Jay Bookman

By Charles

May 21, 2008 8:54 AM | Link to this

I can’t WAIT until Mr. Boortz sees this new lie from Mr. Bookman! Let’s see if Jay will actually answer his phone today! (probably not - Liberals have no backbones)

By zeke

May 21, 2008 9:02 AM | Link to this

No J. Bookman! The ridiculous is the current socialist “progressive” tax system! It is straight out of Karl Marx! Progressive is the new code word to hide the true meaning and agenda of socialist, populist, communist in our society! the only thing progressive about the progressive agenda is the progression of liberalism, socialism, communism fascism and communism in our country! The “FAIR TAX” is just that, IT IS FAIR TO EVERYONE! You liberals should be falling all over it! It meets your agenda of higher taxes on those who work har, risk capital, persevere and become successful and in turn become higher earners! It would also force those like the Kennedys, Rockefellers, and other to pay a fair share on the purchases they make and not avoid them by inherited trust funds and the like! How great it would be for John Doe to earn $1000 per week and his check would be $1000 per week and not $600! Same for Joe Doe making $250 per week and his check being for $250 and not $200! How great would that be? FANTASTIC!!!

By B Burns

May 21, 2008 9:03 AM | Link to this

You know, I seldom agree with you. However, in regard to Neal Boortz, he fancies himself as being very intelligent. Maybe he is and maybe not. I know one thing, if someone is getting the best of him he will either end the call or try to make jokes at the callers expense. If he won’t debate you on the air, then he’s afraid you will make him look bad.

By J Moore

May 21, 2008 9:19 AM | Link to this

Jay Bookman and Cynthia Tucker are pathetic Marxists that believe that a janitor and a doctor should be paid the same amount because everyone is a vitim of racist white people. No one has to face up to personal responsiblility and another government program is what is needed for whatever ails us. That includes, Grady, MARTA, welfare, ad naseum. Have I got it about right Jay? You pathetic loser.

By College student

May 21, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this

I wish you all the luck. Try and convince some of these idiots that the FairTax is populist economics at its worst.

By SOUTHSIDE

May 21, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this

BOORTZ IS YOUR TYPICAL NEW-AGE CONSERVATIVE BLOW-HARD. RUNS HIS MOUTH, BUT THEN RUNS FROM THE FIGHT.

By Pompano

May 21, 2008 9:26 AM | Link to this

Jay’s one-trick stick of “all white guys are evil racist except me” is pretty pathetic.

Notice that Jay leaves out the part that Neal did challenge him to a debate - which Jay so cowardly refused.

By Pompano

May 21, 2008 9:36 AM | Link to this

Of course ‘By College Student’ would be for the status quo income tax - BECAUSE YOU PAY NO TAX.

Let me guess - you’re planning to become a Public School teacher??

By SOUTHSIDE

May 21, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this

MOST OF THESE RIGHT-WING MOUTH PIECES ARE EITHER IDIOTS OR JERKS, AND THEIR FOLLOWERS ARE USUALLY BOTH!! THE RIGHT IS ALL TALK(RADIO)!!

By Bill

May 21, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this

Is Boortz still on the air? I thought he vowed to retire when he hit 90.

By Copyleft

May 21, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this

Glad to see you’re getting to discuss this idiotic proposal, Bookman. Though it won’t have any impact on the “true believers” in the FairTax cult, it’s good to get the facts about this scam out to more people.

By Matthew

May 21, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this

There is a reason that nobody has any clue who the hell Jay Bookman is, while Boortz is nationally syndicated.

Liberals are so funny when they try to buck their own passivity. It just comes off as so unnatural.

By vanno

May 21, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this

Jay, make sure and be able to defend the 1913 16th amendment (fed income tax) and why it passed, which was a partisan joke that actually back-fired (you DO know the story, right?) The bigger joke is how people can STILL actually support that political fiasco. The 16th amendment simply has no sound economic foundation.

By Palko

May 21, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this

There is nothing “fair” about the fair tax. Unless you are making six figures, you will not benefit from the fair tax. Try to wrap your tiny brains around this: Lower and middle income folks will be paying a greater percentage of their income than the wealthy because every penny they make will be spent on necessities. If you are wealthy, you do not spend all of the money that you earn. (Hello!) You might want to try reading some opposing viewpoints, so you can actually make an informed decision.

By AH

May 21, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this

Good luck to you Mr. Bookman. Try and keep an open mind and I hope you actually read either the two books by Mr. Boortz and Rep. John Linder or the actual bill.

After your done I hope you look at what you learned and then come back and make an argument against the Fairtax since I have never seen you make one.

In the end I think you will have to agree that the Fairtax is better than what we have and I hope that you can constructively add to the overall concept.

By Copyleft

May 21, 2008 10:00 AM | Link to this

Vanno: No, it has a social and political foundation. Economics be damned; the PEOPLE, not the marketplace, are what matter.

By reservoirDAWG

May 21, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this

Why don’t you anti fair tax people read the book and actually try to understand the proposal. Our current income tax system is nothing less than a joke.

By SOUTHSIDE

May 21, 2008 10:06 AM | Link to this

AND WHAT ARE YOU POMPANO, A SELF-MADE MILLIONAIRE?…YOU JERK! AT LEAST COLLEGE STUDENT IS EDUCATED. TYPICAL..ATTACKING TEACHERS. THE “IDEAS” OF THE RIGHT HAVE DESTROYED OUR ECONOMY, OUR NATIONAL SECURITY, AND EVEN OUR SOCIAL CIVILITY. THOSE THAT THINK THAT ALL THINGS GOVERNMENT ARE EVIL WERE GIVEN A CHANCE TO DO IT THEIR WAY AND THE RESULTS ARE OBVIOUS.

By Gentle G

May 21, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

Tell me what’s wrong with getting your WHOLE paycheck, and only paying tax on what you buy?

By Hmmmmm

May 21, 2008 10:16 AM | Link to this

College student,

I was once a college student. My head was filled with MUSH. I graduated and started to work and my once liberal views have all changed! Be very careful who you call an idiot, as you make yourself look very “idiotic” by spewing ignorance. I have all the confidence in the world that when you graduate and start working you will see the flaw in your ideology. Unless of course you decide to become a university professor and NEVER see the error in your ways! Most of these people could never make it in the private sector! Please do us all a favor and study the fair tax proposal before you make yourself look idiotic. The Fair Tax is not perfect by any stretch, but it is surely better than the system that we have.

By Pompano

May 21, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

Hey Southside - yes you guys are really so smart down there in Clayton County. You’re part of the 10% that can’t pay their mortgage on-time and want “to blame it on the man”.

Bet you can’t name three correct things about the Fair Tax proposal - or even our current tax system for that matter.

By Ben

May 21, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

If Neal were to propose MoreTax I’m sure you would support him. We need a few far left views to make life interesting.

By theBiscuit

May 21, 2008 10:28 AM | Link to this

Jay. Neal isn’t avoiding you. He’s said he wanted an open forum on location in front of an audience to debate you. Oh yes, he’s so fearful of the mighty liberal Jay Bookman.

Btw, he even said at Emory in front of a student body that would be leaning your way. What arrogance on your part to think that you’re the only person with a brain to have challenged him.

By theBiscuit

May 21, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this

FYI Jay. nice job using Neal to make you little more popular and give you 10 more minutes.

By theBiscuit

May 21, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

We should go to socialism so people like southside can make it. They need the government to help them because of a lack of skill.

By Jim

May 21, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this

Every AJC comment section overflows with every abuse of logic known to man - ad hominem attacks, strawmen, post hoc reasoning, overgeneralization, and on and on.

I would like to see the AJC web page employ a non-partisan editor to star or otherwise mark the comments that are worth reading (left or right) and let me and other readers avoid this shouting match of true-believers insulting each other.

By Hmmmmm

May 21, 2008 10:45 AM | Link to this

Southside,

Please get your facts straight! Since you guys re-elected a majority to the House and Senate everything has gone to CRAP! I’m not saying the right side has all the right answers, because even the right side has not endorsed the Fair Tax. If we are going to change the current system, WE THE PEOPLE have to rise up and demand that it be changed! That means that we all have to come together!

Copyleft,

Economics, the market place have a direct impact to the PEOPLE! Politicians, Democrat or Republican have only ONE thing in mind! Control! Wake up man, The Tax system does not WORK! We as a people have to come together and DEMAND CHANGE! The Fair Tax is our best option!

By reservoirDAWG

May 21, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this

College Student, like the old saying goes, if you’re not a liberal when your 20 you have no heart and if you’re not a conservative when you’re 30 you have no brain.

By Shannon, M.Div.

May 21, 2008 11:39 AM | Link to this

Fact: the current system is broken.

Fact: the so-called Fair Tax is about as “fair” as the Patriot Act is “patriotic.”

Fact: the best arguments for the “fair” tax that I’ve heard are these:

*It says fair right in the name! It’s fair! (Those who named it had no stake in your perceptions, right?)

*The current system is broken! (True, but that doesn’t mean that this is what should replace it).

*Progressive income tax is communist! (Not exactly. Does it have elements of socialism? Sure, but in a pure capitalist society, there are no protections for average citizens, consumers, or—well, anyone).

I want to keep my money that I earned! (Under the national sales tax plan, you won’t. Expect that gasoline and food prices will continue to rise, and you’ll be spending a lot of $$ on them. As inflation rises, so will your sales tax. That’s exactly what we *don’t need).

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 11:51 AM | Link to this

AWWWW. Jay Bookman is afraid of Neal Boortz. Seriously Jay, go on his show and debate him. He’s said he’d debate you anytime anywhere.

To all of the Fair Tax haters: Come up with a better plan.

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this

Shannon, M.Div., Oil prices rise because of market demand. Food prices have risen because of the environmental nut cases and bio fuels from corn. Fact. Come up with better solutions

By Bacon's Gal

May 21, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this

If you really want to debate NB, then just call as if you were an everyday listener. Do they really have to know who you are for you disagree with him on air. Seems to me if you really wanted to discuss the pros and cons have some balls and just call. Isn’t that what pr and, e-mail and your column are for? Chicken, BTW people stop commenting on which you do not know!!

By Read the books

May 21, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this

Under the fair tax people making below a minimum income level would get a prebate on taxes to defer the amount of tax they pay on purchases of necessities. So pretty much the same folks that don’t pay tax now, still wouldn’t pay taxes. AND they bring home their entire paycheck and don’t have to wait to get a tax refund at the end of the year.

Foreign visitors, illegal aliens, those getting paid in cash would all pay taxes - not just those who get a company paycheck. This would potentially increase the tax revenue source.

Taxing purchases would encourage savings and investment.

The government could save most of the cost of the IRS since the thousands of pages of tax code would be reduced to nothing.

Businesses would be encouraged to locate in a tax beneficial environment and would ultimately increase jobs which helps everyone.

The folks who would not benefit from this are politicians who can’t give breaks to their cronies and constituents, CPAs, Tax Attorneys and IRS employees.

Does all this sound so bad?

By Skeptic Tank

May 21, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this

Jay: Perhaps this suggestion is untenable, but let me throw it out there for you: would you consider writing a book, or at least a piece, on the fallacies of the Fair Tax? There needs to be a reasoned counterpoint to the Fair Tax proposal, perhaps more than one column in the AJC could encompass. If the FT is, indeed, a fiction predicated on smoke and mirrors…I’d appreciate someone refuting it as eloquently as it has been propounded.

By Staci

May 21, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this

Is there really such a thing as FAIR TAX?

By Dawgma

May 21, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this

Palko, Why not raise your initiatives, get a better paying job, work 2 jobs, do whatever it takes to get ahead. Be proactive in your pursuit of happiness instead of crying over the haves and have nots. Most likely those who have a higher income than you are probably higher educated and posess a higher motivation to achieve on their own instead of waiting for the government to hand it to them. You pathetic loser.

By myother

May 21, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this

I like the fair tax because it elimanites the tax game played by congress. It also taxes consumption and not savings. And for once in my life maybe I’ll know how much I’m paying the federal goverment each year. Try to calculate that now with all the hidden taxes(tires, gas, utilities, corporate, income). Most corporate tax is passed on to the consumer anyway and then taxed again at the retail level. Paying income tax should not require a CPA degree or computer program. Have you tried to do your income tax manually lately? Yes, I would like to have the fair tax but, it will never happen while congress works for the lobbiest. Addendum, I do not care much for Neil Bootz’s big mouth.

By Shannon, M.Div.

May 21, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this

Hey “Truth”: Fact. The “why” of rising prices is irrelevant. It remains truth that a sales tax will hit hardest when inflation on necessities rises.

By the way, about global warming—the verdict isn’t still out on that one. The science is clear, and only shills for the energy industries are being paid to disagree. Find me some scientists not affiliated with any right-wing think tanks or energy industries who disagree. And good luck with that.

And you know what? It’s still irrelevant. If global warming is happening, it doesn’t matter what caused it. The consequences are huge. It’s bad for the developed world and merciless for the developing world. We need to do whatever the heck we can to at least slow it down so our technology and infrastructure can adjust to the new climates.

We can all talk until our tongues fall out and type until our fingers fall off… and it won’t change this stuff. You can say “there’s no such thing as global warming” and click your heels repeatedly and it won’t take you back to a world where it ain’t so. You can say that the flat tax is “fair” over and over and over, and it doesn’t change the fact that (depending on its configuration) it either won’t help anyone but the very wealthy or it won’t bring in enough for the government to cover basic functions.

Meh. I have real work to do. You kids keep duking it out.

By Mark

May 21, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this

The biggest problem with the FT is that it would impact the people making less than $150K/yr the hardest (about 90%) since they spend a larger share of their income on food, housing, fuel, etc. Some argue that the prebate on the FT plan would alleviate that - well if that’s the case, who would pay taxes at all? It would also impact retirees with a double taxation, since they paid it when they were working and have to pay again under the FT. There is no way a 23% rate could even come close to paying for services without huge cuts and you know that SSN & DoD are sacred cows that won’t feel the pinch.

As far as Jay being scared to debate Neal, Neal wants an audience forum that would surely be filled with the fans of his show and the FT, i.e. a hostile audience to Jay. Not much could be debated in this kind of forum.

To me, a true “fair tax” would be a FLAT TAX on ALL income, no matter how you make it (hourly wages, stock trades, bonuses, etc). That way everyone pays the same rate, whether they are rich or poor. When the tax cuts got passed in 2001 and 1981, revenues did go up, but it was disproportionally paid by lower income people. Revenue sharing from the Federal Gov’t was cut to states and cities and they had to raise their taxes to make up the difference. Unlike the Feds, they HAVE to balance their budgets. They cannot borrow into oblivion to pay for things.

I am not a socialist by any means by proposing this (to quote Frank Zappa, communism doesn’t work because people like to own stuff), but would like to see a fairer system where everyone that is subject to taxation gets an even deal from the IRS.

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 1:21 PM | Link to this

Shannon, M.Div., Oil prices are not relevant? Then why did you bring it up? Global Warming? Again, you’ve brought that topic up not me. You can’t blame all of life’s problems on global warming. As far as finding you a non right wing scientist, fine. How about the founder of Weather Channel wanting to sue OwlGore over global scamming? The Earths warming and cooling have been around since time began. There is nothing you nor I can do to change that. Now, back to the Fair Tax. Come up with a better idea other than trashing Neal’s idea.

By DarrylWD

May 21, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this

Jay… there you go again, lying. On many occasions Neal Boortz has invited you to appear on his radio show, and has offered a neutral site to discuss in a Townhall format as well.

Goodness, you are such a Pathetic Liberal LIAR? I’m sure your ancestors would be ashamed of you and your actions.

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 1:43 PM | Link to this

Jay, Quit playing “the victim” and debate Boortz. You’re the big bad AJC page editor so you should feel comfortable debating him on neutral ground. Debate him at The Varsity. I mean, why not. The only thing you have to lose is more subscribers. He’s sold a ton of books and has a very successful radio show. Are you jealous and do you feel inadequate? By the way, please feel free to call me a pathetic white person like you did on your last blog.

By Jay Bookman

May 21, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this

To DarrylWD:

That is 100 percent, absolutely incorrect. Boortz has repeatedly refused to allow me to defend my position on his show, and he has never invited to appear on it. He has spent hours of airtime attacking me personally, but refuses to give me a chance to respond using that same microphone. Ask Boortz yourself. I would be very surprised if he claimed otherwise, because the record is very clear. Instead, Boortz has offered to debate the FairTax issue with me off-the-air, where relatively few people could hear it. My position is that if he uses that 50,000-watt syndicated microphone to attack me, he can let me borrow it for a few minutes to return the favor. We offer space in our pages all the time for people who disagree with our positions, and even seek them out. Personally, I’m not a fan of a government-imposed Fairness Doctrine requiring that all sides get equal time on the public airwaves. But a decency-imposed fairness doctrine seems like a good idea.

By sea

May 21, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this

What is wrong with you people. Aren’t you tired of the government taking your hard earned money out of your paycheck without your permission and giving it to some low life who blames society for all his/her woes and makes it a crime for those of us who want to succeed in life without a hand out from the government. I work 50-60 hours sometimes and want all the money that I worked for in my check and if I want to give something to some needy person let it be my choice not the government. Meanwhile the quote “needy” are sitting at home watching their HDTV’s, talking on their cell phones waiting for the mail man to deliver that welfare check that was stolen out of yours and mine paycheck.

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this

Jay Bookman, You crack me up. I’ve heard Neal say several times that he has invited you on to debate live. Fairness doctrine? Dude, you just don’t get it. You’ll probably blame your newspapers decline on global warming.

By Taxpayer

May 21, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this

Once our elected officials get to the point where they can honestly say that all government expenditures in existence have been thoroughly scrutinized and confirmed to be both reasonable and necessary, then we can talk about a fair tax. Otherwise, talk about the FairTax(TM) is nothing more than another scam — something to divert one’s attention away from the valid issues. We cannot even get the elected ones to get rid of the obvious pork. How could any reasonable person trust them to do anything else right if they cannot handle this one “simple” task first. The arguments about implementing this FairTax(TM) in order to hold the government accountable makes absolutely no sense. We hold government accountable be electing people that are willing to make the hard choices such as eliminating waste rather than creating more waste or re-naming the current waste or, even worse, re-redistributing the current waste. Implementing a system such as this FairTax(TM) does absolutely nothing to address even the “simple” issue of “pork”. It does nothing to eliminate the wasteful legislation such as the farm bill. It has no bearing whatsoever on our war spending. It would have made no difference whatsoever in the cost of energy or healthcare. It would have done nothing to reduce the size of government (replacing the IRS function with an equivalent tax collection function is not a reduction in government). It would have done nothing to ensure against tax fraud (no, the drug dealers still will not be charging a tax on illegal drug sales). All of the statements to the contrary are just that — mere statements. They are repeatedly offered up as though there were some scientific basis to support them when, in fact, they are no more valid or better supported than any statement given here.

On a different topic, has anyone followed the issue with the land application of sludge and the scientists that supported it. Those PHDs and others out there that utilize fabricated data need to be a little more thorough in their thought process. The devil will ultimately collect his dues once you sell him your soul. They really need to think ahead to the day when they have to pay up.

By Jay Bookman

May 21, 2008 2:03 PM | Link to this

To The Truth:

If he said that, he told a great big whopper.

By Disband the IRS

May 21, 2008 2:03 PM | Link to this

I for one am sick of the IRS. I have cut my and my wifes W4 exemptions down to one a piece to see if we can satisfy the IRS hunger for our money. The whole thing needs to be revamped. How a family making 150K a year does not qualify for full credits for their children is insane. With the price of everything today 150K a year will just support a family from paycheck to paycheck with college to pay for. Just got another notice that the IRS wants more money. Looks like my house will be on the foreclosure list soon.

By Observer

May 21, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

Mr. Bookman - YOU ARE A LIAR! I have heard Neal Boortz (on several occasions)offer to debate you in a public forum with a live audiance. For whatever reason, he refuses to debate you on the air. For whatever reason, you refuse to debate him in front of a live audience. I don’t see why both can’t be accomplished at the same time. For you to state that Neal Boortz is affraid to debate you is a DELIBERATE misrepresentation of the facts. But then again, why should you be concerned with the facts - after all, you’re a journalist.

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this

Jay Bookman, Ok. So if he openly invited you on to debate how could that be a whopper? Do you listen to him or do you get your talking points from Keith Olberman? The reason I ask is because I see Ms. Tucker on Chris Matthews show all of the time. Keith Olberman is Chris’s lapdog and I figured you were just trying to get his attention so that you could get on his show. By the way, write a book if you hate the Fair Tax so much.

By Pompano

May 21, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this

I notice that none of the Fair Tax haters ever bother to comment on the issue that revamping our Tax Code will encourage Companies to bring foreign investment dollars back on-shore. The IRS is driving American companies - and the jobs they provide - offshore.

They also never mention the massive amount of money we waste each year on Tax compliance that would get pumped back into the economy.

By CashLessSociety

May 21, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this

We must work together to solve our country’s tax problems. To do that, we must start with a system of taxation that spreads the burden equally amongst the population. The FairTax(TM) can accomplish this task as long as the issue of collecting the taxes on every taxable transaction is dealt with up front. A cashless society is the one sure answer. Every American citizen will need a simple debit card. Most people already have at least one. Then, every American citizen will need a social security number. Most already have this as well. Finally, we just need to link these two items together with a photo ID and cash can be made a thing of the past. Illegal immigrants won’t be able to function here in America any longer. Terrorists will not be able to buy bomb-making products with their hordes of cash. Drug dealers will be going to other countries to do business because no one in America would dare purchase something that is illegal. This approach in conjunction with the FairTax(TM) will solve so many of America’s problems. Spread the word. FAIRTAX(TM) PLUS NO MORE CASH.

By Roy

May 21, 2008 2:28 PM | Link to this

Who can believe Jay Bookman? The man is an ultra-leftist to which lying comes naturally. Boortz has offered several times to debate Bookman. What is Bookman’s response? Write an editorial, then hide under his desk. Typical leftist.

By DarrylWD

May 21, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this

WOW Jay, at least you had the hair on your xxxxx to respond to my comments, no matter how much you continue to lie. I’m impressed.

OK, let’s take a step back and “hypothetically” create a world where Neal won’t let you on his little radio show… I know it’s stretching it a bit, but let’s all imagine. Why don’t you just call in as a regular caller to discuss your points with him. If he cuts you off or won’t speak of the topic, then we all will be able to witness him for the person you claim him to be. Now there is an idea!

Come on Jay… don’t you want to carry on the Bookman name with pride and without shame?

Gor for it!

OH… and stop trying to create a smoke screen by garbling a mess on the Fairness Doctrine… you HAVE to learn to stay on target if you are going to make it as a serious journalist brother.

By janie Hopwood

May 21, 2008 2:30 PM | Link to this

Neither would any politician I have ever heard of or any talk show host or tv analyst. Face it, the only people who do have a frame of reference for the problem are working too hard to discuss it.

By Taxpayer

May 21, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this

The Fortune 500 company that I worked for never once claimed that taxes they paid here in America were the source of their problems. Labor costs were always the number one issue that they claimed. All the while, executive labor cost just kept going higher and higher — the more jobs they outsourced, the more money they had for bonuses and stock options. Of course, these executives then started whining about the taxes they had to pay on their multi-million dollar bonuses and millions in stock options. But, Bush and the Republicans fixed that by introducing the huge tax cuts. So, what is not fair about taxes now? Heck, Bush even threw in two big tax rebates to the masses during his two terms and we are still talking about how unfair taxes are. What will it take to satisfy some people? Do we need to just eliminate taxes altogether. If that’s what it takes, then let’s start up the appropriate chant — Four More Wars, I mean, No More Taxes.

By Observer

May 21, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this

Mr. Bookman - What is your objection to debating Neal Boortz before a live audiance or in a “town hall” format? In the interest of fairness I would like to know why Boortz won’t conduct the same debate on his show.

A “town hall” debate could be moderated by an objective third party and broadcast over the air with great success. I would personally be willing to pay quite a bit to advertise during that program.

Both of you (Bookman and Boortz) need to grow up, check your egos at the door and debate each other.

By Pompano

May 21, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

By The Truth - Jay only believes you should tolerate racism if there are Master’s tickets in it for you.

Awhile back, Jay penned a story regarding a Junket he took to the Masters. According to the story (his words), during the outing there were several racist comments/jokes made. Jay didn’t bother to address any of these comments at the time lest they interfere with his enjoyment of the tournament. Later - in his typical cowardly fashion - he writes an article rebuking the behavior of his companions (conveniently after he had finished enjoying their hospitality).

What a loser!

By Believer

May 21, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this

I believe that naming something as fair does not imply that it is indeed fair. Let’s look at gasoline for example. Assume gas costs $4/gallon and that the current Fed tax is $0.20/gal. Then, the tax is 5.3% of the pre-tax amount. Assuming the FairTax(TM) were implemented, then the $3.80/gal would be $4.67 after applying a 23% tax. By the way, as long as you are consistent with the method of calculating taxes, it does not matter in the end. The result is the same — you pay more under the FairTax(TM). Believe.

By teacher

May 21, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this

If you have not the Fair Tax books, please delete your comments until you do. It appears the the majority f the people who resort to name-calling and labeling do so because of lack of information. I would like to read a discussion, based on FACTS not emotionalism and suppositions whether you agree or disagree on the merits of the Fair Tax. One point that is being overlooked is the fact that all federal taxes will be replaced by the fair tax including the federal tax on gasoline.

By whatever

May 21, 2008 3:54 PM | Link to this

Believer

Can you be that THICK! Please get the book and try reading the BOOK! YOU ARE 100 percent wrong!

By Believer

May 21, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this

I believe the teacher is in need of an education. The books on the topic are not re-prints of the Gospel — there is nothing in them to have faith in or to believe in. Believe this — if you want a fair tax, then press your elected officials to reduce spending. This is the ONLY way to approach a fair tax.

By Believer

May 21, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

whatever,

Can you be so dense to believe that I have not already read that piece of crap. I’m just glad I was able to borrow it. What garbage. Why don’t you read it instead.

By CashLessSociety

May 21, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

The FairTax(TM) will work as long as the issue of making everyone pay their fair share is addressed. Just think about it. The only issue that non-believers have put forth to counter the FairTax(TM) concerns getting the crooks such as drug dealers and others to pay their fair share. The one method that is guaranteed to fix this problem is to create a cash-free society. We must start by issuing everyone a national ID. This part is so easy because most people already have social security numbers. We just need to get a photo to go with the number and print it out. This card would double as your national voter ID — with it, you can vote from anywhere. This multi-purpose ID card could be set up like a debit card to handle all transactions. Just imagine the money that would be saved simply by not printing money any more. A side benefit would be that terrorists and their supporters would be deprived of their favored currency for illegal transactions. Just think about it — every single transaction could be linked to a “buyer” and a “seller”. There will be no more crooks using Our Great American Currency to conduct their illegal businesses. So pass the word. The FairTax(TM) will work as assumed in a cash-free society. NO MORE CASH PLUS FAIRTAX(TM) = FREEDOM

By whatever

May 21, 2008 4:25 PM | Link to this

Good Grief….. Forgive me believer. YOU are the one that needs some EDUCATION! Oh, but of course you must be a member of the LIBERAL ELITE. You guys are the only ones that are educated! HAHA….

By Zod

May 21, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this

“Believer”. The 23% inclusive rate of the Fair tax is based on the fact that 23% of all net prices comes from embedded taxes.

If we assume the price of gas is $4/gal after adding a $0.20/gal gas tax, then the net price is $3.80 and the Fair tax will replace 23% of that, not be added to it. In other words, the Fair tax will first reduce the net price of gas by 23% to $2.93 before it applies a 30% tax raising it back to $3.80. Add the fed gas tax of $0.20/gal and you pay the same $4/gal.

By The Truth

May 21, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this

Pompano, Jay Bookman is a self-hating white person. Somehow Ms. Tucker has convinced him that whitey is the devil and that all white people are evil. He called me a pathetic white person even though he’s white. When Hussein Obama takes over and our taxes skyrocket no one will be able to afford this newspaper and he will be forced to clean the toilets at MSNBC. That’s IF they don’t go under as well.

By Also a believer

May 21, 2008 4:48 PM | Link to this

Believer That is a good point about the fuel and the taxes, however your numbers are slightly wrong. According to the DOE website, 11% of what we pay for fuel is for taxes. So that $4 gallon of fuel, will now cost $3.56 plus the 23% tax, or $4.38. I will need to research this point a little further to see how it would change or is misleading in this argument because of the rapid increase in fuel these days. But, that being said, haters can not argue how the FairTax would not only expose how much is being taken from taxpayers as they will see the increase in their paychecks, but would bring the companies and jobs back to the United States. It will give the people the power to spend, invest, save, and provide their own retirement and health care instead of the government screwing these things up.

By Believer

May 21, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

Good grief indeed, whatever. As I look back on the posts, I see that you are the one that started with the insinuations. Try to be fair with your less than taxing posts. I don’t know how you have managed to ascertain my political affiliation from my posts. I am well educated but I do not consider myself to be an elitist. I don’t even know what a “Liberal Elite” is. Why don’t you elaborate and tell me how it is that you have also determined this about me. I don’t think we know each other — do we? Please do continue with your insults though — if it makes you feel better.

By Believer

May 21, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this

Zod,

If I am paying, for example, $4/gal today for gas and we were able somehow to convert to the FairTax(TM) tomorrow, I would first have to remove the Fed tax since we would no longer have any other Fed tax except the FairTax(TM) and then add on the FairTax(TM) to the cost of gas less the former Fed tax. You go and see how many owners of said gasoline are going to magically reduce their price by an amount equal to whatever value you choose to assign to the FairTax(TM) label, call this reduced price their new cost per gallon and then add that amount back in to the price so that they can then subtract that value for the Fed. Please feel free to call in and give Boortz the results of your investigation. I’m sure he would appreciate your support. I don’t buy into it and that is my right, is it not.

By Zod

May 21, 2008 5:12 PM | Link to this

Income taxes are absurd. If you refuse to pay, you get arrested. If you resist arrest, you get killed. And the government has no incentive to protect your right or pass legislation that is in your best interests. That’s not liberty and justice, it’s tyranny.

Even if the Fair tax caused prices to double or tripple it’d still be worth it to get rid of the income tax system and repeal the 16th Amendment and all the corruption and injustice that comes from it. Fortunately, the worse the Fair tax can do is raise all prices by 30%. Of course competition will prohibit even that but, how much is liberty and justice worth to you?

By Believer

May 21, 2008 5:38 PM | Link to this

Also,

I don’t hate the concept of a fair tax. Why would anyone hate paying for what they get? I don’t see how replacing the current system of taxation will substantively alter things to the point that we will suddenly see things about where our taxes go and/or how much our taxes are better than we can now. It boils down to looking at the receipts/stubs in both cases. Also, as admitted by the authors, the amount of tax collected is supposed to be the same with either method of taxation. Therefore, it does nothing directly to reduce the total tax burden. We the people still have to pay the same amount. If we want to approach a fairer tax, then the first step should be to have our elected ones stop introducing pork and start scrutinizing each and every expenditure to make sure that it is necessary. If our elected ones are spending excessively, then it is our responsibility to vote them out of office and get someone in that will do what we want. Of course, when I say “we”, I necessarily refer to the majority. Obviously, everyone’s desires cannot be met. I know better than to believe that Utopia is achievable.

By Copyleft

May 21, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this

We’re still having a problem with the black-or-white mentality, I see. Logicians call it the “false dichotomy fallacy,” i.e., “If you don’t support the UnfairTax, then you must LOVE our current tax system and think it’s perfect! What on earth is wrong with you?

Of course, that’s childish nonsense. Obviously our tax system needs improvement; the very existence of targeted loopholes for campaign contributors, for example, is shameful.

But the UnfairTax is truly a cure that’s worse than the disease. Just because our current system is flawed doesn’t mean we have to buy the first snake-oil scam that’s thrown our way.

By AL

May 21, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this

I didn’t know there was a Tax that a liberal/socialist/Democrat didn’t like. I guess by calling it Fair is what turns you off. Any Tax that doesn’t penalize hard working so-called rich successfull people, that invest and own businesses and employ Americans (and un-Americans)a liberal won’t embrace. Maybe if it were the “FairShare” Tax you would go for it. Fair Share great Socialist idium.

By Rob

May 21, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this

Believer -

How much would the cost of gasoline fall if all taxes were removed from the production of the fuel? Big Oil would no longer have to collect corporate or payroll taxes (and numerous others - which get passed on to you and me in the price of fuel).

Multiply that same scenario for the refineries, the distributor, the retailer, etc…

There are an oppressive amount of embedded in every product sold in the U.S.

The price of ALL products (including fuel) will fall dramatically if the Fair Tax were implemented. Competition and our free market society will see to that.

By Red Foreman

May 21, 2008 6:33 PM | Link to this

Hey Jay, whats wrong with a fair tax?

Oh thats right, EVERYBODY would have to pay…

By Believer

May 21, 2008 6:38 PM | Link to this

Rob,

The FairTax(TM), by its author’s definition, replaces existing federal taxes dollar for dollar. So, we the people, must pay the same amount before and after. Individually, the amount of tax paid may very well change but the total MUST be the same regardless of which system is used. That is FairTax(TM) 101. Now, if a corporation were paying something — anything — in fed tax with the current system and pays no tax with the new system, then the tax differential MUST be collected from somewhere else in order to remain revenue neutral. This is where all the arguments ultimately lead when any two persons of opposing perspectives start breaking down the FairTax(TM). This is also where the discussions lead to assumptions on where the tax differentials will be accounted for. The key word here is “assumptions”. This is where the discussions always break down and ultimately the parties throw up their hands in disgust. It will happen here if we continue — I can guarantee it even though I am admittedly no mind reader. I just happen to believe in my studies of probability and statistics and when I apply them, even loosely, to this problem, the most likely outcome is easily envisioned. Believe.

By FTF Institute

May 21, 2008 7:15 PM | Link to this

The FairTax has many “dirty little secrets” that haven’t seen the light of day in the mainstream press. For the truth see fairtaxfraud.com.

By Economics

May 21, 2008 7:35 PM | Link to this

If you want to put it on gas ok.
Its less taxes oil companies add less taxes refinery adds less taxes federal adds now add the fair tax. We are saving money. Remember to take away all the built in taxes all the way across the board before you take away your federal tax. Thats where the savings is. Now if you only use 10 gallons thats all you pay for. If you use 50 gallons then you pay for the 50. Its very simple really. Prices go way down first because you take away all the taxes from start to the finished product. Then add your fair tax on to that price.

By Believer

May 21, 2008 7:50 PM | Link to this

Economics,

If a politician or other person[s] were to propose, for example, a 50% (or whatever number, I don’t care what the value is) tax on gasoline, I would say that it is a good idea. The side effects alone would make it worthwhile. I feel the same way about taxing such things as cigarettes and alcohol — the more the better. Junk food should have an extremely high tax. Legalize pot and impose the same tax. Every dollar collected should be used to offset all other taxes that we currently pay. Just don’t expect me to believe in the FairTax(TM). The assumptions made in order to arrive at the end results have not been justified — if you follow a scientific method, that is.

By JR

May 21, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this

First, I am a conservative so you can skip hanging the liberal tag on me. Second, books are not made into laws. Bills become laws and besides Neal’s book is pure fiction. I have studied the bill and done enough research that I probably know more about the Fairtax than most of you. It is pure stupidity to think you can keep you whole salary and prices will fall. Most of you either have no idea about how adversely it would affect you. or hate the present system so badly you will take anything in its place. I’m sure there is something better than the present system but this sure isn’t it. The one thing the Firtax bill does do is point out how mathematically challenged a large segment of the population is!

By Bruinfan

May 21, 2008 8:04 PM | Link to this

Is all you people can do is call people names? Can we tone it down a bit and start discussing some facts?

The one thing about the Fair Tax I have a concern with is how big will the bureaucracy that handles the “prebates” going to have to be? How much will that cost, and will the 23% cover that?

Is gasoline taxed at the same rate. The current tax is 44.4 cents per gallon, which works out to about 10% at the current prices. Are we willing to pay more at the pump in taxes for the sake of keeping your paycheck?

By holdingAJCaccountable

May 21, 2008 8:13 PM | Link to this

Seems like a simple solution to the “will he or won’t he debate”?

The Boortz camp claims it’s open to a debate before a live audience. The Bookman camp claims that by limiting it to a live audience, Boortz is really trying to limit the debate to only a few hundred listeners.

Simple solution? Bookman agrees to meet Boortz for a live debate; and it gets broadcasts to the larger audience.

Bookman gets the “broadcast audience” he claims to desire, and Boortz gets the “live audience” he claims to desire. Neither one has an excuse to back out.

Why is this so difficult for the Bookman or Boortz camps to figure out?

Are they both afraid? LOL

By Bruinfan

May 21, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this

Just because the refiners and oil companies won’t pay payroll tax any longer doesn’t mean their prices will go down. Don’t they buy things, too? Would they have to pay tax on travel expenses, phone calls, equipment, office supplies, materials used in manufacturing, etc. Or will businesses be exempt from sales tax?

By Debate him, big guy

May 21, 2008 8:47 PM | Link to this

Jay, just debate Boortz in front of an audience, like most well organized debates are done. At least Boortz tells his audience that he doesn’t want to debate you on the air. You never mentioned he’d debate you in front of an audience. Typical columnist, never telling the whole story. I read your columns and listen to his show, I can make decisions on my own. What you’ve just wrote is so misleading, it makes you out to be liar. Take some advice from just an engineer, not a writer, you can tell the truth and still lie. When you intend to mislead people, you lie to them. Way to go!

By thogwummpy

May 21, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this

Install the Fair Tax, and over $40 TRILLION in off shore money comes pouring back into the U.S. economy. Of course, that sort of math escapes a class grudge dolt like Bookman (who by the way, probably never took one course in MacroEconomics at Penn State). It sucks that J.B. gets a forum to spew his amatuerish ignorance——while denouncing a blizzard of credible economists that praise the Fair Tax.

By Charles

May 21, 2008 9:12 PM | Link to this

I just realized why Jay doesn’t want a live audience to hear the debate. He’s smart enough to know he’ll be laughed off the stage with his weak arguments. The humiliation might cause him to break down and cry - like a typical Liberal!

By JR

May 21, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this

Face the facts. The reason Boortz wants a live audience is so he pack it with his rabid foaming at the mouth followers. He has to have blind support because his arguments won’t hold water. Remember this is the man that Cynthia Tucker made a fool up in a gun debate. If you lose a debate to her it’s time to stop debating!

By Bruinfan

May 21, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this

“Install the Fair Tax, and over $40 TRILLION in off shore money comes pouring back into the U.S. economy”- Can you be a little more specific? The closest figure I have seen of US money held offshore for tax haven purposes is closer to $10 trillion, unless you are expecting all the world’s tax haven money to suddenly be shipped over here.

And don’t say “it’s in the book”. That’s like saying “it’s in the bible”.

By holdingAJCaccountable

May 21, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this

Charles and JR,

Even if you’re both right, the way I have proposed it, neither one has a legitimate excuse to back out.

I’m sure somebody would be willing to broadcast it.

By Dave Perry

May 21, 2008 9:49 PM | Link to this

There is nothing fair about the current IRS tax system. I’ve read both of Linder/Boortz books and they make sense to me, but then again, I don’t have a socialist agenda, I just hate paying taxes while welfare scum get a free ride and the super rich don’t pay their fair share. Mr. Bookman would probably embrace the Fair Tax if it had been proposed by Al Gore and Hillary Clinton, but since the socialist Democrats want to keep power by pandering to the needy they wouldn’t dare promote anything that really frees people to improve their lives.

By JR

May 21, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this

How is it possible that people don’t see that the super rich would pay less than they are paying now? Their yachts, plane etc. would be bought by the corporations they form. Guess who would have to pay more to make up the difference. It would be a royal screwing for the middle class. Do you think Boortz would buy a new plane as an individual? Of course not! His corporation would buy it tax free and you would have to pay more. Of course he would like a Fairtax!

By holdingAJCaccountable

May 21, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this

Upon further review; a poster named “Observer” first came up with the idea of a “town hall” debate, to be broadcast over the airwaves at 2:36pm.

Both sides get what they want; the “live” audience, and the large broadcast.

Seems like Bookman or Boortz wouldn’t have any wiggle room to back out of that.

By Glenn

May 21, 2008 10:20 PM | Link to this

Mr.Bookman grow up you moron!!!!!Tax you for us,taking Bortz is your career bad move!Let’s see columnist vs. national talk host=u lose loser!

By Glenn

May 21, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this

By the way the only people who love the IRS is the ones who get money back from them…u Bookman? Are u one of the losers who get free rent,food,health care why I do with out any freebies?You all get off your(like my granny said)dupa’s and get a f’n job!u are sorry dog squeeze!

By Redneck

May 21, 2008 11:03 PM | Link to this

JR, you claim that you have read the books but judging from your post you are a liar.

Your last post stated that they “would form corporations to pay for their planes and yachts”. BFD, it doesn’t matter who pays for the new finished product the 23% tax would have to be paid.

The beauty of the FairTax is there are no deductions.

Maybe you should take some reading lessons and read the books again before embarrassing yourself here.

By JR

May 21, 2008 11:15 PM | Link to this

Redneck you need to work on your reading comprehension skills. I never said I have read the book. I studied the bill. Since you have read the book maybe you can tell me where I can see the list of the 400 companies that would move here if the Fairtax bill is passed.

By KhongLo

May 21, 2008 11:21 PM | Link to this

All you people against the fair tax should really spend a little time reading the books by Boortz and Linder. I am not saying buy it, just read it. The library has a copy I am sure and they will let you sit and read it. You can go to Books a Million, Barnes and Nobelm anywhere and read it. Then you will be able to give an educated opinion on the fair tax.

By GaLiberal

May 21, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this

Reading books by Big Mouth Boortz and Rethuglicon Linder isn’t much to brag about. The problem with FairTax supports is they are just simply greedy people that revel in others misery. They want to demand services (roads, police, fire, water/sewer, etc), but not have to pay for them. In their myopic self-centered view of the world they are all that matters.

The ‘complex’ tax structure exists because certain groups wanted a favorable treatment for various suspect reasons. When Ronnie Reagan proposed to disallow the mortgage interest deduction, the real estate lobby howled about how it would kill home ownership. Of course it was a lie, but it sounded good. Think what would happen with this ponsi scheme being proposed. A sale tax on the home purchase (or mortgage or both) would force many people out of home ownership. So there’s an exemption for home buyers. What about equipment used to run a business? Another exemption. Got enough money, you can get some friends to write you a big fat exemption. Just ask Sonny Perdue. So you are right back where you started; a complex tax system with lots of special interest deductions. Of course, the tax rate has to go up to cover the “lost” tax money from all these exemptions. Want to pay a 45% tax rate? Adding up my federal, state, county, and sales don’t come close to that amount so my taxes would actually go up. Is that what you want? A hidden tax increase?

When you vote Rethuglicon, you vote against your own best interests. And these FairTax Boortz/Linder bobble heads are living proof.

By GaLiberal

May 22, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this

One last comment: If Big Mouth Boortz and Rethuglicon Linder actually believed in this scheme, why did they write a book you have to buy? Why didn’t they just put it out there for all to see and read? I’ll tell you why not. There are enough of suckers out there that will buy any anti-tax claptrap to make people like Big Mouth Boortz and Rethuglicon Linder rich(er). Just like B.T. Barnum said (actually it wasn’t), there’s a sucker born every minute. And Big Mouth Boortz and Rethuglicon Linder know it. Otherwise, they’d both be on welfare.

When you vote Rethuglicon, you vote against your own best interets. And Big Mouth Boortz and Rethuglicon Linder are living proof.

By JR

May 22, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this

Recdneck, I forgot to tell you to read the bill and you would see that property bought for business purposes is not taxed. Therefore little kneel could by without paying taxes on a new plane.

Galiberal, voting republican has nothing to do with the Fairtax. Boortz is not a Republican and Linder shouldn’t be!

By Will

May 22, 2008 6:02 AM | Link to this

I’ve noticed that every person on this board that has criticized the Fair Tax doesn’t know what they are talking about!

I don’t mind people disagreeing with it, but at least get your facts straight before you do.

By JR

May 22, 2008 6:22 AM | Link to this

Will, do you care to tell me what facts I have wrong about the Fairtax. MY information comes from the bill itself. Have you read the bill or do you rely on a book?

By Pat

May 22, 2008 7:18 AM | Link to this

I’ll say it again: this country needs a socialist party, for no other reason than so these ‘tards who eagerly lap up every tidbit of wisdom from Boortz, Linbaugh Hannity & Co. could FINALLY see the real thing and begin to understand it so they’ll stop throwing the word around as a weak insult. It’s just pathetic. Did you ever think someone might be against the proposal because they HAD read the book?

By Taxpayer

May 22, 2008 7:32 AM | Link to this

I notice that if Will really knew what he was talking about he would not make such blatantly false posts. Perhaps, Will has hidden motives. Is Will just trying to stir up a little excitement for himself.

By JDE

May 22, 2008 8:11 AM | Link to this

Boortz will eat Bookman for lunch… He has offered to debate Jay several times on his show yet Jay somehow manages to find excuses. Who the hell is Martha Zollar at 550AM? I doubt 550 has the signal strength to be heard more than 100 feet from its studios. Bottom line is that the current tax system punishes achievers and ignores underachievers. Straight out of a Robin Hood story;take from the rich and give to the poor.

By JDE

May 22, 2008 8:28 AM | Link to this

Pat, if you want to live in a Socialist country move to either England,France, Sweden,etc…where they pay up to 80% of their income towards taxes.Health care is “free”. Then again, everything over there is “free”. I suspect you’re in the bottom rung of income earners and don’t quite feel the pain that each of us do when we look at our paychecks. Does the phrase ‘paper or plastic’ sound familiar?

By Taxpayer

May 22, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this

I’m all for a fair tax. Where’s it at? I don’t see it anywhere. Is it over here? Don’t see it. Is it over there? No, not there. Is it even real? Not really. Why is that? Well, first of all, the word fair, when used to describe a tax is necessarily a misnomer because of the extremely high probability that one or more taxpayers will consider the referenced tax to be unfair. Therefore, labeling something as a fair tax is meant to do nothing more than garner attention and stir emotions. Once you stir the emotions, then you have an audience that is “ripe for the picking” because they can be manipulated to do one’s bidding even though there exists no logical basis for the audience to do so. All you need to do is target the appropriate emotion for the task at hand — greed, fear, hatred, etc. Politicians, talk show hosts, etc., use these emotion tools on a regular basis — much like a carpenter uses a hammer — to drive in their particular agenda. The way to avoid their traps is to stay focused on a given topic and to deal with verifiable facts. Never accept someone’s assumptions as truth.

By mickey latimore

May 22, 2008 9:55 AM | Link to this

For all those who do not support the Fairtax, must think our current tax code is better. This is the true idiacy!

You don’t like the Fairtax…… fine, come up with your own tax reform plan to support, but get on board with the idea of eliminating the stupid tax code we have now!

instead of diarrhea of the mouth, become part of the solution, instead of being an obstacle!

By Cheacherger

May 22, 2008 10:16 AM | Link to this

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