Jay Bookman

By Too Late, Baby

July 23, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this

The price of gasoline is still lower than it was in 1974.

The argument about why the price of gas is still lower than it was in 1974 is mindless, Jay.

How many times are you going to say, the liberals blame the conservatives, and the conservatives blame the liberals?

That’s not a topic. That’s a cliche. There are 300 million Americans. There are 300 million reasons why the price of gas is lower than it was in 1974.

Now what are we supposed to blog all day? “Duh, it’s China’s demand for gasoline cause they’re driving more, and India too, and the war in Iraq creates the uncertainty that motivates speculative fears, and if only we’d drill offshore, and find out what the captain of the exxon valdeze is drinking and buy a case of it for all our tanker captains, cause the more we spill the more liberals can regulate business and maybe evern nationalize oil, and we need 100mpg cars, and we need to ride public transportation more, and use bicycles and build more roads and bike lanes and move closer to where we work and develop alternate energies and turn off our lights and set our thermostats and speed limits lower or higher or whatever .”

Jay, if the experts that have appeared at all the hearing for the last fifty years are paid by the oil companies, then what do you expect them to say? Ditto the experts for anti-oil solutions. They’re paid by the anti-oil solution industry.

There’s no room for debate. It’s an exercise in moronium. We may as well, just post one of two words. “To” and “Not”

To.

Not.

to.

Not.

To.

Not.

to.

not.

to.

not.

to.

not.

See? that’s all you’re going to get from the uber-rocket scientists on this blog about this subject.

Let me pick the topic. Oh! I’ve got a good one, Jay. Oh, let me! Let me pick it. I can pick a topic! Let me!! Oh!

By Goldie

July 23, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this

Conservation, conservation — always the answer! We need to be aggressively developing electric vehicles and all of its support systems here in America, right now!

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 9:44 AM | Link to this

I heard a statistic the other day, that a majority of Americans are in favor of drilling.

I wonder how many think that drilling will automatically reduce the price of gas? Or as Jay has mentioned before, that we will receive our “hometown discount?”

I also wonder how many of these in favor of drilling haven’t given the topic one thought until a couple months ago?

Not trying to say members of one party or another are like this, because there is plenty amongst all, but I swear, I’m beginning to believe that most people really are like sheep.

BTW Jay, I’ve been using the phrase “hometown discount” when talking about this among friends, I like that phase, but don’t worry, I give you credit.

Another BTW, I saw a really good program on the National Geographic Channel this weekend. It was called “Rare Earth,” basic premise: the Earth will take care of itself, it’s not the Earth we should be concerned with, but the continued existence of humanity. Good show.

By TW

July 23, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this

The Enron loophole basically allows insider trading.

Closing the loophole would result in a near immediate 25% cut in the cost of gasoline.

C’mon, Jay…

By getalife "whiners"

July 23, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this

Are you saying warmongering on Iran has not incresed the price of oil?

Supply and demand caused oil to hit 80 or 90.

The rest is speculation Jay.

By Dennis

July 23, 2008 10:24 AM | Link to this

You forget, or ignore, that our Democratic Congress initally chose to summoned the oil industry to Washington, two or three times, and use them as whipping boys. Most of the public did not buy into this either time.

As I recall it was after those attempts failed that they switched to blaming speculation.

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

There are numerous “factors” that have a “lasting” impact on the price of oil. As far as speculators are concerned, they can have a short-term impact on prices however the fundamentals determine the underlying “value” associated with the commodity. Speculators typically try to make a quick buck by getting out ahead of the crowd and basically gambling on future outcomes. They may run up prices for oil when a hurricane approaches and if it hits and takes out a major supply line fed by numerous off-shore rigs, then they collect on their bet. Overall though, these speculators are more akin to the constant whining that Mr. Dolby worked so hard to eliminate for the sake of the high-fidelity purist that resides in us all. Of course, that’s just my opinion.

By Paul

July 23, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this

Hey Bosch,

Glad you found your way back!

Battlestar Galactica - August 30! Yes!

By AJC/DNC Management

July 23, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

Even under optimistic assumptions, oil drilling off the U.S. coast will not produce nearly enough additional supply to move the world oil price, blah, blah, blah-kookman, Urinal

Yeah, especially when we don’t do it.

Geez.

By ByteMe

July 23, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

@Bosch: if you think about the people directly affected by an offshore drilling accident and compare that number to the total number of people in the country, you can see how “a majority” would favor drilling… just not in their own backyard. Re-phrase the question: “Would you be ok if we drilled within a block of your pretty suburban home?” and see if the numbers don’t change a bit. It’s like the poll for “do you approve of the job congress is doing?” Most people say “NO”, but if you ask the next logical question: “Do you approve of the job your congressional representatives are doing?” most will say “YES” (how would 94%+ get re-elected each cycle otherwise?).

The people most into building a wall with Mexico are states that don’t border Mexico. Same thing. It’s easy to want if it doesn’t directly affect your backyard.

And @Too Late: I want to know where I can get to be paid by the anti-oil groups! Oh, wait, I have to be an expert in something??

By ByteMe

July 23, 2008 10:51 AM | Link to this

Poor @AJC/DNC-M: Do you really dispise facts that don’t conform to your pre-existing opinion? Well, that’s ok, there’s always the hot anchor-babes on FOX News Channel for you.

By RealityKing

July 23, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this

Supply is up, demand is down..

What’s happening to the oil prices Jay??

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this

Paul,

How do you know? Where’d you find that (about BSG)?

OMG! How exciting.

I’m glad I found my way back too, I was beginning to wonder. I’ve been “spring cleaning” and wow, the stuff that one family can collect is amazing. The oldest is going away to college, so we’ve been changing rooms around — moving inside one’s home is worse than just moving.

Anyway, I digress.

RE: my statement earlier, it amazes me how the average American can give a rat’s a@@ about things (drilling) until it starts to affect them dramatically different - then - everyone panics, and everyone thinks “Well, by God, we need some more oil….AND RIGHT NOW DAMMIT!” What they don’t understand is what is done is done, and it’s kind of too late for that, or rather, they’re going to have to wait a few year.

They think Immediate Oil = Lower prices

And that it’s going to happen next week.

THEN, in the meantime, everyone points fingers, blames this person, blames that person, hell, McCain has blamed the ENTIRE thing on Obama, now isn’t that nice.

See why I think people are getting more and more like sheep.

On a side note - big storm hit my neighborhood last night - my neighborhood is made up of five houses in a row, but to make a long story short - big tree blew over, snapped utility pole in half, sparks flew everywhere, big transformer and electricty lines lying in street, REAL EXCITEMENT!

We spent the evening watching the GA Power guys clean up the mess and playing poker by candlelight. Those guys are amazing. They worked until 1:30 a.m. until my power came back on.

You should have seen us Bosches outside watching everything like big dorks. But it was cool.

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this

I think BP announced that they finally brought Thunder Horse on line in the Gulf in June. I thinks it’s maximum capacity is something like 250,000 bpd but I’d have to double check that. So, all these folks that have been anxiously awaiting that Gulf of Mexico oil, line up and place your orders. While you are at it, ask BP, Exxon, and Chevron to hurry it up and build a few hundred more Thunder Horses. Just do a better job with the welds on that plumbing next time. If the speculators catch wind of that sort of thing, there’s just no telling what kind of damage they’ll do to the oil market.

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this

ByteMe,

Yes, I agree. Like in the cowboy movies, “WHOAAAAA, Nelly, wait just a cotton pickin’ minute here.”

By Abomi Nation

July 23, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this

Oil prices have fallen today in response to a column written by Jay Bookman. Mr. Bookman’s column appearing in his Atlanta Journal Constitution blog, startled the oil market as trading began Wednesday morning. “We’ve seen an immediate reaction,” said one stunned trader. Oil has dropped almost $2.00 this morning, Jay really nailed it.”

Good job Jay!!

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this

It may be too late to mention this, but I think the conversation flows better if you say something like,

OSUR

ONO - UR

ONO - I - NOT

OSIR

It’s got more Bugs Bunny appeal.

By MorningStar

July 23, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this

Lord ‘a Mercy, what a life some of y’all seem to have. Blogging from late PM to REALLY EARLY A.M. To each his own! As I’ve said to some trolls around here, “It’s a free country,” and “Ain’t free speech wonderful?”

Look at Ole Jimmah’s 1977 speech, and you’ll see the problem. Get over it and get on with doing something!!! As much as ‘certain people’ do not and will never admit, Ole Jimmah was right on target. Oh! and lest I forget, Cynthia Tucker has a great article regarding the ‘Ole Jimmah’ recommendations! This was a VERY good article, Ms. Tucker. Please keep up the good work. You too Luckovich!!!!

Can you imagine the publicity Ronald Reagan would get if he’d made that 1977 speech?

Have a great day in ‘Neverland or Wonderland, y’all’

Ain’t free speech wonderful???

By jhimmi

July 23, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this

The ‘majority’ also don’t want windmills, solar panels, nuclear power plants, or geothermal pumps in their backyard. The alternative is the complete destruction of the American economy.

There has to be comprehensive plan that includes intelligently accessing domestic oil and natural gas, subsidizing or somehow encouraging solar, wind, and geothermal infrastructure, and expediting the process of approving new nuclear power plants. Most agree that oil and gas are going to run out, or at least become prohibitively expensive, at some point in the not too distant future - if that’s true, why the resistance? If additional drilling had been allowed 7 years ago, there would be oil coming online right now- many times over what Dems are advocating releasing from the Strategic Reserve.

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this

With oil prices dropping like a rock, the bigger issues, Mr. Bookman, are along the lines of:

• Will Waggoner now introduce the HumDinger, a Hummer powered by one V-12 gas hog for each of its six wheels,

• Will the public start scarfing up those Toyota Tundra deals as though they were the latest i-phone craze,

• Will the oil companies be called back to the Hill for a public thank you from Congress for heeding their warnings and dropping oil prices,

• Will Obama put out a video wagging his finger at McCain and saying I told you so, you senile old coot,

The saga will continue, be it on time or just too late.

By Paul

July 23, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this

Bosch

I’d recorded a Stargate episode and during a commercial there was a single BSG frame that came up that said “after the Olympics.”

But I hope I haven’t been hosed on this - as with the season “finale.” I went to the scifi website schedule for 30 Aug - nothing. Went to the BSG site - just says “coming soon.” Past info was still wait for January. Geez, it’s easier trying to figure out what Obama really said!

By Mike Hussein Smith

July 23, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

1-Wendy (Mrs. Phil) Gramm used to run the Commodity Futures Trading Commission so maybe its report is just more “nation of whiners” junk.

2-Let’s nationalize the oil in ANWR and the Gulf so we can make sure it goes where we want it to: us. That way we don’t have to pay $50M a year to a ceo, plus we can get pushy with it like Chavez.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this

So it basically comes down to supply and demand eh? I wonder who it is that’s been saying that all along?

ByteMe,

It looks like people are being affected a lot more by not getting the oil out before it just seeps up onto the beach

By @@

July 23, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this

I wholeheartedly agree with you Jay. Surprised?

For all their hooplah over the last 35, 40 years what have the environmentalists provided? At least the oil companies were fueling our industry…..giving us what we wanted and needed. The environmentalists were fueling a debate to drive the Democratic Party who repeatedly failed to turn the key in their ignition.

Progress has been made. More Republicans are in agreement to join the global commuters, albeit more in the interest of national security - independence from foreign oil.

INDEPENDENCE……there’s a word that conservatives can rally behind.

The majority of Americans want to drill, pursue alternatives, produce more fuel-efficient vehicles. Our representatives in Washington should heed our call….. BUT, do you know how much of what we produce and market is derived from a petroleum base?

It boggles the mind Jay.

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this

The problem with this blog is that the campaign has hit the summer doldrums. We’ve convinced each other that neither candidate is fit to run a lemonade stand. I am personally sure that McCain wears a burka and attended a Madrass and Obama confessed to war crimes in Korea, and ran an al queda training camp in Peoria. This is all Wooten and Bookman’s fault. They’re the ones who started these lies.

The problem is that there’s nothing else to say until the conventions and then the debates.

The VEEP choices will be anitclimatic. It’s hillary and a quayle clone. (a nobody anybody’s ever heard of)

The only topic not exhausted is why we will switch from the bible to the koran for Obama’s swearing in ceremony.

The total abandonment of the rules of debate by both sides this year means that no discussion can advance. Look at Bookman’s piece today, I mean honestly. If he doesn’t know why, with all the resources he has at his disposal, then what is he asking us for? We dont know. Gas is too expensive. So what? So are the wings at hooters, but you dont see me slowing down there, now, do you?

The low point of journalism history was reached by CNN when they were bragging about their Emmy nomination for their coverage of the Bhutto assassination. We witnessed the most portentous event in recent world history and a talking head was joyously spouting her own network’s accolades for the coverage. Disgraceful.

The Bhutto hit worries me. There’s so much happening behind the scenes that Cheney is still fooling with. What deal was made? Look what’s happening now. Now, that Bhutto’s memory is fading, look at Pakistan. Events themselves tell you why and how Bhutto was waxed. What’s going on? Cross Border raids by both sides. A slow release of the official constraint on insurgents and rebels and the insidious tip of the terrorist’s iceberg positioning itself across the Pakistani Ship of State which itself is a military construct. In pakistan, if you dont achieve power by a military coup, you dont achieve power. (or they wax you, baby)

What are we doing there? We should have gone in and destroyed al queda in 2002. Afghanistan. Instead we find out that Cheney paid tribal leaders to lead our offensive campaign and act as the salient in our tactical maneuvers? WTF? Our army relied on some mysterious militia as part of their attack plans?

No, we’ve been had by Cheney again and again and again. Cheney is at the CENTER of all this. Iraq, Pakistan, and Afghanistan.

The Saudis, we know, have Cheney by the short hairs. No wait, I mean the long hairs, no, which length hair is the balls? vs the butt? Hold on, let me look, RIGHT!

The long hairs. (I’m so lonely)

When our future selves read the declassified information that Cheney has sealed up till 2050, and we find out what really is happening now, then people will find me in the archives and say, “there was a troll who knew everything and screamed bloody murder, but Wooten and Bookman conspired to shut him up because they were jealous p-holes, no, we mean a-holes.”

Is it time for lunch yet? Lunch. I love lunch the most of all. I love to say lunch. I love to hear the word lunch. I love to remember lunches from all points of my memory. I love to think about tomorrow’s lunch while I eat today’s lunch.

Without Lunch, I’d be a real mess.

LUNCH!

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this

Paul,

I went to the scifi website too and didn’t see anything either.

I’ll be back later.

By MorningStar

July 23, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this

By jhimmi July 23, 2008 11:13 AM The ‘majority’ also don’t want windmills, solar panels, nuclear power plants, or geothermal pumps in their backyard. The alternative is the complete destruction of the American economy.

Yep, and the complete destruction of the American economy is well underway! Guess who moved solar panels from the White House after the Carter administration?

So we drill our little selves into oblivian? Guess what? Not enough. Drill, drill, drill!!! Matters not to me, but guess what? It will not be enough, and it will be important to your children and grandchildren! Wha’ever. As my husband tells me frequently, those from age 20 to late 30’s will be making the decisions that affect the country. I’m a bit (but not much) older than that.

We need alternative sources! Go back and look at “THE SPEECH!” You and others!

Quit ‘whining’ and start ‘doing!’

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

Paul,

There’s a site called Zap2It that’s a good place to look for info on upcoming shows. It doesn’t seem to have any help for you and Bosch right now though.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Look at what the WaPo has to say about Obambi’s grand adventure.

Yet Mr. Obama’s account of his strategic vision remains eccentric. He insists that Afghanistan is “the central front” for the United States, along with the border areas of Pakistan. But there are no known al-Qaeda bases in Afghanistan, and any additional U.S. forces sent there would not be able to operate in the Pakistani territories where Osama bin Laden is headquartered. While the United States has an interest in preventing the resurgence of the Afghan Taliban, the country’s strategic importance pales beside that of Iraq, which lies at the geopolitical center of the Middle East and contains some of the world’s largest oil reserves. If Mr. Obama’s antiwar stance has blinded him to those realities, that could prove far more debilitating to him as president than any particular timetable.

By Mike Hussein Smith

July 23, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this

I think too late baby nailed things from the git-go.

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this

Morningstar. Thank you for illustrating the point I’ve been making about the folks that blog here.

By AJC/DNC Management

July 23, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this

By ByteMe July 23, 2008 10:51 AM Poor @AJC/DNC-M: Do you really dispise facts that don’t conform to your pre-existing opinion? Well, that’s ok, there’s always the hot anchor-babes on FOX News Channel for you.

I haven’t watched Fox “News” since the invasion of Iraq in March 2003.

What other mindless responses do you have for my brilliant and so very obvious reasoning?

You gonna scream at me about Rushannity?

Moron.

And the only facts that “conform” to my opinion is the fact that gasoline is over four bucks a gallon, which is bad for the poor and needy but will be very, very good for Republicans here before long.

Keep throwing those tantrums, sycophant.

By CJ

July 23, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this

Commodity Futures Trading Commission: “Current oil prices and the increase in oil prices between January 2003 and June 2008 are largely due to fundamental supply and demand factors…”

The CEO’s of the all the major airlines and trucking companies disagree with the CFTC’s conclusion. This group, not one that would ordinarily default to “instinctive Democratic narratives”, strongly asserts that the increases in the price of oil have dramatically outpaced increases in worldwide demand (worldwide demand would have had to quadruple in the last seven years to justify today’s prices), and that we can see immediate relief at the pump if we crack down on speculators. In fact, according to Public Citizen, nobody knows for sure because of the lack of transparency in the market.

The Senate is about to take up a bill to reign in the kind of speculation that could lead to an oil bubble, if it hasn’t already. We should support that effort.

In the meantime, whether gasoline prices drop or not, we should take this lemon and turn it into lemonade by insisting that our representatives at all levels of government take steps to wean us off of all fossil fuels…post-haste.

By MorningStar

July 23, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this

By Hear the Herd July 23, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this Morningstar. Thank you for illustrating the point I’ve been making about the folks that blog here.

Herd, notice, complete silence regarding certain ‘issues.’ Guess we’ll have to wait and see. I’m sure great thoughts and analytical assumptions will be forthcoming……

By JAY BOOKMAN

July 23, 2008 12:09 PM | Link to this

To Michael Hussein Smith and Too Late Baby:

The only problem is, Baby is very much incorrect.

According to the U.S. Energy Information Administration, gasoline prices in 1974 peaked in July at 55.8 cents a gallon. That’s about $2.60 in 2008 dollars.

You can’t buy gasoline for $2.60 today. The latest EIA figures put the national average at $4.12 a gallon. So gasoline is MUCH more expensive today than in 1974.

Furthermore, everyone understood that high prices in ‘74 were probably temporary, a result of the Arab-Israeli war, etc. Today they’re expected to stay high from here on out, even if they do drop a bit from current stratospheric levels.

By AJC/DNC Management

July 23, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this

Limbaugh is going to destroy Lord High Dimwit, make no mistake about it.

You cannot sit in a press conference and babble and grunt incoherently for 7 and a half minutes without consequence.

It is over with.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 12:16 PM | Link to this

AJC/DNC-M,

Did you see Obambi’s presser today? He had someone else call on the reporters so that it wouldn’t look like he was the one selecting them, but the guy that was picking them had an index card for each one he called on. Obviously the questions were submitted in advance and screened, yet he still babbled on incoherently anyway. I guess they didn’t dare put his answers on a teleprompter for fear that would finally be too much for the media to cover up.

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this

I’m all for weaning although a little whining is to be expected. I don’t like weiners but Ballpark hotdogs are OK for a roasting as long as it’s over an open fire made with real oak and a little mesquite thrown in for good measure. None of that liquefied petroleum or methane though. It leaves a bad after-taste — like burnt brontosaurus or something. Yuk.

By AJC/DNC Management

July 23, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this

RW: Senile is looking better every day, isn’t it?

Lord High Dimwit the sock puppet.

By GodHatesTrash

July 23, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this

A huge % of the increase in the price of oil has to do with the devalued dollar. Compared to the Euro, the dollar is around 3/5ths of what it was in 2004 when the Euro was introduced.

At least 35 to 40% of the price rise of oil has to do with the Bush dollar collapsing. No one wants to get stuck holding our worthless debt instruments.

From CNN Money:

Interest rates affect the dollar, and the Fed’s campaign of rate cuts, which began in September, has sent the greenback into a protracted decline against the euro. Many analysts believe this slide is a big part of the reason oil prices have nearly doubled over the past year.

By Bud Wiser

July 23, 2008 12:29 PM | Link to this

Obama’s Oil Spill

Obama says he doesn’t take money from oil companies. We say that’s a little too slick.

Summary

In a new ad, Obama says, “I don’t take money from oil companies.”

Technically, that’s true, since a law that has been on the books for more than a century prohibits corporations from giving money directly to any federal candidate. But that doesn’t distinguish Obama from his rivals in the race.

We find the statement misleading:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/obamasoilspill.html

So now who cares who is to blame for the mess we are in? Fact is, nobody in political power has taken one dam step toward fixing anything, Republican or Democrat. Makes you wonder who is in the pocket of whom? This makes it look like Obama has a vested interest in keeping the drilling option quiet.

Barry Hussein Obami appears to like his coffee sweet.

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 12:41 PM | Link to this

Why do people want to take bits and pieces of information and draw some irrational conclusions. The “laws” of supply and demand hold even if speculators throw in blips or manipulators screw up the works. If OPEC shuts down production, they will impact the supply side and more people will fight over less product. If more people use just a little less oil, then that affects the demand side and prices drop. Speculators can influence the demand side but if their bets are wrong, they will be short-lived effects. China has just cut back big time on oil consumption by implementing their odd-even driving and the US drivers are cutting back at the same time. That’s enough to make a little difference in oil prices. Then, there’s the dollar. Oil is priced in dollars. A weak dollar means more are needed to buy the same amount of oil. A weak dollar and low yield in treasuries also makes investors look for better returns. They’ll chase higher returns in commodities if there’s a buck to be made and that drives up oil prices as a result of this new demand. That investor demand can also dry up as soon as a better deal comes along. Of course, that just my opinion.

By getalife "whiners"

July 23, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this

Brown just gave a good speech on the Senate floor for the speculation legislation.

Of course, the WH and gop position for big oil welfare and drill drill drill is the easy way out as usual.

But Washington is broken and fixing a complex problem is a thing of the past in that corrupt body.

By Midori

July 23, 2008 12:47 PM | Link to this

looks like the NYT published McCain’s Op Ed after all

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 12:49 PM | Link to this

How’d the coffee meeting club go?

bring it on.

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 12:50 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the link RW.

By Mike Hussein Smith

July 23, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this

Jay, my reference to too late baby being right had nothing to do with the price of oil, butrather, his belief that this blog would generate the same old, same old back and forth. I seriously doubted what he said about oil prices, but 11:19 a.m. was just oo early in the morning for me to get serious about rebutting that. (And nobody gets to call me Michael but my Mama.)

By GodHatesTrash

July 23, 2008 12:55 PM | Link to this

McBushie has raised about 4 times as much oil industry $$ as Obama.

Obama has raised about $300M, the $220K you found is 7/100ths of 1% = .0007. McCain has raised less than $100M, about 1% from oil.

Nice try, little whiny butt - tell your mommy to give you a spanking for telling lies again.

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

I paid 88 cents for gas in 1973 in detroit. You do the math.

Here’s a question for Jay: Why aren’t our roads riveted with rubber? Where does all the rubber go that comes off our tires as we drive?

They did a study years ago and concluded that they didn’t know. They found some trace metals on the side of the roads from the tires but other than that, I think they claimed it eviscerates into the air and we breath it. Huh?

Where does the rubber go?

By hillbilly ragger

July 23, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

Bud @ 12.29, let’s get this straight—because individuals who happen to work within an industry manage to contribute what amounts to… getting out the calculator… a massive four tenths of one percent of his $52,000,000 June contribution, the guy’s on the take?

By Mike Hussein Smith

July 23, 2008 12:58 PM | Link to this

And it’s still too early for me to tell the difference between 11:19 and 11:49, so I think I’ll go play Zuma for a while.

By Bud Wiser

July 23, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this

Midori, you are a tasteless, classless piece of garbage to denigrate one of our veterans (even if he is running for President) with your hollow trash. Your rock is calling. Go climb back under it.

Tool.

By GodHatesTrash

July 23, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this

Funny Midori.

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 23, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this

Republican Presidential candidate John McCain is relying on the projections of oil company executives to push his coastal drilling plan that would enrich those same executives — who by the way aren’t already exploiting every opportunity they have to drill where they’re already allowed to.

“The oil executives say within a couple years we could be seeing results from it. So why not do it,” McCain said in Rochester, NH. “We need to do it.”

more here

ANd the oil and gas chart from open secrets is here

thats a great website…look around for their grading of candidates on disclosure…

By hillbilly ragger

July 23, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this

GHT @ 12.55, great minds and all that.

Although by your reckonining McCain’s oil money is a piddling percentage as well.

And once again, we get sucked into the right-wing trolls’ distraction, avoiding the topic Jay’s presented.

Obviously, both parties tend to oversimplify the solutions to a problem that’s going to involve some serious economic disruption to really solve.

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 1:22 PM | Link to this

Jay is just being nasty and disagreeable for some reason. Could it be that I’ve crossed paths with him before? He’s very strict with personal grudge details concerning the issues.

I mean, 1974 vs 1973. he knows that for as long as gas has been at 4 bucks today it was a 4.50 in 1973. Six months. or so.

And his contention that the futures speculation is less unpredictable now vs then, (a really telling slip), proves that he’s taken my teasing personally. I wonder if Jay was part of the yahoo glw message board fiasco.

Jay, I apologize if I’ve offended you. I’m really astonished at your effrontery on this blog. I apologize for my blogging short comings. Wooten took a couple of swings at me after a while too.

Nobody ever likes me. I’m going to go eat some worms.

By Wyld Byll Hyltnyr

July 23, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this

Jay - what say you break off from the Obamalamadingdong party line just long enough to use the bully pulpit provided by your position for something useful to society - why don’t you, on behalf of the AJC, write an editorial asking congress to reinstate the hybrid tax credit for all lines - now would be a great time to make these vehicles available to more people - thx

ps - I have changed the spelling of my screen name in honor of that Jax gym coach, Mr. Leonard Skinner.

By Taxpayer

July 23, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

Where was that couple from that made the news for letting one of the oil companies drill in their “back yard”? South Dakota or somewhere. Of course, their back yards are little bigger than most people think of. With oil at $140, the oil companies were happy to drill a few miles down to get that oil and the land owners became millionaires overnight as well. If there was oil on my land, I’d lease it for the right price and just move. I might even move next door to some rich oil company executive if I made enough money.

By Bud Wiser

July 23, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

• Obama has accepted more than $213,000 from individuals who work for companies in the oil and gas industry, and their spouses. * Two of Obama’s bundlers are top executives at oil companies and are listed on his Web site as raising between $50,000 and $100,000 for the presidential hopeful.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/obamasoilspill.html

• Obama has accepted more than $213,000 from individuals who work for companies in the oil and gas industry, and their spouses. * Two of Obama’s bundlers are top executives at oil companies and are listed on his Web site as raising between $50,000 and $100,000 for the presidential hopeful.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/obamasoilspill.html

Blind goose stepping idiots like the Dimmokrauts never let facts get in the way of their truth. Their boy is on the take as deep as any Washington politician.

By Midori

July 23, 2008 1:25 PM | Link to this

Bud Wiser,

um, why don’t I meet you there?

By Paul

July 23, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this

RW-(the original)

Thanks for the link. I’ve got it in “Favorites” now.

I’m regularly amazed at what reporters don’t ask Sen Obama. Take Afghanistan. Sure, he’s mirroring Spkr Pelosi’s and Sen Reid’s “it’s the most important place” mantra. Question ought to be “Why?” We hear lots of assertions, few explanations.

I’m waiting to see if the Afghanistan question for Sen (Pres) Obama follows the Iraq questioning for Pres Bush. First off, Obama wants more troops in Afg. Lots more. I think that’s called a ‘surge.’ Is he just flowing more troops in, or does he have a change in strategy? If we have troops there now, and the Taliban is growing stronger, isn’t he just pursuing a failed strategy?

Then there’s the matter of measures of progress. He has 18 for Iraq. How many for Afg? What political progress does the central gov’t need to make? What’s his timetable for getting troops out of Afg? How will he define ‘success’ or who can tell us what it means to ‘win’ in Afg?

The future is so obvious it isn’t even a strain. Time to get the teleprompter loaded -

By GodHatesTrash

July 23, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this

Butt, I know it’s hard for someone like you that’s probably never had more than $100 in your wallet to comprehend, but $220K compared to $300+M is very very small.

That Georgia GED is light on math concepts, I guess.

Now tell your Mom you’ve been a bad boy playing on the ‘puter again, and go take your nap!

By Midori

July 23, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this

another for Bud Wiser’s viewing pleasure

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 23, 2008 1:34 PM | Link to this

Politico is reporting that Novak ran down a pedestrian (who was in the crosswalk and had the right of way) and then took off, only to be chased down by a cyclist. His bright, shiny Corvette was blockaded by the bicyclist until the cops showed up.

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 1:35 PM | Link to this

I liked Buttgeyser’s bit about the rock calling.

“A rock called. It want’s it’s creature back under it”.

No, this is a tough one. Your rock called. It wants it’s insect back.

No, wow, maybe there’s nothing there after all like most of slutsleezer’s material.

The rock called, it wants it’s worm back.

nah, gutbuster’s a zero sum nothing.

glenn, go soak your head.

By Midori

July 23, 2008 1:36 PM | Link to this

it’s gonna be mighty crowded under that rock

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this

Paul@1:27,

You know, that’s a good point. I’ve always supported military operations in Afghanistan, but you make a good argument there.

Until we get attacked domestically again, then Obama gets the ol’ “you didn’t do ANYTHING just like Clinton” routine. APPEASER WIMP!!!

It never ends, does it.

But that’s if we get attacked again.

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 23, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this

BUD WSIER

Here’s a simple test for you.

WHICH NUMBER IS BIGGER

$1,039,768.00

or

$351,550.00

Next Question

WHO GOT THE BIG NUMBER FROM OIL AND GAS

Next Question

NOW WHO EXACTLY IS A BLIND, GOOSE STEPPING IDIOT?

Data at the same place it was at 1:03

Except for that last question of course, that requires judgement.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this

Bosch,

You’re welcome. If you back to the main page at that Zap2it link you can put in your zip code and service provider, then it will customize the listings for you. They seem to keep up with listing changes even better than my own provider. Plus it’s a great place for entertainment news without all the raunchy gossip.

By Goldie

July 23, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this

Such a shame that we’ve been stuck in McBush’s quagmire in Iraq for almost 6 years, and in the meantime, Al-Qaeda and the Taliban have grown even stronger and meaner in Afghanistan.

I certainly think that McBush can take a lot of credit for the length of our occupation of Iraq… after all, he was one of the blowhards back in ‘02 saying that the fight would be “relatively easY’ in Iraq and that we would be “greeted as liberators”.

Boy, all those greeters greeting us for over 5 years now…

By Abomi Nation

July 23, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this

*Barack Obama donned a skull cap today during his visit abroad infuriating conservative bloggers. “This is an outrage,” a very frustrated blogger exclaimed. “For him to show support for Black gang members is disgusting. We knew he would show his support for these Black thug gang bangers sooner or later. Of course the liberal media completely ignored us,” he ranted.

When it was mentioned that it was a Jewish skull cap Obama was wearing the unrepentant blogger replied, “This is an outrage! We knew Obama was not a Christian. Of course the liberal media completely ignored us. OBAMA IS A JEW.”*

By Paul

July 23, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

Bosch

Actually, I wasn’t making an argument, just wondering if consistent questioning was applied to Pres Obama re. Afg as with Pres Bush re. Iraq how convoluted it’d get. But I will hazard a guess critics of Pres Bush/Iraq will take a different tone with Pres Obama/Afg.

Good point on Clinton, but I was having fun pointing out, just days after people were saying Pres Bush was adopting Sen Obama’s positions (Iran) that it seems Sen Obama is adopting Pres Bush’s positions (Iraq).

Dang, I love irony -

By Bud Wiser

July 23, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

If these handfuls of left wingers weren’t stupid, they’d be nothing at all, so you folks need to be thankful for that much.

Too bad you dimwits don’t use what passes for a brain in your circles for something constructive. But then again, when has a Dimmokraut ever been constructive?

What GHT fails to mention about McCains oil money is that is the figure totaled since 1989. The Messiahis figure is for 2 months. As usual, the ignorant left confuses themselves. Recommendation - put your rock in your left hand so you’ll know which way that is, and put away the high tech toys you play with here because you have repeatedly shown an inability to use them.

See ya, gotta go fishing today…so many decisions…fishing, golf, fishing, golf.

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 1:48 PM | Link to this

RW,

I will do as Paul, and put it in the bookmarks. Thanks again.

By GodHatesTrash

July 23, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this

The $770K figure I found for McCain is for 2008, little whiney butt.

Wait until your daddy gets home young man, he’s gonna paddle your bare butt, and then take a Dr. Dobson shower with you. Bad boy!

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this

Paul,

I think Obambi’s handlers told him to lighten up on specifics after his first plan was to have a surge of Arabic translators go into Afghanistan where they don’t speak Arabic and then send a team of agriculture experts to teach them how to grow things besides poppies even though they have few ways to get those crops to market and no way to store them to sell year round.

My apologies if I’m repeating myself, but this guy is a dunce.

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this

Paul,

I think part of that is because a majority of Americans, even now, and many of us peace lovin’ liberals didn’t have and still don’t have a problem with going into Afghanistan.

After 9/11, this peace lovin’ hippy applauded bombing the Taliban back into their caves. That was because I actually thought we were going to go and get the bad guys. Silly me to dream.

But…..now…..

And to be honest, why wouldn’t small, covert operations work just as well in Afghanistan instead of huge shock and awe, bring in the brigade military actions? I see I’ve contradicted myself a little. I don’t think it has worked in Iraq, so why would it work in Afghanistan?

Because the situation in Afghanistan has kind of morphed over into Pakistan, and that’s a WHOLE other ballgame there - they actually HAVE WMDs.

Did you see the Dark Knight? Hell, we should get Morgan Freeman to develop some of those weapons! Just kidding. Seriously, did you see that movie? I loved the make the pencil disappear trick.

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 2:14 PM | Link to this

Paul,

Another thought on Afghanistan…….

I wonder what the opinion of Americans who support military operations in Afghanistans would be if we start getting our collective a@@es handed to us on a plate like the Soviets did?

Or if the death toll reaches around 4000 or so amongst soldiers serving fighting in Afghanistan/Pakistan?

Hmmmm………….

That’s better irony than a burning fire truck.

By "The Corporal"

July 23, 2008 2:19 PM | Link to this

Mr. Bookman:

I’m waiting ………………

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Will+There+Be+Riots+if+Obama+is+Not+Elected%3F

By Paul

July 23, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this

Dang it, RW (2:02), I ‘bout sprayed a mouthful of iced coffee over my keyboard with those first couple of lines!

Mr. Bookman,

This column was an enjoyable read. The “default position’ argument shows what happens when events are viewed through an ideological prism.

I hear Dem leadership accuse Reps of wanting to “drill our way out.” Possibly I’m missing something, but I don’t recall hearing that as a Rep refrain. But hey, if you can put words in your opponent’s mouth and they don’t object, more power to you.

More irony - one guy I’ve tracked for months making the ‘speculation is a major factor in rising oil prices’ is O’Reilly. He’d have guests on saying he was wrong, it was supply and demand, SEC doesn’t agree, etc and he’d do his “bunk, the consumers are getting hosed and the government isn’t looking out for them” routine. Now I hear the same argument made by Spkr Pelosi and Sen Reid. Pelosi and Reid follow O’Reilly. Amazing.

Personally, I find the argument of drilling to lower prices essentially irrelevant. I look at it as one means to replace what we buy from the Mideast oil kingdoms. But again, Reps have missed the ‘big picture’ by focusing on short-term political advantage (price relief) rather than long-term national interest. And Dems’ll focus on the opposite of what the Reps focus on.

BTW - those who oppose offshore drilling because of the chance of leakage (ummm. we do have offshore drilling - in Louisiana) may want to see how Venezuela transports their crude. Especially how many of their platforms and lines go right across Lake Maracaibo, where it’s pumped directly into tankers.

Somehow, I think if the Venezuelans can do something, we can figure out how, too -

By Midori

July 23, 2008 2:23 PM | Link to this

better to be a dunce than a lilly livered coward

ya think?

By Paul

July 23, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this

Bosch

I think most Americans supported going into Afg and taking out their gov’t - which was intertwined with OBL. As far as the shock and awe thing, it started out as a CIA op until SecDef Rumsfeld, backed, I believe, by Cheney, made a successful grab to control the mission.

Money (budgets) and power, again.

Then you stated with more conventional forces. Funny, some here say the surge in Iraq didn’t really work because we bought off our enemies. Just what do they think the CIA guys had in their briefcases? Powerpoint slides?

And yes, missions and situations morph. But the essential question remains for Afg: under what circumstances will we leave?

No problems with contradictions. Real life ain’t all that cut and dried -

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

Paul,

It’s ALWAYS about money. The religious ones just haven’t figured that out yet.

“under what circumstances will we leave?”

And the circle continues.

Powerpoint slides - that’s a good one - they can BORE them to death! Much better weapon than simple explosives!

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

Midori,

Jay has a new post up announcing he’s going on vacation. Maybe if you hurry over to it you can take one last crack at getting him to say Hi to you.

By the way, saying that McBushie is a coward that dodges the press is absurd.

Paul,

i’ve got a wireless keyboard that has dying batteries, so the shift key is one of the first to go. When i type paul without a capital my spell checker gives me a suggestion of Raul and Saul, but not Paul, however that’s not why I’m writing.

You always seem to be up on military matters, so surely you know that a military excursion into Afghanistan couldn’t even resemble one into Iraq. I’m afraid their are too many now, at least the ones that are willing to allow that the surge worked in Iraq, that say since it worked in Iraq let’s do it in Afghanistan. I shudder to think of how many American lives would be lost by flooding the Hindu Kush with conventional forces.

By Midori

July 23, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this

RW,

WAH!!!

I wasn’t aware that I was in such dire need of attention (shrug)

I thought that was “your” thing? (shrug)

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this

RW,

Just out of curiosity, when you wrote:

“I shudder to think of how many American lives would be lost by flooding the Hindu Kush with conventional forces”

Does the American lives lost in Iraq also make you shudder or do you think we’ve learned our lesson?

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this

I always love it when the Dunce gets to the part about there being a difference between preparations and preconditions.

Yes there is a difference if by preparations you mean what to pack and when to fly in, but there is no difference in the way the Obumbler is using the words.

By Paul

July 23, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this

RW-(the original)

Right-o. I was wondering what the “why” was behind the call for “more troops” in Afg a la Obama. Didn’t really expect an answer. Just wondered.

It’s not just numbers - it’s what to do with them (remember some here who criticized the Iraq surge idea because it would only provide more targets for al Qaeda?).

I just looked at a few topographical maps of Afg. The region you referenced is some of the worst in the world for us. And it’s home to our enemies. So many thoughts occur - I will try, for once, to be brief - we are in an ideological war and most of the discussion involves military tactics. Hit them in that region - even into Pakistan? Ever had a long balloon filled with water - squeeze it, all the water flows to a bulge elsewhere?

Saw a news segment a while back - success of US with educational reforms in Afg. Was town by town. Brought in money and development - elders had to allow education, females too, and lighten up on the extremist rhetoric. If I may, I seem to recall advocating that when I first showed up here. That’s the kind of tactic that’s going to work for us. I hope -

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this

Bosch,

I’m one that believes the Iraq war was necessary and also the timing of things couldn’t really have changed much to get us to the point we are. By historical standards we were wildly successful with respect to the lost lives. Any soldier that loses his or her life in defense of our country is both tragic and heroic.

I have said from day 1 when the screams for flooding troops into Afghanistan started that it would be disastrous in terms of body count and not the least bit necessary.

By Abomi Nation

July 23, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this

Come on now. Who can blame McCain for going into seclusion? These are very difficult times for him.

The press is ignoring him, he is now down in Florida and almost all of the swing states. Obama is about to be greeted by tens of thousands of cheering Germans, at the same time Europeans seem to hate McCain. When asked “who would you rather see elected,” those in the UK favored Obama 60% to 15%, in France it was Obama 64%-4% and Germany Obama 62%-10%, according to a poll from Gallup released today .

Poor guy, don’t be surprised to see McCain on Jay’s vacation blog trying to garner a little attention like RW.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

Yet no comment on the Saul/Raul situation. HAHAHA

Ever had a long balloon filled with water - squeeze it, all the water flows to a bulge elsewhere?

Paul,

That takes us full circle back to darling of the left, Richard Clarke, and his Boogie to Baghdad warning except it looks like it would be a boogie to Pakistan. At least until 16 months after Obama takes office for his 8 to 10 year term.

By Bosch

July 23, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this

RW,

So, then am I to assume that if we do not increase troops in Afghanistan, and say if, we get attacked on a 9/11 scale again, we wouldn’t hear “[insert President here] did NOTHING just like CLINTON!!!” from you?

I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with you in regards to Afghanistan right now, Paul just made me go “hmpf” a while ago, and I’m still pondering.

But Iraq? No- I can say we’ll just have to agree to disagree on that one. I don’t think it was necessary at all. But we’ve had this discussion before.

I believe it was also Paul who wrote once (blogger, not Apostle) success should never be measured in the body count of soldiers (or something along those lines) which I agree with.

Gotta run to a meeting. Be back later.

By Paul

July 23, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this

RW-(the original)

Well, considering it’s been a while since I’ve been paul not Paul, I can easily live with Saul (didja know you just made a BSG reference? You’re in…..) but the Raul thing, well… maybe I’ll take up cigars again -

Your full circle comment - like I said, look to the past, see the future. Just hope Obama’s advisors have a mirror.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this

Bosch,

Trust me, I realize we’ll always disagree on Iraq, but the reason for my belief is based on my unknowable, alternate reality scenario from yesterday. Sorry to go all Rummy on you. I have no idea what you mean by that first paragraph/question. If we threw a bunch of extra troops into Afghanistan and ended up having to go to war with Pakistan because of it I would be more likely to say we forced ourselves into a third front from doing too much. We also might pull out and let Al qaeda have Pakistan in which case I would say President blank made a foolish error. neither case is saying that President blank did nothing.

Like it or not, we will get attacked again. Am I supposed to assume you would make the claim that it happened because Bush had done too much/not enough?

Clinton had a whole bunch of attacks by radical Islam on his watch and we made a few arrests and bombed Baghdad so when I say Clinton did nothing I’m pretty darn close. He never even visited the World Trade center after the first attack. So what’s your point again?

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

Paul,

I guess I could just break down and change the batteries. It’s just two AA’s so there’s not much reason for me manically milking the last bit of life out of them.

Is it alright if my BSG cred is just honorary?

I’ll join the entertainment discussion when Heroes starts back up.

By Hear the Herd

July 23, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

Congrats, Jay Bookman, you purport to research rebuttals to my comments and still get the data wrong.

Congratulations, Paul, saul raul and Rw the marginal, you’ve advanced the Iraq/Afghan discussion to where everyone else was in 2002.

You’re only six years behind events. I’m amazed at your progress. There are think tanks begging for people like you guys. U2 bosch. wow. I am humbled.

Now you lisen to me, you gaggle of gargled garbage: Obama will have a tough time during the debates when the Iraq War comes up. He has a little time to bend his position. Why his people allow him to keep opposing the surge is beyond me, unless they’re changing his stance it in stages, so that by the debates, he’ll have less room between McCain’s position and his own. All McCain will have then is the old flip flop criticism, which is the sound of Bush’s second term, and he better not go there. Nothing that reminds people of Bush will work. That’s Obama’s main advantage.

The sheer weight of the pop star momentum should be enough to elect Obama. Another saving grace for Obama: the truth about iraq is so unpopular, that McCain had to 180 his 100 year occcupation. Well, McCain is right! We aint nebah tonna pit mouta Rinaq.

Now, Paul, find a link from 2003 or 2004 that supports some irrelevant idea you have about November. U2, RW, the aboriginal. I’m trying to think of what state allows lobotomies like the one you vunderkinders must have had to end up so stunted.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 4:30 PM | Link to this

Polly,

You left out the part about how you never read me.

By Hillbilly Deluxe

July 23, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this

There was an interesting article in yesterday’s Gainesville, GA Times. Some say that the recent large profits of oil companies will go to exploration. According to this article more money is going to dividends and stock buybacks than to exploration. The article is an AP article and The Times only printed about half the article. The entire article can be read at OneidaDispatch.com and type in “Big oil profits steered to investors” in search. (I am trying to provide a link but not sure I know how to do it).

Link: [http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/O/OIL_PROFITS?SITE=NYONI&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT]

I do agree with Jay that both sides are trying to scapegoat the other side. In my view its past time to get cracking on renewables. No it won’t provide the complete answer and no it won’t be easy but in my view it’s the way to go for the long term.

By sunshine and thunder

July 23, 2008 5:04 PM | Link to this

Stop importing oil from Arab countries and start importing magic carpets.

Makes about as much sense as ANYTHING congess has or will come up with.

By RW-(the original)

July 23, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

H’billy D,

I couldn’t find your story at the OneidaDispatch, but I think this is the one you want.