Jay Bookman

By ByteMan

May 19, 2008 6:16 AM | Link to this

Please please please Oxendine, keep pushing the Fair Tax plan! I can’t think of anything that will more reliably sink your campaign faster. I’d rather not have another 4-8 years of a do-nothing-useful governor.

By Robert

May 19, 2008 7:47 AM | Link to this

I think that is one great campaign issue that the nation needs. We need a change. Remember that the graduated income tax structure is from the communist manifesto, to control the people. This fair tax puts everyone on equal ground. The drug cartel, illegals and underground economy will all have to pay a tax. Takes the control out of the congress and senate and we need a lot less of that.

By StillbornDittos

May 19, 2008 7:50 AM | Link to this

Great joke, Jay!

By AL

May 19, 2008 7:51 AM | Link to this

Please no!!!Ilove our Tax system!! Please don’t try to change it or make it better. I want to elect all Socialist Demmocrats that I can before I die,and see if it’s possible to get a 100% tax rate. I have HOPE that we can squeeze every cent out of hard-working American citzens and get the CHANGE we seek.

By Price

May 19, 2008 7:56 AM | Link to this

I can’t believe Demo’s and Repubs aren’t fighting over who gets to put the Fair Tax forward first!! It gives a HUGE tax break to the poor and middle class without taking it from the rich. It’s a voluntary tax based on consumption. It can’t get any better than that.

By Jack

May 19, 2008 8:02 AM | Link to this

I don’t think Mr. Bookman understand what the Fair Tax is all about or he wouldn’t have added his stupid comment “And as soon as I’m elected pope, I promise to convene the College of Cardinals and repeal the Law of Gravity.” Read Boortz’s Book and get educated. The Fair Tax is exactly what we need.

By Chris

May 19, 2008 8:06 AM | Link to this

I’ve got a new plan I am calling the “Fair Tax Diet”. You can EAT ALL YOU WANT and yet the pounds just drop off like magic! Check it out at www.urabonehead.com.

By Copyleft

May 19, 2008 8:07 AM | Link to this

I’ve read the book; I recognized the lies and the crap and the propaganda; I know the UnFairTax is just that—unfair, unworkable, and idiotic.

So obviously, I’m a tax attorney who’s in love with the current system and wouldn’t change a thing, right? Because that’s the only explanation to the UnfairTax cultists.

By Mike

May 19, 2008 8:09 AM | Link to this

“I’d rather not have another 4-8 years of a do-nothing-useful governor.”

I can’t think of a good governor Georgia that has led the state of Georgia in recent memory. Sonny is terrible but so was his predecessor. And Mark ‘what’s his name’ would not have been any better.

By StillbornDittos

May 19, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this

Fair Tax? The Saudis aren’t going to like it, Yogi. “Never mind, booboo, I’ll levy a fair tax for all the picnickers and only steal one picnic basket for every picnic table”. Yes, but the Saudis aren’t going to like it Yogi, they rely on paying no tax on the corporate welfare they bribed all our politicians to enact for them over the past 25 years. “They’ll never miss it, booboo, it’s only one picnic basket”.

But they could start world war three if they wanted, Yogi. “That’s ridiculous booboo, they’re civilized islamic fundementalists who still use chastity belts and circumsize their females, they can be reasoned with, now STFU, booboo.

“the saudis aren’t going to like you saying all that yogi…..”

By Bonehead

May 19, 2008 8:20 AM | Link to this

Anyone who listens to Boortz for advice (or becuase they are too lazy to think for themselves) is by definition an idiot.

By Pizen

May 19, 2008 8:23 AM | Link to this

Democrats and Republicans alike don’t like the Fair Tax because it takes power away from Washington and returns it to the people. And only the plutocrats would crave a system like the graduated income tax which is unworkable, indefensible, and patently unfair. The current system favors the poor and the rich, and is based on the sheep-like mentality of the middle class who pays the freight in this country. And by the way - you’re welcome.

By Ray

May 19, 2008 8:24 AM | Link to this

The present tax code is the most idiotic, complicated, unfair piece of s* that this country could possibly push off on it’s citizens. With over 43M people not paying taxes in this country, we need to have everyone paying their fair share. EVERYONE!! Corporations, private citizens, the rich, the poor, the churches, Al Sharpton especially, including Je$$ie and his ilk, illegals, EVERYONE!!. I am tired of pay other peoples bills.

By MADMOMMY

May 19, 2008 8:36 AM | Link to this

Do you think we could get Zell to come back for another term? nah, didn’t think so either.

FairTax needs to be put into effect and pronto. I would back him if he stopped all his back office deals and sliding things in at the last minute.

By CashLessSociety

May 19, 2008 8:38 AM | Link to this

The FairTax(TM) will work as long as the issue of making everyone pay their fair share is addressed. Just think about it. The only issue that non-believers have put forth to counter the FairTax(TM) concerns getting the crooks such as drug dealers and others to pay their fair share. The one method that is guaranteed to fix this problem is to create a cash-free society. We must start by issuing everyone a national ID. This part is so easy because most people already have social security numbers. We just need to get a photo to go with the number and print it out. This card would double as your national voter ID — with it, you can vote from anywhere. This multi-purpose ID card could be set up like a debit card to handle all transactions. Just imagine the money that would be saved simply by not printing money any more. A side benefit would be that terrorists and their supporters would be deprived of their favored currency for illegal transactions. Just think about it — every single transaction could be linked to a “buyer” and a “seller”. There will be no more crooks using Our Great American Currency to conduct their illegal businesses. So pass the word. The FairTaxPlus(R), the FairTax(TM) plus a nationally recognized ID/debit card for every single American citizen. It’s the wave of the future — catch a ride or get left behind. Vote Republican — in unity, we can make it happen.

By Jim's a Cherry Picker

May 19, 2008 8:38 AM | Link to this

Hi Jay,

Isn’t Oxendine the same guy who was quoted on the radio last week saying that he was there to “hold people’s hands” through the insurance process related to the Mother’s Day storms?

What a suckup.

By Gordon

May 19, 2008 8:38 AM | Link to this

Copyleft, can you give specific lies and propaganda you are speaking about? Can you explain why it is “unfair, unworkable, and idiotic?” I’ll admit I’m no expert on the subject, so please enlighten me. Or maybe you’re just a name caller who doesn’t like it simply because Neal Boortz does. That’s my guess, but I welcome you to prove me wrong. As Dr. Frasier Crane used to say, “I’m listening….”

By John

May 19, 2008 8:41 AM | Link to this

How can anyone, who pays taxes, not understand the “Fair Tax”. Everyone pays, simple. It is the only fair system developed, maybe that is why Democrats don’t like it. If you come to the conclusion that believing in a fair system is “Boortz Brainwashing”, you too, need to get an education and grow up. And NO, I am not a “brainwashed neo-con”, just a blue collar, hard working taxpayer!

By Jim's a Cherry Picker

May 19, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this

Gordon,

I’ll give you a reason: As soon as the fair tax hits in Ga and the tax on durable goods goes up accordingly, outlet malls will spring up on the interstates at the state lines of all our neighbor states, and Georgians will cease and desist making purchases in Georgia.

I’m sure that Circuit City, Best Buy and every car dealer in the state will love that.

Or will gas be too expensive…?

By Gordon

May 19, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this

JACP, I don’t think that the Fairtax is meant to replace the state income tax, but the federal income tax.

By Ray

May 19, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this

Obama and all of the other socialists just don’t get it. The “rich” in this country, those making over 364,000/year represent 1% of American taxpayers. They pay over 90% of America’s tax bill. That’s 90%, guys. The remaining tax is paid by the other 10%. Over 43M people in this country pay no taxes at all. The “rich” are not the enemy that Obama and other socialists would have you believe. They are paying everyone else’s bills. If you doubt these figures, go to www.taxfoundation.org/press/show for a non-biased, non partisan accounting of what is really going on. It will open your eyes big time.

By zeke

May 19, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this

FAIR TAX! FAIR TAX! FAIR TAX! We must go to the fair tax in the US to insure ALL citizens, non citizens, wealthy heirs, drug dealers and all others pay their fair share! Then we must limit this social program government to live within the revenue of that tax, PERIOD! All other taxes, income, social security, unemployment, property, accomodations, prepared foods, airport, among others, must be constitutionally eliminated! The income tax the same time as the installation of the fair tax to insure that our “elected do nothing socialist legislatures” cannot bring it back without citizens voting!

By StillbornDittos

May 19, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this

We understand the fair tax. Nobody wants to pay taxes. Who wants death? Nobody. Who wants disease? Nobody. Who wants a ugly old fat wife? Not me. But the sad fact is, that that’s all there is: death, taxes, disease, and old ugly fat wives who nag and henpeck us.

Show me where this was in the brochure.

Show me.

By Harry S.

May 19, 2008 9:17 AM | Link to this

Republican Fair Tax scammers tell us corporate America would automatically reduce their prices if only we had a flat tax. But, it never happen when the cable TV companies were deregulated, profit motivation kept prices high. Years ago, we in Georgia were told, if only the state had a mandatory car insurance law, the rates would go down. Next, they said “no fault insurance” would reduce rates. Wrong, never happened! How many times will you poor dumb redneck Republicans fall for the same lie? Most working Americans, (teachers, policemen, nurses, clerks, firemen, construction workers, ect.) don’t pay anywhere near 23% in federal income tax. About 10% would be more accurate for a family of four with a mortgage and around $100,000 income. Do the math instead of listening to the Boortz and his kool-aid drinkers. Fair Tax HR25 is only an amendment to the current tax code.

HR 25 DOES NOT close the IRS, or guarantee the 23% rate will not be increased. The original estimate was 55%, but 23% sounds better and makes it easier to sale books. HR 25 DOES NOT reduce federal spending or the deficit we have already have accumulated.

HR 25 DOES NOT force corporations to reduce their prices.

HR 25 DOES NOT reduce the cost of imported goods. Remember we don’t make anything in this country anymore. It WILL create 50 new giant state agencies to collect, enforce and redistribute the tax. It WILL tax doctor/hospital visits, telephone bills, internet and cable TV bills and basically all services that are not presently taxed. It WILL encourage a huge black market for cash purchases. It WILL have every taxpayer waiting for a monthly government check. It WILL be added to all existing and future state and local taxes. It WILL be a huge tax increase for the middle class and working poor who spend at least 90% of their income. It WILL be a big tax cut for millionaires like Boortz and Linder who only spend a small percentage of their income.

By WestSider

May 19, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this

I think it is rather amusing that all of those that are opposed to alternative tax systems are the same ones who are always telling us that every single other aspect of the government needs “fixing”. Health-care needs fixing, gas prices need fixing, foreign policy, education, and everything else need fixing…but our tax system is JUST FINE!

By StillbornDittos

May 19, 2008 9:30 AM | Link to this

Westsider, your cat needs fixin’

By Mike Jones

May 19, 2008 9:30 AM | Link to this

Boortz has a good idea.. with a bad name.. he should not call it a “fairtax”, but a “stick it to the rich tax”.. The democrats would immediately draft into legislation then.

By Taxpayer

May 19, 2008 9:38 AM | Link to this

Harry S.,

If “they” could do the math, then they wouldn’t be poor dumb rednecks. They’d be politicians or lobbyists taking money from rich dumb rednecks to push their scams on poor dumb rednecks. It’s a vicious circle. Rich dumb rednecks trying to eat poor dumb rednecks. All the while, the politicians and lobbyists sitting in the bleachers looking down on their prey while commenting, “Look at all those dumb rednecks.”

By Josh

May 19, 2008 9:38 AM | Link to this

“About 10% would be more accurate for a family of four with a mortgage and around $100,000 income.”

You’ve absolutely killed the rest of your argument with that absurd, moronic sentence.

By truthman

May 19, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

The FairTax isn’t, period!

By Beer_Stein

May 19, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this

The problem with arguing about the Fair Tax is that the opposing viewpoints proceed from a different understanding of what “Fair” means. Fair Tax proponents look at an individual making $300,000 per year being taxed at “23%” and an individual making $30,000 being taxed at “23%” and say they are being treated fairly with respect to one another. Opponents of the Fair Tax look at the same situation and note that the individual making $30,000 per year spends a disproportionate amount of their income on obligatory consumption. Things like food, power, water, gas, etc. Now, to be “fair” the Fair Tax has built in an exemption, which is designed to reduce the naturally disproportionate impact of the tax on the lower income individual, the models put forth do not necessarily reflect actual levels of expenditure for an individual at that earnings level, therefore the actual impact is likely to be more disproportionate than what is stated.

I for one, lie in the uppper middle class and I have a run a number of scenarios for my family. We lose under the Fair Tax, as do many of the individuals who sit down and actually analyze the numbers.

Some of the points made by Harry S are valid, there is no indication that companies will uniformly lower prices to the extent necessary to offset the consumption based tax.

Fundamentally, the proponents of the Fair Tax approach the issue from the standpoint that “fairness” derives from equal treatment prior to consideration of any limitation, constraint, etc. Proceeding from the same mentality, we arrive at the conclusion that two professional boxers, one a fly weight and one a heavy weight are “fairly” matched when put in the ring together. It should be startlingly obvious that they are not “fairly” matched. Yet, somehow, Fair Tax proponents miss this simple analogy.

By Fix-It

May 19, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this

Come on CopyLeft, I know you did not read the Fair Tax book; it has no pictures for you. The Fair Tax could be one of the greatest coups for the American people. The only people against it are the ones who would lose power. There is no reason to have over 70,000 pages of tax code, that is plain stupid.

By dreamers

May 19, 2008 9:44 AM | Link to this

It will not happen. If you think some lawyer who spent his life busting his rear end to graduate from an ivy league school to specialize in tax law will allow some dirt bag politician to ruin his life by implementing a fair tax you also believe in santa claus.

Why don’t you talk about the fact that the federal reserve and IRS are both illegal and unconstitutional. ever since 1913 every single president has been a traitor. that’s right folks every single president and elected official serving in washington has betrayed the american people.

the government is against you until you decide to sell your soul to it

By sunshine and thunder

May 19, 2008 9:46 AM | Link to this

Pass the FairTax - NOW. Get the government out of the social engineering business. NO MORE TAX BREAKS JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE “AL GORE” STAMPED ON THE BOTTOM OF YOUR TOILET.

By Dave

May 19, 2008 9:46 AM | Link to this

Ox may be elected Gov., but you need to give up on the Pope thing Jay…

By Jose

May 19, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this

Fair Tax taxes everyone and by the way, the rich spend more money then the middle class therefore more tax..This tax would allow everyone to pay taxes on a federal level equally. Remember the only people who have the right to tax is the states and that is what the Fair Tax also allows. Have you ever looked at the Tax Code? It is like 23 BOOKS long? There are accountants who can’t even grasp all the information in those 23 books+!!! The fair tax elminates the loop holes that are in the 23 books+ If you are rich and donate to a non-profit then you can decrease your taxable income!! If you are middle class, you have to acquire debt in a larger amount compared to your income to recieve a tax break (ex-incure a mortgage (debt) to reduce your taxable income. I am a middle class worker who SUPPORTS THE FAIR TAX!!!

By Get It Right

May 19, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this

The uninformed Jay Bookman strikes again. Yes, let’s keep our current ‘progressive’ tax system. You know, just like Marx recommended in the Communist Manifesto. By the way, I hear that Australia is considering lowering their corporate tax rates in order to… wait … improve their economy and attract foreign investments. Fair Tax…

By Soothsayer

May 19, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this

The 10% federal excise tax levied on “luxury” yachts in the 80s is a perfect model for the FairTax. Like the FairTax, the excise tax only applied to NEW yachts. So, to avoid paying the tax, you just had to buy a used boat. The result? Virtually all boat builders went out of business and have not returned to this day.

The FairTax is 30 cents on the dollar. 30 cents is 23% of $1.30. Got it?

If we had a FairTax today, gasoline would be $4.83 a gallon. You would pay a 30% tax on your mortgage interest, property taxes, ad valorem tax on your car, any service (doctor, dentist, car repair, etc.) If you own a service busines, you would have to collect and pay over the 30% tax.

A $200,000 new home would cost $260,000. A $30,000 new car would cost $39,000. While an existing home or used car would have no tax. I’m not sure but I can’t imagine getting financing for the tax portion from a bank.

But, all else aside, can a FairTax work? (you will need an Excel spreadsheet to do this). Can the FairTax fund the government? How much would you and I have to spend and be taxed on to fund the govt?

The latest US budget is $3,000,000,000,000. Divide this by the tax rate (.30) 30%. The result is the smount of goods/services that must be taxed to fund the govt. Add to that the $3,000,000,000,000 tax. (Goods/services + tax) Now, divide that total amt by the 300,000,000 people in the US. What you get is the amount each American would have to spend each year to fund the govt. This does not factor the “prebate” which would raise this number. Somehow I just don’t see it happening.

By rob

May 19, 2008 10:18 AM | Link to this

Harry S. - You just don’t get it. Corporations who don’t lower the prices of their products will go out of business because other corporations will - it’s called competition. A free market society is something socialists (Democrats) just don’t understand.

And as for cable television deregulation - please tell me one location that has more than one choice of cable provider? It’s one or the other. That’s not deregulation as far as I can tell.

By Soothsayer

May 19, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this

Don’t dismay. Even Dr. Walby stopped returning my e-mails when confronted with this analysis.

By Copyleft

May 19, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Beer_Stein and others have already touched on some of the UnfairTax flaws, Gordon, but here’s a good starting point for you:

http://www.mises.org/story/1814

The UnfairTax will increase prices on basic consumption necessities of everyday life. The insistence that “everyone will pay less, and we’ll generate just as much money!” is illogical on its face, and yet the cultists keep chanting it like they’ve found the secret to eternal youth.

By shifting entire tax base to consumption sales, the tax burden moves significantly AWAY from those with other sources of wealth and proportionally fewer expenses (i.e., the wealthy), and overwhelming TOWARD the middle and lower classes, despite the few concessionary bones thrown to “basic living-expense exemptions.”

The millionaires pushing the UnfairTax are hoping we’re dumb enough to fall for this scam they’ve cooked up. I’m hoping America’s not quite that stupid… yet.

(And yes, cultists: ANY criticism of your sacred text means I’m 100% in love with the current tax system and see NO need for it to be changed or improved in ANY way, you betcha. Sheesh, what simpleminded dolts Boortz has recruited.)

By GaLiberal

May 19, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this

Price @ 7:56 AM stupidly said: It’s a voluntary tax based on consumption. It can’t get any better than that.

Do you not understand the Fair Tax is just another neo-con Rethuglicon sham? First, it is levied on everything you buy. That includes food, clothing, housing (including rent and mortgage payments), medical care, etc. I hardly would call that a a “voluntary tax.” Unless I don’t eat, wear clothes, live in a house, or go to the doctor.

Second, the math simply doesn’t work. You would need a tax rate of over 40% to be provide the same revenues. Of course the state, county, and city governments would add to that tax rate. Want to pay almost double for everything? I don’t and the measly tax “prebate” doesn’t even come close to making up the difference.

Bottom line is the ‘Fair Tax’ would cost you more and you would have no deductions to offset the amount you would pay. Not what I’m looking forward to.

When you vote Rethuglicon, you vote against your own best interests. And the Fair Tax supporters are living proof.

By ByteMan

May 19, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

@Mike: Zell was probably the last-most-recent “effective” governor that I can think of. Before that… my memory doesn’t remember that far back. But you can’t go back, so the question is to figure out who to support going forward.

It isn’t going to be “two-faced” Cagle. Oxendine hasn’t done anything useful with the Insurnace Commissioner’s office. We’re still several months from seeing who else decides to step up.

As for the “FairTax Fools”: riddle me this: when is a 23% tax not a 23% tax? When it doesn’t cover the expenses you’re trying to pay! 23% will only leave us with a $300+ BILLION deficit right now and significantly more in recessionary periods (when people don’t spend more, so tax collections go down). And you’re dreaming if you think that the Congress is going to significantly cut spending. That ship hasn’t sailed since before Reagan took office. Likely that 23% is going to need to vary between 26% and 30% and increase further as more boomers retire and slow their purchasing and increase the amounts spent on Social Security and Medicare. Talk about a party-killer: corporations get to cut prices, not bother to pay taxes, but we get to pay more taxes during tougher times for the basics in our lives. Where do I sign up?

By CashLessSociety

May 19, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this

My fellow Americans, we must work in unity. To do that, we must start with a system of taxation that spreads the burden equally amongst the population. The FairTax(TM) can accomplish this task as long as the issue of collecting the taxes on every taxable transaction is dealt with up front. A cashless society is the one sure answer. Every American citizen will need a simple debit card. Most people already have at least one. Then, every American citizen will need a social security number. Most already have this as well. Finally, we just need to link these two items together with a photo ID and cash can be made a thing of the past. Illegal immigrants won’t be able to function here in America any longer. Terrorists will not be able to buy bomb-making products with their hordes of cash. Drug dealers will be going to other countries to do business because no one in America would dare purchase something that is illegal. This approach in conjunction with the FairTax(TM) will solve so many of America’s problems. FIrst, we must stand in unity, we must stand as Republicans. Spread the word. FAIRTAX(TM) PLUS NO MORE CASH.

By FAIR_TAX_IS_FAIR

May 19, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this

Of course liberals are afraid of anything with the word “fair” in it so I’m not surprised by Bookman’s comments. They would rather all us hard working Americans that get ahead in life to keep paying a disproportionate share of our income to provide for those too lazy to work hard and succeed in life.

PS: GA_Liberal and Copyleft are two of the biggest idiots I’ve ever encountered on a blog. Way to go!

By Soothsayer

May 19, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being ATTACKED (caps added), and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” —Hermann Goering, Commander in cheif, Luftwaffe; President of the Reichstag

There’s a TERRORIST behind ever TREE looking to spend CASH to do us harm! Only a national debit card and a national photo ID card can save us!!!

By CashLessSociety

May 19, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this

Yes, Soothsayer. You see. Now we are two. Who else will join us. Join the cause. Eliminate crime and spread the tax burden equally amongst every hard working American. Join together in Unity. Even Copyleft and Ga_Liberal will have to see the way. Together we can stamp out those terrorists and drug dealers and other crooks amongst us. Spread the word before it is too late.

By Soothsayer

May 19, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this

CashLessSociety:

Can you say NOT! My statement was a condemnation of your misguided post.

By DK

May 19, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

Fair Tax is just another attempt to shift the tax burden from the rich to the middle-class. My wife and would see our tax bill triple under the “Fair Tax” plan. For those of you who are going to want to tell me that “I don’t get it”, my wife and I are both tax professionals who have worked in the field virtually our entire working lives. Together we have over 50 years of combined experience in the field of taxation (neither of us would lose our jobs or businesses if Fair Tax passed, so my opinion isn’t self-serving from a professional standpoint).

I am a life-long Republican who is beginning to realize that the party is leaving me when it proposes garbage like this. Tax cuts were needed when Reagan cut taxes in the early 80’s, however tax cuts are but one tool in the “economic toolbox”, and it’s certainly not a fix-all tool. Today’s Republicans think tax cuts are the answer to every economic problem. The U.S. has one of the lowest tax rates in the industrial world and is getting its butt kicked by other countries that have higher tax rates (maybe there is a lesson there). Fair tax isn’t even a tax cut; it’s tax re-distribution, but most who advocate it believe it will lower their taxes. The Republican Party used to be the party of fiscal responsibility, but it’s been hijacked by greedy rich people who use rhetoric like “fair tax” to trick the masses into paying their taxes for them. If you’re middle-class and spend most of your income to live, simply multiply your gross salary times 30% and compare that figure to what you actually paid Uncle Sam last year. I suggest that one do the math and then decide which plan is “fair” for you. Do this, then vote accordingly.

By Soothsayer

May 19, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

Here’s an idea. What if each of us has our identifying number tattooed on our forearm?

By Wild Bill Hiltner

May 19, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this

“Oh Jay” Bookman - now there you go again - butchering another idea without fully understanding its viability - some calibration needs to be worked out, but this is a better, more efficient collection mechanism than the IRS -

By Soothsayer

May 19, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this

Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens.

“Against stupidity the gods themselves struggle in vain.”

With that I am out of here.

By CashLessSociety

May 19, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this

Soothsayer,

How can you say such things. We must work in Unity, for the good of the people. Together we can make a difference. Don’t you see how simple it will be to finalize the implementation of the cashless society. Don’t you see how close we are already. How many people do you know that 1)have direct deposit, 2)use credit and/or debit cards instead of cash, 3)utilize the Internet for bill-paying, 4)file their tax-returns electronically, 5)have gone paperless with everyone from their Banks to their Insurance company, 6)have a photo ID/voter ID and/or passport. Don’t you see how close we are to finalizing the years of effort. Cash is already a thing of the past — a relic. It belongs in a museum. Stand with me and we can make the FairTax(TM) a reality — all that is needed is to take that last little step and pull the plug on cash. By the way, Soothsayer, there is no need to ridicule me. I would not ask anyone to bear the mark. That would be so wrong.

By Mobama

May 19, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this

Bookman is just way too invested in a system where the unproductive sit around and try to divvy up what the productive create. He is always for protecting anything that would enhance the ability of the government to take our money.

By Jimmy Joe Bob

May 19, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

Know what’s farest thang ‘bout ‘at dar FarTikes? Exxon Mobil ain’t gonna have to pay no damn tikeses! Hahahahahahahahahahaha!

By Fix-It

May 19, 2008 1:17 PM | Link to this

All you super smart liberals that keep saying, the FairTax is not fair, yet I do not see any proof. Will just one of you tell me what is wrong with all of us paying the same taxes? And yes the rich consume more and they would pay more. This all seems very democratic to me. Well since all the UnFair Tax people are so smart, how come none of you have given us any ideas? It takes a simple mind to criticize, it take a smart person to find a solution.

By Copyleft

May 19, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this

Fix-It: You’re not seeing the proof because you REFUSE to see it. It’s been offered, repeatedly—and not just here, today.

“What’s wrong with all of us paying the same taxes?” Plenty—especially since the UnfairTax wouldn’t do even THAT much. A consumption tax doesn’t have “everyone paying the same”—it has the poor paying proportionally MORE than the rich. That’s called “regressive taxation,” and it’s a stupid idea.

“How come none of you have offered any ideas?” There are plenty of ideas for tax reform; the UnfairTax is just the worst of the bunch, nothing more.

One idea is restoring corporate tax rates to their pre-Reagan levels, and the topmost bracket rate (especially on capital gains and other unearned income) to where they were in the conservative Golden Age, the 1950s.

Heck, eliminating the salary cap on Social Security taxes would more than suffice to fix the Social Security “crisis,” all by itself! But you’ll never hear an UnfairTax advocate mention that, will you?

By Beer_Stein

May 19, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this

Fix-it, the Fair Tax is fair - in the most basic, Darwinian sense of the word. It is fair in that it approaches every individual, every transaction, every good sold from an identical standpoint. It is also extraordinarily simplistic. The Fair Tax, like many of the positions its proponents adopt, proceeds from the simplistic view, the view that what’s good for the goose is good for the gander; the view that holds there are those who are productive and those who siphon off the fruits of that productivity. This view is, logically speaking, completely, utterly flawed in almost every respect.

I will return to the boxing analogy. If you believe that a flyweight and a heavyweight boxer in the ring together are “fairly” matched because they both know how to box, then you may want to check your reasoning again - carefully. Just because you and I are both capable of making the right (or wrong) decisions and moves doesn’t mean we are “fairly” matched.

The problem, again, is that Fair Tax proponents beleive that “fair” treatment means approaching every situation identically - and this belief is wrong.

By gttim

May 19, 2008 1:43 PM | Link to this

A free market society is something socialists (Democrats) just don’t understand.

Actually I do understand it. However, the US and most of the world does not have a free market society. If you study economics you learn that in a true free market corporate profits are kept to near the risk free interest rate. If a market starts making significantly more, investment and new corporations flood the market until the profit rates drops back down. Exxon mobile made 32% return on capital in 2006 and 34% return on capital in 2007. Nobody is flooding the market to sell you gas making a lower profit margin.

Liberals understand the free market. It is the rubes voting for GOP candidates all the time who have created a market rigged for large corporations at the expense of the middle class and small business that do not understand a “free market society.”

If corporate America is pushing for the FairTax, and they are, you can bet your last dollar they are not doing it because it is going to help the people. They are pushing it because it is going to help them make more money at your expense.

By Jose

May 19, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this

Is anyone on here an economist? If not then stop acting like one…Yes a tax distorts the true price, however under our current system, you have your Gross wages, not your net and I myself would love to have that 60,000 back that I paid the Federal Govt last year that they are paying for a $200 toliet seat for some un-needed office! This tax would allow individuals to pay a tax on consumption. Right now, the two extremes of the curve don’t pay taxes on nearly anything they are paying. This would decrease that happening and allow individuals that don’t pay taxes to pay them. An by the way, you DON’T PAY TAX ON INTEREST! Oh, you would get that credited back to you. You pay this tax on items purchased..simple. Do I need to create a website so you will believe it? Apparently that is what it takes for Monday morning quarterbacks around here to believe anything… Have a great day!

By sunshine and thunder

May 19, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this

Galiberal wrote: Bottom line is the ‘Fair Tax’ would cost you more and you would have no deductions to offset the amount you would pay. Not what I’m looking forward to.

When you vote Rethuglicon, you vote against your own best interests. And the Fair Tax supporters are living proof.

How utterly ignorant. The FairTax is not at all the way you describe. But what else can one expect from a posting thug who uses moronic words such as “rethuglicon”?

Since you must be a democRAT I’ll try to explain something to you evem though logic and reason are probably lost on you.

Why do you need a deduction if you don’t have a tax? If the income tax is gone so is the need for deductions. The same analogy would apply to a person who is angry that his favorite restaurant is giving away free food and now his discount coupons are worthless.

By Gordon

May 20, 2008 6:23 AM | Link to this

Copyleft,

Thank you for providing the link. I read it, and it seemed that it’s main point was that the Fair Tax doesn’t do enough to curb the power of the Federal Government. I don’t think the author did enough to convince me that the Fair Tax is a bad thing - it simply lists problems that it doesn’s solve that already exist. The thing that appeals to me about the Fair Tax is that it takes the tax code away from politicians who use it to get re-elected. I think that is a great starting point.

By Gordon

May 20, 2008 6:28 AM | Link to this

Copyleft,

One more thing - I saw one of your posts above talking about how the Fair Tax treats everyone the same. From my understanding (and again I don’t claim to be an expert), poor people get rebates from the tax they have paid. The poor DO NOT pay the same percentage of tax as those in higher income brackets. The Fair Tax is not just a consumption tax with a flat rate.