Braves

By erik

June 21, 2006 11:51 AM | Link to this

I think that Sosa might be good from the bullpen in a long or middle relief role. I had been pleased with the work that Paronto was doing in that role up until this week. Now I’m not so sure…

By Larry

June 21, 2006 11:53 AM | Link to this

The only way Thomson can help is by staying on the D.L.and Sosa in the pen sounds like a decent idea at this point.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 11:54 AM | Link to this

What does it matter who is pitching?

The donkey managing the team couldnt win it all but one time with THREE HOF starters.

Being stuck with Sosa aint the issue

Continuing to stick ourselves with d******* Cox is.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 11:57 AM | Link to this

Look for my new website to debut soon - dedicated to getting Bobby Cox fired

www.donkeyinthedugout.com

By DonkeeBallz

June 21, 2006 11:57 AM | Link to this

What about Donkeeballz? We should try to re-sign Otis Nixon once he gets out of jail, need more speed at the top of the lineup instead of that 8 year old in disguise Willy Gilly.

By sepulthrax

June 21, 2006 12:05 PM | Link to this

Why can’t they just send Sosa to Richmond along with half of the bullpen and call up some of the kids in AA & AAA? They can’t be any worse. Other MLB teams don’t have a problem using our minor league picthers on their staffs. Just look at Miner in Detroit, Belisle in Cincinnati, Wainwright in St. Louis and Capellan in Milwaukee. Imagine if we still had those guys.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 12:06 PM | Link to this

Sosa has pitched fairly well this year. Did you watch the bullpen lose yet another gamne last night or do you blame it on Sosa ? Braves problem is one word : BULLPEN.

By Larry

June 21, 2006 12:11 PM | Link to this

I couldn’t agree with Robert anymore. Bobby Cox is a complete idiot! Any retard could have won at least 1 world series title with the teams that the GREAT DONKEY has had over the last 15 years. Why in the world would DONKEY COX keep bunting late in the game to try and tie the score, wasting an out, knowing that the bullpen is absolutely atrocious. Does BIG EARS think that if he ties the game in the 7th, or, even goes ahead by a run, that the bullpen is capable of holding a lead? I guess PRATT will be starting tonight since the Jays are starting a “lefty”.Too bad Jordan is hurt; I’m sure “THE DONK” would love to have his SIZZLING bat in the line-up tonight. “WHEW”!!!!!!

By Billy

June 21, 2006 12:30 PM | Link to this

Dont you guys get tired of the same rants everyday…..”the braves shouldve won more than one world series”. We get point already. People like this is what ruins a great idea by the newspaper…….too bad we dont have law to stop ignorant and stupid use of the feedom of speech……rember its a right AND a responsibility.

By Bobby Cox

June 21, 2006 12:35 PM | Link to this

Ever notice when the camera is on me in the dugout, and you frequently see a finger or two up my nose? Here’s a little inside information that Tony LaRussa would love to know! One finger up the nose means Remmy is about to enter the game. Two fingers means Reitsma is coming in.

Boy I miss Reitsma ! We could have used him in that Red Sox series for sure. He’s been looking sharp throwing batting practice. He struck Frenchie out on three pitches. He’ll be a big help during the pennant run.

Remember Brad Clontz? Our scouts spotted him in a church softball league and they say he looks like the Clontzie of old. Look for a big anouncement from Davey O’Brien in a few days.

By SR

June 21, 2006 12:41 PM | Link to this

The primary problem with this team is most certainly the bullpen but the team’s problems go far beyond that, they simply are not good enough!! Look at the different ways they find to lose every night for evidence. They lose games when starting pitching is sub-par, (most nights. They lose games when any member of the retread bullpen comes within 10 feet of the mound (every night). They lose games by 1 run, they lose games by 5 runs. They lose games when they don’t hit. (most nights) They lose games when someone throws the ball away. They lose games when they cannot advance a runner via a bunt or by hitting the ball to the right side. They lose games when they set the world record for strikeouts. (every night) Begin to see a trend? Get the picture??

Bad, bad team. There are ample reasons they are in last place, it is not simply bad luck, they have earned it.

By Michael

June 21, 2006 12:48 PM | Link to this

The Braves staff miss Mazzone. They are nont going to admit it. This guy McDowell hasn’t showm me nothing. Massone had revived the careers of many pitchers. Where would Jared Wright and Chris Hamilton be today without Mazzone. The Braves were stupid to let him get away.

By Hal

June 21, 2006 12:57 PM | Link to this

SR

couldent agree more with your post ! Also the long term planning if there was any leaves much to be desired.How can any major league team commit 60 mil to 5 players and propose winning on a Budget of 80 mil ?Unless my math sucks really bad that leaves 20 mil for 20 roster spots

I dont see a whole bunch of major league caliber pitchers making 1 mil a year

the ones in OUR bullpen probably are making less then that but then they deserve less then that actually they deserve to be in triple A

No Bullpen, No lead off man ,no real first baseman or left fielder.Genus at work constructing this team

By rowland

June 21, 2006 12:58 PM | Link to this

When they call up James, will they send down Cormier? As long as Thomson is out, they have to keep Sosa and Ramirez in the rotation, don’t they? And none of this addresses the greater problem, the bullpen. Yeesh. I’m not pushing the Smoltz rumor, but Detroit’s closer has an ERA over six. They have a solid rotation, but you wonder - just wonder - if Smoltz would be tempted to close for his home state team. And, if so, what would the Braves get to make it worthwhile?

By braves fan

June 21, 2006 01:00 PM | Link to this

Mazzone is a good pitching coach, but the Braves miss him about as much as the Orioles are loving him right now. Ever check the stats? Guess not. The O’s as every bit as bad as the Braves. They have a team ERA of 5.31 while ATL has a 4.85 team ERA. Oh yeah, Mazzone is the reason. Gimme a break.

By Jim J

June 21, 2006 01:02 PM | Link to this

I don’t know what everyone else saw last night but I saw this:

Bobby Cox is two years away from yelling at a big screen TV in the family room of an assisted living center.

Chipper Jones is the laziest player in major league baseball. How can you continue to watch McCann and Francouer play with drive and some spirit only to have Chipper p** on the fire?

Andruw Jones is on the decline. Peter Gammons was right on when he said the years of diving and flopping have taken their toll on Andruw. Trade him now, light a fire under everybody else, and tell Chipper he’s gone if he doesn’t get some life about him. Langerhans, Francouer, or Betemit can handle center field.

Every time the Braves have to go to the bullpen, I have to go to the bathroom. (For an extended cleansing.) I think Smoltz is just smart enough to push the organization by saying he’s ready to go. Would you be ready to go if the bullpen had cost you 6 wins? Bring in 6 finger Alfonseco and the stars from Richmond and Pearl. Cut the whole bullpen and send them packing.

This years team makes Rod Gilbreath look like Charlie Hustle. Bring back Barry Bonnell and Bob Beall………….

By gulag

June 21, 2006 01:02 PM | Link to this

1. Caught part of last night’s game on the radio. Sounded like lady luck might start smiling on us early in the game when McCann reached on a strikeout/wildpitch and Francoeur followed with a bloop single. My question: was it a mental error when McCann did not tag up and advance on the next fly ball out to left center (first out of the inning)? If so, he could have scored on the next fly ball out to deep center.

2. What is that 8 in a row? Only 13 more to equal the longest losing steak in the modern era.

3. Let’s get some “color” back into the radio commentary. Even Chip, Don, Pete and Skip seem to snoozing along with the team.

4. Go bravos. You’ll figure it out — hopefully sooner, rather than later.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 01:03 PM | Link to this

I’m confused - when you want Reitsma is that two fingers up the SAME nostril or one finger in EACH nostril?

What does it mean when you have your finger up your behind?

Does that mean you are about to make a managerial movement?

By Kent

June 21, 2006 01:11 PM | Link to this

Andruw Jones on the decline???? The guys is 29 years!!! And he has barely spent any time on the DL in his career. You’re crazy!

By the way, Andruw doesn’t dive for flyballs any more than the average center fielder. What makes him such a great outfielder are his instincts and the kind of jump he gets when he’s going after a ball. He get to balls standing up that most outfielders are forced to dive for or might not be able to get to at all.

By Larry

June 21, 2006 01:13 PM | Link to this

Hey Billy;HEE-HAW HEE-HAW HEE-HAW!!!!! One title in 15 years; TRAGIC! You cant fire the whole team;fire the “DONK” Do it now!!

By Kent

June 21, 2006 01:15 PM | Link to this

…”years old. Sorry

By Billy

June 21, 2006 01:18 PM | Link to this

LOL…….how many of you people hated Furcal When (not now) he left. I bet it the same ones who says trade chipper. LOL. I cant belive some of the Braves fans are this disloyal and ignorant on how things work. One lossing season and throw everyone to the wolves, who cares what they mean to the team. I would never boo my home team like some other fans (Philli for one) would. Not to mention jettison them for having a rough streacth……I cant understand how you can be fan of the game being as fickle as you are. Makes me think you have no idea about baseball.

By THL

June 21, 2006 01:25 PM | Link to this

Sosa has closer stuff but his location just kills him. I don’t know if he’s trying to tone down his pitches do he can last longer in the games or what. Who knows, maybe if he goes back to the bullpen and just brings it as hard as he can for an inning, it might just work. The results couldn’t be any worse than his or the other relievers performances to date.

By Woodrow

June 21, 2006 01:26 PM | Link to this

I know what is wrong with this ball club. ever since Jeff Torborg started his “color” (or lack thereof) commentary on television, the Braves have been losing. When he went on vacation in May and Ron Gnat took his place, the Bravos started winning. Send Torborg to Richmond or Pearl!

By Guy that doesnt suck c**

June 21, 2006 01:40 PM | Link to this

You D.U.M.B.A.S.S Sosa wouldnt be able to help the bullpen? Your f*** crazy! At least he went the first 4 innings without giving up a run which he has for most of the season. Our bullpen right now cant even get 3 outs in an inning without giving up at least 1 run.

MOVE SOSA TO BULLPEN NOW

By Billy

June 21, 2006 01:45 PM | Link to this

Larry,

How old are you?

I have no expectations that you will answer that question. If your wondering if you comments get to me……well the answer is sort of….it annoying like when a little kid keeps bugging you with all the question they have….its annoying and thats about it. Further, I get relief knowing the fact that you garner no respect amoung adults that frequent this blog. Which you would probably would reply to that, correct me if I’m wrong, you dont care what other people think about you. Which if you belive that your only fooling your self. My belief is that you posted your ignorant (not stupid) words in hopes of getting a reaction. Now lets ask this question. What makes a person post such ignorant stuff in order to get a reaction. In my exeperince the reason is to garner attetion on ones self. Which make me and probably other wonder why you need so much attention from a buch of Braves fan. I doubt you answer that question with any logic at all because I belive you have low self esteem and no pride about your self so you attempt ot cover that up by making ridicouls post. You should honestly care what other think about you to a certain extent. If people respect you, you more than likely will get a favorable response from them which will make you feel all warm and fuzzy inside which by your words you have typed you despartely need. But again I completly expect you to make another post with no thought or pride in what your doing. So I wont reply to you anymore but take my words serious and you may find your self better off in life.

or

Shut the F%#K up

By Antonio McNugget

June 21, 2006 01:56 PM | Link to this

**DOB,

Who would win in a no holds barred steel cage match between you and Mark Bowman?**

Just wondering.

By Sammy Kershaw

June 21, 2006 02:03 PM | Link to this

Robert

You are a raging irrational douchebag. Why dont you do us a favor and pull for another team.

By Glass Half Full

June 21, 2006 02:05 PM | Link to this

Taking a page from ESPN and Fox Sports, we should all start unfounded and ridiculous trade rumors just to see how far they fly. I’ll start: Pete Orr and Chris Reitsma to the Yankees for Alex Rodriguez AND Chien Ming Wang; Chipper would then accept a trade to the Devil Rays for Scott Kazmir and Carl Crawford.

By Sammy Kershaw

June 21, 2006 02:06 PM | Link to this

Larry, same for you as well. Grow up and stop being a jackass. Your the donkey, b***.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 02:10 PM | Link to this

Let me get this right.

Because I think our manager is not a good one, that means I am not a fan

Makes sense, if you’re a donkey like Bobby Cox

By nathan

June 21, 2006 02:16 PM | Link to this

kent

my opinion is closr to yours on Andruw being in decline than it is to Gammons. Though I believe Gammons is a VERY intelligent baseball man. So it makes you wonder.

However, I have noticed towards the end of last year and throughout the beginning (it’s not early anymore) of this year, Andruw has had way more balls hit over his head than in years past.

The only other thing I can think of to attribute this to other than declining skills, is pitchers not hitting there “spots” or lack of execution in “pitching to how the defense is set”.

Either way, if andruw is in decline, 80-90 percent of andruw defensively is better than most. Just not sure if he’s worth 15 million dollars.

Did anybody see Gammons comment on sunday night about how andruw takes 17 percent of the teams payroll, and that NO TEAM HAS EVER WON THE WORLD SERIES with a player taking up as much as 16 percent of the payroll.

This is why I think one or more of Andruw, Chipper, Hudson, or Smoltz has to go. It’s not that they are “worthless” or I don’t want them on the team anymore. It’s just that if the new ownership is going to keep the payroll around 80 million dollars, I think this years team is a good glimpse into the future of what the “rest” of the roster and bullpen will look like if so much of the payroll is taken up by 4 or 5 guys. (I’m including Hampton)

But, having said that, I think they should wait until the “new” ownership takes over, see what they are willing to spend on payroll. If they are willing to add 20 million to the payroll, well then heck, keep these guys around and just add some more talent. I’ve got no problem with Smoltz, Chipper and Andruw (who I don’t think we’ll keep when he’s a FA after next year) wanting to finish their careers here. They and we have earned that right to root for that. But, I don’t want to watch horrible baseball for the next three years, just because a couple of guys don’t want to leave. But I think we’ve seen with the comments from Chipper and Smoltz that they LOVE this organization enough to not want to become a hinderance to the payroll and future of the club.

This year is over. If JS even tries to salvage this season by trading prospects for anybody that doesn’t fit into the longterm plans for building a new team, I’m gonna be p*ssed! Give Up. Wait for this miserable season to end, and assess it later.

I firmly believe that if we still wanted to “dump” for lack of better words, all of the mentioned veterans, it could still be done in the offseason. (with exception to maybe Chipper - too much money left on that deal!)

I’m ready for new blood. I also think we could recieve A LOT for Smoltz. But if the new ownership was willing to ad payroll, would the people who are yelling TRADE HIM (myself included - for the better of the future), really have a problem with keeping him around for a measly 8 million. That’s cheap people.

So I’m sure that didn’t clear anything up on my opinion! I’m on the fence, I’ll support whatever the decisions are, as long as they are made with the future in mind, not this season!

By Glass Half Full

June 21, 2006 02:18 PM | Link to this

Jorge Sosa and John Thomson for Nick Swisher and Barry Zito?

By Dr. Jay

June 21, 2006 02:19 PM | Link to this

My my my…such f#@%#&% language… Is it just me, or does Sosa look like the outfielder you bring in to pitch when the game is a blowout…? He just slings it up there, as if to say “try and hit this”… and they do.

By Sammy Kershaw

June 21, 2006 02:21 PM | Link to this

Robert when you say irrational immature ridiculous things it makes you a raging douchebag. Sorry should have clarified.

By Larry

June 21, 2006 02:23 PM | Link to this

Now, calm down, Billy; You ‘re probably one of those who never played ball, so, you really dont understand how to play the game. I, on the other hand, have played pro. ball, against the likes of Don Mattingly, Sal Bano’s little brother, Chris, and several others who made it to the big leagues. If you’re a Bobby Cox fan, good for you; you obviously dont know any better. By the way, I’m 45 years old, and have been a Braves fan since 1969, even when I played in the Reds Organization, in the early 80’s. Anyway, this is not about me or your immature comments; bottom line is the Braves are not playing like a professional major league team presently, and that reflects upon management.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 02:25 PM | Link to this

Sammy, i’m not agreeing or disagreeing with you. (frankly i find the jacka$$ stuff kinda funny)

But when you turn around and call larry a douchebag……..sorry to tell you pal, you are personally attacking him based on his opinion of Bobby (and Bobby is very debatable)……so tel me, what’s the differnce between you and larry?

By Todd A

June 21, 2006 02:26 PM | Link to this

C’mon people…get a freakin’ clue.Y’all know that the playoffs are a crap-shoot(sarcasm).

By nathan

June 21, 2006 02:26 PM | Link to this

sorry sammy, i just read again and realized that you called Robert the douchebag…..I’m completely OK with that!

Just kidding Robert. LOL!

By ernesto

June 21, 2006 02:31 PM | Link to this

Sosa hasn’t been great, okay he’s been terrible. But he’s shown flashes, why not put him in long relief. I think he has trouble maintaining, but for an inning or three…give it a shot. He can’t be any worse than what we’ve got out there now.

By matt

June 21, 2006 02:33 PM | Link to this

tired of listening to all you whiny a$$ fair weather fans. Cox and JS have done nothing except put a winning team on the field year after year. Andruw should of left a couple years ago but gave the Braves one hell of a hometown break by creating the contract on his own and not allowing Scott Boras in on the meeting till after everything was in agreement. This right after Arod getting stupid amounts of money. We do have a team that could compete right now with a couple of changes and everyone seems to think that this season is already done. IT ISN’T EVEN THE ALL STAR BREAK YET! So why don’t all of you go down to the stadium and support your team instead of being the same fans who didn’t even fill the seats during the playoffs. Again leave Andruw alone he is still the best center fielder to ever play the game.

By Sammy Kershaw

June 21, 2006 02:33 PM | Link to this

Not the opinion the thought process behind it, or lack there of.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 02:36 PM | Link to this

i agree ernest…..been sayin it since last year. He seem to get through the order once with out trouble most of the time. That just screams relief! Of course he gets BOMBED in the first inning every now and then and I think that’s what bobby is afraid of. Actually, that probably doesn’t scare Bobby at all, because that sure hasn’t stopped him from bringin Reitsma and company in. But what I was getting at is that he has very electric stuff, which you want your relievers to have IMO, but we’d have to live with the occasional meltdown I’m afraid!

By Sammy Kershaw

June 21, 2006 02:37 PM | Link to this

see matt’s post was an opinion. Not irrational and raging garbage.

By Rob

June 21, 2006 02:38 PM | Link to this

I say give Sosa as shot at closer. What would it hurt. He was doing great through 3 innings last night. Remember, people were ready to hang Eric Gagne as a starter, he was brutal. Then they moved him to the closer, and he was lights out. Let’s give it a shot while we have nothing to lose.

By T Robb

June 21, 2006 02:40 PM | Link to this

Sosa’s ERA and Batting average against:

Leadoff: 2.45 .222

1st Inn: 2.77 .234

2nd Inn: 6.23 .309

3rd Inn: 6.57 .300

4th Inn: 6.00 .358

5th Inn: 4.66 .282

6th Inn: 7.88 .382

1st 9: 3.16 .243

2nd 9: 7.13 .340

3rd 9: 7.16 .366

Sosa is effective early in games. Only when his pitch counts get high does he tire, lose his arm slot and command. He belongs in the pen; maybe even as the closer

By nathan

June 21, 2006 02:44 PM | Link to this

I hear you sammy. But I (and I realize it’s just me - mister sarcastic! LOL) still think it’s funny.

Take it from sombody who loves to annoy people, you just fuel us on by reacting. If you are really that bothered by it or other posts like it, skip over them and ignore them. But I suspect you enjoy reacting to them, even if it is just a little!

Though I do have to say, judging by how often I post, and my posts are loaded with sarcasm, I just keep going. Even if I’m not getting any reaction! I’ve got no more friends around here that are still Braves fans, they all gave up long ago. So I’ve gotta “VENT” somewhere! LOL.

Back to ernest. I read somewhere this spring that Sosa was “praising” Leo. Maybe we should trade him to Baltimore for Kris Benson…..then at least we’d have Anna to look at! Her antics might be a silver lining of “entertainment” since the baseball these days isn’t worth watching!

Could you IMAGINE Bobby commenting on her?

“Aw, shucks, she’a sweet gal……..”

I could go on and be much funnier, but it would be borderline lude and crude. So do to the possiblities of young kids being on here, I’ll back off. Use your imagination!

By Chop Chop

June 21, 2006 02:44 PM | Link to this

I don’t trust Sosa in any role. Just because he might not give up a run in the first inning or two of his starts doesn’t mean that he’ll come in from the ‘pen and pitch well. Sosa is a bad pitcher. The old saying, “Million-dollar arm, ten-cent brain”, applies to him, so why waste any further appearances on him? Dump him off on some team and get a crappy reliever in return. The Braves made their bed with sorry relievers and untrustworthy pitchers at the back end of the rotation, so they have to get whatever they can in return for them.

By Billy

June 21, 2006 02:45 PM | Link to this

Larry,

I could care less if you played pro ball as I dont see the relevence theat it had in the discussion (thats had not intentions of insulting you). For some reason you are trying to spin it up as im mad where I clearly stated I was annoyed. I am surprised you answered the question…..I may have misjudged you. However, fact that you defend this post which was directed at me leaves somthing to be desired, see below

By Larry

June 21, 2006 01:13 PM | Link to this

Hey Billy;HEE-HAW HEE-HAW HEE-HAW!!!!! One title in 15 years; TRAGIC! You cant fire the whole team;fire the “DONK” Do it now!!

If you want please explain the purpose of directing this to me? My comments before stand…..

By Todd

June 21, 2006 02:51 PM | Link to this

Ok, I think today’s witty repartee has finally killed this blog for me. Thanks for your reporting, DOB, and to a select few of you who have always had something intelligent and insightful to say. To the rest of you, congratulations for helping this blog make sports talk radio look like a Federal Reserve meeting by comparison.

By Billy

June 21, 2006 02:53 PM | Link to this

oh yeah….what was immature about my comments…….I merely stated my opinions on your comments….which if you were to take a poll about the post im refering to about you and my post lets see which one gets more votes for being immature.

Peace Bro

By Chop Chop

June 21, 2006 02:54 PM | Link to this

T Robb,

Do you honestly believe that Sosa would come in and pitch well with pressure? Mark Twain, who attributed this phrase to British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli, said it best: “There are three kinds of lies: Lies, damned lies, and statistics.” I think Sosa’s stats from the first two innings of games in 2006 are exemplified by that quote. Sosa was “Houdini” last year as a starter. His luck ran out this year. Since last year was the only year he ever had any luck as a pitcher, you have to assume that the guy is hopeless. While it would be well worth pulling him out of the starting rotation, I don’t think I want to see him coming in and giving up gopher balls from the ‘pen. I just want him gone. Guys who consistently fail are not going to help this team get better this year. After all, there are lots of guys out there who have great arms and no understanding of how to use them. Sosa’s just one in a long line of ‘em.

By KneeJerk

June 21, 2006 02:56 PM | Link to this

I, along with several others stopped paying attention to Robert’s posts long ago. All he does is call names and ignore logical questions when asked them. Maybe Bobby turned him down for an autograph or something. I don’t know.

By Dr. Jay

June 21, 2006 02:57 PM | Link to this

Dang tootin’…Sosa as closer when Chuck James gets back. Do it Bobby!!!!!!!!

By KneeJerk

June 21, 2006 02:58 PM | Link to this

To disagree with a manager’s decisions is common. To resort the name-calling is, well…childish.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 03:00 PM | Link to this

In all fairness, I bet you agree with his opinion, so it’s easier for you to accept it.

As far as me getting out to the games to fill the empty seats. Kinda hard to do, I live about 3000 miles away. I do travel usually twice a year to see them (Milwakee and Colorado if they happen to be on the schedule in the Summer months. This year they didn’t so I’m not going. This has gone on for the last 10 years or so. So think before you post that!

If I lived in Atlanta, I’d probably go to just as many if not more games than you go to, whether they were stinking or not.

As far as Andruw being a good deal because Arod got stupid money. You better think before you start comparing apples and oranges. What AROD got, has nothing to do with what anybody else is worth. Texas wanted and thought they had to get him at all costs. From what I’ve heard they got about 225 million dollars to sell the naming right to the “ballpark”. So Tom Hicks made his money back on the Arod Deal. Didn’t cost him a thing!

But more so, here is what I’m talking about:

Albert Pujols: 2005 - 41 Home Runs & 117 RBI, his 2006 salary: $14,000,000

Adam Laroche: 2005 - 20 Home Runs & 78 RBI.

what’s my point you may ask? Well, by the way I see it, Adam’s stats were about half the numbers of Pujols. Are you saying that you’d have no problem paying LaRoche $7,000,000 dollars? Didn’t think so! And get this, in reality, Adam is probably a better defensive 1B than Pujols. Just thought I’d through that out there, cuz I knew you probably would throw Andruw’s defense into the equation!

By Voice of Reason

June 21, 2006 03:01 PM | Link to this

This blog used to be a great place to exchange information and discuss opinions. It has devolved into a cesspool of juvenile wannabe comedians with little self-control and even less self-respect. To the few remaining bloggers who remain above the crap-line, it has been fun. To the rest of you, ya’ll can have it—

By nathan

June 21, 2006 03:03 PM | Link to this

In all fairness, I bet you agree with his opinion, so it’s easier for you to accept it.

As far as me getting out to the games to fill the empty seats. Kinda hard to do, I live about 3000 miles away. I do travel usually twice a year to see them (Milwakee and Colorado if they happen to be on the schedule in the Summer months. This year they didn’t so I’m not going. This has gone on for the last 10 years or so. So think before you post that!

If I lived in Atlanta, I’d probably go to just as many if not more games than you go to, whether they were stinking or not.

As far as Andruw being a good deal because Arod got stupid money. You better think before you start comparing apples and oranges. What AROD got, has nothing to do with what anybody else is worth. Texas wanted and thought they had to get him at all costs. From what I’ve heard they got about 225 million dollars to sell the naming right to the “ballpark”. So Tom Hicks made his money back on the Arod Deal. Didn’t cost him a thing!

But more so, here is what I’m talking about:

Albert Pujols: 2005 - 41 Home Runs & 117 RBI, his 2006 salary: $14,000,000

Adam Laroche: 2005 - 20 Home Runs & 78 RBI.

what’s my point you may ask? Well, by the way I see it, Adam’s stats were about half the numbers of Pujols. Are you saying that you’d have no problem paying LaRoche $7,000,000 dollars? Didn’t think so! And get this, in reality, Adam is probably a better defensive 1B than Pujols. Just thought I’d through that out there, cuz I knew you probably would throw Andruw’s defense into the equation!

By Vinnie Boombotz

June 21, 2006 03:07 PM | Link to this

Trade Hudson and Smoltz to the Mets, you’ll get some nice minor league talent to build off of there, cut Chipper outright and send Andrew Jones to the track so his fat as* can do some laps…

By nathan

June 21, 2006 03:07 PM | Link to this

sorry guys, not sure why that posted twice!

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:11 PM | Link to this

We are still within striking distance of the Wild Card, but I still think It’s definitely time to give up on this season.

The Braves don’t need bullpen help, they need to construct an almost entirely new bullpen. In my view, the only Braves relievers that should still be around next season are Ken Ray, McKay McBride, and possibly Phil Stockman (if he proves himself this year). There’s too much wrong to fix this thing on the fly. But they can get it done between now the start of next season. Also remember that Blaine Boyer should be healthy and ready to go in the spring. As long as the bullpen is fixed (or reconstructed) there are good things in store for Braves fans next season.

Here’s why next season will be the year the Braves finally get back on the World Series stage:

1-Shuerholz and company will make fixing the bullpen their top priority, both before the trade deadline this year, and in the offseason.

2-Most pitchers now-a-days who have a full 18 months to recover from Tommy John surgery (as Mike Hampton will have between now and spring training) have far less arm trouble than they did in the years leading up to the surgery. Look for Hampton to have his best year since his pre-Denver days.

3-All of the Braves big guns (Smoltz, Hudson, and the Jonses’) are likely to have better seasons than they are having right now. The next 3 months of the season will give Atlanta an opportunity to find more offense from within the organization and try them out at the big league level. Scott Thorman might be the guy they’re looking for, but in any case I believe they will find a way to improve the Braves offense for next season

My prediction: next year Atlanta will return to pitching dominance and will finish with one of the 5 lowest team ERA’s in baseball. The offense will be solid. And the big 3 (Smoltz, Hudson, Hampton) will lead Atlanta back to the World Series.

By matt

June 21, 2006 03:12 PM | Link to this

You have got to be kidding .. compare la roche to pujols! I was saying that Andruw could have gotten close to Arod money and that was what the Yankees and Scott Boras were thinking. Andruw showed loyalty to his organization which is extremely rare in baseball or any sport for that matter. As far as living in Atlanta or 3000 miles away doesn’t matter, support the team in any way that you can. Quit all the whining and stick with constructive thoughts.

By TennesseePaul

June 21, 2006 03:13 PM | Link to this

I think Pujols’s millions are earned by the fact that, he hits .333 and every year his strike outs get fewer and fewer and his walks go higher and higher. Plus, he’s probably the greatest hitter ever. It’s early in his career, but so far, the start of his career is unparalleled in the history of the game.
I just wish he was a Brave.

I certainly can’t wait for the 10 day window JS is using. We have to win one game sometime. This is getting ridiculous. The hitting could be better. They blew a few good opportunities. But at the same time, It’s like that bullpen just doesn’t want to see a W get posted anywhere near a Brave. As soon as we get back in it, they ramble on out to the mound and toss a few juicy steaks up there.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:17 PM | Link to this

TennesseePaul, Mmmm… A juicy steak sounds good! Do you have Christ Reitsma’s phone#?

By krath

June 21, 2006 03:17 PM | Link to this

To borrow an idea from a screen name here “glass half full,” when you’re 15 out,why not do some experimenting? Have some fun since the only luxury is NOT being in a pennant race.

Why not try Sosa as a closer? Ken Ray hasn’t exactly been lights out his last couple of appearances giving up runs each time.

Look at Eric Gagne.’ He had little success as a starter. Moved him to the bullpen and said “you’re the guy” and he has been lights out when healthy. Who knows, it may only take giving Sosa the shot to make it work. Or….. it may be a dismal failure but at 14 1/2 out….what do ya have to lose?

By PeterNY

June 21, 2006 03:17 PM | Link to this

I’m a Mets fan. I’ve been checking this blog lately to see if there was any news on potential Braves trades—you know, just sort of keeping an eye on the competition. What I cannot BELIEVE, however, is the absolute immaturity of many posters on this board. In New York, we talk baseball. Here, I’ve lost count of the posts calling your manager a donkey, insulting the players, insulting other posters, using profanity, etc. I mean, if you specifically come here to fill a post with line after line of “hee-haw,” you have needs in your life that baseball simply won’t be able to fill. And, if this is how you all handle losing, you never deserved to win in the first place.

No wonder your team doesn’t seem to be playing hard for its “fans” right now. Why would they?

My apologies to all the true Braves fans out there—it’s just a shame you can’t be in the majority on this board. I really don’t know why the newspaper doesn’t just shut it down, to be honest. It’s an embarrassment to the team and to the people who read it.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:18 PM | Link to this

I can agree that the offense and starting pitching fail sometimes. But the bullpen fails “ALL THE TIME”. I’ve never seen such a bunch of losers on one team in the bullpen since the late 70’s Braves team. I’d release them all except McBride and call up minor leaguers.

By krath

June 21, 2006 03:21 PM | Link to this

Forgot to make one point about moving Sosa to closer….. don’t put him out there for middle relief…that’s about how long he is lasting now. Tell him you want all he’s got for one inning and one inning only. If he pukes, you’re not out anything.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:23 PM | Link to this

OOOPS, I accidential called Chris Reitsma “Christ” Reitsma. Mistake. I swear I wasn’t trying to be funny.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:23 PM | Link to this

Why not try Sosa as closer ? Reitsma and K.Ray can’t do the job. Give someone a chance to come thru if you have to audition 10 pitchers for closer.

By TrueBlueBravesFan

June 21, 2006 03:26 PM | Link to this

Wow. I actually agree with a Mets Fan. Amen PeterNY.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:26 PM | Link to this

krath, I don’t know about the Sosa-closer thing, but I’m will you on the experimentation thing. Let’s look on the bright side. That’s the beauty of not worrying about a penant race… you can experiment as well as try out some young now so you don’t have to experiment at the start of next season when wins and losses will mean something again.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:28 PM | Link to this

I can hear Bob Uecker now if he were a Braves announcer : “Here’s comes Reitsma the Loser, oh I meant Closer but I accidentally left the “C” off.” “Here’s Adam LaRoche, you know LaRoche means “The Roach” translated. Adam has bewen getting squished by the opposing pitching lately too…”

By jon

June 21, 2006 03:32 PM | Link to this

I agree PeterNY and I’m a freaking Braves fan! You know the southern redneck has to come out of these people. Lord forbid they just be happy with what Bobby Cox has done for us. The FEW fans that get on this blog make Atlanta a laughing stock

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:33 PM | Link to this

This just in… Jorge Sosa has now officially given up more round trips than that Wendy’s-Airtran promotion!

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:33 PM | Link to this

Hey Guy Curtright, why haven’t we read anything (comments) from JS and Bobby Cox in the newspaper lately about the current losing streak ? Do they think being silent will make it all go away ? Sometimes you need to bash players to get them to respond.

By matt

June 21, 2006 03:34 PM | Link to this

as a braves fan … thank you peter from ny

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:34 PM | Link to this

…And we’re racking up the frequent loser miles.

By krath

June 21, 2006 03:35 PM | Link to this

I agree with you Kent, it’s as rogdawg said as well…. run 10 guys out there if you have to and give them a shot. Don’t give the guys 3 shots to prove they can pitch in the clutch, give them a couple of shots then move on! If they can pitch under pressure of knowing they only have a couple of shots then that’s what you’re after.

I’m not slamming Bobby or anyone when I say that I don’t totally agree with patience and not putting pressure on players. Heck that’s what the game is! Performance under pressure! If you don’t perform under pressure you don’t win. The closer role illustrates that more than any other position.

Only one problem….. we’ve already run 10 guys out there in the bullpen and none of them can stop the opposition in the 6th inning much less the 9th! lol

Guess we need to scour the independent leagues for some fresh meat hehehe

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:38 PM | Link to this

Well in response to the Mets fan he’s right about the name-calling being wrong. But when his Mets win 14 straight division titles and then look like the Mets have looked the last 14 years then he will know how we feel. He must have been so used to the Mets losing that he became immune to anger.

By matt

June 21, 2006 03:41 PM | Link to this

robdawg continuing to show the class of these posts

By tigger101023

June 21, 2006 03:42 PM | Link to this

Sosa can’t handle pressure? Nonsense. Look at what he pitched out of last year. His start in Houston (NLDS) last year wasn’t bad at all. We’ve had headcases, but he isn’t one of them. I think is problem is physical, not mental. He’s slimmed down. He does pretty well the first time through the order. I think he could do very well in the bullpen.

You better believe I’d take a flyer on him as set-up or even closer. Why not?

Farnsworth, Reitsma, these are guys that may not handle pressure very well. But every mediocre pitcher does not have problems dealing with pressure.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:43 PM | Link to this

If losing doesn’t anger you Matt then you aren’t a true fan. And anger leads to expletives. Its natural.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:45 PM | Link to this

I’ve said one expletive on another post. One total. If you read my blogs you know I stick to the facts.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:46 PM | Link to this

krath, yeah there’s a big difference between the Braves now and the Braves several years ago. It used to be that Atlanta always had the money to go out and fill their needs with proven players. Now they can’t always afford to do that, and have to put players out there that they hope will do the job (Reistma and all the rookies in the bullpen).

That’s probably not going to change with another corporate owner coming in, so the Braves won’t be able to just go out and bring in solid free agents like they used to. But ir is good news for next year’s team that Bobby Cox will have a chance to get a look at everything now, rather than having to start next season with a bunch of guys we hope can perform.

By matt

June 21, 2006 03:47 PM | Link to this

anger is fine but why bash someone who actually said something true regardless of him rooting for a team most of us can not stand. He is one of the few in here who was straight forward.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:48 PM | Link to this

Is pointing out the fact the Mets have been losers for the last 14 years bashing ? Its fact.

By Billy

June 21, 2006 03:49 PM | Link to this

They wont ever shut this blog down….look how many hits it gets a day…….more hits…..more ad’s….more ad’s….more money…….Beside rob is right….people here dont know how to handle lossing…..somthing the mets fans have come accustom to doing. Not trying to start things with the Mets fans so dont take it like an attack.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:50 PM | Link to this

Whadya say we stop talking about anger and start talking about baseball. Dr. Phil hasn’t posted anything here to the best of my knowledge.

By MGL

June 21, 2006 03:51 PM | Link to this

I’m with Voice Of Reason, a bunch of you folks have recently trashed what was an enjoyable interchange of ideas with a little clean humor mixed in. This has deteriorated into the most childish bunch of name calling that I have seen since I was last around elementary and middle school kids.

Larry, I was floored when you said you were 45 and a baseball professional. I don’t doubt you, but your posts clearly gave Billy the idea that you were just a kid, and they did me also.

Robert, you have some good opinions that I enjoy reading, but the name calling ruins them.

Hopefully this great team will start winning soon and this blog can return to being a positive experience. Maybe we can even lure VOR, Carolina Lady, and others back when the childishness and nasty language goes away.

For those of you who enjoy the childishness, I suggest that you try Myspace with the rest of the kids.

By matt

June 21, 2006 03:52 PM | Link to this

but unnecessary

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:52 PM | Link to this

To blog is to release anger Kent. Replace the bullpen and I’ll shut up gladly. Even if the replacements fail. Just don’t stand pat and demoralize the team.

By matt

June 21, 2006 03:53 PM | Link to this

but unnecessary

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:54 PM | Link to this

Alright people… baseball, baseball, this is a baseball forum! Enough of the bickering huh?!

By Billy

June 21, 2006 03:55 PM | Link to this

Well….could be like the Cartoon blog from yesterday concerning the braves stuggles…..that turned into a diatrabe on Iraq. The political crowd was in full force on that one.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:55 PM | Link to this

Maybe the bullpen could benefit from a few Gaylord Perry… “toolkits”. :o)

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 03:56 PM | Link to this

Ok. My solution is the same as its been that the bullpen needs replacing (except for McBride). What are your solutions ? Let’s talk baseball !

By PENN

June 21, 2006 03:57 PM | Link to this

Quote:

By PeterNY June 21, 2006 03:17 PM | Link to this

I’m a Mets fan. I’ve been checking this blog lately to see if there was any news on potential Braves trades—you know, just sort of keeping an eye on the competition. What I cannot BELIEVE, however, is the absolute immaturity of many posters on this board. In New York, we talk baseball. Here, I’ve lost count of the posts calling your manager a donkey, insulting the players, insulting other posters, using profanity, etc. I mean, if you specifically come here to fill a post with line after line of “hee-haw,” you have needs in your life that baseball simply won’t be able to fill. And, if this is how you all handle losing, you never deserved to win in the first place.

No wonder your team doesn’t seem to be playing hard for its “fans” right now. Why would they?

My apologies to all the true Braves fans out there—it’s just a shame you can’t be in the majority on this board. I really don’t know why the newspaper doesn’t just shut it down, to be honest. It’s an embarrassment to the team and to the people who read it.

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Peter, you expressed my thoughts precisely. Good luck this year, enjoy it and we’ll be after your butts next year. JS and Cox will get things straightened out.

The team I worry about more than the Mets in 2007 are the Marlins, wherever they are playing. They have put together a fine young team and they are getting better by the day and Girradi is doing a fabulous job. He ought to win manager of the year if he can play .500 ball all the way through. What a job he’s done.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 03:59 PM | Link to this

robdawg06, Don’t leave Ken Ray out of the equation. He’s only had 2 or 3 rough outings all season. Who else in the bullpen can say that?

By NYFAN

June 21, 2006 03:59 PM | Link to this

After the division steak was snapped, I predicted brave fans would have time to reflect and ask “How could we win just one world series??” After reading some of the vents and blogs it seems to be coming true.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:01 PM | Link to this

Why don’t ya’ll send Peter a Hallmark,a dozen roses,and some Worthman’s boxed candy ? He scolds mad Braves fans and you guys salute him ? Wow !

By Eyes of the World

June 21, 2006 04:01 PM | Link to this

Braves need Pat Riley to take over and bring that bowl which contains each of the players prized possesions for motivation.

What you have here is a broken team with limited talent and a bad attitude. Cox and the entire coaching staff(besides Bobby Dews) is worthless and should be sent home. The only players that deserve to stay are Smoltz, Hudson, McCann, Renteria, Betemit, Ray, and Francouer. Diaz, Langerhans, Ramierez, and McBride should be put on notice. The rest including Chipper, Andruw, LaRoach, Hampton, Sosa, and the entire bullpen should be kicked to the curb. Chipper continues to be the posterchild for lazy uninspired play, Andruw hits when it doesn’t matter, and Hampton may never visit the rubber anywhere again.

Cox was the recipient of exceptional pitching talent in a shoddy division for years. That is the only way the old coot had any success. Give me a manager with some fire and smarts over him any day. I challenge to say that ANY manager could have produced at least 1 title given the talent Cox had.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:04 PM | Link to this

I feel exactly the same way Eyes. Bobby basically pencils in the names and makes (usually bad) pitching changes. Otherwise, its all on the players backs. There’s 10 reasons (players actually) that the Braves won 14 straight NL East titles and Bobby Cox ain’t one of them.

By matt

June 21, 2006 04:06 PM | Link to this

robdawg … peterny said nothing wrong now nyfan was deserving of those comments

By Lew

June 21, 2006 04:06 PM | Link to this

You’re all insane.

By Jimbo

June 21, 2006 04:07 PM | Link to this

People! People! Why are we all so dismayed? Didn’t DOB drink the Kool-Aide and tell us everything will be rosey in ‘07?

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:08 PM | Link to this

Although some crazy moves stick out in my mind by Bobby, he’s really a non-factor for me. Not much credit or blame is deserved. The players play the game and either execute or not.

By Billy

June 21, 2006 04:09 PM | Link to this

Ok baseball……

What else is there to be said right now? It looks like the Front Office has given 10 days to see if this season is salvagable. It could be, I hope it is, and will watch every game with that in mind. However, the reality is its going to be a long uphill battle that can not be fixed during the season. I firmly belive that the bullpen cost us this year. Point fingers at who ever you want but to call for peoples heads after one lousey season is just plain being fickle and fair weathered. As much as I hate to see it and I dont really want to as next to Andruw, M. Giles is my favorite player. However, it looks like he is the only thing we can use to trade for help for this year and next. I dont see pay roll being a problem as J. Thompson and his 6+ million salary will be long gone. I also would not be surprised to see H. Ramirez traded as well as he makes 4.75 million and you have C. James ready for the spot. Thats 10 million with trade Giles and the savings from this year that keeps getting mentioned you have a lot of wiggle room for improvement. 2007 appear to be our year.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:10 PM | Link to this

My name’s not Wayne and I’m not insane cuz I ride the train and sit next to plain Jane who some say is on cocaine that’s killing her brain.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 04:11 PM | Link to this

Thomson makes $4.5 and Ramirez makes nowhere near $4.75. And you’re all still insane.

By NYFAN

June 21, 2006 04:12 PM | Link to this

Matt What did I write that wasn’t accurate? Just read this blog to verify what I’ve said all along. Now that the streak seems to be coming to an end. Brave fans will wonder why only one world championship? There was a ton of talent and they could only be champs once?

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:14 PM | Link to this

NYFAN, the Mets had tons of talent (do I need to name names ?) Mo Vaughn,R.Alomar,Piazza,ok you get the drift… and couldn’t win the division. Ecery year they spent more and more money to try to beat the Braves. This year it may work. Look in the mirror before casting stones dude.

By Patrick

June 21, 2006 04:14 PM | Link to this

Hey DOB!!!

Did you see someone from foxsports.com is putting words in your mouth!?!?

Here’s the link for you: http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5717100

By BravesFaninRockies

June 21, 2006 04:14 PM | Link to this

Of course the bullpen is pathetic. That’s what you get when you fill it primarily with guys making the ML minimum that no one else wants (4 current pitchers were not in a ML camp this spring).

But my goodness, the lack of love for Bobby Cox! The most legit criticism I can find is that he hasn’t thought outside the box in a couple of decades. He wants speed at the top of the lineup, not realizing that you can’t steal first. The BoSox had Youklis hitting leadoff, for crying out loud. Bet he scores more runs than Marcus.

I’ve said it in previous blogs, if the Braves aren’t going to make any major offensive moves, BC should bunch his most productive hitters together. I’d leadoff Chipper, Renteria 2nd, McCann 3rd, Andruw 4th, Betemit/Thorman/Diaz 5th, Francoeur 6th (he produces runs, and his strikeouts won’t hurt too much with other strikeout guys behind him …), LaRoche 7th, Giles 8th (if Betemit’s not playing).

This way, you can maybe sustain an inning or two a game before the strikeout machines come up.

Of course, if they can find some contact hitters with power on eBay, you could plug them in the lineup anywhere.

By Jimbo

June 21, 2006 04:15 PM | Link to this

Here’s my gripe with Andruw. He’s 29 years old and has been in the majors for how long? Yet he still tries to pull a pitch in the opposite batter’s box. At some point, don’t we have to realize he will never get it. Worst clutch hitter ever for a superstar (suposedly).

Chippy has become the highest paid singles hitter in the history of the game.

The midget still keeps trying to hit home runs and he can’t get it past the warning track.

BTW. I have been a big BC guy over the years but he has not been good this year. I also think the “Donkey in the Dugout” stuff is funny. He has been a donkey this year.

By matt

June 21, 2006 04:18 PM | Link to this

robdawg i am coming back around to your side

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:18 PM | Link to this

Tony Gwynn and Wade Boggs were highly paid singles hitters as is Iciro,Alfonso Soriano, and Derek Jeter.

By Kent

June 21, 2006 04:18 PM | Link to this

I know what I think should happen, but here’s what I think will happen (before the start of next season):

Marcus Giles makes just a shade under 4 million this year, and is eligible for arbitration after this season. That means he’ll probably be traded. Unfortunately, the salary he’ll likely get next year, and the lousy season he’s had so far will greatly diminish his trade value. Even so, the braves should be able to get a decent relief pitcher in echange for him. With Giles gone, Wilson Betemit will take over at 2B.

John Thompson, Jorge Sosa, and Christ Reitsma are free agents at the end of the season, and needless to say, all 3 of them will be shown the door.

Their departure will free up some cash. Some of that money will have to pay Mike Hampton. Insurance covered 60% of the 12.5 million the Braves owed him this year (The Marlins payed the rest, and the same will be true next year). Atlanta will have to pay Hampton 7.5 million more next season that they had to cough up this year. Even so, there should still save a little money with departure of the afore mentioned free agents.

If Chuck James impresses, look for the Braves to trade Heracio Ramirez as well. That would free up another 2-3 million.

When all is said and done, Atlanta should have some money to spend in the bullpen.

They will make a trade or two to help the pen’, and they’ll sign a free agent releiver or two in the offseason. There’s no way to no what that bullpen will look like next season, but we can be sure that it’ll look different.

The rotation will most likely be: 1-Husdon 2-Smoltz 3-Hampton 4-Davies 5-C. James

The line up will probably look pretty much the same except that Betemit will likely replace Giles, and Scott Thorman might play his way into a regular job.

That’s what I expect. Any thoughts?

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:19 PM | Link to this

Its all cool Matt. We are all just frustrated.

By NYFAN

June 21, 2006 04:20 PM | Link to this

I’m not casting stones. You know as well as I do if the Yankees or Mets had won divisions titles year after year without winiing it all, NY fans wouldn’t be constantly patting themselves on the back. They be asking whats the problem.

By Rob

June 21, 2006 04:23 PM | Link to this

Sure is funny when Sports Illustrated ran a pole of people that truly know what they are talking about,(players, gm’s and managers) Bobby Cox was far and away voted the best. Don’t believe me? Look it up. They ran it last year. Say what you want, the man is brilliant and by far the best. I for one will be devastated the day he and JS leave. It’s just a shame a few of you Monday morning QB’s don’t appreciate what you have.

By Chop Chop

June 21, 2006 04:23 PM | Link to this

PeterNY,

You’re right about a lot of blogs posted here, but I wonder why you’re here at all. What difference is a trade going to make for the Braves? Your Mets would have to have a monumental collapse to be within the Braves’ striking distance. They are 14.5 games behind you. As a Braves fan who is accustomed to winning (Zing! Yeah, only one World Series title during the run. Excuse me while I weep…), I can tell you that I didn’t scout the last-place team in the NL West in ‘91 (Houston Astros) when the Braves were trying to go from worst to first. Then again, I was 11 years old at the time. My point is that Mets fans should be more concerned about what their team will do. If there’s anything that cheering for a team that’s been on top of the mountain for a while has taught me, it’s that you can’t worry about what other teams below you are doing. You just have to focus on consistently winning games. For example, let’s say that the Mets go ten games over .500 (51-41) the rest of the year. They’re 44-26 right now. That’s a 95-67 record. The Braves are 30-41 right now. The Braves would have to win 65 of their last 91 games to tie the Mets. That’s .714 baseball. If the Braves play that well the rest of the year, I will giggle with delight and promise to respond with a hearty “Daaaaaaay-O” every time it is played at Turner Field.

My point is that you don’t have to worry about the Braves. Worry about what your own team is doing, PeterNY. After all, the only competition the New York Mets have right now is self-destruction.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:25 PM | Link to this

The first goal is winning your division or the wild card. Then its a crap shoot in a short 5 to 7 game playoff. You slump and you lose. Teams get hot and win. The Braves usually got cold and slumped for some unexplainable reason.

By Billy

June 21, 2006 04:25 PM | Link to this

I stand corrected

In case anyone is wondering

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/salaries/braves.html

By matt

June 21, 2006 04:27 PM | Link to this

nyfan .. you are casting stones. in ny they have been asking what is wrong cause the mets haven’t even had a shot in years. the yankees have but at what cost 200 million payroll and a farm system that couldn’t field a little league team

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 04:28 PM | Link to this

rob, this journalist is not familiar with that pole. perhaps it is a totem pole?

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:30 PM | Link to this

Hey Rob, do you remember Cox losing 100 games with the Bluejays and Braves ? Look it up, he did. Why ? Bad players. He gets good players and wins 14 straight. Look at Phil Jackson. With Jordan,Pippen,and Rodman he’s the greatest coach ever. With the Lakers and just Kobe they say is he really a good coach ? The players make a manager look good or bad.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 04:33 PM | Link to this

Rob Dawg…..all those guys you mentioned Ichiro excluded, never made even close to the money that chipper is. SORIANO! the guys got twenty-somthing homers- he ad more homers in the series against us than chipper has all year.

Ichiro has speed. Gwynn hit about .335 year in and year out. So if chipper is going to be a singles hitter he better up the average

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 04:35 PM | Link to this

journalist would remind someone to wake bob up for the game, but alas, bob has disappeared. and where is bob? at gordy tire? at the varsity? ormewood park? we must find bob before game time. if he is not asleep he must be lurking close by.

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:36 PM | Link to this

Chipper will up EVERYTHING when he’s healthy. A guy takes you to 14 championships and you fault him for not producing when he’s not 100 %. I’m not happy with his lack of power this year either but he’s far from the worst problem on the Braves (I.E. bullpen).

By Rob

June 21, 2006 04:38 PM | Link to this

So what was the excuse for him winning last year with Chipper on the DL 1/2 the year, and a rag tag bullpen? Oh yeah those players were great. And typical of journalist, when he gets out-debated (see DOB’s blog yesterday) he resorts to childish remarks and poor attempts at humor. The pole exists. Google it. Or archive it. Give credit where it’s due, the man can flat out coach.

By Billy

June 21, 2006 04:38 PM | Link to this

The person who says andruw is not clutch…please list his career ba with runners in scoring postion.

By bravesfansince1966

June 21, 2006 04:38 PM | Link to this

HEY NY!!! Kiss our Grits!!! You could only dream that the Muts could win 14 straight— LOSER!

By nathan

June 21, 2006 04:39 PM | Link to this

totem pole…that’s funny

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:39 PM | Link to this

And Gwynn,Ichiro,and Boggs made/make tens of millions a year as singles hitters.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 04:39 PM | Link to this

Journalist Jimmy. It is probably the pole that needs to be shoved (we won’t talk about where it needs to be shoved-choose your own anatomical location) of all of you fair weathered fans. You’re all insane.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 04:41 PM | Link to this

billy i don’t know them exactly…..but last year it was about .220 & this year i believe it’s below .190.

but i’ll look them up for you.

If he would’ve hit better with RISP last year he would’ve had silly good RBI total and probably won the MVP. The guy hits .265 in general, what do you expext his RISP number to be?

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:42 PM | Link to this

He won last year because he put rookies in that got the job done. He got lucky they played well. That was his only option since the $$$ was tight. Credit McCann,Francoeur,Davies,Langerhans,and McBride instead of Cox.

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 04:42 PM | Link to this

rob, you are a wizard. all jimmy smith did was ask about the pole you referenced. you resort to insults and character assassination. journalist has called no one a donkey. jimmy smith only inquired about the pole. perhaps it is the one at the speedway? you seem to be the smart one on the blog, why don’t you explain it to us?

By Rob

June 21, 2006 04:43 PM | Link to this

Unbelieveable!!!!!!!!!!!

By robdawg06

June 21, 2006 04:46 PM | Link to this

So if you or I Rob were manager and we had Raul Mondesi in RF and B.Jordan in LF bothhitting under .200 and we call up Francoeur and Langerhans and let them start we are genuises ? As for his great managing why did he wait so long to remove Kolb as closer last year ?

By matt

June 21, 2006 04:50 PM | Link to this

journalist jimmy smith … are you actually referencing yourself in the 3rd person?!?!?

By Lew

June 21, 2006 04:50 PM | Link to this

I repeat. You are all insane.

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 04:51 PM | Link to this

hey lew, journalist is not fair weather. jimmy smith is hurt and disappointed but he has just purchased tickets for the next homestand. hope you didn’t make portraits of the relief pitchers this year. they will all be gone soon. once journalist removes the pole you placed he will buy you a piece of pie.

rob, journalist took your suggestion and googled for that pole. there was a bird atop the pole. was that you? is rob short for robin?

By Billy

June 21, 2006 04:52 PM | Link to this

Not expecting it to be great….was just wondering cuz i could not find it……despite his aveage driving in 100+ runs a year is good enough for me to be worth 15 million. more later gotta go home

By rowland

June 21, 2006 04:54 PM | Link to this

Journalist is hilarious. Irony is lost on the mouth-breathers. I believe Rob meant to say a “people of Poles” rather than a “pole of people.” Famous Poles include Dick Pole, former pitching coach who, indeed, knew what he was talking about.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 04:56 PM | Link to this

rob dawg. other that ichiro, not in ONE SEASON.

And if you are trying to say that Chipper has as much impact OVERALL on a game as Ichiro does, you just don’t get it.

I see your point, and for the most part I agree with it. But if the Braves wanted a SINGLES hitter at one of their corner IF positions, especially with A.D.D. over at 1B, they would’ve signed Bill Mueller for about a third of the cost. Chipper was signed to that contract to TAKE GAMES over, change the opposing manager/pitcher’s philosophy on “who” to pitch to in the line up, all that good stuff your #3 (best-alledgedly) hitter is supposed to do.

Lets name the #3 hitters (just this year) on other teams

NY Mets: Beltran

Philadelphia: Abreu

Florida: Cabrera

Houston: Berkman

Minnesota: Mauer

Boston: Ortiz

Texas: Txeria

ChiW: Thome

Angels: Guererro

Stl: Pujols

Now honestly, just this year, not based on past performances, RIGHT NOW, would you honestly take Chipper over any of these guys. How do you think Anaheim would feel if all of the sudden (with all the money they gave him) Vlad showed up and could only hit singles?…..Disappointed, I imagine. I’m not mad at Chipper, I don’t hate Chipper, I’m disappointed that he’s got three years left on the deal and I don’t see the old chipper coming back anytime soon.

On another note. Was I the only one in the offseason that thought the Blue Jays were morons for giving Ryan all that money when he really wasn’t a “proven” closer for very long? My guess is a lot of GM’s are 2nd guessing themselves on that one. That guy is awesome! They were talkin about his numbers the last 4 years, 2 as set up and 2 as closer. Ridiculous. Pays to gamble I guess.

By Steve

June 21, 2006 04:57 PM | Link to this

Some of these posts reveal who the true idiots are. Yes, the current problems on this team are numerous, but one of them is not the manager. Bobby Cox is truly one of the classiest acts in the game.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 04:58 PM | Link to this

I can’t find any damn stats on ESPN, SI or FOX that actually have RISP on their listed stats. Am I blind?

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 05:01 PM | Link to this

rowland is kind. imagine rob’s confusion when he goes to the polling place on July 18. what, not a voter? go figure.

By Rob

June 21, 2006 05:03 PM | Link to this

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/5681/situational;_ylt=AtL5yOuJ16cVFgOd8SiyxJaFCLcF?year=career&type=Batting

Here’s his stats

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:04 PM | Link to this

Wouldn’t it be kind of weird to go to a strip club and take a poll?

By Rob

June 21, 2006 05:04 PM | Link to this

And journalist, where will you be sitting at the upcoming game? I’d like to come over and say hi.

By Rob C

June 21, 2006 05:06 PM | Link to this

Anybody heard any trade possibilities/rumors? (Other than the stupid Smoltz stuff, not gonna happen). I just read that Dayton Moore’s first move as the KC GM was to trade for Joey Gathright from Tampa. Makes me wonder if there’s a CHANCE that he’s going to try and spin him to ATL for prospects. If you think about it, nobody outside of Atlanta has a better idea of what the Braves have in their org, and what they are searching for. Gathright would give the big league team a leadoff hitter/LF that could improve the lineup immediately, and 2-3 prospects could go a long way toward rebuilding in KC. I wouldn’t be at all suprised if in the next few weeks Gathright is headed to ATL.

By bigdawg31650

June 21, 2006 05:06 PM | Link to this

I have haad enough of you so called fans piling on the team that we have now. Atlanta has won for 14 staight years with less than stellar support from you big time braves fans so why should you care now that they have hit a rough spot. As for the Bobby bashers, he is probably only one of the two or three best managers in the game today so yeah the Braves should get someone better like Joe Torre no wait the Brave had him already and he couldn’t win here, maybe Chuck Tanner well no wait he couldn’t win here either. I know Earl Weaver, Billy Martin,Sparky Anderson, well they are all retired. When will you fairweather fans wake up and realize that Bobby is a great manager and the Braves have a greqat organization. 14 division titles in 14 years is a great accomplishment. Be proud of our world championship and if you aren’t try being a Pirate or Devil Rays fan and see how you like that for a while.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 05:06 PM | Link to this

Journalist Jimmy, I appreciate it, but it is the Braves that need the pie. The only relief portrait I did was Blaine Boyer and look what happened to him. Maybe I should be killed along with Bobby Cox. Maybe it is really MY fault the Braves are so bad this year. But the rest of you (most of you anyway) are insane. Ever since last October, all I have heard on these blogs are disgruntled fair weather fans hacking up hairballs over why we should have won more WS titles. If we had won 3 or 4 would anyone be any happier. I doubt it. Then they could all complain that BC should have won 10 or 12. NO ONE, NOT EVEN THE YANKEES HAVE EVER WON 14 IN A ROW. BC has won 15 in a row. NO OTHER MANAGER HAS EVER DONE THIS. Is this now clear to everyone? The same goes for JS. NO OTHER GM,ETC. He is also the only GM to win a WS title in both leagues. And if they did it because they had good players, where did these players come from? Did they just show up on the Braves’ doorstep asking to be fed and clothed? The Braves are not, in all likelihood, going to make it 15 this year. So what? It will give you idiots something to gripe about THIS winter. For the past three weeks all I have heard from the worst fans in the history of baseball is that BC and JS should be ridden out of town on a rail, Chipper, who is the 3rd leading switch hitter of all time (the other two are in the HOF) and who is hitting about .290 this year, despite tearing up his knee AND ankle and having to wear a cumbersome brace,should be thrown on the scrap heap of baseball, if not on the heap of life itself. You wonder whymI call you insane? Prove you’re not. Go see the Braves at Turner field and cheer for them instead of booing.

By Young

June 21, 2006 05:07 PM | Link to this

John Thomson is a bag of dead grass. He is just like the goverment and the IRS. He likes to take other people’s money.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:07 PM | Link to this

thanks for the link rob!

By matt

June 21, 2006 05:08 PM | Link to this

here is a link for situational stats on a. jones [http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/5681/situational;_ylt=Atu.eFStZToojqT8x9ULRjGFCLcF]

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 05:09 PM | Link to this

nathan, that would preclude the famous poll dance. perhaps rob can take a pole of other bloggers and see if that would be useful. of course, if he takes your pole you’ll have nowhere to fly your flag. journalist is becoming confused and a more than a little tender after lew gave him that shot with the pole earlier. perhaps we should turn to dob for closure on this matter. this is a rather droll subject but it beats calling bobby a donkey.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:09 PM | Link to this

Billy martin is DEAD not retired.

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 05:10 PM | Link to this

in keeping with the mood of the moment, journalist should have said drole subject.

By Rob

June 21, 2006 05:11 PM | Link to this

Very well said Lew. Couldn’t agree more. It’s just really sad that these 2 aren’t appreciated more. 5 years after both of them retire, they will be making acceptance speeches in Cooperstown. I’d bet my life on it.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 05:12 PM | Link to this

Let them eat pie. Amen

By Rob C

June 21, 2006 05:13 PM | Link to this

Also, about the trading Chipper stuff: The Braves CANNOT trade him. Regardless of if they wanted to, the rules of baseball say that as a 10/5 player he can block any trade. That means if St. Louis offered Pujols, Rolen, AND Carpenter, and agreed to pay all of their salaries for just Chipper, it would STILL need Chipper’s ok to go through. It’d be like trying to buy a car from someone who refuses to sell for sentimental reasons….no matter how much money you offer, it’s still the owner’s choice. So pretty much all the talk of trading Chipper is pointless. (If you want to talk about how the Braves shouldn’t have given him this contract or extended it, I’ll disagree with you but at least the argument would have a purpose).

By matt

June 21, 2006 05:13 PM | Link to this

Andruw is hitting .271 with 4 hrs and 41 rbis with risp … last year he hit .207 with 9 hrs and 72 rbis

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 05:13 PM | Link to this

rob, you can’t afford that section. maybe you can wave from a distance. or you could climb a poll.

By Cox rules

June 21, 2006 05:14 PM | Link to this

I suppose you “winners” could do better than Bobby Cox, that’s why you all have over 1000 major league baseball wins….You are ALL sooooo right.

By Rob

June 21, 2006 05:16 PM | Link to this

I’ve seen journalists wages, and you’re not within 2 tax brackets of me. Don’t want to say hi?

By matt

June 21, 2006 05:16 PM | Link to this

again that link is [http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/5681/situational;ylt=Atpp2pqXRNvlctjKCUvpkmFCLcF?year=2006&type=Batting] if that is what you were looking for nathan

By Robert

June 21, 2006 05:18 PM | Link to this

Hate to break the news but other teams are NOT jealous of our 14 straight division titles

To other teams, what matters is WS titles

From 91-05, the Braves shoulve won at least 3, more likely 4, and COULD have won as many as seven. They won all of ONE. That is NOT an item for the manager to put on his resume, no matter how much it continues to impress the more feebleminded among us

There’s a donkey in the dugout

By U r too

June 21, 2006 05:18 PM | Link to this

The Braves are coming back with passion, desire and more power, just wait and see…! We didn’t win all those years for nothing, we know how to win. Screw the STATS and all that crap, the BRAVES are coming back from DEATH…! Fairweather fans just go and blow your noses somewhere else because you are making awful noise and it is nasty..!Bobby knows how to win and we all know that..it is not over, we are just starting to make an incredible run for the title. This is my opinion and I welcome yours…GO BRAVES.

By Rob C

June 21, 2006 05:19 PM | Link to this

To anyone named Robert,

Ever get annoyed that there are like 15 of us on here that all try to use Robert or Rob as our name, but keep getting mixed up with people who either a)want everyone fired/traded or b)the opposite? I know I do. (For the record, I am a huge supporter of Scherholtz and Cox, but appreciate hearing intelligent arguments for either side…the problem is that many here are not intelligent).

By rowland

June 21, 2006 05:19 PM | Link to this

We need more roll players. Or a team with a sole. Will the Dawgs go to a boll? What about the ‘Nolls?

By Justice of Storm

June 21, 2006 05:22 PM | Link to this

Thank you for the great blog U r too. I agree with you. The Braves are not losers. Go Braves.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:25 PM | Link to this

You are right they are going to put Bobby in Cooperstown. JS, not sure if a GM will ever get in.

But without bashing the Donkey. (oops) Let’s operate on a couple of if’s. (yeah I know….If if’s and buts were cherries and nuts we’d all have a Merry Christmas! Or my personal favorite: If my aunt Betty had a mustache, she’d be my uncle Chris!)

But you are honestly telling me that if Bobby was say………the Kansas City Royals Mangager or the Devil Rays Manager, he’d have them in the playoffs every year? Now before you get a head of yourself, I’m putting a stipulation on this “what if”.

Those two teams would have to have EXACTLY the same rosters they’ve had for the previous 10 years (or how ever long TB has been in the league - who cares about TB?). No other free agents no other trades, just Bobby and those rosters. Then what?

If anything, lets give credit to a place that nobody is even mentioning, much less talking about. Not Bobby, Not JS, Not Chuck Tanner. How about the scouts that find the players to draft. And the minor league managers, coaches, instructors etc…..

I mean, it’s not like Francoeur came up as a Relief Pitcher and Bobby said, “hey that kid sure can hit in batting practice, let’s put him in RF”

Jeff was obviously an outstanding HS player, he got drafted, had sucess in the minors and came up and tore it up. WOW, Bobby’s a genius. You gotta be some kinda smart to releas Mondesi, and let this kid get a shot. And then, WOW!!! This kid can hit a little, Throw A LOT! I think we’ll keep him around a while. Yeah NO SH*T!

Ok maybe Frenchy is not a good example. Since he obviously doesn’t listen to any coaches advise. LOL. But you get the point.

THREE HALL OF FAME PITCHERS

THREE HALL OF FAME PITCHERS

THREE HALL OF FAME PITCHERS

THREE HALL OF FAME PITCHERS

That’s all I’ve got to say about that!

Hee - Haw!!! (sorry I had to!)

By Chop Chop

June 21, 2006 05:27 PM | Link to this

Rob,

You think Chipper’s going in on the first ballot? Chipper’s been a hell of a hitter for a long time, but I wouldn’t bet my life on it.

As for Andruw, I think he has a better shot of being a first-ballot Hall of Famer because of his production and defense at a glamour position. Wouldn’t bet my life on it, though.

By Blogger not named Rob

June 21, 2006 05:28 PM | Link to this

Not gonna find much intelligent conversation here; it’s mostly drive-by insults…

By Rob C

June 21, 2006 05:28 PM | Link to this

You know what….Robert is right. All that matters are WS titles. So aside from the front offices of the Yankees, Marlins, and Blue Jays, everyone in baseball has been an utter and complete failure for the past 15 years. Sure the White Sox won last year, but that’s only one WS in the past 15 years, those bums need to be fired. Same for management of the Red Sox. And the Orioles, Cubs, Reds, Indians, Rockies, Tigers, Astros, Royals, Dodgers, Brewers, Mets, Athletics, Phillies, Pirates, Padres, Giants, Mariners, Cardinals, Devil Rays, Rangers, and Nationals haven’t won a single WS in the past 15 years….these teams just need to be taken away entirely. Don’t waste our time with non-WS winners.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 05:31 PM | Link to this

Better to be feeble minded than to be a complete and utter idiot and total a##. Shouldn’t that have been WHINERS, not winners?At least as feenle minded it implies that I at least have a brain. You’re all insane.

By Rob C

June 21, 2006 05:31 PM | Link to this

My point in that last post was, aside from the Blue Jays, Yankees, and Marlins, EVERYONE in baseball is 1 for 14 or 0 for 14 in World Series titles in the past 15 years…..

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 05:32 PM | Link to this

lew, have you done a portrait of bobby? that one will be worth something down the road because he will be revered when he retires. if you haven’t done it yet but plan to, ask him to keep his hands in his pockets.

journalist jimmy smith’s wife got to talk with bobby at a golf tournament the day after he received the ws ring and he let her try on the ring! he was very cordial and she has been a fan ever since.

now, rob … want to meet the journalist, huh? meet me by the fowl poll. you must be a 28 percenter. how do you stand on the fair tax? journalist doesn’t really care, just taking a pole.

now jimmy smith understands why that other rob added the “c” to his name.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 05:33 PM | Link to this

And the scouting departments and minor league management were put together by BC and JS.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:35 PM | Link to this

Cox rules:

All Smart A$$ comments aside.

Let’s say for instance you were made Manager of the Atlanta Braves in 1995.

Your rotation consists of:

Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, Avery & Bileki

Your everyday line up is:

Grissom, Blauser, Chipper, McGriff, Justice, Klesko, Javy, Lemke

and you got Wholers to close it out.

are you still with me?

You showed up everyday, watched them take infield, batting practice, shag flies in the outfield.

Right before game time you WOBBLE up to home plate and turn in that same line up card night, after night, after night, after night, after night, after night (i was going to type it 162 times - but I assume you get the picture). (Of course on the nights Maddux pitches you give Javy the night off and insert Charlie O’brien - Cuz in 3 years in the big leagues your coaching staff couldn’t teach Javy how to actually be a catcher!)

If this would be the case, for 162 games. How many games do you honestly think the players would win with that lineup?

Even Billy Martin (now) could manage these guys.

So yeah. I think I could manage this team if it was with all the talent he’s had.

The only problem I’d have is remembering all those signs. What was it 2 fingers in the nose to bring in Reitsma? LOL!

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:37 PM | Link to this

Rob C.

the point you’re missing is that most of those teams have fired managers and front office people for failing to win.

By Lew

June 21, 2006 05:39 PM | Link to this

I give up. Trying to convince you non-believers is like telling a brick wall it’s missing a mortar joint. Even if the brick wall was capable of understanding, which in this case it obviously isn’t, it is highly unlikely that the brick wall will care, much less fix itself. Argue on you brick walls.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 05:41 PM | Link to this

Ok chew on this

Over the course of the last 15 seasons, Bobby Cox had ten teams that featured three HOF pitchers. Those and like 13 with two

Most of his teams have had several HOF candidate hitters as well. Personally, I dont like Chipper or Andru, but both will likely end up in the HOF. McGriff is a borderline candidate, but was a major rbi producer for over a decade in the bigs.

I showed before (and am not gonna thru the analysis again - the numbers are easy enough to research) - that the Braves of 91-05 needed, on average 91-92 wins a year to win the division title

How impressive is 92 wins when your rotation starts off Maddux-Glavine-Smoltz?

Come ON people. Admit it - Billy Heywood could’ve won 92 games a year with those teams

Cox’s stated attitude is that the playoffs are a crapshoot.

Ok, let’s suppose for a moment that they are. With wild card teams (which werent always there during the run) - the odds in a crapshoot are 1 in 8. So your boy Cox wins at about half the rate that he ought to (and that assumes all eight playoff teams are equal, not that he has the best one at least half the time)

Cox is so bad, he can fork up a crapshoot.

Second, even if it IS a crapshoot, that’s NOT what you teach your players. Every player should approach every possible chance at a WS title as if it were THE single most important opportunity and maybe the ONLY opportunity they will ever have.

Ask Ty Cobb - was on the losing team in the WS three consecutive times in his early 20’s, never got to play another playoff game

Ask Ernie Banks, or Barry Bonds, or any other vet who has never had a chance if they’d treat a playoff chance as a crapshoot

Starting about the 1993, the Braves developed this attitude that it wasnt such a big deal to lose in the playoffs, because there would be next year, and because it’s just a crapshoot. They began to treat the playoffs as their birthrite by virtue of their being Braves - and didnt cherish the perceived birthrite.

Bobby Cox is the man behind that attitude.

And in my book, that attitude is utterly contemptible

On top of this, if you ever read what he says, Cox says some of the dumbest things I have ever read. Start with “We dont have any use for speed” (several years ago) and gop on thru “He’s been highly touted for weeks” or “Just one bad pitch” the list is endless

Sometimes, we know what he WANTS to say - there’s some sense to it but Bobby just has a knack for making it sound stupid - Sometimes it is just plain unfathomably irrational and dopey

Now - Cox fans - the floor is yours. I want a list. Playoff games that were won because of a Bobby Cox move - list the game, the situation, and the brilliant move that no other manager couldve dreamt of pulling

For the course of a regular season, when you have a team loaded with stars, filling out the lineup cards, playing righty vs lefty, and letting mature experienced players work thru their own slumps will work - it doesnt rock the boat - it may not create wins, but it avoids turmoil and avoids losses - fine, Cox is a genius babysitter

Come the playoffs, when the other side has something approaching equal talent, Cox’s predictablility puts him at the other manager’s mercy. His moves are so predictable they can be prepared for and in fact elicited. End result - in a crucial late game situation, the opposing manager gets the matchup he wants, because he has prodded Bobby into making the rote predictable moves he has wanted him to make

As a GM, Bobby certainly did a fine job. As a manager, he is THE single most overrated manager or coach in the history of organized sports

I dont care if he takes Sosa Thomspon and company and wins 2831 consecutive Little League World Series - he is an absolute ZERO as a bench manager

By Blogger not named Rob

June 21, 2006 05:43 PM | Link to this

While all of you have been b*** and moaning and slinging crap at each other, the Braves officially announced that Sosa has been placed in the bullpen. He’ll be ready to come out of the ‘pen around Saturday, to be used in 8th or 9th inning situations. Sorry if I interrupted your childish bickering with some real news.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:44 PM | Link to this

Your right lew. they were put together by those two guys. But since I see Bobby in the dugout yelling at umpires and adding a “y” to the end of everybodies name. I can assume that there is not two of him (we can only hope). So there is no way humanly possible that other than spring training he’s actually helped DEVELOP any of the skills these players have when they get up to the big club. Hell I don’t rembmer who it was last year, but Cox admitted he didn’t know anything about him when the got called up. Was it Pete Orr, no I don’t think so, I don’t remember. Sorry.

Skip, Joe, Pete, and Soul Glow always talk about Philosophy of the STAFF. That JS and Bobby instill it into all of their coaches in the system, they hire coaches that know what Bobby expects of players etc….etc…

So I get that Bobby has a “hand” in it.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 05:46 PM | Link to this

What’s worse - the Devil Rays or Royals failing to win the WS with the rosters they have, or the Braves failing to win it with Maddux Glavine Smoltz, Chipper Andru McGriff and company?

Name me a manager that couldnt average 92 wins a year with a rotation featuring Maddux Glavine and Smoltz

Cox’s most memorable playoff wins came against two other donkeys. Hargrove was one, and Bobby Valentine was the other. Man what a managerial coup that was when Cox got that bases loaded walk to Andru that finally ended the Mets series in what was it 1999?

Cox vs Valentine - it was like watching Spy vs Spy trying to outwit each other and putting egg on their own faces time after time after time

By Patrick

June 21, 2006 05:47 PM | Link to this

The truth is that most of the people typing all the nonsense on this blog don’t have a clue about baseball. If you are a fan, then you are a fan through good and bad, ups and downs, and win or lose. Just shut up and support the team. We dont have the talent that we once did, but I am still a Braves fan. I have been to 16 games this season(5 losses in a row), but I am going again next week because I love the Braves. Look at Red Sox fans and Cubs fans… They sell out the stadium every game in good years and bad years. That’s how you support your team. Talking smack on a blog does nothing but show your ignorance. I am tired of all the Braves bashing. They havent had a losing record in 15 years. I bet all of you will jump right back on the bandwagon as soon as the Braves turn it around, and I am certain they will!

Go Braves!

A loyal fan

By Robert

June 21, 2006 05:49 PM | Link to this

To me, Game 1 of the 99 World Series is the ultimate indictment of Cox. Flash back. Maddux ends the seventh by striking out Ricky Ledee on a change up that moved about 8 inches out and eight inches down. He has given up nary a run. The first hitter due up in the eight (Brosius) already has two hits off him. Without a doubt Maddux should be done for the evening, and the bullpen should be brought in to do what it is paid to do. But NOOOOOOO - he comes Maddux being trotted out to start the eight. I mutter something under my breath .Brosius singles. I curse at the screen.Maddux stays in the game Strawberry walks. I throw an empty and some chips at the screen. Maddux stays in the game. By the time Jeter comes to the plate I am repeating over and over, louder and louder “Take him out He is done” Jeter singles and I have I have about blown a gasket screaming “When are you going to him out you g_ stupid F JACKASS!

At that moment, I swear I heard hee-hawing coming from the Braves dugout - and the pitching change was made

In fact, if Cox ever DID Hee-Haw, in my book it would be the smartest sounding thing he has said in about 20 years

By student

June 21, 2006 05:52 PM | Link to this

Guys did you think we could win forever? We aren’t the yankees, or the Red Sox for that matter. We don’t have a tiny payroll but we don’t have a big enough one to just buy ourselves into the playoffs every year. So the Braves developed a strategy of paying a few guys very well, paying a lot of attention to producing players through the farm system, and then try to find guys on the cheap that other teams either gave up on or weren’t interested in that someone in the organazation thought could still play (J.D Drew, Jared Wright, Julio Franco, Edgar Renteria, Hammond.)

The Braves did this all very well for a long time, but this year it didn’t work. The retreads and kids in the bullpen turned out to all be terrible, except for Ken Ray, we had some unfortuante injuries out there too. Some of the second year players had drop off seasons. Giles, who whatever anyone says had been a dependable player for the last two years had a real off season. The cobbled together back of the rotation blew up on us.

So you have two choices, you can look at an organazation that has had a tremendous amount of sucess and decide on the basis of one very bad year that they all are terrible and should be fired, or you could decide that this year is an abberation. This was the perfect storm of seasons. Everything went wrong, but I can’t see why things can’t be turned around next year. I still think we have most of the parts of a very good team. A few pieces are missing, but with a little rejiggering the thing can be fixed. Don’t act like spoiled children.

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 05:52 PM | Link to this

sosa is now in the bullpen. good thing the braves read this blog.

hey rob, if you’re trying to be a bully learn to express yourself intelligently so that you may be taken seriously. walk softly and carry a big poll. no one fears a dummy. jimmy smith would be well known to you if you were a little smarter. think about it. take a pole.

By Chop Chop

June 21, 2006 05:53 PM | Link to this

Blogger not named Rob,

I read that article a little while ago. Sosa was bound to get bounced out of the rotation at some point, so that news isn’t a shocker. I think Bobby had no choice but to put him in the bullpen and hope for the best. Of course, the most important thing to all of us self-important bloggers is that we shall now see how “well” Sosa is going to pitch late in games. We shall see how well his “first and second innings as a starter this season” stats hold up. I hope he does well, but I have a strong suspicion he will pitch “well”. That’s all I’m going to say about it.

By TrailofTears

June 21, 2006 05:55 PM | Link to this

For everyone that has posted give up on this season, pat yourself on the back.

If Schuerholz reacts by trading away the farm for bullpen help for a team with no chance of moving past the 1st round of the playoffs, in the improbably chance they made it there anyway, we will all look back in disgust for the next decade when this team resembles the Braves of the 80’s— new unwanted FA’s every year with no farm system.

Please everyone stop posting about potential trades for this reliever or that one to try and salvage this season. This season is lost already. If we can trade for a player that will help us win next year without giving up a key player having a curret bad year, then do it. Otherwise close the front office early this year, go on vacation, a book tour, or anything else and get ready to unload the following in the off-season. 1)LaRoche (had his best year already, not improving) 2) Langerhans (keep as a 4th outfielder only) 3)Giles (trade to SD to play with his brother, not going to get any better here) 4)The entire bullpen except the young guys (I mean did we really expect anything of Mike Remlinger for god’s sake? If I hear Bobby say “Remmy” one more time, thats so quier). 5)Thompson (time to give the young ones(James especially) a shot in the 4th and 5th slots) 6)Methusila Pratt (didn’t Mccann prove he is mature enough to not need the Braves equivalent of a Ty Detmer type coach/player taking a roster spot?) 7)Unload Brian Jordan now.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 05:55 PM | Link to this

Robert

You are DEAD ON.

People think that I Hate Bobby and come on these blogs to rip him.

That’s not the case. I come on these blogs to have fun. But in the mean time, I must butt in to argue with people that think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

You are so right about the babysitter thing. He keeps a “clean” clubhouse. Other that Rocker, there hasn’t been much hoopla going on in there. He keeps the even keel all year long. That’s probably a good thing. He’s a good people guy, he’d make an awesome BENCH COACH.

But as far as “strategy”, come on, if you can’t see that he’s failed us with incredible line ups than that’s too bad.

But of course I don’t put all the blame on him, he’s part of it, but not all of it. Plenty of players have BLOWN their own opportunities as well.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 06:01 PM | Link to this

How many of those player mistakes might have occurred because of the attitude of its ok, just a crapshoot, besides we’ll be back next year?

When the 96 debacle finally ended, Cox was 1 for 4 in the WS and his best team (1993) had managed to avoid even getting to the WS

He shouldve been shown the door after 96

It’s ironic - thru the run the Braves always said that no matter that they always lost in the playoffs the one thing they’d never change, their foundation, was Cox

I contend that the one constant thru all the years of underachievment is the obvious starting point when you search foran underlying reason for the failures

Now with Leo gone, same staff, but with almost a run a game worse ERA, and we have gone from being able to win an easy division to - 30-41 and looking much worse than that

And what has Cox done during this horrendous streak?

Sat there, wiggled his ears, shuffled his hooves, and swatted flies with his tail

By TrailofTears

June 21, 2006 06:13 PM | Link to this

Robert…

Good points on Cox. While I do not think he is as inept as you feel, I think his modus operandi has runs its course. The greatest coaches in all sports reach a point when their approach lags behind the changes in the game itself. I would have expected it to be last year for Cox with so many rookies on the team and a very hands-off approach. Without Cox, perhaps we make the playoffs less than 50% of the current 14 year run, but as has been pointed out before, the true judgement of a coach is his teams performance in the biggest games. Take any SEC football team for example. 3-5 years of 8-3 football, while a great winning percentage, without a championship results in a pink slip. I dont know if changing managers with this current team would have made any difference, but desperate times call for… But whoever coaches this team next year will not have different results with the same roster, so there is much to be done.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 06:16 PM | Link to this

TrailofTears - Well said and thought out on both posts. Welcome.

By nathan

June 21, 2006 06:18 PM | Link to this

Sat there, wiggled his ears, shuffled his hooves, and swatted flies with his tail

Robert you kill me. All this Donkey stuff is brialliant. I Love it!

PS: to whoever posted about the Donkey Tshirts earlier, I’ll take one. Sorry People, it is funny!

By Chico Escuela

June 21, 2006 06:37 PM | Link to this

Talent-wise, I think the Braves peaked in 1996. Player for player, that was their best roster, especially after getting Denny Neagle.

After the two trades in spring training 1997, I cite that as the starting point of the Braves’ slow demise. Their only World Series in Turner Field was 1999 and they were swept by the Yankees. Sure those divisional championships were won but what stiff competition did they have all those years, other than 1991-1994 ? After McGriff & Galarraga left, look at the el cheapo route they’ve gone on firstbase.

Mike Hampton? After major surgery and a year layoff how effective will he be in 2007.

I’m not drinking that coolaid being dispensed by Braves’ management.

Unload one of the five players tying up the payroll and get some speed, bullpen help & a stud on first.

By Chop Chop

June 21, 2006 06:39 PM | Link to this

Chico,

In my opinion, your first two paragraphs are dead-on.

By Ron Roberts

June 21, 2006 06:48 PM | Link to this

Bicker about Cox’s playoff record all you want, folks…

…but we’d not have had 14 chances to win a World Series without Bobby Cox in the dugout.

His patience (which is sometimes his downfall) won out in 1991 when some folks had us buried at the All-Star break. The same could be said when we were dead-in-the-water in 1993. We were clearly the best team in the NL in 1995 and 1996, and honestly, weren’t the best MLB team on paper in 1995 when we actually did win the WS. From 2001 on, though, the man has taken weaker, lesser rosters and still won division titles. Even with good starters, we’d never had two radar-burners in our rotation to win these $#%@! short series, and we’ve learned, over the years, that sometimes that, more than everything else on the lineup card, starters with heat can tip the scales. We fell to the D-backs and Cubs because of this; I don’t see how that’s Cox’s fault, though. Again, from 2001 on, we’ve had lesser product on the field, and he’s gotten those squads into the playoffs when I feel certain other managers wouldn’t have.

Seriously, nobody was picking us as pre-season NL East titlists in 2004 or 2005, and we still did it. We were outmanned in the postseason those two seasons, as well, by the way.

Folks who wanna blog on here just throwing raw stats (1-15, for example) couldn’t possibly have played pro-level baseball, because they’d also know that Cox has only helped to worsen that number by defying the odds and getting into the playoffs with teams that probably had no business being in them in the first place. Give the man his due, there.

This season? He’s putting on the field what he’d been given to put on the field. How does he “manage” Francoeur or Langerhans past a sophomore slump? How does he make Sosa be the Sosa of 2005? How does he wave his wand and concoct a closer, hell a bullpen, PERIOD?!?

We’ve been spoiled, not just by this organization, but by a baseball mastermind, as well. We ecpect him to take any roster the organization gives him to playoff level baseball. It just doesn’t always happen, and we’re learning that.

By Larry

June 21, 2006 06:51 PM | Link to this

Enough is enough,WE WIN TONIGHT!!!

By widmarc Clark

June 21, 2006 07:07 PM | Link to this

This is it folks, there will be no trades. If there were JS would have made them long before now.we are stuck for the season with the present roster. Look the Mets bought a team to win the division 101 plus millions worth. Time-Warner won’t come up with the money so it’s the farm club or nothing. JS got Hudson, Edger R, and no more money for anyone else. No other team is in a hurry to trade with JS cause they are happy the Braves are on the bottom for the 1st time in 14 yrs we got no friends you understand the Mets and Phillies love us in last place we’ll get no help from those teams. JS thought he was holding a good hand, but he was wrong, it could happed to anyone, yes the relief pitchers can’t get seem to get a very bad high school team out, ” Why ” I don’t know, they just can’t, this present roster will either learn how to play MLB at a ML level or fold the tent and lose 101 games this year. This team has the ability to do a lot better, 75% of the Braves team need a heck of a lot of practice in how to batt and make routine plays around the bags.

everyone most likely is unhappy with the 2006 season so far if the players can’t turn things around,then both Cox and John will probably get fired then the wheels will fall off and no one ever has been able to guess just how bad a situation can get when those things begin to unfold. Lets hope our gang get it together and pull off a decent second half of the season we’ll all know for sure the end of Sept. widmarc clark

By glennbo

June 21, 2006 07:10 PM | Link to this

“Journalist” Jimmy, You have been testy the last couple of days. Take a midol, you’ll feel like a new woman.

By Todd A

June 21, 2006 07:11 PM | Link to this

Who can forget the infamous 1998 NLCS game 3 lineup Cox employed against Sterling Hitchcock?He trotted out his weak right handed hitting lineup consisting of Eddie Perez,Danny Bautista,and Tony Graffanino,despite the fact the Braves were already down 2-0 in the series.The guy is a buffoon.Period.

By a true fan

June 21, 2006 07:15 PM | Link to this

a problem with the last fifteen years is nobody appreciates what bobby and the boys have done. we have had the baseball world handed to us on a silver platter, and everbody is to use to it to even enjoy it. 15 divisional titles in a row, that is 15 years…. so outta of 5 years of my short life there has been another champion in the divison. what other team has accomplished that? this is where the braves need our support, and you know what they deserve it. yes the only won one world series out of 15 tries, but it happens and thats the way the dice fall sometimes… some teams will never even make it to the post season in the next ten years i.e. the royals… this orginization has been nothing but classy ever since bobby and john took it over.

Sosa has all the makings and tools of beening a star in this league. yes he has struggled since leo left, but he can be saved. he makes one or two mistakes a game and he gets punished. he will get better, and after the way he pitched last year helping us to the title we show support him. pitchers have off years all the time i.e. tom glavine in ny, greg maddux in chc…

so everyone stop whining and crying its not like we have a horrible team, we have a good core of vets(15 29 10 25 11) and future stars( 16 & 7) and we will be in good shape for next year, heck we might make this close in the second half… in this the last fifteen years they have given us no reason to trust them, so i am gonna trust them…

By a true fan

June 21, 2006 07:16 PM | Link to this

not to trust them*

By a true fan

June 21, 2006 07:16 PM | Link to this

no reason to not trust them*

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 07:16 PM | Link to this

Mr. J.J. Smith, doesn’t Drole make pineapples?

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 07:20 PM | Link to this

Does Bobby Cox like carrot cake?

By student

June 21, 2006 07:20 PM | Link to this

Chico in terms of pure talent thats probably true. 95 and 96 were probably the best Braves teams we ever had, mostly because the pitching was at its most dominant though. Maddux, Glavine and Smoltz at their prime were tough to beat. But if your long slow decline involves 8 more division titles, that isn’t really so bad is it?

By Bobby Cox

June 21, 2006 07:25 PM | Link to this

Ah, the ‘98 playoffs. Man I miss those guys! Eddie Perez, Danny Bautista and Graffy Graffinino. Don’t forget Keith Lockhart !

What a lineup ! I think Walt Weiss was with us that year.

Good news today on Chris Reitsma. He was throwing lefthanded in the bullpen & looked danged sharp ! He’ll be a big help during this pennant stretch, and take some of the burden off Remmy.

John may sign Clontzie to a minor league deal, and start him in Rome or Pearl to get in some work.

Can you imagine going down the stretch with Clontzie and a new Reitsma at your disposal?

This game never fails to excite the old skipper !

By billy

June 21, 2006 07:45 PM | Link to this

Andruw stats arent bad…..IMO. I biased though…..I love him

By Mark

June 21, 2006 07:47 PM | Link to this

I’m at least happy Cox moved Sosa to the bullpen. I think he can contribute there. Not going to solve all the teams issues, but I’m happy to see some sort of change to at least slow down the bleeding.

By JJMB

June 21, 2006 08:04 PM | Link to this

I have a comment to make to the “true blue FANS” that seem upset that anyone would dare complain about the Braves. One yankee poster (typical butinski northerner) questioned the worth of Atlanta fans, and if they deserved the Braves, or something like that nonsense. Several Atlanta fans agreed with it, and several have posted on their own about the unworthiness of those that dare complain.

My comment is this: None of it matters, except the back and forth arguing, the fretting, the angst, maintains a level of interest in the Braves. The play on the field is dictated by the talent level of the players, and the manager to a lesser degree. Fans do not win games.

So complain or don’t complain, it hardly matters. If the talent is present, the team will win, if not, the team will lose. Cheering, praying, scowling, berating others, makes not a whit of difference.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 08:07 PM | Link to this

“but we’d not have had 14 chances to win a World Series without Bobby Cox in the dugout.”

BULL-S*&T!

Ok - so MAYBE there’s a year or two in there where Cox’s ability to maintain stability got us in where a more divisive manager like a Bowa wouldnt have

So we make it 12 out of 14

The thing is, with Cox, we made the playoffs 14 years in a row, but despite that had no chance to win the WS the last ten years

I’d rather go to the playoffs a little less often but have a real chance to win when we do

Nathan said maybe half - I dunno, I have a hard time picturing a pre-02 Braves team that wouldnt have won the division with just about any perfusing eukaryote as manager.

So the last three to four years - a couple of those Cox’s even keel method might’ve got us in. But folks, remind me, when was the last time the Braves won a playoff series?

The teams that mightve actually gotten there because of Cox had zero fight in them when they got there - BECAUSE OF COX!

Nathan - the donkey stuff I cant help it. I watch the Braves getting blown to smithereens in the playoffs and they pan the camera to Cox and there he is, picking his nose and with this vacant stare - like does he even realize what is happening?

Every time I see that I get a mental visual of Pinnochio where the little kids have turned into donkeys but are still wearing people clothes

Who was the high 20’s age reliever that Cox was so up on a few weeks ago, saying that this pitcher had been highly touted for weeks

WEEKS - the guy is nearing thirty, is a journeyman bushleaguer, and he’s been touted for WEEKS

I just got the image of a bunch of managers all leaning up against a fencepost watching a springtraining game watching this guy pitch - he’s loaded the bases on walks - there’s Torre, and Piniella, and Dusty, and of course Bobby and what we see is these guys from the back so we see Bobby’s ears and tail - and all these smart managers are all leaning over to whisper in the genius’ ear

“Bobby you oughta get that guy. Man have you heard how highly we’ve been touting him?”

Yes I take it too far. As a manager, I hold the man in contempt. As far as I’m concerned, I’d be hard pressed to name a worse bench coach/manager in any sport at any time (ok, maybe Bobby Cremins - let’s see who gets riled up over that one)

I realize Bobby did some good stuff as GM - Obviously he knows something in that field, so my contempt for him should be tempered in that regard.

But as far as helping a baseball team win a game by doing something as a gameday manager, Cox is more useless than t** on a bull

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 08:07 PM | Link to this

What’s with the “TC” patches on the arms of all the Blue Jays? Are they all “Magnum P.I.” fans?

By Woogidy

June 21, 2006 08:07 PM | Link to this

Can Sosa make the bullpen any worse?

By brian

June 21, 2006 08:10 PM | Link to this

Giles did learn from yesterday. Got the double play instead of being duped

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 08:12 PM | Link to this

Francour finally looked at a pitch instead of swinging! Unfortunately, it was a called strike three.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 08:15 PM | Link to this

There’s a lot of reflection here about how the talent level just isnt there on this team. And I think it’s good to reflect on that - think back to what was vs what is

Now, instead of using that to pick a bone with ownership or to defend how Cox doesnt have the talent needed to succeed, just reflect for a minute on what we had

Maddux - Glavine - Smoltz - Andru - Chipper - McGriff - Galarragga

yes, you dont appreciate what you have until it’s gone - but look at those rosters from the 90’s Braves

doesnt ANYONE else get the feeling that GEEZ we shoulda been able to have more playoff success than we did?

How hard is it to win 92 games a year when you have three HOF pitchers, and maybe one or two halfway competative teams in your division each year?

Terrence Morre couldve won a few playoff berths with those teams, if he ever got over the fact that neither Maddux Glavine nor Smoltz were black

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 08:20 PM | Link to this

the announcers are having a bad night on FSN tonight, torborg sounds like a cyborg. hello to glennbo! yes, all this losing makes one testy. journalist will ask mombo for a midol. now, 3-0 and 2 more men on base. not pretty.

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:21 PM | Link to this

You know what the problem is….Bobby hasnt been thrown out of a game in a long time

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:22 PM | Link to this

TC is a former anooucer for the braves

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:24 PM | Link to this

i meant jays sorry

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:26 PM | Link to this

Torberg is horrible……

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 08:30 PM | Link to this

Ahh. Thank you, Billy. This bad sound feed is making the game sound like Dante’s Inferno. Glad to know I wasn’t the only one who noticed; thought I was having an acid flashback.

By Robert

June 21, 2006 08:31 PM | Link to this

The only way Cox should be allowed within 100 yards of the HOF is if he buys a ticket

If I am given the best team year after year, how much of an accomplishment is it to make the playoffs year after year

Cox’s legacy started long before he started managing the Braves. Remember the 85 ALCS - Cox’s Blue Jays blew a 3-1 series lead against an inferior-on-paper Royals team

If it werent for Don Denkinger the only Royals playoff series victory in the last 25 years would be against - Bobby Cox

The Houston Astros organization is in it’s 45th year of existance. In that time, they have a grand total of 3 playoff series victories. Two of those are against - Bobby Cox (the other is against the other overhyped “genius” manager Tony LaRussa)

The Chicago Cubs have ONE playoff series victory in the past 60 years. It came against - you guessed it, Bobby Cox

Somebody tell me again why we’re supposed to be impressed with this donkey?

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:32 PM | Link to this

turn on the radio

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 08:37 PM | Link to this

2 men on, nobody out, no runs score. it’s more than the bullpen, fellas. they are not playing together like a team. can no one bunt? can no one hit a ball behind the runner? even the jays can do that. ted lilly is fearsome tonight. journalist must go take a midol soon. thanks, glennbo.

By Paul Hamilton

June 21, 2006 08:44 PM | Link to this

Okay I checked that link with this years salaries. If we either trade or drop Thompson, Giles, Ramirez, Pratt, Jordan, Reitsma, Sosa, Remlinger. I think those are the salaries I used then we would have 15.8 million to spend. Betemit fills Giles spot, James fills Sosa’s spot, Davies fills Thompson’s spot, the other young catcher we have takes pratt’s spot, and S.T. takes over for Jordan then we have the bulk of that to spend. That’s actually not too bad and gives me a little hope. 13 or 14 million could bring in two quality relievers and fill any backup spots with minor leaguers. If it’s true that Smoltz’s salary will drop from 11mill to 8 mill then that’s another 3 million to spend. You could then drop Ladouche and a few of the other relievers and maybe come up with a leadoff man. There is hope, but not until next season.

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:52 PM | Link to this

now that was a double play

By billy

June 21, 2006 08:55 PM | Link to this

alright all you pudnits watching the game…what do you do before bobby does it…….and you second guess him….do you go to the bull pen with Hudson struggling with his control……what do you do?

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 09:01 PM | Link to this

mccann sure can hit. will anybody move him over, get him in? never mind, he’ll steal the base and get there on his own. now, can anybody score him?

By Todd A

June 21, 2006 09:01 PM | Link to this

It’s pretty obvious this team has pretty much thrown in the towel this season.We’re now tied record wise with the Tampa Bay Devil Rays.You knew at some point the streak would end,but no one expected a meltdown of epic proportions like this.And Dave O’Brien thinks we shouldn’t blow this roster up?My question is,why would we want most of this team back next year?

We already knew Hampton was going to be out for the season.So he wasn’t part of the equation anyway.The Braves believe that if we had Davies,Boyer,Grand-Slam Devine,and Foster,we would be challenging the Mets for first place?

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 09:02 PM | Link to this

Bring in Chad Paranto!

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 09:04 PM | Link to this

Journalist, the Braves line-up makes a lot of pitchers look fearsome.

By A Nobody

June 21, 2006 09:04 PM | Link to this

Jimmy Smith, you’re so far ahead of the pack they’ll never catch up. I don’t think there’s more than about 2 of them that have any clue as to what you’re really saying. Funny! CL was right.

By Steve H

June 21, 2006 09:07 PM | Link to this

I don’t understand the lineup. Why do have Diaz and McCann, batting a collective .716 batting 7th and 8th? If it was me, I would have Diaz and Renteria batting 1,2 or 2,1, hit McCann and Chipper 3rd or 5th. I knew Giles would not produce at leadoff - he’s just not that type of hitter. he’s got an undisciplined swing and needs protection from the leadoff guy getting on and threatening to steal.

It’s clear we’re headed for a down period, but at least put a lineup out there that can score runs.

By Steve H

June 21, 2006 09:07 PM | Link to this

I don’t understand the lineup. Why have Diaz and McCann, batting a collective .716 batting 7th and 8th? If it was me, I would have Diaz and Renteria batting 1,2 or 2,1, hit McCann and Chipper 3rd or 5th. I knew Giles would not produce at leadoff - he’s just not that type of hitter. he’s got an undisciplined swing and needs protection from the leadoff guy getting on and threatening to steal.

It’s clear we’re headed for a down period, but at least put a lineup out there that can score runs.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:08 PM | Link to this

Mcann is batting little over .150 against lefty’s. That might be the reason.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:12 PM | Link to this

this is the inning we have to do damage

By Miguel Manuel

June 21, 2006 09:13 PM | Link to this

To shed some light on what bloggers are writing about the “trade Andruw Jones” scenario: for those of you that didn’t see or pay attention to Peter Gammons’ comments on ESPN’s Sunday night telecast, or hear those same comments reiterated on last night’s Baseball Tonight, ANDRUW is the one that told Gammons he is feeling chronic shoulder soreness after all the years of diving, crashing into walls, etc., and it is affecting his bat speed (which is where power comes from, kids). Andruw has been my favorite Brave for about as long as he has been playing in the majors, and I would not relish seeing him in another team’s uniform, but he makes a lot of money and is the best candidate for shedding salary this year or in the offseason (and don’t kid yourself, the Braves desperately need payroll flexibility to remain competitive, and I belive Giles will likely be traded this year or before next season): Hampton is not tradeable at this point because of the injuries, his long recovery time, his salary, and the unknown of how he will perform next year. Smoltz’s $8 million option for next year makes him relatively inexpesive, plus there’s the psychological impact of gutting the team of the one player who’s been around since the last bad-old days, and he would be ideal to mentor the young pitching we will be promoting and/or acquiring this year and next. Chipper is a 10 & 5 player, and can thus veto any trade (although I’d still like to see the Braves approach him discreetly in the offseason about a possible trade, something he would find favorable—I’d much prefer to see Andruw’s beer belly and chronic smile than Larry Jr’s stoneface). No one doubts that Andruw can still perform at his expected level, but given all the factors involved he seems the most likely to go. I’m wondering if anyone can answer this question about Andruw’s impending 10 & 5 status: the 10-year anniversary of Andruw’s debut is August 15th, so I am wondering if the 10-year requirement is met at that point, or if it’s based on full seasons being up with a team, etc.

By Woogidy

June 21, 2006 09:15 PM | Link to this

All the Trash Talk of Bobby is getting annoying. What about the players? The fundamentals are as bad as I have seen on a BC managed team. This is an exception year for Bobby, He is still a great manager, but the players are losing these games for the most part, not the manager.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:15 PM | Link to this

poor bat speed 51 hommers….I’ll take it

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 09:16 PM | Link to this

I think the rest of this season should just be an extended spring training… Give the young kids an opportunity to make a name for themselves, and let them earn their stripes… then we can decide who we want to keep next year.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:17 PM | Link to this

sorry for all the post tonight (not really but had to make the effort)

Is AJ on one of his hot streak?

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 09:19 PM | Link to this

I don’t agree with a lot of how BC manages the team, but stop calling him names. Surely he’s had something to do with their success the last 14 years. I do NOT agree with him continuing to allow Marcus to lead off.

By glennbo

June 21, 2006 09:20 PM | Link to this

jimmy smith, glad I could help. If your symptoms still persist, try chocolate.

By Woogidy

June 21, 2006 09:21 PM | Link to this

Miguel, chronic shoulder problems? Peter Gammons is an ignorant puss. He is a year removed from 51 homers and is 29, 29 yr olds w/ chronic shoulder problems are few and far between. STOP BEING BRAINWASHED BY ESPN

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:25 PM | Link to this

good inning they did the damage

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 09:27 PM | Link to this

thanks, a nobody. have you ever been to snellville? in snellville everybody is somebody. it’s confusing but true.

now, this is a story about four people named everybody, somebody, anybody and nobody. there was an important job to be done and everybody was sure somebody would do it. anybody could have done it, but nobody did it. somebody got angry, because it was everybody’s job. everybody thought anybody could do it, but nobody realized everybody wouldn’t do it. So everybody blamed somebody when nobody did what anybody could have done.

somebody must step up for the braves tonight.

journalist thinks a nobody is not aptly named. we must find you a new name. maybe rob will take a pole.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:28 PM | Link to this

now one of the big boppers have to go deep…good play reteria

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 09:28 PM | Link to this

I’ll throw myself out there right now and say Hudson shouldn’t be in… that means he’ll get a 1-2-3 inning.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:30 PM | Link to this

damn can we hold a team…!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 09:31 PM | Link to this

Bob Drole for president!

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 09:32 PM | Link to this

billy, the wrong bopper went deep.

By glennbo

June 21, 2006 09:33 PM | Link to this

Famous Last Words: “I’m tellin’ ya, John, Reitsma can handle it.”

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:34 PM | Link to this

lol……that really made me laugh……..

well its time for a walk off HR by one of OUR boppers

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 09:34 PM | Link to this

Hey, Billy, if you’re asking that before we even get to the bullpen…

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:37 PM | Link to this

petes is giving a good AB giving the other bats agood look at the pitcher….mabey giles can get another hit

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 09:42 PM | Link to this

Renteria got robbed. At least he looks like he cares.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:42 PM | Link to this

cincy couldnt hold hte lead

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:44 PM | Link to this

just dont walk nobody mcbride

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:49 PM | Link to this

booo hooooo

damn stop walking people bullpen…..let’em hit out of the park witout people on base….give our offence better chance to come back

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 09:51 PM | Link to this

anymore “p” players tonight? let’s hope not. paronto? jimmy smith was high on him for awhile but thinks he now is a “p” player. of course, if he can make that sinker work he is tough. must not have been working the last two times out. renteria and mccann can hold their heads high. both are playing all out and it shows.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:53 PM | Link to this

dont foget giles and his defence jimmy

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:56 PM | Link to this

aonther game our bullpen gives up a run……reds have bases loaded 2 out againt wagnor 5/4 mets

By journalist jimmy smith

June 21, 2006 09:56 PM | Link to this

definitely a “p” player.

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:57 PM | Link to this

blown save wagner reds have lead….come on braves

By billy

June 21, 2006 09:59 PM | Link to this

oh yeah jose reyes hit for the cycle…what a good looking player

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:02 PM | Link to this

little know fact…….AJ hits better agaist righties

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 10:03 PM | Link to this

Just a lofty prediction… Braves score 2 in the 8th, and lose 6-5

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 10:04 PM | Link to this

Gotta admit… people are still goin’ to the games.. announced crowd over 25K

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 10:07 PM | Link to this

Paranto takes vitamin P. Beer contains vitamin P. Coincidence?

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:09 PM | Link to this

mcann gets up we have a chance

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:11 PM | Link to this

mets lost….now lets go big boy bring us home….

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:14 PM | Link to this

just hang one please!!!!!!!!!!11

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:18 PM | Link to this

well boys……and girls…..not counting us out of the game yet….but you really cant blame the bats tonight…..once again our bull fails and hudddy just did not have it tonight. lets see how ray does.

By Miguel Manuel

June 21, 2006 10:19 PM | Link to this

Woogidy, Billy, 51 HRs for Andruw last year, but what was his batting average with RISP? I seem to remember it was somewhere well below .225, which is awful, no matter how you slice it. Point being, although he’s one of my favorites and led the majors in HRs last year, how many of ‘em were difference-makers, and how many were padding statistics by pounding on bad pitching? Trade him while the value is still high, because he will be traded barring something unusual like Ted buying the team again. Brainwashed? Sorry, kid, the intelligence you’ve failed to display in your posts indicates your lack of perspective and complete inability to understand any situation (wipe yesterday’s drool off your face)…btw, Gammons is a hall-of-famer and has no reason to dog Andruw or the Braves in their home park.

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 10:22 PM | Link to this

Is it me… or is Ray throwin’ it up there like there’s nothing to lose?

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:24 PM | Link to this

how many RBI’s did he have……how many runs did he score…..how many runs did he save with his golve…..how many teams would love to have Andruw jones….why do you think his trade value is high….do you think a major leauge team will commit to 15 million on a “player in decline” or “damaged goods”? dont attack me dude…just shows your ignorance and lack of a good argument……ie attack someone to take away the light from your point.

ray looked good huh

By Fastfoodfreak

June 21, 2006 10:24 PM | Link to this

Hello!! A 1-2-3 inning brought to you by the Brave’s bullpen!

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:28 PM | Link to this

you get chipper up he will go deep its a lock

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:31 PM | Link to this

95 Run’s 128 RBI’s (Thats two hundred runs)…..thats production no matter how you cut it kid……..you have one stat to dictate weather or not you keep a players or not……good thing you not a GM

By bryan

June 21, 2006 10:32 PM | Link to this

you people amaze me. not one, two or even three players or coaches totally ruins a team. that’s why it’s called a team. leo NEVER played, all he did was to give his philosophy to the players he coached, it is up to the pitcher to do what he’s told. so it’s a different philosopy, guy’s like smoltz will speak up when there are some leo-isms that work better. bobby cox kept this team in first place for 14 years with new and differnt players every year. he’s having a bad year, everyone has a bad year now and then, especially in a span of 15 years. so everyone just quit crying about where the braves are BEFORE the all-star break and root for the wild card. if that doesn’t work out, which i think it will, then look forward to ‘07 with the soon-to-be-great young players the braves have.

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:35 PM | Link to this

By the way im not saying he a puljos, ortiz, ramierz……but prob a notch below……name a player we have a reasonble abiliy to get that can replace those numbers.

By The Grinch

June 21, 2006 10:35 PM | Link to this

Ray looked good, anyway. Did you guys just see the camera pan to a little 5-year old boy sitting in the stands with his glove and crying? Sums it up so far. If it was an adult, I’d think it was over the concession prices.

By billy

June 21, 2006 10:38 PM | Link to this

how many of those meanless hr’s are ones that created a blow out?

By Todd A

June 21, 2006 10:50 PM | Link to this

Andruw’s avg with RISP last year was .207.Hardly the stuff legends are made of.

By Todd A

June 21, 2006 10:53 PM | Link to this

I’m beginning to think we may not win another game this year.

By yawn

June 21, 2006 10:56 PM | Link to this

By Billy June 21, 2006 12:30 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 01:18 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 01:45 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 02:45 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 02:53 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 03:49 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 03:55 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 04:09 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 04:25 PM By Billy June 21, 2006 04:38 PM plus 31 more…….

By Woogidy

June 21, 2006 11:03 PM | Link to this

Manuel, ESPN is known by the media to start “storys” such as David Segui using HGH. WHO? David Segui? Who cares. Read a little about the interview with John Smoltz. They didn’t show the whole thing and took it out of context only to start a trade rumor. I don’t care if Peter “I only care about the Red Sox” Gammons is a HOF’er, He is NEVER a reliable source. He doesn’t need a reason. Look it up. I challenge my intelligence with anyone. Oh, and .225 with RISP? He himself at home plate is a RISP so that number is inaccurate. He did have 21 game winning RBI as well(pujols 20). If he is traded, I’ll buy the BRAVES! Yesterday’s drool? He has 61 RBI. Isn’t RBI what it’s all about? Read the reports. [http://www.prosportsdaily.com/mlb/braves/rumors.html]

By Woogidy

June 21, 2006 11:07 PM | Link to this

manuel related to ozzie guillen, shhoting off at the mouth.

By billy

June 21, 2006 11:12 PM | Link to this

The people who are pro “trade Andruw” can only bring up one stat….give me another reson to trade him……..and Peter Gammons dont count.

If anyone can think of a legit hitter that has shown similar stats as Andruw over a period of three years that we can realisticaly get then mabey I’ll consider it. Trading approx 200 runs and god knows how many runs saved by defence just seems asine to me…….

And to yawn….you did not have much to say i guess as your point is only to shed light on my euthisasm concerning the braves…….your the people the guys talk about….you have anything about baseball you would like to tell us?

By Lambos Lambasas

June 21, 2006 11:19 PM | Link to this

Since I have solid information on my side, I’m gonna throw this out there to the Cox-haters: The Society for American Baseball Research (SABR) has certain in-depth statistics they call “SABRmetrics”. Consider one known as Actual Wins Minus Expected Wins (A-E), defined in the sixth edition of Total Baseball thusly: “A measure of the extent to which a team outperformed or underperformed its talent; for a single season or two a high figure may be attributable to chance, but over time one must credit good managing” (emphasis mine). Expected wins are calculated like this:

(Runs Scored - Runs Allowed)/ Runs Per Win + (Wins + Losses)/2

I only have stats available through the 1998 season (at some point I’ll calculate it through the current season, but it’s too much work to do right now), but suffice it to say, it puts things in perspective: in the 17 season Robert Jospeh Cox managed in the majors through 1998, he is credited with 25.9 A-E; that’s 26 games he is credited with practically willing his team to win as a manager. By comparison, Joe “Catcher” Torre (who inherited organizations ready to compete from Cox in Atlanta and Showalter in NYC), in 17 seasons (1977-1998) is credited with -8.3 A-E, meaning he actually cost his teams 8 wins over the years that they should have won. Consider other contemporaries and past managerial stars: Sparky Anderson, 26 seasons managing, 23.9 A-E; Leo Durocher, 24 seasons, -14.0 A-E; Whitey Herzog, 18 seasons, 21.6 A-E; Miller Huggins, 17 seasons, 13.5 A-E; Ralph Houk (Cox’s professed mentor), 20 seasons, 27.8 A-E; Davey Johnson, 12 seasons, 16.1 A-E; Tommy Lasorda, 21 seasons, -15.5 A-E; Tony LaRussa, 20 seasons, 20.1 A-E; Jim Leyland, 13 seasons, 2.8 A-E; Connie Mack (just for fun), 53 seasons, 13.6 A-E; Joe McCarthy, 24 seasons, -23.6 A-E; John McGraw, 33 seasons, -12.0 A-E; Lou Piniella, 12 seasons, -10.0 A-E; Casey Stengel, 25 seasons, -4.8 A-E; Bobby Valentine, 11 seasons, 15.9 A-E; Earl Weaver (to whom Cox is most-frequently compared, for an imagined reliance on the “3-run homer”), 17 seasons, 29.9 A-E. So, all those who think Cox has done it because of all those great players that miraculously walked on the field (If Ted builds it, they will come), please explain why Huggins, Stengel, and McCarthy (all managed the Yankees for several years during the era of 1920s-50s that they absolutely owned) had such relatively low A-E. Also, explain why none of the above managers were able to enter the playoffs 15 consecutive years, while also explaining why Cox was able to steer his teams into the playoffs for that amount of time, during an era that arguably has greater parity than any other in the history of the game. I have no idea where Cox’s A-E may be these days relative to someone like Torre or Dusty Baker, but consider that since 1998 he was voted Manager of the Year twice, which means people who get paid to watch the game and consider it intelligently seem to think he’s onto something.

By Frankie Cabrera

June 21, 2006 11:26 PM | Link to this

Robert,

Bobby Cox is the man…lay off you horse’s a*.

By Miguel Manuel

June 21, 2006 11:37 PM | Link to this

Take your Ritalin, Billy, you’ve responded to my post of 10:19 pm 6 times already. Yes, Andruw’s value is still high, as I readily acknowledged (also stated he was my favorite player), however, as I’ve already noted, an average with RISP that is so close to the Mendoza line is not acceptable, especially for a cleanup guy, and throwing runs scored and RBIs at me does not trump such a low average—it’s the one glaringly obvious stat that cost Andruw MVP votes last year (Pujols deserved it anyway). Again, with such a low RISP, you tell me how many of those awesome RBIs were difference makers, and how many occurred via one of those home runs that made the score 10-2 instead of 8-2. My point is that he’s the one very costly player that has the most likelihood of being moved (and easily the most value, except maybe Smoltzie going to a contender that’s willing to overpay, like Detroit, but now that seems unlikely), although it seems more likely to happen in the offseason than the trading deadline, AND it seems that he hit his ceiling a couple of years ago—he’s never likely to be the clutch offensive threat we always hoped he’d be, and his defense will suffer as he gets older. No, I don’t want him to go, but in any trade he’s likely to bring us something we need more. BTW, Woogidy, I don’t go to WNBA games or Madonna concerts.

By dewan lee

June 21, 2006 11:50 PM | Link to this

Okay please tell me and show me where Gammons has made any HOF. You will not find that trust me. Second thing how can Sosa be the closer when we have not led in the ninth in 10 years. Lets try starter by committee. With that we may get a win this summer. Smolts pitches 3 Sosa 3 Huddy 2 and Ramirez the 9th and hopefully Betemit is playing and Laroche is seeing his ADD therapist. (LOL)

By gotigers72

June 21, 2006 11:52 PM | Link to this

I agree that Sosa belongs on the bullpen. At Myrtle Beach.

By Brent

June 21, 2006 11:59 PM | Link to this

One way to assure that we never see Jorge again is to announce that he will now be the closer.

By Miguel Manuel

June 22, 2006 12:02 AM | Link to this

A little bit more about it Woogidy/Billy. Game-winning RBI haven’t been counted by MLB for about 20 years because they were rightly recognized as a useless statistic: a player could get a GWRBI in the first inning, for instance, while playing a clearly inferior team, facing a pitcher who doesn’t have the stuff to take the mound that game, so that a team could run a pitcher out of a game in the first inning, have their own pitchers shutout the other team, and win 10-0—was the first person to drive in a run in that game really more desrving of special statistical consideration? “He himself at home plate is a RISP” (sic)? OK, so in that scenario, he was an RISP 51 times last year, but last year while standing at the plate he was also a K 112 times, he was a GIDP 19 times, and he had 0 sacrifice hits.
Y’know, I really didn’t get into this blog to rip on Andruw, he really is my favorite and I love watching him glide like a gazelle, then patiently wait standing under a ball that would force Jim Edmonds, Torii Hunter, or anyone else to dive. I guess it’s asking too much to ask the typical knee-jerk bloggers to consider the entirety of what I wrote.

By dewan lee

June 22, 2006 12:03 AM | Link to this

Mcbride sucks, Ray has started to suck, Paronto sucks, Reitsma has always sucked even with Leo he sucked, Thomson has sucked every sense lazy got lazy on him, Huddy has not proven a thing in his two years, Ramirez is iffy, Davies sucks and dont try and convince me otherwise as the stats dont lie minors or majors, Yates ( I dont think I need to say anything about him) Take his goatee and ball and ride out. Langerhans was impressive last year but sucks this year, Diaz is not a good hitter jsut an average hitter wiht slow bat speed and terrible defense in the OF, Giles is butcher at second (bring up Prado) and not a leadoff hitter, Chipper seems to not care and has started to dog it at third. Chipper is not a 280 hitter and 7 hr guy so that leads me to wonder if he is hurt, dogging it or has come off of the stuff? Yes I went there and it may be true jsut check the stats with his warning track power all of a sudden.

By JJMB

June 22, 2006 12:08 AM | Link to this

I think the avg with RISP is a great stat. Look at Henry Aaron’s numbers. Career HR’s, RBI’s, R’s. Yet he was a terrible clutch hitter. All time major league leader in hitting into DP’s. Horrible post season stats. All Star game stats are bad too, if I remember correctly. He was pitched to because there wasn’t any reason not to. The Braves were usually down by 5-6 runs a game.

By Lambos Lambasas

June 22, 2006 12:11 AM | Link to this

Hi Dewan Lee, I googled the words “gammons hall fame”, and actually found 441,000 results. I haven’t had time to go through all of them (haha), but suffice it to say, many of them will confirm that he is a hall-of-fame baseball scribe.

By journalist jimmy smith

June 22, 2006 12:25 AM | Link to this

Hee Hee Hee HEE Haw Haw Hawq Haw Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee,,,,,,,,,,,,Haw?heehawheehawheehaeheehae Hee Haaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,hawhawhawhawhawhawhawhaw

By p.russ

June 22, 2006 12:29 AM | Link to this

I was just curious, is Chipper injured and not telling anyone? He seems to be pulling off every single pitch when he bats left handed. Hence the fact he is only getting opposite field singles when he does get a hit. He stays on the ball pretty well when hitting from the right side. Now if I am able to see this on TV and from the stands why hasnt our great hitting coach(HA!) TP helped him fix this problem?

By p.russ

June 22, 2006 12:32 AM | Link to this

Oh yeah one more thought … i hope the Braves have put in a waiver claim for Antonio Alfonseca. Even though he wasnt pitching that great for Texas I am sure he would do better than some of the chumps we have in the pen right now.

By teoa

June 22, 2006 12:52 AM | Link to this

Ron Roberts, I really hope you were joking when you called Bobby Cox a “mastermind.” That’s funny if you were being sarcastic — ridiculous otherwise. Not even the most ardent Cox supporters would call him a mastermind…I guarantee you are the first. The argument can be made that he is a good figurehead for this organization — a cheerleader who usually gets the most out of his players. But Bobby Cox has the baseball IQ of a rock, and he is the one primarily responsible for this disaster of a team. I agree this isn’t a championship caliber team, but no way the Braves should be this bad if their manager had any ability to adapt his managing strategy to the specific strengths of his players.

I could easily name 20 incredibly stupid (statistically provable) personnel decisions by Cox this year that no other manager in baseball would make that have cost this team at least 15 wins — the prime example being Reitsma as closer for morale-crushing disaster after disaster after disaster until the team’s confidence was completey destroyed.

This is common sense, Ron, see if you can follow: Baseball strategy dictates that you use your best relief pitcher in the 9th innings of close games. You don’t use your 2nd best, your 3rd best, your 4th best, and you certainly don’t use your worst reliever. And you sure as hell don’t use the WORST RELIEVER IN ALL OF BASEBALL, WHICH REITSMA HAS BEEN THIS YEAR! You can say that Reitsma didn’t blow that many games, but everyone started to press when they realized the “mastermind” was going to put the worst pitcher in baseball in the game in the 9th inning no matter what. The hitters started trying to lead by 10 runs after 8 so they could survive Reitsma, the rest of the pen started to try to strike out 10 guys an inning to combat the perception that they (not Reitsma) were blowing every lead — and all this led to the current 9 straight losses. It’s hard to stop it when you’re in that deep of a rut, and you should look no further than your “mastermind” as to how they got there.

By David O'Brien

June 22, 2006 01:03 AM | Link to this

If anybody actually cares, Andruw’s salary is $13.5 mill next season, not $15 mill.

I just wish ESPN would report the salary figure, so some of you guys would then repeat it like parrots 1,200 times and everyone would know and we’d at least be accurate with that one point.

By Lambos Lambasas

June 22, 2006 01:19 AM | Link to this

Very astute point about Chipper’s batting, p.russ, I nominate thee for most levelheaded, intelligent blogger since the season started. It raises a question I’ve always wondered; if a guy can no longer hit well from both sides of the plate, is he really still a switch-hitter? I understand that at this point in his career he can’t be asked to bat exclusively from one side of the plate against both righties and lefties, but barring Chipper doing some serious soul-searching and finding in himself some last ember of desire to win and focus on playing harder, can we not reasonably expect to let Wilson Betemit platoon with Chipper? Wilson is currently hitting .300 against righties and .250 against lefties. This idea of coddling underperforming or nonperfoming stars is irksome, especially when an outstanding alternative exists in the Braves’ dugout.

By lester reyes

June 22, 2006 01:26 AM | Link to this

OK, teoa, so if you don’t go to Reitsma as closer, who in the Braves bullpen do you go to as your closer? …C’mon, you’re on the hotseat, since you obviously have a baseball IQ that’s greater than the average rock. I guess you’d go to Brad Lidge, or Mariano Rivera, maybe Billy Wagner, since, in your world, we could probably trade our lowest-level prospects (except Schuerholz the younger) for any or all of them.

By lester reyes

June 22, 2006 01:32 AM | Link to this

Many of you probably already heard this since it was decided before the game tonight, but for those of us outside the SportSouth/TurnerSouth footprint, this was posted on the Braves’ mlb.com site about an hour ago: Sosa to the bullpen, with a chance to prove himself as the closer. I know he’s been ugly as a starter, but I like giving him the chance to air it out for an inning a night; hopefully not having to focus for 5 2/3 innings once a week will help the young man find his groove again.

By Head Coach

June 22, 2006 01:57 AM | Link to this

Yes , Chipper is playing hurt. Why , I have no clue ,unless he thinks he is helping the team by being in the lineup everyday. End of the month , 20 games games out , I called it , its going to happen. Giles is still batting leadoff , Cox still has his finger up his nose and Schuerholz is sitting on his hands in denial. It’s wonderful to be a Braves fan and hey , all the games are televised nationally this weekend , I get to watch them get thier brains beat out and throw beer cans at the tv , kick the dog and cuss like a sailor. It’s going to be a great weekend ! I luv it.

By Johnny Taco

June 22, 2006 07:21 AM | Link to this

Time to call the Yankees, Dodgers & Red Sox and start taking offers for Tim Hudson.

Other than an occasional flash of brilliance, he’s been average to mediocre at best. The Braves could get quite a bit for him that could address more pressing needs.

Walking the bases loaded? Hmm.

By KneeJerk

June 22, 2006 07:29 AM | Link to this

Robert, In your little fable about managers standing around a fencepost, you actually included Dusty Baker as a “smart” manager. I’ll bet people in Chicago would differ. If there was ONE manager that can’t manage a pitching staff, it’s him. Piniella doesn’t have a job, and seems about as smart as a brick on the Fox baseball telecasts. Torre, we’ll never know unless he takes a job without endless funds to spend on players.
And your reasoning for bashing Cox is “Look at the talent we had”. We weren’t playing against Ron Roberts’ t-ball team. We actually played against teams that were good enough to make it to the playoffs or W.S. From our run, we’ll have 2 or 3 position players possibly make the HOF. Several teams have that from the past 15 years. About our 3 HOF pitchers: Bobby can’t pitch for them. Are Maddux’s post-season failures Bobby’s fault? Disagree with our manager’s decisions all you want, but why let it get personal? Did you not get that autograph you wanted? You can’t be in the game unless you ante up. For the past 15 years, with Cox we’ve anted up.

By dewan lee

June 22, 2006 08:15 AM | Link to this

Actually He is not a HOF. I reseached it and what he is is a recipient of a HOF award but not to be confused with being a HOF. Read below.

So you’re probably waiting for the punchline … we’ve certainly taken our fair share of shots at the Archbishop of Boston Baseball here at Batter’s Box, occasionally pointing out his, ahem, spotty record of prognosticating trades and transactions.

But in case you hadn’t heard, Peter Gammons is headed to the Hall of Fame … sort of, anyway, as the 2004 recipient of the J.G. Taylor Spink Award.

What better way to salute him than with song lyrics?

I refuse to lose, I pay dues up in this game I should be awarded to be in the Hall Of Fame Rollin with my Squad that’s how I maintain I should be awarded to be in the Hall Of Fame — Rampage, “Hall of Fame”

According to the Baseball Hall of Fame Web site, “The J.G. Taylor Spink Award, named after the late founder of The Sporting News, has been voted upon annually since 1962 when Spink himself was the recipient of the inaugural honor. The award honors a baseball writer (or writers) “for meritorious contributions to baseball writing” and is presented at the Hall of Fame Induction Ceremony by that year’s President of the Baseball Writers’ Association of America (BBWAA).

“The award is voted upon annually by the BBWAA, via a meeting and subsequent “show of hands” either at the preceding year’s World Series or Winter Meetings. A nominee is recommended by the BBWAA’s Screening Committee prior to the meeting. Each award recipient (not to be confused with an inductee) is presented with a certificate during the Hall of Fame Induction Ceremony and is recognized in the “Scribes & Mikemen” exhibit in the Library of the National Baseball Hall of Fame.”

So props to Gammons … what other song lyrics — remember, the edgier the better for this guy — can you offer to him?

By Zinte

June 22, 2006 08:43 AM | Link to this

The bullpen imploded again and this team has a bunch of kids who probably should be playing AAA ball. The Braves have aging superstars w/fat contracts whom are injury prone. Plus(just MAYBE),the competition is actually BETTER. Any surprise why the Braves get their tails handed to them on seemingly a nightly basis? Just play the best ball you can and not worry about winning the division. All the Braves will do is get smoked in the 1st round and prove(once again)that just because you MADE the playoffs doesen’t mean you’re a playoff team. I am a Braves fan(BEFORE 1991)and it’s simply time to get realistic about some things.

By ugadawg

June 22, 2006 08:57 AM | Link to this

For everybody saying Andruw is overpayed…. Torii Hunter is a great defensive CF, but his career average is only .267, and he averages 23 HRs a season with 88 RBIs. He makes $11 mil.

Andruw is a better CF, has a .268 career average, and averages 34 HRs and 102 RBIs a year. He’s on pace to have over 140 RBIs this year. He makes $13 mil. Don’t tell me he’s not worth the money.

Beltran and Damon are making $13 mil, and Edmonds is making $12 mil.

Andruw is better defensively than all of them, and will give you more RBIs than all of them.

By Johnny Taco

June 22, 2006 08:57 AM | Link to this

Chipper had a good night. Struck out twice and made an error. Average working its way down.

He has to be the least effective #3 hitter in all baseball.

He should consider giving all his salary back so the Braves can get some players !

By mitc0218

June 22, 2006 09:03 AM | Link to this

This team has more problems than just the bull pen. That is the major challenge but this team is weak defensivly up the middle with the exception of Andruw. They have no true lead off hitter and they have no idea what a strike is. Bad defense makes for bad pitcheing. The 2006 braves are at best a mediocre team and while I would like to believe that May was what the real braves look like I believe that the June Braves are closer to the real team. I’ll continue to support them because they have been my team through the bad years in the 70’s and 80’s. The run had to come to an end I just didn’t expect the crash to be so hard and fast.

By Robert

June 22, 2006 09:23 AM | Link to this

Mastermind?

MASTERMIND?

Now tell me, next time they pan the Braves dugout and we see Cox sitting there picking his nose. Which name belongs on the back of his jersey - “Mastermind” or “Eeyore” ?

By jimmy smith, gentleman journalist

June 22, 2006 09:31 AM | Link to this

jimmy smith, gentleman journalist, did not post a hee haw post about bobby cox. this journalist has never/would never call bobby cox a donkey. bobby cox is manager of the atlanta braves. jimmy smith will have some fun with bobby’s nose picking but jimmy smith will never call him a donkey.

surprise! others are posting using jimmy smith’s name. look for grammatical errors and spelling errors, too. these tang drinkers’ posts are easily identified.

if you find a purported jimmy smith post that contains ugly words be assured the post is not from gentleman journalist, jimmy smith. only exception, jimmy smith will occassionally say hello to southerneasterbunnyrevertedtojackaszz.

now, jimmy smith will sometimes take a few liberties with the glennbos and the robs of this blog but they typically bring it upon themselves. and where is journalist bob, today? reach out to him, please, dob. only you can prevent bob’s departure. if you do not act soon, there will only be glennbos and robs and no one will touch this blog with a ten foot poll.

By A Nobody

June 22, 2006 09:49 AM | Link to this

True words, Jimmy Smith. Since the heavy influx of middle-schoolers who have mistaken a blog for a chat room, most of the genuine baseball bloggers have vanished. This has deteriorated into a crashing bore. Except for DOB’s posts, yours and 1 or 2 others, there’s nothing here worth spending time on anymore. Instead of goofing off, they really should pay more attention to their spelling and grammar lessons; they’d get better grades and present themselves better to the world when they graduate.

By eware

June 22, 2006 11:00 AM | Link to this

DOB, we need some music recommendations! With the Braves in the dumps, I need something new to focus my attention on, pronto.

Have you heard any of the Soledad Brothers work? Pretty bluesy/early Stones-type stuff. I dig it.

Tickets on sale tomorrow for July 29th Ryan Adams show at the Tabernacle.

Thanks!

By johnmrog

June 22, 2006 11:36 AM | Link to this

Paul Hamilton, you do realize that when you drop or cut players in baseball, that the team is still responsible for 100% of their contracted salary until and unless that player signs with another team? So dropping/cutting players like Sosa, Reitsma, or Todd Pratt does absolutely NOTHING in recovering salary.

By journalist jimmy smith

June 22, 2006 11:37 AM | Link to this

eware, you are right. we must have some diversions. even dob’s music will be fine at this time. your use of the word, “pronto”, stunned jimmy smith. it reminds jimmy smith of a “p” player who has given up many runs in the past few days. better forgotten. yes, diversions are necessary. perhaps raisins will return and we can talk pie. perhaps ron roberts will report on his safety in new orleans. alas, maybe the lady will offer a report on the crows. in any case, we must not call our manager a donkey. now, bobby dews … journalist jimmy smith would ask dob to bring us some insight from the esteemed coach of the bullpen. bob, hk, and penn are probably deep sea fishing somewhere and did not invite jimmy smith.

By Gene

June 22, 2006 11:57 AM | Link to this

I think the reality is that most Braves fans are so stunned by the last 22 games that we have nothing left to say. It has become obvious that the team is not going to make any changes because they seem to be hanging on to the incredibly slim hope that fortunes will reverse. Such was the case with the Astros the last couple of years, but this Braves team is just not nearly as talented as the Astros. I think for the first time since about 1988 I will just ignore them for awhile.

By brad webb

June 22, 2006 12:15 PM | Link to this

way to keep the lineup the same bobby, awesome idea. although yo did drop mccann to the end of the lineup. brilliant.

By Stinky Jones

June 22, 2006 01:12 PM | Link to this

Poor Jimmy. All those delusions of grandeur flooding your posts. Tsk tsk. Just because nobody asked you to fill in on the blog launch earlier this week, you got all hostile on DOB.

And your open hostility towards Bobby Cox…Hmmm. Methinks it has something to do with your wife’s handholding episode with him. Just think, those hands held your honey’s. OOOfff (with a shudder).

Your preoccupation with poles is also disturbing. You really should see somenone about that. Perhaps you should poll the other bloggers to determine your best option on how to handle this.

And Nobody. You’re not guiltless when it comes to being a boor. I seem to remember you trying to pick a snit with me. As I recall, you weren’t quite clever enough to pull it off. You seem to only speek up in defense of Jimmy. HHMMMM….

By Tony

June 22, 2006 01:29 PM | Link to this

Sosa for Closer It So-Sa Right!

By Dave

June 22, 2006 02:57 PM | Link to this

all of you calling for Bobbys head calling him a Donkey.. What a year makes last year his finist job now get rid of him

By Aaron

June 22, 2006 03:30 PM | Link to this

If 14 titles isn’t something other people/teams talk about, then why is it that every spring for the past 10 years the LEAD story in the National League is “Can the Braves do it again?!” And every year since there’s been someone calling for the Braves demise, getting it wrong like the weatherman, and then starting up the same routine again every March. This year they got it right. Good. Now this coming spring they can shut up with the constant doomsaying and focus on the Braves’ future season as opposed to all the past ones.

As for Giles, at this point I’d be willing to talk Jerry Royster or Rowland Office out of retirement to take over at leadoff. Somebody call Rick Mahler, we need a spot starter for Sunday’s game.

By DonCoburleone

June 22, 2006 05:12 PM | Link to this

Trade Giles to St. Louis, Laroche to ANYBODY, and as much as it pains me to say it, Smoltz to Detroit. And get nothing but bullpen help in return! Smoltz for Zumaya!

By DonCoburleone

June 22, 2006 05:19 PM | Link to this

I don’t think you can blame McDowell for the Braves problems this year. I just think he has the wrong approach with this team. The pitchers just seem to do what they want, rather than what they’re supposed to do. With Mazzone, they knew what their job was: Work the outside corner and keep the ball down. And Mazzone stood by that and verbally disciplined pitchers who went away from that. McDowell’s frat-house mentality instills no discipline on these pitchers, SOMEBODY NEEDS TO START CRACKIN THE WHIP ON THESE GUYS!

By DavidBradley

June 24, 2006 12:15 AM | Link to this

Man, does anyone know what it means to be a fan anymore? No wonder northern transplants rag on these fair-weather fans, these self-proclaimed experts in the art and science of baseball management… they’re all talk and no heart, no love of the game, just using baseball as an excuse to blow themselves up and cut other people down.

I’ve been a Braves fan since major league baseball came to the South. I was six at the time. Twenty-five years later, they played in the World Series. When they didn’t win, the same sort of baseball experts as clog this page derided a parade for them, mostly, I think, to hear themselves bray. These people aren’t baseball fans.

Do you know any Cubs fans? Diehard Cubbie fans? Do you know any of the loyal fans who believed until the Red Sox broke the “Bambino curse”, or White Sox fans who kept coming to the park until their team finally won a World Series fair and square? Those are the kind of baseball fans the Braves deserve. There’s nothing stupid or immoral about supporting your team through lean times, but there might be in deserting them.

It’s not a video game. It’s not fantasy baseball. It’s a kid’s game played by admittedly overpaid grownups. The beautiful irony of baseball is that as much as people love yammering about statistics, the game hasn’t a damned thing to do with statistics, and people who play it know that. It’s heart and hustle, grace and power, making the extra effort and accepting an ump’s call without being a crybaby. It’s a great game. It deserves real fans.

By Metropolitan Man

June 24, 2006 10:05 AM | Link to this

We like Sosa, please keep him as a starter. Stop tinkering with a wonderful braves lineup. You guys are just giving back wins for all those games stolen by a bunch of overrated, Country club of the south slobs. Lets begin a new losing streak today. I say today the game will not be blown by the bullpen but by Error Renteria. Take off those braves and stankee hats and don them METS hats!!!

By brownstar

June 24, 2006 03:16 PM | Link to this

yup, I was right. you do just run your mouthes when you win.

By Metropolitan Man

June 25, 2006 08:45 AM | Link to this

Nope, I run my mouth when you crappy braves fans no longer want to talk baseball. Its still your team, your south, your crap brownstar. But I would not have much to say either if the team I rooted for was a loser. That winning thing may never visit another ATL team again, just ask Terance Moore. If I were a braves fan, I would start wearing war pait to the games. If you cant scare the opponent, try to make them laugh with those silly dissapointed, did we just lose another 1 run game face.