By Paul

November 25, 2008 5:02 PM | Link to this

Well Jay, I suppose on this Thanksgiving Week we can all give thanks that…. it’s not worse!

Best of luck to the incoming administration. Bold times calling for bold measures, and all that. Krugman’s done a series of columns calling for boldness. Forget the old theories - they don’t hold. Take your worst guess and double it. Interesting premise.

We got sick. Our kids and grandkids got stuck with the medicine. Sad. Let’s just hope the people have the will to see it through.

Happy Turkey Day, all -

By Let's get down to business

November 25, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

I think we should just garnish the incomes of all the executives at the financial companies that got us into this mess in the first place. Make them work until it’s paid back even if we have to give them the first doses of that “fountain of youth” drug when it comes out. Maybe that would at least keep them out of trouble for the rest of their lives.

By Paul

November 25, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

Oh, and Jay -

seems two references to The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Universe are appropriate.

First: “”The Universe is Big. Really big. It may seem like a long way to the corner chemist, but compared to the Universe, that’s peanuts.” “

and, why is “The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Universe” the most popular book ever published? Because

“It has the words DON’T PANIC inscribed in large, friendly letters on its cover.”

That all may make more sense after the holiday celebrations begin -

By Greg Mendel

November 25, 2008 5:27 PM | Link to this

Republicans do things big. The worst president in American history gives his conservative friends the biggest handout in the history of Mankind. Just in time for Thanksgiving and Christmas.

Yes, Virginia, there is a Dubya Claus.

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this

Wait till Oblahmi starts adding to it.

We will be a wholly owned subsidiary of China.

I have begun hoarding yen, I’m hoping they’ll let me keep them when they invade.

Hey, Walmart won’t be selling “foreign” goods when that happens.

By Paul

November 25, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this

Golly, Greg,

Pres Bush has been consulting with Pres-elect Obama. Are you suggesting Pres Obama would have done any differently? Or won’t do more?

And check the contribution records of those investment and banking institutions. I think you’ll find there are more Obama donations than Bush represented. So I guess you’re saying the bailout money didn’t go to these institutions?

By getalife

November 25, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this

Jay reports 3.92 trillion, CNBC reports 4.28 trillion, Bloomberg reports 7.4 trillion but we really don’t know the total cost yet.

I am at a loss of words to describe what we are witnessing but it is a historic disaster.

Some heads need to roll and enough with no accountability in this country or this will end really bad.

By mike hussein smith

November 25, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this

So you’re saying we don’t need a bailout and should just sit idly by and watch behemoths belly up? (I can live without Chrysler and Bob Nardelli. How about you?) Or do you want to just pussyfoot around and try the same kind of half-a&& measures that all seem to turn around and bite us in the buttocks a few years down the road? Do we skimp or go whole hog? Those aren’t great choices, but I’d go for a fix, not just a touch-up. And, Jay, not all of this money has been spent and, depending on how effective the bailout is, some of it may never be.

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 5:42 PM | Link to this

Paul: You don’t find it a tad ironic that Krugwoman is now preaching what he whined about for the last 8 years?

By Paul

November 25, 2008 5:47 PM | Link to this

AJC/DNC Management,

I didn’t want to be the one to bring it up. Just seemed enough that someone made a case for more and then these numbers rolled in.

With all the gloom of these posts I was hopin’ Jay or someone would bring up the best news I’ve heard in a long while: the Holy Land Foundation suspects were found guilty on all counts and could get life.

I think it’s good news. Can’t imagine anyone disagreeing….

By "The Corporal"

November 25, 2008 5:50 PM | Link to this

“….. and unless they had the mark of the beast they could neither buy not sell.”

If it’s this big think what will happen if it all comes crashing down ?

By AmVet

November 25, 2008 5:50 PM | Link to this

The anti-environmentalists/global-warming ostriches took another big hit in the second consecutive neo-con humiliation, I mean, November election.

Of the eight new US Senators, seven Democrats, all were either endorsed by the Sierra Club or have demonstrated some positive action on clean energy and environmental issues. Even Johanns, the token Republican has voiced his support for more fuel efficient vehicles and renewable energy.

Looks like the science-hating, flat earthers in the GOP first, had their one and only chance to completely destroy and rape the planet for a few dollars but came up a little short.

Too bad…

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 5:58 PM | Link to this

It’s a regular Whine-O-Rama in thee Pinko Nation-

The president-elect’s lineup for key governing positions has opted for continuity, not change. Virtually all of his leading appointments are restoring the Clinton presidency, only without Mr. Bill. In some important ways, Obama’s selections seem designed to sustain the failing policies of George W. Bush.

Ouch.

His victory, it appears, was a triumph for the cautious center-right politics that has described the Democratic party for several decades. Those of us who expected more were duped, not so much by Obama but by our own wishful thinking.-TheNation

And here I thought it was the hardcore Conservatives getting cast out, hahahaha.

By Greg Mendel

November 25, 2008 6:09 PM | Link to this

“Pres Bush has been consulting with Pres-elect Obama. Are you suggesting Pres Obama would have done any differently? Or won’t do more?” — Paul

I’m saying that the George W. Bush administration has been at the governmental helm for eight years, and still is. During that time, his administration failed to strictly monitor the performance and behavior of the banking and financial industries, which is an administration responsibility.

The “housing bubble” that caused the collapse was preceded by the “dot-com bubble,” which should have served as a warning. Bubbles always burst, so the Bush administration had every reason to address its bubble. It didn’t.

I’m sure Obama will continue the bailouts. He has no choice. But, a more competent administration would have been more likely to step in before there was a meltdown.

Even today, the U. S. Secretary of the Treasury seems to have little idea of what to do. A previous Bush SoT said that Bush was “not engaged.” Obviously he was right, and the president’s lack of engagement has cost this country more than the bailouts.

By Paul

November 25, 2008 6:26 PM | Link to this

Greg Mendel

Thoughtful response - thanks. The initial post seemed a tad ideological (conservative friends and all that) and I generally point out beneficiaries of this largesse aren’t split on party lines.

I started to wonder what might have happened if he’d been more engaged, then thought better of it.

Anyhow, off for the holiday.

Pleasant overeating and overimbibing, all -

By Greg Mendel

November 25, 2008 6:33 PM | Link to this

Paul: I got carried away, I’m afraid. Have a happy holiday! And eat your sweet peas.

— Gregor Mendel

By RW-(the original)

November 25, 2008 6:40 PM | Link to this

Breaking news from Iowahawk.

WASHINGTON DC - Ending weeks of speculation and rumors, President-Elect Barack Obama today named Bill Clinton to join his incoming administration as President of the United States, where he will head the federal government’s executive branch

“I am pleased that Bill Clinton has agreed to come out of retirement to head up this crucial post in my administration,” said Obama. “He brings a lifetime of previous executive experience as Governor of Arkansas and President of the United States, and has worked closely with most of the members of my Cabinet.”

By getalife

November 25, 2008 6:41 PM | Link to this

Now why would w ignore the housing bubble burst?

Could it be the Dems wanted to replace it with green energy jobs, a blow to big oil profits?

I think big oil should bail out big auto but the Dems will do it to get green cars.

The Dems are going to spend big to try get out of this mess.

By RW-(the original)

November 25, 2008 6:50 PM | Link to this

getalife,

Yesterday Obama said we were going to spend massively to get things going, but today he’s become a budget hawk. So far the fawning media hasn’t noticed.

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this

Nah, we ain’t doing this in the dark-

By Eklutna Lake November 25, 2008 4:22 PM No ‘Liberal” here……just an AK resident, living in the 907/995xx area, accutely aware of our guv’s dearth of leadership qualifications, as evidenced day after day after teeth-gritting day in the Greatland.

By AJC/DNC Management November 25, 2008 4:37 PM Eklutna Lake: Are you one of those 12% dead enders? According to a new Rasmussen Reports poll, Sarah Palin has become more popular than Barack Obama. Did she cut off your earmarks or what?

By Abomi Nation November 25, 2008 5:11 PM What a bunch of bs. This is not a new poll, it was taken right after McCain announced her as his running mate.

By AJC/DNC Management November 25, 2008 5:40 PM Aborti Nation: If you pay close attention, you would see the discussion pertains to Sarah Palin the governor of Alaska, not the Sarah Palin of the psycho paranoid media. The wipeout in the 2006 election left Republicans in such a state of dejection that they’ve overlooked the one shining victory in which a Republican star was born. The triumph came in Alaska where Sarah Palin, a politician of eye-popping integrity, was elected governor. She is now the most popular governor in America, with an approval rating in the 90s, and probably the most popular public official in any state.

By JAY BOOKMAN November 25, 2008 6:12 PM Wow, Management, did you really try to foist a three-month-old poll off as current? Are you that desperate? Has the cupboard become that bare?

Eklutna Lake clearly portrayed itself as a resident of Alaska who was “accutely aware of our guv’s dearth of leadership qualifications” and I framed my response around the fact that Sarah Palin was one of the most popular governors in American history, obviously someone who also possessed “leadership qualifications.”

Anybody can see that.

But that ain’t the reason I dragged this over here into the light, can you believe that Mister Three A Day Anti Sarah Screeds And Paranoid Ramblings has the freaking nerve to call me “desperate?”

By T

November 25, 2008 7:18 PM | Link to this

Should we let all of these companies fail? As much as I think they should get what they have earned, what happens to all of those employees?

What othe options do we have? I think it would be ugly either way.

What happened to people being held accountable?

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 7:25 PM | Link to this

My “desperation” will be evident as I wheel the Escalade into the Convention Center parking lot Monday evening with the Bose 10.1 Acoustimass System pumping out Barracuda at ear popping decibel levels.

Let the games begin.

May the best woman win.

By Greg Mendel

November 25, 2008 7:51 PM | Link to this

Take a look at the list Jay posted. The Marshall Plan, Louisiana Purchase, space programs, etc. We got a return on some of those expenditures. We didn’t get much for the wars, if anything.

Take a look at the Invasion of Iraq. $597 billion. Iraq cost more than the Marshall Plan, the Louisiana Purchase, and the Moon Race — combined. What did we get for that money?

With no WMD found there even before the invasion, we didn’t get protection from any real threat. There were no terrorists there until we arrived. We got to tear down a big statue. The Iraqis got rid of Saddam, in exchange for civil war.

But, what did we get? Other than a bill that’s still growing.

By getalife

November 25, 2008 8:10 PM | Link to this

Damn shame they decided to bail out the greedy ones who caused this mess when they could have provided excellent health care for everybody, restructure mortgages, and invest in green jobs to create a new bubble.

Business as usual in Washington.

Pathetic.

By getalife

November 25, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this

RW,

Dobbs noticed as his head exploded. I am not real confident in Obama’s economic team with their part in these bailouts.

His defense team is strong.

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this

What we are talking about is a golden political opportunity for politicians to use the current financial crisis to fundamentally change an economy that has been successful for more than two centuries, so that politicians can henceforth micro-manage all sorts of businesses and play Robin Hood, taking from those who are not likely to vote for them and transferring part of their earnings to those who will vote for them.-Thomas Sowell

If that ain’t socialism then you need to show me what is.

By RW-(the original)

November 25, 2008 8:33 PM | Link to this

getalife,

Here’s a strong defense team.

The next time 250 heavily armed insurgents ambush somebody it probably won’t be 30 US Marines.

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 8:43 PM | Link to this

Will Klintoon’s first trip as Secretary of State be to China with a large, empty suitcase in tow?

Or do they have wire transfers in place already?

By Chad Harris

November 25, 2008 8:48 PM | Link to this

Bring the moron in. Every second of Palin exposure wins elections for Dems. She’s the turkey that keeps on giving.

One thing to be the most thankful for this Tgiving is that there are still a sizable group of Republicans out there who are stupid enough to think Sarah Palin would be awesome in 2012. And are wasting their money to make it happen.

Moron Palin is the quintissential Turkey that keeps on giving. We’re glad to kick her butt to the curb anytime you run her or trot her out.

By getalife

November 25, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this

RW,

Kill em while you can. Karzai wants a withdrawal date.

Andy,

May the best woman win.

You are a woman?

Anyhoo, she will be paying the interest in the bailout money borrowed.

By AJC/DNC Management

November 25, 2008 9:01 PM | Link to this

Chad Harris: Your hero should have beaten McCain in a landslide, after all it was an anti Bush election and McCain was just about as lame as Oblahma was.

But for some reason he didn’t win in a landslide.

Hmmmmm, I wonder why?

By RW-(the original)

November 25, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this

getalife,

I thought Obama was just planning to invade Pockeestahn. Maybe that’s Karzai’s withdrawal date.

By BT fan

November 25, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this

Thanks to Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Barney Franks, Ed Dodd, CEO`s of Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac, Wall Street, Mortgage Bankers, CFO of major banks, George Bush and people who purchase homes who did not take into consideration they have to make payments…WHAT A FRICKIN MESS

By luvlee

November 25, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

BT Fan finally someone on this blog has nailed why this meltdown occurred, the mortgages…look up Community Reinvestment Act (CRA), No Income No Job or Assets (NINJA Loans)….that’s what started this mess and it was way way, before Bush’s 8 years just happened to meltdown while he was in office.

By getalife

November 25, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this

RW,

Doubt he is dumb enough to invade, occupy and break Pakistan but they will continue to drop a few bombs now and then.

Israel is getting ready to bomb Iran soon. Russia warships are in Venezuela, Gaza crossing closed again after some rockets,same ole crap in Africa and them pirates are getting paid.

Hillary will be busy.

By BDAtlanta

November 25, 2008 9:48 PM | Link to this

In 13 years we’ve spent $500 billion on the War on Drugs.

By Greg Mendel

November 25, 2008 11:23 PM | Link to this

“BT Fan finally someone on this blog has nailed why this meltdown occurred, the mortgages…look up Community Reinvestment Act (CRA), No Income No Job or Assets (NINJA Loans)….that’s what started this mess and it was way way, before Bush’s 8 years just happened to meltdown while he was in office.” — luvlee

I hope folks take you advice, and look up the Community Reinvestment Act.

Take your OWN advice. Look it up. You will find that it deals only with “redlining,” has no reporting requirements, and no punishment for violating it.

This lie has been repeated over and over again by wingnuts who know other wingnuts won’t look it up. By people who want to blame the Great Bush Megabillion Meltdown Handout on poor people.

You bet’cha.

By DB, Gwinnettian

November 26, 2008 7:38 AM | Link to this

“This lie has been repeated over and over again by wingnuts who know other wingnuts won’t look it up.”

indeed. It’s become Zombie Lie; it refuses to die, no matter how many times it gets killed, and no matter how effectively some have worked to explain just how it is, in fact, a lie.

There’ve been plenty of examples in print; Jay’s posted on this as well. Here’s my favorite, “Subprime Suspects” from Newsweek, in case you need a link the next time it comes up.

By bobfromcanton

November 26, 2008 7:56 AM | Link to this

Jay you are intellectually dishonest with your Editorial Opinion today. I am sure you weren’t wanting to move Inauguration day sooner during the last weeks of Clinton’s dynasty. And I can bet that you won’t want to shorten the Big O’s time in office when he is sent packing at the next Presidential election either! You are a left wingnut yourself….

By ISUG

November 26, 2008 7:58 AM | Link to this

JAY - YOUR LIBERAL SAVIOR ALREADY TOLD YOU HOW BIG THE BAIL OUT WOULD BE. “I WILL SPEND WHATEVER IT TAKES.”

By Peter

November 26, 2008 8:03 AM | Link to this

Gee wasn’t Bush going to balance the budget ?

Republican’s spenders and liars !

All without a CLUE !

By PinkoNeoConLibertarian

November 26, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this

Paul @ 5:07

Unfortunately, the policy makers have been wearing their peril sensitive sunglasses for a long time now!

By Peadawg

November 26, 2008 9:00 AM | Link to this

So much the “change” Obama promised…keeping Robert Gates? Keep the lies coming…

By yankee

November 26, 2008 9:03 AM | Link to this

I’m glad someone else read the reinvestment act. Not that it’l make any difference, after all, Obama’s a Muslem.

By making

November 26, 2008 9:10 AM | Link to this

Bailout…a bottomless pit leading to a fast track to a depression…only in America!

By tsing how

November 26, 2008 9:38 AM | Link to this

Maybe China taking over the US wouldn’t be so bad…instead of bailing out the greedy slobs that caused this mess, the Chinese would be marching them out to a firing squad.

By Red

November 26, 2008 9:38 AM | Link to this

Spending fell 1% last month; a deflationary spiral is a very real possibility. Yes Bush has impoverished us, but we have to play the hand that the neo cons have dealt us. This means running the money printing presses 24/7 until we start to reinflate. Personally, I’ll put $5 a month toward ‘Obamabonds’.

By luvlee

November 26, 2008 9:42 AM | Link to this

greg mendel I never blamed the poor people I blame Washington but the blame didn’t start with Bush it was a lot further back than that. Any comment about NINJA loans you don’t think that has anything to do with this meltdown either, huh? I’m sick and tired of these bailouts while it appears no one is looking for the root of the problem, Washington is as Washington does. Let’s let them keep on doing what they’ve been doing, it’s worked so well hasn’t it?

By SaveOurRepublic

November 26, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this

RUSSIAN ANALYST PREDICTS DECLINE AND BREAKUP OF USA….

http://www.drudgereport.com/flashrur.htm

By Jake

November 26, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this

Paulson’s handouts to his Wall Street and banker friends that aren’t doing anything to help the crisis are a disgrace. Dividends, bonuses and acquisitions don’t do anything to improve the liquidity or solvency issues. A civilized country would roll the guillotines into DC and Wall Street.

By tsing how

November 26, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this

Being a demoncrat I hate to admit it but the mess really started with Bill Clinton. By signing the Gramm-Leach-Bailey act in 1999 he laid the foundation for the greed and fraud that followed in the banking industry. I’m sure his intentions were to beef up the banks with cash so could afford to make homeowners of us all, and now we see that many of us just can’t afford to be homeowners.

So can someone explain how all of this cash we are all collectively throwing at banks is going to make the problem any better? People with adequate incomes, credit history and down payments can get loans now..at good rates. If we are throwing all this money at bank so they will start lending again, aren’t we going to just get more insolvent homeowners. What am I missing?

By Jake

November 26, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this

Depends on what the banks do with the money. If they borrow $10B and use it to make $120B of new good loans to qualified borrowers it would help tremendously. If they spend it on dividends, bonuses, and acquisitions of failed banks with bad loan and security portfolios, it won’t help at all.

By Peter

November 26, 2008 12:05 PM | Link to this

Republican’s are conservative, and for small government……… Keep the lies coming !

By RH

November 26, 2008 3:34 PM | Link to this

Jay, Why don’t you tell us what and who caused the problem. I’ve got a hint, it was not GWB. You know it and any thinking American knows it. One of the culprits is telling us help is on the way.The others are sitting in judgement of the Big 3 auto ex’s. Only in America!

By Mike In Woodstock

November 26, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this

The picture on the opening page of the empty airport security line on Thanksgiving eve is just another legacy of the Bush Depression. He will definitely be the last Republican President that this country ever has.