Home > Jay Bookman > Archives > 2008 > June > 11 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USIraqis reject McCain’s ‘100-year’ plan
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
From the very beginning, one of the biggest prizes of our invasion of Iraq was the chance to build permanent bases in the country, just as we did in Japan and Germany after WWII and in Korea. John McCain, among others, has said it would be OK by him if our troops stayed in Iraq for 100 years.
Such bases would give us considerable military leverage in the region, particularly over neighboring Iran. However, the Iraqis don’t seem quite so enthralled with the idea. Their vision for the future seems closer to that of Barack Obama than to McCain.
BAGHDAD, June 10 — High-level negotiations over the future role of the U.S. military in Iraq have turned into an increasingly acrimonious public debate, with Iraqi politicians denouncing what they say are U.S. demands to maintain nearly 60 bases in their country indefinitely.
Top Iraqi officials are calling for a radical reduction of the U.S. military’s role here after the U.N. mandate authorizing its presence expires at the end of this year. Encouraged by recent Iraqi military successes, government officials have said that the United States should agree to confine American troops to military bases unless the Iraqis ask for their assistance, with some saying Iraq might be better off without them.
“The Americans are making demands that would lead to the colonization of Iraq,” said Sami al-Askari, a senior Shiite politician on parliament’s foreign relations committee who is close to Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki. “If we can’t reach a fair agreement, many people think we should say, ‘Goodbye, U.S. troops. We don’t need you here anymore.’ “
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Comments
By Grateful Flea
June 11, 2008 7:42 AM | Link to this
We aint nebah gonna mit poutta Miraq.
We aint nebah ponna git moutta Niraq!
Dammit, I cant say this right.
We will never extricate our army from Iraq without triggering armegeddon, einsteins, Y cant any1 see that?
By Taxpayer
June 11, 2008 8:08 AM | Link to this
If the elected government of the sovereign nation of Iraq is giving us a “face saving” means to exit their country, why not take it? After all, weren’t we just going in to handle some specific tasks such as 1)confirm that there were no WMDs stockpiled there, 2)remove an evil dictatorial regime from power, 3)liberate a repressed people and 4)help start a democratic government. Well, maybe it’s time to pull out that banner and proudly display it. You know the one — “Mission Accomplished”. Let’s move on and start the healing process here at home as well as in Iraq.
By Copyleft
June 11, 2008 8:11 AM | Link to this
Who CARES what the Iraqis want? They couldn’t even be bothered to overthrow their own government—we had to do it for them!
They should just shut up and be grateful for the way we’re running their country, right?
By Scooter
June 11, 2008 8:11 AM | Link to this
Create your straw man Bookman. we will do whatever the freely elected Iraqi government says. It is their country.
Years ago you wrote an article that spoke to the brilliance of trying to foster democracy in the Middle-East but said you didn’t think it would work - bigot. Middle-Easterners are incapable of representative governments?
Now, we have forced Al-Qaeda to play their hand in the center of the Middle-East and I see things like this; Former jihadis seem to be lining up to condemn Bin Laden.
I’ll bet a dollar to donuts those Jihadis would still be supporting Bin Laden had we focused on turning him into a martyr.
I digress, you have done everything in your power to erode the resolve of our nation and tell our troops they and their buddies are dying for a mistake, a lie… and on and on.
We are fighting a war of ideologies in which the media front is the most important and you and your ilk are a great asset to the enemy, so be proud. So many of the terrorists arguments are supported by voices coming from the big tent party and it disgust me.
By Mayor of Basra
June 11, 2008 8:13 AM | Link to this
We would very much like to a see a permanant U.S. base in or near our city. It would be very good for business. The pawn shop and tattoo parlor owners are especially enthusiastic about this idea.
By Fred
June 11, 2008 8:29 AM | Link to this
I think we need to get our troops out of Iraq but we need to finish the job first. Get the lawyers out of it, let our soldiers kill the bad guys without lap dogs nipping at their heels. Once we get them out, get our troops out of Europe and Korea. Redeploy most of them to our northern and southern borders. The rest, we need to send to Alaska to man the oil rigs in ANWR or to work in the refineries that we need to build in each state. We will also need to put some of our troops in Washington to b*tch slap the idiots in Congress on a daily basis.
By CC
June 11, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this
Reagan cut and ran from Lebanon after putting our Marines in a horrible position, and they didn’t follow us home, and there wasn’t a turket shoot, and stop calling our brave people in the military turkeys!
By Mayor of Atlanta
June 11, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this
I say let us bid for the permanent U.S. base. Our great city needs the business also. We have the finest pawn shops and tattoo parlors in the world right here in Atlanta so why set up a base on the other side of the world?
To start with, we can offer the U.S. government a loyal, tax-paying, voting base that can help ensure that the current government will maintain its grip on anything we have that it wants. I ask you, honestly, can Iraq offer you that? So, what can they offer you? Oil? HA! At what cost? Why, it would be cheaper in the long run to just meet the demands of the American people for alternative energy sources.
By James
June 11, 2008 8:38 AM | Link to this
“When civilized man can no longer stand the horror of war and refuses to fight, then he will surely be killed or enslaved by the uncivilized who can.”
Author Unknown
By Fred
June 11, 2008 8:39 AM | Link to this
Jay,
You should really think about supporting Obama. You just seem so ambivalent about him…
By Joe
June 11, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this
It’s so easy to pick and chose what words you want to hear Jay. Libs do that quite often. You do realize that McCain was taken out of context but in reality we should build a base in Iraq. We need to stay there so that our presence will be felt by Iran. Libs really don’t understand reality though….
By hillbilly ragger
June 11, 2008 8:54 AM | Link to this
What I want to know is, when is Obama going to start using this as a clown hammer with which to beat down McCain?
How much more obvious a message do we need from the people we’re supposedly “liberating” from the “terrists?”
They. Do. Not. Want. Us. There.
By Scooter
June 11, 2008 8:54 AM | Link to this
Pardon me but I realized my link was faulty so here it is again;
Now, we have forced Al-Qaeda to play their hand in the center of the Middle-East and I see things like this; Former jihadis seem to be lining up to condemn Bin Laden.
I’ll bet a dollar to donuts those Jihadis would still be supporting Bin Laden had we focused on turning him into a martyr.
I’m still disgusted by duplicitous, say whatever is politically expedient at the time democrats.
By Thor
June 11, 2008 8:56 AM | Link to this
America will never totally leave Iraq - never. We need the oil.
By hillbilly ragger
June 11, 2008 8:58 AM | Link to this
Hey, Scooter:
Years ago you wrote an article that spoke to the brilliance of trying to foster democracy in the Middle-East but said you didn’t think it would work - bigot. Middle-Easterners are incapable of representative governments?
They have Internets on the com-pyoo-ter nowadays. Want to provide an actual cite for this article you kinda-sorta remember?
By hillbilly ragger
June 11, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this
Joe @ 8.45 gave us “We need to stay there so that our presence will be felt by Iran.”
You do realize that the radical theocrats in Iran—the ones we’re supposed to, these days, be all askairt of because they’re just so danged powerful and nukyoular-wantin’… that these Iranian nutjobs were the happiest to see Saddamn’s ostensibly secular, Sunni-dominated government toppled, yes?
Why can’t you wingnuts make up your damn minds about who it is you want to p!ss off from one year to the next?
By Independent
June 11, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this
Hey Jay did You also compare McCains Iraq plan to Obama’s?
From Obama’s website: Bringing Our Troops Home Obama will immediately begin to remove our troops from Iraq. He will remove one to two combat brigades each month, and have all of our combat brigades out of Iraq within 16 months. Obama will make it clear that we will not build any permanent bases in Iraq. He will keep some troops in Iraq to protect our embassy and diplomats; if al Qaeda attempts to build a base within Iraq, he will keep troops in Iraq or elsewhere in the region to carry out targeted strikes on al Qaeda.
Notice the last two lines. It appears they are saying identical things in regards to our troops continued presence in Iraq. But you and the US media just keep on misleading the voters
By qwaszx
June 11, 2008 9:12 AM | Link to this
I love it! “Top Iraqi officials” “Many People” That sure sounds like a consensus to me! It is kind of funny that the justification for removing all our troops is the opinion of a Shiite politician! Excuse me folks but Shiites are aligned with Iran. Do you hate Bush so much that you would hand Iraq over to Iran just to be able to say that he screwed up? You folks will sell anyone down the river for political gain and you have the nerve to act as if Republicans are mercenary! Hypocritical losers.
By Independent
June 11, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this
In reality neither party knows what to do about Iraq.
By Bosch
June 11, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this
Fred,
I was with you until you said that about the ANWR drilling, and maybe you can answer a question for me.
Or this question is for anyone:
If we increase drilling in our country, say in ANWR, Gulf of Mexico, where ever, who owns the oil that comes out of the ground?
Will it benefit the consumers in this country? Or will it go into the “world supply?”
By Bosch
June 11, 2008 9:19 AM | Link to this
Independent,
Keeping our troops elsewhere in the region is totally different than building permanent bases in Iraq. “In the region” could mean Germany. As long as we are on that side of the planet, that’s “in the region.”
By Independent
June 11, 2008 9:23 AM | Link to this
Again for the reading impaired “He will keep some troops in Iraq to protect our embassy and diplomats; if al Qaeda attempts to build a base within Iraq, he will keep troops in Iraq or elsewhere”
By JAY BOOKMAN
June 11, 2008 9:24 AM | Link to this
Dear qwaszx:
I hate to break it to you, but the overwhelming majority of Iraqis are Shiite. They outnumber Iraqi Sunnis by 3 to 1. So if Iraq is governed as a democracy, the Shiites will dominate.
In other words, it has been President Bush’s plan all along to “turn Iraq over” to the Shiites aligned with Iran, as you put it. The only alternative would be to install a Sunni as dictator of Iraq — you know, just like that Saddam guy?
By Brent
June 11, 2008 9:25 AM | Link to this
Bookman, I guess that means your voting for Obama?
You throw a cheapshot at McCain, support obama, and then copy another newspapers article. Wow, I can see why they pay you so much money. Genius!
By Scooter
June 11, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this
Hillbilly Ragger,
You and your ilk are the reason I don’t even bother anymore. Your mind is made up, despite the historical facts, and you avoid confronting those facts by distracting with your little nips. Notice you had no comment on the Former jihadis seem to be lining up to condemn Bin Laden. Did you distract from that because you know it would not be the case had we continued to follow the old strategy of “whacking moles”?
Bush forced the ideological confrontation to take place in Iraq and as a bonus we got to see through years of Saddam’s deceit. Because of this the world saw what Bin Laden had to offer and it really isn’t that attractive when compared to representative government.
To your request; no I will not cite it. Jay knows he wrote it and I was typing to him.
Now, don’t the terrorists have some talking points they need you to reinforce. For instance, they call the permanent bases “Lilly Pads” so get with the program.
By hillbilly ragger
June 11, 2008 9:44 AM | Link to this
Oh for crap’s sake, Scooter—evidence suggests that Bush didn’t know there were different kinds of Muslims in Iraq before he invaded.
And now you’re claiming he craftily “forced the ideological confrontation to take place in Iraq and as a bonus we got to see through years of Saddam’s deceit”?
Go on, pull the other one.
By Taxpayer
June 11, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this
I see Bush finally had to back off his tough guy talk and start apologizing to people that we need as our allies. Some people have to learn lessons the hard way. Unfortunately, when it’s our President that’s learning the lessons, we the people also have to suffer the consequences. Maybe, for future reference, reaching across the aisle and reaching out to our allies and actually listening to their advice would be a good thing to do, for starters.
By Robert
June 11, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this
Jay, I guess you wish that Republicans never leave Washington,D.C. You would not have anything to write about and be out of a job. I bet it hurt you to write about Hillary.
By Bite
June 11, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this
Bookman…credibility???? You have to be kidding. He sold out a long time ago. Bookman is a toady. Nothing he says has credibility and hasn’t for years.
By Dusty
June 11, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this
Taxpayer@9:51
I think one of your visitng bears must have smacked you aside the head. Democrats ought to be apologizing to Bush. He has kept our country safe and liberated two others. Democrats took control of Congress and have done exactly NOTHING worthwhile while complaining, investigating and “backsliding” against the war for which they voted.
Now Democrats want to give us a president with more shadows in his background than Al Capone.
Bush has refused to raise taxes, has “insulted” alQueda and the Taliban, has found a general who could fight successfully. He has given us rebates for the economy. He has spent billions on storm rescue work with only accusations for appreciation. He does not have CONTROL of the flow of oil or the manufacture of gas guzzlers.
You may deserve or want a socialistic communistic antiwar tax-raising President but I don’t. I don’t want this country CHANGED to a socialistic communistic antiwar tax-raising country that is pure bait for terrorists. NO WAY!
By Dave
June 11, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this
The British had troops in Irag for over 30 years now we want to do the same thing they did and think Iraq would welcome this. Some of you need to read the BBC article of British history of relations with Iraq you might gain some insight http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/recent/iraq/britainiraq01.shtml
By Taxpayer
June 11, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this
Dusty. Dusty. DUSTY! Wake UP! You’re day-dreaming again. Don’t you read the news. Bush was the one making the world tour and FINALLY apologizing for some of his past mistakes. I will give him credit for doing that much. Further, when are you going to give up on that lame argument about the Democrats having control. Don’t you even understand what a veto-proof majority is? Further, your lame attempts to mask the fact that the Republicans really did have control of our government and failed to even put in place those over-hyped permanent tax cuts shows that you really are acting out of desperation in your insatiable appetite for lies, deceit, and obfuscation. I couldn’t help throwing in the X-files reference. After all, we are talking about the fine specimens of “statesmen” that periodically volunteer to serve our country — the ones that offer us the world in exchange for a vote. By the way, Dusty, an even more diabolical, evil, way to hand this country over to the terrorists would be to have us fight and fight and fight and spend and borrow and spend and borrow until we are nothing but a decaying hulk of rusting infrastructure. Then, they could come over and just take what they want. Of course, by “they” I mean the ones with the money. You know. The ones that every single financial institution in America are out begging for money. Stick your head back in that hole, Dusty. You have no room to tell me or anyone else about what we deserve or want.
By Scooter
June 11, 2008 11:00 AM | Link to this
Hillbilly Ragger,
I’ll address your latest distraction and I’m out. And now you’re claiming he craftily “forced the ideological confrontation to take place in Iraq and as a bonus we got to see through years of Saddam’s deceit”?
Help me understand your point of distraction, are you saying Saddam was a cooperative fellow always willing to work with inspectors and didn’t employ stall tactics? Or are you saying representative government wasn’t a stated intention to counter tyrannical rule and terror?
If you were using the first to distract, you are removed from reality, so I’ll assume it was the later. To that I pose a 2003 speech by Bush.
[As we watch and encourage reforms in the region, we are mindful that modernization is not the same as Westernization. Representative governments in the Middle East will reflect their own cultures… This is a massive and difficult undertaking — it is worth our effort, it is worth our sacrifice, because we know the stakes. The failure of Iraqi democracy would embolden terrorists around the world, increase dangers to the American people, and extinguish the hopes of millions in the region. Iraqi democracy will succeed — and that success will send forth the news, from Damascus to Teheran — that freedom can be the future of every nation. (Applause.) The establishment of a free Iraq at the heart of the Middle East will be a watershed event in the global democratic revolution.]
Consider the other “one” pulled while you spun, and spun… and got so distracted you couldn’t see.
By Scooter
June 11, 2008 11:10 AM | Link to this
As we watch and encourage reforms in the region, we are mindful that modernization is not the same as Westernization. Representative governments in the Middle East will reflect their own cultures… This is a massive and difficult undertaking — it is worth our effort, it is worth our sacrifice, because we know the stakes. The failure of Iraqi democracy would embolden terrorists around the world, increase dangers to the American people, and extinguish the hopes of millions in the region. Iraqi democracy will succeed — and that success will send forth the news, from Damascus to Teheran — that freedom can be the future of every nation. (Applause.) The establishment of a free Iraq at the heart of the Middle East will be a watershed event in the global democratic revolution.
There, that’s better… I’m out.
By hillbilly ragger
June 11, 2008 11:25 AM | Link to this
Holy mother of fark, Scooter, you expect me to read one of Chimpy’s bloviating speeches from 2003? What kind of drugs are you on?
And as to my “point of distraction”, I’m not looking to distract, I’m ridiculing your notion that this cluster-foxtrot in Iraq has been beneficial to this nation in any way, save for a tiny cadre of profiteers who’ve robbed us blind the past five years.
But hey, don’t take my word for it. Take the word of the vast majority of Americans, who are fed up with the waste and the horrors and want us the hell out.
By JE
June 11, 2008 11:26 AM | Link to this
Speaking of rejection and making history. Wow, what about Jim Strickland the Gov of Ohio stating flat out that he’ll never consider the VP spot for Obama and he was at the top of the short list. Add this to his already bad publicty of James Johnson and Countrywide Financial. Not a good week for Obama. Talk about a biiitch slap across the face, ouch…the Strickland refusal was brutal! That had to have hurt. Obama is tanking in Florida, he lost 6 points in most all polls this week in FL when you compaired him with McCain. Obama must win Ohio to win in November, anyone with a spoon full of political sense knows to win you have to take either Ohio or Florida. This has to be killing the Obama camp to be so publicly rejected. No one wants to attach themselves to this evident loser.
By Change NOW
June 11, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this
we made Iraq worse…saddam was the only stabilizing influence, the baathists were able to appease sunnis, shiiates, kurds….any weapons he had, we sold him to fight iran…we have created ALL OF OUR OWN PROBLEMS!!!!!! just like afghanistan taliban whom we armed to fight soviets!!!! over and over and over……..
US purposely split up iraq just like balkans and other areas…so we can divide and conquer, our main pipeline from russian oilfields goes through kazhakstan, whom we propped up after the demise of Soviet Union….
the rest of the world hates us, and rightly so….
we are very evil and greedy empire builders w/utopian social engineering plan overseas to fit our own needs and then we hypocritically tell countries you hate our freedoms…what freedoms, can’t afford to travel, get a home, no jobs except military which now forced to accept felons….what is left to defend??
on the positive side, China probably will decide not to take us over now once they realize what a c r a p hole and festering cesspool we have become????
By Change NOW
June 11, 2008 11:44 AM | Link to this
I have a brilliant idea: let’s elect a candidate who says I know nothing about the economy, but it is fine anyway, but iraq is the real issue…if we lose in iraq, I lose…problem is, I plan on staying in iraq for 100 years. Unfortunately, I will only fan the flames of war for a year or two before I keel over, but it will be long enough to destroy what is left of western democracy!!!!!!!! all the rednecks here don’t care anyway….better to go down my w/antiquated racial hatred still intact that vote for positive change….if gays/lesbians can marry, I should be able to marry my first cousin!!!!!we already have ten kids anyway…..living off other’s taxes…but those dems don’t have any right to actually charge oil cos more to help our country…that would be wrong!!!!!
yeehaw…..
mcbush ‘08
By Centered
June 11, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this
the worst argument I’ve heard is that we haven’t had a terrorist attack in the U.S. since 9/11. that’s false, there haven’t been major ones, but there have been Muslims attack Americans since 9/11 here in this country, Malvo, at UNC, bomb at British Consulate in New York, the recent incident in California. but what is so shameful is that some people think that sending over 4000 Americans to die in a foreign craphole like Iraq is not better than having 3000 civilians die here. it’s like saying civilian lives are more important than military ones, and basically that military lives are automatically expendable just because they joined up. that in no way means we should ignorantly waste their lives. and in my opinion, military lives are much more valuable than civilian lives. they are actually serving there country, which a lot more than I can say about someone who calls themself a patriot because they put some yellow ribbons or an American flag bumper sticker on there car.
By Dusty
June 11, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this
Taxpayer,10:42
I certainly can tell you exactly what I want to tell you. If President Bush is making nice with other countries…fine. If you haven’t heard about the positions of Nancy Pelosi(D) and Reid(D) in Congress, somebody ought to tell you. Obamas would be even worse for the country than those two.
Go ahead and try to make this county CHANGE. IN no time, it will be SMALL CHANGE. As for you telling me what to post, FORGET IT. I learned about free speech a long time ago.
By dueno
June 11, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this
bush and the republicans raised my taxes. in 2003, in a sneaky back alley way they decreased the amount of taxes I could write off at the end of the year for things like equipment and vehicles. this in affect raised my taxes from the year before. now mccain is saying he is going to make that something he will give to small businesses to help them out. oh thanks buddy, for being nice enough to give me something back you voted to take away from me in the first place. also republicans tried to do away with overtime pay around that same time, the republican party is no friend to the working man. they have left capitalism for their own creation: corporatism. trust me, no ceo of any large corporation needs anymore money, hell, their kids, rarely ever serve in our military. the middle class needs help, and we can’t keep looking to the republican party for that help, they have lied to their own supporters, and they have lost their way.
By mike
June 11, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this
Why is it hussein obama wants to meet with iran but not petraeus?
By Dusty
June 11, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this
Bookman,
Your first sentence is a lie. We did not invade Iraq for bases.
Your title is a lie. McCain has made NO 100 year plan for the USA in Iraq.
Then, like a good liberal, you cut-n-paste from The Washington Post with quotations from an Iraqi politician acting “big”.. He said Goodbye, US troops, we don’t need you here any more.
He sounds like Obama who is anti-war and would say much the same thing.i.e. Goodbye, US troops, we don’t need you here in the USA any more.
Yeah, who needs ‘em. We will still have the Boy Scouts.
By Taxpayer
June 11, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this
Dusty! Wake up and read what I said — not what you want to hear. Try responding instead of reacting. I said “You have no room…”. I never said that you could not or would not speak so incoherently. The least you could do, assuming you wanted to carry on any form of intelligent conversation, is learn a little reading comprehension. Besides, I have no desire whatsoever to try and tell you what to do. If I did have such a desire, it would be to tell you something like “Grow Up” — if I did, that is. By the way, I heard that Mr. Wooten really has his hands full over there with an abundance of people presenting logical arguments against continuing with this administration’s policies. Doesn’t that just make you fighting mad. To think that there are so many people out there that just don’t “think” as you apparently do. Sic ‘em, if you want to, that is.
By Mythbuster
June 11, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this
Republicans talk about how much they hate those darn liberal entitlement programs, yet when they controlled the White House and the Congress, they did not address this problem, I wonder why? actually the government dole hurts the people receiving it more than anyone else. and ya know what, the two greatest entitlement programs in the history of the world were created by the Republicans, illegal immigration to give dirt cheap labor to their CEO buddies and let the taxpayers pick up the difference for the Latinos through the government dole, and Iraq, what an entitlement program that has been for citizens of another country also. it’s obvious that the last 8 years have been a disaster. as a patriot no one should support something that is so clearly hurting this country. and if the Republican party is the big tough man, than be a big tough man and admit you made a mistake and do something different that is positive to help America. I voted for Reagan the first time, but not the second time. because I saw what was happening and saw that I was being lied to and saw that Oliver North was not a hero, but a traitor. I was more mad at the Republican party than the people that voted against them. because they lied to me. and I bought it. but today, even after 8 years of stupidity and greed that’s right in everybody’s face to see, people are still supporting this awful people just so no one will see they were wrong, they made a mistake, even at the cost of our great nation.
By md
June 11, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this
they need to start thinking about opening bases in the us they have closed & procting the usa & the people therein & get out of ir
By Ben
June 11, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this
McCain never said “it will be OK for the military to stay in Iraq for 100 years”. As you well kinow, his reference was to the history of leaving the military for many years in Japan, Germany and Korea. History also shows that all these counties have to do is request our military leave and they will leave as was the case with France. Your cewdibility suffers with such blatant spins.
By Scooter
June 11, 2008 12:41 PM | Link to this
Hillbilly Ragger,
My weakness has allowed your seething ignorance and resistance to information counter to yours draw me back in to expose said ignorance.
I’m ridiculing your notion that this cluster-foxtrot in Iraq has been beneficial to this nation in any way, save for a tiny cadre of profiteers who’ve robbed us blind the past five years.
To maintain that position you ignored me twice posting a link to ‘Former Jihadis lining up to condemn Bin Laden’ and I’m sure you will ignore this next one to preserve you fallacious position. But, here it is anyway and this would not have happened if we turned Osama into the Martyr he wants to be - Bush and our soldiers discredited his ideology first.
Osama bin Laden’s standing has dropped significantly in some pivotal Muslim countries, while support for suicide bombings and other acts of violence has “declined dramatically,” according to a new survey released yesterday.
Yeah that isn’t making us safer?
By hillbilly ragger
June 11, 2008 12:48 PM | Link to this
Scooter, that’s a brilliant premise. It was worth dumping a trillion dollars in the sand in Iraq and losing over four thousand soldiers so that you could cite a story wherein OBL’s “standing has dropped significantly in some pivotal Muslim countries.”
That’s what became of “Dead or Alive?” making the World’s Worstest Terrist less attractive to that handful of Islamic nutjobs who were ever attracted to him in the first place?
Man, do you guys suck at this!
By Dusty
June 11, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this
Taxpayer@12:14
You are trapped by your own words. Your version of “shut up” is this @ 10:42; You have no room to tell me or anyone else what we deserve or want.
What kinda ‘room’ do I have that I don’t have freedom of speech? There isn’t one. If you say I speak incoherently, then the truth is incoherent. You don’t want to hear the truth about Obama. You want to bash Bush, first of all for winning two elections quite legally.
Liberals may be posting over at Wooten’s. Liberals invade every blog to propagandize their policies and blogging is cheap. ‘Devastator’ admits that is what he is doing at Wooten’s. IN THE NEWS is cutting-n-pasting 30 t0 40 times a day at Luckovich’s. That’s Dem policy. If you have a sorry candidate, then brain wash as many and as much as possible. I see they have gotten to you, easily.
By GodHatesTrash
June 11, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this
If you neo-con(federate)s had brains, then perhaps they could be washed.
Halfwit twits.
By Crafty
June 11, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this
This would be a better headline for Obama Hussein:
With Obama Hussein in charge, we will now begin to fight terrorists on our own soil.
That is exactly what the next 4 years will be. I can see Obama hiding in a bathroom while we’re getting bombed. Just like Ray Nagin did after Katrina. Libs are all the same. Really stupid people who complain about everything.
By T
June 11, 2008 1:40 PM | Link to this
Scooter Interesting article. However, it does state that these people are against hurting their own, half still believe it is ok to hurt Americans. They like America less now. Is that a good thing? By the way Germany also wants us out of their country. Bases are slowly closing there. Our Armed forces are being over worked and over used. So is their equipment. They have no time to recoup. Annual rotations are a joke. Sure a unit can not deploy to Iraq without being home for a year. However, that does not include deployments to Afganistan or any where else. Nor does that stop individual soldiers from being deployed twice in the same year.Does 100 years in Iraq mean that all 140,000 troops need to be there?
By dueno
June 11, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
after being in the military, just thinking about being stationed in Iraq is so sad. no place to go after work to hang out, blow off some steam (except on base stuff and that was usually pretty lame), very little chance of getting any sex for a year (for a young man that’s some real punishment), no ‘site’-seeing tours of anything interesting, most of the people don’t like you. we just need to get our people out of there, george got us into a bad situation that even Jesus himself would have trouble getting out of.
By Second Banana
June 11, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
This blog is only about 150 posts behind The Jim Wooten Experience.
By T
June 11, 2008 2:15 PM | Link to this
Dueno Could you imagine the look on those poor soldiers faces when their permanent orders say Iraq. I suppose there is always the PX or BX for entertainment. Oh, if they are lucky Burger King. Thats my favorite hang out. Walking around in pt’s when you are off work. Drinking not so near beer.Definately no sex. At least not the sex you want. Military.com said some wacko Senator was trying to take Playboy mag from them too.
By Taxpayer
June 11, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this
Dusty,
Have you forgotten the basics. You should not take a person’s sentences and slice and dice them and dissect them in a vain attempt to support some meaningless supposition[s]. Isn’t that what you just [wrongly, in my humble opinion] accused Mr. Bookman of doing?
Now, as to my sentence: “You have no room to tell me or anyone else about what we deserve or want.”
If you recall, Dusty, from your earlier post: “You may deserve or want a socialistic communistic antiwar tax-raising President but I don’t.”
My sentence was a partial response to that particular statement (above) that you directed at me as well as a closing remark for that particular post. Again, I did not attack your right to the same freedoms that we all enjoy as Americans. I don’t know how to say it any plainer than that. It did not mean “shut up” — it more closely translates, at least partially, into “your posts lead me to believe that you are a very closed-minded and uninformed person who is prone to making irrational statements…”. For example, how on earth did you arrive at the “conclusions” that you have stated? Will you ask “what conclusions”? If so, how about these for openers:
“You don’t want to hear the truth about Obama.”
“You want to bash Bush, first of all for winning two elections quite legally.”
“…I see they have gotten to you, easily.”
I seriously doubt that you’ll be interested in the following but I’ll throw it out there anyway just to give you a few facts:
I voted for Jimmy Carter. I have voted for the Republican Presidential candidate ever since. In this year’s primary, I voted for Ron Paul — not because I consider myself to be a Libertarian but because I found his honesty quite refreshing. I don’t like McCain or Obama and I doubt that I will change my mind before the general election. I am tired of voting for the “lesser of the evils” and yet that is still all I see coming out of the Republican and Democrat camps. I do not consider myself to be strongly aligned, philosophically, with any one party — my beliefs are an ever-evolving blend. Besides, I also believe that stagnation is a terrible waste of the human mind.
By Peter
June 11, 2008 2:45 PM | Link to this
Gee Dusty should tell us why we need bases in Iraq!
She should also tell us where the Iraq Oil money is…… does she have a clue?
Seems it is disappearing around the world in private accounts.
Congress can’t find it, and Bush isn’t telling us any News of that money as well.
But are we NOT rebuilding Iraq with AMERICAN TAX PAYER MONEY ?
By dueno
June 11, 2008 2:47 PM | Link to this
taxpayer, I think the same way, I wish more people did. the truth and the answers are closer to the middle than at either pole. when someone decides to be a Republican or a Democrat they essentially paint themselves into a corner. polarizing themself. then when someone form their party does something stupid they feel that they need to defend their party at all costs, even the well-being of America, just to attempt to save face. I’m just the opposite, when someone lets me down because they have lied to me, I’m madder at them than their opposition. we should all politicians accountable for their actions, even if they are in the same club as we are. it’s about America, not politicians, we need to focus on America, not focus on supporting a particular political party. especially to the point that we blame everybody but the oil companies for this oil mess. WWTJD? what would Thomas Jefferson do? and no he wasn’t perfect, but we should think about today and what he would do in certain situations, not what our political minders would want us to do for their own selfish reasons.
By Peter
June 11, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
hey …….By Second Banana…..funny comment!
June 11, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this
This blog is only about 150 posts behind The Jim Wooten Experience.
Know why….this blog makes sense and has substance….. unlike Whooten’s cheerleading Right wing Nothing crap!
He writes about not affording Obama, yet a Trillion Dollar made up war is OK with him.
Maybe you can tell us where the Iraq OIL money is going, while American Tax payers rebuild Iraq?
Tell me what BUSH is doing for Vets that come home with mental illness, other then placing them next to shooting ranges, so they continue to live with the horrors they had to deal with?
Please tell me why BUSH allowed FEMA Trailers to be placed in America that is so hazardest to the families living in them, that the children are getting cancer?
Who is going to pay for their illnesses?
By mike
June 11, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
Well, look… I don’t know about any of you but I don’t see many folks here that wanna colonize Iraq. Just don’t see the point. (Ooops - I’m forgetting the Obama factor. Might need to think again. Gotta have somewhere to go to start over after that happens).
By nephew
June 11, 2008 3:30 PM | Link to this
Iraq the biggest entitlement program this world has ever known, on the dole: people from another country that really don’t like us and the corporate friends of cheney and bush. I just wish I could watch Jesus and God got at ol’ george on judgement day, it ain’t gonna be pretty.
By Dusty
June 11, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this
Taxpayer,
I did not “slice or dice ” your words or Bookman’s. I quotedyours ver batim. Now you are disclaiming your own words.
You say you are a (blended)libertarian. Fine. Cast a vote that does not count. Obama resembles Jimmy Carter (except for military service of course) and you voted for Carter. You want your supposed “stagnation” turned into another Carter era even worse than the one before.
I recognize things that are easily discernible. One example is your Bush bashing. Subtle but shown in the utter blindness to the things that Bush has done for us. We are safe and sound and free.
You are what I call a wishy washy lib. You try to call it “philosophical”. That is better than what I see from Bookman which is straight out lying.
He has moved to another subject in his “duck & dodge” blogs and gives us yet another fabricated claim. Anything to please you “philosopical” libs I suppose, the blind leading the blind.
By Reality
June 11, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this
We need to just go back to old fashioned colonialism. Here is a quick to do list for our new colony; Kill all insugents and foreign fighters and anyone who won’t go along with us including Muslim clerics, install a puppet government, steal their oil and use it to break OPEC, build numerous military bases in preparation for the inevitable war with Iran, share the booty with our allies. In return the colony gets; law and order, freedom of or from religion as long as you do not interfer with our running the country, full protection of the US from all enemies, an impartial government who could care less if your Sunni or S** there by ending Muslim religous infighting as well as tribal problems.
By Taxpayer
June 11, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this
Dusty,
What do you expect me to say (before you say anything, let me guess: “I don’t expect you to say anything, blah, blah, blah). You obviously have chosen to read whatever it is that you want to hear into everything that others post. If that’s how your mind chooses to deal with words, sentence structure, etc., that it apparently cannot grasp, that’s fine. Have a nice day.
By Peter
June 11, 2008 4:16 PM | Link to this
HA HA HA Dusty says ………..Subtle but shown in the utter blindness to the things that Bush has done for us. We are safe and sound and free.
HA HA HA BUSH has made America less safe, gee where is Bin Laden these days Dusty….with him out there America is definitely NOT SAFE!
Dusty we are also BROKE as a country with high inflation, and a huge deficit, that no Republican is doing anything about!
By gttim
June 11, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this
They couldn’t even be bothered to overthrow their own government—we had to do it for them!
And the French had to help us because we could not do it alone…
He has kept our country safe and liberated two others.
If he has liberated 2 others, why can’t we leave them? I guess it depends what your definition of “liberated” is.
Now Democrats want to give us a president with more shadows in his background than Al Capone.
The Bush family is probably one of the most corrupt and crooked families in the world. This is not even going back to the days when Prescott did business with the Nazis or was part of a group of “US Corporate Barons” who tried to overthrow the US government. Bush’s brother got nabbed in the S&L fallout, his father selling weapons to terrorists and his sister-in-law got caught smuggling. Don’t even get started on the nieces and nephews.
By S&L
June 11, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this
very good point, the Bush’s were involved in the S&L fallout and now look, the Bush’s are involved again and we have a very similar crime occur. it’s bad to basically steal things from others, but it’s even worse when you blame the victim for the crime, as most conservatives have done. caring about America also means caring about other Americans, the two are not separate.
By GOPs got to go
June 11, 2008 6:09 PM | Link to this
Dusty, You are incredibly dense. So go dust something please, maybe your rarely used brain.
Joe and all the rest of “Jim’s” gang, take your McCarthyism, Socialist BS and shove it. No one is buying it any more.
By Grateful Flea
June 11, 2008 11:14 PM | Link to this
Here’s a great campaign slogan for Obama: “It’s the Iraq War, $150 oil, massive deficits, broken healthcare, and the crumbling infrastructure, stupid.”
Here’s a great campaing slogan for Mccain: “Oh no, I din’t!”
bwa, Obwama!
By Jessica
June 15, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this
Could you please direct me to the original plan that Bush has for Iraq’s future. I believe that he mentioned that companies i.e. Halepertin would be acting as the “police”, also that the US would be incomplete control of the air space over Iraq. I would appreciate this information.