Home > Jay Bookman > Archives > 2008 > December > 03 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USPlaxico Burress, NRA poster star?
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Plaxico Burress, for you non-sports-fans out there, is a star wide receiver for the New York Giants who caught the game-winning pass in last year’s Super Bowl. But his season and perhaps his career have been cut short after a handgun in his possession discharged accidentally in a New York nightclub early Saturday, wounding him in the thigh.
Burress has since been arrested and charged with illegal possession of a handgun, a charge that under New York’s strict law carries a mandatory minimum sentence of three-and-a-half years in prison.
To Cajun Boy in the City, that raises an interesting question: “What would Charlton Heston do?”
As Cajun Boy puts it (H/T to Andrew Sullivan):
“Where is the statement expressing outrage from the NRA that a humble American gun owner like Plaxico, who was just trying to protect himself and his family by carrying a hand gun, is being mercilessly persecuted by The Man and his Draconian gun control laws?”
That’s a darn good point: How come Wayne LaPierre isn’t rushing to defend Plaxico? The man was just exercising his Second Amendment rights, after all!
It’s also interesting to point out that a lot of state legislators in Georgia want to allow concealed-weapon permit holders to legally take loaded handguns into bars and nightclubs. They think that’s a good idea, that it’ll make people safer somehow.
Personally, I think that’s nuts.
Comments
By BDAtlanta
December 3, 2008 11:58 AM | Link to this
drunks with hand guns. sounds like the Old West
By Richard
December 3, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this
A few points:
He’s not protecting his family since his family wasn’t there.
Not to question his ability to be a good husband/father, but why is a familiy man in a nightclub? Picking up girls?
If you’re making $8 million per year, why do you need the gun? To stop someone from mugging you and taking your $50k watch that you have insurance for and doesn’t even make a dent in your bank account?
Why not just get a friggin permit?
Have we ever heard a story on the news with the words “nightclub”, “athlete”, and “gun” and had anything to do with self defense?
By RW-(the original)
December 3, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this
Jay B.,
Do you do even a cursory check of the facts before you blindly follow Andrew Sullivan around?
By getalife
December 3, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this
He should hire Puff Daddy’s lawyers. Like our broken government, there is no accountability for celebrities.
By tcoach
December 3, 2008 12:05 PM | Link to this
Jay read more on the story Plaxico had an inproper permit to carry the gun. The NRA has not been in favor of everyone owning a gun. I would say most NRA members follow most gun laws most of the time.
Also Mr. Burress was flaunting the gun and doing what some reported as tricks with the gun. He deserved to shoot himself if he chooses to PLAY with a gun. This is not an issue of gun ownership rights, this was a stupid person doing a stupid thing. He should be punished.
Also since you are so against the ownership of guns, and the topic is football players, Mr. Bookman.
Most experts that have studied the case say that Sean Taylor would be alive today had he had a gun when he went downstairs in his home.
But I guess you are fine with criminals having guns, just not lawful citizens. Makes since to me.
By Joey
December 3, 2008 12:12 PM | Link to this
My understanding is that the Second Amendment speaks to our right to own guns. Pretty sure it does not get into any discussion about carrying a consealed pistol or revolver into a nightclub.
I am not surprised that Jay is unable or unwilling to see any difference. I am certain that the NRA can.
A prediction: It will not be the NRA or some pro-gun group that comes to the defense of Mr. Burress. It will be a liberal group. Probably a group that is anti-gun. Why? Because most pro-gun groups are also law abiding citizens. And Liberals only support stiff prison sentences for Republican Politicians.
By Truthman
December 3, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this
Jay, the NRA is never on the side of minorities with guns (look at their convention photos!)!! I haven’t seen that many happy white folk in one room since Gerry Cooney went 6 1/2 rounds with Muhammed Ali!!!
By tcoach
December 3, 2008 12:19 PM | Link to this
Truthman, Why are the ones who accuse others of racism, are also the same ones that always bring the issue of race up.
Have you ever stopped to think that you are the only one thinking of it in racial terms, while those you deem racist have most likely given the race of the person very little thought.
There is true racism out there and should be called and dealt with.
However you are starting to sound like the little boy who cried wolf.
By RW-(the original)
December 3, 2008 12:25 PM | Link to this
Ah Chicago……
“Ideally, it should be hard to find one corrupt police officer and it should never be easy to find 15 who allegedly used their guns and badges to protect people they believed were dealing drugs instead of arresting them,” Fitzgerald said in a prepared statement issued Tuesday afternoon.
Maybe this was the Chicago police’s way of keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. Just protect the criminals during their crimes.
By Matthew
December 3, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this
Of course people like Jay think this is nuts. People like Jay believe that self-defense is an antiquated concept, and thus he’d prefer to cower until someone comes to rescue him. Self-reliance isn’t very chic, because guns are scary!
Plaxico is being criticized by gun owners both for his law breaking (despite what Jay would prefer you to believe, gun owners are some of the most law-abiding individuals in our country), and for his incompetence in gun handling.
By @@
December 3, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
Shute man, Plaxico (is that his given name?) oughta be talking to PrezE Obama on this one.
Ok for states & cities to determine local gun laws. (Apr 2008)
FactCheck: Yes, Obama endorsed Illinois handgun ban. (Apr 2008)
Respect 2nd Amendment, but local gun bans ok. (Feb 2008)
Provide some common-sense enforcement on gun licensing. (Jan 2008)
2000: cosponsored bill to limit purchases to 1 gun per month. (Oct 2007)
Concealed carry OK for retired police officers. (Aug 2007)
Stop unscrupulous gun dealers dumping guns in cities. (Jul 2007)
Keep guns out of inner cities—but also problem of morality. (Oct 2006)
Bush erred in failing to renew assault weapons ban. (Oct 2004)
Ban semi-automatics, and more possession restrictions. (Jul 1998)
Voted NO on prohibiting lawsuits against gun manufacturers. (Jul 2005)
Do you know if he voted for Obama?
And another thing, jay. In lite of RW’s link setting you straight on this topic, I find it’s necessary to haul this up from downstairs:
By @@ December 3, 2008 11:37 AM | Link to this
jay! You make it sound as though Gates has signed on to Obama’s Iraq withdrawal proposal.
Mr. Gates also said he is now comfortable with President-elect Barack Obama’s call for U.S. combat forces to leave Iraq by the middle of 2010, after earlier questioning Mr. Obama’s withdrawal timeline during the presidential campaign.
Tuesday UPI (and various other sites) — While supporting the Obama’s withdrawal plan in broad terms, Gates stopped short during a news conference Tuesday of endorsing Obama’s campaign pledge of withdrawing all troops within 16 months, The New York Times reported Wednesday.
It was Gates who acknowledged Obama’s flexibility on the issue of Iraq.
Where do you field your information, shortstop?
I know I’ve talked to you about this before……
Quality vs. quantity!
Quality vs. quantity!
Try to remember, jay!!!!!
By Wyld Byll Hyltnyr
December 3, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
By Truthman 12:13 PM
We are aware that you rarely let the facts influence your feeling, but i feel compelled to point out that, “Gerry Cooney went 6 1/2 rounds with Muhammed Ali.” In fact, given their respective eras, it is highly likely that Cooney would have knocked out Ali in less than three were the fight held on the same day that Cooney fought Larry Holmes.
As for Jay, the NRA promotes gun safety and supports responsible gun owners. Peptobismol Burris, or whatever his name is, is (obviously) neither safe nor a responsible gun owner.
An appropriate analogy would be that just because Jay Bokkman universally supports liberals, it does not follow that he supports KArl Marx and marxist revolution. In both instances, the first part of the statement, e verdad, but the second does not pass the smell test.
By Abomi Nation
December 3, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
Jay, you know we need our guns. Just last week there was a shoot out at a southern California Toys-R-Us. The war on Christmas is the perfect battleground for gun rights. Can you imagine if some fool tried to take away your Malibu Barbie?
Then we have the Walmart in NY. The Walmart greeter was trying to stop people from Christmas shopping in his own sick, demented war on Christmas and paid the ultimate price. It would have been more humane to shoot the evil doer. Instead, these poor shoppers were forced to trample the man.
People would surely get a “Merry Christmas” instead of a “Happy Holidays” if the store employees knew the shoppers were packing.
WWJD? Surely he’d say “He who is without guns can only cast stones.”
By AJC/DNC Management
December 3, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this
In places like NY City and Chicago, I’d rather become a victim of a crime than get caught with a gun and have to face a bunch of self righteous pinkkkos in their kangaroo court system.
It ain’t no revolving door unless, of course, you rape or rob.
By Geezer
December 3, 2008 12:49 PM | Link to this
This is just another case of a homeboy showing off.
Trust me, the NRA will distance themselves from this one.
By Bosch
December 3, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
Okay, I’ll just say it, after last year’s Superbowl, the best damn football game I have ever seen, and the amazing catch by Plaxico - can’t we just give him this one?
When someone has that good of hands, and shoots himself in the leg, can’t we just let it go? Come on. Did you SEE that game? I mean really. Did you see it?
By AJC/DNC Management
December 3, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this
From RW’s link, which I guess the libs do not know how to open-
When police can’t promise to protect law-abiding citizens such Plaxico Burress or the victims in India, why don’t we allow people the right to protect themselves?-National Rifle Association
Duh.
By mike hussein smith
December 3, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this
Maybe affirmative action was to blame for Gerry Cooney’s loss to Ali. Stew a bit on that, wingnuts.
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 1:21 PM | Link to this
I don’t have a problem with the loaded concealed guns as long as the law is applied equally to everyone and everywhere. Guns in school, in church, in Congress, in Court, etc. No exceptions.
By tcoach
December 3, 2008 1:21 PM | Link to this
Bosch David Tyree was the one who made the incredible catch, with his hands and helmet.
So no pass for Plaxico all he did was get open on blown coverage for the game winning catch. None that were great though.
Athlete do not feel safe now though. After what happened to Sean Taylor many have started hiring security firms. That is what Mr. Burress should have done if he felt in danger, not take an illegal handgun in a club.
Just plain stupid, and he should pay any and all consequences.
By Eric1
December 3, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
The second ammendment does NOT grant the right to own a gun. Read it! What well formed militia do you belong to, Moron?
By Paul
December 3, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this
Jay
[[a lot of state legislators in Georgia want to allow concealed-weapon permit holders to legally take loaded handguns into bars and nightclubs]]
Sounds to me like way too many Georgia legislators spend too much time in bars. Could anyone sober come up with this idea? Alcohol, testosterone and guns. Great combination.
Not many responses on your “Where’s the NRA?” question. Truthman addressed the elephant in the room -not sure if anyone has anything better to offer.
But I’ll offer - maybe it’s like the ACLU’s selectivity. NRA has a target audience just like the ACLU?
Link: ACLU - we’ll defend, well, almost everyone’s rights
Bosch
Vick went to prison. NY has mandatory sentencing laws. Good luck on this one.
And I still think the guy shot himself in the foot.
By Paul
December 3, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this
Eric1
You may want to review the DC ruling.
Link: Court affirms right of individuals to own guns
BTW - my view is closer to yours than to the Court’s decision, (so please don’t take my putting forth a conflicting opinion as meaning I take the opposite side) but the law’s the law.
By mm
December 3, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this
Geez Jay, these wingnuts must have read something other than your article. Where do they come up with this crap?
My take is that you are calling Plaxico an idiot for breaking the law (and for shooting himself) and calling law makers idiots for wanting to allow guns in bars and nightclubs.
I didn’t see you call for a gun ban. I haven’t heard Obama call for a gun ban. But you sure heard it from the wingnuts, using their usual election scare tactics for the stupid.
Abortion, gays, taxes, and guns, the eternal cry of the dimwitted wingnuts.
Last time I looked, abortion was legal, gays were human beings, the law requires taxes to be paid, and guns were legal.
Jay, I love how you pull the wingnuts chain.
By @@
December 3, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
mm:
jay questioned why the NRA wasn’t defending Plaxico.
RW showed him that they were.
jay’s getting lax in his research.
By GodHatesTrash
December 3, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this
I am someone who used to use handguns in my work. They are dangerous, even in the hands of competent, mature people.
But bottom line, in the United States, the vast majority of gun owners, especially handgun owners, don’t posess the intellect or emotional maturity to properly handle them without endangering themselves or their loved ones.
By 22:1
December 3, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this
For every ‘successful’ defense with handgun, there are 22 fatalities from hand gun suicide, child accidents, etc.
Plaxico might try bleach if he’s serious about help from the NRA.
By mm
December 3, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this
@@,
That link doesn’t look like they are defending him to me. Saying that is really a stretch.
But they can defend him if they want. He broke the law. Now it’s up to the prosecutor and the courts. Too many thugs running around with unlicensed guns and/or no concealed weapon permit.
By Bosch
December 3, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this
Paul,
You know I was joking ^^^^^^ right?
:-)
This guy could go to jail for being stupid, how embarrassing. The only thing that could be worse is that he shot himself in the bottom. But he won’t go to jail - he’ll be fined, do some community service, probation, but not jail.
By tcoach
December 3, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this
God hates trash, Since you are claiming to have superior knowledge of guns and gun use.
What is the percentage exactly that a vast majority entails?
Do you have actual information or are these your opinions?
Sounds like you are using your opinion as a factual statement.
What study concluded this, how many people did they survey?
Or is this another time when we are all to sit by and agree that the great God Hates Trash is smarter than us all so lets take his consistently accurate opinion as fact.
If you cannot support your case please do not just make up stuff.
By Bosch
December 3, 2008 2:38 PM | Link to this
Richardson as Commerce Sec.? Didn’t see that one coming. He should’ve been Secretary of State.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this
Free men do not ask permission to defend themselves.
A Little Gun Control History Lesson.
In 1929, the Soviet Union established gun control. From 1929 to 1953, about 20 million dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
In 1911, Turkey established gun control. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938 and from 1939 to 1945, a total of 13 million Jews and others who were unable to defend themselves were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, one million ‘educated’ people, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Defenseless people rounded up and exterminated in the 20th Century because of gun control: 56 million.
It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by their own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars. The first year results are now in:
Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent
Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent
Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!
In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent. Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not, and criminals still possess their guns!
It will never happen here? I bet the Aussies said that too!
While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed.
There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the ELDERLY. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, af ter such monumental effort and expense was expended in successfully ridding Australian society of guns. The Australian experience and the other historical facts above prove it.
You won’t see this data on the U.S. evening news, or hear politicians disseminating this information.
Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property - and yes, gun-control laws adversely affect only the law-abiding citizens.
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this
Free men who defend themselves illegally may find themselves imprisoned — or dead.
By DirtyHarry
December 3, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this
It’s good that Jay acknowledges the futility of his carrying a weapon in public. A mans got to know his limitations…
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 2:52 PM | Link to this
To Taxpayer
Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.
By mm
December 3, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this
Corporal,
You always talk about loving our great country. So why do you always bring up other countries in your arguments? Only wingnuts are obsessed with what goes on in other countries. I don’t think our government is going to be rounding up and exterminating people (though I was waiting on Bush to round up political foes).
We need to either ban handguns or force everyone to carry one. Didn’t Stone Mountain do that a few years back? How did that work out?
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this
Corporal,
Good luck with protecting yourself from someone with a tank, bomb, etc., with that concealed handgun. You won’t have to worry about being carried by six or tried by twelve because they would never even find all of your parts if you got hit by one of those shells.
By tcoach
December 3, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this
Taxpayer, Currently illegal possession of a gun is not an offense punishable by death. Therefor the “or dead” part is inaccurate.
You stated Free men who defend themselves illegally….
If they defended themselves then how could they die. You would have had a point if you chose to say Free men attempting to defend……
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this
To mm
1) “If you do not learn from history you are doomed to repeat it.” It’s simple. I work now to protect my great, great grandchildren as my founding fathers worked to protect me ………
2) It was Kennesaw, Ga. and it worked out fine.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this
Jay
Shooting oneself in the leg with a dangerous piece of machinery is similar to having a car wreck with a dangerous piece of transportation.
In this case the gun may have been illegally possessed but thousands of people are being killed and maimed in this country every year by illegally possesed vehicles (driven by illegal immigrants).
Let’s do an expose on that!
By tg
December 3, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this
I would imagine the NRA would condemn Plaxico since he was not carrying his firearm in accordance with the law. The NRA does not condone lawlessness they promote responsible gun ownership, and carrying a firearm while you are drinking is not responsible and would not be condoned by the NRA, but I’m sure that point will be lost on your audience, keep your rhetoric up it’s really helping your circulation.
By tcoach
December 3, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this
How can anyone argue with that Corporal.
But you know how it goes it is only an issue if it is an issue to the left/liberal/dem/whatever other name I may have missed.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this
To Taxpayer
Now you are changing the subject, being ridiculous. Tanks (don’t know of any terrorist tanks in the country but let me know if you see one) and bombs are up to the police and the Army to handle ……… it’s all about the odds.
Thoughts on carrying:
I don’t carry a gun to kill people. I carry a gun to keep from being killed.
I don’t carry a gun to scare people. I carry a gun because sometimes this world can be a scary place.
I don’t carry a gun because I’m paranoid. I carry a gun because there are real threats in the world.
I don’t carry a gun because I’m evil. I carry a gun because I have lived long enough to see the evil in the world.
I don’t carry a gun because I hate the government. I carry a gun because I understand the limitations of government.
I don’t carry a gun because I’m angry now. I carry a gun so I don’t have to spend the rest of my life being angry for being unprepared.
I don’t carry a gun because I want to shoot someone. I carry a gun because I want to die at a ripe old age in my bed and not on a sidewalk.
I don’t carry a gun to make me feel like a man. I carry a gun because men should have every tool to take care of themselves and the ones they love.
I don’t carry a gun because I feel inadequate. I carry a gun because unarmed and facing three armed thugs I am inadequate.
I don’t carry a gun because I love it. I carry a gun because I love life and the people who make it meaningful to me.
Police Protection is an oxymoron. Free citizens must protect themselves. Police do not “protect” you from crime; they usually just investigate the crime after it happens and then call someone in to clean up the mess.
By AmVet
December 3, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this
It would appear that for most of these “young, dumb and I’ve got a gun” thugs, a handgun is great replacement for a lack of spine.
Bosch at 2:38. I also think Richardson would have made a great SecState, but am glad he’s in the cabinet nonetheless.
It’s time to put the X back in Xmas, boys and girls. And for those of you who still have a job and who really want to get show the true meaning of the holidays, be sure to get in line REAL early at your local Walmart.
OH WAIT! NO! DON’T!
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 3:24 PM | Link to this
tcoach,
There’s more than one way to end up dead. In the old west, for example, the slower draw and/or poorer aim usually ended up dead first unless they got the drop on the quicker draw. Further, lots of people who defend themselves die. It just means that their defense didn’t work. Finally, the bold statement was initially made just to counter Corporal’s earlier statement. I was not trying to make any other point with it. Just a little banter.
By Paul
December 3, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this
Bosch
I kinda thought it was a lighthearted comment.
Bosch - AmVet
Richardson’s true test of integrity: will he, or won’t he…
keep the beard?
I say, go for it!
By getalife
December 3, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this
Reality check for “private”:
We are all going to die so don’t be a coward about it.
You are scared to death, man up junior.
By @@
December 3, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
mm:
By AJC/DNC Management December 3, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this
From RW’s link, which I guess the libs do not know how to open-
When police can’t promise to protect law-abiding citizens such Plaxico Burress or the victims in India, why don’t we allow people the right to protect themselves?- National Rifle Association
Duh.
Call it defending his rights in print. I don’t know enough about the NRA to determine whether they offer legal defense, but the ACLU’s opinion is that it is a collective right, not an individual right.
So in other words, the ACLU believes that those Chicago policemen mentioned up ^^^ there…..somewhere ARE part of that collective that should take precedence over the individual.
Don’t make sense to me.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this
To tcoach
Agree. Always work within the law or change it.
There’s pleanty of room.
Ooo Rah!
By RW-(the original)
December 3, 2008 3:29 PM | Link to this
Paul,
The beard is already gone. Richardson got asked about it, but Obama insisted on answering for him saying he thought the beard should have stayed. The Gov had a goofy grin on his face as if to say, “that’s not what I was told.”
By AJC/DNC Management
December 3, 2008 3:29 PM | Link to this
Sarah Palin packs heat.
What else do you need to know?
~~~~~
By mm December 3, 2008 2:54 PM Corporal, You always talk about loving our great country. So why do you always bring up other countries in your arguments?
mm: Corporal missed an important point in his response so allow me- It is precisely because US citizens own guns that the fate of other nations have not befallen us.
The Chinks and various zipperheads of the world worry just as much about all the rednecks and hillbillies blowing them away as they do about our Armed Forces.
We scare our enemies and make them hysterical, just see any of God’s Trash posts for an idea of what I’m taking about.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 3, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
In any event, the Minnesota battle is not over yet: As of Tuesday, with more than 6,000 ballots having been challenged, Coleman’s lead stood at 303 votes, according to the Minneapolis Star-Tribune.
That’s more than what he started with.
Any man with a shred of common decency and respect for the electoral process of this great country would have conceded by now.
I guess that’s why Franken is still scheming, huh?
By Paul
December 3, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this
RW-(the original)
So much for ‘change.’ Who’da thunk they’d be so hung up on appearances?
Wait, appearances… that was the Sara Palin wardrobe Republican hangup…. oh, never mind.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this
To AJC/DNC
Thank you ………….
To Taxpayer
It’s rarely about shooting and killing someone. How about:
1) The number of perpetrators shot by a civilian but not killed.
2) The number of perpetrators shot “at” by a civilian and missed/scared off.
3) The number of perpetrators who saw the civilian’s gun “pointed” at them and ran.
4) The number of perpetrators who “saw” the civilian had a gun and left quietly.
5) The number of perpetrators who “thought” the civilian might be armed and kept going.
Also, gun toters know that:
1) Deadly forced is used only as a “last resort”.
2) Shooting someone is a very traumatic event for the shooter as well.
3) Your every action will be scrutinized by a police and grand jury investigation.
4) No matter how justified the shooting, the perpetrator’s family will find some attorney willing to sue you.
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
Corporal,
As I recall, you changed the subject when you jumped to talking about millions rounded up in other countries and killed. Exactly how is that supposed to tie into carrying a concealed handgun in the US. So, I was just playing along since I’m sure those millions were not rounded up at the point of a handgun. It was most likely with the use of force such as tanks, machine guns, bombs, etc.
By AJC/DNC Management
December 3, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
Fresh off his runoff victory Tuesday night, Georgia Republican Sen. Saxby Chambliss credited Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin with firing up his base.
“I can’t overstate the impact she had down here,” Chambliss said during an interview Wednesday morning on Fox News.
“When she walks in a room, folks just explode,” he added. “And they really did pack the house everywhere we went. She’s a dynamic lady, a great administrator, and I think she’s got a great future in the Republican Party.”
Dude!
The girl’s got it.
By Truthman
December 3, 2008 3:58 PM | Link to this
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!!!!!!!!
Beam me up Scotty!
Thanks for the shout out, Paul!
By Truthman
December 3, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
Saxby Chambliss’ first post-election “100 percent wrong club” prediction!!
“I can’t overstate the impact she had down here,” Chambliss said during an interview Wednesday morning on Fox News.
“When she walks in a room, folks just explode,” he added. “And they really did pack the house everywhere we went. She’s a dynamic lady, a great administrator, and I think she’s got a great future in the Republican Party.”
You betchya!!
Andi, does your mommy know about your Palin-crush?
By AmVet
December 3, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
Sauxtobeus, doing his part to ensure the further demise of the hemorrhaging GOP!
“GOP must return to Reagan principles”
YEAH, that’s the ticket! MORE faux conservatism!
Time to pull out the new prediction!
Republican Bloodbath, Part Trois. Coming to an election everywhere, November 2010.
By Truthman
December 3, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this
AmVet: “Saxtobeus!” Priceless!
Yes, he does remind one of a corpulent, Roman Senator full of wine and bluster!
By @@
December 3, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this
Damn! Richardson shaved his beard off?
Beards are a big deal with middle eastern mean. Has somethin’ to do with virility.
Maybe Hillary needs to let hers grow.
By Bud Wiser
December 3, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this
Corporal at 3:14 - Good One!
Might I add:
I don’t carry a gun because under the law I can I carry a gun so the moron who tried to shoot me first can have his relatives sit in the courtroom and cry because he is dead, instead of my wife and children and grandchildren doing the same because I am dead.
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
Corporal,
I don’t have a problem with the guns. Like I said earlier:
By Taxpayer December 3, 2008 1:21 PM I don’t have a problem with the loaded concealed guns as long as the law is applied equally to everyone and everywhere. Guns in school, in church, in Congress, in Court, etc. No exceptions.
By AF
December 3, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this
Well, Saxby is right and how embarrassng! Palin does draw a crowd and some Georgians really do get misty eyed over her. Now she will be invited again and again! The good side of that is it keeps reminding those who consider her an idiot of why they need to stay alert.
Can you image Palin as president right now? Who would she pick fo a cabinet? Would it have any centrist person in it?
By JAY BOOKMAN
December 3, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this
RW, the problem is fixed. Thanks for the heads up, I was otherwise occupied.
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this
Who would Palin pick for a cabinet? Interesting question. To start with, they would likely all be referred to as Pastor, Preacher, Brother, Sister, etc., and they would all be packing concealed weapons — big weapons. Really big weapons…bombs…big bombs….
By RW-(the original)
December 3, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this
Jay B,
Thanks, but I wouldn’t say the problem is exactly fixed. I only asked a simple question and now you pull down everything except amvet’s 3:20 making it look as if he had a valid point.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 5:13 PM | Link to this
To Taxpayer @ 3:51
But you miss the point. It never starts with everything. It’s always the slippery slope. It starts with handguns, then rifles, then shotguns, etc. Classic Frog in the Kettle.
So……to keep it from happening period….. you draw a line in the sand.
To Taxpayer @ 4:24
The law is the law but we are also free to change it.
In my opinion, licensed gun toters should be allowed to carry in schools and churches (the bad guys will). I am on our church security committee (we are not in the best area for folkis going to their cars at night, etc.) and I can carry because I am retired law enforcement. We need more to be able to do so.
Congress, courts, airports or anywhere that uses magnetometers to “ensure” safety can be an exception. You shouldn’t be able to declare a gun free zone unless you can guarantee it and you should be ethically and legally bound to do so. Churches and schools are NOT gun free zones so they should be excepted for gun toters under the law.
We’ll see next year when the State Legislature meets.
By RW-(the original)
December 3, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this
Cool edit!
By Tell It Like It Is
December 3, 2008 5:28 PM | Link to this
Its too bad that Georgia’s legislators are not allowed to carry guns so that they can all shoot each other and save us the embarassment of watching them in action.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this
To Tell It Like It Is
Thanks so much for adding your brilliant comments to a very complex area of American life.
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 7:29 PM | Link to this
Corporal,
I did not miss any valid point pertaining to the topic of carrying concealed guns in the US. Your shift in topic to the killing of millions in other countries does not contribute to the topic.
Regarding carrying concealed weapons and the use of metal detectors, you would surely be willing to part with your weapon at any location that provides such security then, right? So, we could just as easily have required metal detectors at churches, schools, bars, Congress, airports, train stations, etc., and skipped the gun toting issue entirely were it not for the gun lobbyists and their desire to make an extra buck.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this
To Taxpayer
1) My comments about other countries is competely valid. If you think it can never happen here (i.e., New Orleans/Katrina), your head is in the sand.
By the way, doctors kill more people in this country (accidentally of course) than people with gun toters permits.
2) You are being totally unrealistic. You have no idea what it costs to man and maintain magnetometers. It would be off the charts. In addition, you must secure the entire perimeter to keep anyone from sneaking in. That’s why that effort is used at only a few places like government buildings.
To answer your specific question I am somewhat comfortable in places like that (but remember the Fulton County Courthouse episode). It all boils down to the training and people involved.
3) “The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that’s good”
George Washington
By t in mi
December 3, 2008 8:04 PM | Link to this
Bozzo’s never seem to fail and speak for the NRA. I have a carry permit and it’s not valid with alchol use, not even permited in a bar. Would another gun law have stopped this…how many did he break already? I suppose it’s too much to ask for “journalists” to know facts. Thats why paper sales and news outlets subscripions are down….
By Taxpayer
December 3, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this
Corporal,
Your topic about killing millions is valid if one were talking about avoiding mass killings by people such as Hitler. That’s not the topic here. Now, you’ve thrown in doctors. How far off the topic of carrying hidden handguns are you going and to what end.
How am I being unrealistic. Since when has cost stopped a Republican from doing something. You just borrow whatever it takes from future generations like with the Iraq war, the tax cuts on capital gains, the prescription drug program, etc.
The Fulton Co. Courthouse episode could have been prevented by escorting the known dangerous and larger felon with a couple of larger guards. It has nothing to do with the issue of the general public carrying concealed handguns.
The very presence of the Omega series missile has the capability of either restraining evil or promoting it depending on who has their hand on the button and what each party’s ultimate goal is. All hail the all mighty bomb. You just gotta love those old Planet of the Ape movies, dontcha. I think everyone should keep a copy of those movies mounted over their mantles right underneath their HO scale Omega missile.
By "The Corporal"
December 3, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this
Taxpayer
My point was your in much more danger from your doctor than you are someone with a handgun permit.
But alas, I have enjoyed the discussion. At least you are civil about it unlike some of the others on this blog.
P.S. The Fulton County Courthouse happened in large part because of political correctness. You trying being a supervisor and even insinuating a female deputy can’t do the job a male deputy can. Get ready for an EEO complaint. I’ve been there.