Jay Bookman

By Bud Wiser

July 16, 2008 7:00 AM | Link to this

Well, well, well; Jay wants government to solve everyone’s problems, and run everyone’s lives, yet when a segment of the market that does not fall within his ideological framework calls for help, now it is a crime?

That in a nutshell shows the true hypocrisy of the Demokrats. If you (or the market) cannot supply them with the votes to stay in power, forget the government throwing money your way. Why do you think trillions have been poured into the ghetto since Lyndon Johnson’s Great Society? They have created and sustained the new slavery of African Americans by providing the absolute bare minimum of living conditions, welfare, the pathetic joke of public education, public assistance, etc., but perpetually with the promise that if you reelect them, there will be more more more. And the blacks fall for it every election year, marching and singing and holding hands walking in lockstep to the polls to vote Demokrat.

The Demokrats will be your daddy. They will house, clothe and feed you. They will (not) educate you so you can sustain yourself later. All you need is a helping hand….. What a pathetic set of lies they have spat for decades, yet the uneducated masses fall for it, which of course is by design. For every ghetto rat that has gone on to Harvard to become a doctor, to MIT to be an engineer, to Princeton to be a, well, whatever, I can show you hundreds of thousands walking the streets doing nothing, thousands more in prisons for drugs or violent crime. Hell, just turn on the local news in the evening and tell me what you see when 11 DeadorAlive has its local crime segments.

IT IS THE LIES AND DISINGENUOUS MISLEADINGS OF THE DEMOKRAT PARTY IN THEIR HYSTERICAL ATTEMPTS TO PERPETUATE THEIR POWER STRUCTURE THAT HAS LEAD TO THIS POINT!!

Vote McCain 08’

By lovelyliz

July 16, 2008 7:16 AM | Link to this

Jay

Don’t forget the neo-con mantra: Welfare and government benfits for people BAD, Welfare and government benfits for business GOOD

By lovelyliz

July 16, 2008 7:16 AM | Link to this

Jay

Don’t forget the neo-con mantra: Welfare and government benefits for people BAD, Welfare and government benefits for business GOOD

By lovelyliz

July 16, 2008 7:22 AM | Link to this

Per haps the real difference between self-professed free market capitalists and socialist is who the government exists to finance.

By hillbilly ragger

July 16, 2008 7:37 AM | Link to this

I smiled a bit when I saw this in the dead-tree edition over morning coffee.

Nice work, Jay.

I’m going to enjoy watching the right-wing troll army try to defend their gratuitous use of the term “socialist” online and in print (as if that were an insult!) which they hurl at any politician even slightly more progressive than they’d like.

By Go Fish

July 16, 2008 7:43 AM | Link to this

I don’t know. I have never got a job from a poor person. With all the Government rules banks must follow we still have the FDIC which they (Banks) must pay for. Will more government rules help? I don’t think so.

By Copyleft

July 16, 2008 7:51 AM | Link to this

Yeah, what has government intervention ever gotten us except cleaner air and water, the 40-hour work week, child labor laws, workplace safety, and all that other unimportant stuff that just gets in the way of profits?

The question is whether government should be acting in OUR interests… or the interests of corporations. We know what the corporations want, and they have the money to buy it—if we allow it.

By Davo

July 16, 2008 7:52 AM | Link to this

Agree 100%, Jay. For those of you that didn’t pay attention Ron Paul and Peter Schiff have been predicting this mess for a long time. Wefare is subsidized poverty and now Wallstreet has it’s hands out. Someone tell me, how this is a free market?

By T Boone Pickens

July 16, 2008 8:09 AM | Link to this

NeoCons want the military to solve everyone’s problems…

By Idiot

July 16, 2008 8:15 AM | Link to this

NeoCons want the military to solve everyone’s problems…

By T Boone Pickens

July 16, 2008 8:19 AM | Link to this

Funny Republicans tell us there isn’t any money for social problems. They tell the poor, the hurting and the sick “pull yourselves up by you bootstraps”. The hypocrisy is there is PLENTY of money, we spend 1 BILLION DOLLARS a DAY in Iraq! Republicans decry “big government”, but that is ONLY in health, education and welfare. Defense can grow the “pork” pen as large as possible. Funny we spend 200 million dollare on the F-22 but they won’t put it into combat. Why have them? Expensive, corporate welfare programs for the defense industry.

At least Dems spend on PEOPLE’s needs, not on weapons and wars.

Hey NeoCons….. why can’t the Iraqi people “pull themselves up by their bootstraps”? Why all this “welfare” to them?

You see, ALL want welfare. Some for the poor and needy, and some for the greedy!

“I am a oil man, and we can’t drill our way out of this one”

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 8:21 AM | Link to this

Bud Wiser — you are one ugly Neo-KKKon.

And he has no comment about his Party promoting socialism for Wall Street… so ugly.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 8:25 AM | Link to this

And a vote for McBush is a vote for more of the McSame: more corporate welfare while you slave away your wages to promote corporate welfare!

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 8:25 AM | Link to this

Why it’s….It’s just….disgusting.

By hillbilly ragger

July 16, 2008 8:26 AM | Link to this

Jay, remember the chainsaw?

I don’t, but I see an infamous 2003 press conference, apparently attended by one James Gilleran of the Office of Thrift Supervision, which included a chain-saw prop. The idea was that the MBA Preznit was all about eliminatin’ them pesky banking regulations.

But I’ve tried to find a transcript of that press conference, and other than tons of references to Gilleran and chainsaws, I can’t actually find it.

Anyway, if you have any luck, you might want to post a follow-up and explain how we really got into this mess. (If the transcript of the press conference is really as damning as I imagine it might be, that is.)

By Eric1

July 16, 2008 8:27 AM | Link to this

This massive display of hypocrisy comes directly from the rich, right wing republicans. God forbid the government should help the poor, the starving, the homeless. But let some over privledged moron hit a bump in the road and they’re falling all over themselves to rush to his rescue. That’s just one example from a list that must be a mile long. Compassionate my aunt’s fanny!

By T Boone Pickens

July 16, 2008 8:29 AM | Link to this

Carter couldn’t fix what Nixon and Ford broke Clinton DID fix what Reagan and Bush 1 broke Obama will have to fix what Bush 2 has broke.

Funny recessions seem to come when Republicans are in office….

By GodHatesTrash

July 16, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this

WHEN YOU SAY BUTT WHINER YOU’VE SAID IT ALL

Surprise, surprise. Another loudmouthed moron for McCain.

By hillbilly ragger

July 16, 2008 8:33 AM | Link to this

Silly Goldie @ 8.25—it isn’t “income redistribution” when Republicans do it!

By Mike

July 16, 2008 8:40 AM | Link to this

To Jay:

This is classic. So you are claiming some type of hypocrisy here because Anthony Mozilo was complaining and then John McCain supported the bailout.

Why is McCain responsible for Anthony Mozilo’s comments? According to Portfolio.com, Mozilo’s buddies are mostly Democrats and he has been buying them off:

“In June, Condé Nast Portfolio disclosed the names of five V.I.P.-loan recipients: Senators Christopher Dodd and Kent Conrad, former cabinet members Alphonso Jackson and Donna Shalala, and former United Nations Ambassador Richard Holbrooke. The Wall Street Journal reported that James Johnson and Franklin Raines, both former C.E.O.’s of government-sponsored mortgage buyer Fannie Mae, received favorable rates.

But many other V.I.P. borrowers haven’t been named until now, including former Countrywide director Henry Cisneros, who served as secretary of Housing and Urban Development in the Clinton administration; former White House staffer Paul Begala, now a commentator on CNN; and Postmaster General John Potter. Countrywide also offered special discounts to Congressional staffers involved in housing issues.”

http://www.portfolio.com/news-markets/national-news/portfolio/2008/07/16/Countrywide-Deals-Exposed

Even if all of this were not the case, McCain has always viewed a role for government regulation. It’s one of the many criticisms made of him from the right.

McCain repeatedly states that his role model in Teddy Roosevelt, who as some know was largely responible for the onset of modern American regulation of business.

I assume you knows that. But acknowledging the truth wouldn’t have fit your spurious claim that McCain has discovered government intervention “all of a sudden”.

“Game, Set and Match” LOL

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 8:40 AM | Link to this

Bud Wiser is Andy, don’t ya’ think?

[The Corporate Welfare State: How the Federal Government Subsidizes U.S. Businesses ….What’s wrong with federal business subsidies?…..Government is ill-suited to finding the “next big thing….Corporate welfare programs create an incestuous relationship between business and government…..Subsidies also create a perverse incentive for businesses.]http://www.kiplinger.com/businessresource/summary/archive/2007/SlivinskiCorporateCato.html)

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this

The Corporate Welfare State: How the Federal Government Subsidizes U.S. Businesses ….What’s wrong with federal business subsidies?…..Government is ill-suited to finding the “next big thing….Corporate welfare programs create an incestuous relationship between business and government…..Subsidies also create a perverse incentive for businesses.

Sorry to screw up the link the first time…it’s early….need more caffiene

By Mike

July 16, 2008 8:46 AM | Link to this

I wonder why the CEO of Countrywide’s connections with bunches of Democrat politicians and pundits never became a “scandal” when the media spent weeks on Cheney’s hunting accident.

Let’s all say it together, “What liberal bias?”

By GodHatesTrash

July 16, 2008 8:47 AM | Link to this

Now now Butt, calm down, Mommy will get your breakfast soon, but she’s looking for your diapers. You know you’re not supposed to be playing in them so early in the morning.

Now be a good little boy the rest of the day.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 8:49 AM | Link to this

Regulation is not socialism. Responsibility for one’s actions is not capitalism.

Interesting the column begins questioning the difference between a socialist and a capitalist - then uses Wall Street as an example. Don’t we remember the posts concerning Wall Street money flowing to the Obama campaign? Does this mean many of those involved in this mess are not capitalists, but socialists (using the undefined terms introducing the article)? Or are they public, political socialists, but personal capitalists?

The greed cited is not unique to socialists or capitalists. That’s why we have laws - because people and organizations do not generally operate out of the “higher good.” The system clunks along until excesses are revealed or the flaws are too great to ignore - then we get more laws to address these aspects and the system continues to clunk along.

By bdatlanta

July 16, 2008 8:50 AM | Link to this

“…after years of privatizing their gains and reaping immense financial rewards through their manipulation of the “free market” system, the leading lights of Wall Street are suddenly turning socialist. Now that it’s time to pay the piper for risk gone bad, they turn to government and ask, “Hey, buddy, will you get that for me?”

That is spot on, Jay. They won’t pony up any of their past profits to help solve the mess they created. That is just the American way. Always has been, always will be.

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

Nice column Jay, couldn’t have said it better.

OMG! Today, hell hath frozen over. Okay, I’m about to say it:

Way to go George W. Bush for sending diplomats to talk to the Iranians. I guess he’s realizing what Obama has been saying all along is right!

Good job George!

It’s time for everyone to realize, especially with the economic climate we are in - economic prosperity is a vital component, if not one of the most crucial components of national security.

It’s easy to bring down a country from within - and without guns and bombs. When will OUR leaders learn this? As soon as they get their hands out of the cookie jar and start paying attention!

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

And how many BILLIONS of $$$ have we paid to the Big Oil companies for their “welfare” during the past decade??? Where’s the Repukes’ outrage over our socialist gov’t giving WELFARE to their BIG OIL friends???

By Me Again

July 16, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this

Jay- Please answer one question for me.

What do you think the role of government should be?

The role of governement should be to protect it’s citizens from foreign or domestic aggressors and to protect the rights of it’s citizens. That is it. All else can and should be privatized.

I await your response.

By hillbilly ragger

July 16, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this

Republican Presidents vs. Democratic Presidents on the economy.

Shorter version: If a GOP’s in the White House and you’re not in the upper 5 percent of income earning American, you’re basically screwed.

By bdatlanta

July 16, 2008 8:56 AM | Link to this

The Conservative Nanny State

How the Wealthy Use the Government to Stay Rich and Get Richer

http://www.conservativenannystate.org/

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 8:58 AM | Link to this

Maybe I’m wrong here but somehow, after reading Jay’s opinion, I was left with the impression that he was talking about a basic premise posited by the GOP that socialism is bad — bad for all. Then, there are the hypocrites amongst us all. In this case though they just happen to be leaning to the right. Pointing out how some Democrats have involvements with, heaven forbid, mortgages hardly provides a basis for anything other than they were just looking for a cheap roof to put their bed under. Aren’t we all, Mike?

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this

Bosch

Good Morning!

Not only is Bush taking Obama’s advice on talking to Iran, let’s not forget that he also authorized strikes into Pakistan as Obama has said he would do.

AND….Now McCain is following Obama on increasing troop levels in Afghanistan!

Did you catch Obama on Larry King last night? Talked about the Commander in Chief’s job and the need to look at the BIG picture…Iraq, Afghanistan, Our Economy etc….

By @@

July 16, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this

It may surprise you to hear Jay, that I don’t believe anyone who fails to achieve on their own should be bailed out.

Unfortunately, when the HMS Global is sinking you have no choice but to bail. The dingies get a tow.

Would there have been a market for such loans had we not been convinced that EVERYONE is entitled to equal shares?

In all the accounts I’ve read from those individuals caught up in these loans, there excuse was “I didn’t know.” “I thought I could.” “I wasn’t expecting.”

I know it sounds heartless, but to them I would say….

“You should have known.”

“Thinking is not doing.”

“Always plan for the unexpected.”

A government education leaves too many vulnerable.

By Mike

July 16, 2008 9:02 AM | Link to this

Any of the GOP bashers care to comments on the fact that Countrywide’s CEO was tied almost exclusively to Democrats?

Anyone care to ask Bookman why he is trying to deceive you into thinking the contrary?

Don’t be the liberal version of Rush’s “dittoheads”. You are being lied to.

By bdatlanta

July 16, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this

Listen to Boortz or Hannity and what they are really concerned with this election season is that a Democrat will get elected and raise taxes on the top earners. Every comment out of their mouths is in protection of what they have in their bank account.

By @@

July 16, 2008 9:07 AM | Link to this

Bosch:

Way to go George W. Bush for sending diplomats to talk to the Iranians. I guess he’s realizing what Obama has been saying all along is right!

Diplomats come from the most unlikely places. These talks have been ongoing for some time. The time and circumstances are right. It was Ahmadenijad who extended the invitation. That’s important to know.

As Obama, would say……”You just weren’t paying attention.”

By Paul

July 16, 2008 9:11 AM | Link to this

Goldie

Hello again. Unfortunately, it’s not just Republicans, altho recently they’ve been the ones to want to maintain the status quo.

Here’s an article from the Union of Concerned Scientists regarding oil subsidies. Note the dates and who was Pres then. I know who held the Congress then, but the point is - this is the way its been for years.

Who says bribes, um, I mean, ‘campaign contributions’ don’t work?

Link: Subsidizing Big Oil

BTW - a handful of worldwide oil companies; production by a cartel; stringent controls on operations; heavy government subsidies and other involvement -

does not a ‘free market’ make.

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this

Privatising has worked so well in Iraq

Privatising the Iraq war has created a trigger-happy mercenary army that is, as yet, subject to no laws

By getalife "whiners"

July 16, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this

Of course, corporate and Iraqi welfare good, welfare for the American people bad.

Talks with Iran and stopping the warmongering will get oil prices down.

Which bank will collapse next?

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 9:20 AM | Link to this

Mike @ 8:46 — Is this topic about “Countrywide” or is it about Wall Street? Do try to stay focused on the issue of discussion, even if you have to think real hard about it.

Oh, and bringing up “Cheney’s hunting accident” is just brilliant — what an excuse for the Repugs to be promoting socialism on Wall Street…

By SaveOurRepublic

July 16, 2008 9:20 AM | Link to this

Bravo for Davo (@ 7:52AM)! True patriot Ron Paul has indeed long spotlighted the coming fallout from Corporate welfare. He’s rightly stated that Government handouts (of all types) need to be greatly curtailed. As was typical of the controlled “mainstream” media, they tried vehemently to bury & marginalize Dr.Paul (a true champion of the Constitution), but his grassroots supports was still tremendous. Since Dr.Paul dropped from the race, I’ve switch support to CP candidate Chuck Baldwin, who’s Constitutionalist platform is almost identical to Dr.Paul’s.

http://www.constitutionparty.com

By Paul

July 16, 2008 9:26 AM | Link to this

Me Again 8:53

Whatever happened to “promote the general welfare”?

(Preamble to the Constitution) -

hillbilly ragger 8:53

Ummm, you may want to check the text of the “Bush tax cuts” - noting child care credits, removal of low-income families from the rolls, reduction in marginal rates, etc.

Of course, for a long time Dems railed against the cuts and said they’d rescind them. Then they got a clue that it would raise taxes on a key part of their constituency, which is why we now hear “we never said that - we want to rescind only the upper-tier cuts.”

BTW - McCain wanting to keep the upper-tier cuts is seriously out of step with his populist designs.

Mrs. Godzilla

And Obama is taking Bush’s advice about leaving troops in Iraq for a lonnnng time! LOL!

And you are happy about public calls to bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Pakistan?

I suppose you missed our discussion at ML’s about Obama’s “I’ll do anything” to keep Iran from getting nukes. “Anything” means “there’s nothing I won’t do.”

If you liked Bush, you’re gonna love Obama!

:-)

By MrArmani LobbyistExtraordinaire

July 16, 2008 9:30 AM | Link to this

We provide a valuable service. As long as we can charge 25, 30, 35% interest, plus fees when needed, we can afford to take on the risks associated with providing an invaluable service to that portion of our population — the poor and under-educated — that otherwise would not have access to affordable credit.

We simply need to insure that people who have come to us for money are not able to shirk their financial obligations by manipulating the system. Therefore, we ask that you plug these loopholes that allow people to file for bankruptcy or wait a few years without making payment and get off scott free. After all, how can we afford to continue to provide our valuable service without protection. We need your protection from those that would use the legal system for their own benefit.

All we are asking you to do is to help us during this time of financial hardship. Without your help, the very underpinnings of this great society of ours will be in jeopardy. It was just an unfortunate sequence of unforeseen events, a perfect storm, that no one, not even us, could have known could happen. It all started with those disgusting little people and their subprime loans. But now their disease has spread. It has spread to those of us who are nothing more than innocent little pawns in the game of life. Just a few billion dollars will do for now. We’ll be able to survive. We have a plan. Commodities are cheap. They’re ripe for the picking. We’ll restore our great institutions and we’ll do it on the backs of those that started this whole mess. Those little people should have just paid their monthly payments and fees.

By WillM

July 16, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this

Hey Buddy! (Bud Wiser),

You truly are delusional.

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this

Well, Paul, I’ll take Obama’s 16 months with some advisors after and a promise of no permanent bases over McCain’s 100 years!

(Maliki and the Iraqis agree!)

Calls to bomb, bomb , bomb Pakistan?

I love the concept of an intelligence backed targeted strike on the area that harbors Osama bin Laden (murderer times 3500)- isn’t that what we were supposed to get done after 9/12?

If you liked Bush, your taste is all in your mouth!

Yep, That’s funny stuff. Makes me laugh out loud.

By NRB

July 16, 2008 9:35 AM | Link to this

Capitalism at work:

“The Atlanta Journal-Constitution will cut its workforce by 8 percent, or about 184 jobs, and eliminate all of its geographically targeted news sections as part of a cost-cutting plan announced Wednesday.”

Can’t wait until this rag finally shuts down for good.

By Chris

July 16, 2008 9:36 AM | Link to this

I completely agree. The Republican mantra that greed is good is only when things are going their way. Failure is good, as long as it happens to someone else. Buy-outs and mergers are good, as long as they are doing them. Turn the shoe on the other foot and all these hard-core Republican Free Market, Survival of the Fittest Republicans become the very thing they claim to despise: little socialists looking for government bailouts.

The JP Morgan government subsidized buyout of Bear Sterns is an example. The mortgage mess is another. Yet another is the buyout of the BUD Beer brand.

When bad things happen to normal people, that’s life. When the Big Corporations and Super Rich get tax cuts, that’s rewarding success……..except when these very same folks fall flat on their faces.

By Fred

July 16, 2008 9:37 AM | Link to this

The problem is that the POLITICIANS of both parties are more interested in feathering their own beds than overseeing the financial sector. When “anything goes”, it appears that everything goes…

By Alan Greenspan

July 16, 2008 9:42 AM | Link to this

I spawned the housing boom when I - in an effort to stop a recession from the bursting “tech bubble” - set interest rates at 1%.

This cheap fiat money, loaned at negative real interest rates and backed not by assets but merely by the “full faith of the U.S government”, sent fabricated and false signals to the market, hugely contributing to the housing boom and subsequent bust.

Strange, since I used to be an Ayn Rand disciple and favored a hard-asset backed currency, knowing full well that history has shown that every fiat currency that ever existed has failed in time.

Nevertheless, I’m happy to see my successor Helicopter Ben Bernanke carrying on my good work while bloggers p** and moan about Demopublicans and we tell them that inflation is 4% while we talk out of the side of our mouths and p** away the dollar and bring about the new lower American standard of living.

Oh the sheep, gawd bless’em..

Regards, The Maestro

By Huac

July 16, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this

Wait a minute. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were always quasi-government, like the Fed and the Red Cross! Privatize what was already government generated? C’mon! “The Sky is Falling, The Sky is Falling.” Can we just get a grip here, or would we rather be provoked? Provoked, by the looks of things around here….

By @@

July 16, 2008 9:46 AM | Link to this

Mrs. G-zilla:

If you liked Bush, your taste is all in your mouth!

I’m unaccustomed to seeing comments like ^^^ that from you.

Just a wee bit touchy today, aren’t you?

By Me Again

July 16, 2008 9:46 AM | Link to this

Paul 9:26 Where exactly in the Constitution does it say take money from the achievers and give to the under achievers? Promote the general welfare refers to the protection of rights. Which by the way, does not include the right to my money, the right to vote, the right to an education, a job, health care, child welfare checks, food stamps, etc.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this

bdatlanta @ 9:05 — and those are the same people that promote the occupation of Iraq as defeating “terrrism”, but they still don’t want to pay for it with their own taxes! They’re talking outta both sides of their mouths and expecting China to pay for their wars!

By Paul

July 16, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this

Mrs Godzilla 9:34

My too-subtle underlying point was the “evolution” of Obama’s Iraq policy - from out now to (introduced liegislation) all out by March 2008 to 16 months after he gets in. And I don’t think he’s modified his earlier “plan” for bases in the region.

You do know better than the 100-years bases quip. Comparing Iraq to post-WWII basing policies with no casualties is not an endorsement. BTW - I disagree with both, but Obama apparently doesn’t. We can discuss further if you’re interested.

Is “an intelligence backed targeted strike” the new generation of “surgical strike”?!!? Now it’s my turn to laugh. Making a case for air power to win wars? Or is the objective only to kill a couple of specific individuals? What do you do when the successors are identified? You can look up some aerial photos of where we “think” he is. Take note of the other things called ‘buildings’ that are scattered about. And the things inside called ‘people.’ How precise are you going to get?

Amazing how many Obama supporters sound more and more like some in the early days of the Bush Administration. “This military operation is going to be eeeeeeasy.”

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

Mrs. G,

I didn’t see him, I was at a friend’s house. But it will take a lot for the McCain camp to twist their way out of this one. Bush just sucker punched him.

@@,

If these talks had been going on for a long time, you’d think that someone would have told McCain about them, so he wouldn’t have scoffed at the idea when Obama brought it up. It’s pretty obvious that the Iranians offered the invitation, I’m surprised that Bush accepted. But it’s a good step in the right direction, no matter who did what.

Paul,

I think Jay’s column is kind of sarcastic. I read it as more of a bash on the hypocrisy of the right than anything else.

And be serious, Obama never said he’d just jerk the troops out of Iraq, end of story. Feeling a little cheeky this morning?

The other Bosch and I were talking last night about Iraq - we saw Peter Bergen on CNN - I like him. Anyway, he was explaining how to simply look at any one factor is very simplistic, which I agree, and to say the increase in the troops as the mitigating factor is hogwash. As he explained, the surge is over.

I’ve used the words “cheeky” and “hogwash” this morning. My English roots must be coming out. All I need now is to fit in “poppycock” and “bloody hell.”

I saw your post about Sarah Conner yesterday - I’ll check it out!

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this

Oh and Me Again,

Would you consider foreign takeovers of our corporations, foreign purchases of our infrastructure, and an inordinate amount of debt to foreign governments a form of foreign invasion?

I certainly do.

You are right that one of the primary functions of government is to protect it’s citizenry from foreign invasion - the only thing is, in today’s world, that doesn’t necessarily come in the form of armies invading that blow things up, it can also come in the form of armies coming in and buying all your assets.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this

Promote the general welfare refers to the protection of rights.

Again @ 9:46 — I’m guessing you don’t ever travel our national highway system either, as you might say that’s just another way to take “my money” for “general welfare” that you don’t believe in…

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 10:00 AM | Link to this

@@

Good Morning Dear!

How goes it with you? All’s well with the family G, thank you!

Yes, I can be a tad snarky…. but it’s just a play on a very old cliche. I am sorry if it offended you.

By ByteMan

July 16, 2008 10:00 AM | Link to this

Thoughts on a sunny day:

• This isn’t socialism at all. Socialism is government redistributing wealth to its people for the benefit of all people. This is “corporatism” — government redistributing wealth to corporations for the benefit of corporations. Well, really, it’s “cronyism” with an ideological cover story.

• Which is more expensive, regulation of financial institutions or cleaning up the mess after? The Office of Thrift Supervision is saying it’ll cost taxpayers billions of $$ to cover IndyMac’s failure. What would it have cost us for OTS to have been AWAKE while IndyMac was making loans to people who couldn’t repay them?

• If Fannie and Freddie need a bailout, who benefits? Well, without Fannie and Freddie, the mortgage interest rate will be about 1% higher than now. But the bulk of the Fannie and Freddie paper is being held by China and Russia. Think about who’s pulling the strings here when taxpayers foot the bill for the bailout.

By GeorgiaValues

July 16, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this

I thought tax cuts were supposed to produce growth and prosperity? WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED?

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this

Paul @ 9:52 — care to post a link that cites Obama’s “out now” strategy from Iraq? I remember only Gov. Richardson stating the “out now” policy during the debates last year. Obama’s always stated that he would be “as careful withdrawing troops as Bush has been careless going in”…

By Me Again

July 16, 2008 10:06 AM | Link to this

Bosch-

Nice try and you almost had it until you said “Buying assets”. I would agree 100% with you if you had said taking assets by force (ironically, just like the government does now). But I still say that a corportation should be free to buy or sell whatever assets they deem necessary in order to return the highest yield to the shareholders.

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 10:07 AM | Link to this

Paul, please -

“Amazing how many Obama supporters sound more and more like some in the early days of the Bush Administration. “This military operation is going to be eeeeeeasy.”

WTF?

By getalife "whiners"

July 16, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this

Mrs. G.

@@ was a very emotional lib but sold her soul to the gop.

Why?

I have no idea but think she will flip flop back from the dark side.

Brunning, a repube from KY called it socialism and disgusting.

By sunshine and thunder

July 16, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

What tripe.

Jay Bookman is a bloody socialist and obviously is very smug about the latest news of proposed government bailouts.

What he doesn’t realize is that it is the expectation of government bailouts that got us into this mess. Beginning with the Greenspan Fed during the 1987 stock market crash, Wall Street has come to expect a final “put” option from the Fed.

In other words, take all the risk you want to and, when the fat lady sings, simply put your bad investments back to the Fed and go home.

Who wouldn’t take undue risks when they know there is a friendly “socialist” government bailout waiting for when you get into trouble.

By GeorgiaValues

July 16, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

Tax cuts were supposed to produce growth and prosperity.

What happened?

Tax cuts have brought us to the edge of financial disaster.

By zeke

July 16, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

The biggest most dangerous enemy of a free USA is liberals and socialism! You, yes you Jay, and all your henchmen like Obama, Reid, Pilosi, Soros and the like are the worst enemy a free nation could have!! The nuts in Congress demanded that banks and mortgage loan companies give housing loans to those “less fortunate” who really could not afford them, calling their sound loan approval processes and procedures racist and discriminatory! So, they did what you demanded, and, as usual with you liberals, now you blame them instead of taking the blame yourselves! MORONS!

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 10:15 AM | Link to this

• BRUSSELS (Reuters) - The International Monetary Fund is sticking to its estimate that losses on U.S. assets from the subprime crisis and its wider fallout would be about $1 trillion despite fresh U.S. banking problems recently, a senior IMF official said on Wednesday… *

Some think that their estimate is on the low side. We’ll see.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 10:16 AM | Link to this

Also Paul @ 9:11 — there may be a difference in giving BILLIONS of $$$ in welfare to the Big Oil CEOS when they’re not actually making BILLIONS of $$$ in profit quarter after quarter, dontcha think?

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 10:18 AM | Link to this

Me Again,

No, I got it, you’re getting hung up on a word or two.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 10:20 AM | Link to this

Bosch

Leave it to you to be reasonable. Funny thing about Obama is, you can have him take just about any Iraq policy you want, given his past comments.

A brief analysis would be, if the war looked promising, he was supportive. As it got difficult, he became pessimistic and his calls for withdrawal became more abrupt. As the war stabilized or showed promise, he extended the withdrawal timetable.

So to me it’s looking less and less different from McCain. Remember, he was a huge critic of the Bush Administration’s strategy. He called early on for lots more troops, a suggestion I criticized with the question “and do what with them?” It wasn’t until we’d learned some hard lessons and Gen Petraeus drafted a plan that more troops made more sense.

As I’ve said, withdraw from Iraq but relocate within the region is just moving the pieces about the chess board.

Me Again 9:46

The Preamble says. “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”

Nothing about general welfare being tied to rights. General welfare is an evolving concept. For years the Fed gov’t fought the idea of a standing army. Then they realize the general welfare required one. Same with other area - the expectation that drugs will contain the ingredients advertised. Providing a national highway system. All require money. Education is one of those ‘greater good’ concepts - so people with no kids still pay taxes to educate other peoples’ kids.

So fight against specific issues if you want - but the idea of ‘rugged individualism as policy’ ended a couple hundred years ago.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

The biggest most dangerous enemy of a free USA is liberals and socialism!

HA! Zeke, the “biggest” enemy of a free USA is the Islamo-fascist terrrrists, remember? Or did you forget to read the latest Repug memos being faxed to you as we post? McBush himself is still spouting that the “Islamofascists” are America’s biggest threat we have — when are you gonna get updated with the latest Repug rhetoric?

Next, you’ll be posting that we have to “win in Iraq” before we can have “peace with honor”, or that the communists will be taking over like “dominoes”…

By N-GA

July 16, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this

I tried to quickly scan the posts, so I hope I’m not repeating something already posted.

The CEO of Countrywide Mortgage is/was Angelo Mozilo.

A subsidiary of Countrywide Mortgage was Countrywide Mortgage Investment, created in 1985. In 1997 Mozilo spun off the subsidiary and it became IndyMac Federal Bank.

On June 25, 2008 Bank of America acquired Countrywide mortgage as it collapsed and neared insolvency.

On July 11, 2008 Federal Regulators took over IndyMac Federal Bank.

That Mozilo is really an astute businessman, isn’t he? (sarc: off)

By willie

July 16, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this

Obama is the Anti-Christ!! 3 1/2 years of prosperity then world war III. And the government under liberal control will subsidize it.

By Me Again

July 16, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

Paul- I believe you have lost your mind, I really and truly believe that. Who said anything about rugged individiualism? Where is that even mentioned in the Constitution? I think it is so funny that “General Welfare” has now become the catch all bucket for imaginary and contemporary “rights” people think that they deserve! Of course to be funded by the evil more “fortunate” rich. Am I right Paul? Also, what the hell is wrong with private enterprise competing for services and allowing the consumer the right to choose? Did anybody here go to business school? For those of you that didn’t -Competition is good, monopolies are bad.

By Analchord

July 16, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this

The Domino Theory! The world destroyed in thirty minutes or less. Isn’t that the new Domino Theory presented to England’s Parliament by the prime minister to get england to invade Iraq, that they could hit with nukes in thirty minutes or less?

Isn’t it?

So there are two domino theries, one for justifying Vietnam, the other for justifying Iraq.

Un-forking-believable, people fall for the same nonsense over and over and over.

That’s why we’ll never know a world where there’s power to the people. (right on) We’re too stupid. We’re idiots.

What the next domino theory? To justify Iran. Or Korea, or Sri Lanka…. If you leave gaps in the setting up of dominoes, then they all wont fall down……the domino gap theory……OMG! Let’s attack.

ATTACK!!!!

By N-GA

July 16, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this

Paul,

Your 9:34 left me a little confused.

“…from out now to (introduced liegislation) all out by March 2008 to 16 months after he gets in.”

If that middle part {all out by March 2008} is an accurate representation of Obama’s position, he must have been crazy. Even if someone calculates exactly how long it would take to extract our troops and materials from Iraq, one can’t predict the completion date without knowing the start date.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this

Goldie 10:04

Sure. In Jan of 2007 he introduced legislation to force all US troops out by spring of 2008. So I guess that wasn’t “out now” as it was 16 months out (he does seem to have a thing for 16 months). Shall we call it “out then” since spring of 2008 has passed? Point is, if he were to have had his legislation passed the troops would be out now. Given the time it takes to do that, the withdrawal would have begun months earlier. ‘Course, it was only ‘combat’ forces, but let’s not get too picky (hey, I’m in the Army but I’m not a combat force!).

And the implications are enormous. Which is why Obama’s strategy is to focus on his initial statements in opposition to the war - not to his subsequent comments on his reaction to the current situation(s) over time. That gets a bit sticky (another Britishism for you, Bosch).

Is MSNBC an okay source?

Link: Obama wants troops home by spring 2008

Bosch 10:07

Just pointing out the comments with tippy-toeing into Pakistan with the comments about jumping into Iraq - “It’ll be easy! The Republican Guard will crumble! The people will love us!”

“Pakistan’ll just have to put up with it if we want to bomb their country! We’d don’t need no stinkin’ permission! And if the bombs don’t work, maybe a Special Ops team. It’s just a few people. Won’t be there long. There won’t be riots or anything, Musharraf’s government is stable and secure!”

Goldie 10:16

Yes, I do agree. If there’s one thing I remember from courses at university, and subsequent real life, it’s that stockholder influence over corporate buddy-buddy boards rewarding each other is a royal joke. And “pay for performance” does NOT apply at the top in many companies.

By thogwummpy

July 16, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

What Bookman doesn’t understand in his typical shoddy research, is that the genesis of this credit crisis goes back to GOVERNMENT in the form of the Bannking Act of 1996, which forced banks eliminate “redline” policies on considering customer’s credit status. Furthermore (and as I have a family member that works for Fannie Mae here in Atlanta); in order to further cater to minorities—-Fannie and Freddie were forced to by shifts in policies dictated by GOVERNMENT to accept guarantees on loans for just about anybody. Yep…I’ve sat around the dinner table hearing absurdist stories of how Fannie Mae was having to approve home loans for people ON WELFARE!!!!

By Mrs. Godzilla

July 16, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this

Paul, Paul, Paul, Paul….

You were not subtle in the least….you parrot the GOP talking points when you say Obama has changed posistion on Iraq. Subtle would not be the correct adjective for that.

Media quote GOP claim that Obama reversed Iraq policy, without noting Obama’s prior statements

Paul, McCain should have known better than to make the 100 years quip. He is the GOP presumptive presidential nominee after all.

Were you offended when Bush made a surgical strike into Pakistan?

The Bush administration, whose determined prosecution of the war on terror McCain continues to tout. The Washington Post reported — as it happens, the same day McCain made his smear — that the CIA launched Hellfire missiles at an al Qaeda operative in Pakistan. As the Post noted, “Having requested the Pakistani government’s official permission for such strikes on previous occasions, only to be put off or turned down, this time the U.S. spy agency did not seek approval.”

What I find amazing is McCain supporters who mistakenly assume that military service gives one some special magic, some mystical power to say stuff like “I know how to win wars”.

I drive in GA everyday….(and have not wrecked ANY cars) ….so I am qualified to work out the metro Atlanta traffic plan!

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

Paul,

You should be drawn and quartered for that 10:20. I had an 8th grade teacher that made us write the preamble, starting with 100 times, for any perceived indiscretion in the classroom. She was also a babe and I was, well, an 8th grader so I spent that year writing the preamble nearly nonstop.

I was already getting antsy when you excerpted it earlier.

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this

Paul,

Me? Reasonable? Bloody Hell! Don’t patronize me! :-) Just kidding.

IMO, pull them out of Iraq, Iraq is done - put them in Afghanistan where now the Taliban has come back strong, and the jihadists are going into Pakistan (who just happens to have nukes already). It’s not just randomly making moves on the chess board, it’s strategically placing your rook and bishop so that you can later scream “check mate!”

BOTH candidates have done round abouts on Iraq, and the media, and bloggers can spin it however they want, but it’s just plain common sense to change maneuvering as events play out. To say otherwise, for either candidate is kind of playing into the rhetoric of the pundits and bloggers who conveniently leave things out of their analysis in an order to make one candidate look bad or favorable. It’s just the way it works.

The biggest problems I see for McCain right now are the facts that he agrees with Bush about permanent bases, against the wills of the Iraqis and Americans and he scoffed at the idea of “talks” with Iran. He speaks in more “absolute” terms which could come back to bite him in the backside.

Obama doesn’t - which some say is wishy washy, too general and vague, but I see it as just plain common sense. Remember, I’m an Episcopalian, and we don’t think anything is etched in stone!

By SaveOurRepublic

July 16, 2008 10:51 AM | Link to this

“Alan Greenspan” @ 9:42AM EDT - You’re right on the (fiat) money indeed! Greenspan once embraced the sage idea of hard-backed currency (as patriot Ron Paul has long sought the return of the gold standard & abolition of the private Fed), but Alan was “bought” by the Central/International Banking Cartel & sold his soul to the Globalist Elite.

This whole business of the private Fed (their un-Constitutional “collection agency” the IRS), fiat currency & fractional reserve banking has long needed to end. However, due to the entrenched power of the Central Banking Cartel & the Globalist Elite, this will never come to fruition.

If more Americans don’t awaken to the mass deception and agenda of the Internationalists & their legions of pawns (including “Jorge Skull&Bones” Bush, “The Clintonistas”, “Juan McAmnasty” & “Bacrock Obummer”), our Constitutional Republic (sovereignty, borders & middle class) will be a memory all too soon!!! <:-(

[http://www.jbs.org](http://www.jbs.org]

By AJC/DNC Management

July 16, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this

Isn’t it amazing how swift the vindication of Conservative ideas is coming lately?

Bush Says Drill, Drill, Drill — and Oil Drops $9!

~~~~~

They “want” diplomacy and then they whine when you give it to them:

U.S. envoy to meet with Iran on nukes- Hopes raised for increased diplomacy, The decision appeared to bend, if not exactly break, the administration’s insistence that it would not negotiate with Iran over its nuclear programs unless it first suspended uranium enrichment, as demanded by three resolutions of the U.N. Security Council.-Urinal/DNC

Gosh, I wonder if that’s what they are negotiating about?

Some things are too tough to figure out on your own, aren’t they AJC/DNC?

~~~~~

Teenage detainee breaks down on tape, Boy held at prison in Cuba grilled over grenade toss, Toronto —- In a video released Tuesday, a 16-year-old captured in Afghanistan cries out for his mother and says he needs treatment for his battle wounds during questioning by Canadian officials at the U.S. military prison in Guantanamo Bay.-Doom and Gloom/DNC

Why, he was just playing grenade toss with Coalition forces, the poor thing!

Got that, future throat cutting savages?

Just whine and moan about mommy when you get caught, thee Urinal/DNC will gin up sympathy on your behalf.

You’ll have the Supreme Court freeing you in no time flat.

~~~~~

While murderers run wild in their city, the D.C. Council cracks down on you:

The District of Columbia Council approved new firearms legislation that will allow residents to begin applying for handgun permits this week. The emergency legislation will allow handguns to be kept in the home if used only for self-defense and carry fewer than 12 rounds of ammunition.-Doom and Gloom/PMS

Now they can kick your door down to count your bullets.

Geez.

~~~~~

Queen Pinko arrives to the party fashionably late:

Pricey council does a number on Atlanta’s police By Cynthia Tucker- Some of those positions in the police department could have been saved if the Atlanta City Council had behaved with fiscal restraint. But it didn’t. While demanding cuts in other city departments, the council has indulged itself, committing to spend about $3 million more —- for staff, travel and other expenses —- than it did in the last budget.-Urinal/DNC

And………?

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 10:57 AM | Link to this

RW,

You don’t know the School House Rock song? That’s what did it for my sisters and I.

By AJC/DNC Management

July 16, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

By Planner July 16, 2008 8:44 AM I know there’s no good answer to the troll problem. But the columnists at the AJC often raise some interesting topics of local interest that I would like to be able to engage in a productive dialogue on.

Yeah, as long as the Conservative view is edited out of it.

Isn’t funny how these libs whine about me but not Polly, who posts far more than I do?

What was that discussion about whining?

~~~~~

Ooops on 10:56, I forgot to format it.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

By Me Again 10:33

“I believe you have lost your mind” – careful with the assumptions. To lose something means you have to have it in the first place.

I was using “rugged individualism” to describe what I took as your position that everyone is pretty much responsible for himself and there is not a case to ask anyone to contribute to another in difficulty. It’s not mentioned in the Constitution. Some do use “general welfare” as a catch-all – which is why I said the battle needs to be fought on an issue by issue basis, as there is general acceptance there is ‘some’ form of general welfare.

Nothing wrong with private enterprise competing for services - or even providing them – witness Obama’s faith-based initiative program. And yes, competition is good – but in nearly every case, the deck is stacked. And government, sometimes, is the one that stacked it.

N-GA – 9:34

I believe it left you confused, not just from my sentence construction, but from taking individual comments from Obama at face value.

So this doesn’t get too far out of hand, my thoughts (subject to flip-flopping revisionism at any time) are that Obama was prescient in his opposition to the war and the reasons outlined in his speech were valid. As the situation deteriorated //and there were no corresponding adjustments from the military or Administration// Obama essentially said, ‘it’s a lost cause, cut our losses and get out.” Was he serious? It was a way to differentiate himself from the field and appeal to the power brokers during the nomination process. His 2007 bill did that – and he knew it would never become law so the consequences of the timetable were essentially irrelevant. As things stabilized he didn’t modify his view that the end point would be to leave – just modified the way we’d do it. BUT – he still has a number in the power faction of the Democratic Party who are none too happy with that – so he emphasizes his initial opposition (also in contrast to McCain) but realizes he can achieve his disengagement goal and not jeopardize the gains that have been made.

By P.Gramm

July 16, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

It was my legislation what done this — or was that Enron. And it was 1999. All I did was help make legal what everyone was already doing. Anyway, just get over it you bunch of whiners. Now suck it up and get a grip on those bootstraps. That goes for you too, Perot.

By "The Corporal"

July 16, 2008 11:03 AM | Link to this

HEY “JAY” :

Side Bar ……..

Sheriff Freeman getting enough votes to be in a runoff with Former FBI SAC Jackson shows just why our founding fathers never intended for the ignorant, unwashed masses (black or white) to be part of the system. They really are like children who need adult guidance. One person one vote will eventually bring this country to its knees or worse. We need to get some proportionality on sanity back into our system.

P.S. Please notice my “handle” change. I’m getting more militant.

By Analchord

July 16, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this

The man it the suit has just bought a new car from the profit he’s made on your dreams…..

Traffic knew where we were headed.

Obama 08: He doesn’t just terrorist-fist bump with his wife, you know.

McCain 08: No, that not a deer in headlights, ask him something else he’s been briefed on. Ask him how many years must a mountain exist before it is washed to the sea……”100 years, yeah, definitely a 100 years, yeah…definitely 100 years, yeah” very good, McCain, now how long does the average housefly live? “hundred years, yeah, definitely a hundert years, yeah, 100 years, yeah..yeah…”

Whew. Okay.

McCain 08: The Rainman. Yeah.

By Mike

July 16, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this

By Goldie

“Mike @ 8:46 — Is this topic about “Countrywide” or is it about Wall Street? Do try to stay focused on the issue of discussion, even if you have to think real hard about it.”

Are you kidding? Bookman is quoting a Countrywide CEO’s comments and then using them to accuse McCain of hypocrisy.

Please tell me who you are referring to as “Wall Street” if the CEOs of publicly traded are not. I need (another) good laugh.

It’s clear that you really don’t understand what Bookman is saying at al. You just scan to the “McCain bad” part.

If you have no interest in holding Democrats equally accountable as Republicans, then good for you. I’m sure they appreciate your blind faith and your incessant and mindless bleating on their behalf.

By "The Corporal"

July 16, 2008 11:08 AM | Link to this

I know one thing. It won’t be long until the “free market” spells the end of the AJC as we know it.

By Dusty

July 16, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this

Well, I saw and heard Obama’s speech last night. He did not say he was following Bush’s plan for Iraq BUT then said he would leave troops for Embassy protection, Iraqi troop training and mentioned protection of bases. Bases? (He emphasized “occupation” but forgot to mention his early anti-war stance and dire predictions.)

Since Iraq has a government of its own getting settled and we are already withdrawing troops, what is the big CHANGE that Obama is to bring?? We are also sending more troops to Afghanistan.

Obama is trying to act like a Commander-in-Chief but it comes across as a little man trying to be a big soldier. And when is he going to Iraq? When he gets brave enough to go??

Other than playing soldier, Obama promises to “help”(subsidize) housing, jobs, health, cities, counties, states, banks with YOUR TAXES. And he says that YOUR TAXES wiil be coming from the RICH(which will manage to include almost EVERYBODY).

In other words, USA will be an everybody-gets-a-little Communist compound run by Emperor Obama’s government. All diplomacy will be his “talks” alone.

NO WAY, my friends. We do not need a scared inexperienced Power-seeker running this country. McCain 2008 to save America.

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 11:16 AM | Link to this

AJC/DNC,

It sounds like DC only got half of the keep and bear part. I guess it’s time to drag them back to court.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Jay,

It’s pretty hard to blame the current situation on the free market. Did you ever read the series the AJC did about the practice of redlining?

I would truly love to see us ever try free market capitalism. That would include letting failed businesses fail, but I’m afraid we’re hopelessly mired in this cycle of government screwing things up and government “fixing” the screwups. We also shouldn’t be rebuilding underwater cities.

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this

Corporal,

You are hereby demoted to the level of “Mike”. That’s just one level above “Zeke” so be careful.

By @@

July 16, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this

Bosch @ 9:53:

Come on….just the other day Bush was asked to respond to Obama’s scolding him on his lack of diplomacy. In one of those rare instances when Bush becomes irritated, he said “Senator Obama has no way of knowing what has been going on behind the scenes.

There’s been way too much interference in foreign policy of late, from reps in the house . Some of it, in my opinion, skirts The Logan Act and serves no one but political party.

Even Ahmadenijad admits that this showdown is a psychological battle between Iran and the West.

While McCain has no qualms about confronting President Bush on how he’s waging the war (more troops needed), I think he knows the dangers of interfering in foreign policy or diplomatic efforts if you will.

Too many cooks can spoil the broth.

Mrs. G-zilla @ 10:00:

Not offended, just surprised.

Getalife @ 10:08:

Sometimes a heart that’s too tender can cripple those you’re trying to help.

Remember when I told you what a hard taskmaster I was with the kids I work with? It pushes them to be more self-sufficient.

It would be selfish of me to soothe my soul at their expense.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this

RW-(the original) 10:43

And if I would have been discussing with you I would have used a different tact. I was responding to “The role of governement should be to protect it’s citizens from foreign or domestic aggressors and to protect the rights of it’s citizens. That is it. All else can and should be privatized.” (sic)

Mrs. Godzilla

Parrot GOP talking points? Haven’t read’em. I’d hope mine are better than theirs.. My main interest it to see how Obama supporters respond to his past comments. I trust you read my response to N-GA for my view.

Offended? What’s that got to do with anything? Conducting military action against a sovereign nation (is this where I’m supposed to repeat the mantra “who didn’t attack us!!!”), I thought was a no-no. From what I remember from Iraq opposition. But as Pakistan has a population largely hostile to us, any military ops are risky business. Which is why I asked where it would end. Rather seems to me the Left is content with cherry-picking how and when we kill others - if there’s an underlying principle I haven’t heard it.

Bosch

The “chess board” referred to Obama’s plan to have troops in the region for a quick response back into Iran. You know my feeling about permanent bases – and how no one on the “Left” has taken issue with me! Amazing.

By "The Corporal"

July 16, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this

To Taxpayer:

“Aye, Aye Sir”

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this

Paul,

I wasn’t complaining about your argument, it was the horrible pain that shot through my writing hand when I saw those words again. It sure would be easier today. I could cut and paste it 100 times in a few seconds.

Be wary of Obambi’s plan to leave troops “in the region.” He may be listening to Murtha and thinking that Okinawa is close enough.

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 11:46 AM | Link to this

Well dang, Corporal. You’re no fun. That’s just sailor talk.

By "The Corporal"

July 16, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

To “JAY” :

What’s up with this ??

ATLANTA (AP) — The Atlanta Journal-Constitution is cutting its staff by nearly 200 jobs and eliminating some targeted news sections.

Publisher John Mellott said the move, announced Wednesday, is a cost-cutting plan in the face of dwindling advertising revenues and steadily increasing fuel and newsprint costs.

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

@@,

Come on. Bush has seen that talking with people instead of blowing them up is much better, just like Obama has said all along.

I’m not implying that this JUST happened, I’m not one of the ADD Americans who think POOF this just occured. I’m well aware that diplomacy takes time and this has been on-going.

Which makes me all the more curious about Iraq - either he’s learned this lesson entirely TOO LATE, or that he knew this all along and his intentions for going into Iraq and his goals for the outcome are all lies.

Or both.

By AJC/DNC Management

July 16, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this

• Poor Barack Obama. In the space of a few short weeks, he has gone from liberal savior with a 15 point lead over John McCain, to a mere mortal in a dead heat in the polls. He has alienated some of his base by flip-flopping on issues like the FISA vote, partial-birth abortion and most importantly, stating that he will continue to “refine” his Iraq War policy.*

And he will continue flip flopping until the dhimmokrat party stops whining, which I figure could be around, oh, let’s say, never.

Bwa.

By Brent

July 16, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this

Don’t forget the government’s role in this mess, encouraging the lending of money to individuals who were not credit worthy.

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 12:02 PM | Link to this

JibJab’s back.

By truthman

July 16, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this

Picture the Bush regime doesn’t want you to see:

http://graniteslate.typepad.com/granite_slate/2008/07/nh-guard-honors.html

SUPPORT OUR TROOPS! ELECT BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA!!!

By h ryder

July 16, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this

There are bankers, real estate brokers, and others too numerous to mention responsible for most of the real estate mortage fiasco. These people should by all rights have been incarcerated long ago, they no longer belong in jail, they should be buried under the jail along with the people who failed to carry out normal oversight of maintaining prudent standards of fiscial responsiblity. This includes members of Congress, many taking bribes disguised as loans or campaign contributions, or publicly creating panic. Yes, Chuck, when your lust for riches, power, and “got ya’s” are so great you belong under Attica or Levenworth.

By truthman

July 16, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this

So, let’s take this whole “carrying guns in public places” to it’s illogical conclusion:

Most people hate Brian Nichols, right!?!

But, since so many people hate Brian Nichols, he might need to be provided with a gun because someone might try to kill him during his trial.

And, of course, all the jurors and spectators should pack heat in the courtroom because some people don’t like jurors or spectators at high-profile cases.

All reporters should be carrying as well because, you know, they’re all part of the liberal media.

And my 11-year-old daughter should carry a piece because she attends public school!!

Thanks for the suggestions, Sonny!! Your thought process just “kills” me!!

By Paul

July 16, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this

truthman

Don’tcha’ just hate it when the Bush regime continues the same policies of the Clinton regime?

By AJC/DNC Management

July 16, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this

By “The Corporal” July 16, 2008 11:48 AM ATLANTA (AP) — The Atlanta Journal-Constitution is cutting its staff by nearly 200 jobs and eliminating some targeted news sections.

We can all take a certain pleasure watching the Beast that the AJC Urinal helped to create with all their nonstop, constant doom, gloom and whining, come to life and gobble their as-ses up.

Karma.

By Peter

July 16, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this

Yes Republicans are basically Flip Floppers on many issues such as these………..

Correct they want no government intervention…….it’s all about the Free market, Ops then the collapse and we need Government help.

Hey no different then no to abortions, then they go invade another country for OIL, and kill a bunch of innocent folks !

Killing is Killing no matter what the age…….

By GodHatesTrash

July 16, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this

Little Butt is happy now. His mommy changed his diapers when her new friend Senator Vitter came by. Then Uncle Larry Craig came by to take him on an outing - they’re going to the airport and watch the planes or somesuch.

Little Butt wants to be a pilot. So he just looooves going to the airport with Uncle Larry.

He won’t be so cranky later.

By truthman

July 16, 2008 12:15 PM | Link to this

FLASH: S.C. competes with Georgia for America’s stupidest state!!

http://www.thestate.com/local/story/462047.html

Oh, the humanity!

By GodHatesTrash

July 16, 2008 12:17 PM | Link to this

Regarding kkkonservative glee about 200 people losing their jobs.

Disgusting, shows what moronic s-hit eating jackals they are, as if we didn’t already know.

By truthman

July 16, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this

Paul,

Of what do you speak? Clinton’s DOD didn’t have a ban on photographing the caskets of dead service members. Of course, Clinton didn’t kill many service members when he was Commander in Chief

By "The Corporal"

July 16, 2008 12:20 PM | Link to this

To Truthman:

Regarding your comments about Governor Perdue ………

Under current Georgia law, government buildings are exempted from places people can carry mainnly because they have magnetometers to screen out the bad guys. If you are talking about the airport situation, I have a question for you.

For years prior to 7/1/08, a licensed gun carrier was legal in the airport parking lots, roadways, arrival area and anywhere in the airport except alcohol serving restaurants and past the security checkpoint area - and there were no problems. The Mayor and DeCosta then declared the airport a “gun free zone” the morning of 7/1. Why didn’t they care before that ?????

By Analchord

July 16, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this

McCain 08: The Rainman

By @@

July 16, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this

Bosch:

Obama sees the Iraq issue in the simplest of terms. Terms that serve his political aspirations. He’s totally lacking in his understanding of the intricacies involved. He quickly and carelessly (for political reasons) latched onto Maliki’s call for a timetable.

He totally missed what’s really going on in Iraqi politics.

It’s political jockeying ahead of provincial elections with pressure on various factions from Iran.

Maliki’s faction is small, so he’s begun to appeal to the populace as a national leader, not a tribal leader. It’s the security improvements that have allowed him to do so - Shiite versus Sunni and the reverse. He’s hedging his bets Bosch. He knows why the Sunni insurgents no longer pose a problem. They’re receiving financial backing from the U.S. so it’ll take more time to integrate them into the political system.

The only thing that put a halt to radical shiite (Sadr’s militia) was when Americans came to the rescue. Iraqi troops weren’t able to go it alone.

It’s a work in progress and upcoming elections will hopefully cement Sunni political participation. They (the Sunnis) are already moving in that direction.

There’s waffling going on in the Iraqi government on the issue of a timetable. Maliki’s national security adviser, al-Rubaie mentioned a “time line **horizon.” Someone else in the government mentioned anywhere from three to five years. After reading where Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani had endorsed a timetable for withdrawal, now one of his spokesman has come out and said he did no such thing.

It would appear as though Obama gets his foreign policy knowledge from the MSM and that ain’t no way to conduct foreign policy or national security.

Obama has no business running a country during a time of war. He really is naive not to mention self-serving.

Like Obama, you haven’t been paying attention.

By DAVID

July 16, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this

If it is not spelled out in the Constitution…it is not a function of government. Our Congress has thrown out the Constitution ..

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

your blind faith and your incessant and mindless bleating on their behalf

Mike @ 11:05 — and I’m sure McBush is counting on your blind faith in keeping our current disasters ongoing for the next 4 years. It’s all about everything staying the McSame, if not worster!

By Paul

July 16, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this

truthman

The Pentagon policy of permitting media coverage of fallen soldiers’ return to the US was curtailed during the Gulf War.

“February 2, 1991: “Media coverage of the arrival of [] remains at the port of entry or at the interim stops will not be permitted…” Public Affairs Guidance – Operation Desert Storm, Casualty and Mortuary Affairs, Office of the Secretary of Defense (Arlington, VA), Feb. 2, 1991.”

It was continued during the Clinton Administration. So Clinton continued Bush the Elder’s policy, and Bush the Younger continued from both.

You really don’t want to get into a “if Clinton had taken other action in response to terrorism the future would be different” do you? Avoidance of casualties is not an indicator of an appropriate national policy.

Especially if Obama bombs Pakistan (or Iran if they test a nuke) and the military stages a coup and the military are sympathetic to the Islamists and…

Kinda rhetorical. It’s lunchtime. Later -

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this

Oh, and Mike @ 11:05 — why don’t we discuss “Cheney’s hunting accident”, since you brought that up earlier?

By truthman

July 16, 2008 12:39 PM | Link to this

I found this quote in today’s Seattle Times in an article about minorties and Obama.

It just points out what I’ve said about Ronnie Raygun since 1982…He did more to set back race relations in America than any president this century!

“Michael J. Smith, an assistant professor of graduate education at Portland State University in Oregon, says that having lived in Los Angeles, he has grown to accept racial tensions among minorities as an unfortunate part of politics and life.

“After Reaganomics, there was a sense that there was not enough around for all people of color anymore,” says Smith, 47. “Each group is always trying to prove that they’re more deserving than the other, because they’ve been here longer, they’ve struggled through slavery and fought for civil rights, or because they work harder.”

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this

The newbies are so easy to spot sometimes. Hi, David.

By Midori

July 16, 2008 12:42 PM | Link to this

ah, I see the Republican’s still citing their ABC’s: Always Blame Clinton.

That crap is so, um, “pre-9/11”…..

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this

Oh great, now this thin skinned whiner wants to start a few worldwide riots.

“You know, there are wonderful Muslim Americans all across the country who are doing wonderful things,” the presidential candidate told CNN’s Larry King. “And for this to be used as sort of an insult, or to raise suspicions about me, I think is unfortunate. And it’s not what America’s all about.”

Have I mentioned that this guy is also a dunce?

If you read the link you’ll get your laugh of the day and perhaps the year in the second to last paragraph.

By truthman

July 16, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this

Paul,

There is a difference between DOD PAG and Executive Orders, you DO agree, right!?!

Either way, it ain’t right!

By Taxpayer

July 16, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

If people don’t want to risk having others comment on their work, then they shouldn’t publish it — or draw it.

By Jimbo I

July 16, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

I say, let it burn.

The Depression forged the people who built our golden age and the Second World War tempered them into what is commonly called the “greatest generation”.

True sacrifice and perseverance are something I think most of us have forgotten. The majority has barely reached discomfort and already the people are howling their discontent.

So, let it burn, and see if those fires create change. Not “change we can believe in” but true and meaningful change.

These things come in cycles, if we keep our wits about us we’ll come out of this stronger and better than we were before (at least for fifty or so years until our spoiled children and their children’s REALLY spoiled children wreck it all over again).

By Bud Wiser

July 16, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

“By Goldie

July 16, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

And how many BILLIONS of $$$ have we paid to the Big Oil companies for their “welfare” during the past decade??? “

You are such a Kool Aid drinker.

At least we got oil, gas, and natural gas in return, all things useful and used in our society.

What have we gotten from the ghetto rats? Drugs, murder rates far above anything in civilized society, multitudes of unwed mothers spewing out more babies for ‘mo money’, all drags on our society. Oh, I almost forgot… we also got lockstep morons singing, dancing and holding hands as they saunter down to the polls to vote Demokrat, to help them perpetuate this worthless cycle.

From Jay, we finally get a glimmer of truth: “There’s no doubt that excessive government regulation can strangle free enterprise.” There may be hope for you after all, Jay.

From Analchord we get: “Fannie Mae proves: Subsidized, lobbied Capitalism is Communism with middlemen.” How true, how true. I say let ‘em fail. They dug their own graves by loaning money to people who never would have qualified for loans in a world where you get things by having the wherewithall to earn it. And the Demokrats continue to escalate the gas crisis by blocking new drilling opportunities. It becomes apparent that the Dims prefer to watch spotted owls, snail darters, mussels and the like live their completely unconcious lives, while real live people see theirs falling down around them like a house of cards.

All for political power my friends, all for political power. The Demokrats will continue to throw under the bus the American economy just for their own power.

By N-GA

July 16, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

Hey RW,

How can you call it whining when he was responding to Larry King? I’m also curious why I don’t see you posting about the liars who are continuously spreading propaganda about Obama being Muslim, or that he must be un-American because he doesn’t hold his hand over his heart during the National Anthem (that one plays on the abject stupidity of some voters).

By your own admission you intend to remain largely on the sidelines for this election, yet you continue to try to influence others, even at the cost of distorting facts by spinning them.

By "The Corporal"

July 16, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this

To Truthman:

I think you are ignoring my 12:20pm post so I will send this again …….

Regarding your comments about Governor Perdue ………

Under current Georgia law, government buildings are exempted from places people can carry mainnly because they have magnetometers to screen out the bad guys. If you are talking about the airport situation, I have a question for you.

For years prior to 7/1/08, a licensed gun carrier was legal in the airport parking lots, roadways, arrival area and anywhere in the airport except alcohol serving restaurants and past the security checkpoint area - and there were no problems. The Mayor and DeCosta then declared the airport a “gun free zone” the morning of 7/1. Why didn’t they care before that ?????

By getalife "whiners"

July 16, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this

@@,

Do you waterboard them?

If you do, the dems are for it. Spying too.

Glenn is the best reporter out there. So, it really does not matter which party you blindly support.

They are both covering up crimes. They are both corrupt and they both have destroyed our country.

So, I just have to laugh at the luncacy of the gullible Americans giddily supporting these criminals.

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this

N-GA,

It’s not like he wasn’t already whining before he went to Larry King and it wasn’t just about this issue.

If you want me to comment about “all these people” spreading rumors about Obama being a Muslim, I’d have to start complaining about you and a few other leftists that claim to get all these emails about it. Frankly I think it’s BS because there’s no way I would never have received one.

Why does Obambi think it’s an insult to be called a Muslim anyway? Isn’t that statement offensive to Muslims?

There’s another track that claims he’s a Muslim under Sharia law because his father had been a Muslim and he really has no choice in the matter. That makes him an apostate in some sectors of the Muslim world, but I don’t know if that’s true and I certainly haven’t seen a widespread push to spread that around either.

I haven’t a single time ever said I plan to be on the sidelines for this election. There’ll be several candidates I’ll be working for in some capacity or another. What I’ve said is that I won’t vote for John McCain. Talk about twisting someone’s words to distort the facts! I’m a piker compared to you.

Now quit spreading rumors about Obambi being a Muslim because he says that’s bad or something.

By DumbAmericans

July 16, 2008 1:11 PM | Link to this

WALL STREET IS THE BIGGEST PONZI SCHEME CREATED BY MANKIND TO RIP OFF THE AVERAGE JOE.

DIVERSIFY. THINK LONG TERM.

YEAH RIGHT

SUCKERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

YOU HAVE BETTER CHANCES IN VEGAS SAME PRINCIPLES GAME THEORY.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 1:21 PM | Link to this

truthman

Yeah. Usually the policy follows the EOs. But I believe the earlier policy (hey Midori - we’re talking Bush the Elder. 1991. Gulf War. Before Clinton) was as much a privacy and respect issue as anything. As far as being ‘right’ I tend to fall on the side of the families rather than the media desire to broadcast everything that happens. Which then gets woven into their political views.

getalife whiner

Are you also getalife? Anyway - that Salon link, it’s old news. Haven’t you heard? We don’t need to waterboard (got your attention, Midori?). No more holding people down (all three of them) and pouring water up their noses for thirty seconds. Nope. We have new techniques. But some call them coercive, so they probably are torture.

And what are these marvelous new techniques that may be coercive, if not downright torture? Why, just have a female soldier touch the suspect on his thigh! He’ll be so scared he’ll answer anything!

“Bin Laden driver says U.S. coerced him Detainee testifies female interrogator used sexual tactics Jerry Markon,Josh White, Washington Post Wednesday, July 16, 2008

Salim Ahmed Hamdan, the alleged al Qaeda driver who faces a historic military trial next week, testified Tuesday that a female interrogator elicited information from him using sexually suggestive behavior that he called “improper.”

Hamdan, a former driver for Osama bin Laden who is accused in a terrorism conspiracy, told a military court that during questioning in 2002 a female interrogator “came close to me, she came very close, with her whole body towards me. I couldn’t do anything. I was afraid of the soldiers.”

“Did she touch your thigh?” asked Hamdan’s attorney, Charles Swift.

“Yes. … I said to her, ‘What do you want?’ ” Hamdan said at a pretrial hearing. “She said, ‘I want you to answer all of my questions.’ “

“Did you answer all of her questions after that?” Swift asked. Hamdan said he did.

Hamdan’s attorneys are seeking to persuade a judge to throw out incriminating statements he allegedly made to interrogators at the U.S. military prison at the Guantanamo Bay naval base, arguing that they were obtained through coercive interrogation tactics.”

By Jimbo I

July 16, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this

By DumbAmericans

RAAAAR I AM SMARTER THAN ALL ECONOMISTS WHO CAME BEFORE RAAAAAAAR! KEEP YOUR MONEY UNDER YOUR MATTRESS!! RAAAAAR! THE WAY OF THE FUTURE!!! RAAAAAAAAR!!!

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

Why is Israel exchanging live prisoners for dead soldiers?

By @@

July 16, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

Getalife:

Do you waterboard them?

What a thing to ask!!!!!

NO! although they sometimes respond to my firm insistence as though it’s torture.

I can tune their protests out pretty easily. The oddest thing is that they often give me a hug once they’ve regained control of their emotional protests.

It’s the wierdest thing.

I do, however, return the hugs but only after they’ve completed the task.

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this

@@,

I have been paying attention, as usual, we just see things differently.

With all due respect, I think you’re just plain wrong. It’s not how I see things.

I feel that McCain’s direction of permanent bases in Iraq and his lack of diplomacy, is very dangerous for our country.

Obama has said that he would put forces where, I feel, they should have been all along.

Obama is just as capable of dealing with Maliki and al Sadr as McCain - maybe even a little more so - he handles things more diplomatically and doesn’t lose his temper as easily. And as we’ve seen in the past 24 hours - talking doesn’t necessarily mean wimping out - no matter how much you try to spin it. It is possible to make intentions perfectly clear of what WILL happen by talking first and if needed, blowing stuff up later.

Not much time to explain otherwise. Sorry.

Later.

By Tom

July 16, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this

But all that REALLY matters is that:

“I know how to win wars. I know how to win wars.” (sic)

No matter that all thru my life I was called, “Jerk, Punk, McNasty,” barely ever “passed” much of anything I undertook. Despised by most of my fellows. A long recorded history of all this stuff. Being a POW as a result of my own direct misconduct was my finest hour, and it shall never be allowed to be forgotten. Riiight??

Seems Iraq was doing pretty damned well all by itself until Bush thought he could become a hero, like me. If it ain’t Saddam, it’s someone else. Iraq had nothing whatever to do w 9/11. So we, in our “righteousness,” have completely destroyed the entire country. (While destroying our own in the process.) Now the American taxpayers will pay to rebuild Iraq. Al Sadr gleefully watches, holds back, waiting for an easier day.

Sure makes sense to me and the Repug Party. After all, “I know how to win wars!!” God Bluss Murcuh and thee flag and Geesuss and our Heroes.

By SaveOurRepublic

July 16, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this

DAVID @ 12:31 PM EDT - You’re unfortunately all too correct…Congress (& Globalist pawns like “Sick Willie ClinTAX” & “Skull&Bonesman Boosh”) have trashed our Constitution!

“DumbAmericans” @ 1:11 PM EDT - You are correct regarding the smoke & mirrors scheme that is Wall $treet. Most of these “investments” are pegged to the quickly collapsing, fiat U.S. dollar. The international stock is pegged on other fiat currency created out of thin air by various Central Banks. It’s all set up to bilk the lemmings while lining the coffers of Big Corporations. This way, the Globalist Elite again makes American more vulnerable while rewarding their Corporate puppets. The best (true) investments are precious metals (gold, silver, etc.) kept on-hand & tangible assets such as land/property. Although thanks to the “Supremes” & their endorsement of Emminent Domain…personal property is also in the Globalist’s cross-hairs!

http://www.jbs.org

By @@

July 16, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this

Bosch:

You seem to be confusing Maliki with Ahmadenijad.

There are those Arab countries who believe that no bases in Iraq would threaten their security interests and those of their neighbors.

he handles things more diplomatically and doesn’t lose his temper as easily.

You’re basing your assumptions on the image he would have you believe. Review is rise in Illinois state politics. He is NOT what you believe him to be.

Don’t mean to hurt your feelings here Bosch but you too, are a bit naive. There’s nothing wrong with being naive, it’s just that you shouldn’t pass it on to others as trustworthy.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this

Bosch @ 1:51 — I believe what McBush really meant to say was “I know how to invade other countries”, and then he would follow up with an explanation, something like “you know, I was backing Bush’s plans to invade Iraq from the very beginning!”

Also, I meant to comment to you earlier re: your post saying Remember, I’m an Episcopalian, and we don’t think anything is etched in stone!
— that reminds me of how a friend of mine describes herself as a “whiskey-palian”… it’s good to have tongue planted firmly in cheek at times, yes?

By Debt Debt Bo Bet

July 16, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this

TRILLION, TRILLION, BO BILLION, FE FI FOFILLION…TRILLION!!!

By Paul

July 16, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this

RW-(the original) 1:34

Excerpt from a book by Danny Kaplan

“… in a series of incidents int he Gaza Strip roadside bombs set off next to Israeli armed personnel carriers killed all the soldiers with the vehicles. In the first explosion body parts of the dead soldiers were torn up, and some were viciously removed and tampered with by a group of local Palestinians in front of television cameras. The second incident resulted again in extensive scattering of the remains, and this time the military rushed heavy reinforcements to the rescue of the bodies. Infantry soldiers were instruted to crawl bare-handed on the sand dunes i order to scan for any possible rmains. Other soldiers provided cover for their activity, demolishing houses from which Palestinian fire was aimed. The crossfire resulted in ten Palestinian casualties and two more Israeli soldiers dead. The use of such extreme measures to recover the dead, at the expense of additional Israeli and Palestinian lives, is revealing. Israeli state institutions have always followed Jewish tradition, attempting to honor the dead by recovering body remains for proper burial. Yet the gradual amalgamation of ultra-orthodox zeal and military organizational logic has turned these actions into a national obsession with the sacrificial dead. It would seem that the military code of ethics demanding the rescue of injured soldiers under fire… has inconspicuously mutated into a nonwritten code of ethics, driven by both national and religious sentiments, demanding the recovery of all bits and pieces of dead soldiers under fire. Int the words of one of the soldiers participating in the operation above, in response to the public criticism it roused: “One of the most important values in the IDF is to return the boys home… returning them healthy or injured, dead or alive, but returning them at any cost. This way, every soldier knows that if something happens to him, he shall return. Every soldier and every soldier’s family know that the military will not desert them.”

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this

Paul,

i believe these were the soldiers that were kidnapped resulting in the 2006 conflict. i get that you want to get the remains back, but letting them kidnap and murder your soldiers, then trading a live convicted murderer for the remains of the two murder victims sends another message to them too. Not to mention setting them up as kidnap/murder targets.

By The good side

July 16, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this

To RW,

If you has ask Jesus to come into your life and for 20 years considered yourself a CHRISTIAN do you want to be called a MUSLIM?

Their is nothing wrong being called a MUSLIM if you are MUSLIM! Plus each person chooses he religion not the father if someone else choose your religion then it is just a cult DUMMY!

TO Zeke home purchasing was pushed by the Bush Adminstration just 4 years ago Mr. Bush was taking credit for the increase in home ownership among minorities and overall in the US.

Can any person who support the Bush Adminstration or is a conservative TELL THE TRUTH about anything? IS IT AGAINST YOUR CODE TO TELL THE TRUTH?

You lie about the war in IRAQ, the surge is working when every reporter in Iraq states we are paying both SHIA and Sunni to stand down!

The Republicans had the White House, The Senate and The House of Rep now you blame the Democrats who have a slight majority for the economy, housing crisis, foreclosures, not drilling in ANWAR, high gas prices, high food prices, increasing umeployment, Not winning the war in Iraq or Aftganistan, high medical costs etc!

Wake-up and smell the coffee!

By Hillbilly Deluxe

July 16, 2008 3:12 PM | Link to this

Mr. Bookman, You and I very often disagree on a great many things but you hit the nail on the head this time. You probably don’t remember it but you and I had this very discussion in an email months ago, that this very thing was bound to happen.

The hypocrisy of all this would be funny if it didn’t have such a negative effect on so many people who are helpless to do anything about it. As with most things in the world it’s a matter of whose ox is getting gored. The stuck hog always squeals the loudest.

If these people truly believe in unrestricted, unregulated capitalism let them explain why they should be so special as to receive government help. Let them also explain tax incentives for certain businesses. Let them explain state and local government paying factories to build in certain areas. If your area is the most feasible place to build a factory won’t shrewd businessmen build there without being bought off? Let them explain spending millions of dollars to build sports arenas for privately owned sports teams. (Sports teams are just another business. Let them succeed or fail on their own merits.) Let them explain subsidies for anything.

I believe in free enterprise but I don’t believe it gives the haves the right to run roughshod over the havenots. This era reminds me alot of the late 1800s and the Robber Baron era. I guess we need another Teddy Roosevelt but I don’t see one on the horizon.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

RW-(the original)

Could it be the message is, we value our dead more than we value your living?

This is really a good example of being able to just scratch the surface of understanding another culture. And if we think that’s foreign, well, Middle East Islamic society and culture is… what’s a word that describes ‘foreign’ as foreign?

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this

Tgs,

On his fight the smears page he has down as a smear that he’s been called a Muslim. The last time I looked it had no other context, so it would seem that he considers even being called a Muslim is a smear.

By Goldie

July 16, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this

So did McBush finally acknowledge that it’s a good idea to withdraw our troops from Iraq because the Iraqi gov’t has suggested several times that need to leave? Or is McBush still promoting his “permanent bases in Iraq” strategy, all the while the Iraqis are saying “LEAVE ALREADY”?

America, just say “NO!” to another war-mongering, foreign country-occupying, permanent bases-into-eternity Repug in the White House!

By SaveOurRepublic

July 16, 2008 3:35 PM | Link to this

“Hillbilly Deluxe” @ 3:12 PM EDT - Very good & accurate analogy to the Robber Barons. In fact, it is the very descendents of those Robber Barons& their associates (the Rockefellers, Morgans, Carnegies + Duponts & Rothschilds) who largely comprise the Globalist Elite (who truly rule the world) today…combined with International Elite (ala the Bilderberg Group). The Corporate World & politicians are merely puppets/avenues of agenda implementation for these ruling Internationalists. I’d suggest the following books that provide much insight into the history & agenda of the Globalist Elite…

• The Brotherhood of Darkness by Dr.Stan Monteith

• The Hope of the Wicked by Ted Flynn

• The Creature from Jekyll Island by G.Edward Griffin

By Bosch

July 16, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

@@,

There are only four people in this world who have the capability of hurting my feelings, and you aren’t one of them.

No, I’m not getting anyone confused, and as I’ve said before, you can’t tell me what I’m basing my assumptions on, or what I think or believe.

“You’re basing your assumptions on the image he would have you believe. Review is rise in Illinois state politics. He is NOT what you believe him to be”

Goodness. That’s a little melodramatic, don’t you think?

Always better to be a little naive than full of hyperbolic melodrama in my book.

To be honest, that line up there makes you sound like you’re scared to death of him, or a little paranoid. And you might be scared to death of him, but, I feel, it’s for the wrong reasons.

There’s one big difference between you and I (ha, who am I kidding, many differences between you and I) - one major: I’m not scared to death of John McCain, I could even live with him being President. I certainly wouldn’t like it or prefer it, but I could live with it.

I stick to issues, and dont’ listen or take much credence in the hyperbolic, rhetorical, propagandistic melodrama crap purportrated by the right about Obama.

Goldie@ 2:47,

The way Bush has been skipping around the palate of things lately, I’m sure it’s getting more and more difficult for McCain to keep up.

AAAhhhh, the ol’ Whiskeypalian - one of my favorite images to try and uphold. Just kidding, but, suddenly, now I’m thirsty.

We really need to start working on the design for our sign for the White House fence.

:-)

By Abomi Nation

July 16, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

Post of the day Hillbilly Deluxe, good job.

By Paul

July 16, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this

There still seems to me, at least, an implicit assumption in today’s comments that Wall Street Greed = Capitalist = Republican.

Let’s try it with Wall Street Greed = Capitalist = Liberal Democrat.

Could be the same factors at work that have Liberals (not necessarily Democrats) calling for social justice, fairness and such… while conservatives donate more to charity. Happens with the Red State Blue State split. In other words, big on talking and theory, somewhat short on personal follow-through. Unless the government mandates conduct.

Link: Wall Street’s Divided Loyalties

By Midori

July 16, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this

By The good side

July 16, 2008 3:11 PM

Hear, Hear!!!!

By SaveOurRepublic

July 16, 2008 4:31 PM | Link to this

Paul @ 4:06PM EDT - More like Wall$treet = smoke & mirrors/ponzie scheme. However, the “equation” of the day would be (puppeteered) GOP “leadership” + DNC “leadership” = 2 sides of the same Globalist Elite controlled coin!

http://www.jbs.org

By RW-(the original)

July 16, 2008 5:25 PM | Link to this

Oh good, I was worried that the mindless cheerleading parrot had gotten lost.

By Kenny

July 18, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this

Experience an easier way of shopping for bespoke suits & shirts at Euro Tailors