Home > Jay Bookman > Archives > 2008 > December > 10 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USWhat’s the story with Rod and Barack?
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The allegations in the Blagojevich case out of Illinois would be fascinating in their own right, if nothing else as a case study in self delusion. That guy thought he would get away with all this? But it’s also important to remember that he’s in his second term of governor and spent most of his life in Illinois politics — his assumptions and understandings of how the world worked that the rest of us find so astounding did not rise out of nowhere. They reflect what he saw around him.
You occasionally get whiffs of a similar world here in Georgia — stories about politicians shaking down contributors in return for, say, a zoning necessary for an apartment project, or a politician slyly reminding a business person that he has regulatory oversight over that person’s industry. And sure enough, when you look later at the campaign disclosures, there’s a substantial contribution from that business person to that politician. Unfortunately, that’s not enough to go to press with.
The larger story, however, is what impact this will have on President-elect Barack Obama, who as a Democratic senator from Illinois inevitably had dealings with Illinois’ Democratic governor. The only thing on the record is in Obama’s favor — Blagojevich’s anger and frustration at Obama’s refusal to “pay to play” in naming his replacement to the Senate.
Reuters describes Obama as essentially untouched by the scandal:
CHICAGO - President-elect Barack Obama’s decision to keep a distance from his state’s governor, who was arrested on corruption charges on Tuesday, should enable him to escape becoming tainted by the scandal, analysts said.
Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich stands accused of trying to sell the president-elect’s vacant U.S. Senate seat for financial and other personal benefits for himself and his wife, among other charges.
“Obama is not related to the corruption pattern in Chicago,” said political scientist Dick Simpson of the University of Illinois in Chicago. “He has not been pressing for any person to replace him in his Senate seat.”
However, Michael Scherer at Time’s Swampland blog is not quite so sure:
At a news conference just now, U.S. Attorney Patrick Fitzgerald made very clear that he had uncovered no evidence of misbehavior on the part of Barack Obama. “I should be clear that the complaint makes no allegations whatsoever about the president-elect or his conduct,” he said. But he also made clear that his investigation was hardly complete. He still needed “to find out what happened.” And he said, as a policy, that the U.S. Attorney office is not in the business of “giving clean bills of health.”
That’s the reason that the fall of Gov. Rod Blagojevich is going to continue to haunt Obama, not to mention Chicago’s Democratic establishment where he built his roots. The President of the United States has a higher burden than just about any elected official anywhere. His staff will be called on by the press to account for all their conversations with Blagojevich and his aides. Obama will have to explain what he knew about these discussions. The bit players in the complaint, like the unnamed Senate Candidate 1 and Senate Candidate 5, will have to come forward and explain their involvement.
If the investigation continues into next year, which seems likely, there may even be calls for the appointment of something like an independent counsel at the Justice Department to avoid any hint of political interference. Obama’s staff and political allies may be forced to get attorneys of their own.
And ABC News describes some heated, and quite obscene, language from Blagojevich toward Obama in FBI wiretaps, particularly considering Obama’s refusal to pay to play:
“Told by two other advisers he has to “suck it up” for two years, the FBI says it heard Blagojevich complain he has to give this “motherfer [the president-elect] his senator. F him. For nothing? F* him.”
The governor is heard saying he will pick another candidate “before I just give fing [Senate Candidate l] a fing Senate seat and I don’t get anything.”
All in all, there seems no sign of any direct problem for Obama. But the case will be a distraction at a time he really didn’t need any.
Comments
By Mrs. Godzilla
December 10, 2008 7:58 AM | Link to this
Rod should resign or be impeached.
Sad, that the story of Governor Don Siegelman doesn’t get as much play.
By leni
December 10, 2008 8:00 AM | Link to this
Having been an admirer of Mr. Axelrod’s straightforward answers, unsurpassed knowledge of Chicago politics, and eloquence in speaking for his candidate in many news conferences, I was stunned and amazed to hear that on the matter of relations between the Big O and Blag he “misspoke.”
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 8:01 AM | Link to this
“Told by two other advisers he has to “suck it up” for two years, the FBI says it heard Blagojevich complain he has to give this “motherfer [the president-elect] his senator. F him. For nothing? F him.”*
Suck what up for two years?
His “Health and Human Services” chairmanship?
It sounds to me like a deal was struck and Blago didn’t like the outcome.
And who the hell is Reuters? Are they the criminal justice system in this country? How long are we going to subvert the laws of this land so we can be in the pocket apologists for an obvious career political hack like Obama, who even before this has a long line of questionable dealings that have been brushed under the rug, such as Acorn and Rezko?
Appoint an independent counselor now.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 8:03 AM | Link to this
Well. well let’s see, will it be Chicagogate, Illinoisgate, Slimygate, Corruptgate or WhatMeWorrygate?
*WASHINGTON – President-elect Barack Obama hasn’t even stepped into office and already a scandal is threatening to dog him.
Obama isn’t accused of anything. But the fact that Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich, a fellow Democrat, has been charged with trying to sell Obama’s now-vacant Senate post gives political opponents an opening to try to link him to the scandal. A slew of questions remain. The investigation is still under way. And the ultimate impact on Obama is far from certain.*
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 8:06 AM | Link to this
P.S.
If only this and $1.50 gas had come just before the election……..
Oh well, he who laughs last laughs loudest.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this
Obama also endorsed Blagojevich for reelection, even as the governor was embroiled in a controversy over hiring. “If the governor asks me to work on his behalf, I’ll be happy to do it,” Obama told the Chicago Daily Herald in July 2006.
Obama’s past political support for Blagojevich should renew concerns about the incoming president’s pattern of troubling associations, or at least, his willingness to look the other way in the face of wrongdoing if it’s in his political interests at the time.-Amspec
Attack the gay Congressman and spin.
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 8:11 AM | Link to this
If Obama were on record to receive say 50 percent of the proceeds from the sale of that seat on E-Bay, then one might have to be concerned about Obama’s business skills. He should clearly hold out for 75 percent of the proceeds like any good Republican politician would.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 8:14 AM | Link to this
Jay
You’re a great investigative reporter. I look forward to anything you will uncover on this.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 8:16 AM | Link to this
Earl Long, Huey Long’s brother, issued an authoritative dictum on minimalist communication for crooked pols that the Blagojevichs and Jeffersons were too sloppy to study: “Don’t write anything you can phone. Don’t phone anything you can talk. Don’t talk anything you can whisper. Don’t whisper anything you can smile. Don’t smile anything you can nod. Don’t nod anything you can wink.”
Blagojevich’s idea of a suave aside was to inform an aide that his list of demands to bidders for the sale of Obama’s Senate seat “can’t be in writing.” Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald said even his most cynical investigators were “shocked” by Blagojevich, though he didn’t spell out the source of their shock: whether it was the extent of Blagojevich’s corruption, the depth of his stupidity, or both.-Amspec
When you got a compliant army of apologists covering up your every move in the mainstream media and press, do you even care anymore if you get caught?
Apparently not.
This guy thought he could ride the same protection, the same mountainous wave of propaganda that has been shoveled up in front of Oblahma, little did he realize how quickly they would move on him once he threaten Wonder Boy.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 8:36 AM | Link to this
Hey Libs.
You’re a little quiet this morning ………
By Shawny
December 10, 2008 8:41 AM | Link to this
The media that wanted Obama will do what is necessary to make this go away, and repeat the line that Obama has and had no ties to the Gov until we all believe it. This has to be covered to the extent that the Gov is slayed, but it will quickly be hushed afterwards. watch and see.
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 8:46 AM | Link to this
Dang, Jay. You throw a whole side of juicy red meat out for the blood-thirsty 20 percenters and they fall silent. They should be busy just throwing out one juicy morsel after another this morning and yet it’s as though you have already covered it all to their satisfaction. Good job, Jay.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 8:51 AM | Link to this
Headline ABC News (not Drudge Jay):
Obama and Blagojevich: Who Spoke to Whom, and When?
Obama team says president-elect never spoke to Blagojevich about his senate seat.
Will the mainstream media have the guts to take this wherever it leads?
I seriously doubt it.
By JAY BOOKMAN
December 10, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this
test
By DB, Gwinnettian
December 10, 2008 9:08 AM | Link to this
Jay @ 9.06, that’s SO LIKE YOU!!
U R SO BIAS!!!!11!!
By Redneck Convert
December 10, 2008 9:09 AM | Link to this
Well, it’s a pretty sorry pass when a guy that’s sacrificing at 200,000 a year serving the public can’t make a little money on the side. If we keep griping about this kind of Free Innerprize pretty soon we’ll have nothing but rich people in office. If a guy can vote in Illinois when he’s dead, I don’t see why a living guvner can’t get a canadate for senate to pony up a few hunderd thousand as a campaign contribution.
But I might of knowed. Everybody’s out to attack a guy for trying to make a buck or two. I figure it would be a bargain for the senate canadate. He would probly have to spend 4 or 5 million to get elected the reglar way. What’s wrong with cutting down on expenses? Don’t you have no business sense?
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this
I like the way reporters who want this to be a story phrases things:
“Obama’s staff and political allies may be forced to get attorneys of their own”
And they also MAY have to one day take cover when aliens attack the Earth, but let’s just let him do his job until then.
This won’t be a distraction for Obama, this will be a distraction in the media who needs distractions to sell stories and the ADD Americans who will think about this for a couple of days.
But in the meantime, President-Elect Obama will continue to focus on what’s important and carry on getting this country on track.
By lovelyliz
December 10, 2008 9:14 AM | Link to this
The governor was upset that all he got from Obama was a thank you. Doesn’t look like he was involved in the whole pay for a Senate seat issue at all.
At least the Dems didn’t try to paint Sarah Palin with the Ted Stevens guilt by association for being from the same state.
By Road Scholar
December 10, 2008 9:18 AM | Link to this
Sorry to post off subject, but here is an explanation of US car makers wages and an interesting proposal for resetting the wages to market rates.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/10/business/economy/10leonhardt.html?hp
I know there will be consternation by many as to the proposal made, but it is food for thought. The real issue is getting “Detroit” to produce vehicles that people want to buy, that are energy efficient, and quality built.
Jay, do you have any details as to Sonny’s project list for the $1 Billion in bonds? He still hasn’t learned anything from the debt service impact to GDOT’s ability to fund long term programs, has he? But he will need to find state funds to match the Federal Funds, if Obama’s public works stimulus package is approved!
Has the legislature agreed to remove the pork projects added to the budget since reveneus continue to be less than estimated, and that state employees get no raise this year? How special it was for the legislators to vote down the legislators raises, while allowing the Teachers to get theirs. Does that mean state employees are second class? and that we have a second class, over paid legislature?
By Road Scholar
December 10, 2008 9:18 AM | Link to this
Sorry to post off subject, but here is an explanation of US car makers wages and an interesting proposal for resetting the wages to market rates.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/10/business/economy/10leonhardt.html?hp
I know there will be consternation by many as to the proposal made, but it is food for thought. The real issue is getting “Detroit” to produce vehicles that people want to buy, that are energy efficient, and quality built.
Jay, do you have any details as to Sonny’s project list for the $1 Billion in bonds? He still hasn’t learned anything from the debt service impact to GDOT’s ability to fund long term programs, has he? But he will need to find state funds to match the Federal Funds, if Obama’s public works stimulus package is approved!
Has the legislature agreed to remove the pork projects added to the budget since reveneus continue to be less than estimated, and that state employees get no raise this year? How special it was for the legislators to vote down the legislators raises, while allowing the Teachers to get theirs. Does that mean state employees are second class? and that we have a second class, over paid legislature?
By mm
December 10, 2008 9:27 AM | Link to this
Wow, Corporal and Management are all worked up this morning. I’m sure you two have gotten aroused about this subject. But in the end, you’ll be let down as usual.
Like the song from Meatloaf says:
“All revved up and no place to go”.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 9:28 AM | Link to this
At least the Dems didn’t try to paint Sarah Palin with the Ted Stevens guilt by association for being from the same state.
thank you, Liz.
And Corporal - how can any Democrat be heard on this board by all the lunatics baying at the moon?
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 9:31 AM | Link to this
Road Scholar,
I thought the state legislature agreed to only defer their raises — not eliminate them for this year. Remember, they’re politicians and that means that they have an image to project — not morals to live by. Don’t worry though. Our Georgia politicians are looking out for us. They’re still planning on pushing that legislation to freeze property appraisals to protect us from higher property taxes this year due to increased property valuations. Now, isn’t it comforting to know that they would do that for us. How could anyone wonder why an educated and informed public would want to tar and feather the whole lot of them.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this
Tip of the Iceberg
“What did the President Elect know and when did he know it?”
These things take on a life of their own, people start talking, making deals to save their a$$ and eventually the investigation starts going WAY BACK beyond this senatorial appointment thing.
I really wish the prosecutor had kept the lid on and let him make the deal with someone.
Time will tell. May justice be done.
By DB, Gwinnettian
December 10, 2008 9:36 AM | Link to this
Midori, Liz is off a hair in her bit @ 9.14; remember, the Dems didn’t have to go there.
There’s a whole lot of places Team Obama didn’t bother visiting because, well, when you say you’re going to run a different kind of campaign, one that’s more about substance and issues that really matter to voters, it kinda helps when you actually walk the walk.
To be sure, Obama ran plenty of negative ads, but they were focused on real-life pocketbook issues, not whether (for example) McCain really meant it when he publicly stated in 2007 that Americans wouldn’t pick lettuce for 50 dollars an hour.
By getalife
December 10, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this
They probably tipped Obama on wiretapping Blago.
Imagine if they wiretapped all Senators during the bank bailouts.
The Super Bowl of corruption.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this
In a sequence of events that neatly captures the contradictions of Barack Obama’s rise through Illinois politics, a phone call he made three months ago to urge passage of a state ethics bill indirectly contributed to the downfall of a fellow Democrat he twice supported, Gov. Rod R. Blagojevich.
Mr. Obama placed the call to his political mentor, Emil Jones Jr., president of the Illinois Senate. Mr. Jones was a critic of the legislation, which sought to curb the influence of money in politics, as was Mr. Blagojevich, who had vetoed it. But after the call from Mr. Obama, the Senate overrode the veto, prompting the governor to press state contractors for campaign contributions before the law’s restrictions could take effect on Jan. 1, prosecutors say.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this
New Blog Pool-
Approximately what date will they frog march Oblahma out of the White House?
I got mid March 09.
The closest guess will win………something.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 9:56 AM | Link to this
The next real question when Obama takes office is will he replace the U.S. Attorney in Chicago or allow him to finish his probe ……. hummmmmmm …..
We all know that if given enough time and resources, half of the politicians in Chicago (past and present) could be put in (under) the jail.
And I say again: Boy, you libs.* are awful **quiet today! If this were about a Republican, I wouldn’t be able to get a post on here. The blog would have probably crashed by now.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this
Gee, I wonder if this is one of those Tribune editorial writers Blago wanted to get rid of-
They’ve been clinging to the ridiculous notion that Chicago is Camelot for months now, cleaving to the idea with the willfulness of stubborn children. It must help them see Obama as some pristine creature, perhaps a gentle faun of a magic forest, unstained by our grubby politics, a bedtime story for grown-ups who insist upon fairy tales. But now the national media may finally be forced to confront reality.-John Cass
By Swami Dave
December 10, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this
Liz:
“At least the Dems didn’t try to paint Sarah Palin with the Ted Stevens guilt by association for being from the same state.”
I suspect that is because there have been no accusations, mention, or allegations that Sarah Palin was getting preferential treatment from contractors. It is probably because the case against Stevens had nothing to do with Palin.
It is actually because anyone who tried to make that association would be correctly labeled a lunatic.
The reason that Obama’s associations keep getting questioned is because the actions, behaviors, and statements of those parties with whom he chose to associate appear so blatantly egregious. For someone who is portrayed as so intelligent, strategic, and visionary, it becomes more and more difficult to understand how he “never saw” any of it. If he indeed did “see” it, then it raises the question of his judgement to apparently take no action to change his association with them.
It is really as simple as your mama told you: Pick your friends wisely because you usually become who you hang around; and if not, you will certainly be associated and judged by their actions.
-Swami Dave
By jtom
December 10, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this
Just a few dots to connect:
Joe Biden is waiting until after Jan.1 to retire. Then his replacement can be named.
There is a tough new ethics law going into effect in Illinois on 1/1/09. Not so in Biden’s state of NJ.
Obama decided to retire in the middle of Nov., giving Blagojevich time to name a replacement before the new ethics law.
What motivated Obama to retire when he did?
There’s plenty of room for speculation, and lots of smoke indicating a possible fire.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this
Chicago
Let’s all sing together now ……
Chicago, Chicago—that toddlin’ town, that toddlin’ town Chicago, Chicago—I’ll show you around—I love it ……….. Don’t tell me sin is rampid and right Think of that man who danced with his wife In Chicago…Chicago… I feel sympathy for that wonderful, windy town!
By getalife
December 10, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
Well, it gives the bithers another tin foil hat conspiracy but Obama is clean on this one.
Now Coleman is being probed by the FBI for $100,000 for his wife.
If corruption is probable cause, they should wiretap all Senators and clean up the corrupt Senate.
By Bill
December 10, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this
The contradictions are interesting. In a story published Nov. 5, this was reported:
**”By Carol Sowers Wednesday, November 05, 2008 at 10:39 a.m.
CHICAGO, ILL. — Now that Barack Obama will be moving to the White House, his seat in the U.S. Senate representing Illinois will have to be filled.
That’s one of Obama’s first priorities today.
He’s meeting with Governor Rod Blagojevich this afternoon in Chicago to discuss it.
Illinois law states that the governor chooses that replacement.”**
Then, on Nov. 23, Obama’s adviser, David Axelrod, seems to confirm the substance of that news story saying: “I know he’s talked to the governor and there are a whole range of names many of which have surfaced, and I think he has a fondness for a lot of them.”
Still later Axelrod recanted that statement. Even if Axelrod did indeed make an honest mistake, there’s still a unsolved problem. The ABC news site notes it:
**In fact, there are indications that Mr. Obama and his team refused to go along with the “pay to play” way Blagojevich is accused of operating, offering only “gratitude” if the governor appointed his friend Valerie Jarrett to take his U.S. Senate seat, much to the governor’s chagrin.
But there remain questions about how Blagojevich knew that Mr. Obama was not willing to give him anything in exchange for the Senate seat — with whom was Blagojevich speaking? Did that person report the governor to the authorities?**
By ByteMe
December 10, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this
And if we intersect the set of “birthers” from the previous column downstairs with the set of “what-ifers” here, we get….
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this
Of course there’s the never-ending piles of trash being dumped on we the people by the likes of AIG and other companies and the Greenbergs, Fulds, etc., of the world. After all the money AIG’s had shoveled at it, why does it need another $10 billion? Because, as the Wall Street Journal reports, the money its gotten from the government are supposed to pay off its bad CDS bets — essentially, the money went to retiring the underlying CDO —- but it’s also stuck $10 billion on what were just bad bets, not necessarily designed to help clients manage risk. They make people like Blagojevich look like kindergarten children. If only a corrupt politician was the worst of this country’s problems.
By Wyld Byll Hyltnyr
December 10, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this
Ah, yes, there’s nothing like the smell of the first Obama Administration scandal in the morning.
So, they think that Obama is untouched because he wouldn’t pay to play. That means the proposition must have been presented to him or his minions, and, yet, Mr. Clean did not rat out the Blagv - doen’t seem unscathed to me.
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 10:57 AM | Link to this
Have we all truly forgotten innocent until proven guilty.
Have not heard tapes but it sounds bad what I have read.
However, that will be for a judge or jury to decide his fate.
Obama is a different issue. There is nothing to link him to this mess. If anything surfaces then attack away, with speculation. So far there is nothing there to support an idea of Obama having a hand in this.
Claiming so fuels the fire of the accusations against most considered to be conservative. That we jump to conclusions and over-react, instead of react responsibly. I think both parties do that but it does not matter.
The only question that has been left unanswered is how did the gov. know Obama was not going to “pay to play”
Who told the governor that and why did they not report the gov. for asking such a question?
By Mrs. Godzilla
December 10, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this
Republicans are demanding, somewhat self-servedly, that Obama affirmatively state that he’ll keep Patrick Fitzgerald on as U.S. attorney for Northern Illinois. Turns out Obama has already said as much
—David Kurtz
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 11:04 AM | Link to this
Not your best post, Jay. It’s like Andy gone mad on cut and paste. A dumb sentence like “And ABC News describes some heated, and quite obscene, language” really should have read: ABC and everybody else in the news game quoted the U.S. attorney’s description of what apparently was the governor’s heated, obscene language. ABC has no special knowledge. Neither does Michael Scherer, for that matter, just because he throws around the spector of a special prosecutor. Reports last night said Rahm fingered Blago after Valerie Jarrett dropped out of consideration. That doesn’t sound like much of a conspiracy to me. Right now, all this is like saying Sonny Perdue might be an adulterer because Glenn Richardson cheated on his wife.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this
Tcoach - maybe the answer to your question can be found in my 9:52.
I’ve noticed the members of the “string Obama up” crowd still haven’t commented on it.
What’s that about people being quiet, Corporal?
or have you run out of cliches?
By Shawny
December 10, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this
What will be interesting to see is how much teflon Obama has. There never was a Teflon Don like Bill Clinton. SuperGlue wouldn’t stick to him.
By AmVet
December 10, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this
Had I ever voted, even once, much less twice, for the Hero of the Texas ANG - the biggest, most dangerous idiot to ever sit in the West Wing - I too would be looking in every nook and cranny to justify my stupidity…
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this
Well, mike hussein smith, I think that would depend on whether Sonny was fooling around with Glenn or someone else — hypothetically speaking, of course. Besides that, you cannot have a real scandal without a triangle. So, the real issue is what is going on between Sonny, Glenn, and Casey. Were they Republican triplets that were separated at birth? Are they closet Democrats? What is it about these three and their sibling-like rivalries.
By Tell It Like It Is
December 10, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this
The only thing different in Illinois vs. Georgia is party affiliation. Perdue and Chambliss are just as bad as Blago. Blago just cannot control his mouth.
Politics and the system breed these guys.What is interesting is how some people react to corruption based on beliefs and interpretation of the law. To me, an unwarranted war that kills Americans is worse than anything politicians like Blago,Rangle,Chambliss,Palin,Rove etc. might do to grease their palms with money. Politics is all about compromise with favors being the resolution. America and the world will always experience issues of this type. Life goes on.
By AmVet
December 10, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this
Speaking of our rotund guv, his prayers seem to be working!
If the clown only understood science he would realize that his spoken prayers travel at the speed of sound, which takes a helluva long time to get to the Big Guy upstairs.
Had he emailed or tested him, the request would have gotten to Heaven almost instantaneously.
That flat-earth idiot cost us months of precip…
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this
Shawny,
“There never was a Teflon Don like Bill Clinton. SuperGlue wouldn’t stick to him”
I disagree. There is Dubya and Dick.
Tell it Like it Is,
Yeap. I agree.
By Mrs. Godzilla
December 10, 2008 11:26 AM | Link to this
speaking of Governors
An attorney and a veteran journalist, both from Birmingham, said they expect a mistrial to be declared in the Don Siegelman case after listening to oral arguments today at the U.S. Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals in Atlanta. Associated Press reported that two of the three judges made comments indicating they saw grounds for granting a new trial. Attorney Ed Gentle said he expects the appeals panel, at the very least, will declare a mistrial based on juror misconduct. Gentle also said he saw signs that the appellate court might overturn the case and throw it out entirely.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
AmVet @11:24,
Too funny.
By AmVet
December 10, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
That’s texted, not tested.
That is the job we heathens perform…
By dittohead
December 10, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this
When the Ill. governor said kill all the EDITORIal writers at the Chicago Tribune...I take his advice under consideration.....Might be a good idea where the Atlanta Urnal Constipation is concerned....The AJC could use a fewer Marxists editors.....Give them all PINK slips....Close down the AJC.By AmVet
December 10, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this
dddddiiiiittttttttttooooohhhhheeeeeaaaaaddddd!!!!!
STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT!
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this
Well, Taxpayer, Sonny and Glenn work in the same building, which gives them opportunity to huddle in a corner and conspire. I mean, that is a possibility, even if it isn’t a probability. That’s all I’m saying. Try this one on: Sonny is suing the state budget to enhance property he owns. The project is called Go Fish Georgia. It is so sacrosanct it’s not subject to the budget cuts education and law enforcement are seeing. Sure smells funny to me. Or this: Sonny’s boys pushed through a tax break in the dead of night that saved him a couple of million on some Florida land he owns. Sure smells funny to me. Originally, I never said Sonny was this or that. I used the words “might be” — the great hedge of journalists everywhere who are willing to overreach.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this
AmVet,
I think dittohead started having convulsions when he thought about the AJC editors getting pink slips.
By Disgusted
December 10, 2008 11:51 AM | Link to this
OK, all you novices. When you click on Post and a message says Please Wait, then wait, dang it. Don’t keep pounding on Post in the hope that your nonsense will appear instantaneously. Otherwise, we’re all doomed to read your blather about a dozen times.
Wooten needs to conduct a Posting school as a prerequisite for joining this blog. Sheesh!
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this
So, when is “Call in Straight Day?”
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this
Road Scholar, thanks for the link to the NYT story about autoworker pay. The folks who claimed on this blog that the workers are paid an average “salary” of $73 an hour obviously were wrong.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this
The failed NY Times, a rapidly sinking ship and goon propaganda, spews on behalf of the autoworker’s union:
Very soon, they need to shrink to a size that reflects the American public’s collective judgment about the quality of their products.
It’s a sad story, in many ways. But it can’t really be undone at this point. If we had wanted to preserve the Big Three, we would have bought more of their cars.
That’s nice but GM sells more automobiles than anyone else in the world.
Sick lying criminal liberals……..ew.
By getalife
December 10, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this
Intel Chief To Bush: Stop Blaming Us For Your Failures.
Ha.
I wonder if Blago can claim executive privilege and have all refuse to testify.
Ford opts out of socialization. The gop will not pass it anyway.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 12:20 PM | Link to this
Troubling
I am still very concerned as to why this stage of the investigation was brought to a head when it was. As a personal example, if someone wants to buy counterfeit money - you wait and close the deal. There was really no compelling reason (that I see) to file a complaint and drag a sitting Governor ouit of his home at 6:00am in the morning. An indictment would have sufficed. If you really want to prove your case you let him go on and seal it for you.
It worries me that someone high up may have ordered this brought to at least this preliminary conclusion. Another month or so of tapes might have been very interesting. Now that method of gathering evidence is gone.
Hummmmmm………….
By AmVet
December 10, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this
Bosch, I must confess I never tire of the McCarthyites who show up here from time to time with the mantra of “Because of the commies at the AJC I’m canceling my subscription!”
Or it’s equally idiotic corollary, “The AJC is going under because it is a liberal rag.”
Had they lived a hundred years or so ago, they would have attributed the demise of the telegraph to the Democrats…
By Dan
December 10, 2008 12:24 PM | Link to this
Why is anyone surprised by this, the only surprise here is it’s blatancy (sp?). As bookman points out, its a reflection Illinois political environment. (Probably most political environments)although Illinois is the poster child for this type of thing (and anyone raised in Illinois politics is well aware and versed in this type of maneuvering) This is why it cracks me up when people want gov to protect them from business. At least business doesn’t lie about it’s motivation, (not to mention the exponentially more efficient process)
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
MIDORI, from what I read of your post it basically showed that Obama is good at using people for his political gain.
However I must assume that the gov. must have also assumed Obama would not pay to play. As there still was not a source to attribute the gov. thinking that. Since he said it on tape I am inclined to think it is what the gov. believed.
Do you think the gov. was making an assumption or was he told this by someone, either related or not related to Obama’s inner circle?
That was my only point, I say my opinion but rarely try to string any one up, with out factual evidence, if that was you implication. My apologies if that was not your implication
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this
Center for Public Integrity publishes “Bush’s Greatest Failures” Says “even we were shocked by the amount and scope of his actions and inactions!”
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/WatchdoggroupdocumentsBushsBrokenGovernment1210.html
Without a doubt the #1 WORST PRESIDENT EVER IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD!!
P.S. I was hoping the Private and Andi would call in gay today!
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this
Corporal, I also question the timing of this as it came within 24 hours of Blago threatening to withdraw all state business from Bank of America. But maybe the feds already have a case against the Guv. Perhaps he was closer to a deal than we now realize. Perhaps this heads-up was meant to give the decent folks of Illinois a chance to circumvent Blago. AS you are sooooo fond of saying: Time will tell.
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 12:41 PM | Link to this
When is call in straight day? Great point Bosch I need a day off.
How does it go into the books as a personal day, or sick day? And if out of personal day are they then forced to apply it to a sick day?
Is that discrimination against the employer for calling homosexuality a sickness, or illness?
Just food for thought not serious.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 12:43 PM | Link to this
To Mike Hussein Smith
Good points. The wheels of justice grind slowly.
To Jay - Important
Truthman’s post (12:32) is offensive to gays.
He is accusing me (and Andi) of being one and that would upset them very much.
I think his post should be pulled.
By Abomi Nation
December 10, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this
Bosch are you asking for your wife?
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 12:50 PM | Link to this
AC/DC — I doubt you could tell the truth even if your life depended on it. You claim that the following statement was made about the autoworkers union: “Very soon, they need to shrink to a size that reflects the American public’s collective judgment about the quality of their products.” But anybody who can read can readily see that the NYT was referring to the Big Three when it wrote: “But Congress and the Obama administration shouldn’t fool themselves into thinking that they can preserve the Big Three in anything like their current form. Very soon, they need to shrink to a size that reflects the American public’s collective judgment about the quality of their products.” Show me the word “union.”
By Opus X
December 10, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Birds of a feather…
At the very least, BHO uses questionable judgment when it comes to his friends. He was born from the cesspool of Chicago polictics.
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 12:58 PM | Link to this
Opus X go read Midori’s post earlier.
Comes with a link that shows it was not poor judgment, he used these people for political gain. Obama did not care about the makeup of those he associated with as long as it advanced his politics.
He just uses people.
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
Thanks, Opus X. You just proved that Sarah Palin must be as corrupt as Ted Stevens.
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this
Mike Hussein Smith,
You don’t have to convince me about Sonny or Saxby or many other Georgia Republicans. I wouldn’t waste my spit on them.
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this
Private…DEAL WITH IT!!!
Bwahahahahahaha!!!!
You are so easy to hook!! (Place picture of fish taking bait here!).
By hotlanta
December 10, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this
This is getting good. The arrogant Gov. brought this on himself.
By hotlanta
December 10, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this
This is getting good. The arrogant Gov. brought this on himself.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 1:22 PM | Link to this
Abomi Nation,
Yeah. I don’t get to call in sick, but I can work in my underwear and bathrobe if I want to. Trade off.
I hate that kind of crap, “Call in Gay Day.” Yeah, let’s hurt the American workforce by shoving our sexual orientation into everyone’s face.
Gay Pride Parades? I’m good with that. Celebrating who you are is one thing, but this is kind of retarded.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 1:25 PM | Link to this
And is it just me, or does this Blago dude look like a b@stard son of one of the Kennedys?
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 1:26 PM | Link to this
Things are always “retarded” to those who aren’t oppressed!
By Taxpayer
December 10, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this
truthman at 12:32,
It’s really sad that we let this scumbag, Bush, and his cronies wreak such havoc on civilization. I’m sickened every time I read about what this so-called Christian and his Republican party has done.
By delois
December 10, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
I thought it was interesting that I didn’t get a CNN breaking news email on this story yesterday. I get one everytime a Republican is in trouble for something. I even seem to get one when Britney Spears goes potty or Lindsay Lohan fights with her latest girlfriend. The left wing media will do whatever it can to keep this story out of the news.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this
Truthman,
I’m all for gays getting married and I think to deny them this right is outright discrimination.
But not going to work because you are gay today to prove a point about how important gays and lesbians are in our society is ridiculous in my opinion.
Sorry.
By FreeGetOutofJaiCardl
December 10, 2008 1:35 PM | Link to this
From Jay’s intro above — “…But it’s also important to remember that he’s in his second term of governor and spent most of his life in Illinois politics — his assumptions and understandings of how the world worked that the rest of us find so astounding did not rise out of nowhere. They reflect what he saw around him…”
And Obama gets yet another “pass” or “no story here, keep moving”???
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 1:45 PM | Link to this
By mike hussein smith December 10, 2008 12:50 PMAC/DC — I doubt you could tell the truth even if your life depended on it. You claim that the following statement was made about the autoworkers union: “Very soon, they need to shrink to a size that reflects the American public’s collective judgment about the quality of their products.”
Perhaps you should take a comprehension class-
spews on behalf
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this
Bosch…so, by your reasoning, Rosa Parks should of gone to the back of the bus and never started the Montgomery Bus Strike that brought about integration of the bus system (and, eventually, the South).
Yeah, standing up (or sitting down) for a cause never makes any sense, does it.
Guess we should go back to being British subjects!?! Cheerio!
By Abomi Nation
December 10, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this
Economic protest has a long history in this country. From boycotts to sit-ins and strikes. In this country money talks.
When garbage workers strike trash piles up. When auto workers strike millions of other businesses suffer.
To say that the American work force suffers because of a one day strike to me is absurd.
I support any peaceful protest to the fullest. Even those I disagree with, including the right to protest abortion. Including the right to peacefully protest against gay rights, or to support gun laws.
The whole point of protest is to shove your views into other peoples faces.
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
Taxpayer…Thanks, and back atchya!!
Isn’t it great to be, continually, on the correct side of history!?!
Everything the priviledged Repubs have stood against over the last 140 years has been proven wrong, discounted or done away with because of liberal activism.
ALL I CAN SAY IS, “IT’S GREAT TO BE A LIBERAL!!”
By nudist
December 10, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
everyone show up for work naked tomorrow!
put in in their face folks!
By patriot
December 10, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this
I see the obama apologists are out in full force before the ink is dry on the Blogo complaint. The propaganda defense is going strong. None of you (or me) know the real facts behind this. I do know IL politics, and you can bet your butt this will drop on the messiah’s doorstep before it is over….unless covered up. Obama is already lying about whether he discussed senate seat with Blogo…let’s see what else comes out. Of course, if he is “only lying”, liberals consider clever lying an art form, and have no problem with it as long as it is a liberal lying.,
By Quiet blog?
December 10, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this
Why does right wing “victimhood” perpetually scream “If this had been a Republican…” nonsense?
Why does right wing “victimhood” always blame “liberal media bias” for its own shortcomings and failures, rather than looking at its ideology and actions.
Bottom line is…you cooks are all tickly in your pants because you PRAY that this sociopath’s actions can be tied to Obama. Your sick little minds are euphoric with the hallucination that Barack may not be able to take office ‘because he’s a corrupt politican’. Hah! Both ideas are idiotic to say the least. You couldn’t get him on his natural birth status..check - your credibility tank is on fumes as it is.
So go ahead with this and suck out the last little miserable life that’s left within you. I feel a vacuum…
By nudist colony worker
December 10, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
I with you, nudist. Let’s do it!
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 2:08 PM | Link to this
truthman, your point is valid but misdirected.
Rosa refused to go to the back of the bus, because that was one of the items they were being discriminated against.
However this looks like an attempt to exploit the down economy and subsequently hurt innocent victims by making the entire mess worse.
Also since you agree in non-violent protest I guess you will not object if each person who called in, w/o any personal days left, is fired for not showing up to work or if their pay is docked.
That would be the employer enacting his right to non-violently protest against non-violent protest. Right!
By Midori
December 10, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this
I see the obama apologists are out in full force before the ink is dry on the Blogo complaint.
first we were accused of being “suspiciously absent”; now we are accused of being out in “full force”.
I really wish the lunatics would make up their minds.
Pick a smear and stick to it.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this
No Truthman,
By my logic, calling in sick today because you’re gay is about as effective as the “Let’s not buy gas for a day and bring down the oil businesses.”
I’m not arguing that gay and lesbians are not discriminated against, but this is a completely ineffective protest.
When Rosa Parks decided not to move on that bus, that was her making an individual spontaneous decision not to do so — which became a symbol for a cause.
Being gay isn’t a wrong in our society, and calling in sick today because your gay will not become a national symbol of the discrimination gays and lesbians face.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 2:17 PM | Link to this
Truthman,
To me, protests should matter if you are going to bother with it at all. And believe, me I know a thing or two about protests. I’ve screamed my head off with the best of them. The point is, I’ve screamed my head off.
It’s like using margarine when you want butter, or eating fat free ice cream, or decaffeinated coffee, or heaven forbid sugar-free diet soda (what the hell?), or even diluting good scotch with soda.
If you are going to protest - then do it right and do it loud.
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this
Midori…as long as their warped world-view permeates their collective consciousness, they have little rational mind to make up!
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
Some of your gay coworkers might WANT you to show up naked. Ever think of that?
By AJC/DNC Management
December 10, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
This statement was allowed to stand unchallenged for over two weeks until corrupt Chicago politician Blagojevich was indicted and fellow Chicago politician Obama denied having even spoken to Blagojevich regarding the minor matter of who the next Senator from Illinois might be. I mean, why would Obama even care who sits in the Senate or inherits much of Obama’s state political machine?-Human Events
By Abomi Nation
December 10, 2008 2:23 PM | Link to this
Also since you agree in non-violent protest I guess you will not object if each person who called in, w/o any personal days left, is fired for not showing up to work or if their pay is docked.
I agree 100% with that statement. There are many cases in which peaceful protest caused a backlash. The courage to face the consequences for standing up to ones convictions should be applauded.
By cliff zeider
December 10, 2008 2:23 PM | Link to this
Hey, I say put Obama and all his crooked pals in Chicago in a gunny sack and dump them out and they would all come tubling out together. CZ
By Midori
December 10, 2008 2:24 PM | Link to this
word, Truthman.
word!!
By cliff zeider
December 10, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
Hey, I say put Obama and all his crooked pals in Chicago in a gunny sack and dump them out and they would all come tubling out together. CZ
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this
Bosch, How much of a sweet-tooth do you have?
You like sweets more than my 2 year old.
How can you do that, without having the worst sugar hangover ever?
This is how you blog for so long isn’t it?
Take away his sugar and we can take him down boys.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 2:32 PM | Link to this
LOL, Tcoach — screw with Bosch over my dead body!!!!
BTW — Has anyone seen Paul?
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 2:35 PM | Link to this
Pardon me, Patriot, but your 2:05 post turned to sh!t right about here: “None of you (or me) know the real facts behind this. I do know IL politics, and you can bet your butt this will drop on the messiah’s doorstep before it is over…unless covered up. Obama is already lying about whether he discussed senate seat with Blogo.” Are you possessed? The good you wrote the first sentence, but then let the evil you take over? If you don’t know anything — and you probably don’t — how can you claim with such assurance that Obama is lying? How do you know this will drop at O’s doorstep? How do you know there is a cover-up?
By GodHatesTrash
December 10, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this
By jtom
December 10, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this
Just a few dots to connect:
Joe Biden is waiting until after Jan.1 to retire. Then his replacement can be named.
There is a tough new ethics law going into effect in Illinois on 1/1/09. Not so in Biden’s state of NJ.
Delaware, RightWingnut
Obama decided to retire in the middle of Nov., giving Blagojevich time to name a replacement before the new ethics law.
because he was elected President of the United States of America
What motivated Obama to retire when he did?
He was elected President of the United States of America
There’s plenty of room for speculation,
certainly for moronic speculation
and lots of smoke indicating a possible fire.
Put out that cigarette, Mr. President-elect!!
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 2:37 PM | Link to this
tcoach@ 2:26,
Are you referring to a couple days ago when my neighbor left the tin of Christmas cookies with me when no one else was home but me and I woke up with cookie crubs all over me and was dazed and confused for a bit?
To be honest, I don’t have that much of a sweet tooth, but when I get the hankering for sweets, I eat them, and I eat alot of them, and when I want butter, I eat butter - the same with ice cream, I don’t eat that fat-free crap. I eat ice cream.
I also don’t water down my Scotch - except with an ice cube or two, when I want a cigarette, I don’t smoke the light ones.
That was the point I was trying to make to Truthman - if you are going to try and protest something you feel passionate about - do it right. If you want ice cream, eat ice cream.
Don’t water down your protests. Do it loud and proud with no regrets.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this
OMG!!!
This is so effing funny!!!
ROFL!!!!!!!
The good you wrote the first sentence, but then let the evil you take over?
Sir Trash — that happens around here.
A LOT.
ROFL!!!!!!
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this
Midori,
Thanks. Right back at ‘cha! :-) I got your back too, but somehow that means more coming from you than me.
I saw a post by Paul this weekend, his son is having surgery again, and his daughter-in-law was hospitalized having a baby. The baby was pretty early (30 wks), so I’m sure he’s kind of busy with that. His son has been really sick and if I’m not mistaken - it’s the sick son’s wife that is having the baby, so it’s kind of a double whammy.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this
GHT,
I had forgetten about that earlier post - your post just made me about fall out of my chair laughing. Thanks.
By Dusty
December 10, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
Dear Bosch,
You need a glucose tolerance test before you go into a diabetic coma.
Keep eating with no regresta and it won’t be long before you won’t have any regrets, none whatsoever. Are you overweight by any chance?
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 2:52 PM | Link to this
Dusty,
Moderation is the key. No, I’m not overweight, I’m very physically active.
By Truthman
December 10, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this
HAS AMERICA JUMPED THE SHARK?
http://www.nolanchart.com/article5622.html
At least American capitalism has…Socialist bailouts for poorly run, or even corrupt, businesses!!
By Midori
December 10, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this
Thanks for the info, Bosch.
We are having some pot lucks next week, and Monday is the day my team has to provide the food.
Just thought I’d get a couple ideas from him.
Want to see something freaking hilarious???
Check it out:
Eligibility question? FedEx Electoral College members WND follows up Supreme Court letter campaign with historic 1st
WASHINGTON – Following up a campaign that sent more than 60,000 letters by overnight delivery to the U.S. Supreme Court, WND today announces a historic first in its quest to establish Barack Obama’s eligibility for office – a similar FedEx letter drive directed at individual Electoral College members.
Through Thursday at 1 p.m. Eastern, WND is providing an opportunity to Americans who would like to contact electors of the next president before they vote Monday to send Obama to the White House.
The letters will be sent FedEx to 470 members of the 538-member Electoral College for whom addresses are available. They will all be delivered Friday morning, giving each elector the weekend to consider the constitutional issues raised by Obama’s presidency.
As WND has reported, there remain serious questions as to whether Obama is “a natural born citizen,” as specified in Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution. While he claims to have been born in Hawaii in 1961, two Obama family members have told WND they were present at his birth in Mombasa, Kenya.
By LittleMissSunshine
December 10, 2008 2:56 PM | Link to this
By “The Corporal”
December 10, 2008 8:06 AM | Link to this
P.S.
If only this and $1.50 gas had come just before the election……..
It’s doubtful that even those would’ve saved John McCain. When he chose his running mate (who although maybe very popular here in Georgia is seen for what she really is just about everywhere else in the country … a complete and utter ditz who doesn’t even know Africa is a continent) and said “the fundamentals of our economy are strong” he sealed his fate from there on out.
By Reasonable
December 10, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
I am continually amazed at the inaccuracies and wild speculations that keep getting posted. First, the U.S. Attorney (the same one so many people called a zealot in the Plame case) made it plain that the compliant issued yesterday did not have anything to do with the President-elect, that he did not know or was aware of the scheme by the Governor (they are not close and, in fact, appear to dislioke each other as evidenced by the Governor’s taped comments. Second, only in this crazy world would anyone read the comments of the Governor and speculate that any sort of dirt on this issue could attach to Obama. As for the U.S. Attorney’s comment that his office is not in the business of clearing people, that is a mere statement of fact. Third, speculations and assertions based on no evidence are useless. If there is anything it will come to light but, if as I suspect, there’s not, it will join the other fringe junk on Obama’s citizenship. Fourth, I always get a laugh out of the “liberal media” line. The truth is what ever their political slant, the only bias in the media of a consistent basis is a bias towards its own self-righteousness. I expect that despite all of the serious problems facing the nation, the media will run wld with this until they get embarassed. Fifth, the Obama transition team is being quite with the press and public until it has all of the information from staffers to see if anyone had coversations with the Governor, however innocence. Far better to take your time and get it all out that have to go back and correct something as poor David Axlerod is finding out. Finally, there was a story last night that the Obama folks had notified the U.S. Attorney about their concern with the Governor’s dealings - I do not know if it is true or not. If they have not, do not jump to conclusions as to why not, vulgar and rude conduct by the Governor does not necessarily translate into illegal conduct and if they were exposed to nothing illegal there is nothing to report.
By tcoach
December 10, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this
Bosch, I got the point you were making.
Was not trying to upset you just have noticed over time that you mention sweets some.
I agree on the scotch, if you do not like the taste then pick a different drink. Buy cheap vodka like college kids if you want to mix it with something to mask its flavor.
Nothing better than scotch and a fine cigar to relax an evening away. Tis something we agree on.
By Ray
December 10, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
The pathetic thing about Chicago politics…… they are all precinct liberals. Not a Repub among them. Fine upstanding citizens intent on doing the will of the people. Corrupt as the King family and seemingly proud of it. If the Chief Executive of the State is a criminal, wonder what the rest of that precinct political organization is all about. And Buckwheat was right in the big middle of it…… from the time he was groomed for the State Senate until Emil Jones touched him on the shoulder and annointed him the next Senator from Illinois. If it weren’t so pathetic it would be funny. FBI spokesman…. paraphrasing…. If there is another more corrupt state in the nation, I really don’t know where it is. Midori is so proud of Mr. Jones. He has been the State Senate leader since 1983. Don’t you think that this sort of thing rubs off, Midori?… But his is just another liberal political hack with a power and image problem. The governor, Jessie Jackson, Jr., Durbin, the Lt. Governor, Jones, Buckwheat … all in bed together scratching each other’s backs. And 52% of the people voted for this clown.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this
Midori,
Sigh (as I shake my head). I should be a protest consultant.
I was kind of hoping that Paul would check in, but of course, having a new grandchild while your son is having surgery on his internal intestines kind of trumps the old Bookman blog.
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
Ray the Racist: The pathetic thing about you is not racism isn’t your only fault.
By CommunistAJC
December 10, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this
As a citizen of Chicago, let me be the first to tell everyone about the chaos the democrat party is in right now. It’s every man for himself. You have Jesse Jackson Jr. running off and hiding and then you have Obama Husein saying that he knew nothing about it. Uh huh. Sure.
Bookman, you must be pretty nervous right about now. Seeing how your messiah is about to be in the thick of this mess and all. I’ll never understand the minds of northern liberals and how they keep putting these corrupt clowns in office.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 3:15 PM | Link to this
Little Miss Sunshine
I respectfully disagree. It was a fairly close election by popular vote. It wouldn’t have taken much.
To Truthman
Sorry, but I was patronizing you.
By CommunistAJC
December 10, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this
mike hussein smith , How many Jews have you killed? I mean, you are a Nazi, right? Calling someone racist because they point out the corruption of the democrat party is about as stupid as stupid gets. Your democrat party is full of morons and its finally starting to all come out.
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
Ray the Racist: The pathetic thing about you is that racism isn’t your only fault.
By Bosch
December 10, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
Midori,
My 3:07 - I just noticed something funny. I wrote “internal intestines” as if, in contrast, there are “external” ones.
Ew. I just gave myself goosebumps at the image.
tcoach,
Contrary to what you think of me, nothing on this blog upsets me. If it did, I wouldn’t blog here. I dont’ do things unless I find some fun in it.
It’s always hard to read people when all you have to go on is their writings. People tend to put their own personality traits into what other people write.
I like to go back and forth with you because you think I’m a jerk, so I just play the part, but nothing on this blog offends or upsets me.
There’s enough in real life for that.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this
Being a racist means you basically think another race is genetically inferior or inferior as a culture.
I think most of you people mean prejudiced or bigoted which one can be without being a racist.
How about everyone using the correct words…..but….not just because someone disagrees politically.
By the way and by definition:
Lincoln was a pure racist.
By Ray
December 10, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this
Smith,
When all else fails, pull out the race card and then the discussion is supposed to end. Think again. I don’t like the people this clown is associating with. You should not either. They are liberal hack politicians, intent on staying in office, making all of the money they can and to hell with the people who voted for them.
Do you remember all of the vile, incorrect and demonizing names that you idiots called Palin? Some were much worse than Buckwheat. Also McCain. Trash seemed to take a special liking in calling McCain some of the worst names of all. He ranted on about his age, his family, his war record….. and all of this was alright with you libs. Many even chimed in. He didn’t deserve all of the ridicule that you heaped upon him. We who voted for him have very long memories. So Buckwheat it is. When he proves that he can be a good president, do the business of the people and is not a Chicago hack politician, then we will change his name to Obama. Until then, stay tuned.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this
LOL, Ray and Communist AJC: Does Elvis talk to you?
You two sound like the founding fathers of Loons ‘R Us.
ROFL!!!
By Midori
December 10, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this
Hey Ray!!!
Is this the “Mr. Jones” of which you speak??
By LittleMissSunshine
December 10, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this
You’re right The Corporal it probably wouldn’t have taken much, but I think the majority of this country was so ready for change and it was crystal clear to the majority of the country that McCain-Palin did not represent that change and Obama-Biden did. Plus, gas prices had already dropped pretty significantly by the time the election rolled around, but because the economy was so bad off and because McCain did not appear to have a clue about how to handle it, I don’t think any of what you cited would’ve made a difference. Also, and jmo, but 8,538,559 and is a pretty big difference, IMO (especially when you consider that you have to go back 24 years to 1984 to find a bigger margin of difference).
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this
Ray, you’re the one who played the race card. Folks have been chatting back and forth all day on the blog without stooping to your depths. Tell me what name I have called Palin. You want me to call her by the C word? Because, morally, that is the same thing you’re doing to Barack: creating an ID for him because of one salient physical characteristic.
Commie, I wish you would learn to read. And stay in Chicago.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this
Obama Appoints First High-Level Gay Official
now to sit back and watch the real fun
Go get em, Ray!!!
By Abomi Nation
December 10, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this
Just who the hell has President Bush been associating with Ray? A male prostitute fake lawyer that spent the night at the White House on many occasions? Jack Abramoff? The Rev Haggard?
Scooter Libby was indicted and convicted while serving in the administration and was most certainly closer to Bush and Cheney than Obama was with Blagojevich.
I don’t ever recall Scooter calling Bush a M’fer.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 3:54 PM | Link to this
Little Miss Sunshine
I hear you.
By LittleMissSunshine
December 10, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this
So Midori, where are these two family members and why come they have never said anything publicly??
Also, I know that the members of the E.C. don’t have to vote the way those that they represent vote, but they would be making a huge mistake if they overturned the results of this election.
If people want to disprove the Obama is not legitimately an Natural Born Citizen then they need to wait and let him be sworn in and then work to have him impeached or something like this, but whatever they do they’re going to have to prove their case better than they have already attempted to, because the majority of the United States citizens do not agree with them and neither did every level of the courts (including the Supreme Court) that this case went to. Personally, I don’t think they’ll have much luck, because regardless of this claim they make there is no definitive proof that Barack Obama was born anywhere other than Honolulu, Hawaii in August 1961 and whether certain people want to believe it or not there is plenty of proof to back up that he was born there.
By CommunistAJC
December 10, 2008 4:09 PM | Link to this
Midori , Elvis? No, but Ray Charles does. Does that make me racist?
By Jake
December 10, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this
The story is birds of a feather flock together! Corruption in Chicago politics has been widely recognized at least since Dailey the elder stuffed the ballot box for JFK. What exactly did the libs think a ‘community organizer’ does? He was a bag boy getting out the vote for the Dailey machine and now he’s the POTUS.
By mike hussein smith
December 10, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this
Ray the Racist: Who is this “we” you suddenly mention? You’re the only one who doesn’t know the name of our next president. But believe you me, I’ll sure be glad when Pubic Hair is out of the White House.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this
Little Miss Sunshine,
I think the 2 family members are hanging out with Ray, Elvis and CommunistAJC. :)
Communist:
I don’t know.
Are you racist? You would know that better than either I, Ray or Elvis.
thank you very much
don’t step on my blue suede shoes
By GodHatesTrash
December 10, 2008 4:22 PM | Link to this
Now Corporal,
Lincoln was our second-worst wartime President, the worst of all time until “Mission Accomplished”. Lincoln was even worse than LBJ, only because LBJ had the decency to realize what a failure his leadership had become. Of course, Dumbya makes even Lincoln look like a military genius.
John Wilkes Booth greatly improved Lincoln’s place in history. If Lincoln had not been shot, he most likely would have met the same fate as Andrew Johnson, Thaddeus Stevens wanted the South to pay for its treason, and if Lincoln, like Johnson, had emphasized reinstatement over reconstruction, then Lincoln’s poltical power would have been crippled. And, as I have said before, he did his country no favors when, after Jeff Davis took the trash out, he dragged it back in, killings hundreds of thousands for such a worthless action.
But really Corporal, you do stretch the truth with your simplistic-ness, as usual.
Early and mid-19th century Americans were almost all racists, lacking the scientific evidence that we have today that race is the least of our human differences. You have more in common with people your same height than of your same race, for instance.
American-style white supremacy started early in our history, something the Europeans brought with them in 1492 and thereafter. The slavers institutionalized it in the Carolinas and America-wide in the 17th century, made it national policy with the 3/5ths rule when the country was established, and made it our “foreign” policy in the 1830s when Andy Jackson, redneck extraordinaire, expelled the Cherokee from their own lands in the 1830s, basically because they weren’t white.
Jackson, like Lincoln, came from a log cabin in the Appalachian foothills, from hardscrabble mountain stock. And it was the 18th and 19th century, of course they were racists - many of the people that live in those areas 200 years later are still dragging their knuckles, as the McCain vote in November shows.
It has become “Republican Dumbarse Fashionable” the last several years to point out Lincoln’s racial “hypocrisy”, although to be fair to Lincoln, there is little, if any, in his writings where he promotes racial equality. He, like most decent people, even of his era, found the notion of slavery, especially chattel slavery, monstrous, disgusting, degenerate, and evil. Methinks that many RightWingnuts like to point out Lincoln’s supposed hypocrisy to justify their own racism, hatreds, and superstitions.
By Midori
December 10, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this
I’m pretty sure you can tie Obama to the first Daley administration and its attendant corruption. Also, wasn’t Obama somehow connected to Chicago crime boss Al Capone? And are you going to tell me that Chicago-based Obama was never involved in milking Mrs. O’Leary’s arsonist cow?
By Jake
December 10, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this
After almost 100 years of standardized testing the 1.5% genetic difference, and perhaps some cultural differences have consistently resulting in IQ’s one standard deviation below the Euro-Americans. Now is that racism, prejudice, or just reality?
By Abomi Nation
December 10, 2008 5:03 PM | Link to this
After almost 100 years of standardized testing the 1.5% genetic difference, and perhaps some cultural differences have consistently resulting in IQ’s one standard deviation below the Euro-Americans.
After reading that Jake, I’m left wondering, whats your excuse?
By Frederick Douglass
December 10, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this
Jake, I don’t want to misunderstand you, are you saying Dubya is actually black?
By Practically speaking
December 10, 2008 5:15 PM | Link to this
Here’s the deal - for those who can’t figure this whole thing out without a scorecard.
Obama wouldn’t deal with the governor. He wouldn’t give the guy money in return for a favor.
Obama did know that the gov was a crook - since the gov asked him how much Obama would pay to get his choice for the Senate seat.
Obama didn’t report the gov.
Net net? Obama is honest, for a Chicago pol. He didn’t try to get a payoff (although you have to figure he doesn’t need the money with the presidency in hand).
But he isn’t guilty of the worst sin — trying to deal with the gov. He is guilty of the minor sin of not turning the gov in. But, jeez, he had to figure that’s gonna cause a great stink. And he didn’t need that. So it was practical and smart to turn a blind eye.
Does that make him a terrible person? Nah, it makes him a Chicago politican.
Maybe that’s what America needs right now, a practical politican who can work wonders. Weirdly, Nixon, not the world’s most virtuous human, re-established relations with China and got us out of Vietnam.
Obama may be just the person we need right now. It’s fine with me if we can find a way to sweep under the rug any of his sins. America has survived based on practical pols who came along at the right time. I am not religious but maybe there’s more than luck involved her. I think Obama is the practical politican that can fix what ails us. In the process, he may line his pockets a bit, or do some things that wouldn’t be approved of by Miss Manners. It’s OK with me if - in the process - he gets us back on course.
By willie
December 10, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this
OBAMA LIED!
OBAMA LIED!
OBAMA LIED!
By willie
December 10, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this
OBAMA LIED!
OBAMA LIED!
OBAMA LIED!
By Danjonglee
December 10, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this
Me wonders how much H. R. Clinton’s senate seat is going for in back halls of the NY Democrat Party….
By Frederick Douglass
December 10, 2008 6:28 PM | Link to this
A guy in Chicago spilled a cup of coffee this morning, it was Obama’s fault.
By GodHatesTrash
December 10, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this
Appalachians test even lower than that, Jake.
By greygent
December 10, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this
Barack Hussein Obama = Nicolae Carpathian
LEFT BEHIND
By obamasucks
December 10, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this
hey frederick douglas… George W Bush gets blamed for EVERYTHING, get used to your guy taking the heat, if he can’t then he should have never stepped into the kitchen. Oh and practically speaking, umm… I love it how you liberals rationalize any unethical behavior by your guys ” Lets sweep his sins under the rug.” Huh? Where was this approach to George W Bush?
By Fredeick Douglass
December 10, 2008 7:05 PM | Link to this
How are Blago’s transgressions suddenly Obama’s? All I can say is that my 401k has crept steadily upward since Obama named his economic team, or is the genius from Crawford Tx. fueling the rise? When you’re the worst president in recorded history, you’ve opened yourself up to at least a smidgen of scrutiny wouldn’t you say? Dow’s up again today Bub!
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 7:31 PM | Link to this
To GodHatesTrash
1) Many good points.
2) The only reason I keep harping on Lincoln is to show that people must be judged according to the time they lived in. Lincoln would have kept slavery to save the Union if he had had to. Many Southerners never had slaves, opposed it, and despised it.
The war in reality was about economics and states rights (a war still being fought).
Many men of color fought in the Confederacy but the Army of the James (all black units) was not even allowed to march in the Grand Review at the end of the war. Grant and Sherman would not allow it.
3) I think we agree that Lincoln fought a war that need not have been. It could have been worked out, slavery ended and all the acrimony avoided.
4) High Schools all over the place are droping the names Washington, Lee, etc. but keeping Lincoln. Absurd on its face.
5) We need to learn to distinguish between racism, bigotry and prejudice.
6) Enjoyed the exchange. This is much better than just calling names.
By GodHatesTrash
December 10, 2008 9:26 PM | Link to this
The Army of the James was a Union Army - and it was not all black.
Use the google on the internet Corporal, and stop spreading BS.
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 9:44 PM | Link to this
To God Hates Trash
I’m surprised at you splitting hairs like that to disquise the main valid point.
All of the black units in the East were in the Army of the James because Grant would NOT allow them to be designated under the Army of the Potomac.
Neither Grant nor Sherman would allow those black units to march in the two day Grand Revue down Pennsylvania Avenue immediately after the war.
Just days before the parade, they were all re-organized as the 25th Corps and shipped to Texas as occupation troops.
Do you deny that?
P.S. Sherman was blunt in his opinion of black troops. When a subordinate said, “They can stop a bullet as well as a white man”, Sherman replied, “A sandbag is better.”
In a letter to a friend, Sherman wrote, “A Ni$$er as such is a most excellent fellow, but he is not fit to marry, to associate, or vote with me or mine.”
If we do not learn from history we are doomed to repeat it.
By GodHatesTrash
December 10, 2008 10:07 PM | Link to this
Not shocked at all that Grant and Sherman were bigots and racists. Lee was, too. Forrest ran the KKK. Davis owned 5000 slaves.
Once again, the larger, and much more important question is why are so many of you 21st century RightWingnuts racist, stupid, superstitious klowns?
By "The Corporal"
December 10, 2008 10:50 PM | Link to this
To GodHatesTrash
Were done. You know how I feel about name calling vs. debate.
Adieu
By Cheryl
December 10, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this
CommunistAJC wrote:
Calling someone racist because they point out the corruption of the democrat party is about as stupid as stupid gets.
UH, he calls him a racist because of his insistence in calling President Elect Obama, “Buckwheat”!!!! If you don’t understand that that is extraordinarily racist, and offensive, to many who post here than maybe you are too!
He apparently has some litmus test that the President Elect must pass, which includes, ….. But I am certain that the Good President Elect, has nothing better to do than try to appease Ray and those like him, nothing better to do than to try to make sense to the senseless…..
Barack Hussein Obama, swallow that, and get used to it because HE is YOUR Commander now! hahaha, here’s one for you Ray, you know what they say….. Once you go Black……. lol,hahaha, I for one am in Heaven! There is a GOD Afterall!
By "The Corporal"
December 11, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this
To Cheyrl
1) Using the term “Buckwheat” is not nice due to it’s racial overtones but it’s not racist. Prejudiced or bigoted probably but not racist.
2) I use the term Private Obama often since our President Elect claims to have all of this military insight. That is no better or worse than those who use Dubya.
3) Obama will be every American’s president but he will be Commander only to those in the military…..an important distinction.
4) Finally, I owe my allegiance not to the President, Congress or the Supreme Court. I took the oath four times in my career and it was always to The Constitution !
By Copyleft
December 11, 2008 8:16 AM | Link to this
What’s the story with Rod and Barack? Easy: Rod was corrupt and tried to get Barack to offer an illegal deal; Barack, being honorable, made no such offer.
Once again, President Obama takes the high road and leaves his enemies choking impotently in the dust!
By Cheryl
December 11, 2008 8:40 AM | Link to this
By “The Corporal”
1) Using the term “Buckwheat” is not nice due to it’s racial overtones but it’s not racist. Prejudiced or bigoted probably but not racist.
You keep on believing that one, but I haven’t heard you call any other “racially tinged” names to anyone else, so I will stick with Racist!
And I believe I know when someone is using a racial slurrrrrrr….. I don’t need to be enlightened by you and your excuses.
How bout this one…. Go to a Black man you know and call him Buckwheat, and see how fast you have to go to the dentist for new teeth, if you really think calling a Black man Buckwheat is not really racist….
Go sell that to some other like minded knuckle dragger for understanding…….
By "The Corporal"
December 11, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this
To Cheryl
If a black man calls me a Redneck Cracker (which happened often in my law enforcement career) was that racist (or bigoted/prejudiced)? Did that person mean to say all white people are genetically inferior?
The same holds true for Buckwheat. The person may be a racist but using the term Buckwheat does not make him so (i.e., Eddie Murphy). He may just be unkind, insensitive, etc.
We’re talking definitions here. Look up the words (racism/bigotry/prejudice)!
By GodHatesTrash
December 11, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this
Cheryl, I’d say don’t feed the trolls, but damn, some of them are ridiculous fun to laugh at.
By Cheryl
December 11, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this
By “The Corporal”
If a black man calls me a Redneck Cracker (which happened often in my law enforcement career) was that racist (or bigoted/prejudiced)? Did that person mean to say all white people are genetically inferior?
Yes, if that Black man calls you a Redneck Cracker, just because you stopped him, that is a racist thing to say! It is meant to belittle you because of your culture and heritage, and is demeaning. (I don’t know if Rednecks are genetically inferior, I never heard that before, I thought it was a state of mind) But Black people don’t generally think all white people are redneck crackers, and really not those who have shown themselves to be otherwise. Blacks are brought up to respect people of high achievement, and give them the respect they deserve. Sadly so, police do not always fit that bill…. Most do, but some most certainly do not. And before you jump on me, my dad is a retired sheriff’s deputy, my father-in-law was a Chicago Police Officer so we have blue blood and I respect law enforcement.
But given your penchant for condoning the use of racist terms, perhaps you were called that because you acted like one. If you act like one, then you might get called one though it would not be right.
Now, if you call yourself a Redneck Cracker, then it is not racist because you are using the term to identify yourself, and you are privy to information that would cause you to define yourself that way, but it’s your own definition of yourself, not another’s.
But back to the point…… Buckwheat, is a fictional character who was known as being docile, and infantile although he was as old as the rest of the gang. He spoke in broken english, and was the depiction of a “coon” or “pickaninny”. sp - “somebody stole all oua matas!” Was one of his quotes. Calling someone “Buckwheat” is done to imply that he is Black and inferior and stupid. It’s not even code, it’s just plain in your face racist, which is why I suspect you don’t go around calling Black Men Buckwheat to their faces.
There is absolutely nothing about President Elect Barack Obama, that remotely resembles Buckwheat except for the fact that he is a Black man, and therefore the term , when used to discuss the President Elect, is a Racial slur and not a new one I might add. Blacks have endured being called Buckwheat for many moons, and it’s funny that you are trying to turn it into something else than what it is.
Eddie Murphy was making fun of the despicable nature of the character, It was satire… Not meant to uplift Buckwheat, rather, it was a jab at “audacity of the creators of the character”. Buckwheat was not a hero of Black people, in no way, and if you thought the Buckwheat satire by Murphy was just funny, then you really missed the joke.
It’s just like if you think calling an educated and accomplished and brilliant Black Man especially the President Elect of this country Buckwheat is not racist……. well, let me put it this way; if you don’t know better, then you don’t know better. If you do and do it anyway, then the racist shoe fits…..
If you didn’t know before, then stop doing it, if you continue, then I will continue to point out the fact that you are a RACIST!
By "The Corporal"
December 11, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this
Cheryl
Bless your heart , you have missed the entire point again.
I never use the name Buckwheat or any other derogatory terms involving African-Americans. That would be wrong!
All I am saying is that for those who do, it doesn’t necessarily make them a racist by the definition of the term (Webster not me). Prejudiced - yes, bigoted - yes, hateful - yes, mean spirited - yes, unChristian - yes, etc., etc.
I’m simply trying to get people to use the correct terminology.
Is it that hard to understand ?
By Cheryl
December 11, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this
Nope, I understand completely the terminology of Racism… Believe me, I do, I understand the definitions perfectly, all of the above mentioned.
If you don’t call him that, and I didn’t say you did, I said Ray did, you jumped in and tried to explain his conduct, then that means you are probably a real decent guy, and that’s great!
It is a Racist thing to say, even if it is not his intent, he feels he has a position of power in that apparently he is a member of the “majority” race in this country and can just use that terminology to put Mr. Obama in his place, as if he has that right to do that. It does not matter what heights President Elect Obama has risen to, in his eyes he is still “Just Buckwheat” and he feels comfortable in saying so, whenever he has the chance, at least in writing he does. It is in fact racism, the same as if he called Bill Richardson Speedy Gonzales, or Joe Lieberman Julius Rosenberg….. You get my point.
I am glad to hear that you would never do such a thing, especially as an officer of the law, (former) and clearly holding a position of power, because that too would be racism.
It was also a prejudiced and bigoted thing to say as well. Archie Bunker couldn’t do it any better than Ray does.
By "The Corporal"
December 11, 2008 7:43 PM | Link to this
Cheryl
I hear you but it still doesn’t meet the definition of racist.
Lincoln & Darwin were racists (as most were in their day) because they believed blacks were genetically/culturally inferior as a race.
“Ray” may be bigoted/prejudiced but not racist. Only he knows.
Like my dad said, we can agree to disagree without being disagreeable.
I enjoyed the debate.