-6 years.

Actually, take a look at Koufax stats in his final four seasons. Nothing comparable in the modern era, and nothing ever will be. Unbelievably dominant.

By ncscoots

March 2, 2007 2:05 PM | Link to this

TPaul, think it was 69, the year after Gibson’s microscopic ERA. Least I think that was 68.

By Thrillhouse44

March 2, 2007 2:13 PM | Link to this

Man, I’m jealous of you guys that get to watch the game…Glad Smoltz looked good. Is KJ okay? Did he end up playing?

By KC

March 2, 2007 2:14 PM | Link to this

LEW: Are you telling us that Koufax was better than the early-mid 90’s Greg Maddux? Hard to imagine anyone being any better than he was over that span.

By N8

March 2, 2007 2:16 PM | Link to this

John Adcox

IMO, McBride is doing what he has ALWAYS done, since we’ve seen him play at the big league level:

Looks good against lefties and not so good against the righies.

If he doesn’t eventually find a pitch that will CONSISTANTLY get righties out, he will be relegated to bullpen duty as a “lefty specialist” for the entirety of his career. Of course there is nothing wrong with that, many people have had LONG careers in that roll. How’s the old saying go?

“If you throw lefthanded and have a pulse, there’s a job for you on a big league club”.

Not a good stretch (comitted too soon) by Thorman on a “nice” play by Pena in the hole. Would’ve been bang/bang anyhow, but LaRoche probably makes that play. That’s why fielding percentage of the 1B is misleading, IMO. It’s not the plays that the 1B makes where HE doesn’t commit an error, it’s the errors (I believe it was ruled a hit, but you get the point), that the 1B can save the OTHER INFIELDERS.

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 2:19 PM | Link to this

Home Run Frenchy!

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this

Nice Francoeur. And then Thor… just hustles down the line. I love it!

By Lew

March 2, 2007 2:21 PM | Link to this

Good play by a fan on that Francoeur laser beam. Barehanded catch on the fly. That looked like one of Sheffield’s rocket shots. Got out quick.

By Greg in TN

March 2, 2007 2:22 PM | Link to this

Greetings folks…

DOB, Great stuff on LaRoche having to wear a defensive lineman’s number at the game today. Had to smile at that and Smoltzie’s knuckler to him.

I’ll wade back into the HOF debate, especially in terms of differences between eras. You can’t get to the bigs without being good. That is true whether it’s 1937, 1977 or 2007. Would a 1937 journeyman outfielder be able to sniff the bigs if he got into Dr. Emmitt Brown’s DeLorian? I don’t think he would.

My point is this… Great players are timeless. If Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb, Honus Wagner, Lou Gehrig, Sandy Koufax, Bob Gibson, Warren Spahn and other HOF’ers showed up to the ballpark one night instead of the Devil Rays, I think they hold their own. These guys would have to make some adjustments to how the game is played in terms of the height of the mound and things like that, but these are the guys that could make that adjustment, even back in their day.

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this

Gonzo in now…pitching the 6th.

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 2:25 PM | Link to this

And walks the first batter he sees.

By Salty

March 2, 2007 2:25 PM | Link to this

Nice catch by the ‘yellow-shirted’ left-fielder…hmmm…can he hit, though?

I’ll take Koufax and Gibson, even on the lowered mound. I’ll take Guidry in his prime, and Maddux. Who needs a 5th starter…heck, who needs a bullpen, beyond a Rollie or a Goose? Game’s over…IMO!

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this

And gives up a 2-run homer.

By eric the elder

March 2, 2007 2:34 PM | Link to this

Gonzo: high, high, high. Looks like he might be tipping the breaking ball, too. Rough outing.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 2:36 PM | Link to this

TenPaul-All I can say is that Santo was considered to be the class of 3Bmen when I was growing up.The only others that compared to him was Ken Boyer of the Cards, who won a batting title and several years later when Richie Allen came along in 64. Most of the others, like Clete Boyer, were more great fielders than great hitters. Hell, back then your shortstop was EXPECTED to hit .225-245. Now I know he was a 3B, but still the criteria were different back then. The common perception at the time was that Santo was one of the best. What can I say? Shaun-Please don’t quote me stats and whatnot. If you had seen Koufax pitch on a regular basis, you would also say he was the best you had seen. The 60’s were a pitcher’s era, whatever the reason (I think the mound was lowered after only one player, Yaz, I think, was the only .300 hitter for a season-67), and Koufax was widely acknowledged to be the best of his era. You’ve got to realize that this was when Gibson, Marichal, Gaylord Perry, Tom Seaver, Drysdale, Sutton, Jenkins-were all in their prime. Koufax, for a four year period was unbelievable. Four no hitters including a perfect game in four years. The only reason he didn’t win 300 was that his arthritis got so bad, he had to retire. He was unhittable. DonC-You talk about the strength of today’s players. Do you really think no one lifted weights before? If they had the technology available, I’m sure they would have studied film. Think Zapruder, Dude. That was the current technology available in the 60’s-a Brownie 35mm video camera. That was it. Period. What you’re saying is on par with saying that we know more about baseball than our grandfathers, because we watch televison. Look at pictures of Ted Klezewski of the Reds, or Roger Maris. Those dudes were big and ripped. Look at the size and strength of Frank Howard or Frank Robinson and then talk to me about strength. I did an interview with Mike Schmidt in 1980 where he talked about training with the Nautilus system Let’s not go to where the current players got so strong. It was the advent of elliptical trainers, right?

By N8

March 2, 2007 2:36 PM | Link to this

KC

I was thinking the same thing, in regards to Maddux vs. Koufax.

In the era of hitters, small ballparks, and steroid allegations, it’s hard to imagine ANYBODY being more dominant (as compared to the league average) than Maddux was in the early 90’s. Especially 94 & 95 (even though they were both strike shortened years).

Having said that, before DOB and other guys that saw Koufax pitch (I did not), rip on me for being naive, I’m not going to try and compare players from different eras. All I’m doing is stating what DOB just stated, which is:

In MY LIFETIME, nobody has been more dominant over a 4 or 5 year period than Greg Maddux. Of course one could argue that Clemens and Randy Johnson have had equal (if not greater success) than Maddux had.

btw: for those not watching the game, who will read it in the box score later. The 2 Run HR that Gonzalez gave up was VERY wind aided (in the Wrigley Field varity). So don’t hit the panic button, LOL!

Gregor Blanco just lead off with a walk. Let’s see if he can manufacture something here.

By don

March 2, 2007 2:40 PM | Link to this

BNoy, I loved your reference to the “fringe outfielder” and the “top shortstop prospect”. You are really a homer. I saw the “tsp” last year playing against Myrtle Beach. He clearly isn’t a “tsp” by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, he seemed rather old to be in Class A.

By kdbanks

March 2, 2007 2:43 PM | Link to this

Hoping I’m not rousing any feathers with the Gonzo comments…I’m sure he’s just working on his pitches, location, etc., and not concerned with who he’s facing or what they’re looking for.

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this

Out of Nowhere it’s Jurries. Tie game.

By N8

March 2, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this

Hmmm.

We have a James Jurries sighting. LOL!

Nice job by Prado picking up the RBI on the previous AB, going down to take a breaking ball up the middle for a hit. Didn’t try to do too much with it.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this

If Jurries has a great spring, what a fly in the ointment that would be.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 2:45 PM | Link to this

If the Braves played all their games in Central Florida, perhaps James Jurries would be a star. The dude is a spring-training slugger _ even when he’s in minor league camp and only invited over for the day. His double just tied it 3-3.

By Novice Ned

March 2, 2007 2:46 PM | Link to this

What’s the fielding story on Johnson? Anything hit his way yet? And has he had a chance to turn a doubkle play yet in the past 2 games?

By Lew

March 2, 2007 2:48 PM | Link to this

Sorry Shaun-That was actually KC who asked about Koufax /Maddux.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this

Don’t get me wrong here. If I has to have an all time staff, both Koufax and Maddux would be on it. But the had completely different styles and approaches. Maddux would fool you whereas Koufax made you look like a little leaguer. He would dominate you. His fastball was much faster than Maddux’s and his curve was an abslute killer. He was capable of pitching a no hitter any time he pitched and the times he didn’t pitch no hitters a one or two hitter was always more than a possibility. He was ungodly good.

By DonCoburleone

March 2, 2007 2:57 PM | Link to this

“That party from a couple nights ago must still be going, my friend. You just said Santana was as good or better than arguably the best pitcher of my lifetime, certainly the best over a span of 5-6 years. Actually, take a look at Koufax stats in his final four seasons. Nothing comparable in the modern era, and nothing ever will be. Unbelievably dominant.”

I agree the numbers were dominant, and I don’t doubt that Koufax may have been the best pitcher of all time; BUT, you have to admit that hitters during that time (overall, not specific individual players) were smaller, weaker, and less prepared than hitters today. And, that ballparks were much larger back then, leading to much better statistics by pitchers…

By Lew

March 2, 2007 3:00 PM | Link to this

Nathan and KC-Let’s put it like this. A batter, after walking back to the dugout after Maddux getting him out might say “Damn, how did I miss that pitch.” After Koufax getting him out would say “Damn, there’s no way anyone will EVER hit that pitch.” They both got you out, but one made you look sick.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 3:10 PM | Link to this

DonC-What you say about stadium size and other peripherals is true, for the most part, but don’t you think that the hitters from today’s teams benefit by having smaller stadiums and access to more than Dexies? It works both ways. The pitchers from today OVERALL are not as good. They can’t be. In the 60’s (which I don’t really even see as being the greatest era, if, indeed, there is one) there were 16 teams, whereas today there are 30. That does dilute the pitching talent somewhat. Back then, an ERA over 3 was considered terrible and an average of .285 was good. Not so today on either front. It really is difficult to compare players of different eras, but Koufax was exceptional in every era.

By AstoriaMetsFan

March 2, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this

Regarding Koufax - park and the size of the players are irrelevant when discussing Koufax. What made him so dominant is the fact that his stuff was so good the hitters never were able to put a good swing on the ball, if they were even able to make contact. Hitters were helpless in the box. Koufax would paint the corners with a 95 mph fastball then finish you off with a slow, knee buckling curvethat the hitters could not do anything with.

By Russell

March 2, 2007 3:25 PM | Link to this

Catching the tail end of our ST game and is it just my imagination or is Moylan using a different arm slot than last year?

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this

Sheeeesh. You weren’t kidding DOB. Lillibridge looks like he’s 10 years old.

By journalist jimmy smith

March 2, 2007 3:40 PM | Link to this

this is fun, isn’t it? there are some players in camp. hope bobby picks the right ones. what happens if jurries shines? again. oh, the humanity! what if harris continues to look good at 2b? yes, there are some players in camp. escobar hit the ball hard in the 9th - the guy made a good play. oh, the humanity! extra innings!

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 3:43 PM | Link to this

Lew: Let’s put it this way. In, I think, 1996 the WS vs the Yankees. The home plate ump was calling the game Maddux was pitching. After it was done he said: Now I understand what every one has been talking about.

By N8

March 2, 2007 3:48 PM | Link to this

When the pitchers are looking down, I actually LOVE the “look” of the new ST caps. Because from that angle you can’t see the red “stripes” on the side (Braves players are right, that is ABSOLUTELY hidious).

I’ve never been a big fan of the red on the brim of the Braves caps. Often wondered why they don’t go with a solid blue hat, with the white “A” on the front.

Oh well.

By woogidy

March 2, 2007 3:48 PM | Link to this

Yea,Good thing is for Lillibridge, if he ever had a carrer ending injury, he could be a decoy on NBC’s “To Catch A Predator” show.

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this

Excellent! GO BRAVES

By N8

March 2, 2007 3:57 PM | Link to this

Shaun

Is it you that STILL insists that an out is an out, is an out????

Hard to imagine the winning run scoring on that play if Prado DOESN’T MAKE CONTACT and strikes out. Huh?

Just giving you a hard time man. But I can’t EXPLAIN to you (and anybody else) who doesn’t get it, how much making contact is NOT A BAD THING.

I get your point about “avoiding” outs rather than the kind of outs you make, but I will still contest that it’s hard to get a basehit if you can’t HIT THE BALL consistantly.

Kind of like the old saying referring to a base stealer that can’t get on base: “you can’t steal 1B”.

L8R man.

By 10-7-4

March 2, 2007 4:02 PM | Link to this

Lew—Koufax is by far the best I ever saw. Once, late in the season, during a hot pennant race, with the Cardinals, an obnoxious fan leaned over the railing and shouted-“hey ya bums, the Cards got 3 in the 2nd with Gibson pitching”. Drysdale, stuck his head out and retorted, “so what, we got 1 in the 1st with Koufax pitching”. I think that this kind of summed it all up. If they scored at all, game pretty much over.

By Honey

March 2, 2007 4:02 PM | Link to this

Shaun Santo,

Honey, I just love your logical, objective mind

You think it’s dangerous to say if Player x wasn’t voted in in 1977, he isn’t good enough to be voted in in 2007. What if some new, overwhelming evidence is found that says Player x should be in the Hall?

That’s good thinking!! I never saw player X play but your’re right honey, he should be inducted without a vote for being so good that he could keep the evidence hidden all this time.

Who said we can’t define the Babe or the Dutchman as Hall of Fame players? He’s a dummy, whoever he is. It’s okay honey, cause they’re already in! But it is dangerous to use them in defining Hall of Famers cause then the hall would be almost empty.

Shaun honey, what is a true historian? What is a false historian?

You got some good points honey but don’t go gettin too familiar using using “our” when you’re talkin about yourself. No, I wouldn’t agree that “our” knowledge of the game has increased over time. Yours has mine hain’t cause I used to more bout it than I do now and you are just now learning from the experts and true historians.

I’m impressed! You’re a boy of many talents. Honey, this is good stuff: “don’t you think we have more knowledge now as to what a HOFer is than we did 20, 30, 40 years ago?”.

Now that is funny. If you want people to take you serious, the you’ve got to be serious. Otherwise, folks will think you’re a journalist!

By tp

March 2, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this

i don’t agree with anyone who says maddux doesn’t/didn’t have hall-of-fame caliber, dominant stuff. the movement on his change-up is/was absurd. a cut fastball that rivals mariano rivera’s (minus the velocity). remember too - he threw these pitches at various speeds - even during the same at-bat.

you can out-think hitters all you want, but you don’t win 300 games in the major leagues without dominant stuff.

By RP

March 2, 2007 4:06 PM | Link to this

In 2000, there were roughly 44 million males aged 15-44 in this country. I realize this is a broad spec of datum, but it is a reasonable baseball age, at least as a point of general comparison. In 1960, there was less than 35 million.

16 teams, 35 million; 32 teams, 44 million plus a vastly expanded role for our own african-american population, plus an even more significant influx from south and central america, and to a much lesser extent japan. it’s not perfect, but i would have to say dillution of the talent pool is a much smaller factor than many would like to believe

By Head Coach

March 2, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this

For those of you who didn’t get to see the game , Braves win 5-4 in ten.

By Arkansas Hillbilly

March 2, 2007 4:08 PM | Link to this

My wife just called me at work and told me the Braves won. That’s good news to me: Not that the we won, but that in less than one year of marriage, my wife has become a big enough fan to watch a whole spring training game without me there, making her watch it. WOO HOO!!!

That is unless she’s not watching it by herself. Wait a damn minute. I don’t have internet at home so let me see, who was not blogging during the game…..GRINCH!!!!

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 4:09 PM | Link to this

That umpire was talking about an 86 pitch game Maddux tossed.

Maddux threw a stunning 4-1 complete game in the first game of a doubleheader on July 22, 1997 in which he threw only 76 pitches, 63 for strikes.

Baseball Hall of Famer Wade Boggs said of Maddux, “It seems like he’s inside your mind with you. When he knows you’re not going to swing, he throws a straight one. He sees into the future. It’s like he has a crystal ball hidden inside his glove.” Dwight Gooden once commended Maddux, saying, “You wish there was another league he could get called up to.” Joe Morgan once said that “Greg Maddux could put a baseball through a Life Saver.” Maddux was also remarkable for the late movement on his pitches, which, combined with his superb command, made him one of the most effective groundball pitchers in history.

Maddux’s best season was likely in 1995 when he finished 19-2 with an incredible 1.63 ERA in a year when the overall National League ERA was 4.23. In the strike-shortened 1994 season, he had an even lower ERA of 1.56, the best single-season ERA among currently active pitchers, which compared even more favorably to the NL in that year (4.26).

Since the introduction of the live-ball era in 1920, there have only been five pitchers to have full-season ERAs under 1.65: Luis Tiant and Bob Gibson in the anomalous 1968 season, Dwight Gooden in 1985, and Greg Maddux, twice (1994 and 1995).

And this one I found…
During the construction of the Olympic Stadium in Atlanta, which was converted into Turner Field after the 1996 Summer Olympics, the Braves front office challenged the golden trio of Braves starters (Maddux, Glavine, and Smoltz) to win the World Series in 1995 by saying that if they did, a putting green would be installed in the locker room at Turner Field.

Is this true? Is there a putting green in the locker room?

By Arkansas Hillbilly

March 2, 2007 4:11 PM | Link to this

Or Tomahawkin’,

I better not find a foam tomahawk or two empty keg cups at my house when I get home…. =-)

By woogidy

March 2, 2007 4:15 PM | Link to this

Can’t get enough of how young Lillibridge looks. Click on this. It is worth it!

By RC

March 2, 2007 4:20 PM | Link to this

TennPaul: There is indeed a putting green in the locker room. Got to take a locker room tour during winter fan fest…the wallpaper around it is a picture of one of the greens at Augusta National, I think the 18th.

By Braves fan 202

March 2, 2007 4:25 PM | Link to this

Man i wish i couldve seen the game, its ok i taped it and ill see it later. Sounds like they’re startin off good

By ncscoots

March 2, 2007 4:28 PM | Link to this

Oh, man, just looked at the box…how can any self-respecting GM have a pitcher named “Sharpless”? LOL

I’m betting he has intangibles! Ha! :-)

By N8

March 2, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this

woogidy

Nice link. Last time I checked the official site, his photo wasn’t up yet. Thanx.

btw: I loved him in “Home Alone”! LOL!

Good god, he looks like he’s 11.

By Carroll

March 2, 2007 4:50 PM | Link to this

Lew: If Koufax made you look sick, then Maddux made you look plain stupid.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 4:54 PM | Link to this

AstoriaMetsFan, you said it best on Koufax at 3:22. Devastating stuff, heat and a knee-buckling curve, and could absolutely paint the corners. None better. Ever.

Yes, Lillibridge will be carded until he’s 45. Or older.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 4:57 PM | Link to this

And don’t stress over Gonzalez, folks. It was his first outing since AUGUST, remember, because he missed the last five weeks with elbow tendinitis.

he said that’s all he was thinking about today, and was greatly relieved that it felt great. he’s had no problems with it all spring, but wanted to pitch in game conditions for that next test.

he’ll be fine, i’d bet. Also, after the game, Wickman offered unsolicited a comment about how he’ll be happy setting up or closing, said when the bell rings he hopes he’s closing, but if not, he don’t mind setting up at all.

Sounds to me like he’s thought about it or talked about it, or just knows it’s possible. I still expect him to break camp as the closer, but who knows what could happen by summer.

By Keith

March 2, 2007 4:59 PM | Link to this

I read somewhere that Koufax tipped all his pitches. So, the majority of batters knew what was coming and were STILL helpless. That is good stuff.

By Bobby Dews

March 2, 2007 5:06 PM | Link to this

DOB, Way to not take any $hit from the guys at ESPN that came into the press box and tried to open the windows. You’re a unique rebel!

By Head Coach

March 2, 2007 5:06 PM | Link to this

Watching the fifth inning and Francoeur was irritating and exhilarating all at once. He , as usual swings like a madman at a first pitch off speed offering and misses by a mile. Then the second pitch is a fastball and he pounds it over the fence in left and a fan makes a nice barehanded catch. Francoeur is going to drive me crazy all season. Good thing Lillibridge isn’t going to make the team yet , can you imagine him trying to get past security at every big league park ? Hey I’m a player , I am , really. Look at my ID ! Yea right kid , your going straight back to your mommy !

By N8

March 2, 2007 5:10 PM | Link to this

WOW.

Wickman just continues to impress me both on and OFF the field, DOB.

Seems like a true class act, team guy.

Simply AMAZING in this day and age of “me first” athletes.

DOB

Do you personally know Woody Paige? I’m watching “Around the Horn” on ESPN, and I really get a kick out of his humor and “energy”. Seems like a character, if you ask me.

By Catfish

March 2, 2007 5:10 PM | Link to this

DOB: Listening to Buck and Kincade here on 680 Fan. Buck said you got a little “testy” in the press box when an ESPN-type came in before the game opening windows. Said you were hard at work with papers spread out that would blow all over the pb if he opened the windows. The ESPN guy responded to your complaint with the explanation: “That’s why God gave you elbows”. Buck said you were ready to “throw down” and get after him :>)

Both gave you a big compliment - said you were the hardest working guy down there and you were the first thing they checked daily during baseball season.

‘fish

By tim- braves lifer

March 2, 2007 5:11 PM | Link to this

watched the game today and it was nice to see Francoeur go deep. He and Mcann may have to share the nl mvp! a guy can dream!

By Wayne in UT

March 2, 2007 5:35 PM | Link to this

Compare Wickman to Baez:

The Ballad of Danys

Last year we needed some pitchin’ Went to the Dodgers a itchin’ We sent them a decent young feller Got one we thought might be better. When he left here last fall, Said he wanted the ball, Now he sits in the nineth a twitchin’.

Now I gotta write one for Wicky….

By Jared

March 2, 2007 5:55 PM | Link to this

The homerun Gonzalez gave up looked like it wouldn’t have even reached the warning track at Turner Field. I think Gonzalez will be the Braves best relief pitcher in 2007, above both Wickman and Soriano.

I thought O’Brein wasn’t suppose to be on the radio until after 6:00.

By Robert

March 2, 2007 6:31 PM | Link to this

“Actually, take a look at Koufax stats in his final four seasons. Nothing comparable in the modern era, and nothing ever will be.”

If you look at ERA vs league ERA, then Pedro 1997-2000 actually outdoes Koufax by quite a ways, and Maddux 1992-1998 equals him but goes almost twice as long

Not to say Koufax’s 4 year run wasnt awesome

Maddux’s 94 and 95 rank up in the top 12 or so all-time years. The travesty of the strike was that the peak years of one of the best pitchers of all time were not truly complete

Best season all-time still has to be Gibson in 1968. 34 starts, 28 complete games 304.2 innings, 1.12 ERA. And the dude LOST 9 games on a WS team. That’s dominance. Different game before the mound change, but dominence

By MS

March 2, 2007 6:43 PM | Link to this

Go DOB! I love how you got on Kinkade for dogging Andruw.

By N8

March 2, 2007 6:51 PM | Link to this

DOB when you are on the radio, can one access that online?

What station? How often are you on?

By Scott

March 2, 2007 7:05 PM | Link to this

Braves looked really good today, especially Smoltz who was NASTY and Francouer looked good too.

I have a question though, how come James Jurries isn’t in the running for the first base job? He’s looked good for a couple of years in the minors now and should get a shot.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 7:10 PM | Link to this

Everyone can make up their own minds on who is better between Maddux and Koufax, but I wanted to quantify this for those of you who never saw Koufax pitch. In the five years between 1962-66, Koufax went 14-7, 25-5, 19-5, 26-8, and 27-9. His ERA’s over those five seasons were 2.54 (3.63), 1.88 (3.02), 1.74 (3.25), 2.04 (3.26), and 1.73 (3.28). League ERA’s are in parenthesis. He struck out 1454 batters in these five years!!! This includes season totals of 216, 306, 223, 382, and 317. He struck out over 300 three times people. One year he came within striking range of 400 K!!!! In this time he walked only 316 batters. That’s almost a 5 to 1 K/BB over five years. He had 110 complete games during this time and had 33 shutouts. He had four no hitters in these five years (none in 1962), including a perfect game against the Cubs. Now you can argue however you want about who is or is not better, but I seriously doubt ANYONE was this totally dominant during a similar stretch.

By tim

March 2, 2007 7:12 PM | Link to this

Dave-Thanks for the food suggestions the other day, we ended up driving into Winter Park to an old neighborhood funky place called Dandelion Cafe..Good respite from the corporate crap around here…Really enjoyed the games the last 3 days too….So Wickman is trimmed down? Then of course he shall become Slim Wickman…

By Lew

March 2, 2007 7:26 PM | Link to this

To add just a bit more. In those five years, Koufax was 111-34. That’s an average of 22 wins a year. During this time, he was also fighting progressive arthritic degeneration in his pitching elbow and was forced to retire after a 27 win season. Also, during these years, his innings pitched were 184, 311, 223, 335, and 323. No one comes vaguely close to 300 IP anymore. Throwing 200 is considered a benchmark. Thank you. That’s all. Talk among yourselves.

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 7:43 PM | Link to this

1962-66 3.20+ League ERAs. What a time that was. I doubt we’ll ever see League ERAs that low for that long of time. All that time Koufax kept his ERA a little over a run below the league average. He was good no doubt.

On December 3, 1968, the Baseball Rules Committee voted to lower the height of the pitching mound from fifteen to ten inches and to require that all pitching mounds be sloped gradually so that pitchers will not appear to be firing from a steep cliff to the batter below. The pitcher has more leverage on a higher mound while the greater angle produced from the higher mound makes it more difficult to hit the ball squarely.
Like you said Lew, comparing eras… Maddux was never a strike out pitcher. That’s why he could throw 70 pitch games.

By StingerSplash

March 2, 2007 7:44 PM | Link to this

Trent Reznor upset (initially) that the Man was going to cover his song? Reznor can’t carry John Cash’s guitar strap. You, sir, are no Mr. Cash. By the way - watching baseball in the sunshine on a Friday afternoon? I’m jealous.

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 7:47 PM | Link to this

No one comes vaguely close to 300 IP anymore. Throwing 200 is considered a benchmark.
Lew, I think this has more to do with management and owner protection of investment than anything else. From what I hear, a lot of these guys would love to stay out there and pitch as long as they could. Livan Hernandez throws forever when he’s allowed. But this is a different time. Koufax wasn’t an 18 million dollar a year investment. But again, comparing eras…

By Wayne in UT

March 2, 2007 7:49 PM | Link to this

DOB I have been curious about an older Cuban prospect named Francisley Bueno. He is 25-26 years old and supposedly a flame throwing lefty starter. I was wondering if this player being older might be more seasoned, and possibly on the radar screen.

Thanks for any info….

By Lew

March 2, 2007 7:53 PM | Link to this

TenPaul-Like I said, it was a pitching era. There were a bunch of other greats which helped keep that league ERA down. Hell, Drysdale was only a number two starter. Gibson, Marichal, Fergie Jenkins (who repeatedly won 20 at Wrigley), Gaylord Perry, Seaver-there were so many great pitchers. When Maddux did his 1.54 ERA, I would almost bet no one came vaguely close. In the 60’s there were people like Gibby going one year with a 1.10 ERA. It was unbelievable by today’s standards. You’re likely right-it won’t happen again soon-if ever.

By N8

March 2, 2007 8:00 PM | Link to this

Lew cool stats on Koufax.

I’m not sure ANYBODY can argue with how dominant that he was during that stretch. But I was gonna try. LOL!

I compared the numbers of Koufax from 62-66 to Maddux of 92-96.

Strangely they are incredibly similar. The majority of the difference in the “numbers” between the two, can be explained by the ammounts of starts that Koufax (in the day of the 4 man rotations), had each season vs. Maddux and the 5 man rottaions of recent memory.

Though even when all the numbers are calculated and “pro-rated” as though Maddux had the same opportunity to start that many games.

Here is what I came up with.

Koufax from 1962-1966:

He started 176 games over those 5 years. (which happens to average out to 35.5 starts per year) He had 111 wins (22.2 per year). But more importantly it calculated out to .63 wins per start.

He had 1377 IP with 298 ER = an ERA of 1.94 over those 5 years.

He had 1444 K’s and 316 BB’s which comes out to .218 BB for every K.

Maddux from 1992-1996

He started 159 games (which averages out to 31.8 starts per year). He won 90 games (averaging 18 wins per year). Which calculates out to .56 wins per start.

*So had maddux had the same ammount of starts as Koufax in his 5 year stretch, he “could have” gained about 98 wins at his rate of .56 wins per start - STILL well below Koufax)

He had 1191 IP with 321 ER = an ERA of 2.42. (Also considerably HIGHER than Koufax’s 1.94 ERA during his compared period)

He had 905 K’s and 204 BB which comes out to .225 BB for every K (not much worse of a ratio than Koufax)

In fact one could argue that, while Maddux didn’t have Strikeout “stuff”, maybe he would’ve had more K’s had he pitched with before the mound was lowered. I know history says that the mound difference really only helped power pitchers. But Maddux made PLENTY of people swing and miss at his changeup, so who knows how many K’s he would’ve ammassed with the mound up higher.

Then again, the same arguement could be made for Clemens, Pedro and The Big Unit. I’m willing to just conceed that Maddux was NEVER cut out to be a strikeout pitcher. He flat out loses in that category in a head to head comparison with Koufax.

So in conclusion, I didn’t come up with any numbers to tell me that Maddux’s 5 year stretch was better than Koufax’s was. But one would be hard pressed to say it was that much worse.

I still tend to give Maddux (and today’s pitchers) a little more of the benefit of the doubt, due to the badboxes they play in. Not to mention the steroids and amphetimines (which of course could also have been aiding the pitchers - so the “drugs” could be considered a wash by many).

Again, all I was doing was “rooting” and standing by a guy that I watched for almost his entire career vs. a guy that I NEVER saw pitch.

All this comparison has really done, is make me wish I could’ve seen Koufax pitch. Pretty incredible numbers……no matter what era we’re talking about.

But my guess is, that when my kids are looking over “old stats” they may be just as impressed with Greg Maddux’s career as well.

To be honest, MLB will probably NEVER have another pitcher do what EITHER of these guys did for that long.

AMAZING.

(sigh) THANK GOD spring is here! LOL!

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 8:03 PM | Link to this

Scott, James Jurries was horrendous last year after his great spring training. He hit .205 with eight home runs, 27 RBIs, 34 walks and 106 _ yes, 106 _ strikeouts in 307 at-bats in Triple-A and was dropped from the 40-man roster.

Why on earth would he be a candidate for the 1B job over Scott Thorman and Craig Wilson? Jurries wasn’t even invited to camp. He was brought over today for a game because they needed a second first baseman, since they don’t have one besides Wilson, who’s a lF/1B and pinch-hitter…

Tim, I didn’t know you were considering going all the way over to that side of town. Winter Park and parts of downtown Orlando are quite cool. Nothing like this area out here at all. Those are actual real places with something other than mid-priced restaurant chains and buildings that are more than 20 years old. I like that area a lot.

Slim Wickman … very good. He’s a long way from being Slim Wickman, but I like it.

By N8

March 2, 2007 8:08 PM | Link to this

Lew

you said:

“When Maddux did his 1.54 ERA, I would almost bet no one came vaguely close.”

I think THAT is what makes what Maddux (and Clemens, Pedro and Randy…hell EVEN Glavine), so impressive.

Again, not saying it’s MORE impressive (when comparing the pure numbers) than what Koufax did. But maybe more rare.

Thus making it just as, if not MORE impressive by comparison to the rest of the league.

Either way. It’s just fun talkin baseball, isn’t it?

I think of ALL the records that are out there, the one that is MOST impressive to me, that I think will NEVER, EVER be broken (from a pitching standpoint), is Hersheiser’s 59 scoreless IP streak.

MAYBE a relief pitcher might come close, but not a chance in hell of a Starter EVER doing that again, IMO. Simply amazing.

By N8

March 2, 2007 8:08 PM | Link to this

Lew

you said:

“When Maddux did his 1.54 ERA, I would almost bet no one came vaguely close.”

I think THAT is what makes what Maddux (and Clemens, Pedro and Randy…hell EVEN Glavine), so impressive.

Again, not saying it’s MORE impressive (when comparing the pure numbers) than what Koufax did. But maybe more rare.

Thus making it just as, if not MORE impressive by comparison to the rest of the league.

Either way. It’s just fun talkin baseball, isn’t it?

I think of ALL the records that are out there, the one that is MOST impressive to me, that I think will NEVER, EVER be broken (from a pitching standpoint), is Hersheiser’s 59 scoreless IP streak.

MAYBE a relief pitcher might come close, but not a chance in hell of a Starter EVER doing that again, IMO. Simply amazing.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 8:08 PM | Link to this

Wayne, that Cuban pitcher isn’t on the radar yet, and not in camp. He was 1-7 with a 3.59 in 17 games (14 starts) at Mississip, a solid ERA and 84 K in 80-1/3 innings, but also gave up 10 homers. Only 19 walks.

By Honey

March 2, 2007 8:32 PM | Link to this

Lew, Paul,

MadDog was good, I’ll give you that … but Sanford Braun was a GreenBay Packer while Greg was but a Brave!

Did you ever try to get tickets when Sandy was pitching … I did. He packed them in wherever he went!

It’s impossible to compare pitchers … people are always talking about matchups … Pitcher A against Pitcher B … but I always thought it was Pitcher A against Pitcher B’s team … and Pitcher B against Pitcher A’s team.

The fact that Sanford threw all those shutouts against us didn’t mean he was any good … just that our guys couldn’t hit for squat!

By Norm

March 2, 2007 10:41 PM | Link to this

We hav Willy Aybar, If you want to get him back leave some pie and some barbekew in a basskit upside the stands at Turner Feele.

W e r m s

By Jared

March 2, 2007 10:42 PM | Link to this

Did the blog and the AJC go down for a while or was it just me?

By ssiscribe

March 2, 2007 10:47 PM | Link to this

Good evening to all, although not that great here in Scribe-ville. Didn’t go to the Thrashers game. Didn’t realize no TV for Thrashers (thank goodness for listening on the Net). Wife didn’t come home at lunch and hit the VCR for me (gotta get TIVO up in here).

But alas, perspective shakes all of us. Compared to the folks in southeast Alabama or southwest Georgia, or the folks associated with the bus crash this morning off the Northside Drive exit ramp, I don’t have a damn thing to complain about, folks.

Now, baseball. Great news first of all on Smoltz, his pitch count and number of strikes. Sounds like he threw it pretty well. Also, good news on Gonzalez, the two-run homer notwithstanding. Dude hadn’t pitched in six months or so. Don’t care about the linescore this early. Good to see Big Wick out there doing his thing, too, and Frenchy going yard.

James Jurries: MVP in a season of Marchs. Otherwise, just a guy who can get it done amid the seabreezes of Florida, but little more.

Three games, three wins (although the Tech game doesn’t count in the standings). So far, so good, indeed.

And I’ll weigh in briefly on the debate du jour: I watched Maddux pitched throughout his stretch of ultra-greatness. I was born after Koufax retired. However, from what I’ve read and people who watched Koufax pitch, I think I’d go with Sandy K. over Doggy. Koufax was unbelievably brilliant for a four-year stretch.

Gotta love LaRoche. Man, I miss that guy, but I’m glad the trade happened. I hope dude goes .300-35-115 up there, though, and I hope he gets a loud, long standing O when the Bucs make their first visit to the A.

OK, gotta run. To all of you, a great evening. Please keep the folks involved in the storms and the bus crash in your thoughts and prayers. We’re all so, so very lucky to have what it is we have, and we’re lucky to have the Braves and this forum in which to share our passion — baseball. Take care out there and enjoy your weekend.

The Scribe abides. Peace and good night.

—30—

By gotigers72

March 2, 2007 10:51 PM | Link to this

Impressed with Smoltz, Willie Harris and Andruw. Andruw looks in the best shape he’s been in years, and the throw he made to cut down the runner at home was a thing of beauty.

The only thing that didn’t impress me was Escobar not being able to sacrifice in the 9th and then lining into a double play. If he sacrifices, game over. I know he hit a rope, and I know poor baserunning by Lillibridge was part of the reason for the DP, but it wouldn’t have mattered had he sacrificed. Getting sacrifces down, moving runners over and the bullpen must all improve if the Braves are to have a shot. I don’t know how many games the Braves lost, if any, due to not doing the fundamentals right LATE IN GAMES, but they were pi** poor at it at times.

With Sanchez. LaRoche and Bay in the middle of the lineup, and that good young pitching staff they have, the Pirates could move up to 3rd in their division this year. What could keep them from doing so is their bullpen being much weaker with Gonzalez gone.

By gotigers72

March 2, 2007 10:57 PM | Link to this

As for Koufax, i saw Pete rose interviewed once, and he was asked who the best pitcher he ever faced was, and he said hands down it was Koufax. Comes from a pretty fair country hitter and someone that saw a lot of pitchers during his time, even though he was a degenerate.

By Lew

March 2, 2007 11:03 PM | Link to this

Well y’all-It’s like I said earlier. If I had to pick my all-time starting staff, I think Maddux, Koufax, Gibson, Marichal (that leg kick makes Dontrelle’s anemic) and chose one from Clemens, Pedro Randy Johnson or whomever. After your first three, nobody will beat you, anyway. Maybe for the playoffs, I’d like Smoltz in there somewhere, too.

By NoOrdinaryRabbit

March 2, 2007 11:15 PM | Link to this

Wow I found the video to *Hurt on YouTube and it is awesome! Well worth checking out.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 11:18 PM | Link to this

OK, I’ll bite:

No particular order: Walter Johnson (can’t deny the stats), Koufax, Gibson, Clemens, Maddux.

Close behind: Tom Seaver, Cy Young, Pedro Martinez, Steve Carlton, Spahn.

Just outside my top 10: Nolan Ryan, Satchel Paige, Randy Johnson.

Probably should have Christy Mathewson in top 10, but I’m going with only the greatest of the bygone era, “Big Train” Walter Johnson, whose stats are too great to downplay as purely the product of a different time. He was so much better than any other of his time, he belongs.

By TennesseePaul

March 2, 2007 11:20 PM | Link to this

I would like to know what our modern day guys could do with that extra 5 inches on the mound. That’s such a serious advantage for a pitcher.

Another good one who set some serious standards has this career line…
W L ERA CG SHO K BB
511 316 2.63 749 76 2803 1217
From 1904 to 1908 He pitched 162 complete games. 1630.2 innings. 2.81 ERA. And 23 Shutouts. He walked 137 batters that whole time which averages out to 27 a season to go with his average 326 innings a season. All this was done after 15 seasons in the majors. He also pitched a no hitter during that time and set the major league mark for consecutive innings without allowing a hit, 24.

But again, it’s comparing eras. I never saw Cy pitch, but his numbers are simply baffling. Maddux just beat one of his records a few years ago. Nobody is ever going to touch his complete games. Much less his wins or losses.

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 11:22 PM | Link to this

Jared, yes, the blog and the entire rest of the ajc.com went down.

Probably because we had more page hits than any day in our brief online history, and three biggest hours ever this morning because of the bus crash.

By ElbravoX

March 2, 2007 11:33 PM | Link to this

First team to win on ESPN spring games will be the same to win the last playoffs game on FOX, baby!

By Jared

March 2, 2007 11:42 PM | Link to this

Thanks David O’Brein. I was wondering.

Was the spiderman/spider web tattoo on Andruw Jones’ arm new or has that always been there?

By David O'Brien

March 2, 2007 11:51 PM | Link to this

New. And he said it’s not finished; it was hurting too much so he stopped before it was done, though it looks done.

By mr baseball

March 2, 2007 11:58 PM | Link to this

The Bobby Cox test for 2007: How will he handle the bullpen in late inning situations? Will he manage as he usually does and stick to a pattern — Soriano 7th, Gonzalez 8th, Wickman 9th? Or will he shock us and actually use some insight and logic?

Braves are leading the Phillies 4-2 after 6 innings and Cox goes to the bullpen with the top of the order coming up (Rollins, whoever, Utley, Howard). Does he use McBride in the 7th instead of one of the “Big 3”? Does he send in Soriano against the lefties because Soriano is his 7th inning pitcher? Does he go to Gonzalez, followed by Soriano & Wickman, hoping to get through the lineup before the stud hitters come up again in the 9th?

The logical move in this instance would be McBride in the 7th, followed by Soriano against the RH hitters and Wickman or Gonzalez in the 9th, depending on where the Phillies are in the lineup. This may sound nitpicky, but these are the decisions that determine plenty of games during the season, as well as deciding the fate of a lot of post-season series.

How many games have the Braves lost over the years, especially in the playoffs, because the wrong reliever was facing a hitter he should not have been facing in that situation?

For a change, the GM has given Cox a bullpen that should protect a hefty percentage of late inning leads. Good to see that Wickman will not have a problem in working in a set-up role. Will Cox have the sense to mix and match his multiple closers depending on the situation, or will he do whatever requires the least amount of strategic thinking?

Maybe he’ll surprise us this year.

By No Chop Zone

March 3, 2007 12:00 AM | Link to this

LEW, you left out Seaver. He played on some pretty bad teams but must be considered one the the best.

By N8

March 3, 2007 12:03 AM | Link to this

Can’t argue with that list DOB.

IMO, Clemens has had the more impressive overall career compared to Maddux, but it’s hard not being partial to Greg, watching so much of his career so closely.

That being said, I still think, in the last 20 years or so, what Maddux did over the 94-95 seasons, is SILLY good, even with the strike shortening both seasons. My guess, with how “on” he was those two years, had they NOT been shortened by the strike, they would’ve ended up being that much MORE impressive.

Good night all, we rented Departed tonight, buddy of mine (whom I share the same movie tastes), rented it yesterday and said it INSTANTLY went into his top 10. So I figured I better check it out.

L8R

By N8

March 3, 2007 12:11 AM | Link to this

mr baseball

As I stated earlier today in the blog.

IMO, until McBride shows he can get righties out consistantly, he’ll ONLY be used (or should be only used) against lefties. Somebody like Moylan, Paranto or Boyer, may be better options for “full inning” pitchers.

That’s not to say with hard work and time, McBride won’t turn into an overall good reliever vs. BOTH lefties and righties.

But, I had to laugh when I saw the other day that Bobby had said he might be an option for the rotation since he (McBride) wants to start. That may work if he got to pitch against the 1997 Braves (Blauser, Lopez and Andruw were the ONLY pure Right handed hitters in the everyday lineup).

Anyhow. I’m sure Bobby we’ll manage the bullpen just fine.

By No Chop Zone

March 3, 2007 12:27 AM | Link to this

In fact…..Seaver was better than maddox. Seaver has a better lifetime ERA (2.86 vs 3.08) more strikeouts (3640 vs 3169) more shutout (61 vs 35) complete games (231 vs 108) and he played for teams that were not as good …..NO DOUBT ABOUT IT

By flbravesgirl

March 3, 2007 12:32 AM | Link to this

Thatta boy, DOB! Don’t let those ESPN guys give you a hard time!

Actually they did a pretty good job on the broadcast. I cringed when I saw Phillips there but he managed not to annoy me and Kruk & Thorne were fairly entertaining.

So LaRoche forgot his jersey & sunglasses? That boy needs to hire a personal assistant to follow him around with all the stuff he needs, lol. I’m gonna miss him.

First impressions: The hats are still ugly. Smoltz looks ready for Opening Day. Andruw looked a lot thinner to me. Wickman, while not on Andruw’s diet plan, does appear a little trimmer around the middle. I’m siding with Mrs. Jones, facial hair just doesn’t work on Chipper. Nice to see Bobby Dews in the dugout. Lillibridge… oh my goodness, is he 12? How often do y’all think he gets mistaken for a batboy?

By hk

March 3, 2007 12:44 AM | Link to this

flbravesgirl ..

… I agree on the facial hair … this is the most ever for him …

By Lew

March 3, 2007 1:32 AM | Link to this

NoChopZone-You’re right, but I did mention him earlier-a couple of times. He was one of the best.

By Gil in Mechanicsville

March 3, 2007 1:35 AM | Link to this

Great pitchers are just that. Once in a life time. It is why we must enjoy them while we can because we know not when they will come again.

Great game today. Smoltz looked sharp in his two innings.

By Luke, journalist

March 3, 2007 2:51 AM | Link to this

And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:

Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.

The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.

I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes to heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.

I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for everyone that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 3:15 AM | Link to this

HK, for a moment, I thought you were referring to Lillibridge … if he doesn’t make the team and is lazy he could always get work as the “after” in shaving commercials.

By ssiscribe

March 3, 2007 7:40 AM | Link to this

Good morning from the southern rim of the A. Coffee in the cup, cartoons on the tube, kids and the cat playing, wife still snoozing. A nice morning, after a tough day yesterday. Happy weekend and how about those undefeated, first-place Braves!

That’s always great to say, no matter the month or circumstance.

OK, I’ll take my shot at the debate from last night/this morning, too:

My first rotation, in no order: Koufax, Maddux, Cy Young (511 wins speaks for itself), Clemens, Warren Spahn (need another lefty in there).

Second rotation, again in no order: Gibson (he’s the first to go on the first five), Walter Johnson, Mathewson, Seaver, Ryan.

I won’t run through the numbers and the comparison between Maddux and Koufax — who I didn’t see pitch in person — because it’s already been very well done above by N8 and Lew and others.

But for a short period of time, Koufax was as dominant as any pitcher in history. Maddux was right there, but as I said last night, from what I’ve been told and what I’ve read, I’d take Koufax. It’s a darn shame his arm troubles cut his career so short; no telling what he’d been able to do if he could’ve pitched into the ’70s. As for Doggy, I still say one of the greatest pitched games I ever saw in person was Maddux’s two-hitter in Game 1 of the ‘95 Series against Cleveland.

For what it’s worth, I think Nolan Ryan is one of the most amazing pitchers ever. I know he’s a little low on my list, but to pitch as well as he did, and throw as hard as he did, for as long as he did, is simply incredible to me. And, he signed my glove one hot summer afternoon at the old stadium (along with Jose Cruz Sr. and Alan Ashby). Always kinda liked the Stros after that, even if those unis were hard on the eyes.

When you think about it, folks, we saw some great, great players come through Atlanta in the early 1980s (albeit most wearing the other team’s jersey). Willie McCovey, right before he retired early in ‘80. Willie Stargell. Ryan. Seaver. Carlton. Rose. Sutton. Paul Molitor (huh, you say? The Brewers played an exhibition game at the old stadium against the Braves in August 1981, after the strike was settled, giving us NL folks long before the days of interleague play a chance to see Molitor, Cecil Cooper, Robin Yount, etc., the year before Harvey’s Wallbangers went to the World Series … and to think, three wins for the Braves the next October against the Cards, and that exhibition game would’ve been a World Series preview).

Now that’s one long parenthesis. At least it’s not a triple parenthesis!

Enough for now. Again, excellent job by Smoltz yesterday, and even better hearing his comments. If he can get that changeup working, I honestly think he could win 20 with the revamped bullpen and continued good health.

And a thought to close: Remember all the angst and teeth-nashing when Smoltz returned to the rotation for the 2005 season, starting a season in which he turned 38 after three years in the bullpen? Now, he’ll be 40 this season, he’s thrown 461.2 innings the past two seasons and won 30 games, after combining for 144 saves the previous three seasons in the bullpen.

When this debate is held 10 years or 20 years from now, I think Smoltz’s name probably will enter into the equation the same way Ryan’s does. While Smoltz’s numbers aren’t like Ryan’s numbers, what he’s accomplishing at his age — especially after the number of surgeries he’s had — is something special indeed.

The Scribe abides.

—30—

By ssiscribe

March 3, 2007 8:06 AM | Link to this

Oh, one more thing: DOB, don’t take any crap from those glitzy TV folks. Everybody knows real journalism starts with scribes! Those TV hams are just in it for the bright lights. It’s the ink-stained folks who bring the real news.

Peace.

—30—

By David O'Brien

March 3, 2007 8:33 AM | Link to this

N8, the Departed is definitely one of Scorsese’s best, as we’ve discussed here and seem to generally agree upon.

And I agree with you on McBride and lefty-righty thing

By Heath Mason

March 3, 2007 9:18 AM | Link to this

Keep up the good work…I have really enjoyed the spring training coverage thus far and can’t wait for the season to start.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 9:21 AM | Link to this

Luke, Journalist

Interesting parable recounted by the Gentile physician turned journalist … I’ve often pondered “were the publican to proffer the parable would he not then become the Pharisee?”

SSIScribe, My top 5 are in your top 10 … I first considered young George Herman until I remembered that he had Babe Ruth as his designated hitter which gave him an unfair advantage.

Seriously, I wonder who would have been on your top 10 “fiercest competitor” list?

By Lew

March 3, 2007 10:01 AM | Link to this

Bob- Sometimes it’s just hard to tell the dancer from the dance.

By Jim

March 3, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this

Lew, How can you not consider Warren Spahn as one of your all-time starters? He won 20 games in 13 different seasons in three decades. (He did not win his first MLB game until age 26 due to WWII). Only 14 other pitchers since WWII have won 20 games 5 or more times (15 if you include Feller who did it before and after WWII). That list does not include Koufax, Maddux, or Pedro. He led the league in wins, Ks, ERA, IPs, and shutouts multiple times. His last dominant year coincided with Koufax’s first. In 1963, at age 42 he went 23-7 with 7 shutouts and an ERA of 2.60. That was also the year of his memorable 16 inning 1-0 duel with Marichal, that he lost when Mays hit his 201st pitch of the night for an HR. For a short span or a single game I would go with Kuofax, but for consistency over a long career, you have to choose Spahn.

By Ben

March 3, 2007 10:22 AM | Link to this

DOB- I heard about you and the ESPN guy in the booth. You should have knocked him out. Keep up the good work!

By Head Coach

March 3, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this

I’m digging it Scribe. Smoltz would have won 22 last season if not for that dang bullpen(Reitsma , I despise you). If Smoltzy pitches the same in 07 he could win 25. Here is to those 3-0 undefeated Braves. Better crow while we can ,right ?

By eric the elder

March 3, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this

Bob, journalist, I’ll throw in a “fiercest competitor” name, even though he would be on no one’s top 10. That would be Early Wynn of the Clevelnad Indians. Burly Early.

His pet peeve was a batter who hit one through the mound area. Anyone who did that should count on getting a fast ball at his ear lobe the next time up. I’ll be anxious to see Soriano’s “glare,” but Wynn’s would melt iron.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this

Jim-I had to leave someone worthy off of the list. Include him on yours and I won’t argue with you. Or Cy Young, Or Seaver. Or Mathewson, etc., etc.. Dude, It’s only a five man rotation. I really think I could win with the one I picked.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 10:36 AM | Link to this

Lew, I too have have Spahnie, though not for his wisdom in continuing to play those last few years.

Well said, but it may have someting to do with whom you’re dancing and the tune being played.

Did you see and understand my little Bobby comments?

By eric the elder

March 3, 2007 10:39 AM | Link to this

Jim, interesting that you mention Bob Feller, another case of a “would-have” had he not spent so long in WWII.

I was the head of an independent school in the Cleveland suburbs, and Feller lived nearby. We had a 300-acre campus with the largest barn in Ohio. For some reason, Feller arranged to store some of his memorabilia in that barn. I had several occasions to talk with him, and the memory of sitting on a bale of straw and talking baseball with Bob Feller is a fan’s dream.

He was, and still is, kind of a snarly guy - - an incurable conservative, highly opinionated, and downright nasty at times. He sounds like Bob Dole with that midwest twang. If he were asked to make a top 10 list, I have no doubt he would put himself on it.

BTW, the barn burned to the ground in the 1970s, a fire that could be seen for miles. Feller’s memorabilia were lost.

By ssiscribe

March 3, 2007 10:49 AM | Link to this

Wow, Rocket Bob Feller. I almost brought his name up when mentioning Spahn earlier this morning. Just imagine what his numbers, Spahn’s, Ted Williams’, etc., numbers would’ve been if not for World War II.

I just hooked myself up with Gameday Audio, so I’m good to go. Realized midway through the Thrashers’ game last night that you can listen to NHL games for free, either home or away audio. Sat and listened to Kamal through the wi-fi hookup on the laptop. Nice.

Looking forward to hearing the Bravos on Monday, and also surfing around and checking out some of the other games, Wainwright’s starts for the Cards, see what the Mets, Dodgers and BoSox are doing, etc. and so forth.

Baseball, so glad to have you back. Like a long, lost friend who shows up this time each year, walking through the door and grabbing that familiar barstool as the calendar flips to March.

Selah.

—30—

By Lew

March 3, 2007 10:52 AM | Link to this

Bob-Yes, the participants in the Passion Play and it’s events do matter, I suppose. I’ve often wondered whether we live in a metapysical prison camp or an obstacle course/training camp. Ever the cynic, aren’t I. Missed the Little Bobby comments. I still think I could win with my pitchers. They can’t all make the team now, can they. Someone’s going to feel left out. I still think Koufax was the best. If only he wasn’t arthritic. I think that’s the one aspect of his career that really makes him great. If he had to retire after a 27 win season, it makes you wonder how much he really hurt winning 53 games his final two season. God help the NL if he had been healthy while winning all of those games.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this

Scribe-Let’s not forget that Ted did time in Korea, too. He got the double whammy.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 11:04 AM | Link to this

Well hello Elder Eric!!

Tis good to see you here! Not too sure you’re right about Wynn … he might just surprise you and be on a list or two or three or 300.

I think we’d find much more diversity among our respective lists than what we see the best rotation lists … Paige, Gibson and Dean would probably go on mine … maybe Ford and Wynn.

Another “fiercest competitor” list that could cause some controversy might be one of a team of the most intense competitors at each position.

By Tom

March 3, 2007 11:04 AM | Link to this

I’ll take Pedro’s 4 year stretch over any other pitcher in history.

Look at stats such as OBA, WHIP and opponent’s BA. Pedro’s stats are almost dead-even with Koufax.

Now factor in the bandboxes that Pedro pitched in vs. the caverns that Koufax pitched in, the higher mound vs. the lower mound, and the hitters today as opposed to “back in the day” (hitters breaking bats on homeruns today, weightlifting is practically mandatory now, and the supplements/steroids in today’s era…) and the stats become mindboggling for Pedro.

If for some reason you still hold lovingly onto your yesteryear pitchers, compare Pedro’s stats vs. the league average and do the same for any other pitcher in any other era. The discrepancies for Pedro are the greatest of all time.

By Matthew, tax collector

March 3, 2007 11:06 AM | Link to this

Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity…

By Norm

March 3, 2007 11:08 AM | Link to this

No one wants Aybar back, huh? Make it a peach pie and no barbekue and yew can have him back. I knew we shoulda got Willie Harrisc insted.

W e r m s

By Jim

March 3, 2007 11:12 AM | Link to this

Whitey Ford is another name that should be included for discussion. His winning percentage is still the best of all-time (neck & neck with Pedro). He did not have a big 20-win season before Ralph Houk became the manager becuase Stengel would hold him back to face the ace of contending teams, not giving him as many starts as other number 1 starters of the era. Sure, pitching for the Yankees from ‘51 - ‘64 helps anybody’s W-L record, but he had to do it the hard way. He was one of the toughest competitors in a big game that there ever was.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this

Lew methinks I emailed those to you earlier … but it was late at night and I with all that has transpired, I could be mistaken … check, and if you have them not, I’ll revisit my thoughts.

By Polly, Cosmetician & Stylist

March 3, 2007 11:17 AM | Link to this

Whither the strand that combs over? Verily, it is at the end of the lobe. Ye must comb from the side and over the top if ye desire homily. smote the publican. the jurries is still out.

By ssiscribe

March 3, 2007 11:18 AM | Link to this

Lew, right ya are. Teddy Ballgame missed, what, all or parts of six seasons (42-45, 51-52?) between WWII and Korea? Man, what insane type of numbers would he have put up without all those lost ABs.

Just been scrolling through some old video on the MLB site this morning, from Burdette’s Game 7 in 1957 to the D’Backs’ Game 7 win in 2001. Good stuff, indeed.

—30—

By Gil in Mechanicsville

March 3, 2007 11:20 AM | Link to this

Morning y’all, beautiful day. Wonderful discussion. I could not begin to pick an all time top five. Too many great ones from which to choose. However…

Rejoice Braves fans; you will be talking about Smoltz being one of the greatest in about 20 years, when you look at his body of work along side his emotional makeup plus the number of surgeries he has rehabbed from. That to me is the true measure of greatness. WOW!!!! How lucky we are to have this guy in a Braves uniform….

By Lew

March 3, 2007 11:43 AM | Link to this

Bob-Yes, I received them and understand. Tom-All I can tell you is that everyone here that saw Koufax pitch, also saw Pedro and Maddux pitch. Yes, they had great stretches. But Dude, If you never saw Koufax pitch, you just don’t know. He was the pitching equivalent of God for five years. With degenerative arthritis, no less, and still pitching over 300 innings, something Maddux and Pedro never came vaguely close to and while striking out over 300 per season. Dude, he almost had 400 K in one season. That’s more than sick. 53 wins his last two seasons, with his arm falling off. As far as facing substandard hitters, how about him facing Willie Mays, Hank Aaron, Willie McCovey, Bobby Bonds, Eddie Mathews, Frank Robinson, Richie Allen, Frank Howard, and, I believe, Mickey Mantle and Roger Maris in the series. Most of these players hit 500 HR when 30 a year was considered good. If you think there were no good hitters back then, you really need to get a clue. Pedro was good, but if you look uppitcher in the encyclopedia, Koufax’s pitcher is there.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 11:51 AM | Link to this

Let’s not forget that Koufax also faced Musial, Clemente, Rose, Joe Morgan, Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Yeah, there were no hitters in the 60’s. No steroids or bow flex machines, either.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this

Tax Collector,

If we could see ourselves as others see us, we’d probably spend less time looking in the mirror and more time with plastic surgeons … maybe that’s why blogging is so popular, where we can be appear as we would like to be rather than what we really are … but if lowly tax collectors can become exaulted apostles, then there’s hope for all of us.

By Tom

March 3, 2007 12:07 PM | Link to this

Ahhh, Lew. Sometimes you gotta let go. EVERYBODY seems to look back at their youth and feel that things were better back in their day. Of course, we look back and see so many hideous things that so many choose to forget.

How many Dominicans were in the majors back then? African-Americans? The pool of worldly talent now dwarfs the pool of talent back then. (yet another factor that is chosen to be forgotten)

He was aided by the 4 man rotation when you talk number of wins.

I’ll say this. If you believe that Koufax was the greatest of all time, then you need to say that Barry Bonds’ years are the greatest offensive years of all time. And Sosa/McGwire’s years are the greatest power surges of all time.

I didn’t say that Mantle and Aaron and all those other great players weren’t great. That’s absurd. I said you’re choosing to leave out all of the other factors in your argument.

You said, “Pedro was good.”

Sir, if you think Pedro’s 4 year span was “good”, then we need to stop with our debate right here.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 12:17 PM | Link to this

Eric, I’m headed out … but, you gotta admit that Feller always had nasty stuff!

Personally, I have no problem with highly opinionated, incurable conservatives who can be downright nasty at times … my wife’s married to one, or so she claims.

Did you burn down the barn?

By Robert

March 3, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this

It’s hard to compare pitchers from different eras. It is not quite fair to say one guy was more dominant than another because of K rates - the job is to get hitters out, not to strike hitters out

In terms of ERA differential, Maddux basically equalled Koufax but did it for 7 years vs 4. Pedro 1997-2000 blows both of em away in terms of ERA differential

Now you could argue that when ERAs were lower, it was harder to achieve ERA differential than when they are higher.

Bottom line - Koufax was a great pitcher and had a stretch comparable to almost any. Maddux did what he did near twice as long and has pitched twice the innings for his career

Koufax was great, but he wasnt Maddux

By Tom

March 3, 2007 12:26 PM | Link to this

Thank you, Robert.

Finally some sanity brought here.

By Metropolitan Man

March 3, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this

I know its spring training but did you guys like what you saw on the field the 1st couple of innings of yesterdays game???? I wasnt impressed with that Gonzalez cat, and the Jones boys looks like they left their enthusiasm in 2006. Its very early of course but comparing the 1st couple of spring training games, the right players on the the philthies and METS looks like they came to play ball this year. braves still playing the nonchalant role, fo figure!

By Ben

March 3, 2007 12:31 PM | Link to this

DOB- I heard about you and the ESPN guy in the booth. You should have knocked him out. Keep up the good work!

By Tom

March 3, 2007 12:35 PM | Link to this

Gonzalez didn’t blow a save last year, Metropolitan. Watch some baseball some time, buddy. The guy has serious stuff.

You’re making judgements based on the 1st couple of innings of spring training??? LOL

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 12:39 PM | Link to this

I told my players about steroids and that it was bad … bad for them … but worse for me, the team, and Baseball!

Some folks think that the worse thing about players using steriods is their getting caught!

Bye now …

By eric the elder

March 3, 2007 12:40 PM | Link to this

Bob , no I didn’t burn the barn. It was a landmark and quite a tragedy when it was lost.

Rapid Robert was taught by his father to throw a ball as hard as he could, and he practiced by throwing against the side of their barn in Iowa - - ironic, huh? It was during his days with the Indians that creative descriptions arose: He could throw a fastball through a car wash and the ball would come out dry. Etc.

I didn’t use “conservative” in a pejorative way, and I hope I didn’t offend. I was just struck with how in-your-face his conservatism was, and he often launched into tirades that were not related to the topic at hand. Seemed very defensive about things. I’m sure he would completely take over this who-was-the-best thread and tell us in no uncertain terms who the best were, starting with himself. A fascinating, complicated character, and a Cleveland hero for all time.

By Metropolitan Man

March 3, 2007 12:51 PM | Link to this

No Tom, I’ve been a baseball fan to long to base a couple of spring games off of anything let alone a few innings. But saving for Pittsburgh and then pitching for the braves is very similar dare I say to Dan Kolb experiemnt. Kolb did well for the brew crew, but when he was put in a divison race, he choked because he wasnt use to the pressure just like Gozalez, or Soriano for that matter. Hope you test your pen out in pressure situations before its too late. You guys better hope Wickmans fearlessness rubs off real fast on those division race deliquents. Or else you guys might end up crying, we might as well kept Sosa.

By hk

March 3, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this

Bob, Eric ..

… first game I ever saw, Fenway park, 1939, Feller pitching, I was in the right field bleachers, Ted Williams hit one out, at first looked like it was coming right at me … my hero ever since …

By Metropolitan Spam

March 3, 2007 12:55 PM | Link to this

Yooz guyz betta watch out fo da Metz awesum bullpen…Wez gotz Jorge Soza and Ambioriz Burgoz anz Guillermo Motaz…So whats if hez was busted fo steroids…Dats ok…My brudda Vinny uses dem allz da time….Go Metzz!!

By Lew

March 3, 2007 1:08 PM | Link to this

Tom-Dude-I was born some years AFTER Jackie Robinson joined the Dodgers. Like I said, I saw Mays, Aaron, Clemente and others. There was no lack of minority players in the 60’s. It’s certainly not a matter of letting go of my childhood. Dude, I revel In Andruw’s defense. I marvel at how good Griffey Jr. was before his injuries. I very much appreciate what MNaddux and Pedro have accomplished. I don’t necessarily think that baseball was better in those days. But you just have to realize that there were some awesome players back then. You talk of how good Pedro was pitching against all these pumped up players in their bandbox stadiums. You’re absolutely correct-these guys have been great. But, again, what of the players who hit more than 500 HR’s in those large stadiums with pitchers that league-wide were posting ERA’s that the BEST of last year would turn green over? There were some great hitters and pitchers in the 60’s-and the 20’s, 30’s, 40’s, 50’s, 70’s, 80’s, 90’s and beyond. I still contend Koufax was the best. Think of it-382 K and pitching over 300 innings with an arm that hurt like hell. It has nothing to do with how good anyone else is or how old I am and what I may or may not remember. Keep in mind, Dude, I saw the others you mentioned, also.

By eric the elder

March 3, 2007 1:09 PM | Link to this

I promise to drop this, but hk reminded me of a classic Fellerism. He recalled the time when Ted Williams approached him, and I thought Feller was going to say something about how great Williams was. Instead, Feller claimed that Williams said, “Bob, show me how you throw your curveball.”

I don’t believe that for a minute. For one thing, Williams thought that pitchers were stupid. But it is an example of of the strange Feller ego that always seemed to be in play.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 1:12 PM | Link to this

Tom-One last thing. You mention the four man rotation as if it was a boon to those of that era? Not so. Do you actually think the players of today could even concieve of 300 innings? 335? The pitchers today couldn’t do it even if they were given a chance. A four man rotation with no bullpen hardly made it easier on them. That’s a dumb argument. That’s basically all I have to say. Think what you will. I’ll do the same.

By Zac

March 3, 2007 1:15 PM | Link to this

Just finished watching Friday’s game, and am sorry if this was already tackled, but did anyone else seem concerned with Macay’s lack of velocity? I’m used to seeing him hit the 93-94 area, but didn’t see him touch 90 on the espn radar yesterday.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 1:22 PM | Link to this

Eric-I’m not sure. Knowing Williams, if he knew how Feller threw the curve he probably could have figured how to leave it in the seats.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 1:24 PM | Link to this

And let’s not forget Steve Carlton’s 27-10 season for a team that won 58 games. He pitched against the Big Red Machine-minorities and all.

By eric the elder

March 3, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this

Lew - - yikes! You could be right. Williams never exactly kept his own ego in check.

By ColoradoBravesFan

March 3, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this

Somebody provide some updates on the Braves game. How is Hudson doing? Does anyone know why the game is not on XM radio?

By alex

March 3, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this

so does anyone know how the game againt the astros is going so far?

By Lord Doom

March 3, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this

Doom is happy to be rid of the bastard. This year, it is a*******kicking time for the braves!!!!

By eric the elder

March 3, 2007 2:08 PM | Link to this

DOB, do you have enough influence to get someone to work the “Log” under the box scores of this site? That would give us some play-by-play that so many of us crave?

By Jim

March 3, 2007 2:13 PM | Link to this

How much is Wolf Camera paying y’all to add another # to the list of braves spring pix slideshows, when that “new” slideshow is the same one I saw a week ago?

By The Stranger

March 3, 2007 2:18 PM | Link to this

Rock Chalk

By braveheart

March 3, 2007 2:18 PM | Link to this

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/boxscore.jsp?gid=20070303houmlbatlmlb_1

By Carolina Lady

March 3, 2007 2:29 PM | Link to this

At the end of the 4th, it is tied 1-1. Pitchers:
Atlanta IP H R ER BB SO HR ERA
Hudson 2.0 2 0 0 0 1 0 0.00
Lerew 2.0 3 1 1 0 3 0 4.50

Here’s a link

By ColoradoBravesFan

March 3, 2007 2:33 PM | Link to this

Thanks Braveheart and CL…

By TN-MAN

March 3, 2007 2:33 PM | Link to this

Wheres DOB at today? No blog or updates, something must be going on.

By Ricardo

March 3, 2007 2:35 PM | Link to this

DOB -

I was listening to Buck Belue on after the game yesterday and he mentioned some ESPN guy was messin’ with the windows in the press box or something and the two of you went toe to toe for a second. You put him in his place or what?

By Bob Feller,conservative

March 3, 2007 2:46 PM | Link to this

Boys, you seem to think that Ted and I were great; Sandy and those other Fellers too!

I admit that you are right!

But fair is fair; would you have us all be so stupid that we don’t know we were good when even you admit that we were great?

By David O'Brien

March 3, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this

Braves are down 5-1 in bottom of eighth.

Hudson pitched well _ two scoreless innings, two hits, one strikout, 19 strikes in 31 pitches. But the same can’t be said for a couple of relievers:

Lerew was decent _ three hits, one run in two innings with three strikeouts. But the journeyman Jonathan Johnson got beat up a bit, five hits and three runs in two innings. Both will be at Richmond, I’m sure.

Andruw drove in a run with a single

By Solomon, very wise dude

March 3, 2007 4:31 PM | Link to this

A reproof entereth more into a wise man than an hundred stripes into a fool…

By Robert

March 3, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this

Shultz reports that Cox is hanging it up after next season. Just 17 years too late. Hee Haw!

Now what I say is Yee haw! Maybe I can be a Braves fan again.

By ElbravoX

March 3, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this

Now we know where DOB was, not getting the Cox retirement story. This is huge for upcoming free agents, bigger than Liberty!

By Head Coach

March 3, 2007 5:03 PM | Link to this

Alright already ! Lets look at some historical facts concerning this argument. In 1961 we had the 154 game season. In 1962 They switched to 162 games. Four man rotations were the norm , starters were expected to go eight and nine innings. Steve Carlton was the last pitcher to throw 300 innings(304) in nineteen freaking eighty (1980) , that was twenty-seven years ago. Niekro was the last Brave to do it in 1979(342.0 innings)with 44 starts(unheard of except for the fact that he was a knuckleballer). Koufax or Maddux , Gibson or Clemens. It’s like trying to compare apples and oranges, they are both fruits. But different in every respect. The Baseball being played today is far different than even twenty-five years ago.If someone hit a homerun , he put his head down and ran around the bases quickly. The show boating done today would get a fastball in your ear the next at bat. We have pinch hitting specialist , defensive players who come in late during the 8th and 9th inning. Utility players , one inning middle relief pitchers and on and one and on. Few of these aspects existed thirty years ago. Ballparks were bigger , the freaking baseball was totally different. The mound was higher, for God’s sake. So cut it out already , nobody is right and nobody is wrong. They are all the best players of their respective era’s. They are all hall of famer’s and deserving of it.

By N8

March 3, 2007 5:07 PM | Link to this

Robert

I just heard a scream outside that sounded like it was coming from very far away. Wasn’t sure what it was, but then I read that Bobby said he’d be done after next season (2008).

So I thought I’d help you out.

576 Days……and counting.

Man will that be STRANGE. Not sure it’s neccesarily a bad thing. He’s been great. But who’s to say that whoever is “next” won’t be greater?

The guy is entitled to live life a little, isn’t he?

It’s too bad Fredi Gonzalez took the Marlins job. I had/have a good feeling about him. Then again, I’ll assume that if Bobby leaves, TP will take over, and that’s not a bad thing, in my book either. Not only did he play for winning teams, he’s coached on winning teams.

Funny thing is, I can see him being MUCH MORE like Ozzie Guillen, as far as being vocal. Wasn’t it TP that walked off the field when a Braves pitcher (forgot who), wouldn’t throw at an opposing player, after a Brave had been hit the previous inning?

It’s gonna be interesting, that’s for sure.

By Lew

March 3, 2007 5:13 PM | Link to this

The problem is that there has been no music discussed for quite a while. Must be several hours. Here’s one from the dust covered closets of music history-Be Bop Deluxe with Bill Nelson, “Sunburst Finish”. Kind of a combination of “Peaches En Regalia” era Zappa and Todd Rundgren.

By Head Coach

March 3, 2007 5:25 PM | Link to this

We are about to witness the end of an historical era in Braves baseball. Andruw , Cox and who knows else will be gone and life as we know it will be forever changed.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 5:40 PM | Link to this

These comparisons of great right handed pitchers comes down to preference,are you more impressed by power than brains and control? if so Kofax,Walter Johnson or Clemons would get the vote.But if great PITCHING is your bag Maddox is the choice here.I’m a Maddox guy myself so with that in mind heres my case.In his best years Maddox had the best era ratio against the league average.This to me is the best way to transcend the differences in mound height,park size etc.Another thing is I would like to dispel the myth of his lack of post season effectiveness and in doing so purge the idea that finesse pitchers can’t get the job done in the playoffs.The record for most consecutive post season starts by a starting pitcher giving up two or less earned runs was achived concurrently by teammates,those teammates were Tom Glavine and Greg Maddox in the late 90s.You can look it up!

By Mackey Sasser

March 3, 2007 5:42 PM | Link to this

ElBravoX,

You’re right. It is huge. Hugely bad. Everybody wants to play for Bobby. I trust that’s what you meant. Right? I’d love to have TP take over. And, yes, N8 it was TP who walked off the field in St Louis or Philly I think when a Braves pitcher didn’t hit somebody. Can’t remember who the pitcher was but Marvin Freeman comes to mind for some reason. Whatever the case, TP would be a good fit from a continuity standpoint. I’d love to see Mazzone come back but the pitching coach to manager transition has been a loser in most cases.

By braveheart

March 3, 2007 5:51 PM | Link to this

head coach, didn’t they play 162 games in 1961, hence the reason why the commish forced an asterik next to maris’ 61 home runs

By Robert

March 3, 2007 5:53 PM | Link to this

There IS a GOD in heaven

PLEASE dont let this be a tease

Not 100 percent sure of the number, but 577 days I believe to October 1 2008.

577 and counting, with a prayer every morning , noon, and night that Donk doesnt change his mind

I know I’m gonna get the usual scornful remarks.

By the end of 09, y’all will be shaking your heads thinkin “That SOB wasnt nuts after all. He told us”

Actually, if the Braves win a World Series twenty years after he is dead and buried y’all will give the credit to Cox.

Who cares.

GOOD NEWS!!!!!

By Mackey Sasser

March 3, 2007 6:09 PM | Link to this

Robert, you can shut up about it now though right? I mean, Bobby’s leaving so there’s nothing to talk about. Right? That’s what I will be praying for noon and night. For you and your lame, one-note self to go away and give us a freakin break.

By Kenny D

March 3, 2007 6:11 PM | Link to this

Maybe Cox is just being a drama queen like Favre and Clemens. I very much doubt that though.

For all of us in despair about Cox possibly hanging it up and for all the old timers looking down on the modern era and all you youngsters spitting on the old timers, here is a song for you:

Changes David Bowie

I still don’t know what I was waiting for And my time was running wild A million dead-end streets Every time I thought I’d got it made It seemed the taste was not so sweet So I turned myself to face me But I’ve never caught a glimpse Of how the others must see the faker I’m much too fast to take that test

Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes (Turn and face the strain) Ch-ch-Changes Don’t want to be a richer man Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes (Turn and face the strain) Ch-ch-Changes Just gonna have to be a different man Time may change me But I can’t trace time

I watch the ripples change their size But never leave the stream Of warm impermanence and So the days float through my eyes But still the days seem the same And these children that you spit on As they try to change their worlds Are immune to your consultations They’re quite aware of what they’re going through

Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes (Turn and face the strain) Ch-ch-Changes Don’t tell them to grow up and out of it Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes (Turn and face the strain) Ch-ch-Changes

Where’s your shame You’ve left us up to our necks in it Time may change me But you can’t trace time

Strange fascination, fascinating me Changes are taking the pace I’m going through

Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes (Turn and face the strain) Ch-ch-Changes Oh, look out you rock ‘n rollers Ch-ch-ch-ch-Changes (Turn and face the strain) Ch-ch-Changes

Pretty soon you’re gonna get a little older Time may change me But I can’t trace time I said that time may change me But I can’t trace time

By Robert

March 3, 2007 6:11 PM | Link to this

DOB should be able to verify that 4:38pm was NOT me.

Whoever it was imitating me, however, could not have said it better

Only 17 years late.

YEEEEEEEE - HAAAAAAAAAA

Bobby - You are entitled to the life of a grandpa. Matter of fact, if you feel the need, go ahead and pack your stuff and leave. Today. Right now is ok. I’ll pay your cab fare to the airport. Hecl, I’ll DRIVE you to the airport. I’ll fly your behind home and buy a dozen roses you can give to the Mrs.

For the first time since Game 1 of the 1999 World Series, HOPE LIVES for Braves fans

By Mad Dawg

March 3, 2007 6:13 PM | Link to this

Hey, Rapping Robertos, Yee-Haw for the Hee-Haw!

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 6:16 PM | Link to this

I’d like to add that the record for most consecutive post season starts giving up two or fewer earned runs is eight(I think)and both Glavines’ and Maddoxs’streaks were ended by the skankees in the 1999 WS.

By Gil in Mechanicsville

March 3, 2007 6:20 PM | Link to this

Yes Robert, and then we will all know who the real donkey has been all along. HeeHaw InDeed…

By A.J.

March 3, 2007 6:25 PM | Link to this

So if Bobby hangs it up in two years, who are the very early favorites for the job?

My guess is that it will be a Bobby Cox apprentice, not an outside guy.

I imagine Cadahia and Snitker are in the mix. Probably Pendleton, maybe even Blauser. I doubt McDowell or Hubbard are in the mix.

Maybe we all root against the Brewers and find Ned Yost in the mix after a year or two. You have to think Fredi Gonzalez will still be with the Marlins, you know, unless he wins Manager of the Year. They don’t like that.

Speaking of, interesting outside name, assuming he doesn’t get back in the game next season, is Joe Girardi.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 6:34 PM | Link to this

Pendleton is my guess to take over for Mr Cox.But that could be further down the road than many think.

By KC

March 3, 2007 6:35 PM | Link to this

A couple weeks ago, I said the only thing I really wanted to see happen this spring was for our starters to get off to a good start. So far, so good!!

For all the talk about Mike Hampton, the real key to this rotation is Tim Hudson… and he looked very sharp today. It’s not the box score from his two innings (though they were scoreless) that was the cause for encouragement… it’s the fact that the ball never left the infield. That’s what he used to do every 5th day in Oakland.

I’ll obviously wait at least a couple more months before I break out with the celebratory “Huddy is back” champagne toast… but this was certainly a very encouraging start. Davies as well the other day… very encouraging.

I’m hopeful that Hampton will simply get better as the season moves along, and that he will turn in a solid 2nd half effort. But if we see more of the same from Hudson and Davies, it won’t matter that much what we get from Hampton.

By N8

March 3, 2007 6:43 PM | Link to this

AJ

Blauser was relieved of his duties at AA Mississippi, so my guess is that he is NOT in the mix.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 6:46 PM | Link to this

KC L’ll be more interested to see Hudson in sep.Will he wilt again?

By KC

March 3, 2007 6:47 PM | Link to this

AJ: “My guess is that it will be a Bobby Cox apprentice, not an outside guy.”

Good call. I agree. I think Pendleton would be the frontrunner.

Jeff Blauser??? Are you kidding me? They fired him from his minor league gig. His name isn’t even likely to come up.

By ElbravoX

March 3, 2007 6:47 PM | Link to this

One year deal for Smoltz but AJ is gone…Mickey Sasser, that’s exactly what I meant.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 6:52 PM | Link to this

Oh add Tom Glavine to my list of potential replacements for Mr Cox,now that would be cool!

By Robert

March 3, 2007 6:53 PM | Link to this

Indeed we will see

Open wager to any and all takers. IF Cox does retire after ‘08, I wager a six pack of the winner’s favorite malted or carbonated beverage that the ‘09 Braves improve 10 games or more compared to the ‘08 Braves

Just say you want a piece - (and then y’all can all get together and ship the keg to LAWTON, Oklahoma)

And if they win the World Series in ‘09, y’all that are in and around Atlanta can KEEP all them six packs owed me - just drink a toast to me during the celebration

Today was the first time in 17 YEARS that Bobby Cox said something that made sense.

Trick now is to keep him from doing any permanent damage and hold out for 577 more days. After 17 YEARS ofd torure, 577 days is a cakewalk.

I just checked my calendar again to make sure it isnt April Fool’s Day.

Just dont let this be a hoe axe

There is ONLY one choice for song/lyrics of the day

I can see clearly now the pain is gone

All of the bad feelings have disappeared

Here is the rainbow Ive been praying for

Gonna be a bright bright bright sunshiny day

By A.J.

March 3, 2007 6:54 PM | Link to this

N8: “Blauser was relieved of his duties at AA Mississippi, so my guess is that he is NOT in the mix.”

My bad. I had not heard that.

KC: “Are you kidding me?”

No really, I didn’t hear it.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 7:04 PM | Link to this

Robert Seriously man! even groundhog day had an end.COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX COX ETC ETC ETC ETC ETC !!!!

By KC

March 3, 2007 7:13 PM | Link to this

Oddjob:

Hudson does not have a long history of wilting in September, though his last couple Septembers have not been great. Actually, Hudson’s September last year was pretty much in line with the rest of his season (not to suggest that was a good thing…lol).

I think two things will help Hudson this year late in the season. First, he has dedicated himself to a new conditioning program specifically aimed at bolstering his endurance. And second… THE BULLPEN! It’s not likely that he (or any other Atlanta starter) will ever feel the need push it when they’re tired.

Bobby Cox will have the luxury of dialing back the innings pitched by guys like Smoltz and Hudson to make sure they’ve got something left in the tank in September and October.

I’ll bet you any time this year Hudson pitches on a hot day or an especially muggy evening… BC will yank him after 6 innings, even if he’s pitching well and wants to stay in. No need to wear a guy out when you’ve got a pen like that.

By Brad in MT

March 3, 2007 7:13 PM | Link to this

What a sad day for the whole Braves organization, Bobby Cox is leaving in two years. You don’t have a team this good for this long with out an amazing manager. Every player loves playing for Bobby and its going to be impossible for the Braves to replace him. Let’s hope the next two years go great, the Braves and all the fans are sure going to miss him. Hopefully someone like TP can step in and things won’t change too much. Mackey Sasser, I completely agree with you and hope that Robert will just shut up and leave the blog, his lame pathetic posts are really ruining this blog for me and I’m sure a lot of other bloggers.

By Jared

March 3, 2007 7:24 PM | Link to this

“Hope you test your pen out in pressure situations before its too late.”

The only one who needs that test is Billy Wagner. Boy does he stink in the playoffs.

By KC

March 3, 2007 7:25 PM | Link to this

It will be a sad day when Bobby leaves, but to be honest, I won’t be worried until Schuerholz says he’s hanging it up.

By supa

March 3, 2007 7:33 PM | Link to this

DOB, interesting info about Wickman. Maybe Cox told him he might set up on occasion. But I think he’s probably saying that on his own because he’s a team player. He just seems like a good dude.

I like what he said last year after the Braves acquired him and he brought some confidence back to the pen…he said something to the effect of “always act like you’ve been here before.” Wick’s been around the block and knows what it takes to win…including setting up for Gonzy or Soriano sometimes.

Thanks for all the Spring Training insights. I love em!

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 7:35 PM | Link to this

KC I hope Hudson returns to Oakland form. I agree he is a bigger key to the season than Hampton.If we get good production from Smoltz,James and Hudson Hampton is less vital and it seems unwise to expect a full season coming off Tommy John surgery.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 8:06 PM | Link to this

On Mr Cox statement concerning his probable retirement,let me try for some perspective on winning 14 strait.The Mets would have to win every year through 2020 just to tie the record.The Yankees need five more to tie, they have what a 200 million dollar payroll? and they’ve signed more top free agents than maybe every other team combined the past ten years,(Hideki Matsui,Johnny Damon,Bobby Abreu,A Rod,Jason Giambi,Mike Mussina,Randy Johnson,Gary Sheffield, etc)while the Braves have been on a tight budget and the only high dollar signing in many years was Hudson.Even with all the advantages who would bet NY will win through 2011? not me,what Mr Cox and others have done may never be equaled in major team sports.So heres to great things.

By KC

March 3, 2007 8:08 PM | Link to this

Oddjob: “KC I hope Hudson returns to Oakland form”

Me too.

As you have pointed out, September has been a problem for Huddy in recent years. But for both of the reasons I’ve mentioned, I think there is much cause for hope. Not saying “bet the farm on him”… just that there is reason to be encouraged.

Hudson has never pitched in front of a bullpen like this. It makes sense to surmise that he’ll have more left in the tank come Sept/Oct than he has since he was a young pup in Oakland. This bullpen should take a big load off all of our starters this year. And again… hopefully the conditioning program will have a positive effect.

By KC

March 3, 2007 8:12 PM | Link to this

Kind of unfortunate timing for BC to mention this, in my opinion. I’d rather talk about beginning of this promising season, rather than the end of Bobby’s career. This is the type of news I’d rather hear him break 7 months from now.

By Jared

March 3, 2007 8:13 PM | Link to this

Robert, I thought you already wrote you were joking?

By Robert February 28, 2007 4:40 PM

“Braveheart we weren’t going to let this out of the bag so soon, but the joke is getting a little long in the tooth.

I, Robert, am not really thumbsucking, drooling, raving maniac.

We are actually five students at Berry College who thought it would be fun to create a character to bug people by being Robert One Note on Bobby Cox. No harm intended and we will stop now.”

http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/ajc/braves/entries/2007/02/28/ladiesandgent.html#comment-1030579

By Robert

March 3, 2007 8:26 PM | Link to this

It’ll be very interesting to see who the Braves consider for and who they ultimately hire as their new manager.

I’d like to see them consider Girardi, but dont think it will happen. He is a good game manager, but I think JS and the bigwigs are gonna be looking for a “company man”.

One line of logic suggests Pendleton. He is a Braves company man to the core. But he has no managerial experience.

Dangit if only Leyland had waited two more years to come back (or if only Bobby had decided it was time to go to barn just a little earlier, but I am gonna make it a point to forget the past and thinki about the bright future)

Whoever brought him up can forget about Blauser. Even Donk wouldnt fire someone and then bring him back at the elite level two years later.

If Steinbrenner axes Torre, he oughta get a look.

Heck. go to the Library of Congress, open a random phone book to a random page and point at a random name, and it’ll be better.

Keep hating on me. And please,take my bet.

Cheers. I’m off to drink a cold one.

By KC

March 3, 2007 8:28 PM | Link to this

Great… now Robert is not one, but 5 people. Or is he? Remember the college roommate in A Beautiful Mind?

By Robert (Justice Is The Best)

March 3, 2007 8:34 PM | Link to this

Robert, this must be the second happiest day of your life. I am going presume the happiest will be Cox’s final game. Are you still sober. I figured you would have popped a few champagne corks by now!

Well, let’s hope Cox’s impending retirement gives the Braves just that much more motivation to win it all this year and next. However, I think this is just another nail in the coffin for Andruw to leave.

Also, I wonder if Pendleton will begin to be groomed to take over. And, does this mean the end for JS as well?

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 8:34 PM | Link to this

Berry five No harm,I’m told Martha Berry was known for getting loaded and tipping the occasional cow.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 8:41 PM | Link to this

Someone I treasure sent this message to someone I love and, since this is the address I have for you …

No, I didn’t write it … but the feelings are truly mine!

I think this about you

A girl asked a guy if he thought she was pretty, he said … no.

She asked him if he would want to be with her forever … and he said no.

She then asked him if she were to leave would he cry, and once again he replied with a no.

She had heard enough. As she walked away, tears streaming down her face the boy grabbed her arm and said …

“You’re not pretty you’re beautiful! I don’t want to be with you forever, I NEED to be with you forever! And I wouldn’t cry if you walked away … I’d die!”

SO NOW I WILL SAY:

I like you because of who you are to me … A true friend … and if I don’t get this back I’ll take the hint.

A good friend will come bail you out of jail … but a true friend will be sitting next to you saying “WE screwed up, but we had fun! Proud to be your Friend!”

I’ve learned … that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes.

I’ve learned … that we should be glad God doesn’t give us everything we ask for.

I’ve learned … that money doesn’t buy class.

I’ve learned … that it’s those small daily happenings that make life so spectacular.

I’ve learned … that under everyone’s hard shell is someone who wants to be appreciated and loved.

I’ve learned … that the Lord didn’t do it all in one day. What makes me think I can?

I’ve learned…that to ignore the facts does not change the facts.

I’ve learned… that the less time I have to work, the more things I get done.

It’s National Friendship Week.

Show your friends how much you care. Send this to everyone you consider a FRIEND, even if it means sending it back to the person who sent it to you.

If it comes back to you, then you’ll know you have a circle of friends. HAPPY FRIENDSHIP WEEK TO YOU!!!!!!

YOU ARE MY FRIEND AND I am honored

By KC

March 3, 2007 8:48 PM | Link to this

Robert(JIB):

I think AJ’s point earlier was accurate. It’ll probably be a BC understudy that gets the job. Might as well… everyone else keeps hiring Bobby Cox understudies to fill their managerial positions: Jimmy Williams, Ned Yost, Freddy Gonzalez… seems like I’m missing one or two.

Pendleton has received serious consideration from more than one team looking to fill a managerial position over the past couple years. He’d be the most likely candidate at this point.

But we’ll see. That’s still two full seasons away. Ya never know… if Bobby changed his mind and postponed retirement, he certainly wouldn’t be the first pro sports figure to do so.

It’ll be sad. But again… I’m not scared until I hear those words from Schuerholz. As great a manager as BC is… I think JS is even better at what he does. And personally, I think great GM’s are harder to come by than great managers.

By woogidy

March 3, 2007 9:03 PM | Link to this

Sad day. Oh well. Terry Pendleton, get ready. It will be you to take his place.

By David O'Brien

March 3, 2007 9:07 PM | Link to this

Robert, if you talked to 10 people around baseball about Girardi, other than most of the Marlins players, you’d know why he won’t be hired to manage the Braves, at least not anytime soon.

Totally unrelated to the Bobby stuff today at the ballpark, I had three separate conversations with very prominent people in baseball, and heard stories about what an overbearing, stubborn and unlikeable guy Girardi was. Think about it: How bad an impression do you have to leave to not only get fired as manager when you’re the NL Manager of the Year, but then to not be able to get another job other than broadcaster, as young as he is.

I should make it clear, I’ve never done more than exchanged hellos with the guy a few times, never talked to him. So maybe these people are all wrong or have agendas of their own, but it was some very respected and bright people I was talking to….

Those speculating on T.P. as manager, I’d peg him as my early favorite to get it. I really think he’d do a great job, and he has so much respect from players. Very good guy, very smart, and extremely well-liked by everyone. No pretense, not a bad bone in his body.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 9:09 PM | Link to this

Bob Q - you know how the cowboy got covered in dung? A - He went looking for love in all the wrong places.

By David O'Brien

March 3, 2007 9:20 PM | Link to this

Don’t know if you guys noticed (I haven’t read all the posts yet), but Devine hit not one, but two guys in the ninth ining. Struck out two, hit two, gave up a hit. I feel bad for the kid, but he’s a looong way from harnessing that talent and getting past his demons, I’m afraid. Hope I’m wrong.

If I were running things, I’d send him down with no chance of a callup until September if at all this year. Let him get completely confident in the minors and put up some great numbers, not risk another meltdown in the majors. Another one might be even more devastating, if the others haven’t already been. But nothing wrong with continuing to pitch him in the spring, of course. I mean, if he can’t do it in spring training games, there’s a real, real bad problem….

Hey Robert, try displaying a modicum of class in regards to the comments to Cox, OK? I mean, enough. We know you hate him as a manager, have no respect for him, etc. Good for you. Everyone else in baseball completely disagrees with you, but that’s fine.

You have your opinions, you’ve stated them 9 million times. Good for you. Buyt it’s tired. Sorry, just is. Seriously, you’re more creative and intelligent than to repeat the same crap ad nauseum on the day the man says he’s leaning toward retiring in two years.

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 9:28 PM | Link to this

OddJob, I can understand your frustration with the redundant quintent but why would you make disparraging remarks about Miss Berry?

By Jared

March 3, 2007 9:31 PM | Link to this

By my calculations, if the Tom Glavine is the opening day starter for the Mets and they use the normal five-man starting rotation, he should pitch against the Braves at Turner Field on April 8. I’d bet money he gets booed heavily.

By plainly simple

March 3, 2007 9:40 PM | Link to this

Robert, the blog feels the same way about you as you feel about Cox>>>can’t wait till you’re gone either…

By KC

March 3, 2007 9:47 PM | Link to this

In regard to Pendleton…

I once heard a story about him that made me laugh. It was his first or second year as Braves’ hitting coach (2003, I think), and he was watching Andruw Jones take batting practice.

Andruw was busy practicing his standard approach at the plate (at the time), which was to throw open his hips and try to pull everything into the left-field bleachers.

Here’s how the conversation went:

Terry: “Ya know, there’s a lot of hits in right field”.

Andruw: “they don’t pay me to hit singles”.

Terry: “well right now they’re just paying you to catch that ball, cause’ you’re not hitting worth a damn”.

LOL! Great stuff!

By Jared

March 3, 2007 9:47 PM | Link to this

Anyone see that new banner on the Braves’ official website? They changed it to include Smoltz, Chipper, Andruw, McCann and Francoeur. Smoltz, Chipper and Andruw are sort of in the background while McCann and Francoeur are really colorful and big. Also, they removed Hudson (old banner was Andruw, Chipper, Smoltz, Giles and Hudson.)

The new Braves’ slogan: “Welcome to the bigs.”

By Greg in TN

March 3, 2007 9:54 PM | Link to this

Evening folks…

Very encouraging to see Hudson pitch well today. I am hopeful he takes today’s performance and build on it, and I think he will.

So I guess the BC retirement watch begins. There is a lot of time between now and next October and anything can happen. I think TP would make a wonderful choice as manager as would Ned Yost or Fredi Gonzalez. I think Brian Snitker needs a little more time although I also have to say that I have no issues with how he’s done in the farm system.

But Girardi? At this point, I can only think of Jim Mora’s press conference when asked about the playoffs (and recently revisited in a clever beer commercial this past NFL season). Imagine him saying this instead…

Girardi? Don’t talk about… Girardi? You kidding me? Girardi?

Actually, I would have been fine with the idea up until a few days ago, however calling up a pitcher playing for a DIVISION RIVAL and giving him advice???? Huh? I don’t care if he did play with Lieber, I don’t want any part of a guy that would even think of doing that drawing a baseball paycheck from the 404 area code anytime soon.

Hey DOB I asked this in the last blog but I didn’t see a response and with today’s BC news, I was just wondering… What are your thoughts on Frank Wren? I know one of these days, JS will decide to hang ‘em up and Wren appears is the heir apparent within the organization with the departure of Dayton Moore. From what little I’ve seen or heard of him, he seems to be a sharp guy.

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 10:00 PM | Link to this

Bob why would you disparage a good cow tippen? I’m from Cedartown where the art is held in high esteem.

By The Grinch

March 3, 2007 10:04 PM | Link to this

Howdy, all! Back from an adventurous few days. Me and T-Hawkin’ met this really hot chick in a bar in Smackover, ARK. of all places. Caught just a few minutes of the game at her place (wink,wink), then she started screamin’ about her crazy hillbilly husband might be home any minute so we high-tailed it outta there (especially after lookin’ at all them stuffed animals hangin’ on the walls). Unfortunately, we left behind some apparel, so if anyone knows who I’m talkin’ about please tell her to send those size 18 yellow clown shoes, foam tommahawks and Wickman-signed Braves coozies to 666 Grinch Mountain, Atlanta GA. Watch me trip over a manhole cover now next time I’m downtown. :-)

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 10:05 PM | Link to this

Greg, maybe I misread it but I think Bobby was suggesting the day following our parade in October 2008.

By Robert (Justice Is The Best)

March 3, 2007 10:09 PM | Link to this

DOB, what is your gut feeling about this team right now after three weeks or so of spring training? Do you see any surprises in the works as far as guys making the 25 man roster that weren’t expected to or is it too early to tell?

By Greg in TN

March 3, 2007 10:12 PM | Link to this

Hey Bob, that was my fault. We have two parades until we have to worry about that!

By The Grinch

March 3, 2007 10:24 PM | Link to this

OddJob, my mom’s family grew up in Rockmart. Polk County in the house! DOB, there a tape of that radio broadcast I can access?

By spirited steed

March 3, 2007 10:28 PM | Link to this

“The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. When there is a gap between one’s real and one’s declared aims, one turns, as it were, instinctively to long words and exhausted idioms, like a cuttlefish squirting out ink.”

By OddJob

March 3, 2007 10:32 PM | Link to this

Grinch A former Miss Oddjob is from Rockmart,her name will not be mentioned here,but she is a redhead of Irish stock.

By David O'Brien

March 3, 2007 10:33 PM | Link to this

Greg in TN, you’re right: Wren’s a very sharp guy. Absolutely ready to step in and be a good GM now. Former minor league player (career ended by an aneurysm), knows every aspect of the organization, having served in virtually every role during his stints with Expos, Marlins, Orioles (his ill-fated one and only GM job, when he was in an impossible situation with the meddling Angelos sons) and Braves.

I’m surprised he hasn’t gotten a job by now, but gotta think he’d be in line here, especially with Dayton out of the picture. Might even have been if Dayton were still here. Still a relatively young guy (yes, 48 used to be fairly young for a GM, believe it or not).

All that said, not sure Schuerholz will be hanging it up within two years. He might go 3-5 more, for all we know.

By Greg in TN

March 3, 2007 10:43 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the background information DOB. There are indeed no indications that JS will retire after 2008, but if and when he does, assuming Wren remains in the organization, I feel very comfortable with him taking over. I know that too isn’t guaranteed since Liberty, or whatever person or entity has the deed to the team at that point may want to go in another direction (which I think would be really stupid move if Wren is around at that time).

By Braveheart

March 3, 2007 10:50 PM | Link to this

This is probably Bobby’s greatest motivational tool he has ever used.

Cox is essentially telling Smoltz to hang with him two more years and inspiring the rest of this team to have the urgency missing for years.

I hear a rallying cry, boys.

We will be the World Series champs sometime in the next two years.

It may be next year after andruw leaves and the young bravos are forced to step up.

There will be a centerfielder next year who will play the role of Tee Martin to Andruw’s Peyton Manning. Not sure who yet though.

A World Series championship in the next two years with the current young pups will be the perfect bookend to the magic that happened in 1991 with a bunch of other young pups.

It will be even sweeter if Cox and Smoltz ride out into the sunset together.

Despite what the Five Robertas may say, the Braves will probably spend years never finding a suitable replacement for Bobby Cox, just like Alabama has been wandering around aimlessly since the retirement and death of the great Bear.

The shadow of Bobby will haunt this team just like the Bear’s shadow has haunted BAMA for the past 25 years.

By The Grinch

March 3, 2007 10:53 PM | Link to this

‘tis a trademark of that area; lots of Scots, Irish and Welsh who migrated there to mine the slate. My aunt has red hair…Uncle Wayne? You still owe me a 12-pack from the ‘96 Super Bowl. Don’t think the divorce got you off the hook for that one. :-)

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 11:16 PM | Link to this

OddJob,

Depending on your tenure, we may have been neighbors … but that would make it worse cause you should know better that make vulgar suggestions about any lady … especially someone kind like Miss Martha Berry! And, I ain’t talking about tipping over no cows neither … if you trade stock, your’s will be lowered if you show disrespect for the cows, drunk or sober.

Besides, drunk cows don’t need any help in tippin over.

A fellow from Rockmart taught me that acceptable vulgar humor is not something you think is funny while others think it’s vulgar … I know that Rockmart’s not Cedartown, and besides, I think he was originally from CaveSprings … but he said it was true from LaGrange all the way up to Chattanooga.

Check your shoes, cause it’s just possible you have ‘em on incorrectly … the “L” stands for left foot, and “R” stands for right.

By Jeremy

March 3, 2007 11:22 PM | Link to this

I really don’t understand where all of this Joe Girardi bashing is coming from. As a high school senior growing up in Jupiter, FL, I got press credentials for spring training games at Roger Dean Stadium (I should also mention I’m a broadcast journalism major at UCF now). The point is, so many players like Albert Pujols, Jim Edmonds, and Alfonso Soriano never gave me a second of their time, even if they weren’t busy. But alot of guys also DID help me out with interviews, one of them being Joe Girardi. He was nice, friendly, and professional to me in the roughly 5 minutes that I spent with him last spring.

Additionally, I interned at ESPN 760 in West Palm Beach where Girardi had a weekly show last season. He never missed a show, always friendly, and honestly answering all questions. Even admist all the controversy late last season, he never said anything bad about any individuals or the orginization. In my time spent with Girardi, he has always been very stand-up and professional, where as so many other baseball personalities were simply not. Hopefully this will give you a better idea of the Joe Girardi that I at least knew…

By ssiscribe

March 3, 2007 11:27 PM | Link to this

Two more years of Robert J. Cox in the dugout for the Atlanta Braves?

There will be plenty to write, plenty to say, on this as we go along. But I’ll go ahead and agree with what I’ve seen mentioned on here already:

The Atlanta Braves WILL win the World Series either this year, next year, or both years. Plain and simple.

That’s all I got tonight. The Scribe abides.

—30—

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 11:32 PM | Link to this

Spirited Steed, you have a point … but, idioms can be useful, depending on the audience and what one man perceives as big words, another needs a magnifying glass to see.

Regarding agendas, declared and secret, what’s yours?

By blog scourge

March 3, 2007 11:39 PM | Link to this

A thing is not vulgar until you’ve seen it’s reflection in the mirrors of your perverse heart…

By David O'Brien

March 3, 2007 11:40 PM | Link to this

Robert (JIB), a little early to tell on roster surprises. Ask me in a week.

Grinch, unless that broadcast is available at 680TheFan’s website, you’d probably have to call the Radio Hall of Fame to get an MP3 of it.

(kidding, of course)

By DAP

March 3, 2007 11:45 PM | Link to this

i think we all knew bobby was going to be done soon, but now that he has put a time table on it, i think it seriously hurts our chances of keeping andruw. one reason he would want to stay is to play for bobby, and if he knows will will only be there one more season, that motivation will be gone. i havent given up on keeping andruw yet, but its getting harder and harder to hang onto that…

By enigmatically obvious

March 3, 2007 11:53 PM | Link to this

I think s steed is just seeing what he can catch, without any hook…

By Bob, journalist

March 3, 2007 11:53 PM | Link to this

Blog Scourge, I know what you mean … I once had a customer tell me that he and his wife were appauled at the vulgar language someone on my staff was supposedly using … I too was appauled, until he explained that they had never heard such language before.

Besides, vulgarity is more a function of context than words … methinks you know that “indulging in the vulgar” and “being obscene” are not interchangable.

By OddJob

March 4, 2007 12:02 AM | Link to this

Can any of you tell me the Braves playoff record( games wins and losses and series wins and losses)in the past 16 years?

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 12:04 AM | Link to this

Enigmatically Obvious,

More obvious than you probably realize … but alas, neither the poll nor the line is long enough, or strong enough … and the water is clear enough for the fish to see through the transparent fisherman.

Alack, duty calls.

By Hammy the Brave

March 4, 2007 12:06 AM | Link to this

DOB,

How concerned are you with Hampton at this early stage of camp, and do you think a lot of this may be more mental than physical, on his part? Also, don’t you think the Braves would be smart to bring in a veteran lefty starter for insurance, like Mark Redmon, instead of maybe relying on two question marks at the end of their rotation, if he can’t start the season? It shouldn’t cost that much to sign Redmon to a minor league contract and bring him in to camp?

    Like to hear your response,

       Hammy the Brave

By some jackass

March 4, 2007 12:11 AM | Link to this

Only he who is nearing insanity can truly recognize he who is already there…

By mr baseball

March 4, 2007 12:11 AM | Link to this

The fact that someone says they’re planning to retire doesn’t mean they’re going to. Michael Jordan, Roger Clemens, Jim Leyland, etc, etc. The Braves will certainly miss Cox’s presence in the clubhouse, whenever he decides to hang up his spikes. On the other hand, his juvenile player nicknames, mindless rants against umpires and suspect strategic decisions will not be missed, at least by some of us.

Those of us who have maintained that Cox is not necessarily a bad manager — just one with his positives and negatives and grossly over-rated by baseball observors who don’t watch the Braves on a nightly basis — will soon (?) find out whether we were right or wrong.

If the next manager can just get the Braves to the post-season, it’s a pretty good bet that he will do a whole lot better than Cox has for the last decade. If that turns out to be the case, it will be interesting to see the reaction of those who have Cox on a fast track to the Hall of Fame.

And no one will ever be able to shut up the blogger/bloggettes known as Robert ever again.

As to Cox’s successor, here’s one vote against Pendleton. For all the blather about how valuable his veteran presence in the clubhouse was (it was vital in ‘91, negligible after that), the Braves only WS title during their run came with a rookie playing 3B and Pendleton putting on weight in south Florida. His petulant walk-off was pathetic and the Braves’ managerial job is too valued to have to hire someone with no managerial experience at any level.

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 12:20 AM | Link to this

Tis difficult to distinguish one from another … good noght old friend!

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 12:44 AM | Link to this

Hammy The Brave, I’m at least a litte concerned about Hampton, though I’ll give it another week before moving to genuinely concerned.

When you say Mark Redmon, I’m assuming you’re talking about Mark Redman, who was 11-10 with a 5.71 ERA for Kansas City last year and 5-15 with a 4.90 ERA for Pittsburgh in 2005.

How is he significantly better than what they already have as backup possibilities _ Cormier, Villarreal? Nothing about Redman leads me to believe he’s an answer.

By chickenlittle

March 4, 2007 1:00 AM | Link to this

Only a fool asks the question of which he knows not the answer…

By KC

March 4, 2007 1:17 AM | Link to this

DOB: What’s the rotation schedule? I guessing Hampton will skip his first spring start?

By KC

March 4, 2007 1:42 AM | Link to this

Well, it was a good day. Hudson looked very sharp, and that’s the best news the Braves could get in the first week of spring training.

G’night all.

By TK

March 4, 2007 5:38 AM | Link to this

DOB, what is the deal with Francoeur turning down a raise?

By ncscoots

March 4, 2007 6:31 AM | Link to this

If Smoltz is working so hard on his changeup, does that mean he’s forgoing his splitter? Looking back, my perception is that he didn’t even throw the splitter much last year. I guess I always considered that his “offspeed” pitch.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 7:28 AM | Link to this

KC, the “plan” has been and remains for Hampton to possibly pitch Tuesday after Kyle starts that game vs. , to follow him in third or fourth inning. But that’s only if he’s ready, and lately it hasn’t looked like he would be. We’ll find out today, I’m sure.

Chuck James goes today, then Cormier. Then Kyle/possibly Hampton. They’ll adjust at some point, but for now they’ll keep running those six (including Hampton) out as if preparing all six to be in five-man rotation.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 7:31 AM | Link to this

TK, I’m going to guess _ which I have to, since agent didn’t call back _ that the agent believed Francoeur deserved as much as McCann, seeing how Frenchy made about $50,000 last year. Of course, McCann made the All-Star team and had aveage, OBP and slugging that blew Francoer out of the water. Almost matched him in RBIs in 32 fewer games.

Anyway, I’ll ask Francoer today. It’s not a big deal, though. Means nothing in big picture, whatsoever.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 7:35 AM | Link to this

Scoots, I asked Smoltz about the splits, since he threw none other day. He assured he’ll throw some this spring. He wisely waits to sharpen that pitch, for two reasons probably: It comes back to him quickly, not a feel pitch like change-up, and it’s the one that’s supposedly hard on the elbow, at least a lot of pitchers say so.

He didn’t throw any last spring, or very few.

By ssiscribe

March 4, 2007 7:46 AM | Link to this

Top of the morning to all in the blogosphere on a frosty morning on the south side of the ATL.

A few notes and thoughts before breakfast and church calls:

I hope my short take on Cox late last night made sense, although in reading it this morning, it may not. Certainly the announcement by Bobby that he probably will retire after next season will give the Braves extra motivation to win the World Series, but motivation can only go so far. You’ve got to have good health, good pitching, enough (and timely) offense, excellent defense, a great bullpen and a little luck on the way to the top of the mountain.

I think there is a chance Cox will stay around longer than the next two seasons, but we all knew this moment would come at some point in time. I’ll admit I’m surprised to hear him tell it to Schultz in a column. I’ve also always said if the Braves were to win a World Series soon, I think Cox would retire after that, a notion tempered the past two years by the influx of young talent.

I also think Cox’s announcement that he’s thinking about hanging up his spikes drives up the price tag on AJ some, and there certainly is no wiggle room when it comes to what the center fielder will bring on the open market. Having Cox here for the first few years of a new deal with Andruw would be a lure for Jones to stay here. Now, it seems that Cox will be here for just the first year of a long-term deal with AJ, and I don’t think he’ll take a big discount not knowing who he’ll be playing for come 2009.

I don’t know about Smoltz, however. Unlike Andruw, Smoltz has played for another major league manager (I believe Russ Nixon already had replaced Chuck Tanner when Smoltz made his debut in 1988, but I’m not 100 percent sure of it). Smoltz has indicated he would be OK with leaving Atlanta at the end of the season, so I don’t know how much of a role Cox’s possible retirement will have in Smoltz’s decision. It’s possible Smoltz could sign a one-year deal and look to go out together with Cox after the 2008 season. Time will tell.

Good news on Hudson yesterday (listened to bits and pieces of the game). Sounded like Timmy threw it well, worked his way out of trouble in the first and overall got plenty of ground balls. Encouraging indeed.

On Hampton, I’m not worried at all right now. Don’t think he’ll make his first start for another week or so, and even then, it’s going to be a slow process. Should we get to next weekend and he’s still not ready to pitch in a game, then I think there would have to be some concern he won’t be ready for the home opener April 6 vs. the Mets.

Joey Devine … geez. I was so encouraged with his solid showing in September. Yesterday was not good, by any stretch of the imagination. But again, it’s early. If the youngster can settle down and pitch well the rest of spring, then maybe he’s got a chance to make it. Otherwise, though, you got to think barring an injury or three at the big-league level that Devine’s going to spend a full season at Richmond. And that’s OK. Dude is so young. Two years ago, he was pitching for N.C. State, so there’s no need to rush him to the bigs. He’s got the stuff; he’s just gotta get over his wildness.

That’s all I got for now. Chuck James on the hill today, toeing the slab and hoping to continue the good run of pitching by Atlanta’s starters so far.

—30—

By james

March 4, 2007 9:19 AM | Link to this

DOB what tv station or channel are the braves on today?

By Gil in Mechanicsville

March 4, 2007 9:39 AM | Link to this

Nuke LaRoosh lives…

By eric the elder

March 4, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this

Bob, journalist, hope you caught my 12:40 post yesterday. I don’t mean to offend anyone, and certainly not you.

By Mac

March 4, 2007 10:00 AM | Link to this

Dave, I agree with most of what you say,but think you’re a little rash with Devine. If every pitcher this spring who had a bad outing got the same reaction from you we’d have no one on the roster. Thank God Bobby is a little more understanding of the big picture.

By the way was in a record store the other day and they were playing the Lucinda Williams album and you are right good stuff. By the way I asked on another blog, have you heard the Christina Aguilera “Back to the Basics” album. Good stuff there also. Maybe not what you’d expect from her, but good stuff.

By Robert

March 4, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this

DOB and the rest who have ridiculed my theories. Try to swallow this one. This is a post from a minor league coach on the Cox Blog

“By Glenn

March 4, 2007 6:12 AM | Link to this

Being a coach in minor leagues now and having played for Bobby I have to say I have seen the good and bad. He is a players coach like the former Mora Jr. Thats not always a good thing which lead to a lot of first round disasters during the playoffs while I was there anyway. He knows the game, but I’d say he is a little on the short side when it came to quick thinking and strategy.

I’m glad a lot of Atlanta folks are snowed by the regular season wins, pennants and TV/media press”

A coach and a guy who PLAYED FOR BOBBY

Being a player’s manager isnt always a good thing

On the short side when it comes to quick thinking and strategy (boy he understated things there)

Now read that last line. And then read it again.

The competition is glad we are snowed. They know that as long as Cox manages, the Braves have been rendered inpotent in the postseason.

We have been the butt of the joke. Vote the SOB manager of the year and sing his praises. That way they’ll keep him and thereby maximize the opposition’s postseason chances against the Braves

THANK YOU Glenn for saying it

Why did he say it now? Because Cox is leaving so it doesnt matter any more.

How does it feel folks, thinking your team has been the center of adulation of the baseball universe, and now you find out we’ve been led on a 17 year long snipe hunt

By the way, still not a single taker on my bet (except one made way back, I remember)

The day in Feb 2009 when pitchers and catchers report, but Bobby Cox does not, will be a day to behold.

576 and counting

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this

Elder Eric,

You are truly delightful … anyone who uses “pejorative” in explaining the intent of comments that were truly well expressed obviously is obviously one of breeding and of letters … how could such a person possibly offend?!

You painted a wonderfully clear picture of a great pitcher … your eloquence and wisdom suggests your name be from Eric to Cato, the elder of course!

By Robert

March 4, 2007 10:19 AM | Link to this

Braveheart said “We will be the World Series champs sometime in the next two years. “

I got my paycheck against yours dude taking the negatory on that remark

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 10:31 AM | Link to this

Elder Cato,

Apologies!

My post post was “cbviously” sloppy, a malady of increasing concern … I would have “changed” it but for the spilled coffee knocked over as I started to edit … hitting the post button instead … another use of “pejorative” describes the situation well … everything I did seemed to make matters worse!

By Braveheart

March 4, 2007 10:36 AM | Link to this

yeah. that’s a fair trade. trading my paycheck for a paycheck from a college kid.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 10:39 AM | Link to this

Robert, your hypocrisy is beyond belief. I mean, you’ve absolutely GOT TO BE KIDDING. Let me get this straight: You’ll latch on desperately and quote verbatim a totally anonymous blogger _ who could be my mother for all you know _ and portray his words as the bottom line on this issue. The ONE GUY who says he played for Cox and has a critical comment about him, one and, again, I’ll point out he’s not even willing to give us his name.

Yet all the players, past and present, who praise Cox, guys who’ve moved on to other teams and have absolutely nothing to lose by being critical of him, you absolutely dismiss their opinions. I mean, guys going on the record aren’t even mildly critical of the man, guys who have long since retired and, as I said, have nothing to lose by being a bit critical of him, guys who aren’t in baseball anymore.

Yet you dismiss all them as having whatever agenda you say they/we have. Yet one anonymous blogger questions Cox’s decision-making in games, and you seize upon that without any verification that he even played for Cox. You seize upon that as gospel, one voice against the literally hundreds who’ve praised him.

Comical. You’re absolutely comical in your crusade against the man you just called an “SOB.” You’ve got two years to deal with him, at least. Get comfortable. Come up with some new schtick, though. Please. You’re coming across as mildly deranged.

The guy might be right, for all I know. But it’d help if he’d at least give us his name. And even if he did, if we knew he played for Cox, please explain to me why this person’s word means so much to you? Oh, that’s right. Because you finally might have found someone who agrees with you.

Maybe I should check. For all I know, it was you as “Glenn,” or your best friend from work.

What a joke. Nice argument. Real strong logic, Robert. I’m sure it’ll change a lot of opinions here.

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this

Braveheart,

The kid’s no dummy trying to get 100:1 odds … don’t take it!

Martha Berry’s a fine school but Robert bespeaks a possible recent lowering of school standards … imagine taking 5 to screw in a lightbulb or to cut and paste the same rudundant post time after time.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 10:42 AM | Link to this

Hey Mac, you been following the kid’s career? I like his talent and am only sorry the Braves brought him up so fast. And like I said, I’d keep running him out there this spring, but I just think he needs a full year in the minors to get completely grounded.

Hey, if he’s lights-out the rest of the spring and has no command problems, I’m certainly willing to change my opinion. Unlike some, I’m not inflexible and more than willing to admit when I’m wrong.

By the way, it’s gonna be BEAUTIFUL DAY here at DODGERTOWN. I’ll try to get a new blog up soon.

You folks, I wish you could all be here. This is absolutely what it’s all about. Spring training heaven.

By woogidy

March 4, 2007 11:09 AM | Link to this

Robert, Seriously dude, no one wants to hear it. I mean you’re entitled to say what you want, but find something else to b!$@h about. It’s not even about Bobby anymore, just shut up!

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 11:16 AM | Link to this

In a way, the ongoing defence of our Mr. Cox may be a disservice to the man … he needs not defending!

The young men creating and maintaining the “Robert” persona indicated some imagination and initiative and I applauded that … but their vision is impaired and they are reflecting negatively upon themselves and a fine school.

It is not idle rhetoric to suggest that it would behoove these young men to reflect upon the utility of continuing their diversion and the possible ramifications of their actions.

By Lew

March 4, 2007 11:21 AM | Link to this

Robert-What happened to you being 10 Berry students that here ever after you were going to shut the —— up? Why don’t you? Your whole rant got more than tiresome a long time ago. My parrot is more original in it’s thought process than you. It has more to say, that’s for sure. Get’s into Jimi Hendrix and John Fogerty. too.

By james

March 4, 2007 11:30 AM | Link to this

DOB what tv station or channel are the braves on today?

By eric the elder

March 4, 2007 11:33 AM | Link to this

To stretch my friend’s characterization, Cato is credited with saying “Grasp the subject, and the words will follow.”

The converse is, roughly, “If words are flowing, then the subject has been grasped.” Our Cox detractors iluustrate that the converse of a true proposition can be false.

By Head Coach

March 4, 2007 11:33 AM | Link to this

If ever a team was given the perfect motivation to win it all…..well , now the Braves have it.

By woogidy

March 4, 2007 11:35 AM | Link to this

Hey, anybody have comcast with BravesHD channel? Is every game in HD or I guess I should say, How did it work last season? If anyone could be of help. It would be appreciated.

By some jackass

March 4, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this

Some folks say nothing all day long—others take all day long to say nothing…

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 11:44 AM | Link to this

Robert, if my previous post seemed harsh or critical, I want to make it clear that it was so intended!

To continually ridicule someone is boorish and something of which you will someday not be proud … it’s much better to leave the game while folks are still in awe of your accomplishments than after you have become an embarrassment.

By Glembo

March 4, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this

Anyone know if Andruw is still slowed from sliding on that bat last season? Is that bat available for purchase?

By Robert

March 4, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this

DOB - You are right that Glenn isnt verified. I’d bet he’s real. And I’d bet his sentiment is rather common - and that you’d find that out either off the record, or will find it out after Cox is gone

Folks, I am not 10 Berry students. I am not deranged. I dont hate Cox personally.

I’d like to see one man (or woman) who’d stop just sneering at me thru a blog and instead put their money where their mouth is - take my bet

Go to the Cox blog. Read the posts by the anti-Cox minority. They are well written, thorough and logical. They are ridiculed by posts that suggest division titles are the goal of baseball and that the Braves shouldve never sniffed the postseason.

We’ll know the answer.

And to whoever noted the about the likely timing of the Liberty deal’s finalization in relation to Cox’s timetable - SHREWD OBSERVATION my friend ;)

Will the announcement motivate the players? Sure it will. They love Donk. (even the ones who, once away from the asylum will realize he wasnt what was best for them). They might just get to the World Series and give the him one last chance to show the world what an idiot he is.

Well, to show Atlanta. The rest of the world already knows.

By The Grinch

March 4, 2007 11:55 AM | Link to this

Morning, all! It’s freezing-a$$ cold here; glad you’re enjoying yourself in the sunshine, Dave. Poor you. BTW, congrats on the Big-12 title. I’m off to see “Zodiac,” partly because it looks like it might be good and partly because I expect the theater to be heated. Later.

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 11:55 AM | Link to this

It doesn’t take me all day to say nothing … it’s me typing that makes it seem that way … that, and the delays imposed by the AJC in an effort to control Robert.

By Robert

March 4, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this

Bob journalist - No offense taken

Ongoing defense of Cox is a disservice to the Braves organization and to your intellect. But this will all become apparent soon enough.

Everyone will be fine, with the Braves and with me, by late October of 2009

Mark my words. Noone wants to hear it, but that doesnt make it not true.

I was not around last week. I’m half curious about this 5 or 10 Berry students story. (no I’m not).

DOB can verify that those werent me, and also that “Glenn” from the other board is nowehere near me

What I need to do is to quit responding to the proddings. I need to just sit back and enjoy thinking about the wonderful possibilities open to the Braves starting in 2009. I vowed to do that. I’m gonna try

576

By cardboard box

March 4, 2007 12:10 PM | Link to this

it’s amazing how some folks make themselves the target for every stray arrow shot…

By Braveheart

March 4, 2007 12:50 PM | Link to this

You sound like the Dolphins’ fans who thought things might be better once Dan Marino left. Respect when he was there; who cares since he left.

You sound like the Knicks’ fans who thought things might be better once Patrick Ewing left town. Playoffs for almost 15 years in a row with Ewing; a nightmare since.

You sound like the Hoosiers’ fan who thought things might be better once Bobby Knight left town. They might have made a Final Four with his players since but things have certainly not been better.

Is Steve Spurrier overrated as well since he only has one national championship?

Dean Smith won two national championships in 36 years. Was he overrated as well?

Don Shula won two superbowls, lost four in 33 years as a coach. Overrated as well?

The Braves have usually been fatally flawed every year in at least one area of the team - whether that was bullpen, the bench, or whatever.

In the early 1990s, they were young.

In 1994, there was a strike.

In 1995, they won it all.

From 1996-2000, the Yankees were far and away the best team in baseball - they won 14 freaking world series games in a row.

Since the turn of the century, the cheapkate owners have handcuffed John S. and Bobby financially, thereby ensuring that the Braves were not the best team. Almost any other manager with this team since the turn of the century, would have never made the playoffs every year.

You are watching a great “manager”. With all of the flux in players that has gone on around him, only a great people manager like Bobby Cox could have pulled it off for 14 years in a row.

By KC

March 4, 2007 12:54 PM | Link to this

Yeah Robert… what is the deal with you being 5 Berry college guys. Are you now saying that’s not the case, or are you just not ready to give up the gag. Which is it?

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 1:07 PM | Link to this

Braveheart, strong post. But you used logic with Robert. That won’t work.

By riprock3

March 4, 2007 1:15 PM | Link to this

Robert says it doesn’t matter that one opinion is more popular than another, that it doesn’t make it the right one…Well, you sure spend a lot of time in this room trying to convince the board otherwise…And as far as a bet? What do you have in mind? I’ll bet you that the Braves WILL NOT have a better record in 2009 than they will in 2008. (I hope they do, but I’m more than willing to bet you just to see if you will actually walk the walk). There’s just one catch….If you actually do want to bet, put your name and address on this site…You do and I’ll do the same. Let’s make this real. We all know your convictions about Cox, here’s your chance to back them up.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 1:23 PM | Link to this

Two outs in the first inning and Chuck has given up three hits, a walk and a run….

As I wrote that, he just got third out on a groundout to Escobar.

By the way: Johnson leading off, Escobar at shortstop batting second, B. Pena hitting third, Frenchy hitting cleanup, Thorman hitting fifth, T.J. Bohn in center and batting sixth, Langy in left batting seventh, Prado at third and batting eighth

By Gil in Mechanicsville

March 4, 2007 1:27 PM | Link to this

Now that is a bold move my friend… Checkmate….

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 1:29 PM | Link to this

Braves two runs in the second (and still batting), RBI singles by Langerhans and Prado.

By Robert

March 4, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this

Braveheart -

Bobby Knight’s teams might not always be championship caliber, but they are always better at the end of the season than at the start

Fact is that a lot of coaches/managers in a lot of sports earn reputations that are overdone one way or the other based o purely on raw win numbers, without appropriate consdieration for context

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this

Robert, I’m bemused by your assertion that “Ongoing defense of Cox is a disservice to my intellect and that it will become apparent soon enough”.

I assume that to be intended as an expression of contempt for my intellect and while I may sometime share in that appraisal … I assure you that it is more than adequate to address this situation.

I question not your veracity. If indeed the individual or collective purporting to be creator(s) of the “Robert” persona is not the genuine number one Bobby Cox detractor on the Blog, then those indulging in the devilment should be admonished and/or banned for “Identity Theft”, regardless of intent.

I do question the wisdom of constant redundant harangues.

That Bobby is certainly as flawed as any other Robert, you and me included. Bobby Cox supporters, a club in which I have membership, certainly recognize that! I doubt that there is one among us who doesn’t second guess his decisions and I’m sure everyone finds him lacking in one area or another.

However, we also recognize the complexities of both the decision making process and management of the team … find him to one of the best managers the game has seen … and we know that his perspective must, by definition, be different than that of our own.

I can well imagine that you like neither his style nor approach to the game but I seriously doubt that you do not appreciate the man’s genius as a manager.

Regardless, from my perspective, your behavior borders on the contemptible when you belabor your obvious contempt for the man and show total disregard for the feelings of those who hold him in high regard.

By hk

March 4, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this

dob …

… well, there’s an upside with the Robert deal right now, I think … in the last 24 hours, in reacting to Robert, the guys have maybe produced better posts about Bobby than they would have otherwise, at just the moment in time when they need to be our very best, sort of our gift back to Bobby … provocation makes you mad, makes you say dumb things for sure, but sometimes it gets those juices going that force you think things through better, take a little more care in choosing words to express … also there have been some excellent posts speculating how this might effect the decisions of Andruw, Smoltz, John S, Chipper, Liberty, and Brave performance for that matter …

… long and short of it, provocation can sometimes improve blog quality (for a little while, that is :))

By N8

March 4, 2007 1:44 PM | Link to this

Here’s what you are ALL failing to realize in the thought process of making a bet with Robert about the 2009 season.

1) What will ownership do at that point? Smoltz might be gone in 2009. So odds are, if I’m managing, Bobby’s managing or Tommy Lasorda is managing, without Smoltz this team more than likely will be WORSE.

2) On the other hand, maybe Francoeur and McCann are just coming into their own and dominating the NL with there sticks. Lillibridge could be up.

MANY, MANY factors that will go into the Braves in 2009.

As I’ve stated a million times (seems like it anyhow), in the regular season, the Braves may suffer without Bobby. Though I’d argue, that TP (if that’s who replaces him), has been around him enough as both player and coach to UNDERSTAND the importance of not letting the team get to high or too low. However, in the post season, Bobby seems to push all the wrong buttons. Now before you attack me, I personally place 95 percent of the BLAME on the players, in the post season failures. Example:

Did Bobby need to use Wohlers for 2 innings in 1996? Not sure. One could (and has) argued BOTH sides of that arguement. That being said, Neagle BLEW a HUGE lead in that game. And surely Bobby cannont be blamed for the HORRIBLE location of that Slider to nothing more than a GARBAGE ball hitter in Leyritz who had been late on EVERY fastball at that point. If that slider is a foot lower and to the outside more, that series may have changed right there.

As for Maddux, and Glavine. While giving credit to Glavine for quite possibly the 2nd best game ever pitched in Atlanta history (I’m still partial to Smoltz’ game vs. Morris in 1991), and surely the most IMPORTANT, it wouldn’t be a stretch to say that Maddux and Glavine BOTH were far from the dominant pitchers that they were in the regular season. So is that Bobby’s fault? Nope. Of course one COULD blame him for leaving them in too long (Maddux in game 1 of 1999 WS - comes to mind).

I don’t have a problem with Robert not liking Bobby. He’s entitled to his opinion, whether he is right or wrong.

He may be right that the Braves improve in 2009, but that may also have nothing more to with Bobby being gone, than good young talent settling in.

The ONLY way to fairly assess one manager (or head coach in football - I’ve been going round and round on the KC Chiefs boards for a year arguing the difference between Herm Edward and Dick Vermiel), is by having EVERY player on the roster remain the same, and play the same opponants under the same circumstances in which they happened for the other guy.

Of course one could argue that the coaches decisions of who plays, and who plays what role, come into play. Sure they do. That goes back to Roberts’ arguement about the 1981 Braves (managed by Bobby) and the 1982 Braves (managed by Torre) and there difference in success.

Yes, Torre switched bullpen roles around for guys (Garber, Bedrosian), and that led to better success (based on the results). But who’s to say that both of those guys wern’t just better players in 1982. NOBDOY will really know.

So in closing, I’ll say this:

Appreciate Bobby while he’s still here. Enjoy Braves Baseball NO MATTER who the manager is (we have many good young players to root for). And for those who think doom is coming once Bobby leaves. Change isn’t ALWAYS bad. Just different.

I’m gonna stop typing before my head explodes.

By Robert

March 4, 2007 1:44 PM | Link to this

DOB - This is the real Robert. To try and facilitate easier contact I have updated my email addy to a working one. To explain, I registered long ago to ajc.com and was still logging in with an email addy that hasnt been active since I moved to Oklahoma

riprock - We can work out terms for a bet, I assure you. I’ll walk the walk. I will NOT, however, post my name and address on a blog accessible by anybody. I’d also strongly discourage you from doing so. It’s just plain dumb to do so. If a way can be found for us to exchange contact info in an intelligent manner, let’s get it on

You say the Braves of ‘08 will be better than the Braves of ‘09? Correct?

Bet is a six pack of beer or favorite nonalcoholic beverage.

Spit and shake

By KC

March 4, 2007 1:56 PM | Link to this

“I will NOT, however, post my name and address on a blog accessible by anybody.”

Good idea… cause’ if any suspicious packages arrive at BC’s house, you’ll probably be the first one fingered by the FBI.

By N8

March 4, 2007 1:57 PM | Link to this

I know I rambled on in my last post, and I have stated it many times, but It doesn’t appear as though I was clear in my comments.

I’m not the biggest fan of Bobby the strategy man. In other words, I’m not sure I agree with waiting for the 3 run HR as opposed to manufacturing. I am however, willing to conceed that your ROSTER does dictate how you play, so if he doesn’t have anything but a bunch of “hackers”, what is he to do? Also, I’m not a big fan of playing the infield “in” as much as Bobby does, but what the hell do I know? LOL!

Having said that…HE is the one who gets the final say on the 25 man roster….isn’t he? So he can’t really complain about the “type” or “style” of players, when I’m sure he and JS discuss at length what type of players to draft and push through the system.

Having said ALL OF THAT (sorry), I do COMPLETELY APPRECIATE what the man did as a GM in buliding the foundation in the late 80’s. I appreciate his knack for keeping players “grounded” and focussed for 162 games. I appreciate his eye for guys that play the game correctly and his unwillingness to budge on “head cases” for the better of the team.

For the last 15 years, the Braves have been run better and CLASSIER than all professional sports teams, IMO. MUCH of that, starts and ends with Bobby. When somebody doesn’t fit the “personality” mold. They are shipped off. (Rocker, Lofton, etc…)

So don’t take my minor gripes about some of Bobby’s “decisions”, as for me not understanding what good he HAS done for the team, and development (mentally) of young players. Save Kevin McGlinchy and Joey Devine. LOL!

By Robert

March 4, 2007 2:00 PM | Link to this

Bob - dont take me the wrong way

I am not saying that your have no intellect. On the contrary - if you were dumb, you’d have no intellect to do a disservice to

“but I seriously doubt that you do not appreciate the man’s genius as a manager.”

Doubt no more, but rather KNOW - That which is nonexistant can not be appreciated

By Bob, journalist

March 4, 2007 2:02 PM | Link to this

Cardboard Box,

What’s amazing to me is what’s amazing to others … I thought the archer was just practicing and was trying to facilitate the honing of his aim and retrieval for his quiver … didn’t want him having to worry about accidently hurting someone less experienced in the art of deflection.

Not to worry, I shall let the arrows find their mark … the hot tub awaits as soon as I can adjust the volume so that I can continue to hear the game while so doing.

By riprock3

March 4, 2007 2:04 PM | Link to this

Robert…Call me dumb. My name is Anthony Richardson, and I have a PO Box at the Winder post office that i’ll be glad to give you….PO Box 812, Winder, Ga., 30684. Yes, the Braves of 2008 will be better than 2009. Or, I tell you what….Three years is a long time….Wanna make a bet on the number of wins for the Braves this year? I’ll go 85. Nonalchoholic beverages? I was thinking at least $100. Back at ya homie.

By David O'Brien

March 4, 2007 2:07 PM | Link to this

NEW BLOG IS UP … or should be shortly. I just posted it

By Robert

March 4, 2007 2:15 PM | Link to this

n8 - “it wouldn’t be a stretch to say that Maddux and Glavine BOTH were far from the dominant pitchers that they were in the regular season”

Glavine - career regular season ERA 3.46 and career playoff ERA 3.42

Maddux - 3.07 regular season and 3.34

Consider that you dont get to play the sub-.500 teams in the playoffs and I think the case is made that these guys were EVERY BIT as good in the playoffs as they were in the regular season

What you’re seeing here is that they could flat dominate with those numbers in the regular season. In the postseason, you need someone who can use them properly and to best effect. And therefore, pfffftt

“Yes, Torre switched bullpen roles around for guys (Garber, Bedrosian), and that led to better success”

Yeah, Torre put the milk in the fridge and the ice cream in the freezer, but that doesnt mean the guy who did it the other way around wasnt a great manager. Come on, man.

I probably will send Bobby a package on the big day. A big bag of carrots and two five pound bags of sugar cubes.

By Robert

March 4, 2007 2:25 PM | Link to this

riprock - I could care LESS how many games the Braves win this regular season. 85 wins. Why would I bet on 85 wins , as if that somehow defines genious in the manager?

But $100 says they dont win the World Series ever again in a season in which Cox manages for the duration of the postseason.

You can post your name and addy if you want to. I aint posting it in a public blog board. If DOB can and is willing to help, so be it

I dont expect ajc would be too pleased to have him involved in a wager facilitated by his blog

Gimme an ebay id or somesuch and I’ll contact you outside this board

I’m all about taking easy money, but I aint dumb enough to post personal info, especially since my mail comes to my home address, not to a PO Box

By Braveheart

March 4, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this

Robert, you said: Bobby Knight’s teams might not always be championship caliber, but they are always better at the end of the season than at the start

I guess what you are implying is that Bobby Cox’s teams are not better at the end than they are the beginning or middle of the season, right?

1991 - worst to first; 9.5 games out at the all star break; 2.5 games out 12 days later; division title at the end; enough in season improvement for you?

1992 - 20-27, 7 games out on May 27; 78-37 in the last 115 games; another division title; enough in season improvement for you?

1993 - 10 games out on July 22; 54-19 to close out the season; another division title; enough in season improvement for you?

1995 - 23-20, 5 games out on June 14; 67-34 to close out the season; another division title; a WORLD SERIES championship; enough in season improvement for you?

2001 - 1 game out at the All Star Break; another division title; enough in season improvement for you?

2004 - 32-38, 6.5 games out after 70 games; 45-42, 1 game out at the all star break; 64-28 to close the season; of course, another division title; enough in season improvement for you?

2005 - 32-32 after 64 games; 58-40 to close the season; of course, another division title; enough in season improvement for you?

2006 - even last year, they were 33-47 in the first 80 games; and 46-36 in the last 82 games; enough in season improvement for you?

and that’s just the data and information i can find within the last hour. i can go on if you like?

By riprock3

March 4, 2007 2:34 PM | Link to this

Robert…Sounds like you’re just chicken sheet to me….Taking easy money? I thought you liked to bet? If Cox is as stupid as you say, certainly he won’t lead this team of mis-fits to 85 wins? You got my address home skillet. USE IT.

By riprock3

March 4, 2007 2:37 PM | Link to this

Robert…We don’t need DOB to faciliate any bet…You live near Atlanta? I WILL BE MORE THAN HAPPY to meet you in person to “spit and shake” if that’s what you want to do.

By KC

March 4, 2007 2:40 PM | Link to this

Anyone care to share your division/WC picks? Here are mine:

NATIONAL LEAGUE

East: Braves

Central: Cardinals (but only by default)

West: Dodgers

Wild Card: Mets

Honorable mention: Padres could be in the thick of both the division and Wild Card races to the end. The Phillies could be a serious post-season contender as well, but only if Freddy Garcia and Cole Hamels have big years.

AMERICAN LEAGUE:

East: Red Sox (Unless Clemens returns to NY)

Central: Tigers

West: Angels

Wild Card: Yankees

Honorable mention: The Twins can’t be counted out.

By riprock3

March 4, 2007 2:49 PM | Link to this

Here’s mine KC - NL East - Philly, Central - Cubs, West - Padres Wild card - Braves AL East - Red Sox, Central - Cleveland, West - Angels Wild card - Yankees

By hk

March 4, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this

… Braves up 3-1 through 5 … too early to tell, but some of the to-date batting avg stats are interesting: Johnson .167

Escobar .500

Pena .400

Francoeur .333

Thorman .286

Langy .286

Prado .571

Betemit .000

… current Box Score:

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/boxscore.jsp?gid=20070304atlmlblanmlb_1

By Steve-O

March 4, 2007 3:09 PM | Link to this

AWESOME!

By N8

March 4, 2007 3:09 PM | Link to this

Robert

I read your point and didn’t believe you. I figured that Maddux’s dominance in regular season ERA from 93-98 would’ve been FAR superior to his post-season ERA. It’s not much off.

Regular Season from 93-98:

336 ER, 1406 IP = 2.15 ERA & he was 107-42 in the W-L column.

Post Season from 93-98:

33 ER, 122.66 IP = 2.42 EAR & he was 9-7 in the W-L column.

So I appologize. I figured it wa MUCH worse than that. He did what was asked of him. Seems our hitters couldn’t get the big hit off of the Schillings, Cones, Clemens, Livians, Browns, Hitchcock’s of the world to get the job done. YIKES!

I won’t bother looking up Glavine’s stats, I’ll assume they’re similar.

Carrots & sugar cubes? Nice. As ridiculous as you are, you make me chuckle.

By Robert

March 4, 2007 3:09 PM | Link to this

riprock, I live in Lawton Oklahoma.

Braveheart - With the Braves losing before they should have in the playoffs so many years, I cant say they were better at the end than at the start

I was referring to are they a better team at the end of their season than the day they showed up to spring training, not first half vs second half

By Braveheart

March 4, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this

Bobby Knight has appeared in the tournament 26 times over the past 40 years. He has won three national championships in about 40 years as a coach - one every 13 years. He has lost in the tournament 23 times. Knight is a great coach but so is Bobby Cox. Keep deluding yourself that Bobby Knight’s team got so much better during the course of a season as opposed to Bobby Cox’s teams