Home > Jay Bookman > Archives > 2008 > October > 20 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USThe real Lincoln, not the e-mail Lincoln
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
A list of bogus Lincoln quotes is making the e-mail circuit, including statements such as “You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong” and “You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling the wage payer down.”
If you’ve ever read Lincoln, you know he could never write such trite garbage. The language is wrong and sounds nothing like the man. The sentiments are also clearly not those of Lincoln.
“Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital,” our greatest president said in his first annual message to Congress. “Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.”
He also had a profound understanding of true liberty and its challenges.
“The shepherd drives the wolf from the sheep’s throat, for which the sheep thanks the shepherd as his liberator, while the wolf denounces him for the same act…,” he once said. “Plainly the sheep and the wolf are not agreed upon a definition of liberty.”
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Comments
By Midori
October 20, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
So now we know: most of Corporal’s bs quotes are made up.
wonder where he pulled them out of ? the air? his back side?
my bet is the latter.
By Mrs.Godzilla
October 20, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this
Brilliant Jay!
American’s need to be very wary of a bad bargain.
Great Ad. Spread it around.
By Ackmed
October 20, 2008 6:41 PM | Link to this
Today thee Iman has us conducting a poll for ABC News/ Wash Post, I am so excited and proud to be doing my duty for thee democrat party!
This is good work in thee Pakistani frontier, I hope we don’t mess it up. We even get to use thee al Qaeda #2 man’s cave, he hasn’t been back for a few days, what nice digs he has though.
Listen in to my first phone call-
Hello, Mrs. Myers?
Mrs. Myers- Yes, how are you?
Hi, Mrs. Myers, my name is George and I’m conducting a presidential poll for ABC/ Wapo, my first question to you is, are you a Repug or a democrat?
Mrs. Myers- I am a lifelong Republi
Click.
Let’s see, what is thee second number on my list?
Hello, Mr. Mcbozo?
Mr. Mcbozo- What do you want?
My name is George and I am conducting thee presidential poll for thee ABC/ Wapo, may ask if you hate thee George Bushie?
Mr. Mcbozo- With a purple passion.
Wonderful, that is one vote for thee Oblahma. Thank you for your time.
Mr. Mcbozo-But
Click
Thee McCain and thee Bushie are the same person, that’s what Oblahma says, right?
Hello Mr. Nasty?
Yes, this is Nasty.
Hi Nasty, my name is Ack, I mean George, and I am conducting thee presidential poll for thee ABC/Wapo, would you like to participate?
Mr. Nasty- Why not.
Great, who do you find to be more inexperienced, thee infidel Palin or thee infidel McCain?
Mr. Nasty- You mean Palin or Oblahma, right?
No I don’t, apostate, answer thee question.
Mr. Nasty- Say, what the f
Click
Aahhh, yes, another vote for thee Oblahma.
This is too easy!
Allah Akbar!
Yes we can!
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this
I don’t think he was talking about forced labor, kookman, you may want to reread some of the lit.
And, you forgot something very important in your usurping of greatness, Lincoln was a Republican
By Doggone/GA
October 20, 2008 6:59 PM | Link to this
“And, you forgot something very important in your usurping of greatness, Lincoln was a Republican”
But it wasn’t the same Republican party. If Lincoln was alive today he’d be a Democrat. The Republican “Southern Strategy” would have made SURE of that.
By Taxpayer
October 20, 2008 7:00 PM | Link to this
Even worse are the wolves in sheep’s clothing — the modern-day Republican. Abe has to be rolling over in his grave at the sight of these whiny, debtor-nation, war-mongering — I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday, with money borrowed from the grandchildren of others, for a Hessian today — 21st Century Republicans.
By Mrs.Godzilla
October 20, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this
Evening Midori….
You know as well as I do we wear ourselves slap out proving the gobbletygook that is splattered about by the Radical Right.
I nearly wore out my google!
As we have experienced if a Rightie says A then B it is!
Tax cuts for 95% of Americans is socialist? What then were the Bush tax cuts for the top 1%? Only a teeny weeny itsy bit socialist?
Romney just said the plan was to send all us poor folk checks from taxing the rich. CHECKS? Romney remains a dim bulb. A male Palin.
Next they will speak the words that must never be spoken, words so frightening, so foul as to cause women to wimper and grown men to wail. Class warfare and redistribution of wealth! EEEEEEK!
(I think I better wash my mouth out with JD and Coke.)
By David
October 20, 2008 7:17 PM | Link to this
Like David Brooks, Christopher Buckley, Colin Powell, Christopher Hitchens, and Andrew Sullivan, real conservatives are leaning towards Obama over McCain.
All of these intellectual elites have written of the lack of real conservatism in the Republican party of late, largely thanks to the rot within brought by the neo-cons, such as Cheney, Bush, and company.
By Mrs.Godzilla
October 20, 2008 7:21 PM | Link to this
Peggy Noonan has come into the light!
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 7:23 PM | Link to this
Yes, David, you can have the low hanging fruits.
They are all yours.
You forgot to take your little peggy noonan with ya.
By Midori
October 20, 2008 7:26 PM | Link to this
Mrs. G,
Howdy :)
is it me, or is Andy the only person who uses the term “thee” around here?
Just an observation…..
By GMAN
October 20, 2008 7:38 PM | Link to this
I’ve heard a lot about reaching across the aisle by Republicans this election season. However, the minute one of their own walks acrosss the aisle they are thrown under the bus and treated like gutter trash. It goes to show that talk is cheap!
Bush/McCain - Gambling with your children’s futures… and losing!
By Bud Wiser
October 20, 2008 7:39 PM | Link to this
You must have missed this one Jay. It is the total antithesis for which your beloved Democratic Party stands:
”*”Property is the fruit of labor…property is desirable…is a positive good in the world. That some should be rich shows that others may become rich, and hence is just encouragement to industry and enterprise. Let not him who is houseless pull down the house of another; but let him labor diligently and build one for himself, thus by example assuring that his own shall be safe from violence when built.” *
The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume VII, “Reply to New York Workingmen’s Democratic Republican Association” (March 21, 1864), pp. 259-260.
I guess Honest Abe would be having a heart attack over the constant giveaways and entitlements spewing forth from your party. And the so-called ‘economic stimulus’ checks (more giveaways from those that make to those that take), Lincoln would have laughed out of his office.
The Wall Street and banking crisis bailout? Guess that covers those as well.
Lesson: Never open a can of worms unless you already expect someone to count and inspect each and every one.
Obama/Biden ‘08 - making it easy to be stupid
By getalife
October 20, 2008 7:39 PM | Link to this
“I’m Bill Clinton and I think you deserve a change. That’s why I’ve offered a plan to get the economy moving again, starting with a middle-class tax cut…”
--Bill Clinton campaign commercial, 1/16/92Wasn’t Lincoln a one term Senator from Illinois too?
By Ray
October 20, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this
Just finished Noonan’s latest book, “Patriotic Grace”. Must say that she has some good points. Do disagree with her stand on our “friends” throughout the world, including Caesar Chavez. She is right on when she describes the polarization of the American electorate. We probably cannot get anything done if we remain so against each other. But she doesn’t describe how good it makes you feel to call Bookman an as** and how it really fits to speak out about how Tucker is such a jerk. We will probably remain polarized far past the election and just like Bush’s past press secretary states, ” We will be doing this election well past Nov4th”.
By Ackmed
October 20, 2008 7:44 PM | Link to this
i r o diM: Thee are thee idiot.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 7:47 PM | Link to this
al-Gitmo: Thanks for that info, KKKlinton raised taxes on the middle class, after he lied, I had forgotten about that.
By getalife
October 20, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this
Of course, Andy er Ackmed.
Daddy bush left a recession.
The market was at 3300.
When President Clinton left, there was a surplus and the market was over 10,000.
The good ole days. We can have them again because Obama is using Clinton’s economic team.
Yes, we can.
By Taxpayer
October 20, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this
I was reading an article at minyanville and I ran across the following quote in the article:
John W. Gardner once observed:
“The society which scorns excellence in plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an exalted activity will have neither good plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water.”
By hillbilly ragger
October 20, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this
Luckotrooooooool, kindly cite how and when Bill Clinton “raised taxes on the middle class.”
By Midori
October 20, 2008 7:56 PM | Link to this
if you say so, Andy.
but then, you haven’t been right about one single, solitary thing to date.
your track record, much like you, sucks.
By G
October 20, 2008 8:01 PM | Link to this
From the LA Times today:
Mark Jacoby, the owner of Young Political Majors (YPM) was arrested. Jacoby, who the California Republican Party hired to register tens of thousands of voters this year was arrested in Ontario over the weekend on suspicion of voter registration fraud.
YPM has been accused of using bait-and-switch tactics across the country. Election officials and lawmakers have launched investigations into the activities of YPM workers in Florida and Massachusetts. In Arizona, the firm was recently a defendant in a civil rights lawsuit.
It’s the Republican way.
Obama/Biden ‘08
By AmVet
October 20, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this
Speaking of great quotes by former American presidents, I found this looking for another Jefferson quote.
The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. ~Thomas Jefferson
That day, thankfully, is here Mr. Jefferson.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:08 PM | Link to this
In 1992, Bill Clinton ran on a promise of a middle class tax cut. It was one of the centerpieces of his campaign. When he took office in 1993, almost immediatly he declared that idea dead. The economy was much worse than he ever imagined. Instead of a middle class tax cut, he would actually have to raise taxes. And that is exactly what happened.
Clinton, who had Democratic majorities in both the house and senate, raised taxes on the middle class. When the house passed the tax increase, the Democrats actually stood and gave themselves a standing ovation for being brave enough to increase taxes on the middle class.
Clinton raised motor fuel taxes, inheritance taxes, capital gains taxes, every freaking tax that caught his lying eye.
By the way, the dot.com bubble made the KKKlinton economy look good and when it burst, led to the last recession that the US suffered through.
By getalife
October 20, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this
So, felony arrest for voter fraud by gop YPM is one and ACORN is zero.
The socialism McCain is spewing is going back to Clinton tax policies.
All he has left is the wright card.
He will lose then retire.
By Ray
October 20, 2008 8:12 PM | Link to this
Love is not makes the world go ‘round, love is just what makes it worthwhile.
Franklin P. Jones
By getalife
October 20, 2008 8:16 PM | Link to this
Andy,
Yes, daddy lied about how bad the economy actually was. His son is doing the same and never believe the numbers they spew.
We will get back to the good ole days and you will attack Obama’s every move like you did with President Clinton.
You really hate America don’t you?
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:21 PM | Link to this
“God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are a gift from God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, and that His justice cannot sleep forever.” [Notes on the State of Virginia, 1781]-Thomas Jefferson
By Doggone/GA
October 20, 2008 8:22 PM | Link to this
As long as we’re quoting:
“The modern conservative is engaged in one of man’s oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.” John Kenneth Galbraith
By getalife
October 20, 2008 8:24 PM | Link to this
Yeah Andy,
The investment bankers took the profit from dot com and invested in mortgage fraud and the housing bubble burst.
The good news is oil has dropped 30% which will help our economy. The bad news is when it recovers, oil will go back up.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this
al-Gitmo: So what taxes did Bushie cut, hmmmmmm?
By G
October 20, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this
Democrats and Republicans have settled the suit seeking to prevent Michigan Republicans from using foreclosure lists to challenge voters. The Michigan Democratic Party statement on the settlement says:
An agreement announced today by Obama for America, the Republican National Committee, the Democratic National Committee, the Michigan Republican Party, the Michigan Democratic Party, the Macomb County Republican Party, the Macomb County Democratic Party, and plaintiffs Duane Maletski, Sharon Lopez, and Frances M. Zick protects the voting rights of foreclosure victims. **The settlement acknowledges the existence of an illegal scheme by the Republicans to use mortgage foreclosure lists to deny foreclosure victims their right to vote.** This settlement has the force of law behind it and ensures that Republicans cannot disenfranchise families facing foreclosure.Go to emptywheel.firedoglake.com to read in its entirety.
Obama/Biden ‘08
By hillbilly ragger
October 20, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this
So Luckotroooool, you’ve got one right. I guess one might say that the long-overdue, piddling 4-cent-per-gallon excise tax on gasoline imposed in 1994 might’ve been a “middle class tax hike.”
The rest is the usual bullsh!t. (Inheritance taxes? you’re fecking kidding me!)
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:30 PM | Link to this
You know, as a matter of fact, KKKlinton cut taxes in 1999 so the lame-o internet creator would have a chance against Bushie.
How could he possibly do that if they were cut already, hmmmmm?
By getalife
October 20, 2008 8:32 PM | Link to this
“Fiscal conservatism has been on life support for quite some time. Bush/Paulson pulled the plug permanently today.”
Michelle Malkin
By getalife
October 20, 2008 8:35 PM | Link to this
Andy,
The top 1% silly.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:38 PM | Link to this
Uh-huh:
That bill, the largest tax increase in American history, raised income corporate, estate and gift taxes rectroactively to Jan. 1, 1993 — a date that fell 20 days before Clinton’s inauguration and four days before the 103rd Congress was sworn in.
Never doubt me, moron.
By G
October 20, 2008 8:38 PM | Link to this
McCain’s giving up on Colorado, but Palin campaigned there today.
I guess no one bothered to send her the memo … again.
Why does she lug her kids to these campaign hate-fests? Is this “family values”? Don’t any of them go to school?
Obama/Biden ‘08
By Taxpayer
October 20, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this
Andy, no one doubts you. You and your skills are well known to one and all. You, the slayer of blogs. You, most note-worthy paster of cuts. Andy, the self-proclaimed manager of the AJC — AJC/DNC Management, the recycler of all that is the “urinal”, the head urinal himself, the keeper of all that trickles down. In short, Andy, you’re full and proud of it, for some perverse reason. So, blog on, Andy, and may God bless Bush for leaving you, no, all of us, that right — then again, his term isn’t up yet. Now, there’s something for a true fear mongering type to latch onto.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 9:14 PM | Link to this
Taxpayer: I sense your frustration with Oblahma’s steady decline in the polls. I feel your pain. I did not have sex with your woman, Miss Lewinsky. I will cut your taxes. I will not balance the budget by gutting the military. I will work hard to make this the most honest and open government in history.
There, there, taxpayer, don’t cry, go now to kookman’s archives and drink freely from the stale koolaid, it will cheer you up.
Think happy thoughts, girlfriend.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
Girlieman: 4 month olds don’t attend school, although I’m sure Oblahma would like to enroll them in sex education, should he get the chance.
What’s up with your obsession with the children?
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this
PALM BEACH GARDENS — In divorce papers filed Monday, the wife of Democrat Congressman Tim Mahoney claims her husband “recently sold jointly owned real property” moved the proceeds to an account in his name and “dissipated funds from said account.”
Terry Ellen Mahoney also claims that in the last two years Tim Mahoney “dissipated marital assets” and asks for a full accounting of the transactions so that she can collect her share.
Tim Mahoney, who has admitted to “numerous” affairs, said he paid Patricia Allen of Hobe Sound, a former staffer with whom he was romantically linked, $121,000 out of his own pocket to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit Allen threatened.
“Change” you can count on!
By AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this
Investors brace for bottom!! Recession may have already begun in parts of U.S!!-Urinal/ Doom and Gloom
Uh, the little engine^^ that couldn’t-
Wall Street surges on credit market easing; Dow rises 400
NEW YORK (AP) - The economy’s health improved for the first time in five months in September as supplier deliveries and new orders strengthened, a private research group said Monday.
Gasoline under $3 for first time since February
Now there is doom and gloom……for the democrats.
bwa
By Taxpayer
October 20, 2008 9:48 PM | Link to this
Andy, I sense hostility. And after I gave you such a warm review — all fair and balanced and filled with historical accuracy, some words even nearly verbatim. Care to scan some archives and rebut, eh?
By "The Corporal"
October 20, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this
The Army Times (won’t see this in the New York Times) just released a poll on military voters.
It was 68% to 23% for McCain
Hummmmm …………..
Check it out ………
http://www.techimo.com/forum/debateimo-politics-religion-controversy/216907-army-times-poll-military-personnel-re-election.html
By "The Corporal"
October 20, 2008 10:12 PM | Link to this
Jay
You forgot some …………
1) The great emancipator/racist:
“Free them, and make them politically and socially our equals? My own feelings will not admit of this … we cannot then, make them equals.” (Lincoln’s first reply to Stephen Douglas, first debate, 4/21/1858.
2) The great revolutionary
:”Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up, and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable – a most sacred right – a right, which we hope and believe, is to liberate the world.”
“Nor,” said Lincoln, “is this right confined to cases in which the whole people of an existing government may choose to exercise it. Any portion of such people that can, may revolutionize, and make their own, of so much of the territory as they inhabit.” (The Real Lincoln, by Thomas J. DiLorenzo, Professor of Economics, Loyola College.)
3) The great orator of free speech:
“You will take possession by military force, of the printing establishments of the New York World and Journal of Commerce … and prohibit any further publication thereof … you are therefore commanded forthwith to arrest and imprison … the editors, proprietors and publishers of the aforesaid newspapers.”
(Ibid.)
I could go on and on with the great jurist and the great warrior, the great dictator, etc., etc. but I want to watch the football game.
By "The Corporal"
October 20, 2008 10:20 PM | Link to this
Hey AmVet:
Sink your teeth into this one ………
“If in the opinion of the People, the distribution or modificatio of the Constitutional powers be in any particular wrong, let it be corrected by an amendment in the way which the Constitution designates. But let there be no change by usurpation; for though this, in one instance, may be the instrument of good, it is the customary weapon by which free governments are destroyed.” George Washington
TRANSLATION:
If you make the Constitution say something that’s not there (even if you are doing it for good) your prostitute it and open it up for someone to do the reverse and you sure won’t like it then.
Comprendo?
By JAY BOOKMAN
October 20, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this
Hey Corporal, you forgot to mention this:
“The results of the Military Times 2008 Election Poll are not representative of the opinions of the military as a whole. The group surveyed is older, more senior in rank and less ethnically diverse than the overall armed services.”
It was a survey, not a scientific poll. It surveyed subscribers to the Military Times, not members of the military in general. In other words, as a scientific poll of the members of the military, it was not scientific, not a poll, and did not generally reach members of the military.
Other than that, you’re right.
By "The Corporal"
October 20, 2008 10:47 PM | Link to this
To Jay
1) And you think some of your polls are that scientific when more democrats are surveyed ?
2) Why did the democrats try to keep the military absentee ballots from being counted in Florida during the Bush/Glore debacle ?
3) But in our hearts (we know don’t we ………….
I’ll wait for the real military results after the election ….
Lunch at the Ritz Buckhead ?
We can even go on different days if you like but only one pays the bill ….
Deal ??
By AmVet
October 20, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this
Comprendo, Corporal.
But I still contend that the fake conservatives should keep their filthy hands off that sacred document…
By RW-(the original)
October 20, 2008 10:57 PM | Link to this
Maybe it’s another State Senator Barack Obama. You know, another one who would have worked closely enough with an unrepentant terrorist to get an advance look at his new book, and to write promotional material for its sales. One who partnered with Ayers on a multimillion-dollar school reform project that ended up a failure. One who owed Ayers after the unrepentant terrorist help launch his career in a fundraiser in the Ayers/Dohrn household. You know, there has to be at least a dozen Barack Obamas who fit that description!
On a more serious note, this wouldn’t be an issue if the Obama campaign would stop lying about the nature of his relationship with Ayers. They’ve continually fibbed about it when the public record is pretty clear that they formed a political alliance meant to boost Obama’s electoral career. Their inability to be honest about this relationship is what makes these lesser revelations more significant than they should be. A modest blurb on an obscure book would have no meaning at all absent the fact that Team Obama lied about it on two separate occasions
On the off chance this posts what’s up with Team Barry constantly lying about this relationship if we’re also supposed to believe that nobody cares about the relationship?
By "The Corporal"
October 20, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this
To Amvet
I agree (conservative or liberal) if the plan is to usurp it.
Amend it or keep your hands and personal philosophies off !
By the way: What branch, unit, etc. were you in. Just curious. No intent to subvert an answer.
By Frederick Douglass
October 20, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this
Go search where you will,roam through all the monarchies and despotisms of the old world, travel through South America, search out abuse and when you have found the last, lay your facts by the side of the everyday practices of this nation, and you will say with me that, for revolting barbarity and shameless hypocrisy, America reigns without a rival.
Frederick Douglass July 4, 1852
By TN Gelding
October 20, 2008 11:12 PM | Link to this
AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:08 PM
Yeah, Clinton raised the motor fuel tax and the price at the pump went down.
That’s what happens with sound fiscal policy.
His administration facilitated the dot.com boom. After all, Gore did invent the internet.
He also cut spending by $250 billion over 5 years.
By AmVet
October 20, 2008 11:25 PM | Link to this
Corporal, thanks for inquiring. And I completely believe your honorable intentions.
But sadly, there are some here without them. Some like Dusty, have said they doubted I ever served and have repeatedly questioned my patriotism. Simply because of my views.
Of course, she’s a loud-mouthed fool (like me I suppose!), but I’ll give them no more information to use against me.
But I still remember as if it was yesterday when I raised my right hand at that AFEES station in Denver and swore to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic and that I would bear true faith and allegiance to the same.
And I still try to live by that “code of honor” today.
Let me just say that I enlisted in 1972 just four months after my 17th birthday. (My parents had to sign the papers.) Viet Nam was still raging of course, and though I was not yet 18, I voted in the presidential election in November as I was considered active duty thought still in boot camp.
And knowing me as you do, you’ll not find it surprising that I did not vote for Nixon!
BTW, my only child, a son, also enlisted last year, so he’s followed in his dad’s footsteps by doing so in time of war.
And I am obviously very proud of him…
By TN Gelding
October 20, 2008 11:27 PM | Link to this
AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 8:08 PM
P.S. Depression over Bush winning contributed to the recession.
And some of the ones that liked having Bush in the WH didn’t like the process.
Federal tax revenue was over $2 trillion in 2000 and would have been at least that much in 2001 if not for the retroactive tax cuts.
By Swami Dave
October 20, 2008 11:28 PM | Link to this
Jay:
I believe that the supposed “Lincoln” quotes that have floated around the internet (and other publications prior to the internet) have been allegedly attributed to a minister of one of the Christian faiths a number of years ago.
Ms. Godzilla:
The only way that tax cuts for the “top 1%” could be socialism is if they were cut to the point that they no longer paid income taxes and they were being paid directly from the confiscated wealth of the “other 99%”. Largely, it is not socialism or “marxist” to allow people to keep what is theirs. The money earned by the “top 1%” does not belong to you or me.
However, we are not talking about “giving” money to the top 5%. The money is theirs; noone has to “give” it to them. We are highlighting the fallacy of a plan that would increase their income taxes to fund redistribution of their money to others. Logically, there can be no income tax “cuts” to those who already pay no income tax. That would be transfer of earnings - what people who understand the philosophy realize is marxist or socialism.
At minimum, I respect liberals who admit that they are socialists because they are honest. They do not attempt to spin or redefine reality to hide what they are and what they think.
Have a good evening. -Swami Dave
By TN Gelding
October 20, 2008 11:50 PM | Link to this
AJC/DNC Management
October 20, 2008 9:45 PM
Because it looks like Obama is in?
Surely you don’t think another stimulus package is a good thing?
The lower gas price will be stimulus enough.
I see you’ve put the plumber to rest. Better late than never.
By RW-(the original)
October 21, 2008 12:02 AM | Link to this
Gelding,
The plumber is your worst nightmare.
John McCain and an Army of Joes The real anger at McCain’s rallies.
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 12:38 AM | Link to this
RW-(the original)
October 21, 2008 12:02 AM
He was a fraud and a plant.
Obama will reduce his taxes and help him pay for health care he probably doesn’t have. Ditto for his boss.
Granted he used a poor choice of words with spreading the wealth. That’s why the plumber had to be discredited. It was McCain that made a big deal out of it. And of course, Fox news.
Anyway let’s wish him well and let him get on with his life. He seemed like a decent enough fellow.
It’s time to concentrate on the horrors of a filibuster proof Senate and attacking Colin Powell. At least until tomorrow.
By RW-(the original)
October 21, 2008 12:45 AM | Link to this
Gelding,
Once again you have chosen to discuss my comment without having the balls to read my link.
OOPS, sorry, I guess you already told us that with your screen name.
Now explain to me how Joe the Plumber was a plant? He was in his own front yard when Obama was “canvassing” that neighborhood. Exactly when did someone figure out that Obama was going to be going door to door in a Toledo neighborhood and get Joe to move there?
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 1:17 AM | Link to this
RW-(the original)
October 21, 2008 12:45 AM
I read the link right after I replied.
It was irrelevant. Same paranoid, misinformed folks. Worried they might have to pay another dollar or two in taxes as we run a $500 BILLION DEFICIT.
You’re right about the plant. I guess an ambush would be better. He knew he was coming and put forth a false premise. The company wasn’t making anywhere near $250K. He wss an apprentice not a plumber, and as I said he and his boss would be getting a tax cut.
That said, I don’t agree with the plan, as I’ve stated before. We all need to sacrifice and pay a little more and get spending under control.
It’s kind of hard to do that tho in a slowing economy.
By "The Corporal"
October 21, 2008 1:20 AM | Link to this
To Jay
How’s this for accuracy ……….
“A just released Army Times Magazine poll of U.S. military career officers, enlisted personnel and retirees who subscribe to their individual branch (Army, Navy, Marines & Air Force) Military Times magazines shows McCain leading Obama for Commander in Chief by a huge margin of 68% to 23%. I find it pathetic that the great majority of those who are so underpaid yet spend an entire career willing to give their lives in defense of this country are outvoted by those who stay safely at home.”
By the way, for all of you out there in civilian land the Marines led the other three branches 75% to 18% for McCain. Chesty Puller would be proud!
Ooo Rah and Semper Fi !
P.S. General Powell - are you listening ……..sir?
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 1:38 AM | Link to this
“The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 1:20 AM
You do know this ain’t the Corporal’s army?
I take it you supported Gore and Kerry?
Comander-in-Chief
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 1:43 AM | Link to this
The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 1:20 AM
Underpaid?
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 1:53 AM | Link to this
“The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 1:20 AM
Or well compensated?
When I was discharged in 1963 I was making less than half of what a similar civilian job paid. I had been provided housing (barracks) food and medical care, however.
By "The Corporal"
October 21, 2008 2:13 AM | Link to this
To TN Gelding
You’re skirting the main issue. You didn’t address the percentages ……..
By "The Corporal"
October 21, 2008 2:23 AM | Link to this
P.S. to TN Gelding
You know I didn’t vote for those two and neither did the great percentage of military personnel.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 21, 2008 6:10 AM | Link to this
Look at the Urinal/DNC trying to distract from Biden’s game changing gaffe:
Next leader faces first terrorism transition- Urinal/DNC
Does anybody know what the hell this even means?
Whatever, all that matters is that it kinda sounds like something the dimwits that read the AJC heard yesterday, and whew, they thought O’Biden said we were going to get invaded because Oblahma is naive.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 21, 2008 6:13 AM | Link to this
Oh yeah, David Brooks is the second coming of Barry Goldwater-
Obama proves he’s more than just a celebrity fad- Brooks, Urinal/DNC
By AJC/DNC Management
October 21, 2008 6:27 AM | Link to this
CHARLEROI, Pa. — U.S. Rep. John Murtha is calling many of the people who put him in office “rednecks.”
The news comes one week after Murtha claimed the area is racist, then apologized for that comment.
In explaining his comments about racism, Murtha told WTAE it’s difficult for many in the area to change. Murtha said that just five to 10 years ago the entire area was “redneck.”
Murtha just “loves” his country, don’t he?
By AJC/DNC Management
October 21, 2008 6:38 AM | Link to this
“Senator Barack Obama’s newest claim (also made in a television ad) that Senator John McCain’s health care plan will cut $882 billion in Medicare health care benefits for seniors, has to rank among the biggest whoppers of the whole campaign.” CBS goes on to say, “It’s a poorly calculated estimate drawn from a suspect report, and the disputed figures in question don’t represent benefit cuts.”
You mean Oblahma lied?
Or is he naive?
By AJC/DNC Management
October 21, 2008 6:44 AM | Link to this
“We don’t want a president who invites testing from the world at a time when our economy is in crisis and Americans are already fighting in two wars,” McCain, a 72-year-old Vietnam War veteran, told a crowd Monday in Belton, Mo.
“What is more troubling is that Sen. Biden told their campaign donors that when that crisis hits, they would have to stand with them, because it wouldn’t be apparent Sen. Obama would have the right response,” added the Republican nominee, who was spending Tuesday in Pennsylvania, another battleground. “Forget apparent. Sen. Obama won’t have the right response, and we know that because we’ve seen the wrong response from him over and over during this campaign.”
By GodHatesTrash
October 21, 2008 6:50 AM | Link to this
Nothing left of the GOP except kkkooks, kkkrazies, retards and racists.
Poor Abe.
By AJC/DNC Management
October 21, 2008 7:14 AM | Link to this
Barney Frank: Plenty of rich people that we can tax
There needs to be an immediate increase in government spending.
What else do you need to know?
By Bud Wiser
October 21, 2008 7:17 AM | Link to this
GHT - another mentally deficient idiot that belongs in a rubber room, but all of the ‘mental health’ facilities are currently overflowing with fellow mental midgets and Democrats.
And Jay, since you got on my case last week for labeling most all Democrats as racists because of their apparent mind-control (oxymoron intended) techniques over certain minority groups, perhaps a little note to the idiot known as GHT would be in order.
And GHT, your rock is missing you …. go crawl back under it.
By E
October 21, 2008 7:50 AM | Link to this
Air America radio has got it going on this morning. They’re all over this idiot Rep. Bachmann.
RE: Weekend statements made by Biden: I’d like to point out that in Shrub’s first 8 months he was presented with a crisis with international implications just as Clinton was in his first month, there is a definite pattern of it - and Biden was speaking preemptively to that worry.
I know who I want in charge, and that’s Obama.
I can’t imagine the erratic, running around like a chicken with its head cut off, McDiscombobulated having to deal with a crisis. Or Sarah, Queen of the Ignorant. “Shudder!”
Obama/Biden ‘08
By Mrs. Godzilla
October 21, 2008 8:15 AM | Link to this
Anticipating a crisis!!
What a concept!!
I’m with the prepared duo -
Obama/Biden 08.
By Eric1
October 21, 2008 8:55 AM | Link to this
President Lincoln would not be a republican in today’s world.
By "The Corporal"
October 21, 2008 8:56 AM | Link to this
To TN Gelding
Thanks for your service. My best friend in bootcamp and I are on opposite ends of the spectrum ……….. :o)
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this
“The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 2:13 AM
The percentages mean nothing.
They would if a scientific poll was taken, but it would probably have a larger than normal margin of error.
I would suspect the officers support Obama and the grunts support McCain.
But then 90% of them thought they were in Iraq because of Saddam’s involvement in 9/11, so you’ve got to wonder what kind of information and indoctrination they’re getting.
Like I said this is not the Corporal’s army. A lot has changed, and I’m not sure for the better. War was never intended for family men; too many mouths left to feed and hearts broken. Sacrifice the single, young and uneducated to the war gods. Don’t want to waste money on educating someone that will end up in an early grave
We need those experienced, highly skilled technicians to fill civilian jobs, and we can’t afford their higher salaries and the tremendous increase in the number of dependents. Less than 20% (16%?) used to be marrried men, now it is over 50%. The health care costs alone are prohibitive. I remember sick call wasn’t a very pleasant experience during my time of duty.
Yeah, you guessed it, USAF 1959-1963.
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this
“The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 8:56 AM
My best service buddy is voting for McCain.
Even tho he agrees with Obama more on the issues. I’m still working on him tho.
Thanks for your service as well.
By "The Corporal"
October 21, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this
To TN Gelding
Check out the Army Times. The officers and enlisted careerists are virtually the same.
Yeah, you guessed it.
Marine Corps, infantry, 1967-68.
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this
“The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 11:18 AM
I think the USMC is the only branch that still has more singles than marrieds.
You can understand why. They would have either killed me or sent me home to mommy after rhe first week. Cogratulations on having the right stuff.
By TN Gelding
October 21, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this
“The Corporal”
October 21, 2008 11:18 AM
*If only it were true.
Similarly, the character question plays to McCain’s strength, Feaver said. His dramatic experience as a POW is embodied in his campaign slogan, “Country First,” and carries a particular resonance in the military community, as service members themselves indicated.
Commander-in-Chief?